The DUP thread seems to have disappeared, or my search skills have gone to sh:te. I was't enamoured of the title but it was a useful place to gather various examples of prejudice.
I would have posted this. Back in the day the DUP were boycotting Bushmills as they were sponsoring the GAA, presumably Antrim.
https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/arid-41034599.html
Quote from: armaghniac on December 31, 2022, 05:22:31 PM
The DUP thread seems to have disappeared, or my search skills have gone to sh:te. I was't enamoured of the title but it was a useful place to gather various examples of prejudice.
I would have posted this. Back in the day the DUP were boycotting Bushmills as they were sponsoring the GAA, presumably Antrim.
https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/arid-41034599.html
In a United Ireland a DUP thread would be oppressed by the republican hordes.
Maybe not a bad thing.
Quote from: Windmill abu on December 31, 2022, 07:45:55 PM
Quote from: armaghniac on December 31, 2022, 05:22:31 PM
The DUP thread seems to have disappeared, or my search skills have gone to sh:te. I was't enamoured of the title but it was a useful place to gather various examples of prejudice.
I would have posted this. Back in the day the DUP were boycotting Bushmills as they were sponsoring the GAA, presumably Antrim.
https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/arid-41034599.html
In a United Ireland a DUP thread would be oppressed by the republican hordes.
Maybe not a bad thing.
IRA/GAA supporters delete thread containing many references to
bigotry stauch DUP defence of the union.
Quote from: Windmill abu on December 31, 2022, 07:45:55 PM
Quote from: armaghniac on December 31, 2022, 05:22:31 PM
The DUP thread seems to have disappeared, or my search skills have gone to sh:te. I was't enamoured of the title but it was a useful place to gather various examples of prejudice.
I would have posted this. Back in the day the DUP were boycotting Bushmills as they were sponsoring the GAA, presumably Antrim.
https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/arid-41034599.html
In a United Ireland a DUP thread would be oppressed by the republican hordes.
Maybe not a bad thing.
I would hope that loyalists will finally realise it's better to be a big fish in a small pond, than a tiny fish in an ocean. They can embrace their culture and celebrate it peacefully and in a truely shared manner. I cannot manage any suppression except those that want to terrorise.
They would hardly be a big fish though. If the place went to 32 counties I'd expect their racketeering to be clamped down on unlike it is now. Though maybe a blind eye would be turned a wee bit to keep the place peaceful but I couldn't see them get away with what they do now.
The racketeering only benefits a few, it is curse to most people in loyalist areas.
Quote from: armaghniac on January 01, 2023, 07:33:32 PM
The racketeering only benefits a few, it is curse to most people in loyalist areas.
The DUP only benefits a few, it is a curse to most people in loyalist areas.
By most metrics , loyalists are very poorly served by their public representatives.
https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/arid-41051942.html
Does anyone in the 6 Cos care anymore?
Quote from: Rossfan on January 19, 2023, 10:23:38 AM
https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/arid-41051942.html
Does anyone in the 6 Cos care anymore?
No, I don't ... but I would like to see at least a move to Joint Authority as a further step along the road that is only going in one direction.
Has joint authority ever been implemented anywhere? How can you not have a single authority?
I mean, how would it even work? I don't know why people keep bringing this up as if it were a possibility. It's never been proposed by any British or Irish governments in recent times that I'm aware of.
Quote from: Rossfan on January 19, 2023, 10:23:38 AM
https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/arid-41051942.html
Does anyone in the 6 Cos care anymore?
That is a good question. There is so much apathy now. DUP have their head in the sand. Sinn Fein couldn't run a bath. The others won't get a look in because we're all too busy keeping the other lot out. Place is a shambles. I used to follow local politics on the tv & radio - I switch it over now.
Thought the Orange Order and DUP didn't support terrorism ::)
https://m.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/sunday-life/news/dup-councillor-attends-controversial-parade-honouring-slain-uda-member-42304829.html
The DUP thread must have gone missing on the DUP/reality interface.
Proper joint authority would be an absolute mess. Think I would prefer direct rule from Westminster with Some influence from Dublin. If joint authority was a goer it should have been brought in post GFA. All it would do now is permanently block a UI
I have seen it all now ArleneFoster talking about making progress in Northern Ireland with a 'Never Never Never' blouse on.
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FnEpq1XWIAAz4Gr?format=jpg&name=small)
She never grew up, like a great majority of here supporters, living in the past, and if this province is a basket case no problem as long as its a UK one.
Carla Lockhart spreading more lies online about your woman arrested for praying. Failed to mention that she was actually arrested for constantly breaking an exclusion zone outside an abortion clinic due to groups of religious people intimidating women who had chosen to go for an abortion. Good to see they are more worried about issues in Birmingham than in their own country and constituency
Did wee Jeff vote for or against the right to strike? lol
What happened the DUP?
https://www.irishtimes.com/opinion/2023/01/26/positive-movement-on-protocol-a-tough-sell-to-unionists-who-know-desperate-dup-spin-is-coming/
There should be political generosity from Brussels on a protocol deal, but unionism will have to compromise, Bertie Ahern told Westminster's Northern Ireland Affairs Committee on Monday. The former taoiseach said he does not believe the DUP's "seven tests" for a deal can be met.
The greater the gap between political unionism in Northern Ireland and the broader policy interests of UK governments, then the greater the difficulty for unionists in making the case for equality of treatment as UK citizens. Unionism must not allow itself to become the existential threat to its own existence.
A premeditated and long flagged-up knee-jerk response to the protocol deal brings enormous dangers, while a rollover by the DUP would tear unionism and loyalism apart in a way not seen before
I'll get the popcorn in.
Alex Kane has written a pretty good article here.
https://twitter.com/AlexKane221b/status/1620139674844143616?cxt=HHwWgIDR2emc8vssAAAA
Wee Jeff sure is in a pickle. There is sure to be an EU UK agreement soon as regards the protocol. Jeffrey will have to give some sort of response, i assume based on his 7 tests. There is no way any deal can pass those 7 tests, so Jeffrey is going to have to compromise and lundify himself if a deal is to be done.
He's also got to work under a Sinn Fein first minister in any return to Stormount. I was about to say " Im not sure which would be the more bitter pill to swallow ' but serving under MON would hurt worse i'd say.
https://www.irishtimes.com/opinion/2023/01/28/unionism-has-painted-itself-into-a-corner-and-no-longer-has-friends-in-high-places-to-bail-it-out/The biggest threat to unionism is unionism itself
Anti-protocol unionism doesn't seem to have a thought-through alternative if its bluff is called
Alex Kane
Sat Jan 28 2023
It seems much more likely than not that within the next few weeks unionism – and the DUP in particular – will be required to give a response to a protocol deal agreed by the EU and UK. Their response will depend on whether or not the deal goes far enough in persuading them that there is no longer an "existential threat" to the union and to Northern Ireland's position within the UK.
But what is an existential threat to the union? Or, putting it another way, if the protocol remains, even in a watered-down form (which strikes me as the most likely outcome of the EU-UK deal) does it necessarily follow that the constitutional link between Britain and Northern Ireland will be sundered? Surely that could only happen if, in the event of a Border poll, a majority of voters in the North voted to end the constitutional status quo in favour of a united Ireland.
The protocol pushes Northern Ireland into the constitutional equivalent of a granny flat. Not entirely in the EU. Not entirely in the UK. But not in a united Ireland, either. So maybe not an existential threat to the union, either?
Even with the protocol, Northern Ireland would remain within the UK. Sovereign power would remain with the UK parliament. MPs from Northern Ireland would still be returned there. In the event of the Assembly collapsing, it would be the UK parliament, via the Northern Ireland Office, that would govern. There would be input from the Irish Government and a continuing recognition of the "Irish dimension" (as has been the case since October 1972), but it would still be the United Kingdom of Britain and Northern Ireland.
Yet treating Northern Ireland entirely differently from the rest of the UK, which is what the existing protocol does, and the renegotiated version is likely to do, too, does weaken unionism's hand in Northern Ireland. While it has always been true that Northern Ireland has been "a place apart" since 1921 (when it became the only part of the UK with a devolved government and a parliament entitled to make "locals-only" legislation), it has been a place apart within the UK. The protocol adds to that sense of apartness by placing it within EU parameters as well.
[ Positive movement on protocol a tough sell to unionists who know desperate DUP spin is coming ]
Those who made the case that a new and hard land border in Ireland would change the political and constitutional dynamic with potentially destabilising consequences for the Belfast Agreement were right. Yet they seem blind and deaf to the argument that the Northern Ireland protocol would have a similar impact from a unionist perspective. The polling and electoral evidence does suggest that the overwhelming majority of those who vote for unionist parties have concerns now about the threat to their status and identity.
So what happens if the pending deal doesn't rip up the protocol? What does unionism do then? There is a section of unionism and loyalism that would insist on the end of powersharing.
The mantra "it's the protocol or powersharing ... you can't have both" has become part of their campaigning currency lately. But it is the same section of unionism and loyalism that has resolutely opposed the Belfast Agreement since 1998. It is content to use the protocol as a way of bringing down the institutions established in 1988. Even the most benign deal will be dismissed by this lobby: a lobby that has huge influence across unionism right now.
But collapsing the Assembly brings considerable consequences: no significant unionist political or legislative presence at a local level; the UK-EU deal implemented anyway; a form of direct rule that will include input from the Irish Government; and what would be interpreted as a very clear signal that political unionism no longer prioritises devolution.
More importantly, it would create an enormous gap between unionism and the political centre at Westminster. All of this could also be construed to be an existential threat to the union and local unionism.
The other problem – which also contains existential elements – is that anti-protocol unionism doesn't seem to have a thought-through alternative if its bluff is called on the protocol.
It didn't have that thought-through alternative when Faulkner's cabinet resigned in March 1972; or when the UUUC (United Ulster Unionist Council) strike collapsed the assembly in May 1974; or when the constitutional convention imploded in 1975; or when the anti-Anglo Irish Agreement protests fizzled out in 1986; or when the UK and Irish governments agreed the 1993 Downing Street Declaration (complete with the "no selfish strategic or economic interest" in Northern Ireland doctrine); or when prime ministers Theresa May, Boris Johnson, Liz Truss and now Rishi Sunak let it down. Let's face it, unionism doesn't appear to do thought-through strategies, preferring instead to turn in on itself and then nurture break-away factions.
There is an argument that the protocol in and of itself does not represent an existential threat. Ironically, though, it could be the unionist response that becomes the greatest long-term threat. The greater the gap between political unionism in Northern Ireland and the broader policy interests of UK governments, then the greater the difficulty for unionists in making the case for equality of treatment as UK citizens. Unionism must not allow itself to become the existential threat to its own existence.
A premeditated and long flagged-up knee-jerk response to the protocol deal brings enormous dangers, while a rollover by the DUP would tear unionism and loyalism apart in a way not seen before. A deal that embraces the protocol in some form would be a signal that the UK government was prepared to face down unionism. The next few months will be critical for unionism. It has not been in this position for more than a century. The difference this time is that it is not the electoral majority and nor does it have reliable friends on the government or opposition benches.
https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=pfbid0sGtsLimZQyvUYzRX1ooYbRnLQiezXHtCtGCpLbXTy3vdNjKRpShGHPSuMxV23Ua2l&id=526712010807134
The lack of self awareness is unreal. Man is wearing a poppy ffs 🤣
Shooting themselves in the foot there as plenty of their own attend plenty of commemorations - more recently or maybe just more public recently. Idiots.
Be a few orange marches have to be banned.
Quote from: imtommygunn on February 02, 2023, 01:12:13 PM
Shooting themselves in the foot there as plenty of their own attend plenty of commemorations - more recently or maybe just more public recently. Idiots.
Be a few orange marches have to be banned.
and all their uvf flegs
Quote from: imtommygunn on February 02, 2023, 01:12:13 PM
Shooting themselves in the foot there as plenty of their own attend plenty of commemorations - more recently or maybe just more public recently. Idiots.
Be a few orange marches have to be banned.
Ah, but that's different. How you may ask, but in their wee minds it just is.
https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/arid-41066591.html
The UK Supreme Court has ruled that the wee Protocol is legal.
The Tories don't care about the DUP.
Quote from: seafoid on February 08, 2023, 11:00:38 AM
The UK Supreme Court has ruled that the wee Protocol is legal.
The Tories don't care about the DUP.
Serial losers. The DUP couldn't pick last week's winning lotto numbers.
So where do they go from here.
Quote from: seafoid on February 08, 2023, 11:15:52 AM
Quote from: Armagh18 on February 08, 2023, 11:11:04 AM
So where do they go from here.
Drumcree ?
Nothing has actually changed though so they'll continue to say no, hold the place to ransom and order a new election and get the no brigade out in force!
This will not matter one jot to their argument.
Basic fact is they wont share power, every excuse has been dismantled and they just keep adding more and more demands as their arguments fall. It's end of days stuff and the only way to check where they stand is to have an election.
We will only see then how their support is holding up. Sad thing is we probably have a fair idea how that will play out and even post election we are back to the same place.
Now they have a new issue with the ECHR is it? I saw Brolly on about it on twitter. They'll find a new bogeyman. Blatantly no desire to go back to stormont.
Yeah if only they would get crushed by the electorate but unfortunately that is a highly unlikely scenario :(
https://www.itv.com/news/utv/2023-02-08/former-councillor-banned-over-britain-first-stunt-fake-fine
are they threatening violence yet
isnt their beloved king the head of the supreme court.
Quote from: Rossfan on February 08, 2023, 07:42:27 PM
https://www.itv.com/news/utv/2023-02-08/former-councillor-banned-over-britain-first-stunt-fake-fine
That's hilarious tbh. She had Britain first over at flag protests regularly until they realised what she was. They deserve each other. She's a nasty piece of work her - still at it though with the drag acts reading kid's stories etc. Creating a bit of a story there too.
Tbh doesn't matter your views on any of this - she is just a shit stirrer with nothing useful to add to society.
northern ireland politics is cure for insomnia just bunch of the same faces boring people every day yawnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnn is what they are,
(https://i.ibb.co/x3k0dXV/IMG-20230209-WA0006.jpg)
Kicking the can down the road for another year I see https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-64574751
What an absolute shower.....
Its a fact now that power sharing is finished here in the north.
This latest chapter proves beyond doubt that Unionists will not and never will be seen to take orders from nationalists in there own wee state.
I know people will say its only the DUP, but if the UUP were in power the very same thing would be happening.
I don't know where we go from here but one thing is for sure the longer there is a stalemate the more time for there is for certain mouthpieces have to stir tensions up.
Quote from: Hereiam on February 09, 2023, 12:29:37 PM
Its a fact now that power sharing is finished here in the north.
This latest chapter proves beyond doubt that Unionists will not and never will be seen to take orders from nationalists in there own wee state.
I know people will say its only the DUP, but if the UUP were in power the very same thing would be happening.
I don't know where we go from here but one thing is for sure the longer there is a stalemate the more time for there is for certain mouthpieces have to stir tensions up.
I'd go even further in saying they still wouldn't share power with an SDLP first minister, let alone SF...
Completely agree with everything said.
They are talking about all kinds of cuts to services now. The very first thing that should be cut is MLA salaries in their entirety. There should be no debate around it or hesitancy in doing it. How can the regular Joe on the street be expected to stomach cuts to health etc while MLAs continue to receive a salary? It has gone far, far beyond a joke at this stage.
Quote from: 93-DY-SAM on February 09, 2023, 01:35:04 PM
They are talking about all kinds of cuts to services now. The very first thing that should be cut is MLA salaries in their entirety. There should be no debate around it or hesitancy in doing it. How can the regular Joe on the street be expected to stomach cuts to health etc while MLAs continue to receive a salary? It has gone far, far beyond a joke at this stage.
They use the excuse of having to be able to attract talent to the roles, the talent isn't there and there isn't a hope of stormont getting ip and running so why keep throwing good money at it
Quote from: 93-DY-SAM on February 09, 2023, 01:35:04 PM
They are talking about all kinds of cuts to services now. The very first thing that should be cut is MLA salaries in their entirety. There should be no debate around it or hesitancy in doing it. How can the regular Joe on the street be expected to stomach cuts to health etc while MLAs continue to receive a salary? It has gone far, far beyond a joke at this stage.
The DUP put the n in cuts
tories are a joke too for cutting wages 100 percent should give them a deadline to next month or its over.
Quote from: Eire90 on February 09, 2023, 04:36:17 PM
tories are a joke too for not cutting wages 100 percent should give them a deadline to next month or its over.
think ill ignore ni politics now its so boring i felt tired reading brysons tweets yesterday and now tired again
Quote from: Eire90 on February 09, 2023, 04:37:34 PM
think ill ignore ni politics now its so boring i felt tired reading brysons tweets yesterday and now tired again
How about ignoring GAABoard?
what are these morons like
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-64625483
The dup just posh loyalists paramilitary spokespeople in suits (posh in northern ireland terms tories probably still see them as peasants)
Dishy Rishy flew into the Black North last night with the expectation of talking to the leaders of the various political parties (except Mary Lou) and other organisations and "stake holders"...
Looks like he's greasing up the DUP for the NIP Protocol agreement with the EU.
Nothing will be enough for them and Angry Jim.
Speculation is Monday it'll be announced. I noticed from twitter Beattie wasn't invited. I do wonder were Eastwood or Long either.
I wonder does it mean their 7 red lines though they've even added another one since. I highly doubt it.
I could see them spin it but really can't see Stormont coming back.
Mary lou just walked into the culloden 5mins ago JC
But as you say, nothing will be good enough for Jim and Jeff. Hard to know what is going to happen. Think the power-sharing agreement was necessary to get NI moving forward, but it may have run its course
Eastwood, Long and Beattie were there this morning too
It looks like the end of the road for the DUP's strategy
The strategy is to say no to everything. They'll still get plenty of votes.
Quote from: imtommygunn on February 17, 2023, 10:05:02 AM
The strategy is to say no to everything. They'll still get plenty of votes.
Yup, council elections in May, NO,NO,NO!
General Election next year, NO, NO, NO!
Perhaps after that they may start to behave like adults but highly unlikely
Quote from: imtommygunn on February 17, 2023, 10:05:02 AM
The strategy is to say no to everything. They'll still get plenty of votes.
They are going to get bitchslappped by a combo of the UK Government and the EU.
Their strategy is in bits.
I don't think they can smile their way out of this.
Quote from: keep her low this half on February 17, 2023, 10:37:48 AM
Quote from: imtommygunn on February 17, 2023, 10:05:02 AM
The strategy is to say no to everything. They'll still get plenty of votes.
Yup, council elections in May, NO,NO,NO!
General Election next year, NO, NO, NO!
Perhaps after that they may start to behave like adults but highly unlikely
When the negotiations started originally with the EU they were being lauded as great negotiators. Then the penny dropped that they just said no to everything and no more was ever said about their great negotiation strategy.
SF they always come up smelling of roses. Unfortunately that's how it works. All the neanderthal bigots will get their place in the house of lords and rake the money in.
You can guarantee wee Jeff has his seat in the lords secured now and an ample donation to the DUP coffers has been arranged, They don't give one fcuk about the ordinary man & women, its always about themselves.
They are just tories really. (who are more or less UKIP these days). All the same. Not one shite could they give - spew up some hate to get votes then shit on the people who vote for them.
Quote from: Hereiam on February 17, 2023, 10:51:44 AM
You can guarantee wee Jeff has his seat in the lords secured now and an ample donation to the DUP coffers has been arranged, They don't give one fcuk about the ordinary man & women, its always about themselves.
He's resigned to the fact that the NIP is here to stay. There's a softening in his language, but no doubt he'll speak to the LLC/Orange Order and come back with a harder stance....
If he doesn't except it strip him off his knighthood, the slimey shit will force it through
You are assuming he has a choice. Highly unlikely.
Unionism is just one big No.
what will the loyalists do block roads they probably moaned about climate protestors blocking roads
I see Daithi's law is being put through Westminster. Good to see.
Quote from: Armagh18 on February 20, 2023, 10:39:30 AM
I see Daithi's law is being put through Westminster. Good to see.
It is good to see and I wonder if a backroom deal has been done.
Scenario 1. Westminster agrees to Daithis law, taking heat off the DUP, the DUP announce that the new Protocol deal meets their seven tests and everyone back to Stormont ( very very unlikely)
Scenario 2. Westminster does a deal with Brussels, DUP object, no Stormont, direct rule from Westminster for the next two years minimum. This was Westminster addressing devolved matters which they said last week they would not do. First of many?
Between the DUP, the ERG and
Between the DUP, the ERG and Bryson only one thing is sure. Nobody gives a f**k about ordinary Loyalist gobshites.
https://mobile.twitter.com/JamieBrysonCPNI/status/1626662477239910400
Unionism/Loyalism stands united.
@J_Donaldson_MP
has remained resolute & kept his word to the unionist community. I am absolutely convinced he will continue to do so. But it's important unionism collectively provides support & encouragement. #StandFirm
NI will burn: UVF's chilling warning over new NI Protocol 'betrayal'
Senior UVF figures have warned loyalists will "wreck the place" and "the streets will be in flames" if any Brexit deal between the UK and EU does not scrap the Irish Sea border.
Quote from: Eire90 on February 25, 2023, 11:43:09 PM
NI will burn: UVF's chilling warning over new NI Protocol 'betrayal'
Senior UVF figures have warned loyalists will "wreck the place" and "the streets will be in flames" if any Brexit deal between the UK and EU does not scrap the Irish Sea border.
Meh. Are they gonna block the roads with bins again? We'll just find another way home from work like we did in 2012.
Quote from: RedHand88 on February 25, 2023, 11:45:31 PM
Quote from: Eire90 on February 25, 2023, 11:43:09 PM
NI will burn: UVF's chilling warning over new NI Protocol 'betrayal'
Senior UVF figures have warned loyalists will "wreck the place" and "the streets will be in flames" if any Brexit deal between the UK and EU does not scrap the Irish Sea border.
Meh. Are they gonna block the roads with bins again? We'll just find another way home from work like we did in 2012.
Is this another Belfast live exclusive? From a top source?
Shit like this always makes me wonder what exactly it is that they are "loyal" to. Clearly not the rule of law as set down by Westminster, so, what, exactly?
Quote from: Jell 0 Biafra on February 26, 2023, 12:53:33 AM
Shit like this always makes me wonder what exactly it is that they are "loyal" to. Clearly not the rule of law as set down by Westminster, so, what, exactly?
Their fleg, marching and hating taigs.
And for a lot of them, selling drugs.
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on February 25, 2023, 11:53:34 PM
Quote from: RedHand88 on February 25, 2023, 11:45:31 PM
Quote from: Eire90 on February 25, 2023, 11:43:09 PM
NI will burn: UVF's chilling warning over new NI Protocol 'betrayal'
Senior UVF figures have warned loyalists will "wreck the place" and "the streets will be in flames" if any Brexit deal between the UK and EU does not scrap the Irish Sea border.
Meh. Are they gonna block the roads with bins again? We'll just find another way home from work like we did in 2012.
Is this another Belfast live exclusive? From a top source?
belfast telegraph
https://m.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/sunday-life/news/ni-will-burn-uvfs-chilling-warning-over-new-ni-protocol-betrayal/1714828166.html
Sunak has now given the DUP a hospital pass
Dup will probably reject it.
wowwwwwwww dup excepted to accept it reported in irish news i still wouldn't whole my breath.
wait until they meet the lcc though
Quote from: imtommygunn on February 27, 2023, 01:21:04 PM
wait until they meet the lcc though
I would think if the DUP are happy the LCC will be happy
Donaldson painted himself into a corner from day one and now has no way out. Tactically give himself no room for manoeuvre. If he tentatively backs the deal then he will lose out to Allister electorally. If he doesn't back the deal and refuses to return to Stormont then it will proceed anyway and the outcome of that will be far worse for Unionism as Westminster will make decisions under a soon to be Labour government.
It's hard to believe how incompetent Donaldson is. I thought he was half intelligent but he has even made Arlene Foster look good and that is saying something.
Quote from: Saffrongael on February 27, 2023, 01:32:41 PM
Quote from: imtommygunn on February 27, 2023, 01:21:04 PM
wait until they meet the lcc though
I would think if the DUP are happy the LCC will be happy
You've a short memory! Remember 2018? The DUP and SF's negotiators came to an agreement on re-establishing the assembly/Irish language legislation only for the DUP to walk away and deny any agreement was ever reached (SF later published the agreement's text) after they took it away to consult with the Orange Order and representatives of loyalist paramilitaries.
No Stormont. No pay for lots of MLA's DUP or otherwise and some are hardly going to pick up similar salaries in the private sector..
What now?
Quote from: johnnycool on February 27, 2023, 02:38:02 PM
No Stormont. No pay for lots of MLA's DUP or otherwise and some are hardly going to pick up similar salaries in the private sector..
What now?
the dole?
Arlene not happy. That's a good sign ;D
I don't know where unionism go from here.
Quote from: imtommygunn on February 27, 2023, 02:44:53 PM
Arlene not happy. That's a good sign ;D
I don't know where unionism go from here.
Hard unionism has already created another couple of bogeymen in King Charles and the Irish News and the day isn't yet over! The lack of self awareness that Arlene Foster displays is bizarre. She's got her big titles but was the main instigator in leading Unionism down this path yet instead of staying in the background she has continued to put herself at the front and centre of any political debate. Definitely more loyal to the half crown than the crown that one, together with the other Westminster MP cronies.
She's an idiot.
Quote from: yellowcard on February 27, 2023, 02:52:35 PM
Quote from: imtommygunn on February 27, 2023, 02:44:53 PM
Arlene not happy. That's a good sign ;D
I don't know where unionism go from here.
Hard unionism has already created another couple of bogeymen in King Charles and the Irish News and the day isn't yet over! The lack of self awareness that Arlene Foster displays is bizarre. She's got her big titles but was the main instigator in leading Unionism down this path yet instead of staying in the background she has continued to put herself at the front and centre of any political debate. Definitely more loyal to the half crown than the crown that one, together with the other Westminster MP cronies.
To my eternal shame I first read that as something else :-[
Quote from: Shamrock Shore on February 27, 2023, 03:06:02 PM
Quote from: yellowcard on February 27, 2023, 02:52:35 PM
Quote from: imtommygunn on February 27, 2023, 02:44:53 PM
Arlene not happy. That's a good sign ;D
I don't know where unionism go from here.
Hard unionism has already created another couple of bogeymen in King Charles and the Irish News and the day isn't yet over! The lack of self awareness that Arlene Foster displays is bizarre. She's got her big titles but was the main instigator in leading Unionism down this path yet instead of staying in the background she has continued to put herself at the front and centre of any political debate. Definitely more loyal to the half crown than the crown that one, together with the other Westminster MP cronies.
To my eternal shame I first read that as something else :-[
As did I - was going to say I never noticed them before :-[
Quote from: Shamrock Shore on February 27, 2023, 03:06:02 PM
Quote from: yellowcard on February 27, 2023, 02:52:35 PM
Quote from: imtommygunn on February 27, 2023, 02:44:53 PM
Arlene not happy. That's a good sign ;D
I don't know where unionism go from here.
Hard unionism has already created another couple of bogeymen in King Charles and the Irish News and the day isn't yet over! The lack of self awareness that Arlene Foster displays is bizarre. She's got her big titles but was the main instigator in leading Unionism down this path yet instead of staying in the background she has continued to put herself at the front and centre of any political debate. Definitely more loyal to the half crown than the crown that one, together with the other Westminster MP cronies.
To my eternal shame I first read that as something else :-[
🤣🤣
Jesus :o
They are going to call this new Protocol the Windsor agreement or something like that. How could any unionist oppose that?
Sunak by announcing this must think it meets the DUPs tests and that it's the best he can do. Interesting few hours and days ahead to see if the DUP do accept it and if they will return to Stormont. If the answers to those questions is No, I honestly don't know where we go from here.
She's a real Brexit muppet, same as most of the ERG heads. They were chosen because they wouldn't object to anything.
She's the intellectual equivalent of Mark Francois.
This brake will lead to a shit show, unionist veto.
It's a huge opportunity for Jim Allister to make his party the voice of Unionism. Donaldson has looked like a lame duck leader from day one and this fork in the road was coming. From a tactical perspective Allister has played him like a kipper. Its a given that Allister will reject the deal and subsequently LCC/OO/loyalist alliance so then its over to Jeffrey whose head must be spinning at the minute. I can't see him backing it and if he does he's probably toast.
Quote from: yellowcard on February 27, 2023, 04:05:24 PM
It's a huge opportunity for Jim Allister to make his party the voice of Unionism. Donaldson has looked like a lame duck leader from day one and this fork in the road was coming. From a tactical perspective Allister has played him like a kipper. Its a given that Allister will reject the deal and subsequently LCC/OO/loyalist alliance so then its over to Jeffrey whose head must be spinning at the minute. I can't see him backing it and if he does he's probably toast.
But if he does it is another opportunity for the non-unionist parties. If they split they hardline vote between DUP and TUV again they will do nothing but gut themselves, weakening their position further.
Quote from: Applesisapples on February 27, 2023, 03:58:39 PM
This brake will lead to a shit show, unionist veto.
It's not, the POC has to be "applied" with London/Westminster & then has to be externally assessed if the POC numbers are met
Quote from: NAG1 on February 27, 2023, 04:08:38 PM
Quote from: yellowcard on February 27, 2023, 04:05:24 PM
It's a huge opportunity for Jim Allister to make his party the voice of Unionism. Donaldson has looked like a lame duck leader from day one and this fork in the road was coming. From a tactical perspective Allister has played him like a kipper. Its a given that Allister will reject the deal and subsequently LCC/OO/loyalist alliance so then its over to Jeffrey whose head must be spinning at the minute. I can't see him backing it and if he does he's probably toast.
But if he does it is another opportunity for the non-unionist parties. If they split they hardline vote between DUP and TUV again they will do nothing but gut themselves, weakening their position further.
It could well do. At the minute TUV is effectively a one man band but if Donaldson can't keep his party together then Allister will profit most and will make capital off the back of that. Whatever you think about Allister (and he is horrific) he is more of a leader and strategist than Jeffrey Donaldson will ever be.
Quote from: Saffrongael on February 27, 2023, 04:08:58 PM
Quote from: Applesisapples on February 27, 2023, 03:58:39 PM
This brake will lead to a shit show, unionist veto.
It's not, the POC has to be "applied" with London/Westminster & then has to be externally assessed if the POC numbers are met
The POC has been invoked more by the DUP than any other party and Allister and enough UUP will pitch in.
Probably a stupid question.....is it possible for Uk Government and Irish Government together to change items of the GFA? Namely the ability for a single party to pull the institutions down.
If the DUP don't accept this deal, by their own admission they will not return to government so we are at a permanent stalemate.
In that scenario, the only parties remaining are UK and Irish governement so I'm just wondering if there is anything they can do to enable the Assembly to return with the DUP.
Quote from: Applesisapples on February 27, 2023, 04:15:58 PM
Quote from: Saffrongael on February 27, 2023, 04:08:58 PM
Quote from: Applesisapples on February 27, 2023, 03:58:39 PM
This brake will lead to a shit show, unionist veto.
It's not, the POC has to be "applied" with London/Westminster & then has to be externally assessed if the POC numbers are met
The POC has been invoked more by the DUP than any other party and Allister and enough UUP will pitch in.
You need to read my post again, it can't happen with just Stormont parties alone applying it. London has to agree & we will also soon have a Labour government
Quote from: tbrick18 on February 27, 2023, 04:17:15 PM
Probably a stupid question.....is it possible for Uk Government and Irish Government together to change items of the GFA? Namely the ability for a single party to pull the institutions down.
If the DUP don't accept this deal, by their own admission they will not return to government so we are at a permanent stalemate.
In that scenario, the only parties remaining are UK and Irish governement so I'm just wondering if there is anything they can do to enable the Assembly to return with the DUP.
You'd imagine it's something that would be possible but would the 2 governments want to start tinkering with the GFA? Might been seen by some as an excuse to threaten more violence. Ideally stormont would be up and running tomorrow without the dinosaurs.
Quote from: Saffrongael on February 27, 2023, 04:19:28 PM
Quote from: Applesisapples on February 27, 2023, 04:15:58 PM
Quote from: Saffrongael on February 27, 2023, 04:08:58 PM
Quote from: Applesisapples on February 27, 2023, 03:58:39 PM
This brake will lead to a shit show, unionist veto.
It's not, the POC has to be "applied" with London/Westminster & then has to be externally assessed if the POC numbers are met
The POC has been invoked more by the DUP than any other party and Allister and enough UUP will pitch in.
You need to read my post again, it can't happen with just Stormont parties alone applying it. London has to agree & we will also soon have a Labour government
The UK government is to be bound to take notice of this brake and the DUP will push for it to be given a legislative basis. I am basing my opinion on what has been said by the UK/EU and not on your statement. It will lead to more instability and be used for mischief.
Quote from: Saffrongael on February 27, 2023, 04:19:28 PM
Quote from: Applesisapples on February 27, 2023, 04:15:58 PM
Quote from: Saffrongael on February 27, 2023, 04:08:58 PM
Quote from: Applesisapples on February 27, 2023, 03:58:39 PM
This brake will lead to a shit show, unionist veto.
It's not, the POC has to be "applied" with London/Westminster & then has to be externally assessed if the POC numbers are met
The POC has been invoked more by the DUP than any other party and Allister and enough UUP will pitch in.
You need to read my post again, it can't happen with just Stormont parties alone applying it. London has to agree & we will also soon have a Labour government
Maybe not. Only 3 Labour leaders have won an election since 1945. They all had over 60 seats in Scotland. Now Labour has 2. They all had a lot of left wing votes. Starmer has purged the left. And they all had loads of female votes. A lot of women are pissed off about Labour's position on trans.
I would be surprised if Labour would win England given all of that.
Quote from: seafoid on February 27, 2023, 05:29:00 PM
Quote from: Saffrongael on February 27, 2023, 04:19:28 PM
Quote from: Applesisapples on February 27, 2023, 04:15:58 PM
Quote from: Saffrongael on February 27, 2023, 04:08:58 PM
Quote from: Applesisapples on February 27, 2023, 03:58:39 PM
This brake will lead to a shit show, unionist veto.
It's not, the POC has to be "applied" with London/Westminster & then has to be externally assessed if the POC numbers are met
The POC has been invoked more by the DUP than any other party and Allister and enough UUP will pitch in.
You need to read my post again, it can't happen with just Stormont parties alone applying it. London has to agree & we will also soon have a Labour government
Maybe not. Only 3 Labour leaders have won an election since 1945. They all had over 60 seats in Scotland. Now Labour has 2. They all had a lot of left wing votes. Starmer has purged the left. And they all had loads of female votes. A lot of women are pissed off about Labour's position on trans.
I would be surprised if Labour would win England given all of that.
How have Labour pissed off women with the trans issue? Curious because if anything they've pissed off trans activists and don't see how you can say that women are annoyed with them? It's the Looney left and commys that are annoyed with Labour... Sturgeon is gone so SNP are on the wobble and Labour been working hard in Scotland could see them doing well there
It looks like a lot of work went into the deal
https://www.irishtimes.com/politics/2023/02/27/northern-ireland-protocol-deal-eu-uk-brexit/
Sunak says there will be a parliamentary vote on the new Windsor framework 'and it will be respected'
The deal, which will be subject to a vote in Westminster at the "appropriate time", includes green and red lanes for imports into the North. It returns to Westminster the power to set all VAT rates.
It contains safeguards to ensure that all supermarket goods and medicines available in Britain will automatically be available in the North.
Leading Irish American congressman Brendan Boyle, who is also co-chair of the congressional EU caucus, strongly backed the new Northern Ireland protocol deal.
.
The Northern Ireland Business Brexit Working Group, an umbrella group representing 14 industry bodies, said it commended the "considerable efforts made by the EU and the UK government to find joint solutions on the Northern Ireland protocol.
Sunak hails 'decisive breakthrough' on post-Brexit rules for Northern Ireland
UK prime minister Rishi Sunak has said his "decisive breakthrough" on post-Brexit rules for Northern Ireland will remove trade barriers in the Irish Sea as he seeks the backing of unionists and Tory Eurosceptics.
/Mr Sunak said the agreement "safeguards sovereignty" for Northern Ireland.
He said the deal introduces a new Stormont brake, allowing the assembly not only to have a say over EU laws but also to block them from applying in Northern Ireland.
Chairman of the European Research Group of hardline Conservative MPs Mark Francois told Sky News that they wanted "a situation where EU law is expunged from Northern Ireland so it is treated on the same basis as England, Scotland and Wales."
"We're not stupid," he told the broadcaster.
Ms Long added: "All of us would like to see the relationship with the EU in a better place, I think the UK as a whole needs that, but I think it would also be good for north/south and east/west relationships because they've been damaged by Brexit."
________________________________________
Quote from: yellowcard on February 27, 2023, 02:52:35 PM
Quote from: imtommygunn on February 27, 2023, 02:44:53 PM
Arlene not happy. That's a good sign ;D
I don't know where unionism go from here.
Hard unionism has already created another couple of bogeymen in King Charles and the Irish News and the day isn't yet over! The lack of self awareness that Arlene Foster displays is bizarre. She's got her big titles but was the main instigator in leading Unionism down this path yet instead of staying in the background she has continued to put herself at the front and centre of any political debate. Definitely more loyal to the half crown than the crown that one, together with the other Westminster MP cronies.
I actually thought that said "she's got her big titties..." and I thought what the hell have they got to do with the protocol? ;D
Edit: turns out I wasn't the only one!
Given that the deal is called the Windsor Framework, Northern Ireland's national mar dhea stadium should from on on be called Protocol Park
Quote from: yellowcard on February 27, 2023, 04:13:58 PM
Quote from: NAG1 on February 27, 2023, 04:08:38 PM
Quote from: yellowcard on February 27, 2023, 04:05:24 PM
It's a huge opportunity for Jim Allister to make his party the voice of Unionism. Donaldson has looked like a lame duck leader from day one and this fork in the road was coming. From a tactical perspective Allister has played him like a kipper. Its a given that Allister will reject the deal and subsequently LCC/OO/loyalist alliance so then its over to Jeffrey whose head must be spinning at the minute. I can't see him backing it and if he does he's probably toast.
But if he does it is another opportunity for the non-unionist parties. If they split they hardline vote between DUP and TUV again they will do nothing but gut themselves, weakening their position further.
It could well do. At the minute TUV is effectively a one man band but if Donaldson can't keep his party together then Allister will profit most and will make capital off the back of that. Whatever you think about Allister (and he is horrific) he is more of a leader and strategist than Jeffrey Donaldson will ever be.
Don't think so.
He just says no to everything.
Quote from: marty34 on February 27, 2023, 10:32:09 PM
Quote from: yellowcard on February 27, 2023, 04:13:58 PM
Quote from: NAG1 on February 27, 2023, 04:08:38 PM
Quote from: yellowcard on February 27, 2023, 04:05:24 PM
It's a huge opportunity for Jim Allister to make his party the voice of Unionism. Donaldson has looked like a lame duck leader from day one and this fork in the road was coming. From a tactical perspective Allister has played him like a kipper. Its a given that Allister will reject the deal and subsequently LCC/OO/loyalist alliance so then its over to Jeffrey whose head must be spinning at the minute. I can't see him backing it and if he does he's probably toast.
But if he does it is another opportunity for the non-unionist parties. If they split they hardline vote between DUP and TUV again they will do nothing but gut themselves, weakening their position further.
It could well do. At the minute TUV is effectively a one man band but if Donaldson can't keep his party together then Allister will profit most and will make capital off the back of that. Whatever you think about Allister (and he is horrific) he is more of a leader and strategist than Jeffrey Donaldson will ever be.
Don't think so.
He just says no to everything.
That appeals to the sort of yokes he wants voting for him
At the start of the EU negotiations god knows how long ago they thought the DUP were playing a blinder playing hardball and saying no in negotiations. People then realised that was actually all they'd got and they said no to everything. No is all they've got.
Quote from: yellowcard on February 27, 2023, 04:05:24 PM
It's a huge opportunity for Jim Allister to make his party the voice of Unionism. Donaldson has looked like a lame duck leader from day one and this fork in the road was coming. From a tactical perspective Allister has played him like a kipper. Its a given that Allister will reject the deal and subsequently LCC/OO/loyalist alliance so then its over to Jeffrey whose head must be spinning at the minute. I can't see him backing it and if he does he's probably toast.
The great minds of the LCC must have completed their assessment as Ian Og says the deal 'doesn't cut the mustard'
Let's say the 17th Century says NO! to the "Windsor protocol"......
I highly doubt the EU and the Brits are going to tear it up and start all over again?
Quote from: Rossfan on February 28, 2023, 09:10:28 AM
Let's say the 17th Century says NO! to the "Windsor protocol"......
I highly doubt the EU and the Brits are going to tear it up and start all over again?
Nope this is it. They either get on and make it work for their community or they get left behind
Quote from: Rossfan on February 28, 2023, 09:10:28 AM
Let's say the 17th Century says NO! to the "Windsor protocol"......
I highly doubt the EU and the Brits are going to tear it up and start all over again?
Yeah surely no more renegotiating now. As someone else as said, Rishi has played a blinder getting Charlie to look like he's backing it without openly backing it.
Quote from: Armagh18 on February 28, 2023, 09:23:40 AM
Quote from: Rossfan on February 28, 2023, 09:10:28 AM
Let's say the 17th Century says NO! to the "Windsor protocol"......
I highly doubt the EU and the Brits are going to tear it up and start all over again?
Yeah surely no more renegotiating now. As someone else as said, Rishi has played a blinder getting Charlie to look like he's backing it without openly backing it.
Charlie and Jeffrey's relationship is hardly the warmest either going by the reception in Hillsborough the time of his Ma's death.
It will be interesting how the DUP spin this as TBH their intransigence has earned some big compromises from the EU and a normal party would spin that as a serious win, but not Sammy fingers and Ian Óg, oh no, they're boxing Donaldson into a corner as this deal doesn't cut the mustard and looking to overplay their hand.
Sunak has binned their Protocol Bill, so this is the only show in town.
It is hard to know where they go from here if they say no.
If they say no they are basically saying northern ireland can't work because we won't let it.
Some speculate a border poll if they say no however I doubt it.
Quote from: JoG2 on February 28, 2023, 07:15:19 AM
Quote from: yellowcard on February 27, 2023, 04:05:24 PM
It's a huge opportunity for Jim Allister to make his party the voice of Unionism. Donaldson has looked like a lame duck leader from day one and this fork in the road was coming. From a tactical perspective Allister has played him like a kipper. Its a given that Allister will reject the deal and subsequently LCC/OO/loyalist alliance so then its over to Jeffrey whose head must be spinning at the minute. I can't see him backing it and if he does he's probably toast.
The great minds of the LCC must have completed their assessment as Ian Og says the deal 'doesn't cut the mustard'
IanOg doesn't speak for the LCC, he and Sammy will take the same line as Farage, Banks and their Russian owners.
Jeffrey knows it is a good deal but he needs to see what way the wind is blowing.
Must be pressure from inside the party to say yes. It's ok for the MP's to waltz back and fourth to London on those wages and expenses while everyone else (MLA's) could be going back to their day jobs ?
Quote from: imtommygunn on February 28, 2023, 09:36:01 AM
It is hard to know where they go from here if they say no.
If they say no they are basically saying northern ireland can't work because we won't let it.
Some speculate a border poll if they say no however I doubt it.
Labour have said they will back the deal. England and to an extent the ERG want to "get Brexit done". The DUP are being offered a way out, a chance to trumpet a big win. However, for an image of the Stormont brake, imagine a toy steering wheel being handed to a child in the back seat so they can "drive the car, just like Daddy".
Regardless of whether the protocol is approved or not , the DUP's ego is huge (to them anyway), as they made the EU and British government effectively dance to their tune
They think they're more important than they really are. Will they want to give all this power up, slink back into the shadows , never to be seen or heard from again? I doubt it.
I don't think they will approve this deal. So sooner or later , their bluff has to be called . Be that, a border poll, joint rule and/or closing Stormont , and the big wages that goes with it
They're going to have to accept it. There has been give and take between the UK and EU and that's the way these things work. It's going ahead regardless so they will be left out in the cold if they come back with more demands. Countries like Switzerland and Norway don't have an issue with aligning with EU regulations. It's what needs done if you want to trade fairly seamlessly with Europe. Not doing so would turn this place into a bigger economic wasteland that it already is. The dumb wits in the DUP either can't seem to grasp that, or they think it's a price worth paying for their idea of sovereignty. It's ironic given their mantra over the years of nationalists not wanting this place to work.
Quote from: johnnycool on February 28, 2023, 09:31:39 AM
Quote from: Armagh18 on February 28, 2023, 09:23:40 AM
Quote from: Rossfan on February 28, 2023, 09:10:28 AM
Let's say the 17th Century says NO! to the "Windsor protocol"......
I highly doubt the EU and the Brits are going to tear it up and start all over again?
Yeah surely no more renegotiating now. As someone else as said, Rishi has played a blinder getting Charlie to look like he's backing it without openly backing it.
Charlie and Jeffrey's relationship is hardly the warmest either going by the reception in Hillsborough the time of his Ma's death.
It will be interesting how the DUP spin this as TBH their intransigence has earned some big compromises from the EU and a normal party would spin that as a serious win, but not Sammy fingers and Ian Óg, oh no, they're boxing Donaldson into a corner as this deal doesn't cut the mustard and looking to overplay their hand.
Sunak has binned their Protocol Bill, so this is the only show in town.
Yeah not sure where the Sammy and Ian Og want Jeffrey to go from here. You could let Allister write the deal himself and he'd still say no, it's just in them to. I suppose at the end of the day it all boils down to the fact they will never go into Stormont under Sinn Fein.
Quote from: Armagh18 on February 28, 2023, 09:53:51 AM
Quote from: johnnycool on February 28, 2023, 09:31:39 AM
Quote from: Armagh18 on February 28, 2023, 09:23:40 AM
Quote from: Rossfan on February 28, 2023, 09:10:28 AM
Let's say the 17th Century says NO! to the "Windsor protocol"......
I highly doubt the EU and the Brits are going to tear it up and start all over again?
Yeah surely no more renegotiating now. As someone else as said, Rishi has played a blinder getting Charlie to look like he's backing it without openly backing it.
Charlie and Jeffrey's relationship is hardly the warmest either going by the reception in Hillsborough the time of his Ma's death.
It will be interesting how the DUP spin this as TBH their intransigence has earned some big compromises from the EU and a normal party would spin that as a serious win, but not Sammy fingers and Ian Óg, oh no, they're boxing Donaldson into a corner as this deal doesn't cut the mustard and looking to overplay their hand.
Sunak has binned their Protocol Bill, so this is the only show in town.
Yeah not sure where the Sammy and Ian Og want Jeffrey to go from here. You could let Allister write the deal himself and he'd still say no, it's just in them to. I suppose at the end of the day it all boils down to the fact they will never go into Stormont under Sinn Fein.
Jim said this yesterday. The deal was irrelevant, he said they still shouldn't allow a Sinn Fein 1st minister.
The only thing that gives me any confidence that this is the game, is down to the fact that the Little- Englander ERG types appear to have run out of patience with the DUP and just want this done to move on.
So they may find themselves slightly under P to get signed up too it from their once allies.
so Jim Allister is blatantly denying democracy hes not even being veiled about it.
Quote from: RedHand88 on February 28, 2023, 09:57:26 AM
Quote from: Armagh18 on February 28, 2023, 09:53:51 AM
Quote from: johnnycool on February 28, 2023, 09:31:39 AM
Quote from: Armagh18 on February 28, 2023, 09:23:40 AM
Quote from: Rossfan on February 28, 2023, 09:10:28 AM
Let's say the 17th Century says NO! to the "Windsor protocol"......
I highly doubt the EU and the Brits are going to tear it up and start all over again?
Yeah surely no more renegotiating now. As someone else as said, Rishi has played a blinder getting Charlie to look like he's backing it without openly backing it.
Charlie and Jeffrey's relationship is hardly the warmest either going by the reception in Hillsborough the time of his Ma's death.
It will be interesting how the DUP spin this as TBH their intransigence has earned some big compromises from the EU and a normal party would spin that as a serious win, but not Sammy fingers and Ian Óg, oh no, they're boxing Donaldson into a corner as this deal doesn't cut the mustard and looking to overplay their hand.
Sunak has binned their Protocol Bill, so this is the only show in town.
Yeah not sure where the Sammy and Ian Og want Jeffrey to go from here. You could let Allister write the deal himself and he'd still say no, it's just in them to. I suppose at the end of the day it all boils down to the fact they will never go into Stormont under Sinn Fein.
Jim said this yesterday. The deal was irrelevant, he said they still shouldn't allow a Sinn Fein 1st minister.
How the feck does he get away with it. Was he challenged at all on that? Have you link to that interview?
Quote from: Armagh18 on February 28, 2023, 11:23:48 AM
Quote from: RedHand88 on February 28, 2023, 09:57:26 AM
Quote from: Armagh18 on February 28, 2023, 09:53:51 AM
Quote from: johnnycool on February 28, 2023, 09:31:39 AM
Quote from: Armagh18 on February 28, 2023, 09:23:40 AM
Quote from: Rossfan on February 28, 2023, 09:10:28 AM
Let's say the 17th Century says NO! to the "Windsor protocol"......
I highly doubt the EU and the Brits are going to tear it up and start all over again?
Yeah surely no more renegotiating now. As someone else as said, Rishi has played a blinder getting Charlie to look like he's backing it without openly backing it.
Charlie and Jeffrey's relationship is hardly the warmest either going by the reception in Hillsborough the time of his Ma's death.
It will be interesting how the DUP spin this as TBH their intransigence has earned some big compromises from the EU and a normal party would spin that as a serious win, but not Sammy fingers and Ian Óg, oh no, they're boxing Donaldson into a corner as this deal doesn't cut the mustard and looking to overplay their hand.
Sunak has binned their Protocol Bill, so this is the only show in town.
Yeah not sure where the Sammy and Ian Og want Jeffrey to go from here. You could let Allister write the deal himself and he'd still say no, it's just in them to. I suppose at the end of the day it all boils down to the fact they will never go into Stormont under Sinn Fein.
Jim said this yesterday. The deal was irrelevant, he said they still shouldn't allow a Sinn Fein 1st minister.
How the feck does he get away with it. Was he challenged at all on that? Have you link to that interview?
https://www.newsletter.co.uk/business/watch-for-yourself-interview-with-jim-allister-dup-seven-tests-leave-them-with-wriggle-room-but-even-if-they-accept-the-deal-there-should-be-no-return-to-a-sinn-fein-led-stormont-4043736 (https://www.newsletter.co.uk/business/watch-for-yourself-interview-with-jim-allister-dup-seven-tests-leave-them-with-wriggle-room-but-even-if-they-accept-the-deal-there-should-be-no-return-to-a-sinn-fein-led-stormont-4043736)
"As to whether the DUP should be going into Stormont at all, even if its Seven Tests are met, Mr Allister pointed to Sinn Fein's ongoing apologetics for the IRA, with the would-be First Minister Michelle O'Neill having declared recently that there was "no alternative" to republican paramilitary violence during the Troubles."
Penny is dropping with Steve Baker and his ERG mates that the DUP, Alistair et al will only ever be happy with one thing and that is "There are unionists who would dig a moat between the North and the South, those unionists will never be happy.".
Quote from: 93-DY-SAM on February 28, 2023, 12:15:41 PM
Penny is dropping with Steve Baker and his ERG mates that the DUP, Alistair et al will only ever be happy with one thing and that is "There are unionists who would dig a moat between the North and the South, those unionists will never be happy.".
They would still moan that the moat isnt wide enough or deep enough, probably need too main taigs to dig it ffs
The big question today is why is Rishi Sunak claiming that we now have such a uniquely privileged position here in economic terms. After all his main audience is an English one so that raises massive questions as to the so called benefits of Brexit itself to begin with. It seems like it is the beginning of a change in policy from UK government when you hear this and the likes of Steve 'Brexit hard man' Baker having a road to Damascus moment. Sunak knows that he has seen off the threat of Johnson and he is now emboldened to pursue a closer relationship with Europe.
I've no doubt that Sunak convinced the EU that he days of the UK acting the bollix are over. So the EU is less worried about stuff coming into NI because the UK is not going to greatly change standards etc.
Quote from: armaghniac on February 28, 2023, 02:16:23 PM
I've no doubt that Sunak convinced the EU that he days of the UK acting the bollix are over. So the EU is less worried about stuff coming into NI because the UK is not going to greatly change standards etc.
The Protocol was holding up other deals in the Pacific and the US. The Brits had no choice.
Quote from: armaghniac on February 28, 2023, 02:16:23 PM
I've no doubt that Sunak convinced the EU that he days of the UK acting the bollix are over. So the EU is less worried about stuff coming into NI because the UK is not going to greatly change standards etc.
And no doubt the Brits realise that it's not a great idea shutting your eyes and pretending 400,000,000 pretty well off people on you doorstep don't exist.
Steve Baker slabbering on about his mental health. This guy. Christ on a bike. An Absolute moron who cared not one jot for the people of NI leaving us with no government, huge NHS waiting lists, political instability and double digit inflation. f**k his mental health. w**ker.
Quote from: trailer on February 28, 2023, 05:04:44 PM
Steve Baker slabbering on about his mental health. This guy. Christ on a bike. An Absolute moron who cared not one jot for the people of NI leaving us with no government, huge NHS waiting lists, political instability and double digit inflation. f**k his mental health. w**ker.
But what do you really think of Steve Baker? He was a self styled Brexit hard man but was he any worse than Mogg, Johnson, Frost, Francois, Banks, Braverman, Dorris, etc. And that's before you move onto the DUPers who flirted and hitched their wagon to them from the outset. History will not be kind to those politicians. At least Baker belatedly appears to have seen the light even if he probably has his own self serving reasons for doing so.
The outworkings of this Brexit deal for this place economically will be interesting to watch unfold. If it thrives within the next 10/15 years then you could find that middle England will be looking at another EU referendum within a generation. Sunak is already facing a bit of a shit storm among remainers and pro Indy Scots over his comments from earlier today when heralding the unique position we face with the dual access.
The UK has to play by the rules now. There is no Brexit Shangri-la . There is no there there.
Quote from: yellowcard on February 28, 2023, 05:15:58 PM
Quote from: trailer on February 28, 2023, 05:04:44 PM
Steve Baker slabbering on about his mental health. This guy. Christ on a bike. An Absolute moron who cared not one jot for the people of NI leaving us with no government, huge NHS waiting lists, political instability and double digit inflation. f**k his mental health. w**ker.
But what do you really think of Steve Baker? He was a self styled Brexit hard man but was he any worse than Mogg, Johnson, Frost, Francois, Banks, Braverman, Dorris, etc. And that's before you move onto the DUPers who flirted and hitched their wagon to them from the outset. History will not be kind to those politicians. At least Baker belatedly appears to have seen the light even if he probably has his own self serving reasons for doing so.
The outworkings of this Brexit deal for this place economically will be interesting to watch unfold. If it thrives within the next 10/15 years then you could find that middle England will be looking at another EU referendum within a generation. Sunak is already facing a bit of a shit storm among remainers and pro Indy Scots over his comments from earlier today when heralding the unique position we face with the dual access.
Baker definitely changed. He apologised to Ireland for his stance. He was tough on DUP. He trolled Bryson. Was seeing enjoying pints in Dublin. He was nowhere on the same level as those hateful hardline Tories you cite.
Quote from: weareros on February 28, 2023, 08:16:43 PM
Quote from: yellowcard on February 28, 2023, 05:15:58 PM
Quote from: trailer on February 28, 2023, 05:04:44 PM
Steve Baker slabbering on about his mental health. This guy. Christ on a bike. An Absolute moron who cared not one jot for the people of NI leaving us with no government, huge NHS waiting lists, political instability and double digit inflation. f**k his mental health. w**ker.
But what do you really think of Steve Baker? He was a self styled Brexit hard man but was he any worse than Mogg, Johnson, Frost, Francois, Banks, Braverman, Dorris, etc. And that's before you move onto the DUPers who flirted and hitched their wagon to them from the outset. History will not be kind to those politicians. At least Baker belatedly appears to have seen the light even if he probably has his own self serving reasons for doing so.
The outworkings of this Brexit deal for this place economically will be interesting to watch unfold. If it thrives within the next 10/15 years then you could find that middle England will be looking at another EU referendum within a generation. Sunak is already facing a bit of a shit storm among remainers and pro Indy Scots over his comments from earlier today when heralding the unique position we face with the dual access.
Baker definitely changed. He apologised to Ireland for his stance. He was tough on DUP. He trolled Bryson. Was seeing enjoying pints in Dublin. He was nowhere on the same level as those hateful hardline Tories you cite.
Beware! A leopard never changes it's spots. He's a w**ker. f**k him.
Quote from: weareros on February 28, 2023, 08:16:43 PM
Quote from: yellowcard on February 28, 2023, 05:15:58 PM
Quote from: trailer on February 28, 2023, 05:04:44 PM
Steve Baker slabbering on about his mental health. This guy. Christ on a bike. An Absolute moron who cared not one jot for the people of NI leaving us with no government, huge NHS waiting lists, political instability and double digit inflation. f**k his mental health. w**ker.
But what do you really think of Steve Baker? He was a self styled Brexit hard man but was he any worse than Mogg, Johnson, Frost, Francois, Banks, Braverman, Dorris, etc. And that's before you move onto the DUPers who flirted and hitched their wagon to them from the outset. History will not be kind to those politicians. At least Baker belatedly appears to have seen the light even if he probably has his own self serving reasons for doing so.
The outworkings of this Brexit deal for this place economically will be interesting to watch unfold. If it thrives within the next 10/15 years then you could find that middle England will be looking at another EU referendum within a generation. Sunak is already facing a bit of a shit storm among remainers and pro Indy Scots over his comments from earlier today when heralding the unique position we face with the dual access.
Baker definitely changed. He apologised to Ireland for his stance. He was tough on DUP. He trolled Bryson. Was seeing enjoying pints in Dublin. He was nowhere on the same level as those hateful hardline Tories you cite.
He very much was a hateful hardline Tory cúnt, heavily involved in the lies being spun during the Brexit referendum, lets not forget.
He's very much had a road to Damascus moment, whether his conscience got the better of him, who knows, but there's still a lot of the same cúnts pulling the strings in this Tory Government.
There's none of them can be trusted.
Quote from: johnnycool on March 01, 2023, 08:04:06 AM
Quote from: weareros on February 28, 2023, 08:16:43 PM
Quote from: yellowcard on February 28, 2023, 05:15:58 PM
Quote from: trailer on February 28, 2023, 05:04:44 PM
Steve Baker slabbering on about his mental health. This guy. Christ on a bike. An Absolute moron who cared not one jot for the people of NI leaving us with no government, huge NHS waiting lists, political instability and double digit inflation. f**k his mental health. w**ker.
But what do you really think of Steve Baker? He was a self styled Brexit hard man but was he any worse than Mogg, Johnson, Frost, Francois, Banks, Braverman, Dorris, etc. And that's before you move onto the DUPers who flirted and hitched their wagon to them from the outset. History will not be kind to those politicians. At least Baker belatedly appears to have seen the light even if he probably has his own self serving reasons for doing so.
The outworkings of this Brexit deal for this place economically will be interesting to watch unfold. If it thrives within the next 10/15 years then you could find that middle England will be looking at another EU referendum within a generation. Sunak is already facing a bit of a shit storm among remainers and pro Indy Scots over his comments from earlier today when heralding the unique position we face with the dual access.
Baker definitely changed. He apologised to Ireland for his stance. He was tough on DUP. He trolled Bryson. Was seeing enjoying pints in Dublin. He was nowhere on the same level as those hateful hardline Tories you cite.
He very much was a hateful hardline Tory cúnt, heavily involved in the lies being spun during the Brexit referendum, lets not forget.
He's very much had a road to Damascus moment, whether his conscience got the better of him, who knows, but there's still a lot of the same cúnts pulling the strings in this Tory Government.
Has he f**k. He's out for himself. And what really pisses me off more than anything is he's clearly playing the mental health card but you can't say anything because "Mental Health" There'd be f**k all wrong with his mental health if he wasn't such a ****.
And on a more broader point there is some amount of young people running about saying they're having mental health issues... some (not all) but some just using it as an excuse to not go to work, school etc. It's the new "My Granny has died" excuse. Baker and others who play this card are feeding it. Here's an idea, lay of the white lines at 5am in some lads kitchen and you'll be grand.
and what if your not taking white lines at 5am.
Possibly a bit extreme ;D
He's a tory. They are bad c**ts the lot of them and not one word that comes out of any of their mouths should be trusted.
How do you know when they're telling lies? When their lips move.
And this morning Frost is out criticising the deal. This guy... he negotiated the last deal which Unionists hated and led to the collapse of Stormont. Do these people have no self awareness? He actually campaigned to stay in EU when the Whiskey trade was paying him! What credible journalist is giving him oxygen? He is nothing more than cheap whiskey lobbyist. And Whiskey, lets face it, is pure pish.
Quote from: trailer on March 01, 2023, 09:01:09 AM
Quote from: johnnycool on March 01, 2023, 08:04:06 AM
Quote from: weareros on February 28, 2023, 08:16:43 PM
Quote from: yellowcard on February 28, 2023, 05:15:58 PM
Quote from: trailer on February 28, 2023, 05:04:44 PM
Steve Baker slabbering on about his mental health. This guy. Christ on a bike. An Absolute moron who cared not one jot for the people of NI leaving us with no government, huge NHS waiting lists, political instability and double digit inflation. f**k his mental health. w**ker.
But what do you really think of Steve Baker? He was a self styled Brexit hard man but was he any worse than Mogg, Johnson, Frost, Francois, Banks, Braverman, Dorris, etc. And that's before you move onto the DUPers who flirted and hitched their wagon to them from the outset. History will not be kind to those politicians. At least Baker belatedly appears to have seen the light even if he probably has his own self serving reasons for doing so.
The outworkings of this Brexit deal for this place economically will be interesting to watch unfold. If it thrives within the next 10/15 years then you could find that middle England will be looking at another EU referendum within a generation. Sunak is already facing a bit of a shit storm among remainers and pro Indy Scots over his comments from earlier today when heralding the unique position we face with the dual access.
Baker definitely changed. He apologised to Ireland for his stance. He was tough on DUP. He trolled Bryson. Was seeing enjoying pints in Dublin. He was nowhere on the same level as those hateful hardline Tories you cite.
He very much was a hateful hardline Tory cúnt, heavily involved in the lies being spun during the Brexit referendum, lets not forget.
He's very much had a road to Damascus moment, whether his conscience got the better of him, who knows, but there's still a lot of the same cúnts pulling the strings in this Tory Government.
Has he f**k. He's out for himself. And what really pisses me off more than anything is he's clearly playing the mental health card but you can't say anything because "Mental Health" There'd be f**k all wrong with his mental health if he wasn't such a ****.
And on a more broader point there is some amount of young people running about saying they're having mental health issues... some (not all) but some just using it as an excuse to not go to work, school etc. It's the new "My Granny has died" excuse. Baker and others who play this card are feeding it. Here's an idea, lay of the white lines at 5am in some lads kitchen and you'll be grand.
Agreed. Baker is Tory at the end of the day- they can never ever be trusted. Only thing you can sure of is they'll do what suits them and their buddies pocket!
Second paragraph is bang on.
Dup politicians are personally rich so they dont care.
Quote from: trailer on March 01, 2023, 09:16:46 AM
And this morning Frost is out criticising the deal. This guy... he negotiated the last deal which Unionists hated and led to the collapse of Stormont. Do these people have no self awareness? He actually campaigned to stay in EU when the Whiskey trade was paying him! What credible journalist is giving him oxygen? He is nothing more than cheap whiskey lobbyist. And Whiskey, lets face it, is pure pish.
They don't care. Not one bit. They'll spin and lie whatever way they think it suits them.
It is clear he's an idiot.
Quote from: Eire90 on March 01, 2023, 09:28:33 AM
Dup politicians are personally rich so they dont care.
Some possibly are, the MP's barring Shannon and maybe the girl from Portydown direction aren't personally rich I'd have thought, plus a load of the MLA's aren't so I'd say they're missing their wee salary or will be very soon if the DUP don't accept the deal and get back into Stormont.
Quote from: trailer on March 01, 2023, 09:16:46 AM
And this morning Frost is out criticising the deal. This guy... he negotiated the last deal which Unionists hated and led to the collapse of Stormont. Do these people have no self awareness? He actually campaigned to stay in EU when the Whiskey trade was paying him! What credible journalist is giving him oxygen? He is nothing more than cheap whiskey lobbyist. And Whiskey, lets face it, is pure pish.
Whoa, whoa, whoa. It's 'whisky'.
Vive la difference.
Quote from: mouview on March 01, 2023, 11:34:37 AM
Quote from: trailer on March 01, 2023, 09:16:46 AM
And this morning Frost is out criticising the deal. This guy... he negotiated the last deal which Unionists hated and led to the collapse of Stormont. Do these people have no self awareness? He actually campaigned to stay in EU when the Whiskey trade was paying him! What credible journalist is giving him oxygen? He is nothing more than cheap whiskey lobbyist. And Whiskey, lets face it, is pure pish.
Whoa, whoa, whoa. It's 'whisky'. Vive la difference.
Not in Ireland it's not.
Quote from: Snapchap on March 01, 2023, 12:16:52 PM
Quote from: mouview on March 01, 2023, 11:34:37 AM
Quote from: trailer on March 01, 2023, 09:16:46 AM
And this morning Frost is out criticising the deal. This guy... he negotiated the last deal which Unionists hated and led to the collapse of Stormont. Do these people have no self awareness? He actually campaigned to stay in EU when the Whiskey trade was paying him! What credible journalist is giving him oxygen? He is nothing more than cheap whiskey lobbyist. And Whiskey, lets face it, is pure pish.
Whoa, whoa, whoa. It's 'whisky'. Vive la difference.
Not in Ireland it's not.
Yes, but Frost was selling the Scottish product, not the Irish one.
Quote from: johnnycool on March 01, 2023, 11:07:18 AM
Quote from: Eire90 on March 01, 2023, 09:28:33 AM
Dup politicians are personally rich so they dont care.
Some possibly are, the MP's barring Shannon and maybe the girl from Portydown direction aren't personally rich I'd have thought, plus a load of the MLA's aren't so I'd say they're missing their wee salary or will be very soon if the DUP don't accept the deal and get back into Stormont.
I'd say one MP isn't as rich as many think and that's why he is constantly seeking money for favours, must have a serious addiction of sorts thats losing him money
While the DUPUDA "consider" (delay) things will the European and British Parliaments go ahead and approve the deal or does it all stop till the 17th Century says No?
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on March 01, 2023, 02:15:17 PM
Quote from: johnnycool on March 01, 2023, 11:07:18 AM
Quote from: Eire90 on March 01, 2023, 09:28:33 AM
Dup politicians are personally rich so they dont care.
Some possibly are, the MP's barring Shannon and maybe the girl from Portydown direction aren't personally rich I'd have thought, plus a load of the MLA's aren't so I'd say they're missing their wee salary or will be very soon if the DUP don't accept the deal and get back into Stormont.
I'd say one MP isn't as rich as many think and that's why he is constantly seeking money for favours, must have a serious addiction of sorts thats losing him money
There's no pockets in his Da's shroud....
It must have went somewhere!
Quote from: johnnycool on March 01, 2023, 02:27:53 PM
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on March 01, 2023, 02:15:17 PM
Quote from: johnnycool on March 01, 2023, 11:07:18 AM
Quote from: Eire90 on March 01, 2023, 09:28:33 AM
Dup politicians are personally rich so they dont care.
Some possibly are, the MP's barring Shannon and maybe the girl from Portydown direction aren't personally rich I'd have thought, plus a load of the MLA's aren't so I'd say they're missing their wee salary or will be very soon if the DUP don't accept the deal and get back into Stormont.
I'd say one MP isn't as rich as many think and that's why he is constantly seeking money for favours, must have a serious addiction of sorts thats losing him money
There's no pockets in his Da's shroud....
It must have went somewhere!
Digs and food paid for while away in London, flights also. Free bar upstairs and then whatever else they can milk off the system before they take their salary!!
So guessing some sort of addiction
The likes of Arlene Foster and Nigel Dodds are very wealthy individuals totally out of touch with what ordinary people have to face. It makes no difference to some of those people whether the health service is on its knees or if people are struggling in a cost of living crisis. Hence why they took some of the catastrophic decisions they did during Brexit negotiations that were economically self harming. It was almost solely about proving themselves as superbrits to the ERG and aiming to harden the border. For those 2 to continually resurface as commentators during ongoing negotiations just shows an incredible lack of self awareness. Far worse than Jeffrey Donaldson who was handed a poisoned chalice.
Its a disgrace that MLA's are still getting any salary whilst Stormont is down but I'd say there is an internal battle going on within the DUP between the local MLA's and the bigwigs in Westminster.
The DUP are basically tories. There are still major questions over who funded their brexit campaign and what they got out of it.
Same as tories - what is in it for them? As someone here said - loyal to the half crown and not the crown.
SNP are now arguing that Scotland should get the same EU deal that the DUP are possibly going to reject 😂
What the North got is what it had pre Brexit. Aka Remain
Quote from: imtommygunn on March 01, 2023, 04:23:11 PM
The DUP are basically tories. There are still major questions over who funded their brexit campaign and what they got out of it.
Same as tories - what is in it for them? As someone here said - loyal to the half crown and not the crown.
Worse than Tories.
Iniitially the DUP were pro Protocol. Now that almost all of the complaints have been addressed they probably won't get much mileage out of being contrary.
https://www.irishtimes.com/opinion/alex-kane-unsettled-unionists-caught-in-perfect-storm-1.4491016
Arlene Foster and other leading members had even begun a strategy of welcoming the "new opportunities" afforded by Brexit: a strategy which crashed and burned as soon as people began contacting newspapers and radio phone-ins with an ever-lengthening list of the inconveniences and non-deliveries they were experiencing
Quote from: Dougal Maguire on March 01, 2023, 04:51:39 PM
SNP are now arguing that Scotland should get the same EU deal that the DUP are possibly going to reject 😂
SNP made some fool of Sunak today- he made some own goal trying to tel the north how good they have it now with all the benefits of being in the EU. Which Sunak is denying the Scots...
Quote from: Armagh18 on March 01, 2023, 08:04:51 PM
Quote from: Dougal Maguire on March 01, 2023, 04:51:39 PM
SNP are now arguing that Scotland should get the same EU deal that the DUP are possibly going to reject 😂
SNP made some fool of Sunak today- he made some own goal trying to tel the north how good they have it now with all the benefits of being in the EU. Which Sunak is denying the Scots...
Another point scored for Scottish independence then?
BREAKING DUP John larkin says the new deal is not compatible with the act of union
The DUP in a nut shell
https://youtu.be/xHash5takWU
Paisley has gone on a solo run on Nolan ... DUP about to destroy themselves again here!!
Quote from: screenexile on March 01, 2023, 11:07:29 PM
Paisley has gone on a solo run on Nolan ... DUP about to destroy themselves again here!!
Jeffrey really has no control over his party's MPs. They seem to be on a solo run yet again.
looks like boris is about to open his mouth about it if boris says no i bet the dup will see that as a endorsement
Sorcha Eastwood is not good at this!
Quote from: screenexile on March 01, 2023, 11:34:04 PM
Sorcha Eastwood is not good at this!
Sorcha has Jim on strings. If hes not careful he'll blow a gasket
I thought she was useless and the one seat jibe was petty.
If winding Jim up is a measure of politician performance we've set a very low bar as it looks very easy!
She said absolutely nothing of substance bar repeating herself a number of times saying she wanted back into Stormont.
Quote from: screenexile on March 01, 2023, 11:40:11 PM
I thought she was useless and the one seat jibe was petty.
If winding Jim up is a measure of politician performance we've set a very low bar as it looks very easy!
She said absolutely nothing of substance bar repeating herself a number of times saying she wanted back into Stormont.
Agreed. Plenty of soundbites but not a lot else. Allister still rattled but then hes perma angry
Quote from: screenexile on March 01, 2023, 11:40:11 PM
I thought she was useless and the one seat jibe was petty.
If winding Jim up is a measure of politician performance we've set a very low bar as it looks very easy!
She said absolutely nothing of substance bar repeating herself a number of times saying she wanted back into Stormont.
Whats she meant to say when Jims busy talking over everyone swearing his allegiance to the union?
She could have said NI is in the Union until a referendum says otherwise... Jim took a gamble on Brexit pulling NI away from the South and he lost so it turned out the opposite.
Real world examples of why they wanted rigorous implementation of the protocol and real world examples of how this will help NI now... the medicines part of the new deal is massive and I've heard nobody mention it yet!!
Quote from: screenexile on March 01, 2023, 11:49:39 PM
She could have said NI is in the Union until a referendum says otherwise... Jim took a gamble on Brexit pulling NI away from the South and he lost so it turned out the opposite.
Real world examples of why they wanted rigorous implementation of the protocol and real world examples of how this will help NI now... the medicines part of the new deal is massive and I've heard nobody mention it yet!!
Why would she have to say NI is in the union. Everyone knows it is. That's a fact. Jim's the one yapping at it saying he's being subjugated and feels less british
Sinn Fein and the SDLP given up on Noaln all together? Very 1 sided approach the night.
Quote from: Wildweasel74 on March 02, 2023, 01:00:42 AM
Sinn Fein and the SDLP given up on Noaln all together? Very 1 sided approach the night.
Lads,
Turn that shíte off, it's a light entertainment show, not to be taken seriously just like Jerry Springer or your man Kilroy Silk.
Quote from: johnnycool on March 02, 2023, 08:00:17 AM
Quote from: Wildweasel74 on March 02, 2023, 01:00:42 AM
Sinn Fein and the SDLP given up on Noaln all together? Very 1 sided approach the night.
Lads,
Turn that shíte off, it's a light entertainment show, not to be taken seriously just like Jerry Springer or your man Kilroy Silk.
Agree.
How does Angry Jim get so much time on that show?
Compare him to Carroll of PBP who gets no time on it.
Quote from: marty34 on March 02, 2023, 08:14:06 AM
Quote from: johnnycool on March 02, 2023, 08:00:17 AM
Quote from: Wildweasel74 on March 02, 2023, 01:00:42 AM
Sinn Fein and the SDLP given up on Noaln all together? Very 1 sided approach the night.
Lads,
Turn that shíte off, it's a light entertainment show, not to be taken seriously just like Jerry Springer or your man Kilroy Silk.
Agree.
How does Angry Jim get so much time on that show?
Compare him to Carroll of PBP who gets no time on it.
When I said it was a light entertainment show I wasn't joking. It doesn't have to meet any rules on impartiality on the BBC like the News or a current affairs program.
Quote from: Wildweasel74 on March 02, 2023, 01:00:42 AM
Sinn Fein and the SDLP given up on Noaln all together? Very 1 sided approach the night.
If someone had landed from Mars 6 years ago they would think that the triumvirate of DUP/TUV/LCC ran this place and that everybody else was in the minority. The Nolan show has over indulged this protocol wrangling from within loyalism for far too long, its like the mouthpiece for the Newsletter. They are totally out of touch with the reality on the ground and some day the penny might drop if there isn't a backlash before then. As was often stated if he had been around in the days of the GFA I don't think there would have been any deal there either. The relationship between Nolan, Allister, Bryson, Paisley etc is a very curious one.
The phrase 'silent majority' springs to mind. All of the attention is on a smaller hard core section of the population. People who vote SF, SDLP, Alliance and even Ulster Unionist aren't being heard.
The wackos are box office. They boost ratings. That's all they are about in reality. If it was Gerry Carroll or Claire Hanna on last night none of you would be talking about it today.
I had the misfortune to hear the intro to the Nolan show on the radio this morning, it sounded like a party political broadcast for the anti protocol party. How on earth does he get away with this shite, and all on the licence payers dime.
Quote from: Keyser soze on March 02, 2023, 10:10:21 AM
I had the misfortune to hear the intro to the Nolan show on the radio this morning, it sounded like a party political broadcast for the anti protocol party. How on earth does he get away with this shite, and all on the licence payers dime.
It's light entertainment just like the two Johnnies or Hugo Duncan..
Turn off.
Quote from: johnnycool on March 02, 2023, 10:19:48 AM
Quote from: Keyser soze on March 02, 2023, 10:10:21 AM
I had the misfortune to hear the intro to the Nolan show on the radio this morning, it sounded like a party political broadcast for the anti protocol party. How on earth does he get away with this shite, and all on the licence payers dime.
It's light entertainment just like the two Johnnies or Hugo Duncan..
Turn off.
I dont listen to him, he comes on to do a promo before the 9 o'clock news.
Quote from: johnnycool on March 02, 2023, 10:19:48 AM
Quote from: Keyser soze on March 02, 2023, 10:10:21 AM
I had the misfortune to hear the intro to the Nolan show on the radio this morning, it sounded like a party political broadcast for the anti protocol party. How on earth does he get away with this shite, and all on the licence payers dime.
It's light entertainment just like the two Johnnies or Hugo Duncan..
Turn off.
The problem is he rabble rousing and sensationalising which only creates more anxiety and negativity among unionists? Compare him to a William Crawley who can let people have their say without whipping up hysteria.
Quote from: johnnycool on March 02, 2023, 10:19:48 AM
Quote from: Keyser soze on March 02, 2023, 10:10:21 AM
I had the misfortune to hear the intro to the Nolan show on the radio this morning, it sounded like a party political broadcast for the anti protocol party. How on earth does he get away with this shite, and all on the licence payers dime.
It's light entertainment just like the two Johnnies or Hugo Duncan..
Turn off.
Oh Christ, as bad as Hugo is , I'd prefer him over those two
So now that we have Ian og/ Sammy, Bin Boy and the LCC all rejecting the deal.
How does wee Jeff manoeuvre out of this never ending cul de sac?
The hardliners and the West Minister yob running the show, while it seems the rank and file DUP would actually go for the deal just to move past this mess of their own making.
Hard to see any way for wee Jeff now to sell this as the victory they thought they were going to get.
What's the story if they do reject? Will Rishi not just go ahead with a vote anyway, and it'll get enough support especially with labour suppirting. Can they not implement it without DUP/ NI assembly? Will just mean the "brake" will be out of action removing all power from theDUP to challenge Europe.
Struggling with this sovereignty thing.
"we" left the EU to have the parliament in London and the crown as the only sovereign rule maker.
But if that sovereign Government in London and signed into law by HM the Queen of the realm passes a bill such as the NI Protocol where certain EU regulations are to be honoured in a certain part of the UK, is that not within it's rights?
Quote from: trueblue1234 on March 02, 2023, 03:20:28 PM
What's the story if they do reject? Will Rishi not just go ahead with a vote anyway, and it'll get enough support especially with labour suppirting. Can they not implement it without DUP/ NI assembly? Will just mean the "brake" will be out of action removing all power from theDUP to challenge Europe.
It will go through the UK parliament irrespective of the DUP as no amount of ERG'ers will get the numbers up to stop it especially if Labour row in behind Rishi.
What the DUP need to ask themselves is what happens if Stormont is down for another year, what replaces it and how does that pan out long term?
Quote from: johnnycool on March 02, 2023, 03:30:26 PM
Quote from: trueblue1234 on March 02, 2023, 03:20:28 PM
What's the story if they do reject? Will Rishi not just go ahead with a vote anyway, and it'll get enough support especially with labour suppirting. Can they not implement it without DUP/ NI assembly? Will just mean the "brake" will be out of action removing all power from theDUP to challenge Europe.
It will go through the UK parliament irrespective of the DUP as no amount of ERG'ers will get the numbers up to stop it especially if Labour row in behind Rishi.
What the DUP need to ask themselves is what happens if Stormont is down for another year, what replaces it and how does that pan out long term?
Long term everyone knows what is coming just a question of when.
Aside from that though the DUP don't have the intelligence or foresight to plan ahead. All they know is saying no to everything!
Quote from: Armagh18 on March 02, 2023, 03:39:30 PM
Quote from: johnnycool on March 02, 2023, 03:30:26 PM
Quote from: trueblue1234 on March 02, 2023, 03:20:28 PM
What's the story if they do reject? Will Rishi not just go ahead with a vote anyway, and it'll get enough support especially with labour suppirting. Can they not implement it without DUP/ NI assembly? Will just mean the "brake" will be out of action removing all power from theDUP to challenge Europe.
It will go through the UK parliament irrespective of the DUP as no amount of ERG'ers will get the numbers up to stop it especially if Labour row in behind Rishi.
What the DUP need to ask themselves is what happens if Stormont is down for another year, what replaces it and how does that pan out long term?
Long term everyone knows what is coming just a question of when.
Aside from that though the DUP don't have the intelligence or foresight to plan ahead. All they know is saying no to everything!
And that will work for a while with an ever diminishing level of support as they circle the plug hole...
Quote from: johnnycool on March 02, 2023, 04:01:15 PM
Quote from: Armagh18 on March 02, 2023, 03:39:30 PM
Quote from: johnnycool on March 02, 2023, 03:30:26 PM
Quote from: trueblue1234 on March 02, 2023, 03:20:28 PM
What's the story if they do reject? Will Rishi not just go ahead with a vote anyway, and it'll get enough support especially with labour suppirting. Can they not implement it without DUP/ NI assembly? Will just mean the "brake" will be out of action removing all power from theDUP to challenge Europe.
It will go through the UK parliament irrespective of the DUP as no amount of ERG'ers will get the numbers up to stop it especially if Labour row in behind Rishi.
What the DUP need to ask themselves is what happens if Stormont is down for another year, what replaces it and how does that pan out long term?
Long term everyone knows what is coming just a question of when.
Aside from that though the DUP don't have the intelligence or foresight to plan ahead. All they know is saying no to everything!
And that will work for a while with an ever diminishing level of support as they circle the plug hole...
They day they get washed down it can't come soon enough for the rest of us.
Quote from: johnnycool on March 02, 2023, 03:30:26 PM
Quote from: trueblue1234 on March 02, 2023, 03:20:28 PM
What's the story if they do reject? Will Rishi not just go ahead with a vote anyway, and it'll get enough support especially with labour suppirting. Can they not implement it without DUP/ NI assembly? Will just mean the "brake" will be out of action removing all power from theDUP to challenge Europe.
It will go through the UK parliament irrespective of the DUP as no amount of ERG'ers will get the numbers up to stop it especially if Labour row in behind Rishi.
What the DUP need to ask themselves is what happens if Stormont is down for another year, what replaces it and how does that pan out long term?
64 million dollar question right there.
If the deal is dead Stormont is dead.
If Stormont is dead the GFA is dead.
If the GFA is dead no way will nationalists/ republicans accept direct rule from London.
Either the change has to be made to allow a "coalition of the willing " to take power in Stormont with the rest in opposition or Rishi has to grow a set and move straight to joint authority.
Quote from: trueblue1234 on March 02, 2023, 03:20:28 PM
What's the story if they do reject? Will Rishi not just go ahead with a vote anyway, and it'll get enough support especially with labour suppirting. Can they not implement it without DUP/ NI assembly? Will just mean the "brake" will be out of action removing all power from theDUP to challenge Europe.
I would assume it will go ahead as long as parliament votes for it. The brake is a mechanism that can't be used though if no Stormont. So they would be worse off.
Quote from: Armaghtothebone on March 02, 2023, 04:20:20 PM
Quote from: johnnycool on March 02, 2023, 03:30:26 PM
Quote from: trueblue1234 on March 02, 2023, 03:20:28 PM
What's the story if they do reject? Will Rishi not just go ahead with a vote anyway, and it'll get enough support especially with labour suppirting. Can they not implement it without DUP/ NI assembly? Will just mean the "brake" will be out of action removing all power from theDUP to challenge Europe.
It will go through the UK parliament irrespective of the DUP as no amount of ERG'ers will get the numbers up to stop it especially if Labour row in behind Rishi.
What the DUP need to ask themselves is what happens if Stormont is down for another year, what replaces it and how does that pan out long term?
64 million dollar question right there.
If the deal is dead Stormont is dead.
If Stormont is dead the GFA is dead.
If the GFA is dead no way will nationalists/ republicans accept direct rule from London.
Either the change has to be made to allow a "coalition of the willing " to take power in Stormont with the rest in opposition or Rishi has to grow a set and move straight to joint authority.
Can't see the EU wanting any more negotiations. Bigger fish to fry now. If DUP stay out of Stormont it does like very much like the current model is finished. Either direct rule or a coalition of those who do want to work together. I'd bet on the DUP seeking 'clarification' on a number of aspects to save a bit of face before returning. I think they will return - there's no where else to go.
What does Stormont actually do though?
Any laws passed in recent times has been passed by Westminster. As well as fuel payments, covid grants etc. So what is the point of Stormont?
Unionism has an image problem over on the mother ship. Most English people don't care .
Then you have stuff like this
https://www.irishtimes.com/opinion/2023/03/02/unionism-really-needs-to-ask-why-london-wont-take-its-side/
Jim Allister, leader of the TUV, noted on Tuesday morning: "So, all in all, for anyone whose compass is set by sovereignty considerations and whose goal is the strengthening, not weakening, of the union with GB, this is a deal which falls far short.
As for it being enough to cause unionism to give up its Stormont leverage and settle for this deal, which comes with the added packaging of a Sinn Féin First Minister, then, no thanks!"
As Alex Kane says in the same article
"But not one of the unionist critics of the Framework – or of any other "deal" – will ask, or has asked the only question that matters for UK governments: why do you do it?
It's a question that needs to be asked and answered, not least because unionism needs to know what it must do (or stop doing) in order to win over a more sympathetic audience in Westminster, the national media and its fellow citizens across the entire United Kingdom."
Quote from: AustinPowers on March 02, 2023, 05:47:30 PM
What does Stormont actually do though?
Any laws passed in recent times has been passed by Westminster. As well as fuel payments, covid grants etc. So what is the point of Stormont?
Devolved government.
Quote from: AustinPowers on March 02, 2023, 05:47:30 PM
What does Stormont actually do though?
Any laws passed in recent times has been passed by Westminster. As well as fuel payments, covid grants etc. So what is the point of Stormont?
In theory it brings some decision making closer to the people on things like health and education where policies are devolved. But of course it's plagued by the fact its almost completely reliant on the block grant from Treasury, the civil service is too bureaucratic, and the politicians are a bunch of amateurs who save up all the tough decisions for when they pull the house down so someone else can decide. They haven't the balls to restructure hospitals, introduce water charges etc.
But in theory it's a good thing lol. But it's a fair question to ask what significant difference would it make if it returned. I think best positive answer to that is that the people who do the real work here and go out and win business contracts and attract investment and jobs aren't undermined by political uncertainty.
they will probably reject it as boris says its bad
did paisley say he was speaking on behalf of bryson
Quote from: Eire90 on March 02, 2023, 06:39:18 PM
did paisley say he was speaking on behalf of bryson
Bryson is a member of the ' think - tank' ! You have to laugh, a shit show all round !
Quote from: Sportacus on March 02, 2023, 06:27:12 PM
Quote from: AustinPowers on March 02, 2023, 05:47:30 PM
What does Stormont actually do though?
Any laws passed in recent times has been passed by Westminster. As well as fuel payments, covid grants etc. So what is the point of Stormont?
In theory it brings some decision making closer to the people on things like health and education where policies are devolved. But of course it's plagued by the fact its almost completely reliant on the block grant from Treasury, the civil service is too bureaucratic, and the politicians are a bunch of amateurs who save up all the tough decisions for when they pull the house down so someone else can decide. They haven't the balls to restructure hospitals, introduce water charges etc.
But in theory it's a good thing lol. But it's a fair question to ask what significant difference would it make if it returned. I think best positive answer to that is that the people who do the real work here and go out and win business contracts and attract investment and jobs aren't undermined by political uncertainty.
So, no point then? ;)
So, good riddance Stormont.
Anyone listen to talkback hear William tearing this 'independent think tank' to shreds over its credibility in using the term independant. When asked who has worked with them, the 21 year old founder listed people all of the same political ideology as a 'wide range of people from other backgrounds'. He's also been to NI a few times when he was young kid on holiday
Well for a start it can give departments (like health and education) multi year budgets so they can plan and implement. As opposed to leaving decisions to senior civil servants
Dont see why English should care france is closer to England than northern ireland
Quote from: Eire90 on March 02, 2023, 07:41:05 PM
Dont see why English should care france is closer to England than northern ireland
Cumbria isn't
I can't see the Tories tolerating an ongoing shutdown of Stormont just because the DUP don't want to share power with Michelle O'Neill.
Stormont is about real life and real people.
Quote from: seafoid on March 02, 2023, 09:13:46 PM
I can't see the Tories tolerating an ongoing shutdown of Stormont just because the DUP don't want to share power with Michelle O'Neill.
Stormont is about real life and real people.
They've let it go this long. Do you really think they give a flying f**k about us?
PM needs to drop the joint authority option into a discussion with Jeffrey and co., see how they want to play it then. It's time for Westminster to move onto other things, DUP have run their course on this one, if they've any sense they'll jump at the deal and try to stabilise their position for another few years. It's like watching the march of the dodo's to their eventual destiny, not going to be pretty in the latter stages.
Apologies if this has been brought up previously......
If a deal is agreed that leaves the north in an unique situation, with access to UK/EU markets, then big companies might be drawn to that unique trading position.
Let's say big tech companies, manufacturing, medical companies set up home in the north. And the north becomes an economic boomtown, and things are good economy-wise. Plenty of jobs, better wages, people have more expendable income etc etc..... then a United ireland would sail off down the river. I mean , even if you were a hardened republican, you'd be mad to look for a United ireland when you're living in an economic utopia, and never had it so good.
Unionists just have to tuck that penalty kick in the net , and that would become a reality. Bye bye United ireland. The union would be more secure than it ever has been . If only they would have the foresight to see that far
Quote from: balladmaker on March 02, 2023, 10:01:16 PM
PM needs to drop the joint authority option into a discussion with Jeffrey and co., see how they want to play it then. It's time for Westminster to move onto other things, DUP have run their course on this one, if they've any sense they'll jump at the deal and try to stabilise their position for another few years. It's like watching the march of the dodo's to their eventual destiny, not going to be pretty in the latter stages.
I thought it was very apt that in his first 2 questions to be asked after announcing the framework he first asked the BBC and 2nd asked RTE. He's already dropping the hint that the Republic will play a part in the future of Northern Ireland
Quote from: AustinPowers on March 02, 2023, 10:02:09 PM
Apologies if this has been brought up previously......
If a deal is agreed that leaves the north in an unique situation, with access to UK/EU markets, then big companies might be drawn to that unique trading position.
Let's say big tech companies, manufacturing, medical companies set up home in the north. And the north becomes an economic boomtown, and things are good economy-wise. Plenty of jobs, better wages, people have more expendable income etc etc..... then a United ireland would sail off down the river. I mean , even if you were a hardened republican, you'd be mad to look for a United ireland when you're living in an economic utopia, and never had it so good.
Unionists just have to tuck that penalty kick in the net , and that would become a reality. Bye bye United ireland. The union would be more secure than it ever has been . If only they would have the foresight to see that far
They are that thick and bitter it'll never happen. Seriously short sighted.
Quote from: Duine Inteacht Eile on March 02, 2023, 10:19:58 PM
Quote from: AustinPowers on March 02, 2023, 10:02:09 PM
Apologies if this has been brought up previously......
If a deal is agreed that leaves the north in an unique situation, with access to UK/EU markets, then big companies might be drawn to that unique trading position.
Let's say big tech companies, manufacturing, medical companies set up home in the north. And the north becomes an economic boomtown, and things are good economy-wise. Plenty of jobs, better wages, people have more expendable income etc etc..... then a United ireland would sail off down the river. I mean , even if you were a hardened republican, you'd be mad to look for a United ireland when you're living in an economic utopia, and never had it so good.
Unionists just have to tuck that penalty kick in the net , and that would become a reality. Bye bye United ireland. The union would be more secure than it ever has been . If only they would have the foresight to see that far
I'm not sure exactly what a "hardened Republican" is in 2023 but you are expecting them to be (economic) Unionists overnight. That's a jump maybe?
Well ok, the wrong term maybe, but you know the point I'm making.
Would it be wrong to say the dup/lcc agenda is to have a hard border in ireland between north and south that they want to exhaust all options so they say the only solution is border.
So the spokesman for loyalists paramilitaries is giving airtime on bbc
Quote from: Eire90 on March 02, 2023, 10:52:32 PM
Would it be wrong to say the dup/lcc agenda is to have a hard border in ireland between north and south that they want to exhaust all options so they say the only solution is border.
Are they that stupid? As soon as a hard border goes up the calls for a unity ref get too loud to ignore. (They probably are that stupid actually)
Shape of that David Campbell on the view. Just about intelligent enough not to eat himself!
Quote from: AustinPowers on March 02, 2023, 10:02:09 PM
Apologies if this has been brought up previously......
If a deal is agreed that leaves the north in an unique situation, with access to UK/EU markets, then big companies might be drawn to that unique trading position.
Let's say big tech companies, manufacturing, medical companies set up home in the north. And the north becomes an economic boomtown, and things are good economy-wise. Plenty of jobs, better wages, people have more expendable income etc etc..... then a United ireland would sail off down the river. I mean , even if you were a hardened republican, you'd be mad to look for a United ireland when you're living in an economic utopia, and never had it so good.
Unionists just have to tuck that penalty kick in the net , and that would become a reality. Bye bye United ireland. The union would be more secure than it ever has been . If only they would have the foresight to see that far
Some businessman on with Mark Carruthers made this point last night, common sense to most but not the DUP who are being led by the nose by a taxi caller from Donaghadee who's making the most of his 15 minutes of fame.
The DUP have a choice
1. Turn NI into an economic powerhouse and make the place such a success it secures the middle ground and the Union
2. Force a hard border like the good old days and push the middle ground into a UI.
However they see it as
1. Become a Lundy and serve under SF
2. Do what Banks / Wigmore / Farage and their Russian handlers want, to prove how British they are.
I can't see the EU or London doing any more dealing with this framework now. That's it I believe.
It's a deal of an original deal so it's either, for the DUP/lcc, take it or leave it. Too much time exhausted on a small grouping.
Does the the south not have the same advantages as a member of the Single Market/Customs Union and given the Common Trade area with GB?
The North's economy is a basket case but the DUP don't care.
Quote from: marty34 on March 03, 2023, 08:39:10 AM
I can't see the EU or London doing any more dealing with this framework now. That's it I believe.
It's a deal of an original deal so it's either, for the DUP/lcc, take it or leave it. Too much time exhausted on a small grouping.
The issue was the Protocol. This was dealt with.
If the DUP can't handle a SF first minister that is not the EU's problem.
Quote from: seafoid on March 03, 2023, 08:40:34 AM
Quote from: marty34 on March 03, 2023, 08:39:10 AM
I can't see the EU or London doing any more dealing with this framework now. That's it I believe.
It's a deal of an original deal so it's either, for the DUP/lcc, take it or leave it. Too much time exhausted on a small grouping.
The issue was the Protocol. This was dealt with.
If the DUP can't handle a SF first minister that is not the EU's problem.
And neither can the EU do anything about Article VI of the act of union written 100's of years ago, currently now suspended and is driving Jim Allister nuts.
Suck it up Jim, that's what the sovereign Gov in London agreed and implemented.
We are loyal to the king they say.
Umm the king endorsed this deal.
Stop politicising this deal.
;D
Quote from: johnnycool on March 03, 2023, 08:18:08 AM
Quote from: AustinPowers on March 02, 2023, 10:02:09 PM
Apologies if this has been brought up previously......
If a deal is agreed that leaves the north in an unique situation, with access to UK/EU markets, then big companies might be drawn to that unique trading position.
Let's say big tech companies, manufacturing, medical companies set up home in the north. And the north becomes an economic boomtown, and things are good economy-wise. Plenty of jobs, better wages, people have more expendable income etc etc..... then a United ireland would sail off down the river. I mean , even if you were a hardened republican, you'd be mad to look for a United ireland when you're living in an economic utopia, and never had it so good.
Unionists just have to tuck that penalty kick in the net , and that would become a reality. Bye bye United ireland. The union would be more secure than it ever has been . If only they would have the foresight to see that far
Some businessman on with Mark Carruthers made this point last night, common sense to most but not the DUP who are being led by the nose by a taxi caller from Donaghadee who's making the most of his 15 minutes of fame.
Problem moving forward is 25% corporation tax in the north with 12.5% in the 26 counties. Would this not be a big problem to large companies setting up?
Nolan cutting the line off on Matthew O'Toole this morning, and loyalist paramilitary representatives on tv last night for as long as they like. BBC need to catch a grip.
The problem for the DUP is that people in England won't understand why they don't want to go back in. And they need people in England to understand them. Jim Allister doesn't understand this. The north is not physically attached to GB.
Quote from: Sportacus on March 03, 2023, 09:39:48 AM
Nolan cutting the line off on Matthew O'Toole this morning, and loyalist paramilitary representatives on tv last night for as long as they like. BBC need to catch a grip.
In fairness Carruthers did get stuck into Campbell.
Quote from: Walter Cronc on March 03, 2023, 07:43:40 AM
Shape of that David Campbell on the view. Just about intelligent enough not to eat himself!
Cringeworthy stuff. Who's paying him a salary?!
dont they see the king as woke
Quote from: mackers on March 03, 2023, 09:48:30 AM
Quote from: Sportacus on March 03, 2023, 09:39:48 AM
Nolan cutting the line off on Matthew O'Toole this morning, and loyalist paramilitary representatives on tv last night for as long as they like. BBC need to catch a grip.
In fairness Carruthers did get stuck into Campbell.
What i dont get is him going on about the para's having a big say in the GFA and then saying they need represented in this deal as well. Majority have moved on in the 25 years and see paras as no longer relevant in a political discussion. Rishi would have some laugh if he shows up at his door looking adjustments to the framework on behalf of UDA/UVF/RHC
Quote from: seafoid on March 03, 2023, 08:39:33 AM
Does the the south not have the same advantages as a member of the Single Market/Customs Union and given the Common Trade area with GB?
The North's economy is a basket case but the DUP don't care.
Common travel area, not common trade area.
Quote from: GJL on March 03, 2023, 09:22:49 AM
Quote from: johnnycool on March 03, 2023, 08:18:08 AM
Quote from: AustinPowers on March 02, 2023, 10:02:09 PM
Apologies if this has been brought up previously......
If a deal is agreed that leaves the north in an unique situation, with access to UK/EU markets, then big companies might be drawn to that unique trading position.
Let's say big tech companies, manufacturing, medical companies set up home in the north. And the north becomes an economic boomtown, and things are good economy-wise. Plenty of jobs, better wages, people have more expendable income etc etc..... then a United ireland would sail off down the river. I mean , even if you were a hardened republican, you'd be mad to look for a United ireland when you're living in an economic utopia, and never had it so good.
Unionists just have to tuck that penalty kick in the net , and that would become a reality. Bye bye United ireland. The union would be more secure than it ever has been . If only they would have the foresight to see that far
Some businessman on with Mark Carruthers made this point last night, common sense to most but not the DUP who are being led by the nose by a taxi caller from Donaghadee who's making the most of his 15 minutes of fame.
Problem moving forward is 25% corporation tax in the north with 12.5% in the 26 counties. Would this not be a big problem to large companies setting up?
Does the new agreement not have some allowance for setting Corp tax?
Quote from: Sportacus on March 03, 2023, 09:39:48 AM
Nolan cutting the line off on Matthew O'Toole this morning, and loyalist paramilitary representatives on tv last night for as long as they like. BBC need to catch a grip.
Ridiculous. A lot of complaints headed into the BBC off the back of it. Nolan should be hauled in front of the Editorial bosses to explain himself.
Quote from: trailer on March 03, 2023, 02:27:42 PM
Quote from: Sportacus on March 03, 2023, 09:39:48 AM
Nolan cutting the line off on Matthew O'Toole this morning, and loyalist paramilitary representatives on tv last night for as long as they like. BBC need to catch a grip.
Ridiculous. A lot of complaints headed into the BBC off the back of it. Nolan should be hauled in front of the Editorial bosses to explain himself.
What happened??
https://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/dup-s-brexit-ads-who-bankrolled-the-secretive-435-000-campaign-1.4320055
Longford-born journalist Peter Geoghegan was sitting in a train carriage in Newcastle just before the Brexit referendum in 2016 when a quest began to unravel a mystery about the Democratic Unionist Party's role in winning it.
Flicking through a "well-thumbed copy" of the Metro newspaper, Geoghegan, who works now in Glasgow and London, saw the free newspaper's front page "wraparound" advertisement.
In it, British voters were urged to "Take back control", the slogan of the official Vote Leave campaign," Geoghegan recalls in his new book, Democracy for Sale, which is published by Head of Zeus on Thursday.
"I turned the paper over. An imprint on the back said that the advert had been 'paid for by the Democratic Unionist Party'," says Geoghegan, a journalist with opendemocracy.net.
"This was very curious. Since its foundation in 1971, the Democratic Unionist Party had never run a single candidate outside Northern Ireland, " he writes.
It was a little epiphany that ultimately led him down a number of other tracks and has resulted in the book.
It is filled with the likes Steve Bannon, Donald Trump, Dominic Cummings, Boris Johnson, Nigel Farage and a former head of Saudi Arabian intelligence, Prince Nawwaf bin Abdul Aziz al Saud.
Right there, too, is the DUP, which spent £435,000 "on a massive ad campaign promoting Brexit in England. I knew that election spending in the UK is tightly capped."
"I also knew, having worked as a reporter in Belfast, that political donations to Northern Irish parties were kept secret under anachronistic local laws. Perhaps this was a way around campaign limits?"
So, would he solve the mystery?
In his sleuthing Geoghegan examines how the DUP was "bankrolled by the biggest [political] donation in Northern Irish history" to support the campaign to take the UK out of the European Union.
Geoghegan contends in Democracy for Sale that the money was channelled to the DUP through the official Vote Leave campaign because Vote Leave had almost used up its permitted spending of £7 million.
Vote Leave and the DUP have denied the claim.
Geoghegan contends that the money was channelled to the DUP through the official Vote Leave campaign
Uncommunicative group
Other organisations on both sides of the campaign were allowed additional spending of up to £700,000. The author recounts how he discovered that an uncommunicative organisation called the Constitutional Research Council (CRC) donated £435,000 to the DUP to support the Leave crusade.
•
To prop up his Vote Leave-DUP connection conviction, Geoghegan writes, "Two months before the referendum, Matthew Elliott, Vote Leave's chief executive, wrote in an email to senior staff: 'The DUP also have a £700k spending limit, which can be spent nationwide!' "
"At that stage the DUP had yet to register as a referendum participant," Geoghegan writes. "It only did so in late May. When the CRC started giving money to the DUP, Vote Leave had almost completely exhausted its spending allowance."
https://ft.com/content/abc098e2-6529-44e8-9365-ef0a1ba70194
And, beneath it all, is the Unionists' conviction that they are losing every battle. The Brexit they backed to loosen links to the Irish Republic has instead weakened ties with the UK.
Quote from: seafoid on March 03, 2023, 07:36:50 PM
https://ft.com/content/abc098e2-6529-44e8-9365-ef0a1ba70194
And, beneath it all, is the Unionists' conviction that they are losing every battle. The Brexit they backed to loosen links to the Irish Republic has instead weakened ties with the UK.
Perhaps you should change your username to Paywall?
Just how many members here do you think have a FT subscription?
Quote from: Main Street on March 03, 2023, 09:58:18 PM
Quote from: seafoid on March 03, 2023, 07:36:50 PM
https://ft.com/content/abc098e2-6529-44e8-9365-ef0a1ba70194
And, beneath it all, is the Unionists' conviction that they are losing every battle. The Brexit they backed to loosen links to the Irish Republic has instead weakened ties with the UK.
Perhaps you should change your username to Paywall?
Just how many members here do you think have a FT subscription?
If someone erects a 10ft wall just use a 12ft ladder https://12ft.io/proxy?q=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.ft.com%2Fcontent%2Fabc098e2-6529-44e8-9365-ef0a1ba70194
Quote from: Main Street on March 03, 2023, 09:58:18 PM
Quote from: seafoid on March 03, 2023, 07:36:50 PM
https://ft.com/content/abc098e2-6529-44e8-9365-ef0a1ba70194
And, beneath it all, is the Unionists' conviction that they are losing every battle. The Brexit they backed to loosen links to the Irish Republic has instead weakened ties with the UK.
Perhaps you should change your username to Paywall?
Just how many members here do you think have a FT subscription?
FT is £55 a month online sub
Quote from: dec on March 03, 2023, 10:31:33 PM
Quote from: Main Street on March 03, 2023, 09:58:18 PM
Quote from: seafoid on March 03, 2023, 07:36:50 PM
https://ft.com/content/abc098e2-6529-44e8-9365-ef0a1ba70194
And, beneath it all, is the Unionists' conviction that they are losing every battle. The Brexit they backed to loosen links to the Irish Republic has instead weakened ties with the UK.
Perhaps you should change your username to Paywall?
Just how many members here do you think have a FT subscription?
If someone erects a 10ft wall just use a 12ft ladder https://12ft.io/proxy?q=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.ft.com%2Fcontent%2Fabc098e2-6529-44e8-9365-ef0a1ba70194
You don't even need to, with the FT if you enter the link into Google Search then you generally are able to read the article or if you open an account you get a few free articles.
Also if you clicked every link SF put on here you'd not have very much time left in your life so ignoring might be a better policy ;D
Quote from: imtommygunn on March 04, 2023, 08:41:40 AM
Also if you clicked every link SF put on here you'd not have very much time left in your life so ignoring might be a better policy ;D
+1,000,000
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on March 04, 2023, 08:43:14 AM
Quote from: imtommygunn on March 04, 2023, 08:41:40 AM
Also if you clicked every link SF put on here you'd not have very much time left in your life so ignoring might be a better policy ;D
+1,000,000
Ah lads yous are a bit harsh ;D. I appreciate the articles to the relevant subject matters. Definitely a lot of good ones that I wouldn't have came across otherwise. Keep sticking them up Seaf!
Quote from: RedHand88 on March 03, 2023, 02:38:26 PM
Quote from: trailer on March 03, 2023, 02:27:42 PM
Quote from: Sportacus on March 03, 2023, 09:39:48 AM
Nolan cutting the line off on Matthew O'Toole this morning, and loyalist paramilitary representatives on tv last night for as long as they like. BBC need to catch a grip.
Ridiculous. A lot of complaints headed into the BBC off the back of it. Nolan should be hauled in front of the Editorial bosses to explain himself.
What happened??
Along these lines: MO'T says big David Campbell's appearance on The View was sinister. Nolan says don't be casting aspersions on Campbell. MO'T says well ok, but I think we all know the craic. And Nolan cuts him off quick as a flash. Couldn't wait to get showing him who is boss.
Not right in my opinion. O'Toole has a mandate and it's valid for him to be on the airwaves. Campbell shouldn't be anywhere near a studio, and if he was theres only one question - when are the drug dealers leaving.
Quote from: Sportacus on March 04, 2023, 10:04:31 AM
Quote from: RedHand88 on March 03, 2023, 02:38:26 PM
Quote from: trailer on March 03, 2023, 02:27:42 PM
Quote from: Sportacus on March 03, 2023, 09:39:48 AM
Nolan cutting the line off on Matthew O'Toole this morning, and loyalist paramilitary representatives on tv last night for as long as they like. BBC need to catch a grip.
Ridiculous. A lot of complaints headed into the BBC off the back of it. Nolan should be hauled in front of the Editorial bosses to explain himself.
What happened??
Along these lines: MO'T says big David Campbell's appearance on The View was sinister. Nolan says don't be casting aspersions on Campbell. MO'T says well ok, but I think we all know the craic. And Nolan cuts him off quick as a flash. Couldn't wait to get showing him who is boss.
Not right in my opinion. O'Toole has a mandate and it's valid for him to be on the airwaves. Campbell shouldn't be anywhere near a studio, and if he was theres only one question - when are the drug dealers leaving.
SDLP should boycott Nolan now. Simple as.
Quote from: marty34 on March 04, 2023, 10:38:04 AM
Quote from: Sportacus on March 04, 2023, 10:04:31 AM
Quote from: RedHand88 on March 03, 2023, 02:38:26 PM
Quote from: trailer on March 03, 2023, 02:27:42 PM
Quote from: Sportacus on March 03, 2023, 09:39:48 AM
Nolan cutting the line off on Matthew O'Toole this morning, and loyalist paramilitary representatives on tv last night for as long as they like. BBC need to catch a grip.
Ridiculous. A lot of complaints headed into the BBC off the back of it. Nolan should be hauled in front of the Editorial bosses to explain himself.
What happened??
Along these lines: MO'T says big David Campbell's appearance on The View was sinister. Nolan says don't be casting aspersions on Campbell. MO'T says well ok, but I think we all know the craic. And Nolan cuts him off quick as a flash. Couldn't wait to get showing him who is boss.
Not right in my opinion. O'Toole has a mandate and it's valid for him to be on the airwaves. Campbell shouldn't be anywhere near a studio, and if he was theres only one question - when are the drug dealers leaving.
SDLP should boycott Nolan now. Simple as.
Everyone should boycott him.
Quote from: Square Ball on March 04, 2023, 11:27:29 AM
Quote from: marty34 on March 04, 2023, 10:38:04 AM
Quote from: Sportacus on March 04, 2023, 10:04:31 AM
Quote from: RedHand88 on March 03, 2023, 02:38:26 PM
Quote from: trailer on March 03, 2023, 02:27:42 PM
Quote from: Sportacus on March 03, 2023, 09:39:48 AM
Nolan cutting the line off on Matthew O'Toole this morning, and loyalist paramilitary representatives on tv last night for as long as they like. BBC need to catch a grip.
Ridiculous. A lot of complaints headed into the BBC off the back of it. Nolan should be hauled in front of the Editorial bosses to explain himself.
What happened??
Along these lines: MO'T says big David Campbell's appearance on The View was sinister. Nolan says don't be casting aspersions on Campbell. MO'T says well ok, but I think we all know the craic. And Nolan cuts him off quick as a flash. Couldn't wait to get showing him who is boss.
Not right in my opinion. O'Toole has a mandate and it's valid for him to be on the airwaves. Campbell shouldn't be anywhere near a studio, and if he was theres only one question - when are the drug dealers leaving.
SDLP should boycott Nolan now. Simple as.
Everyone should boycott him.
Nolan pushes an agenda which is not constructive
People should not give him a profile
If it wasn't for him the likes of Bryson wouldn't have a profile. I wouldn't go near the nolan show but it's influential and is not in any way constructive for this place at all. It gives voices to people who if they were in a bar you wouldn't entertain. Tbh it's dangerous.
Why isn't he asking questions of the likes of your man Campbell who is a sinister being.
Everyone has an agenda, Nolan is no different. The problem is the platform he has and whether he likes it or not, he is destructive. Needs taken off the air given the lack of editorial balance and his apparent agenda to only further a unionist/loyalist cause. All nationalists should boycott him, I think his handling of Mathew O'Toole yesterday will be a watershed moment for Nolan.
Quote from: Square Ball on March 04, 2023, 11:27:29 AM
Quote from: marty34 on March 04, 2023, 10:38:04 AM
Quote from: Sportacus on March 04, 2023, 10:04:31 AM
Quote from: RedHand88 on March 03, 2023, 02:38:26 PM
Quote from: trailer on March 03, 2023, 02:27:42 PM
Quote from: Sportacus on March 03, 2023, 09:39:48 AM
Nolan cutting the line off on Matthew O'Toole this morning, and loyalist paramilitary representatives on tv last night for as long as they like. BBC need to catch a grip.
Ridiculous. A lot of complaints headed into the BBC off the back of it. Nolan should be hauled in front of the Editorial bosses to explain himself.
What happened??
Along these lines: MO'T says big David Campbell's appearance on The View was sinister. Nolan says don't be casting aspersions on Campbell. MO'T says well ok, but I think we all know the craic. And Nolan cuts him off quick as a flash. Couldn't wait to get showing him who is boss.
Not right in my opinion. O'Toole has a mandate and it's valid for him to be on the airwaves. Campbell shouldn't be anywhere near a studio, and if he was theres only one question - when are the drug dealers leaving.
SDLP should boycott Nolan now. Simple as.
Everyone should boycott him.
No, nationalists should.
He has Bryson and Angry Jim on regularly.
SDLP need to cut their links with him.
Allister wants Jim Crow in the North. No uppity Taigs becoming First Minister. He is insane
Sf allister is just saying what some of the rest of them are thinking. At least he says it.
Quote from: balladmaker on March 04, 2023, 01:20:34 PM
Everyone has an agenda, Nolan is no different. The problem is the platform he has and whether he likes it or not, he is destructive. Needs taken off the air given the lack of editorial balance and his apparent agenda to only further a unionist/loyalist cause. All nationalists should boycott him, I think his handling of Mathew O'Toole yesterday will be a watershed moment for Nolan.
Does Nolan set the agenda/topic/discussion on his shows? Or is there a team above him who dictate the topics?
Quote from: dec on March 03, 2023, 10:31:33 PM
Quote from: Main Street on March 03, 2023, 09:58:18 PM
Quote from: seafoid on March 03, 2023, 07:36:50 PM
https://ft.com/content/abc098e2-6529-44e8-9365-ef0a1ba70194
And, beneath it all, is the Unionists' conviction that they are losing every battle. The Brexit they backed to loosen links to the Irish Republic has instead weakened ties with the UK.
Perhaps you should change your username to Paywall?
Just how many members here do you think have a FT subscription?
If someone erects a 10ft wall just use a 12ft ladder https://12ft.io/proxy?q=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.ft.com%2Fcontent%2Fabc098e2-6529-44e8-9365-ef0a1ba70194
Thanks.
Though that's strange, I had tried the ladder link bypass but it didn't work, message -
Request timed out try again later .
Your working ladder link contains 2Fwww.ft.com
my ladder link has 2Fft.com
Quote from: imtommygunn on March 04, 2023, 01:48:42 PM
Sf allister is just saying what some of the rest of them are thinking. At least he says it.
Yip, Poots was holding his nose when in office with SF, Arlene and her crocodiles statement..
some hide it better than others, but it's there nonetheless
8 reasons the DUP are in this hole
There is no political advantage in grasping reality if your voters don't (Jim Allister is also at it)
After correcting for birth, power goes to the people most committed to getting it. •
An inability to admit past error
If your genuine beliefs contradict reality, deny reality
Denying reality proves your fanaticism to other fanatics.
Laziness
Stupidity
Ignorance
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j-fWDrZSiZs
Quote from: AustinPowers on March 04, 2023, 01:58:42 PM
Quote from: balladmaker on March 04, 2023, 01:20:34 PM
Everyone has an agenda, Nolan is no different. The problem is the platform he has and whether he likes it or not, he is destructive. Needs taken off the air given the lack of editorial balance and his apparent agenda to only further a unionist/loyalist cause. All nationalists should boycott him, I think his handling of Mathew O'Toole yesterday will be a watershed moment for Nolan.
Does Nolan set the agenda/topic/discussion on his shows? Or is there a team above him who dictate the topics?
I'm sure they have production meetings where they agree on topics to cover ... the problem is Nolan is live at the mic, how he handles issues is on him, and his bias is obvious for all to see. I understand when he has to tow the legal line in the BBC and move discussions away from possible litigation, however he does let a very pro-unionist/loyalist view point come through in his questioning time and again.
I have just listened to the earlier discussed March 3rd Nolan show where Matthew O'Toole was cancelled by Nolan in midstream saying that stuff about Campbell, ironic considering Nolan had just made mention of the freedom of speech which allows loyalists groups to mouth off their threats of violence.
It's a blatant obvious ploy straight from the handbook of the parliamentary unionist party of the day , 'we're not violent, we don't support violence, but if our 7 demands are not met there are these mad loyalist thugs who will create mayhem this summer'.
Implication is, support our demands or else. That is the text book definition of a politician being sinister.
Quote from: Main Street on March 07, 2023, 08:27:35 PM
I have just listened to the earlier discussed March 3rd Nolan show where Matthew O'Toole was cancelled by Nolan in midstream saying that stuff about Campbell, ironic considering Nolan had just made mention of the freedom of speech which allows loyalists groups to mouth off their threats of violence.
It's a blatant obvious ploy straight from the handbook of the parliamentary unionist party of the day , 'we're not violent, we don't support violence, but if our 7 demands are not met there are these mad loyalist thugs who will create mayhem this summer'.
Implication is, support our demands or else. That is the text book definition of a politician being sinister.
Anybody know has tthe SDLP went back on Nolan since that?
Quote from: marty34 on March 07, 2023, 08:34:57 PM
Quote from: Main Street on March 07, 2023, 08:27:35 PM
I have just listened to the earlier discussed March 3rd Nolan show where Matthew O'Toole was cancelled by Nolan in midstream saying that stuff about Campbell, ironic considering Nolan had just made mention of the freedom of speech which allows loyalists groups to mouth off their threats of violence.
It's a blatant obvious ploy straight from the handbook of the parliamentary unionist party of the day , 'we're not violent, we don't support violence, but if our 7 demands are not met there are these mad loyalist thugs who will create mayhem this summer'.
Implication is, support our demands or else. That is the text book definition of a politician being sinister.
Anybody know has tthe SDLP went back on Nolan since that?
They put out a statement criticising BBC and asking them to clarify their editorial position.
Poor Jim, his old friend RDE has forsaken him and endorsed the new agreement. Will she now be a target along with King Charles.
Roof deadly the lundy! Who'd have thought.
I do wonder how long the DUP will take to give their thoughts on the Framework.
Or indeed, how long they will be allowed to take by the UK govt.
Surely there isn't any logical reason why, more than a week later, they still haven't given their opinion on whether they can support it or not.
Quote from: Smokin Joe on March 09, 2023, 10:53:40 AM
I do wonder how long the DUP will take to give their thoughts on the Framework.
Or indeed, how long they will be allowed to take by the UK govt.
Surely there isn't any logical reason why, more than a week later, they still haven't given their opinion on whether they can support it or not.
They said by the end of the month, must be to piss people off but sure they'll still say no? Or must be gauging what's in it for them first from behind closed doors, all sorts of peerages being promised as sweeteners
They're putting together a panel to assess it.
https://www.newsletter.co.uk/news/politics/windsor-framework-and-northern-ireland-protocol-who-is-who-on-dup-leader-sir-jeffrey-donaldsons-consultative-group-to-assess-eu-uk-agreement-and-what-have-they-said-about-the-protocol-4054064
I firmly believe they'll accept it (& have already come to that conclusion) this is all showboating for the bonehead elements. Also timed to run into Council election campaign.
Jim Alister feels his britishness is being eroded away bit by bit. Can we help him with a full list of that erosion?
1793 Penal Laws Removed (despite loyalist outrage)
1829 Catholic Emancipation (despite loyalist outrage)
1922 Ireland breaks free (despite loyalist outrage)
1973 Sunningdale Agreement (despite loyalist outrage)
1985 Anglo-Irish Agreement (despite loyalist outrage)
1998 Good Friday Agreement (loyalist outrage)
2016 Brexit Vote (loyalist jubilation)
2019 NI Protocol (loyalist outrage)
2023 Windsor Framework (loyalist outrage)
Irish Church Act 1869 removed Protestantism as state religion in Ireland.
Don't forget about removing the fleg from Belfast City Hall ;)
Have to watch the Tories that to appease them they don't write something into NI Act that makes a border poll harder to achieve. That ultimately is what the DUP want out of this, a rewriting of the GFA to lock North into UK. They wouldn't care if every sausage was blocked at Larne and sent back to Cumberland if they achieved that.
Quote from: weareros on March 09, 2023, 01:32:59 PM
Have to watch the Tories that to appease them they don't write something into NI Act that makes a border poll harder to achieve. That ultimately is what the DUP want out of this, a rewriting of the GFA to lock North into UK. They wouldn't care if every sausage was blocked at Larne and sent back to Cumberland if they achieved that.
Yeah, I said that a while back, saying they're trying to re-write the GFA to say something similar.
Quote from: marty34 on March 09, 2023, 02:33:59 PM
Quote from: weareros on March 09, 2023, 01:32:59 PM
Have to watch the Tories that to appease them they don't write something into NI Act that makes a border poll harder to achieve. That ultimately is what the DUP want out of this, a rewriting of the GFA to lock North into UK. They wouldn't care if every sausage was blocked at Larne and sent back to Cumberland if they achieved that.
Yeah, I said that a while back, saying they're trying to re-write the GFA to say something similar.
Surely even this duplicitous shower of Tory scum couldn't try and do that in an international agreement OR could they?
The mood music coming from the US was that this would be unacceptable and not tolerated.
Quote from: johnnycool on March 09, 2023, 02:38:54 PM
Quote from: marty34 on March 09, 2023, 02:33:59 PM
Quote from: weareros on March 09, 2023, 01:32:59 PM
Have to watch the Tories that to appease them they don't write something into NI Act that makes a border poll harder to achieve. That ultimately is what the DUP want out of this, a rewriting of the GFA to lock North into UK. They wouldn't care if every sausage was blocked at Larne and sent back to Cumberland if they achieved that.
Yeah, I said that a while back, saying they're trying to re-write the GFA to say something similar.
Surely even this duplicitous shower of Tory scum couldn't try and do that in an international agreement OR could they?
Why couldn't they? They could put in some wishy washy new act to get this protocol framework over the line. Wouldn't surprise me.
The Torys don't care. It'll be a fudge, like the Windsor Framework - all smoke and mirrors.
Quote from: marty34 on March 09, 2023, 02:42:04 PM
Quote from: johnnycool on March 09, 2023, 02:38:54 PM
Quote from: marty34 on March 09, 2023, 02:33:59 PM
Quote from: weareros on March 09, 2023, 01:32:59 PM
Have to watch the Tories that to appease them they don't write something into NI Act that makes a border poll harder to achieve. That ultimately is what the DUP want out of this, a rewriting of the GFA to lock North into UK. They wouldn't care if every sausage was blocked at Larne and sent back to Cumberland if they achieved that.
Yeah, I said that a while back, saying they're trying to re-write the GFA to say something similar.
Surely even this duplicitous shower of Tory scum couldn't try and do that in an international agreement OR could they?
Why couldn't they? They could put in some wishy washy new act to get this protocol framework over the line. Wouldn't surprise me.
The Torys don't care. It'll be a fudge, like the Windsor Framework - all smoke and mirrors.
No chance. UK Government would just be swopping DUP outrage for Nationalist outrage
Quote from: bennydorano on March 09, 2023, 03:00:07 PM
Quote from: marty34 on March 09, 2023, 02:42:04 PM
Quote from: johnnycool on March 09, 2023, 02:38:54 PM
Quote from: marty34 on March 09, 2023, 02:33:59 PM
Quote from: weareros on March 09, 2023, 01:32:59 PM
Have to watch the Tories that to appease them they don't write something into NI Act that makes a border poll harder to achieve. That ultimately is what the DUP want out of this, a rewriting of the GFA to lock North into UK. They wouldn't care if every sausage was blocked at Larne and sent back to Cumberland if they achieved that.
Yeah, I said that a while back, saying they're trying to re-write the GFA to say something similar.
Surely even this duplicitous shower of Tory scum couldn't try and do that in an international agreement OR could they?
Why couldn't they? They could put in some wishy washy new act to get this protocol framework over the line. Wouldn't surprise me.
The Torys don't care. It'll be a fudge, like the Windsor Framework - all smoke and mirrors.
No chance. UK Government would just be swopping DUP outrage for Nationalist outrage
Uncle Joe, oh Uncle Joe, those Brits are at it again!!!
Quote from: bennydorano on March 09, 2023, 03:00:07 PM
Quote from: marty34 on March 09, 2023, 02:42:04 PM
Quote from: johnnycool on March 09, 2023, 02:38:54 PM
Quote from: marty34 on March 09, 2023, 02:33:59 PM
Quote from: weareros on March 09, 2023, 01:32:59 PM
Have to watch the Tories that to appease them they don't write something into NI Act that makes a border poll harder to achieve. That ultimately is what the DUP want out of this, a rewriting of the GFA to lock North into UK. They wouldn't care if every sausage was blocked at Larne and sent back to Cumberland if they achieved that.
Yeah, I said that a while back, saying they're trying to re-write the GFA to say something similar.
Surely even this duplicitous shower of Tory scum couldn't try and do that in an international agreement OR could they?
Why couldn't they? They could put in some wishy washy new act to get this protocol framework over the line. Wouldn't surprise me.
The Torys don't care. It'll be a fudge, like the Windsor Framework - all smoke and mirrors.
No chance. UK Government would just be swopping DUP outrage for Nationalist outrage
Probably not but what would nationalists do?
Can't see them out protesting alà Bryson and the loyalists.
Even if the DUP got their way via the Windsor Framework a few weeks ago, what would nationalists do?
Quote from: marty34 on March 09, 2023, 03:08:35 PM
Quote from: bennydorano on March 09, 2023, 03:00:07 PM
Quote from: marty34 on March 09, 2023, 02:42:04 PM
Quote from: johnnycool on March 09, 2023, 02:38:54 PM
Quote from: marty34 on March 09, 2023, 02:33:59 PM
Quote from: weareros on March 09, 2023, 01:32:59 PM
Have to watch the Tories that to appease them they don't write something into NI Act that makes a border poll harder to achieve. That ultimately is what the DUP want out of this, a rewriting of the GFA to lock North into UK. They wouldn't care if every sausage was blocked at Larne and sent back to Cumberland if they achieved that.
Yeah, I said that a while back, saying they're trying to re-write the GFA to say something similar.
Surely even this duplicitous shower of Tory scum couldn't try and do that in an international agreement OR could they?
Why couldn't they? They could put in some wishy washy new act to get this protocol framework over the line. Wouldn't surprise me.
The Torys don't care. It'll be a fudge, like the Windsor Framework - all smoke and mirrors.
No chance. UK Government would just be swopping DUP outrage for Nationalist outrage
Probably not but what would nationalists do?
Can't see them out protesting alà Bryson and the loyalists.
Even if the DUP got their way via the Windsor Framework a few weeks ago, what would nationalists do?
Their way? As in a border? There'd be serious protests. Probably ends up in violence at some point.
I think Rishi isn't stupid, he wants to move on from Brexit and keep close enough ties with the eu trade wise.
Quote from: Armagh18 on March 09, 2023, 03:11:55 PM
Quote from: marty34 on March 09, 2023, 03:08:35 PM
Quote from: bennydorano on March 09, 2023, 03:00:07 PM
Quote from: marty34 on March 09, 2023, 02:42:04 PM
Quote from: johnnycool on March 09, 2023, 02:38:54 PM
Quote from: marty34 on March 09, 2023, 02:33:59 PM
Quote from: weareros on March 09, 2023, 01:32:59 PM
Have to watch the Tories that to appease them they don't write something into NI Act that makes a border poll harder to achieve. That ultimately is what the DUP want out of this, a rewriting of the GFA to lock North into UK. They wouldn't care if every sausage was blocked at Larne and sent back to Cumberland if they achieved that.
Yeah, I said that a while back, saying they're trying to re-write the GFA to say something similar.
Surely even this duplicitous shower of Tory scum couldn't try and do that in an international agreement OR could they?
Why couldn't they? They could put in some wishy washy new act to get this protocol framework over the line. Wouldn't surprise me.
The Torys don't care. It'll be a fudge, like the Windsor Framework - all smoke and mirrors.
No chance. UK Government would just be swopping DUP outrage for Nationalist outrage
Probably not but what would nationalists do?
Can't see them out protesting alà Bryson and the loyalists.
Even if the DUP got their way via the Windsor Framework a few weeks ago, what would nationalists do?
Their way? As in a border? There'd be serious protests. Probably ends up in violence at some point.
I think Rishi isn't stupid, he wants to move on from Brexit and keep close enough ties with the eu trade wise.
Especially with the US and EU now in discussions about a free/ closer trade agreement.
Hard border I don't think US would be impressed by either and that is probably a factor.
There will never be a hard border. It would not last in South Armagh for starters.
Rishi wants economic growth. The hard Brexit was minus 5% .
Hopefully SF pull out of Stormont if the DUP agree to a change ;D ;D ;D
Was rinse repeat
Nothing to do with a hard border. It's all about getting the super majority bill for all future referendums though Westminster. Second reading is later this month. That removes 50%+1 in a border poll.
If they try stunts with the GFA they will be great lads among the knuckle draggers around Larne, but will drive numbers of soft u and Alliance voters towards vote yes. Great strategy lads.
Id love to see Eastwood turn Jeffrey over in Lisburn next GE. Like Dodd's career here ending in embarrassment. In fact if they keep this poor me attitude up SF and SDLP should stand aside in Lisburn.
Quote from: weareros on March 09, 2023, 04:29:04 PM
Nothing to do with a hard border. It's all about getting the super majority bill for all future referendums though Westminster. Second reading is later this month. That removes 50%+1 in a border poll.
So the GFA is fucked then?
They're shouting it's f**ked while f**king it at the same time. Clever when you think about it...
I don't think that super majority is going to be a thing. It was Ian Og taking the piss as he usually does.
Quote from: imtommygunn on March 09, 2023, 05:03:35 PM
They're shouting it's f**ked while f**king it at the same time. Clever when you think about it...
I don't think that super majority is going to be a thing. It was Ian Og taking the piss as he usually does.
While it's Paisley taking the piss, the Tories had already been discussing changing rules for a Scottish Indy referendum to a super majority. He will get support for this. The DUP and TUV have no interest in protecting the GFA. They never supported it. They have been angling for awhile to change what consent means. It means a simple majority for constitutional change and Dublin/Nationalist parties need to stay awake.
Gregory must be feeling a bit left out seeing all his colleagues being anointed with knighthoods, damehoods, baronesses and Lords. Trying a bit too hard to defend his Tory/ERG colleagues in a monologue about Lineker today was classic Gregory. He's definitely given himself a chance but is probably still behind Sammy and Ian Og in the queue.
We have all been laughing at the DUP over the last couple of months/years as they seemed to dig themselves further into problems of their own creation. The more that this goes on the more I fear they will win their battle and win it handsomely. Mad to think that a Party that holds just over 20% of the vote in Northern Ireland should hold so much power. I mean nearly 80% didn't vote for them if you look at it from the other perspective. Crazy!
Quote from: weareros on March 09, 2023, 06:10:43 PM
Quote from: imtommygunn on March 09, 2023, 05:03:35 PM
They're shouting it's f**ked while f**king it at the same time. Clever when you think about it...
I don't think that super majority is going to be a thing. It was Ian Og taking the piss as he usually does.
While it's Paisley taking the piss, the Tories had already been discussing changing rules for a Scottish Indy referendum to a super majority. He will get support for this. The DUP and TUV have no interest in protecting the GFA. They never supported it. They have been angling for awhile to change what consent means. It means a simple majority for constitutional change and Dublin/Nationalist parties need to stay awake.
Dublin parties would be quite happy to move away from 50%+1. In fact they regularly voice such support. Micheal Martin has spoken of his desire for a wholly undemocratic and anti-GFA "parallel consent" mechanism while Varadkar has repeatedly stated the view that 50%+1 would not be a success.
Both FF and FG are vocal advocates of what essentially is a unionist veto of a pro unity vote.
Quote from: marty34 on March 09, 2023, 03:08:35 PM
Quote from: bennydorano on March 09, 2023, 03:00:07 PM
Quote from: marty34 on March 09, 2023, 02:42:04 PM
Quote from: johnnycool on March 09, 2023, 02:38:54 PM
Quote from: marty34 on March 09, 2023, 02:33:59 PM
Quote from: weareros on March 09, 2023, 01:32:59 PM
Have to watch the Tories that to appease them they don't write something into NI Act that makes a border poll harder to achieve. That ultimately is what the DUP want out of this, a rewriting of the GFA to lock North into UK. They wouldn't care if every sausage was blocked at Larne and sent back to Cumberland if they achieved that.
Yeah, I said that a while back, saying they're trying to re-write the GFA to say something similar.
Surely even this duplicitous shower of Tory scum couldn't try and do that in an international agreement OR could they?
Why couldn't they? They could put in some wishy washy new act to get this protocol framework over the line. Wouldn't surprise me.
The Torys don't care. It'll be a fudge, like the Windsor Framework - all smoke and mirrors.
No chance. UK Government would just be swopping DUP outrage for Nationalist outrage
Probably not but what would nationalists do?
Can't see them out protesting alà Bryson and the loyalists.
Even if the DUP got their way via the Windsor Framework a few weeks ago, what would nationalists do?
https://www.ft.com/content/fcf6e9f2-82fd-4a03-8945-a3679c6bc640
Even the most brilliant political strategies must ultimately be measured against their outcomes.
The DUP are going to end up going back with the GFA in place. They have no powerful allies in London or the US
What always bugs me is the hypocrisy of unionism, its as if all the evil since partition was down to the "minority" without whom this "wee country" would be paradise. It bugs me even more that no-one ever calls this out, not the media, not the SDLP, not Alliance and SF only in very limited circumstances and then very quietly. Nationalists have be tip toeing around unionism for a century, it is no longer the "minority" a term UU politicians of old used in the most perforative fashion. Equality can no longer be a one way street.
Quote from: Snapchap on March 10, 2023, 07:50:12 AM
Quote from: weareros on March 09, 2023, 06:10:43 PM
Quote from: imtommygunn on March 09, 2023, 05:03:35 PM
They're shouting it's f**ked while f**king it at the same time. Clever when you think about it...
I don't think that super majority is going to be a thing. It was Ian Og taking the piss as he usually does.
While it's Paisley taking the piss, the Tories had already been discussing changing rules for a Scottish Indy referendum to a super majority. He will get support for this. The DUP and TUV have no interest in protecting the GFA. They never supported it. They have been angling for awhile to change what consent means. It means a simple majority for constitutional change and Dublin/Nationalist parties need to stay awake.
Dublin parties would be quite happy to move away from 50%+1. In fact they regularly voice such support. Micheal Martin has spoken of his desire for a wholly undemocratic and anti-GFA "parallel consent" mechanism while Varadkar has repeatedly stated the view that 50%+1 would not be a success.
Both FF and FG are vocal advocates of what essentially is a unionist veto of a pro unity vote.
It's funny because you always hear the line about Britain don't want the north and would get rid if they could. Same with the south though , they clearly don't want the north . The people maybe, but not the establishment.
Quote from: AustinPowers on March 10, 2023, 12:34:35 PM
Quote from: Snapchap on March 10, 2023, 07:50:12 AM
Quote from: weareros on March 09, 2023, 06:10:43 PM
Quote from: imtommygunn on March 09, 2023, 05:03:35 PM
They're shouting it's f**ked while f**king it at the same time. Clever when you think about it...
I don't think that super majority is going to be a thing. It was Ian Og taking the piss as he usually does.
While it's Paisley taking the piss, the Tories had already been discussing changing rules for a Scottish Indy referendum to a super majority. He will get support for this. The DUP and TUV have no interest in protecting the GFA. They never supported it. They have been angling for awhile to change what consent means. It means a simple majority for constitutional change and Dublin/Nationalist parties need to stay awake.
Dublin parties would be quite happy to move away from 50%+1. In fact they regularly voice such support. Micheal Martin has spoken of his desire for a wholly undemocratic and anti-GFA "parallel consent" mechanism while Varadkar has repeatedly stated the view that 50%+1 would not be a success.
Both FF and FG are vocal advocates of what essentially is a unionist veto of a pro unity vote.
It's funny because you always hear the line about Britain don't want the north and would get rid if they could. Same with the south though , they clearly don't want the north . The people maybe, but not the establishment.
Next election should sort that out hopefully.
Quote from: Applesisapples on March 10, 2023, 11:01:05 AM
What always bugs me is the hypocrisy of unionism, its as if all the evil since partition was down to the "minority" without whom this "wee country" would be paradise. It bugs me even more that no-one ever calls this out, not the media, not the SDLP, not Alliance and SF only in very limited circumstances and then very quietly. Nationalists have be tip toeing around unionism for a century, it is no longer the "minority" a term UU politicians of old used in the most perforative fashion. Equality can no longer be a one way street.
The other thing that gets me is Protestant emigration and why nothing is ever done about it. They don't actually care. It doesn't make sense
Growing up It was common to hear the Catholic community referred to as the minority community, Usually by some arsehole Secretary of State. It is a very colonial phrase.
It is no longer in use for obvious reasons. There no longer is a majority community and every other reason for the existence of Northern Ireland is defunct.
The Time For Unity is Now.
Quote from: seafoid on March 10, 2023, 01:34:40 PM
Quote from: Applesisapples on March 10, 2023, 11:01:05 AM
What always bugs me is the hypocrisy of unionism, its as if all the evil since partition was down to the "minority" without whom this "wee country" would be paradise. It bugs me even more that no-one ever calls this out, not the media, not the SDLP, not Alliance and SF only in very limited circumstances and then very quietly. Nationalists have be tip toeing around unionism for a century, it is no longer the "minority" a term UU politicians of old used in the most perforative fashion. Equality can no longer be a one way street.
The other thing that gets me is Protestant emigration and why nothing is ever done about it. They don't actually care. It doesn't make sense
I'm doing a course at UU and there is 120 at a lecture on a Monday, from going through the class register and the amount of GAA tops in it each week I conservatively put it at 100/20 wee Fenians.
Quote from: pbat on March 10, 2023, 02:13:54 PM
Quote from: seafoid on March 10, 2023, 01:34:40 PM
Quote from: Applesisapples on March 10, 2023, 11:01:05 AM
What always bugs me is the hypocrisy of unionism, its as if all the evil since partition was down to the "minority" without whom this "wee country" would be paradise. It bugs me even more that no-one ever calls this out, not the media, not the SDLP, not Alliance and SF only in very limited circumstances and then very quietly. Nationalists have be tip toeing around unionism for a century, it is no longer the "minority" a term UU politicians of old used in the most perforative fashion. Equality can no longer be a one way street.
The other thing that gets me is Protestant emigration and why nothing is ever done about it. They don't actually care. It doesn't make sense
I'm doing a course at UU and there is 120 at a lecture on a Monday, from going through the class register and the amount of GAA tops in it each week I conservatively put it at 100/20 wee Fenians.
And no doubt Jim Allister will be along again soon to describe the universities in the north as "cold houses for unionism" or similar, when what he's really pissed off about is them uppity taigs daring to go and get themselves an education.
Quote from: balladmaker on March 10, 2023, 01:03:40 PM
Quote from: AustinPowers on March 10, 2023, 12:34:35 PM
Quote from: Snapchap on March 10, 2023, 07:50:12 AM
Quote from: weareros on March 09, 2023, 06:10:43 PM
Quote from: imtommygunn on March 09, 2023, 05:03:35 PM
They're shouting it's f**ked while f**king it at the same time. Clever when you think about it...
I don't think that super majority is going to be a thing. It was Ian Og taking the piss as he usually does.
While it's Paisley taking the piss, the Tories had already been discussing changing rules for a Scottish Indy referendum to a super majority. He will get support for this. The DUP and TUV have no interest in protecting the GFA. They never supported it. They have been angling for awhile to change what consent means. It means a simple majority for constitutional change and Dublin/Nationalist parties need to stay awake.
Dublin parties would be quite happy to move away from 50%+1. In fact they regularly voice such support. Micheal Martin has spoken of his desire for a wholly undemocratic and anti-GFA "parallel consent" mechanism while Varadkar has repeatedly stated the view that 50%+1 would not be a success.
Both FF and FG are vocal advocates of what essentially is a unionist veto of a pro unity vote.
It's funny because you always hear the line about Britain don't want the north and would get rid if they could. Same with the south though , they clearly don't want the north . The people maybe, but not the establishment.
Next election should sort that out hopefully.
What do you think is going to happen? :o
Quote from: gallsman on March 10, 2023, 04:18:45 PM
Quote from: pbat on March 10, 2023, 02:13:54 PM
Quote from: seafoid on March 10, 2023, 01:34:40 PM
Quote from: Applesisapples on March 10, 2023, 11:01:05 AM
What always bugs me is the hypocrisy of unionism, its as if all the evil since partition was down to the "minority" without whom this "wee country" would be paradise. It bugs me even more that no-one ever calls this out, not the media, not the SDLP, not Alliance and SF only in very limited circumstances and then very quietly. Nationalists have be tip toeing around unionism for a century, it is no longer the "minority" a term UU politicians of old used in the most perforative fashion. Equality can no longer be a one way street.
The other thing that gets me is Protestant emigration and why nothing is ever done about it. They don't actually care. It doesn't make sense
I'm doing a course at UU and there is 120 at a lecture on a Monday, from going through the class register and the amount of GAA tops in it each week I conservatively put it at 100/20 wee Fenians.
And no doubt Jim Allister will be along again soon to describe the universities in the north as "cold houses for unionism" or similar, when what he's really pissed off about is them uppity taigs daring to go and get themselves an education.
Nationalists shouldn't be pandering to unioniats now.
Get the national flag up in every nationalist controlled council now I say.
Quote from: marty34 on March 10, 2023, 05:20:47 PM
Quote from: gallsman on March 10, 2023, 04:18:45 PM
Quote from: pbat on March 10, 2023, 02:13:54 PM
Quote from: seafoid on March 10, 2023, 01:34:40 PM
Quote from: Applesisapples on March 10, 2023, 11:01:05 AM
What always bugs me is the hypocrisy of unionism, its as if all the evil since partition was down to the "minority" without whom this "wee country" would be paradise. It bugs me even more that no-one ever calls this out, not the media, not the SDLP, not Alliance and SF only in very limited circumstances and then very quietly. Nationalists have be tip toeing around unionism for a century, it is no longer the "minority" a term UU politicians of old used in the most perforative fashion. Equality can no longer be a one way street.
The other thing that gets me is Protestant emigration and why nothing is ever done about it. They don't actually care. It doesn't make sense
I'm doing a course at UU and there is 120 at a lecture on a Monday, from going through the class register and the amount of GAA tops in it each week I conservatively put it at 100/20 wee Fenians.
And no doubt Jim Allister will be along again soon to describe the universities in the north as "cold houses for unionism" or similar, when what he's really pissed off about is them uppity taigs daring to go and get themselves an education.
Nationalists shouldn't be pandering to unioniats now.
Get the national flag up in every nationalist controlled council now I say.
Then those of use who are unfortunate enough to live in a Unionist controlled district have to suffer the consequences >:(
Quote from: Brendan on March 10, 2023, 07:13:01 PM
Quote from: marty34 on March 10, 2023, 05:20:47 PM
Quote from: gallsman on March 10, 2023, 04:18:45 PM
Quote from: pbat on March 10, 2023, 02:13:54 PM
Quote from: seafoid on March 10, 2023, 01:34:40 PM
Quote from: Applesisapples on March 10, 2023, 11:01:05 AM
What always bugs me is the hypocrisy of unionism, its as if all the evil since partition was down to the "minority" without whom this "wee country" would be paradise. It bugs me even more that no-one ever calls this out, not the media, not the SDLP, not Alliance and SF only in very limited circumstances and then very quietly. Nationalists have be tip toeing around unionism for a century, it is no longer the "minority" a term UU politicians of old used in the most perforative fashion. Equality can no longer be a one way street.
The other thing that gets me is Protestant emigration and why nothing is ever done about it. They don't actually care. It doesn't make sense
I'm doing a course at UU and there is 120 at a lecture on a Monday, from going through the class register and the amount of GAA tops in it each week I conservatively put it at 100/20 wee Fenians.
And no doubt Jim Allister will be along again soon to describe the universities in the north as "cold houses for unionism" or similar, when what he's really pissed off about is them uppity taigs daring to go and get themselves an education.
Nationalists shouldn't be pandering to unioniats now.
Get the national flag up in every nationalist controlled council now I say.
Then those of use who are unfortunate enough to live in a Unionist controlled district have to suffer the consequences >:(
Marty, you're not exactly out thinking them with that.
Quote from: gallsman on March 10, 2023, 04:18:45 PM
Quote from: pbat on March 10, 2023, 02:13:54 PM
Quote from: seafoid on March 10, 2023, 01:34:40 PM
Quote from: Applesisapples on March 10, 2023, 11:01:05 AM
What always bugs me is the hypocrisy of unionism, its as if all the evil since partition was down to the "minority" without whom this "wee country" would be paradise. It bugs me even more that no-one ever calls this out, not the media, not the SDLP, not Alliance and SF only in very limited circumstances and then very quietly. Nationalists have be tip toeing around unionism for a century, it is no longer the "minority" a term UU politicians of old used in the most perforative fashion. Equality can no longer be a one way street.
The other thing that gets me is Protestant emigration and why nothing is ever done about it. They don't actually care. It doesn't make sense
I'm doing a course at UU and there is 120 at a lecture on a Monday, from going through the class register and the amount of GAA tops in it each week I conservatively put it at 100/20 wee Fenians.
And no doubt Jim Allister will be along again soon to describe the universities in the north as "cold houses for unionism" or similar, when what he's really pissed off about is them uppity taigs daring to go and get themselves an education.
A hell of a lot of students from a Protestant background go to college across the water. Not sure of the figures though
Quote from: Sportacus on March 10, 2023, 08:42:09 PM
Quote from: Brendan on March 10, 2023, 07:13:01 PM
Quote from: marty34 on March 10, 2023, 05:20:47 PM
Quote from: gallsman on March 10, 2023, 04:18:45 PM
Quote from: pbat on March 10, 2023, 02:13:54 PM
Quote from: seafoid on March 10, 2023, 01:34:40 PM
Quote from: Applesisapples on March 10, 2023, 11:01:05 AM
What always bugs me is the hypocrisy of unionism, its as if all the evil since partition was down to the "minority" without whom this "wee country" would be paradise. It bugs me even more that no-one ever calls this out, not the media, not the SDLP, not Alliance and SF only in very limited circumstances and then very quietly. Nationalists have be tip toeing around unionism for a century, it is no longer the "minority" a term UU politicians of old used in the most perforative fashion. Equality can no longer be a one way street.
The other thing that gets me is Protestant emigration and why nothing is ever done about it. They don't actually care. It doesn't make sense
I'm doing a course at UU and there is 120 at a lecture on a Monday, from going through the class register and the amount of GAA tops in it each week I conservatively put it at 100/20 wee Fenians.
And no doubt Jim Allister will be along again soon to describe the universities in the north as "cold houses for unionism" or similar, when what he's really pissed off about is them uppity taigs daring to go and get themselves an education.
Nationalists shouldn't be pandering to unioniats now.
Get the national flag up in every nationalist controlled council now I say.
Then those of use who are unfortunate enough to live in a Unionist controlled district have to suffer the consequences >:(
Marty, you're not exactly out thinking them with that.
And?
Quote from: marty34 on March 10, 2023, 09:53:57 PM
Quote from: Sportacus on March 10, 2023, 08:42:09 PM
Quote from: Brendan on March 10, 2023, 07:13:01 PM
Quote from: marty34 on March 10, 2023, 05:20:47 PM
Quote from: gallsman on March 10, 2023, 04:18:45 PM
Quote from: pbat on March 10, 2023, 02:13:54 PM
Quote from: seafoid on March 10, 2023, 01:34:40 PM
Quote from: Applesisapples on March 10, 2023, 11:01:05 AM
What always bugs me is the hypocrisy of unionism, its as if all the evil since partition was down to the "minority" without whom this "wee country" would be paradise. It bugs me even more that no-one ever calls this out, not the media, not the SDLP, not Alliance and SF only in very limited circumstances and then very quietly. Nationalists have be tip toeing around unionism for a century, it is no longer the "minority" a term UU politicians of old used in the most perforative fashion. Equality can no longer be a one way street.
The other thing that gets me is Protestant emigration and why nothing is ever done about it. They don't actually care. It doesn't make sense
I'm doing a course at UU and there is 120 at a lecture on a Monday, from going through the class register and the amount of GAA tops in it each week I conservatively put it at 100/20 wee Fenians.
And no doubt Jim Allister will be along again soon to describe the universities in the north as "cold houses for unionism" or similar, when what he's really pissed off about is them uppity taigs daring to go and get themselves an education.
Nationalists shouldn't be pandering to unioniats now.
Get the national flag up in every nationalist controlled council now I say.
Then those of use who are unfortunate enough to live in a Unionist controlled district have to suffer the consequences >:(
Marty, you're not exactly out thinking them with that.
And?
Wouldn't you like to offer something better than matching up their efforts to plaster the place with flags?
I'd like to think as a community we would approach these matters in a more mature and responsible manner than the dup & Tuv have, and unionism in general to be fair.
I think its important that we learn from the mistakes unionism has made and that we are more tolerant and inclusive when we have a majority. And I honestly think we will be. I can never see a Jim Allister/Sammy Wilson/Gregory Campbell type character dominating republican or nationalist politics.
Quote from: Sportacus on March 10, 2023, 10:14:25 PM
Quote from: marty34 on March 10, 2023, 09:53:57 PM
Quote from: Sportacus on March 10, 2023, 08:42:09 PM
Quote from: Brendan on March 10, 2023, 07:13:01 PM
Quote from: marty34 on March 10, 2023, 05:20:47 PM
Quote from: gallsman on March 10, 2023, 04:18:45 PM
Quote from: pbat on March 10, 2023, 02:13:54 PM
Quote from: seafoid on March 10, 2023, 01:34:40 PM
Quote from: Applesisapples on March 10, 2023, 11:01:05 AM
What always bugs me is the hypocrisy of unionism, its as if all the evil since partition was down to the "minority" without whom this "wee country" would be paradise. It bugs me even more that no-one ever calls this out, not the media, not the SDLP, not Alliance and SF only in very limited circumstances and then very quietly. Nationalists have be tip toeing around unionism for a century, it is no longer the "minority" a term UU politicians of old used in the most perforative fashion. Equality can no longer be a one way street.
The other thing that gets me is Protestant emigration and why nothing is ever done about it. They don't actually care. It doesn't make sense
I'm doing a course at UU and there is 120 at a lecture on a Monday, from going through the class register and the amount of GAA tops in it each week I conservatively put it at 100/20 wee Fenians.
And no doubt Jim Allister will be along again soon to describe the universities in the north as "cold houses for unionism" or similar, when what he's really pissed off about is them uppity taigs daring to go and get themselves an education.
Nationalists shouldn't be pandering to unioniats now.
Get the national flag up in every nationalist controlled council now I say.
Then those of use who are unfortunate enough to live in a Unionist controlled district have to suffer the consequences >:(
Marty, you're not exactly out thinking them with that.
And?
Wouldn't you like to offer something better than matching up their efforts to plaster the place with flags?
Sorry, I meant in the district offices only.
A hell of a lot of students from a Protestant background go to college across the water. Not sure of the figures though
[/quote]
The 2021 census confirmed that there are significantly more Catholics than Protestants in NI. The detailed in depth figures have not been released yet, but they will show that only about 33% of 18 year olds are Protestant and that well over 50% of 18 year old are Catholic. In addition Protestant schools tend to have lower educational attainment and therefore a lower percentage of Protestant kids actually go to Uni. Of those that do go to Uni they are significantly more likely to choose Scotland and England in comparison with their Catholic peers. When you add this all together the proportion of Protestant kids entering University in the North is a tiny percentage. So much so that the 'Protestant' teacher training college in Stranmillis has as many Catholic students as Protestants due to St Mary's being over subscribed. This has been going on for years but the disparity is increasing each year.
So kids that go to Inst BRA Methody Ballymena Academy Bangor Grammar and the other dozen or more Protestant schools don't go to uni?
Both my daughters went to a non catholic school but went to uni as did any of the kids that finished upper 6th as most passed their A levels. So I'm only using their years and results from that school
No, I didn't say that. Of course kids from those schools and many others go to Uni. A previous poster estimated that a lecture had a possible 100/20 split in favour of Catholic students and I'm just elaborating on how that is an entirely credible scenario.
Quote from: Feckitt on March 10, 2023, 11:26:33 PM
No, I didn't say that. Of course kids from those schools and many others go to Uni. A previous poster estimated that a lecture had a possible 100/20 split in favour of Catholic students and I'm just elaborating on how that is an entirely credible scenario.
No, but there is a perception that Protestants are thick :D
But the reality is slightly different. I went to a secondary school were no one went to college, no one. If they did it was later in life
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on March 10, 2023, 11:19:15 PM
So kids that go to Inst BRA Methody Ballymena Academy Bangor Grammar and the other dozen or more Protestant schools don't go to uni?
Of course they went to uni, the really good ones to Oxford or Cambridge, the rest to Edinburgh or St Andrews.
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on March 10, 2023, 11:31:01 PM
No, but there is a perception that Protestants are thick :D
I'm not sure that there is, not in Ireland generally. However, the Ulster variety are obstinate and unimaginative in many cases.
2/3 of kids from here who go to Uni in GB settle there. I don't care what background they are from, that's a sad situation. Partly because of a lack of funding for our universities. The grades for the likes of St Mary's are through the roof.
Quote from: Sportacus on March 11, 2023, 09:18:38 AM
2/3 of kids from here who go to Uni in GB settle there. I don't care what background they are from, that's a sad situation. Partly because of a lack of funding for our universities. The grades for the likes of St Mary's are through the roof.
It's sad but the reality is they have more career opportunities
Quote from: Sportacus on March 11, 2023, 09:18:38 AM
2/3 of kids from here who go to Uni in GB settle there. I don't care what background they are from, that's a sad situation. Partly because of a lack of funding for our universities. The grades for the likes of St Mary's are through the roof.
Would it be worth considering that a hefty percentage of those who go to uni in England, have already formed a desire to leave NI for good, and studying in England provides a suitable window of opportunities?
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on March 10, 2023, 11:19:15 PM
So kids that go to Inst BRA Methody Ballymena Academy Bangor Grammar and the other dozen or more Protestant schools don't go to uni?
Both my daughters went to a non catholic school but went to uni as did any of the kids that finished upper 6th as most passed their A levels. So I'm only using their years and results from that school
I worked in a place several years ago, time of the 11 plus, where a lot of my colleagues had kids looking to go to schools such as those highlighted. They were all paying for private tuition at the time as well to help with the test. I remember saying to a colleague one day that if their kid failed the 11 plus it was the not the end of the world as they could always go to the local high school. This was not an option for them as to all intents and purposes if their darling kids ended up going to the local high school they were f@#ked for life as they would end up mixing with the local riff raff. That is one thing I have always found with Protestants, awful snobbery within.
Quote from: thewobbler on March 11, 2023, 12:18:01 PM
Quote from: Sportacus on March 11, 2023, 09:18:38 AM
2/3 of kids from here who go to Uni in GB settle there. I don't care what background they are from, that's a sad situation. Partly because of a lack of funding for our universities. The grades for the likes of St Mary's are through the roof.
Would it be worth considering that a hefty percentage of those who go to uni in England, have already formed a desire to leave NI for good, and studying in England provides a suitable window of opportunities?
Yeah that's fair. I don't know what the split is between those who want to leave and those who are forced to leave.
Quote from: Sportacus on March 11, 2023, 12:58:38 PM
Quote from: thewobbler on March 11, 2023, 12:18:01 PM
Quote from: Sportacus on March 11, 2023, 09:18:38 AM
2/3 of kids from here who go to Uni in GB settle there. I don't care what background they are from, that's a sad situation. Partly because of a lack of funding for our universities. The grades for the likes of St Mary's are through the roof.
Would it be worth considering that a hefty percentage of those who go to uni in England, have already formed a desire to leave NI for good, and studying in England provides a suitable window of opportunities?
Yeah that's fair. I don't know what the split is between those who want to leave and those who are forced to leave.
My daughters year only one from her class stayed, they are all partying sorry studying across the water. Not forced either. Eldest daughter stayed went to queens but is a home bird though lives in Belfast, all but one of her friends went across the water also
Quote from: Sportacus on March 11, 2023, 09:18:38 AM
2/3 of kids from here who go to Uni in GB settle there. I don't care what background they are from, that's a sad situation. Partly because of a lack of funding for our universities. The grades for the likes of St Mary's are through the roof.
It is shocking that there is little interest in having enough places in NI universities proportionate to the population. Even in the 2009 recession the Dublin government actually increased the number of places, now they did that by underfunding the institutions, but they had the right idea.
Studies have shown that Protestants who go to Britain, or even Dublin, are less likely to go back than Catholics. In addition, some Catholics who study in Britain come to the 26 counties to work if there is a lack of opportunity in NI.
Jeffrey will have to get off the fence. The latest poll shows DUP voters against the Framework, but non unionists in favour
https://twitter.com/BelTel/status/1634460289620951040
- 67% of people - Yes
73% of DUP voters - No
56% UUP voters - Yes
38% of unionists - Yes
98% of Alliance/Green voters, 97% of nationalists
There was an article in Irish News recently detailing the difference between university places in North and the 26. There's a university for every 400,000 citizens in the South, in North it is 1 per million. While the "South" in the 60s - led by Patrick Hillary - were building regional technical colleges (which have now merged to become 5 technological universities), Unionists were blocking education investment East of the Bann. Too bad young Unionist supporters don't see what a terrible legacy they left when running the place.
Quote from: weareros on March 11, 2023, 04:23:57 PM
There was an article in Irish News recently detailing the difference between university places in North and the 26. There's a university for every 400,000 citizens in the South, in North it is 1 per million. While the "South" in the 60s - led by Patrick Hillary - were building regional technical colleges (which have now merged to become 5 technological universities), Unionists were blocking education investment East of the Bann. Too bad young Unionist supporters don't see what a terrible legacy they left when running the place.
But if Protestant students from those schools I mentioned had to go to college at home they would, they probably choose to go away as the places is a shambles, and they can afford it too possibly
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on March 11, 2023, 04:27:47 PM
But if Protestant students from those schools I mentioned had to go to college at home they would, they probably choose to go away as the places is a shambles, and they can afford it too possibly
We know it is a shambles. The question is why do people not aim that it not be?
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on March 11, 2023, 04:27:47 PM
Quote from: weareros on March 11, 2023, 04:23:57 PM
There was an article in Irish News recently detailing the difference between university places in North and the 26. There's a university for every 400,000 citizens in the South, in North it is 1 per million. While the "South" in the 60s - led by Patrick Hillary - were building regional technical colleges (which have now merged to become 5 technological universities), Unionists were blocking education investment East of the Bann. Too bad young Unionist supporters don't see what a terrible legacy they left when running the place.
But if Protestant students from those schools I mentioned had to go to college at home they would, they probably choose to go away as the places is a shambles, and they can afford it too possibly
Alot of students who live in Greater Belfast / North Down/South Antrim Area are not keen on going to Uni in Belfast. Part of Student Life is getting away from your locality and spreading your wings.
Quote from: armaghniac on March 11, 2023, 04:15:35 PM
Jeffrey will have to get off the fence. The latest poll shows DUP voters against the Framework, but non unionists in favour
https://twitter.com/BelTel/status/1634460289620951040
- 67% of people - Yes
73% of DUP voters - No
56% UUP voters - Yes
38% of unionists - Yes
98% of Alliance/Green voters, 97% of nationalists
Give it 15 years and half of that 73% of voters will be dead
Quote from: Mourne Red on March 11, 2023, 06:24:08 PM
Give it 15 years and half of that 73% of voters will be dead
More than three-quarters of 18 to 34-year-olds (77%) back the framework compared to 65% of 35 to 54-year-olds and 61% of those over 55.Sadly, there is bigotry among the young also, if not quite in the same proportion.
Quote from: Sportacus on March 11, 2023, 12:58:38 PM
Quote from: thewobbler on March 11, 2023, 12:18:01 PM
Quote from: Sportacus on March 11, 2023, 09:18:38 AM
2/3 of kids from here who go to Uni in GB settle there. I don't care what background they are from, that's a sad situation. Partly because of a lack of funding for our universities. The grades for the likes of St Mary's are through the roof.
Would it be worth considering that a hefty percentage of those who go to uni in England, have already formed a desire to leave NI for good, and studying in England provides a suitable window of opportunities?
Yeah that's fair. I don't know what the split is between those who want to leave and those who are forced to leave.
Can't speak to the six counties experience, but when I first moved to the US, on a grad student visa, I had no intention of staying. I was just in it for the education and the experience of somewhere else. But then life happens. 4-6 years living in a place, from when you're late teen/early 20s is formative. You make friends, fall in love, get job opportunities. Even if you originally intended to go home, that can change in a hurry.
Quote from: armaghniac on March 11, 2023, 06:35:34 PM
Quote from: Mourne Red on March 11, 2023, 06:24:08 PM
Give it 15 years and half of that 73% of voters will be dead
More than three-quarters of 18 to 34-year-olds (77%) back the framework compared to 65% of 35 to 54-year-olds and 61% of those over 55.
Sadly, there is bigotry among the young also, if not quite in the same proportion.
Going by these latest polls and the Brexit vote statistics, really starting to look like a scheme of withdrawing the vote after a certain age would be a good idea ;D ;D ;D
UK Gov telling the DUP that the WF is the only deal in town.
https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/politics/downing-street-warns-dup-that-windsor-framework-is-best-deal-available-to-ni/1638827166.html (https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/politics/downing-street-warns-dup-that-windsor-framework-is-best-deal-available-to-ni/1638827166.html)
Wee Jeffrey should be looking for a win in this situation but looking over his shoulder at the LCC/Bryson/Allister is never going to be a long term strategy but he hasn't the toy dolls to face them down.
Always the lowest common denominator with Unionism.
A very good summation of the quandary the DUP find itself in.
https://unherd.com/2023/03/larkins-lesson-for-northern-ireland/ (https://unherd.com/2023/03/larkins-lesson-for-northern-ireland/)
Quote from: johnnycool on March 15, 2023, 12:45:29 PM
UK Gov telling the DUP that the WF is the only deal in town.
https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/politics/downing-street-warns-dup-that-windsor-framework-is-best-deal-available-to-ni/1638827166.html (https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/politics/downing-street-warns-dup-that-windsor-framework-is-best-deal-available-to-ni/1638827166.html)
Wee Jeffrey should be looking for a win in this situation but looking over his shoulder at the LCC/Bryson/Allister is never going to be a long term strategy but he hasn't the toy dolls to face them down.
Basically, Sunak rang the EU and said "we both know Boris is a bollix, you revise the deal and give any flexibility you can and I'll implement it without coming back for more". That is what happened, and nobody has any interest in what the DUP think, an honest effort was made and everyone has moved on.
Quote from: armaghniac on March 15, 2023, 02:43:45 PM
Quote from: johnnycool on March 15, 2023, 12:45:29 PM
UK Gov telling the DUP that the WF is the only deal in town.
https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/politics/downing-street-warns-dup-that-windsor-framework-is-best-deal-available-to-ni/1638827166.html (https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/politics/downing-street-warns-dup-that-windsor-framework-is-best-deal-available-to-ni/1638827166.html)
Wee Jeffrey should be looking for a win in this situation but looking over his shoulder at the LCC/Bryson/Allister is never going to be a long term strategy but he hasn't the toy dolls to face them down.
Basically, Sunak rang the EU and said "we both know Boris is a bollix, you revise the deal and give any flexibility you can and I'll implement it without coming back for more". That is what happened, and nobody has any interest in what the DUP think, an honest effort was made and everyone has moved on.
Yeah, they had their chance. Time to move on.
A very small minority wagging the dog.
What will their ploy be now? Bluff it out to after the May elections?
Then what?
https://www.ft.com/content/67db49bd-c4e4-4c48-a6a1-206feb0b0139
The British Social Attitudes survey reported that 77 per cent of Britons wanted less immigration; over half stated they wanted it reduced by "a lot".
The DUP and the Tories rode this wave from 2016 on.
But now things are different. Inflation is out of control
Inflation is out of control? Currently falling and forecast to be 2.9% by year-end (in UK). Inflation today in Argentina is over 100%, now that is out of control.
Quote from: bennydorano on March 15, 2023, 03:54:04 PM
Inflation is out of control? Currently falling and forecast to be 2.9% by year-end (in UK). Inflation today in Argentina is over 100%, now that is out of control.
It's currently very high in the UK and in the US it is sticky and not expected to fall to the Central Bank's target .
So the Fed may have to manufacture a recession. This would be quite serious.
Quote from: marty34 on March 15, 2023, 02:49:20 PM
Quote from: armaghniac on March 15, 2023, 02:43:45 PM
Quote from: johnnycool on March 15, 2023, 12:45:29 PM
UK Gov telling the DUP that the WF is the only deal in town.
https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/politics/downing-street-warns-dup-that-windsor-framework-is-best-deal-available-to-ni/1638827166.html (https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/politics/downing-street-warns-dup-that-windsor-framework-is-best-deal-available-to-ni/1638827166.html)
Wee Jeffrey should be looking for a win in this situation but looking over his shoulder at the LCC/Bryson/Allister is never going to be a long term strategy but he hasn't the toy dolls to face them down.
Basically, Sunak rang the EU and said "we both know Boris is a bollix, you revise the deal and give any flexibility you can and I'll implement it without coming back for more". That is what happened, and nobody has any interest in what the DUP think, an honest effort was made and everyone has moved on.
Yeah, they had their chance. Time to move on.
A very small minority wagging the dog.
What will their ploy be now? Bluff it out to after the May elections?
Then what?
Well you can't give in now and have Biden blowing about the GFA with Michelle at his side.
Then you have the elections.
Then you have the marching season....
Quote from: bennydorano on March 15, 2023, 03:54:04 PM
Inflation is out of control? Currently falling and forecast to be 2.9% by year-end (in UK). Inflation today in Argentina is over 100%, now that is out of control.
It won't be 2.9%.
https://www.irishtimes.com/business/economy/2023/03/16/inflation-in-irish-economy-unexpectedly-rises-to-85-in-february/
They're not going back to serve under a Fenian First Minister. Northern Ireland is finished, but the only way out is democratically and quickly.
https://www.gov.uk/register-to-vote
Make sure your friends, family, neighbours and work colleagues are registered to vote. Has your daughter moved to Uni, your cousin moved house Maybe your Polish work colleague never bothered to vote? Make sure they are all registered!
https://www.gov.uk/register-to-vote
Getting Polish to vote should be a big push, quite a no here now, any where I live don't bother to vote.
When the Unity referendum comes the sizeable population originally from Central and Eastern Europe will have the opportunity to get back in the EU and therefore have closer links to their home country.
Quote from: Feckitt on March 19, 2023, 04:45:05 PM
When the Unity referendum comes the sizeable population originally from Central and Eastern Europe will have the opportunity to get back in the EU and therefore have closer links to their home country.
If they are allowed vote.
It's decision time now for Donaldson and the DUP. I can't see the leadership of the party publicly supporting the WF which could then leave them in an even more perilous position. At every juncture they have managed to make things even worse for themselves as they are petrified of being lundified. I think Peter Robinson is one of the few in the party who has a strategic brain and will recognise the opportunity that the WF offers to unionists. But he is only one of 8 people and the threat of the TUV/LCC/OO axis looms large over any decision to be made.
Quote from: yellowcard on March 19, 2023, 10:08:19 PM
It's decision time now for Donaldson and the DUP. I can't see the leadership of the party publicly supporting the WF which could then leave them in an even more perilous position. At every juncture they have managed to make things even worse for themselves as they are petrified of being lundified. I think Peter Robinson is one of the few in the party who has a strategic brain and will recognise the opportunity that the WF offers to unionists. But he is only one of 8 people and the threat of the TUV/LCC/OO axis looms large over any decision to be made.
Decision time would suggest that Donaldson has options.
If he has 3 options then he has 3.
If he has 2 options then he has 2.
If he has 1 option then he has no option.
He will reject the WF, and say that he is passing the problem back to Rishi. He will then tell his electorate that Rishi has messed up and Rishi has to find a solution.
Looking like no Stormont for 2 or 3 years.
Quote from: Orior on March 19, 2023, 10:31:21 PM
Quote from: yellowcard on March 19, 2023, 10:08:19 PM
It's decision time now for Donaldson and the DUP. I can't see the leadership of the party publicly supporting the WF which could then leave them in an even more perilous position. At every juncture they have managed to make things even worse for themselves as they are petrified of being lundified. I think Peter Robinson is one of the few in the party who has a strategic brain and will recognise the opportunity that the WF offers to unionists. But he is only one of 8 people and the threat of the TUV/LCC/OO axis looms large over any decision to be made.
Decision time would suggest that Donaldson has options.
If he has 3 options then he has 3.
If he has 2 options then he has 2.
If he has 1 option then he has no option.
He will reject the WF, and say that he is passing the problem back to Rishi. He will then tell his electorate that Rishi has messed up and Rishi has to find a solution.
Looking like no Stormont for 2 or 3 years.
Conservative Party is the most successful party in World Politics for a reason.. They will string this out and then next year when they're out of gov it will be a Labour problem. This is when Labour will probably f**k up and do something that'll threaten the union and there the conservatives slogan will be run on in the 2028 election to save the Union and our Country vote Tory. They've already started with going after refugees, they know they lost 2024 so it's all about getting back asap
Quote from: Orior on March 19, 2023, 10:31:21 PM
Quote from: yellowcard on March 19, 2023, 10:08:19 PM
It's decision time now for Donaldson and the DUP. I can't see the leadership of the party publicly supporting the WF which could then leave them in an even more perilous position. At every juncture they have managed to make things even worse for themselves as they are petrified of being lundified. I think Peter Robinson is one of the few in the party who has a strategic brain and will recognise the opportunity that the WF offers to unionists. But he is only one of 8 people and the threat of the TUV/LCC/OO axis looms large over any decision to be made.
Decision time would suggest that Donaldson has options.
If he has 3 options then he has 3.
If he has 2 options then he has 2.
If he has 1 option then he has no option.
He will reject the WF, and say that he is passing the problem back to Rishi. He will then tell his electorate that Rishi has messed up and Rishi has to find a solution.
Looking like no Stormont for 2 or 3 years.
He could well reject it but he has set up a committee to avoid him personally taking the blame for whatever the outcome. How can he square the circle of pulling MLAs out of Stormont (which affects the lives of the people living here) in protest at the protocol yet still have MPs parading around Westminster which is where any objections should be aimed. It's all a smokescreen.
Also Sunak doesn't have to find any solution, it will comfortably get through a vote this week so what do the DUP do then. The likelihood is that they will be facing direct rule with decision making being taken out of their hands with a soon to be Labour government in the UK and a probable SF government in the south. Strategically it is in unionisms best interests to get Stormont back up running again.
Quote from: yellowcard on March 19, 2023, 11:13:49 PM
Quote from: Orior on March 19, 2023, 10:31:21 PM
Quote from: yellowcard on March 19, 2023, 10:08:19 PM
It's decision time now for Donaldson and the DUP. I can't see the leadership of the party publicly supporting the WF which could then leave them in an even more perilous position. At every juncture they have managed to make things even worse for themselves as they are petrified of being lundified. I think Peter Robinson is one of the few in the party who has a strategic brain and will recognise the opportunity that the WF offers to unionists. But he is only one of 8 people and the threat of the TUV/LCC/OO axis looms large over any decision to be made.
Decision time would suggest that Donaldson has options.
If he has 3 options then he has 3.
If he has 2 options then he has 2.
If he has 1 option then he has no option.
He will reject the WF, and say that he is passing the problem back to Rishi. He will then tell his electorate that Rishi has messed up and Rishi has to find a solution.
Looking like no Stormont for 2 or 3 years.
He could well reject it but he has set up a committee to avoid him personally taking the blame for whatever the outcome. How can he square the circle of pulling MLAs out of Stormont (which affects the lives of the people living here) in protest at the protocol yet still have MPs parading around Westminster which is where any objections should be aimed. It's all a smokescreen.
Also Sunak doesn't have to find any solution, it will comfortably get through a vote this week so what do the DUP do then. The likelihood is that they will be facing direct rule with decision making being taken out of their hands with a soon to be Labour government in the UK and a probable SF government in the south. Strategically it is in unionisms best interests to get Stormont back up running again.
Always looking over their shoulder at wee Jimbob so they'll probably not commit on the framework. Drag it out a bit until the election.
The TUV could pick up a good few council seats at the expense of the DUP.
Quote from: Mourne Red on March 19, 2023, 11:12:01 PM
Quote from: Orior on March 19, 2023, 10:31:21 PM
Quote from: yellowcard on March 19, 2023, 10:08:19 PM
It's decision time now for Donaldson and the DUP. I can't see the leadership of the party publicly supporting the WF which could then leave them in an even more perilous position. At every juncture they have managed to make things even worse for themselves as they are petrified of being lundified. I think Peter Robinson is one of the few in the party who has a strategic brain and will recognise the opportunity that the WF offers to unionists. But he is only one of 8 people and the threat of the TUV/LCC/OO axis looms large over any decision to be made.
Decision time would suggest that Donaldson has options.
If he has 3 options then he has 3.
If he has 2 options then he has 2.
If he has 1 option then he has no option.
He will reject the WF, and say that he is passing the problem back to Rishi. He will then tell his electorate that Rishi has messed up and Rishi has to find a solution.
Looking like no Stormont for 2 or 3 years.
Conservative Party is the most successful party in World Politics for a reason.. They will string this out and then next year when they're out of gov it will be a Labour problem. This is when Labour will probably f**k up and do something that'll threaten the union and there the conservatives slogan will be run on in the 2028 election to save the Union and our Country vote Tory. They've already started with going after refugees, they know they lost 2024 so it's all about getting back asap
Yup sounds about right
But surely the Brits will say to themselves , never vote those Tory b*******s again!!! I mean , not everyone was around during the thatcher years and the shit that she did.. but by Christ they should remember these Tory years!
Quote from: yellowcard on March 19, 2023, 10:08:19 PM
It's decision time now for Donaldson and the DUP. I can't see the leadership of the party publicly supporting the WF which could then leave them in an even more perilous position. At every juncture they have managed to make things even worse for themselves as they are petrified of being lundified. I think Peter Robinson is one of the few in the party who has a strategic brain and will recognise the opportunity that the WF offers to unionists. But he is only one of 8 people and the threat of the TUV/LCC/OO axis looms large over any decision to be made.
That's it in a nutshell. The hot potato that is the unionist leadership . Say no to everything. Replace, and repeat
Quote from: AustinPowers on March 19, 2023, 11:50:00 PM
Quote from: yellowcard on March 19, 2023, 10:08:19 PM
It's decision time now for Donaldson and the DUP. I can't see the leadership of the party publicly supporting the WF which could then leave them in an even more perilous position. At every juncture they have managed to make things even worse for themselves as they are petrified of being lundified. I think Peter Robinson is one of the few in the party who has a strategic brain and will recognise the opportunity that the WF offers to unionists. But he is only one of 8 people and the threat of the TUV/LCC/OO axis looms large over any decision to be made.
That's it in a nutshell. The hot potato that is the unionist leadership . Say no to everything. Replace, and repeat
The DUP isn't unionism
Quote from: seafoid on March 20, 2023, 08:16:43 AM
Quote from: AustinPowers on March 19, 2023, 11:50:00 PM
Quote from: yellowcard on March 19, 2023, 10:08:19 PM
It's decision time now for Donaldson and the DUP. I can't see the leadership of the party publicly supporting the WF which could then leave them in an even more perilous position. At every juncture they have managed to make things even worse for themselves as they are petrified of being lundified. I think Peter Robinson is one of the few in the party who has a strategic brain and will recognise the opportunity that the WF offers to unionists. But he is only one of 8 people and the threat of the TUV/LCC/OO axis looms large over any decision to be made.
That's it in a nutshell. The hot potato that is the unionist leadership . Say no to everything. Replace, and repeat
The DUP isn't unionism
Unionism always lurches to the right. There's always a bogey man going to make a lundy of anyone who deviates from the norm.
Look at it 25 years ago, same thing. Now it's wee Jim screaming from the sidelines.
It's the way unionism works.
i actually think the tories will be back in again around 2029 and they might still pull of the upset and win next election labour will be attack by the right wing media every day and the dm and express readers will probably vote tory again.
There will be a massive smear campaign against labour and starmer which will crank up in the not that distant future. They are far from gone yet.
Quote from: Mourne Red on March 19, 2023, 11:12:01 PM
Quote from: Orior on March 19, 2023, 10:31:21 PM
Quote from: yellowcard on March 19, 2023, 10:08:19 PM
It's decision time now for Donaldson and the DUP. I can't see the leadership of the party publicly supporting the WF which could then leave them in an even more perilous position. At every juncture they have managed to make things even worse for themselves as they are petrified of being lundified. I think Peter Robinson is one of the few in the party who has a strategic brain and will recognise the opportunity that the WF offers to unionists. But he is only one of 8 people and the threat of the TUV/LCC/OO axis looms large over any decision to be made.
Decision time would suggest that Donaldson has options.
If he has 3 options then he has 3.
If he has 2 options then he has 2.
If he has 1 option then he has no option.
He will reject the WF, and say that he is passing the problem back to Rishi. He will then tell his electorate that Rishi has messed up and Rishi has to find a solution.
Looking like no Stormont for 2 or 3 years.
Conservative Party is the most successful party in World Politics for a reason.. They will string this out and then next year when they're out of gov it will be a Labour problem. This is when Labour will probably f**k up and do something that'll threaten the union and there the conservatives slogan will be run on in the 2028 election to save the Union and our Country vote Tory. They've already started with going after refugees, they know they lost 2024 so it's all about getting back asap
Two reasons for that and neither has much to do with their political acumen. The voting system itself and a right wing media press interconnected to the Tory political class who control and manipulate public opinion.
They're rejecting it
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2023/mar/20/dup-ian-paisley-vote-against-northern-ireland-post-brexit-deal?CMP=Share_AndroidApp_Other (https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2023/mar/20/dup-ian-paisley-vote-against-northern-ireland-post-brexit-deal?CMP=Share_AndroidApp_Other)
Will have to be joint authority now surely as an election won't change anything and there won't be any more negotiations with the EU.
Another own goal, genuinely must take a serious effort to be on the wrong side of everything constantly.
No more negotiations to be had, the Gov't going to force it through regardless.
Quote from: NAG1 on March 20, 2023, 01:54:37 PM
Another own goal, genuinely must take a serious effort to be on the wrong side of everything constantly.
No more negotiations to be had, the Gov't going to force it through regardless.
Touch of arrogance from Mr Donaldson, expecting Sunak and the EU to re-open the talks just to appease him and his ever decreasing cabal.
What now for the Assembly, Is it Joint authority with major inputs from the Irish Tánaiste?
Quote from: tyrone08 on March 20, 2023, 01:46:36 PM
Will have to be joint authority now surely as an election won't change anything and there won't be any more negotiations with the EU.
This 100%.
Joint authority, otherwise the last 55 years has been a waste of time.
Quote from: johnnycool on March 20, 2023, 02:00:13 PM
Quote from: NAG1 on March 20, 2023, 01:54:37 PM
Another own goal, genuinely must take a serious effort to be on the wrong side of everything constantly.
No more negotiations to be had, the Gov't going to force it through regardless.
Touch of arrogance from Mr Donaldson, expecting Sunak and the EU to re-open the talks just to appease him and his ever decreasing cabal.
What now for the Assembly, Is it Joint authority with major inputs from the Irish Tánaiste?
Well , I'm in need of some rubble for a laneway so I'm hoping they knock down Stormont
Only thing is , I could no longer complain about Stormont never having done anything for me
Quote from: AustinPowers on March 20, 2023, 02:11:07 PM
Quote from: johnnycool on March 20, 2023, 02:00:13 PM
Quote from: NAG1 on March 20, 2023, 01:54:37 PM
Another own goal, genuinely must take a serious effort to be on the wrong side of everything constantly.
No more negotiations to be had, the Gov't going to force it through regardless.
Touch of arrogance from Mr Donaldson, expecting Sunak and the EU to re-open the talks just to appease him and his ever decreasing cabal.
What now for the Assembly, Is it Joint authority with major inputs from the Irish Tánaiste?
Well , I'm in need of some rubble for a laneway so I'm hoping they knock down Stormont
Only thing is , I could no longer complain about Stormont never having done anything for me
I've heard some of the road crews sell off the old tarmac they've lifted up. You can buy it, get it levelled and roll the shíte out of it in the hot weather and it's meant to be the dogs danglies for a laneway.
Knocking down the home of the famed Dublin hurler is a bit much for your lane all the same.
Quote from: johnnycool on March 20, 2023, 02:00:13 PM
Quote from: NAG1 on March 20, 2023, 01:54:37 PM
Another own goal, genuinely must take a serious effort to be on the wrong side of everything constantly.
No more negotiations to be had, the Gov't going to force it through regardless.
Touch of arrogance from Mr Donaldson, expecting Sunak and the EU to re-open the talks just to appease him and his ever decreasing cabal.
What now for the Assembly, Is it Joint authority with major inputs from the Irish Tánaiste?
Abolish all MLAs salary immediately. If they fail to go back into government then Stormont is effectively finished. After that politicians here will have no control over our own affairs. It will be some form of joint authority although it mightn't be worded as such.
I still think Donaldson is too fearful of the consequences of not going back into Stormont and that they will find some form of workaround. It does show the folly of painting himself into a corner in pulling down Stormont to begin with though.
Quote from: yellowcard on March 20, 2023, 02:17:02 PM
Quote from: johnnycool on March 20, 2023, 02:00:13 PM
Quote from: NAG1 on March 20, 2023, 01:54:37 PM
Another own goal, genuinely must take a serious effort to be on the wrong side of everything constantly.
No more negotiations to be had, the Gov't going to force it through regardless.
Touch of arrogance from Mr Donaldson, expecting Sunak and the EU to re-open the talks just to appease him and his ever decreasing cabal.
What now for the Assembly, Is it Joint authority with major inputs from the Irish Tánaiste?
Abolish all MLAs salary immediately. If they fail to go back into government then Stormont is effectively finished. After that politicians here will have no control over our own affairs. It will be some form of joint authority although it mightn't be worded as such.
I still think Donaldson is too fearful of the consequences of not going back into Stormont and that they will find some form of workaround. It does show the folly of painting himself into a corner in pulling down Stormont to begin with though.
Yes, I'd pull the MLA's salaries as a starting point and then set a date for late summer for re-elections.
Is there no way they can just pull the DUP MLA salaries?
To your point about Donaldson and arrogance Donaldson is arrogance personified. Even the look of him is arrogant.
As many would say if the UK government ploughs on then what have they achieved here. They have basically proved or made here unworkable.
Quote from: johnnycool on March 20, 2023, 02:00:13 PM
Quote from: NAG1 on March 20, 2023, 01:54:37 PM
Another own goal, genuinely must take a serious effort to be on the wrong side of everything constantly.
No more negotiations to be had, the Gov't going to force it through regardless.
Touch of arrogance from Mr Donaldson, expecting Sunak and the EU to re-open the talks just to appease him and his ever decreasing cabal.
What now for the Assembly, Is it Joint authority with major inputs from the Irish Tánaiste?
Can't see the uk government going back to the eu or the eu even encountering any change either.
Last chance saloon.
would joint authority not mean a loyalist return to war.
Quote from: Eire90 on March 20, 2023, 04:21:16 PM
would joint authority not mean a loyalist return to war.
They'll go clean mad but they've only themselves to blame!
there's no way the EU and the british government would agree to exactly what the DUP want. In fact tbh they don't even know what they want or they know what they want can't be articulated in public without them looking like a very backward bunch of bigots.
If they agree to what the DUP want, aka a hard border, then that would mean a republican return to war too you would imagine.
This all boils down to one thing and one thing only - a nationalist first minister. That's the long and short or it.
The Protocol was about for a good while before the unionists decided to tackle it head on.
I wonder why?
So other than the DUP and a few cranks in the Tory party, will anyone else vote against it? It's going to be ridiculously one sided and Jeff et al will look like clowns yet again.
It is just a token. They can show they voted against the perfidious WA but the Tories stabbed them in the back so they need to go into Stormont to stop RishIRA Sunak and his ToIRA party from doing it again.
Quote from: screenexile on March 20, 2023, 04:22:05 PM
Quote from: Eire90 on March 20, 2023, 04:21:16 PM
would joint authority not mean a loyalist return to war.
They'll go clean mad but they've only themselves to blame!
We keep hearing about this loyalist return to violence. Who are they going to be waging this war against? Just an excuse for them to start murdering innocent Catholics.
Quote from: marty34 on March 20, 2023, 04:35:00 PM
This all boils down to one thing and one thing only - a nationalist first minister. That's the long and short or it.
The Protocol was about for a good while before the unionists decided to tackle it head on.
I wonder why?
I agree totally. The WF has 3% exposure to EU law. Whining about it does not make sense except as a way of avoiding going into government under SF.
Quote from: 93-DY-SAM on March 20, 2023, 04:46:42 PM
Quote from: screenexile on March 20, 2023, 04:22:05 PM
Quote from: Eire90 on March 20, 2023, 04:21:16 PM
would joint authority not mean a loyalist return to war.
They'll go clean mad but they've only themselves to blame!
We keep hearing about this loyalist return to violence. Who are they going to be waging this war against? Just an excuse for them to start murdering innocent Catholics.
The threat of loyalist violence does get overstated somewhat. It's like the lad in school that keeps on telling you he is going to hit you but never actually does anything about it. Its largely used for political leverage as was the case with the flag protests, the riots and the protocol protests. If they start up again it would only bring a lot more heat on them and shine a light on their other more nefarious activities which are more important to those at the top of those organisations. Those groups like to create intimidation and fear and are more concerned with controlling communities and making money from extortion, racketeering and the sale of narcotics.
Quote from: yellowcard on March 20, 2023, 05:28:28 PM
Quote from: 93-DY-SAM on March 20, 2023, 04:46:42 PM
Quote from: screenexile on March 20, 2023, 04:22:05 PM
Quote from: Eire90 on March 20, 2023, 04:21:16 PM
would joint authority not mean a loyalist return to war.
They'll go clean mad but they've only themselves to blame!
We keep hearing about this loyalist return to violence. Who are they going to be waging this war against? Just an excuse for them to start murdering innocent Catholics.
The threat of loyalist violence does get overstated somewhat. It's like the lad in school that keeps on telling you he is going to hit you but never actually does anything about it. Its largely used for political leverage as was the case with the flag protests, the riots and the protocol protests. If they start up again it would only bring a lot more heat on them and shine a light on their other more nefarious activities which are more important to those at the top of those organisations. Those groups like to create intimidation and fear and are more concerned with controlling communities and making money from extortion, racketeering and the sale of narcotics.
They're going to march on their Sovereign Gov in Westminster who exercised it's new found sovereign powers annexing part of the UK into the clutches of the EU and the dirty Taigs in Dublin.
Since day one it has been an over amplified minority wrt loyalists and violence.
I would expect some of them might get uppety but the vocal minority are pawns for Habib and all those other clowns who blatantly stand to make money from Brexit.
Quote from: AustinPowers on March 20, 2023, 02:11:07 PM
Well , I'm in need of some rubble for a laneway so I'm hoping they knock down Stormont
I wouldn't recommend it.
First bit of pressure and ye just know it'd collapse on ye.
Then you'd have to do it all over again.
https://www.irishtimes.com/opinion/2023/03/18/boardrooms-of-corporate-america-gearing-up-to-support-peace-again/
The message that the North can look forward to a "decade of investment" if political stability returns is being made publicly and – rather more forcefully, one imagines – privately. The boardrooms of corporate America are gearing up again. The three governments – once again in lockstep, at least on this issue – are pressing the point home. If the institutions are revived and function effectively and sensibly, then there will be tangible economic benefits for Northern Ireland and its people. But to unlock this, the DUP needs to accept the Windsor Framework .
The DUP won't go back to Stormont so as to pressure the British government to fix the Windsor Agreement.
But they're happy with direct rule by the same British government that agreed the Windsor Agreement with the EU.
Nice one Jeff.
Does anyone know what loyalists are actually loyal to? They aren't loyal to the UK government because they don't listen to what they say to them and don't agree with any laws they make for NI e.g. abortion laws. They aren't loyal to the crown as they are going against this Windsor framework that has King Charles blessing.
Quote from: Nanderson on March 20, 2023, 08:46:36 PM
Does anyone know what loyalists are actually loyal to? They aren't loyal to the UK government because they don't listen to what they say to them and don't agree with any laws they make for NI e.g. abortion laws. They aren't loyal to the crown as they are going against this Windsor framework that has King Charles blessing.
For Drugs and Ulster
What a carry on. Honestly don't care much about politics but this crowd are something else. Don't give one shit about any one of us or helping a soul other than themselves. Really sad and with young kids now pisses me of even more so.
Quote from: Brendan on March 20, 2023, 08:54:26 PM
Quote from: Nanderson on March 20, 2023, 08:46:36 PM
Does anyone know what loyalists are actually loyal to? They aren't loyal to the UK government because they don't listen to what they say to them and don't agree with any laws they make for NI e.g. abortion laws. They aren't loyal to the crown as they are going against this Windsor framework that has King Charles blessing.
For Drugs and Ulster
6/9ths of Ulster
Stormont Brake vote today in Westminster, DUP not supporting along with the intellectual heavyweights in the ERG led by Mark Francois.. Labour will see this over the line as much as its being seen as an indicative vote on the full Windsor Framework, but too many rebels will mean Sunaks time is limited.
Quote from: johnnycool on March 22, 2023, 12:15:11 PM
Stormont Brake vote today in Westminster, DUP not supporting along with the intellectual heavyweights in the ERG led by Mark Francois.. Labour will see this over the line as much as its being seen as an indicative vote on the full Windsor Framework, but too many rebels will mean Sunaks time is limited.
Johnson not voting for an agreement that builds on his own "oven ready" agreement says all you need to know about these self serving c***ts.
Soft as shite Sunak should enforce a 3 line whip and any "rebels" fucked out of the party.
Quote from: trailer on March 22, 2023, 12:20:09 PM
Quote from: johnnycool on March 22, 2023, 12:15:11 PM
Stormont Brake vote today in Westminster, DUP not supporting along with the intellectual heavyweights in the ERG led by Mark Francois.. Labour will see this over the line as much as its being seen as an indicative vote on the full Windsor Framework, but too many rebels will mean Sunaks time is limited.
Johnson not voting for an agreement that builds on his own "oven ready" agreement says all you need to know about these self serving c***ts.
At this point I think Johnson is a Labour plant.. No way does he think the public will go for him as a PM again, just ruining the Tories - Great too see all the same
Quote from: johnnycool on March 22, 2023, 12:15:11 PM
Stormont Brake vote today in Westminster, DUP not supporting along with the intellectual heavyweights in the ERG led by Mark Francois.. Labour will see this over the line as much as its being seen as an indicative vote on the full Windsor Framework, but too many rebels will mean Sunaks time is limited.
The Tories have moved on
Only 29 votes against the deal, take the 8 dupers out that only leaves 21 Tory rebels. Shows over, deal done.
The show is well and truly over for wee Jeff and the lads.
He either toes the line or its direct rule.
The last kick of a dying party will want to cause carnage here
At least Jim Shannon is using his influence at Westminster for good things. Putting a motion in to honour Dolly Parton on the 50th anniversary for one of her songs ::)
Only 29 against, that is a laughable figure. Honestly thought there would be a sizeable minority that could give some, albeit minor, credence to the DUP position but it's over for them
What's next though, I just don't know. Think the GFA is done, we need to move to a coalition of the willing
Yeah I was a bit worried too. That's them put in their box, though probably briefly, but there'll be plenty of noise from them yet.
I expected well over 100 rebels from the talk all week. We could probably name the 29 as there seemed to be that many publicly saying they would go against it!
Total embarrassment for the DUP and ERG (how many members do they actually have in reality?!)
Quote from: square_ball on March 22, 2023, 02:51:55 PM
At least Jim Shannon is using his influence at Westminster for good things. Putting a motion in to honour Dolly Parton on the 50th anniversary for one of her songs ::)
This should be in the WTF category.......what an absolute clown, sums up the calibre of politician in this country. This is like something you would expect the Healy Reas to come out with.
WTF is the only response to that
What are these guys actually smoking
Quote from: RedHand88 on March 22, 2023, 03:14:53 PM
I expected well over 100 rebels from the talk all week. We could probably name the 29 as there seemed to be that many publicly saying they would go against it!
Total embarrassment for the DUP and ERG (how many members do they actually have in reality?!)
8 DUP, Johnson, Truss, JRM and Patel, all stated they were voting against.
On GMU this morning, they'd a fella from the ERG on saying that they had "dozens of members", and they wouldn't recommend voting for the Framework, however all members had a free choice on what way to vote.
So it looks like most of those members decided to vote for the framework.
I called it a couple if days ago. It was always going to be humiliating. How can they keep at this shit when they get hammered in the UK parliament and on top of that a poll in NI claims only 16% of the population are against the new protocol. Surely to fook the game is up, enough of the wankers
This framework is all bullshit anyway. The real problem is as obvious as the nose on your face. THEY WON'T SHARE POWER WITH A FENIAN FIRST MINISTER
Quote from: smort on March 22, 2023, 03:03:45 PM
Only 29 against, that is a laughable figure. Honestly thought there would be a sizeable minority that could give some, albeit minor, credence to the DUP position but it's over for them
What's next though, I just don't know. Think the GFA is done, we need to move to a coalition of the willing
Yup, should have happened 20 years ago. If Stormont is to function in any way , that is what needs to happen . Otherwise , knock it down (I still need that rubble)
Ian Og also using his time wisely at Westminster by getting stickers made up. These cnuts need chased. Unfortunately they are are going to be around for the foreseeable.
https://twitter.com/naomi_long/status/1638543409693483008?s=20
Quote from: square_ball on March 22, 2023, 02:51:55 PM
At least Jim Shannon is using his influence at Westminster for good things. Putting a motion in to honour Dolly Parton on the 50th anniversary for one of her songs ::)
Jim is my MP and he really is
SPECIAL. ;)
Only 22 Conservative MPs voted against the Stormont Brake. The Tories have moved on, just a cabal of Johnston, Truss, Rees Mogg, Francois and a few other headers left. DUP are in no man's land.
Quote from: Feckitt on March 22, 2023, 03:38:25 PM
This framework is all bullshit anyway. The real problem is as obvious as the nose on your face. THEY WON'T SHARE POWER WITH A FENIAN FIRST MINISTER
Of course, it is. If you go back through this thread (and the old DUP thread which BTW did we ever figure out what happened it?) you'll see people say this time and time again. The DUP are supremacists with a supremacist history and mindset. That will never change so long as they exist. I don't know why they are not being called out on this by journalists instead of being facilitated by the likes of Nolan etc. They want a wall around the border which could never be high enough or wide enough armed with Brit soldiers to keep pesky Fenians in their place. They thought Brexit would deliver this. A shower of more hateful c***ts you will be hard-pressed to find anywhere else.
Quote from: Sportacus on March 22, 2023, 04:05:35 PM
Only 22 Conservative MPs voted against the Stormont Brake. The Tories have moved on, just a cabal of Johnston, Truss, Rees Mogg, Francois and a few other headers left. DUP are in no man's land.
The lunatic fringe. They will become increasingly isolated. It's all games anyway with the DUP. They'll string it out for a while and eventually come back.
Quote from: Armamike on March 22, 2023, 04:11:16 PM
Quote from: Sportacus on March 22, 2023, 04:05:35 PM
Only 22 Conservative MPs voted against the Stormont Brake. The Tories have moved on, just a cabal of Johnston, Truss, Rees Mogg, Francois and a few other headers left. DUP are in no man's land.
The lunatic fringe. They will become increasingly isolated. It's all games anyway with the DUP. They'll string it out for a while and eventually come back.
I agree. The only thing on the mind of the average Tory MP is saving their skin in next years election and wasting time on the DUP isn't in the equation. Jeffrey still on a hook, all they are doing is hanging onto their hard core support but it's all tactics and no strategy.
JC they are talking about this Shannon motion on Evening Extra! It's ludicrous!
Quote from: smort on March 22, 2023, 04:31:27 PM
JC they are talking about this Shannon motion on Evening Extra! It's ludicrous!
The man hasn't got the brains to tie his own shoe laces... A stooge if ever there was one but they needed someone quick after Iris was playing offside.
Not that big a stooge looking at his expenses :( Bigger expenses than Ian Og IIRC.
Quote from: imtommygunn on March 22, 2023, 04:43:44 PM
Not that big a stooge looking at his expenses :( Bigger expenses than Ian Og IIRC.
Aye, he knows how to line his pockets, always did.
I'd always had him down as a farm labourer but then noticed his dodgyness and this came back to me;
"Shannon was educated at Ballywalter Primary School and Coleraine Academical Institution. He was a soldier in the Ulster Defence Regiment in 1973–1975 and 1976–1977 and was awarded the General Service Medal. He served in the Royal Artillery TA from 1977 to 1988. He was expelled from the Territorial Army along with two of his colleagues after the theft of a replica Blowpipe missile by loyalists associated with the Ulster Resistance paramilitary group. The group intented to give the missile system to Apartheid South Africa in exchange for weapons.[3] He is a member of the Orange Order and Apprentice Boys of Derry."
Quote from: square_ball on March 22, 2023, 02:51:55 PM
At least Jim Shannon is using his influence at Westminster for good things. Putting a motion in to honour Dolly Parton on the 50th anniversary for one of her songs ::)
Deliberately done to try and deflect from the resounding defeat of the WF vote. Taking the people for fools.
Quote from: yellowcard on March 22, 2023, 05:29:19 PM
Quote from: square_ball on March 22, 2023, 02:51:55 PM
At least Jim Shannon is using his influence at Westminster for good things. Putting a motion in to honour Dolly Parton on the 50th anniversary for one of her songs ::)
Deliberately done to try and deflect from the resounding defeat of the WF vote. Taking the people for fools.
You're giving Jim too much credit, trust me.
Quote from: johnnycool on March 22, 2023, 05:51:22 PM
Quote from: yellowcard on March 22, 2023, 05:29:19 PM
Quote from: square_ball on March 22, 2023, 02:51:55 PM
At least Jim Shannon is using his influence at Westminster for good things. Putting a motion in to honour Dolly Parton on the 50th anniversary for one of her songs ::)
Deliberately done to try and deflect from the resounding defeat of the WF vote. Taking the people for fools.
You're giving Jim too much credit, trust me.
Maybe so, he does come across as a bit of a simpleton alright. Lacking in self awareness and utterly shameless are traits most associated with Wilson, Paisley, Poots and Foster so perhaps Shannon needs to be added to the list as well.
Quote from: yellowcard on March 22, 2023, 05:29:19 PM
Quote from: square_ball on March 22, 2023, 02:51:55 PM
At least Jim Shannon is using his influence at Westminster for good things. Putting a motion in to honour Dolly Parton on the 50th anniversary for one of her songs ::)
Deliberately done to try and deflect from the resounding defeat of the WF vote. Taking the people for fools.
Rather than deflect, somehow it reminds me they made tits of themselves.
Taxpayers are the fools not Jim Shannon.
It's his voters not tax payers. These pricks know how to milk things unfortunately.
What happens next?
More theatrics.
DUP could safely vote against the WF Bill today in the knowledge it would safely pass, they can now tell the electorate how hardcore they are. Hard to see Stormont up and running again anytime soon as the DUP will likely be looking some secondary legislation passed in the HOC in regards to safeguarding NI's place within the UK, as the withdrawal agreement superceded the Act of Union. They'll be pushing to legally nail down what the Stormont brake will look like in practice too I'd imagine.
Varadkar was quoted in today's Irish Times saying that Stormont can probably be reopened without the DUP.
Quote from: seafoid on March 22, 2023, 09:12:01 PM
Varadkar was quoted in today's Irish Times saying that Stormont can probably be reopened without the DUP.
Oh flip. That'll get the hackles up of the low-brow knuckle-dragging king-loving irish-hating loyalists.
Quote from: Orior on March 22, 2023, 09:26:31 PM
Quote from: seafoid on March 22, 2023, 09:12:01 PM
Varadkar was quoted in today's Irish Times saying that Stormont can probably be reopened without the DUP.
Oh flip. That'll get the hackles up of the low-brow knuckle-dragging king-loving irish-hating loyalists.
The DUP tore the arse out of it
The DUP has bigger fish to fry. Jim Shannon is busy going round Westminster trying to get support for his Early Day Motion to mark the 50th anniversary of Dolly Parton's song 'I Will Always Love You'. You couldn't make it up.
Quote from: Dougal Maguire on March 22, 2023, 10:05:56 PM
The DUP has bigger fish to fry. Jim Shannon is busy going round Westminster trying to get support for his Early Day Motion to mark the 50th anniversary of Dolly Parton's song 'I Will Always Love You'. You couldn't make it up.
The DUP love their country.
Bryson talking about war if stormont returns
Quote from: Eire90 on March 23, 2023, 06:15:42 AM
Bryson talking about war if stormont returns
Wouldn't listen to a thing that wee scrote says
Quote from: armaghniac on March 22, 2023, 10:43:50 PM
Quote from: Dougal Maguire on March 22, 2023, 10:05:56 PM
The DUP has bigger fish to fry. Jim Shannon is busy going round Westminster trying to get support for his Early Day Motion to mark the 50th anniversary of Dolly Parton's song 'I Will Always Love You'. You couldn't make it up.
The DUP love their country.
Very underrated response that. ;D
Time to replace the Wolfe Tones with Dolly after championship win TikTok videos.
Quote from: armaghniac on March 22, 2023, 10:43:50 PM
Quote from: Dougal Maguire on March 22, 2023, 10:05:56 PM
The DUP has bigger fish to fry. Jim Shannon is busy going round Westminster trying to get support for his Early Day Motion to mark the 50th anniversary of Dolly Parton's song 'I Will Always Love You'. You couldn't make it up.
The DUP love their country.
very good
Jeffrey, Arlene, Sammy, Gregory, Nigel, Emma, Ian Og, Edwin, Givan, Carla, Angry Jim, Bryson, Moore, Kate, Ben Habib. Ben Lowry, Nolan
What a line up? No friends anywhere in the world, no strategy......Lowry wants to go back to 1972 to 1998........they would all love that.
At last the world sees them for the clowns that they are........but how can we all move on despite them wanting to hold this place back to a time 30 years ago?
Quote from: The Trap on March 23, 2023, 11:52:06 AM
Jeffrey, Arlene, Sammy, Gregory, Nigel, Emma, Ian Og, Edwin, Givan, Carla, Angry Jim, Bryson, Moore, Kate, Ben Habib. Ben Lowry, Nolan
What a line up? No friends anywhere in the world, no strategy......Lowry wants to go back to 1972 to 1998........they would all love that.
At last the world sees them for the clowns that they are........but how can we all move on despite them wanting to hold this place back to a time 30 years ago?
If the voters could gradually abandon them. Allister is deluded
https://twitter.com/JimAllister/status/1638858161464516612
TalkBack doing a segment on Shannon's Dolly Parton love
WTF
Quote from: seafoid on March 23, 2023, 12:16:30 PM
Quote from: The Trap on March 23, 2023, 11:52:06 AM
Jeffrey, Arlene, Sammy, Gregory, Nigel, Emma, Ian Og, Edwin, Givan, Carla, Angry Jim, Bryson, Moore, Kate, Ben Habib. Ben Lowry, Nolan
What a line up? No friends anywhere in the world, no strategy......Lowry wants to go back to 1972 to 1998........they would all love that.
At last the world sees them for the clowns that they are........but how can we all move on despite them wanting to hold this place back to a time 30 years ago?
If the voters could gradually abandon them. Allister is deluded
https://twitter.com/JimAllister/status/1638858161464516612
I enjoyed that very much so.
Quote from: The Trap on March 23, 2023, 11:52:06 AM
Jeffrey, Arlene, Sammy, Gregory, Nigel, Emma, Ian Og, Edwin, Givan, Carla, Angry Jim, Bryson, Moore, Kate, Ben Habib. Ben Lowry, Nolan
What a line up? No friends anywhere in the world, no strategy......Lowry wants to go back to 1972 to 1998........they would all love that.
At last the world sees them for the clowns that they are........but how can we all move on despite them wanting to hold this place back to a time 30 years ago?
Ben Lowry did actually say that direct rule worked well in the 1970's. Quite unbelievable.
One problem with Unionists is that they don't know who they are. This makes them easy to manipulate.
We all need to step back a bit and revaluate what has happened since the GFA came into being.
From the beginning the DUP did not want this agreement because I'm sure Paisley knew it was the start of the end for majority rule by one side of the community.
Jump forward to present day and the DUP couldn't have been given a better excuse to wreck the GFA once and for all especially now that SF hold the balance of power.
I do believe that this is the end of the line for the GFA if the DUP do not take their seats (which I dont think they will do) as no nationalist party could go into power with them again.
I do believe that if the UUP were in the DUP's position it would be no differnt as the stakeholders will always call the shots.
In a democracy , democratic parties accept the results of elections. The DUP and Allister are living in la la land.
Quote from: Hereiam on March 23, 2023, 02:17:28 PM
We all need to step back a bit and revaluate what has happened since the GFA came into being.
From the beginning the DUP did not want this agreement because I'm sure Paisley knew it was the start of the end for majority rule by one side of the community.
Jump forward to present day and the DUP couldn't have been given a better excuse to wreck the GFA once and for all especially now that SF hold the balance of power.
I do believe that this is the end of the line for the GFA if the DUP do not take their seats (which I dont think they will do) as no nationalist party could go into power with them again.
I do believe that if the UUP were in the DUP's position it would be no differnt as the stakeholders will always call the shots.
You forgot to add that while doing that they have constantly said that it's other people who are in breach of the GFA.
They thrive on division and tbh it's all they've got. What problems that causes from now on I guess time will tell but I don't think they'd be particularly unhappy if the troubles came back(which is not something I could remotely see happening tbh).
It's not advisable for Allister to attack the UK Gov or to imply that the Union is over. Because it's behaviour such as his which will end in it being over.
They are Supremacists. It is as pure and simple as that.
Quote from: The Trap on March 23, 2023, 11:52:06 AM
Jeffrey, Arlene, Sammy, Gregory, Nigel, Emma, Ian Og, Edwin, Givan, Carla, Angry Jim, Bryson, Moore, Kate, Ben Habib. Ben Lowry, Nolan
What a line up? No friends anywhere in the world, no strategy......Lowry wants to go back to 1972 to 1998........they would all love that.
At last the world sees them for the clowns that they are........but how can we all move on despite them wanting to hold this place back to a time 30 years ago?
Don't you mean 300 years ago?
The British people have moved on . Only unionists in the north.( and those bigots in Lewes ) behave like they still live in the 1600's.
I presume the Irish Government, Brit Govt and the White House are still pinning hope on DUPUDA going back to Stormont.
Have they a plan B at all?
Quote from: seafoid on March 23, 2023, 03:13:08 PM
It's not advisable for Allister to attack the UK Gov or to imply that the Union is over. Because it's behaviour such as his which will end in it being over.
Shhhh don't be telling him that!
Quote from: Rossfan on March 23, 2023, 04:39:10 PM
I presume the Irish Government, Brit Govt and the White House are still pinning hope on DUPUDA going back to Stormont.
Have they a plan B at all?
If it were up to me, there'd be a ruling body comprising representatives from Westminster and the Dail - with potential non-voting representation from Stormont (to basically act as a conduit to the locals) and the US congress (which might up investment).
Chris Donnelly is a tool too......why is he on so much
It wasn't his best evening. Yer man Shirlow from Liverpool Uni waffling as well. John Campbell cutting through to the facts as always .
Quote from: The Trap on March 23, 2023, 11:28:52 PM
Chris Donnelly is a tool too......why is he on so much
Very harsh. I think He's articulate, intelligent and well able to handle himself whether in radio, tv or writing in the papers. Unashamedly a Republican and there's nothing wrong with that either.
Quote from: Orior on March 23, 2023, 01:50:29 PM
Quote from: The Trap on March 23, 2023, 11:52:06 AM
Jeffrey, Arlene, Sammy, Gregory, Nigel, Emma, Ian Og, Edwin, Givan, Carla, Angry Jim, Bryson, Moore, Kate, Ben Habib. Ben Lowry, Nolan
What a line up? No friends anywhere in the world, no strategy......Lowry wants to go back to 1972 to 1998........they would all love that.
At last the world sees them for the clowns that they are........but how can we all move on despite them wanting to hold this place back to a time 30 years ago?
Ben Lowry did actually say that direct rule worked well in the 1970's. Quite unbelievable.
I recorded the program and watched it last night. I had to pause it because I thought , nah he didn't just say that. I rewind , and sure enough, he had just said it. Unbelievable. But This is what you're dealing with
Quote from: Sportacus on March 23, 2023, 11:40:45 PM
It wasn't his best evening. Yer man Shirlow from Liverpool Uni waffling as well. John Campbell cutting through to the facts as always .
Has anyone ever seen John Campbell smile?
I'd like to hear him crack a joke about numbers e.g. 2+2=5 (for big values of 2)
Quote from: Orior on March 24, 2023, 10:23:33 AM
Quote from: Sportacus on March 23, 2023, 11:40:45 PM
It wasn't his best evening. Yer man Shirlow from Liverpool Uni waffling as well. John Campbell cutting through to the facts as always .
Has anyone ever seen John Campbell smile?
I'd like to hear him crack a joke about numbers e.g. 2+2=5 (for big values of 2)
Is he an Antrim man?
Ballymena.
Has Caruthers ever got a bigger role than interviewing parish pump type politicians in North. He is quite a polished presenter, better than anyone on RTE. Nolan on the other hand is an embarrassment. The other night when he told the caller with a disability to put his face up close to the TV and then proceeds to yell at the top of his lungs: "Michele O'Neill was the Minister of Health." Have the BBC no shame allowing this lug on the air?
Shock jock. And shite at it. In other words, hes a gobshite
He's not that shite at it the money he's getting >:( He just plays to the lowest common denominator and it works for him.
Quote from: johnnycool on March 24, 2023, 10:31:35 AM
Quote from: Orior on March 24, 2023, 10:23:33 AM
Quote from: Sportacus on March 23, 2023, 11:40:45 PM
It wasn't his best evening. Yer man Shirlow from Liverpool Uni waffling as well. John Campbell cutting through to the facts as always .
Has anyone ever seen John Campbell smile?
I'd like to hear him crack a joke about numbers e.g. 2+2=5 (for big values of 2)
Is he an Antrim man?
Went to Garron Tower/St Killians
Quote from: Sportacus on March 23, 2023, 11:40:45 PM
It wasn't his best evening. Yer man Shirlow from Liverpool Uni waffling as well. John Campbell cutting through to the facts as always .
Shirlow was good. Called out Donnelly the SF plant anyway.
Quote from: trailer on March 24, 2023, 12:38:50 PM
Quote from: Sportacus on March 23, 2023, 11:40:45 PM
It wasn't his best evening. Yer man Shirlow from Liverpool Uni waffling as well. John Campbell cutting through to the facts as always .
Shirlow was good. Called out Donnelly the SF plant anyway.
??
I thought Donnelly as usual spoke well. It's a shame most of our politicians can't string a sentence together. Shirliow also spoke well but I see as usual no-one questions the dodgy methodology of the Liverpool university surveys and polls.
https://www.irishtimes.com/politics/2023/03/23/dup-secretly-warned-against-its-own-trade-deal-demand-letter-reveals/
The Democratic Unionist Party (DUP) privately warned the UK government that a "dual regulation" environment in Northern Ireland would not work for crucial industry groups, despite the idea now being one of its demands to restore the region's devolved government.The big issue which the Ulster Farmers' Union (UFU) have raised is the area of dual regulation," Wilson wrote in a letter to the agriculture department, Defra, seen by the Financial Times, adding that the idea "does raise some concerns for us".He explained that farmers in Northern Ireland would always opt to follow EU rules for commercial reasons because that gave them equal access to both the UK and EU markets.The idea of a "dual regulation" framework for Northern Ireland was proposed in former prime minister Boris Johnson's controversial Northern Ireland protocol Bill that was replaced by Mr Sunak's Windsor Framework.But at Westminster on Wednesday, he insisted: "What I do not accept is a situation where every business in my constituency must comply with EU rules even if they do not sell a single widget to the EU. That is wrong, because it harms our place in the internal market of the UK."However, UK officials say the DUP has yet to come up with concrete examples of where the requirement to follow EU rules has impeded Northern Ireland companies from trading with the UK.But London has said there will be none. "There is nothing more to get out of ... negotiation. It is done," Chris Heaton-Harris, the UK's Northern Ireland secretary, said on Thursday.
Quote from: seafoid on March 24, 2023, 01:22:43 PM
https://www.irishtimes.com/politics/2023/03/23/dup-secretly-warned-against-its-own-trade-deal-demand-letter-reveals/
The Democratic Unionist Party (DUP) privately warned the UK government that a "dual regulation" environment in Northern Ireland would not work for crucial industry groups, despite the idea now being one of its demands to restore the region's devolved government.The big issue which the Ulster Farmers' Union (UFU) have raised is the area of dual regulation," Wilson wrote in a letter to the agriculture department, Defra, seen by the Financial Times, adding that the idea "does raise some concerns for us".He explained that farmers in Northern Ireland would always opt to follow EU rules for commercial reasons because that gave them equal access to both the UK and EU markets.The idea of a "dual regulation" framework for Northern Ireland was proposed in former prime minister Boris Johnson's controversial Northern Ireland protocol Bill that was replaced by Mr Sunak's Windsor Framework.But at Westminster on Wednesday, he insisted: "What I do not accept is a situation where every business in my constituency must comply with EU rules even if they do not sell a single widget to the EU. That is wrong, because it harms our place in the internal market of the UK."However, UK officials say the DUP has yet to come up with concrete examples of where the requirement to follow EU rules has impeded Northern Ireland companies from trading with the UK.But London has said there will be none. "There is nothing more to get out of ... negotiation. It is done," Chris Heaton-Harris, the UK's Northern Ireland secretary, said on Thursday.
Wee Sammy caught telling porkies and undermining the UFU and lord knows who else..
Quote from: Silver hill on March 24, 2023, 08:02:22 AM
Quote from: The Trap on March 23, 2023, 11:28:52 PM
Chris Donnelly is a tool too......why is he on so much
Very harsh. I think He's articulate, intelligent and well able to handle himself whether in radio, tv or writing in the papers. Unashamedly a Republican and there's nothing wrong with that either.
Yeah, he speaks grand. Has good political understanding.
Problem is Nolan is running out of lads to come on, so it's a small pool of people he's working with.
II'd say ithey don't go on to his show, then Nolan's show will soon disappear with lack of viewers.
Quote from: Orior on March 23, 2023, 01:50:29 PM
Quote from: The Trap on March 23, 2023, 11:52:06 AM
Jeffrey, Arlene, Sammy, Gregory, Nigel, Emma, Ian Og, Edwin, Givan, Carla, Angry Jim, Bryson, Moore, Kate, Ben Habib. Ben Lowry, Nolan
What a line up? No friends anywhere in the world, no strategy......Lowry wants to go back to 1972 to 1998........they would all love that.
At last the world sees them for the clowns that they are........but how can we all move on despite them wanting to hold this place back to a time 30 years ago?
Ben Lowry did actually say that direct rule worked well in the 1970's. Quite unbelievable.
Not really, if you knew him, or ever had any dealings with him. An utter bigot, and complete tube to boot.
Quote from: red hander on March 24, 2023, 06:01:18 PM
Quote from: Orior on March 23, 2023, 01:50:29 PM
Quote from: The Trap on March 23, 2023, 11:52:06 AM
Jeffrey, Arlene, Sammy, Gregory, Nigel, Emma, Ian Og, Edwin, Givan, Carla, Angry Jim, Bryson, Moore, Kate, Ben Habib. Ben Lowry, Nolan
What a line up? No friends anywhere in the world, no strategy......Lowry wants to go back to 1972 to 1998........they would all love that.
At last the world sees them for the clowns that they are........but how can we all move on despite them wanting to hold this place back to a time 30 years ago?
Ben Lowry did actually say that direct rule worked well in the 1970's. Quite unbelievable.
Not really, if you knew him, or ever had any dealings with him. An utter bigot, and complete tube to boot.
Yeah, at times he gets so worked up about the olden days, you'd think he's about to cry.
(http://www.whytes.ie/images/archive/20130126/243.jpg)
Lowry has a write up today in the Newsletter from a director of a logistics company claiming the Windsor arrangement is worse than the protocol. He fails to mention the same director is also on the board of directors of Mc Burney Transport who was recently sold to a Danish company for 140 million thanks to the duel access.
Quote from: red hander on March 24, 2023, 06:01:18 PM
Quote from: Orior on March 23, 2023, 01:50:29 PM
Quote from: The Trap on March 23, 2023, 11:52:06 AM
Jeffrey, Arlene, Sammy, Gregory, Nigel, Emma, Ian Og, Edwin, Givan, Carla, Angry Jim, Bryson, Moore, Kate, Ben Habib. Ben Lowry, Nolan
What a line up? No friends anywhere in the world, no strategy......Lowry wants to go back to 1972 to 1998........they would all love that.
At last the world sees them for the clowns that they are........but how can we all move on despite them wanting to hold this place back to a time 30 years ago?
Ben Lowry did actually say that direct rule worked well in the 1970's. Quite unbelievable.
Not really, if you knew him, or ever had any dealings with him. An utter bigot, and complete tube to boot.
Can't listen to him. Very blinkered. The plummy accent grinds a bit too.
https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-northern-ireland-65075772 (https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-northern-ireland-65075772)
Jim says no to Stormont at the TUV Ard fheis
Quote from: RedHand88 on March 25, 2023, 06:25:12 PM
https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-northern-ireland-65075772 (https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-northern-ireland-65075772)
Jim says no to Stormont at the TUV Ard fheis
Kate Hoey there too.
https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/the-decline-and-fall-of-the-dup/
There's an excellent read, when the Spectator is on there back its not a great sign.
Quote from: RedHand88 on March 25, 2023, 06:25:12 PM
https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-northern-ireland-65075772 (https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-northern-ireland-65075772)
Jim says no to Stormont at the TUV Ard fheis
Yet they have no issue calling their annual conference their Ard fheis?
Bizzare ;)
Quote from: AustinPowers on March 25, 2023, 07:45:52 PM
Quote from: RedHand88 on March 25, 2023, 06:25:12 PM
https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-northern-ireland-65075772 (https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-northern-ireland-65075772)
Jim says no to Stormont at the TUV Ard fheis
Yet they have no issue calling their annual conference their Ard fheis?
Bizzare ;)
They even have an Ard Comhairle, only Jim is on it
Quote from: Brendan on March 25, 2023, 08:49:23 PM
Quote from: AustinPowers on March 25, 2023, 07:45:52 PM
Quote from: RedHand88 on March 25, 2023, 06:25:12 PM
https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-northern-ireland-65075772 (https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-northern-ireland-65075772)
Jim says no to Stormont at the TUV Ard fheis
Yet they have no issue calling their annual conference their Ard fheis?
Bizzare ;)
They even have an Ard Comhairle, only Jim is on it
Guth traidisiúnta aontachtach
Though I'm not that aufait with unionist politics, but haven't the DUP just shot themselves in both feet by rejecting the Windsor Framework? They could've claimed full credit for the positive changes in the WF but instead come across as political nihilists. Should the next development be calling for new elections isn't there a good chance that there will be a serious swing away from the nihilists?
Unfortunately it's not guaranteed that they would lose votes :( You would have to hope that at some point in this bonkers place people eventually stop voting for the dup but I wouldn't guarantee it. The ticket we're not sf seems to be enough.
In a sane world it would be political suicide yes.
There's no hope the DUP will go back to Stormont the way things are.
It looks like there will be no change to the WF , and according to Mark carruthers the other night , neither British or Irish governments are keen to reform power sharing ( or sf/dup losing their veto)
If there's going to be no change to the WF or power sharing reform , then what are we waiting for ? People can't sit forever waiting and hoping there will be some sort of resolution to get Stormont going again. It's not going to happen
It's either Westminster rule, or joint rule. Whether people want either of those or not , it has to happen. And it needs to happen very quickly.
So here we are. The DUP are never going to go into Government with a SF First Minister. You'd hope that those who could never vote SF would at least choose Alliance. One thing for sure there are a Plethora of elected members getting a big wad of money for doing nothing.
I have a rule if you don't attend 60% attendance at stormont/ govt you don't get paid. Hard to bring in as MPs in England attendance for their Westminster wouldn't be great
In summary, what's the DUPs issue with this latest agreement?
Quote from: nrico2006 on March 26, 2023, 08:06:31 AM
In summary, what's the DUPs issue with this latest agreement?
If you look really closely at the text, you will see that it involves a Nationalist as First Minister.
Quote from: nrico2006 on March 26, 2023, 08:06:31 AM
In summary, what's the DUPs issue with this latest agreement?
1 - as Red Hand says
2 - 470,000,000 didn't do what 200,000 demanded!!
3 - TUVUDAUVFOO says NO.
Quote from: From the Bunker on March 26, 2023, 12:00:40 AM
So here we are. The DUP are never going to go into Government with a SF First Minister. You'd hope that those who could never vote SF would at least choose Alliance. One thing for sure there are a Plethora of elected members getting a big wad of money for doing nothing.
The DUP don't have to be in Government if they don't respect the democratic result. They can be excluded
Quote from: nrico2006 on March 26, 2023, 08:06:31 AM
In summary, what's the DUPs issue with this latest agreement?
Equality - don't want to see a nationalist First Minister. All about the optics.
Protocol is a red herring.
Quote from: nrico2006 on March 26, 2023, 08:06:31 AM
In summary, what's the DUPs issue with this latest agreement?
irishtimes.com/politics/2023/03/23/dup-secretly-warned-against-its-own-trade-deal-demand-letter-reveals/...
"At Westminster Donaldson insisted: "What I don't accept is a situation where every business in my constituency must comply with EU rules even if they do not sell a single widget to the EU. That is wrong, because it harms our place in the UK internal market"
However, UK officials say the DUP has yet to come up with concrete examples of where the requirement to follow EU rules has impeded Northern Ireland companies from trading with the UK. "
Just fancy that!
https://www.irishtimes.com/opinion/2023/03/23/improved-uk-eu-relationship-will-facilitate-all-important-fudges-of-windsor-framework/
Stalling until after May's council elections, which appears to be the DUP's plan, has doomed it to several months of nit-picking and mischief-making, none of it conducive to welcoming a new spirit of partnership.
Quote from: marty34 on March 26, 2023, 10:53:50 AM
Quote from: nrico2006 on March 26, 2023, 08:06:31 AM
In summary, what's the DUPs issue with this latest agreement?
Equality - don't want to see a nationalist First Minister. All about the optics.
Protocol is a red herring.
As someone said- you could let Jim Allister write the framework himself and he would still object to it
Pipe bombs, petrol bombs and masked vigilante groups hanging on street corners "protecting" peoples homes, just another tidy weekend in Newtownards...
Cops watch on.
DUP response, NADA....
Quote from: johnnycool on March 27, 2023, 04:08:35 PM
Pipe bombs, petrol bombs and masked vigilante groups hanging on street corners "protecting" peoples homes, just another tidy weekend in Newtownards...
Cops watch on.
DUP response, NADA....
DUP should be made stand on steps of Stormont and denounce their fellow travellers.
Quote from: marty34 on March 27, 2023, 05:27:36 PM
Quote from: johnnycool on March 27, 2023, 04:08:35 PM
Pipe bombs, petrol bombs and masked vigilante groups hanging on street corners "protecting" peoples homes, just another tidy weekend in Newtownards...
Cops watch on.
DUP response, NADA....
DUP should be made stand on steps of Stormont and denounce their fellow travellers.
DUP strangely quiet on this and the only murmurings from the usual Loyalist bloggers is almost welcoming this "purge" when it's really a power struggle for control of the drugs, not some cleansing of Loyalism...
Helicopters over Ards last night, very little on BBC NI, but I bet the biggest show in the country will be all over it as he can probably hear the helicopters from his house.
Quote from: johnnycool on March 28, 2023, 09:26:07 AM
Quote from: marty34 on March 27, 2023, 05:27:36 PM
Quote from: johnnycool on March 27, 2023, 04:08:35 PM
Pipe bombs, petrol bombs and masked vigilante groups hanging on street corners "protecting" peoples homes, just another tidy weekend in Newtownards...
Cops watch on.
DUP response, NADA....
DUP should be made stand on steps of Stormont and denounce their fellow travellers.
DUP strangely quiet on this and the only murmurings from the usual Loyalist bloggers is almost welcoming this "purge" when it's really a power struggle for control of the drugs, not some cleansing of Loyalism...
Helicopters over Ards last night, very little on BBC NI, but I bet the biggest show in the country will be all over it as he can probably hear the helicopters from his house.
Emma Pengelly was interviewed on GMU this morning about it. I am no DUP supporter but they haven't been quiet.
FWIW I thought Pengelly was giving some political cover to the LCC and by extension these groups.
Quote from: trailer on March 28, 2023, 09:52:12 AM
Quote from: johnnycool on March 28, 2023, 09:26:07 AM
Quote from: marty34 on March 27, 2023, 05:27:36 PM
Quote from: johnnycool on March 27, 2023, 04:08:35 PM
Pipe bombs, petrol bombs and masked vigilante groups hanging on street corners "protecting" peoples homes, just another tidy weekend in Newtownards...
Cops watch on.
DUP response, NADA....
DUP should be made stand on steps of Stormont and denounce their fellow travellers.
DUP strangely quiet on this and the only murmurings from the usual Loyalist bloggers is almost welcoming this "purge" when it's really a power struggle for control of the drugs, not some cleansing of Loyalism...
Helicopters over Ards last night, very little on BBC NI, but I bet the biggest show in the country will be all over it as he can probably hear the helicopters from his house.
Emma Pengelly was interviewed on GMU this morning about it. I am no DUP supporter but they haven't been quiet.
FWIW I thought Pengelly was giving some political cover to the LCC and by extension these groups.
What did she say?
Quote from: johnnycool on March 28, 2023, 09:53:09 AM
Quote from: trailer on March 28, 2023, 09:52:12 AM
Quote from: johnnycool on March 28, 2023, 09:26:07 AM
Quote from: marty34 on March 27, 2023, 05:27:36 PM
Quote from: johnnycool on March 27, 2023, 04:08:35 PM
Pipe bombs, petrol bombs and masked vigilante groups hanging on street corners "protecting" peoples homes, just another tidy weekend in Newtownards...
Cops watch on.
DUP response, NADA....
DUP should be made stand on steps of Stormont and denounce their fellow travellers.
DUP strangely quiet on this and the only murmurings from the usual Loyalist bloggers is almost welcoming this "purge" when it's really a power struggle for control of the drugs, not some cleansing of Loyalism...
Helicopters over Ards last night, very little on BBC NI, but I bet the biggest show in the country will be all over it as he can probably hear the helicopters from his house.
Emma Pengelly was interviewed on GMU this morning about it. I am no DUP supporter but they haven't been quiet.
FWIW I thought Pengelly was giving some political cover to the LCC and by extension these groups.
What did she say?
They condemn violence and that they will engage with all groups. LCC is to facilitate a move away from violence. They're helping these groups, UDA, UVF etc to move away from criminality. Felt she got an easy enough ride.
I don't know how the LCC is facilitating a move away from violence when they are continually using thinly veiled threats of violence wrt the protocol. They are in fact doing the opposite.
If they move away from criminality then they don't exist (unless government funding makes them stop that).
She's horrendous.
Quote from: imtommygunn on March 28, 2023, 10:18:32 AM
I don't know how the LCC is facilitating a move away from violence when they are continually using thinly veiled threats of violence wrt the protocol. They are in fact doing the opposite.
If they move away from criminality then they don't exist (unless government funding makes them stop that).
She's horrendous.
The actual existence of the UVF/UDA doesn't ever seem to be questioned and this LCC crap and the DUP in discussions with stakeholders reinforces this crap that somehow these organisations are legitimate and no one bats an eyelid..
It's ludicrous (I was going to say unbelievable but not so much) there hasn't been significant scrutiny on this and in particular the background of the likes of the guy Campbell etc.
When was the last time a loyalist or anyone for that matter been convicted with being a member of the UDA/UVF ect.
Tells you all you need to know about the state of the law and order in the north.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-65091660
All thanks to the DUP
What an utter cesspit of a society we live in. If anything its getting worse
Quote from: Hereiam on March 28, 2023, 11:47:54 AM
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-65091660
All thanks to the DUP
FFS.
50 yrs in schools??? I'm not 50 and I never had this in either primary or secondary school
Quote from: snoopdog on March 28, 2023, 01:45:34 PM
50 yrs in schools??? I'm not 50 and I never had this in either primary or secondary school
We'd it in Primary school, early 80's.
Quote from: snoopdog on March 28, 2023, 01:45:34 PM
50 yrs in schools??? I'm not 50 and I never had this in either primary or secondary school
You would have needed to be able to cycle a bicycle to get on it. :P
Quote from: snoopdog on March 28, 2023, 01:45:34 PM
50 yrs in schools??? I'm not 50 and I never had this in either primary or secondary school
Are all transport related issues not segregated by religion up there ?
Quote from: johnnycool on March 28, 2023, 01:47:37 PM
Quote from: snoopdog on March 28, 2023, 01:45:34 PM
50 yrs in schools??? I'm not 50 and I never had this in either primary or secondary school
We'd it in Primary school, early 80's 70's
Fixed that
Quote from: seafoid on March 28, 2023, 03:37:13 PM
Quote from: snoopdog on March 28, 2023, 01:45:34 PM
50 yrs in schools??? I'm not 50 and I never had this in either primary or secondary school
Are all transport related issues not segregated by religion up there ?
No-one mentioned tandem bikes did they?
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on March 28, 2023, 06:51:40 PM
Quote from: johnnycool on March 28, 2023, 01:47:37 PM
Quote from: snoopdog on March 28, 2023, 01:45:34 PM
50 yrs in schools??? I'm not 50 and I never had this in either primary or secondary school
We'd it in Primary school, early 80's 70's
Fixed that
I was in P7, so 79 or so.. Thanks for the correction ;)
Quote from: johnnycool on March 29, 2023, 08:53:29 AM
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on March 28, 2023, 06:51:40 PM
Quote from: johnnycool on March 28, 2023, 01:47:37 PM
Quote from: snoopdog on March 28, 2023, 01:45:34 PM
50 yrs in schools??? I'm not 50 and I never had this in either primary or secondary school
We'd it in Primary school, early 80's 70's
Fixed that
I was in P7, so 79 or so.. Thanks for the correction ;)
I'm a bit younger so 80's for me ;) though cycling to school and avoiding the burnt out buses and coming home during the riots was more like an assault course
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on March 29, 2023, 09:00:22 AM
Quote from: johnnycool on March 29, 2023, 08:53:29 AM
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on March 28, 2023, 06:51:40 PM
Quote from: johnnycool on March 28, 2023, 01:47:37 PM
Quote from: snoopdog on March 28, 2023, 01:45:34 PM
50 yrs in schools??? I'm not 50 and I never had this in either primary or secondary school
We'd it in Primary school, early 80's 70's
Fixed that
I was in P7, so 79 or so.. Thanks for the correction ;)
I'm a bit younger so 80's for me ;) though cycling to school and avoiding the burnt out buses and coming home during the riots was more like an assault course
The kids in Newtownards will be experiencing that this morning ;D
Ah, the good ole days, I was just trying to avoid the cow shíte on the roads.
Quote from: trailer on March 28, 2023, 09:55:19 AM
Quote from: johnnycool on March 28, 2023, 09:53:09 AM
Quote from: trailer on March 28, 2023, 09:52:12 AM
Quote from: johnnycool on March 28, 2023, 09:26:07 AM
Quote from: marty34 on March 27, 2023, 05:27:36 PM
Quote from: johnnycool on March 27, 2023, 04:08:35 PM
Pipe bombs, petrol bombs and masked vigilante groups hanging on street corners "protecting" peoples homes, just another tidy weekend in Newtownards...
Cops watch on.
DUP response, NADA....
DUP should be made stand on steps of Stormont and denounce their fellow travellers.
DUP strangely quiet on this and the only murmurings from the usual Loyalist bloggers is almost welcoming this "purge" when it's really a power struggle for control of the drugs, not some cleansing of Loyalism...
Helicopters over Ards last night, very little on BBC NI, but I bet the biggest show in the country will be all over it as he can probably hear the helicopters from his house.
Emma Pengelly was interviewed on GMU this morning about it. I am no DUP supporter but they haven't been quiet.
FWIW I thought Pengelly was giving some political cover to the LCC and by extension these groups.
What did she say?
They condemn violence and that they will engage with all groups. LCC is to facilitate a move away from violence. They're helping these groups, UDA, UVF etc to move away from criminality. Felt she got an easy enough ride.
Car set alight in Ballywalter, almost at Jim Shannon's back door, but NADA...
You can't expect DUPUDA to criticise their masters!
Chopper in the air tonight again, place is turning into Vietnam ;D
Enjoyed the show on The Prime Minister of Northern Ireland.. bunch of public school rich orange feckers
https://www.irishtimes.com/sport/gaelic-games/2023/03/30/ciaran-murphy-its-not-hard-to-do-away-with-superfluous-finals-and-increase-drama/
There is an event at Croke Park this Saturday, April 1st, part of the Thinking Futures: Building Recognition initiative for the Institute of Irish Studies, University of Liverpool and the GAA. Each forum will feature a chaired panel discussion with two pro-union and two GAA panel members with 10 minutes each to explain their identity and attitude to the constitutional question. The aim is to start a conversation and build reconciliation.
Tickets are available on eventbrite.
https://www.eventbrite.co.uk/e/thinking-futures-building-recognition-dublin-tickets-580651964657
While the exploitation of people at these 'international' car wash places needs to be investigated and those that are being used by criminal gangs need to be need to be brought to hand, the recent events in Newtownards is being ignored by Nolan lol!!
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on March 30, 2023, 09:41:13 AM
While the exploitation of people at these 'international' car wash places needs to be investigated and those that are being used by criminal gangs need to be need to be brought to hand, the recent events in Newtownards is being ignored by Nolan lol!!
Nolan needs sent to work in a carwash for a week or two, some real work might do him good!
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on March 30, 2023, 09:41:13 AM
While the exploitation of people at these 'international' car wash places needs to be investigated and those that are being used by criminal gangs need to be need to be brought to hand, the recent events in Newtownards is being ignored by Nolan lol!!
When you're able to get a valet and wash for 15quid, there's something not right.
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on March 30, 2023, 09:41:13 AM
While the exploitation of people at these 'international' car wash places needs to be investigated and those that are being used by criminal gangs need to be need to be brought to hand, the recent events in Newtownards is being ignored by Nolan lol!!
The same loyalist paramilitary groups are a very useful tool for extreme unionism to be used as and when required. So it shouldn't be surprising that institutionalised media do not want to highlight or report these sinister criminals feuding. When it gets to the stage where the SDLP are boycotting that show you know it is merely nothing more than an entertainment show that places sectariansim as its main selling point, mostly as a talking shop for loyalism.
The SDLP one was more than entertainment though. It was the LCC getting their usual free ride. It's actually quite sinister.
Quote from: RedHand88 on March 30, 2023, 10:14:17 AM
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on March 30, 2023, 09:41:13 AM
While the exploitation of people at these 'international' car wash places needs to be investigated and those that are being used by criminal gangs need to be need to be brought to hand, the recent events in Newtownards is being ignored by Nolan lol!!
When you're able to get a valet and wash for 15quid, there's something not right.
It is estimated that its a 1.7billion business industry in the UK, be that legal or the other, Wife still uses them, I tell her not too but what's new lol.. there is a way of looking at it, first the police or councils that allow the sites to run, need to step in, check that H&S is being adhered to at the very least and that those employed are doing so of their own free will.
The owners should be checked that they are paying properly (minimum wage) and its not bringing illegals or migrant workers as slaves. Also that the business is not polluting water systems
If we use them (illegal ones) then you are encouraging it. I've stopped using them a long time ago, but knowing fine well that none of it was legit at the time.
Are they linked to paramilitary groups? If not probably paying protection money.
If they were all shut down, where would they be put to work? Drug dealing prostitution and so on?
groups of masked men appear in newtownards town centre in broad daylight
Quote from: Eire90 on March 30, 2023, 03:15:01 PM
groups of masked men appear in newtownards town centre in broad daylight
Covid must be rife there
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on March 30, 2023, 03:15:58 PM
Quote from: Eire90 on March 30, 2023, 03:15:01 PM
groups of masked men appear in newtownards town centre in broad daylight
Covid must be rife there
The worst thing is those right wing criminal extremists wouldn't wear a mask when they were supposed to.
WTF are those useless PSNI wankers doing about these scum? Heard on the radio they were 'negotiating' to bring an end to feud. Proof, if proof was needed, of what a failed shithole statelet this is. Do you think the response would be same if this was happening in a nationalist area, or in any place in Britain?
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on March 30, 2023, 03:15:58 PM
Quote from: Eire90 on March 30, 2023, 03:15:01 PM
groups of masked men appear in newtownards town centre in broad daylight
Covid must be rife there
the peelers treating them like sheep...
(https://focus.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/thumbor/SSoq9AcC7MtQnF6aAUlctS0IMsM=/0x0:3394x2059/fit-in/960x640/prod-mh-ireland/55ccce13-1673-4def-a5f8-ebfab9dcaa87/bc1e9ce8-97b4-4e7a-b6d1-0d8b2ae1f6cf/55ccce13-1673-4def-a5f8-ebfab9dcaa87.jpg)
Quote from: red hander on March 30, 2023, 04:12:03 PM
WTF are those useless PSNI wankers doing about these scum? Heard on the radio they were 'negotiating' to bring an end to feud. Proof, if proof was needed, of what a failed shithole statelet this is. Do you think the response would be same if this was happening in a nationalist area, or in any place in Britain?
In any normal functioning society the sight of masked men openly walking around town streets would be front page news. But it is normalised here as working class protestant people are told by politicians exactly where to look for their enemies. Loyalism is a cloak for their primary purpose which is coercion, racketeering, drug dealing and extortion. It's all about controlling communities by fear and if people are kept in poverty then they can't see a way out.
Just remember these illegal groups are the people who the DUP run to for approval on major political decisions. The LCC and David Campbell have placed themselves at the forefront of political discussions around the protocol and the BBC have sought their opinion at various stages throughout this process. Where is David Campbell now?
Loyalism is a name of convenience for these groups. They are organised criminals from a loyalist background. The language is changing but the policing is not. There should be a full frontal on them and there should be widespread condemnation of the lack of condemnation from the DUP....but this won't happen. It's all part of the game that is our politics and our day to day life. Biden is coming over next week. Will be a big financial package out in place to make this cursed place work for the next number of years....£5bn I hear. A portion of this will go to the 'community groups' who have lost a load of European funding this week. This is the pension for the Dee Stitts et al.
These scumbags shouldn't get a penny when hard working people can barely get by. Why on earth is the UDA even mentioned by the press when they are no longer members. The language used is vital yet the cretins here in the media don't seem to understand this. Hopefully they kill other!!!
Let's face it most of the funding in these community groups, on both sides of the house, go on salaries & a bit left over for whatever project they are working on
Absolute scumbags the whole lot of them with not a single brain cell between them. In an ideal world where there is a united ireland I would love to see a few van loads of guards being sent in to put manners on these f@#kers.
shooting in west belfast last night
Quote from: LC on March 30, 2023, 08:10:46 PM
Absolute scumbags the whole lot of them with not a single brain cell between them. In an ideal world where there is a united ireland I would love to see a few van loads of guards being sent in to put manners on these f@#kers.
that would start the troubles again
Group calling themselves the real UFF is this the original real UFF or the new real UFF
Quote from: Eire90 on March 31, 2023, 12:09:37 PM
shooting in west belfast last night
Was teaching up the Shankill during one of the feuds, god must be over 20 years ago. Families all had top move out of the areas they lived in for fear of being shot or house petrol bombed while they were in it. They don't mess about, most just guilty by association rather than being involved
Quote from: LC on March 30, 2023, 08:10:46 PM
Absolute scumbags the whole lot of them with not a single brain cell between them. In an ideal world where there is a united ireland I would love to see a few van loads of guards being sent in to put manners on these f@#kers.
Christ on a bike you think the ERU is resourced enough to take on all these lads?! Or maybe your everyday run off the mill Garda with the big thick head on him should be sent in to help as well?
apparantly there has been an assault at a shopping centre in newtownards
Wouldnt be suprise if we see violence tonight with them all on the weekend coke
Imagine the scenes if this shit was going on in Cross or somewhere!
Quote from: Armagh18 on March 31, 2023, 07:26:48 PM
Imagine the scenes if this shit was going on in Cross or somewhere!
The thing is it wouldn't be happening to this level, maybe back in the day but those days are gone. There is no control over those involved anymore. Too much money involved in this turf war
When the last time there was a major republican fued.
Quote from: brokencrossbar1 on March 31, 2023, 07:32:43 PM
Quote from: Armagh18 on March 31, 2023, 07:26:48 PM
Imagine the scenes if this shit was going on in Cross or somewhere!
The thing is it wouldn't be happening to this level, maybe back in the day but those days are gone. There is no control over those involved anymore. Too much money involved in this turf war
This is not really political at all, it is more like the Hutch-Kinahan feud or other gang wars in Limerick or Drogheda.
Quote from: Eire90 on March 31, 2023, 06:30:15 PM
Wouldnt be suprise if we see violence tonight with them all on the weekend coke
We can only hope!
Quote from: armaghniac on March 31, 2023, 08:53:30 PM
Quote from: brokencrossbar1 on March 31, 2023, 07:32:43 PM
Quote from: Armagh18 on March 31, 2023, 07:26:48 PM
Imagine the scenes if this shit was going on in Cross or somewhere!
The thing is it wouldn't be happening to this level, maybe back in the day but those days are gone. There is no control over those involved anymore. Too much money involved in this turf war
This is not really political at all, it is more like the Hutch-Kinahan feud or other gang wars in Limerick or Drogheda.
Which side are the DUP on?
Quote from: Eire90 on March 31, 2023, 08:43:54 PM
When the last time there was a major republican fued.
When Peadar Toibín left to set up Aontú
Was there not a boy shot in short strand a few years ago in some kind of feud? That may have been drug related but more or less the same... Actually that may have been someone from dublin came up.
https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/sunday-life/news/dup-seeks-meeting-with-ni-secretary-to-resolve-drumcree-dispute/1802280697.html
Not hard to know July is far away, time to stir the pot. How niaive on her part to think SoS give two hoots about this.
Lockhart...
A vile bigot ::)
They need some votes in council elections so need to stir things up a bit for the lowest common denominator.
Quote from: LC on April 02, 2023, 06:43:47 PM
https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/sunday-life/news/dup-seeks-meeting-with-ni-secretary-to-resolve-drumcree-dispute/1802280697.html
Not hard to know July is far away, time to stir the pot. How niaive on her part to think SoS give two hoots about this.
Wasn't it resolved 25 years ago when the cnuts were told ye can't parade down Garvaghy Road?
Quote from: LC on April 02, 2023, 06:43:47 PM
https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/sunday-life/news/dup-seeks-meeting-with-ni-secretary-to-resolve-drumcree-dispute/1802280697.html
Not hard to know July is far away, time to stir the pot. How niaive on her part to think SoS give two hoots about this.
April Fool?
I have no doubt this would have part of the deals done between the DUP and the Tories for their votes.
dup basically threatening eu not to show up to good friday agreement events but i bet they wouldnt dare threaten the tories even tho they signed the agreement also do not see them threatening joe biden
What or where is this? I see no mention of it.
sammy wilson and arlene foster warn eu delegates to stay away
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2023/04/03/unionists-eu-northern-ireland-peace-deal-anniversary/
The EU has a lot more reason to attend Good Friday events than the anti GF agreement DUP.
Quote from: Eire90 on April 04, 2023, 05:05:50 PM
sammy wilson and arlene foster warn eu delegates to stay away
No one likes us we don't care say the DUP! It would appear that Arlene Foster has retired in name only with the amount of publicity she has received since being ousted but self awareness was never her strong point after leading unionism down a Brexit cul de sac which has continued to this day.
They are still doing the bidding of the ERG and Arlene in particular has a debt to repay to them after getting her Baroness and Dame titles off the back of propping up the Brexit wing of the Tory party. I think they live in a bubble where they think that a fringe regional political party are at the centre of the universe.
Quote from: yellowcard on April 04, 2023, 05:30:37 PM
Quote from: Eire90 on April 04, 2023, 05:05:50 PM
sammy wilson and arlene foster warn eu delegates to stay away
No one likes us we don't care say the DUP! It would appear that Arlene Foster has retired in name only with the amount of publicity she has received since being ousted but self awareness was never her strong point after leading unionism down a Brexit cul de sac which has continued to this day.
They are still doing the bidding of the ERG and Arlene in particular has a debt to repay to them after getting her Baroness and Dame titles off the back of propping up the Brexit wing of the Tory party. I think they live in a bubble where they think that a fringe regional political party are at the centre of the universe.
+1
Quote from: LC on April 04, 2023, 05:50:28 PM
Quote from: yellowcard on April 04, 2023, 05:30:37 PM
Quote from: Eire90 on April 04, 2023, 05:05:50 PM
sammy wilson and arlene foster warn eu delegates to stay away
No one likes us we don't care say the DUP! It would appear that Arlene Foster has retired in name only with the amount of publicity she has received since being ousted but self awareness was never her strong point after leading unionism down a Brexit cul de sac which has continued to this day.
They are still doing the bidding of the ERG and Arlene in particular has a debt to repay to them after getting her Baroness and Dame titles off the back of propping up the Brexit wing of the Tory party. I think they live in a bubble where they think that a fringe regional political party are at the centre of the universe.
+1
But that universe is only 5000 years old ;D ;)
Talkbalk has Unionists on gurning about Biden coming here.
"He says he's Irish, hes not Northern Irish"
I see the DUP have launched another charm offensive against the US administration as he embarks on his tour of Ireland. They just can't help themselves, before inviting someone else into their house for a cup of tea they would first need to prove their Britishness, anyone else is simply persona non grata.
Foster has completely lost the plot. Tbh I suspect she is at this point just looking for attention. She keeps getting peerages and awards but that doesn't hide the fact she is a complete failure and has done almost irreparable damage to the DUP. (Well hope that is the case anyway!).
Quote from: imtommygunn on April 12, 2023, 03:45:32 PM
Foster has completely lost the plot. Tbh I suspect she is at this point just looking for attention. She keeps getting peerages and awards but that doesn't hide the fact she is a complete failure and has done almost irreparable damage to the DUP. (Well hope that is the case anyway!).
Dan Wooten loves her.
Kate Hoey loves her.
Sammy Wilson loves her.
Nigel Farage loves her.
Unfortunately none of the above post on GAA Board so we are unable to explore the cause of such adoration.
Quote from: Orior on April 12, 2023, 03:53:18 PM
Quote from: imtommygunn on April 12, 2023, 03:45:32 PM
Foster has completely lost the plot. Tbh I suspect she is at this point just looking for attention. She keeps getting peerages and awards but that doesn't hide the fact she is a complete failure and has done almost irreparable damage to the DUP. (Well hope that is the case anyway!).
Dan Wooten loves her.
Kate Hoey loves her.
Sammy Wilson loves her.
Nigel Farage loves her.
Unfortunately none of the above post on GAA Board so we are unable to explore the cause of such adoration.
What a lovely bunch of "friends".
Quote from: yellowcard on April 12, 2023, 03:33:07 PM
I see the DUP have launched another charm offensive against the US administration as he embarks on his tour of Ireland. They just can't help themselves, before inviting someone else into their house for a cup of tea they would first need to prove their Britishness, anyone else is simply persona non grata.
Arlene has highlighted their train of thought though. If you are Irish or consider yourself Irish, you must hate the British, there is no other middle ground.
Sad really
On the outside, looking it, yet again.
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FthFvisXoAQ3Wuh?format=jpg&name=small)
Quote from: johnnycool on April 12, 2023, 04:11:34 PM
Quote from: yellowcard on April 12, 2023, 03:33:07 PM
I see the DUP have launched another charm offensive against the US administration as he embarks on his tour of Ireland. They just can't help themselves, before inviting someone else into their house for a cup of tea they would first need to prove their Britishness, anyone else is simply persona non grata.
Arlene has highlighted their train of thought though. If you are Irish or consider yourself Irish, you must hate the British, there is no other middle ground.
Sad really
It's only because she hates anything Irish. That has nothing to do with non DUP Brits.
Quote from: johnnycool on April 12, 2023, 04:19:59 PM
On the outside, looking it, yet again.
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FthFvisXoAQ3Wuh?format=jpg&name=small)
That image is like something you'd see in a horror film
And what's Les Ferdinand doing on tv talking about a presidential visit?
Don't like EU, don't like Ireland, Don't like America, Don't like Labour, who do the DUP like? Buddy buddy with the Israelis who killed more British soldiers than the IRA bck before Palestine troubles broke out after WW2. Their only love in left is, Russia.
I've never been able to decide if it's bigotry or stupidity/incompetence that defines Arlene. She certainly has demonstrated incompetence in each of her political roles culminating in RHI. I've come to the conclusion it's a bit of both.
Anyone with a pea for a brain would understand the importance and value of a US President visiting here in terms of potential for foreign investment. Made the mistake of listening to Nolan this morning for 10 minutes. A cesspit of negativity. Not many of his callers got the bigger picture around his visit.
https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/northern-ireland/state-papers-dup-mp-william-mccrea-wanted-air-strikes-launched-on-the-republic-in-the-1980s/30867020.html (https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/northern-ireland/state-papers-dup-mp-william-mccrea-wanted-air-strikes-launched-on-the-republic-in-the-1980s/30867020.html)
Quote from: GJL on April 12, 2023, 09:01:01 PM
https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/northern-ireland/state-papers-dup-mp-william-mccrea-wanted-air-strikes-launched-on-the-republic-in-the-1980s/30867020.html (https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/northern-ireland/state-papers-dup-mp-william-mccrea-wanted-air-strikes-launched-on-the-republic-in-the-1980s/30867020.html)
The singing bigot
Quote from: GJL on April 12, 2023, 09:01:01 PM
https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/northern-ireland/state-papers-dup-mp-william-mccrea-wanted-air-strikes-launched-on-the-republic-in-the-1980s/30867020.html (https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/northern-ireland/state-papers-dup-mp-william-mccrea-wanted-air-strikes-launched-on-the-republic-in-the-1980s/30867020.html)
Willie has wanted (and frequently obtained) many, many things his God wouldn't approve of in his time.
Quote from: gallsman on April 12, 2023, 09:11:03 PM
Quote from: GJL on April 12, 2023, 09:01:01 PM
https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/northern-ireland/state-papers-dup-mp-william-mccrea-wanted-air-strikes-launched-on-the-republic-in-the-1980s/30867020.html (https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/northern-ireland/state-papers-dup-mp-william-mccrea-wanted-air-strikes-launched-on-the-republic-in-the-1980s/30867020.html)
Willie has wanted (and frequently obtained) many, many things his God wouldn't approve of in his time.
Willie has been very much sidelined the past number of years. Maybe the superinjunction rumours were true.
If there's a free junket to the US on St. Patrick's Day, the DUP will not turn it down.
Had the misfortune of being on the same flight as McCrea to Heathrow a couple of months ago ... laughable how he tried to shield his face from everyone boarding the plane. The image of him on the platform with Billy 'King Rat' Wright won't be forgotten, hopefully his pal has the fires well stoked awaiting the arrival of the Baron of Magherafelt & Cookstown.
Quote from: LeoMc on April 12, 2023, 09:43:22 PM
Quote from: gallsman on April 12, 2023, 09:11:03 PM
Quote from: GJL on April 12, 2023, 09:01:01 PM
https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/northern-ireland/state-papers-dup-mp-william-mccrea-wanted-air-strikes-launched-on-the-republic-in-the-1980s/30867020.html (https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/northern-ireland/state-papers-dup-mp-william-mccrea-wanted-air-strikes-launched-on-the-republic-in-the-1980s/30867020.html)
Willie has wanted (and frequently obtained) many, many things his God wouldn't approve of in his time.
Willie has been very much sidelined the past number of years. Maybe the superinjunction rumours were true.
Aw now come on you can't leave us hanging like that. Spill??
Quote from: gallsman on April 12, 2023, 09:11:03 PM
Quote from: GJL on April 12, 2023, 09:01:01 PM
https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/northern-ireland/state-papers-dup-mp-william-mccrea-wanted-air-strikes-launched-on-the-republic-in-the-1980s/30867020.html (https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/northern-ireland/state-papers-dup-mp-william-mccrea-wanted-air-strikes-launched-on-the-republic-in-the-1980s/30867020.html)
Willie has wanted (and frequently obtained) many, many things his God wouldn't approve of in his time.
A bad one and no amount of praying can hide that.
Good living for a living.
After telling her audience that Biden hated the UK, Snarlene Foster has taken offence at the president not flying the union fleg on his presendential car.
At lunchtime today, Ben Lowry let slip that the DUP/Unionists are not good at diplomacy. Who knew!
Now Sammy has weighed in with his 2 cents worth and called Joe Biden a bigot like his mother.
Quote from: Orior on April 13, 2023, 09:30:16 PM
After telling her audience that Biden hated the UK, Snarlene Foster has taken offence at the president not flying the union fleg on his presendential car.
At lunchtime today, Ben Lowry let slip that the DUP/Unionists are not good at diplomacy. Who knew!
They really are going out of their way to be offended .
No amount of talking , pandering, gestures etc will ever be enough for them or will ever please them. It is time to reform Stormont , and move on without them. For all Stormont 's ills , at least reforming it will be a big statement , ie . that we've all had enough of your sh1t.
Quote from: Orior on April 13, 2023, 09:30:16 PM
After telling her audience that Biden hated the UK, Snarlene Foster has taken offence at the president not flying the union fleg on his presendential car.
At lunchtime today, Ben Lowry let slip that the DUP/Unionists are not good at diplomacy. Who knew!
When Ben's giving out, you're in a bad place.
Quote from: AustinPowers on April 13, 2023, 10:23:46 PM
Quote from: Orior on April 13, 2023, 09:30:16 PM
After telling her audience that Biden hated the UK, Snarlene Foster has taken offence at the president not flying the union fleg on his presendential car.
At lunchtime today, Ben Lowry let slip that the DUP/Unionists are not good at diplomacy. Who knew!
They really are going out of their way to be offended .
No amount of talking , pandering, gestures etc will ever be enough for them or will ever please them. It is time to reform Stormont , and move on without them. For all Stormont 's ills , at least reforming it will be a big statement , ie . that we've all had enough of your sh1t.
Sleepy Joe offending the Brits again with his speech in Dublin saying the UK Gov should be doing more with the Irish Gov to resolve the issues in NI, he's very right as since May (Theresa that is ) no UK Prime minister has given two flying fúcks for this place and yet the DUP lick their balls like the subservient slaves that they are..
I wonder will the TUV take many seats off the DUP in the local elections in May?
DUP still playing the 'hardline' card for this election, so it mightn't affect them that much.
Unionism is all over the place and Jeffrey Donaldson has had little or no control of the DUP since taking over. In the last few days you had Wilson, Foster, Wells and Paisley all queuing up from the sidelines to have a pop at the US presidents visit and then you have that ultra antagonist Bryson meeting with him regularly for god knows what. It all sits well with their base but the optics look terrible from the outside world looking in. But none of those DUP politicians have any money concerns so they can afford to whip up the masses for their own political and financial benefits.
Add to that their use of propaganda outlets such as the Newsletter, GB News and the Nolan Show which are used as a political tool and which are all designed to whip up fear & division and Unionism is in a sorry state. No long term strategy whatsoever except for hurdling through the next election with the same old tired, negative voices.
When these people stick 2 fingers up at the most powerful man in the world you really understand that there is no dealing, negotiating or finding common ground with them. They'd let the world burn so long as there was a union jack flying on a pole somewhere. The only question is when will protestants/unionists see that there is no future for them if they continue to vote in these dinosaurs
Hardline unionists have enough support for the next 10-15 years. By that stage majority of the hardcore elders who cling to the trouble era will be dead, then we should see a softer unionists stance the younger generation come through who care more about jobs and wages rather than flags and Britain.
Quote from: yellowcard on April 14, 2023, 09:58:34 AM
Unionism is all over the place and Jeffrey Donaldson has had little or no control of the DUP since taking over. In the last few days you had Wilson, Foster, Wells and Paisley all queuing up from the sidelines to have a pop at the US presidents visit and then you have that ultra antagonist Bryson meeting with him regularly for god knows what. It all sits well with their base but the optics look terrible from the outside world looking in. But none of those DUP politicians have any money concerns so they can afford to whip up the masses for their own political and financial benefits.
Add to that their use of propaganda outlets such as the Newsletter, GB News and the Nolan Show which are used as a political tool and which are all designed to whip up fear & division and Unionism is in a sorry state. No long term strategy whatsoever except for hurdling through the next election with the same old tired, negative voices.
It is a very fragmented party but for some reason it still works. I still think they basically hang on the ticket of "we're not SF".
I would say you're right tyrone08. I don't think they are going anywhere soon but they will eventually.
Also I wish their lies would be called out significantly more. They did not tell their voters they would bring down stormont prior to doing so and you see Pengelly swanning round there having earned nothing.
At least in one regard the world has now seen we have known all along - that they're bonkers and just can't be reasoned with at all.
Quote from: marty34 on April 14, 2023, 09:11:05 AM
I wonder will the TUV take many seats off the DUP in the local elections in May?
DUP still playing the 'hardline' card for this election, so it mightn't affect them that much.
Even if the DUP moved to a more moderate position, the TUV wouldn't take much off them. Always found this curious as to why the DUP feel they need to protect their right flank.
TUV have been on the go for 15 years now. I put their occasional popularity in the polls to the unionist electorates opinion of Jim Allister. Unfortunately for them, he can only stand in one constituency. Even the most prominent of their other candidates wouldn't be the most, shall we kindly say, impressive of individuals. When Jim goes, the party will go (bar an odd councilor).
Quote from: imtommygunn on April 14, 2023, 10:39:04 AM
Quote from: yellowcard on April 14, 2023, 09:58:34 AM
Unionism is all over the place and Jeffrey Donaldson has had little or no control of the DUP since taking over. In the last few days you had Wilson, Foster, Wells and Paisley all queuing up from the sidelines to have a pop at the US presidents visit and then you have that ultra antagonist Bryson meeting with him regularly for god knows what. It all sits well with their base but the optics look terrible from the outside world looking in. But none of those DUP politicians have any money concerns so they can afford to whip up the masses for their own political and financial benefits.
Add to that their use of propaganda outlets such as the Newsletter, GB News and the Nolan Show which are used as a political tool and which are all designed to whip up fear & division and Unionism is in a sorry state. No long term strategy whatsoever except for hurdling through the next election with the same old tired, negative voices.
It is a very fragmented party but for some reason it still works. I still think they basically hang on the ticket of "we're not SF".
I would say you're right tyrone08. I don't think they are going anywhere soon but they will eventually.
Also I wish their lies would be called out significantly more. They did not tell their voters they would bring down stormont prior to doing so and you see Pengelly swanning round there having earned nothing.
At least in one regard the world has now seen we have known all along - that they're bonkers and just can't be reasoned with at all.
This in a nutshell.
The days of saying each side is as bad as each other needs to be questioned as it was never the case and now anyone having to deal with the DUP are seeing what they are like and that includes Sunak who evidently bowed to their pressure and downgraded Bidens visit as per their wishes and made him and the UK look pathetic to the US.
https://www.irishecho.com/2023/4/cold-house-for-biden-no-love-lost-between-americans-and-british-during-visit#.ZDfEVTqtVSx.twitter (https://www.irishecho.com/2023/4/cold-house-for-biden-no-love-lost-between-americans-and-british-during-visit#.ZDfEVTqtVSx.twitter)
I think a lot will change in the next 10 years.
Now is like the old science experiment when it took ages for the water to change colour, then with one drop, the colour changes dramatically.
This is what is happening now with the demographics and the next few years, things will change dramatically.
Demographics is the big shaker now.
Quote from: marty34 on April 14, 2023, 11:20:18 AM
I think a lot will change in the next 10 years.
Now is like the old science experiment when it took ages for the water to change colour, then with one drop, the colour changes dramatically.
This is what is happening now with the demographics and the next few years, things will change dramatically.
Demographics is the big shaker now.
If you think demographics and demographics alone will deliver a united Ireland you are deluded.
Quote from: trailer on April 14, 2023, 12:06:43 PM
Quote from: marty34 on April 14, 2023, 11:20:18 AM
I think a lot will change in the next 10 years.
Now is like the old science experiment when it took ages for the water to change colour, then with one drop, the colour changes dramatically.
This is what is happening now with the demographics and the next few years, things will change dramatically.
Demographics is the big shaker now.
If you think demographics and demographics alone will deliver a united Ireland you are deluded.
Demographics alone won't work because too many nationalists leaning people don't vote or spunk their vote on the alliance party who talk a good game but literally have zero interest in a UI
Quote from: johnnycool on April 14, 2023, 11:12:47 AM
Quote from: imtommygunn on April 14, 2023, 10:39:04 AM
Quote from: yellowcard on April 14, 2023, 09:58:34 AM
Unionism is all over the place and Jeffrey Donaldson has had little or no control of the DUP since taking over. In the last few days you had Wilson, Foster, Wells and Paisley all queuing up from the sidelines to have a pop at the US presidents visit and then you have that ultra antagonist Bryson meeting with him regularly for god knows what. It all sits well with their base but the optics look terrible from the outside world looking in. But none of those DUP politicians have any money concerns so they can afford to whip up the masses for their own political and financial benefits.
Add to that their use of propaganda outlets such as the Newsletter, GB News and the Nolan Show which are used as a political tool and which are all designed to whip up fear & division and Unionism is in a sorry state. No long term strategy whatsoever except for hurdling through the next election with the same old tired, negative voices.
It is a very fragmented party but for some reason it still works. I still think they basically hang on the ticket of "we're not SF".
I would say you're right tyrone08. I don't think they are going anywhere soon but they will eventually.
Also I wish their lies would be called out significantly more. They did not tell their voters they would bring down stormont prior to doing so and you see Pengelly swanning round there having earned nothing.
At least in one regard the world has now seen we have known all along - that they're bonkers and just can't be reasoned with at all.
This in a nutshell.
The days of saying each side is as bad as each other needs to be questioned as it was never the case and now anyone having to deal with the DUP are seeing what they are like and that includes Sunak who evidently bowed to their pressure and downgraded Bidens visit as per their wishes and made him and the UK look pathetic to the US.
https://www.irishecho.com/2023/4/cold-house-for-biden-no-love-lost-between-americans-and-british-during-visit#.ZDfEVTqtVSx.twitter (https://www.irishecho.com/2023/4/cold-house-for-biden-no-love-lost-between-americans-and-british-during-visit#.ZDfEVTqtVSx.twitter)
You can see Biden has very very little regard for Sunak. The Brits are becoming an international embarassment tbh. Johnson's tenure and Brexit have really hammered that home.
Quote from: JPGJOHNNYG on April 14, 2023, 12:29:27 PM
Quote from: trailer on April 14, 2023, 12:06:43 PM
Quote from: marty34 on April 14, 2023, 11:20:18 AM
I think a lot will change in the next 10 years.
Now is like the old science experiment when it took ages for the water to change colour, then with one drop, the colour changes dramatically.
This is what is happening now with the demographics and the next few years, things will change dramatically.
Demographics is the big shaker now.
If you think demographics and demographics alone will deliver a united Ireland you are deluded.
Demographics alone won't work because too many nationalists leaning people don't vote or spunk their vote on the alliance party who talk a good game but literally have zero interest in a UI
You are right, demographics alone won't work but when the UK slides further into economic turmoil after Brexit, guess which part of it will bare the brunt? That and demographics will be the death of the union and the unionists know this but they just can't process it.
Quote from: Itchy on April 14, 2023, 01:10:03 PM
Quote from: JPGJOHNNYG on April 14, 2023, 12:29:27 PM
Quote from: trailer on April 14, 2023, 12:06:43 PM
Quote from: marty34 on April 14, 2023, 11:20:18 AM
I think a lot will change in the next 10 years.
Now is like the old science experiment when it took ages for the water to change colour, then with one drop, the colour changes dramatically.
This is what is happening now with the demographics and the next few years, things will change dramatically.
Demographics is the big shaker now.
If you think demographics and demographics alone will deliver a united Ireland you are deluded.
Demographics alone won't work because too many nationalists leaning people don't vote or spunk their vote on the alliance party who talk a good game but literally have zero interest in a UI
You are right, demographics alone won't work but when the UK slides further into economic turmoil after Brexit, guess which part of it will bare the brunt? That and demographics will be the death of the union and the unionists know this but they just can't process it.
You can't vote Alliance in a UI referendum.
The sitting on the fence will be over.
You have the choice of not voting!
Quote from: Rossfan on April 14, 2023, 01:29:49 PM
You have the choice of not voting!
You certainly do, but that won't prevent a majority from voting Tá
Quote from: Itchy on April 14, 2023, 01:10:03 PM
Quote from: JPGJOHNNYG on April 14, 2023, 12:29:27 PM
Quote from: trailer on April 14, 2023, 12:06:43 PM
Quote from: marty34 on April 14, 2023, 11:20:18 AM
I think a lot will change in the next 10 years.
Now is like the old science experiment when it took ages for the water to change colour, then with one drop, the colour changes dramatically.
This is what is happening now with the demographics and the next few years, things will change dramatically.
Demographics is the big shaker now.
If you think demographics and demographics alone will deliver a united Ireland you are deluded.
Demographics alone won't work because too many nationalists leaning people don't vote or spunk their vote on the alliance party who talk a good game but literally have zero interest in a UI
You are right, demographics alone won't work but when the UK slides further into economic turmoil after Brexit, guess which part of it will bare the brunt? That and demographics will be the death of the union and the unionists know this but they just can't process it.
If people on here think that unionism will change overnight, you's are deluded.
In 2023, the anti-Irish manifesto is still alive and well. Actually worse since the 1920's.
And then people think that unionism can be talked to etc.
How's that going?
Quote from: imtommygunn on April 14, 2023, 12:35:47 PM
Quote from: johnnycool on April 14, 2023, 11:12:47 AM
Quote from: imtommygunn on April 14, 2023, 10:39:04 AM
Quote from: yellowcard on April 14, 2023, 09:58:34 AM
Unionism is all over the place and Jeffrey Donaldson has had little or no control of the DUP since taking over. In the last few days you had Wilson, Foster, Wells and Paisley all queuing up from the sidelines to have a pop at the US presidents visit and then you have that ultra antagonist Bryson meeting with him regularly for god knows what. It all sits well with their base but the optics look terrible from the outside world looking in. But none of those DUP politicians have any money concerns so they can afford to whip up the masses for their own political and financial benefits.
Add to that their use of propaganda outlets such as the Newsletter, GB News and the Nolan Show which are used as a political tool and which are all designed to whip up fear & division and Unionism is in a sorry state. No long term strategy whatsoever except for hurdling through the next election with the same old tired, negative voices.
It is a very fragmented party but for some reason it still works. I still think they basically hang on the ticket of "we're not SF".
I would say you're right tyrone08. I don't think they are going anywhere soon but they will eventually.
Also I wish their lies would be called out significantly more. They did not tell their voters they would bring down stormont prior to doing so and you see Pengelly swanning round there having earned nothing.
At least in one regard the world has now seen we have known all along - that they're bonkers and just can't be reasoned with at all.
This in a nutshell.
The days of saying each side is as bad as each other needs to be questioned as it was never the case and now anyone having to deal with the DUP are seeing what they are like and that includes Sunak who evidently bowed to their pressure and downgraded Bidens visit as per their wishes and made him and the UK look pathetic to the US.
https://www.irishecho.com/2023/4/cold-house-for-biden-no-love-lost-between-americans-and-british-during-visit#.ZDfEVTqtVSx.twitter (https://www.irishecho.com/2023/4/cold-house-for-biden-no-love-lost-between-americans-and-british-during-visit#.ZDfEVTqtVSx.twitter)
You can see Biden has very very little regard for Sunak. The Brits are becoming an international embarassment tbh. Johnson's tenure and Brexit have really hammered that home.
Sunak won't be in post for long, he is a bit of a lame duck prime minister. He knows pragmatically that he has to forge closer relationship with the EU for the overall future economic health of the UK. But he is also hamstrung by the ERG Tories within his own party who will ditch and turn on him as soon as they get the chance. So he finds himself constantly creating culture wars around immigration and the likes.
Ireland has an opportunity now to forge ahead of the UK, being the primary English speaking EU country with a well educated workforce and low corporate tax rate. The north could benefit somewhat from this also with still being in the EU for goods, but looking at the difference in attitude in the last few weeks when the DUP went out of their way to insult the Americans, you would wonder will this investment be as forthcoming as it could potentially be.
https://www.gov.uk/register-to-vote
Make sure all your friends and family are updated and registered to vote at the correct address.
Quote from: marty34 on April 14, 2023, 02:00:05 PM
Quote from: Itchy on April 14, 2023, 01:10:03 PM
Quote from: JPGJOHNNYG on April 14, 2023, 12:29:27 PM
Quote from: trailer on April 14, 2023, 12:06:43 PM
Quote from: marty34 on April 14, 2023, 11:20:18 AM
I think a lot will change in the next 10 years.
Now is like the old science experiment when it took ages for the water to change colour, then with one drop, the colour changes dramatically.
This is what is happening now with the demographics and the next few years, things will change dramatically.
Demographics is the big shaker now.
If you think demographics and demographics alone will deliver a united Ireland you are deluded.
Demographics alone won't work because too many nationalists leaning people don't vote or spunk their vote on the alliance party who talk a good game but literally have zero interest in a UI
You are right, demographics alone won't work but when the UK slides further into economic turmoil after Brexit, guess which part of it will bare the brunt? That and demographics will be the death of the union and the unionists know this but they just can't process it.
If people on here think that unionism will change overnight, you's are deluded.
In 2023, the anti-Irish manifesto is still alive and well. Actually worse since the 1920's.
And then people think that unionism can be talked to etc.
How's that going?
Unionism is an election or two from slipping below 40% of the vote. The biggest question is why UI trails staying in UK in most opinion polls when the statelet is some shitshow. The economic performance of the 26 is light years ahead of the 6. Education prospects are better. Life span is longer and despite criticism of health service in 26, the standards are clearly higher. The xenophobia of the DUP is an embarrassment. There's extremists in 26 too but they command less than a percentage or two of electorate. Then the NI supporters coming out against Casement, unable to see that they have not a stadium for purpose in their mighty UK. You would think at this stage that UI in opinion polls would pull ahead. Why does clinging to the Brexit UK/Unionism still win the day - when a better alternative is now clearly visible.
Quote from: marty34 on April 14, 2023, 02:00:05 PM
Quote from: Itchy on April 14, 2023, 01:10:03 PM
Quote from: JPGJOHNNYG on April 14, 2023, 12:29:27 PM
Quote from: trailer on April 14, 2023, 12:06:43 PM
Quote from: marty34 on April 14, 2023, 11:20:18 AM
I think a lot will change in the next 10 years.
Now is like the old science experiment when it took ages for the water to change colour, then with one drop, the colour changes dramatically.
This is what is happening now with the demographics and the next few years, things will change dramatically.
Demographics is the big shaker now.
If you think demographics and demographics alone will deliver a united Ireland you are deluded.
Demographics alone won't work because too many nationalists leaning people don't vote or spunk their vote on the alliance party who talk a good game but literally have zero interest in a UI
You are right, demographics alone won't work but when the UK slides further into economic turmoil after Brexit, guess which part of it will bare the brunt? That and demographics will be the death of the union and the unionists know this but they just can't process it.
If people on here think that unionism will change overnight, you's are deluded.
In 2023, the anti-Irish manifesto is still alive and well. Actually worse since the 1920's.
And then people think that unionism can be talked to etc.
How's that going?
Hard-line unionists definitely not. The Union is above everything, health, prosperity, everything. Nothing trumps "Our Precious Union".
I think we need to convince some on what would be deemed "our side" who get lumped in with Nationalists and probably some even vote SF. We could start convincing them. And once we've done that we could move on to trickier targets like Alliance voters.
https://www.theguardian.com/stage/2018/sep/30/stephen-rea-british-identity-is-dwindling-brexit-samuel-beckett-cyprus-avenue#:~:text=The%20Belfast%20I%20grew%20up,flag%2C%20all%20that%20stuff.%E2%80%9D
The Belfast I grew up in was a pre-Troubles city, so not progressive in any meaningful way. Put simply, they would not do anything the Free State [Ireland] did. They got rid of the Irish language, they banned the Irish flag, all that stuff."
Unionists were, and still are, cut off not just from Catholics and from Ireland, but from the world. It's pure isolation. And it is so drummed into the young that they cannot let go of these views."
Quote from: weareros on April 14, 2023, 02:39:28 PM
Quote from: marty34 on April 14, 2023, 02:00:05 PM
Quote from: Itchy on April 14, 2023, 01:10:03 PM
Quote from: JPGJOHNNYG on April 14, 2023, 12:29:27 PM
Quote from: trailer on April 14, 2023, 12:06:43 PM
Quote from: marty34 on April 14, 2023, 11:20:18 AM
I think a lot will change in the next 10 years.
Now is like the old science experiment when it took ages for the water to change colour, then with one drop, the colour changes dramatically.
This is what is happening now with the demographics and the next few years, things will change dramatically.
Demographics is the big shaker now.
If you think demographics and demographics alone will deliver a united Ireland you are deluded.
Demographics alone won't work because too many nationalists leaning people don't vote or spunk their vote on the alliance party who talk a good game but literally have zero interest in a UI
You are right, demographics alone won't work but when the UK slides further into economic turmoil after Brexit, guess which part of it will bare the brunt? That and demographics will be the death of the union and the unionists know this but they just can't process it.
If people on here think that unionism will change overnight, you's are deluded.
In 2023, the anti-Irish manifesto is still alive and well. Actually worse since the 1920's.
And then people think that unionism can be talked to etc.
How's that going?
Unionism is an election or two from slipping below 40% of the vote. The biggest question is why UI trails staying in UK in most opinion polls when the statelet is some shitshow. The economic performance of the 26 is light years ahead of the 6. Education prospects are better. Life span is longer and despite criticism of health service in 26, the standards are clearly higher. The xenophobia of the DUP is an embarrassment. There's extremists in 26 too but they command less than a percentage or two of electorate. Then the NI supporters coming out against Casement, unable to see that they have not a stadium for purpose in their mighty UK. You would think at this stage that UI in opinion polls would pull ahead. Why does clinging to the Brexit UK/Unionism still win the day - when a better alternative is now clearly visible.
The reality is people fear change and until the benefits of a UI are clearly defined and risk free people will stay with the status quo. There is a lot of work to be donee on this. The current Irish Government is Luke warm at best on a UI and that doesn't help.
Quote from: Applesisapples on April 14, 2023, 03:02:20 PM
Quote from: weareros on April 14, 2023, 02:39:28 PM
Quote from: marty34 on April 14, 2023, 02:00:05 PM
Quote from: Itchy on April 14, 2023, 01:10:03 PM
Quote from: JPGJOHNNYG on April 14, 2023, 12:29:27 PM
Quote from: trailer on April 14, 2023, 12:06:43 PM
Quote from: marty34 on April 14, 2023, 11:20:18 AM
I think a lot will change in the next 10 years.
Now is like the old science experiment when it took ages for the water to change colour, then with one drop, the colour changes dramatically.
This is what is happening now with the demographics and the next few years, things will change dramatically.
Demographics is the big shaker now.
If you think demographics and demographics alone will deliver a united Ireland you are deluded.
Demographics alone won't work because too many nationalists leaning people don't vote or spunk their vote on the alliance party who talk a good game but literally have zero interest in a UI
You are right, demographics alone won't work but when the UK slides further into economic turmoil after Brexit, guess which part of it will bare the brunt? That and demographics will be the death of the union and the unionists know this but they just can't process it.
If people on here think that unionism will change overnight, you's are deluded.
In 2023, the anti-Irish manifesto is still alive and well. Actually worse since the 1920's.
And then people think that unionism can be talked to etc.
How's that going?
Unionism is an election or two from slipping below 40% of the vote. The biggest question is why UI trails staying in UK in most opinion polls when the statelet is some shitshow. The economic performance of the 26 is light years ahead of the 6. Education prospects are better. Life span is longer and despite criticism of health service in 26, the standards are clearly higher. The xenophobia of the DUP is an embarrassment. There's extremists in 26 too but they command less than a percentage or two of electorate. Then the NI supporters coming out against Casement, unable to see that they have not a stadium for purpose in their mighty UK. You would think at this stage that UI in opinion polls would pull ahead. Why does clinging to the Brexit UK/Unionism still win the day - when a better alternative is now clearly visible.
The reality is people fear change and until the benefits of a UI are clearly defined and risk free people will stay with the status quo. There is a lot of work to be donee on this. The current Irish Government is Luke warm at best on a UI and that doesn't help.
No surpise, NI is an economic basket case that has been insolvent for years. By taking on NI the RoI GDP would be taking a serious hit.
The reform needed in the health service would be huge. The hit with civil service jobs and pensions would be huge. Funding peace initiatives would be huge. Big undertaking for the south. Though please do it ;D
I think any referendum would need to be projected say 15 years or so in the event of a yes to unification.
There would need to be time to get things aligned, but you would imagine significant EU support and funding would be made available. If Brexit means Brexit for the long term, then it would be in the EU's interest to ensure that a United Ireland would be a comparative success.
Identity politics would be so complex. It's hard to visualise Sammy Wilson or Jim Allister in Dáil Éireann, and when the likes of Nigel or Arlene won't have the prospect of a House of Lords as a fallback, it might be more difficult to convince the politicians rather than the electorate.
Quote from: LC on April 14, 2023, 03:48:18 PM
Quote from: Applesisapples on April 14, 2023, 03:02:20 PM
Quote from: weareros on April 14, 2023, 02:39:28 PM
Quote from: marty34 on April 14, 2023, 02:00:05 PM
Quote from: Itchy on April 14, 2023, 01:10:03 PM
Quote from: JPGJOHNNYG on April 14, 2023, 12:29:27 PM
Quote from: trailer on April 14, 2023, 12:06:43 PM
Quote from: marty34 on April 14, 2023, 11:20:18 AM
I think a lot will change in the next 10 years.
Now is like the old science experiment when it took ages for the water to change colour, then with one drop, the colour changes dramatically.
This is what is happening now with the demographics and the next few years, things will change dramatically.
Demographics is the big shaker now.
If you think demographics and demographics alone will deliver a united Ireland you are deluded.
Demographics alone won't work because too many nationalists leaning people don't vote or spunk their vote on the alliance party who talk a good game but literally have zero interest in a UI
You are right, demographics alone won't work but when the UK slides further into economic turmoil after Brexit, guess which part of it will bare the brunt? That and demographics will be the death of the union and the unionists know this but they just can't process it.
If people on here think that unionism will change overnight, you's are deluded.
In 2023, the anti-Irish manifesto is still alive and well. Actually worse since the 1920's.
And then people think that unionism can be talked to etc.
How's that going?
Unionism is an election or two from slipping below 40% of the vote. The biggest question is why UI trails staying in UK in most opinion polls when the statelet is some shitshow. The economic performance of the 26 is light years ahead of the 6. Education prospects are better. Life span is longer and despite criticism of health service in 26, the standards are clearly higher. The xenophobia of the DUP is an embarrassment. There's extremists in 26 too but they command less than a percentage or two of electorate. Then the NI supporters coming out against Casement, unable to see that they have not a stadium for purpose in their mighty UK. You would think at this stage that UI in opinion polls would pull ahead. Why does clinging to the Brexit UK/Unionism still win the day - when a better alternative is now clearly visible.
The reality is people fear change and until the benefits of a UI are clearly defined and risk free people will stay with the status quo. There is a lot of work to be donee on this. The current Irish Government is Luke warm at best on a UI and that doesn't help.
No surpise, NI is an economic basket case that has been insolvent for years. By taking on NI the RoI GDP would be taking a serious hit.
The current Irish Government is on borrowed time and FG especially will be gone after next election
Quote from: seafoid on April 14, 2023, 03:00:50 PM
https://www.theguardian.com/stage/2018/sep/30/stephen-rea-british-identity-is-dwindling-brexit-samuel-beckett-cyprus-avenue#:~:text=The%20Belfast%20I%20grew%20up,flag%2C%20all%20that%20stuff.%E2%80%9D
The Belfast I grew up in was a pre-Troubles city, so not progressive in any meaningful way. Put simply, they would not do anything the Free State [Ireland] did. They got rid of the Irish language, they banned the Irish flag, all that stuff."
Unionists were, and still are, cut off not just from Catholics and from Ireland, but from the world. It's pure isolation. And it is so drummed into the young that they cannot let go of these views."
Seafoid
Fabulous article and genuinely first time I read the poem
Thanks
Stormont budget cuts look to be very deep and severe. CHH is out to punish the DUP (and the rest of us by extension) for their treatment of May when they were in a confidence and supply agreement and for their unwillingness to go into Stormont.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-65378104
The likes of this article today is telling, usually when the private sector gets it a bit tight the construction industry still has public sector works to fall back on however if the housing markets continues to slow down you are looking at a perfect storm.
I would not be surprised if the budget comes out on Friday, always a good day to try and out put out bad news, especially on a bank holiday weekend.
Is he punishing DUP or are these hard choices the Assembly parties would rather London make. Could not see SF or DUP wanting to be associated with water charges, higher university fees, prescription charges, over 60s travel, cuts in civil service workforce. But if Assembly was up and running, how would the £600m financial hole be raised?
The DUP are expected to go back to Stormont next month after the local elections.
Quote from: seafoid on April 25, 2023, 07:59:27 PM
The DUP are expected to go back to Stormont next month after the local elections.
Do you think so?
I'd say they'll not go in until after the marching season...plus with a sweetner from they Tory Party to sell to their faithful as a win.
Quote from: marty34 on April 25, 2023, 08:01:52 PM
Quote from: seafoid on April 25, 2023, 07:59:27 PM
The DUP are expected to go back to Stormont next month after the local elections.
Do you think so?
I'd say they'll not go in until after the marching season...plus with a sweetner from they Tory Party to sell to their faithful as a win.
That's what Newton Emerson expects
It was always about holding out to after the LE, go as hard line as the TUV so as not to lose too many seats. After that then to see about getting some way back into Stormont.
It's a pity their voter base is simply that bigoted that they don't care about public services or schools or hospitals to see through this sh*t show.
I remain to be convinced they'll go back into government tbh. I think they are shooting themselves in the foot if they do and will lose votes going in with a SF first minister.
On the flip side the north is unworkable with no government so they are also shooting themselves in the foot by not going in as it will expedite talk of a united ireland further than they have already done.
I'm sceptical as well as to whether they'll go back. But huge cuts are coming and huge choices. Public works are paused for the foreseeable and other publicly funded groups are shutting their doors it is a terrible look for all our parties but especially the DUP.
CHH is out to punish the DUP. Two reasons. One because they won't form a Government and two just to show those uppity Ulster upstarts that they don't rule WM.
If the DUP go in to stormont in the morning, are things likely to change? Would the wee 6 have access to any more finances? Genuinely interested to hear?
Quote from: trailer on April 26, 2023, 09:17:00 AM
I'm sceptical as well as to whether they'll go back. But huge cuts are coming and huge choices. Public works are paused for the foreseeable and other publicly funded groups are shutting their doors it is a terrible look for all our parties but especially the DUP.
CHH is out to punish the DUP. Two reasons. One because they won't form a Government and two just to show those uppity Ulster upstarts that they don't rule WM.
I don't think the torys have forgot the "milk and no sugar" statement from Ian Og, there is a bit more knife twisting and revenge in store yet.
Quote from: trueblue1234 on April 26, 2023, 10:37:56 AM
If the DUP go in to stormont in the morning, are things likely to change? Would the wee 6 have access to any more finances? Genuinely interested to hear?
Some have suggested the harsh cuts are to force DUP back in and then they - ie DUP - will get a reward. Brian Feeney is sceptical of that in todays Irish News as Britain is broke and there's no Tory votes in North.
Arlene was right!
The IRA will offer hundreds of billions of dollars in grants, loans, tax incentives and subsidies to support the production of goods such as electric vehicles and green energy - the catch being that recipients must manufacture on US soil.
Quote from: trueblue1234 on April 26, 2023, 10:37:56 AM
If the DUP go in to stormont in the morning, are things likely to change? Would the wee 6 have access to any more finances? Genuinely interested to hear?
25 years post the GFA the British Government are long past the point of bank rolling the wee 6, time for us this country to enter the real world of operating within your means. British Government do not give 2 hoots about this place and DUP have absolutely no leverage. All politicians will at no doubt return to Stormont in the next few months but will probably be motivated by getting their wages and those and all their cronies back up to were it was. By that stage all the tough calls will have been made (which none of them would ever have the balls to do) so easy for them to just point the figure at Westminster.
Quote from: weareros on April 26, 2023, 10:55:31 AM
Quote from: trueblue1234 on April 26, 2023, 10:37:56 AM
If the DUP go in to stormont in the morning, are things likely to change? Would the wee 6 have access to any more finances? Genuinely interested to hear?
Some have suggested the harsh cuts are to force DUP back in and then they - ie DUP - will get a reward. Brian Feeney is sceptical of that in todays Irish News as Britain is broke and there's no Tory votes in North.
I am too. I think there are monies owed etc and basically the chickens have come home to roost from overspending and stuff like that.
Quote from: imtommygunn on April 26, 2023, 11:15:50 AM
Quote from: weareros on April 26, 2023, 10:55:31 AM
Quote from: trueblue1234 on April 26, 2023, 10:37:56 AM
If the DUP go in to stormont in the morning, are things likely to change? Would the wee 6 have access to any more finances? Genuinely interested to hear?
Some have suggested the harsh cuts are to force DUP back in and then they - ie DUP - will get a reward. Brian Feeney is sceptical of that in todays Irish News as Britain is broke and there's no Tory votes in North.
I am too. I think there are monies owed etc and basically the chickens have come home to roost from overspending and stuff like that.
Must be serious money wasted on ridiculous things because where is all this overspending happening? The roads are a joke, probably less craters on the moon. The health service is on it's knees, staff are overworked and underpaid and teachers/nurses/doctors if they've any sense are heading to the middle east or down under if they have any sense. Education not much better, schools are unbelievably underfunded.
There is talk of EU money owed too. I read a bit on it but no expert tbh.
The health service here is absolutely crippled. I don't know how it gets out of it's current situation at all. The rest of it as you say isn't great either.
Quote from: imtommygunn on April 26, 2023, 12:13:33 PM
There is talk of EU money owed too. I read a bit on it but no expert tbh.
The health service here is absolutely crippled. I don't know how it gets out of it's current situation at all. The rest of it as you say isn't great either.
The European Social Fund was worth £40m per year to charities in North. DUP mantra was this was UK's money just coming back from EU and Brexit funds would match and exceed. When the ESF recently stopped, it was replaced by UK fund of £57m... then the fine print, £57m over two years.
Meanwhile Nationalism and its leader being all grown up
https://m.independent.ie/irish-news/politics/sinn-feins-michelle-oneill-to-attend-the-coronation-of-king-charles/a826316762.html
Quote from: Rossfan on April 26, 2023, 01:45:00 PM
Meanwhile Nationalism and its leader being all grown up
https://m.independent.ie/irish-news/politics/sinn-feins-michelle-oneill-to-attend-the-coronation-of-king-charles/a826316762.html
Watch wee Jim's head completely explode now!
Quote from: trueblue1234 on April 26, 2023, 10:37:56 AM
If the DUP go in to stormont in the morning, are things likely to change? Would the wee 6 have access to any more finances? Genuinely interested to hear?
Open to correction on any of this, but, as I understood it, last year Stormont took an advance from Westminster of a few hundred million to cover costs. Things like covid and inflation were blamed for this need. They then wanted to pay the few hundred million back over ~5 years, so that any cuts necessary to square things up would be more manageable.
Westminster, maybe because the Brits are broke, or because they don't give a shite about the north, or because they want to stick it to the DUP, said nah, you're paying it all back this year. Add in inflation and the hole in the budget jumps another few hundred million.
Health accounts for a massive proportion of all spending and it's already fucked, so can't be cut at all. Education is the other big ticket item and you can't cut too much there either, because kids have to go to school. So the ~£600 million hole gets plugged with deeper cuts in all the other Departments - and with a lot of things just getting axed altogether.
Completely dysfunctional way to run things, but dysfunction is our specialty up here. Even if funding is restored next year, it will take years to work back from the damages of the 2023 cuts. Some previously funded areas will just have died off altogether, never to return. These are the things that leave us behind our neighbours in the south or elsewhere in western Europe on most important metrics.
There is only one blindingly obvious solution to this.
Wee Jeff been outsmarted by Michelle who is playing a blinder imo.
Watch this space . I'm Not convinced that the DUP aren't the ones who are playing smart and end up getting what they want.
Getting people out to vote is a challenge,but if you play an extreme card , then it can motivate to vote . The danger of softer politics is that it doesn't motivate .
If your position is intransigent, others end up moving to accommodate you , and you can claim victory in your intransigence. This seige mentality can work to your advantage. As we have seen in many occasions .
The final sweetener from the tories to get DUP on board , may be a big payout to boost the NI budget, for which the DUP can also claim victory , just in time for the polls.
The Tories aren't stupid. There's a real chance that Labour will not secure a majority and the Tories could once again be dependent on DUP votes , and in any event they won't want to anger the ERG section of the party by hanging the DUP out to dry.
Meantime a SF soft approach might get a few more SDLP votes on board but is unlikely to result in a surge.
There are craftier people than us making the decisions , and history has shown that whatever happens , Tories won't want to kick the DUP in the teeth .
It ain't over 'til it's over
Quote from: 6th sam on April 26, 2023, 07:16:43 PM
Watch this space . I'm Not convinced that the DUP aren't the ones who are playing smart and end up getting what they want.
Getting people out to vote is a challenge,but if you play an extreme card , then it can motivate to vote . The danger of softer politics is that it doesn't motivate .
If your position is intransigent, others end up moving to accommodate you , and you can claim victory in your intransigence. This seige mentality can work to your advantage. As we have seen in many occasions .
The final sweetener from the tories to get DUP on board , may be a big payout to boost the NI budget, for which the DUP can also claim victory , just in time for the polls.
The Tories aren't stupid. There's a real chance that Labour will not secure a majority and the Tories could once again be dependent on DUP votes , and in any event they won't want to anger the ERG section of the party by hanging the DUP out to dry.
Meantime a SF soft approach might get a few more SDLP votes on board but is unlikely to result in a surge.
There are craftier people than us making the decisions , and history has shown that whatever happens , Tories won't want to kick the DUP in the teeth .
It ain't over 'til it's over
The Tories don't mind shafting the DUP.
Quote from: seafoid on April 26, 2023, 08:04:15 PM
Quote from: 6th sam on April 26, 2023, 07:16:43 PM
Watch this space . I'm Not convinced that the DUP aren't the ones who are playing smart and end up getting what they want.
Getting people out to vote is a challenge,but if you play an extreme card , then it can motivate to vote . The danger of softer politics is that it doesn't motivate .
If your position is intransigent, others end up moving to accommodate you , and you can claim victory in your intransigence. This seige mentality can work to your advantage. As we have seen in many occasions .
The final sweetener from the tories to get DUP on board , may be a big payout to boost the NI budget, for which the DUP can also claim victory , just in time for the polls.
The Tories aren't stupid. There's a real chance that Labour will not secure a majority and the Tories could once again be dependent on DUP votes , and in any event they won't want to anger the ERG section of the party by hanging the DUP out to dry.
Meantime a SF soft approach might get a few more SDLP votes on board but is unlikely to result in a surge.
There are craftier people than us making the decisions , and history has shown that whatever happens , Tories won't want to kick the DUP in the teeth .
It ain't over 'til it's over
The Tories don't mind shafting the DUP.
They've supported the DUP shafting the rest of us for years, what makes u think they'll find a conscience all of a sudden ?
Quote from: 6th sam on April 26, 2023, 09:22:01 PM
Quote from: seafoid on April 26, 2023, 08:04:15 PM
Quote from: 6th sam on April 26, 2023, 07:16:43 PM
Watch this space . I'm Not convinced that the DUP aren't the ones who are playing smart and end up getting what they want.
Getting people out to vote is a challenge,but if you play an extreme card , then it can motivate to vote . The danger of softer politics is that it doesn't motivate .
If your position is intransigent, others end up moving to accommodate you , and you can claim victory in your intransigence. This seige mentality can work to your advantage. As we have seen in many occasions .
The final sweetener from the tories to get DUP on board , may be a big payout to boost the NI budget, for which the DUP can also claim victory , just in time for the polls.
The Tories aren't stupid. There's a real chance that Labour will not secure a majority and the Tories could once again be dependent on DUP votes , and in any event they won't want to anger the ERG section of the party by hanging the DUP out to dry.
Meantime a SF soft approach might get a few more SDLP votes on board but is unlikely to result in a surge.
There are craftier people than us making the decisions , and history has shown that whatever happens , Tories won't want to kick the DUP in the teeth .
It ain't over 'til it's over
The Tories don't mind shafting the DUP.
They've supported the DUP shafting the rest of us for years, what makes u think they'll find a conscience all of a sudden ?
The DUP shafted Theresa May. So they had to pay
Quote from: seafoid on April 26, 2023, 09:26:01 PM
Quote from: 6th sam on April 26, 2023, 09:22:01 PM
Quote from: seafoid on April 26, 2023, 08:04:15 PM
Quote from: 6th sam on April 26, 2023, 07:16:43 PM
Watch this space . I'm Not convinced that the DUP aren't the ones who are playing smart and end up getting what they want.
Getting people out to vote is a challenge,but if you play an extreme card , then it can motivate to vote . The danger of softer politics is that it doesn't motivate .
If your position is intransigent, others end up moving to accommodate you , and you can claim victory in your intransigence. This seige mentality can work to your advantage. As we have seen in many occasions .
The final sweetener from the tories to get DUP on board , may be a big payout to boost the NI budget, for which the DUP can also claim victory , just in time for the polls.
The Tories aren't stupid. There's a real chance that Labour will not secure a majority and the Tories could once again be dependent on DUP votes , and in any event they won't want to anger the ERG section of the party by hanging the DUP out to dry.
Meantime a SF soft approach might get a few more SDLP votes on board but is unlikely to result in a surge.
There are craftier people than us making the decisions , and history has shown that whatever happens , Tories won't want to kick the DUP in the teeth .
It ain't over 'til it's over
The Tories don't mind shafting the DUP.
They've supported the DUP shafting the rest of us for years, what makes u think they'll find a conscience all of a sudden ?
The DUP shafted Theresa May. So they had to pay
We'll see . Would love to be proved wrong but think the DUP will get all the help they need when it comes down to it
The torys know they can hang the dup out to dry, and they also know when they need the dup all they have to do is click their fingers and they will come running in a pathetic attempt to prove their Britishness ( probably to themselves)
Quote from: ardtole on April 26, 2023, 09:59:08 PM
The torys know they can hang the dup out to dry, and they also know when they need the dup all they have to do is click their fingers and they will come running in a pathetic attempt to prove their Britishness ( probably to themselves)
Yup 100% agree
If anyone treated you like that though , you'd tell them where to go. But the DUP clearly have no dignity or backbone. Then again , they can't very well tell the Brits to get stuffed , otherwise who do they be loyal to? They're trapped in a loveless marriage
Carrot and stick.
Whilst the Torys shaft the DUP and by extension all of us....
https://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/varadkar-mcdonald-and-martin-call-for-northern-ireland-executive-to-be-restored-1467954.html
Varadkar said if an Executive is formed, Ireland is ready to use its Shared Island Fund to assist Northern Ireland with issues like housing, the health service, enterprise, the cost of living and budget deficit.
Hmmmm the first 2 items.....
But it's nice to help the poor relations....
Quote from: 6th sam on April 26, 2023, 07:16:43 PM
Watch this space . I'm Not convinced that the DUP aren't the ones who are playing smart and end up getting what they want.
Getting people out to vote is a challenge,but if you play an extreme card , then it can motivate to vote . The danger of softer politics is that it doesn't motivate .
If your position is intransigent, others end up moving to accommodate you , and you can claim victory in your intransigence. This seige mentality can work to your advantage. As we have seen in many occasions .
The final sweetener from the tories to get DUP on board , may be a big payout to boost the NI budget, for which the DUP can also claim victory , just in time for the polls.
The Tories aren't stupid. There's a real chance that Labour will not secure a majority and the Tories could once again be dependent on DUP votes , and in any event they won't want to anger the ERG section of the party by hanging the DUP out to dry.
Meantime a SF soft approach might get a few more SDLP votes on board but is unlikely to result in a surge.
There are craftier people than us making the decisions , and history has shown that whatever happens , Tories won't want to kick the DUP in the teeth .
It ain't over 'til it's over
I've always that doubt in my mind as well, the DUP always seem to come up smelling of roses even when it's their own doing they're neck deep in shíte.
Quote from: Rossfan on April 27, 2023, 12:08:39 PM
Hmmmm the first 2 items.....
But it's nice to help the poor relations....
Roscommon ain't exactly a rich cousin.
Didn't know where put this one, got a video there (Am sure it's doing the rounds) with some lad Adrian Douglas - AD Window cleaning) trying to kick in a single Catholic girl door in, in Lurgan. Wonder will the complaintants of the flag removal at the fball match be quick to reply to this.
Quote from: Wildweasel74 on May 02, 2023, 09:31:01 AM
Didn't know where put this one, got a video there (Am sure it's doing the rounds) with some lad Adrian Douglas - AD Window cleaning) trying to kick in a single Catholic girl door in, in Lurgan. Wonder will the complaintants of the flaf removal at the fball match be quick to reply to this.
AD is also a Facebook friend of Carla Loveheart.
Quote from: Wildweasel74 on May 02, 2023, 09:31:01 AM
Didn't know where put this one, got a video there (Am sure it's doing the rounds) with some lad Adrian Douglas - AD Window cleaning) trying to kick in a single Catholic girl door in, in Lurgan. Wonder will the complaintants of the flaf removal at the fball match be quick to reply to this.
I'd presume given that both brothers are well known Glenavon fans that the local DUP will be asking the IFA to investigate and sanction them.
Quote from: Orior on May 02, 2023, 09:39:44 AM
Quote from: Wildweasel74 on May 02, 2023, 09:31:01 AM
Didn't know where put this one, got a video there (Am sure it's doing the rounds) with some lad Adrian Douglas - AD Window cleaning) trying to kick in a single Catholic girl door in, in Lurgan. Wonder will the complaintants of the flaf removal at the fball match be quick to reply to this.
AD is also a Facebook friend of Carla Loveheart.
She has called it verbal abuse rather than anything secterian. He has taken down his business facebook page.
21 year old single mother at that.
Lockhart is up there with the worst of them tbh and that is saying something. How is someone that young who likely barely lived through troubles so bitter and twisted.
Update - he's been arrested.
Battering her door is "verbal abuse"? Pull the other one, Carla.
Sure he only wanted to talk to her. Them Fenians trying to deflect from the real issues, them Derry wans stealing flegs and them Armagh ones singing.
Quote from: RedHand88 on May 02, 2023, 10:09:58 AM
Update - he's been arrested.
And let go, no hate crime charge either...
Quote from: johnnycool on May 02, 2023, 10:58:29 AM
Quote from: RedHand88 on May 02, 2023, 10:09:58 AM
Update - he's been arrested.
And let go, no hate crime charge either...
I could be wrong, but I thought there was no such thing as a "hate crime" here when charging someone. It was under review and about to be upgraded before the Stormont shutdown.
Can anyone legally minded confirm?
Police not call the flagpole removal a hate crime.
After the flagpole nonsense and a few days of pretty equal whataboutery tallies from both sides, the loyalist bully boy has handed team Nationalism a serious advantage on Twitter.
And by f**k are our lot playing the violins.
I've muted and unfollowed a hefty number of political threads and people the past week, in a hope of never seeing six county shit again, but my timeline is still overflowing with outrage and angst.
Everyone, on both sides, just needs to take a breath and say nothing .
Quote from: Wildweasel74 on May 02, 2023, 12:50:14 PM
Police not call the flagpole removal a hate crime.
It can be described as a hate crime, but it can't be charged as a hate crime (I think).
One man's hate crime is another man's burning effigies on bonfires. Culture.
Quote from: thewobbler on May 02, 2023, 01:06:21 PM
After the flagpole nonsense and a few days of pretty equal whataboutery tallies from both sides, the loyalist bully boy has handed team Nationalism a serious advantage on Twitter.
And by f**k are our lot playing the violins.
I've muted and unfollowed a hefty number of political threads and people the past week, in a hope of never seeing six county shit again, but my timeline is still overflowing with outrage and angst.
Everyone, on both sides, just needs to take a breath and say nothing .
Aye, ignore it, that will make it go away.
Only a couple of weeks ago a few teenagers were battered in Belfast city by a couple of bigots (including an ex squaddie) for the audacity of wearing a GAA jersey. I'm sure if it was one of your Ballyholland minors you'd have a different outlook. God knows what those rats would have done on Sunday had that girl answered her door.
He probably done her windows, noticed when looking through them she had some catholic paraphernalia about!
Like copies of the RTE guide and so on and so forth?
He's only 34 ffs :o
Quote from: Aristo 60 on May 02, 2023, 09:27:27 PM
Like copies of the RTE guide and so on and so forth?
Who da f**k buys a tv mag ;D
Probably a Copy of the Wolfe Tones greatest hits
Quote from: Aristo 60 on May 02, 2023, 09:27:27 PM
Like copies of the RTE guide and so on and so forth?
Ireland's own
Jam in the press
Padre Pio on the wall
Wouldn't need go in my dad's house with the Maze altar they used to do, some hunger strike calendar, plus a few hunger strike items. Beginning to wonder should I mention to him it's 40years ago.
Quote from: RedHand88 on May 02, 2023, 09:51:16 PM
Quote from: Aristo 60 on May 02, 2023, 09:27:27 PM
Like copies of the RTE guide and so on and so forth?
Ireland's own
Jam in the press
Padre Pio on the wall
Sacred heart picture
JFK picture
Jack Charlton and Maurice Setters picture
Ludo trophy
I think I need to take a break from watching Father Ted
Quote from: general_lee on May 02, 2023, 09:10:57 PM
Quote from: thewobbler on May 02, 2023, 01:06:21 PM
After the flagpole nonsense and a few days of pretty equal whataboutery tallies from both sides, the loyalist bully boy has handed team Nationalism a serious advantage on Twitter.
And by f**k are our lot playing the violins.
I've muted and unfollowed a hefty number of political threads and people the past week, in a hope of never seeing six county shit again, but my timeline is still overflowing with outrage and angst.
Everyone, on both sides, just needs to take a breath and say nothing .
Aye, ignore it, that will make it go away.
Only a couple of weeks ago a few teenagers were battered in Belfast city by a couple of bigots (including an ex squaddie) for the audacity of wearing a GAA jersey. I'm sure if it was one of your Ballyholland minors you'd have a different outlook. God knows what those rats would have done on Sunday had that girl answered her door.
Point is.
Every town, village and city across the world this past weekend would have been witness to vile and repugnant acts of bullying and brutality. It's just, unfortunately, how humans are prone to treating each other.
The two sides of the six county spectrum jumping on every incident, no matter how trivial (and I'm not describing this particular one as trivial by the way) with over the top horror and disgust, mixed together with a king sized dollop of whataboutery, is helping nobody. It's just pumping more and more unnecessary air into sectarian ways of living.
f**k that. We don't need it. Just accept that there's c***ts of humans in every town, village and city. The colours they're wearing is a disguise, not a uniform.
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on May 02, 2023, 09:44:22 PM
Quote from: Aristo 60 on May 02, 2023, 09:27:27 PM
Like copies of the RTE guide and so on and so forth?
Who da f**k buys a tv mag ;D
Probably a Copy of the Wolfe Tones greatest hits
Obviously someone must be buying them if they keep printing them
Quote from: thewobbler on May 02, 2023, 10:39:14 PM
Quote from: general_lee on May 02, 2023, 09:10:57 PM
Quote from: thewobbler on May 02, 2023, 01:06:21 PM
After the flagpole nonsense and a few days of pretty equal whataboutery tallies from both sides, the loyalist bully boy has handed team Nationalism a serious advantage on Twitter.
And by f**k are our lot playing the violins.
I've muted and unfollowed a hefty number of political threads and people the past week, in a hope of never seeing six county shit again, but my timeline is still overflowing with outrage and angst.
Everyone, on both sides, just needs to take a breath and say nothing .
Aye, ignore it, that will make it go away.
Only a couple of weeks ago a few teenagers were battered in Belfast city by a couple of bigots (including an ex squaddie) for the audacity of wearing a GAA jersey. I'm sure if it was one of your Ballyholland minors you'd have a different outlook. God knows what those rats would have done on Sunday had that girl answered her door.
Point is.
Every town, village and city across the world this past weekend would have been witness to vile and repugnant acts of bullying and brutality. It's just, unfortunately, how humans are prone to treating each other.
The two sides of the six county spectrum jumping on every incident, no matter how trivial (and I'm not describing this particular one as trivial by the way) with over the top horror and disgust, mixed together with a king sized dollop of whataboutery, is helping nobody. It's just pumping more and more unnecessary air into sectarian ways of living.
f**k that. We don't need it. Just accept that there's c***ts of humans in every town, village and city. The colours they're wearing is a disguise, not a uniform.
Breathtaking ignorance, naiveté or stupidity. Take your pick. You didn't mean to trivialise the incident yet fluked it anyway.
Bothsidesing is every bit as bad as whataboutery.
Quote from: Dougal Maguire on May 02, 2023, 10:52:49 PM
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on May 02, 2023, 09:44:22 PM
Quote from: Aristo 60 on May 02, 2023, 09:27:27 PM
Like copies of the RTE guide and so on and so forth?
Who da f**k buys a tv mag ;D
Probably a Copy of the Wolfe Tones greatest hits
Obviously someone must be buying them if they keep printing them
I suppose the older generation buy it but huge drop recently with things online
43,000 from last period of being recorded. No figures since 2018
Drop from 260,000 in 2002
Will Snarlene do an exclusive for GB News on the Ulster Final which features two British teams from Northern Ireland, Londonderry and Armagh?
Geez, I nearly punched myself for typing that 😐
Anyone hiring Bryson can't be the brightest ....
https://www.rte.ie/news/ireland/2023/0627/1391371-ni-video/
Doesn't deserve any airtime RF. If people would stop talking about him he would fade back into anonymity where he should be... (Not a dig at you)
Bryson is not only an egomaniac and a charlatan, he's a deranged hypocrite.
He is morbidly obsessed with Irish Republicanism - although I have him muted on twitter it's hard not to escape his daily rants about SF and the IRA.
Today, he defended some nonsense bigotry at a bonfire in east Belfast, dismissing a swastika and paramilitary paraphernalia as the work of "over exuberant" kids.
Not sure about that. He's the main driver in unionism nowadays.
He's the link between the DUP, OO and their loyalist armies etc.
He has too put input but ironic thing is that everything he touches fails big time
Quote from: marty34 on June 27, 2023, 04:14:14 PM
Not sure about that. He's the main driver in unionism nowadays.
He's the link between the DUP, OO and their loyalist armies etc.
He has too put input but ironic thing is that everything he touches fails big time
Who's funding him though?
Jamie reckoned she shouldn't have been sacked as there was a shortage of healthcare workers
Some shortage of brains anyway whatever about healthcare staff.
Sorta need try find that Bryson pic on holiday yrs ago in front of the tricolour, and plaster it everywhere on twitter.
https://twitter.com/50SavesOfDeGea/status/297042332556083200?t=kJMkFYIU9Fcaorg1T7jssw&s=19 (https://twitter.com/50SavesOfDeGea/status/297042332556083200?t=kJMkFYIU9Fcaorg1T7jssw&s=19)
https://twitter.com/FcsadakoMartin/status/746096134230257664?t=rCN0MDtRBfVN2cbUSRqCjg&s=19 (https://twitter.com/FcsadakoMartin/status/746096134230257664?t=rCN0MDtRBfVN2cbUSRqCjg&s=19)
Quote from: johnnycool on June 27, 2023, 04:47:00 PM
Quote from: marty34 on June 27, 2023, 04:14:14 PM
Not sure about that. He's the main driver in unionism nowadays.
He's the link between the DUP, OO and their loyalist armies etc.
He has too put input but ironic thing is that everything he touches fails big time
Who's funding him though?
Good question. I think he's some Director of the Union or something...and I use that term loosely.
I asked before - somebody must be helping him. How could he tweet so much (rubbish) every 5 mins from 7 am to 11pm. Madness.
If the DUP show any sign of weakness, he'll be all over them. He seems to be in the No Surrender camp but has the ear of Allister and Donaldson also.
Watched the case of Lisa Dorrian last night on tv, absolutely horrible story and how it's been closed off for so long and reason I've brought it here is that the likes of Bryson's crew in that north Down area all know who done it!
Hopefully they get some justice
Think the police know who did it, proving it another matter.
Quote from: Wildweasel74 on June 30, 2023, 12:03:05 AM
Think the police know who did it, proving it another matter.
There aren't many murders here throughout the troubles that the police/ authorities don't know who carried them out. As has been said actually proving it in a court of law is a different story.
Quote from: NAG1 on June 30, 2023, 08:55:48 AM
Quote from: Wildweasel74 on June 30, 2023, 12:03:05 AM
Think the police know who did it, proving it another matter.
There aren't many murders here throughout the troubles that the police/ authorities don't know who carried them out. As has been said actually proving it in a court of law is a different story.
But christ sake, in this case someone let the family know where they disposed of her and let them have a bitta closure in that regard, the mother died purely down to the murder of her child, this person has murdered one and brought far too early the death of another.
They really tried to get at the partner of the person they suspect of the killing I felt near the end of the show, but they are probably up to their neck in shit that they don't care.
Some heartless cnuts out there
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on June 27, 2023, 10:08:22 PM
Watched the case of Lisa Dorrian last night on tv, absolutely horrible story and how it's been closed off for so long and reason I've brought it here is that the likes of Bryson's crew in that north Down area all know who done it!
Hopefully they get some justice
Horrendous. I don't think I could watch a show on it. The poor family.
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on June 30, 2023, 09:22:53 AM
Quote from: NAG1 on June 30, 2023, 08:55:48 AM
Quote from: Wildweasel74 on June 30, 2023, 12:03:05 AM
Think the police know who did it, proving it another matter.
There aren't many murders here throughout the troubles that the police/ authorities don't know who carried them out. As has been said actually proving it in a court of law is a different story.
But christ sake, in this case someone let the family know where they disposed of her and let them have a bitta closure in that regard, the mother died purely down to the murder of her child, this person has murdered one and brought far too early the death of another.
They really tried to get at the partner of the person they suspect of the killing I felt near the end of the show, but they are probably up to their neck in shit that they don't care.
Some heartless cnuts out there
I haven't seen the show, but I've often thought this too.
How easy would an anonymous tip be? It would give the family some level of comfort to be able to have a funeral and get some kind of closure.
It's un-imaginable the pain of something like that.
I see the OO, via pressure from their various stakeholders, are trying to raise the Dumcree parade again...25 years later.
Trying to force the issue again.
They tried this in Ardoyne/Crumlin Rd a few weeks ago also but got rejected. The locals had come a an agreement a good few years ago but OO tried to renage on it until the Parades Commission rejected it.
Trying to up the ante once again. Very sad.
Quote from: marty34 on June 30, 2023, 10:36:05 AM
I see the OO, via pressure from their various stakeholders, are trying to raise the Dumcree parade again...25 years later.
Trying to force the issue again.
They tried this in Ardoyne/Crumlin Rd a few weeks ago also but got rejected. The locals had come a an agreement a good few years ago but OO tried to renage on it until the Parades Commission rejected it.
Trying to up the ante once again. Very sad.
They're feeling isolated and let down by their leaders here and their betters in London, there's no love for them so they need to express themselves and their culture of exceptionalism the only way they know how, by triumphantly marching through Nationalist areas to get their fix.
It's going to take a while to wane them off that particular fix.
Quote from: marty34 on June 30, 2023, 10:36:05 AM
I see the OO, via pressure from their various stakeholders, are trying to raise the Dumcree parade again...25 years later.
Trying to force the issue again.
They tried this in Ardoyne/Crumlin Rd a few weeks ago also but got rejected. The locals had come a an agreement a good few years ago but OO tried to renage on it until the Parades Commission rejected it.
Trying to up the ante once again. Very sad.
Seems a big effort this year - even with that Larne bonfire.
You'd think people would have learned when someone died there but appears not.
Quote from: imtommygunn on June 30, 2023, 10:59:39 AM
Quote from: marty34 on June 30, 2023, 10:36:05 AM
I see the OO, via pressure from their various stakeholders, are trying to raise the Dumcree parade again...25 years later.
Trying to force the issue again.
They tried this in Ardoyne/Crumlin Rd a few weeks ago also but got rejected. The locals had come a an agreement a good few years ago but OO tried to renage on it until the Parades Commission rejected it.
Trying to up the ante once again. Very sad.
Seems a big effort this year - even with that Larne bonfire.
You'd think people would have learned when someone died there but appears not.
If you saw some of the social media from them at the start of the Larne build, they dont give one f%*k about the lad who died last year. It seemed to give them some sort of sick amusement.
MEA council completely bricking it I'd say, hoping that it goes off without major injury or death.
But yeah there is a serious effort from them at the moment to paint this victim ideology, everyone is against them no one cares etc
The fact that these grievances are mainly self inflicted seems to escape them.
Nationalists outnumber Unionists
Catholics outnumber Protestants
How are we going to keep NI in the UK?? I know!, we'll try and get Orange marches back down the Garvaghy Road, and through Ardoyne. And we'll build the biggest f**king obscene monstrosity of a bonfire and fill it with everything belonging to Kafflicks and set it on fire.
In addition we'll encourage the DUP/Newsletter/Bel Tel to keep attacking the GAA and the Irish Language.
That should keep the Union secure for another 100 years! A foolproof plan.
And, I almost forgot, we will not share power as a junior partner to a Fenian first minister. Northern Ireland. Stronger Together.
No point being a sick organisation without acting like a sick organisation ::)
Quote from: tbrick18 on June 30, 2023, 10:05:49 AM
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on June 30, 2023, 09:22:53 AM
Quote from: NAG1 on June 30, 2023, 08:55:48 AM
Quote from: Wildweasel74 on June 30, 2023, 12:03:05 AM
Think the police know who did it, proving it another matter.
There aren't many murders here throughout the troubles that the police/ authorities don't know who carried them out. As has been said actually proving it in a court of law is a different story.
But christ sake, in this case someone let the family know where they disposed of her and let them have a bitta closure in that regard, the mother died purely down to the murder of her child, this person has murdered one and brought far too early the death of another.
They really tried to get at the partner of the person they suspect of the killing I felt near the end of the show, but they are probably up to their neck in shit that they don't care.
Some heartless cnuts out there
I haven't seen the show, but I've often thought this too.
How easy would an anonymous tip be? It would give the family some level of comfort to be able to have a funeral and get some kind of closure.
It's un-imaginable the pain of something like that.
The only thing I can think of is that there would be some sort of DNA or other evidence even after all these years that would mean no anonymous tips
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-66102199 (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-66102199)
Orange order/Pan nationalist front putting restrictions on their own parade. Lundys!
Belfast is an absolute disaster for their parades between drunkenness, anti-social behaviour etc.
I don't think it's as bad as that with parades elsewhere.
Quote from: RedHand88 on July 06, 2023, 10:06:29 AM
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-66102199 (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-66102199)
Orange order/Pan nationalist front putting restrictions on their own parade. Lundys!
They whip up the absolute dregs of society into a sectarian frenzy and then can't understand why these scum act the way they do. Bizarre
Quote from: imtommygunn on July 06, 2023, 10:18:46 AM
Belfast is an absolute disaster for their parades between drunkenness, anti-social behaviour etc.
I don't think it's as bad as that with parades elsewhere.
Belfast is just the worst. And if you go do Donegal you get the inverse of these people in Bundoran and the likes. Anyone who can disappears on the 12th week.
I wonder who leaked the report/review.
Hopefully it's a sign that these sectarian hatefests are getting less popular.
Quote from: Rossfan on July 07, 2023, 11:51:50 AM
Hopefully it's a sign that these sectarian hatefests are getting less popular.
This will lead to a bumper turn out this year and the fall away again next year. No one wants to walk 10 miles and listen to hymns anymore when you can stand, drink and piss in the street for the day!
It's basically turned into to a rave in Sandy row now. Which is the issue for the elders.
Quote from: Jeepers Creepers on July 07, 2023, 01:50:57 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on July 07, 2023, 11:51:50 AM
Hopefully it's a sign that these sectarian hatefests are getting less popular.
This will lead to a bumper turn out this year and the fall away again next year. No one wants to walk 10 miles and listen to hymns anymore when you can stand, drink and piss in the street for the day!
It's basically turned into to a rave in Sandy row now. Which is the issue for the elders.
It's a day on the beer on sandy row
Similar to saint patricks day in the holy lands
Not much temperance and religious fervour
Do Alliance members/voters engage in the Order Order parades and stuff anymore? Or Ulster Rugby type followers. Much of it seems more loyalist and working class in nature?
(https://media.tenor.com/iu8rcC0LpRAAAAAd/no-surrender-loyalist.gif)
Quote from: full moon on July 07, 2023, 02:26:31 PM
Do Alliance members/voters engage in the Order Order parades and stuff anymore? Or Ulster Rugby type followers. Much of it seems more loyalist and working class in nature?
Some of the rugby farmer types still love it. More and more people from a Unionist background are seeing it for the anachronistic shite that it is.
Quote from: full moon on July 07, 2023, 02:26:31 PM
Do Alliance members/voters engage in the Order Order parades and stuff anymore? Or Ulster Rugby type followers. Much of it seems more loyalist and working class in nature?
The OO is different in character in country parts and in Belfast. In many country parts a few oul fellows get together a few times a year and in most cases do not cause any great trouble to anyone, not least because they have to live there all year round. in Belfast it lets the sectarian slums take over the main streets, but the educated classes have less and less to do with it.
Quote from: Duine Inteacht Eile on July 07, 2023, 03:37:40 PM
Quote from: armaghniac on July 07, 2023, 03:24:08 PM
Quote from: full moon on July 07, 2023, 02:26:31 PM
Do Alliance members/voters engage in the Order Order parades and stuff anymore? Or Ulster Rugby type followers. Much of it seems more loyalist and working class in nature?
The OO is different in character in country parts and in Belfast. In many country parts a few oul fellows get together a few times a year and in most cases do not cause any great trouble to anyone, not least because they have to live there all year round. in Belfast it lets the sectarian slums take over the main streets, but the educated classes have less and less to do with it.
Don't be fooled. Let's remember that those singing about Michaela McAreavey in that band hall were not from Belfast's slums but indeed from God fearing South Derry.
Yeah some places in Armagh are ferociously anti-Irish/Catholic. The area stretching from Portadown-Armagh-Markethill-Tandragee is fairly staunch.
Quote from: general_lee on July 07, 2023, 04:39:51 PM
Quote from: Duine Inteacht Eile on July 07, 2023, 03:37:40 PM
Quote from: armaghniac on July 07, 2023, 03:24:08 PM
Quote from: full moon on July 07, 2023, 02:26:31 PM
Do Alliance members/voters engage in the Order Order parades and stuff anymore? Or Ulster Rugby type followers. Much of it seems more loyalist and working class in nature?
The OO is different in character in country parts and in Belfast. In many country parts a few oul fellows get together a few times a year and in most cases do not cause any great trouble to anyone, not least because they have to live there all year round. in Belfast it lets the sectarian slums take over the main streets, but the educated classes have less and less to do with it.
Don't be fooled. Let's remember that those singing about Michaela McAreavey in that band hall were not from Belfast's slums but indeed from God fearing South Derry.
Yeah some places in Armagh are ferociously anti-Irish/Catholic. The area stretching from Portadown-Armagh-Markethill-Tandragee is fairly staunch.
I have no direct experience of this, in Cross' we did not ever have an Orange lodge unlike places like Birr or Roscrea. But in the 6 counties things are not homogenous, community relations might be decent in Poyntzpass but not in Tandragee, and local Orange lodge might fit into that.
The Gaa social episode with Brian canavan was very interesting. He talked a lot about this and the cross community relationships in his community. What you say is like what he says. It varies greatly from place to place. I imagine all it takes is a few eejits on either side to sour these relations.
Quote from: imtommygunn on July 07, 2023, 05:26:00 PM
The Gaa social episode with Brian canavan was very interesting. He talked a lot about this and the cross community relationships in his community. What you say is like what he says. It varies greatly from place to place. I imagine all it takes is a few eejits on either side to sour these relations.
I was thinking of that in my example, and previous comment by Tony Fearon, Presumably if there was a non confrontational approach in the local lodge then that is reflected in their leadership over time, a son takes over from his father on the committee or whatever. You'd have some places in Fermanagh with civil relations and while the likes of Kilkeel is not good, there could be other places in South Down where this was not the case.
Poyntzpass is the benchmark for good relations. Can always remember when Armagh were going well late 90s/early 00s, the red, white & blue bunting came down straight after the 12th and the orange/white Armagh bunting went up, sometimes with a bit of cross over.
Quote from: armaghniac on July 07, 2023, 07:13:21 PM
Quote from: imtommygunn on July 07, 2023, 05:26:00 PM
The Gaa social episode with Brian canavan was very interesting. He talked a lot about this and the cross community relationships in his community. What you say is like what he says. It varies greatly from place to place. I imagine all it takes is a few eejits on either side to sour these relations.
I was thinking of that in my example, and previous comment by Tony Fearon, Presumably if there was a non confrontational approach in the local lodge then that is reflected in their leadership over time, a son takes over from his father on the committee or whatever. You'd have some places in Fermanagh with civil relations and while the likes of Kilkeel is not good, there could be other places in South Down where this was not the case.
You'll find relationships are good when in areas were they're in a minority and generally in them areas the nationalists let them get on with it. I drove into a small parade last Sunday in South Armagh about two miles from my house. I didn't even know it was on, two cops held me for 10 mins till it walked passed, they stopped at a memorial said a few prayers played about 3 tunes and back into there cars and away.
In areas where they can still lord it over the pesky fenians you find the tensions.
Quote from: general_lee on July 07, 2023, 07:30:40 PM
Poyntzpass is the benchmark for good relations. Can always remember when Armagh were going well late 90s/early 00s, the red, white & blue bunting came down straight after the 12th and the orange/white Armagh bunting went up, sometimes with a bit of cross over.
Now they would have to do it the other way around!
Quote from: pbat on July 07, 2023, 07:46:49 PM
You'll find relationships are good when in areas were they're in a minority and generally in them areas the nationalists let them get on with it. I drove into a small parade last Sunday in South Armagh about two miles from my house. I didn't even know it was on, two cops held me for 10 mins till it walked passed, they stopped at a memorial said a few prayers played about 3 tunes and back into there cars and away.
In areas where they can still lord it over the pesky fenians you find the tensions.
Exactly.
Quote from: general_lee on July 07, 2023, 04:39:51 PM
Quote from: Duine Inteacht Eile on July 07, 2023, 03:37:40 PM
Quote from: armaghniac on July 07, 2023, 03:24:08 PM
Quote from: full moon on July 07, 2023, 02:26:31 PM
Do Alliance members/voters engage in the Order Order parades and stuff anymore? Or Ulster Rugby type followers. Much of it seems more loyalist and working class in nature?
The OO is different in character in country parts and in Belfast. In many country parts a few oul fellows get together a few times a year and in most cases do not cause any great trouble to anyone, not least because they have to live there all year round. in Belfast it lets the sectarian slums take over the main streets, but the educated classes have less and less to do with it.
Don't be fooled. Let's remember that those singing about Michaela McAreavey in that band hall were not from Belfast's slums but indeed from God fearing South Derry.
Yeah some places in Armagh are ferociously anti-Irish/Catholic. The area stretching from Portadown-Armagh-Markethill-Tandragee is fairly staunch.
There is a village called Richhill it's a stop on the Belfast-Cavan/Monaghan bus route. It's in that area I think?
It seemed like a staunch loyalist enclave, there was UVF flags on main Street I think and Soldier F. Not a place that seemed like stopping for a pint in lol
Quote from: general_lee on July 07, 2023, 03:06:14 PM
Quote from: full moon on July 07, 2023, 02:26:31 PM
Do Alliance members/voters engage in the Order Order parades and stuff anymore? Or Ulster Rugby type followers. Much of it seems more loyalist and working class in nature?
Some of the rugby farmer types still love it. More and more people from a Unionist background are seeing it for the anachronistic shite that it is.
It's just sad and pathetic at this point, it just creates more hatred and the cycle continues.
It does seem like some more "educated" or upper class unionists/prods probably find it embarrassing.
Quote from: full moon on July 07, 2023, 09:24:03 PM
Quote from: general_lee on July 07, 2023, 04:39:51 PM
Quote from: Duine Inteacht Eile on July 07, 2023, 03:37:40 PM
Quote from: armaghniac on July 07, 2023, 03:24:08 PM
Quote from: full moon on July 07, 2023, 02:26:31 PM
Do Alliance members/voters engage in the Order Order parades and stuff anymore? Or Ulster Rugby type followers. Much of it seems more loyalist and working class in nature?
The OO is different in character in country parts and in Belfast. In many country parts a few oul fellows get together a few times a year and in most cases do not cause any great trouble to anyone, not least because they have to live there all year round. in Belfast it lets the sectarian slums take over the main streets, but the educated classes have less and less to do with it.
Don't be fooled. Let's remember that those singing about Michaela McAreavey in that band hall were not from Belfast's slums but indeed from God fearing South Derry.
Yeah some places in Armagh are ferociously anti-Irish/Catholic. The area stretching from Portadown-Armagh-Markethill-Tandragee is fairly staunch.
There is a village called Richhill it's a stop on the Belfast-Cavan/Monaghan bus route. It's in that area I think?
It seemed like a staunch loyalist enclave, there was UVF flags on main Street I think and Soldier F. Not a place that seemed like stopping for a pint in lol
And Richhill would be quite an affluent village, a lot of police officers and solicitors/barristers live in it.
Quote from: pbat on July 07, 2023, 09:45:05 PM
Quote from: full moon on July 07, 2023, 09:24:03 PM
Quote from: general_lee on July 07, 2023, 04:39:51 PM
Quote from: Duine Inteacht Eile on July 07, 2023, 03:37:40 PM
Quote from: armaghniac on July 07, 2023, 03:24:08 PM
Quote from: full moon on July 07, 2023, 02:26:31 PM
Do Alliance members/voters engage in the Order Order parades and stuff anymore? Or Ulster Rugby type followers. Much of it seems more loyalist and working class in nature?
The OO is different in character in country parts and in Belfast. In many country parts a few oul fellows get together a few times a year and in most cases do not cause any great trouble to anyone, not least because they have to live there all year round. in Belfast it lets the sectarian slums take over the main streets, but the educated classes have less and less to do with it.
Don't be fooled. Let's remember that those singing about Michaela McAreavey in that band hall were not from Belfast's slums but indeed from God fearing South Derry.
Yeah some places in Armagh are ferociously anti-Irish/Catholic. The area stretching from Portadown-Armagh-Markethill-Tandragee is fairly staunch.
There is a village called Richhill it's a stop on the Belfast-Cavan/Monaghan bus route. It's in that area I think?
It seemed like a staunch loyalist enclave, there was UVF flags on main Street I think and Soldier F. Not a place that seemed like stopping for a pint in lol
And Richhill would be quite an affluent village, a lot of police officers and solicitors/barristers live in it.
It seems like in even the most sectarian areas there are PSNI living there.
Quote from: naka on July 07, 2023, 02:21:01 PM
Quote from: Jeepers Creepers on July 07, 2023, 01:50:57 PM
Quote from: Rossfan on July 07, 2023, 11:51:50 AM
Hopefully it's a sign that these sectarian hatefests are getting less popular.
This will lead to a bumper turn out this year and the fall away again next year. No one wants to walk 10 miles and listen to hymns anymore when you can stand, drink and piss in the street for the day!
It's basically turned into to a rave in Sandy row now. Which is the issue for the elders.
It's a day on the beer on sandy row
Similar to saint patricks day in the holy lands
Not much temperance and religious fervour
Had the pleasure of spending a 12th of July on the 10th floor of the city hospital tower block with the Mrs one year, Birds Eye view of Sandy Row. Pure piss session then at about 5 o'clock a crowd of lads (50 odd) came from Shaftesbury Square direction and an unreal riot started between them and the Sandy Row crowd, kicked absolute shite out of each other, bottles, sticks and everything. Went on for about 10 minutes before the cops intervened, at least 20 taken to hospital, started firing stuff at the ambulances too and one ambulance man got assaulted. It was class viewing, funny enough though not one mention of it on the news that evening
Plenty like thst on both sides. The GAA gets them too when a county starts to go on a run. The part timers come out for the bus trip and drink and abuse the regulars and start fights. We are no saints either.
I thought Clones this year for the Down v Armagh game was very messy.
Quote from: full moon on July 07, 2023, 09:24:03 PM
Quote from: general_lee on July 07, 2023, 04:39:51 PM
Quote from: Duine Inteacht Eile on July 07, 2023, 03:37:40 PM
Quote from: armaghniac on July 07, 2023, 03:24:08 PM
Quote from: full moon on July 07, 2023, 02:26:31 PM
Do Alliance members/voters engage in the Order Order parades and stuff anymore? Or Ulster Rugby type followers. Much of it seems more loyalist and working class in nature?
The OO is different in character in country parts and in Belfast. In many country parts a few oul fellows get together a few times a year and in most cases do not cause any great trouble to anyone, not least because they have to live there all year round. in Belfast it lets the sectarian slums take over the main streets, but the educated classes have less and less to do with it.
Don't be fooled. Let's remember that those singing about Michaela McAreavey in that band hall were not from Belfast's slums but indeed from God fearing South Derry.
Yeah some places in Armagh are ferociously anti-Irish/Catholic. The area stretching from Portadown-Armagh-Markethill-Tandragee is fairly staunch.
There is a village called Richhill it's a stop on the Belfast-Cavan/Monaghan bus route. It's in that area I think?
It seemed like a staunch loyalist enclave, there was UVF flags on main Street I think and Soldier F. Not a place that seemed like stopping for a pint in lol
Not far from Markethill. Fairly staunch and bitter for the most part yeah!
Quote from: Armagh18 on July 08, 2023, 12:50:29 PM
Quote from: full moon on July 07, 2023, 09:24:03 PM
Quote from: general_lee on July 07, 2023, 04:39:51 PM
Quote from: Duine Inteacht Eile on July 07, 2023, 03:37:40 PM
Quote from: armaghniac on July 07, 2023, 03:24:08 PM
Quote from: full moon on July 07, 2023, 02:26:31 PM
Do Alliance members/voters engage in the Order Order parades and stuff anymore? Or Ulster Rugby type followers. Much of it seems more loyalist and working class in nature?
The OO is different in character in country parts and in Belfast. In many country parts a few oul fellows get together a few times a year and in most cases do not cause any great trouble to anyone, not least because they have to live there all year round. in Belfast it lets the sectarian slums take over the main streets, but the educated classes have less and less to do with it.
Don't be fooled. Let's remember that those singing about Michaela McAreavey in that band hall were not from Belfast's slums but indeed from God fearing South Derry.
Yeah some places in Armagh are ferociously anti-Irish/Catholic. The area stretching from Portadown-Armagh-Markethill-Tandragee is fairly staunch.
There is a village called Richhill it's a stop on the Belfast-Cavan/Monaghan bus route. It's in that area I think?
It seemed like a staunch loyalist enclave, there was UVF flags on main Street I think and Soldier F. Not a place that seemed like stopping for a pint in lol
Not far from Markethill. Fairly staunch and bitter for the most part yeah!
Not the famous Rian O'Neill, but Moneymore seems one place where people can tolerate each other.
https://twitter.com/RyanONeill07/status/1678106522503528449
Know that lad.
I worked there for about 5 years. Last year travelling to work I saw Derry flags and Union Jacks flying together on the same lamp post. I didn't know if it was a (hopefully)more tolerant way of getting along. Or did neither side have a Tyrone flag to burn 😛
There were also some Catholics at the Moygashel bonfire. They were Catholics from an integrated school but still claimed as a win by loyalists.
Quote from: Orior on July 10, 2023, 12:54:45 AM
There were also some Catholics at the Moygashel bonfire. They were Catholics from an integrated school but still claimed as a win by loyalists.
This always baffles me when they claim that Catholics/ Nationalists attend these bonfires etc.
No educated self respecting non-loyalist would put themselves in that position, to be at an event that is directly aimed hating on on that section of the community.
Pure unadulterated hate fests.
Quote from: NAG1 on July 10, 2023, 09:31:15 AM
Quote from: Orior on July 10, 2023, 12:54:45 AM
There were also some Catholics at the Moygashel bonfire. They were Catholics from an integrated school but still claimed as a win by loyalists.
This always baffles me when they claim that Catholics/ Nationalists attend these bonfires etc.
No educated self respecting non-loyalist would put themselves in that position, to be at an event that is directly aimed hating on on that section of the community.
Pure unadulterated hate fests.
#
Just like the Westie's Feile, and usually the Wolfe Tones?
Quote from: 5times5times on July 10, 2023, 10:15:08 AM
Quote from: NAG1 on July 10, 2023, 09:31:15 AM
Quote from: Orior on July 10, 2023, 12:54:45 AM
There were also some Catholics at the Moygashel bonfire. They were Catholics from an integrated school but still claimed as a win by loyalists.
This always baffles me when they claim that Catholics/ Nationalists attend these bonfires etc.
No educated self respecting non-loyalist would put themselves in that position, to be at an event that is directly aimed hating on on that section of the community.
Pure unadulterated hate fests.
#
Just like the Westie's Feile, and usually the Wolfe Tones?
While not a massive fan of the WT and definitely think it was time for the Feile to move on from this a few years ago, I don't see any comparison.
One is a sectarian hate fest aimed at the destruction of one side of the community, the other is one act at a week long music festival.
Quote from: Orior on July 10, 2023, 12:54:45 AM
There were also some Catholics at the Moygashel bonfire. They were Catholics from an integrated school but still claimed as a win by loyalists.
Don't let them impress you with those "facts".
Moygashel is one of the least tolerant areas in the north. Regularly have had signs up in the area about "foreigners" not being allowed. UVF, Para and Soldier F flags. The election centre used to be in a primary school at the periphery of moygashel and the locals used to stand at the gates with flags in hand intimidating one side of the community, until the electoral commission changed the location to the leisure centre. Subsequently we had the poor us being persecuted cries.
IF there were catholics for an integrated school at the bonfire (and that's a big IF), then I would suspect they are from those mixed marriages where the leaning is still towards the loyalist/unionist side. Knowing something about the ilk of some (not all) families in the integrated schools in that area, many are only there because its the closest school. The secondary doesnt require transfer tests for entry and the primary has plenty of families who are anything but integrated. It's one of my main issues with integrated education here actually, in my experience they are not particularly integrated in practice. I've heard kids being called fenian scum in an integrated ps for example and primarily all staff are from a loyalist/unionist background.
Everyone needs a tribe. I work with a lot of "PUL" people, some love the whole "carry on", others are embarrassed by it. The enthusiasts are not bad people but they enjoy the opportunity for a get- together and a bit of craic. Not saying for a minute there aren't bad actors involved but the same can also be said of our side. Humans are savages, thats how we got to be the apex predators.
Choose not to be paranoid/offended and the headers will lose their grip.
Quote from: 5times5times on July 10, 2023, 10:15:08 AM
Quote from: NAG1 on July 10, 2023, 09:31:15 AM
Quote from: Orior on July 10, 2023, 12:54:45 AM
There were also some Catholics at the Moygashel bonfire. They were Catholics from an integrated school but still claimed as a win by loyalists.
This always baffles me when they claim that Catholics/ Nationalists attend these bonfires etc.
No educated self respecting non-loyalist would put themselves in that position, to be at an event that is directly aimed hating on on that section of the community.
Pure unadulterated hate fests.
#
Just like the Westie's Feile, and usually the Wolfe Tones?
What a weird/silly post.
Quote from: 5times5times on July 10, 2023, 10:15:08 AM
Quote from: NAG1 on July 10, 2023, 09:31:15 AM
Quote from: Orior on July 10, 2023, 12:54:45 AM
There were also some Catholics at the Moygashel bonfire. They were Catholics from an integrated school but still claimed as a win by loyalists.
This always baffles me when they claim that Catholics/ Nationalists attend these bonfires etc.
No educated self respecting non-loyalist would put themselves in that position, to be at an event that is directly aimed hating on on that section of the community.
Pure unadulterated hate fests.
#
Just like the Westie's Feile, and usually the Wolfe Tones?
Not sure what you're comparing here.
The Féile has been a brilliant addition to West Belfast. It started for all the right reasons and cutting down on the anti-social behaviour etc. A great initiative.
They have loads of debates, sport, talks and concerts etc. for everyone.
I don't think they burn union jacks or unionist election posters etc. at the Wolfe Tones concerts.
Quote from: marty34 on July 10, 2023, 11:17:19 AM
Quote from: 5times5times on July 10, 2023, 10:15:08 AM
Quote from: NAG1 on July 10, 2023, 09:31:15 AM
Quote from: Orior on July 10, 2023, 12:54:45 AM
There were also some Catholics at the Moygashel bonfire. They were Catholics from an integrated school but still claimed as a win by loyalists.
This always baffles me when they claim that Catholics/ Nationalists attend these bonfires etc.
No educated self respecting non-loyalist would put themselves in that position, to be at an event that is directly aimed hating on on that section of the community.
Pure unadulterated hate fests.
#
Just like the Westie's Feile, and usually the Wolfe Tones?
Not sure what you're comparing here.
The Féile has been a brilliant addition to West Belfast. It started for all the right reasons and cutting down on the anti-social behaviour etc. A great initiative.
They have loads of debates, sport, talks and concerts etc. for everyone.
I don't think they burn union jacks or unionist election posters etc. at the Wolfe Tones concerts.
Definitely improved from the Springhill days ;D
I was at one when I was 11, we stayed with a mixed family at Ballykeel. I remember when going out to play with the children they said don't tell them u surname or religion. Otherwise I be top spot on that Bonfire. Same family ended up getting fire bombed out of Ballykeel years later.
Was up around the north coast at the weekend.....must a be a fair few neanderthals around Portrush as the place was full of flegs. I can only presume that the people around Portstewart have a bit more cop on as thankfully it was not plastered in the same way.
Quote from: LC on July 11, 2023, 08:25:12 AM
Was up around the north coast at the weekend.....must a be a fair few neanderthals around Portrush as the place was full of flegs. I can only presume that the people around Portstewart have a bit more cop on as thankfully it was not plastered in the same way.
The caravaners love it ;D
It is a kip of a place especially over the summer months, shame really when it could be such a tourist attraction.
Quote from: NAG1 on July 11, 2023, 08:44:02 AM
Quote from: LC on July 11, 2023, 08:25:12 AM
Was up around the north coast at the weekend.....must a be a fair few neanderthals around Portrush as the place was full of flegs. I can only presume that the people around Portstewart have a bit more cop on as thankfully it was not plastered in the same way.
The caravaners love it ;D
It is a kip of a place especially over the summer months, shame really when it could be such a tourist attraction.
You are 100% correct you can only imagine what bus loads of foreign tourists think of the likes of Bushmills when they drive through it around this time of year on their way to the Giants Causeway and it absolutely plastered with flags , red white and blue kerbs etc.
Quote from: LC on July 11, 2023, 09:47:28 AM
Quote from: NAG1 on July 11, 2023, 08:44:02 AM
Quote from: LC on July 11, 2023, 08:25:12 AM
Was up around the north coast at the weekend.....must a be a fair few neanderthals around Portrush as the place was full of flegs. I can only presume that the people around Portstewart have a bit more cop on as thankfully it was not plastered in the same way.
The caravaners love it ;D
It is a kip of a place especially over the summer months, shame really when it could be such a tourist attraction.
You are 100% correct you can only imagine what bus loads of foreign tourists think of the likes of Bushmills when they drive through it around this time of year on their way to the Giants Causeway and it absolutely plastered with flags , red white and blue kerbs etc.
They probably think it's a festival of some sort. They wouldn't know any difference.
Portstewart is nice but a lot of the places up round the neck of woods are "fleggy" and I don't think would be voting yes in the united ireland vote... Same when you drive round the coast road from waterfoot to carrickfergus - lovely in so many places then you hit the flags everywhere. There's one wee place I think there are more union jacks than there are buildings in the village.
In mainly nationalist villages all over the north, there's always a few flags up at the 12 th (for 2/3 weeks) and, as an outsider, you'd think it's a majority unionist village/town whereas in fact, it could be up to 70% or 80% nationalist.
All about perception and I firmly believe, as a result of this, unionists can't see the demographics changing so quickly in certain villages and towns.
Quote from: LC on July 11, 2023, 09:47:28 AM
Quote from: NAG1 on July 11, 2023, 08:44:02 AM
Quote from: LC on July 11, 2023, 08:25:12 AM
Was up around the north coast at the weekend.....must a be a fair few neanderthals around Portrush as the place was full of flegs. I can only presume that the people around Portstewart have a bit more cop on as thankfully it was not plastered in the same way.
The caravaners love it ;D
It is a kip of a place especially over the summer months, shame really when it could be such a tourist attraction.
You are 100% correct you can only imagine what bus loads of foreign tourists think of the likes of Bushmills when they drive through it around this time of year on their way to the Giants Causeway and it absolutely plastered with flags , red white and blue kerbs etc.
I'd say the Scottish ones love it! I suppose if it's done "tastefully" (I use that term sparingly) it can't really do much harm. Different if they've been hanging rotten for the previous 6 months.
Quote from: imtommygunn on July 11, 2023, 09:57:29 AM
Portstewart is nice but a lot of the places up round the neck of woods are "fleggy" and I don't think would be voting yes in the united ireland vote... Same when you drive round the coast road from waterfoot to carrickfergus - lovely in so many places then you hit the flags everywhere. There's one wee place I think there are more union jacks than there are buildings in the village.
I think it's fair to say that Portstewart would have a more Catholic population than Portrush.
But even Portrush has mellowed out over the years. My mother had some relatives who lived in Portrush, all dead and gone now, but they never had any issues as far as I know. We've been to a couple of caravan sites in Portrush too, big on on a hill up behind the Lidl and it was full of kids in gaelic jersey's playing football with kids in rangers tops. They all just got on.
As much as a don't like the fleggers or marchers, there's plenty of middle of the road normal protestants in both Portrush and Portstewart who would not be involved in any of that, but as with most places here, the minority knuckle dragger element get their way.
I have to say I love the north coast and we're going up there for a week in August with the kids. Plenty of beaches, plenty of eating houses and is laid back enough.
Quote from: general_lee on July 11, 2023, 10:02:51 AM
Quote from: LC on July 11, 2023, 09:47:28 AM
Quote from: NAG1 on July 11, 2023, 08:44:02 AM
Quote from: LC on July 11, 2023, 08:25:12 AM
Was up around the north coast at the weekend.....must a be a fair few neanderthals around Portrush as the place was full of flegs. I can only presume that the people around Portstewart have a bit more cop on as thankfully it was not plastered in the same way.
The caravaners love it ;D
It is a kip of a place especially over the summer months, shame really when it could be such a tourist attraction.
You are 100% correct you can only imagine what bus loads of foreign tourists think of the likes of Bushmills when they drive through it around this time of year on their way to the Giants Causeway and it absolutely plastered with flags , red white and blue kerbs etc.
I'd say the Scottish ones love it! I suppose if it's done "tastefully" (I use that term sparingly) it can't really do much harm. Different if they've been hanging rotten for the previous 6 months.
Many years ago I worked in Ayr for a while.....yes definitely no surprise Johnny Adair relocated to here.......an absolute sh#t hole.
some guy on Slugger did the sums on the Craighyhill bonfire
I looked at the Craigiehill from an aerial photo and the outer ring of the lower half of the bonfire is made up of 6 rings of pallets the first ring being 24 pallets the last ring being four and the bonfire diameter reduces as it reaches its enormous height.
The height of the bonfire is 202 feet in old money, which is 61,650mm. A euro pallet is 144mm high so the bonfire has 423 rings of pallets.
So assuming rings of 24, 20, 16, 12, 8 and 4 pallets and following the ring profile reducing as the bonfire gets taller, this equates to approximately 27,000 pallets.
A euro pallet is 24kg, so this equates to a total tonnage of wood of 648 tonnes.
The amount of carbon emitted from burning 1 kilogram (kg) of wood can vary depending on the type of wood and the combustion conditions. However, on average, the carbon content of dry wood is roughly 50% by weight. This means that approximately 0.5 kg (or 500 grams) of carbon is released when 1 kg of wood is burned.
It's important to note that when wood is burned, not all of the carbon is released as carbon dioxide (CO2). Some of the carbon is converted into other compounds, such as carbon monoxide (CO) and particulate matter (soot). The efficiency of the combustion process, including factors like temperature and oxygen supply, also affects the emissions.
To estimate the amount of carbon dioxide specifically emitted from burning 1 kg of wood, we need to consider the stoichiometry of the combustion reaction. When wood burns completely, the reaction can be simplified as follows:
C6H12O6 + 6O2 → 6CO2 + 6H2O
This equation shows that for every 6 moles of oxygen (O2) consumed, 6 moles of carbon dioxide (CO2) are produced. Since the molar mass of carbon is 12 grams per mole and the molar mass of carbon dioxide is 44 grams per mole, we can calculate the amount of CO2 produced from the carbon in 1 kg of wood:
(0.5 kg carbon) × (44 g CO2 / 12 g carbon) = 1.83 kg CO2
The Craigiehill bonfire will emit approximately 1,185 tonnes of CO2 emissions during its short life.
Most of the pallets are painted, and the viewers of the bonfire and the local community can look forward to being exposed to the following pollutants:-
Nitrogen oxides (NOx): Nitrogen present in the air combines with oxygen during combustion to form nitrogen oxides. NOx emissions contribute to the formation of smog
Volatile Organic Compounds (VOCs): Paints often contain VOCs, which are released as gases during combustion. VOCs can contribute to air pollution, smog formation, and have adverse health effects.
Hazardous Air Pollutants (HAPs): Some paints may contain hazardous substances such as lead, mercury, chromium, or other heavy metals. Burning painted wood can release these HAPs into the air, which pose health risks and environmental concerns.
Particulate Matter (PM): Burning painted wood can generate fine particulate matter, including soot and ash. These particles can contribute to air pollution and have adverse effects on respiratory health.
Toxic Gases: The combustion of painted wood can release toxic gases such as carbon monoxide (CO) and nitrogen oxides (NOx). sulphur dioxide (SO2). These gases are harmful to human health and contribute to air pollution.
A standard used Euro pallet costs £8.00 to £10.00 second hand, and all coloured pallets remain property of CHEP and therefore are stolen, so we are watching pallets with a conservative value of £250,000 being burned.
Wouldn't be hard to raise a quarter of a Mill by raffling off a few bottles of Vodka don't you worry
Quote from: armaghniac on July 11, 2023, 09:26:45 PM
some guy on Slugger did the sums on the Craighyhill bonfire
I looked at the Craigiehill from an aerial photo and the outer ring of the lower half of the bonfire is made up of 6 rings of pallets the first ring being 24 pallets the last ring being four and the bonfire diameter reduces as it reaches its enormous height.
The height of the bonfire is 202 feet in old money, which is 61,650mm. A euro pallet is 144mm high so the bonfire has 423 rings of pallets.
So assuming rings of 24, 20, 16, 12, 8 and 4 pallets and following the ring profile reducing as the bonfire gets taller, this equates to approximately 27,000 pallets.
A euro pallet is 24kg, so this equates to a total tonnage of wood of 648 tonnes.
The amount of carbon emitted from burning 1 kilogram (kg) of wood can vary depending on the type of wood and the combustion conditions. However, on average, the carbon content of dry wood is roughly 50% by weight. This means that approximately 0.5 kg (or 500 grams) of carbon is released when 1 kg of wood is burned.
It's important to note that when wood is burned, not all of the carbon is released as carbon dioxide (CO2). Some of the carbon is converted into other compounds, such as carbon monoxide (CO) and particulate matter (soot). The efficiency of the combustion process, including factors like temperature and oxygen supply, also affects the emissions.
To estimate the amount of carbon dioxide specifically emitted from burning 1 kg of wood, we need to consider the stoichiometry of the combustion reaction. When wood burns completely, the reaction can be simplified as follows:
C6H12O6 + 6O2 → 6CO2 + 6H2O
This equation shows that for every 6 moles of oxygen (O2) consumed, 6 moles of carbon dioxide (CO2) are produced. Since the molar mass of carbon is 12 grams per mole and the molar mass of carbon dioxide is 44 grams per mole, we can calculate the amount of CO2 produced from the carbon in 1 kg of wood:
(0.5 kg carbon) × (44 g CO2 / 12 g carbon) = 1.83 kg CO2
The Craigiehill bonfire will emit approximately 1,185 tonnes of CO2 emissions during its short life.
Most of the pallets are painted, and the viewers of the bonfire and the local community can look forward to being exposed to the following pollutants:-
Nitrogen oxides (NOx): Nitrogen present in the air combines with oxygen during combustion to form nitrogen oxides. NOx emissions contribute to the formation of smog
Volatile Organic Compounds (VOCs): Paints often contain VOCs, which are released as gases during combustion. VOCs can contribute to air pollution, smog formation, and have adverse health effects.
Hazardous Air Pollutants (HAPs): Some paints may contain hazardous substances such as lead, mercury, chromium, or other heavy metals. Burning painted wood can release these HAPs into the air, which pose health risks and environmental concerns.
Particulate Matter (PM): Burning painted wood can generate fine particulate matter, including soot and ash. These particles can contribute to air pollution and have adverse effects on respiratory health.
Toxic Gases: The combustion of painted wood can release toxic gases such as carbon monoxide (CO) and nitrogen oxides (NOx). sulphur dioxide (SO2). These gases are harmful to human health and contribute to air pollution.
A standard used Euro pallet costs £8.00 to £10.00 second hand, and all coloured pallets remain property of CHEP and therefore are stolen, so we are watching pallets with a conservative value of £250,000 being burned.
Those toxic gases and that amount of money being burned should not be sniffed at.
Year after year I await news of a bonfire going wrong. And let's face it , regardless of which direction the wind is blowing , even if its blowing towards a petrol station or a cigarette factory , the fire will be lit tonight. It's only a matter of time .
Sammy Wilson was commending the builders of Larne bonfire earlier , saying they should be proud of themselves, and he was to mention it in the London parliament that the Larne lads will have broken a world record height for a boney. Sweet Jesus
It's going to take a tragedy for the authorities to cop themselves on. It's only a matter of time before someone, or some family, loses their home, or their lives. Maybe then they will clamp down on this crap. But I wouldn't hold my breath... which is what a lot of people should be doing tonight judging by armaghniac's post
Derry lads CV: Won an All-Ireland minor medal with a team of people. We learnt skills, discipline, tactics, respect and teamwork etc
Larne lads CV: We built a big bonfire.
Quote from: AustinPowers on July 11, 2023, 10:22:27 PM
Year after year I await news of a bonfire going wrong. And let's face it , regardless of which direction the wind is blowing , even if its blowing towards a petrol station or a cigarette factory , the fire will be lit tonight. It's only a matter of time .
Sammy Wilson was commending the builders of Larne bonfire earlier , saying they should be proud of themselves, and he was to mention it in the London parliament that the Larne lads will have broken a world record height for a boney. Sweet Jesus
It's going to take a tragedy for the authorities to cop themselves on. It's only a matter of time before someone, or some family, loses their home, or their lives. Maybe then they will clamp down on this crap. But I wouldn't hold my breath... which is what a lot of people should be doing tonight judging by armaghniac's post
Sure after your man fell off the bonfire last year they lit it as a tribute as its "what he would have wanted "
Quote from: markl121 on July 11, 2023, 10:42:40 PM
Quote from: AustinPowers on July 11, 2023, 10:22:27 PM
Year after year I await news of a bonfire going wrong. And let's face it , regardless of which direction the wind is blowing , even if its blowing towards a petrol station or a cigarette factory , the fire will be lit tonight. It's only a matter of time .
Sammy Wilson was commending the builders of Larne bonfire earlier , saying they should be proud of themselves, and he was to mention it in the London parliament that the Larne lads will have broken a world record height for a boney. Sweet Jesus
It's going to take a tragedy for the authorities to cop themselves on. It's only a matter of time before someone, or some family, loses their home, or their lives. Maybe then they will clamp down on this crap. But I wouldn't hold my breath... which is what a lot of people should be doing tonight judging by armaghniac's post
Sure after your man fell off the bonfire last year they lit it as a tribute as its "what he would have wanted "
It won't matter a thing...
Was watching stuff the other day, old photos of NI, in all the photos I've seen, flegs, were maybe in one or two photos was there an image of a flag, the more we are accelerating towards a UI the more flegs are produced
Quote from: Brendan on July 11, 2023, 09:48:33 PM
Wouldn't be hard to raise a quarter of a Mill by raffling off a few bottles of Vodka don't you worry
Yes the head honcho in Larne power washes gutters for a living and also drives a supercar...
"Master bonfire builder" was it not 😉😃
If nothing else this thread has shown me that Armaghniac is a clever basturt. Could be absolutely wrong but im fcuked if ill ever find out. See above post
I see some lad fell down a right distance of one yesterday after lighting it, I would say he has a fair chance of being at his next bonfire paralysed in a wheelchair
Quote from: quit yo jibbajabba on July 12, 2023, 09:28:00 AM
If nothing else this thread has shown me that Armaghniac is a clever basturt. Could be absolutely wrong but im fcuked if ill ever find out. See above post
Armaghniac never did learn how to do do this....
QuoteAnd I quote
https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-northern-ireland-66167757
#culture
Quote from: Itchy on July 12, 2023, 09:42:09 AM
I see some lad fell down a right distance of one yesterday after lighting it, I would say he has a fair chance of being at his next bonfire paralysed in a wheelchair
Natural selection. Time they were banned.
Quote from: quit yo jibbajabba on July 12, 2023, 09:28:00 AM
If nothing else this thread has shown me that Armaghniac is a clever basturt. Could be absolutely wrong but im fcuked if ill ever find out. See above post
You obviously have not been in Gaaboard long or you would already know this.
However, I cannot take credit for those calculations as someone on Slugger did them.
Quote from: armaghniac on July 12, 2023, 10:21:45 AM
Quote from: quit yo jibbajabba on July 12, 2023, 09:28:00 AM
If nothing else this thread has shown me that Armaghniac is a clever basturt. Could be absolutely wrong but im fcuked if ill ever find out. See above post
You obviously have not been in Gaaboard long or you would already know this.
However, I cannot take credit for those calculations as someone on Slugger did them.
I am now conflicted 😃
Quote from: general_lee on July 12, 2023, 10:15:12 AM
Quote from: Itchy on July 12, 2023, 09:42:09 AM
I see some lad fell down a right distance of one yesterday after lighting it, I would say he has a fair chance of being at his next bonfire paralysed in a wheelchair
Natural selection. Time they were banned.
One of MutantArds finest it seems fell quite a height too, he'll be lucky to walk again by the looks of it.
But sure the local RUFF/EB UVF or whoever oversees that particular bonfire in EA ground (it used to be a primary school) will see to it that he and his family are well looked after.
What I have noticed is this Flaggelation is a class thing, very few flags up in the "developments" in Newtownards or Holywood when I went through it the other day, it's just the sink estates like the Westwinds and the Bowtown Road (pronounced boot-on) where the fleggers seems to be their strongest.
Quote from: johnnycool on July 12, 2023, 10:51:29 AM
Quote from: general_lee on July 12, 2023, 10:15:12 AM
Quote from: Itchy on July 12, 2023, 09:42:09 AM
I see some lad fell down a right distance of one yesterday after lighting it, I would say he has a fair chance of being at his next bonfire paralysed in a wheelchair
Natural selection. Time they were banned.
One of MutantArds finest it seems fell quite a height too, he'll be lucky to walk again by the looks of it.
But sure the local RUFF/EB UVF or whoever oversees that particular bonfire in EA ground (it used to be a primary school) will see to it that he and his family are well looked after.
What I have noticed is this Flaggelation is a class thing, very few flags up in the "developments" in Newtownards or Holywood when I went through it the other day, it's just the sink estates like the Westwinds and the Bowtown Road (pronounced boot-on) where the fleggers seems to be their strongest.
Who fell off the Ards bonfire? Was it the one in Bowtown? I thought it had moved from a bonfire to a beacon some years ago. Send me a PM if you don't want to go public
https://m.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/northern-ireland/sammy-wilson-hails-craigyhill-bonfire-as-best-of-northern-ireland-in-parliamentary-motion/a1209824782.html
(https://m.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/northern-ireland/sammy-wilson-hails-craigyhill-bonfire-as-best-of-northern-ireland-in-parliamentary-motion/a1209824782.html)
I think the bit that stood for me out was....
Mr Wilson said: "The efforts of the people in Craigyhill are an example of what is best in Northern Ireland.
Good soaking today for a change
Quote from: Dougal Maguire on July 12, 2023, 11:18:32 AM
Quote from: johnnycool on July 12, 2023, 10:51:29 AM
Quote from: general_lee on July 12, 2023, 10:15:12 AM
Quote from: Itchy on July 12, 2023, 09:42:09 AM
I see some lad fell down a right distance of one yesterday after lighting it, I would say he has a fair chance of being at his next bonfire paralysed in a wheelchair
Natural selection. Time they were banned.
One of MutantArds finest it seems fell quite a height too, he'll be lucky to walk again by the looks of it.
But sure the local RUFF/EB UVF or whoever oversees that particular bonfire in EA ground (it used to be a primary school) will see to it that he and his family are well looked after.
What I have noticed is this Flaggelation is a class thing, very few flags up in the "developments" in Newtownards or Holywood when I went through it the other day, it's just the sink estates like the Westwinds and the Bowtown Road (pronounced boot-on) where the fleggers seems to be their strongest.
Who fell off the Ards bonfire? Was it the one in Bowtown? I thought it had moved from a bonfire to a beacon some years ago. Send me a PM if you don't want to go public
The bonfire in question is the one in front of the firestation, used to be a Primary school so bonfires on that particular site are probably only 10 to 15 years into their tradition.
I'd say the knuckle draggers who attended this one are from the Movilla Road, Greenwell Street area, frequenters of the pub called "The Pub" in their glory.
Only a matter of time before the lad that fell from the bonfire has a personal injury claim in against the council. The only good thing is he'll probably be represented by Donaghadee's finest QC so he hasn't a hope of winning.
Tbh it seems like a miracle that more people aren't seriously hurt or killed at these things. Man dies in Larne so what do they do - build bigger. Ludicrous.
Once your man Steele's case come up and the family take a fortune of MEA council and the lad from last night sues Belfast council then you might see council's taking a stand on allowing there property been used.
MEA were to have an urgent behind closed doors meeting in May about bonfire's on their properties but it was adjourned to the autumn.
Would cooperate manslaughter laws apply against the council in the Steele's case?
what would be the basis of any lawsuits against local councils? Are they supposed to prevent this sort of thing?
Quote from: imtommygunn on July 12, 2023, 06:06:58 PM
Tbh it seems like a miracle that more people aren't seriously hurt or killed at these things. Man dies in Larne so what do they do - build bigger. Ludicrous.
Yeah , it's madness . Then you get big Sammy bringing it up in parliament , which just ratchets the thing up a peg or ten
Seen that video with the fella falling last night. I'm sure it's a broken leg (or two) at best. Feck knows what injuries he has , or how he'll be left after this . Would be interesting to get his views on bonfires when he recovers , and if it was all worth it
Quote from: AustinPowers on July 12, 2023, 10:13:14 PM
Quote from: imtommygunn on July 12, 2023, 06:06:58 PM
Tbh it seems like a miracle that more people aren't seriously hurt or killed at these things. Man dies in Larne so what do they do - build bigger. Ludicrous.
Yeah , it's madness . Then you get big Sammy bringing it up in parliament , which just ratchets the thing up a peg or ten
Seen that video with the fella falling last night. I'm sure it's a broken leg (or two) at best. Feck knows what injuries he has , or how he'll be left after this . Would be interesting to get his views on bonfires when he recovers , and if it was all worth it
Broken ribs, hip etc nothing life threatening.
How exactly are councils liable?
Quote from: general_lee on July 12, 2023, 10:30:00 PM
Quote from: AustinPowers on July 12, 2023, 10:13:14 PM
Quote from: imtommygunn on July 12, 2023, 06:06:58 PM
Tbh it seems like a miracle that more people aren't seriously hurt or killed at these things. Man dies in Larne so what do they do - build bigger. Ludicrous.
Yeah , it's madness . Then you get big Sammy bringing it up in parliament , which just ratchets the thing up a peg or ten
Seen that video with the fella falling last night. I'm sure it's a broken leg (or two) at best. Feck knows what injuries he has , or how he'll be left after this . Would be interesting to get his views on bonfires when he recovers , and if it was all worth it
Broken ribs, hip etc nothing life threatening.
How exactly are councils liable?
They wouldn't be. But that wouldn't stop some from trying.
If it happens on council land are they not supposed to have the property in a safe condition to prevent injury?
It probably was pretty safe until nutters started to build giant bonfires.
Quote from: screenexile on July 12, 2023, 11:26:56 PM
If it happens on council land are they not supposed to have the property in a safe condition to prevent injury?
How do you make ground safe so someone falling 30 odd foot, or whatever it was, onto it doesn't hurt themselves?
The problem here is there would be significant "anti-social" things which would happen if councils prevented these scales of bonfires happening. The council(s) are damned if they do and damned if they don't.
If PSNI did their job on this and all that flags crap there wouldn't be a problem, but they're a useless shower of shite.
Quote from: imtommygunn on July 13, 2023, 07:46:28 AM
Quote from: screenexile on July 12, 2023, 11:26:56 PM
If it happens on council land are they not supposed to have the property in a safe condition to prevent injury?
How do you make ground safe so someone falling 30 odd foot, or whatever it was, onto it doesn't hurt themselves?
The problem here is there would be significant "anti-social" things which would happen if councils prevented these scales of bonfires happening. The council(s) are damned if they do and damned if they don't.
Requires political leadership. None exists. Carla Lockheart wants to get orange men back down the Garvaghy rd. so this is where this shit is at.
Quote from: trailer on July 13, 2023, 11:03:59 AM
Quote from: imtommygunn on July 13, 2023, 07:46:28 AM
Quote from: screenexile on July 12, 2023, 11:26:56 PM
If it happens on council land are they not supposed to have the property in a safe condition to prevent injury?
How do you make ground safe so someone falling 30 odd foot, or whatever it was, onto it doesn't hurt themselves?
The problem here is there would be significant "anti-social" things which would happen if councils prevented these scales of bonfires happening. The council(s) are damned if they do and damned if they don't.
Requires political leadership. None exists. Carla Lockheart wants to get orange men back down the Garvaghy rd. so this is where this shit is at.
Hopefully there's an election pact there next time out and she gets the boot.
No self-awareness at all.
Quote from: marty34 on July 13, 2023, 11:15:04 AM
Quote from: trailer on July 13, 2023, 11:03:59 AM
Quote from: imtommygunn on July 13, 2023, 07:46:28 AM
Quote from: screenexile on July 12, 2023, 11:26:56 PM
If it happens on council land are they not supposed to have the property in a safe condition to prevent injury?
How do you make ground safe so someone falling 30 odd foot, or whatever it was, onto it doesn't hurt themselves?
The problem here is there would be significant "anti-social" things which would happen if councils prevented these scales of bonfires happening. The council(s) are damned if they do and damned if they don't.
Requires political leadership. None exists. Carla Lockheart wants to get orange men back down the Garvaghy rd. so this is where this shit is at.
Hopefully there's an election pact there next time out and she gets the boot.
No self-awareness at all.
She could do with eating a good Sunday roast
She'd probably be better keeping her mouth shut. Every time it opens something vile comes out then she plays a sympathy card on getting slagged about what she looks like. Her opinions are vile - what she looks like doesn't matter.
Quote from: red hander on July 13, 2023, 11:03:09 AM
If PSNI did their job on this and all that flags crap there wouldn't be a problem, but they're a useless shower of shite.
I read a few tweets from a lad who used to work for CHEP (the blue pallet crowd) and they don't sell them, He said they'd contacted the PSNI about their pallets being on a bonfire and that they wanted them back, the PSNI called them back and said that it would be more hassle than it's worth and weren't going to do anything about it...
It wouldn't take a rocket scientist to know where these pallets come from, stolen or "donated" would be the most of them!
Quote from: imtommygunn on July 13, 2023, 11:33:45 AM
She'd probably be better keeping her mouth shut. Every time it opens something vile comes out then she plays a sympathy card on getting slagged about what she looks like. Her opinions are vile - what she looks like doesn't matter.
But they'll keep voting for her.
It's very clearly orchestrated and done for votes >:(
Quote from: johnnycool on July 13, 2023, 11:40:04 AM
Quote from: red hander on July 13, 2023, 11:03:09 AM
If PSNI did their job on this and all that flags crap there wouldn't be a problem, but they're a useless shower of shite.
I read a few tweets from a lad who used to work for CHEP (the blue pallet crowd) and they don't sell them, He said they'd contacted the PSNI about their pallets being on a bonfire and that they wanted them back, the PSNI called them back and said that it would be more hassle than it's worth and weren't going to do anything about it...
It wouldn't take a rocket scientist to know where these pallets come from, stolen or "donated" would be the most of them!
Them pallets on those huge bonfires are bought. UDA/ UVF drug money.
Quote from: trailer on July 13, 2023, 12:23:54 PM
Quote from: johnnycool on July 13, 2023, 11:40:04 AM
Quote from: red hander on July 13, 2023, 11:03:09 AM
If PSNI did their job on this and all that flags crap there wouldn't be a problem, but they're a useless shower of shite.
I read a few tweets from a lad who used to work for CHEP (the blue pallet crowd) and they don't sell them, He said they'd contacted the PSNI about their pallets being on a bonfire and that they wanted them back, the PSNI called them back and said that it would be more hassle than it's worth and weren't going to do anything about it...
It wouldn't take a rocket scientist to know where these pallets come from, stolen or "donated" would be the most of them!
Them pallets on those huge bonfires are bought. UDA/ UVF drug money.
Must be very large cash transactions well!
Should be easy for the PSNI to trace otherwise.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-66181670
Not content with attacking firefighters now it's paramedics as well, can't even claim it was an isolated incident
Quote from: imtommygunn on July 13, 2023, 11:58:20 AM
It's very clearly orchestrated and done for votes >:(
That's exactly it
Same as Sammy Wilson praising the boys in Larne for their world record bonfire height. Wasn't this the same bonfire where that man died from last year? Like , friggin hell. It's all to appeal to the Neanderthals thinking , so they'll keep votinh for him. These politicians care not a jot about community relations, or the bigger things in society. Better to keep stirring the pot , because that keeps us relevant and in a big wage
Lockhart went on about shared space the other night . Funny that , because the last time I heard , there was a banner supporting soldier F in portadown town centre (and other areas), and by all accounts, the town is decorated with the butchers apron every summer . Shared space , how are ye!
They're only in it for themselves.
half of them marching are coke out of it literal marching powder
Quote from: Eire90 on July 15, 2023, 03:02:04 AM
half of them marching are coke out of it literal marching powder
Yeah, saw that. Crazy stuff.
Person on camera should have shouted at them and they'd have looked up. Just to see their expression would have been class.
Hopefully it'll go viral.
The Bonfires as well as being Dangerous to construct and dangerous when burning.
They leave an unmerciful mess afterwards
(https://ichef.bbci.co.uk/news/976/cpsprodpb/072D/production/_130373810_55da0d6a-c0a6-4d25-9fec-a011387e0c21.jpg.webp)
Quote from: From the Bunker on July 15, 2023, 12:29:21 PM
The Bonfires as well as being Dangerous to construct and dangerous when burning.
They leave an unmerciful mess afterwards
(https://ichef.bbci.co.uk/news/976/cpsprodpb/072D/production/_130373810_55da0d6a-c0a6-4d25-9fec-a011387e0c21.jpg.webp)
As do the crowds
https://twitter.com/IrishMa88348067/status/1679243860545814528?t=kleb7-8AbVEL9uZhAfeq2A&s=19
Who cleans that crap all up? The council?
Quote from: From the Bunker on July 15, 2023, 12:29:21 PM
The Bonfires as well as being Dangerous to construct and dangerous when burning.
They leave an unmerciful mess afterwards
(https://ichef.bbci.co.uk/news/976/cpsprodpb/072D/production/_130373810_55da0d6a-c0a6-4d25-9fec-a011387e0c21.jpg.webp)
Looks like a scene from Ukraine.
I can throw up pics of paddy's day in Holylands, concerts, Street festivals and so on that are exactly the same.
Dont mind many large scale bonnies in the Holylands from my day but in fairness i was drunk a lot of the time
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on July 16, 2023, 12:31:41 AM
I can throw up pics of paddy's day in Holylands, concerts, Street festivals and so on that are exactly the same.
That scene is pretty common after any big event. Where are the bins. Yes they should bring their rubbish home. But the council could prevent a lot of that by putting temp bins in place. The streets around Clones wouldn't be too tidy after a big game either. Bonfires a diff story obviously.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-66235152
Another 2 fingers from the British Government to the DUP.
Howards Hastings et al will be on the phone to wee Jeffrey telling them to wind their necks in.
Quote from: LC on July 18, 2023, 05:18:16 PM
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-66235152
Another 2 fingers from the British Government to the DUP.
Howards Hastings et al will be on the phone to wee Jeffrey telling them to wind their necks in.
"Unacceptable gap in UK border security"
I wonder is Mr Jenrick talking about enforcing these checks along the Irish sea.....
https://www.derrynow.com/news/home/1252229/county-derry-estate-redevelopment-project-halted-as-it-sits-on-bonfire-site.html?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=facebook&fbclid=IwAR0X1CYXKr4jLeVrrk34oJRg5lRgQj66k6ZYdJ5Os0jO6LQvyfVMwjYfkQI
Quote from: Brendan on July 19, 2023, 07:17:11 PM
https://www.derrynow.com/news/home/1252229/county-derry-estate-redevelopment-project-halted-as-it-sits-on-bonfire-site.html?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=facebook&fbclid=IwAR0X1CYXKr4jLeVrrk34oJRg5lRgQj66k6ZYdJ5Os0jO6LQvyfVMwjYfkQI
Madness, just like the picture above. That mess should be left as it is and they should have to clean it up themselves. Let them look at that for 365 days of the year.
Former Northern Ireland First Minister Arlene Foster has said she "feels so sorry" for holidaymakers trapped in Greece, as wildfires continue to grip Rhodes.
She described initially being "oblivious" to the fires on the island – until a restaurant where she visited was burnt to the ground.
Thousands of holidaymakers are currently on the Greek island, which has been ravaged by flames, and holiday firms are scrambling to get them home.
Speaking to GB News, Ms Foster recounted her experience.
"The thing is I had a wonderful holiday and was quite oblivious to what was going on on other parts of the island until Saturday when I was due to leave (that evening)," she said.
"We had been to such beautiful places in Rhodes, including a gorgeous little restaurant by the beach – and on Saturday evening I found out it was completely burnt to the ground.
"The place where I had been all day on Thursday...and on Saturday evening, my daughter looked at Twitter and it was burnt to the ground.
"When we were taking off on early Sunday morning, we could look back and see the fires raging on the ground. I had been walking around the town that day, no one was concerned but when I got to the airport that's when I got concerned."
Ms Foster said she was "very fortunate" that they had managed to escape the chaos after multiple holiday providers subsequently cancelled flights in and out of the island.
Some 19,000 people have been evacuated from Rhodes after many holidaymakers had to resort to escaping to the beach to escape the extreme weather conditions.
The Greek island of Corfu has also experienced serious fires across the island, with 2,500 people evacuated from the island.
"The lovely people of Rhodes who work and live there, who were telling us they don't make much money during the winter, are now devastated," Ms Foster continued.
"I'm told they have fires most summers but this is certainly the worst they've had in many years."
Upon returning to Northern Ireland, the politician turned broadcaster tweeted and said she is watching the news reports of the fires across the island.
She Tweeted: "Watching the terrible story of the fires in the Greek island. I came home from Rhodes on Sunday and feel so sorry for all those wonderful people in Rhodes who have lost their homes and livelihoods and wish safe passage to all those trying to get home to the UK."
Despite the chaos she escaped, Ms Foster said she wouldn't let the emergency situation put her off Rhodes for a future holiday.
"I would go back, particularly because the tourist season is their biggest industry. They were so lovely and wonderful people. This is devastation for them," she said.
Well as long as her dinner was lovely and she was oblivious to the raging fires destroying the areas where she went for a lovely walk!
That sums up the DUP. Oblivious to the place burning down round them.
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on July 24, 2023, 04:00:19 PM
Well as long as her dinner was lovely and she was oblivious to the raging fires destroying the areas where she went for a lovely walk!
Ah sure it's all just a bit of weather, according to her right wing friends in GB News and Talk Radio.
Campbell from lcc, the dup bedfellows, suing Matthew o'toole of sdlp over comments on the Nolan show. The outcome will be interesting. Hope it exposes that lcc.
Is Brolly representing Campbell, lol, lol.
At some point voters will wake up to who is in bed with the DUP. Maybe when house prices collapse. The party seems to have a similar relationship to money as the GOP. It's total Scooby Doo
Quote from: bannside on August 26, 2023, 10:20:21 AM
Is Brolly representing Campbell, lol, lol.
:D
Some of the derry posters would combust lol.
It's little coincidence that he has waited until the allegations over Stephen Nolan last week.
It's also quite telling the number of so called prominent journalists who failed to comment on the Nolan story since it broke. So much for impartiality and independence, all on the gravy train and a firm part of the 'NI' media establishment.
Quote from: yellowcard on August 26, 2023, 12:50:49 PM
It's little coincidence that he has waited until the allegations over Stephen Nolan last week.
It's also quite telling the number of so called prominent journalists who failed to comment on the Nolan story since it broke. So much for impartiality and independence, all on the gravy train and a firm part of the 'NI' media establishment.
Allison Morris has been on Nolan more than anyone from January - June, and Patricia Devlin has asked if any of them are on monthly retainers via Nolan's production company. Has Morris commented on the Nolan stuff?, i don't follow her as she is a dose & hilariously refers to herself as a "security expert"
Quote from: Kidder81 on August 26, 2023, 01:01:47 PM
Quote from: yellowcard on August 26, 2023, 12:50:49 PM
It's little coincidence that he has waited until the allegations over Stephen Nolan last week.
It's also quite telling the number of so called prominent journalists who failed to comment on the Nolan story since it broke. So much for impartiality and independence, all on the gravy train and a firm part of the 'NI' media establishment.
Allison Morris has been on Nolan more than anyone from January - June, and Patricia Devlin has asked if any of them are on monthly retainers via Nolan's production company. Has Morris commented on the Nolan stuff?, i don't follow her as she is a dose & hilariously refers to herself as a "security expert"
She's a big part of that Nolan golden circle so she won't be saying anything.
Devlin has said plenty. Morris has said a bit but maybe not as much
Sam thingy from newsletter is the main to have said nothing.
Quote from: imtommygunn on August 26, 2023, 03:34:33 PM
Devlin has said plenty. Morris has said a bit but maybe not as much
Sam thingy from newsletter is the main to have said nothing.
There is previous between Morris and Devlin. Morris very much portrays herself as a bastion of women's rights, but was called out for her silence at the time Patricia Devlin was receiving threats from loyalists and others.
Devlin mustn't fall into their golden circle
Quote from: JohnDenver on August 26, 2023, 09:33:11 PM
Quote from: imtommygunn on August 26, 2023, 03:34:33 PM
Devlin has said plenty. Morris has said a bit but maybe not as much
Sam thingy from newsletter is the main to have said nothing.
There is previous between Morris and Devlin. Morris very much portrays herself as a bastion of women's rights, but was called out for her silence at the time Patricia Devlin was receiving threats from loyalists and others.
Devlin mustn't fall into their golden circle
Devlin and Morris definitely don't get on, Morris has basically made a career out of talking about mysogny etc but never said a word, as you say, when Devlin was getting all sorts of harassment. It spoke volumes about her.
Wondered why the DUP were pushing for the head PSNI guy to go then that absolute muppet Lockhart puts out a tweet blaming him for two tier policing (also said some judge said there was now two tier policing) talking about orange march policing and the Bobby Storey funeral.
You couldn't make it up (well she probably did)
Quote from: imtommygunn on August 31, 2023, 09:19:29 AM
Wondered why the DUP were pushing for the head PSNI guy to go then that absolute muppet Lockhart puts out a tweet blaming him for two tier policing (also said some judge said there was now two tier policing) talking about orange march policing and the Bobby Storey funeral.
You couldn't make it up (well she probably did)
He should go though. After all his incompetence to remain in such a high profile job is beyond belief. Remember the Crossmaglen assault rifles picture on Christmas Day? The force is as sectarian as ever if we belief Sam McBride, it lurches from crisis to crisis. His handling of the Covid regulations during the pandemic was farcical. Remeber the BLM march in Derry? He's in over his head and he should go.
He should - but not because of "two tier policing".
Quote from: imtommygunn on August 31, 2023, 09:38:45 AM
He should - but not because of "two tier policing".
Agree
Two tier policing:
https://www.thedetail.tv/articles/almost-twice-the-number-of-catholics-than-protestants-arrested-and-charged-by-psni (https://www.thedetail.tv/articles/almost-twice-the-number-of-catholics-than-protestants-arrested-and-charged-by-psni)
https://www.thedetail.tv/articles/nearly-twice-as-many-security-stop-and-searches-on-catholics-as-protestants (https://www.thedetail.tv/articles/nearly-twice-as-many-security-stop-and-searches-on-catholics-as-protestants)
https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/opinion/columnists/sam-mcbride/anti-catholic-sentiment-in-the-psni-is-driving-brave-officers-away/a498017723.html (https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/opinion/columnists/sam-mcbride/anti-catholic-sentiment-in-the-psni-is-driving-brave-officers-away/a498017723.html)
Exactly.
I no longer am sure whether they believe what they say or are just shit stirring. Tbh I used to just think the latter but now I think the former especially with this imbecile.
Bin Lowry in tears on Nolan this morning.
Quote from: Orior on August 31, 2023, 10:31:36 AM
Bin Lowry in tears on Nolan this morning.
What was his problem today?
Quote from: Kidder81 on August 26, 2023, 09:48:40 PM
Quote from: JohnDenver on August 26, 2023, 09:33:11 PM
Quote from: imtommygunn on August 26, 2023, 03:34:33 PM
Devlin has said plenty. Morris has said a bit but maybe not as much
Sam thingy from newsletter is the main to have said nothing.
There is previous between Morris and Devlin. Morris very much portrays herself as a bastion of women's rights, but was called out for her silence at the time Patricia Devlin was receiving threats from loyalists and others.
Devlin mustn't fall into their golden circle
Devlin and Morris definitely don't get on, Morris has basically made a career out of talking about mysogny etc but never said a word, as you say, when Devlin was getting all sorts of harassment. It spoke volumes about her.
Check out The Pensive Quill website/blog and search for 'Mean Girl Allison Morris'. Tells you all you need to know about that one.
Quote from: red hander on August 31, 2023, 11:51:48 AM
Quote from: Kidder81 on August 26, 2023, 09:48:40 PM
Quote from: JohnDenver on August 26, 2023, 09:33:11 PM
Quote from: imtommygunn on August 26, 2023, 03:34:33 PM
Devlin has said plenty. Morris has said a bit but maybe not as much
Sam thingy from newsletter is the main to have said nothing.
There is previous between Morris and Devlin. Morris very much portrays herself as a bastion of women's rights, but was called out for her silence at the time Patricia Devlin was receiving threats from loyalists and others.
Devlin mustn't fall into their golden circle
Devlin and Morris definitely don't get on, Morris has basically made a career out of talking about mysogny etc but never said a word, as you say, when Devlin was getting all sorts of harassment. It spoke volumes about her.
Check out The Pensive Quill website/blog and search for 'Mean Girl Allison Morris'. Tells you all you need to know about that one.
Not great reading though not surprising reading either tbh.
We all say we hate Nolan but come on is there anything more entertaining than Lowry or Bryson in full meltdown?
Everything the DUP touch is disputed. They should change their name to the Unionist Friction Party
Cheers. Ah I thought there was more than that I didn't know about.
Quote from: HiMucker on August 31, 2023, 02:53:22 PM
Quote from: Taylor on August 31, 2023, 02:42:59 PM
Quote from: Orior on August 31, 2023, 12:13:27 PM
Quote from: Taylor on August 31, 2023, 10:35:25 AM
Quote from: Orior on August 31, 2023, 10:31:36 AM
Bin Lowry in tears on Nolan this morning.
What was his problem today?
PSNIRA
Is there anyone that isnt in the RA at this stage?
Gerry Adams
Beat me to it! ;D
It's all gotten a bit murky for those cops at the Sean Grahams anniversary as they initially said they didn't know what the gathering was for or anything about the Sean Grahams massacre but the radio recordings suggest different as they were told exactly what was going on.
It won't be the first time a member of the PSNI/RUC told a few porkies in a court of law so little wonder these young recruits ably assisted by the Police Federation didn't think it was an issue to continue to do so!
They blatantly knew about that.
It didn't sit right at the time and now we are starting find out why.
It is just shambles after shambles, it would actually be quite entertaining were it not so sinister.
I would be amazed if new recruits are not being given a bit of a history lesson about the place. Out of all that has come out in the last few days and all that the media are spouting, the one reason I would be sacking the chief constable would be on that, that new recruits claim not to have a clue about major incidents that happened during the troubles and that are still raw for many in the community. Is that not the biggest scandal here? Is that not a rather fundamental flaw to policing in NI?
The PSNI story is another dead cat.
This relentless distraction must be a feature of post conflict societies in Bosnia etc.
Quote from: NAG1 on September 01, 2023, 09:45:19 AM
It didn't sit right at the time and now we are starting find out why.
It is just shambles after shambles, it would actually be quite entertaining were it not so sinister.
Definitely that ormeau road one did not sit right at all.
Then they come out with two tier policing ::)
Quote from: seafoid on September 01, 2023, 09:53:51 AM
The PSNI story is another dead cat.
This relentless distraction must be a feature of post conflict societies in Bosnia etc.
The PSNI are limping from one disaster to the next, removing Simon Byrne as head won't change the nature of that organisation as we see how they walk alongside vigilante groups in Newtownards and much more....
Quote from: JPGJOHNNYG on September 01, 2023, 09:51:49 AM
I would be amazed if new recruits are not being given a bit of a history lesson about the place. Out of all that has come out in the last few days and all that the media are spouting, the one reason I would be sacking the chief constable would be on that, that new recruits claim not to have a clue about major incidents that happened during the troubles and that are still raw for many in the community. Is that not the biggest scandal here? Is that not a rather fundamental flaw to policing in NI?
As referenced by another poster above, and contrary to the statements provided by the two cops in question, court documents show that they actually were told over the radio what the gathering was. So they KNEW what it was. They KNEW it was a commemoration. The could no doubt clearly that see those in attendance were socially distanced and masked, and they still made the decision to go in and throw their weight around and make a few arrests.
The Police Ombusdmans investigation into the Sean Grahams massacre confirmed that the RUC colluded with the UDA in the attack. 29 years later, we see the psni turn up to intimidate and arrest the families at an anniversary commemoration. One of those arrested at the commemoration was Mark Sykes, a man who was shot five times during the massacre, and who's brother-in-law was killed. As if that weren't bad enough, it was set against the optics of a few days previous, where masked UDA men walked through a council estate as the psni stood aside and watched.
(https://www.irishnews.com/picturesarchive/irishnews/irishnews/2022/04/13/162224617-888a0a6d-feb9-4d46-a042-6012b08750fc.jpg)
Quote from: johnnycool on September 01, 2023, 10:30:45 AM
Quote from: seafoid on September 01, 2023, 09:53:51 AM
The PSNI story is another dead cat.
This relentless distraction must be a feature of post conflict societies in Bosnia etc.
The PSNI are limping from one disaster to the next, removing Simon Byrne as head won't change the nature of that organisation as we see how they walk alongside vigilante groups in Newtownards and much more....
It's that interacting with the DUP's problems. There is no sign of Stormont being restored, meanwhile. It's no wonder the South gets all the investment.
Quote from: Snapchap on September 01, 2023, 10:34:48 AM
Quote from: JPGJOHNNYG on September 01, 2023, 09:51:49 AM
I would be amazed if new recruits are not being given a bit of a history lesson about the place. Out of all that has come out in the last few days and all that the media are spouting, the one reason I would be sacking the chief constable would be on that, that new recruits claim not to have a clue about major incidents that happened during the troubles and that are still raw for many in the community. Is that not the biggest scandal here? Is that not a rather fundamental flaw to policing in NI?
As referenced by another poster above, and contrary to the statements provided by the two cops in question, court documents show that they actually were told over the radio what the gathering was. So they KNEW what it was. They KNEW it was a commemoration. The could no doubt clearly that see those in attendance were socially distanced and masked, and they still made the decision to go in and throw their weight around and make a few arrests.
The Police Ombusdmans investigation into the Sean Grahams massacre confirmed that the RUC colluded with the UDA in the attack. 29 years later, we see the psni turn up to intimidate and arrest the families at an anniversary commemoration. One of those arrested at the commemoration was Mark Sykes, a man who was shot five times during the massacre, and who's brother-in-law was killed. As if that weren't bad enough, it was set against the optics of a few days previous, where masked UDA men walked through a council estate as the psni stood aside and watched.
(https://www.irishnews.com/picturesarchive/irishnews/irishnews/2022/04/13/162224617-888a0a6d-feb9-4d46-a042-6012b08750fc.jpg)
Playing devil's advocate, the fella Nolan had on the last couple of days argued that the footage clearly showed that they were asked to come over by a member of the crowd whilst in their car. Both things can't be true.
Quote from: gallsman on September 01, 2023, 11:53:03 AM
Quote from: Snapchap on September 01, 2023, 10:34:48 AM
Quote from: JPGJOHNNYG on September 01, 2023, 09:51:49 AM
I would be amazed if new recruits are not being given a bit of a history lesson about the place. Out of all that has come out in the last few days and all that the media are spouting, the one reason I would be sacking the chief constable would be on that, that new recruits claim not to have a clue about major incidents that happened during the troubles and that are still raw for many in the community. Is that not the biggest scandal here? Is that not a rather fundamental flaw to policing in NI?
As referenced by another poster above, and contrary to the statements provided by the two cops in question, court documents show that they actually were told over the radio what the gathering was. So they KNEW what it was. They KNEW it was a commemoration. The could no doubt clearly that see those in attendance were socially distanced and masked, and they still made the decision to go in and throw their weight around and make a few arrests.
The Police Ombusdmans investigation into the Sean Grahams massacre confirmed that the RUC colluded with the UDA in the attack. 29 years later, we see the psni turn up to intimidate and arrest the families at an anniversary commemoration. One of those arrested at the commemoration was Mark Sykes, a man who was shot five times during the massacre, and who's brother-in-law was killed. As if that weren't bad enough, it was set against the optics of a few days previous, where masked UDA men walked through a council estate as the psni stood aside and watched.
(https://www.irishnews.com/picturesarchive/irishnews/irishnews/2022/04/13/162224617-888a0a6d-feb9-4d46-a042-6012b08750fc.jpg)
Playing devil's advocate, the fella Nolan had on the last couple of days argued that the footage clearly showed that they were asked to come over by a member of the crowd whilst in their car. Both things can't be true.
Who's "the fella on Nolan"? Is he suggesting the people, mid-commemoration, took the time to ask the cops to come over and arrest a few of them?
Mark Sykes, who as I say was shot 5 times during the massacre, and who lost his brother-in-law, was arrested and left handcuffed in a police car for two and a half hours for attending the commemoration. He remains, to this day, the only person that the police have ever arrested in relation to a massacre that the police themselves colluded in.
These things paralyse the North every so often. It is not surprising . The hurt and the pain of the Troubles was never really addressed properly and so many people suffered.
Some institution led by a independent credible outsider accepted by both sides with a role to address this and positioned above politics might help. The current system does not work.
If the PSNI had interrupted a memorial to the Shankill bomb would the DUP have waited until now to call for the Chief Constable's head?
Can a new Chief Constable be appointed while the DUP have closed Stormont?
Quote from: Orior on September 01, 2023, 01:27:57 PM
If the PSNI had interrupted a memorial to the Shankill bomb would the DUP have waited until now to call for the Chief Constable's head?
Can a new Chief Constable be appointed while the DUP have closed Stormont?
At the minute no, needs stormont to rubber stamp a new CC
Quote from: Snapchap on September 01, 2023, 12:45:00 PM
Who's "the fella on Nolan"? Is he suggesting the people, mid-commemoration, took the time to ask the cops to come over and arrest a few of them?
Mark Sykes, who as I say was shot 5 times during the massacre, and who lost his brother-in-law, was arrested and left handcuffed in a police car for two and a half hours for attending the commemoration. He remains, to this day, the only person that the police have ever arrested in relation to a massacre that the police themselves colluded in.
John Burrows, a former PSNI officer "with a background in professional ethics" who testified during the case.
The suggestion, as I understand it from judge's view of the bodycam evidence, is that the memorial had concluded. The speakers had finished, people had left and equipment was being dissasmbled. There are clearly semantics at play here but if the video evidence is as such, it's easy for them to argue the claim they arrested Sykes "during the memorial" is inaccurate. Their presence, obviously, was known during the memorial itself.
Quote from: johnnycool on September 01, 2023, 08:56:56 AM
It's all gotten a bit murky for those cops at the Sean Grahams anniversary as they initially said they didn't know what the gathering was for or anything about the Sean Grahams massacre but the radio recordings suggest different as they were told exactly what was going on.
It won't be the first time a member of the PSNI/RUC told a few porkies in a court of law so little wonder these young recruits ably assisted by the Police Federation didn't think it was an issue to continue to do so!
Are the audio/video clips themselves to corroborate this point of view available? The judgment, if you've read it, makes reference to an officer on the radio having mentioned Sean Grahams and another referring to the "30 year anniversary of the bookie shooting there". I don't find the suggestion that the two beat cops (7 and 10 months on the job, and one of them a Catholic from the South) hadn't the slightest clue about either the massacre itself or the memorial in any way implausible. A few bits of chatter on the radio during the moment itself making reference to events they neither know of the existence or significance of wasn't going to give them a history lesson.
Quote from: JPGJOHNNYG on September 01, 2023, 01:32:13 PM
Quote from: Orior on September 01, 2023, 01:27:57 PM
If the PSNI had interrupted a memorial to the Shankill bomb would the DUP have waited until now to call for the Chief Constable's head?
Can a new Chief Constable be appointed while the DUP have closed Stormont?
At the minute no, needs stormont to rubber stamp a new CC
Could this be a plan by the DUP to engineer a reason for them to get stormont up and running again? Ie whip up a frenzy "ah sure we had to get back at it in order to get rid of the IRA supporting cheif constable"?
Quote from: HiMucker on September 01, 2023, 03:37:57 PM
Quote from: JPGJOHNNYG on September 01, 2023, 01:32:13 PM
Quote from: Orior on September 01, 2023, 01:27:57 PM
If the PSNI had interrupted a memorial to the Shankill bomb would the DUP have waited until now to call for the Chief Constable's head?
Can a new Chief Constable be appointed while the DUP have closed Stormont?
At the minute no, needs stormont to rubber stamp a new CC
Could this be a plan by the DUP to engineer a reason for them to get stormont up and running again? Ie whip up a frenzy "ah sure we had to get back at it in order to get rid of the IRA supporting cheif constable"?
Either way it is a dead cat because the narrative is shifted away from the DUP and their boycott of Stormont and the knock-on effects with the local services and the economy.
Gets them off the hook for a bit any way.
A shadowy vigilante group has declared war on Ulster's drug dealers.
The Sunday World can reveal that a group of ex-loyalist paramilitaries have set up an organisation with the sole aim of targeting drug peddlers.
Dealers from the bottom of the food chain to the top are in the sights of the group members who say they will strike without warning and claim they are prepared to take lives.
It is understood the group has been holding meetings over a long period of time and has been building an 'intelligence file' on the country's major and minor dealers – no one is exempt.
The group is made up of veteran loyalist paramilitaries, mostly from the UVF and the dormant Ulster Resistance.
The anti-drug purge is the brainchild of a farmer/landowner from mid Ulster, and the organisation has bypassed the current paramilitary leadership. UVF Chief of Staff John Bunter Graham and UDA godfather Jackie McDonald have been vocal in their opposition to the drugs trade but have failed to curb the spread of drug abuse and have turned a blind eye as paramilitaries make money from the illicit trade.
Our source said low-level dealers will be kneecapped but their main focus is on suppliers who they say will be shot dead.
"Their main intention is the protection of loyalist communities – they will target anyone whether they are dissidents or foreign gangs. If they're dealing in loyalist communities they are fair game."
The source said they had access to a significant cache of weaponry.
It is known the secretive Ulster Resistance retains an arsenal of weapons hidden in arms dumps across Northern Ireland
Quote from: Eire90 on September 02, 2023, 12:07:11 AM
A shadowy vigilante group has declared war on Ulster's drug dealers.
The Sunday World can reveal that a group of ex-loyalist paramilitaries have set up an organisation with the sole aim of targeting drug peddlers.
Dealers from the bottom of the food chain to the top are in the sights of the group members who say they will strike without warning and claim they are prepared to take lives.
It is understood the group has been holding meetings over a long period of time and has been building an 'intelligence file' on the country's major and minor dealers – no one is exempt.
The group is made up of veteran loyalist paramilitaries, mostly from the UVF and the dormant Ulster Resistance.
The anti-drug purge is the brainchild of a farmer/landowner from mid Ulster, and the organisation has bypassed the current paramilitary leadership. UVF Chief of Staff John Bunter Graham and UDA godfather Jackie McDonald have been vocal in their opposition to the drugs trade but have failed to curb the spread of drug abuse and have turned a blind eye as paramilitaries make money from the illicit trade.
They don't want to stop drugs that's the problem. They just want to limit all the supply of it so that only the paramilitaries can make money from it
Quote from: HiMucker on August 31, 2023, 02:53:22 PM
Quote from: Taylor on August 31, 2023, 02:42:59 PM
Quote from: Orior on August 31, 2023, 12:13:27 PM
Quote from: Taylor on August 31, 2023, 10:35:25 AM
Quote from: Orior on August 31, 2023, 10:31:36 AM
Bin Lowry in tears on Nolan this morning.
What was his problem today?
PSNIRA
Is there anyone that isnt in the RA at this stage?
Gerry Adams
brilliant
NI budget clusterfuck
https://www.irishtimes.com/politics/2023/09/03/london-will-not-throw-money-at-northern-ireland-chris-heaton-harris/
In a speech at the British Irish Association's annual conference in Oxford at the weekend, Chris Heaton-Harris said that in the past the "so-called solution" to a Northern Ireland problem had been to "throw money at it and hope it will go away" and this pattern could not be repeated.
"The problems facing Northern Ireland cannot be fixed with a sticking-plaster funding settlement, which would not do anything to address the structural problems that have been building for years," he said
Another day, another Lundy outed. This time, one of the founders of the DUP...
https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/politics/new-ireland-is-now-inevitable-says-dup-founding-member/a1243025765.html
Quote from: Orior on September 04, 2023, 11:51:49 AM
Another day, another Lundy outed. This time, one of the founders of the DUP...
https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/politics/new-ireland-is-now-inevitable-says-dup-founding-member/a1243025765.html
I think that reality has been obvious now for years, it's the persistent policy of trying to wreck the place before they lose their grip is a reflection of the vindictiveness and bile. But their electorate seems happy with the chaos.
Good living for a living;
https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/business/agri/farmer-who-criticised-police-for-not-catching-those-behind-huge-cannabis-factory-is-charged-himself/a760397715.html (https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/business/agri/farmer-who-criticised-police-for-not-catching-those-behind-huge-cannabis-factory-is-charged-himself/a760397715.html)
Quote from: NAG1 on September 01, 2023, 03:45:07 PM
Quote from: HiMucker on September 01, 2023, 03:37:57 PM
Quote from: JPGJOHNNYG on September 01, 2023, 01:32:13 PM
Quote from: Orior on September 01, 2023, 01:27:57 PM
If the PSNI had interrupted a memorial to the Shankill bomb would the DUP have waited until now to call for the Chief Constable's head?
Can a new Chief Constable be appointed while the DUP have closed Stormont?
At the minute no, needs stormont to rubber stamp a new CC
Could this be a plan by the DUP to engineer a reason for them to get stormont up and running again? Ie whip up a frenzy "ah sure we had to get back at it in order to get rid of the IRA supporting cheif constable"?
Either way it is a dead cat because the narrative is shifted away from the DUP and their boycott of Stormont and the knock-on effects with the local services and the economy.
Gets them off the hook for a bit any way.
They are holding the North back. Even the Tories say there is no justification for the boycott. It's so depressing.
Fingers in ears, eyes closed, head buried under sand....
https://m.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/politics/i-didnt-want-to-see-that-front-page-in-tesco-jim-wells-says-wallace-thompson-shouldve-kept-new-ireland-views-to-himself/a1289071126.html
Wasn't much need for Sinn Fein boycott, got them nothing, so their position in trying get DUP bck starting from a bad base, as their boycott, the stick used to beat them.
Quote from: Wildweasel74 on September 06, 2023, 01:30:36 AM
Wasn't much need for Sinn Fein boycott, got them nothing, so their position in trying get DUP bck starting from a bad base, as their boycott, the stick used to beat them.
Rights or wrongs behind SF pulling out at that time was at least a principled one regarding RHI.
DUP boycott is completely sectarian, they can gurn about the WF or Protocol all they want (they aren't stupid enough at this point to think they can actually change it) but at the end of the day, they simply cannot countenance going in to Stormont under a SF FM and a woman at that. All the rest is them dancing on the head of a pin because they know they have been sold out and know they have no where to turn.
The longer they stay away the more influence Dublin can assert and we have already seen this with some low key joint investment projects.
I am not a SF supporter but it had reached the point where it was completely taking the piss and something needed done.. Any DUP MLA, or DUP member it would seem, could do whatever they wanted and they could get away with it. They were taking the piss out of everyone - they were pretty much doing what Johnson did before he did it. Do whatever you want with zero accountability. (I am not sure it is much different now mind you).
I still don't believe that the DUP informed their voters etc they were bailing out of this. There has to come a point where this has to stop. You would think it's long past mind you.
They think they hold the key to everything and everything revolves round them. Get Dublin involved and then see what they do then.
Quote from: Wildweasel74 on September 06, 2023, 01:30:36 AM
Wasn't much need for Sinn Fein boycott, got them nothing, so their position in trying get DUP bck starting from a bad base, as their boycott, the stick used to beat them.
Big difference was that quite quickly SF did a deal with Poots on behalf of the DUP to go back in, only for loyalist groupings to put pressure on the DUP who then reneged on the deal. The point is you cannot rely on the DUP or the UUP to keep their word, they are beholden to the Bryson's of this world.
Yep, we have to out extreme the extremists.
The GFA has to be rewritten so that no party can boycott Stormont. The DUP boycott is a disaster for the people.
Quote from: seafoid on September 06, 2023, 10:46:48 AM
The GFA has to be rewritten so that no party can boycott Stormont. The DUP boycott is a disaster for the people.
Or that they can boycott it if they want, but the rest can go ahead without them.
Quote from: dec on September 06, 2023, 02:09:04 PM
Quote from: seafoid on September 06, 2023, 10:46:48 AM
The GFA has to be rewritten so that no party can boycott Stormont. The DUP boycott is a disaster for the people.
Or that they can boycott it if they want, but the rest can go ahead without them.
Yes.
I think too, parties like Alliance should be able to take first/deputy first minister role. So far as I know (and I could be wrong) they can't hold either position as they don't designate as Nationalist/Unionist.
I assume the same is true for independents.
I think, or hope, we have moved on enough as a society that we can do this.
I'd also be in favour of at least reviewing the Petition of concern and how it can be used. It has certainly been abused, particularly by unionists.
How do we get to the stage where it's agreed that no one party can collapse the executive?
Does all parties have to actually be sitting in the assembly , and take a vote to agree the reform?
Can the British/Irish governments go over the executive 's heads and just announce that we are doing this?
Or do all parties and both governments have to actually sit down again and basically thrash out a new GFA?
Quote from: AustinPowers on September 06, 2023, 03:26:23 PM
How do we get to the stage where it's agreed that no one party can collapse the executive?
Does all parties have to actually be sitting in the assembly , and take a vote to agree the reform?
Can the British/Irish governments go over the executive 's heads and just announce that we are doing this?
Or do all parties and both governments have to actually sit down again and basically thrash out a new GFA?
You need a new GFA. They didn't think about everything.
Someone needs to tell the DUP to GFY.
Quote from: seafoid on September 06, 2023, 04:04:37 PM
Quote from: AustinPowers on September 06, 2023, 03:26:23 PM
How do we get to the stage where it's agreed that no one party can collapse the executive?
Does all parties have to actually be sitting in the assembly , and take a vote to agree the reform?
Can the British/Irish governments go over the executive 's heads and just announce that we are doing this?
Or do all parties and both governments have to actually sit down again and basically thrash out a new GFA?
You need a new GFA. They didn't think about everything.
Someone needs to tell the DUP to GFY.
25 years ago no one would have thought that you didn't want to help govern the place. SF used the loophole first and monkey see, monkey do.
People will suffer ultimately, health, education, infrastructure as we can see is unravelling before our eyes.
What is the DUPs endgame? Nothing seems to change for them in relation to the protocol, and the longer they stay away the more difficult it becomes for them to go back.
But we have to remember this is what people want and have voted for. SF's vote went up with their boycott and the DUPs vote is holding up and the policy is popular with its voters. Nobody really cares that Stormont isn't sitting and see no discernible difference in their lives, even though we are being left behind in the UK and Europe.
Sammy Wilson nearly talked himself into a border poll trying to debate with Steve Baker Monday night in the commons. I'd say it's minimum viable running of North until enough see it's a failed state and a poll can be called. He threw gauntlet down to DUP to make it work or face a different future. They've talked themselves into a corner.
Quote from: weareros on September 06, 2023, 04:29:36 PM
Sammy Wilson nearly talked himself into a border poll trying to debate with Steve Baker Monday night in the commons. I'd say it's minimum viable running of North until enough see it's a failed state and a poll can be called. He threw gauntlet down to DUP to make it work or face a different future. They've talked themselves into a corner.
The short-sightedness of the DUP has caught them out time and time again. From Brexit, to backing Boris, to this Boycott. They will have no one to blame but themselves. It's a roadmap in how not to do politics.
Quote from: weareros on September 06, 2023, 04:29:36 PM
Sammy Wilson nearly talked himself into a border poll trying to debate with Steve Baker Monday night in the commons. I'd say it's minimum viable running of North until enough see it's a failed state and a poll can be called. He threw gauntlet down to DUP to make it work or face a different future. They've talked themselves into a corner.
They will only change course if they have no other choice. As long as gobshites continue to vote for them there will be no change.
https://twitter.com/duncan_morrow/status/1699229432979116072
Quote from: trailer on September 06, 2023, 04:18:14 PM
Quote from: seafoid on September 06, 2023, 04:04:37 PM
Quote from: AustinPowers on September 06, 2023, 03:26:23 PM
How do we get to the stage where it's agreed that no one party can collapse the executive?
Does all parties have to actually be sitting in the assembly , and take a vote to agree the reform?
Can the British/Irish governments go over the executive 's heads and just announce that we are doing this?
Or do all parties and both governments have to actually sit down again and basically thrash out a new GFA?
You need a new GFA. They didn't think about everything.
Someone needs to tell the DUP to GFY.
25 years ago no one would have thought that you didn't want to help govern the place. SF used the loophole first and monkey see, monkey do.
People will suffer ultimately, health, education, infrastructure as we can see is unravelling before our eyes.
What is the DUPs endgame? Nothing seems to change for them in relation to the protocol, and the longer they stay away the more difficult it becomes for them to go back.
But we have to remember this is what people want and have voted for. SF's vote went up with their boycott and the DUPs vote is holding up and the policy is popular with its voters. Nobody really cares that Stormont isn't sitting and see no discernible difference in their lives, even though we are being left behind in the UK and Europe.
This is not SF"s fault. Don't forget the SF boycott started over RHI and both Alliance and the SDLP were supportive of SF's position regarding the need for Forster to stand aside given her involvement in the decision making. The nationalist community weighed in behind the Irish Speaking community on the need for respect and an ILA. Poots did a deal with them within a short period only for the DUP to renege on the deal, showing their ongoing disrespect for the Irish/nationalist community. So it is not correct or fair and just lazy analysis to blame SF on the past boycott. This time is different the DUP are boycotting Stormont over issues that are between the UK government and the EU. So the two can not be compared.
Quote from: Applesisapples on September 07, 2023, 09:23:04 AM
Quote from: trailer on September 06, 2023, 04:18:14 PM
Quote from: seafoid on September 06, 2023, 04:04:37 PM
Quote from: AustinPowers on September 06, 2023, 03:26:23 PM
How do we get to the stage where it's agreed that no one party can collapse the executive?
Does all parties have to actually be sitting in the assembly , and take a vote to agree the reform?
Can the British/Irish governments go over the executive 's heads and just announce that we are doing this?
Or do all parties and both governments have to actually sit down again and basically thrash out a new GFA?
You need a new GFA. They didn't think about everything.
Someone needs to tell the DUP to GFY.
25 years ago no one would have thought that you didn't want to help govern the place. SF used the loophole first and monkey see, monkey do.
People will suffer ultimately, health, education, infrastructure as we can see is unravelling before our eyes.
What is the DUPs endgame? Nothing seems to change for them in relation to the protocol, and the longer they stay away the more difficult it becomes for them to go back.
But we have to remember this is what people want and have voted for. SF's vote went up with their boycott and the DUPs vote is holding up and the policy is popular with its voters. Nobody really cares that Stormont isn't sitting and see no discernible difference in their lives, even though we are being left behind in the UK and Europe.
This is not SF"s fault. Don't forget the SF boycott started over RHI and both Alliance and the SDLP were supportive of SF's position regarding the need for Forster to stand aside given her involvement in the decision making. The nationalist community weighed in behind the Irish Speaking community on the need for respect and an ILA. Poots did a deal with them within a short period only for the DUP to renege on the deal, showing their ongoing disrespect for the Irish/nationalist community. So it is not correct or fair and just lazy analysis to blame SF on the past boycott. This time is different the DUP are boycotting Stormont over issues that are between the UK government and the EU. So the two can not be compared.
The reasons are different. But they are using the exact same mechanism that SF used. Surely you can see that?
Quote from: trailer on September 07, 2023, 09:25:25 AM
Quote from: Applesisapples on September 07, 2023, 09:23:04 AM
Quote from: trailer on September 06, 2023, 04:18:14 PM
Quote from: seafoid on September 06, 2023, 04:04:37 PM
Quote from: AustinPowers on September 06, 2023, 03:26:23 PM
How do we get to the stage where it's agreed that no one party can collapse the executive?
Does all parties have to actually be sitting in the assembly , and take a vote to agree the reform?
Can the British/Irish governments go over the executive 's heads and just announce that we are doing this?
Or do all parties and both governments have to actually sit down again and basically thrash out a new GFA?
You need a new GFA. They didn't think about everything.
Someone needs to tell the DUP to GFY.
25 years ago no one would have thought that you didn't want to help govern the place. SF used the loophole first and monkey see, monkey do.
People will suffer ultimately, health, education, infrastructure as we can see is unravelling before our eyes.
What is the DUPs endgame? Nothing seems to change for them in relation to the protocol, and the longer they stay away the more difficult it becomes for them to go back.
But we have to remember this is what people want and have voted for. SF's vote went up with their boycott and the DUPs vote is holding up and the policy is popular with its voters. Nobody really cares that Stormont isn't sitting and see no discernible difference in their lives, even though we are being left behind in the UK and Europe.
This is not SF"s fault. Don't forget the SF boycott started over RHI and both Alliance and the SDLP were supportive of SF's position regarding the need for Forster to stand aside given her involvement in the decision making. The nationalist community weighed in behind the Irish Speaking community on the need for respect and an ILA. Poots did a deal with them within a short period only for the DUP to renege on the deal, showing their ongoing disrespect for the Irish/nationalist community. So it is not correct or fair and just lazy analysis to blame SF on the past boycott. This time is different the DUP are boycotting Stormont over issues that are between the UK government and the EU. So the two can not be compared.
The reasons are different. But they are using the exact same mechanism that SF used. Surely you can see that?
I'm not sure how it's relevant that they used the same mechanism? Are you pointing out the flaws in the system? Genuine question.
For me, SF collapsed the assembly as the DUP were governing for themselves and themselves alone. There were many issues around the use of the POC, the Irish langauge act which had already been agreed to be implemented by all parties and the DUP reneged on, the RHI scandal and blatant one sided governance.
SF had my support in collapsing the assembly at that time in protest to DUP blocking everything that didnt suit them.
In this current instance, DUP have collapsed it as the WF doesnt suit them.
So the same mechanism and the same underlying reason.
The difference this time is that the DUP have no support from anyone apart from a portion of their own electorate, which includes the paramilitaries (the real leadership of the DUP). I know many traditional DUP voters who don't agree with the stance, or at least that's what they say. I'd guess they'd still vote DUP.
Trailer do you think that if SF hadn't done what they did the DUP wouldn't have worked out themselves that they could do this?
Quote from: tbrick18 on September 07, 2023, 09:49:30 AM
Quote from: trailer on September 07, 2023, 09:25:25 AM
Quote from: Applesisapples on September 07, 2023, 09:23:04 AM
Quote from: trailer on September 06, 2023, 04:18:14 PM
Quote from: seafoid on September 06, 2023, 04:04:37 PM
Quote from: AustinPowers on September 06, 2023, 03:26:23 PM
How do we get to the stage where it's agreed that no one party can collapse the executive?
Does all parties have to actually be sitting in the assembly , and take a vote to agree the reform?
Can the British/Irish governments go over the executive 's heads and just announce that we are doing this?
Or do all parties and both governments have to actually sit down again and basically thrash out a new GFA?
You need a new GFA. They didn't think about everything.
Someone needs to tell the DUP to GFY.
25 years ago no one would have thought that you didn't want to help govern the place. SF used the loophole first and monkey see, monkey do.
People will suffer ultimately, health, education, infrastructure as we can see is unravelling before our eyes.
What is the DUPs endgame? Nothing seems to change for them in relation to the protocol, and the longer they stay away the more difficult it becomes for them to go back.
But we have to remember this is what people want and have voted for. SF's vote went up with their boycott and the DUPs vote is holding up and the policy is popular with its voters. Nobody really cares that Stormont isn't sitting and see no discernible difference in their lives, even though we are being left behind in the UK and Europe.
This is not SF"s fault. Don't forget the SF boycott started over RHI and both Alliance and the SDLP were supportive of SF's position regarding the need for Forster to stand aside given her involvement in the decision making. The nationalist community weighed in behind the Irish Speaking community on the need for respect and an ILA. Poots did a deal with them within a short period only for the DUP to renege on the deal, showing their ongoing disrespect for the Irish/nationalist community. So it is not correct or fair and just lazy analysis to blame SF on the past boycott. This time is different the DUP are boycotting Stormont over issues that are between the UK government and the EU. So the two can not be compared.
The reasons are different. But they are using the exact same mechanism that SF used. Surely you can see that?
I'm not sure how it's relevant that they used the same mechanism? Are you pointing out the flaws in the system? Genuine question.
For me, SF collapsed the assembly as the DUP were governing for themselves and themselves alone. There were many issues around the use of the POC, the Irish langauge act which had already been agreed to be implemented by all parties and the DUP reneged on, the RHI scandal and blatant one sided governance.
SF had my support in collapsing the assembly at that time in protest to DUP blocking everything that didnt suit them.
In this current instance, DUP have collapsed it as the WF doesnt suit them.
So the same mechanism and the same underlying reason.
The difference this time is that the DUP have no support from anyone apart from a portion of their own electorate, which includes the paramilitaries (the real leadership of the DUP). I know many traditional DUP voters who don't agree with the stance, or at least that's what they say. I'd guess they'd still vote DUP.
I don't think if SF had did what they did, the DUP would've have done the same. Leaving aside why SF collapsed the assembly, it gives the DUP cover for their current actions by simply pointing out that SF did the exact same thing. Maybe I am wrong. Who knows. The DUP are useless c***ts for sure.
When MMcG collapsed the Assembly the tagline was no return to the status quo. Fair enough. But then they went back into exactly that. No ILA, Foster FM, and I can't even remember what the 3rd thing was. It was just a waste of time were services suffered. That pissed me off.
Quote from: imtommygunn on September 07, 2023, 10:03:22 AM
Trailer do you think that if SF hadn't done what they did the DUP wouldn't have worked out themselves that they could do this?
They would've known to do it, but it was the nuclear option and they might not have gone through with it. SF's previous gives them cover. It plays great with their base.
"Sticking it to SF. If they can do it so can we. An eye for an eye. Them Republicans won't tell us what to do." blah, blah, blah.
I don't think so tbh. They wouldn't care about going nuclear with or without the cover of that. They always have their default fallback of but what about the ra.
They're slippery enough they'd have found some "reason".
Quote from: trailer on September 07, 2023, 09:25:25 AM
Quote from: Applesisapples on September 07, 2023, 09:23:04 AM
Quote from: trailer on September 06, 2023, 04:18:14 PM
Quote from: seafoid on September 06, 2023, 04:04:37 PM
Quote from: AustinPowers on September 06, 2023, 03:26:23 PM
How do we get to the stage where it's agreed that no one party can collapse the executive?
Does all parties have to actually be sitting in the assembly , and take a vote to agree the reform?
Can the British/Irish governments go over the executive 's heads and just announce that we are doing this?
Or do all parties and both governments have to actually sit down again and basically thrash out a new GFA?
You need a new GFA. They didn't think about everything.
Someone needs to tell the DUP to GFY.
25 years ago no one would have thought that you didn't want to help govern the place. SF used the loophole first and monkey see, monkey do.
People will suffer ultimately, health, education, infrastructure as we can see is unravelling before our eyes.
What is the DUPs endgame? Nothing seems to change for them in relation to the protocol, and the longer they stay away the more difficult it becomes for them to go back.
But we have to remember this is what people want and have voted for. SF's vote went up with their boycott and the DUPs vote is holding up and the policy is popular with its voters. Nobody really cares that Stormont isn't sitting and see no discernible difference in their lives, even though we are being left behind in the UK and Europe.
This is not SF"s fault. Don't forget the SF boycott started over RHI and both Alliance and the SDLP were supportive of SF's position regarding the need for Forster to stand aside given her involvement in the decision making. The nationalist community weighed in behind the Irish Speaking community on the need for respect and an ILA. Poots did a deal with them within a short period only for the DUP to renege on the deal, showing their ongoing disrespect for the Irish/nationalist community. So it is not correct or fair and just lazy analysis to blame SF on the past boycott. This time is different the DUP are boycotting Stormont over issues that are between the UK government and the EU. So the two can not be compared.
The reasons are different. But they are using the exact same mechanism that SF used. Surely you can see that?
The point I am making is that SF had agreed to go back very quickly under a deal which the DUP reneged on at the behest of loyalist paramilitaries and their fellow travellers, their boycott also was about matters over which Stormont had control. So they are not the same and cannot be conflated and it is lazy analysis to do so.
Quote from: imtommygunn on September 07, 2023, 10:08:50 AM
I don't think so tbh. They wouldn't care about going nuclear with or without the cover of that. They always have their default fallback of but what about the ra.
They're slippery enough they'd have found some "reason".
One thing I learned back in the '80's during Drumcree, is you should never underestimate the willingness of hardcore DUP voters and loyalists to cut off every appendage to spite their face. Even if it causes them to lose everything they own.
Quote from: Applesisapples on September 07, 2023, 10:29:54 AM
Quote from: imtommygunn on September 07, 2023, 10:08:50 AM
I don't think so tbh. They wouldn't care about going nuclear with or without the cover of that. They always have their default fallback of but what about the ra.
They're slippery enough they'd have found some "reason".
One thing I learned back in the '80's during Drumcree, is you should never underestimate the willingness of hardcore DUP voters and loyalists to cut off every appendage to spite their face. Even if it causes them to lose everything they own.
Oh so true.
The DUP, Donaldson to be precise is still wrangling for a win of sorts to allow them to save some face and get Stormont up and running as they know it will hurt them long term with the electorate, but he's being undermined by the more vocal in his party but the absurdity of creating these 7 tests and the likes which they're bound to have known the UK government would never meet ranks of stupidity and arrogance of the highest level.
Sitting beside Michelle O'Neill as first minister also doesn't help, but that will be for ELP and not wee Jeffrey if he's still around in the next few months.
They really are badly led ever since Robinson exited the stage for them.
DUP really have backed themselves into a corner.
They have gambled that the tories will give them what they want if they collapse Stormont.
It doesnt seem to be working as the tories have just kind of said, leave them to it.
The Tories and the GB public in general couldn't give a toss about this place or the sensitivities of the unionist hard liners.
They will see a financial cost....that's it. Would they be happy cutting that cost off?
I don't see a way back for the DUP without losing face and probably leadership again. By changing leadership they could go back in and put all the blame on wee jeff. They'd need to do it quickly though to allow a settling in period before the next round of elections.
The days of unionist dominance over all are over and they still have not been able to accept that, and I dont know why.
What's the worst that could happen for them? They country is run by a governement sitting in Dublin, but they can still be British, sing to the queen/king, march around bonfires, etc. They might get a better set of public services under a dublin government too.
Perhaps the spectre of SF running the country is what terrifies them most.
Quote from: tbrick18 on September 07, 2023, 11:07:17 AM
DUP really have backed themselves into a corner.
They have gambled that the tories will give them what they want if they collapse Stormont.
It doesnt seem to be working as the tories have just kind of said, leave them to it.
The Tories and the GB public in general couldn't give a toss about this place or the sensitivities of the unionist hard liners.
They will see a financial cost....that's it. Would they be happy cutting that cost off?
I don't see a way back for the DUP without losing face and probably leadership again. By changing leadership they could go back in and put all the blame on wee jeff. They'd need to do it quickly though to allow a settling in period before the next round of elections.
The days of unionist dominance over all are over and they still have not been able to accept that, and I dont know why.
What's the worst that could happen for them? They country is run by a governement sitting in Dublin, but they can still be British, sing to the queen/king, march around bonfires, etc. They might get a better set of public services under a dublin government too.
Perhaps the spectre of SF running the country is what terrifies them most.
The DUP are paranoid. They are terrified of losing control. It would probably indicate to them that the future of the North was very uncertain.
SF are as neoliberal as they are. They are far more teddy bear than the Tories.
Quote from: johnnycool on September 07, 2023, 10:39:25 AM
Quote from: Applesisapples on September 07, 2023, 10:29:54 AM
Quote from: imtommygunn on September 07, 2023, 10:08:50 AM
I don't think so tbh. They wouldn't care about going nuclear with or without the cover of that. They always have their default fallback of but what about the ra.
They're slippery enough they'd have found some "reason".
One thing I learned back in the '80's during Drumcree, is you should never underestimate the willingness of hardcore DUP voters and loyalists to cut off every appendage to spite their face. Even if it causes them to lose everything they own.
Oh so true.
The DUP, Donaldson to be precise is still wrangling for a win of sorts to allow them to save some face and get Stormont up and running as they know it will hurt them long term with the electorate, but he's being undermined by the more vocal in his party but the absurdity of creating these 7 tests and the likes which they're bound to have known the UK government would never meet ranks of stupidity and arrogance of the highest level.
Sitting beside Michelle O'Neill as first minister also doesn't help, but that will be for ELP and not wee Jeffrey if he's still around in the next few months.
They really are badly led ever since Robinson exited the stage for them.
The 7 that started as 5 and will probably grow yet.
There has to be an end line somewhere but their bitterness knows no bounds and really I think that is the main reason they are not in government.
Donaldson is nearly worse than Foster and that is saying something.
The DUP were all set to accept the protocol until they got spooked by Bryson, Allister and LCC. While they are bigots on social issues, Irish culture, they know well the economic benefits of having access to EU for trade. Even Paisley made sure to note the cows were Irish during Foot and Mouth. Sure Poots was writing letters behind the scenes to make sure farmers were still getting EU benefits and was giving out stink about having to compete with cheap Aussie and NZ beef and lamb from Brexit trade deals. He was even having his department build the customs posts which Allister dubbed Poots Posts. He also objected to protection status for Irish Grass Fed Beef in EU because it did not include the 6 counties. He won and now it's 32. They tried to be too clever for their own good instead of being honest with the Unionist electorate that having access to EU trade means some necessary compromises.
Don't rule out the possibility that the DUP will use the current stalemate to force new negotiations in relation to the governance of the North, which they will use as an opportunity to attempt renegotiation of the GFA. They are running out of moves and are desperate to move the goalposts on a border poll.
Quote from: Caesar on September 07, 2023, 12:08:43 PM
Don't rule out the possibility that the DUP will use the current stalemate to force new negotiations in relation to the governance of the North, which they will use as an opportunity to attempt renegotiation of the GFA. They are running out of moves and are desperate to move the goalposts on a border poll.
It shouldn't matter now. They're not in a position of power anymore. They don't hold the majority vote backed up by a sympathetic UK Gov anymore. They squandered their opportunity to try and make an alternative NI a possibility in the long term. Any negotiations they go into now is at a weakened state. They will have to be dragged kicking and screaming into any shared future because as was pointed out to them in the Commons this week, the option they want to return to, isn't there anymore. It's no longer an option. So you have to pick from the available options. And if they don't, it will be forced onto them just like the WF.
They're trying to shift the majority that's required for a UI.
It's all a far cry from milk and two sugars.
Quote from: imtommygunn on September 07, 2023, 12:37:34 PM
They're trying to shift the majority that's required for a UI.
But they won't be able to. It would never be accepted by nationalists. And they swing as much power as Unionists now and their majority will only grow. It's too late to try and force that now. They're in too weak a position.
The other big motivation for the DUP maintaining the stalemate is to avoid a Sinn Fein First Minister. For years the DUP have used this as a scare tactic to garner votes. "The DUP are the only party capable of stopping Sinn Fein...".
Don't underestimate this. Not even unionists vote DUP based on what they deliver for the electorate. It's all scare tactics. Once Sinn Fein hold the First Minister position and the DUP lose this leverage it could be make a big impact!
I find it strange that the FM / Deputy FM roles were named as they were in the GFA. In reality, They are equal roles but the wording of the FM title is important. UNionists could always think they held the power while they held the FM role. Even though the deputy was an equal position, symbolically it was as if they still lorded it over those pesky fenians.
Makes you wonder why nationalist parties agreed to the titles of these roles in 1998. I mean , was it not called "power sharing"? Surely that should mean JOINT first ministers?
And did unionists never actually envision a time when a politician from a nationalist party might be FM?
The DUP have painted themselves into a corner. It would take a heart of stone not to laugh.
Of course there wouldn't be a nationalist FM this time either except for the St Andrews agreement imposed by the DUP. That would only have delayed things for one or two elections though.
Quote from: Caesar on September 07, 2023, 02:07:57 PM
The other big motivation for the DUP maintaining the stalemate is to avoid a Sinn Fein First Minister. For years the DUP have used this as a scare tactic to garner votes. "The DUP are the only party capable of stopping Sinn Fein...".
Don't underestimate this. Not even unionists vote DUP based on what they deliver for the electorate. It's all scare tactics. Once Sinn Fein hold the First Minister position and the DUP lose this leverage it could be make a big impact!
Don't kid yourself into thinking there is any other motivation than that. Said it a million times here. Everything else is a smokescreen around the fact they don't want a Sinn Fein First Minister. Especially one that is a woman.
Times they are a changing fast and change can't come quick enough.
DUP also no longer have enough seats for petition of concern. They made great use of that when they had the power and most of the social progress they blocked has now come in via Westminster.
Quote from: AustinPowers on September 07, 2023, 02:29:14 PM
I find it strange that the FM / Deputy FM roles were named as they were in the GFA. In reality, They are equal roles but the wording of the FM title is important. UNionists could always think they held the power while they held the FM role. Even though the deputy was an equal position, symbolically it was as if they still lorded it over those pesky fenians.
Makes you wonder why nationalist parties agreed to the titles of these roles in 1998. I mean , was it not called "power sharing"? Surely that should mean JOINT first ministers?
And did unionists never actually envision a time when a politician from a nationalist party might be FM?
Therein lies the biggest problem for political unionism. They cannot see past the next election cycle never mind look at what the medium term future might hold. Practically every political decision they ever make is solely with the next election in mind, and now that they don't have the majority, the chickens are coming home to roost. But they won't change, that much is clear at this stage. The smallest of what they deem to be a concession will always be pounced upon by the hardliners for political gain.
Quote from: johnnycool on September 07, 2023, 10:39:25 AM
Quote from: Applesisapples on September 07, 2023, 10:29:54 AM
Quote from: imtommygunn on September 07, 2023, 10:08:50 AM
I don't think so tbh. They wouldn't care about going nuclear with or without the cover of that. They always have their default fallback of but what about the ra.
They're slippery enough they'd have found some "reason".
One thing I learned back in the '80's during Drumcree, is you should never underestimate the willingness of hardcore DUP voters and loyalists to cut off every appendage to spite their face. Even if it causes them to lose everything they own.
Oh so true.
The DUP, Donaldson to be precise is still wrangling for a win of sorts to allow them to save some face and get Stormont up and running as they know it will hurt them long term with the electorate, but he's being undermined by the more vocal in his party but the absurdity of creating these 7 tests and the likes which they're bound to have known the UK government would never meet ranks of stupidity and arrogance of the highest level.
Sitting beside Michelle O'Neill as first minister also doesn't help, but that will be for ELP and not wee Jeffrey if he's still around in the next few months.
They really are badly led ever since Robinson exited the stage for them.
Will it hurt them with their electorate? I'm not too sure.
There seems to be a hardening of attitudes....as in..we'll dig ourselves into a bigger whole. We don't care.
Education, in a bad way at the minute, alot of capital works stopped to redivert existing funding just to keep schools open from maint issues ans school meals issues. A number of schools having issues with provision of school meals, plus massive Special Needs overscription. And not 1 politican gives a shit! How these people keep getting paid for not doing the job they supposed to, is amazing.
Driving tests and MOT's going up in price.
Tories punishing us all, via the DUP.
What'll be next? Water charges? Perscription charges?
The English are hardly going to keep paying to give ye things for free that they have to pay for.
Quote from: Rossfan on September 08, 2023, 08:01:32 AM
The English are hardly going to keep paying to give ye things for free that they have to pay for.
Exactly Rossfan, they'd be far wiser to pay the republic to take us off their hands
Quote from: marty34 on September 07, 2023, 08:01:39 PM
Quote from: johnnycool on September 07, 2023, 10:39:25 AM
Quote from: Applesisapples on September 07, 2023, 10:29:54 AM
Quote from: imtommygunn on September 07, 2023, 10:08:50 AM
I don't think so tbh. They wouldn't care about going nuclear with or without the cover of that. They always have their default fallback of but what about the ra.
They're slippery enough they'd have found some "reason".
One thing I learned back in the '80's during Drumcree, is you should never underestimate the willingness of hardcore DUP voters and loyalists to cut off every appendage to spite their face. Even if it causes them to lose everything they own.
Oh so true.
The DUP, Donaldson to be precise is still wrangling for a win of sorts to allow them to save some face and get Stormont up and running as they know it will hurt them long term with the electorate, but he's being undermined by the more vocal in his party but the absurdity of creating these 7 tests and the likes which they're bound to have known the UK government would never meet ranks of stupidity and arrogance of the highest level.
Sitting beside Michelle O'Neill as first minister also doesn't help, but that will be for ELP and not wee Jeffrey if he's still around in the next few months.
They really are badly led ever since Robinson exited the stage for them.
Will it hurt them with their electorate? I'm not too sure.
There seems to be a hardening of attitudes....as in..we'll dig ourselves into a bigger whole. We don't care.
It won't hurt them with
their electorate, no, but their electoral pool is dwindling, they've maxed out the hardline vote and they're still play second fiddle to SF.
They've fended off the TUV to their right, but Alliance are still making gains to the middle on what is perceived to be small u unionists. The likes of East Belfast could well fall to Alliance at the next GE.
In a recent poll it is thought Doug Beattie is cutting through to young unionists, how that plays out in the polls in the next election we'll see.
Quote from: johnnycool on September 08, 2023, 08:24:49 AM
Quote from: marty34 on September 07, 2023, 08:01:39 PM
Quote from: johnnycool on September 07, 2023, 10:39:25 AM
Quote from: Applesisapples on September 07, 2023, 10:29:54 AM
Quote from: imtommygunn on September 07, 2023, 10:08:50 AM
I don't think so tbh. They wouldn't care about going nuclear with or without the cover of that. They always have their default fallback of but what about the ra.
They're slippery enough they'd have found some "reason".
One thing I learned back in the '80's during Drumcree, is you should never underestimate the willingness of hardcore DUP voters and loyalists to cut off every appendage to spite their face. Even if it causes them to lose everything they own.
Oh so true.
The DUP, Donaldson to be precise is still wrangling for a win of sorts to allow them to save some face and get Stormont up and running as they know it will hurt them long term with the electorate, but he's being undermined by the more vocal in his party but the absurdity of creating these 7 tests and the likes which they're bound to have known the UK government would never meet ranks of stupidity and arrogance of the highest level.
Sitting beside Michelle O'Neill as first minister also doesn't help, but that will be for ELP and not wee Jeffrey if he's still around in the next few months.
They really are badly led ever since Robinson exited the stage for them.
Will it hurt them with their electorate? I'm not too sure.
There seems to be a hardening of attitudes....as in..we'll dig ourselves into a bigger whole. We don't care.
It won't hurt them with their electorate, no, but their electoral pool is dwindling, they've maxed out the hardline vote and they're still play second fiddle to SF.
They've fended off the TUV to their right, but Alliance are still making gains to the middle on what is perceived to be small u unionists. The likes of East Belfast could well fall to Alliance at the next GE.
In a recent poll it is thought Doug Beattie is cutting through to young unionists, how that plays out in the polls in the next election we'll see.
At some stage the UUP will take over again As the DUP did in the noughties.
"The crisis takes a much longer time coming than you think, and then it happens much faster than you would have thought." Rüdiger Dornbusch
'young' unionists may well think that Beattie makes more sense than the DUP loons, but will they go out and vote.?
Not convinced Beattie is cutting it tbh. Party not in a great place and if they can't pick up unionist votes now when can they.
jamie bryson making threats against brexit hardman steve bakar.
Quote from: Eire90 on September 13, 2023, 09:44:51 AM
jamie bryson making threats against brexit hardman steve bakar.
And actually proving Bakers point!
Snarlene was on GB News this morning and they were discussing legislation introduced by MPs in England.
In their usual right wing pompous fashion the english commentators were slagging MPs for not knowing the legislation that they had voted in, and said they expected the MPs to read the detail.
Snarlene went very quiet at that point, lol.
Quote from: Orior on September 13, 2023, 12:45:43 PM
Snarlene was on GB News this morning and they were discussing legislation introduced by MPs in England.
In their usual right wing pompous fashion the english commentators were slagging MPs for not knowing the legislation that they had voted in, and said they expected the MPs to read the detail.
Snarlene went very quiet at that point, lol.
You can't expect the MP's to be over ever jot and tittle...
xl bully ban does not apply blood on mla to northern hands if anyone gets attack and dies will northern ireland now become a dumping ground for xl bullys.
Actually was gonna pet one of those dogs outsude a shop the other day, stopped as I wasn't sure what it was, Head massive on it. Not a Inch on the Russian sheepdog, now they are real monsters.
https://www.rte.ie/news/leinster/2023/0929/1408002-meath-dowth-park/ (https://www.rte.ie/news/leinster/2023/0929/1408002-meath-dowth-park/)
New visitor attraction for the unionists?
Quote from: Aristo 60 on September 29, 2023, 03:25:33 PMhttps://www.rte.ie/news/leinster/2023/0929/1408002-meath-dowth-park/ (https://www.rte.ie/news/leinster/2023/0929/1408002-meath-dowth-park/)
New visitor attraction for the unionists?
They'll probably lament the fact it's no longer owned by whatever wealthy Anglo-Irish gimp used to call it home.
Quote from: Aristo 60 on September 29, 2023, 03:25:33 PMhttps://www.rte.ie/news/leinster/2023/0929/1408002-meath-dowth-park/ (https://www.rte.ie/news/leinster/2023/0929/1408002-meath-dowth-park/)
New visitor attraction for the unionists?
Irish government already pumped 15 million into the Boyne site after the GFA. I had a look once when I was taking family to Newgrange and it's a very nice visitor location. Not that any of them even appreciate these acts.
Some Unionists probably don't believe
1 that there were people in Ireland before 1609
2 that the Earth existed 5,000 years ago
Quote from: Rossfan on September 29, 2023, 04:20:04 PMSome Unionists probably don't believe
1 that there were people in Ireland before 1609
2 that the Earth existed 5,000 years ago
You are too cynical. After all who built Carrickfergus castle and the earth founded almost 6026 years ago, as every unionist knows.
Looks like the path has opened up for the DUP to go back into the executive. The wheelie bin brigade already issuing threats from grassroots unionism to incite mass protests riots and threatening to destroy their electorate vote if they do decide to go back into the assembley
hopefully whatever happens it'l be the end of him. absolute waste of space
Quote from: Nanderson on October 03, 2023, 02:18:24 PMLooks like the path has opened up for the DUP to go back into the executive. The wheelie bin brigade already issuing threats from grassroots unionism to incite mass protests riots and threatening to destroy their electorate vote if they do decide to go back into the assembley
There's a terrace-style chant in there somewhere ....
Quote from: AustinPowers on October 03, 2023, 06:22:26 PMQuote from: Nanderson on October 03, 2023, 02:18:24 PMLooks like the path has opened up for the DUP to go back into the executive. The wheelie bin brigade already issuing threats from grassroots unionism to incite mass protests riots and threatening to destroy their electorate vote if they do decide to go back into the assembley YA CNUTS?
There's a terrace-style chant in there somewhere ....
And the bigotry continues....
https://m.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/politics/irish-street-sign-survey-to-proceed-after-dup-fails-in-bid-to-block-move/a911265799.html
Israel-Gaza violence: Prime Minister Rishi Sunak calls Palestinian protest in Belfast school 'malicious'
Makedy uppity news from Wee Sammy, Arlene and the Newsletter. What a lowly piece of crap that paper is. Sad losers.
Quote from: grounded on October 17, 2023, 11:59:38 AMIsrael-Gaza violence: Prime Minister Rishi Sunak calls Palestinian protest in Belfast school 'malicious'
Makedy uppity news from Wee Sammy, Arlene and the Newsletter. What a lowly piece of crap that paper is. Sad losers.
Id love to know in what way it was malicious
There seems to be no ability to distinguish between supporting the plight of the palestinian people and supporting hamas. Even a prime minister can't do it though I would say it is more won't than can't.
He's a horrible wee man tbh.
https://www.irishtimes.com/ireland/2023/10/17/loyalists-must-get-educated-and-get-professional-jobs-argues-loyalist-activist/
Loyalists finally realising what the nationalist population figured out 50 years ago.......
If he's the best loyalism have to offer then he's right. I don't think any number of schools could help that boy though.
He was at some committee yesterday and had his arse handed to him on a plate as usual. He kept using the word subjugate and the boy had to more or less explain to him what it meant...
Imbecile.
Loyalist paramilitaries and the DUP are doing nothing to help the above. They are the biggest enemies of loyalism tbh.
Quote from: imtommygunn on October 18, 2023, 03:26:09 PMIf he's the best loyalism have to offer then he's right. I don't think any number of schools could help that boy though.
He was at some committee yesterday and had his arse handed to him on a plate as usual. He kept using the word subjugate and the boy had to more or less explain to him what it meant...
Imbecile.
Loyalist paramilitaries and the DUP are doing nothing to help the above. They are the biggest enemies of loyalism tbh.
All very true - and yet it is one side that follow him on social media, engage with him on social media and give him the oxygen he craves.
Whoever follows or engages with him are part of the problem.
If he tweeted to an echo chamber he would soon disappear
Yes exactly. The joke's over. It's not funny any more.
Nolan keeps this bollacks relevant, there is a photo floating around years ago of him in a Irish Pub in Spain with the Tricolour /(Not photoshopped) love to find that again,
https://www.reddit.com/r/northernireland/comments/sjvw2q/jamie_claiming_a_nationalist_coup_as_stormont/
I have forgotten how to add photos ;D
Quote from: LC on October 18, 2023, 03:20:33 PMhttps://www.irishtimes.com/ireland/2023/10/17/loyalists-must-get-educated-and-get-professional-jobs-argues-loyalist-activist/
Loyalists finally realising what the nationalist population figured out 50 years ago.......
Some illegal immigrant from Tipp or Timbuktu is keeping wee billy boy out of a job as a brain surgeon.
Quote from: Wildweasel74 on October 18, 2023, 10:12:40 PMNolan keeps this bollacks relevant, there is a photo floating around years ago of him in a Irish Pub in Spain with the Tricolour /(Not photoshopped) love to find that again,
Bwyson on Nolan again
He's on there nearly as often aS Vogue Williams on the late late show
What's way u make a official complaint about Nolan, gotta be the most biased f**ker on TV cause no Catholic would entertain him, that f**ker Bryson couldnt get 70 votes.DUP regret the day they sucked up to that tosser.
Quote from: AustinPowers on October 18, 2023, 11:32:13 PMQuote from: Wildweasel74 on October 18, 2023, 10:12:40 PMNolan keeps this bollacks relevant, there is a photo floating around years ago of him in a Irish Pub in Spain with the Tricolour /(Not photoshopped) love to find that again,
Bwyson on Nolan again
He's on there nearly as often aS Vogue Williams on the late late show
Vogue Williams is a qualified quantity surveyor and has won the best podcast in Britain. What is binlid's excuse.
Quote from: armaghniac on October 19, 2023, 12:06:02 AMQuote from: AustinPowers on October 18, 2023, 11:32:13 PMQuote from: Wildweasel74 on October 18, 2023, 10:12:40 PMNolan keeps this bollacks relevant, there is a photo floating around years ago of him in a Irish Pub in Spain with the Tricolour /(Not photoshopped) love to find that again,
Bwyson on Nolan again
He's on there nearly as often aS Vogue Williams on the late late show
Vogue Williams is a qualified quantity surveyor and has won the best podcast in Britain. What is binlid's excuse.
He's a useful idiot to those behind him and pulling his strings, Allister certainly, Donaldson seems to be trying to distance himself from Jamie a bit, but then you've the other DUP Pro Brexit hardliners using him, ably assisted by the uber Loyalist trying to portray himself as Mr Middle of the road Stevie Nolan.
Quote from: Wildweasel74 on October 18, 2023, 11:38:32 PMWhat's way u make a official complaint about Nolan, gotta be the most biased f**ker on TV cause no Catholic would entertain him, that f**ker Bryson couldnt get 70 votes.DUP regret the day they sucked up to that tosser.
I'll have you know he got 167 votes so he did.
Nearly as popular as the Fascists in the 26.
Wonder if those people whose homes have been devastated by storm Babet, will be consoled by money being pumped into the six counties because a small percentage feel a little bit less british?
Would a right minded unionist not wonder about a nation on its doorstep building a sovereign wealth fund whilst their particular political representatives are telling them we better off with those lads across the qater that keep stabbing us in the back and all we have to do is go back to London and tell them you just need to keep handing us more charity money and it will be OK.
Quote from: WT4E on October 23, 2023, 10:36:43 PMWould a right minded unionist not wonder about a nation on its doorstep building a sovereign wealth fund whilst their particular political representatives are telling them we better off with those lads across the qater that keep stabbing us in the back and all we have to do is go back to London and tell them you just need to keep handing us more charity money and it will be OK.
I've highlighted everything you need to know
Quote from: WT4E on October 23, 2023, 10:36:43 PMWould a right minded unionist not wonder about a nation on its doorstep building a sovereign wealth fund whilst their particular political representatives are telling them we better off with those lads across the qater that keep stabbing us in the back and all we have to do is go back to London and tell them you just need to keep handing us more charity money and it will be OK.
An oxymoron if ever there was one
Quote from: blasmere on October 24, 2023, 08:59:49 AMQuote from: WT4E on October 23, 2023, 10:36:43 PMWould a right minded unionist not wonder about a nation on its doorstep building a sovereign wealth fund whilst their particular political representatives are telling them we better off with those lads across the qater that keep stabbing us in the back and all we have to do is go back to London and tell them you just need to keep handing us more charity money and it will be OK.
An oxymoron if ever there was one
Moron is well deserved here. I should have said protestant - moderate unionist?
Quote from: WT4E on October 24, 2023, 02:09:08 PMQuote from: blasmere on October 24, 2023, 08:59:49 AMQuote from: WT4E on October 23, 2023, 10:36:43 PMWould a right minded unionist not wonder about a nation on its doorstep building a sovereign wealth fund whilst their particular political representatives are telling them we better off with those lads across the qater that keep stabbing us in the back and all we have to do is go back to London and tell them you just need to keep handing us more charity money and it will be OK.
An oxymoron if ever there was one
Moron is well deserved here. I should have said protestant - moderate unionist?
Just a prod will do, by definition of Unionist, and if he's labels him/herself as a unionist then they'll take some changing to buy into an united Ireland
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on October 24, 2023, 10:43:40 PMQuote from: WT4E on October 24, 2023, 02:09:08 PMQuote from: blasmere on October 24, 2023, 08:59:49 AMQuote from: WT4E on October 23, 2023, 10:36:43 PMWould a right minded unionist not wonder about a nation on its doorstep building a sovereign wealth fund whilst their particular political representatives are telling them we better off with those lads across the qater that keep stabbing us in the back and all we have to do is go back to London and tell them you just need to keep handing us more charity money and it will be OK.
An oxymoron if ever there was one
Moron is well deserved here. I should have said protestant - moderate unionist?
Just a prod will do, by definition of Unionist, and if he's labels him/herself as a unionist then they'll take some changing to buy into an united Ireland
Fair point. Anyway surely a united Ireland vote be won by any right minded person.
Quote from: WT4E on October 24, 2023, 11:33:06 PMQuote from: Milltown Row2 on October 24, 2023, 10:43:40 PMQuote from: WT4E on October 24, 2023, 02:09:08 PMQuote from: blasmere on October 24, 2023, 08:59:49 AMQuote from: WT4E on October 23, 2023, 10:36:43 PMWould a right minded unionist not wonder about a nation on its doorstep building a sovereign wealth fund whilst their particular political representatives are telling them we better off with those lads across the qater that keep stabbing us in the back and all we have to do is go back to London and tell them you just need to keep handing us more charity money and it will be OK.
An oxymoron if ever there was one
Moron is well deserved here. I should have said protestant - moderate unionist?
Just a prod will do, by definition of Unionist, and if he's labels him/herself as a unionist then they'll take some changing to buy into an united Ireland
Fair point. Anyway surely a united Ireland vote be won by any right minded person.
If you logically think it through it's a no brainier, but when did logic ever enter the equation?!
Sammy a slow learner...
https://m.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/politics/ni-thrown-under-the-bus-says-dups-sammy-wilson-after-sacked-braverman-accuses-pm-of-dishonesty-over-protocol/a936361049.html
Quote from: Rossfan on November 15, 2023, 11:00:20 AMSammy a slow learner...
https://m.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/politics/ni-thrown-under-the-bus-says-dups-sammy-wilson-after-sacked-braverman-accuses-pm-of-dishonesty-over-protocol/a936361049.html
They always seem shocked when PM after PM shows they don't give a fcuk about them.
They are comeplete simps for the tories.
Quote from: Tony Baloney on November 15, 2023, 06:03:07 PMQuote from: Rossfan on November 15, 2023, 11:00:20 AMSammy a slow learner...
https://m.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/politics/ni-thrown-under-the-bus-says-dups-sammy-wilson-after-sacked-braverman-accuses-pm-of-dishonesty-over-protocol/a936361049.html
They always seem shocked when PM after PM shows they don't give a fcuk about them.
They are as thick as mince.
Wasn't sure where to post this, but as they're close advisors for the DUP....
Newton Emerson make a great comment on Saturday that the East Belfast UDA had lost the UDA franchise, lol.
So their racqueteering, drug selling, community "services" will no longer be under the name of the UDA.
Ah bless.
Quote from: Orior on November 20, 2023, 03:11:18 PMWasn't sure where to post this, but as they're close advisors for the DUP....
Newton Emerson make a great comment on Saturday that the East Belfast UDA had lost the UDA franchise, lol.
So their racqueteering, drug selling, community "services" will no longer be under the name of the UDA.
Ah bless.
It will cost them a fortune getting new headed notepaper and business cards done
Ulster says dough
Some pressure on them, and the optics of healthcare staff telling them to get back to work is awful.
Jeffrey wants to get back but the other Westminster MPs aren't so keen.
Not one f**k could they give though.
Quote from: Orior on December 12, 2023, 09:04:35 AMUlster says dough
Quote from: imtommygunn on December 12, 2023, 09:23:22 AMNot one f**k could they give though.
Both statements 100% true.
Part of me wishes the British Government would tell the whole the lot of them to go f@+k themselves and if they were not sitting in Stormont on Monday morning them and their office staff (family members and other hanger ons) would have their salaries reduced to £0.
Quote from: LC on December 12, 2023, 06:22:57 PMQuote from: Orior on December 12, 2023, 09:04:35 AMUlster says dough
Quote from: imtommygunn on December 12, 2023, 09:23:22 AMNot one f**k could they give though.
Both statements 100% true.
Part of me wishes the British Government would tell the whole the lot of them to go f@+k themselves and if they were not sitting in Stormont on Monday morning them and their office staff (family members and other hanger ons) would have their salaries reduced to £0.
In a normal society that would have been done a week after the c***ts wouldnt go back in after the election.
I see Arlene and Michelle have been publicly found to have something in common ie a willingness to destroy any records that might show how inept they were in power.
They're a pair of c***ts, on the same level as Boris.
The truth is very few of them have the ability to run a country.
Quote from: thewobbler on December 12, 2023, 09:41:46 PMI see Arlene and Michelle have been publicly found to have something in common ie a willingness to destroy any records that might show how inept they were in power.
They're a pair of c***ts, on the same level as Boris.
Is it not the case that their phones are wiped once they hand them back?
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on December 13, 2023, 08:55:22 AMQuote from: thewobbler on December 12, 2023, 09:41:46 PMI see Arlene and Michelle have been publicly found to have something in common ie a willingness to destroy any records that might show how inept they were in power.
They're a pair of c***ts, on the same level as Boris.
Is it not the case that their phones are wiped once they hand them back?
Yes, this would happen in most companies if you hand back a mobile phone, computer or laptop.
Quote from: johnnycool on December 13, 2023, 09:53:28 AMQuote from: Milltown Row2 on December 13, 2023, 08:55:22 AMQuote from: thewobbler on December 12, 2023, 09:41:46 PMI see Arlene and Michelle have been publicly found to have something in common ie a willingness to destroy any records that might show how inept they were in power.
They're a pair of c***ts, on the same level as Boris.
Is it not the case that their phones are wiped once they hand them back?
Yes, this would happen in most companies if you hand back a mobile phone, computer or laptop.
And so it should, You do not want a record of government to be sitting in a storeroom or whatever. However, things like Whatsapps or text messages can be backed up before the phone is wiped and should be archived in some way if they are used for official business.
Quote from: armaghniac on December 13, 2023, 09:58:47 AMQuote from: johnnycool on December 13, 2023, 09:53:28 AMQuote from: Milltown Row2 on December 13, 2023, 08:55:22 AMQuote from: thewobbler on December 12, 2023, 09:41:46 PMI see Arlene and Michelle have been publicly found to have something in common ie a willingness to destroy any records that might show how inept they were in power.
They're a pair of c***ts, on the same level as Boris.
Is it not the case that their phones are wiped once they hand them back?
Yes, this would happen in most companies if you hand back a mobile phone, computer or laptop.
And so it should, You do not want a record of government to be sitting in a storeroom or whatever. However, things like Whatsapps or text messages can be backed up before the phone is wiped and should be archived in some way if they are used for official business.
Who backs it up? The Government or ministers? What safe environment would the ministers back it up to? Twitter lol!
I'm sure that stuff could be retrieved, and nothing like digging up shit to make news
Quote from: johnnycool on December 13, 2023, 09:53:28 AMQuote from: Milltown Row2 on December 13, 2023, 08:55:22 AMQuote from: thewobbler on December 12, 2023, 09:41:46 PMI see Arlene and Michelle have been publicly found to have something in common ie a willingness to destroy any records that might show how inept they were in power.
They're a pair of c***ts, on the same level as Boris.
Is it not the case that their phones are wiped once they hand them back?
Yes, this would happen in most companies if you hand back a mobile phone, computer or laptop.
Except when the civil servants had been told not to do that. That they would be required or the enquiry. Another blunder from a civil service full of shitheads who are completely unemployable in the real world.
Quote from: thewobbler on December 12, 2023, 09:41:46 PMI see Arlene and Michelle have been publicly found to have something in common ie a willingness to destroy any records that might show how inept they were in power.
They're a pair of c***ts, on the same level as Boris.
My understanding is that the ministers didn't wipe anything. They handed back the phones when they were no longer service as ministers.
Civil servants then reset them to factory settings.
I can see why they'd do this, but I also beleive that if there was official communications done via Whatsapp or other means then those records should have been retained.
Sounds like a break down in process again.
Quote from: tbrick18 on December 13, 2023, 10:41:17 AMQuote from: thewobbler on December 12, 2023, 09:41:46 PMI see Arlene and Michelle have been publicly found to have something in common ie a willingness to destroy any records that might show how inept they were in power.
They're a pair of c***ts, on the same level as Boris.
My understanding is that the ministers didn't wipe anything. They handed back the phones when they were no longer service as ministers.
Civil servants then reset them to factory settings.
I can see why they'd do this, but I also beleive that if there was official communications done via Whatsapp or other means then those records should have been retained.
Sounds like a break down in process again.
Yeah, heard Naomi Long on about it this morning and that seems to be the case. Don't think this sits at the door of Arlene or Michelle. Civil service are responsible for this.
Isn't stopping Jim Allister from having a pop about Michelle over it and even wheeling out the Bobby Storey funeral again.
Quote from: RedHand88 on December 13, 2023, 11:36:36 AMIsn't stopping Jim Allister from having a pop about Michelle over it and even wheeling out the Bobby Storey funeral again.
General rule of thumb, if you're annoying that clown you're doing something right lol.
Quote from: brokencrossbar1 on December 13, 2023, 11:18:57 AMQuote from: tbrick18 on December 13, 2023, 10:41:17 AMQuote from: thewobbler on December 12, 2023, 09:41:46 PMI see Arlene and Michelle have been publicly found to have something in common ie a willingness to destroy any records that might show how inept they were in power.
They're a pair of c***ts, on the same level as Boris.
My understanding is that the ministers didn't wipe anything. They handed back the phones when they were no longer service as ministers.
Civil servants then reset them to factory settings.
I can see why they'd do this, but I also beleive that if there was official communications done via Whatsapp or other means then those records should have been retained.
Sounds like a break down in process again.
Yeah, heard Naomi Long on about it this morning and that seems to be the case. Don't think this sits at the door of Arlene or Michelle. Civil service are responsible for this.
Not their fault but the facts never get in the way of a good headline. Bad press that phones where wiped and that's probably all most people will hear.
Quote from: Armagh18 on December 13, 2023, 12:32:19 PMQuote from: brokencrossbar1 on December 13, 2023, 11:18:57 AMQuote from: tbrick18 on December 13, 2023, 10:41:17 AMQuote from: thewobbler on December 12, 2023, 09:41:46 PMI see Arlene and Michelle have been publicly found to have something in common ie a willingness to destroy any records that might show how inept they were in power.
They're a pair of c***ts, on the same level as Boris.
My understanding is that the ministers didn't wipe anything. They handed back the phones when they were no longer service as ministers.
Civil servants then reset them to factory settings.
I can see why they'd do this, but I also beleive that if there was official communications done via Whatsapp or other means then those records should have been retained.
Sounds like a break down in process again.
Yeah, heard Naomi Long on about it this morning and that seems to be the case. Don't think this sits at the door of Arlene or Michelle. Civil service are responsible for this.
Not their fault but the facts never get in the way of a good headline. Bad press that phones where wiped and that's probably all most people will hear.
Would we really want to read Snarlene's (alledged) flirty texts with her chauffeur?
Quote from: Orior on December 13, 2023, 01:07:25 PMQuote from: Armagh18 on December 13, 2023, 12:32:19 PMQuote from: brokencrossbar1 on December 13, 2023, 11:18:57 AMQuote from: tbrick18 on December 13, 2023, 10:41:17 AMQuote from: thewobbler on December 12, 2023, 09:41:46 PMI see Arlene and Michelle have been publicly found to have something in common ie a willingness to destroy any records that might show how inept they were in power.
They're a pair of c***ts, on the same level as Boris.
My understanding is that the ministers didn't wipe anything. They handed back the phones when they were no longer service as ministers.
Civil servants then reset them to factory settings.
I can see why they'd do this, but I also beleive that if there was official communications done via Whatsapp or other means then those records should have been retained.
Sounds like a break down in process again.
Yeah, heard Naomi Long on about it this morning and that seems to be the case. Don't think this sits at the door of Arlene or Michelle. Civil service are responsible for this.
Not their fault but the facts never get in the way of a good headline. Bad press that phones where wiped and that's probably all most people will hear.
Would we really want to read Snarlene's (alledged) flirty texts with her chauffeur?
'Oh baby I can't wait for you to drive your big limo up my traditional route!'
Or see pics of snarlenes growler!
Cheers lads. Saved me buying lunch today I've lost my appetite!
Quote from: Orior on December 13, 2023, 01:07:25 PMQuote from: Armagh18 on December 13, 2023, 12:32:19 PMQuote from: brokencrossbar1 on December 13, 2023, 11:18:57 AMQuote from: tbrick18 on December 13, 2023, 10:41:17 AMQuote from: thewobbler on December 12, 2023, 09:41:46 PMI see Arlene and Michelle have been publicly found to have something in common ie a willingness to destroy any records that might show how inept they were in power.
They're a pair of c***ts, on the same level as Boris.
My understanding is that the ministers didn't wipe anything. They handed back the phones when they were no longer service as ministers.
Civil servants then reset them to factory settings.
I can see why they'd do this, but I also beleive that if there was official communications done via Whatsapp or other means then those records should have been retained.
Sounds like a break down in process again.
Yeah, heard Naomi Long on about it this morning and that seems to be the case. Don't think this sits at the door of Arlene or Michelle. Civil service are responsible for this.
Not their fault but the facts never get in the way of a good headline. Bad press that phones where wiped and that's probably all most people will hear.
Would we really want to read Snarlene's (alledged) flirty texts with her chauffeur?
YES! ;D
sinn fein and dup wiping whatsapps messages but aye sinn fein and dup are good people.
Quote from: Eire90 on December 13, 2023, 05:36:58 PMsinn fein and dup wiping whatsapps messages but aye sinn fein and dup are good people.
Anyone wanna explain this "story" to Eire90?
Quote from: Snapchap on December 13, 2023, 05:45:56 PMQuote from: Eire90 on December 13, 2023, 05:36:58 PMsinn fein and dup wiping whatsapps messages but aye sinn fein and dup are good people.
Anyone wanna explain this "story" to Eire90?
Would only give me a sore head
Quote from: Snapchap on December 13, 2023, 05:45:56 PMQuote from: Eire90 on December 13, 2023, 05:36:58 PMsinn fein and dup wiping whatsapps messages but aye sinn fein and dup are good people.
Anyone wanna explain this "story" to Eire90?
During Covid, politicians relied heavily on WhatsApp for communications and policy agreements.
Covid as we know now, was a very difficult time for politicians. There was no correct way to handle how it unfolded.
But one of the legacies of it all seems to be that politicians were able to dream up and unfurl measures to make unusual profits for friends and influencers.
And as a result, enquiries are being held to work out just how much of this was by accident and how much of it was on purpose.
As the paper trail for the conversations that allowed this all to happen was heavily undertaken on WhatsApp, politicians across the world are scrambling to erase all messages from that period.
This is of course immoral behaviour.
In NI the big two, who never agree on anything, have decided to throw the civil service under the bus for doing this without their knowledge. Which is of course horse shit and the real reason is has happened is because the civil servants in question were bullied and likely bribed into taking it on the chin.
This approach allows the blinkered supporters of each party to believe that the behaviour of their leaders is different to that of the crooked Boris Johnson. And they will lap it up.
Where'd you pull that out of wobbler?
Bullied and bribed lol.. plenty of facts in most of your post, but stretching here..
Can phone information be recalled via the 'cloud' or some other technique?
Quote from: thewobbler on December 13, 2023, 07:04:03 PMQuote from: Snapchap on December 13, 2023, 05:45:56 PMQuote from: Eire90 on December 13, 2023, 05:36:58 PMsinn fein and dup wiping whatsapps messages but aye sinn fein and dup are good people.
Anyone wanna explain this "story" to Eire90?
During Covid, politicians relied heavily on WhatsApp for communications and policy agreements.
Covid as we know now, was a very difficult time for politicians. There was no correct way to handle how it unfolded.
But one of the legacies of it all seems to be that politicians were able to dream up and unfurl measures to make unusual profits for friends and influencers.
And as a result, enquiries are being held to work out just how much of this was by accident and how much of it was on purpose.
As the paper trail for the conversations that allowed this all to happen was heavily undertaken on WhatsApp, politicians across the world are scrambling to erase all messages from that period.
This is of course immoral behaviour.
In NI the big two, who never agree on anything, have decided to throw the civil service under the bus for doing this without their knowledge. Which is of course horse shit and the real reason is has happened is because the civil servants in question were bullied and likely bribed into taking it on the chin.
This approach allows the blinkered supporters of each party to believe that the behaviour of their leaders is different to that of the crooked Boris Johnson. And they will lap it up.
Nailed it.
I know theres lots of links to Hancock and Boris letting their mates get contracts for PPE etc but unless I'm forgetting something there wasn't anything like that happening here as far as I remember anyway.
Quote from: Armagh18 on December 13, 2023, 08:03:47 PMI know theres lots of links to Hancock and Boris letting their mates get contracts for PPE etc but unless I'm forgetting something there wasn't anything like that happening here as far as I remember anyway.
Funeral gate is the only thing they are actually interested in.
There was something down south with private health and beds (which was possibly more panic) but the scale of what the tories have been at is on another level to most countries.
Your woman who does the undewear shop lines, not get a ton of contracts, then the stuff didn't meet the standard!
Quote from: thewobbler on December 13, 2023, 07:04:03 PMQuote from: Snapchap on December 13, 2023, 05:45:56 PMQuote from: Eire90 on December 13, 2023, 05:36:58 PMsinn fein and dup wiping whatsapps messages but aye sinn fein and dup are good people.
Anyone wanna explain this "story" to Eire90?
During Covid, politicians relied heavily on WhatsApp for communications and policy agreements.
Covid as we know now, was a very difficult time for politicians. There was no correct way to handle how it unfolded.
But one of the legacies of it all seems to be that politicians were able to dream up and unfurl measures to make unusual profits for friends and influencers.
And as a result, enquiries are being held to work out just how much of this was by accident and how much of it was on purpose.
As the paper trail for the conversations that allowed this all to happen was heavily undertaken on WhatsApp, politicians across the world are scrambling to erase all messages from that period.
This is of course immoral behaviour.
In NI the big two, who never agree on anything, have decided to throw the civil service under the bus for doing this without their knowledge. Which is of course horse shit and the real reason is has happened is because the civil servants in question were bullied and likely bribed into taking it on the chin.
This approach allows the blinkered supporters of each party to believe that the behaviour of their leaders is different to that of the crooked Boris Johnson. And they will lap it up.
Is this based on anything? Serious question by the way? I'm assuming it's based on something?
Naomi's phone was also wiped when hers was returned - something she has described as standard practice. Where does that fit into your claim that it's all a SF/DUP "big two" conspiracy, Wobbler?
Quote from: thewobbler on December 13, 2023, 07:04:03 PMIn NI the big two, who never agree on anything, have decided to throw the civil service under the bus for doing this without their knowledge. Which is of course horse shit and the real reason is has happened is because the civil servants in question were bullied and likely bribed into taking it on the chin.
This approach allows the blinkered supporters of each party to believe that the behaviour of their leaders is different to that of the crooked Boris Johnson. And they will lap it up.
I don't particularly want to defend either SF or DUP - both are two sides of the same turd in my view - but....
If the civil servants had either a semblance of balls or brains, they'd have backed the stuff up. Its not as if the politicians could touch them.
But they have neither. You'd have to travel a long way to find a more gormless bunch of fuckwits.
Quote from: RadioGAAGAA on December 13, 2023, 10:47:53 PMQuote from: thewobbler on December 13, 2023, 07:04:03 PMIn NI the big two, who never agree on anything, have decided to throw the civil service under the bus for doing this without their knowledge. Which is of course horse shit and the real reason is has happened is because the civil servants in question were bullied and likely bribed into taking it on the chin.
This approach allows the blinkered supporters of each party to believe that the behaviour of their leaders is different to that of the crooked Boris Johnson. And they will lap it up.
I don't particularly want to defend either SF or DUP - both are two sides of the same turd in my view - but....
If the civil servants had either a semblance of balls or brains, they'd have backed the stuff up. Its not as if the politicians could touch them.
But they have neither. You'd have to travel a long way to find a more gormless bunch of fuckwits.
That's a lazy analysis. SF have plenty of faults but they aren't on the same level as that other shower
I do enjoy a lively discourse.
Is there any fact in what I posted above? No. It's all supposition. Every last word.
But to answer questions.
Was bullying or bribery involved? Perhaps not. My understanding of how people reach the upper echelons of the Civil Service is that they are intuitively diplomatic. They walk in the direction the wind is blowing, and only pick fights to help the wind blow in the same direction.
Covid though is a very emotive subject, which makes their intuition of "toe the line" more difficult.
And I'll put it like this. If I tell an employee "do this or else", that's bullying. And if I tell an employee "say nothing and you will be promoted", that's bribery.
I can't possibly say that this has happened in Stormont. All I know is that whistleblowers in the high ranks of NiCS are traditionally few and far between. And they witness awful politics as par for the course.
——
In terms of the scope of our local politicians for fraud, philandering, whatever. It's genuinely negligible compared to their colleagues in Westminster. But it should then also be measured in relative terms. So if they're capable of giving a nod, that nod should be measured the same as Westminster, in relative terms.
——
If I was given the opportunity to restart my original soliloquy I would now mention that Arlene and Michelle might actually be in the same boat as NiCS. They may have received simple instructions from Westminster that their financial and political wellbeing would only be enhanced by wiping any semblance of WhatsApp during Covid times.
Why? Because they would have been involved in WhatsApp groups with Boris and/or his cabinet and aides that contained messages, that are now damning of the Conservative government. Boris and co likely had them on mute ffs but messages would have been passed... and answered.
Naomi Long wouldn't have been involved in those discussions. But she would provide tangible links to them through forwarded messages and other WhatsApp groups where they were discussed. Getting her phone wiped is important, but not so much as those the rank above.
——
And being honest I don't blame anyone for following such a protocol. A WhatsApp deletion scandal might last a week. The messages within - should they happen to be rolling the wrong direction either then or now - could destroy careers.
We all say things we don't mean on WhatsApp.
But very few of us are running the country.
——
My honest reason for the post above was to engage other posters.
As far as I'm concerned, Boris Johnson is a ****. An absolute ****. Not because of how the Tories handled Covid (difficult situation, no right answer). But for his outright disrespect for the needs and wants of the average person, before, during and after. We are all but pawns in a big money game to that ****.
That his entire WhatsApp history for that period of history is now "gone" is neither surprising nor important. It's expected.
But for any person to simultaneously admonish him directly for what is happening to enquiries in Westminster, while declaring what happened in Stormont as a Civil Servant issue, well it just drives me mad. This is adults who might wonder how children can believe in Santa Claus, but will believe anything they're told as long as it matches their political beliefs.
These politicians are all hiding something, all these WhatsApp deleters. Some more than others, no doubt. But they're all hiding something.
They're all c***ts.
There's not one politician in government that would have come out of covid without doing something, on reflection, they'll have regret, making a mistake or bad decision would have been expected to be fair.
Considering the extent of the pandemic and what it involved there's not a nation that came away without looking back and thinking there could have been a better approach.
The WhatsApps could provide some insight to what best/worst practices could be used or not used should this if come to light again.
The inquiry should have (I hope) a blueprint to how governments should react in the future, attacking them is futile, we know most of them are incompetent and the skill set they bring for such events is minimal.
It's whether or not they would be able to allow the actual science to guide them rather than their own needs.
Protocols on such things will need to be looked at, and the practice of wiping phones during times in office should have a time period of a few years, just in case, would be difficult to do or control.
And yes, I agree with your last line ;D
DUP party officers meeting today/tonight to discuss the current negotiations.
Are they about to go back into Stormont?
Quote from: tbrick18 on December 15, 2023, 11:23:02 AMDUP party officers meeting today/tonight to discuss the current negotiations.
Are they about to go back into Stormont?
Bryson in full flow, time they ignored that bollox but the loyalist "stakeholders" and the OO will also have their say, yet they still get on their high horse over "SF/IRA"!!!
Dodds and Sammy will be trying to scupper this as well.
Donaldson could sell this as a win, but he lacks backbone and will need to read the room as patience is running out on the DUP with the NHS in freefall and the education sector looking at a swathe of redundancies if more budget isn't secured for 2024.
Quote from: johnnycool on December 15, 2023, 12:21:09 PMQuote from: tbrick18 on December 15, 2023, 11:23:02 AMDUP party officers meeting today/tonight to discuss the current negotiations.
Are they about to go back into Stormont?
Bryson in full flow, time they ignored that bollox but the loyalist "stakeholders" and the OO will also have their say, yet they still get on their high horse over "SF/IRA"!!!
Dodds and Sammy will be trying to scupper this as well.
Donaldson could sell this as a win, but he lacks backbone and will need to read the room as patience is running out on the DUP with the NHS in freefall and the education sector looking at a swathe of redundancies if more budget isn't secured for 2024.
I assume the Nolan show?
Bryson is a mouthpiece who needs something to shout about to stay relevant with his UVF friends. Shouldn't be given the time of day.
Likewise with the OO. Are the a religious organisation or a political one?
They should be given as much say as the Catholic church in the running of a state.
Quote from: johnnycool on December 15, 2023, 12:21:09 PMQuote from: tbrick18 on December 15, 2023, 11:23:02 AMDUP party officers meeting today/tonight to discuss the current negotiations.
Are they about to go back into Stormont?
Bryson in full flow, time they ignored that bollox but the loyalist "stakeholders" and the OO will also have their say, yet they still get on their high horse over "SF/IRA"!!!
Dodds and Sammy will be trying to scupper this as well.
Donaldson could sell this as a win, but he lacks backbone and will need to read the room as patience is running out on the DUP with the NHS in freefall and the education sector looking at a swathe of redundancies if more budget isn't secured for 2024.
If DUP / Shinners et all walked back into Stormont in the morning they would not have and never will have the competency (brains) to fix things. There is £2.5 billion carrot being dangled so why do the British Government not just give the money to the Civil Service, who are currently running the country, and let them get on with things. When it comes to fiscal management our elected representatives are to often blinded by their political alleigances when it comes to the allocation of public money whether it be Irish Language, bonfires, housing and the slush fund of all slush funds the 'community' groups. Putting money towards Irish Language / bonfires scores brownie points with their core vote and they would far rather do this than put their heads together to see what needs to be done to have for example prevent Causeway Hospital maternity being relocated to Antrim or ensuring Daisy Hill and SWAH are able to offer a better service than they currently are. If they cant wrap a tricolour or union jack around it they don't give a f@@k.
Quote from: tbrick18 on December 15, 2023, 01:30:53 PMQuote from: johnnycool on December 15, 2023, 12:21:09 PMQuote from: tbrick18 on December 15, 2023, 11:23:02 AMDUP party officers meeting today/tonight to discuss the current negotiations.
Are they about to go back into Stormont?
Bryson in full flow, time they ignored that bollox but the loyalist "stakeholders" and the OO will also have their say, yet they still get on their high horse over "SF/IRA"!!!
Dodds and Sammy will be trying to scupper this as well.
Donaldson could sell this as a win, but he lacks backbone and will need to read the room as patience is running out on the DUP with the NHS in freefall and the education sector looking at a swathe of redundancies if more budget isn't secured for 2024.
I assume the Nolan show?
Bryson is a mouthpiece who needs something to shout about to stay relevant with his UVF friends. Shouldn't be given the time of day.
Likewise with the OO. Are the a religious organisation or a political one?
They should be given as much say as the Catholic church in the running of a state.
Exactly this - but anyone who follows him on social media is to blame for giving him a platform.
Even worse are those who reply to him - this simply gives him ammo for future tweets.
Its amazing these people dont realise that they are part of the problem
Lads getting on as if they don't know how WhatsApp backups work in 2023 ffs. Wise up.
He should be blocked on social media and Nolan shouldn't be near your radio or tv.
Here I think JB is a great fella, someone of this calibre setting the agenda for unionism can only be good for nationalism imo, and needs to be encouraged. Everything he touches turns to shit.
Though in fairness the elected face of unionism as repped by Sammy, Gregory, Shannon and Lockhart are hardly intellectual heavyweights either.
Quote from: johnnycool on December 15, 2023, 12:21:09 PMQuote from: tbrick18 on December 15, 2023, 11:23:02 AMDUP party officers meeting today/tonight to discuss the current negotiations.
Are they about to go back into Stormont?
Bryson in full flow, time they ignored that bollox but the loyalist "stakeholders" and the OO will also have their say, yet they still get on their high horse over "SF/IRA"!!!
Dodds and Sammy will be trying to scupper this as well.
Donaldson could sell this as a win, but he lacks backbone and will need to read the room as patience is running out on the DUP with the NHS in freefall and the education sector looking at a swathe of redundancies if more budget isn't secured for 2024.
Their MPs are probably against it. Out of sight and out of mind type of thing. They don't care. They have it handy hob nobing in London and won't get the anger the MLAs get.
Quote from: LC on December 15, 2023, 02:06:51 PMQuote from: johnnycool on December 15, 2023, 12:21:09 PMQuote from: tbrick18 on December 15, 2023, 11:23:02 AMDUP party officers meeting today/tonight to discuss the current negotiations.
Are they about to go back into Stormont?
Bryson in full flow, time they ignored that bollox but the loyalist "stakeholders" and the OO will also have their say, yet they still get on their high horse over "SF/IRA"!!!
Dodds and Sammy will be trying to scupper this as well.
Donaldson could sell this as a win, but he lacks backbone and will need to read the room as patience is running out on the DUP with the NHS in freefall and the education sector looking at a swathe of redundancies if more budget isn't secured for 2024.
If DUP / Shinners et all walked back into Stormont in the morning they would not have and never will have the competency (brains) to fix things. There is £2.5 billion carrot being dangled so why do the British Government not just give the money to the Civil Service, who are currently running the country, and let them get on with things. When it comes to fiscal management our elected representatives are to often blinded by their political alleigances when it comes to the allocation of public money whether it be Irish Language, bonfires, housing and the slush fund of all slush funds the 'community' groups. Putting money towards Irish Language / bonfires scores brownie points with their core vote and they would far rather do this than put their heads together to see what needs to be done to have for example prevent Causeway Hospital maternity being relocated to Antrim or ensuring Daisy Hill and SWAH are able to offer a better service than they currently are. If they cant wrap a tricolour or union jack around it they don't give a f@@k.
What's the Irish language got to do with anything?
too many stakeholder types in irish politics on both sides of border
Listen, they signed off a structure in EA and DE which left 2 more layers of management than previous. I say to ones in at work, if this was a private company I sack 25% of the staff, and reduce all the extra layers of paperwork and actually maybe get stuff done. The amount of staff hired past 4yrs is something else.
The EA is a complete shambles. They are understaffed, people leaving in droves, the admin of SEN is a disgrace. The amalgamation into one provincial body was poorly planned , ( saved very little money!) and has no leadership!
Quote from: marty34 on December 15, 2023, 09:28:28 PMQuote from: LC on December 15, 2023, 02:06:51 PMQuote from: johnnycool on December 15, 2023, 12:21:09 PMQuote from: tbrick18 on December 15, 2023, 11:23:02 AMDUP party officers meeting today/tonight to discuss the current negotiations.
Are they about to go back into Stormont?
Bryson in full flow, time they ignored that bollox but the loyalist "stakeholders" and the OO will also have their say, yet they still get on their high horse over "SF/IRA"!!!
Dodds and Sammy will be trying to scupper this as well.
Donaldson could sell this as a win, but he lacks backbone and will need to read the room as patience is running out on the DUP with the NHS in freefall and the education sector looking at a swathe of redundancies if more budget isn't secured for 2024.
If DUP / Shinners et all walked back into Stormont in the morning they would not have and never will have the competency (brains) to fix things. There is £2.5 billion carrot being dangled so why do the British Government not just give the money to the Civil Service, who are currently running the country, and let them get on with things. When it comes to fiscal management our elected representatives are to often blinded by their political alleigances when it comes to the allocation of public money whether it be Irish Language, bonfires, housing and the slush fund of all slush funds the 'community' groups. Putting money towards Irish Language / bonfires scores brownie points with their core vote and they would far rather do this than put their heads together to see what needs to be done to have for example prevent Causeway Hospital maternity being relocated to Antrim or ensuring Daisy Hill and SWAH are able to offer a better service than they currently are. If they cant wrap a tricolour or union jack around it they don't give a f@@k.
What's the Irish language got to do with anything?
I think his point is that it's not one bit important in the grand scheme of things, has been a major issue that's been heavily focused on but whether it was implemented or not really doesn't positively impact the country as a whole in real terms.
Quote from: nrico2006 on December 17, 2023, 09:22:14 AMQuote from: marty34 on December 15, 2023, 09:28:28 PMQuote from: LC on December 15, 2023, 02:06:51 PMQuote from: johnnycool on December 15, 2023, 12:21:09 PMQuote from: tbrick18 on December 15, 2023, 11:23:02 AMDUP party officers meeting today/tonight to discuss the current negotiations.
Are they about to go back into Stormont?
Bryson in full flow, time they ignored that bollox but the loyalist "stakeholders" and the OO will also have their say, yet they still get on their high horse over "SF/IRA"!!!
Dodds and Sammy will be trying to scupper this as well.
Donaldson could sell this as a win, but he lacks backbone and will need to read the room as patience is running out on the DUP with the NHS in freefall and the education sector looking at a swathe of redundancies if more budget isn't secured for 2024.
If DUP / Shinners et all walked back into Stormont in the morning they would not have and never will have the competency (brains) to fix things. There is £2.5 billion carrot being dangled so why do the British Government not just give the money to the Civil Service, who are currently running the country, and let them get on with things. When it comes to fiscal management our elected representatives are to often blinded by their political alleigances when it comes to the allocation of public money whether it be Irish Language, bonfires, housing and the slush fund of all slush funds the 'community' groups. Putting money towards Irish Language / bonfires scores brownie points with their core vote and they would far rather do this than put their heads together to see what needs to be done to have for example prevent Causeway Hospital maternity being relocated to Antrim or ensuring Daisy Hill and SWAH are able to offer a better service than they currently are. If they cant wrap a tricolour or union jack around it they don't give a f@@k.
What's the Irish language got to do with anything?
I think his point is that it's not one bit important in the grand scheme of things, has been a major issue that's been heavily focused on but whether it was implemented or not really doesn't positively impact the country as a whole in real terms.
Could not have put it better myself nrico.
Nothing against the Irish Language but access to a decent healthcare service will always be a greater benefit, and I would like to think more important for the majority of people, than if the local road signs are in Irish or not.
Quote from: LC on December 17, 2023, 11:08:15 AMNothing against the Irish Language but access to a decent healthcare service will always be a greater benefit, and I would like to think more important for the majority of people, than if the local road signs are in Irish or not.
The two things are not in conflict at all, we should have both.
Quote from: armaghniac on December 17, 2023, 11:18:48 AMQuote from: LC on December 17, 2023, 11:08:15 AMNothing against the Irish Language but access to a decent healthcare service will always be a greater benefit, and I would like to think more important for the majority of people, than if the local road signs are in Irish or not.
The two things are not in conflict at all, we should have both.
In the current economic climate of course they are in conflict. I know from my side, if it was a choice between ten more nurses in the NHS in the province or every sign in Irish it's a no brainer as far as I'm concerned.
Quote from: TabClear on December 17, 2023, 11:54:00 AMQuote from: armaghniac on December 17, 2023, 11:18:48 AMQuote from: LC on December 17, 2023, 11:08:15 AMNothing against the Irish Language but access to a decent healthcare service will always be a greater benefit, and I would like to think more important for the majority of people, than if the local road signs are in Irish or not.
The two things are not in conflict at all, we should have both.
In the current economic climate of course they are in conflict. I know from my side, if it was a choice between ten more nurses in the NHS in the province or every sign in Irish it's a no brainer as far as I'm concerned.
This is a false dichotomy, nobody is proposing wholesale erection of signs in Irish, only that they might be replaced in due course as they need to. The only waste of money in relation to Irish is these "consultations" that allow anti Irish sentiments to determine public policy.
If you examined all public expenditure in NI with a view to diverting more funds to the NHS then there are plenty of areas to look at.
'Stop the DUP sellout' signs starting to appear overnight in DUP strongholds. The stakeholders know whats coming this week and they want to threaten the DUP into 'standing firm'
Quote from: LC on December 17, 2023, 11:08:15 AMQuote from: nrico2006 on December 17, 2023, 09:22:14 AMQuote from: marty34 on December 15, 2023, 09:28:28 PMQuote from: LC on December 15, 2023, 02:06:51 PMQuote from: johnnycool on December 15, 2023, 12:21:09 PMQuote from: tbrick18 on December 15, 2023, 11:23:02 AMDUP party officers meeting today/tonight to discuss the current negotiations.
Are they about to go back into Stormont?
Bryson in full flow, time they ignored that bollox but the loyalist "stakeholders" and the OO will also have their say, yet they still get on their high horse over "SF/IRA"!!!
Dodds and Sammy will be trying to scupper this as well.
Donaldson could sell this as a win, but he lacks backbone and will need to read the room as patience is running out on the DUP with the NHS in freefall and the education sector looking at a swathe of redundancies if more budget isn't secured for 2024.
If DUP / Shinners et all walked back into Stormont in the morning they would not have and never will have the competency (brains) to fix things. There is £2.5 billion carrot being dangled so why do the British Government not just give the money to the Civil Service, who are currently running the country, and let them get on with things. When it comes to fiscal management our elected representatives are to often blinded by their political alleigances when it comes to the allocation of public money whether it be Irish Language, bonfires, housing and the slush fund of all slush funds the 'community' groups. Putting money towards Irish Language / bonfires scores brownie points with their core vote and they would far rather do this than put their heads together to see what needs to be done to have for example prevent Causeway Hospital maternity being relocated to Antrim or ensuring Daisy Hill and SWAH are able to offer a better service than they currently are. If they cant wrap a tricolour or union jack around it they don't give a f@@k.
What's the Irish language got to do with anything?
I think his point is that it's not one bit important in the grand scheme of things, has been a major issue that's been heavily focused on but whether it was implemented or not really doesn't positively impact the country as a whole in real terms.
Could not have put it better myself nrico.
Nothing against the Irish Language but access to a decent healthcare service will always be a greater benefit, and I would like to think more important for the majority of people, than if the local road signs are in Irish or not.
Nothing against the Irish language BUT.....
You can't pick and choose things. Health is the most important thing imo also but it doesn't work like that.
Where do you stop?
Don't fund cricket because it not that popular.
Don't fill potholes in Fermanagh because that's where the least people in the north live.
Where do you stop and who decides?
Funny you pick out the Irish language when you could pick out a 100 other things.
The Irish language has been discriminated against for hundreds of years. More recently by the unionist regime in the north.
Quote from: marty34 on December 17, 2023, 01:29:55 PMQuote from: LC on December 17, 2023, 11:08:15 AMQuote from: nrico2006 on December 17, 2023, 09:22:14 AMQuote from: marty34 on December 15, 2023, 09:28:28 PMQuote from: LC on December 15, 2023, 02:06:51 PMQuote from: johnnycool on December 15, 2023, 12:21:09 PMQuote from: tbrick18 on December 15, 2023, 11:23:02 AMDUP party officers meeting today/tonight to discuss the current negotiations.
Are they about to go back into Stormont?
Bryson in full flow, time they ignored that bollox but the loyalist "stakeholders" and the OO will also have their say, yet they still get on their high horse over "SF/IRA"!!!
Dodds and Sammy will be trying to scupper this as well.
Donaldson could sell this as a win, but he lacks backbone and will need to read the room as patience is running out on the DUP with the NHS in freefall and the education sector looking at a swathe of redundancies if more budget isn't secured for 2024.
If DUP / Shinners et all walked back into Stormont in the morning they would not have and never will have the competency (brains) to fix things. There is £2.5 billion carrot being dangled so why do the British Government not just give the money to the Civil Service, who are currently running the country, and let them get on with things. When it comes to fiscal management our elected representatives are to often blinded by their political alleigances when it comes to the allocation of public money whether it be Irish Language, bonfires, housing and the slush fund of all slush funds the 'community' groups. Putting money towards Irish Language / bonfires scores brownie points with their core vote and they would far rather do this than put their heads together to see what needs to be done to have for example prevent Causeway Hospital maternity being relocated to Antrim or ensuring Daisy Hill and SWAH are able to offer a better service than they currently are. If they cant wrap a tricolour or union jack around it they don't give a f@@k.
What's the Irish language got to do with anything?
I think his point is that it's not one bit important in the grand scheme of things, has been a major issue that's been heavily focused on but whether it was implemented or not really doesn't positively impact the country as a whole in real terms.
Could not have put it better myself nrico.
Nothing against the Irish Language but access to a decent healthcare service will always be a greater benefit, and I would like to think more important for the majority of people, than if the local road signs are in Irish or not.
Nothing against the Irish language BUT.....
You can't pick and choose things. Health is the most important thing imo also but it doesn't work like that.
Where do you stop?
Don't fund cricket because it not that popular.
Don't fill potholes in Fermanagh because that's where the least people in the north live.
Where do you stop and who decides?
Funny you pick out the Irish language when you could pick out a 100 other things.
The Irish language has been discriminated against for hundreds of years. More recently by the unionist regime in the north.
The Shinners have hijacked the Irish Language and have used it as a stick to ram down the throats of unionists at every opportunity. The IL Act was a real red line for SF a while back and M O'N was very vocal about it.......in English of course, dont recall her being interviewed on TG4 much.
Quote from: LC on December 17, 2023, 03:56:24 PMThe Shinners have hijacked the Irish Language and have used it as a stick to ram down the throats of unionists at every opportunity. The IL Act was a real red line for SF a while back and M O'N was very vocal about it.......in English of course, dont recall her being interviewed on TG4 much.
All the unionists had to do was agree and there was no longer an issue.
Quote from: armaghniac on December 17, 2023, 04:22:54 PMQuote from: LC on December 17, 2023, 03:56:24 PMThe Shinners have hijacked the Irish Language and have used it as a stick to ram down the throats of unionists at every opportunity. The IL Act was a real red line for SF a while back and M O'N was very vocal about it.......in English of course, dont recall her being interviewed on TG4 much.
All the unionists had to do was agree and there was no longer an issue.
SF knew fine rightly the DUP would not agree to it however it help feeds the narrative it is all their fault and not ours as to why things don't get sorted. The Shinners are a lot of things but they are not stupid.
Quote from: LC on December 17, 2023, 04:33:04 PMQuote from: armaghniac on December 17, 2023, 04:22:54 PMQuote from: LC on December 17, 2023, 03:56:24 PMThe Shinners have hijacked the Irish Language and have used it as a stick to ram down the throats of unionists at every opportunity. The IL Act was a real red line for SF a while back and M O'N was very vocal about it.......in English of course, dont recall her being interviewed on TG4 much.
All the unionists had to do was agree and there was no longer an issue.
SF knew fine rightly the DUP would not agree to it however it help feeds the narrative it is all their fault and not ours as to why things don't get sorted. The Shinners are a lot of things but they are not stupid.
There are things that should be done and they should be done whatever shit the DUP want to stir. It is 25 years after the GFA, this should all have been done 20 years ago and it has nothing to do with current shortfalls in the health service.
TUV admit to being behind intimidation posters outside DUP members office's. Unionism has never been more divided
Usually a dup stunt. Hard not to laugh.
Quote from: LC on December 17, 2023, 03:56:24 PMQuote from: marty34 on December 17, 2023, 01:29:55 PMQuote from: LC on December 17, 2023, 11:08:15 AMQuote from: nrico2006 on December 17, 2023, 09:22:14 AMQuote from: marty34 on December 15, 2023, 09:28:28 PMQuote from: LC on December 15, 2023, 02:06:51 PMQuote from: johnnycool on December 15, 2023, 12:21:09 PMQuote from: tbrick18 on December 15, 2023, 11:23:02 AMDUP party officers meeting today/tonight to discuss the current negotiations.
Are they about to go back into Stormont?
Bryson in full flow, time they ignored that bollox but the loyalist "stakeholders" and the OO will also have their say, yet they still get on their high horse over "SF/IRA"!!!
Dodds and Sammy will be trying to scupper this as well.
Donaldson could sell this as a win, but he lacks backbone and will need to read the room as patience is running out on the DUP with the NHS in freefall and the education sector looking at a swathe of redundancies if more budget isn't secured for 2024.
If DUP / Shinners et all walked back into Stormont in the morning they would not have and never will have the competency (brains) to fix things. There is £2.5 billion carrot being dangled so why do the British Government not just give the money to the Civil Service, who are currently running the country, and let them get on with things. When it comes to fiscal management our elected representatives are to often blinded by their political alleigances when it comes to the allocation of public money whether it be Irish Language, bonfires, housing and the slush fund of all slush funds the 'community' groups. Putting money towards Irish Language / bonfires scores brownie points with their core vote and they would far rather do this than put their heads together to see what needs to be done to have for example prevent Causeway Hospital maternity being relocated to Antrim or ensuring Daisy Hill and SWAH are able to offer a better service than they currently are. If they cant wrap a tricolour or union jack around it they don't give a f@@k.
What's the Irish language got to do with anything?
I think his point is that it's not one bit important in the grand scheme of things, has been a major issue that's been heavily focused on but whether it was implemented or not really doesn't positively impact the country as a whole in real terms.
Could not have put it better myself nrico.
Nothing against the Irish Language but access to a decent healthcare service will always be a greater benefit, and I would like to think more important for the majority of people, than if the local road signs are in Irish or not.
Nothing against the Irish language BUT.....
You can't pick and choose things. Health is the most important thing imo also but it doesn't work like that.
Where do you stop?
Don't fund cricket because it not that popular.
Don't fill potholes in Fermanagh because that's where the least people in the north live.
Where do you stop and who decides?
Funny you pick out the Irish language when you could pick out a 100 other things.
The Irish language has been discriminated against for hundreds of years. More recently by the unionist regime in the north.
The Shinners have hijacked the Irish Language and have used it as a stick to ram down the throats of unionists at every opportunity. The IL Act was a real red line for SF a while back and M O'N was very vocal about it.......in English of course, dont recall her being interviewed on TG4 much.
Are you sure you're not Jim Allister of the TUV?
For some reason you're doubling down on the Irish language (again) when I raised the point that you could bring up 100 more areas where money could be 'diverted' to the health service.
Quote from: Nanderson on December 17, 2023, 07:44:21 PMTUV admit to being behind intimidation posters outside DUP members office's. Unionism has never been more divided
I think the other 'loyalist stakeholders' now realise that the DUP are looking for a way to get back in again with their list of 7 unfulfilled and are turning up the heat on them.
Quote from: LC on December 17, 2023, 03:56:24 PMThe Shinners have hijacked the Irish Language and have used it as a stick to ram down the throats of unionists at every opportunity. The IL Act was a real red line for SF a while back and M O'N was very vocal about it.......in English of course, dont recall her being interviewed on TG4 much.
Is there a single argument re the Language Act that you haven't blindly taken from the TUV?? In response to the above and your previous posts on the topic:
1. A Language Act is a financial drop in the ocean. It never has been about a choice between funding the heath service and funding a Language Act. I'm going to give you the benefit of the doubt and suggest that you are just indulging in a bit of political point scoring and that you aren't really so stupid as to actually believe it's a choice of being able to fund one or the other.
2. How have SF "hijacked" the Irish Language and "rammed it down unionists throats"? By using it?? Is it your view that the sectarian intolerance of the indigenous Language of the place where we actually live should be not only tolerated but a actively facilitated?
3. A majority of parties and a majority of MLAs were in favour of an Irish Language Act, it was not just a SF policy.
4. An Irish Language Act does not involve road signs all being translated to Irish.
5. Does Michelle O'Neill her to be a fluent Irish speaker to believe that the language needs legislative protection in the area to which it is indigenous? By that logic, should only gay people have been allowed to lobby for marriage equality?
Quote from: marty34 on December 17, 2023, 08:49:04 PMQuote from: Nanderson on December 17, 2023, 07:44:21 PMTUV admit to being behind intimidation posters outside DUP members office's. Unionism has never been more divided
I think the other 'loyalist stakeholders' now realise that the DUP are looking for a way to get back in again with their list of 7 unfulfilled and are turning up the heat on them.
Get the popcorn
Quote from: marty34 on December 17, 2023, 08:45:27 PMQuote from: LC on December 17, 2023, 03:56:24 PMQuote from: marty34 on December 17, 2023, 01:29:55 PMQuote from: LC on December 17, 2023, 11:08:15 AMQuote from: nrico2006 on December 17, 2023, 09:22:14 AMQuote from: marty34 on December 15, 2023, 09:28:28 PMQuote from: LC on December 15, 2023, 02:06:51 PMQuote from: johnnycool on December 15, 2023, 12:21:09 PMQuote from: tbrick18 on December 15, 2023, 11:23:02 AMDUP party officers meeting today/tonight to discuss the current negotiations.
Are they about to go back into Stormont?
Bryson in full flow, time they ignored that bollox but the loyalist "stakeholders" and the OO will also have their say, yet they still get on their high horse over "SF/IRA"!!!
Dodds and Sammy will be trying to scupper this as well.
Donaldson could sell this as a win, but he lacks backbone and will need to read the room as patience is running out on the DUP with the NHS in freefall and the education sector looking at a swathe of redundancies if more budget isn't secured for 2024.
If DUP / Shinners et all walked back into Stormont in the morning they would not have and never will have the competency (brains) to fix things. There is £2.5 billion carrot being dangled so why do the British Government not just give the money to the Civil Service, who are currently running the country, and let them get on with things. When it comes to fiscal management our elected representatives are to often blinded by their political alleigances when it comes to the allocation of public money whether it be Irish Language, bonfires, housing and the slush fund of all slush funds the 'community' groups. Putting money towards Irish Language / bonfires scores brownie points with their core vote and they would far rather do this than put their heads together to see what needs to be done to have for example prevent Causeway Hospital maternity being relocated to Antrim or ensuring Daisy Hill and SWAH are able to offer a better service than they currently are. If they cant wrap a tricolour or union jack around it they don't give a f@@k.
What's the Irish language got to do with anything?
I think his point is that it's not one bit important in the grand scheme of things, has been a major issue that's been heavily focused on but whether it was implemented or not really doesn't positively impact the country as a whole in real terms.
Could not have put it better myself nrico.
Nothing against the Irish Language but access to a decent healthcare service will always be a greater benefit, and I would like to think more important for the majority of people, than if the local road signs are in Irish or not.
Nothing against the Irish language BUT.....
You can't pick and choose things. Health is the most important thing imo also but it doesn't work like that.
Where do you stop?
Don't fund cricket because it not that popular.
Don't fill potholes in Fermanagh because that's where the least people in the north live.
Where do you stop and who decides?
Funny you pick out the Irish language when you could pick out a 100 other things.
The Irish language has been discriminated against for hundreds of years. More recently by the unionist regime in the north.
The Shinners have hijacked the Irish Language and have used it as a stick to ram down the throats of unionists at every opportunity. The IL Act was a real red line for SF a while back and M O'N was very vocal about it.......in English of course, dont recall her being interviewed on TG4 much.
Are you sure you're not Jim Allister of the TUV?
For some reason you're doubling down on the Irish language (again) when I raised the point that you could bring up 100 more areas where money could be 'diverted' to the health service.
SF greatest achievement was forcing nurses to strike for the first time ever in Northern Ireland. Shamed them back in. The same scenes outside Hillsborough last week should do the same for the DUP.
Quote from: Snapchap on December 13, 2023, 05:45:56 PMQuote from: Eire90 on December 13, 2023, 05:36:58 PMsinn fein and dup wiping whatsapps messages but aye sinn fein and dup are good people.
Anyone wanna explain this "story" to Eire90?
No point, he will believe what suits.
Irish Language is dead. Complete waste of effort and resources trying to do anything about it.
Quote from: nrico2006 on December 18, 2023, 05:41:10 PMIrish Language is dead. Complete waste of effort and resources trying to do anything about it.
That statement is complete and utter nonsense.
Quote from: nrico2006 on December 18, 2023, 05:41:10 PMIrish Language is dead. Complete waste of effort and resources trying to do anything about it.
Imagine if the Israelis had said that back in 1948
SOS has put the ball firmly in to the DUP court.
Going to be hard to stage manage saying NO to £3.3bn including public sector pay rises, in the middle of a Cost of Living crisis.
Quote from: NAG1 on December 19, 2023, 12:52:36 PMSOS has put the ball firmly in to the DUP court.
Going to be hard to stage manage saying NO to £3.3bn including public sector pay rises, in the middle of a Cost of Living crisis.
They'll do it. And their supporters will lap it up.
Some jump from the 2.5 or whatever it was offered last week.
Quote from: Armagh18 on December 19, 2023, 12:57:38 PMQuote from: NAG1 on December 19, 2023, 12:52:36 PMSOS has put the ball firmly in to the DUP court.
Going to be hard to stage manage saying NO to £3.3bn including public sector pay rises, in the middle of a Cost of Living crisis.
They'll do it. And their supporters will lap it up.
Some jump from the 2.5 or whatever it was offered last week.
I fear they will too, but when you are struggling to pay your bills and you are waiting on that extra income it might be a harder sell. But I suppose a good portion of their voters don't really have to worry about those sorts of things.
Think there are too many middle of the road unionists who work in the public sector that would deflect if pay increases aren't implemented next year. They would definitely be badly hit imo. There will be a % who won't care regardless of how they're hit in the pocket. But there is still a sizeable % (on both sides it should be said) who will vote with the £. If these people are being directly impacted financially by the DUP boycott then many will find it acceptable to vote UUP instead.
Here's hoping we don't get to that and the DUP realise they can't win going against the TUV. They have to accept they have lost that section. But start trying to win votes from the Alliance party and being realistic. And get back into government.
The NO brigade would rather go back to the troubles and have soldiers on the streets, the RUC, UDR etc.....take a few casualties
to keep stoking tensions..... not a forward looking mind between them.
I know people have been saying for years that schools have failed them but it is really showing now!
Hopefully they see the light. But wouldn't be holding my breath. How bitter would you have to be to turn down all that money over not wanting a SF First Minister.
Quote from: The Trap on December 19, 2023, 01:10:09 PMThe NO brigade would rather go back to the troubles and have soldiers on the streets, the RUC, UDR etc.....take a few casualties
to keep stoking tensions..... not a forward looking mind between them.
I know people have been saying for years that schools have failed them but it is really showing now!
100% right.
Quote from: NAG1 on December 19, 2023, 12:52:36 PMSOS has put the ball firmly in to the DUP court.
Going to be hard to stage manage saying NO to £3.3bn including public sector pay rises, in the middle of a Cost of Living crisis.
The whole thing could have been sorted a long time ago. Their £55k basic salary , taken from all DUP members in Feb 2022 for refusing to go into the executive .
Sea borders /frameworks etc , would have been quickly forgotten by Jeffrey and Co when they realise their big wages were suddenly stopped.
Quote from: The Trap on December 19, 2023, 01:10:09 PMThe NO brigade would rather go back to the troubles and have soldiers on the streets, the RUC, UDR etc.....take a few casualties
to keep stoking tensions..... not a forward looking mind between them.
I know people have been saying for years that schools have failed them but it is really showing now!
There was an absolute dose on Talkback earlier who said he didn't want a local government or a peace process because "Republicans get everything and Unionists get naffin".
When you are accustomed to privilege equality feels like oppression.
I'm sceptical if they'll go back in. CHH has dealt every card he has and the DUP are still not satisfied. I don't think they want a Catholic girl to be FM of NI.
I think that is pretty much it. They have backed themselves into a corner here. If they go back they will lose hardcode voters which is their bread and butter. If they don't they will probably lose more moderate voters.
It's a mess all of their own doing and hopefully it is the end of them as a serious party. (They never were a serious party but unfortunately they're a party that has to be taken seriously >:( )
Quote from: imtommygunn on December 19, 2023, 03:48:37 PMI think that is pretty much it. They have backed themselves into a corner here. If they go back they will lose hardcode voters which is their bread and butter. If they don't they will probably lose more moderate voters.
It's a mess all of their own doing and hopefully it is the end of them as a serious party. (They never were a serious party but unfortunately they're a party that has to be taken seriously >:( )
To me, that is one of the most depressing aspects of all this - that there are as many hardcore voters out there who support this nonsense that the likes of the DUP have to pander to. Depressing as f**k.
Quote from: 93-DY-SAM on December 19, 2023, 04:02:28 PMQuote from: imtommygunn on December 19, 2023, 03:48:37 PMI think that is pretty much it. They have backed themselves into a corner here. If they go back they will lose hardcode voters which is their bread and butter. If they don't they will probably lose more moderate voters.
It's a mess all of their own doing and hopefully it is the end of them as a serious party. (They never were a serious party but unfortunately they're a party that has to be taken seriously >:( )
To me, that is one of the most depressing aspects of all this - that there are as many hardcore voters out there who support this nonsense that the likes of the DUP have to pander to. Depressing as f**k.
Problem is this hardcore element will vote for them regardless, are at two different ends of the spectrum socially.
One are the hardcore loyalists in Carrick, Antrim and Ards and the like who will claim their benefits regardless so doesnt affect them. The other are the well off older generation who can have their principles because they can afford them, final salary pensions, houses paid off etc.
It's the group in the middle who are being impacted who should have the say, but will they?!
Quote from: NAG1 on December 19, 2023, 04:07:12 PMQuote from: 93-DY-SAM on December 19, 2023, 04:02:28 PMQuote from: imtommygunn on December 19, 2023, 03:48:37 PMI think that is pretty much it. They have backed themselves into a corner here. If they go back they will lose hardcode voters which is their bread and butter. If they don't they will probably lose more moderate voters.
It's a mess all of their own doing and hopefully it is the end of them as a serious party. (They never were a serious party but unfortunately they're a party that has to be taken seriously >:( )
To me, that is one of the most depressing aspects of all this - that there are as many hardcore voters out there who support this nonsense that the likes of the DUP have to pander to. Depressing as f**k.
Problem is this hardcore element will vote for them regardless, are at two different ends of the spectrum socially.
One are the hardcore loyalists in Carrick, Antrim and Ards and the like who will claim their benefits regardless so doesnt affect them. The other are the well off older generation who can have their principles because they can afford them, final salary pensions, houses paid off etc.
It's the group in the middle who are being impacted who should have the say, but will they?!
18th Jan is a massive day of co-ordinated strike action with the unions. We'll see if it makes a difference but so far the unions are directing their anger at CHH and not the DUP.
Quote from: trailer on December 19, 2023, 04:10:12 PMQuote from: NAG1 on December 19, 2023, 04:07:12 PMQuote from: 93-DY-SAM on December 19, 2023, 04:02:28 PMQuote from: imtommygunn on December 19, 2023, 03:48:37 PMI think that is pretty much it. They have backed themselves into a corner here. If they go back they will lose hardcode voters which is their bread and butter. If they don't they will probably lose more moderate voters.
It's a mess all of their own doing and hopefully it is the end of them as a serious party. (They never were a serious party but unfortunately they're a party that has to be taken seriously >:( )
To me, that is one of the most depressing aspects of all this - that there are as many hardcore voters out there who support this nonsense that the likes of the DUP have to pander to. Depressing as f**k.
Problem is this hardcore element will vote for them regardless, are at two different ends of the spectrum socially.
One are the hardcore loyalists in Carrick, Antrim and Ards and the like who will claim their benefits regardless so doesnt affect them. The other are the well off older generation who can have their principles because they can afford them, final salary pensions, houses paid off etc.
It's the group in the middle who are being impacted who should have the say, but will they?!
18th Jan is a massive day of co-ordinated strike action but the unions. We'll see if it makes a difference but so far the unions are directing their anger at CHH and not the DUP.
Bar telling the DUP to go and jump and letting Michelle in with Naomi Long as her deputy I'm not sure what else he's meant to do in fairness to him.
Madness that it's taken so long to get to this point though.
Presumably it is just a once off. The UK government and bank of England created inflation so it is fair for them to pay. The GFA needs to be revised. It is too easy to hijack, leaving the North without an Assembly.
Jeff saying he needs the deal to "restore NI's place in the UK".
What does that mean ffs. Should a decent interviewer not say to him that no one is threatening it?
Brits should threaten him with a border poll if he doesn't go back in. And one a year every year until Stormont is back or it passes.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-67759418
The Scots are £1.5b in the red and they have to sort it themselves and make the hard / unpopular calls to fix it, they must look at NI and go wtf.
Re the hard calls the Scottish Government are having to make even if the British Government gave full authority on all fiscal matters to Stormont no minister would have the balls to make decisions like this. Folks on the hill want to have power and control but not make hard calls.
One thing for sure is that our rates are going to take a fair jump. Strap yourselves in
Quote from: Hereiam on December 20, 2023, 12:31:09 AMOne thing for sure is that our rates are going to take a fair jump. Strap yourselves in
I actually wouldn't mind rates going up if services improved. But hiking rates and taxes in general when most roads are full of potholes, waiting lists are years long, school buildings are falling down, almost every union is striking and Lough Neagh resembles a sink someone has been sick in at a bad NYE party is going to be hard to stomach.
Quote from: Hereiam on December 20, 2023, 12:31:09 AMOne thing for sure is that our rates are going to take a fair jump. Strap yourselves in
some transparency on expenditure would be welcome
Quote from: trailer on December 20, 2023, 08:39:00 AMQuote from: Hereiam on December 20, 2023, 12:31:09 AMOne thing for sure is that our rates are going to take a fair jump. Strap yourselves in
I actually wouldn't mind rates going up if services improved. But hiking rates and taxes in general when most roads are full of potholes, waiting lists are years long, school buildings are falling down, almost every union is striking and Lough Neagh resembles a sink someone has been sick in at a bad NYE party is going to be hard to stomach.
It's always ordinary folk who suffer though isn't it? Services won't. get any better when they take more money off people.
Here's a starting place though. A salary of £55,000 x 25 DUP MLA's = £1,375,000. Nearly double that considering it's been 2 years since they sat .
That's a lot of potholes fixed , and nurses wages or classroom assistants.
That Donaldson is a hostage to extreme loyalists both within the DUP and outside. I've said it before and it's worth repeating, I learned a long time ago that you cannot underestimate the amount of self inflicted harm hardline unionists will endure rather than be seen to give even an inch. Time to close Stormont for good and get joint authority on the go.
I will never understand why someone doesn't stop their salaries straight away when these boycotts happen.
Quote from: nrico2006 on December 20, 2023, 11:05:11 AMI will never understand why someone doesn't stop their salaries straight away when these boycotts happen.
They are reduced by 27% at the minute. But if they don't go in this time the whole assembly needs binned. It's clearly not workable.
Quote from: trailer on December 20, 2023, 11:21:58 AMQuote from: nrico2006 on December 20, 2023, 11:05:11 AMI will never understand why someone doesn't stop their salaries straight away when these boycotts happen.
They are reduced by 27% at the minute. But if they don't go in this time the whole assembly needs binned. It's clearly not workable.
Sooner the better. It's a joke shop. Michelle seems the caring type and a decent spud, but the MLAs aren't capable of making the big decisions. They are mostly either incompetent or too twisted to work together.
Quote from: trailer on December 20, 2023, 11:21:58 AMQuote from: nrico2006 on December 20, 2023, 11:05:11 AMI will never understand why someone doesn't stop their salaries straight away when these boycotts happen.
They are reduced by 27% at the minute. But if they don't go in this time the whole assembly needs binned. It's clearly not workable.
Snipping a bit off was never going to make a difference. We need a system where the best/most intelligent people run the country, not the ones who simply do the best in elections.
I don't think anywhere in the world has that...
Quote from: nrico2006 on December 20, 2023, 12:22:58 PMQuote from: trailer on December 20, 2023, 11:21:58 AMQuote from: nrico2006 on December 20, 2023, 11:05:11 AMI will never understand why someone doesn't stop their salaries straight away when these boycotts happen.
They are reduced by 27% at the minute. But if they don't go in this time the whole assembly needs binned. It's clearly not workable.
Snipping a bit off was never going to make a difference. We need a system where the best/most intelligent people run the country, not the ones who simply do the best in elections.
Unfortunately the best and brightest never (or very very rarely) end up in politics and even more unfortunately the corrupt and incompetent more often than not do.
Quote from: LC on December 19, 2023, 06:41:39 PMhttps://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-67759418
The Scots are £1.5b in the red and they have to sort it themselves and make the hard / unpopular calls to fix it, they must look at NI and go wtf.
Re the hard calls the Scottish Government are having to make even if the British Government gave full authority on all fiscal matters to Stormont no minister would have the balls to make decisions like this. Folks on the hill want to have power and control but not make hard calls.
Has GB News or Talk TV discussed this yet? I wonder what they make of the two different approaches.
Conservatives forcing Jeffrey and the gang further and further into the corner they will struggle to get out of;
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-67950962
I am sure they would hand over the 6 counties in the morning if they could get away with it.
DUP'ers voting on returning to Stormont and is apparently coming down to one or two votes either way..
Quote from: Armagh18 on January 19, 2024, 10:04:50 AMDUP'ers voting on returning to Stormont and is apparently coming down to one or two votes either way..
It'll be a damp squib because they all have their noses in the trough. Jeffrey will get it through if/when he has the guts to do it, and there'll be very few big names break away. That's my prediction.
And if they don't, Michelle was right, they can't bear to see a nationalist First Minister.
Quote from: Sportacus on January 19, 2024, 01:07:47 PMQuote from: Armagh18 on January 19, 2024, 10:04:50 AMDUP'ers voting on returning to Stormont and is apparently coming down to one or two votes either way..
It'll be a damp squib because they all have their noses in the trough. Jeffrey will get it through if/when he has the guts to do it, and there'll be very few big names break away. That's my prediction.
And if they don't, Michelle was right, they can't bear to see a nationalist First Minister.
It's a strange one.
In my opinion, they were never going to get their 7 tests...it was always a gamble but one the DUP took to pacify the Sammy Wilson type persona in the DUP. They probably thought they'd get enough concessions to get them onside at some point, but CHH and the Tory government have basically said FU. Best we'll do is give you a few quid to smooth the return.
Realisation has hit in, the strike has shown them that they are losing the people they were confident they had in election terms. They probably still thought CHH would pay the money out for the public sector workers and the strike would be cancelled and they'd be off the hook, but that hasnt happened and now the panic is on.
Lesser of two evils, try to protect the vote by getting them the money as that's what's more important to people than the windsor framework. Yet, there's still the DUP right wingers who would do anything rather than risk their precious union or sit in Stormount with SF as the First Minister - even if that meant direct rule and no assembly. The bigotry is so rife in them.
If they go back in....it will probably be followed by another split in the DUP or another leadership contest (or maybe both). And if that happens, they could boycott it again in a very short period of time.
If they don't go back in....then we're at a standstill. Westminster don't care as there's no votes for them over here. The anti-windsor agreement element of the dup are happy enough as they are protecting the union. The people here suffer more and more in terms of health, education, public services in general and pay. But the union is protected. A minority party with a declining minority electorate basically holding everyone to ransom for their narrow minded views.
It all shows that the only thing the DUP are interested in is the party, not the people.
If I was CHH, I'd call the border poll. I don't see any future here with a DUP who refuse to accept the democratic views of the majority unless it suits them.
The practical economic benefits of a UI are now far outweighing any romantic views of a UI or British Union, in my opinion.
I can see big Jeffrey leaving the DUP , rather than do a deal or to be seen to be backing down on the WF. So he will be safe from getting his arse thrown on the bonfire every July.
The DUP as a party will then slip back to Stormont , then appoint a leader after so no leader gets the blame for doing the deal.
Workers will get some sort of a pay rise . But the DUP will walk out again within weeks over something stupid, like the milk containers for the tea in Stormont have green lids
Don't get this about if the DUP agreed to go back in then the pay disputes would be sorted. I have no idea what the offer is for me as a schoolmaster to cease industrial action. The negotiations have yet to begin as far as I am concerned so the industrial action may well continue long after if and when Stormont returns.
Quote from: tbrick18 on January 19, 2024, 01:28:05 PMIt's a strange one.
In my opinion, they were never going to get their 7 tests...it was always a gamble but one the DUP took to pacify the Sammy Wilson type persona in the DUP. They probably thought they'd get enough concessions to get them onside at some point, but CHH and the Tory government have basically said FU. Best we'll do is give you a few quid to smooth the return.
Realisation has hit in, the strike has shown them that they are losing the people they were confident they had in election terms. They probably still thought CHH would pay the money out for the public sector workers and the strike would be cancelled and they'd be off the hook, but that hasnt happened and now the panic is on.
In the real world, the Tories did not say FU, there were quite a few practical measures introduced to the Protocol, as much as was possible while NI remained in the Single Market and GB did not. But a bit like Theresa May, who made a genuine effort to give them something, Sunak found that these people have no interest in the real world.
Quote from: Jim Bob on January 19, 2024, 03:49:07 PMDon't get this about if the DUP agreed to go back in then the pay disputes would be sorted. I have no idea what the offer is for me as a schoolmaster to cease industrial action. The negotiations have yet to begin as far as I am concerned so the industrial action may well continue long after if and when Stormont returns.
That's a fair point. I'd assumed there was a figure that the unions are asking for and the financial settlement from Westminster included funds to meet that figure so that there is pay parity across the UK.
Perhaps that's not the case.
Does this money go away if the DUP do not go back in. Carmel Gates made them sound like the heroes of the hour on BBC last night, she wasn't going to criticise them in case they were holding out for more money.
Quote from: weareros on January 19, 2024, 04:33:28 PMDoes this money go away if the DUP do not go back in. Carmel Gates made them sound like the heroes of the hour on BBC last night, she wasn't going to criticise them in case they were holding out for more money.
The reluctance of unions to call out the DUP is yet more evidence that they're pretty useless organisations. Holding out for more dough is a recipe for never going back..."'cause they'll offer us more next week"
Quote from: Pub Bore on January 19, 2024, 05:12:24 PMQuote from: weareros on January 19, 2024, 04:33:28 PMDoes this money go away if the DUP do not go back in. Carmel Gates made them sound like the heroes of the hour on BBC last night, she wasn't going to criticise them in case they were holding out for more money.
The reluctance of unions to call out the DUP is yet more evidence that they're pretty useless organisations. Holding out for more dough is a recipe for never going back..."'cause they'll offer us more next week"
I think it's clear CHH did cough up more dough for pay disputes and it's tied to the DUP going back into Stormont.
If the DUP don't go back then that money goes back to whitehall evidently.
Jeffrey still having splinters on the auld arse by the looks of it.
I think the DUP are spooked by the big strike yesterday. This 'meeting' has come very quick after the lull last week.
There was a vox pox on Evening Extra for the Shankill Road and it was about 3/4 saying to the DUP to get back to work.
On the other side you have the TUV who'll be turning the screw.
Interesting stuff.
On Thursday the DUP get walloped by strikers and a resignation so on Friday they change the narrative to take away the negative headlines.......if they don't go back they should br further vilified for taking publicity away from the strikers. They have no shame!
A f**king TUV Party Political broadcast was on straight after the BBCNI news tonight, WTF was that about? Thought they were only allowed on when elections were imminent. Seemed very odd to me, haven't seen any other party's recently 🤔
Quote from: bennydorano on January 19, 2024, 08:56:47 PMA f**king TUV Party Political broadcast was on straight after the BBCNI news tonight, WTF was that about? Thought they were only allowed on when elections were imminent. Seemed very odd to me, haven't seen any other party's recently 🤔
I'm pretty sure i've seen that one before. TUV have contacts in BBC now so i'd say big Jim dipped into the petty cash to get it pushed on at prime time after the news broke this morning
no decision what a joke i knew it was all pantomine shame on media for giving them publicity
The media should have said aye your having a wee meeting are you ok f off
Quote from: bennydorano on January 19, 2024, 08:56:47 PMA f**king TUV Party Political broadcast was on straight after the BBCNI news tonight, WTF was that about? Thought they were only allowed on when elections were imminent. Seemed very odd to me, haven't seen any other party's recently 🤔
But did you watch it? Christ I laughed. Fantastic photoshop skills with the North turning into a tricolour.
It was like a parody.
It was poor quality stuff. Not very slick.
How do they get a party political broadcast on at this time of year?
Seems wee Jeff hasn't got enough support.
Quote from: marty34 on January 19, 2024, 10:45:18 PMIt was poor quality stuff. Not very slick.
How do they get a party political broadcast on at this time of year?
Seems wee Jeff hasn't got enough support.
Must have been a lot of arm bending over the weekend, from what I have seen and read it is very close within the party. Hilary Benn's contribution in the HoC the other day will have made them sit up and think (if that is possible) new government same position.
Jon Tonge, who is an expert on the DUP has basically said a DUP faction is aligning with the TUV and Bryson followers to stop the DUP going into power sharing. Debunking Sam McBrides contention that the DUP decision is not about a SF First Minister. That is exactly what it is about. Time for Nationalists to give up on Stormont.
Quote from: Applesisapples on January 22, 2024, 11:45:35 AMJon Tonge, who is an expert on the DUP has basically said a DUP faction is aligning with the TUV and Bryson followers to stop the DUP going into power sharing. Debunking Sam McBrides contention that the DUP decision is not about a SF First Minister. That is exactly what it is about. Time for Nationalists to give up on Stormont.
Of course it is about a SF first minister, at least for some within the party. Note their MPs didn't withdraw their services from Westminster.
Getting sick and weary of the column inches and round the clock media coverage given over to the DUP circus, if you came down from Mars you would think that nobody else existed in this place.
Quote from: Applesisapples on January 22, 2024, 11:45:35 AMJon Tonge, who is an expert on the DUP has basically said a DUP faction is aligning with the TUV and Bryson followers to stop the DUP going into power sharing. Debunking Sam McBrides contention that the DUP decision is not about a SF First Minister. That is exactly what it is about. Time for Nationalists to give up on Stormont.
Mc Bride's article was pure waffle.
Saying it was nothing to do with a SF, nationalist republican woman as head of the north.
The DUP could have penned the article. Doing the bidding for the DUP.
Everybody knows that's the reason for it.
A lot of questions asked about how the shock Jock was able to call into his own show with a bit of gossip that probably derailed wee Jeffreys attempt to push through a return to Stormont.
Shock Jock as been replaced by Holly Hamilton the last few weeks allegedly but was well enough to call in with his wee titbit
Quote from: johnnycool on January 22, 2024, 03:22:24 PMA lot of questions asked about how the shock Jock was able to call into his own show with a bit of gossip that probably derailed wee Jeffreys attempt to push through a return to Stormont.
Shock Jock as been replaced by Holly Hamilton the last few weeks allegedly but was well enough to call in with his wee titbit
I think he was on holidays in the States
Quote from: bogball88 on January 22, 2024, 03:40:06 PMQuote from: johnnycool on January 22, 2024, 03:22:24 PMA lot of questions asked about how the shock Jock was able to call into his own show with a bit of gossip that probably derailed wee Jeffreys attempt to push through a return to Stormont.
Shock Jock as been replaced by Holly Hamilton the last few weeks allegedly but was well enough to call in with his wee titbit
I think he was on holidays in the States
Minimum 5 hours behind, so the shock jock got out of his bed at 4 or 5 in the morning to scupper Donaldsons attempt to get Stormont up and running...
Donaldson needs to grow a set all the same, but the amplification of a minority of hardliners by Nolan isn't helping.
Quote from: johnnycool on January 22, 2024, 03:48:49 PMQuote from: bogball88 on January 22, 2024, 03:40:06 PMQuote from: johnnycool on January 22, 2024, 03:22:24 PMA lot of questions asked about how the shock Jock was able to call into his own show with a bit of gossip that probably derailed wee Jeffreys attempt to push through a return to Stormont.
Shock Jock as been replaced by Holly Hamilton the last few weeks allegedly but was well enough to call in with his wee titbit
I think he was on holidays in the States
Minimum 5 hours behind, so the shock jock got out of his bed at 4 or 5 in the morning to scupper Donaldsons attempt to get Stormont up and running...
Donaldson needs to grow a set all the same, but the amplification of a minority of hardliners by Nolan isn't helping.
How he is getting away with this on license fee payers money is unbelievable. It must go right to the top in BBC NI but then when you see who is leading it there would be no surprise there.
Would the Good Friday Agreement have happened with Nolan about?
I don't think so... This stuff further highlights it. Things being even slightly harmonious doesn't suit people like this.
It's Jeffrey versus Dodds.
Quote from: Sportacus on January 22, 2024, 06:18:56 PMIt's Jeffrey versus Dodds.
Looks like Jeffrey finally grew a set of balls today.
Watching the expression of junior sitting behind him today was equally funny yet very telling. He couldn't hide his disdain for Donaldson and I think it's a safe bet that it's him who has been leaking stuff to the media. Pantomime stuff from the DUP.
Jeffrey showing the pressure.
Jesus he is a dose.
Brexit is a culture war and the the DUP is a culture war and then the TUV is a culture war against the DUP. It is all so weird.
So Jeffrey was threatened , by an unnamed person(s). Very convenient ::)
So now he's reduced the heat on himself and Colm Eastwood even coming out in support of him.
He should have turned on the tears as well. That would have put the tin hat on it
Personally Donaldson has wanted to return to Stormont for a long while, but it's not just his call.
The TUV will prosper. UUP -> DUP - > TUV, that's the direction of travel, black, blacker, blackest
Quote from: AustinPowers on January 24, 2024, 06:27:26 PMSo Jeffrey was threatened , by an unnamed person(s). Very convenient ::)
So now he's reduced the heat on himself and Colm Eastwood even coming out in support of him.
He should have turned on the tears as well. That would have put the tin hat on it
Why do you find it so hard to believe dissident loyalists have been threatening him when you can see it on Twitter every day? Put your biased cynicism to one side and look at it objectively.
Quote from: RedHand88 on January 24, 2024, 07:39:48 PMQuote from: AustinPowers on January 24, 2024, 06:27:26 PMSo Jeffrey was threatened , by an unnamed person(s). Very convenient ::)
So now he's reduced the heat on himself and Colm Eastwood even coming out in support of him.
He should have turned on the tears as well. That would have put the tin hat on it
Why do you find it so hard to believe dissident loyalists have been threatening him when you can see it on Twitter every day? Put your biased cynicism to one side and look at it objectively.
Lie down with dogs and you'll get fleas...
Donaldson as much as anyone gave bin man, LCC and the OO too much credence at the start and led them down a blind alley with his 7 tests stuff.
He'll reap what he sowed.
Quote from: RedHand88 on January 24, 2024, 07:39:48 PMQuote from: AustinPowers on January 24, 2024, 06:27:26 PMSo Jeffrey was threatened , by an unnamed person(s). Very convenient ::)
So now he's reduced the heat on himself and Colm Eastwood even coming out in support of him.
He should have turned on the tears as well. That would have put the tin hat on it
Why do you find it so hard to believe dissident loyalists have been threatening him when you can see it on Twitter every day? Put your biased cynicism to one side and look at it objectively.
I'm sure he has been abused and threatened on Twitter/Facebook etc, just like every other politician. It comes with the territory. (That doesn't mean i think it's right btw)
But why bring it up now though?
His party has refused to sit in Stormont for near 2 years , and suddenly he delivers this emotive speech, just as he's under the most pressure he's probably ever been, with tens of thousands of workers on his back.
Seems a bit too convenient to me.
Quote from: AustinPowers on January 24, 2024, 09:48:57 PMQuote from: RedHand88 on January 24, 2024, 07:39:48 PMQuote from: AustinPowers on January 24, 2024, 06:27:26 PMSo Jeffrey was threatened , by an unnamed person(s). Very convenient ::)
So now he's reduced the heat on himself and Colm Eastwood even coming out in support of him.
He should have turned on the tears as well. That would have put the tin hat on it
Why do you find it so hard to believe dissident loyalists have been threatening him when you can see it on Twitter every day? Put your biased cynicism to one side and look at it objectively.
I'm sure he has been abused and threatened on Twitter/Facebook etc, just like every other politician. It comes with the territory. (That doesn't mean i think it's right btw)
But why bring it up now though?
His party has refused to sit in Stormont for near 2 years , and suddenly he delivers this emotive speech, just as he's under the most pressure he's probably ever been, with tens of thousands of workers on his back.
Seems a bit too convenient to me.
Yeah. 0 sympathy for him.
He and his cronies have legitimised some fairly dubious voices. I still would say he was probably threatened. Horrible man but definitely between a rock and a hard place too.
He seems to have been comfort eating too.
Quote from: AustinPowers on January 24, 2024, 06:27:26 PMSo Jeffrey was threatened , by an unnamed person(s). Very convenient ::)
So now he's reduced the heat on himself and Colm Eastwood even coming out in support of him.
He should have turned on the tears as well. That would have put the tin hat on it
Threatened by an unknown person who, when he checked hadn't voted!
How can he check if someone voted? I thought that was anonymous?
Can't be an unknown person if he knows them!
Whole thing is a deflection....ironic give he said he wouldn't be deflected.
No sympathy for him, I don't condone threats, I mean the situation he and the dup are in. Its self made and we are all suffering for their party politics.
Quote from: tbrick18 on January 25, 2024, 08:28:04 AMQuote from: AustinPowers on January 24, 2024, 06:27:26 PMSo Jeffrey was threatened , by an unnamed person(s). Very convenient ::)
So now he's reduced the heat on himself and Colm Eastwood even coming out in support of him.
He should have turned on the tears as well. That would have put the tin hat on it
Threatened by an unknown person who, when he checked hadn't voted!
How can he check if someone voted? I thought that was anonymous?
Can't be an unknown person if he knows them!
Whole thing is a deflection....ironic give he said he wouldn't be deflected.
No sympathy for him, I don't condone threats, I mean the situation he and the dup are in. Its self made and we are all suffering for their party politics.
Think most parties have a list of eligible voters and tick it off on election day when they see the person at voting stations.
Quote from: tbrick18 on January 25, 2024, 08:28:04 AMQuote from: AustinPowers on January 24, 2024, 06:27:26 PMSo Jeffrey was threatened , by an unnamed person(s). Very convenient ::)
So now he's reduced the heat on himself and Colm Eastwood even coming out in support of him.
He should have turned on the tears as well. That would have put the tin hat on it
Threatened by an unknown person who, when he checked hadn't voted!
How can he check if someone voted? I thought that was anonymous?
Can't be an unknown person if he knows them!
Whole thing is a deflection....ironic give he said he wouldn't be deflected.
No sympathy for him, I don't condone threats, I mean the situation he and the dup are in. Its self made and we are all suffering for their party politics.
Jeff did not say they were unknown people, it's possible he could have checked earlier online comments made. Wasn't it Donaldson who threatened Trimble back in the day?
I see he was spoofing about all the alterations to the protocol that he alone was able to negotiate.
I had to laugh at Allison Morris going on this morning how wee Jeff has stood up as a leader now after his pantomime performance in the common's, we now have had 3 DUP Politian's stand in the HOC blubbering like little babies and this is what we are to believe leadership looks like.
Quote from: tbrick18 on January 25, 2024, 08:28:04 AMQuote from: AustinPowers on January 24, 2024, 06:27:26 PMSo Jeffrey was threatened , by an unnamed person(s). Very convenient ::)
So now he's reduced the heat on himself and Colm Eastwood even coming out in support of him.
He should have turned on the tears as well. That would have put the tin hat on it
Threatened by an unknown person who, when he checked hadn't voted!
How can he check if someone voted? I thought that was anonymous?
Can't be an unknown person if he knows them!
Whole thing is a deflection....ironic give he said he wouldn't be deflected.
No sympathy for him, I don't condone threats, I mean the situation he and the dup are in. Its self made and we are all suffering for their party politics.
The person who didn't vote is wee Seamie I suspect. On the day of the election is was gurning as there was a Rangers game on that day and he was not able to vote, according to him, as he was away at the game. The references by wee Jeff and CCH to people on twitter is a clear shot at Bryson.
While I have little sympathy for Donaldson maybe he has grown a pair and publicly now has stood up to the back room bullies. Very pointed sitting in the HoC with all the DUP members in a row expect Junior sitting directly behind wee Jeff in the eye of the camera.
Quote from: Main Street on January 25, 2024, 09:10:07 AMQuote from: tbrick18 on January 25, 2024, 08:28:04 AMQuote from: AustinPowers on January 24, 2024, 06:27:26 PMSo Jeffrey was threatened , by an unnamed person(s). Very convenient ::)
So now he's reduced the heat on himself and Colm Eastwood even coming out in support of him.
He should have turned on the tears as well. That would have put the tin hat on it
Threatened by an unknown person who, when he checked hadn't voted!
How can he check if someone voted? I thought that was anonymous?
Can't be an unknown person if he knows them!
Whole thing is a deflection....ironic give he said he wouldn't be deflected.
No sympathy for him, I don't condone threats, I mean the situation he and the dup are in. Its self made and we are all suffering for their party politics.
Jeff did not say they were unknown people, it's possible he could have checked earlier online comments made. Wasn't it Donaldson who threatened Trimble back in the day?
I see he was spoofing about all the alterations to the protocol that he alone was able to negotiate.
My bad, I misread unnamed as unknown.
I still don't understand how he can check if someone voted.
He's full of it. Don't believe a word he says to be honest and I'm surprised so many have been taken in by the performance.
I was never a huge fan of SDLPs Eastwood, but he seriously went down in my estimations yesterday with how he responded. He's right to condemn threats of course, but good god.
Quote from: tbrick18 on January 25, 2024, 09:38:22 AMQuote from: Main Street on January 25, 2024, 09:10:07 AMQuote from: tbrick18 on January 25, 2024, 08:28:04 AMQuote from: AustinPowers on January 24, 2024, 06:27:26 PMSo Jeffrey was threatened , by an unnamed person(s). Very convenient ::)
So now he's reduced the heat on himself and Colm Eastwood even coming out in support of him.
He should have turned on the tears as well. That would have put the tin hat on it
Threatened by an unknown person who, when he checked hadn't voted!
How can he check if someone voted? I thought that was anonymous?
Can't be an unknown person if he knows them!
Whole thing is a deflection....ironic give he said he wouldn't be deflected.
No sympathy for him, I don't condone threats, I mean the situation he and the dup are in. Its self made and we are all suffering for their party politics.
Jeff did not say they were unknown people, it's possible he could have checked earlier online comments made. Wasn't it Donaldson who threatened Trimble back in the day?
I see he was spoofing about all the alterations to the protocol that he alone was able to negotiate.
My bad, I misread unnamed as unknown.
I still don't understand how he can check if someone voted.
He's full of it. Don't believe a word he says to be honest and I'm surprised so many have been taken in by the performance.
I was never a huge fan of SDLPs Eastwood, but he seriously went down in my estimations yesterday with how he responded. He's right to condemn threats of course, but good god.
You get checked off if you vote. Register can be viewed, just not who you voted for.
1 clown calling out 2 other clowns from the capital of their glorious union, imagining the shade of Jim Allister's face as he watched from home, it was very enjoyable.
Quote from: tbrick18 on January 25, 2024, 08:28:04 AMQuote from: AustinPowers on January 24, 2024, 06:27:26 PMSo Jeffrey was threatened , by an unnamed person(s). Very convenient ::)
So now he's reduced the heat on himself and Colm Eastwood even coming out in support of him.
He should have turned on the tears as well. That would have put the tin hat on it
Threatened by an unknown person who, when he checked hadn't voted!
How can he check if someone voted? I thought that was anonymous?
Can't be an unknown person if he knows them!
Whole thing is a deflection....ironic give he said he wouldn't be deflected.
No sympathy for him, I don't condone threats, I mean the situation he and the dup are in. Its self made and we are all suffering for their party politics.
Not at all, the party operative sitting in the polling station is marking names off as they vote. Nothing illegal about it, its allowed so long as they aren't looking over your shoulder obviously.
Also possible that the person isn't on the register (public information) in which case they would not have voted.
He said the person was not on the register and that is how he knew they did not vote.
Wee Jeff has stood side by side with these clowns for far too long legitimising them. He has to have some responsibility for that. When you lie down with dogs you get up with fleas. Impossible to have any sympathy for him given what he has put the rest of us through these past 18+ months. Using the protocol as a smokescreen for the real agenda - a nationalist FM and worse still a woman!!!
Time to sh1t or get off the pot.
Quote from: 93-DY-SAM on January 25, 2024, 10:04:58 AMWee Jeff has stood side by side with these clowns for far too long legitimising them. He has to have some responsibility for that. When you lie down with dogs you get up with fleas. Impossible to have any sympathy for him given what he has put the rest of us through these past 18+ months. Using the protocol as a smokescreen for the real agenda - a nationalist FM and worse still a woman!!!
Time to sh1t or get off the pot.
Spot on.
Quote from: 93-DY-SAM on January 25, 2024, 10:04:58 AMWee Jeff has stood side by side with these clowns for far too long legitimising them. He has to have some responsibility for that. When you lie down with dogs you get up with fleas. Impossible to have any sympathy for him given what he has put the rest of us through these past 18+ months. Using the protocol as a smokescreen for the real agenda - a nationalist FM and worse still a woman!!!
Time to sh1t or get off the pot.
Nails hit on head there on all fronts.
Instead iof getting on with things after the last Election they went running to the OO, Binlid and the various U criminal gangs.
Their only view on anything is No! unless it's a return to the 1950s or 1690
Hard to see how the DUP can survive in its current iteration. There is clearly a split WM v Stormont. Jeffrey might be trying to choreograph a return but with Jim Alister to the right backed up by unelected eejits he will do well to keep everyone on board.
I think another problem could be if he bounces ELP in as DFM (nearly forgot the D) I think a good chunk of DUP MLA's won't be happy. Maybe he has calculated it and knows the numbers I'm not sure.
He will have support from certain parts of unionism, of that there is no doubt, but will he have enough?
The reality is he's not really in charge of the party at all. Foster probably wasn't too. I am not sure if Robinson was but maybe he was. There are more sinister elements really call the shots and tbh I've thought that for a long while.
Quote from: tbrick18 on January 25, 2024, 09:38:22 AMQuote from: Main Street on January 25, 2024, 09:10:07 AMQuote from: tbrick18 on January 25, 2024, 08:28:04 AMQuote from: AustinPowers on January 24, 2024, 06:27:26 PMSo Jeffrey was threatened , by an unnamed person(s). Very convenient ::)
So now he's reduced the heat on himself and Colm Eastwood even coming out in support of him.
He should have turned on the tears as well. That would have put the tin hat on it
Threatened by an unknown person who, when he checked hadn't voted!
How can he check if someone voted? I thought that was anonymous?
Can't be an unknown person if he knows them!
Whole thing is a deflection....ironic give he said he wouldn't be deflected.
No sympathy for him, I don't condone threats, I mean the situation he and the dup are in. Its self made and we are all suffering for their party politics.
Jeff did not say they were unknown people, it's possible he could have checked earlier online comments made. Wasn't it Donaldson who threatened Trimble back in the day?
I see he was spoofing about all the alterations to the protocol that he alone was able to negotiate.
My bad, I misread unnamed as unknown.
I still don't understand how he can check if someone voted.
He's full of it. Don't believe a word he says to be honest and I'm surprised so many have been taken in by the performance.
I was never a huge fan of SDLPs Eastwood, but he seriously went down in my estimations yesterday with how he responded. He's right to condemn threats of course, but good god.
Whole thing reminded me of Schofield's announcement a few years back. Bunch of gobshites saying how brave he was , when I was saying... what about his wife and family? Lying to them for 20+ years? Ach nah, never mind that, he's so brave. It was so staged , and so was Jeffrey 's performance
I still think Jeffrey
will walk away . He'll say the threats are taking a toll on his menntal health as a get out of jail free card , And walk away without becoming the Lundy for doing a deal.
Quote from: Jeepers Creepers on January 25, 2024, 09:47:24 AMQuote from: tbrick18 on January 25, 2024, 09:38:22 AMQuote from: Main Street on January 25, 2024, 09:10:07 AMQuote from: tbrick18 on January 25, 2024, 08:28:04 AMQuote from: AustinPowers on January 24, 2024, 06:27:26 PMSo Jeffrey was threatened , by an unnamed person(s). Very convenient ::)
So now he's reduced the heat on himself and Colm Eastwood even coming out in support of him.
He should have turned on the tears as well. That would have put the tin hat on it
Threatened by an unknown person who, when he checked hadn't voted!
How can he check if someone voted? I thought that was anonymous?
Can't be an unknown person if he knows them!
Whole thing is a deflection....ironic give he said he wouldn't be deflected.
No sympathy for him, I don't condone threats, I mean the situation he and the dup are in. Its self made and we are all suffering for their party politics.
Jeff did not say they were unknown people, it's possible he could have checked earlier online comments made. Wasn't it Donaldson who threatened Trimble back in the day?
I see he was spoofing about all the alterations to the protocol that he alone was able to negotiate.
My bad, I misread unnamed as unknown.
I still don't understand how he can check if someone voted.
He's full of it. Don't believe a word he says to be honest and I'm surprised so many have been taken in by the performance.
I was never a huge fan of SDLPs Eastwood, but he seriously went down in my estimations yesterday with how he responded. He's right to condemn threats of course, but good god.
You get checked off if you vote. Register can be viewed, just not who you voted for.
Never new it!
Can anyone see it?
Dup and sinn fein do not care about the severe mental health epidemic in northern ireland as long as they got there champagne and steak
The problem with the DUP is that it hasn't been operating on the reality spectrum for a number of years.
It is still very vulnerable to the TUV awhile Protestant voters are crying out for leadership. There is no Conor Glass type figure to read the political game, take a grip on the party and drive it on .
Quote from: tbrick18 on January 25, 2024, 10:32:03 AMQuote from: Jeepers Creepers on January 25, 2024, 09:47:24 AMQuote from: tbrick18 on January 25, 2024, 09:38:22 AMQuote from: Main Street on January 25, 2024, 09:10:07 AMQuote from: tbrick18 on January 25, 2024, 08:28:04 AMQuote from: AustinPowers on January 24, 2024, 06:27:26 PMSo Jeffrey was threatened , by an unnamed person(s). Very convenient ::)
So now he's reduced the heat on himself and Colm Eastwood even coming out in support of him.
He should have turned on the tears as well. That would have put the tin hat on it
Threatened by an unknown person who, when he checked hadn't voted!
How can he check if someone voted? I thought that was anonymous?
Can't be an unknown person if he knows them!
Whole thing is a deflection....ironic give he said he wouldn't be deflected.
No sympathy for him, I don't condone threats, I mean the situation he and the dup are in. Its self made and we are all suffering for their party politics.
Jeff did not say they were unknown people, it's possible he could have checked earlier online comments made. Wasn't it Donaldson who threatened Trimble back in the day?
I see he was spoofing about all the alterations to the protocol that he alone was able to negotiate.
My bad, I misread unnamed as unknown.
I still don't understand how he can check if someone voted.
He's full of it. Don't believe a word he says to be honest and I'm surprised so many have been taken in by the performance.
I was never a huge fan of SDLPs Eastwood, but he seriously went down in my estimations yesterday with how he responded. He's right to condemn threats of course, but good god.
You get checked off if you vote. Register can be viewed, just not who you voted for.
Never new it!
Can anyone see it?
YES!
https://www.eoni.org.uk/Register-To-Vote/Inspecting-the-Electoral-Register
I tried to listened to this, when he said he put on the uniform of the UDR to protect the whole community I switched straight off.
Quote from: north_antrim_hound on January 25, 2024, 11:14:11 AMI tried to listened to this, when he said he put on the uniform of the UDR to protect the whole community I switched straight off.
So that is what he meant.
Quote from: north_antrim_hound on January 25, 2024, 11:14:11 AMI tried to listened to this, when he said he put on the uniform of the UDR to protect the whole community I switched straight off.
Same and then he said he was working night and day
Quote from: brokencrossbar1 on January 25, 2024, 09:29:12 AMQuote from: tbrick18 on January 25, 2024, 08:28:04 AMQuote from: AustinPowers on January 24, 2024, 06:27:26 PMSo Jeffrey was threatened , by an unnamed person(s). Very convenient ::)
So now he's reduced the heat on himself and Colm Eastwood even coming out in support of him.
He should have turned on the tears as well. That would have put the tin hat on it
Threatened by an unknown person who, when he checked hadn't voted!
How can he check if someone voted? I thought that was anonymous?
Can't be an unknown person if he knows them!
Whole thing is a deflection....ironic give he said he wouldn't be deflected.
No sympathy for him, I don't condone threats, I mean the situation he and the dup are in. Its self made and we are all suffering for their party politics.
The person who didn't vote is wee Seamie I suspect. On the day of the election is was gurning as there was a Rangers game on that day and he was not able to vote, according to him, as he was away at the game. The references by wee Jeff and CCH to people on twitter is a clear shot at Bryson.
While I have little sympathy for Donaldson maybe he has grown a pair and publicly now has stood up to the back room bullies. Very pointed sitting in the HoC with all the DUP members in a row expect Junior sitting directly behind wee Jeff in the eye of the camera.
That's it. He's saying the exact thing we've all been saying, Bryson (and the rest) doesn't have a mandate so why are people giving any sort of credence to his incitement. Something he should have called out long ago and called the media out on over the disproportionate amount of coverage afforded to him.
No sympathy, and I suspect whatever happens it's the end of the DUP or any unionist party ever being the biggest party in the North as this will split the unionist/loyalist voting. Cue Stormont up and down while they come to terms with this.
Really doesn't matter how this plays out in terms of the Nationalist population politically.
Worst case scenario they all rally around the DUP and he gains voters - unlikely and doesn't really matter in terms of the demographics just delays things.
Best case scenario completely splinters the loyalist/ unionist vote even further and they are weakened even more.
The real danger is that when loyalists are feeling threatened or are angry with whatever, who do they target and our history shows us that it is usually innocent Catholics.
Quote from: NAG1 on January 25, 2024, 11:45:06 AMReally doesn't matter how this plays out in terms of the Nationalist population politically.
Worst case scenario they all rally around the DUP and he gains voters - unlikely and doesn't really matter in terms of the demographics just delays things.
Best case scenario completely splinters the loyalist/ unionist vote even further and they are weakened even more.
The real danger is that when loyalists are feeling threatened or are angry with whatever, who do they target and our history shows us that it is usually innocent Catholics.
That's the danger here. All while wee Jeff, Allister et al wash their hands off it saying it had nothing to do with us.
It's a fractured party. What really is keeping it together? Is it a gravy train they're on they don't want off or is it just they'll do anything to not have SF the largest party? (Yes they are that anyway but by a landslide I mean)
He does the bidding for the OO and UDA/UVF.
That's the reality.
I couldn't care less for him. They'll never change. There's no De Clerk or their supporters won't allow a De Clerk.
Quote from: tbrick18 on January 25, 2024, 10:32:03 AMQuote from: Jeepers Creepers on January 25, 2024, 09:47:24 AMQuote from: tbrick18 on January 25, 2024, 09:38:22 AMQuote from: Main Street on January 25, 2024, 09:10:07 AMQuote from: tbrick18 on January 25, 2024, 08:28:04 AMQuote from: AustinPowers on January 24, 2024, 06:27:26 PMSo Jeffrey was threatened , by an unnamed person(s). Very convenient ::)
So now he's reduced the heat on himself and Colm Eastwood even coming out in support of him.
He should have turned on the tears as well. That would have put the tin hat on it
Threatened by an unknown person who, when he checked hadn't voted!
How can he check if someone voted? I thought that was anonymous?
Can't be an unknown person if he knows them!
Whole thing is a deflection....ironic give he said he wouldn't be deflected.
No sympathy for him, I don't condone threats, I mean the situation he and the dup are in. Its self made and we are all suffering for their party politics.
Jeff did not say they were unknown people, it's possible he could have checked earlier online comments made. Wasn't it Donaldson who threatened Trimble back in the day?
I see he was spoofing about all the alterations to the protocol that he alone was able to negotiate.
My bad, I misread unnamed as unknown.
I still don't understand how he can check if someone voted.
He's full of it. Don't believe a word he says to be honest and I'm surprised so many have been taken in by the performance.
I was never a huge fan of SDLPs Eastwood, but he seriously went down in my estimations yesterday with how he responded. He's right to condemn threats of course, but good god.
You get checked off if you vote. Register can be viewed, just not who you voted for.
Never new it!
Can anyone see it?
They probably don't even need to do that. In your polling station there's a table set up for Polling Agents and they have a blank copy of the register. When a voter comes in they'll come to the voting desk and give ID etc, the staff then have to shout out that person's number so the polling agent can then mark them as voted on their own register.
I've worked half a dozen elections in the Glens of Antrim so only ever seen Sinn Fein polling agents but I'm sure in DUP strongholds they'll have them working. If there's people who haven't voted they'll contact them and offer them lifts to the polling station etc.
is having lists of who has and who has not voted a very dangerous thing
what happens if it comes to a united ireland vote and someone does not vote could sinn fein order masked men to beat them up. or the dup order loyalists to beast someone up whos not voted in the shankill
Quote from: Eire90 on January 25, 2024, 12:44:29 PMis having lists of who has and who has not voted a very dangerous thing
what happens if it comes to a united ireland vote and someone does not vote could sinn fein order masked men to beat them up. or the dup order loyalists to beast someone up whos not voted in the shankill
Yeah that'll happen.
Thing here is I would say that most people wouldn't have known this at all (I certainly wouldn't) and now this clampit has shone a light on it ::)
Quote from: Eire90 on January 25, 2024, 12:44:29 PMis having lists of who has and who has not voted a very dangerous thing
what happens if it comes to a united ireland vote and someone does not vote could sinn fein order masked men to beat them up. or the dup order loyalists to beast someone up whos not voted in the shankill
There's no lists of who has or hasn't voted. The Electoral Register is a public document that can be viewed at the ER headquarters and lists who is registered to vote at each address. So you can easily check someone's address to see if they are registered. Not registered then clearly didn't vote.
Quote from: TyroneOnlooker on January 25, 2024, 01:42:47 PMQuote from: Eire90 on January 25, 2024, 12:44:29 PMis having lists of who has and who has not voted a very dangerous thing
what happens if it comes to a united ireland vote and someone does not vote could sinn fein order masked men to beat them up. or the dup order loyalists to beast someone up whos not voted in the shankill
There's no lists of who has or hasn't voted. The Electoral Register is a public document that can be viewed at the ER headquarters and lists who is registered to vote at each address. So you can easily check someone's address to see if they are registered. Not registered then clearly didn't vote.
Not strictly true. Parties who have the army of help... they can keep a record as they have people in every polling station. Like what did people think all those randomers are doing sitting at different tables in the polling stations?
Pity Jeffery didn't
Quote from: Armagh18 on January 25, 2024, 12:57:49 PMQuote from: Eire90 on January 25, 2024, 12:44:29 PMis having lists of who has and who has not voted a very dangerous thing
what happens if it comes to a united ireland vote and someone does not vote could sinn fein order masked men to beat them up. or the dup order loyalists to beast someone up whos not voted in the shankill
Yeah that'll happen.
Pity Jeffery didn't acknowledge when looking at voting electoral info that 79% of people that did vote didn't vote for the DUP.
I am pretty sure you cannot sit in the polling station regardless of what political party you come from.
Observers can sit in on the count at the count centre though to verify numbers of votes though the voting process is confidential and a vote can not be linked to an individual.
Quote from: Keyser soze on January 25, 2024, 02:44:16 PMI am pretty sure you cannot sit in the polling station regardless of what political party you come from.
Observers can sit in on the count at the count centre though to verify numbers of votes though the voting process is confidential and a vote can not be linked to an individual.
It's been happening for years - parties know who has & hasn't voted. None of this stuff is new
wasnt there not reports of shinners or duppers outside polling stations last year intimidating people
Quote from: Keyser soze on January 25, 2024, 02:44:16 PMI am pretty sure you cannot sit in the polling station regardless of what political party you come from.
Observers can sit in on the count at the count centre though to verify numbers of votes though the voting process is confidential and a vote can not be linked to an individual.
You can surely. SF have always done this at my local one. I'm sure the DUP do the same in Unionist areas. They will be sitting at a table by themselves and when the clerk calls out your name and address, the party official will score you off on their copy of the register. They take this back to party HQ where it is input into a database so that when they are canvassing next time round, they will know if you are a likely voter/nonvoter before you've even answered the door (though they won't know who you voted for unless you've told them when they canvassed last time round)
For the real staunch areas it's useful on polling day as around 6pm the database is able to produce a list of people who
1) Indicted in canvassing they would vote for your candidate
AND
2) Have not voted that day yet.
From this they can go door to door on the evening of polling day offering lifts, encouraging them to go to vote etc.
Nothing explicitly illegal any of this EXCEPT the fact they are technically storing data on you which you have not consented to. This caused a ruckus a while back with SF. Other parties kept remarkably quiet because they know they all do the exact same thing.
All those lists at each polling station are collated and the marked list (who has and has not voted) is available to anyone for a small fee.
Quote from: RedHand88 on January 25, 2024, 03:20:26 PMQuote from: Keyser soze on January 25, 2024, 02:44:16 PMI am pretty sure you cannot sit in the polling station regardless of what political party you come from.
Observers can sit in on the count at the count centre though to verify numbers of votes though the voting process is confidential and a vote can not be linked to an individual.
You can surely. SF have always done this at my local one. I'm sure the DUP do the same in Unionist areas. They will be sitting at a table by themselves and when the clerk calls out your name and address, the party official will score you off on their copy of the register. They take this back to party HQ where it is input into a database so that when they are canvassing next time round, they will know if you are a likely voter/nonvoter before you've even answered the door (though they won't know who you voted for unless you've told them when they canvassed last time round)
For the real staunch areas it's useful on polling day as around 6pm the database is able to produce a list of people who
1) Indicted in canvassing they would vote for your candidate
AND
2) Have not voted that day yet.
From this they can go door to door on the evening of polling day offering lifts, encouraging them to go to vote etc.
Nothing explicitly illegal any of this EXCEPT the fact they are technically storing data on you which you have not consented to. This caused a ruckus a while back with SF. Other parties kept remarkably quiet because they know they all do the exact same thing.
Never seen anyone other than the Electoral office officials in a poll centre, am sure that this is against the regs.
Found this:
1 http://www.electoralcommission.org.uk/__data/assets/pdf_file/0011/179741/Code-of-conduct-for␂campaigners-2015.pdf
2 Tellers are an established part of the democratic process although they have no standing in law.
Tellers are usually volunteers for candidates, parties or campaigns who are positioned outside a
polling station to ask voters for their elector number to see whether their supporters have turned out..
This activity is not illegal and may help to increase turnout by allowing campaigners to contact
electors who have not voted. However, tellers may be seen as impeding, obstructing or intimidating
electors on their way into the polling station/place. Any decision regarding the location or behaviour of
tellers is a matter for the Presiding Officer and RO, and tellers must comply with their instructions.
3 See Erlam & Ors v Rahman & Anor [2015] EWHC 1215 (QB) paragraphs 163 – 169 and 575 – 624.
Quote from: LeoMc on January 25, 2024, 03:31:28 PMAll those lists at each polling station are collated and the marked list (who has and has not voted) is available to anyone for a small fee.
All the parties and candidates who run I think can get a copy. In short all parties know if you voted or not.
Quote from: Keyser soze on January 25, 2024, 03:44:34 PMQuote from: RedHand88 on January 25, 2024, 03:20:26 PMQuote from: Keyser soze on January 25, 2024, 02:44:16 PMI am pretty sure you cannot sit in the polling station regardless of what political party you come from.
Observers can sit in on the count at the count centre though to verify numbers of votes though the voting process is confidential and a vote can not be linked to an individual.
You can surely. SF have always done this at my local one. I'm sure the DUP do the same in Unionist areas. They will be sitting at a table by themselves and when the clerk calls out your name and address, the party official will score you off on their copy of the register. They take this back to party HQ where it is input into a database so that when they are canvassing next time round, they will know if you are a likely voter/nonvoter before you've even answered the door (though they won't know who you voted for unless you've told them when they canvassed last time round)
For the real staunch areas it's useful on polling day as around 6pm the database is able to produce a list of people who
1) Indicted in canvassing they would vote for your candidate
AND
2) Have not voted that day yet.
From this they can go door to door on the evening of polling day offering lifts, encouraging them to go to vote etc.
Nothing explicitly illegal any of this EXCEPT the fact they are technically storing data on you which you have not consented to. This caused a ruckus a while back with SF. Other parties kept remarkably quiet because they know they all do the exact same thing.
Never seen anyone other than the Electoral office officials in a poll centre, am sure that this is against the regs.
No it isn't. But it should be.
Quote from: Eire90 on January 25, 2024, 03:08:54 PMwasnt there not reports of shinners or duppers outside polling stations last year intimidating people
A few years back in Dungannon. Polling station was a PS on the edge of Moygashel and the knuckle draggers where at the gates of the school waving flags and just gathering in numbers.
The venue was objected to going forward and the electoral commission moved it to the leisure centre instead, which is more central in the town, but cause uproar from the unionists in the area.
Quote from: Keyser soze on January 25, 2024, 03:44:34 PMQuote from: RedHand88 on January 25, 2024, 03:20:26 PMQuote from: Keyser soze on January 25, 2024, 02:44:16 PMI am pretty sure you cannot sit in the polling station regardless of what political party you come from.
Observers can sit in on the count at the count centre though to verify numbers of votes though the voting process is confidential and a vote can not be linked to an individual.
You can surely. SF have always done this at my local one. I'm sure the DUP do the same in Unionist areas. They will be sitting at a table by themselves and when the clerk calls out your name and address, the party official will score you off on their copy of the register. They take this back to party HQ where it is input into a database so that when they are canvassing next time round, they will know if you are a likely voter/nonvoter before you've even answered the door (though they won't know who you voted for unless you've told them when they canvassed last time round)
For the real staunch areas it's useful on polling day as around 6pm the database is able to produce a list of people who
1) Indicted in canvassing they would vote for your candidate
AND
2) Have not voted that day yet.
From this they can go door to door on the evening of polling day offering lifts, encouraging them to go to vote etc.
Nothing explicitly illegal any of this EXCEPT the fact they are technically storing data on you which you have not consented to. This caused a ruckus a while back with SF. Other parties kept remarkably quiet because they know they all do the exact same thing.
Never seen anyone other than the Electoral office officials in a poll centre, am sure that this is against the regs.
Found this:
1 http://www.electoralcommission.org.uk/__data/assets/pdf_file/0011/179741/Code-of-conduct-for␂campaigners-2015.pdf
2 Tellers are an established part of the democratic process although they have no standing in law.
Tellers are usually volunteers for candidates, parties or campaigns who are positioned outside a
polling station to ask voters for their elector number to see whether their supporters have turned out..
This activity is not illegal and may help to increase turnout by allowing campaigners to contact
electors who have not voted. However, tellers may be seen as impeding, obstructing or intimidating
electors on their way into the polling station/place. Any decision regarding the location or behaviour of
tellers is a matter for the Presiding Officer and RO, and tellers must comply with their instructions.
3 See Erlam & Ors v Rahman & Anor [2015] EWHC 1215 (QB) paragraphs 163 – 169 and 575 – 624.
It's 100% allowed and the parties have to give a list in advance of who will be there. They take it in shifts a few hours at a time.
Quote from: SaffronSports on January 25, 2024, 10:17:45 PMQuote from: Keyser soze on January 25, 2024, 03:44:34 PMQuote from: RedHand88 on January 25, 2024, 03:20:26 PMQuote from: Keyser soze on January 25, 2024, 02:44:16 PMI am pretty sure you cannot sit in the polling station regardless of what political party you come from.
Observers can sit in on the count at the count centre though to verify numbers of votes though the voting process is confidential and a vote can not be linked to an individual.
You can surely. SF have always done this at my local one. I'm sure the DUP do the same in Unionist areas. They will be sitting at a table by themselves and when the clerk calls out your name and address, the party official will score you off on their copy of the register. They take this back to party HQ where it is input into a database so that when they are canvassing next time round, they will know if you are a likely voter/nonvoter before you've even answered the door (though they won't know who you voted for unless you've told them when they canvassed last time round)
For the real staunch areas it's useful on polling day as around 6pm the database is able to produce a list of people who
1) Indicted in canvassing they would vote for your candidate
AND
2) Have not voted that day yet.
From this they can go door to door on the evening of polling day offering lifts, encouraging them to go to vote etc.
Nothing explicitly illegal any of this EXCEPT the fact they are technically storing data on you which you have not consented to. This caused a ruckus a while back with SF. Other parties kept remarkably quiet because they know they all do the exact same thing.
Never seen anyone other than the Electoral office officials in a poll centre, am sure that this is against the regs.
Found this:
1 http://www.electoralcommission.org.uk/__data/assets/pdf_file/0011/179741/Code-of-conduct-for␂campaigners-2015.pdf
2 Tellers are an established part of the democratic process although they have no standing in law.
Tellers are usually volunteers for candidates, parties or campaigns who are positioned outside a
polling station to ask voters for their elector number to see whether their supporters have turned out..
This activity is not illegal and may help to increase turnout by allowing campaigners to contact
electors who have not voted. However, tellers may be seen as impeding, obstructing or intimidating
electors on their way into the polling station/place. Any decision regarding the location or behaviour of
tellers is a matter for the Presiding Officer and RO, and tellers must comply with their instructions.
3 See Erlam & Ors v Rahman & Anor [2015] EWHC 1215 (QB) paragraphs 163 – 169 and 575 – 624.
It's 100% allowed and the parties have to give a list in advance of who will be there. They take it in shifts a few hours at a time.
I have just quoted you the electoral commission regulations which states that it is 100% not allowed.
Quote from: Keyser soze on January 26, 2024, 09:47:26 AMQuote from: SaffronSports on January 25, 2024, 10:17:45 PMQuote from: Keyser soze on January 25, 2024, 03:44:34 PMQuote from: RedHand88 on January 25, 2024, 03:20:26 PMQuote from: Keyser soze on January 25, 2024, 02:44:16 PMI am pretty sure you cannot sit in the polling station regardless of what political party you come from.
Observers can sit in on the count at the count centre though to verify numbers of votes though the voting process is confidential and a vote can not be linked to an individual.
You can surely. SF have always done this at my local one. I'm sure the DUP do the same in Unionist areas. They will be sitting at a table by themselves and when the clerk calls out your name and address, the party official will score you off on their copy of the register. They take this back to party HQ where it is input into a database so that when they are canvassing next time round, they will know if you are a likely voter/nonvoter before you've even answered the door (though they won't know who you voted for unless you've told them when they canvassed last time round)
For the real staunch areas it's useful on polling day as around 6pm the database is able to produce a list of people who
1) Indicted in canvassing they would vote for your candidate
AND
2) Have not voted that day yet.
From this they can go door to door on the evening of polling day offering lifts, encouraging them to go to vote etc.
Nothing explicitly illegal any of this EXCEPT the fact they are technically storing data on you which you have not consented to. This caused a ruckus a while back with SF. Other parties kept remarkably quiet because they know they all do the exact same thing.
Never seen anyone other than the Electoral office officials in a poll centre, am sure that this is against the regs.
Found this:
1 http://www.electoralcommission.org.uk/__data/assets/pdf_file/0011/179741/Code-of-conduct-for␂campaigners-2015.pdf
2 Tellers are an established part of the democratic process although they have no standing in law.
Tellers are usually volunteers for candidates, parties or campaigns who are positioned outside a
polling station to ask voters for their elector number to see whether their supporters have turned out..
This activity is not illegal and may help to increase turnout by allowing campaigners to contact
electors who have not voted. However, tellers may be seen as impeding, obstructing or intimidating
electors on their way into the polling station/place. Any decision regarding the location or behaviour of
tellers is a matter for the Presiding Officer and RO, and tellers must comply with their instructions.
3 See Erlam & Ors v Rahman & Anor [2015] EWHC 1215 (QB) paragraphs 163 – 169 and 575 – 624.
It's 100% allowed and the parties have to give a list in advance of who will be there. They take it in shifts a few hours at a time.
I have just quoted you the electoral commission regulations which states that it is 100% not allowed.
Can I not read or does that quote say "this is not illegal"
Quote from: Keyser soze on January 26, 2024, 09:47:26 AMQuote from: SaffronSports on January 25, 2024, 10:17:45 PMQuote from: Keyser soze on January 25, 2024, 03:44:34 PMQuote from: RedHand88 on January 25, 2024, 03:20:26 PMQuote from: Keyser soze on January 25, 2024, 02:44:16 PMI am pretty sure you cannot sit in the polling station regardless of what political party you come from.
Observers can sit in on the count at the count centre though to verify numbers of votes though the voting process is confidential and a vote can not be linked to an individual.
You can surely. SF have always done this at my local one. I'm sure the DUP do the same in Unionist areas. They will be sitting at a table by themselves and when the clerk calls out your name and address, the party official will score you off on their copy of the register. They take this back to party HQ where it is input into a database so that when they are canvassing next time round, they will know if you are a likely voter/nonvoter before you've even answered the door (though they won't know who you voted for unless you've told them when they canvassed last time round)
For the real staunch areas it's useful on polling day as around 6pm the database is able to produce a list of people who
1) Indicted in canvassing they would vote for your candidate
AND
2) Have not voted that day yet.
From this they can go door to door on the evening of polling day offering lifts, encouraging them to go to vote etc.
Nothing explicitly illegal any of this EXCEPT the fact they are technically storing data on you which you have not consented to. This caused a ruckus a while back with SF. Other parties kept remarkably quiet because they know they all do the exact same thing.
Never seen anyone other than the Electoral office officials in a poll centre, am sure that this is against the regs.
Found this:
1 http://www.electoralcommission.org.uk/__data/assets/pdf_file/0011/179741/Code-of-conduct-for␂campaigners-2015.pdf
2 Tellers are an established part of the democratic process although they have no standing in law.
Tellers are usually volunteers for candidates, parties or campaigns who are positioned outside a
polling station to ask voters for their elector number to see whether their supporters have turned out..
This activity is not illegal and may help to increase turnout by allowing campaigners to contact
electors who have not voted. However, tellers may be seen as impeding, obstructing or intimidating
electors on their way into the polling station/place. Any decision regarding the location or behaviour of
tellers is a matter for the Presiding Officer and RO, and tellers must comply with their instructions.
3 See Erlam & Ors v Rahman & Anor [2015] EWHC 1215 (QB) paragraphs 163 – 169 and 575 – 624.
It's 100% allowed and the parties have to give a list in advance of who will be there. They take it in shifts a few hours at a time.
I have just quoted you the electoral commission regulations which states that it is 100% not allowed.
The Tellers are the "volunteers" from the party.
I don't know if it's allowed or not but the parties definitely know who still has to vote on election day. Come 6pm on polling day they are all over the place trying to round up people to get them to the polling station.
Quote from: Keyser soze on January 26, 2024, 09:47:26 AMQuote from: SaffronSports on January 25, 2024, 10:17:45 PMQuote from: Keyser soze on January 25, 2024, 03:44:34 PMQuote from: RedHand88 on January 25, 2024, 03:20:26 PMQuote from: Keyser soze on January 25, 2024, 02:44:16 PMI am pretty sure you cannot sit in the polling station regardless of what political party you come from.
Observers can sit in on the count at the count centre though to verify numbers of votes though the voting process is confidential and a vote can not be linked to an individual.
You can surely. SF have always done this at my local one. I'm sure the DUP do the same in Unionist areas. They will be sitting at a table by themselves and when the clerk calls out your name and address, the party official will score you off on their copy of the register. They take this back to party HQ where it is input into a database so that when they are canvassing next time round, they will know if you are a likely voter/nonvoter before you've even answered the door (though they won't know who you voted for unless you've told them when they canvassed last time round)
For the real staunch areas it's useful on polling day as around 6pm the database is able to produce a list of people who
1) Indicted in canvassing they would vote for your candidate
AND
2) Have not voted that day yet.
From this they can go door to door on the evening of polling day offering lifts, encouraging them to go to vote etc.
Nothing explicitly illegal any of this EXCEPT the fact they are technically storing data on you which you have not consented to. This caused a ruckus a while back with SF. Other parties kept remarkably quiet because they know they all do the exact same thing.
Never seen anyone other than the Electoral office officials in a poll centre, am sure that this is against the regs.
Found this:
1 http://www.electoralcommission.org.uk/__data/assets/pdf_file/0011/179741/Code-of-conduct-for␂campaigners-2015.pdf
2 Tellers are an established part of the democratic process although they have no standing in law.
Tellers are usually volunteers for candidates, parties or campaigns who are positioned outside a
polling station to ask voters for their elector number to see whether their supporters have turned out..
This activity is not illegal and may help to increase turnout by allowing campaigners to contact
electors who have not voted. However, tellers may be seen as impeding, obstructing or intimidating
electors on their way into the polling station/place. Any decision regarding the location or behaviour of
tellers is a matter for the Presiding Officer and RO, and tellers must comply with their instructions.
3 See Erlam & Ors v Rahman & Anor [2015] EWHC 1215 (QB) paragraphs 163 – 169 and 575 – 624.
It's 100% allowed and the parties have to give a list in advance of who will be there. They take it in shifts a few hours at a time.
I have just quoted you the electoral commission regulations which states that it is 100% not allowed.
That's a teller. They'll stand outside the gates and count people going in.
What I'm talking about is a Polling Agent. We literally have to set up a table for them and leave a copy (a different colour to the real one) of the electoral register on that table. They aren't allowed to take it out of the polling station and it gets taken back to the main polling centre after polls closed but they have access to that thing from 7am -10pm. They have to be known in advance and when they arrive they show ID to the Polling Station manager and they have to keep a log throughout the day of who comes and goes be it polling agents, police, electoral staff or any other information like if someone tries to vote that's maybe done a proxy or postal vote etc.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-politics-68105094
Poots publicly stating that the DUP are not traitors. Shows the pressure they are under that they have to explicitly call this out.
Unionism imploding again.
Quote from: SaffronSports on January 26, 2024, 11:35:33 AMQuote from: Keyser soze on January 26, 2024, 09:47:26 AMQuote from: SaffronSports on January 25, 2024, 10:17:45 PMQuote from: Keyser soze on January 25, 2024, 03:44:34 PMQuote from: RedHand88 on January 25, 2024, 03:20:26 PMQuote from: Keyser soze on January 25, 2024, 02:44:16 PMI am pretty sure you cannot sit in the polling station regardless of what political party you come from.
Observers can sit in on the count at the count centre though to verify numbers of votes though the voting process is confidential and a vote can not be linked to an individual.
You can surely. SF have always done this at my local one. I'm sure the DUP do the same in Unionist areas. They will be sitting at a table by themselves and when the clerk calls out your name and address, the party official will score you off on their copy of the register. They take this back to party HQ where it is input into a database so that when they are canvassing next time round, they will know if you are a likely voter/nonvoter before you've even answered the door (though they won't know who you voted for unless you've told them when they canvassed last time round)
For the real staunch areas it's useful on polling day as around 6pm the database is able to produce a list of people who
1) Indicted in canvassing they would vote for your candidate
AND
2) Have not voted that day yet.
From this they can go door to door on the evening of polling day offering lifts, encouraging them to go to vote etc.
Nothing explicitly illegal any of this EXCEPT the fact they are technically storing data on you which you have not consented to. This caused a ruckus a while back with SF. Other parties kept remarkably quiet because they know they all do the exact same thing.
Never seen anyone other than the Electoral office officials in a poll centre, am sure that this is against the regs.
Found this:
1 http://www.electoralcommission.org.uk/__data/assets/pdf_file/0011/179741/Code-of-conduct-for␂campaigners-2015.pdf
2 Tellers are an established part of the democratic process although they have no standing in law.
Tellers are usually volunteers for candidates, parties or campaigns who are positioned outside a
polling station to ask voters for their elector number to see whether their supporters have turned out..
This activity is not illegal and may help to increase turnout by allowing campaigners to contact
electors who have not voted. However, tellers may be seen as impeding, obstructing or intimidating
electors on their way into the polling station/place. Any decision regarding the location or behaviour of
tellers is a matter for the Presiding Officer and RO, and tellers must comply with their instructions.
3 See Erlam & Ors v Rahman & Anor [2015] EWHC 1215 (QB) paragraphs 163 – 169 and 575 – 624.
It's 100% allowed and the parties have to give a list in advance of who will be there. They take it in shifts a few hours at a time.
I have just quoted you the electoral commission regulations which states that it is 100% not allowed.
That's a teller. They'll stand outside the gates and count people going in.
What I'm talking about is a Polling Agent. We literally have to set up a table for them and leave a copy (a different colour to the real one) of the electoral register on that table. They aren't allowed to take it out of the polling station and it gets taken back to the main polling centre after polls closed but they have access to that thing from 7am -10pm. They have to be known in advance and when they arrive they show ID to the Polling Station manager and they have to keep a log throughout the day of who comes and goes be it polling agents, police, electoral staff or any other information like if someone tries to vote that's maybe done a proxy or postal vote etc.
I stand corrected!
I'm aware that saying so goes completely against the whole ethos of the discussion board, if not SM sites in general lol
Quote from: Keyser soze on January 26, 2024, 12:29:23 PMQuote from: SaffronSports on January 26, 2024, 11:35:33 AMQuote from: Keyser soze on January 26, 2024, 09:47:26 AMQuote from: SaffronSports on January 25, 2024, 10:17:45 PMQuote from: Keyser soze on January 25, 2024, 03:44:34 PMQuote from: RedHand88 on January 25, 2024, 03:20:26 PMQuote from: Keyser soze on January 25, 2024, 02:44:16 PMI am pretty sure you cannot sit in the polling station regardless of what political party you come from.
Observers can sit in on the count at the count centre though to verify numbers of votes though the voting process is confidential and a vote can not be linked to an individual.
You can surely. SF have always done this at my local one. I'm sure the DUP do the same in Unionist areas. They will be sitting at a table by themselves and when the clerk calls out your name and address, the party official will score you off on their copy of the register. They take this back to party HQ where it is input into a database so that when they are canvassing next time round, they will know if you are a likely voter/nonvoter before you've even answered the door (though they won't know who you voted for unless you've told them when they canvassed last time round)
For the real staunch areas it's useful on polling day as around 6pm the database is able to produce a list of people who
1) Indicted in canvassing they would vote for your candidate
AND
2) Have not voted that day yet.
From this they can go door to door on the evening of polling day offering lifts, encouraging them to go to vote etc.
Nothing explicitly illegal any of this EXCEPT the fact they are technically storing data on you which you have not consented to. This caused a ruckus a while back with SF. Other parties kept remarkably quiet because they know they all do the exact same thing.
Never seen anyone other than the Electoral office officials in a poll centre, am sure that this is against the regs.
Found this:
1 http://www.electoralcommission.org.uk/__data/assets/pdf_file/0011/179741/Code-of-conduct-for␂campaigners-2015.pdf
2 Tellers are an established part of the democratic process although they have no standing in law.
Tellers are usually volunteers for candidates, parties or campaigns who are positioned outside a
polling station to ask voters for their elector number to see whether their supporters have turned out..
This activity is not illegal and may help to increase turnout by allowing campaigners to contact
electors who have not voted. However, tellers may be seen as impeding, obstructing or intimidating
electors on their way into the polling station/place. Any decision regarding the location or behaviour of
tellers is a matter for the Presiding Officer and RO, and tellers must comply with their instructions.
3 See Erlam & Ors v Rahman & Anor [2015] EWHC 1215 (QB) paragraphs 163 – 169 and 575 – 624.
It's 100% allowed and the parties have to give a list in advance of who will be there. They take it in shifts a few hours at a time.
I have just quoted you the electoral commission regulations which states that it is 100% not allowed.
That's a teller. They'll stand outside the gates and count people going in.
What I'm talking about is a Polling Agent. We literally have to set up a table for them and leave a copy (a different colour to the real one) of the electoral register on that table. They aren't allowed to take it out of the polling station and it gets taken back to the main polling centre after polls closed but they have access to that thing from 7am -10pm. They have to be known in advance and when they arrive they show ID to the Polling Station manager and they have to keep a log throughout the day of who comes and goes be it polling agents, police, electoral staff or any other information like if someone tries to vote that's maybe done a proxy or postal vote etc.
I stand corrected!
I'm aware that saying so goes completely against the whole ethos of the discussion board, if not SM sites in general lol
😂 An inspiration to all my friend.
Seems Donaldson has calculated he finally has enough support to push them back into Stormont. Big meeting on Monday to lay it all out. Maybe even back at work by the end of the week.
Response of the holdouts will be interesting. A bit of grumbling, but ultimately sticking with the DUP gravy train? Or does it become more messy? Unionism is so directionless at the minute - how stable can government be until they figure themselves out?
I'd say the Brits will fudge some language and jargon to melt the ice a bit for Donaldson and get him over the line.
All depends how Bin man and Allister react to see what happens next.
As I say, Donaldson and the DUP are being dragged into this...not willing to be part of it at all.
Quote from: Ed Ricketts on January 27, 2024, 11:44:48 AMSeems Donaldson has calculated he finally has enough support to push them back into Stormont. Big meeting on Monday to lay it all out. Maybe even back at work by the end of the week.
Response of the holdouts will be interesting. A bit of grumbling, but ultimately sticking with the DUP gravy train? Or does it become more messy? Unionism is so directionless at the minute - how stable can government be until they figure themselves out?
They didn't vote during the last meeting as it was leaked. So Bryson leaked about this one hoping for the same result.
Seen a great response to him from Newton Emerson. If you continually tell people they are not Unionist, eventually you will be right.
Quote from: Ed Ricketts on January 27, 2024, 11:44:48 AMSeems Donaldson has calculated he finally has enough support to push them back into Stormont. Big meeting on Monday to lay it all out. Maybe even back at work by the end of the week.
Response of the holdouts will be interesting. A bit of grumbling, but ultimately sticking with the DUP gravy train? Or does it become more messy? Unionism is so directionless at the minute - how stable can government be until they figure themselves out?
Stephen Nolan is back from holidays on Monday so there is still time to ramp up the outrage and scupper a deal.
Quote from: SaffronSports on January 26, 2024, 12:53:44 PMQuote from: Keyser soze on January 26, 2024, 12:29:23 PMQuote from: SaffronSports on January 26, 2024, 11:35:33 AMQuote from: Keyser soze on January 26, 2024, 09:47:26 AMQuote from: SaffronSports on January 25, 2024, 10:17:45 PMQuote from: Keyser soze on January 25, 2024, 03:44:34 PMQuote from: RedHand88 on January 25, 2024, 03:20:26 PMQuote from: Keyser soze on January 25, 2024, 02:44:16 PMI am pretty sure you cannot sit in the polling station regardless of what political party you come from.
Observers can sit in on the count at the count centre though to verify numbers of votes though the voting process is confidential and a vote can not be linked to an individual.
You can surely. SF have always done this at my local one. I'm sure the DUP do the same in Unionist areas. They will be sitting at a table by themselves and when the clerk calls out your name and address, the party official will score you off on their copy of the register. They take this back to party HQ where it is input into a database so that when they are canvassing next time round, they will know if you are a likely voter/nonvoter before you've even answered the door (though they won't know who you voted for unless you've told them when they canvassed last time round)
For the real staunch areas it's useful on polling day as around 6pm the database is able to produce a list of people who
1) Indicted in canvassing they would vote for your candidate
AND
2) Have not voted that day yet.
From this they can go door to door on the evening of polling day offering lifts, encouraging them to go to vote etc.
Nothing explicitly illegal any of this EXCEPT the fact they are technically storing data on you which you have not consented to. This caused a ruckus a while back with SF. Other parties kept remarkably quiet because they know they all do the exact same thing.
Never seen anyone other than the Electoral office officials in a poll centre, am sure that this is against the regs.
Found this:
1 http://www.electoralcommission.org.uk/__data/assets/pdf_file/0011/179741/Code-of-conduct-for␂campaigners-2015.pdf
2 Tellers are an established part of the democratic process although they have no standing in law.
Tellers are usually volunteers for candidates, parties or campaigns who are positioned outside a
polling station to ask voters for their elector number to see whether their supporters have turned out..
This activity is not illegal and may help to increase turnout by allowing campaigners to contact
electors who have not voted. However, tellers may be seen as impeding, obstructing or intimidating
electors on their way into the polling station/place. Any decision regarding the location or behaviour of
tellers is a matter for the Presiding Officer and RO, and tellers must comply with their instructions.
3 See Erlam & Ors v Rahman & Anor [2015] EWHC 1215 (QB) paragraphs 163 – 169 and 575 – 624.
It's 100% allowed and the parties have to give a list in advance of who will be there. They take it in shifts a few hours at a time.
I have just quoted you the electoral commission regulations which states that it is 100% not allowed.
That's a teller. They'll stand outside the gates and count people going in.
What I'm talking about is a Polling Agent. We literally have to set up a table for them and leave a copy (a different colour to the real one) of the electoral register on that table. They aren't allowed to take it out of the polling station and it gets taken back to the main polling centre after polls closed but they have access to that thing from 7am -10pm. They have to be known in advance and when they arrive they show ID to the Polling Station manager and they have to keep a log throughout the day of who comes and goes be it polling agents, police, electoral staff or any other information like if someone tries to vote that's maybe done a proxy or postal vote etc.
I stand corrected!
I'm aware that saying so goes completely against the whole ethos of the discussion board, if not SM sites in general lol
😂 An inspiration to all my friend.
Both Tellers and Polling Agents "are an established part of the democratic process".
It´s just that Tellers have to behave and act within guidelines.
So, as well as giving the occupied six counties £3 billion, Rishi is going to roll back some of the so-called Brexit benefits? I'm sure the racist English will be delighted,
People gathering in communities to write keep your world letters to dup
Quote from: Eire90 on January 27, 2024, 04:51:07 PMPeople gathering in communities to write keep your world letters to dup
says more about those types of community. Haven't seen a signing outside of east belfast, markethill or moygashel
Quote from: yellowcard on January 27, 2024, 01:06:19 PMQuote from: Ed Ricketts on January 27, 2024, 11:44:48 AMSeems Donaldson has calculated he finally has enough support to push them back into Stormont. Big meeting on Monday to lay it all out. Maybe even back at work by the end of the week.
Response of the holdouts will be interesting. A bit of grumbling, but ultimately sticking with the DUP gravy train? Or does it become more messy? Unionism is so directionless at the minute - how stable can government be until they figure themselves out?
Stephen Nolan is back from holidays on Monday so there is still time to ramp up the outrage and scupper a deal.
a ' Lundy Monday ' Special?
Quote from: grounded on January 27, 2024, 10:25:11 PMQuote from: yellowcard on January 27, 2024, 01:06:19 PMQuote from: Ed Ricketts on January 27, 2024, 11:44:48 AMSeems Donaldson has calculated he finally has enough support to push them back into Stormont. Big meeting on Monday to lay it all out. Maybe even back at work by the end of the week.
Response of the holdouts will be interesting. A bit of grumbling, but ultimately sticking with the DUP gravy train? Or does it become more messy? Unionism is so directionless at the minute - how stable can government be until they figure themselves out?
Stephen Nolan is back from holidays on Monday so there is still time to ramp up the outrage and scupper a deal.
a ' Lundy Monday ' Special?
Or he could have cool sensible heads on the show like Doug Beattie, Peter Shirlow or Newton Emerson. But I guess the ratings are more important.
Quote from: Orior on January 28, 2024, 05:23:32 PMQuote from: grounded on January 27, 2024, 10:25:11 PMQuote from: yellowcard on January 27, 2024, 01:06:19 PMQuote from: Ed Ricketts on January 27, 2024, 11:44:48 AMSeems Donaldson has calculated he finally has enough support to push them back into Stormont. Big meeting on Monday to lay it all out. Maybe even back at work by the end of the week.
Response of the holdouts will be interesting. A bit of grumbling, but ultimately sticking with the DUP gravy train? Or does it become more messy? Unionism is so directionless at the minute - how stable can government be until they figure themselves out?
Stephen Nolan is back from holidays on Monday so there is still time to ramp up the outrage and scupper a deal.
a ' Lundy Monday ' Special?
Or he could have cool sensible heads on the show like Doug Beattie, Peter Shirlow or Newton Emerson. But I guess the ratings are more important.
Peter Shirlow "sensible" :o
Have the popcorn in. Can't wait to see the bastards tearing themselves apart ;D
Quote from: red hander on January 28, 2024, 08:36:16 PMHave the popcorn in. Can't wait to see the bastards tearing themselves apart ;D
Are the predictions of a 'bloodbath' too much to hope for? ;D
Deal or NO deal
Quote from: Orior on January 28, 2024, 05:23:32 PMQuote from: grounded on January 27, 2024, 10:25:11 PMQuote from: yellowcard on January 27, 2024, 01:06:19 PMQuote from: Ed Ricketts on January 27, 2024, 11:44:48 AMSeems Donaldson has calculated he finally has enough support to push them back into Stormont. Big meeting on Monday to lay it all out. Maybe even back at work by the end of the week.
Response of the holdouts will be interesting. A bit of grumbling, but ultimately sticking with the DUP gravy train? Or does it become more messy? Unionism is so directionless at the minute - how stable can government be until they figure themselves out?
Stephen Nolan is back from holidays on Monday so there is still time to ramp up the outrage and scupper a deal.
a ' Lundy Monday ' Special?
Or he could have cool sensible heads on the show like Doug Beattie, Peter Shirlow or Newton Emerson. But I guess the ratings are more important.
Nope... looks like ' Traitor Tuesday ' tomorrow! Grim Allister to the fore once again!
The same goons who backed the party's Brexit support are now packed into a hotel room listening to Jeffrey pretend they can have their cake and eat it. Idiots.
And Bryson is live tweeting what's being said. Embarrassing.
This is by far the worst example of party leadership I've ever seen. They can't stop someone in the meeting live tweeting? Surely they'd have had the foresight not to let anyone in with their phone.
If Jim McGuinness could do it before the Dubs game surely JD should have done it tonight!
https://twitter.com/JamieBrysonCPNI/status/1752052609320423646
JD just began speaking:
Says negotiations are over, and DUP aren't going to get anymore.
Says we have reached moment of decision 1/
He says after much deliberation time is now to bring it to wider party. They expected the Gov to now move with publishing legislation 2/
First challenge to JD - asked who was the policy making body within the party. 2/
JD now complaining about leaks; he says every meeting he holds gets in the hands of the media in less than an hour. Says it impacts on way DUP do business and says it undermines trust. He says party therefore operating with constraints. 3/
JD now beginning presentation. Says this is product of negotiations with Gov. Says party always opposed Protocol. 4/
Meeting now halted. Anger that meeting is being live tweeted. 5/
DUP meeting descends into mayhem. JD saying texts being sent to Jamie Bryson who is giving a blow by blow account to the meeting 6/
MAYHEM in party Exec meeting. One DUP delegate accuses PSNI officers of being the leak. 7/
JD defends police officers says "they are not messaging Jamie Bryson" 8/
JD resuming presentation. DUP enforcers now looking around the rooms. 9/
JD says in response to Windsor Framework DUP consulted. Unlike any other party. Name checks Peter Robinson and Arlene Foster 10/
JD now discussing seven tests "designed to be the measure against which DUP would discuss any future arrangements" 11/
JD says tests being misrepresented- now trying to escape from restoring the Acts of Union. Trying to explain away why his deal doesn't restore the Acts of Union. First sign of DUP backing off 12/
JD now saying legislation will affirm sovereignty! What? 13/
JD says two pieces of constitutional legislation, including amending UK internal market act 14/
Says legislation "restores Parliamentary sovereignty" and reaffirms NI place in the Union; says offers NEW protections on Acts of Union - clearly therefore Acts of Union not restored 15/
JD 'constitutional legislation' sounds like utter waffle 16/
Party Chairman orders 'PHONES OFF' 17/
Continuing with presentation 18/
DUP meeting now halted. Fury and mayhem 19/
JD says PSNI brought in to try and block phone signals 20/
JD says effort to block phone signals hasn't stopped the reporting from the meeting. 21/
JD says there will still be checks and declarations on green lane. 22/
JD still discussing legislation. Talking about reduction in checks. 23/
DUP meeting is utter chaos and mayhem 24/
God its all so hilarious. How long can Donaldson go on as leader with no authority
Seems to be a farce....but pretty enjoyable.
Quote from: Duine Inteacht Eile on January 29, 2024, 08:09:59 PMQuote from: screenexile on January 29, 2024, 08:03:24 PMThis is by far the worst example of party leadership I've ever seen. They can't stop someone in the meeting live tweeting? Surely they'd have had the foresight not to let anyone in with their phone.
If Jim McGuinness could do it before the Dubs game surely JD should have done it tonight!
Someone is wearing a wire I'd say.
Or someone just phoned Bryson before they went in and left their phone on in their pocket. The whole thing is hilarious. Donaldsons reputation in tatters. Karma bites 25 years later for the snake ;D
Cnuts and all that they are they should be allowed to get on with party business without that wee rat reporting their proceedings.
Quote from: Tony Baloney on January 29, 2024, 10:31:20 PMCnuts and all that they are they should be allowed to get on with party business without that wee rat reporting their proceedings.
Mole hunt as we speak.
Flagatha Christie they're calling it.
Ulster says Poirot
I'll get me coat
Mad stuff.
Surely the BBC can't platform Bryson again after that escapade, or even Allister for cheerleading it.
The fall-out of this will be very interesting. A weakened DUP, and a few inevitable defections to TUV. If the primary objection was a Nationalist First Minister, then they not only shot themselves in the foot, they danced on a nail, jumped on a landmine, then amputated the foot and threw it in a barrel of acid.
Quote from: Substandard on January 30, 2024, 12:23:27 AMMad stuff.
Surely the BBC can't platform Bryson again after that escapade, or even Allister for cheerleading it.
The fall-out of this will be very interesting. A weakened DUP, and a few inevitable defections to TUV. If the primary objection was a Nationalist First Minister, then they not only shot themselves in the foot, they danced on a nail, jumped on a landmine, then amputated the foot and threw it in a barrel of acid.
How do they intend to march this year after all that?
I don't think they've thought this through
Quote from: AustinPowers on January 30, 2024, 12:44:46 AMQuote from: Substandard on January 30, 2024, 12:23:27 AMMad stuff.
Surely the BBC can't platform Bryson again after that escapade, or even Allister for cheerleading it.
The fall-out of this will be very interesting. A weakened DUP, and a few inevitable defections to TUV. If the primary objection was a Nationalist First Minister, then they not only shot themselves in the foot, they danced on a nail, jumped on a landmine, then amputated the foot and threw it in a barrel of acid.
How do they intend to march this year after all that?
I don't think they've thought this through
Tis the nature of things- never ones to toe the line, and someone else will foot the bill!!
I'd imagine Jamie is going to be made pay for this, however. It's one thing to be shouting from the sidelines when all it gets is a little limelight, but this will have consequences and repercussions, and there will be a push back.
Don't have to look any further than Paisley.
So their back in pending some legislative changes by UK gov.
Donaldson came across as reasonable and pragmatic during that press conference. Bryson cited Wilson, Dodds and Lockhart as the main opponents. If he manages to face them down and maintain control, it will be impressive, and more than I'd have given him credit for. The hardliners will undoubtedly be spitting fire at this soft-edge DUP, but just going on tonight, Stormont might just be workable.
Jamie's thumbs will be knackered between tonight and the next few days digesting this.
Quote from: Substandard on January 30, 2024, 01:34:48 AMDonaldson came across as reasonable and pragmatic during that press conference. Bryson cited Wilson, Dodds and Lockhart as the main opponents. If he manages to face them down and maintain control, it will be impressive, and more than I'd have given him credit for. The hardliners will undoubtedly be spitting fire at this soft-edge DUP, but just going on tonight, Stormont might just be workable.
Jamie's thumbs will be knackered between tonight and the next few days digesting this.
He's still at it. It's 3am and he's still giving off about the union being betrayed. They aren't wise the half of them.
They look a bunch of amateurs with Bryson seemingly having a live feed of the meeting. But Donaldson legitimised him by standing on platforms with him. Donaldson along with Foster did the exact same to Trimble. So I have little to no sympathy for him.
Yep, they gave bin lid, the OO and various criminal U gangs a virtual veto and danced to their tune for 2 years.
When is the Jamie Bryson joke over?
You feel a bit for Donaldson then you remember what trailer says. What is that song you lie down with dogs you get fleas etc.
We are firmly in 'sold a pup' territory.
Quote from: imtommygunn on January 30, 2024, 08:43:33 AMWhen is the Jamie Bryson joke over?
You feel a bit for Donaldson then you remember what trailer says. What is that song you lie down with dogs you get fleas etc.
To an extent.
Nolan exalted Bryson up the ranks as a voice for Loyalism and Donaldson got suckered into it and went with it as it suited his agenda.
Now he's being foisted on his own petard..
It's hard to have sympathy with Donaldson but we all saw this happening years ago, but he lacked the balls to deal with his own party the way he should have and it's come to this.
How long until they walk out over something else i wonder.
It wouldnt suprise me if its shut down again within six months and the media start the whole cirucs again fawmning over them if it gets shut down again the media should just ignore them and there pay cut to Zero but that wont happen.It wouldnt even suprise me if they pull out again this week.
Yes, there could be twists and turns before the end of the week, they're not back in yet
Quote from: imtommygunn on January 30, 2024, 08:43:33 AMWhen is the Jamie Bryson joke over?
You feel a bit for Donaldson then you remember what trailer says. What is that song you lie down with dogs you get fleas etc.
He's the unionist version of Jedward.
And I'd say even they got more votes than him in the last election
Quote from: Substandard on January 30, 2024, 12:23:27 AMMad stuff.
Surely the BBC can't platform Bryson again after that escapade, or even Allister for cheerleading it.
The fall-out of this will be very interesting. A weakened DUP, and a few inevitable defections to TUV. If the primary objection was a Nationalist First Minister, then they not only shot themselves in the foot, they danced on a nail, jumped on a landmine, then amputated the foot and threw it in a barrel of acid.
There'll be few, if any, defections. Maybe the odd disgruntled MLA or councillor.
They get elected and earn a living based on their status in the DUP, the majority are not going to risk their livelihood for this.
Get back into the executive and by the time the next election comes around they'll still be the biggest Unionist party.
Come the next assembly election don't be surprised to see them and UUP come to some sort of arrangement whereby they run as separate parties, but sit as one in the assembly, giving Unionism the FM position once more.
Isn't it completely ludicrous that there are still a significant percentage of unionists that will get behind a campaign with slogans such as No Surrender, the Slippery Slope to Dublin, No Sellout, For God and Ulster etc people amongst us living in a different millennium to the rest of the planet.
I cannot see there being any major defections to the TUV or others. The DUP has a huge clout in Orange Lodges, Churches and Tea rooms across Ulster. Jumping to the TUV would be political suicide unless they have an ultra super safe seat. Some of these MLA's and MPs are lunatics. Unelectable unless they have the big party behind them. Jonathan Bell a perfect example. While Sammy Wilson and Ian Paisley might not like it they'll suck it up. Dodds and Morrow who have cushy HOL positions can be slightly more vocal but expect Dodds to be bought off with a ministerial position or a baroness title for his wife.
Bryson on the other hand won't be easily handled. Of course he is a muppet but I listened to part of his exchange with Nolan this morning and he is a good media performer. Nolan criticised him for publicising a private DUP meeting on X last night. Bryson pointed out that Nolan did exactly the same a week or so ago dialling in from the USA. Now I didn't have section 7a of whatever legislation he was quoting to hand but he was able to make fairly coherent arguments based on legal text and what he had heard and seen last night about sea borders and acts of union. To me I don't give a f**k if the sea border eats him, but many others in the Unionist community listen to him and that will be an issue for JD.
Someone said it above.... they're not back in yet.
It's hard to know sometimes if it's an amplified minority or there are lots of unionists who think like that. Unfortunately there are way more than you would hope for regardless.
Social media definitely amplifies things as if you look at the protestors there were at that meeting last night there really weren't very many. Just like the flag protests.
Quote from: imtommygunn on January 30, 2024, 11:28:27 AMIt's hard to know sometimes if it's an amplified minority or there are lots of unionists who think like that. Unfortunately there are way more than you would hope for regardless.
Social media definitely amplifies things as if you look at the protestors there were at that meeting last night there really weren't very many. Just like the flag protests.
Hard to know but their stance hasn't harmed their popularity in the polls. As good of indicator that we have. If/when they go back it will be interesting to see if there's any change.
They are a laughing stock. Was barely touched on the BBC and ITV breakfast news this morning which shows you how much of a priority the story is with them. If only they'd report the farcical details of last night to their viewers it would open their eyes a bit more to think that these clowns had their hands anywhere near the levers of power in GB not that long ago aided by a Tory government.
This isn't difficult to understand, Unionist will veto (rightly or wrongly) any attempts to 'break away' from the Union.
They have been sucking on that tit for so long that it might take another 100 years for them to ween off it
All Nationalists should be doing is let them at it, if the border poll shows that a Ref'n is ready then take it, still think its further away than some feel
Wee Jeff trying to polish a turd. EU have said they expect the UK to fulfil its obligations under the Framework. Brexiter headbangers have said GB will continue to be able to diverge. A bit of tinkering at the edges and a lot of cosmetics. If they go back this week, I give the Assembly 12-18 months before some other issue brings it down.
It's all going to be smoke and mirrors but if they go in and they get 3 billion or whatever they get you can be sure the tories won't give this out without conditions. I doubt they would be able to just coup it again quickly.
(Although in an ideal world the tories won't be in that much longer so that is another variable to be thrown in the mix.)
Quote from: Pub Bore on January 30, 2024, 12:11:30 PMWee Jeff trying to polish a turd. EU have said they expect the UK to fulfil its obligations under the Framework. Brexiter headbangers have said GB will continue to be able to diverge. A bit of tinkering at the edges and a lot of cosmetics. If they go back this week, I give the Assembly 12-18 months before some other issue brings it down.
This is it in a nutshell, the hardliners on the Unionist side are right, this deal changes nothing essentially. A couple of cosmetic details on the edges that were easily agreed.
But if JD can get them into the Assembly and up and running again, the local issues will take over and the quick wins of public sector pay increases and budgets actually being in place should get them through the first tricky weeks/ months and the rest hopefully will die down.
Alliance and SDLP are seeking for reform of the assembly to stop one party being able to bring the place down, if there are any right thinking MLAs up there surely this is top priority for the assembly as well.
No sympathy for the DUP and I hope that come the next election that they and TUV have a proper election spat and they eat themselves. Gone are the days of a Unionist majority no matter how much they kick and scream.
Quote from: imtommygunn on January 30, 2024, 12:14:22 PMIt's all going to be smoke and mirrors but if they go in and they get 3 billion or whatever they get you can be sure the tories won't give this out without conditions. I doubt they would be able to just coup it again quickly.
(Although in an ideal world the tories won't be in that much longer so that is another variable to be thrown in the mix.)
Yes. If the DUP return to Stormont , that means the people will suffer as there will be rates hikes, prescription charges, water charges etc.
Now , say what you like about Britain having to pay for those and NI not , the fact is, it's always the ordinary folk who foot the bill. In this case , people will pay for the north being mismanaged and underfunded for decades
Workers will get some sort of a raise. But it will be taken away as quickly
Quote from: NAG1 on January 30, 2024, 12:20:25 PMQuote from: Pub Bore on January 30, 2024, 12:11:30 PMWee Jeff trying to polish a turd. EU have said they expect the UK to fulfil its obligations under the Framework. Brexiter headbangers have said GB will continue to be able to diverge. A bit of tinkering at the edges and a lot of cosmetics. If they go back this week, I give the Assembly 12-18 months before some other issue brings it down.
This is it in a nutshell, the hardliners on the Unionist side are right, this deal changes nothing essentially. A couple of cosmetic details on the edges that were easily agreed.
But if JD can get them into the Assembly and up and running again, the local issues will take over and the quick wins of public sector pay increases and budgets actually being in place should get them through the first tricky weeks/ months and the rest hopefully will die down.
Alliance and SDLP are seeking for reform of the assembly to stop one party being able to bring the place down, if there are any right thinking MLAs up there surely this is top priority for the assembly as well.
I can't see how that can be achieved. The whole point was to implement power sharing so the days of majority rule couldn't be brought back. Such a big change would require a huge re-negotiation including the two governments.
The DUP had a mandate for their position, and will get a mandate for their new position at the next election as well, they've no party capable of challenging them within Unionism.
Quote from: Brendan on January 29, 2024, 08:06:24 PMGod its all so hilarious. How long can Donaldson go on as leader with no authority
This is what Donaldson did to Trimble.
Will Jamie Bryson move to the UUP?
Quote from: seafoid on January 30, 2024, 01:14:10 PMQuote from: Brendan on January 29, 2024, 08:06:24 PMGod its all so hilarious. How long can Donaldson go on as leader with no authority
This is what Donaldson did to Trimble.
Will Jamie Bryson move to the UUP?
Eh, there's no way Doug Beattie would entertain him, Doug is trying to get a few more Army type people like him in to tell the natives how to behave...
Let's see how Tim Collins does against Farry in North Down who both the DUP and UUP have targeted but as yet have failed to unseat.
Quote from: seafoid on January 30, 2024, 01:14:10 PMQuote from: Brendan on January 29, 2024, 08:06:24 PMGod its all so hilarious. How long can Donaldson go on as leader with no authority
This is what Donaldson did to Trimble.
Will Jamie Bryson move to the UUP?
You have about as much chance of joining the UUP. As much chance of Starmer becoming a tory or Martin becoming SF.
At some point the DUP will give way to the UUP. But when?
Quote from: seafoid on January 30, 2024, 02:20:01 PMAt some point the DUP will give way to the UUP. But when?
I still don't see that happening.
There'll be even more hardening of views if SF keep maintaining good voting strength with Alliance picking up the middle ground and squeezing the UUP and to a lesser extent the DUP voters who realise the inevitability of a UI in whoever's lifetime, but the demographics are only going the one way.
Wee Jamie would be better riding all round himself to preserve the union.
Voting has become more and polarised as time goes on. The UUP are somewhere between DUP and Alliance and tbh I don't think fully know their identity so I doubt voters will...
It's a pity as surely there is room for a sensible unionist party. (I still think there is more to Doug Beattie than meets the eye tbh and not necessarily positive - just something about him I am unsure of).
Quote from: imtommygunn on January 30, 2024, 02:33:53 PMVoting has become more and polarised as time goes on. The UUP are somewhere between DUP and Alliance and tbh I don't think fully know their identity so I doubt voters will...
It's a pity as surely there is room for a sensible unionist party. (I still think there is more to Doug Beattie than meets the eye tbh and not necessarily positive - just something about him I am unsure of).
He's like all unionists and deep down he believes that it was those pesky taigs that started all the killing and bombing for no good reason.
They still like to claim the moral high ground, he's no different.
Quote from: johnnycool on January 30, 2024, 02:06:50 PMQuote from: seafoid on January 30, 2024, 01:14:10 PMQuote from: Brendan on January 29, 2024, 08:06:24 PMGod its all so hilarious. How long can Donaldson go on as leader with no authority
This is what Donaldson did to Trimble.
Will Jamie Bryson move to the UUP?
Eh, there's no way Doug Beattie would entertain him, Doug is trying to get a few more Army type people like him in to tell the natives how to behave...
Let's see how Tim Collins does against Farry in North Down who both the DUP and UUP have targeted but as yet have failed to unseat.
I'd say Collins, a softer unionist with 'credentials', is in there to beat Farry.
The DUP will step aside and it'll come down to a head to head between Collins and Farry.
Wee Jeff has been speaking a lot recently about united unionism etc. and this is the start of it. Bryson will be sidelined and the DUP will cosy up with the UUP and gain as many seats as possible.
A one party unionism if you like but make up of 2 parties.
Quote from: marty34 on January 30, 2024, 02:54:00 PMQuote from: johnnycool on January 30, 2024, 02:06:50 PMQuote from: seafoid on January 30, 2024, 01:14:10 PMQuote from: Brendan on January 29, 2024, 08:06:24 PMGod its all so hilarious. How long can Donaldson go on as leader with no authority
This is what Donaldson did to Trimble.
Will Jamie Bryson move to the UUP?
Eh, there's no way Doug Beattie would entertain him, Doug is trying to get a few more Army type people like him in to tell the natives how to behave...
Let's see how Tim Collins does against Farry in North Down who both the DUP and UUP have targeted but as yet have failed to unseat.
I'd say Collins, a softer unionist with 'credentials', is in there to beat Farry.
The DUP will step aside and it'll come down to a head to head between Collins and Farry.
Wee Jeff has been speaking a lot recently about united unionism etc. and this is the start of it. Bryson will be sidelined and the DUP will cosy up with the UUP and gain as many seats as possible.
A one party unionism if you like but make up of 2 parties.
Unionism in a nutshell. They tear each other apart and then line up for the pacts at election time. Even Allister and Bryson will play ball come election time. As much as they would love to run as anti protocol candidates they will only end up risking a unionist loss even in places like Lagan valley strangfird east Antrim they have to be careful in case Alliance sneak through.
Quote from: imtommygunn on January 30, 2024, 08:43:33 AMWhen is the Jamie Bryson joke over?
You feel a bit for Donaldson then you remember what trailer says. What is that song you lie down with dogs you get fleas etc.
🎶 The man behind the wire 🎶
Quote from: imtommygunn on January 30, 2024, 02:16:45 PMQuote from: seafoid on January 30, 2024, 01:14:10 PMQuote from: Brendan on January 29, 2024, 08:06:24 PMGod its all so hilarious. How long can Donaldson go on as leader with no authority
This is what Donaldson did to Trimble.
Will Jamie Bryson move to the UUP?
You have about as much chance of joining the UUP. As much chance of Starmer becoming a tory or Martin becoming SF.
Starmer is even worse than a Tory, tbf
Mad stuff by the rat allowing Bryson to tweet the secret meeting. The rat will now be owned by bin man 167. When I say rat, it might be more accurate to say horse.
Quote from: red hander on January 30, 2024, 03:32:13 PMQuote from: imtommygunn on January 30, 2024, 02:16:45 PMQuote from: seafoid on January 30, 2024, 01:14:10 PMQuote from: Brendan on January 29, 2024, 08:06:24 PMGod its all so hilarious. How long can Donaldson go on as leader with no authority
This is what Donaldson did to Trimble.
Will Jamie Bryson move to the UUP?
You have about as much chance of joining the UUP. As much chance of Starmer becoming a tory or Martin becoming SF.
Starmer is even worse than a Tory, tbf
Was about to say Starmer to the tories isn't that much of a stretch
Quote from: Orior on January 30, 2024, 04:30:04 PMMad stuff by the rat allowing Bryson to tweet the secret meeting. The rat will now be owned by bin man 167. When I say rat, it might be more accurate to say horse.
Carla the tout?
Quote from: Walter Cronc on January 30, 2024, 04:43:53 PMQuote from: Orior on January 30, 2024, 04:30:04 PMMad stuff by the rat allowing Bryson to tweet the secret meeting. The rat will now be owned by bin man 167. When I say rat, it might be more accurate to say horse.
Carla the tout?
A lot of the twitterati are suggesting it's her, whoever it is can only be sure that Bryson will spill the beans at some point in time.
She is not really the sharpest tool in the box her. Whoever did it will inevitably be finished. We can only hope they finish him off too.
Did anything actually change or is Donaldson gaslighting to get back in?
I see they're talking about a meeting of the Assembly on Saturday which could be difficult for double jobbing Justin McNulty
My money still on ole Ian
Quote from: seafoid on January 30, 2024, 05:47:59 PMDid anything actually change or is Donaldson gaslighting to get back in?
He got fcuk all squared and is lying to his base, the majority of which is too thick to realise it.
It's important for Donaldson to get this over the line asap i.e. this week-end.
The longer it takes, I think there'll be more questions.
They basically backed themselves into a corner, shot themselves in the foot and expect the Brits to bail them out with jargon, fudge and bluff saying things have changed and they've got what they wanted.
Pure waffle. The EU seem to be happy with it so there's the problem straight away for the DUP.
They'll say they got closer to what they wanted. They can't say they they got everything (They need to leave a get out clause). It's all about visuals - making it look like holding out for this deal was for the good of Ulster. Most of their constituents haven't a clue what's been bargained anyway. The DUP themselves actually don't know what they want anymore. When its all done and dusted they'll shout a few lines about the Union and stability.
Sunak lied about Customs when he over sold the Windsor Framework, but it's too boring for most people to pay any attention. Jeffrey is at the same game. NI is a backdoor to the EU and there's no way they are turning a blind eye. Watch the Command Paper tomorrow - it will have absolutely no legal standing but it will be full of meat for the DUP men.
Quote from: From the Bunker on January 30, 2024, 07:05:54 PMThey'll say they got closer to what they wanted. They can't say they they got everything (They need to leave a get out clause). It's all about visuals - making it look like holding out for this deal was for the good of Ulster. Most of their constituents haven't a clue what's been bargained anyway. The DUP themselves actually don't know what they want anymore. When its all done and dusted they'll shout a few lines about the Union and stability.
The DUP got into bed with the Brexit vandals. They loved the attention. Brexit like Trump was about destroying multilateral institutions- the EU primarily, but also the UK. The DUP were too blind to see that.
I expect this deal to go tits up, cause there isn't really a deal
The EU have already agreed a few things, which would of course have been agreed anyway had the DUP been in Stormont.
https://twitter.com/EU_Commission/status/1752340346065879267
From listening to big Jeff, I think he's putting the heat back on Westminster , after WM put the heat on the DUP, re: the pay rises/funding
Basically....... We (DUP) will go back to Stormont if you promise to keep your side of the bargain .
Oh, you didn't keep your promises? Ok, we won't go back to Stormont then. NI won't get any funding , and workers still won't get their pay rises.
And it's all your fault, Westminster. Not ours.
And the DUP still won't have to serve under a SF first minister.
Quote from: Dougal Maguire on January 30, 2024, 06:02:22 PMI see they're talking about a meeting of the Assembly on Saturday which could be difficult for double jobbing Justin McNulty
Probably wasn't expecting Stormont to return anytime soon like the rest of us when he took that job
Quote from: johnnycool on January 30, 2024, 04:45:40 PMQuote from: Walter Cronc on January 30, 2024, 04:43:53 PMQuote from: Orior on January 30, 2024, 04:30:04 PMMad stuff by the rat allowing Bryson to tweet the secret meeting. The rat will now be owned by bin man 167. When I say rat, it might be more accurate to say horse.
Carla the tout?
A lot of the twitterati are suggesting it's her, whoever it is can only be sure that Bryson will spill the beans at some point in time.
Would she have the tech skills? Her attempt to use a filter on live TV went spectacularly wrong? She'd probably set the speakers screeching with feedback every time she went near one.
ELP as DFM? Dunno if I have the stomach for this to be honest.
She's a horrendous woman. Sectarian to the core and then cries when she gets voted out like she was some kind of martyr who didn't bow to the UVF in south belfast at every turn.
Married to a sketchy sectarian f**k as well.
Quote from: gallsman on January 31, 2024, 09:00:44 AMMarried to a sketchy sectarian f**k as well.
Chances are that in the next election she wouldn't even make it back to the assembly going by her record. But looks like we are going to have to endure her for the forseeable.
That's if they can get the assembly back up before the, emperor's clothes style of JD's deal are exposed.
I still want to know who is coaching Jamie. Is it Allister just giving him it all written down before his interviews or is it even someone like Dodds. It's certainly not him on his own because the difference between his crap on twitter and then his radio interviews is huge. Didn't daithi McKay prep a lot of his nama stuff (still unsure why he did that).
Quote from: JPGJOHNNYG on January 31, 2024, 10:06:48 AMI still want to know who is coaching Jamie. Is it Allister just giving him it all written down before his interviews or is it even someone like Dodds. It's certainly not him on his own because the difference between his crap on twitter and then his radio interviews is huge. Didn't daithi McKay prep a lot of his nama stuff (still unsure why he did that).
Would you be shocked if he was maybe given the questions to be asked ahead of his appearances on the Radio show.
He is a complete moron and has scuppered any chance of ever being taken seriously (not that there was much chance of that regardless) but no serious politician will ever trust him again. Only a matter of time before he discloses who the moles are, that's if they don't take the initiative and jump before being pushed.
There is a split on the way it is just a matter of how many decide to head over to angry Jim.
Quote from: NAG1 on January 31, 2024, 10:27:30 AMQuote from: JPGJOHNNYG on January 31, 2024, 10:06:48 AMI still want to know who is coaching Jamie. Is it Allister just giving him it all written down before his interviews or is it even someone like Dodds. It's certainly not him on his own because the difference between his crap on twitter and then his radio interviews is huge. Didn't daithi McKay prep a lot of his nama stuff (still unsure why he did that).
Would you be shocked if he was maybe given the questions to be asked ahead of his appearances on the Radio show.
He is a complete moron and has scuppered any chance of ever being taken seriously (not that there was much chance of that regardless) but no serious politician will ever trust him again. Only a matter of time before he discloses who the moles are, that's if they don't take the initiative and jump before being pushed.
There is a split on the way it is just a matter of how many decide to head over to angry Jim.
Can't see there being any split worth talking about. Maybe one or two mental councillors, a token MLA perhaps.
The vast majority of their MLA's will realise they're elected off the back of a party machine rather than any personal vote they might receive. Just look at the TUV and their struggle to get anybody other than Jim Allister elected.
Leaving the party would potentially leave them unemployed after the next election.
Quote from: ranch on January 31, 2024, 12:10:20 PMQuote from: NAG1 on January 31, 2024, 10:27:30 AMQuote from: JPGJOHNNYG on January 31, 2024, 10:06:48 AMI still want to know who is coaching Jamie. Is it Allister just giving him it all written down before his interviews or is it even someone like Dodds. It's certainly not him on his own because the difference between his crap on twitter and then his radio interviews is huge. Didn't daithi McKay prep a lot of his nama stuff (still unsure why he did that).
Would you be shocked if he was maybe given the questions to be asked ahead of his appearances on the Radio show.
He is a complete moron and has scuppered any chance of ever being taken seriously (not that there was much chance of that regardless) but no serious politician will ever trust him again. Only a matter of time before he discloses who the moles are, that's if they don't take the initiative and jump before being pushed.
There is a split on the way it is just a matter of how many decide to head over to angry Jim.
Can't see there being any split worth talking about. Maybe one or two mental councillors, a token MLA perhaps.
The vast majority of their MLA's will realise they're elected off the back of a party machine rather than any personal vote they might receive. Just look at the TUV and their struggle to get anybody other than Jim Allister elected.
Leaving the party would potentially leave them unemployed after the next election.
The impending UK General Election this year will fairly tell a tale as to the impact this will have on Unionism.
Hard to see Ian O'g go to TUV, but may strike out as an independent, possibly Sammy and Lockhart doing the same, Shannon is a moron and will know what side his bread is buttered and stick with the DUP.
Flegory will sit tight I'd say as will the other less vocal MP's.
Bryson after bugging and reporting publicly on a DUP meeting the other night now wants Donaldson to debate him on the contents of the deal. You couldn't make it up.
Quote from: yellowcard on January 31, 2024, 12:45:46 PMBryson after bugging and reporting publicly on a DUP meeting the other night now wants Donaldson to debate him on the contents of the deal. You couldn't make it up.
Can't understand how he hasn't been slapped down for that stunt.
Quote from: Substandard on January 31, 2024, 12:52:37 PMQuote from: yellowcard on January 31, 2024, 12:45:46 PMBryson after bugging and reporting publicly on a DUP meeting the other night now wants Donaldson to debate him on the contents of the deal. You couldn't make it up.
Can't understand how he hasn't been slapped down for that stunt.
I'd imagine it is coming, he has got about 48hrs to wreck the deal JD has in place. So it will ramp up the whole way to Friday.
Quote from: NAG1 on January 31, 2024, 12:59:08 PMQuote from: Substandard on January 31, 2024, 12:52:37 PMQuote from: yellowcard on January 31, 2024, 12:45:46 PMBryson after bugging and reporting publicly on a DUP meeting the other night now wants Donaldson to debate him on the contents of the deal. You couldn't make it up.
Can't understand how he hasn't been slapped down for that stunt.
I'd imagine it is coming, he has got about 48hrs to wreck the deal JD has in place. So it will ramp up the whole way to Friday.
I hope whoever the mole is gets found out, it will wreck their career both in and out of politics
The DUP has to get this over quickly. The essence of the deal is a promise from the UK Government. Hardline Prods want Brexit and a stronger Union. This is impossible. Brexit weaknens the Union.
So we are back to where started in that NI has access (unfettered) to GB and the EU and GB has (unfettered) access to NI.
So answer me this... what has Brexit achieved for Unionists? The people of the North? Am I missing something?
Quote from: trailer on January 31, 2024, 01:29:09 PMSo we are back to where started in that NI has access (unfettered) to GB and the EU and GB has (unfettered) access to NI.
So answer me this... what has Brexit achieved for Unionists? The people of the North? Am I missing something?
You answered your own question
Quote from: johnnycool on January 31, 2024, 12:28:00 PMQuote from: ranch on January 31, 2024, 12:10:20 PMQuote from: NAG1 on January 31, 2024, 10:27:30 AMQuote from: JPGJOHNNYG on January 31, 2024, 10:06:48 AMI still want to know who is coaching Jamie. Is it Allister just giving him it all written down before his interviews or is it even someone like Dodds. It's certainly not him on his own because the difference between his crap on twitter and then his radio interviews is huge. Didn't daithi McKay prep a lot of his nama stuff (still unsure why he did that).
Would you be shocked if he was maybe given the questions to be asked ahead of his appearances on the Radio show.
He is a complete moron and has scuppered any chance of ever being taken seriously (not that there was much chance of that regardless) but no serious politician will ever trust him again. Only a matter of time before he discloses who the moles are, that's if they don't take the initiative and jump before being pushed.
There is a split on the way it is just a matter of how many decide to head over to angry Jim.
Can't see there being any split worth talking about. Maybe one or two mental councillors, a token MLA perhaps.
The vast majority of their MLA's will realise they're elected off the back of a party machine rather than any personal vote they might receive. Just look at the TUV and their struggle to get anybody other than Jim Allister elected.
Leaving the party would potentially leave them unemployed after the next election.
The impending UK General Election this year will fairly tell a tale as to the impact this will have on Unionism.
Hard to see Ian O'g go to TUV, but may strike out as an independent, possibly Sammy and Lockhart doing the same, Shannon is a moron and will know what side his bread is buttered and stick with the DUP.
Flegory will sit tight I'd say as will the other less vocal MP's.
Lockhart has a safe seat, she'll not quit the party. Ian Paisley likewise.
They'll hold their own at the next GE. No real threats within Unionism to take a seat off them. If anything they could improve their vote with an agreement with the UUP to give one another a free run in certain areas (DUP step aside for the UUP in FST and vice versa in North Belfast). The TUV will only ever be a party of protest within Unionism with Jim as a MLA and a loony councillor here and there.
Why would the UUP partner up with the DUP considering they fecking hate each other?
Would it not be a case that the UUP may make a little gain if the DUP and the TUV got at each other again? Add in maybe someone going independent it may change
Nobody has broke cover from within the DUP yet.... Says a lot.
Jeffrey on talkback spoke quote well. Really put his opponents within Unionism in their place without naming names.
Quote from: trailer on January 31, 2024, 01:58:35 PMNobody has broke cover from within the DUP yet.... Says a lot.
That there's more than one spineless cúnt in that party?
Remarkable how the Command Paper is written. All about doing a deal with the DUP, strengthening NI's place in the Union etc, As one sided as you'll ever see, no surprise I suppose. You'd never guess there's a nationalist First Minister incoming.
SF must be willing to tolerate it all because they want the First Minister prize. I can understand that.
See tweets circulating about road blocking by the Loyalists on Friday. The 'TOs are working hard behind the scenes.
As I said before, it's all smoke, mirrors and fudge words to get it over the line.
In reality, nothing has changed.
Unionism is in crisis. That is the big picture. One of the reasons the DUP stayed out of Stormont is that the momentum is with the Shinners.
Quote from: bennydorano on January 31, 2024, 05:46:46 PMSee tweets circulating about road blocking by the Loyalists on Friday. The 'TOs are working hard behind the scenes.
You'd think they'd be delighted their drug shipments will come through without checks.
Quote from: marty34 on January 31, 2024, 05:47:31 PMAs I said before, it's all smoke, mirrors and fudge words to get it over the line.
In reality, nothing has changed.
100%
The reason why the DUP "moved" now , is to hang onto their seats and big salaries. This is all in their own interests, nobody else's.
The lack of any criticism from Nationalists would suggest "we" have no particular real issues about the thing.
Does the "Stormont brake" mean Unionists can block any EU Laws being implemented in the 6?
Quote from: Rossfan on January 31, 2024, 06:58:55 PMThe lack of any criticism from Nationalists would suggest "we" have no particular real issues about the thing.
Does the "Stormont brake" mean Unionists can block any EU Laws being implemented in the 6?
It means they can cry to Westminster about it but they can chose to ignore them
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on January 31, 2024, 01:49:40 PMWhy would the UUP partner up with the DUP considering they fecking hate each other?
Would it not be a case that the UUP may make a little gain if the DUP and the TUV got at each other again? Add in maybe someone going independent it may change
They do hate one another, that hasn't stopped them stepping aside in certain seats in the past. The UUP have a choice if the DUP suggest an election pact - accept it and potentially win a seat, reject it and lose anyway.
Quote from: bennydorano on January 31, 2024, 05:46:46 PMSee tweets circulating about road blocking by the Loyalists on Friday. The 'TOs are working hard behind the scenes.
Last sting of a dying wasp. Their Union is fucked. And the irony is they are responsible because of their stupidity and outright bigotry in backing Brexit.
Quote from: red hander on January 31, 2024, 07:24:41 PMQuote from: bennydorano on January 31, 2024, 05:46:46 PMSee tweets circulating about road blocking by the Loyalists on Friday. The 'TOs are working hard behind the scenes.
Last sting of a dying wasp. Their Union is fucked. And the irony is they are responsible because of their stupidity and outright bigotry in backing Brexit.
Hoping I'm on a road they are trying to block
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on January 31, 2024, 08:07:59 PMQuote from: red hander on January 31, 2024, 07:24:41 PMQuote from: bennydorano on January 31, 2024, 05:46:46 PMSee tweets circulating about road blocking by the Loyalists on Friday. The 'TOs are working hard behind the scenes.
Last sting of a dying wasp. Their Union is fucked. And the irony is they are responsible because of their stupidity and outright bigotry in backing Brexit.
Hoping I'm on a road they are trying to block
Don't give the wee scrotes any excuse to get a claim off you. No doubt they'll all have their phones out.
Water cannon heading up the road this evening.
Quote from: RedHand88 on January 31, 2024, 08:47:39 PMQuote from: Milltown Row2 on January 31, 2024, 08:07:59 PMQuote from: red hander on January 31, 2024, 07:24:41 PMQuote from: bennydorano on January 31, 2024, 05:46:46 PMSee tweets circulating about road blocking by the Loyalists on Friday. The 'TOs are working hard behind the scenes.
Last sting of a dying wasp. Their Union is fucked. And the irony is they are responsible because of their stupidity and outright bigotry in backing Brexit.
Hoping I'm on a road they are trying to block
Don't give the wee scrotes any excuse to get a claim off you. No doubt they'll all have their phones out.
I'll be having my phone out!
Quote from: Rossfan on January 31, 2024, 06:58:55 PMThe lack of any criticism from Nationalists would suggest "we" have no particular real issues about the thing.
Does the "Stormont brake" mean Unionists can block any EU Laws being implemented in the 6?
It's farmers in 26 who should be more worried. All it will take is one dodgy lorry of livestock to come in from Britain that could jeopardise Irish trade deals. EU and Dublin forced Britain into a deal that was in Ireland's interest, now Tories are saying no checks on internal Uk trade. Britain has had zero controls on goods coming into Britain. Even Brits are worried about their own biosecurity. That's a haulier away from Ireland. I don't think Sinn Féin or SDLP are on the ball with this at all. Nor is Martin. Leo is bored off it now. Coveney was a big loss in that roll.
Quote from: weareros on January 31, 2024, 10:39:52 PMQuote from: Rossfan on January 31, 2024, 06:58:55 PMThe lack of any criticism from Nationalists would suggest "we" have no particular real issues about the thing.
Does the "Stormont brake" mean Unionists can block any EU Laws being implemented in the 6?
It's farmers in 26 who should be more worried. All it will take is one dodgy lorry of livestock to come in from Britain that could jeopardise Irish trade deals. EU and Dublin forced Britain into a deal that was in Ireland's interest, now Tories are saying no checks on internal Uk trade. Britain has had zero controls on goods coming into Britain. Even Brits are worried about their own biosecurity. That's a haulier away from Ireland. I don't think Sinn Féin or SDLP are on the ball with this at all. Nor is Martin. Leo is bored off it now. Coveney was a big loss in that roll.
Would there not be that sorta trading going on under the counter anyways over the years?
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on January 31, 2024, 10:43:56 PMQuote from: weareros on January 31, 2024, 10:39:52 PMQuote from: Rossfan on January 31, 2024, 06:58:55 PMThe lack of any criticism from Nationalists would suggest "we" have no particular real issues about the thing.
Does the "Stormont brake" mean Unionists can block any EU Laws being implemented in the 6?
It's farmers in 26 who should be more worried. All it will take is one dodgy lorry of livestock to come in from Britain that could jeopardise Irish trade deals. EU and Dublin forced Britain into a deal that was in Ireland's interest, now Tories are saying no checks on internal Uk trade. Britain has had zero controls on goods coming into Britain. Even Brits are worried about their own biosecurity. That's a haulier away from Ireland. I don't think Sinn Féin or SDLP are on the ball with this at all. Nor is Martin. Leo is bored off it now. Coveney was a big loss in that roll.
Would there not be that sorta trading going on under the counter anyways over the years?
GB was aligned to EU standards so there was no widespread risk. Now they have pesticides banned in EU, substandard beef coming in from other countries, more liberal rules on GMO foodstuffs. Once that gets into Irish food chain, it will destroy reputation of Irish agriculture. The likes of China won't hesitate to ban Irish beef again. Some of the North's farming practices are very questionable to begin with (livestock and chickens in close proximity). This opens the door to making it worse. And you will probably have a DUPer on agriculture to make it worse like the measly fines Poots implemented for polluting lakes and rivers. That lot don't care about the land so long as they can put a flag up on it.
Not really, Ireland will bring in something to highlight different of beef from the North. China ban Irush Beef, ha, they hardly a guiding light in food practices, Man best friend vouch for that.
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on January 31, 2024, 08:07:59 PMQuote from: red hander on January 31, 2024, 07:24:41 PMQuote from: bennydorano on January 31, 2024, 05:46:46 PMSee tweets circulating about road blocking by the Loyalists on Friday. The 'TOs are working hard behind the scenes.
Last sting of a dying wasp. Their Union is fucked. And the irony is they are responsible because of their stupidity and outright bigotry in backing Brexit.
Hoping I'm on a road they are trying to block
Why ?
Quote from: Jim Bob on February 01, 2024, 07:30:47 AMQuote from: Milltown Row2 on January 31, 2024, 08:07:59 PMQuote from: red hander on January 31, 2024, 07:24:41 PMQuote from: bennydorano on January 31, 2024, 05:46:46 PMSee tweets circulating about road blocking by the Loyalists on Friday. The 'TOs are working hard behind the scenes.
Last sting of a dying wasp. Their Union is fucked. And the irony is they are responsible because of their stupidity and outright bigotry in backing Brexit.
Hoping I'm on a road they are trying to block
Why ?
As I'll be going through the road block, I'll be asking the question when I get to the front, why are they blocking the road. The answers should be entertaining.
I'd say most haven't read the new framework
Most have never voted
Many will not understand the benefits of being part of both the EU and UK
None of the issues surrounding the red and green lanes would have had made a difference to their lives.
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on February 01, 2024, 07:37:33 AMQuote from: Jim Bob on February 01, 2024, 07:30:47 AMQuote from: Milltown Row2 on January 31, 2024, 08:07:59 PMQuote from: red hander on January 31, 2024, 07:24:41 PMQuote from: bennydorano on January 31, 2024, 05:46:46 PMSee tweets circulating about road blocking by the Loyalists on Friday. The 'TOs are working hard behind the scenes.
Last sting of a dying wasp. Their Union is fucked. And the irony is they are responsible because of their stupidity and outright bigotry in backing Brexit.
Hoping I'm on a road they are trying to block
Why ?
As I'll be going through the road block, I'll be asking the question when I get to the front, why are they blocking the road. The answers should be entertaining.
I'd say most haven't read the new framework
Most have never voted
Many will not understand the benefits of being part of both the EU and UK
None of the issues surrounding the red and green lanes would have had made a difference to their lives.
Would it be worth winning an argument but having your car burned out?
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on February 01, 2024, 07:37:33 AMQuote from: Jim Bob on February 01, 2024, 07:30:47 AMQuote from: Milltown Row2 on January 31, 2024, 08:07:59 PMQuote from: red hander on January 31, 2024, 07:24:41 PMQuote from: bennydorano on January 31, 2024, 05:46:46 PMSee tweets circulating about road blocking by the Loyalists on Friday. The 'TOs are working hard behind the scenes.
Last sting of a dying wasp. Their Union is fucked. And the irony is they are responsible because of their stupidity and outright bigotry in backing Brexit.
Hoping I'm on a road they are trying to block
Why ?
As I'll be going through the road block, I'll be asking the question when I get to the front, why are they blocking the road. The answers should be entertaining.
I'd say most haven't read the new framework
Most have never voted
Many will not understand the benefits of being part of both the EU and UK
None of the issues surrounding the red and green lanes would have had made a difference to their lives.
The agreement and the protocol make incredibly boring reading (agreement is 80 pages of legal text). It's quite dense and long winded, as laws tend to be.
There isn't a hope in hell any of them will have read a paragraph of it.
Quote from: maddog on February 01, 2024, 08:00:39 AMQuote from: Milltown Row2 on February 01, 2024, 07:37:33 AMQuote from: Jim Bob on February 01, 2024, 07:30:47 AMQuote from: Milltown Row2 on January 31, 2024, 08:07:59 PMQuote from: red hander on January 31, 2024, 07:24:41 PMQuote from: bennydorano on January 31, 2024, 05:46:46 PMSee tweets circulating about road blocking by the Loyalists on Friday. The 'TOs are working hard behind the scenes.
Last sting of a dying wasp. Their Union is fucked. And the irony is they are responsible because of their stupidity and outright bigotry in backing Brexit.
Hoping I'm on a road they are trying to block
Why ?
As I'll be going through the road block, I'll be asking the question when I get to the front, why are they blocking the road. The answers should be entertaining.
I'd say most haven't read the new framework
Most have never voted
Many will not understand the benefits of being part of both the EU and UK
None of the issues surrounding the red and green lanes would have had made a difference to their lives.
Would it be worth winning an argument but having your car burned out?
The man wants a new car leave him alone
Trust me there will be no burning of cars, this mob will do nothing, they stand in their own areas and make their own locals days a misery
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on February 01, 2024, 08:38:11 AMTrust me there will be no burning of cars, this mob will do nothing, they stand in their own areas and make their own locals days a misery
I see they blaming Nationalists/ Republicans for circulating this list of roads to be blocked.
Will be interesting to see if anything materialises.
Quote from: weareros on January 31, 2024, 10:39:52 PMQuote from: Rossfan on January 31, 2024, 06:58:55 PMThe lack of any criticism from Nationalists would suggest "we" have no particular real issues about the thing.
Does the "Stormont brake" mean Unionists can block any EU Laws being implemented in the 6?
It's farmers in 26 who should be more worried. All it will take is one dodgy lorry of livestock to come in from Britain that could jeopardise Irish trade deals. EU and Dublin forced Britain into a deal that was in Ireland's interest, now Tories are saying no checks on internal Uk trade. Britain has had zero controls on goods coming into Britain. Even Brits are worried about their own biosecurity. That's a haulier away from Ireland. I don't think Sinn Féin or SDLP are on the ball with this at all. Nor is Martin. Leo is bored off it now. Coveney was a big loss in that roll.
Always been checks on Livestock from GB to NI and vice versa. Can't imagine that will ever change.
Quote from: Rossfan on January 31, 2024, 06:58:55 PMThe lack of any criticism from Nationalists would suggest "we" have no particular real issues about the thing.
Does the "Stormont brake" mean Unionists can block any EU Laws being implemented in the 6?
With the exception of the party leaders no other politician is really saying much.
From what I understand the agreement is a 76 page document and no doubt probably a bit too much to process for the calibre of politicians we have so no doubt if they exposed themselves to be interviewed on it they could be found wanting.
Main thing from their perspective is they are back up to full wages. I wonder if any will be brave enough to come out and say until nurses, bus drivers etc get sorted as a sign of solidarity they will return to work on their current reduced salary, some chance.
Hard to believe it took two years to come up with that "agreement". Some checks will be reduced but the rest is very much smoothing out a few rough edges of the Framework. Luckily for the DUP the vast majority of Unionism doesn't care and wants the Assembly up and running again. The next big issue is unmasking the DUP's Stakeknife (or knives)
At what point does SF/SDLP pull the plug until a border poll is called 8)
Quote from: Hereiam on February 01, 2024, 10:01:59 AMAt what point does SF/SDLP pull the plug until a border poll is called 8)
Yes, some of the stuff that CHH and other politicians came out with yesterday flew under the radar and was eye watering in its lack of understanding of the GFA.
Quote from: Pub Bore on February 01, 2024, 10:14:09 AMQuote from: Hereiam on February 01, 2024, 10:01:59 AMAt what point does SF/SDLP pull the plug until a border poll is called 8)
Yes, some of the stuff that CHH and other politicians came out with yesterday flew under the radar and was eye watering in its lack of understanding of the GFA.
At this stage I think they will say anything to get the assembly back up and running and SF are not going to pull them on it until it is.
Yet to see anything that devastating, that would prevent JD marching them back up the hill. Everyone and their dog knew it was the MPs holding out this, all on really cushy numbers with no impact on their income or lifestyle from the assembly being down. So they could come across as hard line as they want to play to the galleries.
One thing that maybe has flown under the radar is the possible reduction in Corporation tax here. Looking forward to that for sure. Would be a massive boost to business and the local economy if they can pull it off. Be interesting to see if we have the political ability to get that done.
But but but....that would make "Northern Ireland different to the rest of the UK".....
Quote from: trailer on February 01, 2024, 10:37:23 AMOne thing that maybe has flown under the radar is the possible reduction in Corporation tax here. Looking forward to that for sure. Would be a massive boost to business and the local economy if they can pull it off. Be interesting to see if we have the political ability to get that done.
I read that too.
I also read that as a reduction in corporation tax would mean a reduction in money paid to the British Exchequer from NI, the block grant would then also be reduced accordingly.
So it could be a case of giving on one hand and taking on the other with no net gain....and possibly even a net loss to NI Ltd.
Quote from: tbrick18 on February 01, 2024, 11:32:12 AMQuote from: trailer on February 01, 2024, 10:37:23 AMOne thing that maybe has flown under the radar is the possible reduction in Corporation tax here. Looking forward to that for sure. Would be a massive boost to business and the local economy if they can pull it off. Be interesting to see if we have the political ability to get that done.
I read that too.
I also read that as a reduction in corporation tax would mean a reduction in money paid to the British Exchequer from NI, the block grant would then also be reduced accordingly.
So it could be a case of giving on one hand and taking on the other with no net gain....and possibly even a net loss to NI Ltd.
Is this the beginning of the weaning process?
Quote from: NAG1 on February 01, 2024, 11:44:04 AMQuote from: tbrick18 on February 01, 2024, 11:32:12 AMQuote from: trailer on February 01, 2024, 10:37:23 AMOne thing that maybe has flown under the radar is the possible reduction in Corporation tax here. Looking forward to that for sure. Would be a massive boost to business and the local economy if they can pull it off. Be interesting to see if we have the political ability to get that done.
I read that too.
I also read that as a reduction in corporation tax would mean a reduction in money paid to the British Exchequer from NI, the block grant would then also be reduced accordingly.
So it could be a case of giving on one hand and taking on the other with no net gain....and possibly even a net loss to NI Ltd.
Is this the beginning of the weaning process?
Just create another 'issue' leave the Assembly and get some favours to get back in, rinse and repeat when necessary
Quote from: tbrick18 on February 01, 2024, 11:32:12 AMQuote from: trailer on February 01, 2024, 10:37:23 AMOne thing that maybe has flown under the radar is the possible reduction in Corporation tax here. Looking forward to that for sure. Would be a massive boost to business and the local economy if they can pull it off. Be interesting to see if we have the political ability to get that done.
I read that too.
I also read that as a reduction in corporation tax would mean a reduction in money paid to the British Exchequer from NI, the block grant would then also be reduced accordingly.
So it could be a case of giving on one hand and taking on the other with no net gain....and possibly even a net loss to NI Ltd.
And absolutely the right approach. It means our politicians will actually have to do what they are paid to do, i.e. do a cost benefit analysis and determine if the reduction in tax rate will have a net positive outcome, whether through increased employment or higher taxable profits as more companies relocate. Unfortunately an approach like that needs a stable political base and competent ministers, something I think we are sadly lacking. It should not be a case of "cut tax for the sake of it and sure Whitehall will bail us out to make sure we are no worse off." This begging bowl approach has to stop.
I think this episode over the last few years has woken up a lot of Tories as to what a pain in the arse NI is to UK. And all thanks to the DUP. ;D ;D
Quote from: Pub Bore on February 01, 2024, 10:14:09 AMQuote from: Hereiam on February 01, 2024, 10:01:59 AMAt what point does SF/SDLP pull the plug until a border poll is called 8)
Yes, some of the stuff that CHH and other politicians came out with yesterday flew under the radar and was eye watering in its lack of understanding of the GFA.
Buttering up the DUP, but we'd need to be careful they don't slip some shít under the radar impacting the calling of a border poll
The was a Labour MP interviewed yesterday and she obviously wasn't aware of the UK Governments supposed position in the event of a border poll either.
The Corporation Tax case was made before Brexit, and it did make economic sense back then. Many of my colleagues were involved in the investigative groundwork, and certainly the community of chartered accountants (of which I'm a member) was majority in favour of tax powers devolving here. Not sure how much things will have changed by now.
Quote from: johnnycool on February 01, 2024, 12:06:22 PMQuote from: Pub Bore on February 01, 2024, 10:14:09 AMQuote from: Hereiam on February 01, 2024, 10:01:59 AMAt what point does SF/SDLP pull the plug until a border poll is called 8)
Yes, some of the stuff that CHH and other politicians came out with yesterday flew under the radar and was eye watering in its lack of understanding of the GFA.
Buttering up the DUP, but we'd need to be careful they don't slip some shít under the radar impacting the calling of a border poll
The was a Labour MP interviewed yesterday and she obviously wasn't aware of the UK Governments supposed position in the event of a border poll either.
Saw that on Sky. She's obviously as thick as pigshit, which is all that charlatan Starmer wants in his party, but that odious cow Burley had no idea about what she was on about either and completely lacking in research in her questions. She has a history of ill-researched shit stirring.
Quote from: johnnycool on February 01, 2024, 12:06:22 PMQuote from: Pub Bore on February 01, 2024, 10:14:09 AMQuote from: Hereiam on February 01, 2024, 10:01:59 AMAt what point does SF/SDLP pull the plug until a border poll is called 8)
Yes, some of the stuff that CHH and other politicians came out with yesterday flew under the radar and was eye watering in its lack of understanding of the GFA.
Buttering up the DUP, but we'd need to be careful they don't slip some shít under the radar impacting the calling of a border poll
The was a Labour MP interviewed yesterday and she obviously wasn't aware of the UK Governments supposed position in the event of a border poll either.
That was Tulip Siddiq. She represents Kilburn! ::)
Quote from: johnnycool on February 01, 2024, 12:06:22 PMQuote from: Pub Bore on February 01, 2024, 10:14:09 AMQuote from: Hereiam on February 01, 2024, 10:01:59 AMAt what point does SF/SDLP pull the plug until a border poll is called 8)
Yes, some of the stuff that CHH and other politicians came out with yesterday flew under the radar and was eye watering in its lack of understanding of the GFA.
Buttering up the DUP, but we'd need to be careful they don't slip some shít under the radar impacting the calling of a border poll
The was a Labour MP interviewed yesterday and she obviously wasn't aware of the UK Governments supposed position in the event of a border poll either.
Well Keir Starmer doesn't know either as he has already said he will be campaigning pro-union during any campaign instead of the supposed neutrality
Quote from: Rois on February 01, 2024, 12:12:46 PMThe Corporation Tax case was made before Brexit, and it did make economic sense back then. Many of my colleagues were involved in the investigative groundwork, and certainly the community of chartered accountants (of which I'm a member) was majority in favour of tax powers devolving here. Not sure how much things will have changed by now.
I'd be careful in which powers to devolve. Our politicians are largely incompetent. We already pay 2 million a year for a non existent flight to NYC. We all remember RHI.
I think a cut in corporation tax to make it attractive to companies to invest would be fine, but to allow them to make decisions with income tax, inheritance tax, stamp duty definitely No.
Quote from: red hander on February 01, 2024, 12:14:13 PMQuote from: johnnycool on February 01, 2024, 12:06:22 PMQuote from: Pub Bore on February 01, 2024, 10:14:09 AMQuote from: Hereiam on February 01, 2024, 10:01:59 AMAt what point does SF/SDLP pull the plug until a border poll is called 8)
Yes, some of the stuff that CHH and other politicians came out with yesterday flew under the radar and was eye watering in its lack of understanding of the GFA.
Buttering up the DUP, but we'd need to be careful they don't slip some shít under the radar impacting the calling of a border poll
The was a Labour MP interviewed yesterday and she obviously wasn't aware of the UK Governments supposed position in the event of a border poll either.
Saw that on Sky. She's obviously as thick as pigshit, which is all that charlatan Starmer wants in his party, but that odious cow Burley had no idea about what she was on about either and completely lacking in research in her questions. She has a history of ill-researched shit stirring.
Saw it too and what I took from it was like 99% of MPs in the UK she a) didn't have the first clue about anything to do with politics in the North and b) didn't give a shit about it either.
When is she going to get the pay rise? Hearing teachers may get 8.5% any chance that will be back dated? ;)
Apparently, oul whiskey nose himself is backing the 'Betrayal Deal'. Bin Boy will be going even more apeshit. Need to restock the popcorn supplies.
Hearing the MLAs voices on the radio every day now is only bringing back bad memories for me. I couldn't think of half a dozen who I'd rate as serious operators.
It was funny watching aul Willie Irvine stopping the car outside the gates of the hotel the other night to speak to the protestors. Like most local politicians he's been stealing a living for years spoofing away and chairing the agriculture committee at one stage I think. He couldn't get the window up quick enough when the heat came on.
The quick win will be a public sector pay rise, and there'll be plenty of photo shoots if they want it portraying stability, which is no bad thing if it brings in some jobs.
But not a ward nor small school will they have the balls to shut, so don't be expecting big change.
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2024/feb/01/post-brexit-food-labelling-rules-to-appease-dup-will-lead-to-higher-prices-says-industry
Wee Jeff and the boys making food more expensive for everyone in the UK!
Big Gavin Robinson denying the existence of an All Island economy...
Someone better not tell him or those big Protestant farmers where those Lakeland Dairies lorries loaded with their milk every morning goes!
They must live in total denial.
Do him better to deny the existence of pies
Quote from: johnnycool on February 01, 2024, 04:32:41 PMBig Gavin Robinson denying the existence of an All Island economy...
Someone better not tell him or those big Protestant farmers where those Lakeland Dairies lorries loaded with their milk every morning goes!
They must live in total denial.
He doesn't. But the muppets that give him his vote does so he plays that game as well. Do you think many DUP voters in East Belfast know anything about anything related to farming never mind understanding of milk chains?
Quote from: NAG1 on February 01, 2024, 08:49:27 AMQuote from: Milltown Row2 on February 01, 2024, 08:38:11 AMTrust me there will be no burning of cars, this mob will do nothing, they stand in their own areas and make their own locals days a misery
I see they blaming Nationalists/ Republicans for circulating this list of roads to be blocked.
Will be interesting to see if anything materialises.
Where's this list at?
Quote from: TabClear on February 01, 2024, 11:55:03 AMQuote from: tbrick18 on February 01, 2024, 11:32:12 AMQuote from: trailer on February 01, 2024, 10:37:23 AMOne thing that maybe has flown under the radar is the possible reduction in Corporation tax here. Looking forward to that for sure. Would be a massive boost to business and the local economy if they can pull it off. Be interesting to see if we have the political ability to get that done.
I read that too.
I also read that as a reduction in corporation tax would mean a reduction in money paid to the British Exchequer from NI, the block grant would then also be reduced accordingly.
So it could be a case of giving on one hand and taking on the other with no net gain....and possibly even a net loss to NI Ltd.
And absolutely the right approach. It means our politicians will actually have to do what they are paid to do, i.e. do a cost benefit analysis and determine if the reduction in tax rate will have a net positive outcome, whether through increased employment or higher taxable profits as more companies relocate. Unfortunately an approach like that needs a stable political base and competent ministers, something I think we are sadly lacking. It should not be a case of "cut tax for the sake of it and sure Whitehall will bail us out to make sure we are no worse off." This begging bowl approach has to stop.
I think this episode over the last few years has woken up a lot of Tories as to what a pain in the arse NI is to UK. And all thanks to the DUP. ;D ;D
The issue will be we'll have to pay for water and perscription charges etc.
There'll be some uproar over that.
All well and good saying politicians have to make mature decisions but when they have to make these type of decisions, there'll be some whinging and complaining.
Donaldson seems to have weathered the storm and has done a reasonable job getting his deal out there. The extreme hardliners will never get a deal that satisfies them so things will move on now but I have my doubts over how well Stormont will ultimately work. There have been a lot of damaged relationships between the parties since Brexit began as the loyalist moon howlers attempt to obstruct any semblance of progression.
Its been a whirlwind week for Unionist politics overall but I still can't get my head around the fact that a DUP member wore a wire into a meeting connected to a UVF linked agitator who then put it into the public domain. Espionage without any shame. It's a story that Nolan would normally salivate over if you replaced the characters involved in it. A sure fire way to stoke up the outrage and boast about ratings but yet he has barely mentioned it all week on loyalist radio.
Quote from: marty34 on February 01, 2024, 06:13:59 PMQuote from: TabClear on February 01, 2024, 11:55:03 AMQuote from: tbrick18 on February 01, 2024, 11:32:12 AMQuote from: trailer on February 01, 2024, 10:37:23 AMOne thing that maybe has flown under the radar is the possible reduction in Corporation tax here. Looking forward to that for sure. Would be a massive boost to business and the local economy if they can pull it off. Be interesting to see if we have the political ability to get that done.
I read that too.
I also read that as a reduction in corporation tax would mean a reduction in money paid to the British Exchequer from NI, the block grant would then also be reduced accordingly.
So it could be a case of giving on one hand and taking on the other with no net gain....and possibly even a net loss to NI Ltd.
And absolutely the right approach. It means our politicians will actually have to do what they are paid to do, i.e. do a cost benefit analysis and determine if the reduction in tax rate will have a net positive outcome, whether through increased employment or higher taxable profits as more companies relocate. Unfortunately an approach like that needs a stable political base and competent ministers, something I think we are sadly lacking. It should not be a case of "cut tax for the sake of it and sure Whitehall will bail us out to make sure we are no worse off." This begging bowl approach has to stop.
I think this episode over the last few years has woken up a lot of Tories as to what a pain in the arse NI is to UK. And all thanks to the DUP. ;D ;D
The issue will be we'll have to pay for water and perscription charges etc.
There'll be some uproar over that.
All well and good saying politicians have to make mature decisions but when they have to make these type of decisions, there'll be some whinging and complaining.
As there should be.
Bin boy giving a speech to the mutants in the Village of the Damned tonight. Moygashel needs a new idiot after the old one died from toxic shock syndrome when he had a wash. Agent 167 is perfectly qualified.
Quote from: red hander on February 01, 2024, 06:33:03 PMBin boy giving a speech to the mutants in the Village of the Damned tonight. Moygashel needs a new idiot after the old one died from toxic shock syndrome when he had a wash. Agent 167 is perfectly qualified.
It'd be funny if someone tweeted out from the meeting.
The rugby is on Friday and the Assembly sits on Saturday . trina cheile.
Who is likely to get the ministerial jobs?
Quote from: Duine Inteacht Eile on February 01, 2024, 08:42:14 PMSinn Fein - Economy, Education, Communities
DUP - Finance, Health
Alliance - Justice, Agriculture
Not sure who is left for Infrastructure
UUP are due a post but haven't decided if they'll take one or remain in opposition.
Quote from: lurganblue on February 02, 2024, 08:45:45 AMQuote from: Duine Inteacht Eile on February 01, 2024, 08:42:14 PMSinn Fein - Economy, Education, Communities
DUP - Finance, Health
Alliance - Justice, Agriculture
Not sure who is left for Infrastructure
UUP are due a post but haven't decided if they'll take one or remain in opposition.
Doug wants to take opposition, just needs to persuade his party. O'Toole would be gutted.
Still can't get over how one sided that Command Paper is. It openly boasts that this is a Government/DUP deal, actively seeks to de-legitimise the All Island economy, and sets up a load of structures to keep the focus on NI-GB. Parity of esteem?
SDLP have called it out.
SF strategy seems to be don't rock the boat, let's get Michelle in, and we'll take it from there.
Good to see Mark Carruthers picking up on the DUP's double standards last night when Paul Girvan said it was "unhelpful" for Mary Lou talking about the prospect of a UI, yet it's OK for the DUP and associated Tory ministers talking up strengthening the union.
There's no concern for nationalist sensitivities when it comes to this evidently.
How many thousand turned up at the Binlid/Angry Jim shindig?
Shinners obviously want to get the feet under the Executive table so are keeping mum.
Quote from: Rossfan on February 02, 2024, 10:34:31 AMHow many thousand turned up at the Binlid/Angry Jim shindig?
Shinners obviously want to get the feet under the Executive table so are keeping mum.
50 odd in in Moygashel...
It seems Moygashel and Markethill are their go to places, not Donaghadee, not East Belfast, not Larne.
I find that quite strange.
As for SF, each and every representative interviewed from now on should make it abundantly clear they striving for a UI and fúck Unionist sensitivities.
is the road blocks all talk
Quote from: johnnycool on February 02, 2024, 11:04:38 AMQuote from: Rossfan on February 02, 2024, 10:34:31 AMHow many thousand turned up at the Binlid/Angry Jim shindig?
Shinners obviously want to get the feet under the Executive table so are keeping mum.
50 odd in in Moygashel...
It seems Moygashel and Markethill are their go to places, not Donaghadee, not East Belfast, not Larne.
I find that quite strange.
As for SF, each and every representative interviewed from now on should make it abundantly clear they striving for a UI and fúck Unionist sensitivities.
Having first hand experience of Moygashel, it's right up the Bryson/Allister street.
Bigots and racists. If you're non-loyalist, if you're non-white, if you're a foreign national....you'll get burned out of moygashel.
In terms of SF - I don't think they need to draw attention to the one sidedness of the agreement between dup and WM. I think now, when they are in the ascendancy with the electorate, the demographics are going in one direction they need to make some good progress for all people in NI before the next election. Then, when election mode is on and from that point on they have the referenceability of governing for all and so the UI can be called for to benefit all.
What ever people think of SF, they have been running rings around the unionist parties for well over a decade in terms of politics.
Quote from: tbrick18 on February 02, 2024, 11:12:52 AMQuote from: johnnycool on February 02, 2024, 11:04:38 AMQuote from: Rossfan on February 02, 2024, 10:34:31 AMHow many thousand turned up at the Binlid/Angry Jim shindig?
Shinners obviously want to get the feet under the Executive table so are keeping mum.
50 odd in in Moygashel...
It seems Moygashel and Markethill are their go to places, not Donaghadee, not East Belfast, not Larne.
I find that quite strange.
As for SF, each and every representative interviewed from now on should make it abundantly clear they striving for a UI and fúck Unionist sensitivities.
Having first hand experience of Moygashel, it's right up the Bryson/Allister street.
Bigots and racists. If you're non-loyalist, if you're non-white, if you're a foreign national....you'll get burned out of moygashel.
In terms of SF - I don't think they need to draw attention to the one sidedness of the agreement between dup and WM. I think now, when they are in the ascendancy with the electorate, the demographics are going in one direction they need to make some good progress for all people in NI before the next election. Then, when election mode is on and from that point on they have the referenceability of governing for all and so the UI can be called for to benefit all.
What ever people think of SF, they have been running rings around the unionist parties for well over a decade in terms of politics.
"Non-white", saw pictures of some Asian lad stood next to big Jim at the meeting he must have gotten lost ;D .Reminds me of that famous Muslim rangers lad who then joined the EDL you couldn't make it up
Quote from: tbrick18 on February 02, 2024, 11:12:52 AMQuote from: johnnycool on February 02, 2024, 11:04:38 AMQuote from: Rossfan on February 02, 2024, 10:34:31 AMHow many thousand turned up at the Binlid/Angry Jim shindig?
Shinners obviously want to get the feet under the Executive table so are keeping mum.
50 odd in in Moygashel...
It seems Moygashel and Markethill are their go to places, not Donaghadee, not East Belfast, not Larne.
I find that quite strange.
As for SF, each and every representative interviewed from now on should make it abundantly clear they striving for a UI and fúck Unionist sensitivities.
Having first hand experience of Moygashel, it's right up the Bryson/Allister street.
Bigots and racists. If you're non-loyalist, if you're non-white, if you're a foreign national....you'll get burned out of moygashel.
In terms of SF - I don't think they need to draw attention to the one sidedness of the agreement between dup and WM. I think now, when they are in the ascendancy with the electorate, the demographics are going in one direction they need to make some good progress for all people in NI before the next election. Then, when election mode is on and from that point on they have the referenceability of governing for all and so the UI can be called for to benefit all.
What ever people think of SF, they have been running rings around the unionist parties for well over a decade in terms of politics.
Markethill wouldn't be much better. Remember their disgusting soldier F banners a few years back and plenty of UVF signs in it now plus their Israeli flags.
Quote from: johnnycool on February 02, 2024, 11:04:38 AMQuote from: Rossfan on February 02, 2024, 10:34:31 AMHow many thousand turned up at the Binlid/Angry Jim shindig?
Shinners obviously want to get the feet under the Executive table so are keeping mum.
It seems Moygashel and Markethill are their go to places, not Donaghadee, not East Belfast, not Larne.
I find that quite strange.
Its the pitchfork brigade. East Belfast wouldn't know what a pitchfork was for.
Our Mississippi.
Quote from: maddog on February 02, 2024, 11:23:14 AMQuote from: johnnycool on February 02, 2024, 11:04:38 AMQuote from: Rossfan on February 02, 2024, 10:34:31 AMHow many thousand turned up at the Binlid/Angry Jim shindig?
Shinners obviously want to get the feet under the Executive table so are keeping mum.
It seems Moygashel and Markethill are their go to places, not Donaghadee, not East Belfast, not Larne.
I find that quite strange.
Its the pitchfork brigade. East Belfast wouldn't know what a pitchfork was for.
A Machete or a bull hook, well that's a different story. ;D
I don't know if this is a new thing or not, I certainly don't recall hearing it before but BBC news earlier was talking about the pro-British Democratic Unionist Party. Anyone else notice this.
Quote from: Harold Disgracey on February 02, 2024, 12:15:32 PMI don't know if this is a new thing or not, I certainly don't recall hearing it before but BBC news earlier was talking about the pro-British Democratic Unionist Party. Anyone else notice this.
Is there an anti British one?
Quote from: Duine Inteacht Eile on February 01, 2024, 08:42:14 PMSinn Fein - Economy, Education, Communities
DUP - Finance, Health
Alliance - Justice, Agriculture
Not sure who is left for Infrastructure
GRMA
a call has been put put to set up road blocks to block the mlas going into stormont tommorow
Quote from: johnnycool on February 02, 2024, 11:04:38 AMQuote from: Rossfan on February 02, 2024, 10:34:31 AMHow many thousand turned up at the Binlid/Angry Jim shindig?
Shinners obviously want to get the feet under the Executive table so are keeping mum.
50 odd in in Moygashel...
It seems Moygashel and Markethill are their go to places, not Donaghadee, not East Belfast, not Larne.
I find that quite strange.
As for SF, each and every representative interviewed from now on should make it abundantly clear they striving for a UI and fúck Unionist sensitivities.
Insecure unionist areas , as they feel they're under siege being near all those pesky taigs in south Armagh and east Tyrone , so they have to be more bitter and twisted.
Quote from: JPGJOHNNYG on February 02, 2024, 11:19:19 AMQuote from: tbrick18 on February 02, 2024, 11:12:52 AMQuote from: johnnycool on February 02, 2024, 11:04:38 AMQuote from: Rossfan on February 02, 2024, 10:34:31 AMHow many thousand turned up at the Binlid/Angry Jim shindig?
Shinners obviously want to get the feet under the Executive table so are keeping mum.
50 odd in in Moygashel...
It seems Moygashel and Markethill are their go to places, not Donaghadee, not East Belfast, not Larne.
I find that quite strange.
As for SF, each and every representative interviewed from now on should make it abundantly clear they striving for a UI and fúck Unionist sensitivities.
Having first hand experience of Moygashel, it's right up the Bryson/Allister street.
Bigots and racists. If you're non-loyalist, if you're non-white, if you're a foreign national....you'll get burned out of moygashel.
In terms of SF - I don't think they need to draw attention to the one sidedness of the agreement between dup and WM. I think now, when they are in the ascendancy with the electorate, the demographics are going in one direction they need to make some good progress for all people in NI before the next election. Then, when election mode is on and from that point on they have the referenceability of governing for all and so the UI can be called for to benefit all.
What ever people think of SF, they have been running rings around the unionist parties for well over a decade in terms of politics.
"Non-white", saw pictures of some Asian lad stood next to big Jim at the meeting he must have gotten lost ;D .Reminds me of that famous Muslim rangers lad who then joined the EDL you couldn't make it up
Maybe he was waiting on someone paying him for delivering a Chinese takeaway to the meeting?
UUP confirm they're going into the Executive. They'll get the 5th choice of ministry. SDLP will be in opposition.
Quote from: Pub Bore on February 02, 2024, 04:54:56 PMUUP confirm they're going into the Executive. They'll get the 5th choice of ministry. SDLP will be in opposition.
Couldn't begrudge Swann a run at the health ministry. I genuinely thought he gave it a good go during covid.
Donaldson well fit for Nolan this morning, not often you see a local politician sitting an a show like that for an hour.
Why won't one of the big two take Health ?
Quote from: Kidder81 on February 02, 2024, 06:12:10 PMDonaldson well fit for Nolan this morning, not often you see a local politician sitting an a show like that for an hour.
Why won't one of the big two take Health ?
Because the changes needed to make it sustainable (Bengoa) are not politically ideal. Everyone wants a hospital in their doorstep, which just isn't feasible and closing hospitals or centralising healthcare isn't exactly a vote winner.
Agree on Donaldson, he was excellent and corrected Nolan several times. Also enjoyed his takedown of Brysons commissioned "legal opinion". Its basically comprised of carefully crafted questions to give the impression it backs up their point of view.
Quote from: Kidder81 on February 02, 2024, 06:12:10 PMDonaldson well fit for Nolan this morning, not often you see a local politician sitting an a show like that for an hour.
Why won't one of the big two take Health ?
You simply can't win with Health due to the structural problems. It is probably at the stage where it can't be fixed.
Quote from: Tony Baloney on February 02, 2024, 08:34:01 PMQuote from: Kidder81 on February 02, 2024, 06:12:10 PMDonaldson well fit for Nolan this morning, not often you see a local politician sitting an a show like that for an hour.
Why won't one of the big two take Health ?
You simply can't win with Health due to the structural problems. It is probably at the stage where it can't be fixed.
The 26 county regime have thrown lots of money at health, and still the likes of Limerick hospital is a danger to health. Whoever is in Stormont will have to fix it without much money to add and if anyone can do that then they will raise my opinion of NI politicians.
Jeffrey has got away with it so far, but there is no question the Irish Sea border remains.
Everyone's a winner I suppose.
Excuse my understanding here but how does Bryson get so much access. Like he strolls around political events flanked by people who were actually voted in.
Like how can a blogger get into Stormont, etc?
I think Jamie gets a bad press. He is smarter than a lot of politicians and we talk about his tweets more than anyone else. He's also good looking and can handle himself in the ring.
Like him or loathe him, and I prefer the latter, you have to give wee Jeff some level of credit for his performance over the last week. He has played a blinder one way or another. I really can't believe he has managed to move the masses so quickly with seemingly a very minimal level of fuss.
Also, has Ian Og not been remarkably quiet?
Quote from: Olly on February 02, 2024, 11:37:22 PMI think Jamie gets a bad press. He is smarter than a lot of politicians and we talk about his tweets more than anyone else. He's also good looking and can handle himself in the ring.
You may be taking the piss but sadly there are politicians there he is smarter than particularly the one who was feeding him info as he will probably finish them!
Quote from: podge on February 02, 2024, 11:47:58 PMLike him or loathe him, and I prefer the latter, you have to give wee Jeff some level of credit for his performance over the last week. He has played a blinder one way or another. I really can't believe he has managed to move the masses so quickly with seemingly a very minimal level of fuss.
Also, has Ian Og not been remarkably quiet?
Quickly? :o
Quote from: Sportacus on February 02, 2024, 10:35:27 PMJeffrey has got away with it so far, but there is no question the Irish Sea border remains.
Everyone's a winner I suppose.
Jeffrey has seen some common sense and realised that he was going to have to compromise. Hard to know if he truly believed they were going to get everything they wanted or was he just holding out for a some what acceptable deal.
The likes of Bryson, Allister etc... aren't stupid either. They know this deal is as good as they are going to get. They plain and simple don't want a SF FM. This is just a smoke screen.
Is there any word of roads being blocked? I drove from Crossmaglen to Newry this morning and the road was clear, apart from a herd of cattle at Mullaghban
Quote from: Dougal Maguire on February 03, 2024, 01:35:41 PMIs there any word of roads being blocked? I drove from Crossmaglen to Newry this morning and the road was clear, apart from a herd of cattle at Mullaghban
Rumours of worried sheep around Fords cross as well but maybe they're gone now!
I took a little detour to see if Justy McNulty was at home but he wasn't. Mind you there was no indication as to whether he had headed North or South
Quote from: Ghost on February 03, 2024, 12:51:58 PMQuote from: Sportacus on February 02, 2024, 10:35:27 PMJeffrey has got away with it so far, but there is no question the Irish Sea border remains.
Everyone's a winner I suppose.
Jeffrey has seen some common sense and realised that he was going to have to compromise. Hard to know if he truly believed they were going to get everything they wanted or was he just holding out for a some what acceptable deal.
The likes of Bryson, Allister etc... aren't stupid either. They know this deal is as good as they are going to get. They plain and simple don't want a SF FM. This is just a smoke screen.
I hadn't actually heard this said until the other day. Jim Allister said Jeffrey has sold out and allowed Michelle O'Neill become first minister, and he was clearly pissed about it.
Just heard Pengelly say she was honoured to be first ministers along with MON. She couldn't bear to say a Republican was first minister, but that they were both FM's.
Technically they are the same role, but the title says different
Quote from: Dougal Maguire on February 03, 2024, 01:43:44 PMI took a little detour to see if Justy McNulty was at home but he wasn't. Mind you there was no indication as to whether he had headed North or South
He was at Stormont in an earlier picture I seen. Anyone in Laois have a helicopter he could borrow to get him to the match later?
Can't see him getting to Wexford for 6.
McNulty getting another touch now on TV. He's going to have to make a decision one way or another.
Even when Stormont wasn't sitting , I'm sure he Was under pressure from some of his constituents about his two roles.
SDLP have a dilemma - if they withdraw the whip may choose to be an independent MLA.
Maybe Justin could stand in Laois at next General Election and take the seat of the retiring Charlie Flanagan.
Regardless of what's going on in Stormont, Saturday should normally be the busiest day of the week for a Parliamentarian as that's the day they deal with constituency matters. I was in Newry last Saturday and his office was closed. Not a good message for his constituents
Personally I think the gaa makes him a more recognised person and am sure he doing as much if not more than 50% of people at stormont. As for his office not open, u really want go there,as there a few I see not doing any business on Saturday.
Quote from: AustinPowers on February 03, 2024, 03:28:44 PMMcNulty getting another touch now on TV. He's going to have to make a decision one way or another.
Even when Stormont wasn't sitting , I'm sure he Was under pressure from some of his constituents about his two roles.
And proper order too. The two jobs are not compatible. The SDLP and Justin need to made a choice.
Quote from: Dougal Maguire on February 03, 2024, 03:32:36 PMRegardless of what's going on in Stormont, Saturday should normally be the busiest day of the week for a Parliamentarian as that's the day they deal with constituency matters. I was in Newry last Saturday and his office was closed. Not a good message for his constituents
Does Mickey Brady open on a Saturday?
Quote from: The Boy Wonder on February 03, 2024, 03:32:07 PMSDLP have a dilemma - if they withdraw the whip may choose to be an independent MLA.
Maybe Justin could stand in Laois at next General Election and take the seat of the retiring Charlie Flanagan.
He would likely continue to sit as an independent until the next election if the SDLP withdraw the whip. That said, he doesn't have a huge profile despite being an MLA for quite a few years now. The SDLP never put him forward for TV interviews or anything of that nature.
If he does sit as an independent until that election he wouldn't retain his seat, the SDLP would take it from him when the time comes, or unionists would benefit from a split vote between him and the SDLP.
Quote from: Tony Baloney on February 03, 2024, 04:08:22 PMQuote from: Dougal Maguire on February 03, 2024, 03:32:36 PMRegardless of what's going on in Stormont, Saturday should normally be the busiest day of the week for a Parliamentarian as that's the day they deal with constituency matters. I was in Newry last Saturday and his office was closed. Not a good message for his constituents
Does Mickey Brady open on a Saturday?
Friday would historically be the constituency day for MLA's and MP's as most parliamentary business takes place from a Monday-Thursday.
Quote from: Tony Baloney on February 03, 2024, 04:08:22 PMQuote from: Dougal Maguire on February 03, 2024, 03:32:36 PMRegardless of what's going on in Stormont, Saturday should normally be the busiest day of the week for a Parliamentarian as that's the day they deal with constituency matters. I was in Newry last Saturday and his office was closed. Not a good message for his constituents
Does Mickey Brady open on a Saturday?
Absolutely. The SF constituency office is a hive of activity on a Saturday
I have had to contact my local councillors and MLA a few times over the years and have never had to set foot in their offices. It's not the 1980s. They are all easily contactable
First time Finance not picked first ?
Now the dust has settled and whether you believe it or not, everyone needs to subtly maintain the narrative that the DUP sold out and there still is an Irish Sea border. Time to twist the knife ;D
Quote from: thebigfella on February 03, 2024, 05:09:22 PMNow the dust has settled and whether you believe it or not, everyone needs to subtly maintain the narrative that the DUP sold out and there still is an Irish Sea border. Time to twist the knife ;D
Caught about half of this earlier.. Paul Givan laying into Red Jim and Red Jim laying into Pengelly was great TV
Quote from: Deerstalker on February 03, 2024, 04:41:42 PMFirst time Finance not picked first ?
The Finance person I have never heard of. In a normal government finance is serious post, with an experienced person. In NI, SF seem to think ministries should be shuffled around for some other objective other than experience.
Quote from: armaghniac on February 03, 2024, 05:43:42 PMQuote from: Deerstalker on February 03, 2024, 04:41:42 PMFirst time Finance not picked first ?
The Finance person I have never heard of. In a normal government finance is serious post, with an experienced person. In NI, SF seem to think ministries should be shuffled around for some other objective other than experience.
None of them are qualified for any of it. It's just jobs for the lads.
If I got enough votes , even though I'm not qualified/experienced, could I get the Laois job? (Well, they're going to need somebody soon ).
Quote from: AustinPowers on February 03, 2024, 06:45:31 PMQuote from: armaghniac on February 03, 2024, 05:43:42 PMQuote from: Deerstalker on February 03, 2024, 04:41:42 PMFirst time Finance not picked first ?
The Finance person I have never heard of. In a normal government finance is serious post, with an experienced person. In NI, SF seem to think ministries should be shuffled around for some other objective other than experience.
None of them are qualified for any of it. It's just jobs for the lads.
If I got enough votes , even though I'm not qualified/experienced, could I get the Laois job? (Well, they're going to need somebody soon ).
Exactly. Does anyone actually think these lads or the likes of Carla Lockhart in the Commons are actually reading out their own words?! They are blow-up dolls with the smart people sitting in offices behind the scenes.
nothern ireland politics is all about connections and who you know and who you brown nose suppose lots of world politics is like that.
Quote from: ranch on February 03, 2024, 04:10:16 PMQuote from: The Boy Wonder on February 03, 2024, 03:32:07 PMSDLP have a dilemma - if they withdraw the whip may choose to be an independent MLA.
Maybe Justin could stand in Laois at next General Election and take the seat of the retiring Charlie Flanagan.
He would likely continue to sit as an independent until the next election if the SDLP withdraw the whip. That said, he doesn't have a huge profile despite being an MLA for quite a few years now. The SDLP never put him forward for TV interviews or anything of that nature.
If he does sit as an independent until that election he wouldn't retain his seat, the SDLP would take it from him when the time comes, or unionists would benefit from a split vote between him and the SDLP.
He must have notions about himself. If he can't do the job because he has to be in Laois then hand it back.
Quote from: Eire90 on February 03, 2024, 07:04:17 PMnothern ireland politics is all about connections and who you know and who you brown nose suppose lots of world politics is like that.
Just like office politics
Quote from: armaghniac on February 03, 2024, 05:43:42 PMQuote from: Deerstalker on February 03, 2024, 04:41:42 PMFirst time Finance not picked first ?
The Finance person I have never heard of. In a normal government finance is serious post, with an experienced person. In NI, SF seem to think ministries should be shuffled around for some other objective other than experience.
Caoimhe Archibald has a PhD, had a high profile in previous finance committee and was a regular in the media
PhD in what excately?
Quote from: armaghniac on February 03, 2024, 05:43:42 PMQuote from: Deerstalker on February 03, 2024, 04:41:42 PMFirst time Finance not picked first ?
The Finance person I have never heard of. In a normal government finance is serious post, with an experienced person. In NI, SF seem to think ministries should be shuffled around for some other objective other than experience.
In a normal country the person in charge of Finance is a groupthinker who follows the rules and never thinks. Every so often the shit hits the fan and he or she has no idea what to do.
Paschal is probably going to emulate Brian Cowen in the next 18 months
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CREDXtbfnb0
Quote from: Eire90 on February 03, 2024, 07:04:17 PMnothern ireland politics is all about connections and who you know and who you brown nose suppose lots of world politics is like that.
I presume you're from the 26 counties?
And you make that statement with no hint of irony.
Sure that is politics. Difference in north is you can make it through nailing colours to whatever mast.
Quote from: Eire90 on February 03, 2024, 07:04:17 PMnothern ireland politics is all about connections and who you know and who you brown nose suppose lots of world politics is like that.
Thank God that doesn't happen in the the republic or anywhere else.
Quotethe unelected bridesmaid as deputy
Had to laugh at that line from Allister.
Justin McNulty suspended by SDLP
Quote from: Nanderson on February 03, 2024, 10:14:38 PMJustin McNulty suspended by SDLP
Interesting to see which of his two jobs pays more and he keeps doing.
Quote from: SaffronSports on February 03, 2024, 11:02:08 PMQuote from: Nanderson on February 03, 2024, 10:14:38 PMJustin McNulty suspended by SDLP
Interesting to see which of his two jobs pays more and he keeps doing.
I would say Laois pays more
Quote from: clarshack on February 03, 2024, 11:20:26 PMQuote from: Nanderson on February 03, 2024, 10:14:38 PMJustin McNulty suspended by SDLP
Suspended without pay?
They probably can't withhold his pay as his wage will come from public money. If it's unresolved he could still be an independent MLA or join another party until the next election anyway.
Quote from: clarshack on February 03, 2024, 11:20:26 PMQuote from: Nanderson on February 03, 2024, 10:14:38 PMJustin McNulty suspended by SDLP
Suspended without pay?
The SDLP do not pay him, I expect, so they can hardly suspend his pay.
Quote from: SaffronSports on February 03, 2024, 11:28:51 PMQuote from: clarshack on February 03, 2024, 11:20:26 PMQuote from: Nanderson on February 03, 2024, 10:14:38 PMJustin McNulty suspended by SDLP
Suspended without pay?
They probably can't withhold his pay as his wage will come from public money. If it's unresolved he could still be an independent MLA or join another party until the next election anyway.
He's dead in the water as a politician.
He blocked a mate on fb at the height of the Covid shenanigans. Who had the last laugh now Justin eh?!
(I jest, my friend is a cockwomble and deserved it)
So the spongers in the north go back to work after a 2 year holiday and this is news???
They even managed to vote in a deputy prime minister of their wee country who didn't even stand for election
The fact a county manager treats it with such contempt speaks volumes ;D
Quote from: Mikhail Prokhorov on February 04, 2024, 12:16:31 AMSo the spongers in the north go back to work after a 2 year holiday and this is news???
They even managed to vote in a deputy prime minister of their wee country who didn't even stand for election
The fact a county manager treats it with such contempt speaks volumes ;D
That's not the term she used.
When others called her deputy though , she looked mighty miffed
Quote from: AustinPowers on February 04, 2024, 12:26:21 AMQuote from: Mikhail Prokhorov on February 04, 2024, 12:16:31 AMSo the spongers in the north go back to work after a 2 year holiday and this is news???
They even managed to vote in a deputy prime minister of their wee country who didn't even stand for election
The fact a county manager treats it with such contempt speaks volumes ;D
That's not the term she used.
When others called her deputy though , she looked mighty miffed
Well her own party referred to it as Deputy FM in their socials so....
It's actually brilliant watching the DUP'ers squirm.
Think Allisters head might actually explode.
I like Jim when you hear him talk it makes me feel we have gone back to the eighties ;D
Yer man McNulty was taking the piss. I know he probably didn't think it was starting up again so soon but it ain't a good look being a part time mla when the ones do it full time are pretty f**king useless, wants his cake and eat it.
Quote from: Armagh18 on February 04, 2024, 08:18:58 AMIt's actually brilliant watching the DUP'ers squirm.
Think Allisters head might actually explode.
A big thing for me is seeing them on the opposite sides of the chamber now. It's the optics of it.
This must really really hurt unionists. Seeing the little guys on their side of the chamber now.
McNulty has had the SDLP whip suspended but he can continue as an independent. The only way SDLP can do anything is if he resigns his seat and they co-opt someone on. If that happened it would likely be Pete Byrne. Problem they have is McNulty is very popular and is a 'figure'. They have died a complete death in south Armagh and south down and he is hanging them in there. Byrne is a much more competent operator and is the better person to be there but he doesn't have the profile. McNulty's father is old school SDLP and was at the forefront with Seamus Mallon from the very start so his son has a lot of wriggle room
Quote from: brokencrossbar1 on February 04, 2024, 09:33:44 AMMcNulty has had the SDLP whip suspended but he can continue as an independent. The only way SDLP can do anything is if he resigns his seat and they co-opt someone on. If that happened it would likely be Pete Byrne. Problem they have is McNulty is very popular and is a 'figure'. They have died a complete death in south Armagh and south down and he is hanging them in there. Byrne is a much more competent operator and is the better person to be there but he doesn't have the profile. McNulty's father is old school SDLP and was at the forefront with Seamus Mallon from the very start so his son has a lot of wriggle room
I think he's showing a bit of contempt to be honest. His predecessors, Seamus Mallon for example, worked day and night to represent their constituents and to stand up to discrimination. They didn't make those sacrifices so that today's representatives can complacently dip in and dip out when it suits. He should choose one and drop the other.
Quote from: SaffronSports on February 03, 2024, 11:28:51 PMQuote from: clarshack on February 03, 2024, 11:20:26 PMQuote from: Nanderson on February 03, 2024, 10:14:38 PMJustin McNulty suspended by SDLP
Suspended without pay?
They probably can't withhold his pay as his wage will come from public money. If it's unresolved he could still be an independent MLA or join another party until the next election anyway.
Independent or not, still would be impossible to find the time to be a county manager as well.
Thought it was harsh to be honest. The timetable clash only came about mid week when the DUP agreed to the deal, there was nothing he could have done. I thought the SDLP would have gave him a weeks grace to quit Laois but maybe he's made it clear he intended to continue with both? I don't think that's sustainable either.
Always thought he'd have put politics first when push came to shove just for financial reasons but frig knows what Laois are paying him...
Bad optics and nothing more. Won't see Stormont on a Saturday or Sunday for a long time. If it wasn't for knee jerks you'd see no movement from the SDLP
McNulty managing Laois was discussed on political programs when he took the role a few months back . The SDLP has had plenty of time to deal with it .
Regardless of the time needed for him to sit in Stormont (how often do they sit really?), he still has to represent the people of his constituency, and he could hardly have been doing that well, while he's been trekking to Laois 3-4 nights a week
Quote from: clarshack on February 04, 2024, 11:39:58 AMQuote from: SaffronSports on February 03, 2024, 11:28:51 PMQuote from: clarshack on February 03, 2024, 11:20:26 PMQuote from: Nanderson on February 03, 2024, 10:14:38 PMJustin McNulty suspended by SDLP
Suspended without pay?
They probably can't withhold his pay as his wage will come from public money. If it's unresolved he could still be an independent MLA or join another party until the next election anyway.
Independent or not, still would be impossible to find the time to be a county manager as well.
Yeah they're both jobs that wouldn't be your conventional 9-5 or 40 hours per week. Technically if Laois were happy enough he could carry on with both but you'd be guaranteed he wouldn't get re-elected.
Quote from: RedHand88 on February 04, 2024, 12:41:10 PMThought it was harsh to be honest. The timetable clash only came about mid week when the DUP agreed to the deal, there was nothing he could have done. I thought the SDLP would have gave him a weeks grace to quit Laois but maybe he's made it clear he intended to continue with both? I don't think that's sustainable either.
Always thought he'd have put politics first when push came to shove just for financial reasons but frig knows what Laois are paying him...
£55k plus about £100k in expenses, allowances etc. for a few years is hard to turn your back on, especially if you've got the missus in as "staff".
Quote from: SaffronSports on February 04, 2024, 01:06:29 PMQuote from: clarshack on February 04, 2024, 11:39:58 AMQuote from: SaffronSports on February 03, 2024, 11:28:51 PMQuote from: clarshack on February 03, 2024, 11:20:26 PMQuote from: Nanderson on February 03, 2024, 10:14:38 PMJustin McNulty suspended by SDLP
Suspended without pay?
They probably can't withhold his pay as his wage will come from public money. If it's unresolved he could still be an independent MLA or join another party until the next election anyway.
Independent or not, still would be impossible to find the time to be a county manager as well.
Yeah they're both jobs that wouldn't be your conventional 9-5 or 40 hours per week. Technically if Laois were happy enough he could carry on with both but you'd be guaranteed he wouldn't get re-elected.
I wouldn't vote for him anyway but really wouldn't bother me if a politician took that job on.
Quote from: AustinPowers on February 04, 2024, 12:57:00 PMMcNulty managing Laois was discussed on political programs when he took the role a few months back . The SDLP has had plenty of time to deal with it .
Regardless of the time needed for him to sit in Stormont (how often do they sit really?), he still has to represent the people of his constituency, and he could hardly have been doing that well, while he's been trekking to Laois 3-4 nights a week
He obviously didn't think the DUP would cave so early
One of the reasons that loyalists are so poor is the UK tendency to shaft the losers of economic change instead of supporting them
This a strong argument for reunification
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nairn-Anderson_thesis
The Nairn-Anderson thesis is a theory of British economic and political decline developed in the 1960s and 1970s by political theorist Tom Nairn and historian Perry Anderson.[1][2]
The thesis suggests that Britain's early development into a capitalist society was so successful that it failed to overturn archaic social structures and institutions like the power of the aristocracy. By contrast, continental European states like Germany introduced efficient administrations and educational systems as part of a "second" bourgeois revolution. The result for Britain, wrote Anderson, is that "the triumphs of the past become the bane of the present."[3]
The thesis was first developed in a series of essays in The New Left Review[4] and is cited today in discussions of Britain's post-Imperial decline and "dysfunctional" institutions.[
Quote from: Armagh18 on February 04, 2024, 01:34:03 PMQuote from: SaffronSports on February 04, 2024, 01:06:29 PMQuote from: clarshack on February 04, 2024, 11:39:58 AMQuote from: SaffronSports on February 03, 2024, 11:28:51 PMQuote from: clarshack on February 03, 2024, 11:20:26 PMQuote from: Nanderson on February 03, 2024, 10:14:38 PMJustin McNulty suspended by SDLP
Suspended without pay?
They probably can't withhold his pay as his wage will come from public money. If it's unresolved he could still be an independent MLA or join another party until the next election anyway.
Independent or not, still would be impossible to find the time to be a county manager as well.
Yeah they're both jobs that wouldn't be your conventional 9-5 or 40 hours per week. Technically if Laois were happy enough he could carry on with both but you'd be guaranteed he wouldn't get re-elected.
I wouldn't vote for him anyway but really wouldn't bother me if a politician took that job on.
I just don't think the two jobs are compatible for one man. Something like teaching, you know your hours and you're not working at the weekend. As an MLA, Stormont can run late into the evening, you'll have committees that you're on, you have loads of constituency issues to deal with. I don't feel it would be possible to do both to the best of your ability.
Enough of this nonsense about double jobbing. Surely a politician is entitled to some downtime to pursue his other interests and hobbies. What's wrong with managing an amateur GAA team on a Saturday evening or indeed a Sunday ? Yes, there's also a couple of evenings training during the week involving a bit of travel. And all for a few bob to put diesel in the car and some tea and sandwiches. Greater love hath no man for the GAA.
Bad misstep from Justin, on a day of major historical importance within the statelet, the political junket is also potentially a more long term lucrative role, wrong on all fronts
But you no problem DUP not working for 2 yrs, but all cheer because they bck allowing Michelle O'Neil to be first minister
Quote from: Wildweasel74 on February 04, 2024, 05:56:01 PMBut you no problem DUP not working for 2 yrs, but all cheer because they bck allowing Michelle O'Neil to be first minister
Tell me ya scundered without telling me ya scundered
McNulty has just about enough intelligence not to eat himself
What's this even doing on DUP thread?
So he took a helicopter to the Laois game & is considering legal action against SDLP :D
County management is a full time role so I'm not sure how the 2 jobs can be reconciled. Add in the 10 or so hours travel and I'm not sure how anyone could expect to deliver as both a county manager and MLA. I remember listening to Oisin McConville and Davy Burke at the end of last year saying how county management was so mentally draining and all consuming so I don't know how he can expect to do both jobs to the level required. I think he should pick one and the county managers job is certain to be the more lucrative!
If Geezer was working as an MLA I can only imagine the criticism he would be getting.
Idiotic by McNulty. First day back at Stormont and the SDLP lose an MLA and a UUP MLA has a go at party colleague Robin Swann!
Quote from: Pub Bore on February 05, 2024, 10:31:00 AMIdiotic by McNulty. First day back at Stormont and the SDLP lose an MLA and a UUP MLA has a go at party colleague Robin Swann!
He's right about Swann, just using the Health post as a shop window to try and get into Westminster
Quote from: RedHand88 on February 02, 2024, 06:35:38 PMQuote from: Kidder81 on February 02, 2024, 06:12:10 PMDonaldson well fit for Nolan this morning, not often you see a local politician sitting an a show like that for an hour.
Why won't one of the big two take Health ?
Because the changes needed to make it sustainable (Bengoa) are not politically ideal. Everyone wants a hospital in their doorstep, which just isn't feasible and closing hospitals or centralising healthcare isn't exactly a vote winner.
Agree on Donaldson, he was excellent and corrected Nolan several times. Also enjoyed his takedown of Brysons commissioned "legal opinion". Its basically comprised of carefully crafted questions to give the impression it backs up their point of view.
The internal mechanisms within Stormont make in almost impossible to enact something as foundational as the Bengoa report.
It would be a huge drain on the budget initially and that would mean other departments headed up by members of other parties losing out and the political fallout from that would mean it just wouldn't happen.
Quote from: Kidder81 on February 05, 2024, 10:37:41 AMQuote from: Pub Bore on February 05, 2024, 10:31:00 AMIdiotic by McNulty. First day back at Stormont and the SDLP lose an MLA and a UUP MLA has a go at party colleague Robin Swann!
He's right about Swann, just using the Health post as a shop window to try and get into Westminster
Westminster is more lucrative and it definitely looks like Swann has his sights set there. The expenses and perks far outweigh anything Stormont can provide.
Quote from: yellowcard on February 05, 2024, 10:41:49 AMQuote from: Kidder81 on February 05, 2024, 10:37:41 AMQuote from: Pub Bore on February 05, 2024, 10:31:00 AMIdiotic by McNulty. First day back at Stormont and the SDLP lose an MLA and a UUP MLA has a go at party colleague Robin Swann!
He's right about Swann, just using the Health post as a shop window to try and get into Westminster
Westminster is more lucrative and it definitely looks like Swann has his sights set there. The expenses and perks far outweigh anything Stormont can provide.
And much less hassle
Quote from: yellowcard on February 05, 2024, 10:07:28 AMCounty management is a full time role so I'm not sure how the 2 jobs can be reconciled. Add in the 10 or so hours travel and I'm not sure how anyone could expect to deliver as both a county manager and MLA. I remember listening to Oisin McConville and Davy Burke at the end of last year saying how county management was so mentally draining and all consuming so I don't know how he can expect to do both jobs to the level required. I think he should pick one and the county managers job is certain to be the more lucrative!
If Geezer was working as an MLA I can only imagine the criticism he would be getting.
Maybe in the short term but long term he would have pension etc to consider
Quote from: Pub Bore on February 05, 2024, 10:31:00 AMIdiotic by McNulty. First day back at Stormont and the SDLP lose an MLA and a UUP MLA has a go at party colleague Robin Swann!
Did no-one in the SDLP catch on that there was a clash and have a word with the man? It was even mentioned on this forum on Thursday. It seems like poor communication all round.
Quote from: lurganblue on February 05, 2024, 10:47:34 AMQuote from: Pub Bore on February 05, 2024, 10:31:00 AMIdiotic by McNulty. First day back at Stormont and the SDLP lose an MLA and a UUP MLA has a go at party colleague Robin Swann!
Did no-one in the SDLP catch on that there was a clash and have a word with the man? It was even mentioned on this forum on Thursday. It seems like poor communication all round.
They did. I think Justy is being pig headed about it and refusing to even discuss it. It's been poorly handled but McNulty hasn't been overly cooperative.
Quote from: trailer on February 05, 2024, 11:10:44 AMQuote from: lurganblue on February 05, 2024, 10:47:34 AMQuote from: Pub Bore on February 05, 2024, 10:31:00 AMIdiotic by McNulty. First day back at Stormont and the SDLP lose an MLA and a UUP MLA has a go at party colleague Robin Swann!
Did no-one in the SDLP catch on that there was a clash and have a word with the man? It was even mentioned on this forum on Thursday. It seems like poor communication all round.
They did. I think Justy is being pig headed about it and refusing to even discuss it. It's been poorly handled but McNulty hasn't been overly cooperative.
Wouldn't be like him.
Quote from: yellowcard on February 05, 2024, 10:41:49 AMQuote from: Kidder81 on February 05, 2024, 10:37:41 AMQuote from: Pub Bore on February 05, 2024, 10:31:00 AMIdiotic by McNulty. First day back at Stormont and the SDLP lose an MLA and a UUP MLA has a go at party colleague Robin Swann!
He's right about Swann, just using the Health post as a shop window to try and get into Westminster
Westminster is more lucrative and it definitely looks like Swann has his sights set there. The expenses and perks far outweigh anything Stormont can provide.
Would he run in NA against Ian Óg?
Quote from: trailer on February 05, 2024, 11:10:44 AMQuote from: lurganblue on February 05, 2024, 10:47:34 AMQuote from: Pub Bore on February 05, 2024, 10:31:00 AMIdiotic by McNulty. First day back at Stormont and the SDLP lose an MLA and a UUP MLA has a go at party colleague Robin Swann!
Did no-one in the SDLP catch on that there was a clash and have a word with the man? It was even mentioned on this forum on Thursday. It seems like poor communication all round.
They did. I think Justy is being pig headed about it and refusing to even discuss it. It's been poorly handled but McNulty hasn't been overly cooperative.
That lad O'Toole annoys me.
Always seems to have a head cold when talking. >:(
Quote from: marty34 on February 05, 2024, 11:38:22 AMQuote from: yellowcard on February 05, 2024, 10:41:49 AMQuote from: Kidder81 on February 05, 2024, 10:37:41 AMQuote from: Pub Bore on February 05, 2024, 10:31:00 AMIdiotic by McNulty. First day back at Stormont and the SDLP lose an MLA and a UUP MLA has a go at party colleague Robin Swann!
He's right about Swann, just using the Health post as a shop window to try and get into Westminster
Westminster is more lucrative and it definitely looks like Swann has his sights set there. The expenses and perks far outweigh anything Stormont can provide.
Would he run in NA against Ian Óg?
I was going to post, what would a man of his age be bothered with going to Westminster, then I checked that he's my age!! Is he old or do we always look at ourselves as being a lot younger lol
Quote from: marty34 on February 05, 2024, 11:38:22 AMQuote from: yellowcard on February 05, 2024, 10:41:49 AMQuote from: Kidder81 on February 05, 2024, 10:37:41 AMQuote from: Pub Bore on February 05, 2024, 10:31:00 AMIdiotic by McNulty. First day back at Stormont and the SDLP lose an MLA and a UUP MLA has a go at party colleague Robin Swann!
He's right about Swann, just using the Health post as a shop window to try and get into Westminster
Westminster is more lucrative and it definitely looks like Swann has his sights set there. The expenses and perks far outweigh anything Stormont can provide.
Would he run in NA against Ian Óg?
He has done so in the past and never really laid a glove on him.
That seat is really a safe seat for the DUP and has been this years. Ian Og at this stage can do and say anything he likes and still get in. It's not he's adding any value to anyone's life.
There is a big risk that for ideological reasons the DUP will close down the option of using EU market access to drive investment and grow the North's economy.
Jim Allister now claiming that Poots wanted to deck him after the Stormont sitting on Saturday. It's a circus on the hill.
Quote from: yellowcard on February 05, 2024, 12:29:19 PMJim Allister now claiming that Poots wanted to deck him after the Stormont sitting on Saturday. It's a circus on the hill.
Was there a queue?
Quote from: Pub Bore on February 05, 2024, 10:31:00 AMIdiotic by McNulty. First day back at Stormont and the SDLP lose an MLA and a UUP MLA has a go at party colleague Robin Swann!
Who had a go at Swann?
Quote from: yellowcard on February 05, 2024, 12:29:19 PMJim Allister now claiming that Poots wanted to deck him after the Stormont sitting on Saturday. It's a circus on the hill.
Oh yes, the big impartial speaker was on saying that he couldnt respond to Jim but if he could have, he would have had his clock cleaned ;D
Quote from: lurganblue on February 05, 2024, 10:47:34 AMQuote from: Pub Bore on February 05, 2024, 10:31:00 AMIdiotic by McNulty. First day back at Stormont and the SDLP lose an MLA and a UUP MLA has a go at party colleague Robin Swann!
Did no-one in the SDLP catch on that there was a clash and have a word with the man? It was even mentioned on this forum on Thursday. It seems like poor communication all round.
OToole was on the View on Thursday night and when he was asked about McNulty he said that McNulty was expected to be at Stormont etc.
You could tell OToole wasnt happy that McNulty was double jobbing so this was on the cards if McNulty went to the game
Quote from: lurganblue on February 05, 2024, 12:53:38 PMQuote from: yellowcard on February 05, 2024, 12:29:19 PMJim Allister now claiming that Poots wanted to deck him after the Stormont sitting on Saturday. It's a circus on the hill.
Oh yes, the big impartial speaker was on saying that he couldnt respond to Jim but if he could have, he would have had his clock cleaned ;D
I heard that this morning.
Surely he should be banned from being the speaker if he uses language like that.
I thought you had to be very neutral as regards being the speaker.
Can Mc Nulty just declare as an independent then and go it alone until the next election?
In fairness, being a county manager is a full time job. Far harder if there is a lot of travel time involved also.
Ideal job for a teacher. 9:00 - 4:00pm. And off during the summer.
Quote from: marty34 on February 05, 2024, 01:06:42 PMCan Mc Nulty just declare as an independent then and go it alone until the next election?
In fairness, being a county manager is a full time job. Far harder if there is a lot of travel time involved also.
Ideal job for a teacher. 9:00 - 4:00pm. And off during the summer.
It's not officially though. It's an amateur sport with volunteers and everyone is entitled to do what they want in their own time.
No idea what the contracted hours of an MLA are, but I suspect in terms of employment there is nothing can be done.
Personally, I think the SDLP have become largely irrelevant. How effective is going into opposition in NI under current structures. It's a shame really, as it narrows the voting alternatives for nationalists.
Quote from: tbrick18 on February 05, 2024, 01:18:47 PMQuote from: marty34 on February 05, 2024, 01:06:42 PMCan Mc Nulty just declare as an independent then and go it alone until the next election?
In fairness, being a county manager is a full time job. Far harder if there is a lot of travel time involved also.
Ideal job for a teacher. 9:00 - 4:00pm. And off during the summer.
It's not officially though. It's an amateur sport with volunteers and everyone is entitled to do what they want in their own time.
No idea what the contracted hours of an MLA are, but I suspect in terms of employment there is nothing can be done.
Personally, I think the SDLP have become largely irrelevant. How effective is going into opposition in NI under current structures. It's a shame really, as it narrows the voting alternatives for nationalists.
Fair enough but it (an inter-county manager) is a full time job. Serious hours involved in organising etc.
You're not going to get an inter-county manager doing 10 hours a week. Never.
Quote from: marty34 on February 05, 2024, 01:06:42 PMCan Mc Nulty just declare as an independent then and go it alone until the next election?
In fairness, being a county manager is a full time job. Far harder if there is a lot of travel time involved also.
Ideal job for a teacher. 9:00 - 4:00pm. And off during the summer.
Yes, it is the individual who is elected, not the party.
Quote from: Dougal Maguire on February 05, 2024, 12:38:12 PMQuote from: Pub Bore on February 05, 2024, 10:31:00 AMIdiotic by McNulty. First day back at Stormont and the SDLP lose an MLA and a UUP MLA has a go at party colleague Robin Swann!
Who had a go at Swann?
Andy Allen criticised his decision to stand for Westminster
and become a minister in the Executive.
Apparently Colum Eastwood wasn't there either. Not a good from the SDLP.
Quote from: general_lee on February 05, 2024, 01:42:54 PMApparently Colum Eastwood wasn't there either. Not a good from the SDLP.
He's an MP not an MLA. He's been quoted as saying he didn't want to steal O'Toole's thunder.
Quote from: Pub Bore on February 05, 2024, 01:27:33 PMQuote from: Dougal Maguire on February 05, 2024, 12:38:12 PMQuote from: Pub Bore on February 05, 2024, 10:31:00 AMIdiotic by McNulty. First day back at Stormont and the SDLP lose an MLA and a UUP MLA has a go at party colleague Robin Swann!
Who had a go at Swann?
Andy Allen criticised his decision to stand for Westminster and become a minister in the Executive.
Apparently UUP now discussing Swann not running for Westminster. Major f**k up as Swann was actually moving to run in a UUP target seat.
Quote from: Dougal Maguire on February 03, 2024, 03:32:36 PMRegardless of what's going on in Stormont, Saturday should normally be the busiest day of the week for a Parliamentarian as that's the day they deal with constituency matters. I was in Newry last Saturday and his office was closed. Not a good message for his constituents
Actually Friday is designated for constituency matters, Stormont doesn't sit, save for exceptional circumstances.
I agree that Friday is a day for consistency matters, dealing with local correspondence but Saturday is normally the day that they run their constituency surgeries in order to facilitate people who are working
Quote from: Dougal Maguire on February 05, 2024, 02:22:30 PMI agree that Friday is a day for consistency matters, dealing with local correspondence but Saturday is normally the day that they run their constituency surgeries in order to facilitate people who are working
Email or any electronic channels not reached Armagh yet ?
Quote from: Kidder81 on February 05, 2024, 02:38:30 PMQuote from: Dougal Maguire on February 05, 2024, 02:22:30 PMI agree that Friday is a day for consistency matters, dealing with local correspondence but Saturday is normally the day that they run their constituency surgeries in order to facilitate people who are working
Email or any electronic channels not reached Armagh yet ?
😂In the vast majority of cases people with an issue like to discuss it face to face
Quote from: Pub Bore on February 05, 2024, 01:52:36 PMQuote from: Pub Bore on February 05, 2024, 01:27:33 PMQuote from: Dougal Maguire on February 05, 2024, 12:38:12 PMQuote from: Pub Bore on February 05, 2024, 10:31:00 AMIdiotic by McNulty. First day back at Stormont and the SDLP lose an MLA and a UUP MLA has a go at party colleague Robin Swann!
Who had a go at Swann?
Andy Allen criticised his decision to stand for Westminster and become a minister in the Executive.
Apparently UUP now discussing Swann not running for Westminster. Major f**k up as Swann was actually moving to run in a UUP target seat.
Swann would likely win that seat too as he would get a lot of tactical anti DUP votes
Re unelected Little-Pengelly as deputy first minister, is that because no elected DUP assembly member would want to be seen to be inferior to a fenian?
Quote from: Main Street on February 05, 2024, 04:49:04 PMRe unelected Little-Pengelly as deputy first minister, is that because no elected DUP assembly member would want to be seen to be inferior to a fenian?
Susan McKay touches on this the last few days and adds in a bit of misogyny for good measure, but I think it's her loyalty to wee Jeffrey is probably the biggest reason as it looks like he can't trust too many in that party, MLA's or MP's.
Quote from: Main Street on February 05, 2024, 04:49:04 PMRe unelected Little-Pengelly as deputy first minister, is that because no elected DUP assembly member would want to be seen to be inferior to a fenian?
Don't know. But what really fucks me off about her elevation to DFM is that she sat in the BBC studio at the time of the Assembly results and stated that she didn't speak for the DUP nor was she a member of the DUP. Not one week later she was co-opted in. It is that out and out bullshit that she and others spout that gets on my goat.
Besides all that she probably did zero canvassing in LV for JD when he was running. She continues to fail upwards. I think she won one election in her life and now she holds the highest political office in NI.
If parties are going to continue with this then a list of who will be co-opted needs to be published at the time of nominations.
Quote from: johnnycool on February 05, 2024, 04:55:17 PMQuote from: Main Street on February 05, 2024, 04:49:04 PMRe unelected Little-Pengelly as deputy first minister, is that because no elected DUP assembly member would want to be seen to be inferior to a fenian?
Susan McKay touches on this the last few days and adds in a bit of misogyny for good measure, but I think it's her loyalty to wee Jeffrey is probably the biggest reason as it looks like he can't trust too many in that party, MLA's or MP's.
Not all criticism of women is misogyny. That fucks me off as well. Women hold the highest political office and I am ok with that. But they aren't above scrutiny.
I see their king has had some bad news.
Quote from: trailer on February 05, 2024, 05:13:38 PMQuote from: Main Street on February 05, 2024, 04:49:04 PMRe unelected Little-Pengelly as deputy first minister, is that because no elected DUP assembly member would want to be seen to be inferior to a fenian?
Don't know. But what really fucks me off about her elevation to DFM is that she sat in the BBC studio at the time of the Assembly results and stated that she didn't speak for the DUP nor was she a member of the DUP. Not one week later she was co-opted in. It is that out and out bullshit that she and others spout that gets on my goat.
Besides all that she probably did zero canvassing in LV for JD when he was running. She continues to fail upwards. I think she won one election in her life and now she holds the highest political office in NI.
If parties are going to continue with this then a list of who will be co-opted needs to be published at the time of nominations.
The list would be too long
Quote from: trailer on February 05, 2024, 05:15:51 PMQuote from: johnnycool on February 05, 2024, 04:55:17 PMQuote from: Main Street on February 05, 2024, 04:49:04 PMRe unelected Little-Pengelly as deputy first minister, is that because no elected DUP assembly member would want to be seen to be inferior to a fenian?
Susan McKay touches on this the last few days and adds in a bit of misogyny for good measure, but I think it's her loyalty to wee Jeffrey is probably the biggest reason as it looks like he can't trust too many in that party, MLA's or MP's.
Not all criticism of women is misogyny. That fucks me off as well. Women hold the highest political office and I am ok with that. But they aren't above scrutiny.
I'd agree with you on that point, but the misogyny thing was in relation to the male members of the DUP not wanting to be subservient or seen to be subservient to Michelle O'Neill in this "deputy" role.
All alleged obviously.
Quote from: trailer on February 05, 2024, 05:13:38 PMQuote from: Main Street on February 05, 2024, 04:49:04 PMRe unelected Little-Pengelly as deputy first minister, is that because no elected DUP assembly member would want to be seen to be inferior to a fenian?
Don't know. But what really fucks me off about her elevation to DFM is that she sat in the BBC studio at the time of the Assembly results and stated that she didn't speak for the DUP nor was she a member of the DUP. Not one week later she was co-opted in. It is that out and out bullshit that she and others spout that gets on my goat.
Besides all that she probably did zero canvassing in LV for JD when he was running. She continues to fail upwards. I think she won one election in her life and now she holds the highest political office in NI.
If parties are going to continue with this then a list of who will be co-opted needs to be published at the time of nominations.
Not often I'd agree with you Trailer, but nail on the head here.
There might also be an unspoken reluctance in DUP to have a man serving as deputy to a woman.
And I'd expect too that certain senior DUP figures would not want to be in the position of implementing the protocol.
Can you imagine Sammy Wilson as deputy? Or Gregory?
The DUP are short on credible candidates...even in NI terms.
Absolutely no way there was going to be a male DUP deputy FM. They needed someone high enough profile and the likes of Paul Givan or Gordon Lyons would not even consider it. The imagery of having a man 'subservient' to a woman would not sit well with them
Technically they were all subservient to Arlene not so long ago? A republican woman is a different kettle altogether.
DUP have put a woman in so none of the men had to play second fiddle
Also as it gives them the progressive optic - woman heading up a lead role
They've also deliberately put ELP forward despite being unelected specifically as a f**k you to Nationalists and to try and cheapen/dilute the achievement
At the end of the day they took the soup, and they will continue to do so as they only thing they care about is their own salaries, expenses and getting re-elected to stay on the gravy train
Their lack of real leadership, plan and the unionist brain drain will be their downfall
Quote from: tiempo on February 06, 2024, 11:53:02 AMDUP have put a woman in so none of the men had to play second fiddle
Also as it gives them the progressive optic - woman heading up a lead role
They've also deliberately put ELP forward despite being unelected specifically as a f**k you to Nationalists and to try and cheapen/dilute the achievement
At the end of the day they took the soup, and they will continue to do so as they only thing they care about is their own salaries, expenses and getting re-elected to stay on the gravy train
Their lack of real leadership, plan and the unionist brain drain will be their downfall
Hard to argue with any of that, but what is their strategy for the next election or do they not think that far ahead?
ELP has proven unelectable in the past, so chances of her getting in through a vote are slim enough.
Quote from: tiempo on February 06, 2024, 11:53:02 AMDUP have put a woman in so none of the men had to play second fiddle
Also as it gives them the progressive optic - woman heading up a lead role
They've also deliberately put ELP forward despite being unelected specifically as a f**k you to Nationalists and to try and cheapen/dilute the achievement
At the end of the day they took the soup, and they will continue to do so as they only thing they care about is their own salaries, expenses and getting re-elected to stay on the gravy train
Their lack of real leadership, plan and the unionist brain drain will be their downfall
100% nail on the head!
Quote from: balladmaker on February 06, 2024, 12:12:54 PMQuote from: tiempo on February 06, 2024, 11:53:02 AMDUP have put a woman in so none of the men had to play second fiddle
Also as it gives them the progressive optic - woman heading up a lead role
They've also deliberately put ELP forward despite being unelected specifically as a f**k you to Nationalists and to try and cheapen/dilute the achievement
At the end of the day they took the soup, and they will continue to do so as they only thing they care about is their own salaries, expenses and getting re-elected to stay on the gravy train
Their lack of real leadership, plan and the unionist brain drain will be their downfall
100% nail on the head!
Surely that will backfire with ELP having no real creditability at the elections and with such a seasoned campaigner like MON that she will wipe the floor with her?
I wouldn't have ELP down as a door mat either, and she could surely see through the "lets put a woman" in there attitude (which I don't think it is)
I'd say they'll stick ELP in a safe seat to get her over the line.
Plus this will help her raise her profile.
Quote from: tiempo on February 06, 2024, 11:53:02 AMDUP have put a woman in so none of the men had to play second fiddle
Also as it gives them the progressive optic - woman heading up a lead role
They've also deliberately put ELP forward despite being unelected specifically as a f**k you to Nationalists and to try and cheapen/dilute the achievement
At the end of the day they took the soup, and they will continue to do so as they only thing they care about is their own salaries, expenses and getting re-elected to stay on the gravy train
Their lack of real leadership, plan and the unionist brain drain will be their downfall
Yep x 100
Quote from: NAG1 on February 06, 2024, 12:01:30 PMQuote from: tiempo on February 06, 2024, 11:53:02 AMDUP have put a woman in so none of the men had to play second fiddle
Also as it gives them the progressive optic - woman heading up a lead role
They've also deliberately put ELP forward despite being unelected specifically as a f**k you to Nationalists and to try and cheapen/dilute the achievement
At the end of the day they took the soup, and they will continue to do so as they only thing they care about is their own salaries, expenses and getting re-elected to stay on the gravy train
Their lack of real leadership, plan and the unionist brain drain will be their downfall
Hard to argue with any of that, but what is their strategy for the next election or do they not think that far ahead?
ELP has proven unelectable in the past, so chances of her getting in through a vote are slim enough.
I think you know the answer to that already. It seems that for a long time now they are only capable of thinking about a day in advance. Hence the mess they made of Brexit and everything else since. And it is glorious to watch.
Quote from: NAG1 on February 06, 2024, 12:01:30 PMHard to argue with any of that, but what is their strategy for the next election or do they not think that far ahead?
ELP has proven unelectable in the past, so chances of her getting in through a vote are slim enough.
Bogeyman bogeyman bogeyman
Quote from: marty34 on February 06, 2024, 12:28:04 PMI'd say they'll stick ELP in a safe seat to get her over the line.
Plus this will help her raise her profile.
Poots will go at the end of the term and she'll be back to the safe DUP South Belfast seat.
Wonder how long will DUPUDA stay in?
https://m.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/northern-ireland/rumblings-within-dup-continue-as-emma-little-pengelly-defends-return-to-stormont/a1889379380.html
There seems be a real effort by the DUP lately
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-68490776.amp
My flabber is gasted!
You can see a wee bit of a shift now with them. Jeffrey's speech etc said it. To preserve the "union" they'll need to appease more than DUP voters. Question is will this lose them voters in the process.
I do expect them to revert back to the norm at some point...
Quote from: armaghniac on March 06, 2024, 02:13:05 PMThere seems be a real effort by the DUP lately
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-68490776.amp
Maybe the penny has finally dropped that in order to try and stop the runaway train that is a United Ireland , unionism needs to make NI appealing to nationalists . I doubt it though
Quote from: imtommygunn on March 06, 2024, 02:22:43 PMYou can see a wee bit of a shift now with them. Jeffrey's speech etc said it. To preserve the "union" they'll need to appease more than DUP voters. Question is will this lose them voters in the process.
I do expect them to revert back to the norm at some point...
Robinson came out with the same sort of talk back in the day.
Then Belfast City Council stopped flying the Butcher's apron...........
Quote from: AustinPowers on March 06, 2024, 04:04:28 PMQuote from: armaghniac on March 06, 2024, 02:13:05 PMThere seems be a real effort by the DUP lately
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-68490776.amp
Maybe the penny has finally dropped that in order to try and stop the runaway train that is a United Ireland , unionism needs to make NI appealing to nationalists . I doubt it though
Can't see it unfortunately. And the reason is that making NI appealing to a nationalist will automatically make it unappealing to some unionists who see every grain of equality as a stripping of their Britishness. It's a zero sum game.
Big day for the DUP yesterday. Givan speaking Irish and ELP proving to be better with camog than Michelle. It was nice to see.
Someone better tell Paul Givan that the Waves of Tory doesn't mean the number of Prime Ministers brought down by Brexit
This DUP U-turn is astounding given their hardline position up until the beginning of this year. It's fairly clear that they have had a change of strategy and are now almost just stealing the clothes of the UUP. They had to try something different as they were losing votes but I'd imagine there are those within the party who are finding this new version hard to stomach. It will be interesting to see if they gain enough votes towards the middle to counteract the votes that they will lose on the hard right.
Quote from: lurganblue on March 07, 2024, 09:07:13 AMBig day for the DUP yesterday. Givan speaking Irish and ELP proving to be better with camog than Michelle. It was nice to see.
ELP went with the golf grip, either that or she's a cítog.
Michelle lost my vote after that, poor co-ordination altogether!
Quote from: yellowcard on March 07, 2024, 09:54:44 AMThis DUP U-turn is astounding given their hardline position up until the beginning of this year. It's fairly clear that they have had a change of strategy and are now almost just stealing the clothes of the UUP. They had to try something different as they were losing votes but I'd imagine there are those within the party who are finding this new version hard to stomach. It will be interesting to see if they gain enough votes towards the middle to counteract the votes that they will lose on the hard right.
Only thinv is they'll lose vote to the other side, the TUV.
What they gain one way, they'll lose the other way I think.
Quote from: lurganblue on March 07, 2024, 09:07:13 AMBig day for the DUP yesterday. Givan speaking Irish and ELP proving to be better with camog than Michelle. It was nice to see.
A real 'love in' at the minute between DUP and Sinn Fein.
What's next, M O'N to make a guest appearance in Moygashel on the 11th night?
There was an article in the Irish Times recently where Eamonnn Mallie said that Emma Pengelly was more cross-culturally aware than people realise. He said he had created a poetry reading group during COVID and when she was asked to recite, she chose a poem by Eiléan Ní Chuilleanáin. I think Givan was by DUP standards on the more liberal side and left the Free Presbyterian church when they criticised him for attending an ecumenical service. But it's still the party of extremists, a good few of them now sitting in the home for the bewildered called the House of Lords.
DUP
We're reasonable ...
We're reasonable ...
We're reasonable ...
We're reasonable ...
Is it not reasonable to block Casement or if it has to go ahead there needs to be major £££ spaffed in PUL areas for reparations
Thats how i see it
Quote from: weareros on March 07, 2024, 11:50:07 AMThere was an article in the Irish Times recently where Eamonnn Mallie said that Emma Pengelly was more cross-culturally aware than people realise. He said he had created a poetry reading group during COVID and when she was asked to recite, she chose a poem by Eiléan Ní Chuilleanáin. I think Givan was by DUP standards on the more liberal side and left the Free Presbyterian church when they criticised him for attending an ecumenical service.
That would be an ecumenical matter ?
QuoteBut it's still the party of extremists, a good few of them now sitting in the home for the bewildered called the House of Lords.
Couldn't help laughing out loud at that one! ;D
Quote from: LC on March 07, 2024, 10:55:58 AMQuote from: lurganblue on March 07, 2024, 09:07:13 AMBig day for the DUP yesterday. Givan speaking Irish and ELP proving to be better with camog than Michelle. It was nice to see.
A real 'love in' at the minute between DUP and Sinn Fein.
What's next, M O'N to make a guest appearance in Moygashel on the 11th night?
I thought she made an appearance there every year?
Quote from: tiempo on March 07, 2024, 12:02:48 PMDUP
We're reasonable ...
We're reasonable ...
We're reasonable ...
We're reasonable ...
Is it not reasonable to block Casement or if it has to go ahead there needs to be major £££ spaffed in PUL areas for reparations
Thats how i see it
You've got it in one. No such thing as distributing funding on the basis of need rather themmuns got it so we must get it too
Quote from: AustinPowers on March 07, 2024, 12:28:39 PMQuote from: LC on March 07, 2024, 10:55:58 AMQuote from: lurganblue on March 07, 2024, 09:07:13 AMBig day for the DUP yesterday. Givan speaking Irish and ELP proving to be better with camog than Michelle. It was nice to see.
A real 'love in' at the minute between DUP and Sinn Fein.
What's next, M O'N to make a guest appearance in Moygashel on the 11th night?
I thought she made an appearance there every year?
I see what you done there
Can we reword them the stoop Sinn fein party these days lol.
Quote from: Dougal Maguire on March 07, 2024, 01:06:04 PMQuote from: tiempo on March 07, 2024, 12:02:48 PMDUP
We're reasonable ...
We're reasonable ...
We're reasonable ...
We're reasonable ...
Is it not reasonable to block Casement or if it has to go ahead there needs to be major £££ spaffed in PUL areas for reparations
Thats how i see it
You've got it in one. No such thing as distributing funding on the basis of need rather themmuns got it so we must get it too
Indeed
Quote from: Dougal Maguire on February 25, 2024, 02:22:33 AMQuote from: RadioGAAGAA on February 24, 2024, 09:52:28 PMQuote from: Dreadnought on February 23, 2024, 09:45:10 PMAlright then non lunatic. What's your grand plan? Corrigan Park forever?
Already said it many, many times on the thread. But for your benefit.
- Replace the old main stand with a new one, covered seating. All the facilities they could ever want could be placed underneath this as the new structure could be far more significantly hollowed out relative to old, and the back of it could be extended over the road to add further floor space. No big difference to light on houses to the West of Casement as the existing stand already blocks it.
- Stick a roof over the (renewed) terrace on the far side of the pitch. The back end of this structure can hold the badly needed amenities. It'd be relatively low profile though.
- Renew the terraces at both ends of the pitch. Don't cover them. If there is sufficient demand - as determined by polls, one of the ends could be uncovered seats.
Capacity of 30-40k for the one or two times a year it may be needed - which would be during the summer. Comfortably sufficient covered capacity for during the autumn/winter/spring. 3 or 4 significantly different price tiers.
Basically the stadium that the GAA needs at a cost that will benefit all in the long-run.
Instead we're getting an expensive to build, expensive to maintain milestone, which will come with astronomical ticket prices.
But hey - the Ulster Council might be able to hold a few concerts. That's what this is about right? Otherwise it makes no sense to build what they are trying to build.
Great idea. Windsor all covered all seated, Ravenhill something similar. Casement as suggested above. Croppy lie down
Quote from: Shamrock Shore on March 06, 2024, 02:19:41 PMMy flabber is gasted!
I hope that you have recovered enough to face it again
https://twitter.com/BelTel/status/1765816360934740366
(https://pbs.twimg.com/card_img/1765816181657686016/Pj5o3yJo?format=jpg&name=small)
Quote from: Duine Inteacht Eile on March 07, 2024, 07:15:11 PMQuote from: Dougal Maguire on March 07, 2024, 01:06:04 PMQuote from: tiempo on March 07, 2024, 12:02:48 PMDUP
We're reasonable ...
We're reasonable ...
We're reasonable ...
We're reasonable ...
Is it not reasonable to block Casement or if it has to go ahead there needs to be major £££ spaffed in PUL areas for reparations
Thats how i see it
You've got it in one. No such thing as distributing funding on the basis of need rather themmuns got it so we must get it too
Indeed
Quote from: Dougal Maguire on February 25, 2024, 02:22:33 AMQuote from: RadioGAAGAA on February 24, 2024, 09:52:28 PMQuote from: Dreadnought on February 23, 2024, 09:45:10 PMAlright then non lunatic. What's your grand plan? Corrigan Park forever?
Already said it many, many times on the thread. But for your benefit.
- Replace the old main stand with a new one, covered seating. All the facilities they could ever want could be placed underneath this as the new structure could be far more significantly hollowed out relative to old, and the back of it could be extended over the road to add further floor space. No big difference to light on houses to the West of Casement as the existing stand already blocks it.
- Stick a roof over the (renewed) terrace on the far side of the pitch. The back end of this structure can hold the badly needed amenities. It'd be relatively low profile though.
- Renew the terraces at both ends of the pitch. Don't cover them. If there is sufficient demand - as determined by polls, one of the ends could be uncovered seats.
Capacity of 30-40k for the one or two times a year it may be needed - which would be during the summer. Comfortably sufficient covered capacity for during the autumn/winter/spring. 3 or 4 significantly different price tiers.
Basically the stadium that the GAA needs at a cost that will benefit all in the long-run.
Instead we're getting an expensive to build, expensive to maintain milestone, which will come with astronomical ticket prices.
But hey - the Ulster Council might be able to hold a few concerts. That's what this is about right? Otherwise it makes no sense to build what they are trying to build.
Great idea. Windsor all covered all seated, Ravenhill something similar. Casement as suggested above. Croppy lie down
Windsor and Ravenhill all seated and covered as that's what the need is now to meet supporter's requirements. Casements supporters have the same requirements
Quote from: Dougal Maguire on March 07, 2024, 11:30:16 PMQuote from: Duine Inteacht Eile on March 07, 2024, 07:15:11 PMQuote from: Dougal Maguire on March 07, 2024, 01:06:04 PMQuote from: tiempo on March 07, 2024, 12:02:48 PMDUP
We're reasonable ...
We're reasonable ...
We're reasonable ...
We're reasonable ...
Is it not reasonable to block Casement or if it has to go ahead there needs to be major £££ spaffed in PUL areas for reparations
Thats how i see it
You've got it in one. No such thing as distributing funding on the basis of need rather themmuns got it so we must get it too
Indeed
Quote from: Dougal Maguire on February 25, 2024, 02:22:33 AMQuote from: RadioGAAGAA on February 24, 2024, 09:52:28 PMQuote from: Dreadnought on February 23, 2024, 09:45:10 PMAlright then non lunatic. What's your grand plan? Corrigan Park forever?
Already said it many, many times on the thread. But for your benefit.
- Replace the old main stand with a new one, covered seating. All the facilities they could ever want could be placed underneath this as the new structure could be far more significantly hollowed out relative to old, and the back of it could be extended over the road to add further floor space. No big difference to light on houses to the West of Casement as the existing stand already blocks it.
- Stick a roof over the (renewed) terrace on the far side of the pitch. The back end of this structure can hold the badly needed amenities. It'd be relatively low profile though.
- Renew the terraces at both ends of the pitch. Don't cover them. If there is sufficient demand - as determined by polls, one of the ends could be uncovered seats.
Capacity of 30-40k for the one or two times a year it may be needed - which would be during the summer. Comfortably sufficient covered capacity for during the autumn/winter/spring. 3 or 4 significantly different price tiers.
Basically the stadium that the GAA needs at a cost that will benefit all in the long-run.
Instead we're getting an expensive to build, expensive to maintain milestone, which will come with astronomical ticket prices.
But hey - the Ulster Council might be able to hold a few concerts. That's what this is about right? Otherwise it makes no sense to build what they are trying to build.
Great idea. Windsor all covered all seated, Ravenhill something similar. Casement as suggested above. Croppy lie down
Windsor and Ravenhill all seated and covered as that's what the need is now to meet supporter's requirements. Casements supporters have the same requirements
I see Glentoran boss out in big support of getting Casement built so it could host the 'Big 2' matches ;D
That reminds me of the old joke about 2050 cup final result:
Linfield 2-11 Glentoran 3-6
My spidey senses tell me there's pockets getting lined to incentivize these recent pr initiatives. Just so out of character for the likes of Poots for it to feel real real
Paul Givan IRA
Emma Little Pengelly IRA
Edwin Poots IRA
Hats off to the DUP. They are playing a blinder. No missteps at all.
Deal is done, wait and see the investment in the Shankhill over the next 12 months in an education hub linked to Ulster University. People are meeting with loyalist groups to get them on board. This is all about hearts and minds, making unionist 'Irish' the norm so that the younger generation don't see any difference when the border is gone.
Quote from: trailer on March 08, 2024, 10:41:02 AMPaul Givan IRA
Emma Little Pengelly IRA
Edwin Poots IRA
Hats off to the DUP. They are playing a blinder. No missteps at all.
Preparing the path to an All Ireland outcome.....
Quote from: brokencrossbar1 on March 08, 2024, 11:51:57 AMDeal is done, wait and see the investment in the Shankhill over the next 12 months in an education hub linked to Ulster University. People are meeting with loyalist groups to get them on board. This is all about hearts and minds, making unionist 'Irish' the norm so that the younger generation don't see any difference when the border is gone.
If that was the case that kids from those deprived backgrounds were getting a help out and a sight of a different future from building bonfires and looking up to drug dealers driving X5's then I'd have no qualms about that.
Getting loyalist groups onboard normally means greasing a few palms
Quote from: theskull1 on March 08, 2024, 10:07:42 AMMy spidey senses tell me there's pockets getting lined to incentivize these recent pr initiatives. Just so out of character for the likes of Poots for it to feel real real
I'm getting quite uncomfortable about it, it's so out of character of the DUP I'm wondering if they've been hit by a collective bolt of lightning of the road to
Damascus Ballymoney!
Quote from: johnnycool on March 08, 2024, 01:38:54 PMQuote from: brokencrossbar1 on March 08, 2024, 11:51:57 AMDeal is done, wait and see the investment in the Shankhill over the next 12 months in an education hub linked to Ulster University. People are meeting with loyalist groups to get them on board. This is all about hearts and minds, making unionist 'Irish' the norm so that the younger generation don't see any difference when the border is gone.
If that was the case that kids from those deprived backgrounds were getting a help out and a sight of a different future from building bonfires and looking up to drug dealers driving X5's then I'd have no qualms about that.
Getting loyalist groups onboard normally means greasing a few palms
Make no mistake about it JC, it still means exactly the same. There are very few 'structures' within the loyalist communities to invest in. This money will be filtered through these communities and end up in the same hands as all the other monies have.
All we are doing is making consultants and gate keepers richer than they already are.
Quote from: johnnycool on March 08, 2024, 02:18:19 PMQuote from: theskull1 on March 08, 2024, 10:07:42 AMMy spidey senses tell me there's pockets getting lined to incentivize these recent pr initiatives. Just so out of character for the likes of Poots for it to feel real real
I'm getting quite uncomfortable about it, it's so out of character of the DUP I'm wondering if they've been hit by a collective bolt of lightning of the road to Damascus Ballymoney!
This is a leap year isn't it? Ah well , that explains everything ......
Quote from: theskull1 on March 08, 2024, 10:07:42 AMMy spidey senses tell me there's pockets getting lined to incentivize these recent pr initiatives. Just so out of character for the likes of Poots for it to feel real real
Red white and blue or green, white and gold our local politicians soon throw their principles out the window when it comes to the £££.
It's ok - Paul Girvan has things back to normal and is mingling with binlid and saying he will oppose the sea border.
Quote from: imtommygunn on March 09, 2024, 08:30:56 AMIt's ok - Paul Girvan has things back to normal and is mingling with binlid and saying he will oppose the sea border.
Was getting worried there for a while!
Quote from: AustinPowers on March 08, 2024, 11:51:20 PMQuote from: johnnycool on March 08, 2024, 02:18:19 PMQuote from: theskull1 on March 08, 2024, 10:07:42 AMMy spidey senses tell me there's pockets getting lined to incentivize these recent pr initiatives. Just so out of character for the likes of Poots for it to feel real real
I'm getting quite uncomfortable about it, it's so out of character of the DUP I'm wondering if they've been hit by a collective bolt of lightning of the road to Damascus Ballymoney!
This is a leap year isn't it? Ah well , that explains everything ......
Think you've just won post of the year!
Quote from: Dougal Maguire on March 07, 2024, 11:30:16 PMWindsor and Ravenhill all seated and covered as that's what the need is now to meet supporter's requirements. Casements supporters have the same requirements
Interesting that you ignored this (http://gaaboard.com/board/index.php?msg=2256811) post made in response to the quoted and several days before you posted the above.
Quote from: RadioGAAGAA on February 25, 2024, 09:44:33 AMQuote from: Dougal Maguire on February 25, 2024, 02:22:33 AMGreat idea. Windsor all covered all seated, Ravenhill something similar. Casement as suggested above. Croppy lie down
Something similar to all-covered all-seated... except of course Ravenhill has 3 sides covered seats, 1 side partially-covered terrace and 3 sides uncovered terrace. ???
Quote from: RadioGAAGAA on March 09, 2024, 09:57:44 AMQuote from: Dougal Maguire on March 07, 2024, 11:30:16 PMWindsor and Ravenhill all seated and covered as that's what the need is now to meet supporter's requirements. Casements supporters have the same requirements
Interesting that you ignored this (http://gaaboard.com/board/index.php?msg=2256811) post made in response to the quoted and several days before you posted the above.
Quote from: RadioGAAGAA on February 25, 2024, 09:44:33 AMQuote from: Dougal Maguire on February 25, 2024, 02:22:33 AMGreat idea. Windsor all covered all seated, Ravenhill something similar. Casement as suggested above. Croppy lie down
Something similar to all-covered all-seated... except of course Ravenhill has 3 sides covered seats, 1 side partially-covered terrace and 3 sides uncovered terrace. ???
To be honest, looking at the date and time, I obviously had a few pints in me when I posted that. You're right in that Something along the lines of Ravenhill would be sufficient although it wouldn't win any design awards.
I wonder if the brits were worried that their new Extremism definition might include the Orange Order?
probably not as orange order are seen as conservative types
will the irsp be classed as as extremists now as they have the word socialists in their name.
Quote from: Eire90 on March 14, 2024, 05:17:55 PMprobably not as orange order are seen as conservative types
will the irsp be classed as as extremists now as they have the word socialists in their name.
Are they still going?
well their military wing is suppose to be officially gone but the irsp are active in strabane derry belfast dublin
No doubt making a very positive contribution to their communities............
Quote from: LC on March 14, 2024, 07:30:41 PMNo doubt making a very positive contribution to their communities............
As with any organisation it has its bad eggs (IRSP has more than most tbf) but they have a few hard working and respected activists in Derry
I see the DUP leadership are currently in America.
You'd wonder what the boycott was all about in regards to the sea border. Nothing has changed.
I wonder will they lose votes to the TUV or will things just move on?
Quote from: Brendan on March 14, 2024, 08:49:38 PMQuote from: LC on March 14, 2024, 07:30:41 PMNo doubt making a very positive contribution to their communities............
As with any organisation it has its bad eggs (IRSP has more than most tbf) but they have a few hard working and respected activists in Derry
In terms of few they must be in the 'count with one hand territory'. Most of whom I have heard of / have come across would not have a proper day job (heaven forbid), instead of the they are on the community worker gravy train. In relation to being 'respected' well lets just say they are not sort of people you would want to fall out with.
https://www.reddit.com/r/northernireland/s/lrHzpvYI4f (https://www.reddit.com/r/northernireland/s/lrHzpvYI4f)
There are too many catholics in my uni class. What do I do?
How dare those Catholics try to get educated.
Quote from: Armagh18 on March 16, 2024, 09:41:19 AMHow dare those Catholics try to get educated.
And worse succeed in getting educated and taking our jobs......
Next thing "they'll be running our (sic) Country(sic)"
It gets worse for Jim and Co....
(Apologies for the source)
https://m.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/northern-ireland/figures-reveal-scale-of-post-windsor-framework-checks-on-goods-entering-ni-from-gb/a699851418.html
Quote from: Armagh18 on March 16, 2024, 09:41:19 AMHow dare those Catholics try to get educated.
And wear GAA tops to lecturers.....
Snarlene telling anyone who will listen that it's "better together". No, not an all-Ireland or European Union 😐
Allister talking through his hole. He was the only Prod in his Queens law class in...1974?
Quote from: gallsman on March 16, 2024, 02:26:24 PMAllister talking through his hole. He was the only Prod in his Queens law class in...1974?
And if he was whose fault is that?
Them pesky Fenians again. How dare they get educated to try and fight their way out of being treated as second class citizens.
Quote from: gallsman on March 16, 2024, 02:26:24 PMAllister talking through his hole. He was the only Prod in his Queens law class in...1974?
I'm not sure that's what he said.
He said that he was the first person in 10 years from his school, while there were 12 from St Whatever's.
Though I still wouldn't rule out that he was talking through his hole.
He said he was the only one from his school that year to go Queens law (disputed by Reddit contributors) and the insinuation was that pretty much everyone else around him was a taig.
That's not necessarily the insinuation.
The insinuation was that the nationalist community was driving young people towards law in order to take control of the judiciary.
Quote from: Duine Inteacht Eile on March 17, 2024, 07:52:10 AMQuote from: gallsman on March 16, 2024, 02:26:24 PMAllister talking through his hole. He was the only Prod in his Queens law class in...1974?
I'm not sure that's what he said.
He said that he was the first person in 10 years from his school, while there were 12 from St Whatever's.
Though I still wouldn't rule out that he was talking through his hole.
I think it was sectarian loaded message...the class was full of people from St. ....blah, blah blah. He was having a dig I reckon.
Be interesting to hear the full Q & A...if you could call it that.
The young lad in the uni class seemed to be annoyed with all the GAA tops.
Too late.
I think the demographic of the north is only hitting them now.
Too late.
With the DUP 'changing its spots' recently and trying to be all moderate. The penny has finally dropped.
Quote from: Duine Inteacht Eile on March 17, 2024, 07:52:10 AMQuote from: gallsman on March 16, 2024, 02:26:24 PMAllister talking through his hole. He was the only Prod in his Queens law class in...1974?
I'm not sure that's what he said.
He said that he was the first person in 10 years from his school, while there were 12 from St Whatever's.
Though I still wouldn't rule out that he was talking through his hole.
First post underneath the video dispels that myth right away.
Far be it from me, but Bryson was right in his reply (jesus, I can't believe I'm typing this) but continue on with your studies and work for a better future, it's what was driven into us from the 70's on, get an education as you won't be able to walk into a job in the shipyard/Shorts/Civil Service/Peelers like our Protestant neighbours.
Equality can be a bollox when you're used to entitlement.
Jim's bitterness in relation to the current judiciary is great ;D
Yeah but it wasn't driven into people by some army council boy landing round to the house of everyone with kids in them. It was driven into us by our parents. It wasn't some pre planned notion of this will get a united ireland - it was a notion that education will give you better chances in life. These boys seem to think that it was a joined up effort by the entire population. Bonkers.
Quote from: imtommygunn on March 19, 2024, 02:49:17 PMYeah but it wasn't driven into people by some army council boy landing round to the house of everyone with kids in them. It was driven into us by our parents. It wasn't some pre planned notion of this will get a united ireland - it was a notion that education will give you better chances in life. These boys seem to think that it was a joined up effort by the entire population. Bonkers.
Well said.
Quote from: StephenC on March 19, 2024, 03:01:47 PMQuote from: imtommygunn on March 19, 2024, 02:49:17 PMYeah but it wasn't driven into people by some army council boy landing round to the house of everyone with kids in them. It was driven into us by our parents. It wasn't some pre planned notion of this will get a united ireland - it was a notion that education will give you better chances in life. These boys seem to think that it was a joined up effort by the entire population. Bonkers.
Well said.
But that is the absolute perception out there even amongst the non-hardliners, everything was one big conspiracy against them, it was all joined up thinking by those pesky Taigs.
Quote from: NAG1 on March 19, 2024, 03:17:13 PMQuote from: StephenC on March 19, 2024, 03:01:47 PMQuote from: imtommygunn on March 19, 2024, 02:49:17 PMYeah but it wasn't driven into people by some army council boy landing round to the house of everyone with kids in them. It was driven into us by our parents. It wasn't some pre planned notion of this will get a united ireland - it was a notion that education will give you better chances in life. These boys seem to think that it was a joined up effort by the entire population. Bonkers.
Well said.
But that is the absolute perception out there even amongst the non-hardliners, everything was one big conspiracy against them, it was all joined up thinking by those pesky Taigs.
I don't think that's true at all tbh.
Quote from: NAG1 on March 19, 2024, 03:17:13 PMQuote from: StephenC on March 19, 2024, 03:01:47 PMQuote from: imtommygunn on March 19, 2024, 02:49:17 PMYeah but it wasn't driven into people by some army council boy landing round to the house of everyone with kids in them. It was driven into us by our parents. It wasn't some pre planned notion of this will get a united ireland - it was a notion that education will give you better chances in life. These boys seem to think that it was a joined up effort by the entire population. Bonkers.
Well said.
But that is the absolute perception out there even amongst the non-hardliners, everything was one big conspiracy against them, it was all joined up thinking by those pesky Taigs.
Education is much more class orientated within unionism than nationalism and the DUP have never seem to be overly interesting in addressing this.
Tbh there should be phds in this. There was shorts etc etc and walking into jobs with no education while catholics etc had to get educated. That has more or less now stopped so families who would have assumed to basically be on a gravy train without the effort to educate etc now will be no more.
One of the biggest enemies of the "PUL" community is the DUP. It does nothing to lift up people in poor areas etc.
Quote from: imtommygunn on March 19, 2024, 04:17:33 PMTbh there should be phds in this. There was shorts etc etc and walking into jobs with no education while catholics etc had to get educated. That has more or less now stopped so families who would have assumed to basically be on a gravy train without the effort to educate etc now will be no more.
One of the biggest enemies of the "PUL" community is the DUP. It does nothing to lift up people in poor areas etc.
Basically that's what happened to the Shankill. Generations of families were guaranteed a job in the local factories, and across town in the shipyard. They didn't need to worry about education and over several generations the idea of educational attainment died out. When fair employment eventually kicked in they were left floundering.
Quote from: imtommygunn on March 19, 2024, 04:17:33 PMTbh there should be phds in this. There was shorts etc etc and walking into jobs with no education while catholics etc had to get educated. That has more or less now stopped so families who would have assumed to basically be on a gravy train without the effort to educate etc now will be no more.
One of the biggest enemies of the "PUL" community is the DUP. It does nothing to lift up people in poor areas etc.
And why would they as if the locals get "too" educated they might cast their vote elsewhere. The fear of themmuns is a stronger draw in many communities than the draw a better life and getting the f**k out of there.
Quote from: Tony Baloney on March 19, 2024, 04:41:35 PMQuote from: imtommygunn on March 19, 2024, 04:17:33 PMTbh there should be phds in this. There was shorts etc etc and walking into jobs with no education while catholics etc had to get educated. That has more or less now stopped so families who would have assumed to basically be on a gravy train without the effort to educate etc now will be no more.
One of the biggest enemies of the "PUL" community is the DUP. It does nothing to lift up people in poor areas etc.
And why would they as if the locals get "too" educated they might cast their vote elsewhere. The fear of themmuns is a stronger draw in many communities than the draw a better life and getting the f**k out of their.
There is an enormous themmuns factor in the DUP, everything is positioned in opposition to normal Irish people.
Quote from: johnnycool on March 19, 2024, 02:28:12 PMQuote from: Duine Inteacht Eile on March 17, 2024, 07:52:10 AMQuote from: gallsman on March 16, 2024, 02:26:24 PMAllister talking through his hole. He was the only Prod in his Queens law class in...1974?
I'm not sure that's what he said.
He said that he was the first person in 10 years from his school, while there were 12 from St Whatever's.
Though I still wouldn't rule out that he was talking through his hole.
First post underneath the video dispels that myth right away.
Far be it from me, but Bryson was right in his reply (jesus, I can't believe I'm typing this) but continue on with your studies and work for a better future, it's what was driven into us from the 70's on, get an education as you won't be able to walk into a job in the shipyard/Shorts/Civil Service/Peelers like our Protestant neighbours.
Equality can be a bollox when you're used to entitlement.
Jim's bitterness in relation to the current judiciary is great ;D
It says everything when the likes of Jamie and Co are only figuring this out now.
I see that the DUP were playing silly buggers about the EU in the Assembly today. The "honeymoon" did not last long.
It's time for Jamie Bryson to join the TUV and stand for election. But I'd be surprised if he does because he knows that it could spell the end for him.
Quote from: LC on March 19, 2024, 05:06:22 PMQuote from: johnnycool on March 19, 2024, 02:28:12 PMQuote from: Duine Inteacht Eile on March 17, 2024, 07:52:10 AMQuote from: gallsman on March 16, 2024, 02:26:24 PMAllister talking through his hole. He was the only Prod in his Queens law class in...1974?
I'm not sure that's what he said.
He said that he was the first person in 10 years from his school, while there were 12 from St Whatever's.
Though I still wouldn't rule out that he was talking through his hole.
First post underneath the video dispels that myth right away.
Far be it from me, but Bryson was right in his reply (jesus, I can't believe I'm typing this) but continue on with your studies and work for a better future, it's what was driven into us from the 70's on, get an education as you won't be able to walk into a job in the shipyard/Shorts/Civil Service/Peelers like our Protestant neighbours.
Equality can be a bollox when you're used to entitlement.
Jim's bitterness in relation to the current judiciary is great ;D
It says everything when the likes of Jamie and Co are only figuring this out now.
Jamie didn't take his bigotry to task, with him full of resentment and fear (supposedly) being surrounded by GAA shirts at law school. Jamie's message was plough on son to the end, we need bigot lawyers (not lawyers without bigotry).
(https://i0.wp.com/uklawweekly.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/09/Hutz.jpg?fit=500%2C382&ssl=1)
Quote from: Duine Inteacht Eile on March 17, 2024, 07:52:10 AMQuote from: gallsman on March 16, 2024, 02:26:24 PMAllister talking through his hole. He was the only Prod in his Queens law class in...1974?
I'm not sure that's what he said.
He said that he was the first person in 10 years from his school, while there were 12 from St Whatever's.
Though I still wouldn't rule out that he was talking through his hole.
According to Wikipedia he went to Regent House Grammar School, only 1 law student in 10 years seems pretty unlikely.
Quote from: dec on March 19, 2024, 09:26:42 PMQuote from: Duine Inteacht Eile on March 17, 2024, 07:52:10 AMQuote from: gallsman on March 16, 2024, 02:26:24 PMAllister talking through his hole. He was the only Prod in his Queens law class in...1974?
I'm not sure that's what he said.
He said that he was the first person in 10 years from his school, while there were 12 from St Whatever's.
Though I still wouldn't rule out that he was talking through his hole.
According to Wikipedia he went to Regent House Grammar School, only 1 law student in 10 years seems pretty unlikely.
Jim Allister is 70 years of age so I'd be surprised if he was surrounded by nationalists as much as he claims back in the 1970s. It might be different now but I can't imagine the professions were being flooded with nationalists at that stage.
Quote from: dec on March 19, 2024, 09:26:42 PMQuote from: Duine Inteacht Eile on March 17, 2024, 07:52:10 AMQuote from: gallsman on March 16, 2024, 02:26:24 PMAllister talking through his hole. He was the only Prod in his Queens law class in...1974?
I'm not sure that's what he said.
He said that he was the first person in 10 years from his school, while there were 12 from St Whatever's.
Though I still wouldn't rule out that he was talking through his hole.
According to Wikipedia he went to Regent House Grammar School, only 1 law student in 10 years seems pretty unlikely.
Sweet fúck, he's from my part of the world then.
:o
Mutantards always had a bitter element to it in all fairness and the landed gentry around it are no different, they just hide it better but it came out every once in a while.
I see wee Jeffrey appears to have deleted his twitter account.
Meanwhile apropos of nothing.
A husband and wife from Co Down have been charged with a series of historical sexual offences against two children.
The 61-year old male was arrested at his home alongside his wife around 6am on Thursday, March, 28.
https://www.belfastlive.co.uk/news/northern-ireland/husband-wife-co-down-charged-28907532
MSM performing their function this morning it would appear.
:-X
Now do Willie McCrea
Quote from: Harold Disgracey on March 29, 2024, 12:37:25 AMI see wee Jeffrey appears to have deleted his twitter account.
Meanwhile apropos of nothing.
A husband and wife from Co Down have been charged with a series of historical sexual offences against two children.
The 61-year old male was arrested at his home alongside his wife around 6am on Thursday, March, 28.
https://www.belfastlive.co.uk/news/northern-ireland/husband-wife-co-down-charged-28907532
it is probably only a coincidence that according to Wiki Jeffrey is also 61!
Went to his Wikipedia and looked at the revision history
There was an entry added this morning at 07:56:29 stating only that he closed his Twitter and Instagram on March 28th. Exactly one minute later that entry was removed
Nothing at all from the usually very active PSNI Twitter feed and the BBC etc etc!
Quote from: johnnycool on March 29, 2024, 09:42:52 AMNothing at all from the usually very active PSNI Twitter feed and the BBC etc etc!
Tbf it was the lead story on the 9.30 news on bbc radio ulster
Quote from: smort on March 29, 2024, 09:44:20 AMQuote from: johnnycool on March 29, 2024, 09:42:52 AMNothing at all from the usually very active PSNI Twitter feed and the BBC etc etc!
Tbf it was the lead story on the 9.30 news on bbc radio ulster
That would mean having to listen to Nolan and that's not going to happen!
BBC Northern Ireland have a brief report about the charges "Man, 61, charged over non-recent sexual offences"
J Allister was complaining about super injunctions around 12 March seemed rather random at the time but maybe he was hinting at something.
Quote from: johnnycool on March 29, 2024, 09:52:38 AMQuote from: smort on March 29, 2024, 09:44:20 AMQuote from: johnnycool on March 29, 2024, 09:42:52 AMNothing at all from the usually very active PSNI Twitter feed and the BBC etc etc!
Tbf it was the lead story on the 9.30 news on bbc radio ulster
That would mean having to listen to Nolan and that's not going to happen!
I know, tuned in today for the first time in a while. Hoping for a bit of gossip
If, and it's a big if, this is him they'll kick him out and pull down stormont again...
With the Orange Order rejecting the deal this week, then it doesn't augur well.
It's only the 3rd or 4th story now on the 10 o'clock news
Interesting
There's a lot of speculation on this(though there probably is on everything with social media etc these days). Be a bit mad if so.
Quote from: Aaron Boone on March 29, 2024, 10:00:16 AMWith the Orange Order rejecting the deal this week, then it doesn't augur well.
The Orange Order saying NO 😮.
What's new?
Quote from: smort on March 29, 2024, 10:01:57 AMIt's only the 3rd or 4th story now on the 10 o'clock news
Interesting
They are not in court for three and a half weeks, so what could a new bulletin say? The only thing that could appear on the news was a statement that it wasn't him and the lack of that is damning. One wonders what the DUP are at, there must be panic among some there e.g. Pengelly is a Donaldson affiliate and has made a decent effort at her role.
'If' true, will just be another chapter in the eventual demise of their gerrymandered statelet.
Quote from: Rossfan on March 29, 2024, 10:20:16 AMQuote from: Aaron Boone on March 29, 2024, 10:00:16 AMWith the Orange Order rejecting the deal this week, then it doesn't augur well.
The Orange Order saying NO 😮.
What's new?
In a normal society absolutely no one would give a fúck what an organisation like the OO supports or doesn't support.
they will deflect by saying what about the adams family
Quote from: Eire90 on March 29, 2024, 10:43:23 AMthey will deflect by saying what about the adams family
if it were to be him he'll have to be turfed out.
Quote from: Eire90 on March 29, 2024, 10:43:23 AMthey will deflect by saying what about the adams family
Great show. Hasn't dated well
if its him they will turf him out but they will a bit of deflection by talking a adams too its already begun
Quote from: Eire90 on March 29, 2024, 10:54:05 AMif its him they will turf him out but they will a bit of deflection by talking a adams too its already begun
[/quoteQuote from: Eire90 on March 29, 2024, 10:54:05 AMif its him they will turf him out but they will a bit of deflection by talking a adams too its already begun
Not an Adams fan I take it?
;D What gave it away.
Quote from: balladmaker on March 29, 2024, 10:28:48 AM'If' true, will just be another chapter in the eventual demise of their gerrymandered statelet.
I mean never mind the fact that there allegedly seriously sexual crimes against children here, look at the silver lining that it's a leading unionist! How can we take advantage of this from a constitutional perspective?!
Repulsive.
Quote from: gallsman on March 29, 2024, 11:11:07 AMI mean never mind the fact that there allegedly seriously sexual crimes against children here, look at the silver lining that it's a leading unionist! How can we take advantage of this from a constitutional perspective?!
Repulsive.
Maybe its just me but I find that question repulsive :-\
That's my point.
Quote from: gallsman on March 29, 2024, 11:15:40 AMThat's my point.
Thanks for agreeing with me gallsman ;)
..... penny only dropped there now re reading 8)
DavidMcKeown will be on later tonight telling you guys to be "Careful Now"
Quote from: Shamrock Shore on March 29, 2024, 11:24:04 AMQuote from: clarshack on March 29, 2024, 10:47:52 AMwas really hoping it was Varadkar when I heard the rumours about an 'Irish Politician' but will take this one too if it's who people are saying.
Not much going on in your head, is there?
Who else do you hope abuses children?
FFS!
Horrendous.
In terms of the political situation. Bryson and his cronies have gone head first into the "Jeffrey was coerced" narrative... The DUP are facing another huge crisis which which I don't think will have the same outcome as the last.
talks of emergency dup meeting
can the media keep being quiet about it will they have to inform the public of the dup meeting if that is true
You're not allowed to name defendants for Sexual offences in the North.
Quote from: screenexile on March 29, 2024, 12:10:51 PMYou're not allowed to name defendants for Sexual offences in the North.
But we can use full stops, which is mighty
Quote from: theskull1 on March 29, 2024, 11:15:06 AMQuote from: gallsman on March 29, 2024, 11:11:07 AMI mean never mind the fact that there allegedly seriously sexual crimes against children here, look at the silver lining that it's a leading unionist! How can we take advantage of this from a constitutional perspective?!
Repulsive.
Maybe its just me but I find that question repulsive :-\
This type of thing crosses every political and social divide. Yet people pile on to imply some particular propensity among one group or the other or schadenfreude at their discomfort, when really this is everywhere.
So, has the male involved fled across the shuck while the female remains in the home?
Quote from: Eire90 on March 29, 2024, 12:03:26 PMcan the media keep being quiet about it will they have to inform the public of the dup meeting if that is true
It's very prominent on the BBC NI site. 61 year old man, 57 year old woman.
https://bbc.com/news/uk-northern-ireland-68692007
Confirmed as Jeff.
Quote"The Party Chairman has received a letter from Sir Jeffrey Donaldson MP confirming that he has been charged with allegations of an historical nature and indicating that he is stepping down as Leader of the Democratic Unionist Party with immediate effect.
In accordance with the Party Rules, the Party Officers have suspended Mr Donaldson from membership, pending the outcome of a judicial process.
The Party Officers have this morning unanimously appointed Mr Gavin Robinson MP as the Interim Party Leader."
https://mydup.com/news/dup-statement-3
Holy. Christ.
This person of 61 years of age has resigned
Shocking stuff and when the dust settles the question has to be why this is only coming out now for something that the statement claims is of an historical nature.
Quote from: yellowcard on March 29, 2024, 01:08:31 PMShocking stuff and when the dust settles the question has to be why this is only coming out now for something that the statement claims is of an historical nature.
The suggestion is that the victim only spoke out recently.
Quote from: screenexile on March 29, 2024, 12:10:51 PMYou're not allowed to name defendants for Sexual offences in the North.
And nobody gets named until they are charged
A 61 year old County Down man and his wife arrested for historical child sex abuse allegations including rape. And in a completely unrelated story, DUP Leader Jeffrey Donaldson, 61, from County Down, has deleted all his social media. Mad Ted.
Quote from: Saffrongael on March 29, 2024, 01:15:02 PMQuote from: screenexile on March 29, 2024, 12:10:51 PMYou're not allowed to name defendants for Sexual offences in the North.
And nobody gets named until they are charged
The two were charged when the reports came out earlier with no names included.
Just a tad late there Itchy.
This is happening to the sitting DUP leader, and all the while the files of Kincora etc remain closed, protecting others
Bryson making hay.
As Bill Hicks once said, anyone that far to the right is hiding something
Apologies for my tardiness
Quote from: Applesisapples on March 29, 2024, 01:35:48 PMBryson making hay.
Making hay on rape allegations is pretty low, though it is Byrson
Wonder what prominent solicitor would take this on? JF? lol
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on March 29, 2024, 01:41:52 PMWonder what prominent solicitor would take this on? JF? lol
Probably his own solicitor I'd imagine.
Sadly a victim or victims at the heart of it, but the bollix in me is having a laugh at Nolan, no show until Monday morning, he'll be gutted.
Quote from: Applesisapples on March 29, 2024, 01:35:48 PMBryson making hay.
Allister too, although of course he reminded people that there's a family at the centre of this story.
Horrible bastards the pair of them
Anyone who believes the allegations or timing of them are some sort of conspiracy is a lunatic. Donaldson going as leader of DUP gives the brexit fanatics and anti-framework wing another opportunity to swing the DUP in their direction. It benefits those J Bryson is implying have been wronged by forces unknown keeping the allegations quiet and railroading in the safeguarding the union agreement.
Seems likely to prompt another round of inter unionist fighting over who loves the union most.
Quote from: Sportacus on March 29, 2024, 02:00:34 PMSadly a victim or victims at the heart of it, but the bollix in me is having a laugh at Nolan, no show until Monday morning, he'll be gutted.
I don't listen to Nolan, why's the joke on him.
Quote from: north_antrim_hound on March 29, 2024, 02:11:20 PMQuote from: Sportacus on March 29, 2024, 02:00:34 PMSadly a victim or victims at the heart of it, but the bollix in me is having a laugh at Nolan, no show until Monday morning, he'll be gutted.
I don't listen to Nolan, why's the joke on him.
Because he loves to break the big stories and be the main man.
He couldn't lift the lid on it.
Bryson is a bad wee f**ker and Allister is not much better. Two bad people who you would rather would have no public profile whatsoever.
Convenient timing for the hardliners after he agreed to go back in to government.
Quote from: gallsman on March 29, 2024, 02:03:49 PMQuote from: Applesisapples on March 29, 2024, 01:35:48 PMBryson making hay.
Allister too, although of course he reminded people that there's a family at the centre of this story.
Horrible bastards the pair of them
He wasn't too worried about his mate Tweed's family, the rancid wee bastard
Exactly >:( Scum of the earth.
nolan does a show on 5 live friday saturday sunday nights
Big news breaking about the leader of the DUP. Only caught the end of it.
Quote from: Olly on March 29, 2024, 02:45:49 PMBig news breaking about the leader of the DUP. Only caught the end of it.
The end of Jeffrey is his best bit
Quote from: dec on March 29, 2024, 02:14:09 PMConvenient timing for the hardliners after he agreed to go back in to government.
That would be my thinking too.
Might we see Stormont collapse again? I wouldn't be surprised with big Jeff gone., and Robinson now head honcho
In 10 years they have had as leaders;
Ian Paisley
Peter Robinson
Arlene Foster
Edwin Poots
Jeffrey Donaldson
Gavin Robinson
The melt-down continues.
In the words of the late Ian Paisley (senior) ''Where's Jeffrey?''
I wouldn't have much faith in Robinson's ability to keep anything together or lead in any way. A human burger.
Quote from: From the Bunker on March 29, 2024, 03:16:08 PMIn 10 years they have had as leaders;
Ian Paisley
Peter Robinson
Arlene Foster
Edwin Poots
Jeffrey Donaldson
Gavin Robinson
The melt-down continues.
In the words of the late Ian Paisley (senior) ''Where's Jeffrey?''
Its a poisoned chalice for whoever steps in next as well. They will have to appoint a leader soon as there are elections coming up in the next year. I don't see too many who would be queuing up to get the job with all of the issues that they have to deal with.
Quote from: yellowcard on March 29, 2024, 03:19:43 PMQuote from: From the Bunker on March 29, 2024, 03:16:08 PMIn 10 years they have had as leaders;
Ian Paisley
Peter Robinson
Arlene Foster
Edwin Poots
Jeffrey Donaldson
Gavin Robinson
The melt-down continues.
In the words of the late Ian Paisley (senior) ''Where's Jeffrey?''
Its a poisoned chalice for whoever steps in next as well. They will have to appoint a leader soon as there are elections coming up in the next year. I don't see too many who would be queuing up to get the job with all of the issues that they have to deal with.
Maybe the unelected Emma Little-Pengelly could be leader? Sure she is Deputy First Minister? For a Party who were very worried about Mandates in the 70's and 80's, they sure let their own moral hardline slip when it came to their own.
Quote from: yellowcard on March 29, 2024, 03:19:43 PMQuote from: From the Bunker on March 29, 2024, 03:16:08 PMIn 10 years they have had as leaders;
Ian Paisley
Peter Robinson
Arlene Foster
Edwin Poots
Jeffrey Donaldson
Gavin Robinson
The melt-down continues.
In the words of the late Ian Paisley (senior) ''Where's Jeffrey?''
Its a poisoned chalice for whoever steps in next as well. They will have to appoint a leader soon as there are elections coming up in the next year. I don't see too many who would be queuing up to get the job with all of the issues that they have to deal with.
According to Alex Kane on RTE they can't risk a poisonous pro/anti Deal row in an election so Gavin whashisname will be appointed leader.
Quote from: Itchy on March 29, 2024, 01:36:44 PMAs Bill Hicks once said, anyone that far to the right is hiding something
Apologies for my tardiness
Christopher Hitchens:
Whenever I hear some bigmouth in Washington or the Christian heartland banging on about the evils of sodomy or whatever, I mentally enter his name in my notebook and contentedly set my watch. Sooner rather than later, he will be discovered down on his weary and well-worn old knees in some dreary motel or latrine, with an expired Visa card, having tried to pay well over the odds to be peed upon by some Apache transvestite.
Quote from: AustinPowers on March 29, 2024, 03:10:30 PMQuote from: dec on March 29, 2024, 02:14:09 PMConvenient timing for the hardliners after he agreed to go back in to government.
That would be my thinking too.
Might we see Stormont collapse again? I wouldn't be surprised with big Jeff gone., and Robinson now head honcho
Alex Kane was talking about negotiations for a single Unionist porty. Any more detail on that ?
Quote from: seafoid on March 29, 2024, 03:36:45 PMQuote from: AustinPowers on March 29, 2024, 03:10:30 PMQuote from: dec on March 29, 2024, 02:14:09 PMConvenient timing for the hardliners after he agreed to go back in to government.
That would be my thinking too.
Might we see Stormont collapse again? I wouldn't be surprised with big Jeff gone., and Robinson now head honcho
Alex Kane was talking about negotiations for a single Unionist porty. Any more detail on that ?
Are you taking the piss out of the Malone Road accent?
Doug Beattie, without doing very much may end of King of the Castle...
The party of God, led by the following...
Ian Paisley - Inciter in chief of countless acts of sectarian violence and murder and otherwise too many things to mention
Peter Robinson - Invader of clontibret and up to his oxters in dodgy Nama dealings. Wife shagged a young'un
Arlene Foster - RHI overseer and suspected of cruelty to crocodiles
Edwin Poots - Prima facie clean, but the young boy's a suspected crook with planning shenanigans
Jeffrey Donaldson - Charged with sexual abuse
Gavin Robinson - TBC...
Nah, that'd be "pahty". Porty would be more your neck of the woods and the south Derry types ;D
There is something very significant about Gormfhlaith ni Thuairisg speaking Irish on RTE Radio 1 and telling the nation on the news at 4 that the leader of the DUP has resigned due to a criminal investigation. Curry my yoghurt.
ft.com/content/fcf6e9f2-82fd-4a03-8945-a3679c6bc640...
Even the most brilliant political strategies must ultimately be measured against their outcomes.
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GJ2k7Z6WkAARd_l?format=jpg&name=medium)
Must be very bad, even the orange order suspended him.
Quote from: Itchy on March 29, 2024, 05:01:00 PMMust be very bad, even the orange order suspended him.
When did that shower get morals?
Seen it mentioned on here but is it official that the alleged victim was underage??
Quote from: dec on March 29, 2024, 04:58:54 PM(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GJ2k7Z6WkAARd_l?format=jpg&name=medium)
[/quoteQuote from: dec on March 29, 2024, 04:58:54 PM(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GJ2k7Z6WkAARd_l?format=jpg&name=medium)
That should be his prison attire
All those photos around the house of people shaking hands with Jeff will be getting binned!
The UDR will take his name off their wall too
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on March 29, 2024, 05:09:11 PMAll those photos around the house of people shaking hands with Jeff will be getting binned!
The UDR will take his name off their wall too
All the ones up on people's Dart boards will stay UP though. These things balance themselves out over......
Quote from: HiMucker on March 29, 2024, 05:17:32 PMQuote from: Milltown Row2 on March 29, 2024, 05:09:11 PMAll those photos around the house of people shaking hands with Jeff will be getting binned!
The UDR will take his name off their wall too
All the ones up on people's Dart boards will stay UP though. These things balance themselves out over......
Those photo's will be handy to light the fire on the 11th!
Will he lose his ''SIR'' title?
how does this effect northern ireland and all ireland will they not just move on from this and throw donaldson under the bus how does this change NI politically apart from an internal dup thing.
Quote from: Eire90 on March 29, 2024, 05:29:12 PMhow does this effect northern ireland and all ireland will they not just move on from this and throw donaldson under the bus how does this change NI politically apart from an internal dup thing.
Quote from: From the Bunker on March 29, 2024, 05:26:44 PMWill he lose his ''SIR'' title?
That will be coming down the line if he is found guilty, I would say.
Quote from: Eire90 on March 29, 2024, 05:29:12 PMhow does this effect northern ireland and all ireland will they not just move on from this and throw donaldson under the bus how does this change NI politically apart from an internal dup thing.
If those who didn't want to back into power sharing are now in charge then this could have serious implications.
I heard rumours that that victims were close relatives.
He's away to London, separately it seems. Has been taking canoe lessons lately
Quote from: nrico2006 on March 29, 2024, 05:32:40 PMQuote from: Eire90 on March 29, 2024, 05:29:12 PMhow does this effect northern ireland and all ireland will they not just move on from this and throw donaldson under the bus how does this change NI politically apart from an internal dup thing.
If these who didn't want to back into power sharing are now in charge then this could have serious implications.
I heard rumours that that victims were close relatives.
Multiple victims? Jaysus.
Quote from: Eire90 on March 29, 2024, 05:29:12 PMhow does this effect northern ireland and all ireland will they not just move on from this and throw donaldson under the bus how does this change NI politically apart from an internal dup thing.
A big opportunity now for the opponents of the Windsor Framework. Gavin Robinson doesn't have the kudos to take the party forward, they are too divided. Nigel Dodds is a big string puller in the background and then you have the mavericks like Sammy and the hardliners like Carla. They'll chose a new leader but I'm not really sure how they hold it together because they're not sure whether they are for or against the current arrangement - border in the Irish Sea and second fiddle to Michelle, but trying to 'make NI work'. And ironically that means instability for the Assembly etc.
Will they just wait till the next election or will him stepping down generate a by-election ?
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on March 29, 2024, 06:13:44 PMWill they just wait till the next election or will him stepping down generate a by-election ?
It should generate a by election but will anyone be in a hurry to do this?
Sorcha Eastwood's chances much improved.
Quote from: armaghniac on March 29, 2024, 06:20:18 PMQuote from: Milltown Row2 on March 29, 2024, 06:13:44 PMWill they just wait till the next election or will him stepping down generate a by-election ?
It should generate a by election but will anyone be in a hurry to do this?
Sorcha Eastwood's chances much improved.
The last protest vote Peter Robinson lost the safest seat in Belfast
if assembly goes down again could anyone be arsed with listening nolan and crawley talking every day abou twhen it will be back up again.
Quote from: Eire90 on March 29, 2024, 06:27:50 PMif assembly goes down again could anyone be arsed with listening nolan and crawley talking every day abou twhen it will be back up again.
The rent a mob crowd of "commentators" like David McCann, Alex Kane and Suzanne Breen will be happy anyway
strange thing is donaldson probably win an election if he ran as unionist independent
Quote from: armaghniac on March 29, 2024, 06:20:18 PMQuote from: Milltown Row2 on March 29, 2024, 06:13:44 PMWill they just wait till the next election or will him stepping down generate a by-election ?
It should generate a by election but will anyone be in a hurry to do this?
Sorcha Eastwood's chances much improved.
If the DUP lose 2 Westminster seats and presuming the Shinners don't a single unionist party will be imperative
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_MPs_for_constituencies_in_Northern_Ireland_(2019%E2%80%93present)
Quote from: From the Bunker on March 29, 2024, 05:26:44 PMWill he lose his ''SIR'' title?
Imagine seeing these titles bestowed, career elevation through to the leader of the DUP, all this happening through the eyes of his victims. The world can be a very cruel place at times
Quote from: Sportacus on March 29, 2024, 06:10:40 PMQuote from: Eire90 on March 29, 2024, 05:29:12 PMhow does this effect northern ireland and all ireland will they not just move on from this and throw donaldson under the bus how does this change NI politically apart from an internal dup thing.
A big opportunity now for the opponents of the Windsor Framework. Gavin Robinson doesn't have the kudos to take the party forward, they are too divided. Nigel Dodds is a big string puller in the background and then you have the mavericks like Sammy and the hardliners like Carla. They'll chose a new leader but I'm not really sure how they hold it together because they're not sure whether they are for or against the current arrangement - border in the Irish Sea and second fiddle to Michelle, but trying to 'make NI work'. And ironically that means instability for the Assembly etc.
I can't see it going that way even if we Jamie is filling his pants with excitement. The DUP democratically decided to go back to Stormont and this doesn't change that fact.
Quote from: JoG2 on March 29, 2024, 07:02:12 PMQuote from: From the Bunker on March 29, 2024, 05:26:44 PMWill he lose his ''SIR'' title?
Imagine seeing these titles bestowed, career elevation through to the leader of the DUP, all this happening through the eyes of his victims. The world can be a very cruel place at times
He would have been earmarked for a cushy wee number in the Lords to see out his days.
Quote from: seafoid on March 29, 2024, 06:57:34 PMQuote from: armaghniac on March 29, 2024, 06:20:18 PMQuote from: Milltown Row2 on March 29, 2024, 06:13:44 PMWill they just wait till the next election or will him stepping down generate a by-election ?
It should generate a by election but will anyone be in a hurry to do this?
Sorcha Eastwood's chances much improved.
If the DUP lose 2 Westminster seats and presuming the Shinners don't a single unionist party will be imperative
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_MPs_for_constituencies_in_Northern_Ireland_(2019%E2%80%93present)
Can someone correct me if I am wrong that they can survive a by-election being called as we are in Election year? Michelle Gildernew, Micky Brady and Francie Molly all stepping down there seats but no by-elections.
However if a by-election is called in Lagan Valley Alliance will need lot to go there way - turnout would need to strong and most by elections turnout figures aren't great.
Quote from: seafoid on March 29, 2024, 06:57:34 PMQuote from: armaghniac on March 29, 2024, 06:20:18 PMQuote from: Milltown Row2 on March 29, 2024, 06:13:44 PMWill they just wait till the next election or will him stepping down generate a by-election ?
It should generate a by election but will anyone be in a hurry to do this?
Sorcha Eastwood's chances much improved.
If the DUP lose 2 Westminster seats and presuming the Shinners don't a single unionist party will be imperative
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_MPs_for_constituencies_in_Northern_Ireland_(2019%E2%80%93present)
It's their only hope of remaining a substantial block. Alliance are stealing from both sides who don't want to identify with old skool NI Civil war politics.
Although (I presume) the DUP party are innocent in all this, You cannot feel that it will tarnish the Party.
And who of the minnow Unionist Parties would want to Align with them?
Quote from: drillsergeant on March 29, 2024, 07:32:54 PMCan someone correct me if I am wrong that they can survive a by-election being called as we are in Election year? Michelle Gildernew, Micky Brady and Francie Molly all stepping down there seats but no by-elections.
These people have presumably stated that they want to stop not attending at the next election, but they are still in situ now and still enjoy the confidence of their voters. I suppose the question is whether the DUP want a quick change or see advantage in delay.
allegations against enoch powell too a hero the british right wing
Jesus. I've had a day where, for different reasons, I had no glance at X/ Twitter, and heard no news. Just spent the last half hour reading back over about 10 pages here. A classic 'Did I miss anything?' episode for me...
Gavin Robinson talking about how they have faith in the criminal justice system. Let's remember that the next time a DUPer is whinging about there being too many taigs in the judiciary.
Quote from: drillsergeant on March 29, 2024, 07:32:54 PMQuote from: seafoid on March 29, 2024, 06:57:34 PMQuote from: armaghniac on March 29, 2024, 06:20:18 PMQuote from: Milltown Row2 on March 29, 2024, 06:13:44 PMWill they just wait till the next election or will him stepping down generate a by-election ?
It should generate a by election but will anyone be in a hurry to do this?
Sorcha Eastwood's chances much improved.
If the DUP lose 2 Westminster seats and presuming the Shinners don't a single unionist party will be imperative
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_MPs_for_constituencies_in_Northern_Ireland_(2019%E2%80%93present)
Can someone correct me if I am wrong that they can survive a by-election being called as we are in Election year? Michelle Gildernew, Micky Brady and Francie Molly all stepping down there seats but no by-elections.
However if a by-election is called in Lagan Valley Alliance will need lot to go there way - turnout would need to strong and most by elections turnout figures aren't great.
JD has not resigned as an MP as yet so no bye election required. If he does it will be called within 3 months. The SF representatives mentioned are stepping down at the next election so again no bye election required.
Quote from: JoG2 on March 29, 2024, 07:02:12 PMQuote from: From the Bunker on March 29, 2024, 05:26:44 PMWill he lose his ''SIR'' title?
Imagine seeing these titles bestowed, career elevation through to the leader of the DUP, all this happening through the eyes of his victims. The world can be a very cruel place at times
That's why the victims are to be congratulated. Must have taken huge courage to name someone as high and mighty as that.
Quote from: GTP on March 29, 2024, 08:59:09 PMThe SF representatives mentioned are stepping down at the next election so again no bye election required.
Gildernew is contesting the European seat in June. Will she step down if elected? She should, but with Westminster election one a few months later I wonder would there be any point.
Do you think it'll get to the point when you're not electable unless you've a dark past? Personally, I wouldn't vote for anyone who is clean-cut. They're usually hiding something. That's why Sinn Fein are doing well.
The expenses he ran up watching films in hotel room was strange behaviour
Quote from: Eire90 on March 29, 2024, 07:52:53 PMallegations against enoch powell too a hero the british right wing
The Good Friday Teardown
Has Markethill woman Little-Pengelly got a ticket for Sunday?
Quote from: NotedObserver on March 29, 2024, 10:20:42 PMThe expenses he ran up watching films in hotel room was strange behaviour
Very strange and not much made of it.
MPs are strange. Claim a lot of expenses too...on strange stuff also.
Quote from: Orior on March 29, 2024, 10:46:49 PMHas Markethill woman Little-Pengelly got a ticket for Sunday?
I think her husband is getting a new gig with the DE. Although 6 members of the board voted against his going by the report.
Quote from: marty34 on March 29, 2024, 10:49:22 PMQuote from: Orior on March 29, 2024, 10:46:49 PMHas Markethill woman Little-Pengelly got a ticket for Sunday?
I think her husband is getting a new gig with the DE. Although 6 members of the board voted against his going by the report.
He's got the Interim Head of EA post. People will be keeping a tight eye on where the money is being spent.
Quote from: Eire90 on March 29, 2024, 07:52:53 PMallegations against enoch powell too a hero the british right wing
Wasn't it Powell that once claimed it was the CIA that killed Mountbatten?
Quote from: Saffrongael on March 29, 2024, 06:36:05 PMQuote from: Eire90 on March 29, 2024, 06:27:50 PMif assembly goes down again could anyone be arsed with listening nolan and crawley talking every day abou twhen it will be back up again.
The rent a mob crowd of "commentators" like David McCann, Alex Kane and Suzanne Breen will be happy anyway
I find Gareth Gordon the pick of the current bunch. Comes across as down to earth and well informed.
Quote from: NotedObserver on March 29, 2024, 10:20:42 PMThe expenses he ran up watching films in hotel room was strange behaviour
Always wondered why that story never got more scrutiny. A certain type of movie can be expensive.
Quote from: Sportacus on March 29, 2024, 10:56:03 PMQuote from: Saffrongael on March 29, 2024, 06:36:05 PMQuote from: Eire90 on March 29, 2024, 06:27:50 PMif assembly goes down again could anyone be arsed with listening nolan and crawley talking every day abou twhen it will be back up again.
The rent a mob crowd of "commentators" like David McCann, Alex Kane and Suzanne Breen will be happy anyway
I find Gareth Gordon the pick of the current bunch. Comes across as down to earth and well informed.
David McCann always appears balanced.
Quote from: Tony Baloney on March 29, 2024, 10:50:54 PMQuote from: marty34 on March 29, 2024, 10:49:22 PMQuote from: Orior on March 29, 2024, 10:46:49 PMHas Markethill woman Little-Pengelly got a ticket for Sunday?
I think her husband is getting a new gig with the DE. Although 6 members of the board voted against his going by the report.
He's got the Interim Head of EA post. People will be keeping a tight eye on where the money is being spent.
True. Jobs for the boys.
Quote from: Sportacus on March 29, 2024, 10:56:03 PMQuote from: Saffrongael on March 29, 2024, 06:36:05 PMQuote from: Eire90 on March 29, 2024, 06:27:50 PMif assembly goes down again could anyone be arsed with listening nolan and crawley talking every day abou twhen it will be back up again.
The rent a mob crowd of "commentators" like David McCann, Alex Kane and Suzanne Breen will be happy anyway
I find Gareth Gordon the pick of the current bunch. Comes across as down to earth and well informed.
GG is BBC NI political correspondent. He's a journalist (and you're right, a good one), not a commentator.
Is it a coincidence this news broke just before a bank holiday weekend, or is that a cynical view ?
Quote from: gallsman on March 29, 2024, 09:23:34 PMQuote from: GTP on March 29, 2024, 08:59:09 PMThe SF representatives mentioned are stepping down at the next election so again no bye election required.
Gildernew is contesting the European seat in June. Will she step down if elected? She should, but with Westminster election one a few months later I wonder would there be any point.
My understanding is dual mandates are not permitted so she would have to resign. Bye election would depend on if a general election was to be within the 3 months of resignation.
Quote from: GTP on March 30, 2024, 12:05:55 AMQuote from: gallsman on March 29, 2024, 09:23:34 PMQuote from: GTP on March 29, 2024, 08:59:09 PMThe SF representatives mentioned are stepping down at the next election so again no bye election required.
Gildernew is contesting the European seat in June. Will she step down if elected? She should, but with Westminster election one a few months later I wonder would there be any point.
My understanding is dual mandates are not permitted so she would have to resign. Bye election would depend on if a general election was to be within the 3 months of resignation.
With General Election looming surely now the DUP are looking over there shoulders in South Antrim, East Belfast and now Lagan Valley.
Regarding FST - Sinn Fein will need a strong candidate to hold that seat. No doubt they face a unity Unionist Candidate with it going to the wire.
Quote from: screenexile on March 29, 2024, 12:10:51 PMYou're not allowed to name defendants for Sexual offences in the North.
Yes you are. You aren't allowed to name complainants
Quote from: David McKeown on March 30, 2024, 12:49:23 AMQuote from: screenexile on March 29, 2024, 12:10:51 PMYou're not allowed to name defendants for Sexual offences in the North.
Yes you are. You aren't allowed to name complainants
You can't name defendants if doing so identifies the complainants (ie sex offences committed within a family). However, if the complainants waive their right to anonymity, then the defendants can be named.
Quote from: red hander on March 30, 2024, 01:59:59 AMQuote from: David McKeown on March 30, 2024, 12:49:23 AMQuote from: screenexile on March 29, 2024, 12:10:51 PMYou're not allowed to name defendants for Sexual offences in the North.
Yes you are. You aren't allowed to name complainants
You can't name defendants if doing so identifies the complainants (ie sex offences committed within a family). However, if the complainants waive their right to anonymity, then the defendants can be named.
This is like 'good, better, best' in the Antiques Roadshow
Quote from: Wee Barky on March 30, 2024, 12:00:49 AMIs it a coincidence this news broke just before a bank holiday weekend, or is that a cynical view ?
Not everything is a conspiracy.
Quote from: RedHand88 on March 30, 2024, 06:21:58 AMQuote from: Wee Barky on March 30, 2024, 12:00:49 AMIs it a coincidence this news broke just before a bank holiday weekend, or is that a cynical view ?
Not everything is a conspiracy.
I had thec exact same conversation with my Mrs yesterday funny enough. Gives it all time to die down over the long weekend. I'd say there's been a political choice (or consideration at the very least) made on the timing of the arrest. It's just the way shit works, Chief constables are political beasts. - not to protect wee Jeff either but Stormont itself.
Quote from: bennydorano on March 30, 2024, 06:57:06 AMQuote from: RedHand88 on March 30, 2024, 06:21:58 AMQuote from: Wee Barky on March 30, 2024, 12:00:49 AMIs it a coincidence this news broke just before a bank holiday weekend, or is that a cynical view ?
Not everything is a conspiracy.
I had thec exact same conversation with my Mrs yesterday funny enough. Gives it all time to die down over the long weekend. I'd say there's been a political choice (or consideration at the very least) made on the timing of the arrest. It's just the way shit works, Chief constables are political beasts. - not to protect wee Jeff either but Stormont itself.
Yeah, timing is everything.
Plus no Nolan for a day or two!
Quote from: drillsergeant on March 30, 2024, 12:27:26 AMQuote from: GTP on March 30, 2024, 12:05:55 AMQuote from: gallsman on March 29, 2024, 09:23:34 PMQuote from: GTP on March 29, 2024, 08:59:09 PMThe SF representatives mentioned are stepping down at the next election so again no bye election required.
Gildernew is contesting the European seat in June. Will she step down if elected? She should, but with Westminster election one a few months later I wonder would there be any point.
My understanding is dual mandates are not permitted so she would have to resign. Bye election would depend on if a general election was to be within the 3 months of resignation.
With General Election looming surely now the DUP are looking over there shoulders in South Antrim, East Belfast and now Lagan Valley.
Regarding FST - Sinn Fein will need a strong candidate to hold that seat. No doubt they face a unity Unionist Candidate with it going to the wire.
With demographic shift FST should finally be beyond Unionism even with a unity candidate. I think this year they will win comfortably, although comfortably in FST in recent years has been double figures😂.
Lagan valley most certainly is in play, will be interesting to see how the unionist community reacts to the Donaldson fall out, will they keep voting DUP to keep SF out, will they drift to the TUV headbangers. If the UUP don't massively profit from this crisis then they truly are finished.
SA now looks good for UUP. EB, LV and even EA and Strangford could big improvements for Alliance with maybe a couple of gains.
If the nationalist voters bothered to turn up in upper banned for a change then SF could come through the middle of split unionist vote. EL is similar but would need a miracle perfect storm.
Quote from: JPGJOHNNYG on March 30, 2024, 07:57:12 AMQuote from: drillsergeant on March 30, 2024, 12:27:26 AMQuote from: GTP on March 30, 2024, 12:05:55 AMQuote from: gallsman on March 29, 2024, 09:23:34 PMQuote from: GTP on March 29, 2024, 08:59:09 PMThe SF representatives mentioned are stepping down at the next election so again no bye election required.
Gildernew is contesting the European seat in June. Will she step down if elected? She should, but with Westminster election one a few months later I wonder would there be any point.
My understanding is dual mandates are not permitted so she would have to resign. Bye election would depend on if a general election was to be within the 3 months of resignation.
With General Election looming surely now the DUP are looking over there shoulders in South Antrim, East Belfast and now Lagan Valley.
Regarding FST - Sinn Fein will need a strong candidate to hold that seat. No doubt they face a unity Unionist Candidate with it going to the wire.
With demographic shift FST should finally be beyond Unionism even with a unity candidate. I think this year they will win comfortably, although comfortably in FST in recent years has been double figures😂.
Lagan valley most certainly is in play, will be interesting to see how the unionist community reacts to the Donaldson fall out, will they keep voting DUP to keep SF out, will they drift to the TUV headbangers. If the UUP don't massively profit from this crisis then they truly are finished.
SA now looks good for UUP. EB, LV and even EA and Strangford could see big improvements for Alliance with maybe a couple of gains.
If the nationalist voters bothered to turn up in upper bann for a change then SF could come through the middle of a split unionist vote. EL is similar but would need a miracle perfect storm.
Quote from: JPGJOHNNYG on March 30, 2024, 07:57:12 AMQuote from: drillsergeant on March 30, 2024, 12:27:26 AMQuote from: GTP on March 30, 2024, 12:05:55 AMQuote from: gallsman on March 29, 2024, 09:23:34 PMQuote from: GTP on March 29, 2024, 08:59:09 PMThe SF representatives mentioned are stepping down at the next election so again no bye election required.
Gildernew is contesting the European seat in June. Will she step down if elected? She should, but with Westminster election one a few months later I wonder would there be any point.
My understanding is dual mandates are not permitted so she would have to resign. Bye election would depend on if a general election was to be within the 3 months of resignation.
With General Election looming surely now the DUP are looking over there shoulders in South Antrim, East Belfast and now Lagan Valley.
Regarding FST - Sinn Fein will need a strong candidate to hold that seat. No doubt they face a unity Unionist Candidate with it going to the wire.
With demographic shift FST should finally be beyond Unionism even with a unity candidate. I think this year they will win comfortably, although comfortably in FST in recent years has been double figures😂.
Lagan valley most certainly is in play, will be interesting to see how the unionist community reacts to the Donaldson fall out, will they keep voting DUP to keep SF out, will they drift to the TUV headbangers. If the UUP don't massively profit from this crisis then they truly are finished.
SA now looks good for UUP. EB, LV and even EA and Strangford could big improvements for Alliance with maybe a couple of gains.
If the nationalist voters bothered to turn up in upper banned for a change then SF could come through the middle of split unionist vote. EL is similar but would need a miracle perfect storm.
I think all this will depend on the DUP's path over the next few weeks.
Will the 'no/never'people at WM take control of the party now and drive it further to the right?
Will they kick back against going back into Stormont? Now is their chance.
Will this renergise a united unionist party covering all strands of unionism?
Be interesting to see what their plan of action is.
It's all too early to state will will happens in 12 months. A week, as they say, is a long time in politics.
Quote from: red hander on March 30, 2024, 01:59:59 AMQuote from: David McKeown on March 30, 2024, 12:49:23 AMQuote from: screenexile on March 29, 2024, 12:10:51 PMYou're not allowed to name defendants for Sexual offences in the North.
Yes you are. You aren't allowed to name complainants
You can't name defendants if doing so identifies the complainants (ie sex offences committed within a family). However, if the complainants waive their right to anonymity, then the defendants can be named.
Yes jigsaw identification. You cant publish any details that could lead to the identification of a complainant. So the way that is usually done is if there's a familial relationship the press might say a man has appeared in court accused of raping his grandmother for example or Joe Bloggs has appeared in court accused of rape (but then provide no details as to the relationship with the complainant). In the Donaldson case now that his name is out there, it will not be allowed to publish any details relating to the connection if any between him and the complainants.
what is the purpose of bringing down stormont again apart from it being some childish temper tantrum what do they want the tories or labour to give them
If this brings Stormont down it is surely time for something different.
Think it will be ok though.
Quote from: Armagh18 on March 30, 2024, 10:18:23 AMIf this brings Stormont down it is surely time for something different.
Think it will be ok though.
Joint rule from Dublin and London.
An open threat to do that would likely be enough to keep them in.
joint rule would give loyalists a reason to return to arms
Quote from: RadioGAAGAA on March 30, 2024, 10:36:15 AMQuote from: Armagh18 on March 30, 2024, 10:18:23 AMIf this brings Stormont down it is surely time for something different.
Think it will be ok though.
Joint rule from Dublin and London.
An open threat to do that would likely be enough to keep them in.
Yeah smart move would be to make that known to them behind closed doors.
Zero interest in joint rule would just be a massive fudge for 50 years
Quote from: JPGJOHNNYG on March 30, 2024, 10:56:46 AMZero interest in joint rule would just be a massive fudge for 50 years
As opposed to the massive success Stormont has been lol
Quote from: Armagh18 on March 30, 2024, 10:18:23 AMIf this brings Stormont down it is surely time for something different.
Think it will be ok though.
A breakup of the DUP is more likely.
Are some of the dup freemasons is the freemasons protestant.
https://villagemagazine.ie/judge-a-king-by-his-courtiers-sir-jeffrey-donaldson-the-new-leader-of-the-dup/
Quote from: Eire90 on March 30, 2024, 11:15:41 AMAre some of the dup freemasons is the freemasons protestant.
Cé?
Quote from: Armagh18 on March 30, 2024, 10:18:23 AMIf this brings Stormont down it is surely time for something different.
Think it will be ok though.
Because of the New Decade New Approach deal, bringing down Stormont doesn't have the same leverage as before. The executive will continue to run on a caretaker basis for 6 months so will be no loss of ministers making funding decisions. ALso an election has to be called within 24 weeks of the collapse
Quote from: Nanderson on March 30, 2024, 11:33:41 AMQuote from: Armagh18 on March 30, 2024, 10:18:23 AMIf this brings Stormont down it is surely time for something different.
Think it will be ok though.
Because of the New Decade New Approach deal, bringing down Stormont doesn't have the same leverage as before. The executive will continue to run on a caretaker basis for 6 months so will be no loss of ministers making funding decisions. ALso an election has to be called within 24 weeks of the collapse
the DUP want an election like a hole in the head
Wasn't expecting THAT headline when I opened the Independent app this morning! :o
I think this will leave the Donaldsonite wing vulnerable and the headbangers will smell blood. I don't think there will be a clear winner and there'll be another period of crisis, which will be compounded by opinion polling, and election results etc..
The deal now is tainted even though it's quite a separate thing to Donaldson's behaviour, but it's very much his deal. ELP is his appointee so she is weak, especially having been co-opted.
I'd assume they'll lose some votes to TUV and UUP and even more just won't be motivated to vote. So you'll see a fractured and reduced unionist vote and a more motivated Nationalist/Other vote. The DUP were just above the water line in the last LEA, so depending on how things go before then, unionism could lose a lot of MLAs. You'd have to expect them to lose at least one MP, maybe three. If Robinson was leader and lost his, that would be a big blow.
I'd sort of been thankful and optimistic to see the DUP moving in a more reasonable/conciliatory direction and some sort of normal, but maybe unionism tearing itself apart might be better in the long run.
That said, you'd have expected most people (plenty of reasonable people vote for them) to have abandoned them by now over their spectacular failures and backwardness and they've somehow always managed to keep or win back support, so they could recover or maintain.
Quote from: Eire90 on March 30, 2024, 10:46:49 AMjoint rule would give loyalists a reason to return to arms
Quote from: JPGJOHNNYG on March 30, 2024, 10:56:46 AMZero interest in joint rule would just be a massive fudge for 50 years
Consider it a soft landing toward an eventual United Ireland.
In that context, a border poll is more likely to have them up in arms, and with joint rule, the soft unionists here (that is, those that could be swayed by economics) will have a better chance to see the potential benefits of a United Ireland as media focus moves from, or at least spits between, Westminster to the Dail.
I would consider formal joint governance a massive step toward making the transition to a United Ireland as peaceful and prosperous as possible.
Peaceful, where you lads been past 50yrs, Loyalists not accept it, end of. same way the IRA didn't in the 70's.The outcome will be no different, only in reverse this time.
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GJ85xLGWEAALpAX?format=jpg&name=large)
Quote from: Wildweasel74 on March 30, 2024, 08:31:28 PMPeaceful, where you lads been past 50yrs, Loyalists not accept it, end of. same way the IRA didn't in the 70's.The outcome will be no different, only in reverse this time.
Are the Brits going to fund the loyalists this time? I doubt they have a 10th of the brain power the provos did. I don't think they'll do too much.
they dont need funding they can cause major disruption
Quote from: Eire90 on March 31, 2024, 07:42:59 AMthey dont need funding they can cause major disruption
Likely short term. No shipyard to down tools & march into city centre, no power plant to take over and cause power cuts.
A new settlement could easily kick the can down the road like Britain/China did with Hong Kong. It will be a 32 county country but Stormont still exists in a soft form and people can still choose to be British. Let the future politicians deal with it.
Quote from: Wildweasel74 on March 30, 2024, 08:31:28 PMPeaceful, where you lads been past 50yrs, Loyalists not accept it, end of. same way the IRA didn't in the 70's.The outcome will be no different, only in reverse this time.
f**king wise up.
The c***ts can barely fill a single orange lodge for their wee sea border meetings.
The most they could muster was a burnt out bus on the Shankill and some graffiti in Larne.
The best political minds they have are sectarian idiots like Bryson and Moore Holmes.
The only weapons they have are lying rusted buried somewhere near Markethill.
The actual paramilitaries themselves are fractured, divided and more concerned with the importation and sale of narcotics.
They won't have the state on hand to turn a blind eye, facilitate or actively participate in murdering Catholics like they did before.
They couldn't match the IRA at the peak of the Troubles with all the help they could get, they'll hardly emulate them now.
There's also the problem for them the percentage of the population identifying as British is falling and what's left is ancient so not many of them are going to be capable of much, same as Unionists crying on about the Provo army Council, those men are ready for retirement
Quote from: Eire90 on March 31, 2024, 07:42:59 AMthey dont need funding they can cause major disruption
The recent protests of the Flag the Backstop and Protocol are the height of their powers, re major disruption.
1974 is long gone.
They have nothing keft but emoty threats and comical scaremongering
they could ring bombscares into major social gathrings north and south and threaten to attack polling stations and confront politicians directly north and south do major roadblocks to shut economy down.They could also make a deal with the far right in the south.
The far right huh?
Quote from: Eire90 on March 31, 2024, 11:24:54 AMthey could ring bombscares into major social gathrings north and south and threaten to attack polling stations and confront politicians directly north and south do major roadblocks to shut economy down.They could also make a deal with the far right in the south.
Lol wut.
Quote from: Eire90 on March 31, 2024, 11:24:54 AMthey could ring bombscares into major social gathrings north and south and threaten to attack polling stations and confront politicians directly north and south do major roadblocks to shut economy down.They could also make a deal with the far right in the south.
Seriously ?
Surely you don't believe that.
Quote from: Derryman forever on March 31, 2024, 12:49:05 PMQuote from: Eire90 on March 31, 2024, 11:24:54 AMthey could ring bombscares into major social gathrings north and south and threaten to attack polling stations and confront politicians directly north and south do major roadblocks to shut economy down.They could also make a deal with the far right in the south.
Seriously ?
Surely you don't believe that.
Sometimes I think he's Olly ;D
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on March 31, 2024, 12:50:24 PMQuote from: Derryman forever on March 31, 2024, 12:49:05 PMQuote from: Eire90 on March 31, 2024, 11:24:54 AMthey could ring bombscares into major social gathrings north and south and threaten to attack polling stations and confront politicians directly north and south do major roadblocks to shut economy down.They could also make a deal with the far right in the south.
Seriously ?
Surely you don't believe that.
Sometimes I think he's Olly ;D
Is olly off his trolley?
Quote from: Wildweasel74 on March 30, 2024, 08:31:28 PMPeaceful, where you lads been past 50yrs, Loyalists not accept it, end of. same way the IRA didn't in the 70's.The outcome will be no different, only in reverse this time.
Did you miss the
as possible at the end?
Quote from: Eire90 on March 31, 2024, 11:24:54 AMthey could ring bombscares into major social gathrings north and south and threaten to attack polling stations and confront politicians directly north and south do major roadblocks to shut economy down.They could also make a deal with the far right in the south.
:o !
Wonder will Jeff be cancelled ;)
Will the placard waving mad people be outside his house demanding something?
He could end up in jail here. I think there is a strong chance he will.
Quote from: imtommygunn on April 01, 2024, 12:37:24 PMHe could end up in jail here. I think there is a strong chance he will.
The fact he was charged suggests to me that he will.
This wont stop the dup from saying they are good chrisitian people
Quote from: AustinPowers on April 01, 2024, 01:07:31 PMQuote from: imtommygunn on April 01, 2024, 12:37:24 PMHe could end up in jail here. I think there is a strong chance he will.
The fact he was charged suggests to me that he will.
In general, it is very hard to prove beyond reasonable doubt a crime that happened years ago, which is the standard of proof that should be required in criminal trials. It becomes a he said/she said, which cannot provide proof beyond reasonable doubt.
But whether he goes to jail or not, he is finished.
Jail probably depends on whether the stuff in the WhatsApp is true. If there's a confession on tape then he'll probably go inside.
I'm no legal expert but surely the fact the Mrs has also been charged with aiding and abetting suggests there's a strong chance of a successful conviction?
I would have thought so. No question of whether he's finished professionally now.
Quote from: imtommygunn on April 01, 2024, 12:37:24 PMHe could end up in jail here. I think there is a strong chance he will.
Are charges like these not punishable by lengthy sentences? Isn't rape several years by itself? Without all the other stuff?
I imagine so. If he's guilty of what is alleged he could be due a lengthy enough stint. I think the surface has only been scratched with this.
if hes guilty will paramilitaries be looking to get at him too.
Quote from: Eire90 on April 01, 2024, 06:23:32 PMif hes guilty will paramilitaries be looking to get at him too.
I'd say the vikings would be his main danger. Or maybe the banthas.
Quote from: SaffronSports on April 01, 2024, 03:59:09 PMJail probably depends on whether the stuff in the WhatsApp is true. If there's a confession on tape then he'll probably go inside.
What's this about Whatsapp Saffron? Must have missed a bit
Who the alleged victims are... mods wouldn't appreciate it being posted.
Quote from: imtommygunn on April 01, 2024, 06:40:46 PMWho the alleged victims are... mods wouldn't appreciate it being posted.
I think they have instructed lawyers to go through social media and take people to task over putting 'names' out there.
Those WhatsApp messages, those that sourced and forwarded on would need to be careful I'd imagine
Peer to peer encryption plus the forwarding doesn't say who it's forwarded from so would tend to be alright in WhatsApp but it's definitely something it would be very silly to put near social media if you were that way inclined.
Ah yes. Got that Whatsapp 😉
Seen the whatsapp there. Someone actually had it on facebook. Obviously like everything that goes around on whatsapp you've to take it with a huge pinch of salt.
What could be done if you were caught sharing it around?
Quote from: Armagh18 on April 01, 2024, 07:45:09 PMSeen the whatsapp there. Someone actually had it on facebook. Obviously like everything that goes around on whatsapp you've to take it with a huge pinch of salt.
What could be done if you were caught sharing it around?
Think you can be done for contempt of court but how realistic is that if hundreds maybe even thousands of people have shared it?
Quote from: clarshack on April 01, 2024, 08:14:19 PMQuote from: Armagh18 on April 01, 2024, 07:45:09 PMSeen the whatsapp there. Someone actually had it on facebook. Obviously like everything that goes around on whatsapp you've to take it with a huge pinch of salt.
What could be done if you were caught sharing it around?
Think you can be done for contempt of court but how realistic is that if hundreds maybe even thousands of people have shared it?
It isn't desirable that thousands of people share it, if they cannot find a jury who has not seen this stuff then he is off Scot free.
Quote from: armaghniac on April 01, 2024, 08:17:45 PMQuote from: clarshack on April 01, 2024, 08:14:19 PMQuote from: Armagh18 on April 01, 2024, 07:45:09 PMSeen the whatsapp there. Someone actually had it on facebook. Obviously like everything that goes around on whatsapp you've to take it with a huge pinch of salt.
What could be done if you were caught sharing it around?
Think you can be done for contempt of court but how realistic is that if hundreds maybe even thousands of people have shared it?
It isn't desirable that thousands of people share it, if they cannot find a jury who has not seen this stuff then he is off Scot free.
Sure he can do the diplock court procedure lol.. I'm sure he was a supporter of it back in the day
I wouldn't imagine it carries that much weight.
If it did sure the criminals would just be putting a pile of stuff around about themselves.
You could get bots tweeting it millions of times a minute if you wanted.
Quote from: general_lee on April 01, 2024, 04:13:58 PMI'm no legal expert but surely the fact the Mrs has also been charged with aiding and abetting suggests there's a strong chance of a successful conviction?
Quote from: AustinPowers on April 01, 2024, 01:07:31 PMQuote from: imtommygunn on April 01, 2024, 12:37:24 PMHe could end up in jail here. I think there is a strong chance he will.
The fact he was charged suggests to me that he will.
Statistically there's more likelihood of you being convicted if you have been reported and prosecution decision issues to go by way of summons albeit the differences aren't startling in the grand scheme of things. Statistics would show about 81% of charge sheet decisions result in successful prosecutions and about 89% of cases that go by way of summons do.
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on April 01, 2024, 06:48:35 PMQuote from: imtommygunn on April 01, 2024, 06:40:46 PMWho the alleged victims are... mods wouldn't appreciate it being posted.
I think they have instructed lawyers to go through social media and take people to task over putting 'names' out there.
Those WhatsApp messages, those that sourced and forwarded on would need to be careful I'd imagine
Its a criminal offence to disclose any information that can lead to the identification of a victim of a sexual offence. Whilst I dont expect PSNI to start seizing phones of people forwarding Whatsapps etc I do know they are pretty stong on investigating anyone who posts names on X or Facebook or the like.
I haven't seen any whatsapps but I have been told who the alleged victims are - I won't repeat though.
Has he been accused of something more than rape?
Will he lose his knighthood? Ultimate fall from grace for someone of his ilk.
If guilty, I really hope full weight of the law comes down hard on him. Particularly given his public standing.
Quote from: Eire90 on April 01, 2024, 03:18:39 PMThis wont stop the dup from saying they are good chrisitian people
They are full of hypocrites. Whatever you think about the troubles, no side is without blame. I think SF at least recognise that and recognise that there's subjectivity. The DUP didn't/won't concede anything, as if any inequality was either imagined or deserved by CNR.
The DUP go on about the PIRA and terrorism as if they are principled pacifists, yet will ignore or defend Bloody Sunday, the RUC, UDR, British army etc. established misdeeds, collusion and corruption. They conveniently forget that they were involved with setting up their own paramilitary organisation too and their cosy relationships with other paramilitaries. Likewise they'll bring up Michelle O'Neill's father and ignore ELP's father.
I think, regrettably, the way forward is to agree to disagree, but agree on a peaceful future. I think this is the road SF are going down (mainly as its in their interests and could help smooth the way for a UI).
Quote from: tbrick18 on April 02, 2024, 12:34:47 PMWill he lose his knighthood?
Does it not make him fit in better with the rest of them?
Just another Sir Odious p***k who was honoured for his services to ass-licking the right hole.
When did big Jeff get his knighthood? And what did he actually get it for?
I mean , he never won Wimbledon or an Olympic gold medal like those other deserving knighted folk.
Quote from: AustinPowers on April 02, 2024, 06:17:22 PMWhen did big Jeff get his knighthood? And what did he actually get it for?
I mean , he never won Wimbledon or an Olympic gold medal like those other deserving knighted folk.
Very good question.
Quote from: Armamike on April 02, 2024, 06:22:28 PMQuote from: AustinPowers on April 02, 2024, 06:17:22 PMWhen did big Jeff get his knighthood? And what did he actually get it for?
I mean , he never won Wimbledon or an Olympic gold medal like those other deserving knighted folk.
Very good question.
Services to
saying no politics. I'd say he was shoe in to be fast tracked into Lords when he lost the MP seat in lagan valley. Obviously losing the seat is a guarantee now and his lordship is well and truely in the mud
Quote from: Nanderson on April 02, 2024, 06:27:01 PMQuote from: Armamike on April 02, 2024, 06:22:28 PMQuote from: AustinPowers on April 02, 2024, 06:17:22 PMWhen did big Jeff get his knighthood? And what did he actually get it for?
I mean , he never won Wimbledon or an Olympic gold medal like those other deserving knighted folk.
Very good question.
Services to saying no politics. I'd say he was shoe in to be fast tracked into Lords when he lost the MP seat in lagan valley. Obviously losing the seat is a guarantee now and his lordship is well and truely in the mud
He wouldn't be the first lord involved in moral turpitude, not even in Belfast.
Quote from: seafoid on April 02, 2024, 06:34:41 PMQuote from: Nanderson on April 02, 2024, 06:27:01 PMQuote from: Armamike on April 02, 2024, 06:22:28 PMQuote from: AustinPowers on April 02, 2024, 06:17:22 PMWhen did big Jeff get his knighthood? And what did he actually get it for?
I mean , he never won Wimbledon or an Olympic gold medal like those other deserving knighted folk.
Very good question.
Services to saying no politics. I'd say he was shoe in to be fast tracked into Lords when he lost the MP seat in lagan valley. Obviously losing the seat is a guarantee now and his lordship is well and truely in the mud
He wouldn't be the first lord involved in moral turpitude, not even in Belfast.
He's Lisburn, a different city altogether ;)
Quote from: Nanderson on April 02, 2024, 06:27:01 PMQuote from: Armamike on April 02, 2024, 06:22:28 PMQuote from: AustinPowers on April 02, 2024, 06:17:22 PMWhen did big Jeff get his knighthood? And what did he actually get it for?
I mean , he never won Wimbledon or an Olympic gold medal like those other deserving knighted folk.
Very good question.
Services to saying no politics. I'd say he was shoe in to be fast tracked into Lords when he lost the MP seat in lagan valley. Obviously losing the seat is a guarantee now and his lordship is well and truely in the mud
I remember looking that up a few years ago as I was shocked that he was knighted, especially given his hard it is for some, more deserving, recipients.
Quote from: nrico2006 on April 02, 2024, 11:03:35 PMQuote from: Nanderson on April 02, 2024, 06:27:01 PMQuote from: Armamike on April 02, 2024, 06:22:28 PMQuote from: AustinPowers on April 02, 2024, 06:17:22 PMWhen did big Jeff get his knighthood? And what did he actually get it for?
I mean , he never won Wimbledon or an Olympic gold medal like those other deserving knighted folk.
Very good question.
Services to saying no politics. I'd say he was shoe in to be fast tracked into Lords when he lost the MP seat in lagan valley. Obviously losing the seat is a guarantee now and his lordship is well and truely in the mud
I remember looking that up a few years ago as I was shocked that he was knighted, especially given his hard it is for some, more deserving, recipients.
You make it sound like a British knighthood is something to cherish and be proud of?? ;D
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on April 02, 2024, 06:35:56 PMQuote from: seafoid on April 02, 2024, 06:34:41 PMQuote from: Nanderson on April 02, 2024, 06:27:01 PMQuote from: Armamike on April 02, 2024, 06:22:28 PMQuote from: AustinPowers on April 02, 2024, 06:17:22 PMWhen did big Jeff get his knighthood? And what did he actually get it for?
I mean , he never won Wimbledon or an Olympic gold medal like those other deserving knighted folk.
Very good question.
Services to saying no politics. I'd say he was shoe in to be fast tracked into Lords when he lost the MP seat in lagan valley. Obviously losing the seat is a guarantee now and his lordship is well and truely in the mud
He wouldn't be the first lord involved in moral turpitude, not even in Belfast.
He's Lisburn, a different city altogether ;)
And not surprisingly he's from Kilkeel, that wee lovely fishing village bedecked in flegs all year round!
Is Harry and Megan still some sort of Duke or Duchess over that quaint wee shíthole?
Quote from: Armagh4sam2024 on April 02, 2024, 11:37:43 PMQuote from: nrico2006 on April 02, 2024, 11:03:35 PMQuote from: Nanderson on April 02, 2024, 06:27:01 PMQuote from: Armamike on April 02, 2024, 06:22:28 PMQuote from: AustinPowers on April 02, 2024, 06:17:22 PMWhen did big Jeff get his knighthood? And what did he actually get it for?
I mean , he never won Wimbledon or an Olympic gold medal like those other deserving knighted folk.
Very good question.
Services to saying no politics. I'd say he was shoe in to be fast tracked into Lords when he lost the MP seat in lagan valley. Obviously losing the seat is a guarantee now and his lordship is well and truely in the mud
I remember looking that up a few years ago as I was shocked that he was knighted, especially given his hard it is for some, more deserving, recipients.
You make it sound like a British knighthood is something to cherish and be proud of?? ;D
I thought wee Jeff got his medal for services to smugness and sanctimony. And lest we forget, his dad wasn't a welcome sight at any catholic owned farm in south Down.
Quote from: johnnycool on April 03, 2024, 09:54:12 AMQuote from: Milltown Row2 on April 02, 2024, 06:35:56 PMQuote from: seafoid on April 02, 2024, 06:34:41 PMQuote from: Nanderson on April 02, 2024, 06:27:01 PMQuote from: Armamike on April 02, 2024, 06:22:28 PMQuote from: AustinPowers on April 02, 2024, 06:17:22 PMWhen did big Jeff get his knighthood? And what did he actually get it for?
I mean , he never won Wimbledon or an Olympic gold medal like those other deserving knighted folk.
Very good question.
Services to saying no politics. I'd say he was shoe in to be fast tracked into Lords when he lost the MP seat in lagan valley. Obviously losing the seat is a guarantee now and his lordship is well and truely in the mud
He wouldn't be the first lord involved in moral turpitude, not even in Belfast.
He's Lisburn, a different city altogether ;)
And not surprisingly he's from Kilkeel, that wee lovely fishing village bedecked in flegs all year round!
Is Harry and Megan still some sort of Duke or Duchess over that quaint wee shíthole?
Hey Kilkeel might be a shithole. But it's my shithole :'( :'(
Is it as bad as Carrick?
Jesus Carla Lockhart looks like she has anorexia
Irrespective of anything physical she's a horrendous human being. So young and the bitterness hanging out of her.
Absolutely nothing between the ears on her either. How on earth she's become a big hitter is beyond me. If David Simpson wasn't busy waving his pipe all over Upper Bann, I suspect he'd still be in Westminster and she'd still be a mid tier MLA that very few people paid any heed to.
It's the stuff round bloody sunday etc that gets me on her. The whys and wherefores of the whole thing aside it's just so antagonistic and disrespectful.
Quote from: imtommygunn on April 05, 2024, 09:54:11 AMIt's the stuff round bloody sunday etc that gets me on her. The whys and wherefores of the whole thing aside it's just so antagonistic and disrespectful.
She is a product of her upbringing and background. Though they would try to say otherwise the DUP's demographic is a mirror image of SF's which includes ultra loyalist/republican opinion through to more main stream. Like many SF politicians Lockhart panders to that loyalist bloc for votes.
Quote from: Applesisapples on April 05, 2024, 10:05:43 AMQuote from: imtommygunn on April 05, 2024, 09:54:11 AMIt's the stuff round bloody sunday etc that gets me on her. The whys and wherefores of the whole thing aside it's just so antagonistic and disrespectful.
She is a product of her upbringing and background. Though they would try to say otherwise the DUP's demographic is a mirror image of SF's which includes ultra loyalist/republican opinion through to more main stream. Like many SF politicians Lockhart panders to that loyalist bloc for votes.
Good man. Now can you name me a SF MP that is the reflection of Carla.
I wouldn't want to be giving them my vote.
Quote from: Derryman forever on April 05, 2024, 12:21:41 PMQuote from: Applesisapples on April 05, 2024, 10:05:43 AMQuote from: imtommygunn on April 05, 2024, 09:54:11 AMIt's the stuff round bloody sunday etc that gets me on her. The whys and wherefores of the whole thing aside it's just so antagonistic and disrespectful.
She is a product of her upbringing and background. Though they would try to say otherwise the DUP's demographic is a mirror image of SF's which includes ultra loyalist/republican opinion through to more main stream. Like many SF politicians Lockhart panders to that loyalist bloc for votes.
Good man. Now can you name me a SF MP that is the reflection of Carla.
I wouldn't want to be giving them my vote.
It was her that brought up the Drumcree March again, wanting it "resolved". It was resolved 20 odd years ago. And three young lads lost their lives because of it. Imagine that mayhem happening again.
But as you say , the Drumcree talk would be music to a lot of knuckledraggers ears and a few more votes for Skeletor.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-68857236
Not hard to know what side of the community the current Education Minister is from.
That being said if it had been 4 CCMS schools scheduled for closure and it was a new SF Education minister they would do exactly the same.
Not hard to know there are elections around the corner.
Just about sums up NI (parish) politics.
A school with 13 pupils, 3 teachers and 3 support staff.
Surely that can't continue.
I wonder how far away the next 'similiar' primary school is to each of them?
Is there not an enrolment figure in primary and once it dips below that, there needs to be an assessment down on it.
Politicians won't make good decisions - like hospitals etc.
By 13 pupils is very low.
Quote from: marty34 on April 20, 2024, 08:12:56 AMA school with 13 pupils, 3 teachers and 3 support staff.
Surely that can't continue.
I wonder how far away the next 'similiar' primary school is to each of them?
Is there not an enrolment figure in primary and once it dips below that, there needs to be an assessment down on it.
Politicians won't make good decisions - like hospitals etc.
By 13 pupils is very low.
I'm all for small primary schools, local where everyone knows each other, to this day my best friends are ones from primary school but jeez 13 is very low
Numbers are low for sure, and I'm not at all saying that should stay open, but if these were small, rural banks or post offices, or schools for that matter, I'm nationalist areas, would you be quite so triggered by it?
Schools that size aren't sustainable regardless of green or orange and they should be closed. This is the DUP doing DUP things but the Shinners would be no different. Politicians here don't like making difficult decisions.
I agree, not sustainable, but there'd not be a word said if the shoe was on they other foot.
However, why are we so quick to accept that schools should close, but banks and post offices have to stay open?
Quote from: gallsman on April 20, 2024, 10:46:50 AMI agree, not sustainable, but there'd not be a word said if the shoe was on they other foot.
However, why are we so quick to accept that schools should close, but banks and post offices have to stay open?
John O'Dowd wasn't afraid to close or attempt to close Catholic schools in rural areas. Ultimately though CCMS share some responsibility.
Quote from: Armagh18 on April 20, 2024, 09:07:21 AMQuote from: marty34 on April 20, 2024, 08:12:56 AMA school with 13 pupils, 3 teachers and 3 support staff.
Surely that can't continue.
I wonder how far away the next 'similiar' primary school is to each of them?
Is there not an enrolment figure in primary and once it dips below that, there needs to be an assessment down on it.
Politicians won't make good decisions - like hospitals etc.
By 13 pupils is very low.
That's kids from P1 to P7, so at best two per age group and a classroom size of 4 or 5 for each teacher...
Nuts
Fine Gael favourite, crater face Hoey having a go at Jarlath Burns and the GAA
https://x.com/catharinehoey/status/1782365465433498036?s=46
Quote from: Orior on April 22, 2024, 05:40:40 PMFine Gael favourite, crater face Hoey having a go at Jarlath Burns and the GAA
https://x.com/catharinehoey/status/1782365465433498036?s=46
::) Kate be in the same mould as Jamie and Jim.. I wouldn't pay much heed to her.
Massive bigot who deserves no airtime. How anyone ever elected her in England I don't know - she's bonkers.
Dudley Edwards getting in on the act too
https://x.com/ruthde/status/1782437508644516335?s=46
Quote from: Orior on April 22, 2024, 05:40:40 PMFine Gael favourite, crater face Hoey having a go at Jarlath Burns and the GAA
https://x.com/catharinehoey/status/1782365465433498036?s=46
What paper is that article from? The Newsletter?
People of Rathlin not too happy about Zelda from The Terrahawks using their name when Bojo the Clown gave the bitch some ermine to wear
RDE, Kate Hoey, and Owen Polly FFS. All 3 of them ooze bitterness. I listened to the interview on TalkBack and thought he spoke very well.
Hoey is a weird one as she apparently supported the civil rights movement and was on record as supporting a United Ireland up until the 1990s I think?
It's likewise interesting to see some of the original founders of the DUP, who would be pretty hardcore protestants and Davy Adams, a former UDA man, coming out basically saying things like they think a United Ireland is inevitable or that they'd be open to persuasion.
It's really hard to know where sentiments are among PUL, with many unwilling to speak out because of the grief they'd get. Likewise there's plenty of spin and narratives.
I think people in general aren't that well informed, north and south (in different ways). The headlines are always on what way people would vote if a vote was tomorrow, but we don't know what they'd be voting for. The polling on preference and aspiration, seems to show a very solid block of 30-35% who are against a UI full stop, a similar number who would vote for a UI regardless, maybe another 30-35% who aspire to unity, but aren't fully convinced yet and then 10-15% don't knows. That should be what drives the debate. I'm not sure why this is glossed over so much by governments and media. I think there's some who just want it to go away for political reasons or personal preference and others who want to have the margin larger so it can be a smoother process.
Quote from: AustinPowers on April 22, 2024, 07:07:26 PMQuote from: Orior on April 22, 2024, 05:40:40 PMFine Gael favourite, crater face Hoey having a go at Jarlath Burns and the GAA
https://x.com/catharinehoey/status/1782365465433498036?s=46
What paper is that article from? The Newsletter?
Yes, Newsletter
Big day for Jeffrey and the DUP in Newry
Donaldson, 61, faces 11 charges: one count of rape, one count of gross indecency towards a child and nine counts of indecent assault on a female from 1985 to 2006. The allegations relate to two complainants.
Jesus, that's not good....
''His wife Eleanor Donaldson, 58, is facing four charges including aiding and abetting the offence.''
Does that mean turning a blind eye to what was going on?
I've noticed that none of the papers are referring to him as ''Sir''
Quote from: From the Bunker on April 24, 2024, 03:31:17 PM''His wife Eleanor Donaldson, 58, is facing four charges including aiding and abetting the offence.''
Does that mean turning a blind eye to what was going on?
I've noticed that none of the papers are referring to him as ''Sir''
Does he still get paid as a MP etc.?
Quote from: marty34 on April 24, 2024, 05:19:09 PMQuote from: From the Bunker on April 24, 2024, 03:31:17 PM''His wife Eleanor Donaldson, 58, is facing four charges including aiding and abetting the offence.''
Does that mean turning a blind eye to what was going on?
I've noticed that none of the papers are referring to him as ''Sir''
Does he still get paid as a MP etc.?
He hasn't yet been convicted of anything. This will take a while, and there may well be an election before this process takes its course. MPs are eligible to receive a loss-of-office payment if they lose at an election, but I suppose he would have to run in the election to get that. There is also a winding-up payment to close the office etc,. he might not get that if he resigns so better to wait for an election.
with his christian fish symbol
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GL7kfHBW8AAPu4D?format=jpg)
Having been WhatsApp'd some of the allegations around what is supposed to have happened and who the victims are, I really hope an example is made of him and his wife if they are proven to be correct. There must be a substantial body of evidence if it has gotten as far as it has though. If he's found guilty - he's had some nerve to put himself out in the public domain the way he has for the last 30odd years and shows a complete disregard for the victims.
There's always the flip side to that I suppose too, if he's innocent its a hell of an ordeal to go through.
Only thing for sure is that there are no winners, but hopefully justice is service.
If he's guilty of what he's alleged to be guilty of then he'd have no shame so wouldn't bat an eyelid about victims. If he's not no reason he shouldn't be in public life.
A completely mad one. Could be staring at a lengthy enough jail term. Who knows what way it will pan out.
Quote from: tbrick18 on April 24, 2024, 08:25:27 PMOnly thing for sure is that there are no winners, but hopefully justice is service.
As I said before, it is hard to see how you can prove something 20 years ago beyond reasonable doubt, I doubt there were witnesses other than his wife.
Some of the videos I seen after court was a bit ridiculous (The getaway car not being available didn't help either)
He's still innocent until proven otherwise though , is he not?
Quote from: AustinPowers on April 24, 2024, 09:19:23 PMSome of the videos I seen after court was a bit ridiculous (The getaway car not being available didn't help either)
He's still innocent until proven otherwise though , is he not?
Indeed he is, regardless of who or what he is.
Quote from: imtommygunn on April 24, 2024, 08:34:23 PMIf he's guilty of what he's alleged to be guilty of then he'd have no shame so wouldn't bat an eyelid about victims. If he's not no reason he shouldn't be in public life.
A completely mad one. Could be staring at a lengthy enough jail term. Who knows what way it will pan out.
Hadn't thought of it like that, but I guess that's right.
Agree with other posters though - innocent until proven otherwise.
Quote from: armaghniac on April 24, 2024, 08:34:36 PMQuote from: tbrick18 on April 24, 2024, 08:25:27 PMOnly thing for sure is that there are no winners, but hopefully justice is service.
As I said before, it is hard to see how you can prove something 20 years ago beyond reasonable doubt, I doubt there were witnesses other than his wife.
Hearing other cases the PPS didn't prosecute due unlikelihood of conviction even when there is evidence, they must feel there's a high chance of conviction based on what ever evidence they have. No?
I've no idea myself - I'm doing a lot of reading between the lines and may well be getting it wrong.
Quote from: tbrick18 on April 24, 2024, 10:29:15 PMQuote from: armaghniac on April 24, 2024, 08:34:36 PMQuote from: tbrick18 on April 24, 2024, 08:25:27 PMOnly thing for sure is that there are no winners, but hopefully justice is service.
As I said before, it is hard to see how you can prove something 20 years ago beyond reasonable doubt, I doubt there were witnesses other than his wife.
Hearing other cases the PPS didn't prosecute due unlikelihood of conviction even when there is evidence, they must feel there's a high chance of conviction based on what ever evidence they have. No?
I've no idea myself - I'm doing a lot of reading between the lines and may well be getting it wrong.
Today was the 1st appearance. I'd be shocked if the PPS even have the full file yet let alone have made a decision. It would be unusual for them to have the full file yet particularly if the allegations only surfaced in March.
Quote from: David McKeown on April 24, 2024, 10:33:49 PMQuote from: tbrick18 on April 24, 2024, 10:29:15 PMQuote from: armaghniac on April 24, 2024, 08:34:36 PMQuote from: tbrick18 on April 24, 2024, 08:25:27 PMOnly thing for sure is that there are no winners, but hopefully justice is service.
As I said before, it is hard to see how you can prove something 20 years ago beyond reasonable doubt, I doubt there were witnesses other than his wife.
Hearing other cases the PPS didn't prosecute due unlikelihood of conviction even when there is evidence, they must feel there's a high chance of conviction based on what ever evidence they have. No?
I've no idea myself - I'm doing a lot of reading between the lines and may well be getting it wrong.
Today was the 1st appearance. I'd be shocked if the PPS even have the full file yet let alone have made a decision. It would be unusual for them to have the full file yet particularly if the allegations only surfaced in March.
However, at present this case seems different from teachers, coaches etc where there are multiple people to come forward. But you never know.
Quote from: armaghniac on April 24, 2024, 11:25:51 PMQuote from: David McKeown on April 24, 2024, 10:33:49 PMQuote from: tbrick18 on April 24, 2024, 10:29:15 PMQuote from: armaghniac on April 24, 2024, 08:34:36 PMQuote from: tbrick18 on April 24, 2024, 08:25:27 PMOnly thing for sure is that there are no winners, but hopefully justice is service.
As I said before, it is hard to see how you can prove something 20 years ago beyond reasonable doubt, I doubt there were witnesses other than his wife.
Hearing other cases the PPS didn't prosecute due unlikelihood of conviction even when there is evidence, they must feel there's a high chance of conviction based on what ever evidence they have. No?
I've no idea myself - I'm doing a lot of reading between the lines and may well be getting it wrong.
Today was the 1st appearance. I'd be shocked if the PPS even have the full file yet let alone have made a decision. It would be unusual for them to have the full file yet particularly if the allegations only surfaced in March.
However, at present this case seems different from teachers, coaches etc where there are multiple people to come forward. But you never know.
Are there not two people involved in this?
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on April 25, 2024, 07:27:31 AMQuote from: armaghniac on April 24, 2024, 11:25:51 PMQuote from: David McKeown on April 24, 2024, 10:33:49 PMQuote from: tbrick18 on April 24, 2024, 10:29:15 PMQuote from: armaghniac on April 24, 2024, 08:34:36 PMQuote from: tbrick18 on April 24, 2024, 08:25:27 PMOnly thing for sure is that there are no winners, but hopefully justice is service.
As I said before, it is hard to see how you can prove something 20 years ago beyond reasonable doubt, I doubt there were witnesses other than his wife.
Hearing other cases the PPS didn't prosecute due unlikelihood of conviction even when there is evidence, they must feel there's a high chance of conviction based on what ever evidence they have. No?
I've no idea myself - I'm doing a lot of reading between the lines and may well be getting it wrong.
Today was the 1st appearance. I'd be shocked if the PPS even have the full file yet let alone have made a decision. It would be unusual for them to have the full file yet particularly if the allegations only surfaced in March.
However, at present this case seems different from teachers, coaches etc where there are multiple people to come forward. But you never know.
Are there not two people involved in this?
yes
Quote from: Applesisapples on April 25, 2024, 09:06:21 AMQuote from: Milltown Row2 on April 25, 2024, 07:27:31 AMQuote from: armaghniac on April 24, 2024, 11:25:51 PMQuote from: David McKeown on April 24, 2024, 10:33:49 PMQuote from: tbrick18 on April 24, 2024, 10:29:15 PMQuote from: armaghniac on April 24, 2024, 08:34:36 PMQuote from: tbrick18 on April 24, 2024, 08:25:27 PMOnly thing for sure is that there are no winners, but hopefully justice is service.
As I said before, it is hard to see how you can prove something 20 years ago beyond reasonable doubt, I doubt there were witnesses other than his wife.
Hearing other cases the PPS didn't prosecute due unlikelihood of conviction even when there is evidence, they must feel there's a high chance of conviction based on what ever evidence they have. No?
I've no idea myself - I'm doing a lot of reading between the lines and may well be getting it wrong.
Today was the 1st appearance. I'd be shocked if the PPS even have the full file yet let alone have made a decision. It would be unusual for them to have the full file yet particularly if the allegations only surfaced in March.
However, at present this case seems different from teachers, coaches etc where there are multiple people to come forward. But you never know.
Are there not two people involved in this?
yes
Then it shouldn't fall down to a he said she said scenario?
Been plenty of legacy cases were people have been found guilty, but I'd worry on how they will throw together a set of jurors for this shambles
Quote from: David McKeown on April 24, 2024, 10:33:49 PMQuote from: tbrick18 on April 24, 2024, 10:29:15 PMQuote from: armaghniac on April 24, 2024, 08:34:36 PMQuote from: tbrick18 on April 24, 2024, 08:25:27 PMOnly thing for sure is that there are no winners, but hopefully justice is service.
As I said before, it is hard to see how you can prove something 20 years ago beyond reasonable doubt, I doubt there were witnesses other than his wife.
Hearing other cases the PPS didn't prosecute due unlikelihood of conviction even when there is evidence, they must feel there's a high chance of conviction based on what ever evidence they have. No?
I've no idea myself - I'm doing a lot of reading between the lines and may well be getting it wrong.
Today was the 1st appearance. I'd be shocked if the PPS even have the full file yet let alone have made a decision. It would be unusual for them to have the full file yet particularly if the allegations only surfaced in March.
So does that mean the PPS could still decide not prosecute?
I've no idea how these things work, I'd made the assumption it only gets this far if the PPS are already in a position to prosecute.
Interesting.
Fact the police went straight to charge I think should give an indication in this case.
That's not to decide on the outcome before it has been in front of the court, but the police obviously feel there is case here to be presented.
I see one of the charges relates to 1985 and Donaldson was married in 1987. As for the Lady Eleanor (any Lindisfarne fans out there?), David McKeown will know better than me but I think "aiding and abetting" usually suggests something more active than just knowing and doing nothing about it?
Seen some tosser making a dick of himself outside the courtroom when Donaldson came out. Some people do anything to post online.
Quote from: Wildweasel74 on April 25, 2024, 11:09:53 AMSeen some tosser making a dick of himself outside the courtroom when Donaldson came out. Some people do anything to post online.
Allegedly a TUV supporter, but that could be BS.
Although the same moron posts another video where he's approached by Ben Lowry who seems to know him going by the interaction.
Whoever it is there's something seriously wrong with them...
Quote from: Wildweasel74 on April 25, 2024, 11:09:53 AMSeen some tosser making a dick of himself outside the courtroom when Donaldson came out. Some people do anything to post online.
Major c**k up by the police to bring him out and no transport. Saw a photo of that man and he looks exactly like you expect him to. Bryson seems to think he's a republican.
Quote from: RedHand88 on April 25, 2024, 01:25:00 PMQuote from: Wildweasel74 on April 25, 2024, 11:09:53 AMSeen some tosser making a dick of himself outside the courtroom when Donaldson came out. Some people do anything to post online.
Major c**k up by the police to bring him out and no transport. Saw a photo of that man and he looks exactly like you expect him to. Bryson seems to think he's a republican.
https://twitter.com/i/status/1783121474527580403 (https://twitter.com/i/status/1783121474527580403)
I'm almost certain Ben Lowry says good to see you to him and seemed to know where he was from.
Could be a republican but highly unlikely.
Quote from: johnnycool on April 25, 2024, 02:11:25 PMQuote from: RedHand88 on April 25, 2024, 01:25:00 PMQuote from: Wildweasel74 on April 25, 2024, 11:09:53 AMSeen some tosser making a dick of himself outside the courtroom when Donaldson came out. Some people do anything to post online.
Major c**k up by the police to bring him out and no transport. Saw a photo of that man and he looks exactly like you expect him to. Bryson seems to think he's a republican.
https://twitter.com/i/status/1783121474527580403 (https://twitter.com/i/status/1783121474527580403)
I'm almost certain Ben Lowry says good to see you to him and seemed to know where he was from.
Could be a republican but highly unlikely.
Doesn't look like he knows him to me. Ben Lowry just being nosy.
Quote from: johnnycool on April 25, 2024, 12:20:13 PMQuote from: Wildweasel74 on April 25, 2024, 11:09:53 AMSeen some tosser making a dick of himself outside the courtroom when Donaldson came out. Some people do anything to post online.
Allegedly a TUV supporter, but that could be BS.
Although the same moron posts another video where he's approached by Ben Lowry who seems to know him going by the interaction.
That's a nyuck if ever I heard one. Doubt he's a TUV man.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-68647494.amp
Quote from: tbrick18 on April 25, 2024, 09:57:40 AMQuote from: David McKeown on April 24, 2024, 10:33:49 PMQuote from: tbrick18 on April 24, 2024, 10:29:15 PMQuote from: armaghniac on April 24, 2024, 08:34:36 PMQuote from: tbrick18 on April 24, 2024, 08:25:27 PMOnly thing for sure is that there are no winners, but hopefully justice is service.
As I said before, it is hard to see how you can prove something 20 years ago beyond reasonable doubt, I doubt there were witnesses other than his wife.
Hearing other cases the PPS didn't prosecute due unlikelihood of conviction even when there is evidence, they must feel there's a high chance of conviction based on what ever evidence they have. No?
I've no idea myself - I'm doing a lot of reading between the lines and may well be getting it wrong.
Today was the 1st appearance. I'd be shocked if the PPS even have the full file yet let alone have made a decision. It would be unusual for them to have the full file yet particularly if the allegations only surfaced in March.
So does that mean the PPS could still decide not prosecute?
I've no idea how these things work, I'd made the assumption it only gets this far if the PPS are already in a position to prosecute.
Interesting.
Police once they arrest someone can question them for a total period of initially 24 hours before they must release them without charge or charge them. That time can be extended firstly by senior by police officers and then by courts. Until that time is used up police can release upon pre charge bail in order to gather further evidence but conditions are largely unenforceable (not going into the details of that here not really relevant). Once police believe they have sufficient evidence to establish a prime facie case they can charge. Alternatively they can release for report. Neither way suggests the evidence is any stronger or weaker than the other it more comes down to the perceived necessity by police for bail conditions and/or a remand. The reason some are charged is essentially that police believe there a likelihood of reoffending if not charged, is there a likelihood of interference with witnesses or is there a likelihood of absconding. Rarely there may be other reasons for charging such as to uphold public confidence but these are rare.
If an individual is charged they can be kept to the next remand court (the next day or two if its over a holiday or weekend) if PSNI feel that remand is necessary to meet the above. Or they can be released on post charge bail by the custody sergeant who will set a date within 28 days for a defendant to appear at court and will set bail conditions. That is what happened in this case.
After charge PSNI will continue to gather evidence and collate the already gathered evidence in order to submit a file to the PPS. Once a file is received it will be allocated to a suitably qualified prosecutor who will review the file and if necessary request the police to gather further evidence. Once the PPS have a full file they will decide whether to prosecute and what charges are to be prosecuted and where they are to be prosecuted.
Asking how long that process will last is like asking how long is a piece of string. I recently had a fast tracked one that took 14 months but I've had ones take anything from 4 months to 3 years. It depends on the amount of evidence, the quality, the likelihood of getting more, how busy the directing officer is, how busy the investigating officer is etc etc.
With a charge sheet case the court will keep under review how long things are taking. Had the case been taken for report then its simply a case of when PPS can get round to it, but defendants aren't on bail in report cases.
Statistically report cases have a higher conviction rate but a lower decision to prosecute rate but there's very little difference.
Ultimately all cases investigated by police are sent to PPS for decision. A lot never see the light of day, some get dropped after being charged and others get prosecuted the whole way to trial. At this moment nothing has happened that I am aware of that could lead to any proper conclusions on the strength of the evidence and we would simply be speculating.
Quote from: David McKeown on April 25, 2024, 07:31:48 PMQuote from: tbrick18 on April 25, 2024, 09:57:40 AMQuote from: David McKeown on April 24, 2024, 10:33:49 PMQuote from: tbrick18 on April 24, 2024, 10:29:15 PMQuote from: armaghniac on April 24, 2024, 08:34:36 PMQuote from: tbrick18 on April 24, 2024, 08:25:27 PMOnly thing for sure is that there are no winners, but hopefully justice is service.
As I said before, it is hard to see how you can prove something 20 years ago beyond reasonable doubt, I doubt there were witnesses other than his wife.
Hearing other cases the PPS didn't prosecute due unlikelihood of conviction even when there is evidence, they must feel there's a high chance of conviction based on what ever evidence they have. No?
I've no idea myself - I'm doing a lot of reading between the lines and may well be getting it wrong.
Today was the 1st appearance. I'd be shocked if the PPS even have the full file yet let alone have made a decision. It would be unusual for them to have the full file yet particularly if the allegations only surfaced in March.
So does that mean the PPS could still decide not prosecute?
I've no idea how these things work, I'd made the assumption it only gets this far if the PPS are already in a position to prosecute.
Interesting.
Police once they arrest someone can question them for a total period of initially 24 hours before they must release them without charge or charge them. That time can be extended firstly by senior by police officers and then by courts. Until that time is used up police can release upon pre charge bail in order to gather further evidence but conditions are largely unenforceable (not going into the details of that here not really relevant). Once police believe they have sufficient evidence to establish a prime facie case they can charge. Alternatively they can release for report. Neither way suggests the evidence is any stronger or weaker than the other it more comes down to the perceived necessity by police for bail conditions and/or a remand. The reason some are charged is essentially that police believe there a likelihood of reoffending if not charged, is there a likelihood of interference with witnesses or is there a likelihood of absconding. Rarely there may be other reasons for charging such as to uphold public confidence but these are rare.
If an individual is charged they can be kept to the next remand court (the next day or two if its over a holiday or weekend) if PSNI feel that remand is necessary to meet the above. Or they can be released on post charge bail by the custody sergeant who will set a date within 28 days for a defendant to appear at court and will set bail conditions. That is what happened in this case.
After charge PSNI will continue to gather evidence and collate the already gathered evidence in order to submit a file to the PPS. Once a file is received it will be allocated to a suitably qualified prosecutor who will review the file and if necessary request the police to gather further evidence. Once the PPS have a full file they will decide whether to prosecute and what charges are to be prosecuted and where they are to be prosecuted.
Asking how long that process will last is like asking how long is a piece of string. I recently had a fast tracked one that took 14 months but I've had ones take anything from 4 months to 3 years. It depends on the amount of evidence, the quality, the likelihood of getting more, how busy the directing officer is, how busy the investigating officer is etc etc.
With a charge sheet case the court will keep under review how long things are taking. Had the case been taken for report then its simply a case of when PPS can get round to it, but defendants aren't on bail in report cases.
Statistically report cases have a higher conviction rate but a lower decision to prosecute rate but there's very little difference.
Ultimately all cases investigated by police are sent to PPS for decision. A lot never see the light of day, some get dropped after being charged and others get prosecuted the whole way to trial. At this moment nothing has happened that I am aware of that could lead to any proper conclusions on the strength of the evidence and we would simply be speculating.
A simple "the PPS might decide not to prosecute" would have sufficed. ;D ;D ;D
Thanks for that - definitely an education for me on the process.
All the more reason for people not to jump to conclusions at this stage of things I guess as anything could happen.
Quote from: tbrick18 on April 25, 2024, 08:41:55 PMQuote from: David McKeown on April 25, 2024, 07:31:48 PMQuote from: tbrick18 on April 25, 2024, 09:57:40 AMQuote from: David McKeown on April 24, 2024, 10:33:49 PMQuote from: tbrick18 on April 24, 2024, 10:29:15 PMQuote from: armaghniac on April 24, 2024, 08:34:36 PMQuote from: tbrick18 on April 24, 2024, 08:25:27 PMOnly thing for sure is that there are no winners, but hopefully justice is service.
As I said before, it is hard to see how you can prove something 20 years ago beyond reasonable doubt, I doubt there were witnesses other than his wife.
Hearing other cases the PPS didn't prosecute due unlikelihood of conviction even when there is evidence, they must feel there's a high chance of conviction based on what ever evidence they have. No?
I've no idea myself - I'm doing a lot of reading between the lines and may well be getting it wrong.
Today was the 1st appearance. I'd be shocked if the PPS even have the full file yet let alone have made a decision. It would be unusual for them to have the full file yet particularly if the allegations only surfaced in March.
So does that mean the PPS could still decide not prosecute?
I've no idea how these things work, I'd made the assumption it only gets this far if the PPS are already in a position to prosecute.
Interesting.
Police once they arrest someone can question them for a total period of initially 24 hours before they must release them without charge or charge them. That time can be extended firstly by senior by police officers and then by courts. Until that time is used up police can release upon pre charge bail in order to gather further evidence but conditions are largely unenforceable (not going into the details of that here not really relevant). Once police believe they have sufficient evidence to establish a prime facie case they can charge. Alternatively they can release for report. Neither way suggests the evidence is any stronger or weaker than the other it more comes down to the perceived necessity by police for bail conditions and/or a remand. The reason some are charged is essentially that police believe there a likelihood of reoffending if not charged, is there a likelihood of interference with witnesses or is there a likelihood of absconding. Rarely there may be other reasons for charging such as to uphold public confidence but these are rare.
If an individual is charged they can be kept to the next remand court (the next day or two if its over a holiday or weekend) if PSNI feel that remand is necessary to meet the above. Or they can be released on post charge bail by the custody sergeant who will set a date within 28 days for a defendant to appear at court and will set bail conditions. That is what happened in this case.
After charge PSNI will continue to gather evidence and collate the already gathered evidence in order to submit a file to the PPS. Once a file is received it will be allocated to a suitably qualified prosecutor who will review the file and if necessary request the police to gather further evidence. Once the PPS have a full file they will decide whether to prosecute and what charges are to be prosecuted and where they are to be prosecuted.
Asking how long that process will last is like asking how long is a piece of string. I recently had a fast tracked one that took 14 months but I've had ones take anything from 4 months to 3 years. It depends on the amount of evidence, the quality, the likelihood of getting more, how busy the directing officer is, how busy the investigating officer is etc etc.
With a charge sheet case the court will keep under review how long things are taking. Had the case been taken for report then its simply a case of when PPS can get round to it, but defendants aren't on bail in report cases.
Statistically report cases have a higher conviction rate but a lower decision to prosecute rate but there's very little difference.
Ultimately all cases investigated by police are sent to PPS for decision. A lot never see the light of day, some get dropped after being charged and others get prosecuted the whole way to trial. At this moment nothing has happened that I am aware of that could lead to any proper conclusions on the strength of the evidence and we would simply be speculating.
A simple "the PPS might decide not to prosecute" would have sufficed. ;D ;D ;D
Thanks for that - definitely an education for me on the process.
All the more reason for people not to jump to conclusions at this stage of things I guess as anything could happen.
That'll be £700 please.
David, regarding the PPS. How many people work there?
So say a case comes to them from the cops. Do a small group of them look at it and decide to prosecute or is it discussed between a big group and an answer is given?
I was just wondering how it works. I hear PPS mentioned a lot but am just wondering how it is behind the scenes.
Quote from: johnnycool on April 25, 2024, 02:11:25 PMQuote from: RedHand88 on April 25, 2024, 01:25:00 PMQuote from: Wildweasel74 on April 25, 2024, 11:09:53 AMSeen some tosser making a dick of himself outside the courtroom when Donaldson came out. Some people do anything to post online.
Major c**k up by the police to bring him out and no transport. Saw a photo of that man and he looks exactly like you expect him to. Bryson seems to think he's a republican.
https://twitter.com/i/status/1783121474527580403 (https://twitter.com/i/status/1783121474527580403)
I'm almost certain Ben Lowry says good to see you to him and seemed to know where he was from.
Could be a republican but highly unlikely.
The "good to see you" greeting was so low key as to mean the sewer rats I have to associate with in order to get a bit of info.
Quote from: marty34 on April 25, 2024, 09:31:05 PMDavid, regarding the PPS. How many people work there?
So say a case comes to them from the cops. Do a small group of them look at it and decide to prosecute or is it discussed between a big group and an answer is given?
I was just wondering how it works. I hear PPS mentioned a lot but am just wondering how it is behind the scenes.
Not sure of the exact numbers but around 150 - 200 prosecutors and 300 - 350 support staff split across different regions and specialisms. Cases will be effectively triaged to the correct team and level of seniority. Ultimately it's the directing officers responsibility but they will know seek help and assistance from colleagues and superiors if necessary.
Can the PPS back off with the prosecution (eg after 6 months) but reserve the right to take it up again in the future?
Quote from: David McKeown on April 25, 2024, 10:51:20 PMQuote from: marty34 on April 25, 2024, 09:31:05 PMDavid, regarding the PPS. How many people work there?
So say a case comes to them from the cops. Do a small group of them look at it and decide to prosecute or is it discussed between a big group and an answer is given?
I was just wondering how it works. I hear PPS mentioned a lot but am just wondering how it is behind the scenes.
Not sure of the exact numbers but around 150 - 200 prosecutors and 300 - 350 support staff split across different regions and specialisms. Cases will be effectively triaged to the correct team and level of seniority. Ultimately it's the directing officers responsibility but they will know seek help and assistance from colleagues and superiors if necessary.
Quote from: David McKeown on April 25, 2024, 10:51:20 PMQuote from: marty34 on April 25, 2024, 09:31:05 PMDavid, regarding the PPS. How many people work there?
So say a case comes to them from the cops. Do a small group of them look at it and decide to prosecute or is it discussed between a big group and an answer is given?
I was just wondering how it works. I hear PPS mentioned a lot but am just wondering how it is behind the scenes.
Not sure of the exact numbers but around 150 - 200 prosecutors and 300 - 350 support staff split across different regions and specialisms. Cases will be effectively triaged to the correct team and level of seniority. Ultimately it's the directing officers responsibility but they will know seek help and assistance from colleagues and superiors if necessary.
I have recently seen the police decide cases are not worth pursuing and a waste of public expenditure, but are passed to PPS for endorsement, yet the PPS dig in and proceed with the case.
Do the PPS have graduates who they throw minor cases at for them to gain experience?
Quote from: Main Street on April 30, 2024, 01:55:22 PMCan the PPS back off with the prosecution (eg after 6 months) but reserve the right to take it up again in the future?
The general answer to your question is yes but with some caveats.
Quote from: Orior on April 30, 2024, 02:07:37 PMQuote from: David McKeown on April 25, 2024, 10:51:20 PMQuote from: marty34 on April 25, 2024, 09:31:05 PMDavid, regarding the PPS. How many people work there?
So say a case comes to them from the cops. Do a small group of them look at it and decide to prosecute or is it discussed between a big group and an answer is given?
I was just wondering how it works. I hear PPS mentioned a lot but am just wondering how it is behind the scenes.
Not sure of the exact numbers but around 150 - 200 prosecutors and 300 - 350 support staff split across different regions and specialisms. Cases will be effectively triaged to the correct team and level of seniority. Ultimately it's the directing officers responsibility but they will know seek help and assistance from colleagues and superiors if necessary.
Quote from: David McKeown on April 25, 2024, 10:51:20 PMQuote from: marty34 on April 25, 2024, 09:31:05 PMDavid, regarding the PPS. How many people work there?
So say a case comes to them from the cops. Do a small group of them look at it and decide to prosecute or is it discussed between a big group and an answer is given?
I was just wondering how it works. I hear PPS mentioned a lot but am just wondering how it is behind the scenes.
Not sure of the exact numbers but around 150 - 200 prosecutors and 300 - 350 support staff split across different regions and specialisms. Cases will be effectively triaged to the correct team and level of seniority. Ultimately it's the directing officers responsibility but they will know seek help and assistance from colleagues and superiors if necessary.
I have recently seen the police decide cases are not worth pursuing and a waste of public expenditure, but are passed to PPS for endorsement, yet the PPS dig in and proceed with the case.
Do the PPS have graduates who they throw minor cases at for them to gain experience?
Well they recruit lawyers at different levels. Cases would be triaged when they are received and some types of cases will require specialists but generally not really. Prosecutors will get training and won't be able to make their own decision until they complete that thought. But it's not a case that the newbie will get the no licence case or something like that.
So, big Jeffrey was lying back in January about the Irish Sea border being removed (as anyone with half a brain cell knew)
Robinson yesterday confirmed this.
I 'm not sure why they would admit this with an election coming? Surely this will send many of their voters to the TUV (or other parties)?
Not only that , but Robinson stood with Jeffrey in January knowing what he was saying was a lie. Can unionist voters trust a word he (or the DUP) says again?
Is this the end of the DUP?
Quote from: AustinPowers on May 30, 2024, 06:47:55 PMSo, big Jeffrey was lying back in January about the Irish Sea border being removed (as anyone with half a brain cell knew)
Robinson yesterday confirmed this.
I 'm not sure why they would admit this with an election coming? Surely this will send many of their voters to the TUV (or other parties)?
Not only that , but Robinson stood with Jeffrey in January knowing what he was saying was a lie. Can unionist voters trust a word he (or the DUP) says again?
Is this the end of the DUP?
Not a chance. They've changed their tune because there's an election in the offing. It's a joke.
Giving out about the thing they signed up for to go back into Stormont. Now he's saying we need to look at it again - embarrassing.
Election mode.
Trying to pin the blame on Jeffrey and distance himself from it maybe?
You can bet any problem or complaint will be blamed on Jeffrey
Quote from: Brendan on May 30, 2024, 07:56:17 PMTrying to pin the blame on Jeffrey and distance himself from it maybe?
Is Robinson not just as guilty as Jeffrey? He stood there with Jeffrey when he sold his big lie, and said nothing.
It's very simple for very simple people
SF equals United Ireland
DUP equals staying British
That's the only slogan they need, been working for 100 years for unionists
Quote from: AustinPowers on May 30, 2024, 08:22:57 PMQuote from: Brendan on May 30, 2024, 07:56:17 PMTrying to pin the blame on Jeffrey and distance himself from it maybe?
Is Robinson not just as guilty as Jeffrey? He stood there with Jeffrey when he sold his big lie, and said nothing.
It's the loyalist working class they're trying to fool though and they're idiots
Quote from: Brendan on May 30, 2024, 09:01:07 PMQuote from: AustinPowers on May 30, 2024, 08:22:57 PMQuote from: Brendan on May 30, 2024, 07:56:17 PMTrying to pin the blame on Jeffrey and distance himself from it maybe?
Is Robinson not just as guilty as Jeffrey? He stood there with Jeffrey when he sold his big lie, and said nothing.
It's the loyalist working class they're trying to fool though and they're idiots
A fairly easy task I would imagine.
Perhaps Sammy Wilson posts horse manure here in the Ukraine thread
https://www.irishnews.com/news/northern-ireland/sammy-wilson-says-west-provoked-putin-into-invading-ukraine-AQUFHR26R5DBLFXFVKV73VF62Q
The useless eejits earning their money
Hearing wee Jeffrey will face even more sex charges when he appears in court tomorrow.
Quote from: red hander on July 02, 2024, 01:42:39 PMHearing wee Jeffrey will face even more sex charges when he appears in court tomorrow.
Not unusual in cases of this type. Contrary to the Belfast Telegraph article the defendants will not be asked to indicate their pleas tomorrow. It's merely a procedural hearing to move the case to the Crown Court
Wondering if there's new complainant/s.
Quote from: red hander on July 02, 2024, 02:07:29 PMWondering if there's new complainant/s.
Bbc article still saying 2 complainants.
So David, or any other legal eagles, 10 Sept is the next date, is that when the trial starts or just another step in the process?
What's with wee Jeff's beard?
Quote from: Pub Bore on July 03, 2024, 01:53:26 PMWhat's with wee Jeff's beard?
Has a reputation to uphold
Quote from: quit yo jibbajabba on July 03, 2024, 12:42:03 PMSo David, or any other legal eagles, 10 Sept is the next date, is that when the trial starts or just another step in the process?
That is likely the arraignment date (it may be pre-arraignment mention to make sure there are no issues with the arraignment)
Without getting too technical if the defence accept that there is a true bill, an arraignment is where the defendants will have the charges put to them and asked how they plead. In the event of a not guilty plea a timetable to progress the case (including possibly a trial date) will be set at that hearing.
Good man David ta. Bit to go yet then...
Quote from: David McKeown on July 03, 2024, 02:29:06 PMQuote from: quit yo jibbajabba on July 03, 2024, 12:42:03 PMSo David, or any other legal eagles, 10 Sept is the next date, is that when the trial starts or just another step in the process?
That is likely the arraignment date (it may be pre-arraignment mention to make sure there are no issues with the arraignment)
Without getting too technical if the defence accept that there is a true bill, an arraignment is where the defendants will have the charges put to them and asked how they plead. In the event of a not guilty plea a timetable to progress the case (including possibly a trial date) will be set at that hearing.
Is it normally this protracted or is there a big backlog of paedophilia cases to be heard?
Quote from: Pub Bore on July 03, 2024, 01:53:26 PMWhat's with wee Jeff's beard?
Giving off Gary Glitter vibes there, alright. And where's his wee 'Christian' fish pin?
Quote from: johnnycool on July 03, 2024, 04:39:21 PMQuote from: David McKeown on July 03, 2024, 02:29:06 PMQuote from: quit yo jibbajabba on July 03, 2024, 12:42:03 PMSo David, or any other legal eagles, 10 Sept is the next date, is that when the trial starts or just another step in the process?
That is likely the arraignment date (it may be pre-arraignment mention to make sure there are no issues with the arraignment)
Without getting too technical if the defence accept that there is a true bill, an arraignment is where the defendants will have the charges put to them and asked how they plead. In the event of a not guilty plea a timetable to progress the case (including possibly a trial date) will be set at that hearing.
Is it normally this protracted or is there a big backlog of paedophilia cases to be heard?
Far from protracted this is incredibly quick. The most recent one I had of this was 11 years from complaint to Court although there were some extenuating circumstances no one was overly surprised.
Big night ahead.
Heard a polling expert saying that the election could be a success or a disaster for the DUP over a few thousand votes.
3 seats all to play for.
Lagan Valley( what will the Jeffrey effect be)
East Belfast ( will Robinson pay for support of Donaldsons deal)
One they aren't even contesting but if it goes SF they will be gutted...Fermanagh/South Tyrone.
I have NEVER trusted Tyrone . Prove me wrong midget divers!!
Anyone seen the polling for East Belfast?
Are Alliance close to taking Robinson out.
Can't see Girvan beating Swann.
Do you think the UUP knew that Jeff was going to be done before an election, sticking the popular Swann in there as they knew the sleaze was coming would help win that seat?
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on July 04, 2024, 10:20:48 AMDo you think the UUP knew that Jeff was going to be done before an election, sticking the popular Swann in there as they knew the sleaze was coming would help win that seat?
I think with Swann's OO and Farming connections added to his profile through Covid, I don't think the Jeff stuff would have come into it.
Some very staunch areas in that constituency who will go against the DUPers over their protocol stance and split their vote.
Quote from: Armaghtothebone on July 04, 2024, 09:50:09 AMBig night ahead.
Heard a polling expert saying that the election could be a success or a disaster for the DUP over a few thousand votes.
3 seats all to play for.
Lagan Valley( what will the Jeffrey effect be)
East Belfast ( will Robinson pay for support of Donaldsons deal)
One they aren't even contesting but if it goes SF they will be gutted...Fermanagh/South Tyrone.
I have NEVER trusted Tyrone . Prove me wrong midget divers!!
Time themmuns did something useful alright!
Some people reckon Hazzard could be in trouble in South Down?
Going by the constituency profiles over on Slugger SF should keep all their seats. Brexit isnt a factor this time like it was in 2019 and the Sdlp were able to push that in the last general election, like in East Derry last time Cara Hunter pipped Sinn Féin to 2nd then in the 2022 assembly election SF got almost 4 times her vote if I remember right
Quote from: Brendan on July 04, 2024, 10:59:07 AMGoing by the constituency profiles over on Slugger SF should keep all their seats. Brexit isnt a factor this time like it was in 2019 and the Sdlp were able to push that in the last general election, like in Easter Derry last time Cara Hunter pipped Sinn Féin to 2nd then in the 2022 assembly election SF got almost 4 times her vote if I remember right
Be great result to hold all seats esp FST. Ideally take Foyle back but 17k is an awful lot of votes.
Quote from: Armagh18 on July 04, 2024, 11:00:48 AMQuote from: Brendan on July 04, 2024, 10:59:07 AMGoing by the constituency profiles over on Slugger SF should keep all their seats. Brexit isnt a factor this time like it was in 2019 and the Sdlp were able to push that in the last general election, like in Easter Derry last time Cara Hunter pipped Sinn Féin to 2nd then in the 2022 assembly election SF got almost 4 times her vote if I remember right
Be great result to hold all seats esp FST. Ideally take Foyle back but 17k is an awful lot of votes.
Can't see that happening either, 2017 when they took Foyle was a perfect storm for them with losing an icon like Martin McGuinness and Arlene Foster with her crocodiles
Quote from: Brendan on July 04, 2024, 11:04:33 AMQuote from: Armagh18 on July 04, 2024, 11:00:48 AMQuote from: Brendan on July 04, 2024, 10:59:07 AMGoing by the constituency profiles over on Slugger SF should keep all their seats. Brexit isnt a factor this time like it was in 2019 and the Sdlp were able to push that in the last general election, like in Easter Derry last time Cara Hunter pipped Sinn Féin to 2nd then in the 2022 assembly election SF got almost 4 times her vote if I remember right
Be great result to hold all seats esp FST. Ideally take Foyle back but 17k is an awful lot of votes.
Can't see that happening either, 2017 when they took Foyle was a perfect storm for them with losing an icon like Martin McGuinness and Arlene Foster with her crocodiles
SF should be focussing on places like upper Bann, East Londonderry and South Antrim. These are places that they could get close if the actually bothered their heads. They need to forget Foyle, it is rock solid safe for SDLP, SF would have more of a chance coming through the middle in a heavily split North Antrim than winning Foyle. The lack of interest from pretty much everyone in this election is unreal considering so many seats could be close in NI
Quote from: JPGJOHNNYG on July 04, 2024, 11:18:54 AMQuote from: Brendan on July 04, 2024, 11:04:33 AMQuote from: Armagh18 on July 04, 2024, 11:00:48 AMQuote from: Brendan on July 04, 2024, 10:59:07 AMGoing by the constituency profiles over on Slugger SF should keep all their seats. Brexit isnt a factor this time like it was in 2019 and the Sdlp were able to push that in the last general election, like in Easter Derry last time Cara Hunter pipped Sinn Féin to 2nd then in the 2022 assembly election SF got almost 4 times her vote if I remember right
Be great result to hold all seats esp FST. Ideally take Foyle back but 17k is an awful lot of votes.
Can't see that happening either, 2017 when they took Foyle was a perfect storm for them with losing an icon like Martin McGuinness and Arlene Foster with her crocodiles
SF should be focussing on places like upper Bann, East Londonderry and South Antrim. These are places that they could get close if the actually bothered their heads. They need to forget Foyle, it is rock solid safe for SDLP, SF would have more of a chance coming through the middle in a heavily split North Antrim than winning Foyle. The lack of interest from pretty much everyone in this election is unreal considering so many seats could be close in NI
It's been lowkey for sure, but you have to remember that this is a westminster election, and most people from both sides of the fence (whether unionists will admit it or not), appreciate that westminster elections are absolutely meaningless to this place. Neither Labour nor the Tories care less about here (and why would they?) and don't stand here and wont' start to care about here on the other side of an election. And MPs elected from here are irrelevant non-entities when they go to London. Election count nights are a bit of drama, but there the interest ends for most people.
Quote from: JPGJOHNNYG on July 04, 2024, 11:18:54 AMQuote from: Brendan on July 04, 2024, 11:04:33 AMQuote from: Armagh18 on July 04, 2024, 11:00:48 AMQuote from: Brendan on July 04, 2024, 10:59:07 AMGoing by the constituency profiles over on Slugger SF should keep all their seats. Brexit isnt a factor this time like it was in 2019 and the Sdlp were able to push that in the last general election, like in Easter Derry last time Cara Hunter pipped Sinn Féin to 2nd then in the 2022 assembly election SF got almost 4 times her vote if I remember right
Be great result to hold all seats esp FST. Ideally take Foyle back but 17k is an awful lot of votes.
Can't see that happening either, 2017 when they took Foyle was a perfect storm for them with losing an icon like Martin McGuinness and Arlene Foster with her crocodiles
SF should be focussing on places like upper Bann, East Londonderry and South Antrim. These are places that they could get close if the actually bothered their heads. They need to forget Foyle, it is rock solid safe for SDLP, SF would have more of a chance coming through the middle in a heavily split North Antrim than winning Foyle. The lack of interest from pretty much everyone in this election is unreal considering so many seats could be close in NI
Foyle/Derry city is more symbolic to nationalists
Quote from: JPGJOHNNYG on July 04, 2024, 11:18:54 AMQuote from: Brendan on July 04, 2024, 11:04:33 AMQuote from: Armagh18 on July 04, 2024, 11:00:48 AMQuote from: Brendan on July 04, 2024, 10:59:07 AMGoing by the constituency profiles over on Slugger SF should keep all their seats. Brexit isnt a factor this time like it was in 2019 and the Sdlp were able to push that in the last general election, like in Easter Derry last time Cara Hunter pipped Sinn Féin to 2nd then in the 2022 assembly election SF got almost 4 times her vote if I remember right
Be great result to hold all seats esp FST. Ideally take Foyle back but 17k is an awful lot of votes.
Can't see that happening either, 2017 when they took Foyle was a perfect storm for them with losing an icon like Martin McGuinness and Arlene Foster with her crocodiles
SF should be focussing on places like upper Bann, East Londonderry and South Antrim. These are places that they could get close if the actually bothered their heads. They need to forget Foyle, it is rock solid safe for SDLP, SF would have more of a chance coming through the middle in a heavily split North Antrim than winning Foyle. The lack of interest from pretty much everyone in this election is unreal considering so many seats could be close in NI
Where the f**k is that
The opposite end of West Londonderry?
I wouldn't want to upset Gregory and not call it by it's official name ;D.
The point about apathy is that we are in pre border poll territory no matter what people spoof. The opinion polls are all over the place especially if Mr Shirlow is involved so we only have election results as solid data. I know Westminster is a bit odd with the FPTP set up but if nationalists get below 40% no doubt it will be used again as a reason to nonsense any idea of a referendum
Quote from: JPGJOHNNYG on July 04, 2024, 12:26:16 PMI wouldn't want to upset Gregory and not call it by it's official name ;D.
The point about apathy is that we are in pre border poll territory no matter what people spoof. The opinion polls are all over the place especially if Mr Shirlow is involved so we only have election results as solid data. I know Westminster is a bit odd with the FPTP set up but if nationalists get below 40% no doubt it will be used again as a reason to nonsense any idea of a referendum
It'll be pro-nationalist percentage, pro-unionist percentage...and Alliance bloc.
Breakdown will be interesting.
But as Snapchat says, re: WM, who really cares? Makes very little difference.
Very disappointed SDLP standing in areas where progressive parties can win. Disappointed but not surprised.
They'll be getting nothing from me in the next MLA or local council election.
Quote from: JPGJOHNNYG on July 04, 2024, 12:26:16 PMI wouldn't want to upset Gregory and not call it by it's official name ;D.
The point about apathy is that we are in pre border poll territory no matter what people spoof. The opinion polls are all over the place especially if Mr Shirlow is involved so we only have election results as solid data. I know Westminster is a bit odd with the FPTP set up but if nationalists get below 40% no doubt it will be used again as a reason to nonsense any idea of a referendum
however, data from this type of election is not entirely reliable with first past the post and tactical voting. For instance, Alliance will pick up votes from nationalists in Lagan Valley, East Belfast, North Down and Stangford. The Assembly or local elections are a better guide.
Quote from: armaghniac on July 04, 2024, 07:18:00 PMQuote from: JPGJOHNNYG on July 04, 2024, 12:26:16 PMI wouldn't want to upset Gregory and not call it by it's official name ;D.
The point about apathy is that we are in pre border poll territory no matter what people spoof. The opinion polls are all over the place especially if Mr Shirlow is involved so we only have election results as solid data. I know Westminster is a bit odd with the FPTP set up but if nationalists get below 40% no doubt it will be used again as a reason to nonsense any idea of a referendum
however, data from this type of election is not entirely reliable with first past the post and tactical voting. For instance, Alliance will pick up votes from nationalists in Lagan Valley, East Belfast, North Down and Stangford. The Assembly or local elections are a better guide.
Yeah true plus parties not running in certain places etc.
Lockhart worried about upper Bann. Is that just the bel tel getting me interested to now stay up all night ;D
Doug Beattie resigns as UUP leader.
What are the "irreconcilable differences" ?
17th Century v 21st???
Quote from: Armagh18 on August 19, 2024, 01:28:50 PMDoug Beattie resigns as UUP leader.
/th leader in 14 years I think. 5 of 9 MLAs have already been leader
Quote from: Armagh18 on August 19, 2024, 01:28:50 PMDoug Beattie resigns as UUP leader.
What's he done? Or who has he 'done' ?
Timing looks odd. Thought he would have gone a couple of years ago after his tweets.
Unionism is in crisis is my read of this. Demographics are against unionism so they must try and reach out to those from traditional nationalist areas. I think Beattie was one of the few who was pragmatic and was trying to do this but the dinosaurs in unionism have their heads buried in the sand. Short term I can see someone come into the UUP and start doing election pacts with the DUP, while that might work somewhat in short term it will be the final nail in the coffin of unionism as no nationalist could suffer such a strategy.
Quote from: Itchy on August 19, 2024, 03:07:59 PMUnionism is in crisis is my read of this. Demographics are against unionism so they must try and reach out to those from traditional nationalist areas. I think Beattie was one of the few who was pragmatic and was trying to do this but the dinosaurs in unionism have their heads buried in the sand. Short term I can see someone come into the UUP and start doing election pacts with the DUP, while that might work somewhat in short term it will be the final nail in the coffin of unionism as no nationalist could suffer such a strategy.
They really don't know how and most leaders within Unionism are afraid of being called a Lundy.
Keep putting suspected devices outside Henry Jones playing fields as East Belfast have bigger fish to fry in the coming years...
Quote from: johnnycool on August 19, 2024, 03:24:16 PMQuote from: Itchy on August 19, 2024, 03:07:59 PMUnionism is in crisis is my read of this. Demographics are against unionism so they must try and reach out to those from traditional nationalist areas. I think Beattie was one of the few who was pragmatic and was trying to do this but the dinosaurs in unionism have their heads buried in the sand. Short term I can see someone come into the UUP and start doing election pacts with the DUP, while that might work somewhat in short term it will be the final nail in the coffin of unionism as no nationalist could suffer such a strategy.
They really don't know how and most leaders within Unionism are afraid of being called a Lundy.
Keep putting suspected devices outside Henry Jones playing fields as East Belfast have bigger fish to fry in the coming years...
Isn't it likely this is the issue here? Beattie trying to modernise and make a case to nationalists and others in his party still shouting "not an inch" and probably saying Beattie is making little inroads (probably true).
I would say who the next leader is will answer that itchy.
I always thought, and I suspect I am far from alone, that when you scratched the surface with beattie he wasn't as moderate or liberal as he presented himself to be.
Quote from: Itchy on August 19, 2024, 03:27:25 PMQuote from: johnnycool on August 19, 2024, 03:24:16 PMQuote from: Itchy on August 19, 2024, 03:07:59 PMUnionism is in crisis is my read of this. Demographics are against unionism so they must try and reach out to those from traditional nationalist areas. I think Beattie was one of the few who was pragmatic and was trying to do this but the dinosaurs in unionism have their heads buried in the sand. Short term I can see someone come into the UUP and start doing election pacts with the DUP, while that might work somewhat in short term it will be the final nail in the coffin of unionism as no nationalist could suffer such a strategy.
They really don't know how and most leaders within Unionism are afraid of being called a Lundy.
Keep putting suspected devices outside Henry Jones playing fields as East Belfast have bigger fish to fry in the coming years...
Isn't it likely this is the issue here? Beattie trying to modernise and make a case to nationalists and others in his party still shouting "not an inch" and probably saying Beattie is making little inroads (probably true).
Yeah he is a quandary or at least he was in one up too today, he was trying to move them to the middle ground which Alliance has secured successfully. But he was always held back by the traditional Unionists within the party, who are too moderate for the DUP but too staunch for Alliance.
Hard to see as a party where they go from here, Robin Swann only likely candidate but would he take it on?
Lots of naval gazing for them for a few weeks, will be lots of shouts for a merger with the DUP to fend of SF for a few elections.
All the same the decision to parachute Tim "Nice but dim" Collins into North Down was a disastrous one and every once in a while Beatty has the capacity to make a mad call like that.
A merger between the DUP and UUP will spell the end of moderate unionism if such a thing exists.
I hope they do merge.
Quote from: Itchy on August 19, 2024, 03:27:25 PMQuote from: johnnycool on August 19, 2024, 03:24:16 PMQuote from: Itchy on August 19, 2024, 03:07:59 PMUnionism is in crisis is my read of this. Demographics are against unionism so they must try and reach out to those from traditional nationalist areas. I think Beattie was one of the few who was pragmatic and was trying to do this but the dinosaurs in unionism have their heads buried in the sand. Short term I can see someone come into the UUP and start doing election pacts with the DUP, while that might work somewhat in short term it will be the final nail in the coffin of unionism as no nationalist could suffer such a strategy.
They really don't know how and most leaders within Unionism are afraid of being called a Lundy.
Keep putting suspected devices outside Henry Jones playing fields as East Belfast have bigger fish to fry in the coming years...
Isn't it likely this is the issue here? Beattie trying to modernise and make a case to nationalists and others in his party still shouting "not an inch" and probably saying Beattie is making little inroads (probably true).
Beattie trying to 'modernise'....ffs, he was on to the CC of the PSNI straight away after 'Armaghflagate' incident.
Quote from: imtommygunn on August 19, 2024, 03:36:07 PMI would say who the next leader is will answer that itchy.
I always thought, and I suspect I am far from alone, that when you scratched the surface with beattie he wasn't as moderate or liberal as he presented himself to be.
100% correct imtommygunn.
Portrayed himself as moderate but then again he had an urgent meeting with the Chief Constable over the one handed driving, joyriding PSNI offer with the Armagh flag. He wasn't afraid to be Paddy Irishman but his inner William Ulsterman was always lurking in the shadows.
I always remember Doug Beattie's performance on the Nolan show when the St. Paul's GAA club in Lurgan had the audacity to install goal netting in their club colours i.e. green, white and gold (just like Offaly) ... Doug cited it as sectarian and provocative ... a leopard doesn't change its spots, bigotry was never far from the service with Mr. Beattie.
Quote from: balladmaker on August 19, 2024, 04:43:27 PMI always remember Doug Beattie's performance on the Nolan show when the St. Paul's GAA club in Lurgan had the audacity to install goal netting in their club colours i.e. green, white and gold (just like Offaly) ... Doug cited it as sectarian and provocative ... a leopard doesn't change its spots, bigotry was never far from the service with Mr. Beattie.
To be fair
How many clubs put the Club colours on their nets?
How many clubs have the tri-colour as their colours?
It is pugnacity, but you can understand how they would see this as provocative action.
Quote from: From the Bunker on August 19, 2024, 05:02:48 PMQuote from: balladmaker on August 19, 2024, 04:43:27 PMI always remember Doug Beattie's performance on the Nolan show when the St. Paul's GAA club in Lurgan had the audacity to install goal netting in their club colours i.e. green, white and gold (just like Offaly) ... Doug cited it as sectarian and provocative ... a leopard doesn't change its spots, bigotry was never far from the service with Mr. Beattie.
To be fair
How many clubs put the Club colours on their nets?
How many clubs have the tri-colour as their colours?
It is pugnacity, but you can understand how they would see this as provocative action.
But it's not the tricolour though.
Quote from: JoG2 on August 19, 2024, 05:08:20 PMQuote from: From the Bunker on August 19, 2024, 05:02:48 PMQuote from: balladmaker on August 19, 2024, 04:43:27 PMI always remember Doug Beattie's performance on the Nolan show when the St. Paul's GAA club in Lurgan had the audacity to install goal netting in their club colours i.e. green, white and gold (just like Offaly) ... Doug cited it as sectarian and provocative ... a leopard doesn't change its spots, bigotry was never far from the service with Mr. Beattie.
To be fair
How many clubs put the Club colours on their nets?
How many clubs have the tri-colour as their colours?
It is pugnacity, but you can understand how they would see this as provocative action.
But it's not the tricolour though.
(https://www.newsletter.co.uk/webimg/legacy_oak_104385537.jpg?crop=3:2,smart&trim=&width=990&quality=65&enable=upscale)
How the hell can goal nets be offensive. Considering some towns and villages throughout the north are plastered in red, white and blue and very little said about it.
Green white and gold, might as well be the Italian flag, a different 3rd colour. If people want to get offended, that's on them
Quote from: JoG2 on August 19, 2024, 05:23:00 PMGreen white and gold, might as well be the Italian flag, a different 3rd colour. If people want to get offended, that's on them
Ah the old Green, White and Gold. The Irish mans way of really denying the true background of our Flag! :(
Quote from: ardtole on August 19, 2024, 05:22:46 PMHow the hell can goal nets be offensive. Considering some towns and villages throughout the north are plastered in red, white and blue and very little said about it.
If a Soccer or Rugby pitch had a Union Jack on it's nets (in Ireland) would it bother you? You'd look with distain? I would!
Quote from: From the Bunker on August 19, 2024, 05:26:29 PMQuote from: JoG2 on August 19, 2024, 05:23:00 PMGreen white and gold, might as well be the Italian flag, a different 3rd colour. If people want to get offended, that's on them
Ah the old Green, White and Gold. The Irish mans way of really denying the true background of our Flag! :(
Eh?
Quote from: From the Bunker on August 19, 2024, 05:28:46 PMQuote from: ardtole on August 19, 2024, 05:22:46 PMHow the hell can goal nets be offensive. Considering some towns and villages throughout the north are plastered in red, white and blue and very little said about it.
If a Soccer or Rugby pitch had a Union Jack on it's nets (in Ireland) would it bother you? You'd look with distain? I would!
To be honest, I wouldn't give a damn! If you want to be offended, you'll be offended, personally, I'd laugh at it and move on.
Quote from: balladmaker on August 19, 2024, 05:32:48 PMQuote from: From the Bunker on August 19, 2024, 05:28:46 PMQuote from: ardtole on August 19, 2024, 05:22:46 PMHow the hell can goal nets be offensive. Considering some towns and villages throughout the north are plastered in red, white and blue and very little said about it.
If a Soccer or Rugby pitch had a Union Jack on it's nets (in Ireland) would it bother you? You'd look with distain? I would!
To be honest, I wouldn't give a damn! If you want to be offended, you'll be offended, personally, I'd laugh at it and move on.
I don't know. It's wouldn't say to me - Bring your kids to this club. Flags as much as we love them can hold so much back.
Quote from: JoG2 on August 19, 2024, 05:31:33 PMQuote from: From the Bunker on August 19, 2024, 05:26:29 PMQuote from: JoG2 on August 19, 2024, 05:23:00 PMGreen white and gold, might as well be the Italian flag, a different 3rd colour. If people want to get offended, that's on them
Ah the old Green, White and Gold. The Irish mans way of really denying the true background of our Flag! :(
Eh?
Well it's orange not gold. Orange for a reason.
Quote from: From the Bunker on August 19, 2024, 05:28:46 PMQuote from: ardtole on August 19, 2024, 05:22:46 PMHow the hell can goal nets be offensive. Considering some towns and villages throughout the north are plastered in red, white and blue and very little said about it.
If a Soccer or Rugby pitch had a Union Jack on it's nets (in Ireland) would it bother you? You'd look with distain? I would!
There's a few other local clubs have their nets in the club colours so it's not like St Paul's decided out of the blue to try and make some statement.
Quote from: JoG2 on August 19, 2024, 05:23:00 PMGreen white and gold, might as well be the Italian flag, a different 3rd colour. If people want to get offended, that's on them
They got offended by the Italian flag at the primary school in Tyrone, don't forget.
Quote from: Itchy on August 19, 2024, 05:46:00 PMQuote from: JoG2 on August 19, 2024, 05:31:33 PMQuote from: From the Bunker on August 19, 2024, 05:26:29 PMQuote from: JoG2 on August 19, 2024, 05:23:00 PMGreen white and gold, might as well be the Italian flag, a different 3rd colour. If people want to get offended, that's on them
Ah the old Green, White and Gold. The Irish mans way of really denying the true background of our Flag! :(
Eh?
Well it's orange not gold. Orange for a reason.
exactly. The club and county mentioned above, green, white and orange ain't their colours
Quote from: From the Bunker on August 19, 2024, 05:36:06 PMQuote from: balladmaker on August 19, 2024, 05:32:48 PMQuote from: From the Bunker on August 19, 2024, 05:28:46 PMQuote from: ardtole on August 19, 2024, 05:22:46 PMHow the hell can goal nets be offensive. Considering some towns and villages throughout the north are plastered in red, white and blue and very little said about it.
If a Soccer or Rugby pitch had a Union Jack on it's nets (in Ireland) would it bother you? You'd look with distain? I would!
To be honest, I wouldn't give a damn! If you want to be offended, you'll be offended, personally, I'd laugh at it and move on.
I don't know. It's wouldn't say to me - Bring your kids to this club. Flags as much as we love them can hold so much back.
Is this a serious debate? My club has "inoffensive " colours . We drove several miles to purchase coloured nets because they look far more professional , and in keeping with the positive PR imagery of visible club colours wherever possible . We will not be going back to white nets and neither have any other clubs I know. They look good , and are nothing to do with politics . St Paul's is a stunning ground and coloured nets are in keeping with their impressive club imagery . The ridiculous suggestion that St Paul's purchased coloured nets for political provocation in the middle of technaven estate in Lurgan , doesn't warrant any further discussion.
The club colours aren't green white and orange? They're
And their town neighbours Clanns have blue and white as seen on tg4 yesterday I'm nearly sure
Quote from: 6th sam on August 19, 2024, 07:16:45 PMQuote from: From the Bunker on August 19, 2024, 05:36:06 PMQuote from: balladmaker on August 19, 2024, 05:32:48 PMQuote from: From the Bunker on August 19, 2024, 05:28:46 PMQuote from: ardtole on August 19, 2024, 05:22:46 PMHow the hell can goal nets be offensive. Considering some towns and villages throughout the north are plastered in red, white and blue and very little said about it.
If a Soccer or Rugby pitch had a Union Jack on it's nets (in Ireland) would it bother you? You'd look with distain? I would!
To be honest, I wouldn't give a damn! If you want to be offended, you'll be offended, personally, I'd laugh at it and move on.
I don't know. It's wouldn't say to me - Bring your kids to this club. Flags as much as we love them can hold so much back.
Is this a serious debate? My club has "inoffensive " colours . We drove several miles to purchase coloured nets because they look far more professional , and in keeping with the positive PR imagery of visible club colours wherever possible . We will not be going back to white nets and neither have any other clubs I know. They look good , and are nothing to do with politics . St Paul's is a stunning ground and coloured nets are in keeping with their impressive club imagery . The ridiculous suggestion that St Paul's purchased coloured nets for political provocation in the middle of technaven estate in Lurgan , doesn't warrant any further discussion.
Spot on. One of the best surfaces in the country as well- and the nets look the part too.
Quote from: From the Bunker on August 19, 2024, 05:02:48 PMQuote from: balladmaker on August 19, 2024, 04:43:27 PMI always remember Doug Beattie's performance on the Nolan show when the St. Paul's GAA club in Lurgan had the audacity to install goal netting in their club colours i.e. green, white and gold (just like Offaly) ... Doug cited it as sectarian and provocative ... a leopard doesn't change its spots, bigotry was never far from the service with Mr. Beattie.
To be fair
How many clubs put the Club colours on their nets?
How many clubs have the tri-colour as their colours?
It is pugnacity, but you can understand how they would see this as provocative action.
He jumped the gun on thy one and made an assumption. He'd have been well
advised to actually check why those nets up
Quote from: 6th sam on August 19, 2024, 07:16:45 PMQuote from: From the Bunker on August 19, 2024, 05:36:06 PMQuote from: balladmaker on August 19, 2024, 05:32:48 PMQuote from: From the Bunker on August 19, 2024, 05:28:46 PMQuote from: ardtole on August 19, 2024, 05:22:46 PMHow the hell can goal nets be offensive. Considering some towns and villages throughout the north are plastered in red, white and blue and very little said about it.
If a Soccer or Rugby pitch had a Union Jack on it's nets (in Ireland) would it bother you? You'd look with distain? I would!
To be honest, I wouldn't give a damn! If you want to be offended, you'll be offended, personally, I'd laugh at it and move on.
I don't know. It's wouldn't say to me - Bring your kids to this club. Flags as much as we love them can hold so much back.
Is this a serious debate? My club has "inoffensive " colours . We drove several miles to purchase coloured nets because they look far more professional , and in keeping with the positive PR imagery of visible club colours wherever possible . We will not be going back to white nets and neither have any other clubs I know. They look good , and are nothing to do with politics . St Paul's is a stunning ground and coloured nets are in keeping with their impressive club imagery . The ridiculous suggestion that St Paul's purchased coloured nets for political provocation in the middle of technaven estate in Lurgan , doesn't warrant any further discussion.
I wouldn't class it as the middle of an estate. One of the nets is right beside a road which is very close to Mourneview.
Have DUPUDA and TUV sent in their complaints yet?
https://www.gaa.ie/article/gaa-representatives-meet-psni-chief-constable
Quote from: Rossfan on August 30, 2024, 01:14:45 PMHave DUPUDA and TUV sent in their complaints yet?
https://www.gaa.ie/article/gaa-representatives-meet-psni-chief-constable
And while they're at it, how about this?
https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/courts/orange-order-chief-provides-character-reference-for-top-loyalist-accused-of-inciting-religious-hatred-court-told/a579803475.html
Quote from: Orior on August 30, 2024, 02:29:04 PMQuote from: Rossfan on August 30, 2024, 01:14:45 PMHave DUPUDA and TUV sent in their complaints yet?
https://www.gaa.ie/article/gaa-representatives-meet-psni-chief-constable
And while they're at it, how about this?
https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/courts/orange-order-chief-provides-character-reference-for-top-loyalist-accused-of-inciting-religious-hatred-court-told/a579803475.html
The amount of ironies in that one beats the band.
Stitt sends a facebook post calling Loyalists to rise up and defeat the spread of evil Islam. Meanwhile he got his own shining white chompers done in Turkey, a muslim country. Old Whiskey Nose then comes to give Turkey Teeth a character reference. And to cap it all off, his solicitor John Larkin who Bryson, Allister and unionists have been using to get rid of EU law in North is claiming UK law should not apply to Turkey teeth because he was out sunning himself for six weeks in Spain when he sent the facebook post.
They are some shower.
And I see the Orange Order upset because a Council (Ards and whatever?) wouldn't let them have an "Orange victims day" in a Council Park.
Does anyone know what Ian Og is doing at the moment to put aran on his tabla?
Quote from: Dougal Maguire on August 30, 2024, 04:19:22 PMDoes anyone know what Ian Og is doing at the moment to put aran on his tabla?
He'll be ok another wee while. MPs that lose their seat get 4 months worth of pay after they're ousted.
Quote from: Dougal Maguire on August 30, 2024, 04:19:22 PMDoes anyone know what Ian Og is doing at the moment to put aran on his tabla?
(https://images.nightcafe.studio/jobs/TbLOgilpcLtY4wUF7xYR/TbLOgilpcLtY4wUF7xYR--1--dkyyn.jpg?tr=w-600,c-at_max)
Quote from: weareros on August 30, 2024, 03:42:30 PMQuote from: Orior on August 30, 2024, 02:29:04 PMQuote from: Rossfan on August 30, 2024, 01:14:45 PMHave DUPUDA and TUV sent in their complaints yet?
https://www.gaa.ie/article/gaa-representatives-meet-psni-chief-constable
And while they're at it, how about this?
https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/courts/orange-order-chief-provides-character-reference-for-top-loyalist-accused-of-inciting-religious-hatred-court-told/a579803475.html
The amount of ironies in that one beats the band.
Stitt sends a facebook post calling Loyalists to rise up and defeat the spread of evil Islam. Meanwhile he got his own shining white chompers done in Turkey, a muslim country. Old Whiskey Nose then comes to give Turkey Teeth a character reference. And to cap it all off, his solicitor John Larkin who Bryson, Allister and unionists have been using to get rid of EU law in North is claiming UK law should not apply to Turkey teeth because he was out sunning himself for six weeks in Spain when he sent the facebook post.
They are some shower.
Just the 6 week holiday!
Jeffrey pleads not guilty, court case next March
BBC (https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c5ydzxw3w5po)
Quote from: armaghniac on September 10, 2024, 11:33:02 AMJeffrey pleads not guilty, court case next March
BBC (https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c5ydzxw3w5po)
That's Sir Jeffrey to you...
Strange that a lot of news outlets have dropped the Sir moniker.
18 charges he faces.
As with all of these historical cases, they are going to be hard to prove.
The fact he is entering not guilty means they are obviously going to contest everything, going to get messy.
Quote from: NAG1 on September 10, 2024, 12:50:09 PMAs with all of these historical cases, they are going to be hard to prove.
The fact he is entering not guilty means they are obviously going to contest everything, going to get messy.
Criminal prosecutions require proof beyond reasonable doubt. I cannot see how many of these historical cases could be proven beyond reasonable doubt, it is a high standard of proof.
;D
https://m.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/politics/baroness-for-hire-arlene-foster-is-asking-for-10000-a-day-to-advise-firms-on-green-energy/a1955623953.html
Quote from: Rossfan on September 28, 2024, 10:09:08 AM;D
https://m.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/politics/baroness-for-hire-arlene-foster-is-asking-for-10000-a-day-to-advise-firms-on-green-energy/a1955623953.html
Who in the name of God is paying her for that?
Quote from: armaghniac on September 10, 2024, 01:43:53 PMQuote from: NAG1 on September 10, 2024, 12:50:09 PMAs with all of these historical cases, they are going to be hard to prove.
The fact he is entering not guilty means they are obviously going to contest everything, going to get messy.
Criminal prosecutions require proof beyond reasonable doubt. I cannot see how many of these historical cases could be proven beyond reasonable doubt, it is a high standard of proof.
Never understand how any historical case is won, unless there are impartial witnesses or video evidence.
Although an evil murderer, don't even recall if there was much evidence against Robert Black for the Cardy murder.
Quote from: RedHand88 on September 28, 2024, 10:51:02 AMQuote from: Rossfan on September 28, 2024, 10:09:08 AM;D
https://m.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/politics/baroness-for-hire-arlene-foster-is-asking-for-10000-a-day-to-advise-firms-on-green-energy/a1955623953.html
Who in the name of God is paying her for that?
Fools
Quote from: JoG2 on September 28, 2024, 02:31:11 PMQuote from: RedHand88 on September 28, 2024, 10:51:02 AMQuote from: Rossfan on September 28, 2024, 10:09:08 AM;D
https://m.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/politics/baroness-for-hire-arlene-foster-is-asking-for-10000-a-day-to-advise-firms-on-green-energy/a1955623953.html
Who in the name of God is paying her for that?
Fools
Expert status on RHI and burning money !
Serious coin to be made as an ex politician. The ££ fools like Johnson and Truss can make is crazy
You couldnt redden that bastard's neck with a blowtorch.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c75l7x7ll9ro
Quote from: Aristo 60 on November 01, 2024, 04:54:11 PMhttps://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c75l7x7ll9ro
giving Da a ring
https://www.newsletter.co.uk/news/crime/former-dup-councillor-luke-poots-convicted-of-driving-tractor-on-the-a1-while-on-the-phone-to-his-father-edwin-poots-4849878
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/czxrj1vrxn8o (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/czxrj1vrxn8o)
I see a former Johnnies footballer is getting it in the ear for suggesting that "team NI" shouldn't be represented by the Ulster Banner anymore.
He fancied himself as a bit of a hurler too but wasn't great at it.
Any word on what Ian Og is up to these days, been very quiet.
Quote from: Hereiam on November 29, 2024, 04:04:05 PMAny word on what Ian Og is up to these days, been very quiet.
Trying to follow Arlene's footsteps:
https://x.com/gbnews/status/1861689166511153624?s=46&t=upCstAqzkTQY5JtOIziaYg
Quote from: weareros on November 29, 2024, 04:28:59 PMQuote from: Hereiam on November 29, 2024, 04:04:05 PMAny word on what Ian Og is up to these days, been very quiet.
Trying to follow Arlene's footsteps:
https://x.com/gbnews/status/1861689166511153624?s=46&t=upCstAqzkTQY5JtOIziaYg
He's probably also touting himself as a friend of Trump and hoping it leads to something.
https://www.newsletter.co.uk/news/people/ulsters-marching-bands-praised-as-grants-for-musical-instruments-are-handed-out-4906814
Looking out for themselves as usual....
Gallsman made a point in the Casement thread that many of "them" don't like "us" to get anything.
It appears that works both ways.
Quote from: LC on December 13, 2024, 08:26:37 AMhttps://www.newsletter.co.uk/news/people/ulsters-marching-bands-praised-as-grants-for-musical-instruments-are-handed-out-4906814
Looking out for themselves as usual....
Don't see much wrong here unless you know something more... #usuns #themmuns
.... "There is a superb range of recipients this year, from marching bands and school groups to traditional musicians and musical societies and I hope this grant will support and inspire the next generation of musical talent across the genres..."
Quote from: LC on December 13, 2024, 08:26:37 AMhttps://www.newsletter.co.uk/news/people/ulsters-marching-bands-praised-as-grants-for-musical-instruments-are-handed-out-4906814
Looking out for themselves as usual....
That's the attitude that'll unite us! ;D
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c390914zkd9o
Disappointing but at the same time not surprising.
Parents and Principal both supported the move to integration yet the Minister believes he knows best.
Quote from: LC on January 08, 2025, 02:05:28 PMhttps://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c390914zkd9o
Disappointing but at the same time not surprising.
Parents and Principal both supported the move to integration yet the Minister believes he knows best.
Big new school buildings there and looking like they're struggling to get bums on seats.
St Columbanus would have felt the squeeze if they'd gotten the go-ahead, but Givans rejection tells you all you need to know about where his heads at.
Quote from: johnnycool on January 08, 2025, 02:32:39 PMQuote from: LC on January 08, 2025, 02:05:28 PMhttps://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c390914zkd9o
Disappointing but at the same time not surprising.
Parents and Principal both supported the move to integration yet the Minister believes he knows best.
Big new school buildings there and looking like they're struggling to get bums on seats.
St Columbanus would have felt the squeeze if they'd gotten the go-ahead, but Givans rejection tells you all you need to know about where his heads at.
He may have a point though, the "integrated" school might still be much the same, I doubt if they would be impactful on the MacRory Cup.
Quote from: armaghniac on January 08, 2025, 03:20:40 PMQuote from: johnnycool on January 08, 2025, 02:32:39 PMQuote from: LC on January 08, 2025, 02:05:28 PMhttps://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c390914zkd9o
Disappointing but at the same time not surprising.
Parents and Principal both supported the move to integration yet the Minister believes he knows best.
Big new school buildings there and looking like they're struggling to get bums on seats.
St Columbanus would have felt the squeeze if they'd gotten the go-ahead, but Givans rejection tells you all you need to know about where his heads at.
He may have a point though, the "integrated" school might still be much the same, I doubt if they would be impactful on the MacRory Cup.
Fúck McCrory cups, Mageean Cups are more important ;)
There is a substantial catholic population in the North Down area mostly serviced by OLSPK as the main selective Grammar which has a very high bar in terms of selection and the non selective St Columbanus College, so there might be demand in there for a Grammar school which can take the run off from OLSPK.
I kinda agree also on one point that if these schools want to go integrated they need to do so in a meaningful way, offer Irish language, Gaelic games etc etc and not just lip service.
Quote from: johnnycool on January 08, 2025, 04:25:13 PMQuote from: armaghniac on January 08, 2025, 03:20:40 PMQuote from: johnnycool on January 08, 2025, 02:32:39 PMQuote from: LC on January 08, 2025, 02:05:28 PMhttps://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c390914zkd9o
Disappointing but at the same time not surprising.
Parents and Principal both supported the move to integration yet the Minister believes he knows best.
Big new school buildings there and looking like they're struggling to get bums on seats.
St Columbanus would have felt the squeeze if they'd gotten the go-ahead, but Givans rejection tells you all you need to know about where his heads at.
He may have a point though, the "integrated" school might still be much the same, I doubt if they would be impactful on the MacRory Cup.
Fúck McCrory cups, Mageean Cups are more important ;)
There is a substantial catholic population in the North Down area mostly serviced by OLSPK as the main selective Grammar which has a very high bar in terms of selection and the non selective St Columbanus College, so there might be demand in there for a Grammar school which can take the run off from OLSPK.
I kinda agree also on one point that if these schools want to go integrated they need to do so in a meaningful way, offer Irish language, Gaelic games etc etc and not just lip service.
I've had some first hand experience of Integrated schools in the primary sector. Very much a one sided affair in my experience with no Gaelic, no Irish etc. Even parental complaints, upheld by the school, when a teacher showed up in a Gaelic jersey for a sponsored walk. So much for acceptance and respect for all in an integrated society eh?
Integrated education in theory is brilliant - in practice its not there imo.
We removed our kids from the school at the time as it was very much favouring one side of the community in terms of staffing, teaching and tolerance.
I was actually on the Board of Governors and Mrs. Tbrick was a teacher in the school - the stories I could tell!
And i have to met this non biased person, in a few weeks time!!
Speaking of providing Gaelic Games in schools, why is that school in Dundalk (or was it Drogheda?) only allowing Gaelic Games now?
And wasn't this the same school where students have been protesting for months about this?
What's the story? Is this a protestant school or what?
Both primary and secondary schools I went to only played GAA, no other sport was played, we would have had a decent soccer team at the time but we weren't allowed!
Quote from: AustinPowers on January 08, 2025, 06:04:50 PMSpeaking of providing Gaelic Games in schools, why is that school in Dundalk (or was it Drogheda?) only allowing Gaelic Games now?
And wasn't this the same school where students have been protesting for months about this?
What's the story? Is this a protestant school or what?
Sport in schools requires volunteers to take sport lessons. Maybe the teaching community doesn't have rugby of soccer coaches.
Well, why have ulster teams hardly any hurling teams, you need the right people in place to push it.
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on January 08, 2025, 06:48:02 PMBoth primary and secondary schools I went to only played GAA, no other sport was played, we would have had a decent soccer team at the time but we weren't allowed!
That isn't right either.
I've told this story before about an integrated PS school in our locality which was previously a state school but due to dwindling numbers went integrated.
We sent flyers into the school as we were running a fundamentals block in conjunction with a KS1 Ulster Council coach and asked the Principal if they'd give them to the kids to take home.
Not one kid received any flyer from us yet the scouts etc etc were regularly sent out with the kids. We know this as we've some kids from the club at the school in question.
That has kinda tainted my feelings on integrated education, well intentioned but the reality doesn't necessarily match that.
There may be exceptions to that and the likes of Lagan College would have a better reputation as it was probably an entirely new school built out in the sticks.
Not sure if the figure is still accurate but I think up until recently only 7% of the children in the North of Ireland were in official Integrated education.
Quote from: DownFanatic on January 09, 2025, 09:10:52 AMNot sure if the figure is still accurate but I think up until recently only 7% of the children in the North of Ireland were in official Integrated education.
Would be about right I'd say. 2 of my kids went to an integrated primary school but the reality is that it was probably 65% Catholic and that kept rising. School and teachers were good, they had the coaches in from Down GAA, I did an about on a volunteer basis doing football and basketball. Thing is it was always known locally as the 'Protestant' school. No matter what.
Moved when they were in P5 and P7 to CCMS school. Have to say the level of teaching went up a notch. That may just be school relative but was the right decision for them.
Integrated though is the way forward but the investment has to happen
Quote from: tbrick18 on January 08, 2025, 05:11:16 PMQuote from: johnnycool on January 08, 2025, 04:25:13 PMQuote from: armaghniac on January 08, 2025, 03:20:40 PMQuote from: johnnycool on January 08, 2025, 02:32:39 PMQuote from: LC on January 08, 2025, 02:05:28 PMhttps://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c390914zkd9o
Disappointing but at the same time not surprising.
Parents and Principal both supported the move to integration yet the Minister believes he knows best.
Big new school buildings there and looking like they're struggling to get bums on seats.
St Columbanus would have felt the squeeze if they'd gotten the go-ahead, but Givans rejection tells you all you need to know about where his heads at.
He may have a point though, the "integrated" school might still be much the same, I doubt if they would be impactful on the MacRory Cup.
Fúck McCrory cups, Mageean Cups are more important ;)
There is a substantial catholic population in the North Down area mostly serviced by OLSPK as the main selective Grammar which has a very high bar in terms of selection and the non selective St Columbanus College, so there might be demand in there for a Grammar school which can take the run off from OLSPK.
I kinda agree also on one point that if these schools want to go integrated they need to do so in a meaningful way, offer Irish language, Gaelic games etc etc and not just lip service.
I've had some first hand experience of Integrated schools in the primary sector. Very much a one sided affair in my experience with no Gaelic, no Irish etc. Even parental complaints, upheld by the school, when a teacher showed up in a Gaelic jersey for a sponsored walk. So much for acceptance and respect for all in an integrated society eh?
Integrated education in theory is brilliant - in practice its not there imo.
We removed our kids from the school at the time as it was very much favouring one side of the community in terms of staffing, teaching and tolerance.
I was actually on the Board of Governors and Mrs. Tbrick was a teacher in the school - the stories I could tell!
Don't stop there man for God sake!
I see Givan's decision and of course nothing would surprise you with the DUP.
I'm naive on a lot of this, but if the school wants to act like an integrated school I assume that it can do so anyway? Or is there restrictions based on funding and curriculum?
You need approval to go integrated status. For what it's worth, some maintained schools find it near impossible to go integrated by ccms/parishes. So he's not the only one who's blocks these. Find it strange Bangor Academy decided to go Integrated, but more open thinking maybe, there some big schools in Belfast would be in a better position to go this route.
Was it not a very small number of Catholics, less than 10%? I'm not sure you could class that as integrated if it had went ahead.
Edit - in 2022/23 their enrolment was 1835 enrolled, 1084 Protestant, 54 Catholic & 697 "other".
"Pupils recorded as not belonging to either of the two main traditions are classed as 'other' and not included in the consideration of religious balance."
Technically Integrated should cover other, but over here ,they focus solely on Protestant and Catholic intake with other category, attending both non-maintained and maintained.
It's 40-40-20 with the 20 being other which is a bugbear of mine tbh. Integrated education but you still need that tickbox. We have ours in integrated and it's grand though there isn't much GAA about but he gets plenty of that at the club anyway.
In the medium to long term integrated education further diminishes Unionism as it depends on a hard core and segregation to survive. It's in the DUP's interests to say No. Nothing new or unsurprising about that.
Quote from: 93-DY-SAM on January 09, 2025, 10:56:04 AMIn the medium to long term integrated education further diminishes Unionism as it depends on a hard core and segregation to survive. It's in the DUP's interests to say No. Nothing new or unsurprising about that.
The Catholic church will also hold onto their lofty CCMS position as well, so there's that as well.
Quote from: johnnycool on January 09, 2025, 12:07:14 PMQuote from: 93-DY-SAM on January 09, 2025, 10:56:04 AMIn the medium to long term integrated education further diminishes Unionism as it depends on a hard core and segregation to survive. It's in the DUP's interests to say No. Nothing new or unsurprising about that.
The Catholic church will also hold onto their lofty CCMS position as well, so there's that as well.
CCMS was formed in 1989 in response to the pitiful state of the maintained sector in terms outcomes for young people and school buildings. The Maintained sector is now the highest achieving sector by outcomes. So much so, that Mr.Girvan wants a replica body established for the controlled sector to raise standards and outcomes.
Quote from: Delgany 2nds on January 09, 2025, 06:17:09 PMQuote from: johnnycool on January 09, 2025, 12:07:14 PMQuote from: 93-DY-SAM on January 09, 2025, 10:56:04 AMIn the medium to long term integrated education further diminishes Unionism as it depends on a hard core and segregation to survive. It's in the DUP's interests to say No. Nothing new or unsurprising about that.
The Catholic church will also hold onto their lofty CCMS position as well, so there's that as well.
CCMS was formed in 1989 in response to the pitiful state of the maintained sector in terms outcomes for young people and school building. The Maintained sector is now the highest achieving sector by outcomes. So much so, that Mr.Girvan wants a replica body established fir the controlled sector to raise standards and outcomes.
He will have his work cut out.
Worked a 20 years ago with those would describe themselves as middle class unionists. The thought of their children going to the local high school in the likes of Ballyclare / Bangor / Newtownabbey / Newtownards / Carrickfergus was just unthinkable, it was simply not an option. I'm sure things have not changed.
Yes there might be a bit of snobbery in the nationalist side but gulf in academic standards between grammar and high school on all fronts is nowhere near as much.
The problem with CCMS, and I had dealings with them, they shortsighted. They rather see a school close than become integrated, that doesnt make sense. Worse run is DE, I can't get over how badly it's run, and I not get started about my own outfit EA.
Quote from: Wildweasel74 on January 09, 2025, 06:33:51 PMThe problem with CCMS, and I had dealings with them, they shortsighted. They rather see a school close than become integrated, that doesnt make sense. Worse run is DE, I can't get over how badly it's run, and I not get started about my own outfit EA.
It takes CCMS, DE and EA to run schools in NI? We really are a bureaucrat/bluffers paradise. And that's just for the catholic side!
Quote from: LC on January 09, 2025, 06:28:42 PMQuote from: Delgany 2nds on January 09, 2025, 06:17:09 PMQuote from: johnnycool on January 09, 2025, 12:07:14 PMQuote from: 93-DY-SAM on January 09, 2025, 10:56:04 AMIn the medium to long term integrated education further diminishes Unionism as it depends on a hard core and segregation to survive. It's in the DUP's interests to say No. Nothing new or unsurprising about that.
The Catholic church will also hold onto their lofty CCMS position as well, so there's that as well.
CCMS was formed in 1989 in response to the pitiful state of the maintained sector in terms outcomes for young people and school building. The Maintained sector is now the highest achieving sector by outcomes. So much so, that Mr.Girvan wants a replica body established fir the controlled sector to raise standards and outcomes.
He will have his work cut out.
Worked a 20 years ago with those would describe themselves as middle class unionists. The thought of their children going to the local high school in the likes of Ballyclare / Bangor / Newtownabbey / Newtownards / Carrickfergus was just unthinkable, it was simply not an option. I'm sure things have not changed.
Yes there might be a bit of snobbery in the nationalist side but gulf in academic standards between grammar and high school on all fronts is nowhere near as much.
On average there is a 20% difference in attaining 5 GCSE grades A- C including Maths & English between Grammar (90%+) & Secondary Schools(70%+)
Quote from: LC on January 09, 2025, 06:28:42 PMQuote from: Delgany 2nds on January 09, 2025, 06:17:09 PMQuote from: johnnycool on January 09, 2025, 12:07:14 PMQuote from: 93-DY-SAM on January 09, 2025, 10:56:04 AMIn the medium to long term integrated education further diminishes Unionism as it depends on a hard core and segregation to survive. It's in the DUP's interests to say No. Nothing new or unsurprising about that.
The Catholic church will also hold onto their lofty CCMS position as well, so there's that as well.
CCMS was formed in 1989 in response to the pitiful state of the maintained sector in terms outcomes for young people and school building. The Maintained sector is now the highest achieving sector by outcomes. So much so, that Mr.Girvan wants a replica body established fir the controlled sector to raise standards and outcomes.
He will have his work cut out.
Worked a 20 years ago with those would describe themselves as middle class unionists. The thought of their children going to the local high school in the likes of Ballyclare / Bangor / Newtownabbey / Newtownards / Carrickfergus was just unthinkable, it was simply not an option. I'm sure things have not changed.
Yes there might be a bit of snobbery in the nationalist side but gulf in academic standards between grammar and high school on all fronts is nowhere near as much.
The local high school in Ballyclare is decent for secondary school level.. but Newtownabbey secondary schools wouldn't be great, though some are having lower and upper 6 year classes.
Carrickfergus is awful, I would have taught a load when I was in the local tech, not sure on Ards/Bangor but think they are some better ones.
If you can't pay for them to go grammar you're stuck! It's a right few quid to force your child to go to a school that academic wise, is above their station!
Quote from: Wildweasel74 on January 09, 2025, 06:33:51 PMThe problem with CCMS, and I had dealings with them, they shortsighted. They rather see a school close than become integrated, that doesnt make sense. Worse run is DE, I can't get over how badly it's run, and I not get started about my own outfit EA.
The worst decision the DE made was rationalising the five education & library boards into the EA. It is a complete shitshow ! It is similar to the supercouncils costing just as much as old system!
Do you have to pay to go to those "grammar schools"?
Quote from: Delgany 2nds on January 09, 2025, 07:52:27 PMQuote from: Wildweasel74 on January 09, 2025, 06:33:51 PMThe problem with CCMS, and I had dealings with them, they shortsighted. They rather see a school close than become integrated, that doesnt make sense. Worse run is DE, I can't get over how badly it's run, and I not get started about my own outfit EA.
The worst decision the DE made was rationalising the five education & library boards into the EA. It is a complete shitshow ! It is similar to the supercouncils costing just as much as old system!
Rationalisation in the public sector rarely means a reduction in overheads and/or an increase in productivity. I have a brother in law who works in the EA and he wonders how many of them put the day in.
Quote from: Rossfan on January 09, 2025, 08:12:45 PMDo you have to pay to go to those "grammar schools"?
No, there were some prep schools that allowed you to go to at primary level which gave you entry to that grammar that it was associated too
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on January 09, 2025, 09:26:40 PMQuote from: Rossfan on January 09, 2025, 08:12:45 PMDo you have to pay to go to those "grammar schools"?
No, there were some prep schools that allowed you to go to at primary level which gave you entry to that grammar that it was associated too
The big prep schools aren't free. Inchmarlo, Campbell, Victoria College etc. are all about 5 grand a year.
Quote from: Rossfan on January 09, 2025, 08:12:45 PMDo you have to pay to go to those "grammar schools"?
As far as I am aware, no Catholic grammar school has fees in general, other the the usual "contributions" from time to time. Many of the Protestant grammar schools are fee paying. As noted above the Catholic ones are less socially exclusive, although they do have academic selection.
We paid 65 quid a year...
Campbell College was 2k a year 15yrs ago, not sure what it is now
Quote from: Tony Baloney on January 09, 2025, 09:34:41 PMQuote from: Milltown Row2 on January 09, 2025, 09:26:40 PMQuote from: Rossfan on January 09, 2025, 08:12:45 PMDo you have to pay to go to those "grammar schools"?
No, there were some prep schools that allowed you to go to at primary level which gave you entry to that grammar that it was associated too
The big prep schools aren't free. Inchmarlo, Campbell, Victoria College etc. are all about 5 grand a year.
I meant not paying private to all grammars only those that had prep.
Though as said above Campbell do charge
Anybody of half decent ability in Newtownabbey would go to Hazelwood College.
Quote from: Wildweasel74 on January 09, 2025, 09:44:56 PMAnybody of half decent ability in Newtownabbey would go to Hazelwood College.
Possibly, I never looked at it at the time, I was hoping my daughters would end up at the local grammar.
Hazelwood quite a good school but the integrated bit confused me,when past pupils like Andre Shoukri still ended up so sectarianised.
Quote from: Tony Baloney on January 09, 2025, 08:34:37 PMQuote from: Delgany 2nds on January 09, 2025, 07:52:27 PMQuote from: Wildweasel74 on January 09, 2025, 06:33:51 PMThe problem with CCMS, and I had dealings with them, they shortsighted. They rather see a school close than become integrated, that doesnt make sense. Worse run is DE, I can't get over how badly it's run, and I not get started about my own outfit EA.
The worst decision the DE made was rationalising the five education & library boards into the EA. It is a complete shitshow ! It is similar to the supercouncils costing just as much as old system!
Rationalisation in the public sector rarely means a reduction in overheads and/or an increase in productivity. I have a brother in law who works in the EA and he wonders how many of them put the day in.
Missus is a teacher, and I cannot wrap my head around how inept the general working practices in the education system are.
For instance, why is every teacher around the country having to spend time creating their own resources?
Surely its not beyond the wit of even civil servants to have one highly skilled group in the EA create top-class resources for all... and both ensure quality and reduce overall time spent across every school doing resource creation.
After all, its meant to be the one curriculum.
Although perhaps the difficulty is finding highly skilled people within the EA....
Quote from: Wildweasel74 on January 10, 2025, 01:36:39 AMHazelwood quite a good school but the integrated bit confused me,then past pupils like Andre Shoukri still ended up so sectarianised.
Some people are just bad and he would fit into that category. I would almost have him down as more a gangster than sectarian. I doubt it would have mattered if he'd went to a catholic school never mind an integrated one.
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on January 09, 2025, 09:41:16 PMQuote from: Tony Baloney on January 09, 2025, 09:34:41 PMQuote from: Milltown Row2 on January 09, 2025, 09:26:40 PMQuote from: Rossfan on January 09, 2025, 08:12:45 PMDo you have to pay to go to those "grammar schools"?
No, there were some prep schools that allowed you to go to at primary level which gave you entry to that grammar that it was associated too
The big prep schools aren't free. Inchmarlo, Campbell, Victoria College etc. are all about 5 grand a year.
I meant not paying private to all grammars only those that had prep.
Though as said above Campbell do charge
I was once told by a Regent House illumni that Campbell college would enroll a donkey if they paid the fees..
There is definitely a load of snobbery within the PUL community in terms of the Grammar/secondary split and you really couldn't see the likes of a St Pats, Maghera, St Ronans in Lurgan or the new Lecale Trinity in Downpatrick getting off the ground in the likes of Newtownards for example.
Quote from: johnnycool on January 10, 2025, 09:45:41 AMQuote from: Milltown Row2 on January 09, 2025, 09:41:16 PMQuote from: Tony Baloney on January 09, 2025, 09:34:41 PMQuote from: Milltown Row2 on January 09, 2025, 09:26:40 PMQuote from: Rossfan on January 09, 2025, 08:12:45 PMDo you have to pay to go to those "grammar schools"?
No, there were some prep schools that allowed you to go to at primary level which gave you entry to that grammar that it was associated too
The big prep schools aren't free. Inchmarlo, Campbell, Victoria College etc. are all about 5 grand a year.
I meant not paying private to all grammars only those that had prep.
Though as said above Campbell do charge
I was once told by a Regent House illumni that Campbell college would enroll a donkey if they paid the fees..
There is definitely a load of snobbery within the PUL community in terms of the Grammar/secondary split and you really couldn't see the likes of a St Pats, Maghera, St Ronans in Lurgan or the new Lecale Trinity in Downpatrick getting off the ground in the likes of Newtownards for example.
I always felt there was a certain type of snobbery around places like the 'Convent' in Magherafelt and the 'College' in Newry. They just quietly thought they were a wee bit better.
Quote from: Sportacus on January 10, 2025, 09:48:37 AMQuote from: johnnycool on January 10, 2025, 09:45:41 AMQuote from: Milltown Row2 on January 09, 2025, 09:41:16 PMQuote from: Tony Baloney on January 09, 2025, 09:34:41 PMQuote from: Milltown Row2 on January 09, 2025, 09:26:40 PMQuote from: Rossfan on January 09, 2025, 08:12:45 PMDo you have to pay to go to those "grammar schools"?
No, there were some prep schools that allowed you to go to at primary level which gave you entry to that grammar that it was associated too
The big prep schools aren't free. Inchmarlo, Campbell, Victoria College etc. are all about 5 grand a year.
I meant not paying private to all grammars only those that had prep.
Though as said above Campbell do charge
I was once told by a Regent House illumni that Campbell college would enroll a donkey if they paid the fees..
There is definitely a load of snobbery within the PUL community in terms of the Grammar/secondary split and you really couldn't see the likes of a St Pats, Maghera, St Ronans in Lurgan or the new Lecale Trinity in Downpatrick getting off the ground in the likes of Newtownards for example.
I always felt there was a certain type of snobbery around places like the 'Convent' in Magherafelt and the 'College' in Newry. They just quietly thought they were a wee bit better.
Don't get me wrong I know plenty of parents of kids and past pupils from the Red High kicking up a stink about their kids having to mix with the dregs of the Flying Horse etc that would attend DelaSalle in the town, standards would drop but it still went ahead anyway.
There's no way in gods green earth the DUP or UUP would allow the same in Newtownards for instance.
Quote from: johnnycool on January 10, 2025, 09:45:41 AMI was once told by a Regent House illumni that Campbell college would enroll a donkey if they paid the fees..
There is definitely a load of snobbery within the PUL community in terms of the Grammar/secondary split
Campbell has never had a great reputation academically, at least not in my lifetime. A lot of the primarily Protestant grammars trade on their name and historical reputation that their academic performance doesn't come close to matching. Whether they ever were, or simply they were the schools of the elite, I've no idea. Methody, RBAI etc have fallen way behind.
Quote from: Sportacus on January 10, 2025, 09:48:37 AMI always felt there was a certain type of snobbery around places like the 'Convent' in Magherafelt and the 'College' in Newry. They just quietly thought they were a wee bit better.
Academically they were, but still had quite a few pupils getting free dinners. Their alumni became middle class but in the past not the families they came had modest backgrounds.
Hell I went to the convent, and I felt that about some pupils round me,
Quote from: Sportacus on January 10, 2025, 09:48:37 AMQuote from: johnnycool on January 10, 2025, 09:45:41 AMQuote from: Milltown Row2 on January 09, 2025, 09:41:16 PMQuote from: Tony Baloney on January 09, 2025, 09:34:41 PMQuote from: Milltown Row2 on January 09, 2025, 09:26:40 PMQuote from: Rossfan on January 09, 2025, 08:12:45 PMDo you have to pay to go to those "grammar schools"?
No, there were some prep schools that allowed you to go to at primary level which gave you entry to that grammar that it was associated too
The big prep schools aren't free. Inchmarlo, Campbell, Victoria College etc. are all about 5 grand a year.
I meant not paying private to all grammars only those that had prep.
Though as said above Campbell do charge
I was once told by a Regent House illumni that Campbell college would enroll a donkey if they paid the fees..
There is definitely a load of snobbery within the PUL community in terms of the Grammar/secondary split and you really couldn't see the likes of a St Pats, Maghera, St Ronans in Lurgan or the new Lecale Trinity in Downpatrick getting off the ground in the likes of Newtownards for example.
I always felt there was a certain type of snobbery around places like the 'Convent' in Magherafelt and the 'College' in Newry. They just quietly thought they were a wee bit better.
While running around Cookstown in the 90s if you ended up courting a girl from the Convent this definitely carried a out certain amount of kudos. They always seemed to be at a higher level than girls from other schools.
Kids get to grammar schools as they're bright and gifted.
I always thought being a grammar school teacher would be easy as the kids are bright and for the most part, well mannered etc.
They kids are going to get A and B's etc. regardless of who their teachers are.
I think a pupil getting an A say, is a great result for the teacher in a 'normal' school. Exceptions to this always but that's my take on it.
Quote from: marty34 on January 10, 2025, 12:52:49 PMKids get to grammar schools as they're bright and gifted.
I always thought being a grammar school teacher would be easy as the kids are bright and for the most part, well mannered etc.
They kids are going to get A and B's etc. regardless of who their teachers are.
I think a pupil getting an A say, is a great result for the teacher in a 'normal' school. Exceptions to this always but that's my take on it.
There are plenty of dunces/ bastards in grammar schools.
Quote from: 03,05,08 on January 10, 2025, 12:56:33 PMQuote from: marty34 on January 10, 2025, 12:52:49 PMKids get to grammar schools as they're bright and gifted.
I always thought being a grammar school teacher would be easy as the kids are bright and for the most part, well mannered etc.
They kids are going to get A and B's etc. regardless of who their teachers are.
I think a pupil getting an A say, is a great result for the teacher in a 'normal' school. Exceptions to this always but that's my take on it.
There are plenty of dunces/ bastards in grammar schools.
Leave the teachers out of it. 8)
Quote from: marty34 on January 10, 2025, 01:01:49 PMQuote from: 03,05,08 on January 10, 2025, 12:56:33 PMQuote from: marty34 on January 10, 2025, 12:52:49 PMKids get to grammar schools as they're bright and gifted.
I always thought being a grammar school teacher would be easy as the kids are bright and for the most part, well mannered etc.
They kids are going to get A and B's etc. regardless of who their teachers are.
I think a pupil getting an A say, is a great result for the teacher in a 'normal' school. Exceptions to this always but that's my take on it.
There are plenty of dunces/ bastards in grammar schools.
Leave the teachers out of it. 8)
Teachers within secondary and grammar schools have different levels of expectations and demands..
Lots of schools in secondary are streamed and have been even in my day, even more so now, so there will be ones doing well in the better classes and others in the lower grade won't be and rather than present a poor achieving school these lads (rightly in many cases) are put into areas that look after NVQ's and other like that, which are more achievable and set them up for working within the trade/retail/beauty and so on sectors.
This helps to 'cook the books' when looking at schools tables
Grammar schools parents expect wee johnny to have A*'s and enter them into subjects that they haven't ability for, plus the schools expect also so pressure is on to might unrealistic targets with pupils that were tutored flat out to pass a entry test to get there and haven't the ability to work for themselves
Some teachers are happy to work in secondary and others happy to work in the grammar
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on January 10, 2025, 01:47:03 PMQuote from: marty34 on January 10, 2025, 01:01:49 PMQuote from: 03,05,08 on January 10, 2025, 12:56:33 PMQuote from: marty34 on January 10, 2025, 12:52:49 PMKids get to grammar schools as they're bright and gifted.
I always thought being a grammar school teacher would be easy as the kids are bright and for the most part, well mannered etc.
They kids are going to get A and B's etc. regardless of who their teachers are.
I think a pupil getting an A say, is a great result for the teacher in a 'normal' school. Exceptions to this always but that's my take on it.
There are plenty of dunces/ bastards in grammar schools.
Leave the teachers out of it. 8)
Teachers within secondary and grammar schools have different levels of expectations and demands..
Lots of schools in secondary are streamed and have been even in my day, even more so now, so there will be ones doing well in the better classes and others in the lower grade won't be and rather than present a poor achieving school these lads (rightly in many cases) are put into areas that look after NVQ's and other like that, which are more achievable and set them up for working within the trade/retail/beauty and so on sectors.
This helps to 'cook the books' when looking at schools tables
Grammar schools parents expect wee johnny to have A*'s and enter them into subjects that they haven't ability for, plus the schools expect also so pressure is on to might unrealistic targets with pupils that were tutored flat out to pass a entry test to get there and haven't the ability to work for themselves
Some teachers are happy to work in secondary and others happy to work in the grammar
A lot of kids are tutored to the balls to get past a SEAG test, that's not a measure of intelligence, that's a measure of memory and resources.
Getting into a Grammar school isn't the panacea a lot of parents think it is. It's an opportunity and that's all.
I know loads of Grammar educated lads who're builders, painters, civil servants etc etc along with plenty of secondary school educated people with degrees.
Quote from: johnnycool on January 10, 2025, 02:12:56 PMQuote from: Milltown Row2 on January 10, 2025, 01:47:03 PMQuote from: marty34 on January 10, 2025, 01:01:49 PMQuote from: 03,05,08 on January 10, 2025, 12:56:33 PMQuote from: marty34 on January 10, 2025, 12:52:49 PMKids get to grammar schools as they're bright and gifted.
I always thought being a grammar school teacher would be easy as the kids are bright and for the most part, well mannered etc.
They kids are going to get A and B's etc. regardless of who their teachers are.
I think a pupil getting an A say, is a great result for the teacher in a 'normal' school. Exceptions to this always but that's my take on it.
There are plenty of dunces/ bastards in grammar schools.
Leave the teachers out of it. 8)
Teachers within secondary and grammar schools have different levels of expectations and demands..
Lots of schools in secondary are streamed and have been even in my day, even more so now, so there will be ones doing well in the better classes and others in the lower grade won't be and rather than present a poor achieving school these lads (rightly in many cases) are put into areas that look after NVQ's and other like that, which are more achievable and set them up for working within the trade/retail/beauty and so on sectors.
This helps to 'cook the books' when looking at schools tables
Grammar schools parents expect wee johnny to have A*'s and enter them into subjects that they haven't ability for, plus the schools expect also so pressure is on to might unrealistic targets with pupils that were tutored flat out to pass a entry test to get there and haven't the ability to work for themselves
Some teachers are happy to work in secondary and others happy to work in the grammar
A lot of kids are tutored to the balls to get past a SEAG test, that's not a measure of intelligence, that's a measure of memory and resources.
Getting into a Grammar school isn't the panacea a lot of parents think it is. It's an opportunity and that's all.
I know loads of Grammar educated lads who're builders, painters, civil servants etc etc along with plenty of secondary school educated people with degrees.
Would not be a big fan of the tutoring, if you need it to get your entrance exam then parent / child will feel the need to do likewise for GCSE and A-Levels. There will come a point when there is no safety net and what do they do then. For example if your child was tutored the whole way through school and they just about then scrape into something like Medicine there will come a point they will run out of road somewhere and will be out of their depth.
I would have agreed with you at a time but I had a daughter who struggled a bit for a while on a couple of areas in a subject.
Due to the big class size it was hard to get the one on one help she needed.
We arranged some short term tutoring and it worked really well.
Quote from: Deerstalker on January 10, 2025, 02:25:28 PMI would have agreed with you at a time but I had a daughter who struggled a bit for a while on a couple of areas in a subject.
Due to the big class size it was hard to get the one on one help she needed.
We arranged some short term tutoring and it worked really well.
A small nudge in the right direction can really help. Even if it just helps their confidence overall.
The transfer test is probably the worst for it though, my daughter was the only one doing the test at the time that didn't go to a tutor so we felt like we were in the wrong. She did a couple of sessions and to be fair to the woman taking it she said she didn't need to keep going.
Quote from: Deerstalker on January 10, 2025, 02:25:28 PMI would have agreed with you at a time but I had a daughter who struggled a bit for a while on a couple of areas in a subject.
Due to the big class size it was hard to get the one on one help she needed.
We arranged some short term tutoring and it worked really well.
Big class sizes are prevalent in most Grammar schools too.
I've a wee girl in OLSPK and she's in a class of 32 whereas her older brother was in a class of 26 when he started there 8 years previous.
bums on seats equals more funding.
Quote from: johnnycool on January 10, 2025, 02:59:31 PMQuote from: Deerstalker on January 10, 2025, 02:25:28 PMI would have agreed with you at a time but I had a daughter who struggled a bit for a while on a couple of areas in a subject.
Due to the big class size it was hard to get the one on one help she needed.
We arranged some short term tutoring and it worked really well.
Big class sizes are prevalent in most Grammar schools too.
I've a wee girl in OLSPK and she's in a class of 32 whereas her older brother was in a class of 26 when he started there 8 years previous.
bums on seats equals more funding.
Yes to clarify it was/is a grammar I am talking about, my point was more about tutoring
Quote from: clonian on January 10, 2025, 02:53:28 PMQuote from: Deerstalker on January 10, 2025, 02:25:28 PMI would have agreed with you at a time but I had a daughter who struggled a bit for a while on a couple of areas in a subject.
Due to the big class size it was hard to get the one on one help she needed.
We arranged some short term tutoring and it worked really well.
A small nudge in the right direction can really help. Even if it just helps their confidence overall.
The transfer test is probably the worst for it though, my daughter was the only one doing the test at the time that didn't go to a tutor so we felt like we were in the wrong. She did a couple of sessions and to be fair to the woman taking it she said she didn't need to keep going.
Yeah, son was doing transfer test and needed a bit of help with Maths. Got 5-6 sessions and was 100% and passed with flying colours. At the same time there were parents having their kids going to tutoring for months in P6 and then over the summer pre-P7. Was crazy!
Quote from: Wildweasel74 on January 09, 2025, 09:38:40 PMCampbell College was 2k a year 15yrs ago, not sure what it is now
It's £4k pa. The poshest school in NI is about a third the cost of a full time nursery place in Belfast, which is surprising. I was expecting at least £10k. I work with people in London and private school fees there can be 50k a year. It's mental. A lot of people in good jobs in London seem to think they have to send their kids to private schools too.
Went to a Grammar school as well and for our A Level maths we had a teacher (VP - who I really liked actually but he shouldn't have been a teacher anymore) who did zero preparation. He came in, lifted a textbook and did maybe 3 problems and half explained them and then set us a couple of problems for homework.
I wasn't happy about it and asked my parents about a tutor. Little did I know at the time that out of our class of 15, 8 of us were going to the same tutor!!!
The tutor really pulled us out of a tight spot.
Yeah that happened me at a grammar school. Nearly the whole class went to the same physics tutor at the same time (who also taught at the school - just not our class). Must have made a fortune!
I presume the "Should of" and "had went" posters didn't go to grammar schools?
While the DUP are rightly taking a kicking over the Bangor integration status , the lack of noise from other political parties
on the issue reconfirms that it suits Dup and SF and SDLP and UUP to have a divided school system despite the cost, societal damage and education short comings that arises from it.
It also suits a lot of folk who don't went their Timmy/Tomàs educated with the less well off - look at the drama over the past 10 years in Downpatrick as a case in point.
Quote from: Rossfan on January 10, 2025, 05:10:38 PMI presume the "Should of" and "had went" posters didn't go to grammar schools?
What a p***k.
Anyway back to the tutors. We got our eldest tutored as the p6 teacher was useless. We'd been warned before how bad she was and after a month we realised she was worser 🙂 (That's another issue. Teachers that are known to be shite and nothing done with them 😡).
She preached about how she wasn't there to prepare them for the test and that she wasn't covering it. Yet every other school in the local area were working towards it or doing an after school class. Sometimes needs must. Not all teachers are equal.
Quote from: trueblue1234 on January 10, 2025, 05:51:33 PMQuote from: Rossfan on January 10, 2025, 05:10:38 PMI presume the "Should of" and "had went" posters didn't go to grammar schools?
What a p***k.
Anyway back to the tutors. We got our eldest tutored as the p6 teacher was useless. We'd been warned before how bad she was and after a month we realised she was worser 🙂 (That's another issue. Teachers that are known to be shite and nothing done with them 😡).
She preached about how she wasn't there to prepare them for the test and that she wasn't covering it. Yet every other school in the local area were working towards it or doing an after school class. Sometimes needs must. Not all teachers are equal.
It was EA policy not to teach pupils specifically for the entrance exams as this was a bone of contention down here as one principal made it clear he wouldn't be doing so. Our local PS was more pragmatic and got a good few more pupils on the back of it.
As the years went by this was relaxed by the EA.
Quote from: johnnycool on January 10, 2025, 06:12:08 PMQuote from: trueblue1234 on January 10, 2025, 05:51:33 PMQuote from: Rossfan on January 10, 2025, 05:10:38 PMI presume the "Should of" and "had went" posters didn't go to grammar schools?
What a p***k.
Anyway back to the tutors. We got our eldest tutored as the p6 teacher was useless. We'd been warned before how bad she was and after a month we realised she was worser 🙂 (That's another issue. Teachers that are known to be shite and nothing done with them 😡).
She preached about how she wasn't there to prepare them for the test and that she wasn't covering it. Yet every other school in the local area were working towards it or doing an after school class. Sometimes needs must. Not all teachers are equal.
It was EA policy not to teach pupils specifically for the entrance exams as this was a bone of contention down here as one principal made it clear he wouldn't be doing so. Our local PS was more pragmatic and got a good few more pupils on the back of it.
As the years went by this was relaxed by the EA.
I know, but I think most schools certainly in our area either had the students doing couple of tests a week or doing an after school class. I'd say over 70% of the students doing the test got tutoring because of this.
Quote from: imtommygunn on January 10, 2025, 04:22:17 PMYeah that happened me at a grammar school. Nearly the whole class went to the same physics tutor at the same time (who also taught at the school - just not our class). Must have made a fortune!
Is it the fault of the teacher really?
Quote from: trueblue1234 on January 10, 2025, 05:51:33 PMQuote from: Rossfan on January 10, 2025, 05:10:38 PMI presume the "Should of" and "had went" posters didn't go to grammar schools?
What a p***k.
Anyway back to the tutors. We got our eldest tutored as the p6 teacher was useless. We'd been warned before how bad she was and after a month we realised she was worser 🙂 (That's another issue. Teachers that are known to be shite and nothing done with them 😡).
She preached about how she wasn't there to prepare them for the test and that she wasn't covering it. Yet every other school in the local area were working towards it or doing an after school class. Sometimes needs must. Not all teachers are equal.
Is that not the problem?
Teachers shouldn't be preparing kids for the transfer test. Is that their job?
Should they not just be teaching the curriculum?
School has moved on a lot since I was there. Just Maths and English plus Religion. Then the odd bit of sport.
Nowadays they do so much extra. They get the best of everything with different days out, a heap of sports, out t the garden and people coming in to speak to them. They're nearly out of the classroom more than it in.
Only thing is they never get sTen results for their PE, History or personality/social side even.
All about the results to the arents come aJune/July.
Every school has good teachers and bad teachers. The biggest problem is nothing gets done about the bad ones. Same across the public sector - with banding you can do f**k all every day and/or play the sickness game for 6 months and your pay packet will be the same as someone who is diligent in their work.
A very interesting read, a lot of of stuff I wouldn't have known about, or at best had a vague idea. There's plenty of things that'd bug me about teaching here, but it does seem to be fairer or more equitable.
Quote from: marty34 on January 10, 2025, 07:31:02 PMQuote from: trueblue1234 on January 10, 2025, 05:51:33 PMQuote from: Rossfan on January 10, 2025, 05:10:38 PMI presume the "Should of" and "had went" posters didn't go to grammar schools?
What a p***k.
Anyway back to the tutors. We got our eldest tutored as the p6 teacher was useless. We'd been warned before how bad she was and after a month we realised she was worser 🙂 (That's another issue. Teachers that are known to be shite and nothing done with them 😡).
She preached about how she wasn't there to prepare them for the test and that she wasn't covering it. Yet every other school in the local area were working towards it or doing an after school class. Sometimes needs must. Not all teachers are equal.
Is that not the problem?
Teachers shouldn't be preparing kids for the transfer test. Is that their job?
Should they not just be teaching the curriculum?
School has moved on a lot since I was there. Just Maths and English plus Religion. Then the odd bit of sport.
Nowadays they do so much extra. They get the best of everything with different days out, a heap of sports, out t the garden and people coming in to speak to them. They're nearly out of the classroom more than it in.
Only thing is they never get sTen results for their PE, History or personality/social side even.
All about the results to the arents come aJune/July.
But that's not right. It should be a standard approach across the board. Having some schools working towards the test and some not, leaves children in the schools that don't at a handicap. And in my view the test should mirror the curriculum. So maybe that's the issue. The results are important to parents. Of course they are. It can be a big factor depending on the schools they could be going to on that basis.
Quote from: trueblue1234 on January 10, 2025, 10:16:22 PMQuote from: marty34 on January 10, 2025, 07:31:02 PMQuote from: trueblue1234 on January 10, 2025, 05:51:33 PMQuote from: Rossfan on January 10, 2025, 05:10:38 PMI presume the "Should of" and "had went" posters didn't go to grammar schools?
What a p***k.
Anyway back to the tutors. We got our eldest tutored as the p6 teacher was useless. We'd been warned before how bad she was and after a month we realised she was worser 🙂 (That's another issue. Teachers that are known to be shite and nothing done with them 😡).
She preached about how she wasn't there to prepare them for the test and that she wasn't covering it. Yet every other school in the local area were working towards it or doing an after school class. Sometimes needs must. Not all teachers are equal.
Is that not the problem?
Teachers shouldn't be preparing kids for the transfer test. Is that their job?
Should they not just be teaching the curriculum?
School has moved on a lot since I was there. Just Maths and English plus Religion. Then the odd bit of sport.
Nowadays they do so much extra. They get the best of everything with different days out, a heap of sports, out t the garden and people coming in to speak to them. They're nearly out of the classroom more than it in.
Only thing is they never get sTen results for their PE, History or personality/social side even.
All about the results to the arents come aJune/July.
But that's not right. It should be a standard approach across the board. Having some schools working towards the test and some not, leaves children in the schools that don't at a handicap. And in my view the test should mirror the curriculum. So maybe that's the issue. The results are important to parents. Of course they are. It can be a big factor depending on the schools they could be going to on that basis.
Just about sums it up.
Quote from: Duine Inteacht Eile on January 10, 2025, 10:21:55 PMQuote from: trueblue1234 on January 10, 2025, 10:16:22 PMQuote from: marty34 on January 10, 2025, 07:31:02 PMQuote from: trueblue1234 on January 10, 2025, 05:51:33 PMQuote from: Rossfan on January 10, 2025, 05:10:38 PMI presume the "Should of" and "had went" posters didn't go to grammar schools?
What a p***k.
Anyway back to the tutors. We got our eldest tutored as the p6 teacher was useless. We'd been warned before how bad she was and after a month we realised she was worser 🙂 (That's another issue. Teachers that are known to be shite and nothing done with them 😡).
She preached about how she wasn't there to prepare them for the test and that she wasn't covering it. Yet every other school in the local area were working towards it or doing an after school class. Sometimes needs must. Not all teachers are equal.
Is that not the problem?
Teachers shouldn't be preparing kids for the transfer test. Is that their job?
Should they not just be teaching the curriculum?
School has moved on a lot since I was there. Just Maths and English plus Religion. Then the odd bit of sport.
Nowadays they do so much extra. They get the best of everything with different days out, a heap of sports, out t the garden and people coming in to speak to them. They're nearly out of the classroom more than it in.
Only thing is they never get sTen results for their PE, History or personality/social side even.
All about the results to the arents come aJune/July.
But that's not right. It should be a standard approach across the board. Having some schools working towards the test and some not, leaves children in the schools that don't at a handicap. And in my view the test should mirror the curriculum. So maybe that's the issue. The results are important to parents. Of course they are. It can be a big factor depending on the schools they could be going to on that basis.
Just about sums it up.
Yes sums are important.
Quote from: trueblue1234 on January 10, 2025, 10:16:22 PMQuote from: marty34 on January 10, 2025, 07:31:02 PMQuote from: trueblue1234 on January 10, 2025, 05:51:33 PMQuote from: Rossfan on January 10, 2025, 05:10:38 PMI presume the "Should of" and "had went" posters didn't go to grammar schools?
What a p***k.
Anyway back to the tutors. We got our eldest tutored as the p6 teacher was useless. We'd been warned before how bad she was and after a month we realised she was worser 🙂 (That's another issue. Teachers that are known to be shite and nothing done with them 😡).
She preached about how she wasn't there to prepare them for the test and that she wasn't covering it. Yet every other school in the local area were working towards it or doing an after school class. Sometimes needs must. Not all teachers are equal.
Is that not the problem?
Teachers shouldn't be preparing kids for the transfer test. Is that their job?
Should they not just be teaching the curriculum?
School has moved on a lot since I was there. Just Maths and English plus Religion. Then the odd bit of sport.
Nowadays they do so much extra. They get the best of everything with different days out, a heap of sports, out t the garden and people coming in to speak to them. They're nearly out of the classroom more than it in.
Only thing is they never get sTen results for their PE, History or personality/social side even.
All about the results to the arents come aJune/July.
But that's not right. It should be a standard approach across the board. Having some schools working towards the test and some not, leaves children in the schools that don't at a handicap. And in my view the test should mirror the curriculum. So maybe that's the issue. The results are important to parents. Of course they are. It can be a big factor depending on the schools they could be going to on that basis.
That's what I'm saying. Not standard. Never mind the transfer tests, same as end of year exams in primary schools. Some teachers teaching it and giving key words to the pupils before hand while others don't.
What I'm saying re: results is they just get a couple of results in June. Maths and English. Nothing else apart from a tick in a box about everything else.
I understand what you're saying. But I suppose Maths and English are key to give you the basis to start to learn the other subjects in more detail. The level of history, for example, in our primary school was very limited.
With primary school you're relying on one teacher. At least with secondary school, you'll have a mix of teachers.
Quote from: marty34 on January 10, 2025, 10:28:53 PMQuote from: trueblue1234 on January 10, 2025, 10:16:22 PMQuote from: marty34 on January 10, 2025, 07:31:02 PMQuote from: trueblue1234 on January 10, 2025, 05:51:33 PMQuote from: Rossfan on January 10, 2025, 05:10:38 PMI presume the "Should of" and "had went" posters didn't go to grammar schools?
What a p***k.
Anyway back to the tutors. We got our eldest tutored as the p6 teacher was useless. We'd been warned before how bad she was and after a month we realised she was worser 🙂 (That's another issue. Teachers that are known to be shite and nothing done with them 😡).
She preached about how she wasn't there to prepare them for the test and that she wasn't covering it. Yet every other school in the local area were working towards it or doing an after school class. Sometimes needs must. Not all teachers are equal.
Is that not the problem?
Teachers shouldn't be preparing kids for the transfer test. Is that their job?
Should they not just be teaching the curriculum?
School has moved on a lot since I was there. Just Maths and English plus Religion. Then the odd bit of sport.
Nowadays they do so much extra. They get the best of everything with different days out, a heap of sports, out t the garden and people coming in to speak to them. They're nearly out of the classroom more than it in.
Only thing is they never get sTen results for their PE, History or personality/social side even.
All about the results to the arents come aJune/July.
But that's not right. It should be a standard approach across the board. Having some schools working towards the test and some not, leaves children in the schools that don't at a handicap. And in my view the test should mirror the curriculum. So maybe that's the issue. The results are important to parents. Of course they are. It can be a big factor depending on the schools they could be going to on that basis.
That's what I'm saying. Not standard. Never mind the transfer tests, same as end of year exams in primary schools. Some teachers teaching it and giving key words to the pupils before hand while others don't.
What I'm saying re: results is they just get a couple of results in June. Maths and English. Nothing else apart from a tick in a box about everything else.
The SEAG test is based on the Maths & English curriculum but it is pitched a bit above level 4 of the curriculum , where P7 children are expected be achieving in P7
How many parents would happily send their kids to their local secondary school?
Going comprehensive will bring the levels to England levels
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on January 10, 2025, 11:03:05 PMHow many parents would happily send their kids to their local secondary school?
Going comprehensive will bring the levels to England levels
In theory should be no difference in a properly streamed school. In my local grammar school that my 2 eldest attend/attended the standard of teaching in many (not all) subjects is notoriously poor and external tutors are making an absolute killing because of it. However, they get away with it for the reasons someone mentioned earlier i.e. they feel they don't have to do much as the kids should be able to do it themselves. The missus says there is a difference between teaching and just delivering information.
Many of the teachers are missing from class during the week even at GCSE and A Level as they are out with sports teams. They also take morning gym and take teams on a Saturday so I wonder myself could I be arsed setting a load of homework when I'm running from pillar to post all week.
The lack of consistency for essentially the same goal is baffling.
We need more sparks. And plasterers. Well, I can do the plastering but I won't touch the electrics.
Listen, it's easy saying teaching be the same if they were all taught together.. Holy Trinity Ctown, or St Patricks back in the day, they done tests like most schools, and streamed them on ability. The bottom class may have had people with learning difficulties, back then getting statementated was non-existent. And some very rough lads. That class was basically known as the wild bunch and teaching them was minimal unfortunately. Things have improved alot these days, but pupils still get lost ever year, due to lack of small class teaching and children never getting diagnoses with learning issues.
Children will get through, regardless of what school they go to. That's life. They're resilient.
Parents are the main educator in a child's life. That's fact. Moreso than the teachers. Too many parents, in my opinion anyway, want to blame schools and teachers for their child's lack of ability in terms of their academic studies.
Quote from: marty34 on January 11, 2025, 09:26:08 AMChildren will get through, regardless of what school they go to. That's life. They're resilient.
Parents are the main educator in a child's life. That's fact. Moreso than the teachers. Too many parents, in my opinion anyway, want to blame schools and teachers for their child's lack of ability in terms of their academic studies.
For me that's just giving teachers a by-ball. I don't bring the car to the mechanics and then fix it myself.
Parents have a roll in education of kids without a doubt. But the teachers have a massive one as well, and should be accountable when they're sh!te at their job.
Quote from: trueblue1234 on January 11, 2025, 09:33:42 AMQuote from: marty34 on January 11, 2025, 09:26:08 AMChildren will get through, regardless of what school they go to. That's life. They're resilient.
Parents are the main educator in a child's life. That's fact. Moreso than the teachers. Too many parents, in my opinion anyway, want to blame schools and teachers for their child's lack of ability in terms of their academic studies.
For me that's just giving teachers a by-ball. I don't bring the car to the mechanics and then fix it myself.
Parents have a roll in education of kids without a doubt. But the teachers have a massive one as well, and should be accountable when they're sh!te at their job.
But what if your kid is just thick? Or abusive? Or no intention of learning and just there for the craic? Only so much you can do
In other DUP news, despite half a million people waiting to see a consultant, Gregory Campbell MP has intervened to reduce the amount of GAA content on a UU video. Well done Gregory.
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on January 11, 2025, 10:10:00 AMQuote from: trueblue1234 on January 11, 2025, 09:33:42 AMQuote from: marty34 on January 11, 2025, 09:26:08 AMChildren will get through, regardless of what school they go to. That's life. They're resilient.
Parents are the main educator in a child's life. That's fact. Moreso than the teachers. Too many parents, in my opinion anyway, want to blame schools and teachers for their child's lack of ability in terms of their academic studies.
For me that's just giving teachers a by-ball. I don't bring the car to the mechanics and then fix it myself.
Parents have a roll in education of kids without a doubt. But the teachers have a massive one as well, and should be accountable when they're sh!te at their job.
But what if your kid is just thick? Or abusive? Or no intention of learning and just there for the craic? Only so much you can do
100% correct.
A lot of parents think their kids are A Stars pupils. When they're not, it's the teachers or school's fault.
Probably parents who've never brought their kids to a library or read a book to them etc. Just expect for them to be turned into a genius.
If parents carried so much, they wouldn't hand their kids phones or X-Boxes at 5 yers of age.
It's an easy fix for parents to blame teachers. If parents cared so much, should they not be out protesting at the Eduction Authority for class sizes to be limited to 15 pupils in each class etc.?
Quote from: Sportacus on January 11, 2025, 10:18:27 AMIn other DUP news, despite half a million people waiting to see a consultant, Gregory Campbell MP has intervened to reduce the amount of GAA content on a UU video. Well done Gregory.
https://m.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/education/this-shouldnt-have-happened-in-the-first-place-dup-mp-complaints-about-excessive-gaa-branding-prompt-university-to-change-campaign/a2089785990.html?fbclid=IwY2xjawHvNsRleHRuA2FlbQIxMQABHafta1ARobUdjxlKBtSFGYV6EgQtnFOFDmtgo1jvmul985GdVofn7-5LIA_aem_Igv2KZz5UnBZvnlI-3G__g
It was squeaky bum time for him last time to get re elected after a few years not being his usual bigoted self so he must feel he has to resort back to these silly attacks to win back voters
I remember years ago Jim Allister giving off about to many people wearing GAA tops in J'town.
At the end of the day the majority of those in the Unionist side who have the brains to go to Uni usually go across the water, probably because they realise how backward thinking their own community is.
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on January 11, 2025, 10:10:00 AMQuote from: trueblue1234 on January 11, 2025, 09:33:42 AMQuote from: marty34 on January 11, 2025, 09:26:08 AMChildren will get through, regardless of what school they go to. That's life. They're resilient.
Parents are the main educator in a child's life. That's fact. Moreso than the teachers. Too many parents, in my opinion anyway, want to blame schools and teachers for their child's lack of ability in terms of their academic studies.
For me that's just giving teachers a by-ball. I don't bring the car to the mechanics and then fix it myself.
Parents have a roll in education of kids without a doubt. But the teachers have a massive one as well, and should be accountable when they're sh!te at their job.
But what if your kid is just thick? Or abusive? Or no intention of learning and just there for the craic? Only so much you can do
If they're thick, I'd like to think the teacher will still try their best. Or are you saying Teachers should only try with the brightest?
If they've no intention of learning or abusive, I'd expect the school to have informed the parents of this so parents will be aware of the issues. You can't say some children won't do well in school so therefore can never blame the teachers. That's just nonsense.
Why the rush to blame anyone? There are a million moving parts and sometimes it doesn't work out as you might have hoped.
Quote from: Duine Inteacht Eile on January 11, 2025, 01:01:33 PMWhy the rush to blame anyone? There are a million moving parts and sometimes it doesn't work out as you might have hoped.
Quote from: Duine Inteacht Eile on January 11, 2025, 01:01:33 PMWhy the rush to blame anyone? There are a million moving parts and sometimes it doesn't work out as you might have hoped.
Indeed. And often it can be a combination. But it's just a discussion around education, schools and teachers in general and where issues with the system can occur.
Quote from: Brendan on January 11, 2025, 11:36:48 AMQuote from: Sportacus on January 11, 2025, 10:18:27 AMIn other DUP news, despite half a million people waiting to see a consultant, Gregory Campbell MP has intervened to reduce the amount of GAA content on a UU video. Well done Gregory.
https://m.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/education/this-shouldnt-have-happened-in-the-first-place-dup-mp-complaints-about-excessive-gaa-branding-prompt-university-to-change-campaign/a2089785990.html?fbclid=IwY2xjawHvNsRleHRuA2FlbQIxMQABHafta1ARobUdjxlKBtSFGYV6EgQtnFOFDmtgo1jvmul985GdVofn7-5LIA_aem_Igv2KZz5UnBZvnlI-3G__g
It was squeaky bum time for him last time to get re elected after a few years not being his usual bigoted self so he must feel he has to resort back to these silly attacks to win back voters
That's about the height of it. Rise up the knuckledragging bigoted voters by throwing a wobbler about something related to the GAA , the Irish language or a banned orange March
Retaining their seat, and their cushy salary, that's what it's all about. The likes of him will say or do anything to hold onto that
* except anything constructive for their own constituents.
Quote from: AustinPowers on January 11, 2025, 03:16:47 PMQuote from: Brendan on January 11, 2025, 11:36:48 AMQuote from: Sportacus on January 11, 2025, 10:18:27 AMIn other DUP news, despite half a million people waiting to see a consultant, Gregory Campbell MP has intervened to reduce the amount of GAA content on a UU video. Well done Gregory.
https://m.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/education/this-shouldnt-have-happened-in-the-first-place-dup-mp-complaints-about-excessive-gaa-branding-prompt-university-to-change-campaign/a2089785990.html?fbclid=IwY2xjawHvNsRleHRuA2FlbQIxMQABHafta1ARobUdjxlKBtSFGYV6EgQtnFOFDmtgo1jvmul985GdVofn7-5LIA_aem_Igv2KZz5UnBZvnlI-3G__g
It was squeaky bum time for him last time to get re elected after a few years not being his usual bigoted self so he must feel he has to resort back to these silly attacks to win back voters
That's about the height of it. Rise up the knuckledragging bigoted voters by throwing a wobbler about something related to the GAA , the Irish language or a banned orange March
Retaining their seat, and their cushy salary, that's what it's all about. The likes of him will say or do anything to hold onto that
Maybe a Lord's gig later at £350 a day plus expenses.
Quote from: trueblue1234 on January 11, 2025, 12:14:56 PMQuote from: Milltown Row2 on January 11, 2025, 10:10:00 AMQuote from: trueblue1234 on January 11, 2025, 09:33:42 AMQuote from: marty34 on January 11, 2025, 09:26:08 AMChildren will get through, regardless of what school they go to. That's life. They're resilient.
Parents are the main educator in a child's life. That's fact. Moreso than the teachers. Too many parents, in my opinion anyway, want to blame schools and teachers for their child's lack of ability in terms of their academic studies.
For me that's just giving teachers a by-ball. I don't bring the car to the mechanics and then fix it myself.
Parents have a roll in education of kids without a doubt. But the teachers have a massive one as well, and should be accountable when they're sh!te at their job.
But what if your kid is just thick? Or abusive? Or no intention of learning and just there for the craic? Only so much you can do
If they're thick, I'd like to think the teacher will still try their best. Or are you saying Teachers should only try with the brightest?
If they've no intention of learning or abusive, I'd expect the school to have informed the parents of this so parents will be aware of the issues. You can't say some children won't do well in school so therefore can never blame the teachers. That's just nonsense.
Please point out in my post were I said teachers don't try?
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on January 11, 2025, 07:02:26 PMQuote from: trueblue1234 on January 11, 2025, 12:14:56 PMQuote from: Milltown Row2 on January 11, 2025, 10:10:00 AMQuote from: trueblue1234 on January 11, 2025, 09:33:42 AMQuote from: marty34 on January 11, 2025, 09:26:08 AMChildren will get through, regardless of what school they go to. That's life. They're resilient.
Parents are the main educator in a child's life. That's fact. Moreso than the teachers. Too many parents, in my opinion anyway, want to blame schools and teachers for their child's lack of ability in terms of their academic studies.
For me that's just giving teachers a by-ball. I don't bring the car to the mechanics and then fix it myself.
Parents have a roll in education of kids without a doubt. But the teachers have a massive one as well, and should be accountable when they're sh!te at their job.
But what if your kid is just thick? Or abusive? Or no intention of learning and just there for the craic? Only so much you can do
If they're thick, I'd like to think the teacher will still try their best. Or are you saying Teachers should only try with the brightest?
If they've no intention of learning or abusive, I'd expect the school to have informed the parents of this so parents will be aware of the issues. You can't say some children won't do well in school so therefore can never blame the teachers. That's just nonsense.
Please point out in my post were I said teachers don't try?
Please point out in my post where I said you said that.
Quote from: trueblue1234 on January 11, 2025, 07:42:24 PMQuote from: Milltown Row2 on January 11, 2025, 07:02:26 PMQuote from: trueblue1234 on January 11, 2025, 12:14:56 PMQuote from: Milltown Row2 on January 11, 2025, 10:10:00 AMQuote from: trueblue1234 on January 11, 2025, 09:33:42 AMQuote from: marty34 on January 11, 2025, 09:26:08 AMChildren will get through, regardless of what school they go to. That's life. They're resilient.
Parents are the main educator in a child's life. That's fact. Moreso than the teachers. Too many parents, in my opinion anyway, want to blame schools and teachers for their child's lack of ability in terms of their academic studies.
For me that's just giving teachers a by-ball. I don't bring the car to the mechanics and then fix it myself.
Parents have a roll in education of kids without a doubt. But the teachers have a massive one as well, and should be accountable when they're sh!te at their job.
But what if your kid is just thick? Or abusive? Or no intention of learning and just there for the craic? Only so much you can do
If they're thick, I'd like to think the teacher will still try their best. Or are you saying Teachers should only try with the brightest?
If they've no intention of learning or abusive, I'd expect the school to have informed the parents of this so parents will be aware of the issues. You can't say some children won't do well in school so therefore can never blame the teachers. That's just nonsense.
Please point out in my post were I said teachers don't try?
Please point out in my post where I said you said that.
You said teachers should at least try? Wtf do think they are doing?
You also said should they only try with the brightest!
You are a clown. Parents at parents night tell parents that wee Johnny isn't doing well or is going well or could do better.
Parents then ask could there be more done? Teacher says well, look I'll arrange an after school class to go over some stuff they are struggling on, wee Johnny doesn't turn up or wee Johnny still doesn't get it. But the teacher isn't trying enough.
Personally, I've always looked at the child and if ya aren't blindsided you'll know the reason.
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on January 11, 2025, 07:49:14 PMQuote from: trueblue1234 on January 11, 2025, 07:42:24 PMQuote from: Milltown Row2 on January 11, 2025, 07:02:26 PMQuote from: trueblue1234 on January 11, 2025, 12:14:56 PMQuote from: Milltown Row2 on January 11, 2025, 10:10:00 AMQuote from: trueblue1234 on January 11, 2025, 09:33:42 AMQuote from: marty34 on January 11, 2025, 09:26:08 AMChildren will get through, regardless of what school they go to. That's life. They're resilient.
Parents are the main educator in a child's life. That's fact. Moreso than the teachers. Too many parents, in my opinion anyway, want to blame schools and teachers for their child's lack of ability in terms of their academic studies.
For me that's just giving teachers a by-ball. I don't bring the car to the mechanics and then fix it myself.
Parents have a roll in education of kids without a doubt. But the teachers have a massive one as well, and should be accountable when they're sh!te at their job.
But what if your kid is just thick? Or abusive? Or no intention of learning and just there for the craic? Only so much you can do
If they're thick, I'd like to think the teacher will still try their best. Or are you saying Teachers should only try with the brightest?
If they've no intention of learning or abusive, I'd expect the school to have informed the parents of this so parents will be aware of the issues. You can't say some children won't do well in school so therefore can never blame the teachers. That's just nonsense.
Please point out in my post were I said teachers don't try?
Please point out in my post where I said you said that.
You said teachers should at least try? Wtf do think they are doing?
You also said should they only try with the brightest!
You are a clown. Parents at parents night tell parents that wee Johnny isn't doing well or is going well or could do better.
Parents then ask could there be more done? Teacher says well, look I'll arrange an after school class to go over some stuff they are struggling on, wee Johnny doesn't turn up or wee Johnny still doesn't get it. But the teacher isn't trying enough.
Personally, I've always looked at the child and if ya aren't blindsided you'll know the reason.
FFS you're having a mare today. Between this and the Armagh thread. Away and lie down.
I like to see what Gregory Campbell has brought to his constituency in his whole time elected there. Ballymoney main street, totally run down, nothing of note workwise brought into the area. A total dinosaur from the past, and the fact this **** still gets voted in, says alot about the general unionist population in the area.
Quote from: Wildweasel74 on January 11, 2025, 08:51:59 PMI like to see what Gregory Campbell has brought to his constituency in his whole time elected there. Ballymoney main street, totally run down, nothing of note workwise brought into the area. A total dinosaur from the past, and the fact this **** still gets voted in, says alot about the general unionist population in the area.
As much as I hate Gregory Campbell would Ian Paisley (now Jim Allister) not have been the MP for Ballymoney?
Quote from: SaffronSports on January 11, 2025, 09:11:43 PMQuote from: Wildweasel74 on January 11, 2025, 08:51:59 PMI like to see what Gregory Campbell has brought to his constituency in his whole time elected there. Ballymoney main street, totally run down, nothing of note workwise brought into the area. A total dinosaur from the past, and the fact this **** still gets voted in, says alot about the general unionist population in the area.
As much as I hate Gregory Campbell would Ian Paisley (now Jim Allister) not have been the MP for Ballymoney?
Correct I believe. Flegory is East Derry and Ballymoney is N. Antrim.
Quote from: trueblue1234 on January 11, 2025, 07:51:16 PMQuote from: Milltown Row2 on January 11, 2025, 07:49:14 PMQuote from: trueblue1234 on January 11, 2025, 07:42:24 PMQuote from: Milltown Row2 on January 11, 2025, 07:02:26 PMQuote from: trueblue1234 on January 11, 2025, 12:14:56 PMQuote from: Milltown Row2 on January 11, 2025, 10:10:00 AMQuote from: trueblue1234 on January 11, 2025, 09:33:42 AMQuote from: marty34 on January 11, 2025, 09:26:08 AMChildren will get through, regardless of what school they go to. That's life. They're resilient.
Parents are the main educator in a child's life. That's fact. Moreso than the teachers. Too many parents, in my opinion anyway, want to blame schools and teachers for their child's lack of ability in terms of their academic studies.
For me that's just giving teachers a by-ball. I don't bring the car to the mechanics and then fix it myself.
Parents have a roll in education of kids without a doubt. But the teachers have a massive one as well, and should be accountable when they're sh!te at their job.
But what if your kid is just thick? Or abusive? Or no intention of learning and just there for the craic? Only so much you can do
If they're thick, I'd like to think the teacher will still try their best. Or are you saying Teachers should only try with the brightest?
If they've no intention of learning or abusive, I'd expect the school to have informed the parents of this so parents will be aware of the issues. You can't say some children won't do well in school so therefore can never blame the teachers. That's just nonsense.
Please point out in my post were I said teachers don't try?
Please point out in my post where I said you said that.
You said teachers should at least try? Wtf do think they are doing?
You also said should they only try with the brightest!
You are a clown. Parents at parents night tell parents that wee Johnny isn't doing well or is going well or could do better.
Parents then ask could there be more done? Teacher says well, look I'll arrange an after school class to go over some stuff they are struggling on, wee Johnny doesn't turn up or wee Johnny still doesn't get it. But the teacher isn't trying enough.
Personally, I've always looked at the child and if ya aren't blindsided you'll know the reason.
FFS you're having a mare today. Between this and the Armagh thread. Away and lie down.
Yea, that's the answer.
And I hope you ain't getting me mixed up with another poster on Rian thread not the Armagh thread, though wouldn't surprise me
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on January 11, 2025, 09:42:01 PMQuote from: trueblue1234 on January 11, 2025, 07:51:16 PMQuote from: Milltown Row2 on January 11, 2025, 07:49:14 PMQuote from: trueblue1234 on January 11, 2025, 07:42:24 PMQuote from: Milltown Row2 on January 11, 2025, 07:02:26 PMQuote from: trueblue1234 on January 11, 2025, 12:14:56 PMQuote from: Milltown Row2 on January 11, 2025, 10:10:00 AMQuote from: trueblue1234 on January 11, 2025, 09:33:42 AMQuote from: marty34 on January 11, 2025, 09:26:08 AMChildren will get through, regardless of what school they go to. That's life. They're resilient.
Parents are the main educator in a child's life. That's fact. Moreso than the teachers. Too many parents, in my opinion anyway, want to blame schools and teachers for their child's lack of ability in terms of their academic studies.
For me that's just giving teachers a by-ball. I don't bring the car to the mechanics and then fix it myself.
Parents have a roll in education of kids without a doubt. But the teachers have a massive one as well, and should be accountable when they're sh!te at their job.
But what if your kid is just thick? Or abusive? Or no intention of learning and just there for the craic? Only so much you can do
If they're thick, I'd like to think the teacher will still try their best. Or are you saying Teachers should only try with the brightest?
If they've no intention of learning or abusive, I'd expect the school to have informed the parents of this so parents will be aware of the issues. You can't say some children won't do well in school so therefore can never blame the teachers. That's just nonsense.
Please point out in my post were I said teachers don't try?
Please point out in my post where I said you said that.
You said teachers should at least try? Wtf do think they are doing?
You also said should they only try with the brightest!
You are a clown. Parents at parents night tell parents that wee Johnny isn't doing well or is going well or could do better.
Parents then ask could there be more done? Teacher says well, look I'll arrange an after school class to go over some stuff they are struggling on, wee Johnny doesn't turn up or wee Johnny still doesn't get it. But the teacher isn't trying enough.
Personally, I've always looked at the child and if ya aren't blindsided you'll know the reason.
FFS you're having a mare today. Between this and the Armagh thread. Away and lie down.
Yea, that's the answer.
And I hope you ain't getting me mixed up with another poster on Rian thread not the Armagh thread, though wouldn't surprise me
No mix up, trust me, your debating style is unique on the board.
Quote from: trueblue1234 on January 11, 2025, 10:26:30 PMQuote from: Milltown Row2 on January 11, 2025, 09:42:01 PMQuote from: trueblue1234 on January 11, 2025, 07:51:16 PMQuote from: Milltown Row2 on January 11, 2025, 07:49:14 PMQuote from: trueblue1234 on January 11, 2025, 07:42:24 PMQuote from: Milltown Row2 on January 11, 2025, 07:02:26 PMQuote from: trueblue1234 on January 11, 2025, 12:14:56 PMQuote from: Milltown Row2 on January 11, 2025, 10:10:00 AMQuote from: trueblue1234 on January 11, 2025, 09:33:42 AMQuote from: marty34 on January 11, 2025, 09:26:08 AMChildren will get through, regardless of what school they go to. That's life. They're resilient.
Parents are the main educator in a child's life. That's fact. Moreso than the teachers. Too many parents, in my opinion anyway, want to blame schools and teachers for their child's lack of ability in terms of their academic studies.
For me that's just giving teachers a by-ball. I don't bring the car to the mechanics and then fix it myself.
Parents have a roll in education of kids without a doubt. But the teachers have a massive one as well, and should be accountable when they're sh!te at their job.
But what if your kid is just thick? Or abusive? Or no intention of learning and just there for the craic? Only so much you can do
If they're thick, I'd like to think the teacher will still try their best. Or are you saying Teachers should only try with the brightest?
If they've no intention of learning or abusive, I'd expect the school to have informed the parents of this so parents will be aware of the issues. You can't say some children won't do well in school so therefore can never blame the teachers. That's just nonsense.
Please point out in my post were I said teachers don't try?
Please point out in my post where I said you said that.
You said teachers should at least try? Wtf do think they are doing?
You also said should they only try with the brightest!
You are a clown. Parents at parents night tell parents that wee Johnny isn't doing well or is going well or could do better.
Parents then ask could there be more done? Teacher says well, look I'll arrange an after school class to go over some stuff they are struggling on, wee Johnny doesn't turn up or wee Johnny still doesn't get it. But the teacher isn't trying enough.
Personally, I've always looked at the child and if ya aren't blindsided you'll know the reason.
FFS you're having a mare today. Between this and the Armagh thread. Away and lie down.
Yea, that's the answer.
And I hope you ain't getting me mixed up with another poster on Rian thread not the Armagh thread, though wouldn't surprise me
No mix up, trust me, your debating style is unique on the board.
So where on the Armagh thread today was I debating?
Yeah, he be east Londoderry, Covering Limavady, with Ballymoney, Causeway ,coast and Glen's. Done very little for Limavady either.
Quote from: Wildweasel74 on January 11, 2025, 10:48:23 PMYeah, he be east Londoderry, Covering Limavady, with Ballymoney, Causeway ,coast and Glen's. Done very little for Limavady either.
Gregory is a career politician ie he'll play to his electorate, but, and I'm no fan of the man, he's helped out many of themums over the years. He's also, or was the chairman of a local soccer team who've had plenty of GAA men playing for them, and I'm sure it erks him, one of his wains is married to a taig 😬
Rest assured this will be his last few years in politics. SF came within a whisker of taking what literally everyone, even surely SF, presumed was a solidly safe DUP seat last time out. He won't want to suffer the indignity of losing the seat to the shinners next time round. He'll jump before he is pushed.
Quote from: JoG2 on January 12, 2025, 01:01:54 AMQuote from: Wildweasel74 on January 11, 2025, 10:48:23 PMYeah, he be east Londoderry, Covering Limavady, with Ballymoney, Causeway ,coast and Glen's. Done very little for Limavady either.
Gregory is a career politician ie he'll play to his electorate, but, and I'm no fan of the man, he's helped out many of themums over the years. He's also, or was the chairman of a local soccer team who've had plenty of GAA men playing for them, and I'm sure it erks him, one of his wains is married to a taig 😬
Comment elsewhere suggested that he has adopted this hardline political persona which plays well to the troglodyte DUP electorate, but that personally he wouldn't necessarily be like that.
If so, he's stayed in character pretty well for 40 odd years.
Quote from: Snapchap on January 12, 2025, 05:43:16 PMRest assured this will be his last few years in politics. SF came within a whisker of taking what literally everyone, even surely SF, presumed was a solidly safe DUP seat last time out. He won't want to suffer the indignity of losing the seat to the shinners next time round. He'll jump before he is pushed.
A few commentators had this seat close. The TUV were running so the DUP vote was always going to be down. SF should really have been on it here. Instead they were too busy trying to decapitate the SDLP in Foyle rather than putting all the resources in East derry. In the end their vote was about the same as their assembly vote. Any increase at all, any encouragement to the nationalist voters that actually their was a chance then Gregory was gone. TUV won't stand here next time for fear of being accused of vote splitting. They didn't stand in upper Bann for this reason even though upper Bann was actually much safer. I expect a comfortable enough unionist hold next time. When E Derry and Upper Bann finally go green then it's game over for unionism
Quote from: gallsman on January 13, 2025, 12:05:27 PMIf so, he's stayed in character pretty well for 40 odd years.
;D good point
I see Givan closing a few small rural primary schools.
Demographics starting to kick in presumably.
I see one of the schools was in Lack.
Drove through it a few times on the way to Donegal, hardly see children in the street let alone adults.
Problem is local politicians are up in arms. The schools are unsustainable, numbers wise.
I'd say if job was done right, he could close another 100 schools.
In Donegal there are loads of wee primary schools with very small numbers but because of geography, they're kept open.
Balnamore is only 2 & 1/2 mile outside Ballymoney, so there is school spaces nearby. Tried to go integrated, but way to late,not sure that area pull in any Catholics anyway.
https://www.irishnews.com/news/northern-ireland/former-minister-peter-weir-to-join-education-authority-7XOYUT56NBFNLE4TGNJK33QQEE/
One of those things that gets released on a Friday afternoon hoping not too many will notice.
With Paul Givan pulling rank to reject the school in Bangor becoming integrated, and already appointing his mucker Mervyn Storey as Chairman this latest appointment is no surprise in terms of the direction of travel the DUP are looking to take the education sector........backwards.
Quote from: LC on February 01, 2025, 01:45:22 PMhttps://www.irishnews.com/news/northern-ireland/former-minister-peter-weir-to-join-education-authority-7XOYUT56NBFNLE4TGNJK33QQEE/
One of those things that gets released on a Friday afternoon hoping not too many will notice.
With Paul Givan pulling rank to reject the school in Bangor becoming integrated, and already appointing his mucker Mervyn Storey as Chairman this latest appointment is no surprise in terms of the direction of travel the DUP are looking to take the education sector........backwards.
They'll be having Creationism in the curriculum soon if these chaps are in charge.
Quote from: Tony Baloney on February 01, 2025, 02:25:23 PMQuote from: LC on February 01, 2025, 01:45:22 PMhttps://www.irishnews.com/news/northern-ireland/former-minister-peter-weir-to-join-education-authority-7XOYUT56NBFNLE4TGNJK33QQEE/
One of those things that gets released on a Friday afternoon hoping not too many will notice.
With Paul Givan pulling rank to reject the school in Bangor becoming integrated, and already appointing his mucker Mervyn Storey as Chairman this latest appointment is no surprise in terms of the direction of travel the DUP are looking to take the education sector........backwards.
They'll be having Creationism in the curriculum soon if these chaps are in charge.
Yeah wondering how they square that at schools for 'them' it's even in the museum at Stranmills, embarrassing
This Lisneal college story seems to gathering some legs.
Literally couldn't be up to them at any point, they just can't appear to help themselves.
Quote from: NAG1 on February 04, 2025, 03:17:19 PMThis Lisneal college story seems to gathering some legs.
Literally couldn't be up to them at any point, they just can't appear to help themselves.
It will be interesting to see how it plays out or how deep the investigation goes. Will SF take a hard line approach in front of the cameras or use it as leverage behind closed doors to push casement or the likes.
Also saw a clip of ELP basically defending not accepting additional funding from the free state government as part of the north/south bodies for foras na gaeilge because it's an equal balance funding model and that would then mean it wouldn't be equally balanced......despite no need for the north to match the additional money.
Givan, Lyons and ELP all showing leopard like characteristics.
They are actively out now to make sure Catholic schools are under funded as they see this as the only way to ruin a generation.
Quote from: JohnDenver on February 04, 2025, 03:45:00 PMQuote from: NAG1 on February 04, 2025, 03:17:19 PMThis Lisneal college story seems to gathering some legs.
Literally couldn't be up to them at any point, they just can't appear to help themselves.
It will be interesting to see how it plays out or how deep the investigation goes. Will SF take a hard line approach in front of the cameras or use it as leverage behind closed doors to push casement or the likes.
Also saw a clip of ELP basically defending not accepting additional funding from the free state government as part of the north/south bodies for foras na gaeilge because it's an equal balance funding model and that would then mean it wouldn't be equally balanced......despite no need for the north to match the additional money.
Givan, Lyons and ELP all showing leopard like characteristics.
and don't forget her husband is in the mix too.
He's CEO of the Education Authority who've been flat out lying to Garrett Hargan, the journalist whose investigating this and isn't for letting go anytime soon.
A total DUP stitch they've been at for years.
Quote from: JohnDenver on February 04, 2025, 03:45:00 PMQuote from: NAG1 on February 04, 2025, 03:17:19 PMThis Lisneal college story seems to gathering some legs.
Literally couldn't be up to them at any point, they just can't appear to help themselves.
It will be interesting to see how it plays out or how deep the investigation goes. Will SF take a hard line approach in front of the cameras or use it as leverage behind closed doors to push casement or the likes.
Also saw a clip of ELP basically defending not accepting additional funding from the free state government as part of the north/south bodies for foras na gaeilge because it's an equal balance funding model and that would then mean it wouldn't be equally balanced......despite no need for the north to match the additional money.
Givan, Lyons and ELP all showing leopard like characteristics.
They can push the DUP all they like on Casement, but at the end of the day it's the British Government who aren't playing ball. (Well thrashed out on the other thread).
Quote from: Sportacus on February 04, 2025, 05:35:26 PMQuote from: JohnDenver on February 04, 2025, 03:45:00 PMQuote from: NAG1 on February 04, 2025, 03:17:19 PMThis Lisneal college story seems to gathering some legs.
Literally couldn't be up to them at any point, they just can't appear to help themselves.
It will be interesting to see how it plays out or how deep the investigation goes. Will SF take a hard line approach in front of the cameras or use it as leverage behind closed doors to push casement or the likes.
Also saw a clip of ELP basically defending not accepting additional funding from the free state government as part of the north/south bodies for foras na gaeilge because it's an equal balance funding model and that would then mean it wouldn't be equally balanced......despite no need for the north to match the additional money.
Givan, Lyons and ELP all showing leopard like characteristics.
They can push the DUP all they like on Casement, but at the end of the day it's the British Government who aren't playing ball. (Well thrashed out on the other thread).
Not enough to get Casement over the line by a long shot but rest assured there will be a trade off in return for SF not rocking the boat too much.
I see Tony Benny was basically telling the Executive to pull their finger out of their proverbial today https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c0qw37kxn0po
........someday should tell him not to hold his breath.
Nothing in Lisneal, project been developed from 5yrs bck. And I would know.
Quote from: Wildweasel74 on February 05, 2025, 12:15:29 AMNothing in Lisneal, project been developed from 5yrs bck. And I would know.
What do you mean nothing in Lisneal? Its got nothing to do with how far back the project has been developed. Why was it the only funding that was green lighted in Derry? Why did the Department of Education have to retract their statement on it the other night? It doesn't take a rocket scientist to work out what is going on here. Its a disgrace what is going in Derry with regards to a lack of funding. Not only sectarianism, but we have to contend with a Belfast centric bias as well.
What is the back story to this?
Quote from: marty34 on February 05, 2025, 12:14:06 PMWhat is the back story to this?
A school in Derry got awarded over £700K to upgrade it's soccer pitch even though they never applied for it under the normal scheme.
They had a meeting with some DUP representatives and low and behold they got the money via a different fund which was limited to £500k, but when this was investigated this amount specified has been removed from their DoE website.
Follow Garrett Hargan on Twitter.
All a bit sus.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c4gw8pkd4k8o
A further example no doubt of why the British Government (Exchequer) can not wait to get rid of NI and why the Irish Exchequer would be happy for the can to be kicked down the road for a good few years yet.
The problem is too many of the 'working class' are not big believers in actually working.
Quote from: LC on February 05, 2025, 01:16:53 PMhttps://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c4gw8pkd4k8o
A further example no doubt of why the British Government (Exchequer) can not wait to get rid of NI and why the Irish Exchequer would be happy for the can to be kicked down the road for a good few years yet.
The problem is too many of the 'working class' are not big believers in actually working.
1,000,000 pesky Unionists will do that
Probably around 800k now?
Ah Jesus, would yez ever quit with the 1 Million Unionists ::) It's not 1922 !!
At the 2024 General Election in the North, approximately 330,000 people voted for Unionists.
Quote from: LC on February 05, 2025, 01:16:53 PMhttps://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c4gw8pkd4k8o
A further example no doubt of why the British Government (Exchequer) can not wait to get rid of NI and why the Irish Exchequer would be happy for the can to be kicked down the road for a good few years yet.
The problem is too many of the 'working class' are not big believers in actually working.
Pay people to be "sick" and they will be sick
Quote from: Deerstalker on February 05, 2025, 08:37:18 PMQuote from: LC on February 05, 2025, 01:16:53 PMhttps://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c4gw8pkd4k8o
A further example no doubt of why the British Government (Exchequer) can not wait to get rid of NI and why the Irish Exchequer would be happy for the can to be kicked down the road for a good few years yet.
The problem is too many of the 'working class' are not big believers in actually working.
Pay people to be "sick" and they will be sick
Exactly. Disincentivise lying on your hole and you'd see economic inactivity start to decrease accordingly.
Quote from: Rossfan on February 05, 2025, 03:40:02 PMProbably around 800k now?
Napkin maths, everyone knows its a million
Quote from: Tony Baloney on February 05, 2025, 08:51:12 PMQuote from: Deerstalker on February 05, 2025, 08:37:18 PMQuote from: LC on February 05, 2025, 01:16:53 PMhttps://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c4gw8pkd4k8o
A further example no doubt of why the British Government (Exchequer) can not wait to get rid of NI and why the Irish Exchequer would be happy for the can to be kicked down the road for a good few years yet.
The problem is too many of the 'working class' are not big believers in actually working.
Pay people to be "sick" and they will be sick
Exactly. Disincentivise lying on your hole and you'd see economic inactivity start to decrease accordingly.
It's seemingly on the way
Quote from: Tony Baloney on February 05, 2025, 08:51:12 PMQuote from: Deerstalker on February 05, 2025, 08:37:18 PMQuote from: LC on February 05, 2025, 01:16:53 PMhttps://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c4gw8pkd4k8o
A further example no doubt of why the British Government (Exchequer) can not wait to get rid of NI and why the Irish Exchequer would be happy for the can to be kicked down the road for a good few years yet.
The problem is too many of the 'working class' are not big believers in actually working.
Pay people to be "sick" and they will be sick
Exactly. Disincentivise lying on your hole and you'd see economic inactivity start to decrease accordingly.
Kevin Bridges does a great sketch of paying unemployed people £1k a week and the economy would be bouncing. Spending it on fags and drink...highly taxable goods.
Quote from: johnnycool on February 05, 2025, 12:29:51 PMQuote from: marty34 on February 05, 2025, 12:14:06 PMWhat is the back story to this?
A school in Derry got awarded over £700K to upgrade it's soccer pitch even though they never applied for it under the normal scheme.
They had a meeting with some DUP representatives and low and behold they got the money via a different fund which was limited to £500k, but when this was investigated this amount specified has been removed from their DoE website.
Follow Garrett Hargan on Twitter.
All a bit sus.
Ok. Thanks JC.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cly4ev0p1ewo
Does no harm to name and shame, whether it makes much difference is another thing but anyone who does this then good enough for them, no sympathy.
I remember years ago seeing such cases in our local paper with offenders named.
Did not realise SF had instructed DfC back in 2020 not to publish names anymore, fail to see the reasoning / agenda behind this.
Quote from: LC on February 11, 2025, 08:15:47 PMhttps://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cly4ev0p1ewo
Does no harm to name and shame, whether it makes much difference is another thing but anyone who does this then good enough for them, no sympathy.
I remember years ago seeing such cases in our local paper with offenders named.
Did not realise SF had instructed DfC back in 2020 not to publish names anymore, fail to see the reasoning / agenda behind this.
As long as that goes from the top to the bottom
Quote from: LC on February 11, 2025, 08:15:47 PMhttps://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cly4ev0p1ewo
Does no harm to name and shame, whether it makes much difference is another thing but anyone who does this then good enough for them, no sympathy.
I remember years ago seeing such cases in our local paper with offenders named.
Did not realise SF had instructed DfC back in 2020 not to publish names anymore, fail to see the reasoning / agenda behind this.
I don't get why some are so interested in who claimed what. Who cares? Anyway, its only loose change compared to the millions lost to big businesses tax evasion.
Naming them publicly, sure it's no different to someone in the paper for getting penalty points or a speeding fine. It'll be quickly forgotten about. You'll be lighting the fire with that paper tomorrow
G u a nosey lot!
I remember growing up in the 80s and nearly everyone was doing "the double" so I have more respect for those people than the lazy hoors lying about claiming all round them.
Quote from: AustinPowers on February 11, 2025, 09:55:59 PMQuote from: LC on February 11, 2025, 08:15:47 PMhttps://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cly4ev0p1ewo
Does no harm to name and shame, whether it makes much difference is another thing but anyone who does this then good enough for them, no sympathy.
I remember years ago seeing such cases in our local paper with offenders named.
Did not realise SF had instructed DfC back in 2020 not to publish names anymore, fail to see the reasoning / agenda behind this.
I don't get why some are so interested in who claimed what. Who cares? Anyway, its only loose change compared to the millions lost to big businesses tax evasion.
Naming them publicly, sure it's no different to someone in the paper for getting penalty points or a speeding fine. It'll be quickly forgotten about. You'll be lighting the fire with that paper tomorrow
If it's so quickly forgotten about why bother to not name. Surely if it acts as some small disincentive it's worthwhile.
Quote from: AustinPowers on February 11, 2025, 09:55:59 PMQuote from: LC on February 11, 2025, 08:15:47 PMhttps://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cly4ev0p1ewo
Does no harm to name and shame, whether it makes much difference is another thing but anyone who does this then good enough for them, no sympathy.
I remember years ago seeing such cases in our local paper with offenders named.
Did not realise SF had instructed DfC back in 2020 not to publish names anymore, fail to see the reasoning / agenda behind this.
I don't get why some are so interested in who claimed what. Who cares? Anyway, its only loose change compared to the millions lost to big businesses tax evasion.
Naming them publicly, sure it's no different to someone in the paper for getting penalty points or a speeding fine. It'll be quickly forgotten about. You'll be lighting the fire with that paper tomorrow
I have no issue with this in general but I think the public also need to be educated that since the Genting casino's case you can effectively accidentally commit benefit fraud because of the complicated rules that exists. Obviously there are people who have tried to defraud the system but I just worry that sometimes the nuance between those people and those who are confused by the system will be lost in the reporting.
Quote from: David McKeown on February 11, 2025, 10:27:39 PMQuote from: AustinPowers on February 11, 2025, 09:55:59 PMQuote from: LC on February 11, 2025, 08:15:47 PMhttps://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cly4ev0p1ewo
Does no harm to name and shame, whether it makes much difference is another thing but anyone who does this then good enough for them, no sympathy.
I remember years ago seeing such cases in our local paper with offenders named.
Did not realise SF had instructed DfC back in 2020 not to publish names anymore, fail to see the reasoning / agenda behind this.
I don't get why some are so interested in who claimed what. Who cares? Anyway, its only loose change compared to the millions lost to big businesses tax evasion.
Naming them publicly, sure it's no different to someone in the paper for getting penalty points or a speeding fine. It'll be quickly forgotten about. You'll be lighting the fire with that paper tomorrow
I have no issue with this in general but I think the public also need to be educated that since the Genting casino's case you can effectively accidentally commit benefit fraud because of the complicated rules that exists. Obviously there are people who have tried to defraud the system but I just worry that sometimes the nuance between those people and those who are confused by the system will be lost in the reporting.
;D come on David, you have been representing wrong 'uns for too long! I can imagine all the forms etc. aren't the easiest to navigate so people could get confused but surely there would be measures in place to resolve them and separate them from outright liars
Quote from: trileacman on February 11, 2025, 10:22:41 PMQuote from: AustinPowers on February 11, 2025, 09:55:59 PMQuote from: LC on February 11, 2025, 08:15:47 PMhttps://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cly4ev0p1ewo
Does no harm to name and shame, whether it makes much difference is another thing but anyone who does this then good enough for them, no sympathy.
I remember years ago seeing such cases in our local paper with offenders named.
Did not realise SF had instructed DfC back in 2020 not to publish names anymore, fail to see the reasoning / agenda behind this.
I don't get why some are so interested in who claimed what. Who cares? Anyway, its only loose change compared to the millions lost to big businesses tax evasion.
Naming them publicly, sure it's no different to someone in the paper for getting penalty points or a speeding fine. It'll be quickly forgotten about. You'll be lighting the fire with that paper tomorrow
If it's so quickly forgotten about why bother to not name. Surely if it acts as some small disincentive it's worthwhile.
Social media means that naming frausters lasts a lot longer and can be disovered in seconds via a search.
In many cases shame is the biggest punishment.
Quote from: Tony Baloney on February 11, 2025, 10:46:55 PMQuote from: David McKeown on February 11, 2025, 10:27:39 PMQuote from: AustinPowers on February 11, 2025, 09:55:59 PMQuote from: LC on February 11, 2025, 08:15:47 PMhttps://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cly4ev0p1ewo
Does no harm to name and shame, whether it makes much difference is another thing but anyone who does this then good enough for them, no sympathy.
I remember years ago seeing such cases in our local paper with offenders named.
Did not realise SF had instructed DfC back in 2020 not to publish names anymore, fail to see the reasoning / agenda behind this.
I don't get why some are so interested in who claimed what. Who cares? Anyway, its only loose change compared to the millions lost to big businesses tax evasion.
Naming them publicly, sure it's no different to someone in the paper for getting penalty points or a speeding fine. It'll be quickly forgotten about. You'll be lighting the fire with that paper tomorrow
I have no issue with this in general but I think the public also need to be educated that since the Genting casino's case you can effectively accidentally commit benefit fraud because of the complicated rules that exists. Obviously there are people who have tried to defraud the system but I just worry that sometimes the nuance between those people and those who are confused by the system will be lost in the reporting.
;D come on David, you have been representing wrong 'uns for too long! I can imagine all the forms etc. aren't the easiest to navigate so people could get confused but surely there would be measures in place to resolve them and separate them from outright liars
No not really not since the Genting case (which is actually a case about Phil Ivey the poker player and baccarat). I've represented plenty of both kinds and there's some who are confused by the forms but are still prosecuted. Sometimes there's even involvement from benefits officials who get the thing wrong. There's plenty who are wilfully dishonest as well and plenty who maybe didn't start out as dishonest but should have realised their errors.
I maybe effected by a case I did years ago that involved a women with a severe medical condition that left her bed ridden some days but perfectly fine on others. She was claiming at the time two benefits DLA and I cant remember which other one. When she had good days she would inform the jobs and benefits office as required and then work making sure not to exceed 16 hours a week. The office was only passing on the info on to one section that dealt with her that she could work and was working but didn't realise they had to inform the other section in the same building separately. For a bizarre reason she ended up investigated and taken to the Crown Court. Now she was acquitted but on the basis of irregularities in the investigation but I wouldn't have liked to have left that to a jury. I always thought that case was unfair and its not usual but there's been similar ones since.
A horrific policy, this is about pandering to peoples prejudices and from a supposedly Christian politician.
Marginal cases , folk incorrectly receiving benefits or making a mistake will carry this shame and perhaps not then claim for what they are owed, the fear and the cruelty of such a policy is the point. This group will get zero support to help them back to work it a better position. they will have a politicians boot on their head while being shouted at to get up.
Repeat offenders will not give two hoots about being named and will wear it as a badge of honour.
We don't name people (in NI anyway) who don't pay tax correctly or deliberately are late paying tax , but they are the right sort under this minister.
If the same amount of effort went into hounding tax dodgers as is applied to benefit cheats we'd have enough taxes to fund paradise. I don't consider myself left wing however the lack of empathy every time this policy is raised would drive you to the PBP gang.
Are people named and shamed like this in Britain? And if not, why make an exception for NI? Aren't all benefits a UK wide thing?
Looks to me like it's Stormont trying to look like they're doing something. Meanwhile , millions is squandered by inept gombeens up on the hill. But don't focus on that, look over there... johnny's doing a bit of painting and decorating while claiming the dole!
Quote from: AustinPowers on February 12, 2025, 10:49:32 AMAre people named and shamed like this in Britain? And if not, why make an exception for NI? Aren't all benefits a UK wide thing?
Looks to me like it's Stormont trying to look like they're doing something. Meanwhile , millions is squandered by inept gombeens up on the hill. But don't focus on that, look over there... johnny's doing a bit of painting and decorating while claiming the dole!
Blame the plebs and have us all at each others throats, classic political smokescreen.
All learned from Trump.
Blame the migrants for taking your jobs and benefits and houses, while they carry out one of the biggest scams enriching the rich in the name of America First.
It's all the same play book.
All bs. RHI, PPE and you name it are way bigger drains on the economy than this. The article on PPE about overspend on projects ond the PPE wastage of 96 million bigger problem than benefits fraud.
Sort out the bigger issues.
https://www.rte.ie/news/business/2025/0212/1496282-irish-based-meta-staff-told-of-job-cuts/
Send Zuckerburg in, Facebook looking to cut 5% of its lowest performing staff.
the big players in the IT world all doing that now. Must have cost themselves too much in layoffs this last few years.
Benefits fraud. Those bollacks on the hill done nothing for 5 yrs. They gonna pay bck the money they got for nothing!
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c4g7p7yxlpwo
No big surprise here, this is a can that Stormont to continue to kick down. Ultimately it will probably be like the manifestos of the all the main parties anyway, not worth paper it is printed on.
I wish Elon would send his 5 productive things you did last week email around Stormont.
Is there any difference between having a sitting stormont and a non sitting stormont? It is kind of hard to tell tbh.
Quote from: imtommygunn on February 26, 2025, 07:35:35 AMIs there any difference between having a sitting stormont and a non sitting stormont? It is kind of hard to tell tbh.
Constituency offices never closed (I think) and alot of their work is done there.
Quote from: RedHand88 on February 26, 2025, 07:37:29 AMQuote from: imtommygunn on February 26, 2025, 07:35:35 AMIs there any difference between having a sitting stormont and a non sitting stormont? It is kind of hard to tell tbh.
Constituency offices never closed (I think) and alot of their work is done there.
Constituency office can get something sorted for you, they aren't going to be passing legislation there or tackling any of the big issues that are outstanding. Not that they are in Stormont either
It is very hard to see that anything has been done since they came back and even some of them would say it themselves.
Quote from: Saffrongael on February 26, 2025, 09:14:25 AMQuote from: RedHand88 on February 26, 2025, 07:37:29 AMQuote from: imtommygunn on February 26, 2025, 07:35:35 AMIs there any difference between having a sitting stormont and a non sitting stormont? It is kind of hard to tell tbh.
Constituency offices never closed (I think) and alot of their work is done there.
Constituency office can get something sorted for you, they aren't going to be passing legislation there or tackling any of the big issues that are outstanding. Not that they are in Stormont either
Is that not what councillors are for?
We have the curse of a political system driven by client politics, combined with flag wrapped candidates. A culture then of getting into power but doing nothing with it meaning a total unwillingness to do anything which involves a trade off in choices and that someone might get less than they already get even if we ended up better off overall.
There is no jeopardy for our politicians because we won't vote on their record, why would they go about having one, they'll just bumble along, doing nothing and achieving nothing while celebrating basic outputs (a bus station or sorting a set of traffic lights) as grand achievements and the numpties (us) will keep voting for them.
P.s. the professionals in the Gaa should be fired over casement, no plan anything never mind a plan B.
https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/education/ni-school-at-centre-of-funding-row-got-13m-for-extension-two-months-before-600k-pitch-award/a1072701015.html
More DUP-ing it would seem relating to the same school that was in the news (some news anyway) recently regarding funding
Its a crazy set up:
In no particular order
Get the link between the Westlink and the M2 at Nelson street done
Get the road sorted out in Tyrone
Get Casement built in some fashion
Improve waiting times in hospitals (its horrendous)
Housing
and so on, stop talking about talking and start doing, is it any wonder the place is where its at
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on February 26, 2025, 12:25:12 PMIts a crazy set up:
In no particular order
Get the link between the Westlink and the M2 at Nelson street done
Get the road sorted out in Tyrone
Get Casement built in some fashion
Improve waiting times in hospitals (its horrendous)
Housing
and so on, stop talking about talking and start doing, is it any wonder the place is where its at
There's no incentive for them to do anything. No jeopardy. No consequences. People will just vote them in again .
Councils are no better. I read that a few of them are spending £50k plus on celebrations for VE Day. Like who gives a f**k about that? Between stupid stuff like that and spending a fortune cleaning up after 12th July bonfires , is it any wonder people's Rates are so high? They're all taking the piss, and they're all pissing away people's money.
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on February 26, 2025, 12:25:12 PMIts a crazy set up:
In no particular order
Get the link between the Westlink and the M2 at Nelson street done (Neutral, so might happen)
Get the road sorted out in Tyrone (For themmuns, so not happening, or at least without a fight)
Get Casement built in some fashion (as above)
Improve waiting times in hospitals (its horrendous) (Neutral, but may well meaning centralising certain key services to the detriment of the likes of Daisy Hill and Lagan Valley, both sides offended, so won't happen)
Housing (Depends if yer building Kaflick houses in loyalist area's or not)
and so on, stop talking about talking and start doing, is it any wonder the place is where its at
We can't escape the prism of green/orange in this shíthole of a place so don't deserve nice things.
Quote from: LC on February 26, 2025, 10:24:28 AMQuote from: Saffrongael on February 26, 2025, 09:14:25 AMConstituency office can get something sorted for you, they aren't going to be passing legislation there or tackling any of the big issues that are outstanding. Not that they are in Stormont either
Is that not what councillors are for?
The fact that you need an MLA or councilor to get something sorted for you is a sign of a dysfunctional political system. If there is something that some public service is supposed to provided for me then I should be able to get it resolved with them, without having to get a politician involved.
Quote from: LC on February 26, 2025, 10:24:28 AMQuote from: Saffrongael on February 26, 2025, 09:14:25 AMQuote from: RedHand88 on February 26, 2025, 07:37:29 AMQuote from: imtommygunn on February 26, 2025, 07:35:35 AMIs there any difference between having a sitting stormont and a non sitting stormont? It is kind of hard to tell tbh.
Constituency offices never closed (I think) and alot of their work is done there.
Constituency office can get something sorted for you, they aren't going to be passing legislation there or tackling any of the big issues that are outstanding. Not that they are in Stormont either
Is that not what councillors are for?
Quite a significant number of MLA Constituency Offices are staffed by sitting Councillors. So, they are paid from one public pot by Stormont during the day, in 1 guise & then they are paid from another public pot for being Councillors, in the evening. Bang the 2 together & you can easily lift a tidy £40K a year, for being an MLA Constituency Office worker & Councillor which, in effect, makes some of these Councillors full-timers.
Quote from: playwiththewind1st on February 26, 2025, 05:22:36 PMQuote from: LC on February 26, 2025, 10:24:28 AMQuote from: Saffrongael on February 26, 2025, 09:14:25 AMQuote from: RedHand88 on February 26, 2025, 07:37:29 AMQuote from: imtommygunn on February 26, 2025, 07:35:35 AMIs there any difference between having a sitting stormont and a non sitting stormont? It is kind of hard to tell tbh.
Constituency offices never closed (I think) and alot of their work is done there.
Constituency office can get something sorted for you, they aren't going to be passing legislation there or tackling any of the big issues that are outstanding. Not that they are in Stormont either
Is that not what councillors are for?
Quite a significant number of MLA Constituency Offices are staffed by sitting Councillors. So, they are paid from one public pot by Stormont during the day, in 1 guise & then they are paid from another public pot for being Councillors, in the evening. Bang the 2 together & you can easily lift a tidy £40K a year, for being an MLA Constituency Office worker & Councillor which, in effect, makes some of these Councillors full-timers.
A few of the councillors I know locally don't do this but they are far harder workers than my MLAs and more deserving of a full time wage
Quote from: dec on February 26, 2025, 04:11:40 PMQuote from: LC on February 26, 2025, 10:24:28 AMQuote from: Saffrongael on February 26, 2025, 09:14:25 AMConstituency office can get something sorted for you, they aren't going to be passing legislation there or tackling any of the big issues that are outstanding. Not that they are in Stormont either
Is that not what councillors are for?
The fact that you need an MLA or councilor to get something sorted for you is a sign of a dysfunctional political system. If there is something that some public service is supposed to provided for me then I should be able to get it resolved with them, without having to get a politician involved.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clientelism
Too many base level services require support to get access or provision.
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on February 26, 2025, 12:25:12 PMIts a crazy set up:
In no particular order
Get the link between the Westlink and the M2 at Nelson street done
Get the road sorted out in Tyrone
Get Casement built in some fashion
Improve waiting times in hospitals (its horrendous)
Housing
and so on, stop talking about talking and start doing, is it any wonder the place is where its at
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on February 26, 2025, 12:25:12 PMIts a crazy set up:
In no particular order
Get the link between the Westlink and the M2 at Nelson street done
Get the road sorted out in Tyrone
Get Casement built in some fashion
Improve waiting times in hospitals (its horrendous)
Housing
and so on, stop talking about talking and start doing, is it any wonder the place is where its at
Get the Algae in Lough Neagh sorted as well. A start would be to cancel Edwin poots crazy limit of 15% max fine for farmers who are repeat offenders.
Big boy politics needed here now but neither DUP or SF are prepared to do it as they are not popular and perceived as potential vote losing.
Same with water charges. We should all pay for our water here. Massive under investment over the decades is now coming back to bite us all with no housing allowed in most towns due to the sewerage system being at capacity.
50% of new cars purchased here are DLA...if that doesn't sum up how dysfunctional this place is then I don't know what is. A serious look under the bonnet there is required.
A nominal £2 charge for a prescription would also eliminate unnecessary doctor and a&e visits.
But again, none of these would be introduced as there would be too much of a backlash. We want everything for nothing in this place.
Prescription charges don't even raise that much. I can't mind the exact figure but it's a few million at most. Drop in the ocean of the health budget. But it is political suicide for any party to bring it back so its never going to happen.
Quote from: Silver hill on February 26, 2025, 09:12:47 PMQuote from: Milltown Row2 on February 26, 2025, 12:25:12 PMIts a crazy set up:
In no particular order
Get the link between the Westlink and the M2 at Nelson street done
Get the road sorted out in Tyrone
Get Casement built in some fashion
Improve waiting times in hospitals (its horrendous)
Housing
and so on, stop talking about talking and start doing, is it any wonder the place is where its at
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on February 26, 2025, 12:25:12 PMIts a crazy set up:
In no particular order
Get the link between the Westlink and the M2 at Nelson street done
Get the road sorted out in Tyrone
Get Casement built in some fashion
Improve waiting times in hospitals (its horrendous)
Housing
and so on, stop talking about talking and start doing, is it any wonder the place is where its at
Get the Algae in Lough Neagh sorted as well. A start would be to cancel Edwin poots crazy limit of 15% max fine for farmers who are repeat offenders.
Big boy politics needed here now but neither DUP or SF are prepared to do it as they are not popular and perceived as potential vote losing.
Same with water charges. We should all pay for our water here. Massive under investment over the decades is now coming back to bite us all with no housing allowed in most towns due to the sewerage system being at capacity.
50% of new cars purchased here are DLA...if that doesn't sum up how dysfunctional this place is then I don't know what is. A serious look under the bonnet there is required.
A nominal £2 charge for a prescription would also eliminate unnecessary doctor and a&e visits.
But again, none of these would be introduced as there would be too much of a backlash. We want everything for nothing in this place.
I would not be surprised that in certain parts of Belfast and Derry is where you find most of the DLA wagons, indeed I think the late Gerry Anderson referred to it as the Derry Living Allowance. Drive through these same places the retail mix is primarily fast food takeouts, off licenses and pharmacists, a vicious cycle.
Quote from: LC on February 26, 2025, 09:44:49 PMQuote from: Silver hill on February 26, 2025, 09:12:47 PMQuote from: Milltown Row2 on February 26, 2025, 12:25:12 PMIts a crazy set up:
In no particular order
Get the link between the Westlink and the M2 at Nelson street done
Get the road sorted out in Tyrone
Get Casement built in some fashion
Improve waiting times in hospitals (its horrendous)
Housing
and so on, stop talking about talking and start doing, is it any wonder the place is where its at
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on February 26, 2025, 12:25:12 PMIts a crazy set up:
In no particular order
Get the link between the Westlink and the M2 at Nelson street done
Get the road sorted out in Tyrone
Get Casement built in some fashion
Improve waiting times in hospitals (its horrendous)
Housing
and so on, stop talking about talking and start doing, is it any wonder the place is where its at
Get the Algae in Lough Neagh sorted as well. A start would be to cancel Edwin poots crazy limit of 15% max fine for farmers who are repeat offenders.
Big boy politics needed here now but neither DUP or SF are prepared to do it as they are not popular and perceived as potential vote losing.
Same with water charges. We should all pay for our water here. Massive under investment over the decades is now coming back to bite us all with no housing allowed in most towns due to the sewerage system being at capacity.
50% of new cars purchased here are DLA...if that doesn't sum up how dysfunctional this place is then I don't know what is. A serious look under the bonnet there is required.
A nominal £2 charge for a prescription would also eliminate unnecessary doctor and a&e visits.
But again, none of these would be introduced as there would be too much of a backlash. We want everything for nothing in this place.
I would not be surprised that in certain parts of Belfast and Derry is where you find most of the DLA wagons, indeed I think the late Gerry Anderson referred to it as the Derry Living Allowance. Drive through these same places the retail mix is primarily fast food takeouts, off licenses and pharmacists, a vicious cycle.
It was the Derry Liquor Allowance when I was growing up.
Quote from: LC on February 26, 2025, 09:44:49 PMQuote from: Silver hill on February 26, 2025, 09:12:47 PMQuote from: Milltown Row2 on February 26, 2025, 12:25:12 PMIts a crazy set up:
In no particular order
Get the link between the Westlink and the M2 at Nelson street done
Get the road sorted out in Tyrone
Get Casement built in some fashion
Improve waiting times in hospitals (its horrendous)
Housing
and so on, stop talking about talking and start doing, is it any wonder the place is where its at
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on February 26, 2025, 12:25:12 PMIts a crazy set up:
In no particular order
Get the link between the Westlink and the M2 at Nelson street done
Get the road sorted out in Tyrone
Get Casement built in some fashion
Improve waiting times in hospitals (its horrendous)
Housing
and so on, stop talking about talking and start doing, is it any wonder the place is where its at
Get the Algae in Lough Neagh sorted as well. A start would be to cancel Edwin poots crazy limit of 15% max fine for farmers who are repeat offenders.
Big boy politics needed here now but neither DUP or SF are prepared to do it as they are not popular and perceived as potential vote losing.
Same with water charges. We should all pay for our water here. Massive under investment over the decades is now coming back to bite us all with no housing allowed in most towns due to the sewerage system being at capacity.
50% of new cars purchased here are DLA...if that doesn't sum up how dysfunctional this place is then I don't know what is. A serious look under the bonnet there is required.
A nominal £2 charge for a prescription would also eliminate unnecessary doctor and a&e visits.
But again, none of these would be introduced as there would be too much of a backlash. We want everything for nothing in this place.
I would not be surprised that in certain parts of Belfast and Derry is where you find most of the DLA wagons, indeed I think the late Gerry Anderson referred to it as the Derry Living Allowance. Drive through these same places the retail mix is primarily fast food takeouts, off licenses and pharmacists, a vicious cycle.
Certainly describes Lisburn Road and Ballyhackamore alright.
35% of houses in Belfast don't have a car or van, most of those in perceived less affluent neighbourhoods.
Not in favour of prescription charges, I am in favour of a refundable charge for booking a gp appointment, turn up or get charged.
Remove the cap on household rates - millionaires getting subsidies, tax derelict buildings, do something with your buildings or donate it to the state.
The difficult issue of the worried well (the folk who walk out of one gp appointment and immediately book another one for a month later just in case) needs addressed.
Leave the west link alone (well maybe close some of the slip roads) will never be enough roads, volume of cars and vans has gone up 400% in 40 years. All funding and schemes need to be on making it easier to get out of the car on public transport or goods by rail - not by road.
Belfast and Derry need a congestion charge
on anything over a 1.2L engine air quality is brutal and it's city folk breathing it with the long term health costs.
Get rid of the transfer test, inflicting misery on wains in a rigged system, political cowardice, avoid postcode school selection by requiring schools to have a spread of intake, publish school results and ensure schools are not excluding folk at 16 to juice the results.
Stop asking politicians what they are going to do - ask them what they have done, most have a pretty short list of achievements.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/ckgdykn0zrgo
NI nepotism at its very best it would seem in the Education Authority:
Chief Executive - Husband of the Deputy FM
Chairperson of the Board - Mervyn Storey (DUP)
Board Member - Peter Weir (DUP)
What is next I wonder, senior positions for Ian Og and that clown Nelson McCausland.
Quote from: BigGreenField on February 26, 2025, 10:16:40 PMCertainly describes Lisburn Road and Ballyhackamore alright.
You seem to be mixing up fast food outlets with coffee shops.
For about ten years, every time I went home, the Lisburn Road was like the scene in the Simpsons where all the stores in the mall turn into a Starbucks. New coffee shop in every block etc., and most of them not very good ones. Seems to have plateaued a bit.
Quote from: BigGreenField on February 26, 2025, 10:16:40 PMQuote from: LC on February 26, 2025, 09:44:49 PMQuote from: Silver hill on February 26, 2025, 09:12:47 PMQuote from: Milltown Row2 on February 26, 2025, 12:25:12 PMIts a crazy set up:
In no particular order
Get the link between the Westlink and the M2 at Nelson street done
Get the road sorted out in Tyrone
Get Casement built in some fashion
Improve waiting times in hospitals (its horrendous)
Housing
and so on, stop talking about talking and start doing, is it any wonder the place is where its at
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on February 26, 2025, 12:25:12 PMIts a crazy set up:
In no particular order
Get the link between the Westlink and the M2 at Nelson street done
Get the road sorted out in Tyrone
Get Casement built in some fashion
Improve waiting times in hospitals (its horrendous)
Housing
and so on, stop talking about talking and start doing, is it any wonder the place is where its at
Get the Algae in Lough Neagh sorted as well. A start would be to cancel Edwin poots crazy limit of 15% max fine for farmers who are repeat offenders.
Big boy politics needed here now but neither DUP or SF are prepared to do it as they are not popular and perceived as potential vote losing.
Same with water charges. We should all pay for our water here. Massive under investment over the decades is now coming back to bite us all with no housing allowed in most towns due to the sewerage system being at capacity.
50% of new cars purchased here are DLA...if that doesn't sum up how dysfunctional this place is then I don't know what is. A serious look under the bonnet there is required.
A nominal £2 charge for a prescription would also eliminate unnecessary doctor and a&e visits.
But again, none of these would be introduced as there would be too much of a backlash. We want everything for nothing in this place.
I would not be surprised that in certain parts of Belfast and Derry is where you find most of the DLA wagons, indeed I think the late Gerry Anderson referred to it as the Derry Living Allowance. Drive through these same places the retail mix is primarily fast food takeouts, off licenses and pharmacists, a vicious cycle.
Certainly describes Lisburn Road and Ballyhackamore alright.
35% of houses in Belfast don't have a car or van, most of those in perceived less affluent neighbourhoods.
Not in favour of prescription charges, I am in favour of a refundable charge for booking a gp appointment, turn up or get charged. I am in favour of prescription charges, people take the piss with free stuff, homes are full of unused drug presciptions on one hand and too many are over medicated on the other.
Remove the cap on household rates - millionaires getting subsidies, tax derelict buildings, do something with your buildings or donate it to the state. +1
The difficult issue of the worried well (the folk who walk out of one gp appointment and immediately book another one for a month later just in case) needs addressed.Public health education is a clown show, it is invariably based around a fear narrative so this is the response.
Leave the west link alone (well maybe close some of the slip roads) will never be enough roads, volume of cars and vans has gone up 400% in 40 years. All funding and schemes need to be on making it easier to get out of the car on public transport or goods by rail - not by road. Big investment in a user friendly, cost friendly mass transport system is the only thing that will take vehicles off the road. Building more bigger roads will only result in more vehicles, look at the M50.
Belfast and Derry need a congestion charge
on anything over a 1.2L engine air quality is brutal and it's city folk breathing it with the long term health costs. Fix public transport first.
Get rid of the transfer test, inflicting misery on wains in a rigged system, political cowardice, avoid postcode school selection by requiring schools to have a spread of intake, publish school results and ensure schools are not excluding folk at 16 to juice the results. Think there has to be some sort of process to help guide kids to the right school, I would outlaw coaching, pushy parents have to be more realistic. The whole system is a meat grinder where competition for funding takes precedence over the appropriate education of our children.
Stop asking politicians what they are going to do - ask them what they have done, most have a pretty short list of achievements. +1
I think the design of casement needs to be re-visited with a fresh business plan around opportunities and value for money. A marquee stadium and concert venue for the North, bringing significant investment into West Belfast would be some statement .
They should employ whoever is doing the new IFA centre. According to bbcni website they're building a state of the art , centre of excellence , 50 acre green field site , 5 pitches , 1 indoors, with spectator , meeting and medical facilities , all for £8-10 million. Must be a different contractor doing that refurbishment of the school pitch in Derry for £710000, though I see that's not a problem as the EA don't need to apply to themselves for that money🙈.
The BBC also took the opportunity to flag up the estimate of £450m for Casement to meet UEFA specification!
Call me paranoid 🙈🤔
Quote from: BigGreenField on February 26, 2025, 10:16:40 PMQuote from: LC on February 26, 2025, 09:44:49 PMQuote from: Silver hill on February 26, 2025, 09:12:47 PMQuote from: Milltown Row2 on February 26, 2025, 12:25:12 PMIts a crazy set up:
In no particular order
Get the link between the Westlink and the M2 at Nelson street done
Get the road sorted out in Tyrone
Get Casement built in some fashion
Improve waiting times in hospitals (its horrendous)
Housing
and so on, stop talking about talking and start doing, is it any wonder the place is where its at
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on February 26, 2025, 12:25:12 PMIts a crazy set up:
In no particular order
Get the link between the Westlink and the M2 at Nelson street done
Get the road sorted out in Tyrone
Get Casement built in some fashion
Improve waiting times in hospitals (its horrendous)
Housing
and so on, stop talking about talking and start doing, is it any wonder the place is where its at
Get the Algae in Lough Neagh sorted as well. A start would be to cancel Edwin poots crazy limit of 15% max fine for farmers who are repeat offenders.
Big boy politics needed here now but neither DUP or SF are prepared to do it as they are not popular and perceived as potential vote losing.
Same with water charges. We should all pay for our water here. Massive under investment over the decades is now coming back to bite us all with no housing allowed in most towns due to the sewerage system being at capacity.
50% of new cars purchased here are DLA...if that doesn't sum up how dysfunctional this place is then I don't know what is. A serious look under the bonnet there is required.
A nominal £2 charge for a prescription would also eliminate unnecessary doctor and a&e visits.
But again, none of these would be introduced as there would be too much of a backlash. We want everything for nothing in this place.
I would not be surprised that in certain parts of Belfast and Derry is where you find most of the DLA wagons, indeed I think the late Gerry Anderson referred to it as the Derry Living Allowance. Drive through these same places the retail mix is primarily fast food takeouts, off licenses and pharmacists, a vicious cycle.
Certainly describes Lisburn Road and Ballyhackamore alright.
35% of houses in Belfast don't have a car or van, most of those in perceived less affluent neighbourhoods.
Not in favour of prescription charges, I am in favour of a refundable charge for booking a gp appointment, turn up or get charged.
Remove the cap on household rates - millionaires getting subsidies, tax derelict buildings, do something with your buildings or donate it to the state.
The difficult issue of the worried well (the folk who walk out of one gp appointment and immediately book another one for a month later just in case) needs addressed.
Leave the west link alone (well maybe close some of the slip roads) will never be enough roads, volume of cars and vans has gone up 400% in 40 years. All funding and schemes need to be on making it easier to get out of the car on public transport or goods by rail - not by road.
Belfast and Derry need a congestion charge
on anything over a 1.2L engine air quality is brutal and it's city folk breathing it with the long term health costs.
Get rid of the transfer test, inflicting misery on wains in a rigged system, political cowardice, avoid postcode school selection by requiring schools to have a spread of intake, publish school results and ensure schools are not excluding folk at 16 to juice the results.
Stop asking politicians what they are going to do - ask them what they have done, most have a pretty short list of achievements.
Serious question, what is wrong with the transfer test?
No issues from my experience with my kids, they did it, no tuition, two passed one didn't and there wasn't any issues for them going forward in different level of schools, my only concern for me was finding a school where I live for my daughters had they not passed, as the local secondary schools are very poor and in the local loyalist estate, so sending them there was not option, my lad lived with his mom so he went his local school with his friends and enjoy it, ish!
Until you show me a local school that has a grading system in place and that caters for all levels and is not made up of one crowd over the other then I'll buy into that, thankfully I'm past worrying about schools for the kids.
I see ye now have a Programme for Governnent.
A new golden age begins......
Quote from: Rossfan on February 27, 2025, 06:54:54 PMI see ye now have a Programme for Governnent.
A new golden age begins......
Baby steps. Check progress every 5 years...
Quote from: Tony Baloney on February 27, 2025, 08:26:21 PMQuote from: Rossfan on February 27, 2025, 06:54:54 PMI see ye now have a Programme for Governnent.
A new golden age begins......
Baby steps. Check progress every 5 years...
Has Stormont ever went 5 years without collapsing?
Has little Emma from Markethill been to watch an Armagh match yet?
Quote from: Orior on February 28, 2025, 01:23:29 PMHas little Emma from Markethill been to watch an Armagh match yet?
She's been spotted at a few Mullabrack games
Quote from: general_lee on February 28, 2025, 01:35:41 PMQuote from: Orior on February 28, 2025, 01:23:29 PMHas little Emma from Markethill been to watch an Armagh match yet?
She's been spotted at a few Mullabrack games
Seriously? Remember, I believe everything I read.
Quote from: Orior on February 28, 2025, 03:20:32 PMQuote from: general_lee on February 28, 2025, 01:35:41 PMQuote from: Orior on February 28, 2025, 01:23:29 PMHas little Emma from Markethill been to watch an Armagh match yet?
She's been spotted at a few Mullabrack games
Seriously? Remember, I believe everything I read.
Sorry Markethill Swifts Reserves. I always mix those two up.
Easy mistake to make General don't beat yourself up about it
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/ce8vvzg2n6mo
No doubt this document will be an example of Chat GPT at its finest.
Quote from: LC on March 03, 2025, 10:48:29 AMhttps://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/ce8vvzg2n6mo
No doubt this document will be an example of Chat GPT at its finest.
DRAFT
Quote from: LC on March 03, 2025, 10:48:29 AMhttps://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/ce8vvzg2n6mo
No doubt this document will be an example of Chat GPT at its finest.
Nearly 6000 social houses in 3 years ;D Why do they put such rubbish on paper?!
Quote from: Tony Baloney on March 03, 2025, 11:57:14 AMQuote from: LC on March 03, 2025, 10:48:29 AMhttps://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/ce8vvzg2n6mo
No doubt this document will be an example of Chat GPT at its finest.
Nearly 6000 social houses in 3 years ;D Why do they put such rubbish on paper?!
There's 3-4000 being built in 9ne part of Derry alone at out the Buncrana, a fairly hefty % will be social housing.
There's another big development near Gransha which was originally 70% private and 30% social.. After a reck of private houses were sold they flipped it and now 70% are social. Lousy on the private buyers as a few 'interesting' families have already been relocated there out of other social housing estates
I'm all for social housing as long as it's not on my doorstep
It's a tough one for some to take, but there's never an estate too far away from a residential area anyways
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on March 03, 2025, 07:27:27 PMI'm all for social housing as long as it's not on my doorstep
It's a tough one for some to take, but there's never an estate too far away from a residential area anyways
Any land sold nowadays for housing developments has to have a percentage of social builds as far as I know
Quote from: JoG2 on March 03, 2025, 07:23:42 PMQuote from: Tony Baloney on March 03, 2025, 11:57:14 AMQuote from: LC on March 03, 2025, 10:48:29 AMhttps://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/ce8vvzg2n6mo
No doubt this document will be an example of Chat GPT at its finest.
Nearly 6000 social houses in 3 years ;D Why do they put such rubbish on paper?!
There's 3-4000 being built in 9ne part of Derry alone at out the Buncrana, a fairly hefty % will be social housing.
There's another big development near Gransha which was originally 70% private and 30% social.. After a reck of private houses were sold they flipped it and now 70% are social. Lousy on the private buyers as a few 'interesting' families have already been relocated there out of other social housing estates
Drove by them a few times, the best of houses.
Why work when you can get a free house, it is a vicious cycle in that their offspring will grow up in a culture when there is a sense of entitlement all their lives. These people will catch every illness under the sun except the ability to work.
Quote from: LC on March 03, 2025, 10:04:03 PMQuote from: JoG2 on March 03, 2025, 07:23:42 PMQuote from: Tony Baloney on March 03, 2025, 11:57:14 AMQuote from: LC on March 03, 2025, 10:48:29 AMhttps://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/ce8vvzg2n6mo
No doubt this document will be an example of Chat GPT at its finest.
Nearly 6000 social houses in 3 years ;D Why do they put such rubbish on paper?!
There's 3-4000 being built in 9ne part of Derry alone at out the Buncrana, a fairly hefty % will be social housing.
There's another big development near Gransha which was originally 70% private and 30% social.. After a reck of private houses were sold they flipped it and now 70% are social. Lousy on the private buyers as a few 'interesting' families have already been relocated there out of other social housing estates
Drove by them a few times, the best of houses.
Why work when you can get a free house, it is a vicious cycle in that their offspring will grow up in a culture when there is a sense of entitlement all their lives. These people will catch every illness under the sun except the ability to work.
Forgive my ignorance but there are a lot of people in social housing paying rent as well as those on UC.
Quote from: johnnycool on March 04, 2025, 08:04:55 AMQuote from: LC on March 03, 2025, 10:04:03 PMQuote from: JoG2 on March 03, 2025, 07:23:42 PMQuote from: Tony Baloney on March 03, 2025, 11:57:14 AMQuote from: LC on March 03, 2025, 10:48:29 AMhttps://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/ce8vvzg2n6mo
No doubt this document will be an example of Chat GPT at its finest.
Nearly 6000 social houses in 3 years ;D Why do they put such rubbish on paper?!
There's 3-4000 being built in 9ne part of Derry alone at out the Buncrana, a fairly hefty % will be social housing.
There's another big development near Gransha which was originally 70% private and 30% social.. After a reck of private houses were sold they flipped it and now 70% are social. Lousy on the private buyers as a few 'interesting' families have already been relocated there out of other social housing estates
Drove by them a few times, the best of houses.
Why work when you can get a free house, it is a vicious cycle in that their offspring will grow up in a culture when there is a sense of entitlement all their lives. These people will catch every illness under the sun except the ability to work.
Forgive my ignorance but there are a lot of people in social housing paying rent as well as those on UC.
Think it's about a 70/30 split normally. Social housing rents are paid in full on Universal Credit, whereby private sector is capped and you may have to contribute to the rent.
And NIW wont approved sewage connections for any of it.
I see that Paisley Junior has landed a directorship of some company, or other. Clearly, the Free Presbyterians cannot, or won't, recognise a total spiv, when they see one. How long before he is struck off?
Is Evangelical Protestantism still prominent in certain parts of the North and would the DUP's base still be mostly grounded in it?
I heard the phrase years ago 'good living for a living' definitely applies to a lot of them boys.
https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cyve9p8v23ro
The trial of former Democratic Unionist Party (DUP) leader Sir Jeffrey Donaldson and his wife Lady Eleanor Donaldson on sex abuse charges is to be delayed.
It was due to begin on 24 March but Newry Crown Court has been told Mrs Donaldson, 58, is "unfit to stand trial" at present.
No details of her illness were given in court.
Sir Jeffrey denies 18 offences, including one count of rape and others of indecent assault and gross indecency while his wife denies five charges of aiding and abetting his alleged offending.
The offences allegedly occurred between 1985 and 2008.
Granting an adjournment application by Mrs Donaldson's lawyer, Judge Paul Ramsey said he will review the situation on 16 May.
The court heard medical evidence has been submitted by Mrs Donaldson's doctor.
A prosecution lawyer said the delay will upset the two alleged victims in the case.
Describing them as "vulnerable complainants", she said they will be "emotionally affected" by the development.
The lawyer added the prosecution accepts the issue with Mrs Donaldson's health at present.
He was never not sick enough, to attend parliament in England.
This has been their plan from day 1. When it was decided that they would stand trial together, all it would take was for Mrs Donaldson to become "ill" and to have the trial to be postponed indefinitely. Jeffrey should have his bail revoked until Eleanor becomes well enough to stand trial along side him.
The old 'too ill to face trial' card, who'd have guessed? Delay, delay, delay and hope the victims throw the head up.
Are yous all suggesting the GP is in on it too, fabricating a medical report?
Quote from: RedHand88 on March 14, 2025, 05:03:33 PMAre yous all suggesting the GP is in on it too, fabricating a medical report?
She could say she has depression I guess and a GP is hardly going to say she hasn't
Quote from: Deerstalker on March 14, 2025, 05:25:48 PMQuote from: RedHand88 on March 14, 2025, 05:03:33 PMAre yous all suggesting the GP is in on it too, fabricating a medical report?
She could say she has depression I guess and a GP is hardly going to say she hasn't
It's not that easy. Also may not be a GP but secondary care. Article just says doctor.
I see Ian Og running about Washington in a tux. Did the voters not put him off the scene. Who is picking up his tab?
If getting a doctor to say you are too ill to stand trial is or isn't a valid position to take. It shouldn't prevent your co-accused trial going ahead.
Any chance Jeffrey will use his ace card again, saying he had death threats?
It worked last time... sort of
Quote from: RedHand88 on March 14, 2025, 05:03:33 PMAre yous all suggesting the GP is in on it too, fabricating a medical report?
Ah now its not hard to bluff a GP
Manipulation of the legal system is as old as the courts.
Avoiding a trial by using whatever excuses are available, won't do you any favours with the jury when the trial goes ahead.
Quote from: Windmill abu on March 14, 2025, 10:09:35 PMIf getting a doctor to say you are too ill to stand trial is or isn't a valid position to take. It shouldn't prevent your co-accused trial going ahead.
Yes it should. Otherwise victims would have to relive the trauma twice in court.
Quote from: Windmill abu on March 15, 2025, 12:17:35 AMManipulation of the legal system is as old as the courts.
Avoiding a trial by using whatever excuses are available, won't do you any favours with the jury when the trial goes ahead.
The jury shouldn't know. Probably hard to avoid in a high profile case like this but the jury will be warned.
Quote from: David McKeown on March 15, 2025, 08:48:06 AMQuote from: Windmill abu on March 14, 2025, 10:09:35 PMIf getting a doctor to say you are too ill to stand trial is or isn't a valid position to take. It shouldn't prevent your co-accused trial going ahead.
Yes it should. Otherwise victims would have to relive the trauma twice in court.
If the victim has already given evidence in court and has been cross examined by a defence barrister. Couldn't that testimony be used in the other associated trial?
Quote from: Windmill abu on March 15, 2025, 11:07:25 AMQuote from: David McKeown on March 15, 2025, 08:48:06 AMQuote from: Windmill abu on March 14, 2025, 10:09:35 PMIf getting a doctor to say you are too ill to stand trial is or isn't a valid position to take. It shouldn't prevent your co-accused trial going ahead.
Yes it should. Otherwise victims would have to relive the trauma twice in court.
If the victim has already given evidence in court and has been cross examined by a defence barrister. Couldn't that testimony be used in the other associated trial?
No
What's the bets Gordan Lyons will choose to attend the Antrim Armagh match hoping it won't go ahead
Quote from: Brendan on March 15, 2025, 11:33:30 AMWhat's the bets Gordan Lyons will choose to attend the Antrim Armagh match hoping it won't go ahead
Lol 4d chess right there.
Quote from: Brendan on March 15, 2025, 11:33:30 AMWhat's the bets Gordan Lyons will choose to attend the Antrim Armagh match hoping it won't go ahead
As a proud Antrim man I'd have no doubt that's his pick!
Gordon, Emma & Co getting good press and exposure this week in Washington. Rarely happens like that for them.
Nationalist politicians missing in action. They did give their reasons.
Quote from: David McKeown on March 15, 2025, 08:48:06 AMQuote from: Windmill abu on March 14, 2025, 10:09:35 PMIf getting a doctor to say you are too ill to stand trial is or isn't a valid position to take. It shouldn't prevent your co-accused trial going ahead.
Yes it should. Otherwise victims would have to relive the trauma twice in court.
I take it there is protections in place to ensure at some point the trial will go ahead?
Can the victims request it so?
Otherwise it seems a very easy out.
Quote from: RadioGAAGAA on March 15, 2025, 09:22:02 PMQuote from: David McKeown on March 15, 2025, 08:48:06 AMQuote from: Windmill abu on March 14, 2025, 10:09:35 PMIf getting a doctor to say you are too ill to stand trial is or isn't a valid position to take. It shouldn't prevent your co-accused trial going ahead.
Yes it should. Otherwise victims would have to relive the trauma twice in court.
I take it there is protections in place to ensure at some point the trial will go ahead?
Can the victims request it so?
Otherwise it seems a very easy out.
As I have already said it is a means to prevent a trial proceeding. The best way to prevent this is to revoke all bail and then we will see if the illness is genuine or a delaying tactic.
Quote from: RadioGAAGAA on March 15, 2025, 09:22:02 PMQuote from: David McKeown on March 15, 2025, 08:48:06 AMQuote from: Windmill abu on March 14, 2025, 10:09:35 PMIf getting a doctor to say you are too ill to stand trial is or isn't a valid position to take. It shouldn't prevent your co-accused trial going ahead.
Yes it should. Otherwise victims would have to relive the trauma twice in court.
I take it there is protections in place to ensure at some point the trial will go ahead?
Can the victims request it so?
Otherwise it seems a very easy out.
Generally speaking there has to be good reason for a trial not to go ahead. It's up to Judges to manage the competing interests in that regard and there's plenty of things can be done but it's also hard to look behind a verified medical issue and I don't really think it should be looked behind.
Ultimately trials will run unless defendants die. It's very very difficult to delay trials indefinitely.
Quote from: Windmill abu on March 15, 2025, 10:25:36 PMQuote from: RadioGAAGAA on March 15, 2025, 09:22:02 PMQuote from: David McKeown on March 15, 2025, 08:48:06 AMQuote from: Windmill abu on March 14, 2025, 10:09:35 PMIf getting a doctor to say you are too ill to stand trial is or isn't a valid position to take. It shouldn't prevent your co-accused trial going ahead.
Yes it should. Otherwise victims would have to relive the trauma twice in court.
I take it there is protections in place to ensure at some point the trial will go ahead?
Can the victims request it so?
Otherwise it seems a very easy out.
As I have already said it is a means to prevent a trial proceeding. The best way to prevent this is to revoke all bail and then we will see if the illness is genuine or a delaying tactic.
That most certainly is not the best way to do it.
Dup losing its rag over a rounding error in the Grand Central station budget would drive you to distraction and make you think Jim Allister has a point on mandatory coalition. They have one job (from their perspective) which is to make NI a vaguely welcoming place to live and that would be enough to hold any lid on momentum for a border poll and they just can't do it! Jesus wept.
Is this sickness issue not out of Harvey Weinstein playbook? Surely past history of sickness needs to come into play?
Quote from: Wildweasel74 on April 03, 2025, 10:16:28 PMIs this sickness issue not out of Harvey Weinstein playbook? Surely past history of sickness needs to come into play?
It's very hard to look behind a medical letter from a doctor stating someone is unable to stand trial. If the issue was to continue the Court would examine in greater detail the nature of the issue and would make a decision on how to proceed balancing the triangulation of interests of the public, the prosecution and the defence.
There are all manner of possibilities here. You really wonder of her role in this. Is she a bad one? Is there a huge element of coercive control? Is there now remorse and this has made her sick. You just wouldn't know.
When iris robinson had her fame she was ill. People didn't believe it but I know people who had dealt with her for a good while before all that came out came out. Not always a lie but I guess it could be.
Mick Nesbit is turning (physically) into Wee Jeffery !
In fairness how in the f**k do signs cost £150k?
Quote from: Armagh18 on April 03, 2025, 11:15:44 PMIn fairness how in the f**k do signs cost £150k?
I'd say anything that goes through government procurement processes gets multiplied compared to the normal market.
Setting aside the £150k for Irish Signs was the £300m Grand Central Station even needed in the first place?
You can't have a station that doesn't have a train that goes to Dublin directly.. I've been through it several times it's pretty good and modern in comparison to many stations in other cities
Why was there no executive meeting about the pitch at the school in Derry?
Is that not controversial?
Btw, who decides what's controvertical and what's not?
The DUP had no input on the school pitch in Derry, never had, decision took in EA on the work programme, school had been on the backlog 5yrs.
Quote from: Wildweasel74 on April 04, 2025, 07:40:40 AMThe DUP had no input on the school pitch in Derry, never had, decision took in EA on the work programme, school had been on the backlog 5yrs.
For the pitch renovation that they didn't apply for?
Quote from: johnnycool on April 04, 2025, 08:22:31 AMQuote from: Wildweasel74 on April 04, 2025, 07:40:40 AMThe DUP had no input on the school pitch in Derry, never had, decision took in EA on the work programme, school had been on the backlog 5yrs.
For the pitch renovation that they didn't apply for?
Fair play to Garret Hargan from the Belfast Tele for not letting this story lie ,quote from recent article below ,
"An upgraded football pitch at Lisneal College was prioritised after emails from the school principal and a pitch inspection in 2019 — without the need for a formal application.
Funding approval was ultimately given for the pitch months after a private meeting between the principal, DUP Education Minister Paul Givan, Communities Minister Gordon Lyons and Foyle MLA Gary Middleton in June 2024."
Lyons just recently signed off £250k to go towards the celebration of Americans independence from the brits....WTF
Quote from: LC on April 04, 2025, 06:13:41 AMSetting aside the £150k for Irish Signs was the £300m Grand Central Station even needed in the first place?
In the long term probably yes (something I've changed my mind on) although it's over cooked on spec as have never seen anyone go upstairs and odd with open air platforms will long term be a pain. having cross border services finish there is probably right, although I miss the wee man shouting out "Augher Clogher, Fivemiletown" at the Europa station. The choice of a scanned qr ticket system is antiquated.
Removing cross city services though (having to change at GC) is daft.
Lack of oversight on spend and general competence in anything appears to be a major issue across the governing parties, Andrew Muir (who I think is well intentioned) got skewered on radio this morning when asked about urgent action and his response was something along the lines of "I've authorised a consultation". Politicians need to accept they are in charge and make things happened , at both executive and councils level they appear to be led by the nose by officials.
Quote from: Wildweasel74 on April 04, 2025, 07:40:40 AMThe DUP had no input on the school pitch in Derry, never had, decision took in EA on the work programme, school had been on the backlog 5yrs.
Was Girvan of the DUP and Lyons of the DUP not heavily involved in that decision?
Quote from: marty34 on April 04, 2025, 10:44:43 AMQuote from: Wildweasel74 on April 04, 2025, 07:40:40 AMThe DUP had no input on the school pitch in Derry, never had, decision took in EA on the work programme, school had been on the backlog 5yrs.
Was Girvan of the DUP and Lyons of the DUP not heavily involved in that decision?
Quote from: marty34 on April 04, 2025, 10:44:43 AMQuote from: Wildweasel74 on April 04, 2025, 07:40:40 AMThe DUP had no input on the school pitch in Derry, never had, decision took in EA on the work programme, school had been on the backlog 5yrs.
Was Girvan of the DUP and Lyons of the DUP not heavily involved in that decision?
Of course they were , Funding not applied for and EA signed off after a private meeting between School Principal and Lyons / Given / Middleton
Quote from: Newbridge Exile on April 04, 2025, 10:57:00 AMQuote from: marty34 on April 04, 2025, 10:44:43 AMQuote from: Wildweasel74 on April 04, 2025, 07:40:40 AMThe DUP had no input on the school pitch in Derry, never had, decision took in EA on the work programme, school had been on the backlog 5yrs.
Was Girvan of the DUP and Lyons of the DUP not heavily involved in that decision?
Quote from: marty34 on April 04, 2025, 10:44:43 AMQuote from: Wildweasel74 on April 04, 2025, 07:40:40 AMThe DUP had no input on the school pitch in Derry, never had, decision took in EA on the work programme, school had been on the backlog 5yrs.
Was Girvan of the DUP and Lyons of the DUP not heavily involved in that decision?
Of course they were , Funding not applied for and EA signed off after a private meeting between School Principal and Lyons / Given / Middleton
Why is there no judical review about that?
SF are too soft.
Know for a fact they weren't. School principal had put in to EA grounds on the condition of the pitch. They reviewed it. Done a patch up with the long term replacement recommended. It was on hold due to budget constraints cause Sinn Fein were out 3yrs and the DUP 2yrs. Everything wss running on do minimum to that shit show was sorted out.Lad from the Irish News hasn't a clue. Non'-controlled school threshold been £1million for a long time. Don't remember a fuss when I had met ole Gerry with principal to look at capital works at a west Belfast school. They ended up getting all theirs pushed through, and the school up the road who wouldn't deal with him got nothing.
Quote from: marty34 on April 04, 2025, 11:52:49 AMQuote from: Newbridge Exile on April 04, 2025, 10:57:00 AMQuote from: marty34 on April 04, 2025, 10:44:43 AMQuote from: Wildweasel74 on April 04, 2025, 07:40:40 AMThe DUP had no input on the school pitch in Derry, never had, decision took in EA on the work programme, school had been on the backlog 5yrs.
Was Girvan of the DUP and Lyons of the DUP not heavily involved in that decision?
Quote from: marty34 on April 04, 2025, 10:44:43 AMQuote from: Wildweasel74 on April 04, 2025, 07:40:40 AMThe DUP had no input on the school pitch in Derry, never had, decision took in EA on the work programme, school had been on the backlog 5yrs.
Was Girvan of the DUP and Lyons of the DUP not heavily involved in that decision?
Of course they were , Funding not applied for and EA signed off after a private meeting between School Principal and Lyons / Given / Middleton
Why is there no judical review about that?
SF are too soft.
Those in glass houses will never throw stones.
Quote from: LC on April 04, 2025, 01:07:29 PMQuote from: marty34 on April 04, 2025, 11:52:49 AMQuote from: Newbridge Exile on April 04, 2025, 10:57:00 AMQuote from: marty34 on April 04, 2025, 10:44:43 AMQuote from: Wildweasel74 on April 04, 2025, 07:40:40 AMThe DUP had no input on the school pitch in Derry, never had, decision took in EA on the work programme, school had been on the backlog 5yrs.
Was Girvan of the DUP and Lyons of the DUP not heavily involved in that decision?
Quote from: marty34 on April 04, 2025, 10:44:43 AMQuote from: Wildweasel74 on April 04, 2025, 07:40:40 AMThe DUP had no input on the school pitch in Derry, never had, decision took in EA on the work programme, school had been on the backlog 5yrs.
Was Girvan of the DUP and Lyons of the DUP not heavily involved in that decision?
Of course they were , Funding not applied for and EA signed off after a private meeting between School Principal and Lyons / Given / Middleton
Why is there no judical review about that?
SF are too soft.
Those in glass houses will never throw stones.
That may well be the case, but it isn't stopping the DUP throwing plenty of stones when it comes to Irish culture.
Michelle is so concerned about being the "first minister for all" that she's prepared to let the DUP run rings round them.
As bigots go this DUP waster Clement Cuthbertson from Dungannon is right up there... suggested a childrens competition was to honour a 'terrorist' not bothering to check it wasn't Francie Hughes the hungerstriker but a former deceased club chairman of Coalisland Fianna. He never apologised to Mr Hughes' family or the GAA club.
A piece of work if ever there was one but popular among a class of sectarian bigots.
https://www.irishnews.com/news/northern-ireland/dup-councillor-suspended-for-three-months-over-comments-on-kids-gaa-tournament-HBZ6G3LWLJAY5KYMK7SCNDWQO4/
Quote from: Truthsayer on April 09, 2025, 10:24:06 PMAs bigots go this DUP waster Clement Cuthbertson from Dungannon is right up there... suggested a childrens competition was to honour a 'terrorist' not bothering to check it wasn't Francie Hughes the hungerstriker but a former deceased club chairman of Coalisland Fianna. He never apologised to Mr Hughes' family or the GAA club.
A piece of work if ever there was one but popular among a class of sectarian bigots.
https://www.irishnews.com/news/northern-ireland/dup-councillor-suspended-for-three-months-over-comments-on-kids-gaa-tournament-HBZ6G3LWLJAY5KYMK7SCNDWQO4/
Some achievement as there would be a lot of competition for such a title within that organisatioin.
No point in being DUP Councillor without being a c**t about it.
Hoor never apologised.
Some achievement as there would be a lot of competition for such a title within that organisation.
Ingrained in the 17th Century cnuts.
Will be getting worse as they try to get the Neanderthal vote back from TUVUDA.
It looks like NI Sports minister Gordon Lyons is set for the Armagh Derry match in the Athletic Grounds on Saturday night. He has effectively been shamed into this. If he really had any interest in attending a GAA match it would have happened before now. If he insists on not taking his seat until after the National Anthem should he just be told to f**k off back home??
Quote from: Feckitt on May 23, 2025, 01:22:48 PMIt looks like NI Sports minister Gordon Lyons is set for the Armagh Derry match in the Athletic Grounds on Saturday night. He has effectively been shamed into this. If he really had any interest in attending a GAA match it would have happened before now. If he insists on not taking his seat until after the National Anthem should he just be told to f**k off back home??
Has he attended the Irish Rugby games in the past? Would he take his seat after the anthems for those games?
They'd say we respect the anthem of the State we're in.
Quote from: Feckitt on May 23, 2025, 01:22:48 PMIt looks like NI Sports minister Gordon Lyons is set for the Armagh Derry match in the Athletic Grounds on Saturday night. He has effectively been shamed into this. If he really had any interest in attending a GAA match it would have happened before now. If he insists on not taking his seat until after the National Anthem should he just be told to f**k off back home??
Conveniently the un-televised game?
Why do they do this nonsense? Send Michelle O'Neill to NI soccer matches and DUP to GAA matches. Pointless exercise.
Quote from: SaffronSports on May 23, 2025, 05:43:48 PMWhy do they do this nonsense? Send Michelle O'Neill to NI soccer matches and DUP to GAA matches. Pointless exercise.
He is the sports minister... can't be minister for our sports but not their sports...
Quote from: Truthsayer on May 23, 2025, 07:14:37 PMQuote from: SaffronSports on May 23, 2025, 05:43:48 PMWhy do they do this nonsense? Send Michelle O'Neill to NI soccer matches and DUP to GAA matches. Pointless exercise.
He is the sports minister... can't be minister for our sports but not their sports...
And at that, nobody has to give him any dues, but don't be doing out of your way to get offended because the game isn't on TV FFS.
Quote from: gallsman on May 23, 2025, 08:12:18 PMQuote from: Truthsayer on May 23, 2025, 07:14:37 PMQuote from: SaffronSports on May 23, 2025, 05:43:48 PMWhy do they do this nonsense? Send Michelle O'Neill to NI soccer matches and DUP to GAA matches. Pointless exercise.
He is the sports minister... can't be minister for our sports but not their sports...
And at that, nobody has to give him any dues, but don't be doing out of your way to get offended because the game isn't on TV FFS.
I'm saying why he should attend if he goes to other codes. Personally I don't give a fuc which minister goes to which sport. Is more important equal funding and treatment of sports than the optics... TV? 🤷
Quote from: SaffronSports on May 23, 2025, 05:43:48 PMWhy do they do this nonsense? Send Michelle O'Neill to NI soccer matches and DUP to GAA matches. Pointless exercise.
Reconciliation and outreach.
Quote from: SaffronSports on May 23, 2025, 05:43:48 PMWhy do they do this nonsense? Send Michelle O'Neill to NI soccer matches and DUP to GAA matches. Pointless exercise.
Hope you're nowhere near the Ireland Reunification committee / talks
I wasn't talking about you.
People cry and pretend to be offended that he hasn't gone to a football or hurling match. Then when he does they move the goalposts and her upset about precisely what match he goes to. Could you be bothered like.
Quote from: RedHand88 on May 23, 2025, 08:44:38 PMQuote from: SaffronSports on May 23, 2025, 05:43:48 PMWhy do they do this nonsense? Send Michelle O'Neill to NI soccer matches and DUP to GAA matches. Pointless exercise.
Reconciliation and outreach.
Optics man... Arlene went to Clones.. you really think she was/is into reconciliation and outreach?
Quote from: Truthsayer on May 23, 2025, 09:26:58 PMQuote from: RedHand88 on May 23, 2025, 08:44:38 PMQuote from: SaffronSports on May 23, 2025, 05:43:48 PMWhy do they do this nonsense? Send Michelle O'Neill to NI soccer matches and DUP to GAA matches. Pointless exercise.
Reconciliation and outreach.
Optics man... Arlene went to Clones.. you really think she was/is into reconciliation and outreach?
Arlene going to Clones was hardly impressive, considering that she could have walked there in a couple of hours, which is about where we get parked. However, I did think that Stalford made an effort by coming that day.
Quote from: armaghniac on May 23, 2025, 09:48:18 PMQuote from: Truthsayer on May 23, 2025, 09:26:58 PMQuote from: RedHand88 on May 23, 2025, 08:44:38 PMQuote from: SaffronSports on May 23, 2025, 05:43:48 PMWhy do they do this nonsense? Send Michelle O'Neill to NI soccer matches and DUP to GAA matches. Pointless exercise.
Reconciliation and outreach.
Optics man... Arlene went to Clones.. you really think she was/is into reconciliation and outreach?
Arlene going to Clones was hardly impressive, considering that she could have walked there in a couple of hours, which is about where we get parked. However, I did think that Stalford made an effort by coming that day.
I suppose.. I forgot he went with her 🤷
Gordon Lyons waited until after the anthem to take his seat. Would have been hilarious if they played it again once he got to his seat ;)
Quote from: Nanderson on May 25, 2025, 08:41:49 AMGordon Lyons waited until after the anthem to take his seat. Would have been hilarious if they played it again once he got to his seat ;)
An example of a true bigot
Comment by Jarlath in Westport last night
" Saturday evening, we had the DUP sports minister Gordon Lyons in the Athletic Grounds watching our game.
"He couldn't get over firstly the crowd, it was packed, secondly the atmosphere, thirdly the fact no one was segregated, the fourth thing he said was I'm looking around at half-time, it is all respectable people who go to these games. That is what the GAA is."
Quote from: Rossfan on May 27, 2025, 11:42:18 AMComment by Jarlath in Westport last night
" Saturday evening, we had the DUP sports minister Gordon Lyons in the Athletic Grounds watching our game.
"He couldn't get over firstly the crowd, it was packed, secondly the atmosphere, thirdly the fact no one was segregated, the fourth thing he said was I'm looking around at half-time, it is all respectable people who go to these games. That is what the GAA is."
Gordy must have missed the riot police ;D
Quote from: Rossfan on May 27, 2025, 11:42:18 AMComment by Jarlath in Westport last night
" Saturday evening, we had the DUP sports minister Gordon Lyons in the Athletic Grounds watching our game.
"He couldn't get over firstly the crowd, it was packed, secondly the atmosphere, thirdly the fact no one was segregated, the fourth thing he said was I'm looking around at half-time, it is all respectable people who go to these games. That is what the GAA is."
I hope that statement is reported by the northern press.
Quote from: Orior on May 27, 2025, 04:13:52 PMQuote from: Rossfan on May 27, 2025, 11:42:18 AMComment by Jarlath in Westport last night
" Saturday evening, we had the DUP sports minister Gordon Lyons in the Athletic Grounds watching our game.
"He couldn't get over firstly the crowd, it was packed, secondly the atmosphere, thirdly the fact no one was segregated, the fourth thing he said was I'm looking around at half-time, it is all respectable people who go to these games. That is what the GAA is."
I hope that statement is reported by the northern press.
What a load of condescending piss from Gordon Lyons. In other words, 'I can't believe you peasants are actually able to behave yourselves'.
Respectable people....give me strength.
Just reinforces the notion that we are the inferior race.
Or its an acknowledgement that your average irish league attendee is from the relative dregs?!
Quote from: Silver hill on May 27, 2025, 09:41:17 PMQuote from: Orior on May 27, 2025, 04:13:52 PMQuote from: Rossfan on May 27, 2025, 11:42:18 AMComment by Jarlath in Westport last night
" Saturday evening, we had the DUP sports minister Gordon Lyons in the Athletic Grounds watching our game.
"He couldn't get over firstly the crowd, it was packed, secondly the atmosphere, thirdly the fact no one was segregated, the fourth thing he said was I'm looking around at half-time, it is all respectable people who go to these games. That is what the GAA is."
I hope that statement is reported by the northern press.
What a load of condescending piss from Gordon Lyons. In other words, 'I can't believe you peasants are actually able to behave yourselves'.
Respectable people....give me strength.
Just reinforces the notion that we are the inferior race.
How do we know he actually said those words?
I don't buy those comments or else Jarlath left off #5 for surely Gordon must have made a remark about the attractive GAA women sitting within eyesight.
https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/opinion/columnists/sam-mcbride/vast-sums-of-public-cash-three-mortgages-a-dead-mans-name-and-a-mystery-owner-the-riddle-of-ian-paisley-jrs-office/a492263536.html
Good living for a living .......£££££
I c MiggleDee's picture has disappeared From Belfast City Hall.
More shithousery from the DUP?
Getting a bit ahead of herself, presidential election hasn't even taken place yet
Jamie on X telling us in many ways that he's going to tell us many things in the coming days, but he's not going to say anything today, apart from dozens of times telling us he's not going to say anything today.
I think it would probably be for the best to leave X to one side for the rest of July.
Sean "Creation of Northern Ireland was undemocratic"
Billy "No no no, the majority of people in the north east wanted to remain in the UK"
Sean "The majority of people west of the river Bann want a United Ireland"
Billy "Shut up"
I'm presuming the Dup mla named here will be supportive of the various hotels getting retrospective planning permission
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c9vdldr1032o
https://www.irishnews.com/news/dup-mla-behind-assembly-motion-on-planning-was-at-centre-of-enforcement-probe-DDRFPQRNRRFODNQCWLHFYZU5QM/
As you'd expect.....
https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/ce835r795emo
Quote from: Rossfan on August 27, 2025, 01:03:14 PMAs you'd expect.....
https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/ce835r795emo
I see he left out how he was going to do that lol!
A nothing more to see here story. Two members of Parliament in minority groups with little or no power.
The English and Welsh are thick enough to elect one of those to power.....
Quote from: Rossfan on August 27, 2025, 01:28:22 PMThe English and Welsh are thick enough to elect one of those to power.....
Don't think there were many Welsh involved in the Election of Nigel or Sammy.
100k for the lads to go and piss in someone else's front garden rather than local ones
https://mydup.com/news/travel-funding-demonstrates-dup-commitment-to-our-bands-brooks
Quote from: BigGreenField on August 28, 2025, 10:16:58 PM100k for the lads to go and piss in someone else's front garden rather than local ones
https://mydup.com/news/travel-funding-demonstrates-dup-commitment-to-our-bands-brooks
Had to verify I was human - to read the article. ;D
See the DUP managed to put the EA in real shit in 2yrs. Maybe the hiring of hundreds of staff, Jumping from 15 Assistant Directors to 25, making a ton of made up jobs cause half them came out of the Health service. No real plan of organisation cause the majority at high level got zero educational background, or been jumped up way above their ability. Place was way better run when it was separate Library boards. Then normal Joe Bloggs killing himself trying to fight against the tide of this shit!
Education minister's Israel trip a 'propaganda mission', say Alliance (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/czxky7q99edo)
Some shower of c***ts.
Quote from: Munchie on October 29, 2025, 01:39:35 PMEducation minister's Israel trip a 'propaganda mission', say Alliance (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/czxky7q99edo)
Some shower of c***ts.
Which shower?
They all are but this particular story is posted under the DUP thread.
The increasingly cuntish behaviour of all the Unionist parties this year is shocking.
I firmly believe that the best cure for sectarianism in the North is to end the false state of Northern Ireland. Micheal Martin and other fake Nationalists in Fianna Fail and others. say that reconciliation must come before unity. I believe that Unity is the key to reconciliation not the other way around. It is time for a Unity referendum. If it was booked now with a date of 2028/2029/2030 then I am 100% confident it would pass. The behaviour of Unionist parties convinces me that they are in total denial about the change that is coming. And furthermore when Unity happens I think a lot of people from the Protestant Community will be relieved that it's all over.
Quote from: Feckitt on October 29, 2025, 08:58:03 PMThe increasingly cuntish behaviour of all the Unionist parties this year is shocking.
I firmly believe that the best cure for sectarianism in the North is to end the false state of Northern Ireland. Micheal Martin and other fake Nationalists in Fianna Fail and others. say that reconciliation must come before unity. I believe that Unity is the key to reconciliation not the other way around. It is time for a Unity referendum. If it was booked now with a date of 2028/2029/2030 then I am 100% confident it would pass. The behaviour of Unionist parties convinces me that they are in total denial about the change that is coming. And furthermore when Unity happens I think a lot of people from the Protestant Community will be relieved that it's all over.
Define "reconciliation". It's a meaningless term
At the end of the day , it's down to the British government, and them only, to call the referendum, is it not?
So if the Brits wanted to get rid of the north tomorrow, they could just call a referendum anyway, regardless if there's any sort of preparedness done or not.
The Irish government (and unionists, for that matter) can kick the can down the road as long as they want , and avoid doing any sort of preparedness. But if the Brits call a surprise referendum, they are both (as will we all) up shit creek.
That's probably. unlikely to happen at the minute , but if Farage gets in , who knows?
What is the dup game with this Israel visit ? They blatantly knew the furore it would create. Are they trying to bring the assembly down?
Quote from: imtommygunn on November 02, 2025, 10:13:26 PMWhat is the dup game with this Israel visit ? They blatantly knew the furore it would create. Are they trying to bring the assembly down?
They genuinely don't give one f**k. Their little supremacist minds see the Israeli oppressors and are probably jealous they didn't get the chance to commit a genocide here to the extend the Israelis are getting to in Palestine.
Quote from: Armagh18 on November 02, 2025, 10:36:29 PMQuote from: imtommygunn on November 02, 2025, 10:13:26 PMWhat is the dup game with this Israel visit ? They blatantly knew the furore it would create. Are they trying to bring the assembly down?
They genuinely don't give one f**k. Their little supremacist minds see the Israeli oppressors and are probably jealous they didn't get the chance to commit a genocide here to the extend the Israelis are getting to in Palestine.
The DUP are ethnic supremacists with makey uppy history. Israelis are ethnic supremacists with makey uppy history.
Quote from: Armagh18 on November 02, 2025, 10:36:29 PMQuote from: imtommygunn on November 02, 2025, 10:13:26 PMWhat is the dup game with this Israel visit ? They blatantly knew the furore it would create. Are they trying to bring the assembly down?
They genuinely don't give one f**k. Their little supremacist minds see the Israeli oppressors and are probably jealous they didn't get the chance to commit a genocide here to the extend the Israelis are getting to in Palestine.
You're correct there. They seek to be as offensive as possible same as their leader and others putting up Paratrooper logos on their twitter accounts knowing full well their victims on Bloody Sunday were innocent civil rights marchers.
As for genocide... in 1986 DUP MP Willie McCrea proposed air strikes on Carrickmore, Crossmaglen, Drogheda and Dundalk. That's Rev William McCrea who appeared on stage with the psychopath Billy Wright aka The Rat.
https://m.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/northern-ireland/state-papers-dup-mp-william-mccrea-wanted-air-strikes-launched-on-the-republic-in-the-1980s/30867020.html
It's a free jolly... they've only been looking to line their pockets
QuoteWhat is the dup game with this Israel visit ? They blatantly knew the furore it would create. Are they trying to bring the assembly down?
They have to be opposite to nationalist parties , no matter what. Even if they know themselves they look like genocide supporters (in this case). They can't be seen to be agreeing with nationalists on anything. I don't even think they know at this stage what they really stand for. It's a case of whatever SF say, we'll say the opposite.
similar thing when MON said the 1billion+ deal for Belfast arms factories for munitions for Ukraine, would have been better spent on services. Nah , sure isn't it great for the economy, making munitions to blow people up. What's them Shinners on aboot?
What i dont understand is Israel was responsible for killing more soldiers/police than the IRA but this fact seems to be beyond them, when they fly the Union Jack, Paratrooper flags,beside Israeli flags.
Some muck talked today and not one mention of the people suffering in Gaza.
Unionists on an Israeli paid jolly that they just had to lap up, knowing that it would be insensitive and incendiary.
If concerned and interested in how education works in other places, I'm sure there were plenty of other options available.
Highlights the complete farce that the Executive is, and why this place is failing us all every day.
No confidence vote, but reality is that this is a performance and nothing will change.
Quote from: imtommygunn on November 02, 2025, 10:13:26 PMWhat is the dup game with this Israel visit ? They blatantly knew the furore it would create. Are they trying to bring the assembly down?
Judging by the increased number of councillors and mla's (of all parties) doing photo opps in constituency I'd say an election is on the cards next year.
The giveaway is the number of political reps showing up in Gaa club social media comments who couldn't find the pitch with a Sat nav.
The current crop of politicians playbook is to spend until the money runs out, refuse to make any tough decisions on anything and then have a phoney principled row/decision in order to pull the house down until someone writes a cheque and/or pressure gets too great and they go back in.
Rinse and repeat.
It must be something like that. Visiting Israel for an educational visit was always going to blow up and they knew that. It is probably just another vehicle to shit stir with to the lowest common denominator.
(Worst of all is it will work)
Quote from: imtommygunn on November 03, 2025, 05:13:38 PMIt must be something like that. Visiting Israel for an educational visit was always going to blow up and they knew that. It is probably just another vehicle to shit stir with to the lowest common denominator.
(Worst of all is it will work)
Division plain and simple, deliberate sh1thousery and shows the statelet for what it is... The unionist leaders continue to push toward a united Ireland quicker than the nationalist leaders
Quote from: JoG2 on November 03, 2025, 06:19:41 PMQuote from: imtommygunn on November 03, 2025, 05:13:38 PMIt must be something like that. Visiting Israel for an educational visit was always going to blow up and they knew that. It is probably just another vehicle to shit stir with to the lowest common denominator.
(Worst of all is it will work)
Division plain and simple, deliberate sh1thousery and shows the statelet for what it is... The unionist leaders continue to push toward a united Ireland quicker than the nationalist leaders
We'll be building statues of the likes of Foster and Givan when we do get the United Ireland. :D
Quote from: imtommygunn on November 03, 2025, 05:13:38 PMIt must be something like that. Visiting Israel for an educational visit was always going to blow up and they knew that. It is probably just another vehicle to shit stir with to the lowest common denominator.
(Worst of all is it will work)
In the short term it's to outflank the tuv on "staunchness" and split off any remaining UUp voters they can get. Pissing off everyone else is just a bonus.
Quote from: BigGreenField on November 03, 2025, 09:32:44 PMQuote from: imtommygunn on November 03, 2025, 05:13:38 PMIt must be something like that. Visiting Israel for an educational visit was always going to blow up and they knew that. It is probably just another vehicle to shit stir with to the lowest common denominator.
(Worst of all is it will work)
In the short term it's to outflank the tuv on "staunchness" and split off any remaining UUp voters they can get. Pissing off everyone else is just a bonus.
Looks that way. The UUP could carve out a serious voter base of sensible unionists but they're stone useless.
They never seem to think long-term, or even medium-term. They seem to rely on being fueled by short-term rage always.
I wonder are they looking at a Farage-led government in the hopes that their staunchness and absolute Britishness will seal their place in the union?
Quote from: BigGreenField on November 03, 2025, 05:09:48 PMQuote from: imtommygunn on November 02, 2025, 10:13:26 PMWhat is the dup game with this Israel visit ? They blatantly knew the furore it would create. Are they trying to bring the assembly down?
Judging by the increased number of councillors and mla's (of all parties) doing photo opps in constituency I'd say an election is on the cards next year.
The giveaway is the number of political reps showing up in Gaa club social media comments who couldn't find the pitch with a Sat nav.
The current crop of politicians playbook is to spend until the money runs out, refuse to make any tough decisions on anything and then have a phoney principled row/decision in order to pull the house down until someone writes a cheque and/or pressure gets too great and they go back in.
Rinse and repeat.
There will be no more repeats, if Stormont collapses it will not come back. Rachel Reeves will say that the budget will be the same as the North-East of England and she'll tell Benn to start talks about the right time to have a border poll. You have to wonder why the DUP want this.
Quote from: armaghniac on November 03, 2025, 10:24:35 PMQuote from: BigGreenField on November 03, 2025, 05:09:48 PMQuote from: imtommygunn on November 02, 2025, 10:13:26 PMWhat is the dup game with this Israel visit ? They blatantly knew the furore it would create. Are they trying to bring the assembly down?
Judging by the increased number of councillors and mla's (of all parties) doing photo opps in constituency I'd say an election is on the cards next year.
The giveaway is the number of political reps showing up in Gaa club social media comments who couldn't find the pitch with a Sat nav.
The current crop of politicians playbook is to spend until the money runs out, refuse to make any tough decisions on anything and then have a phoney principled row/decision in order to pull the house down until someone writes a cheque and/or pressure gets too great and they go back in.
Rinse and repeat.
There will be no more repeats, if Stormont collapses it will not come back. Rachel Reeves will say that the budget will be the same as the North-East of England and she'll tell Benn to start talks about the right time to have a border poll. You have to wonder why the DUP want this.
+1
Quote from: LC on November 04, 2025, 07:59:11 AMQuote from: armaghniac on November 03, 2025, 10:24:35 PMQuote from: BigGreenField on November 03, 2025, 05:09:48 PMQuote from: imtommygunn on November 02, 2025, 10:13:26 PMWhat is the dup game with this Israel visit ? They blatantly knew the furore it would create. Are they trying to bring the assembly down?
Judging by the increased number of councillors and mla's (of all parties) doing photo opps in constituency I'd say an election is on the cards next year.
The giveaway is the number of political reps showing up in Gaa club social media comments who couldn't find the pitch with a Sat nav.
The current crop of politicians playbook is to spend until the money runs out, refuse to make any tough decisions on anything and then have a phoney principled row/decision in order to pull the house down until someone writes a cheque and/or pressure gets too great and they go back in.
Rinse and repeat.
There will be no more repeats, if Stormont collapses it will not come back. Rachel Reeves will say that the budget will be the same as the North-East of England and she'll tell Benn to start talks about the right time to have a border poll. You have to wonder why the DUP want this.
+1
The DUP are chasing the hard liners as they see gaining the votes from the TUV as their way of maintaining their dominance within unionism, they care not one jot about the wider community, never have and never will.
Quote from: johnnycool on November 04, 2025, 12:19:00 PMQuote from: LC on November 04, 2025, 07:59:11 AMQuote from: armaghniac on November 03, 2025, 10:24:35 PMQuote from: BigGreenField on November 03, 2025, 05:09:48 PMQuote from: imtommygunn on November 02, 2025, 10:13:26 PMWhat is the dup game with this Israel visit ? They blatantly knew the furore it would create. Are they trying to bring the assembly down?
Judging by the increased number of councillors and mla's (of all parties) doing photo opps in constituency I'd say an election is on the cards next year.
The giveaway is the number of political reps showing up in Gaa club social media comments who couldn't find the pitch with a Sat nav.
The current crop of politicians playbook is to spend until the money runs out, refuse to make any tough decisions on anything and then have a phoney principled row/decision in order to pull the house down until someone writes a cheque and/or pressure gets too great and they go back in.
Rinse and repeat.
There will be no more repeats, if Stormont collapses it will not come back. Rachel Reeves will say that the budget will be the same as the North-East of England and she'll tell Benn to start talks about the right time to have a border poll. You have to wonder why the DUP want this.
+1
The DUP are chasing the hard liners as they see gaining the votes from the TUV as their way of maintaining their dominance within unionism, they care not one jot about the wider community, never have and never will.
They're dying out thankfully.
Bryson advertising soldier F pins for poppy season... sc**bag
I see Pengelly "can't fit in" the Presidential inauguration.
That will stop their most extreme switching to TUVUDA!
Quote from: armaghniac on November 03, 2025, 10:24:35 PMQuote from: BigGreenField on November 03, 2025, 05:09:48 PMQuote from: imtommygunn on November 02, 2025, 10:13:26 PMWhat is the dup game with this Israel visit ? They blatantly knew the furore it would create. Are they trying to bring the assembly down?
Judging by the increased number of councillors and mla's (of all parties) doing photo opps in constituency I'd say an election is on the cards next year.
The giveaway is the number of political reps showing up in Gaa club social media comments who couldn't find the pitch with a Sat nav.
The current crop of politicians playbook is to spend until the money runs out, refuse to make any tough decisions on anything and then have a phoney principled row/decision in order to pull the house down until someone writes a cheque and/or pressure gets too great and they go back in.
Rinse and repeat.
There will be no more repeats, if Stormont collapses it will not come back. Rachel Reeves will say that the budget will be the same as the North-East of England and she'll tell Benn to start talks about the right time to have a border poll. You have to wonder why the DUP want this.
You're completely delusional. Flogging off parts of the UK and giving the Scottish independence movement which is reeling a massive shot in the arm by arranging an NI border poll would do wonders for the Labour party's reputation with the Little Englander voters they are currently haemorrhaging.
I assume you also believe this will happen in the same week that they hand the Falklands over to the Argentinians, re-join the customs union, pay reparations to the Jamaicans and hand the 66 World Cup trophy over to the Germans because Hurst's shot never crossed the line.
Wee Jamie giving it loads about SF getting everything for the last 25 years but has Amnesia for the 75 years before that
This place is a shit hole, and ain't getting better
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on November 07, 2025, 08:46:57 PMWee Jamie giving it loads about SF getting everything for the last 25 years but has Amnesia for the 75 years before that
I think you mean 375 years before that.
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on November 07, 2025, 08:46:57 PMThis place is a shit hole, and ain't getting better
At least some of us win the odd All Ireland to reduce the pain .
This place is a shithole, but it's every inept individual on the hill, in saying that are they that inept, they are making a fortune for themselves and their families and friends, couldn't give a flying one about anyone else, pass no legislation, make no decisions, fix nothing, resolve nothing, invest in nothing and we all vote these wankers in. Sinn Féin could run tayto packets, ham sandwiches, 3 legged pigs, whatever in Armagh and they would get in and yet they do f**k all.
Quote from: trileacman on November 07, 2025, 07:47:16 PMQuote from: armaghniac on November 03, 2025, 10:24:35 PMQuote from: BigGreenField on November 03, 2025, 05:09:48 PMQuote from: imtommygunn on November 02, 2025, 10:13:26 PMWhat is the dup game with this Israel visit ? They blatantly knew the furore it would create. Are they trying to bring the assembly down?
Judging by the increased number of councillors and mla's (of all parties) doing photo opps in constituency I'd say an election is on the cards next year.
The giveaway is the number of political reps showing up in Gaa club social media comments who couldn't find the pitch with a Sat nav.
The current crop of politicians playbook is to spend until the money runs out, refuse to make any tough decisions on anything and then have a phoney principled row/decision in order to pull the house down until someone writes a cheque and/or pressure gets too great and they go back in.
Rinse and repeat.
There will be no more repeats, if Stormont collapses it will not come back. Rachel Reeves will say that the budget will be the same as the North-East of England and she'll tell Benn to start talks about the right time to have a border poll. You have to wonder why the DUP want this.
You're completely delusional. Flogging off parts of the UK and giving the Scottish independence movement which is reeling a massive shot in the arm by arranging an NI border poll would do wonders for the Labour party's reputation with the Little Englander voters they are currently haemorrhaging.
I assume you also believe this will happen in the same week that they hand the Falklands over to the Argentinians, re-join the customs union, pay reparations to the Jamaicans and hand the 66 World Cup trophy over to the Germans because Hurst's shot never crossed the line.
There would be a good chunk of that brigade who'd happily hand the North back over if you told them how much we're costing them.
Quote from: Armagh18 on November 08, 2025, 07:52:38 AMYou're completely delusional. Flogging off parts of the UK and giving the Scottish independence movement which is reeling a massive shot in the arm by arranging an NI border poll would do wonders for the Labour party's reputation with the Little Englander voters they are currently There would be a good chunk of that brigade who'd happily hand the North back over if you told them how much we're costing them.
Maybe it is time a message was plastered across a bus and it was driven around England to remind them.
Quote from: Munchie on November 08, 2025, 07:31:45 AMThis place is a shithole, but it's every inept individual on the hill, in saying that are they that inept, they are making a fortune for themselves and their families and friends, couldn't give a flying one about anyone else, pass no legislation, make no decisions, fix nothing, resolve nothing, invest in nothing and we all vote these wankers in. Sinn Féin could run tayto packets, ham sandwiches, 3 legged pigs, whatever in Armagh and they would get in and yet they do f**k all.
And voting in an abstentionist MP at every Westminster election. What's the SF logic there in this day & age.
But it looks great when said MP turns up to some rally or other, I saw our local councillor posting he had brought up local camogie and hurling wins at last council meeting like it was some sort of achievement, so f**king what, the teams didn't care, the supporters didn't care but hey you scored some sort of points for the cause - grow the f**k up!
Quote from: Munchie on November 08, 2025, 07:31:45 AMThis place is a shithole, but it's every inept individual on the hill, in saying that are they that inept, they are making a fortune for themselves and their families and friends, couldn't give a flying one about anyone else, pass no legislation, make no decisions, fix nothing, resolve nothing, invest in nothing and we all vote these wankers in. Sinn Féin could run tayto packets, ham sandwiches, 3 legged pigs, whatever in Armagh and they would get in and yet they do f**k all.
Who do you vote for, out of interest?
It literally would not matter who you vote for here. It's a basket case, tribal head count for most
Quote from: AustinPowers on November 08, 2025, 11:00:27 AMQuote from: Munchie on November 08, 2025, 07:31:45 AMThis place is a shithole, but it's every inept individual on the hill, in saying that are they that inept, they are making a fortune for themselves and their families and friends, couldn't give a flying one about anyone else, pass no legislation, make no decisions, fix nothing, resolve nothing, invest in nothing and we all vote these wankers in. Sinn Féin could run tayto packets, ham sandwiches, 3 legged pigs, whatever in Armagh and they would get in and yet they do f**k all.
Who do you vote for, out of interest?
Growing up I voted Seamus Mallon - then Sinn Féin when they had that big flush when folk believed they were for the people now and I don't vote, I think to be a councillor in Armagh for Sinn Féin you have to be unemployable elsewhere.
But again as pointed out it was, is and always will be pure tribal.
Quote from: Aaron Boone on November 08, 2025, 08:20:47 AMQuote from: Munchie on November 08, 2025, 07:31:45 AMThis place is a shithole, but it's every inept individual on the hill, in saying that are they that inept, they are making a fortune for themselves and their families and friends, couldn't give a flying one about anyone else, pass no legislation, make no decisions, fix nothing, resolve nothing, invest in nothing and we all vote these wankers in. Sinn Féin could run tayto packets, ham sandwiches, 3 legged pigs, whatever in Armagh and they would get in and yet they do f**k all.
And voting in an abstentionist MP at every Westminster election. What's the SF logic there in this day & age.
Not taking an oath to the crown and much else besides, keep up
Bet they take the crowns money!
Quote from: Munchie on November 08, 2025, 02:35:55 PMBet they take the crowns money!
Of course they would take the money. They are still doing the same work as an MP. They just don't take the trip over to Westminster to sit in an empty chamber. The old saying goes 'The fastest way to clear the chamber for a fire is to announce a debate on Northern Ireland issues'
Quote from: Nanderson on November 08, 2025, 02:37:54 PMQuote from: Munchie on November 08, 2025, 02:35:55 PMBet they take the crowns money!
Of course they would take the money. They are still doing the same work as an MP. They just don't take the trip over to Westminster to sit in an empty chamber. The old saying goes 'The fastest way to clear the chamber for a fire is to announce a debate on Northern Ireland issues'
Can anyone tell me what Daire Hughes has done for Armagh?
Or what Mickey Brady done?
Quote from: Munchie on November 08, 2025, 02:35:55 PMBet they take the crowns money!
Economic warfare/ famine reparations
Quote from: Munchie on November 08, 2025, 02:35:55 PMBet they take the crowns money!
I'd gladly accept a wheelbarrow full of notes and coins with Charlie's big head on them.
Quote from: Munchie on November 08, 2025, 02:35:55 PMBet they take the crowns money!
Dont they pay taxes to that Crown?
What work are they doing as a MP that a MLA cant do or is covering here, please explain?They only reason they contest, is that they do not want the SDLP get a future footing, no other reason.
Quote from: Rossfan on November 08, 2025, 03:57:05 PMQuote from: Munchie on November 08, 2025, 02:35:55 PMBet they take the crowns money!
Dont they pay taxes to that Crown?
Under the occupied 6, anyone working here is legally obliged to do so, what's your point?
Quote from: Munchie on November 08, 2025, 02:50:00 PMOr what Mickey Brady done?
Collected wages and expenses.
https://m.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/politics/education-department-silent-on-potential-for-future-trips-to-israel-by-dup-minister/a391537096.html?fbclid=IwZnRzaAOBHIRleHRuA2FlbQExAHNydGMGYXBwX2lkCjY2Mjg1NjgzNzkAAR7z8sS2JCuKTVaVVq7JennqvDLgt-ol66jbVWUsO9uOLgwlq8L0HEGyYtlaeQ_aem_8qnBStont36oA9OZ38Gsgw#dbxp8ennb1r2vz6j55oe7yumenv8v5vf
Arrogant bastards
Mandate to do what they want, a political system where they or any MLA can't be held to account, as someone else said, place is a shithole.
Quote from: Tony Baloney on November 08, 2025, 04:43:04 PMQuote from: Munchie on November 08, 2025, 02:50:00 PMOr what Mickey Brady done?
Collected wages and expenses.
In fairness Mickey Brady did immense work for his constituents and still does even though he's retired. As a former welfare rights worker he's kept very busy around Newry. He might not maintain a high public profile but he's highly regarded by the people of Newry and the wider area
Yeah he was a real grafter the people of Armagh whom he represented and forever in his debt for hard work and representation.
Quote from: Dougal Maguire on November 12, 2025, 10:45:29 AMQuote from: Tony Baloney on November 08, 2025, 04:43:04 PMQuote from: Munchie on November 08, 2025, 02:50:00 PMOr what Mickey Brady done?
Collected wages and expenses.
In fairness Mickey Brady did immense work for his constituents and still does even though he's retired. As a former welfare rights worker he's kept very busy around Newry. He might not maintain a high public profile but he's highly regarded by the people of Newry and the wider area
100%. And Daire Hughes seems like a decent skin as well.
I cant see the Article but the headline sums them up perfectly
https://m.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/opinion/columnists/suzanne-breen/the-dups-days-of-gesture-politics-are-over-its-only-focus-is-stopping-jim-allister/a340039769.html
Quote from: Rossfan on November 12, 2025, 11:13:23 AMI cant see the Article but the headline sums them up perfectly
https://m.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/opinion/columnists/suzanne-breen/the-dups-days-of-gesture-politics-are-over-its-only-focus-is-stopping-jim-allister/a340039769.html
There are more than 150 DUP elected representatives in Northern Ireland, but apparently not one of them was free to attend the Irish president's inauguration.
Emma Little-Pengelly has said she couldn't go due to Remembrance Day commitments. Gavin Robinson cited a similar reason, and stressed "the significance of the 11th day of the 11th month" for his community.
Yet Peter Robinson managed to join Martin McGuinness for the inauguration of Michael D Higgins on November 11 2011.
While the date of the Irish president's swearing in hasn't changed, DUP attitudes to gestures of reconciliation clearly have. The 'calendar clash' excuse is an attempt to spin a snub.
Catherine Connolly has pledged that her first official visit will be to Northern Ireland. Robinson said his party would be "pleased" to meet her in a formal capacity when she comes here.
That doesn't involve stretching itself in the way that leaving its home turf and travelling to Dublin would have done.
In February, Michelle O'Neill joined Little-Pengelly, the Prime Minister and the leaders of the Scottish and Welsh devolved administrations for a private dinner with King Charles at Windsor Castle.
O'Neill has attended two Remembrance Sunday services, the Queen's funeral and the King's coronation. She stood for 'God Save the King' at Windsor Park last year during a Northern Ireland women's football match against Montenegro.
It is impossible to imagine any DUP figure standing for Amhrán na bhFiann here. The party is in retreat mode on the gesture front.
It's in a very different place compared to when devolution was restored in February 2024. The days of ceili dancing and camogie playing are gone.
In the first Assembly meeting after power-sharing returned, newly appointed Education Minister Paul Givan branded Jim Allister "a dead-end unionist".
by
"He is an angry man, and I can understand why," Givan said. "He has achieved absolutely nothing. I understand why he is angry and shouting at me because his political career has been one marked with failure."
Five months later Allister was elected North Antrim MP. In LucidTalk's last opinion poll for the Belfast Telegraph last month, the TUV was in third place on 13% – just five points behind the DUP.
Robinson's party has moved significantly to the right in an attempt to win back support. TUV had already warned its bigger rival that "there should be no question" of Little-Pengelly attending the inauguration.
Allister said: "For a unionist to meekly troop down to Dublin to attend such an inauguration would send entirely the wrong message.
"Unionists should be standing firm for the Union — not lending legitimacy to those who would see it destroyed and show no respect for our constitutional place as part of the United Kingdom."
Tweeting from Dublin Castle, O'Neill said it was a "a great privilege to represent you all as First Minister at the inauguration of our new President, Catherine Connolly".
She described Connolly as "a leader of compassion and courage who will represent everyone who calls this island home, with integrity and sincerity".
The First Minister added: "I look forward to working alongside Catherine in this time of change and massive potential on our island, as we continue our journey towards a fairer, stronger, and united Ireland."
Connolly pledged to ensure "all voices are represented, heard and valued" as she became the 10th president of Ireland.
She said: "The people have spoken and have given their president a powerful mandate to articulate their vision for a new republic, a republic worthy of its name where everyone is valued and diversity is cherished, where sustainable solutions are urgently implemented, and where a home is a fundamental human right."
The president added: "The change that led to this joyful day began with the small group of elected representatives and volunteers facing what appeared to be insurmountable challenges.
"We were led to believe that it was too great a leap, that our ideas were too far out, too left – at odds with the prevailing narrative."
She stated that Ireland's history meant "the normalisation of war and genocide has never been and will never be acceptable to us".
The president said: "As a sovereign independent nation with the long and cherished tradition of neutrality and an uninterrupted record of peacekeeping since 1958, Ireland is particularly well-placed to lead and articulate alternative diplomatic solutions to conflict and war.
"Indeed, our experience of colonisation and resistance of a catastrophic man-made famine and forced immigration gives us a lived understanding of dispossession, hunger and war and a mandate for Ireland to lead
Connolly said Ireland could take "real pride in the success" of the Good Friday Agreement as a "model for the peaceful resolution of conflict".
She looked forward to her "first official visit to the north", and referenced Article 3 of the constitution which sets out the firm wish of the Irish people for a united Ireland by consent.
As tough as it is to swallow a Sinn Fein leader doing those things- it is proper leadership and the only way forward.
Compare it to the knuckle draggers in the DUP and theres only one side trying to be grown up and work towards a proper shared future here.
To be fair I wouldn't begrudge Pengelly not attending, the remembrance day is probably a fair enough reason, but the DUP should have sent representation. The DUP will get caught in the middle trying to pander to the old bitter bastard Unionist vote which will only dwindle away in the coming years, while the half way sensible protestant/unionist will be more and more attracted to Alliance and maybe the UUP.
Only 1 side trying to be grown up alright.
DUPUDA certainly doing no harm to the UI camp by their chasing the extremist vote.
Quote from: Rossfan on November 12, 2025, 12:12:17 PMOnly 1 side trying to be grown up alright.
DUPUDA certainly doing no harm to the UI camp by their chasing the extremist vote.
Said it during the Brexit talks- we'll be building statues of Arelene and Co in Cross when a United Ireland does happen :D
Gordon Lyon's trying to sell Belfast hosting the Euro 2028 draw as a win after the city losing out on hosting actual matches, embarrassed for him :-[
Quote from: Brendan on November 13, 2025, 09:45:49 AMGordon Lyon's trying to sell Belfast hosting the Euro 2028 draw as a win after the city losing out on hosting actual matches, embarrassed for him :-[
Shambles. They continue to be a complete embarrassment to themselves and their voters.
Quote from: lurganblue on November 13, 2025, 09:52:20 AMQuote from: Brendan on November 13, 2025, 09:45:49 AMGordon Lyon's trying to sell Belfast hosting the Euro 2028 draw as a win after the city losing out on hosting actual matches, embarrassed for him :-[
Shambles. They continue to be a complete embarrassment to themselves and their voters.
But sure the GAA/IRA didn't get any money so it's all good...
Quote from: lurganblue on November 13, 2025, 09:52:20 AMQuote from: Brendan on November 13, 2025, 09:45:49 AMGordon Lyon's trying to sell Belfast hosting the Euro 2028 draw as a win after the city losing out on hosting actual matches, embarrassed for him :-[
Shambles. They continue to be a complete embarrassment to themselves and their voters.
Here's what you could've won!
Given their infinite capacity for screwing up on absolutely everything, except for their own pay, expenses, "factfinding" trips abroad & subsidised Stormont dining, I suppose it must count as one of the most significant achievements of this entire mandate.
Quote from: lurganblue on November 13, 2025, 09:52:20 AMQuote from: Brendan on November 13, 2025, 09:45:49 AMGordon Lyon's trying to sell Belfast hosting the Euro 2028 draw as a win after the city losing out on hosting actual matches, embarrassed for him :-[
Shambles. They continue to be a complete embarrassment to themselves and their voters.
Yes they are an embarrassment, but this sort of thing actually appeals to their knuckledragger voters. It's all about doing and saying whatever it takes, to keep their cushy numbers and big salary.
So, are their voters embarrassed by their behaviour? I seriously doubt it.
Quote from: AustinPowers on November 13, 2025, 10:44:50 AMQuote from: lurganblue on November 13, 2025, 09:52:20 AMQuote from: Brendan on November 13, 2025, 09:45:49 AMGordon Lyon's trying to sell Belfast hosting the Euro 2028 draw as a win after the city losing out on hosting actual matches, embarrassed for him :-[
Shambles. They continue to be a complete embarrassment to themselves and their voters.
Yes they are an embarrassment, but this sort of thing actually appeals to their knuckledragger voters. It's all about doing and saying whatever it takes, to keep their cushy numbers and big salary.
So, are their voters embarrassed by their behaviour? I seriously doubt it.
But they're dying out. And leeching knuckle draggers to the TUV and normal people to Alliance and UUP.
Quote from: Armagh18 on November 13, 2025, 10:45:58 AMQuote from: AustinPowers on November 13, 2025, 10:44:50 AMQuote from: lurganblue on November 13, 2025, 09:52:20 AMQuote from: Brendan on November 13, 2025, 09:45:49 AMGordon Lyon's trying to sell Belfast hosting the Euro 2028 draw as a win after the city losing out on hosting actual matches, embarrassed for him :-[
Shambles. They continue to be a complete embarrassment to themselves and their voters.
Yes they are an embarrassment, but this sort of thing actually appeals to their knuckledragger voters. It's all about doing and saying whatever it takes, to keep their cushy numbers and big salary.
So, are their voters embarrassed by their behaviour? I seriously doubt it.
But they're dying out. And leeching knuckle draggers to the TUV and normal people to Alliance and UUP.
Their job is to make sure there's always a steady supply of bigots coming through.
Afaic, Bryson was 7/8 when the GFA was was signed. What knowledge of the troubles did he have? Skeletor Lockhart not much older, yet they're as bigoted as they come.
Now that the clock is ticking , and the demographics changing, that is only going to breed more bigots. Cornered rats , spring to mind.
Bryson is just for show and only in it for himself. Lockhart is a proper bigot.
Quote from: AustinPowers on November 13, 2025, 10:54:27 AMQuote from: Armagh18 on November 13, 2025, 10:45:58 AMQuote from: AustinPowers on November 13, 2025, 10:44:50 AMQuote from: lurganblue on November 13, 2025, 09:52:20 AMQuote from: Brendan on November 13, 2025, 09:45:49 AMGordon Lyon's trying to sell Belfast hosting the Euro 2028 draw as a win after the city losing out on hosting actual matches, embarrassed for him :-[
Shambles. They continue to be a complete embarrassment to themselves and their voters.
Yes they are an embarrassment, but this sort of thing actually appeals to their knuckledragger voters. It's all about doing and saying whatever it takes, to keep their cushy numbers and big salary.
So, are their voters embarrassed by their behaviour? I seriously doubt it.
But they're dying out. And leeching knuckle draggers to the TUV and normal people to Alliance and UUP.
Their job is to make sure there's always a steady supply of bigots coming through.
Afaic, Bryson was 7/8 when the GFA was was signed. What knowledge of the troubles did he have? Skeletor Lockhart not much older, yet they're as bigoted as they come.
Now that the clock is ticking , and the demographics changing, that is only going to breed more bigots. Cornered rats , spring to mind.
Bitter f**kers, but again hopefully a dying breed.
There'll always be a section that'll never turn, but the sensible ones will see things like M O'N laying wreathes on remembrance day and realise that theres no nationalist bogeyman out to get them.
Quote from: Armagh18 on November 13, 2025, 11:05:26 AMQuote from: AustinPowers on November 13, 2025, 10:54:27 AMQuote from: Armagh18 on November 13, 2025, 10:45:58 AMQuote from: AustinPowers on November 13, 2025, 10:44:50 AMQuote from: lurganblue on November 13, 2025, 09:52:20 AMQuote from: Brendan on November 13, 2025, 09:45:49 AMGordon Lyon's trying to sell Belfast hosting the Euro 2028 draw as a win after the city losing out on hosting actual matches, embarrassed for him :-[
Shambles. They continue to be a complete embarrassment to themselves and their voters.
Yes they are an embarrassment, but this sort of thing actually appeals to their knuckledragger voters. It's all about doing and saying whatever it takes, to keep their cushy numbers and big salary.
So, are their voters embarrassed by their behaviour? I seriously doubt it.
But they're dying out. And leeching knuckle draggers to the TUV and normal people to Alliance and UUP.
Their job is to make sure there's always a steady supply of bigots coming through.
Afaic, Bryson was 7/8 when the GFA was was signed. What knowledge of the troubles did he have? Skeletor Lockhart not much older, yet they're as bigoted as they come.
Now that the clock is ticking , and the demographics changing, that is only going to breed more bigots. Cornered rats , spring to mind.
Bitter f**kers, but again hopefully a dying breed.
There'll always be a section that'll never turn, but the sensible ones will see things like M O'N laying wreathes on remembrance day and realise that theres no nationalist bogeyman out to get them.
I wouldn't be so sure about that.
There's always a nationalist bogeyman out to get them. Sinn Fein, the Irish language , the GAA, the A5 road, Casement Park, James McClean, Gerry Adams' rubber duck.....
Quote from: AustinPowers on November 13, 2025, 11:22:45 AMQuote from: Armagh18 on November 13, 2025, 11:05:26 AMQuote from: AustinPowers on November 13, 2025, 10:54:27 AMQuote from: Armagh18 on November 13, 2025, 10:45:58 AMQuote from: AustinPowers on November 13, 2025, 10:44:50 AMQuote from: lurganblue on November 13, 2025, 09:52:20 AMQuote from: Brendan on November 13, 2025, 09:45:49 AMGordon Lyon's trying to sell Belfast hosting the Euro 2028 draw as a win after the city losing out on hosting actual matches, embarrassed for him :-[
Shambles. They continue to be a complete embarrassment to themselves and their voters.
Yes they are an embarrassment, but this sort of thing actually appeals to their knuckledragger voters. It's all about doing and saying whatever it takes, to keep their cushy numbers and big salary.
So, are their voters embarrassed by their behaviour? I seriously doubt it.
But they're dying out. And leeching knuckle draggers to the TUV and normal people to Alliance and UUP.
Their job is to make sure there's always a steady supply of bigots coming through.
Afaic, Bryson was 7/8 when the GFA was was signed. What knowledge of the troubles did he have? Skeletor Lockhart not much older, yet they're as bigoted as they come.
Now that the clock is ticking , and the demographics changing, that is only going to breed more bigots. Cornered rats , spring to mind.
Bitter f**kers, but again hopefully a dying breed.
There'll always be a section that'll never turn, but the sensible ones will see things like M O'N laying wreathes on remembrance day and realise that theres no nationalist bogeyman out to get them.
I wouldn't be so sure about that.
There's always a nationalist bogeyman out to get them. Sinn Fein, the Irish language , the GAA, the A5 road, Casement Park, James McClean, Gerry Adams' rubber duck.....
I'm not so sure either and no matter how appalled and embarrassed the middle ground are and the more they align with nationalism on nearly every topic they will still not want to rock the boat and stay with the status quo ffs
Quote from: 93-DY-SAM on November 13, 2025, 10:24:56 AMQuote from: lurganblue on November 13, 2025, 09:52:20 AMQuote from: Brendan on November 13, 2025, 09:45:49 AMGordon Lyon's trying to sell Belfast hosting the Euro 2028 draw as a win after the city losing out on hosting actual matches, embarrassed for him :-[
Shambles. They continue to be a complete embarrassment to themselves and their voters.
Here's what you could've won!
Saw a post saying it's like holding your mates coat whilst he gets his hole!
;D ;D ;D
Quote from: AustinPowers on November 13, 2025, 11:22:45 AMQuote from: Armagh18 on November 13, 2025, 11:05:26 AMQuote from: AustinPowers on November 13, 2025, 10:54:27 AMQuote from: Armagh18 on November 13, 2025, 10:45:58 AMQuote from: AustinPowers on November 13, 2025, 10:44:50 AMQuote from: lurganblue on November 13, 2025, 09:52:20 AMQuote from: Brendan on November 13, 2025, 09:45:49 AMGordon Lyon's trying to sell Belfast hosting the Euro 2028 draw as a win after the city losing out on hosting actual matches, embarrassed for him :-[
Shambles. They continue to be a complete embarrassment to themselves and their voters.
Yes they are an embarrassment, but this sort of thing actually appeals to their knuckledragger voters. It's all about doing and saying whatever it takes, to keep their cushy numbers and big salary.
So, are their voters embarrassed by their behaviour? I seriously doubt it.
But they're dying out. And leeching knuckle draggers to the TUV and normal people to Alliance and UUP.
Their job is to make sure there's always a steady supply of bigots coming through.
Afaic, Bryson was 7/8 when the GFA was was signed. What knowledge of the troubles did he have? Skeletor Lockhart not much older, yet they're as bigoted as they come.
Now that the clock is ticking , and the demographics changing, that is only going to breed more bigots. Cornered rats , spring to mind.
Bitter f**kers, but again hopefully a dying breed.
There'll always be a section that'll never turn, but the sensible ones will see things like M O'N laying wreathes on remembrance day and realise that theres no nationalist bogeyman out to get them.
I wouldn't be so sure about that.
There's always a nationalist bogeyman out to get them. Sinn Fein, the Irish language , the GAA, the A5 road, Casement Park, James McClean, Gerry Adams' rubber duck.....
100%.
Quote from: AustinPowers on November 13, 2025, 11:22:45 AMQuote from: Armagh18 on November 13, 2025, 11:05:26 AMQuote from: AustinPowers on November 13, 2025, 10:54:27 AMQuote from: Armagh18 on November 13, 2025, 10:45:58 AMQuote from: AustinPowers on November 13, 2025, 10:44:50 AMQuote from: lurganblue on November 13, 2025, 09:52:20 AMQuote from: Brendan on November 13, 2025, 09:45:49 AMGordon Lyon's trying to sell Belfast hosting the Euro 2028 draw as a win after the city losing out on hosting actual matches, embarrassed for him :-[
Shambles. They continue to be a complete embarrassment to themselves and their voters.
Yes they are an embarrassment, but this sort of thing actually appeals to their knuckledragger voters. It's all about doing and saying whatever it takes, to keep their cushy numbers and big salary.
So, are their voters embarrassed by their behaviour? I seriously doubt it.
But they're dying out. And leeching knuckle draggers to the TUV and normal people to Alliance and UUP.
Their job is to make sure there's always a steady supply of bigots coming through.
Afaic, Bryson was 7/8 when the GFA was was signed. What knowledge of the troubles did he have? Skeletor Lockhart not much older, yet they're as bigoted as they come.
Now that the clock is ticking , and the demographics changing, that is only going to breed more bigots. Cornered rats , spring to mind.
Bitter f**kers, but again hopefully a dying breed.
There'll always be a section that'll never turn, but the sensible ones will see things like M O'N laying wreathes on remembrance day and realise that theres no nationalist bogeyman out to get them.
I wouldn't be so sure about that.
There's always a nationalist bogeyman out to get them. Sinn Fein, the Irish language , the GAA, the A5 road, Casement Park, James McClean, Gerry Adams' rubber duck.....
Thon duck is in the RA!
SF will be the main reasons that the DUP and others are still getting the votes, like it or not that is the main bogeyman..
But we'll just have to plough on as neither will be going away and a UI will still be 50 plus years away, that generation that never had the troubles is still being fed hatred. Unionist parties don't have to do much to stoke the fires, any party that agrees with a motion put by SF will get lumped into the same boat
In my own personal experience, on the few occasions that I have felt the need to contact my local SF "representatives" I have been largely ignored. Subsequent to a follow up prompt from me I received a terse 2 line reply. Thought I might contact my local DUP rep with the same query, what a difference. A courteous response within 7 days promising to look into my questions and 2 further letters to keep me updated on progress.
SF are happy enough to show up for a smiley, back slapping photo opportunity but don't be asking them any "awkward" questions.
A empty Tayto packet running on a SF ticket would get elected and there would as much substance in the empty packet, though the lad now representing Armagh seems a decent skin. ::)
Quote from: Last Man on November 13, 2025, 02:51:26 PMIn my own personal experience, on the few occasions that I have felt the need to contact my local SF "representatives" I have been largely ignored. Subsequent to a follow up prompt from me I received a terse 2 line reply. Thought I might contact my local DUP rep with the same query, what a difference. A courteous response within 7 days promising to look into my questions and 2 further letters to keep me updated on progress.
SF are happy enough to show up for a smiley, back slapping photo opportunity but don't be asking them any "awkward" questions.
I've had exactly the opposite experience. Have had the SDLP at my door promising the moon and the stars and delivering nothing, but when I've spoken to SF on a few different matters, it has been sorted relatively quickly.
Quote from: 93-DY-SAM on November 13, 2025, 04:52:13 PMQuote from: Last Man on November 13, 2025, 02:51:26 PMIn my own personal experience, on the few occasions that I have felt the need to contact my local SF "representatives" I have been largely ignored. Subsequent to a follow up prompt from me I received a terse 2 line reply. Thought I might contact my local DUP rep with the same query, what a difference. A courteous response within 7 days promising to look into my questions and 2 further letters to keep me updated on progress.
SF are happy enough to show up for a smiley, back slapping photo opportunity but don't be asking them any "awkward" questions.
I've had exactly the opposite experience. Have had the SDLP at my door promising the moon and the stars and delivering nothing, but when I've spoken to SF on a few different matters, it has been sorted relatively quickly.
Probably comes down to the individual politician and their team tbh. Danny Kennedy locally (UUP) was always known to be very helpful to anyone no matter their side.
Quote from: Armagh18 on November 13, 2025, 05:06:45 PMQuote from: 93-DY-SAM on November 13, 2025, 04:52:13 PMQuote from: Last Man on November 13, 2025, 02:51:26 PMIn my own personal experience, on the few occasions that I have felt the need to contact my local SF "representatives" I have been largely ignored. Subsequent to a follow up prompt from me I received a terse 2 line reply. Thought I might contact my local DUP rep with the same query, what a difference. A courteous response within 7 days promising to look into my questions and 2 further letters to keep me updated on progress.
SF are happy enough to show up for a smiley, back slapping photo opportunity but don't be asking them any "awkward" questions.
I've had exactly the opposite experience. Have had the SDLP at my door promising the moon and the stars and delivering nothing, but when I've spoken to SF on a few different matters, it has been sorted relatively quickly.
Probably comes down to the individual politician and their team tbh. Danny Kennedy locally (UUP) was always known to be very helpful to anyone no matter their side.
Exactly.
How come ole Geoff trial cant go forward.If this was the common man would he get the same leeway?
G I remember a time we couldn't get get anybody to get speed reductions done at the local school. Last resort was Willie McCrea, low and behold he chased it up and it was done. Only useful thing he done, but again he could done nothing and say I got no votes here!
Bingo @armagh18
Quote from: Last Man on November 13, 2025, 02:51:26 PMIn my own personal experience, on the few occasions that I have felt the need to contact my local SF "representatives" I have been largely ignored. Subsequent to a follow up prompt from me I received a terse 2 line reply. Thought I might contact my local DUP rep with the same query, what a difference. A courteous response within 7 days promising to look into my questions and 2 further letters to keep me updated on progress.
SF are happy enough to show up for a smiley, back slapping photo opportunity but don't be asking them any "awkward" questions.
That's two lines more than I got
Maybe they only do work in areas where they are really fighting for a seat. A comfortably strong nationalist area, no need to do anything . Sure we'll get in anyway . A strong unionist area with little to no hope of winning a seat , why bother.
Quote from: Last Man on November 13, 2025, 02:51:26 PMIn my own personal experience, on the few occasions that I have felt the need to contact my local SF "representatives" I have been largely ignored. Subsequent to a follow up prompt from me I received a terse 2 line reply. Thought I might contact my local DUP rep with the same query, what a difference. A courteous response within 7 days promising to look into my questions and 2 further letters to keep me updated on progress.
SF are happy enough to show up for a smiley, back slapping photo opportunity but don't be asking them any "awkward" questions.
Same. Had reason to contact Cathal Boylan to no avail so went up the line to Mickey Brady. Pure useless. Contacted the DUP. Sorted. Had another issue last year and contacted the DUP directly rather than waste my time with the local SF balloons. Sorted within 24 hrs.
Quote from: AustinPowers on November 13, 2025, 06:41:46 PMQuote from: Last Man on November 13, 2025, 02:51:26 PMIn my own personal experience, on the few occasions that I have felt the need to contact my local SF "representatives" I have been largely ignored. Subsequent to a follow up prompt from me I received a terse 2 line reply. Thought I might contact my local DUP rep with the same query, what a difference. A courteous response within 7 days promising to look into my questions and 2 further letters to keep me updated on progress.
SF are happy enough to show up for a smiley, back slapping photo opportunity but don't be asking them any "awkward" questions.
That's two lines more than I got
Maybe they only do work in areas where they are really fighting for a seat. A comfortably strong nationalist area, no need to do anything . Sure we'll get in anyway . A strong unionist area with little to no hope of winning a seat , why bother.
Seems to be the way, with demographics heading the way they are they don't need to do much and they will still get the votes. They could put up a scare crow as a candidate and it would still get voted in, would probably no different to some of their current cohort. A lot of men lying 6 foot under did not make the ultimate sacrifice for these numpties to be filling their pockets, and those of their 'employed' siblings no doubt.
Quote from: AustinPowers on November 13, 2025, 06:41:46 PMQuote from: Last Man on November 13, 2025, 02:51:26 PMIn my own personal experience, on the few occasions that I have felt the need to contact my local SF "representatives" I have been largely ignored. Subsequent to a follow up prompt from me I received a terse 2 line reply. Thought I might contact my local DUP rep with the same query, what a difference. A courteous response within 7 days promising to look into my questions and 2 further letters to keep me updated on progress.
SF are happy enough to show up for a smiley, back slapping photo opportunity but don't be asking them any "awkward" questions.
That's two lines more than I got
Maybe they only do work in areas where they are really fighting for a seat. A comfortably strong nationalist area, no need to do anything . Sure we'll get in anyway . A strong unionist area with little to no hope of winning a seat , why bother.
Thats very possible.
Although I've been on to Shinners in Newry before re stuff and got help. Again probably down to the individual than the party.
South Belfast Sinn Fein don't bother their arses answering any correspondence, in my experience and that goes for both the MLA concerned & the local Lisburn / Castlereagh councillors.
Maybe you're just a dose? :D
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on November 13, 2025, 12:34:36 PMSF will be the main reasons that the DUP and others are still getting the votes, like it or not that is the main bogeyman..
But we'll just have to plough on as neither will be going away and a UI will still be 50 plus years away, that generation that never had the troubles is still being fed hatred. Unionist parties don't have to do much to stoke the fires, any party that agrees with a motion put by SF will get lumped into the same boat
No, it's not SF.
Go back to the 20's, up to the 60's and 70's, there was no SF so to speak. It was Catholics, starting with whoever the main nationalist party was at that time.
SF is the relatively 'new issue' for them.
The worst thing to happen to unionism was the ceasefire.
Quote from: Wildweasel74 on November 13, 2025, 06:10:29 PMHow come ole Geoff trial cant go forward.If this was the common man would he get the same leeway?
Yeah, was thinking that myself.
What's the story of the delays?
Quote from: marty34 on November 13, 2025, 09:41:52 PMQuote from: Wildweasel74 on November 13, 2025, 06:10:29 PMHow come ole Geoff trial cant go forward.If this was the common man would he get the same leeway?
Yeah, was thinking that myself.
What's the story of the delays?
Lady Donaldson being "unwell". They're being tried together to save the alleged victim(s) having to go through two trials, is my understanding.
Quote from: marty34 on November 13, 2025, 09:34:29 PMQuote from: Milltown Row2 on November 13, 2025, 12:34:36 PMSF will be the main reasons that the DUP and others are still getting the votes, like it or not that is the main bogeyman..
But we'll just have to plough on as neither will be going away and a UI will still be 50 plus years away, that generation that never had the troubles is still being fed hatred. Unionist parties don't have to do much to stoke the fires, any party that agrees with a motion put by SF will get lumped into the same boat
No, it's not SF.
Go back to the 20's, up to the 60's and 70's, there was no SF so to speak. It was Catholics, starting with whoever the main nationalist party was at that time.
SF is the relatively 'new issue' for them.
The worst thing to happen to unionism was the ceasefire.
Give the unionist/loyalist any food they'll eat it up..
Forget about the past and just look at social media today, there's enough tit for tat shit on there to generate plenty of division
Sf are the main bogeymen. Having (and a good mate of mine) people in government that have a history will always be used against SF and nationalists will always be thrown into the same boat..
I really can't see a way out, there are times now I actually think it's worse than before
Quote from: Wildweasel74 on November 13, 2025, 06:10:29 PMHow come ole Geoff trial cant go forward.If this was the common man would he get the same leeway?
Yes in fact this case is being advanced much more quickly than it would be if it were the common man.
Whilst I've no specific knowledge of the case other than what's in press report is it seems that Lady Donaldsons legal team have concerns over her fitness to either plead or stand trial. It's a prerequisite of the law that at all times throughout the criminal process a person must be fit.
As a result of these concerns the defence team have had Lady Donaldson examined by an RQIA appointed consultant. That consultant has obviously been satisfied that at present she isn't fit.
As a result the PPS have sought their own opinion. Again from an RQIA appointed consultant. It's not clear what they have determined.
Either way a second consultant is required by law for the defence.
Whilst it may appear to be slow it's not. These consultants are very limited in number. I recently tried 17 of them and only 2 see the defendant within 18 months.
Without all the reports it's difficult to know how the case will proceed. It could be she's found fit and the trial can commence soon, it's possible she's not and a fact finding here could be held. It's also possible that she's not fit now but could be after months of treatments. Ultimately the trials could be split but that's very very rare and highly unlikely
Quote from: David McKeown on November 14, 2025, 12:28:05 AMQuote from: Wildweasel74 on November 13, 2025, 06:10:29 PMHow come ole Geoff trial cant go forward.If this was the common man would he get the same leeway?
Yes in fact this case is being advanced much more quickly than it would be if it were the common man.
Whilst I've no specific knowledge of the case other than what's in press report is it seems that Lady Donaldsons legal team have concerns over her fitness to either plead or stand trial. It's a prerequisite of the law that at all times throughout the criminal process a person must be fit.
As a result of these concerns the defence team have had Lady Donaldson examined by an RQIA appointed consultant. That consultant has obviously been satisfied that at present she isn't fit.
As a result the PPS have sought their own opinion. Again from an RQIA appointed consultant. It's not clear what they have determined.
Either way a second consultant is required by law for the defence.
Whilst it may appear to be slow it's not. These consultants are very limited in number. I recently tried 17 of them and only 2 see the defendant within 18 months.
Without all the reports it's difficult to know how the case will proceed. It could be she's found fit and the trial can commence soon, it's possible she's not and a fact finding here could be held. It's also possible that she's not fit now but could be after months of treatments. Ultimately the trials could be split but that's very very rare and highly unlikely
What conditions specifically could result in her being unfit to stand trial?
@David McKeown
If she's not fit to enter a plea, never mind stand trial, what happens to the charges against her??
You would want to see them split then...
If your man is guilty of what they say he is then he needs to be locked up and shamed for what he is. If he's innocent he should be cleared too.
Quote from: nrico2006 on November 14, 2025, 01:13:08 PMQuote from: David McKeown on November 14, 2025, 12:28:05 AMQuote from: Wildweasel74 on November 13, 2025, 06:10:29 PMHow come ole Geoff trial cant go forward.If this was the common man would he get the same leeway?
Yes in fact this case is being advanced much more quickly than it would be if it were the common man.
Whilst I've no specific knowledge of the case other than what's in press report is it seems that Lady Donaldsons legal team have concerns over her fitness to either plead or stand trial. It's a prerequisite of the law that at all times throughout the criminal process a person must be fit.
As a result of these concerns the defence team have had Lady Donaldson examined by an RQIA appointed consultant. That consultant has obviously been satisfied that at present she isn't fit.
As a result the PPS have sought their own opinion. Again from an RQIA appointed consultant. It's not clear what they have determined.
Either way a second consultant is required by law for the defence.
Whilst it may appear to be slow it's not. These consultants are very limited in number. I recently tried 17 of them and only 2 see the defendant within 18 months.
Without all the reports it's difficult to know how the case will proceed. It could be she's found fit and the trial can commence soon, it's possible she's not and a fact finding here could be held. It's also possible that she's not fit now but could be after months of treatments. Ultimately the trials could be split but that's very very rare and highly unlikely
What conditions specifically could result in her being unfit to stand trial?
It's not a condition per se it's a test to be applied. A person is unfit if they fail to meet any of the following criteria
a person is unfit to plead if he/she is unable to do any one of the following:-
To understand the charges
To decide whether to plead guilty or not
To exercise their right to challenge jurors
To follow the course of proceedings
To give evidence in their own defence
To instruct their legal representatives
Unfitness is a very high bar to reach
Quote from: Pub Bore on November 14, 2025, 01:25:02 PM@David McKeown
If she's not fit to enter a plea, never mind stand trial, what happens to the charges against her??
A fact finding hearing where a jury will determine if she did the acts alleged. This is different to a trial and to a finding of guilt.
If she did the acts alleged she will be made subject to a hospital order.
Quote from: imtommygunn on November 14, 2025, 01:45:00 PMYou would want to see them split then...
If your man is guilty of what they say he is then he needs to be locked up and shamed for what he is. If he's innocent he should be cleared too.
Splitting the trials may end up happening but it's completely undesirable to have the complainants to have to give evidence twice. Potentially not fair on the defendants either in terms of admissibility of evidence that may arise. It's quite complete
Surely Michael Stone was unfit for trial. Grade A pyscho!
Quote from: Wildweasel74 on November 15, 2025, 12:52:43 AMSurely Michael Stone was unfit for trial. Grade A pyscho!
Which time?
Jesus! I was there that day ducking into graves! That noise still sounding in my head! Crazy
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on November 15, 2025, 08:43:36 AMQuote from: Wildweasel74 on November 15, 2025, 12:52:43 AMSurely Michael Stone was unfit for trial. Grade A pyscho!
Which time?
Jesus! I was there that day ducking into graves! That noise still sounding in my head! Crazy
The late 80s were brutal in the North.
Quote from: Pub Bore on November 14, 2025, 01:25:02 PM@David McKeown
If she's not fit to enter a plea, never mind stand trial, what happens to the charges against her??
They are setting it up so *if* Elaine Donaldson gets a ruling that she's unfit to plead so at trial, Jeffrey can claim his (now absent) wife was to blame as the main instigator and he acted under duress from her. She provides a statement confirming this without having to attend court.
Jeff gets a light sentence and she gets to walk as under medical care.
If Paddy Power accepts odds, put your house on this outcome.
Quote from: Armagh4sam2024 on November 16, 2025, 04:41:42 PMQuote from: Pub Bore on November 14, 2025, 01:25:02 PM@David McKeown
If she's not fit to enter a plea, never mind stand trial, what happens to the charges against her??
They are setting it up so *if* Elaine Donaldson gets a ruling that she's unfit to plead so at trial, Jeffrey can claim his (now absent) wife was to blame as the main instigator and he acted under duress from her. She provides a statement confirming this without having to attend court.
Jeff gets a light sentence and she gets to walk as under medical care.
If Paddy Power accepts odds, put your house on this outcome.
The her providing a statement without attending trial would be very difficult. Also duress of circumstance is a defence not mitigation.
So I wouldn't recommend backing this particular long shot
Quote from: David McKeown on November 16, 2025, 07:08:54 PMQuote from: Armagh4sam2024 on November 16, 2025, 04:41:42 PMQuote from: Pub Bore on November 14, 2025, 01:25:02 PM@David McKeown
If she's not fit to enter a plea, never mind stand trial, what happens to the charges against her??
They are setting it up so *if* Elaine Donaldson gets a ruling that she's unfit to plead so at trial, Jeffrey can claim his (now absent) wife was to blame as the main instigator and he acted under duress from her. She provides a statement confirming this without having to attend court.
Jeff gets a light sentence and she gets to walk as under medical care.
If Paddy Power accepts odds, put your house on this outcome.
The her providing a statement without attending trial would be very difficult. Also duress of circumstance is a defence not mitigation.
So I wouldn't recommend backing this particular long shot
Legally, what is the angle they are playing at here (bar actually being "sick" of course). Are they just kicking the can down the road? Is that all they hope to get out of this if she is found capable of standing trial?
Quote from: Ethan Tremblay on November 16, 2025, 07:43:34 PMQuote from: David McKeown on November 16, 2025, 07:08:54 PMQuote from: Armagh4sam2024 on November 16, 2025, 04:41:42 PMQuote from: Pub Bore on November 14, 2025, 01:25:02 PM@David McKeown
If she's not fit to enter a plea, never mind stand trial, what happens to the charges against her??
They are setting it up so *if* Elaine Donaldson gets a ruling that she's unfit to plead so at trial, Jeffrey can claim his (now absent) wife was to blame as the main instigator and he acted under duress from her. She provides a statement confirming this without having to attend court.
Jeff gets a light sentence and she gets to walk as under medical care.
If Paddy Power accepts odds, put your house on this outcome.
The her providing a statement without attending trial would be very difficult. Also duress of circumstance is a defence not mitigation.
So I wouldn't recommend backing this particular long shot
Legally, what is the angle they are playing at here (bar actually being "sick" of course). Are they just kicking the can down the road? Is that all they hope to get out of this if she is found capable of standing trial?
I don't think there's any playing here at all. The legal team obviously have concerns over her fitness, at least one expert clearly shares those concerns.
It advantages no one for her to be deemed unfit to plead. Hospital Orders are not to be sniffed at.
Quote from: David McKeown on November 16, 2025, 09:58:34 PMQuote from: Ethan Tremblay on November 16, 2025, 07:43:34 PMQuote from: David McKeown on November 16, 2025, 07:08:54 PMQuote from: Armagh4sam2024 on November 16, 2025, 04:41:42 PMQuote from: Pub Bore on November 14, 2025, 01:25:02 PM@David McKeown
If she's not fit to enter a plea, never mind stand trial, what happens to the charges against her??
They are setting it up so *if* Elaine Donaldson gets a ruling that she's unfit to plead so at trial, Jeffrey can claim his (now absent) wife was to blame as the main instigator and he acted under duress from her. She provides a statement confirming this without having to attend court.
Jeff gets a light sentence and she gets to walk as under medical care.
If Paddy Power accepts odds, put your house on this outcome.
The her providing a statement without attending trial would be very difficult. Also duress of circumstance is a defence not mitigation.
So I wouldn't recommend backing this particular long shot
Legally, what is the angle they are playing at here (bar actually being "sick" of course). Are they just kicking the can down the road? Is that all they hope to get out of this if she is found capable of standing trial?
I don't think there's any playing here at all. The legal team obviously have concerns over her fitness, at least one expert clearly shares those concerns.
It advantages no one for her to be deemed unfit to plead. Hospital Orders are not to be sniffed at.
Wake up and smell the coffee David. They are playing the same game as Iris Robinson...
Quote from: Armagh4sam2024 on November 16, 2025, 10:14:49 PMQuote from: David McKeown on November 16, 2025, 09:58:34 PMQuote from: Ethan Tremblay on November 16, 2025, 07:43:34 PMQuote from: David McKeown on November 16, 2025, 07:08:54 PMQuote from: Armagh4sam2024 on November 16, 2025, 04:41:42 PMQuote from: Pub Bore on November 14, 2025, 01:25:02 PM@David McKeown
If she's not fit to enter a plea, never mind stand trial, what happens to the charges against her??
They are setting it up so *if* Elaine Donaldson gets a ruling that she's unfit to plead so at trial, Jeffrey can claim his (now absent) wife was to blame as the main instigator and he acted under duress from her. She provides a statement confirming this without having to attend court.
Jeff gets a light sentence and she gets to walk as under medical care.
If Paddy Power accepts odds, put your house on this outcome.
The her providing a statement without attending trial would be very difficult. Also duress of circumstance is a defence not mitigation.
So I wouldn't recommend backing this particular long shot
Legally, what is the angle they are playing at here (bar actually being "sick" of course). Are they just kicking the can down the road? Is that all they hope to get out of this if she is found capable of standing trial?
I don't think there's any playing here at all. The legal team obviously have concerns over her fitness, at least one expert clearly shares those concerns.
It advantages no one for her to be deemed unfit to plead. Hospital Orders are not to be sniffed at.
Wake up and smell the coffee David. They are playing the same game as Iris Robinson...
Is it just the defence legal team or is the prosecution in on it too? Did they hoodwink the RQIA appointed doctor as well? What about the Judge? Oh and for what gain? So that she can have a finding of fact against her without really being able to challenge the evidence and then have to spend considerable time under a hospital order?
Its not that hard to believe someone in public arena could have a serious breakdown being ACCUSED of horrible things. Particularly if innocent, which is the case at the moment until proven guilty.
Mental health is routinely used as an excuse but not all the DUP are emotionless psychopaths.
It's not hard to believe that the mental health card is the most over played card in society. It is akin to the gambling problem card when the local treasurer is caught stealing thousands.
Must be great to be perfect and know it all
Quote from: David McKeown on November 16, 2025, 11:58:38 PMQuote from: Armagh4sam2024 on November 16, 2025, 10:14:49 PMQuote from: David McKeown on November 16, 2025, 09:58:34 PMQuote from: Ethan Tremblay on November 16, 2025, 07:43:34 PMQuote from: David McKeown on November 16, 2025, 07:08:54 PMQuote from: Armagh4sam2024 on November 16, 2025, 04:41:42 PMQuote from: Pub Bore on November 14, 2025, 01:25:02 PM@David McKeown
If she's not fit to enter a plea, never mind stand trial, what happens to the charges against her??
They are setting it up so *if* Elaine Donaldson gets a ruling that she's unfit to plead so at trial, Jeffrey can claim his (now absent) wife was to blame as the main instigator and he acted under duress from her. She provides a statement confirming this without having to attend court.
Jeff gets a light sentence and she gets to walk as under medical care.
If Paddy Power accepts odds, put your house on this outcome.
The her providing a statement without attending trial would be very difficult. Also duress of circumstance is a defence not mitigation.
So I wouldn't recommend backing this particular long shot
Legally, what is the angle they are playing at here (bar actually being "sick" of course). Are they just kicking the can down the road? Is that all they hope to get out of this if she is found capable of standing trial?
I don't think there's any playing here at all. The legal team obviously have concerns over her fitness, at least one expert clearly shares those concerns.
It advantages no one for her to be deemed unfit to plead. Hospital Orders are not to be sniffed at.
Wake up and smell the coffee David. They are playing the same game as Iris Robinson...
Is it just the defence legal team or is the prosecution in on it too? Did they hoodwink the RQIA appointed doctor as well? What about the Judge? Oh and for what gain? So that she can have a finding of fact against her without really being able to challenge the evidence and then have to spend considerable time under a hospital order?
Does a finding of fact come with prison time? Would the defendant be in some sort of institution for severe mental health issues if this was the reason there was no trial?
Quote from: RedHand88 on November 17, 2025, 09:49:42 AMQuote from: David McKeown on November 16, 2025, 11:58:38 PMQuote from: Armagh4sam2024 on November 16, 2025, 10:14:49 PMQuote from: David McKeown on November 16, 2025, 09:58:34 PMQuote from: Ethan Tremblay on November 16, 2025, 07:43:34 PMQuote from: David McKeown on November 16, 2025, 07:08:54 PMQuote from: Armagh4sam2024 on November 16, 2025, 04:41:42 PMQuote from: Pub Bore on November 14, 2025, 01:25:02 PM@David McKeown
If she's not fit to enter a plea, never mind stand trial, what happens to the charges against her??
They are setting it up so *if* Elaine Donaldson gets a ruling that she's unfit to plead so at trial, Jeffrey can claim his (now absent) wife was to blame as the main instigator and he acted under duress from her. She provides a statement confirming this without having to attend court.
Jeff gets a light sentence and she gets to walk as under medical care.
If Paddy Power accepts odds, put your house on this outcome.
The her providing a statement without attending trial would be very difficult. Also duress of circumstance is a defence not mitigation.
So I wouldn't recommend backing this particular long shot
Legally, what is the angle they are playing at here (bar actually being "sick" of course). Are they just kicking the can down the road? Is that all they hope to get out of this if she is found capable of standing trial?
I don't think there's any playing here at all. The legal team obviously have concerns over her fitness, at least one expert clearly shares those concerns.
It advantages no one for her to be deemed unfit to plead. Hospital Orders are not to be sniffed at.
Wake up and smell the coffee David. They are playing the same game as Iris Robinson...
Is it just the defence legal team or is the prosecution in on it too? Did they hoodwink the RQIA appointed doctor as well? What about the Judge? Oh and for what gain? So that she can have a finding of fact against her without really being able to challenge the evidence and then have to spend considerable time under a hospital order?
Does a finding of fact come with prison time? Would the defendant be in some sort of institution for severe mental health issues if this was the reason there was no trial?
It comes with one of three possible outcomes. Given the seriousness of the charges if there is a finding of fact that an individual did the act alleged then a hospital order is the most likely outcome. A hospital order is a form of detention and is a direct alternative to prison. Decisions on on detention and release/leave etc are made by MHRT but restrictions on same can and usually are made by the court. It's certainly not an easy alternative
Any south Down people know what a muckle darg is?
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/G66l-q6XIAARZ0K?format=jpg&name=medium)
Maybe something from Harry Potter lol
That's like gizoogle gone wrong.
Quote from: armaghniac on November 29, 2025, 10:21:23 PMAny south Down people know what a muckle darg is?
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/G66l-q6XIAARZ0K?format=jpg&name=medium)
If uncle Colm from Derry girls was a protestant farmer from Ballymoney, that's what he'd sound like
Jesus, they're having a laugh looking grant money for that nonsense
When you read that out loud , you don't half sound like a tube.
Is that tripe not just English spelt how it sounds from old Protestant farmers in certain parts? Are they jealous of our language and want their own?
Quote from: Wildweasel74 on November 29, 2025, 10:42:24 PMMaybe something from Harry Potter lol
Catholics are Muckle Dargs...
https://youtu.be/HuohghCQ2SA?si=KV0a6_Pak2vXONGs
This is Belfast, aye:
1986 - huge sign erected with "Belfast says no"
2013 - major protest because union fleg not flown 365 days per year
2025 - loyalists raging because council ignore the wishes of a minority
Have I got that right?
One of the ones raising the legal case against it was away on holidays.
Jamie Wamie involved in the last two. Some asset to society. Told the media how it would not happen. Good work again Jamie.
Jamie must get feck all done. Constantly running around looking for things to complain about.
His lawn must be 6 foot high and the dishes piled high in the sink.
He needs a hobby or a sport to play. Maybe he could join East Belfast GAA and make use of that hurl of his?
They've all seem to have forgot the economic trade border separating them from the motherland ;D
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c2k41eqlvqwo
Between the whole lot of them they could not run a bath.
I think it's all underfunded by the Brits regardless. Historically and now.
The NHS is clearly broke. It's a mess and I woukdn't know where even to start to fix it. How would you even start restructure it?
Education is a mess. Schools having to close because of leaks in the roof. Other schools have mould and damp etc. in classrooms. Mobiles falling apart. Again, how and where do you start to fix that?
Housing is a big issue. Not many houses being built nowadays. House prices are crazy now. Where does that end? Another recession?
Public servants e.g. teachersand nurses etc. all looking for more pay. Where does that stop?
Prices of everything going up....from food to car insurance. When's that going to stop?
I'd stick a £20 fee on going to see a doctor. That would help to cut down on the number of 'no shows'. Trying to get an appointment these days is crazy. People decide to just go to AE and at least, after a huge wait, they'll be seen there.
When you think of the billions that has been sent to support Israel in their genocide campaign in the middle east etc., that could have been better spent on the NHS.
Would people on here be happy to pay water charges for example? Or would here be uproar?
We can't have it every way.
Quote from: LC on December 07, 2025, 10:10:06 AMhttps://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c2k41eqlvqwo
Between the whole lot of them they could not run a bath.
The GFA structure of a permanent government is a problem. The DUP need time in opposition. They are hopeless.
Quote from: marty34 on December 07, 2025, 11:11:10 AMI think it's all underfunded by the Brits regardless. Historically and now.
The NHS is clearly broke. It's a mess and I woukdn't know where even to start to fix it. How would you even start restructure it?
Education is a mess. Schools having to close because of leaks in the roof. Other schools have mould and damp etc. in classrooms. Mobiles falling apart. Again, how and where do you start to fix that?
Housing is a big issue. Not many houses being built nowadays. House prices are crazy now. Where does that end? Another recession?
Public servants e.g. teachersand nurses etc. all looking for more pay. Where does that stop?
Prices of everything going up....from food to car insurance. When's that going to stop?
I'd stick a £20 fee on going to see a doctor. That would help to cut down on the number of 'no shows'. Trying to get an appointment these days is crazy. People decide to just go to AE and at least, after a huge wait, they'll be seen there.
When you think of the billions that has been sent to support Israel in their genocide campaign in the middle east etc., that could have been better spent on the NHS.
Would people on here be happy to pay water charges for example? Or would here be uproar?
We can't have it every way.
Can't see the metrics around any of these improving in the foreseeable future, dread to think where we will be 5 - 10 years from now.
Quote from: marty34 on December 07, 2025, 11:11:10 AMI'd stick a £20 fee on going to see a doctor. That would help to cut down on the number of 'no shows'. Trying to get an appointment these days is crazy. People decide to just go to AE and at least, after a huge wait, they'll be seen there.
I pay 15 quid a month for dental practice, best money every spent, get two checkups a year and an appointment when I need, that day at times no more than a few days wait. 20 quid to see a doctor you might get to see one.
Quote from: seafoid on December 07, 2025, 11:50:17 AMQuote from: LC on December 07, 2025, 10:10:06 AMhttps://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c2k41eqlvqwo
Between the whole lot of them they could not run a bath.
The GFA structure of a permanent government is a problem. The DUP need time in opposition. They are hopeless.
The Sinners are out of their depth also, career politicals looking photo opportunities and achieving f**k all.
Quote from: AustinPowers on December 03, 2025, 07:15:31 PMJamie must get feck all done. Constantly running around looking for things to complain about.
His lawn must be 6 foot high and the dishes piled high in the sink.
He needs a hobby or a sport to play. Maybe he could join East Belfast GAA and make use of that hurl of his?
Who is this guy? Or more importantly, how does he consistently get access to the courts immediately despite not being a lawyer? And he keeps losing/wasting the courts time too...
"Covid-era schemes designed to stimulate the economy cost the taxpayer £10.9bn in fraud, the Sunday Mirror reports, ahead of the publication of a report on Tuesday".
There you go, yet another complete & utter f**k up; there's not a hope in hell of recovering any of that. It's no wonder there's a so-called economic black hole, when any spiv or shyster can get a bucket load of money for free & no meaningful checks were made, or reasonable questions asked, at the time.
Quote from: Baile Brigín 2 on December 07, 2025, 02:02:50 PMQuote from: AustinPowers on December 03, 2025, 07:15:31 PMJamie must get feck all done. Constantly running around looking for things to complain about.
His lawn must be 6 foot high and the dishes piled high in the sink.
He needs a hobby or a sport to play. Maybe he could join East Belfast GAA and make use of that hurl of his?
Who is this guy? Or more importantly, how does he consistently get access to the courts immediately despite not being a lawyer? And he keeps losing/wasting the courts time too...
He was up before me on a couple of back to back Industrial Tribunals, both of which went against his clients. One of his clients had £10,000 in costs awarded against him although, to be fair, Jamie had stopped representing him, by the time that we arrived at that stage.
Chaos as normal. (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c2k41eqlvqwo)
I have a Deep State secret meeting this evening and I'll get this budget nonsense sorted.
Quote from: LC on December 07, 2025, 12:01:37 PMQuote from: marty34 on December 07, 2025, 11:11:10 AMI think it's all underfunded by the Brits regardless. Historically and now.
The NHS is clearly broke. It's a mess and I woukdn't know where even to start to fix it. How would you even start restructure it?
Education is a mess. Schools having to close because of leaks in the roof. Other schools have mould and damp etc. in classrooms. Mobiles falling apart. Again, how and where do you start to fix that?
Housing is a big issue. Not many houses being built nowadays. House prices are crazy now. Where does that end? Another recession?
Public servants e.g. teachersand nurses etc. all looking for more pay. Where does that stop?
Prices of everything going up....from food to car insurance. When's that going to stop?
I'd stick a £20 fee on going to see a doctor. That would help to cut down on the number of 'no shows'. Trying to get an appointment these days is crazy. People decide to just go to AE and at least, after a huge wait, they'll be seen there.
When you think of the billions that has been sent to support Israel in their genocide campaign in the middle east etc., that could have been better spent on the NHS.
Would people on here be happy to pay water charges for example? Or would here be uproar?
We can't have it every way.
Can't see the metrics around any of these improving in the foreseeable future, dread to think where we will be 5 - 10 years from now.
Yep, it's shocking at the moment and it's getting worse and will continue to do so as there's no quick fix, and any long term fix will take serious money over a prolonged period of time which is not coming.
Regardless of where the blame sits for getting into the position we are in (imo Tory austerity is the main culprit but the inability of the unionist parties in particular to put people before politics is a close second), the way forward is not clear so we sit in a stalemate position with everyone hoping it'll sort itself out by shuffling money around a bit.
I used to dread the thought of my kids deciding to move abroad, now I'd actively encourage it.
Layman's view on how to fix the issues, build more hospitals and schools to increase capacity and reduce waiting lists, train/employ more doctors/nurses/consultants and pay them what is needed to retain them, build more houses to reduce demand and ease the pressures of increasing house prices/rents. All of this takes billions of investment (which we won't get) and decades to do (which we can't wait for) and in the meantime the population keeps growing and aging putting additional pressures on the resources we have.
It's taken decades to get this place into the position it's in, it'll take at least as long to fix it IF there is money and a politicians with the know-how to do it, neither of which we have.
Someone said there the Shinners are out of their depth - that may be the case, but when you have the DUP blocking everything that doesn't suit their electorate it wouldn't matter if you had the worlds top politicians in place, nothing would get done. I'd argue that Labour are out of their depth, the Tories just lined their own pockets, the DUP are bigots out to line their own pockets and there is no obvious alternative to any of it.
It really is a depressing state of affairs and I genuinely worry about quality of life here now.
Will a United Ireland resolve the issues? Not sure it would fix everything, but I do think it would improve a lot of things. Being back in the EU for one thing. A single island economy is bound be more efficient than the bastardised version of an economy we have now. Reduced/removed UK influence could only be a positive - as realistically the UK Gov are only interested in England.
Slightly off topic, ChatGPT says that in NI the required gross income for a "minimum acceptable standard of living" is 65K-75K for a family of 4. This is basically how much is needed to keep the lights on.
To have a little bit extra to be able to save some or have a modest social life, its 80K-95K.
An average nurses salary in NI is 33K, so in a home with 2 x 33K salaries (i.e. 2 full time workers) you can just about afford the minimum acceptable standard of living - but you prob wont get access to a doctor if needed.
Country is fooked. Our kids are going to be in a worse position than anyone today with the constant increase in cost and decrease in availability of public services. We really need that magic money tree.
You can't escape the benefit culture in the 6, I in 3 cars are DVLA ffs, the public sector is overloaded with folk doing little or nothing, that's not doctors, nurses, fire fighters, police etc. that is 30000 in the civil service kicking their heels up and folk on the hill paying family and friends to do likewise, it is a shithole and as long as these career politicians orange and green get voted in for doing nothing, nothing will change.
Quote from: Munchie on December 08, 2025, 10:33:24 AMYou can't escape the benefit culture in the 6, I in 3 cars are DVLA ffs, the public sector is overloaded with folk doing little or nothing, that's not doctors, nurses, fire fighters, police etc. that is 30000 in the civil service kicking their heels up and folk on the hill paying family and friends to do likewise, it is a shithole and as long as these career politicians orange and green get voted in for doing nothing, nothing will change.
you really have an issue with the NICS
You think it provides value for money?
It's a waste of time. But sure where do we go if we lay off x amount of people on it? We need a strong all island economy with actual productive jobs for those people.
Quote from: Munchie on December 08, 2025, 10:33:24 AMYou can't escape the benefit culture in the 6, I in 3 cars are DVLA ffs, the public sector is overloaded with folk doing little or nothing, that's not doctors, nurses, fire fighters, police etc. that is 30000 in the civil service kicking their heels up and folk on the hill paying family and friends to do likewise, it is a shithole and as long as these career politicians orange and green get voted in for doing nothing, nothing will change.
That's not unique to NI though, people on benefits all over the UK and indeed ROI.
There will always be people who abuse the system - doesn't mean do away with the system, more that it needs to be fixed. But it needs fixed in a way that doesn't adversely affect those genuinely in need.
Growing up, I knew of plenty who "did the double" - mostly because they couldn't afford not to. Of the people I know on who are on benefits all are in need, 1 has a DLA car and it's entirely warranted.
Whilst I agree there are plenty out there abusing the system, I also don't buy the assertion that they're all milking it which is what terms like "benefit culture" suggest. All sounds a bit Nigel Farage-ish.
But to return to my point on what a minimum acceptable standard of living costs, there are many people who do not have the skills or qualifications to earn a household 65K a year for a small family to survive. So of course they will revert to the benefit system, why wouldn't they? If the cost of living was lower, it might reduce the number of people on benefits. At the minute, the UK government approach is to increase the minimum wage and stop the boats and increase taxes, which increases cost of living and that just perpetuates the cycle.
I do agree with the Civil Service issues to a certain extent. Feels artificially bloated in areas. The entitlement to non-performance related pay rises is not conducive to a performant service - instead it rewards those who are not very good at their job. Then there's the pensions they get too, which we all pay for.
It's just another element of society here that's not really fixable in the short term, especially with unions in to the hilt. But remember Civil Service includes doctors and nurses, teachers and bin collectors. All essential - it's more those back office / managerial roles that seem to be where the issues are. At least from the outside looking in. There might be 30K in the civil service, but I'd imagine the numbers that could be trimmed from the service could be small enough.
As for career politicians, genuinely not entirely clear what you mean by that term? Do you mean just in it for the money? If so, I'm sure for some that is the case but others are in it for the ideology of their parties. I think that most do want to represent their own communities, it's just that some are not very good at putting that ahead of their own personal goals.
Quote from: Armagh18 on December 08, 2025, 10:54:21 AMIt's a waste of time. But sure where do we go if we lay off x amount of people on it? We need a strong all island economy with actual productive jobs for those people.
Sums it up, paid to do nothing whilst employed or paid to do nothing if laid off as these folk wouldn't survive in the private sector.
Our politicians can't even achieve the simplest of changes without backtracking or inventing issues to chuck into the mix.
Council U-turn on busker and preacher noise rules for Belfast city centre | Belfast Live
So, they are very unlikely to be able to resolve the crisis with GP practices and in our hospitals.
I am in a family of 4 and whilst I don't want to say AI is wrong in case it seeks revenge on me, the figure for a minimum acceptable standard of living at 65K-75K for a family of 4 seems high or an acceptable standard of living is more than I expect.
And if the public sector is overloaded with folk doing little or nothing then at least it is people getting a wage. Without this our entire subsidised statelet would be even more screwed.
"Layman's view on how to fix the issues, build more hospitals"
Has it occurred to anyone why we have an ever increasing sick population? Have we somehow created a system that incentivizes poor health, for as far as I can see most of this is self inflicted.
Also, how about tackling the systematic waste in the NHS. If something is "free", people can't help themselves but take the piss out of it.
I am for paying a bit less tax but paying for healthcare and medications as an when I need it.
https://m.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/politics/nobody-will-take-to-street-here-as-they-dont-give-a-damn-about-stormont/a587788087.html
Historian and political commentator Dr Brian Feeney believes that Stormont will never work successfully and that Irish unity is "the only answer".
He thinks that the devolved administration shouldn't continue to exist in the event of a united Ireland.
Historian and political commentator Dr Brian Feeney
Feeney, who has a keen interest in Belgian politics, predicts there wouldn't be the same public anger if Stormont collapsed. "Nobody would take to the streets because nobody gives a damn," he says.
"Opinion polls show that support for the Executive is consistently falling, and that's not surprising. Devolution just doesn't deliver. When it collapses what tends to happen is that direct rule ministers cut through the garbage that goes on here and bring in modern legislation on abortion and LGBTQ rights which Stormont can't do."
Feeney claims that Stormont "makes a complete mess" of its budget. "It spends money on all the wrong things. It's not investing enough in education, health or infrastructure, and far too much on agriculture," he says.
"We spend 3.5 times what the rest of the UK does on agriculture. The Executive isn't dealing with the Lough Neagh crisis. It refuses to raise local taxation. Northern Ireland is withering on the vine."
Quote from: GTP on December 08, 2025, 11:01:23 AMOur politicians can't even achieve the simplest of changes without backtracking or inventing issues to chuck into the mix.
Council U-turn on busker and preacher noise rules for Belfast city centre | Belfast Live
So, they are very unlikely to be able to resolve the crisis with GP practices and in our hospitals.
I am in a family of 4 and whilst I don't want to say AI is wrong in case it seeks revenge on me, the figure for a minimum acceptable standard of living at 65K-75K for a family of 4 seems high or an acceptable standard of living is more than I expect.
And if the public sector is overloaded with folk doing little or nothing then at least it is people getting a wage. Without this our entire subsidised statelet would be even more screwed.
Yeah it is not fully just the fault of politicians now. There has been years of jobs for boys here and we have been over subsidised and are now paying the consequences. I also wonder how much of an impact Brexit has had.
An example if things that could be done - the NHS here should be one trust. That would remove bureaucracy and remove a lot of jobs but it would run much more efficiently. I don't work in it but I know people high up in it who have said that.
I think we are almost too small up here. The state we are in I believe the only way out is a UI and that is not an easy solution either because it would mean 26 counties instead of the. rest of the UK paying for us.
Self sustaining is not something we are and it is hard to see how we get it :(
The whole grade system in the public sector is a complete disaster. Prime getting "promoted" where there are no jobs available and then get to merrily sit on a list for the next job at that grade to come up whether qualified for it or not.
Have a family friend (who is very capable and works hard) in this exact position recently. Got promoted. No job. Job comes up at her grade in a completely different department looking after a completely different sector, and she automatically gets it.
Quote from: GTP on December 08, 2025, 11:01:23 AMOur politicians can't even achieve the simplest of changes without backtracking or inventing issues to chuck into the mix.
Council U-turn on busker and preacher noise rules for Belfast city centre | Belfast Live
So, they are very unlikely to be able to resolve the crisis with GP practices and in our hospitals.
I am in a family of 4 and whilst I don't want to say AI is wrong in case it seeks revenge on me, the figure for a minimum acceptable standard of living at 65K-75K for a family of 4 seems high or an acceptable standard of living is more than I expect.
And if the public sector is overloaded with folk doing little or nothing then at least it is people getting a wage. Without this our entire subsidised statelet would be even more screwed.
The gravy train in a sentence.
Quote from: Last Man on December 08, 2025, 11:08:54 AM"Layman's view on how to fix the issues, build more hospitals"
Has it occurred to anyone why we have an ever increasing sick population? Have we somehow created a system that incentivizes poor health, for as far as I can see most of this is self inflicted.
Also, how about tackling the systematic waste in the NHS. If something is "free", people can't help themselves but take the piss out of it.
I am for paying a bit less tax but paying for healthcare and medications as an when I need it.
Even if they did attempt to raise money, by doing away with free prescriptions for those working or introducing water charges, would you have any faith in them spending the money where needed, waste, waste and repeat and they yap the Brits aren't given them enough money.
Quote from: gallsman on December 08, 2025, 11:38:09 AMThe whole grade system in the public sector is a complete disaster. Prime getting "promoted" where there are no jobs available and then get to merrily sit on a list for the next job at that grade to come up whether qualified for it or not.
Have a family friend (who is very capable and works hard) in this exact position recently. Got promoted. No job. Job comes up at her grade in a completely different department looking after a completely different sector, and she automatically gets it.
And unions negotiate pay rises based on being an employee and nothing to do with performance.
Quote from: Last Man on December 08, 2025, 11:08:54 AM"Layman's view on how to fix the issues, build more hospitals"
Has it occurred to anyone why we have an ever increasing sick population? Have we somehow created a system that incentivizes poor health, for as far as I can see most of this is self inflicted.
Also, how about tackling the systematic waste in the NHS. If something is "free", people can't help themselves but take the piss out of it.
I am for paying a bit less tax but paying for healthcare and medications as an when I need it.
The much vaunted Bengoa report which is probably defunct now said that we had too many hospitals and services needed to be centralised into specialist hubs.
image a Unionist minister giving the go ahead to close Lagan Valley or a nationalist minister giving the go ahead of closing Downpatrick or Omagh!
Quote from: johnnycool on December 08, 2025, 11:54:44 AMQuote from: Last Man on December 08, 2025, 11:08:54 AM"Layman's view on how to fix the issues, build more hospitals"
Has it occurred to anyone why we have an ever increasing sick population? Have we somehow created a system that incentivizes poor health, for as far as I can see most of this is self inflicted.
Also, how about tackling the systematic waste in the NHS. If something is "free", people can't help themselves but take the piss out of it.
I am for paying a bit less tax but paying for healthcare and medications as an when I need it.
The much vaunted Bengoa report which is probably defunct now said that we had too many hospitals and services needed to be centralised into specialist hubs.
image a Unionist minister giving the go ahead to close Lagan Valley or a nationalist minister giving the go ahead of closing Downpatrick or Omagh!
Total lack of leadership, the argument is people don't want to die on the road to [bigger population centre]
Well, you are going to die anyway as the consultant treating you as no experience which is why he is working in your local rural clinic.
It is one of the downside of mandatory coalition, why take the risk of changing anything, protect the status quo.
At some stage people have to be levelled with, if you want to live in the arsehole of nowhere then you can't expect the same services as large populations unless rates go through the roof, that includes the ability to drive into those large centres - get the bus or train or cycle or walk but stop polluting the town/city air because you want to live on a half acre next to your ma.
QuoteQuoteYou can't escape the benefit culture in the 6, I in 3 cars are DVLA ffs, the public sector is overloaded with folk doing little or nothing, that's not doctors, nurses, fire fighters, police etc. that is 30000 in the civil service kicking their heels up and folk on the hill paying family and friends to do likewise, it is a shithole and as long as these career politicians orange and green get voted in for doing nothing, nothing will change.
That's not unique to NI though, people on benefits all over the UK and indeed ROI.
There will always be people who abuse the system - doesn't mean do away with the system, more that it needs to be fixed. But it needs fixed in a way that doesn't adversely affect those genuinely in need.
Growing up, I knew of plenty who "did the double" - mostly because they couldn't afford not to. Of the people I know on who are on benefits all are in need, 1 has a DLA car and it's entirely warranted.
Whilst I agree there are plenty out there abusing the system, I also don't buy the assertion that they're all milking it which is what terms like "benefit culture" suggest. All sounds a bit Nigel Farage-ish.
But to return to my point on what a minimum acceptable standard of living costs, there are many people who do not have the skills or qualifications to earn a household 65K a year for a small family to survive. So of course they will revert to the benefit system, why wouldn't they? If the cost of living was lower, it might reduce the number of people on benefits. At the minute, the UK government approach is to increase the minimum wage and stop the boats and increase taxes, which increases cost of living and that just perpetuates the cycle.
I do agree with the Civil Service issues to a certain extent. Feels artificially bloated in areas. The entitlement to non-performance related pay rises is not conducive to a performant service - instead it rewards those who are not very good at their job. Then there's the pensions they get too, which we all pay for.
It's just another element of society here that's not really fixable in the short term, especially with unions in to the hilt. But remember Civil Service includes doctors and nurses, teachers and bin collectors. All essential - it's more those back office / managerial roles that seem to be where the issues are. At least from the outside looking in. There might be 30K in the civil service, but I'd imagine the numbers that could be trimmed from the service could be small enough.
As for career politicians, genuinely not entirely clear what you mean by that term? Do you mean just in it for the money? If so, I'm sure for some that is the case but others are in it for the ideology of their parties. I think that most do want to represent their own communities, it's just that some are not very good at putting that ahead of their own personal goals.
Yes, good points
Quote"Layman's view on how to fix the issues, build more hospitals"
Has it occurred to anyone why we have an ever increasing sick population? Have we somehow created a system that incentivizes poor health, for as far as I can see most of this is self inflicted.
Also, how about tackling the systematic waste in the NHS. If something is "free", people can't help themselves but take the piss out of it.
I am for paying a bit less tax but paying for healthcare and medications as an when I need it.
I've paid for private consultations over the years, from £100-200. But the amount of missed appointments is ridiculous. If people were charged £100-200 for a missed appointment, they'd turn up next time. Same with missed doctors appointment.
If Stormont are looking for a revenue raising method, I'd say most people would be in favour of this one.
Quote from: Munchie on December 08, 2025, 11:49:24 AMQuote from: Last Man on December 08, 2025, 11:08:54 AM"Layman's view on how to fix the issues, build more hospitals"
Has it occurred to anyone why we have an ever increasing sick population? Have we somehow created a system that incentivizes poor health, for as far as I can see most of this is self inflicted.
Also, how about tackling the systematic waste in the NHS. If something is "free", people can't help themselves but take the piss out of it.
I am for paying a bit less tax but paying for healthcare and medications as an when I need it.
Even if they did attempt to raise money, by doing away with free prescriptions for those working or introducing water charges, would you have any faith in them spending the money where needed, waste, waste and repeat and they yap the Brits aren't given them enough money.
100% No.
It's just more money for. them to piss up the wall.
Let's say there's 500,000 households in the north, who pay £500 water charges a year. That's 250 million. Correct me if I'm wrong , but that chicken house scheme cost nearly 500 million. Need I say more?
Quote from: AustinPowers on December 08, 2025, 12:14:10 PMQuote"Layman's view on how to fix the issues, build more hospitals"
Has it occurred to anyone why we have an ever increasing sick population? Have we somehow created a system that incentivizes poor health, for as far as I can see most of this is self inflicted.
Also, how about tackling the systematic waste in the NHS. If something is "free", people can't help themselves but take the piss out of it.
I am for paying a bit less tax but paying for healthcare and medications as an when I need it.
I've paid for private consultations over the years, from £100-200. But the amount of missed appointments is ridiculous. If people were charged £100-200 for a missed appointment, they'd turn up next time. Same with missed doctors appointment.
If Stormont are looking for a revenue raising method, I'd say more people would be in favour of this one.
Yeah that'd definitely be one worth looking at. Basic decency would mean either turning up or letting them know you won't be there. Fine away for no shows imo
Quote from: Last Man on December 08, 2025, 11:08:54 AM"Layman's view on how to fix the issues, build more hospitals"
Has it occurred to anyone why we have an ever increasing sick population? Have we somehow created a system that incentivizes poor health, for as far as I can see most of this is self inflicted.
Also, how about tackling the systematic waste in the NHS. If something is "free", people can't help themselves but take the piss out of it.
I am for paying a bit less tax but paying for healthcare and medications as an when I need it.
Does not apply to all cases but a significant proportion.
A lot of Mr & Mrs (each 20 stone plus) about pushing a trolley around Tesco's stacked with all of shite of the day. If not already they and their off spring are / will be clogging up the system now and in the future due to their 'lifestyle'. It amazes me that in the so call deprived areas of places like Belfast / Derry you have no shortage of takeaways, off-licenses and pharmacists and usually all beside other.
Not to mention betting shops open from craic of dawn with an unlimited supply of customers.
Quote from: Munchie on December 08, 2025, 01:47:32 PMNot to mention betting shops open from craic of dawn with an unlimited supply of customers.
Must be all calling in on their way home from working a night shift...........some chance.
More like 'work shy' areas as opposed to working class.
Quote from: tonto1888 on December 08, 2025, 10:41:36 AMQuote from: Munchie on December 08, 2025, 10:33:24 AMYou can't escape the benefit culture in the 6, I in 3 cars are DVLA ffs, the public sector is overloaded with folk doing little or nothing, that's not doctors, nurses, fire fighters, police etc. that is 30000 in the civil service kicking their heels up and folk on the hill paying family and friends to do likewise, it is a shithole and as long as these career politicians orange and green get voted in for doing nothing, nothing will change.
you really have an issue with the NICS
I honestly think Munchie has an issue with absolutely everything. Every post I come across from him is negativity. Even the existence of the feckin Late Late Toy Show is source of a gripe ffs!
I see DUP trying to block SF attempts to get "Observer status" at the EU.
And did I hear correctly that Paul Given won't approve letting girls wear trousers in schools?
Quote from: Snapchap on December 08, 2025, 03:10:52 PMQuote from: tonto1888 on December 08, 2025, 10:41:36 AMQuote from: Munchie on December 08, 2025, 10:33:24 AMYou can't escape the benefit culture in the 6, I in 3 cars are DVLA ffs, the public sector is overloaded with folk doing little or nothing, that's not doctors, nurses, fire fighters, police etc. that is 30000 in the civil service kicking their heels up and folk on the hill paying family and friends to do likewise, it is a shithole and as long as these career politicians orange and green get voted in for doing nothing, nothing will change.
you really have an issue with the NICS
I honestly think Munchie has an issue with absolutely everything. Every post I come across from him is negativity. Even the existence of the feckin Late Late Toy Show is source of a gripe ffs!
definitely seems that way
Quote from: LC on December 08, 2025, 01:44:05 PMQuote from: Last Man on December 08, 2025, 11:08:54 AM"Layman's view on how to fix the issues, build more hospitals"
Has it occurred to anyone why we have an ever increasing sick population? Have we somehow created a system that incentivizes poor health, for as far as I can see most of this is self inflicted.
Also, how about tackling the systematic waste in the NHS. If something is "free", people can't help themselves but take the piss out of it.
I am for paying a bit less tax but paying for healthcare and medications as an when I need it.
Does not apply to all cases but a significant proportion.
A lot of Mr & Mrs (each 20 stone plus) about pushing a trolley around Tesco's stacked with all of shite of the day. If not already they and their off spring are / will be clogging up the system now and in the future due to their 'lifestyle'. It amazes me that in the so call deprived areas of places like Belfast / Derry you have no shortage of takeaways, off-licenses and pharmacists and usually all beside other.
Ah lads, that's a bit simplistic if you ask me. I'm not 20 stone, but I know I'm too heavy, have always struggled with weight and have managed to shift about 2 stone over the last year. But, I don't eat all the shite of the day and my kids eat the same diet I do with not one of them overweight. Yes there are some 'lifestyle' issues affecting the health, but the main issue is that people are living longer and the population is growing - and on the flip side services have been reduced due to prolonged lack of investment. Maybe if Bengoa had been implemented at the time we'd be in a better shape now, but I'm not sure about that.
When my local hospital regularly has 19hr A&E waits at this time of year, its not down to lifestyle patients, it's down to not enough capacity in the system to deal with acute spikes in seasonal illness.
People can't get out of hospital as care packages can't be put in place - generally with older people. Which blocks beds.
People can't get to see a consultant as waiting lists are so long, meaning early interventions are reduced, adding more pressure on beds as people who could have avoided getting seriously ill are becoming seriously ill or worse.
I don't know what the answer is to all this, but it feels to me that a complete reset is is needed. If you were to build a health service today from scratch, you'd build it to meet current and known future demand and with scope to scale up or down as needed.
So maybe what's needed is in the short term increase capacity, with the view of streamlining in the longer term.
Lifestyle diseases may not be the main factor but they are certainly significant. 10s of billions per annum and I'd reckon a large proportion of those people in hospital or treatment for obesity or smoking/alcohol/drug related issues are contributing little to nothing in taxes.
Quote from: tbrick18 on December 09, 2025, 02:35:45 PMQuote from: LC on December 08, 2025, 01:44:05 PMQuote from: Last Man on December 08, 2025, 11:08:54 AM"Layman's view on how to fix the issues, build more hospitals"
Has it occurred to anyone why we have an ever increasing sick population? Have we somehow created a system that incentivizes poor health, for as far as I can see most of this is self inflicted.
Also, how about tackling the systematic waste in the NHS. If something is "free", people can't help themselves but take the piss out of it.
I am for paying a bit less tax but paying for healthcare and medications as an when I need it.
Does not apply to all cases but a significant proportion.
A lot of Mr & Mrs (each 20 stone plus) about pushing a trolley around Tesco's stacked with all of shite of the day. If not already they and their off spring are / will be clogging up the system now and in the future due to their 'lifestyle'. It amazes me that in the so call deprived areas of places like Belfast / Derry you have no shortage of takeaways, off-licenses and pharmacists and usually all beside other.
Ah lads, that's a bit simplistic if you ask me. I'm not 20 stone, but I know I'm too heavy, have always struggled with weight and have managed to shift about 2 stone over the last year. But, I don't eat all the shite of the day and my kids eat the same diet I do with not one of them overweight. Yes there are some 'lifestyle' issues affecting the health, but the main issue is that people are living longer and the population is growing - and on the flip side services have been reduced due to prolonged lack of investment. Maybe if Bengoa had been implemented at the time we'd be in a better shape now, but I'm not sure about that.
When my local hospital regularly has 19hr A&E waits at this time of year, its not down to lifestyle patients, it's down to not enough capacity in the system to deal with acute spikes in seasonal illness.
Correct. Inept politicians are to blame.
QuotePeople can't get out of hospital as care packages can't be put in place - generally with older people. Which blocks beds.
This has been the talked about for maybe 3 or 4 years now. Nothing being done. Inept politicians yet again
QuotePeople can't get to see a consultant as waiting lists are so long, meaning early interventions are reduced, adding more pressure on beds as people who could have avoided getting seriously ill are becoming seriously ill or worse.
I don't know what the answer is to all this, but it feels to me that a complete reset is is needed. If you were to build a health service today from scratch, you'd build it to meet current and known future demand and with scope to scale up or down as needed.
So maybe what's needed is in the short term increase capacity, with the view of streamlining in the longer term.
Quote from: Tony Baloney on December 09, 2025, 04:13:46 PMLifestyle diseases may not be the main factor but they are certainly significant. 10s of billions per annum and I'd reckon a large proportion of those people in hospital or treatment for obesity or smoking/alcohol/drug related issues are contributing little to nothing in taxes.
Mortality rates are higher for working class people. Chronic disease is correlated with early death. Smokers die younger as well.
Smokers are paying a right bit of tax!
Quote from: Duine Inteacht Eile on December 09, 2025, 07:19:59 PMSmokers are paying a right bit of tax!
I take a pint myself but I think alcohol should be taxed heavily at off licenses / supermarkets. It is accessed far too easy.
How much less chaotic would A&Es be at the weekend and how much less pressure would the emergency services be under if drink was not as easily affordable especially those who live the working class (work shy) parts of the country.
I appreciate there is still the issue of drugs but if the drink was sorted it would be a starting point.
The DUP abstained in a Westminster vote to re-join the EU customs market, lol.
Quote from: Orior on December 09, 2025, 08:18:51 PMThe DUP abstained in a Westminster vote to re-join the EU customs market, lol.
The North is in the customs union and the Single Market. The DUP gets the best of both worlds.
Quote from: LC on December 09, 2025, 07:47:04 PMQuote from: Duine Inteacht Eile on December 09, 2025, 07:19:59 PMSmokers are paying a right bit of tax!
I take a pint myself but I think alcohol should be taxed heavily at off licenses / supermarkets. It is accessed far too easy.
How much less chaotic would A&Es be at the weekend and how much less pressure would the emergency services be under if drink was not as easily affordable especially those who live the working class (work shy) parts of the country.
I appreciate there is still the issue of drugs but if the drink was sorted it would be a starting point.
An alcoholic will always get a drink, same as a junkie will always get his drugs. Proper addiction/mental health services are the answer, not making drink even more of a rip off than it already is!
Quote from: LC on December 09, 2025, 07:47:04 PMQuote from: Duine Inteacht Eile on December 09, 2025, 07:19:59 PMSmokers are paying a right bit of tax!
I take a pint myself but I think alcohol should be taxed heavily at off licenses / supermarkets. It is accessed far too easy.
How much less chaotic would A&Es be at the weekend and how much less pressure would the emergency services be under if drink was not as easily affordable especially those who live the working class (work shy) parts of the country.
I appreciate there is still the issue of drugs but if the drink was sorted it would be a starting point.
The last 2 bottles of wine I bought in a supermarket in Spain in the summer (Rioja) were €1.75 and €1.95..btl here would be £12. You want it dearer again?
I see UUP leader Nesbitt stepping down (again!)
Easily affordable,dear enough these days. An alcholic still get drunk even if u put the price way up. I havent took a drink in 18months but what about the casual drinker!
I see NI will have the Ulster banner for the commonwealth games again. That Gordon Lyons moved swiftly to put the pressure on one day after Team NI said they would use their logo instead. Shame he didn't move so swiftly over Casement and sat on things for months and months. Unionism making a show of themselves over something so ridiculous. John Burrows claiming not using the flag is a sign of exclusion rather than inclusion (you couldn't make it up). Mick featly on the radio saying something similar FFS. Burrows confirming that he will be leading the UUP to a more traditional and less liberal stance.
It's all quite comical all the faux outrage etc etc except at they end of the day they get what they want. Bonfires in asbestos ridden areas, no problem, expensive ice bowl yep, compare to the likes of casement and A5 getting nowhere, Irish language getting blocked at every opportunity.
I wouldn't mind any of this shit if the country was doing well elsewhere but seeing as it is falling apart and there is no money for anything it's all a bit depressing
It makes you think what are SF actually doing? The SDLP would be no better either if they were in government and as for the middle ground well they are pretty much useless too. So good luck finding a party to vote for.
They finally won a fleg argument did they
NI commonwealth committee said they looked to Stormont for guidance on what fleg to use
Why didn't they just make a decision themselves? The hockey team flies a 4 province flag if I remember correctly . I assume they didn't need Stormont or Dublin government to help them make that decision .
Quote from: AustinPowers on January 14, 2026, 12:56:26 PMNI commonwealth committee said they looked to Stormont for guidance on what fleg to use
Why didn't they just make a decision themselves? The hockey team flies a 4 province flag if I remember correctly . I assume they didn't need Stormont or Dublin government to help them make that decision .
They obviously had some athletes come forward and point out that the flag obviously isn't very inclusive. As you said they should have just done it themselves but thought if they leave it to Stormont then there might be a hope that some arrangement could be made. Instead we had the predictable outrage from Unionism and unfortunately nationalists and the middle ground just sat back and did nothing hence the almost immediate climb down from the committee
Flegs, casement, themuns erosion, equality, blah blah..
Bored outta my brain with the nonsense that keeps people at it
This is the start of what's to come if and when a United Ireland happens
Won't be pretty for a while
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on January 14, 2026, 01:13:31 PMFlegs, casement, themuns erosion, equality, blah blah..
Bored outta my brain with the nonsense that keeps people at it
This is the start of what's to come if and when a United Ireland happens
Won't be pretty for a while ever
Fixed that
Watching the evening news this last few weeks is like Groundhog Day.
Hospitals under pressure
Roads, houses, Casement still not built
Dicks in Stormont snarling at each other
A row about Irish language or a flag
Then when the weather warms up, add in:
Bonfires
Orange marches
Lough Neagh still F**ked
DUPUDA also objecting to a Fleadh event in Bangor.
"Cause tensions"....
Obviously getting their bigotry in before TUVUDA.
One of the many amusing bits in this was unionists saying that nobody has complained. Aye, sure, complaining would result in an avalanche of abuse.
Post from Loyalist Markethill Facebookd page:
This is a cultural war.
Wear your colours with pride. Wear your Rangers tops, and other sporting tops with pride. Get your own loyal order, band, supporters clubs, and cultural society badges etc embroidered and wear them with pride.
Some GAA activists wear their merchandise to work, funerals, schools etc, it's never off some of them. So lets wear our colours and show our identity more proudly.
The lack of brains is mind blowing.
DUP MLAs on social very triumphant about Commonwealth flag issue. Does anyone, other than themselves, really care about the Commonwealth games or what flag they carry?
Hoping to see an influx of band uniforms in the bars in town lol!
Quote from: Truthsayer on January 14, 2026, 01:54:08 PMDUP MLAs on social very triumphant about Commonwealth flag issue. Does anyone, other than themselves, really care about the Commonwealth games or what flag they carry?
I'm not sure what the craic is here? Someone from the games committee said lets try something else, no one complained when it went to the Hill and then when people did complain those that didn't do something about complained?
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on January 14, 2026, 01:58:06 PMHoping to see an influx of band uniforms in the bars in town lol! Quote from: Truthsayer on January 14, 2026, 01:54:08 PMDUP MLAs on social very triumphant about Commonwealth flag issue. Does anyone, other than themselves, really care about the Commonwealth games or what flag they carry?
I'm not sure what the craic is here? Someone from the games committee said lets try something else, no one complained when it went to the Hill and then when people did complain those that didn't do something about complained?
Don't know - don't care. A load DUP MLAs put up similar message bout it this morning and followers then gloating at the outcome... I was then thinking: who cares? Why they gloating?
Quote from: Truthsayer on January 14, 2026, 02:37:15 PMQuote from: Milltown Row2 on January 14, 2026, 01:58:06 PMHoping to see an influx of band uniforms in the bars in town lol! Quote from: Truthsayer on January 14, 2026, 01:54:08 PMDUP MLAs on social very triumphant about Commonwealth flag issue. Does anyone, other than themselves, really care about the Commonwealth games or what flag they carry?
I'm not sure what the craic is here? Someone from the games committee said lets try something else, no one complained when it went to the Hill and then when people did complain those that didn't do something about complained?
Don't know - don't care. A load DUP MLAs put up similar message bout it this morning and followers then gloating at the outcome... I was then thinking: who cares? Why they gloating?
They have to be seen to be doing something... anything .
They can't let their Neanderthal voters think they're lying down and accepting this "pan nationalist fwront" agenda, as Bryson calls it. Any sort of "victory" (even if it isn't) , is perceived to be another point scored in securing the union.
Quote from: AustinPowers on January 14, 2026, 02:59:39 PMQuote from: Truthsayer on January 14, 2026, 02:37:15 PMQuote from: Milltown Row2 on January 14, 2026, 01:58:06 PMHoping to see an influx of band uniforms in the bars in town lol! Quote from: Truthsayer on January 14, 2026, 01:54:08 PMDUP MLAs on social very triumphant about Commonwealth flag issue. Does anyone, other than themselves, really care about the Commonwealth games or what flag they carry?
I'm not sure what the craic is here? Someone from the games committee said lets try something else, no one complained when it went to the Hill and then when people did complain those that didn't do something about complained?
Don't know - don't care. A load DUP MLAs put up similar message bout it this morning and followers then gloating at the outcome... I was then thinking: who cares? Why they gloating?
They have to be seen to be doing something... anything .
They can't let their Neanderthal voters think they're lying down and accepting this "pan nationalist fwront" agenda, as Bryson calls it. Any sort of "victory" (even if it isn't) , is perceived to be another point scored in securing the union.
Everything, and I mean everything, is a battle to them; otherwise, they have nothing to exist for. It's a sad existence.
They're going after Conal Heatley now :-/
Sportswashing for colonialism is all it is.
Circle the wagons time
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cd0y7vnyzl1o
I see the esteemed Carla Lockhart MP is trying to find out how many times Epstein visited Hillsborough Castle. Wonder what it is about men named Jeffrey that gets the DUP so exercised?
Arsehole Campbell giving out to Uachtarán na hÉireann in Derry today because she didn't put London before it in her speech.
Quote from: Rossfan on February 05, 2026, 06:59:38 PMArsehole Campbell giving out to Uachtarán na hÉireann in Derry today because she didn't put London before it in her speech.
I hope she mentioned Derry at least 30 times.
14 apparently lol
Campbell is the ****'s ****.
Quote from: gallsman on February 05, 2026, 08:01:09 PMCampbell is the ****'s ****.
;D I can fill in those blanks.
I stole it from Kevin Bridges in fairness. Once described Danny Dyer as the p***k's p***k.
Ah come on, pr1ck shouldn't be censored!
Not necessarily a swipe at the DUP but more Stormont in general in terms of this is an example of how ineffective it is as an institution in that you have a situation that can be actioned which would make an impact on peoples lives however they have supposedly 'ran out of time'.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cx2gllrzn1do
These are just ordinary people who like the majority of this do not give 2 fs about red, white and blue or green, white and gold however have been let down badly by those who are supposed to look out for our best interests.
Quote from: LC on February 10, 2026, 06:31:27 AMNot necessarily a swipe at the DUP but more Stormont in general in terms of this is an example of how ineffective it is as an institution in that you have a situation that can be actioned which would make an impact on peoples lives however they have supposedly 'ran out of time'.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cx2gllrzn1do
These are just ordinary people who like the majority of this do not give 2 fs about red, white and blue or green, white and gold however have been let down badly by those who are supposed to look out for our best interests.
"No legislative space" to discuss it according to Nesbitt. Sam McBride posted a few weeks ago that the
Legislative Assembly had spent 9 minutes in total discussing legislation and the rest talking shite*.
*My wording.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c7vjnndlm4lo
If those clowns up on the hill were able to do at least one productive thing would be get this across the line.
Having been unfortunate enough to be in casualty on a weekend night on occasions you can see first hand how alcohol plays a key role in a number of incidents.
Quote from: LC on February 19, 2026, 08:25:11 AMhttps://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c7vjnndlm4lo
If those clowns up on the hill were able to do at least one productive thing would be get this across the line.
Having been unfortunate enough to be in casualty on a weekend night on occasions you can see first hand how alcohol plays a key role in a number of incidents.
This may sound daft but what about rising the age?
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on February 19, 2026, 08:29:54 AMQuote from: LC on February 19, 2026, 08:25:11 AMhttps://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c7vjnndlm4lo
If those clowns up on the hill were able to do at least one productive thing would be get this across the line.
Having been unfortunate enough to be in casualty on a weekend night on occasions you can see first hand how alcohol plays a key role in a number of incidents.
This may sound daft but what about rising the age?
You're right it does :D
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cvgjpnere98o
If this place was a Ltd company Administrators would have stepped in ages ago.
The words piss up and brewery come to mind.
Economically the South in normal circumstances would not touch us with a bar pole.
https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/business/northern-ireland/ex-dup-mp-ian-paisley-leading-%C2%A314m-plan-to-restore-historic-co-antrim-castle-and-estate/a/136350564.html
What could possibly go wrong there? We should watch on with interest, to see how this all pans out.
Quote from: playwiththewind1st on February 24, 2026, 12:22:37 PMhttps://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/business/northern-ireland/ex-dup-mp-ian-paisley-leading-%C2%A314m-plan-to-restore-historic-co-antrim-castle-and-estate/a/136350564.html
What could possibly go wrong there? We should watch on with interest, to see how this all pans out.
I can't view that but is there a Seymour Sweeney involved per chance?
Quote from: johnnycool on February 24, 2026, 12:25:41 PMQuote from: playwiththewind1st on February 24, 2026, 12:22:37 PMhttps://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/business/northern-ireland/ex-dup-mp-ian-paisley-leading-%C2%A314m-plan-to-restore-historic-co-antrim-castle-and-estate/a/136350564.html
What could possibly go wrong there? We should watch on with interest, to see how this all pans out.
I can't view that but is there a Seymour Sweeney involved per chance?
https://find-and-update.company-information.service.gov.uk/company/NI719614/officers
Not that I can see, but him & Junior are usually intertwined.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/ce3gwzg5225o
Middle East - sorted.
Husband slotted in to nice wee EA job - check.
Lost twice in South Belfast, but what about a wee switch to Lagan Valley - you bet.
Anything else?
Any chance of an extra £14,000 a year, for working on a Saturday?
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c78xgplv6e1o
I am sure that with what is going on in the world at the minute the last thing the PM probably needed in his schedule was to have to sit down with these clampets.
No surprise EP and M O'N out with the begging bowl as usual.
Quote from: LC on March 12, 2026, 12:55:39 PMhttps://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c78xgplv6e1o
I am sure that with what is going on in the world at the minute the last thing the PM probably needed in his schedule was to have to sit down with these clampets.
No surprise EP and M O'N out with the begging bowl as usual.
Aye he's bigger things to be at, like suppressing anti-Zionist protest and aiding a genocide in Gaza and giving US/Israel support in all illegal attack on Iran... maybe no harm to distract him from that for a while.
Don't disagree with you on those other two muppets lining their own pockets and pushing for huge MLA pay hikes... gravy train Stormont.
Quote from: Truthsayer on March 12, 2026, 01:03:04 PMQuote from: LC on March 12, 2026, 12:55:39 PMhttps://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c78xgplv6e1o
I am sure that with what is going on in the world at the minute the last thing the PM probably needed in his schedule was to have to sit down with these clampets.
No surprise EP and M O'N out with the begging bowl as usual.
Aye he's bigger things to be at, like suppressing anti-Zionist protest and aiding a genocide in Gaza and giving US/Israel support in all illegal attack on Iran... maybe no harm to distract him from that for a while.
Don't disagree with you on those other two muppets lining their own pockets and pushing for huge MLA pay hikes... gravy train Stormont.
They are all saying it's terrible as they can say it's not up to them!
Quote from: LC on March 12, 2026, 12:55:39 PMhttps://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c78xgplv6e1o
I am sure that with what is going on in the world at the minute the last thing the PM probably needed in his schedule was to have to sit down with these clampets.
No surprise EP and M O'N out with the begging bowl as usual.
Might distract him from kissing up to Israel or helping Trump out with their latest slaughtering of civillians.
Not DUP related but look how the BBC frame this pedophile story:
Former teacher jailed for indecently assaulting four girls (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cdrpl5g01z3o)
If you dig deeper into the article you then find out his last job was a UUP researcher and speechwriter right up to 2017.
Now tell me if this was a SF party member would that story of been framed any differently.
You would think the DUP would applaud the statue of a past Westminster MP going up in West Belfast.
Quote from: Orior on May 06, 2026, 12:15:14 PMYou would think the DUP would applaud the statue of a past Westminster MP going up in West Belfast.
The DUP are going all in on this "culture war" thingy and up till now the Shinners haven't really bit, but Gordon Lyons of Líofa fame pulling the funding on dual language signs seems to have stirred them.
The very same lad who upped the grant for musical instruments for "community bands" to over £1M last year.
Quote from: johnnycool on April 30, 2026, 11:50:26 AMNot DUP related but look how the BBC frame this pedophile story:
Former teacher jailed for indecently assaulting four girls (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cdrpl5g01z3o)
If you dig deeper into the article you then find out his last job was a UUP researcher and speechwriter right up to 2017.
Now tell me if this was a SF party member would that story of been framed any differently.
Then, just to top it all off, that self-appointed idiot, David Campbell, of the Loyalist Communities Council, gave him a character reference.
When it comes to the DUP, for a party that originally wanted to save Ulster from sodomy, a fair few of their elected councillors seem to have actively enjoyed such activities, going by various court reports.
Going back as far as Kincora, there have always been mysterious & unexplained links between Loyalism, in general & paedophile activities.
I think I'm past it with regards this place, head down work and move on, its depressing and bleak, with the far right and to an extent the far far left they are a bunch of dicks who just thrive on anything to keep the division going.
As for a UI we are getting further and further away, I'm 54, I won't see it in my life time, as the underbelly of hate just needs stirring, getting the numbers won't be enough to sway the vote I feel
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on May 06, 2026, 01:28:18 PMI think I'm past it with regards this place, head down work and move on, its depressing and bleak, with the far right and to an extent the far far left they are a bunch of dicks who just thrive on anything to keep the division going.
As for a UI we are getting further and further away, I'm 54, I won't see it in my life time, as the underbelly of hate just needs stirring, getting the numbers won't be enough to sway the vote I feel
Getting the numbers will be enough to sway the vote.
Anything other than that, will be anti democratic and we know how democratic the DUP and UUP are or they profess.
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on May 06, 2026, 01:28:18 PMI think I'm past it with regards this place, head down work and move on, its depressing and bleak, with the far right and to an extent the far far left they are a bunch of dicks who just thrive on anything to keep the division going.
As for a UI we are getting further and further away, I'm 54, I won't see it in my life time, as the underbelly of hate just needs stirring, getting the numbers won't be enough to sway the vote I feel
If Reform get in at the next election they might be happy to offload this (in their eyes) basket case and drain on money.
For a mere £5,000,000 contribution towards his....ahem...."long-term personal security" costs, you should be able to get Prime Minister Farage to do whatever your heart desires. No declaration required.
Quote from: playwiththewind1st on May 06, 2026, 02:48:09 PMFor a mere £5,000,000 contribution towards his....ahem...."long-term personal security" costs, you should be able to get Prime Minister Farage to do whatever your heart desires. No declaration required.
The single, biggest personal donation in UK political history.
Christopher Harborne didn't give it for the benefit of his or indeed Farage's health and he's also donated £22M already to the Reform party.
Why?
Quote from: johnnycool on May 06, 2026, 03:26:44 PMQuote from: playwiththewind1st on May 06, 2026, 02:48:09 PMFor a mere £5,000,000 contribution towards his....ahem...."long-term personal security" costs, you should be able to get Prime Minister Farage to do whatever your heart desires. No declaration required.
The single, biggest personal donation in UK political history.
Christopher Harborne didn't give it for the benefit of his or indeed Farage's health and he's also donated £22M already to the Reform party.
Why?
Crypto regulation
So the DUP spent £92k in an attempt to block dual-language signage in Portadown AND then halted £90k for the Place-Names Project.
They will go to some lengths to oppose the Irish language.
SF really need to 'man up'.
Quote from: marty34 on May 06, 2026, 07:32:32 PMSo the DUP spent £92k in an attempt to block dual-language signage in Portadown AND then halted £90k for the Place-Names Project.
They will go to some lengths to oppose the Irish language.
SF really need to 'man up'.
I suppose they used their own hard earned money doing that?
Quote from: AustinPowers on May 06, 2026, 10:00:54 PMQuote from: marty34 on May 06, 2026, 07:32:32 PMSo the DUP spent £92k in an attempt to block dual-language signage in Portadown AND then halted £90k for the Place-Names Project.
They will go to some lengths to oppose the Irish language.
SF really need to 'man up'.
I suppose they used their own hard earned money doing that?
Ratepayers unfortunately but just shows hatred of anything Irish.
Not the DUP obviously but the UUP are deselecting Doug Beattie for the next Assembly elections in 2027.
Why?
Wait for it - "too moderate" apparently. :o
Thought this quote from Robinson was very interesting too
"I'll make you two guarantees. That unionism will win that election. And if unionists bring themselves to cooperate, they will win in a way that you cannot ignore."
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cn0pglw8wgzo (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cn0pglw8wgzo)
Quote from: marty34 on May 06, 2026, 07:32:32 PMSo the DUP spent £92k in an attempt to block dual-language signage in Portadown AND then halted £90k for the Place-Names Project.
They will go to some lengths to oppose the Irish language.
SF really need to 'man up'.
Man up? These are pretty obvious attempts to escalate a culture war ahead of an election, all shortly before some Dup lad or lassie is pictured with a hurl because they are really all about reconciliation message to Alliance voters.
the right approach is to find a political way to implement and puncture the hardliners balloon and let them scream into the void.
Quote from: smort on May 12, 2026, 07:31:40 AMThought this quote from Robinson was very interesting too
"I'll make you two guarantees. That unionism will win that election. And if unionists bring themselves to cooperate, they will win in a way that you cannot ignore."
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cn0pglw8wgzo (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cn0pglw8wgzo)
The SNP and PC have them rattled. They're in full election mode now for next May.
I see, because of boundary changes last year, that the DUP could in a seat in West Belfast.
Quote from: BigGreenField on May 12, 2026, 07:33:44 AMQuote from: marty34 on May 06, 2026, 07:32:32 PMSo the DUP spent £92k in an attempt to block dual-language signage in Portadown AND then halted £90k for the Place-Names Project.
They will go to some lengths to oppose the Irish language.
SF really need to 'man up'.
Man up? These are pretty obvious attempts to escalate a culture war ahead of an election, all shortly before some Dup lad or lassie is pictured with a hurl because they are really all about reconciliation message to Alliance voters.
the right approach is to find a political way to implement and puncture the hardliners balloon and let them scream into the void.
If you think this will work with unionism, you are deluded?
Everyday they are moving to becoming more 'hardline' - moving to the TUV. Reform's election results will embolden them also. We are currenly seeing the outworkings of this already.
Quote from: marty34 on May 12, 2026, 07:34:54 AMQuote from: smort on May 12, 2026, 07:31:40 AMThought this quote from Robinson was very interesting too
"I'll make you two guarantees. That unionism will win that election. And if unionists bring themselves to cooperate, they will win in a way that you cannot ignore."
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cn0pglw8wgzo (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cn0pglw8wgzo)
The SNP and PC have them rattled. They're in full election mode now for next May.
I see, because of boundary changes last year, that the DUP could in a seat in West Belfast.
Did you see who they are standing? ::)
Quote from: marty34 on May 12, 2026, 07:21:02 AMNot the DUP obviously but the UUP are deselecting Doug Beattie for the next Assembly elections in 2027.
Why?
Wait for it - "too moderate" apparently. :o
Saw that and Alan chambers getting the boot as well. The uup under Burrows heading back over towards the DUP. A fools game as it is very crowded over there with TUV as well and a decreasing pool of voters year on year. Interesting that it said Beatie may join another party. But who? Alliance surely wouldn't touch him if they are trying to keep sitting on the fence. Independent candidate at next election much more likely.
The end of party politics couldn't come quick enough IMO, wishful thinking though.
Quote from: JPGJOHNNYG on May 12, 2026, 09:53:19 AMQuote from: marty34 on May 12, 2026, 07:21:02 AMNot the DUP obviously but the UUP are deselecting Doug Beattie for the next Assembly elections in 2027.
Why?
Wait for it - "too moderate" apparently. :o
Saw that and Alan chambers getting the boot as well. The uup under Burrows heading back over towards the DUP. A fools game as it is very crowded over there with TUV as well and a decreasing pool of voters year on year. Interesting that it said Beatie may join another party. But who? Alliance surely wouldn't touch him if they are trying to keep sitting on the fence. Independent candidate at next election much more likely.
If Doug got elected as an independent and Alliance didn't take on Justice, could he be the next justice Minister- Like Claire Sugden was.
Quote from: sensethetone on May 12, 2026, 11:10:29 AMQuote from: JPGJOHNNYG on May 12, 2026, 09:53:19 AMQuote from: marty34 on May 12, 2026, 07:21:02 AMNot the DUP obviously but the UUP are deselecting Doug Beattie for the next Assembly elections in 2027.
Why?
Wait for it - "too moderate" apparently. :o
Saw that and Alan chambers getting the boot as well. The uup under Burrows heading back over towards the DUP. A fools game as it is very crowded over there with TUV as well and a decreasing pool of voters year on year. Interesting that it said Beatie may join another party. But who? Alliance surely wouldn't touch him if they are trying to keep sitting on the fence. Independent candidate at next election much more likely.
If Doug got elected as an independent and Alliance didn't take on Justice, could he be the next justice Minister- Like Claire Sugden was.
It's a good shout, the problem Doug has is as the uup leader he didn't exactly attract the votes in upper bann so he will struggle to get voted back in as an independent. It's quite a busy constituency. Nationalism only has 1 seat when it should have 2 so can imagine he will get squeezed out
Quote from: sensethetone on May 12, 2026, 11:10:29 AMQuote from: JPGJOHNNYG on May 12, 2026, 09:53:19 AMQuote from: marty34 on May 12, 2026, 07:21:02 AMNot the DUP obviously but the UUP are deselecting Doug Beattie for the next Assembly elections in 2027.
Why?
Wait for it - "too moderate" apparently. :o
Saw that and Alan chambers getting the boot as well. The uup under Burrows heading back over towards the DUP. A fools game as it is very crowded over there with TUV as well and a decreasing pool of voters year on year. Interesting that it said Beatie may join another party. But who? Alliance surely wouldn't touch him if they are trying to keep sitting on the fence. Independent candidate at next election much more likely.
If Doug got elected as an independent and Alliance didn't take on Justice, could he be the next justice Minister- Like Claire Sugden was.
Fúck that. Shinners should go for justice.
Why should a unionist get it?
Surely a mistake for the UUP to try and be more staunch?
Any decent people voting for them will jump to Alliance and the knuckle draggers will always go TUV/DUP so they'll get pulled apart from both sides, abit like Labour with Greens/LidDems and the Reformatories.
I'd say they'll be a unionist pact this time. They are getting nervous so it'll happen this time with wee Seamy pulling the strings.
DUP want the 'First Minister' position back. Winning it back would be a big PR 'victory' for them. That's what they're gunning for now. You can see this is what they're gearing up for...from yesterday.
Nationalists could take aseat in Strangford and Lagan Valley maybe? But need to work together.
Quote from: marty34 on May 12, 2026, 12:19:51 PMI'd say they'll be a unionist pact this time. They are getting nervous so it'll happen this time with wee Seamy pulling the strings.
DUP want the 'First Minister' position back. Winning it back would be a big PR 'victory' for them. That's what they're gunning for now. You can see this is what they're gearing up for...from yesterday.
Nationalists could take aseat in Strangford and Lagan Valley maybe? But need to work together.
If they have any sense they will vote down the list anyway so a pact is counterproductive, if anything the more parties/choice the more likely people will turn out to vote just as long as they remember to then transfer wisely. The pacts only really work in the general election.
Can't see SF losing first minister position unless there is huge collapse in interest among nationalist voters
Quote from: JPGJOHNNYG on May 12, 2026, 01:20:58 PMQuote from: marty34 on May 12, 2026, 12:19:51 PMI'd say they'll be a unionist pact this time. They are getting nervous so it'll happen this time with wee Seamy pulling the strings.
DUP want the 'First Minister' position back. Winning it back would be a big PR 'victory' for them. That's what they're gunning for now. You can see this is what they're gearing up for...from yesterday.
Nationalists could take aseat in Strangford and Lagan Valley maybe? But need to work together.
If they have any sense they will vote down the list anyway so a pact is counterproductive, if anything the more parties/choice the more likely people will turn out to vote just as long as they remember to then transfer wisely. The pacts only really work in the general election.
Can't see SF losing first minister position unless there is huge collapse in interest among nationalist voters
I can't see any Unionists packs in an assembly election. They will 100% do one in a Westminster election - don't rule out a UUCC style like 70s one Unionists running in each seat.
Correct me if I'm wrong folks is the DUP only one seat behind SF - I think Alex Easton once he became MP give his assembly seat to DUP even tho he was Independent.
SF don't look in any position to lose any of there seats - DUP claim they can win a seat in Belfast West. That final seat could have a say on the First Minister.
Quote from: marty34 on May 12, 2026, 12:19:51 PMDUP want the 'First Minister' position back. Winning it back would be a big PR 'victory' for them.
Of course it would be a victory for them. O'Neill winning it was absolutely a victory for SF. Can't have it both ways.
I think it was Robinson, who said recently Nationalism doesn't have the First minister position. That it's an equal role with the deputy FM . It's funny, I never heard that spoke of until MON became FM.
I wonder if the DUP regained FM role , would they still be pushing for the two roles to be renamed "joint FM's"?
SF are 2 seats ahead. In the case of a tie it goes to votes cast.
SF had 65k extra votes last time, they essentially have a far better goal difference.
Quote from: AustinPowers on May 12, 2026, 03:38:44 PMI think it was Robinson, who said recently Nationalism doesn't have the First minister position. That it's an equal role with the deputy FM . It's funny, I never heard that spoke of until MON became FM.
I wonder if the DUP regained FM role , would they still be pushing for the two roles to be renamed "joint FM's"?
They were parroting that line as soon as it was apparent that SF had one.
Politician in "saying something to his electorate to cast electoral performance in better light" shocker.
Potential SF gains if their vote holds up- East Derry and Upper Bann
Potential losses, West Belfast, and anywhere they hold 3 of the 5 seats available
No matter what way it ends up will the governance improve, will we see any meaningful change in legislating and improving public services etc?
What they are currently serving up is an embarrassment
Quote from: Deerstalker on May 12, 2026, 04:31:30 PMNo matter what way it ends up will the governance improve, will we see any meaningful change in legislating and improving public services etc?
What they are currently serving up is an embarrassment
Nope which is why I assume they'll lose seats they already have and their only chance of gains is by pushing the "vote us to get themuns out" narative
Quote from: Deerstalker on May 12, 2026, 04:31:30 PMNo matter what way it ends up will the governance improve, will we see any meaningful change in legislating and improving public services etc?
What they are currently serving up is an embarrassment
But, you can be sure that the next so-called "independent" review mechanism will still award the greedy bastards another substantial pay award, in the next mandate.
I wonder if I put out it's a sectarian head count, will Snap say it's isn't?
In all honesty what good any of them, what key points of the last NI govt. Has been delivered?
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on May 12, 2026, 05:45:08 PMI wonder if I put out it's a sectarian head count, will Snap say it's isn't?
Unfortunately thats exactly what it is. The headcount might influence the timing of a border poll, but I think we could come up with a better measurement tool, than paying 108 clowns to deliver absolutely nothing.
Quote from: OakLeaf on May 12, 2026, 06:15:52 PMQuote from: Milltown Row2 on May 12, 2026, 05:45:08 PMI wonder if I put out it's a sectarian head count, will Snap say it's isn't?
Unfortunately thats exactly what it is. The headcount might influence the timing of a border poll, but I think we could come up with a better measurement tool, than paying 108 clowns to deliver absolutely nothing.
It's okay there's only 90 now, they're much better value
Quote from: drillsergeant on May 12, 2026, 02:26:42 PMQuote from: JPGJOHNNYG on May 12, 2026, 01:20:58 PMQuote from: marty34 on May 12, 2026, 12:19:51 PMI'd say they'll be a unionist pact this time. They are getting nervous so it'll happen this time with wee Seamy pulling the strings.
DUP want the 'First Minister' position back. Winning it back would be a big PR 'victory' for them. That's what they're gunning for now. You can see this is what they're gearing up for...from yesterday.
Nationalists could take aseat in Strangford and Lagan Valley maybe? But need to work together.
If they have any sense they will vote down the list anyway so a pact is counterproductive, if anything the more parties/choice the more likely people will turn out to vote just as long as they remember to then transfer wisely. The pacts only really work in the general election.
Can't see SF losing first minister position unless there is huge collapse in interest among nationalist voters
I can't see any Unionists packs in an assembly election. They will 100% do one in a Westminster election - don't rule out a UUCC style like 70s one Unionists running in each seat.
Correct me if I'm wrong folks is the DUP only one seat behind SF - I think Alex Easton once he became MP give his assembly seat to DUP even tho he was Independent.
SF don't look in any position to lose any of there seats - DUP claim they can win a seat in Belfast West. That final seat could have a say on the First Minister.
Maybe that lad who left the SDLP will stand as an Independent? He seems a good lad who does a lot of chartiable stuff so he could get a few thousand votes that could alter things.
Alternatively, the DUP will stand in West Belfast and that'll be only one unionist....so that's a pact. Same in Foyle as well. So they will be using a pact to safeguard their 'one' seat in certain areas.
Quote from: Brendan on May 12, 2026, 06:26:51 PMQuote from: OakLeaf on May 12, 2026, 06:15:52 PMQuote from: Milltown Row2 on May 12, 2026, 05:45:08 PMI wonder if I put out it's a sectarian head count, will Snap say it's isn't?
Unfortunately thats exactly what it is. The headcount might influence the timing of a border poll, but I think we could come up with a better measurement tool, than paying 108 clowns to deliver absolutely nothing.
It's okay there's only 90 now, they're much better value
Lol. That's how much attention I've been paying to it for this past number of years. 90 too many, still.
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on May 12, 2026, 05:45:08 PMI wonder if I put out it's a sectarian head count, will Snap say it's isn't?
A sectarian head count is all it has ever been. There will never be a working government in the north. Stormont was only brought back to get the unionists to agree to the Good Friday deal. The progress to a United Ireland is now inevitable and because most of the sectarian bias has been eliminated (PSNI excluded), the nationalist/catholic population are willing to wait until the numbers have made a referendum a guaranteed victory.
I mean, I can plough this lonely furrow again if I have to.
Most people vote on constitutional lines, and having a constitutional preference isn't sectarian. Ergo, not a sectarian headcount. Much and all as people here f**king love using that catchphrase, it doesn't make it true.
Judge rules that Eleanor Donaldson unfit for trial
Lady Eleanor Donaldson has been deemed medically unfit to stand trial.
Along with her husband Jeffrey Donaldson, the pair face a number of alleged historic sexual offences.
The trial of the Donaldsons is due to commence before Judge Ramsay at Newry Crown Court on Tuesday.
In Court this morning, Thursday, oral medical evidence was provided by a Doctor who had examined Mrs Donaldson on two occasions, in September 2025 and May of this year.
The Court heard that Mrs Donaldson had previously been diagnosed with suffering from chronic anxiety.
As a result of an examination carried out by the Doctor, it was her opinion that Mrs Donaldson would be easily overwhelmed within a Court setting.
The Doctor told the Judge that even with special measures being put in place for Mrs Donaldson she said that Mrs Donaldson couldn't engage with the material during the court proceedings due to her high levels of anxiety and it was hard to see how she could instruct her legal team.
The Doctor explained that if Mrs Donaldson was to give evidence it was highly likely she would break down and receive multiple breaks throughout the hearing which is expected to last a number of weeks.
Judge Paul Ramsay, after hearing oral evidence and giving consideration of a number of other medical reports before the Court, ruled that Mrs Donaldson was unfit to be tried referring to the Pritchard Criteria in that the defendant would be unable to follow the course of the Court proceedings; instruct solicitors and Counsel; and able to give evidence on her own behalf.
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on May 20, 2026, 01:48:29 PMJudge rules that Eleanor Donaldson unfit for trial
Lady Eleanor Donaldson has been deemed medically unfit to stand trial.
Along with her husband Jeffrey Donaldson, the pair face a number of alleged historic sexual offences.
The trial of the Donaldsons is due to commence before Judge Ramsay at Newry Crown Court on Tuesday.
In Court this morning, Thursday, oral medical evidence was provided by a Doctor who had examined Mrs Donaldson on two occasions, in September 2025 and May of this year.
The Court heard that Mrs Donaldson had previously been diagnosed with suffering from chronic anxiety.
As a result of an examination carried out by the Doctor, it was her opinion that Mrs Donaldson would be easily overwhelmed within a Court setting.
The Doctor told the Judge that even with special measures being put in place for Mrs Donaldson she said that Mrs Donaldson couldn't engage with the material during the court proceedings due to her high levels of anxiety and it was hard to see how she could instruct her legal team.
The Doctor explained that if Mrs Donaldson was to give evidence it was highly likely she would break down and receive multiple breaks throughout the hearing which is expected to last a number of weeks.
Judge Paul Ramsay, after hearing oral evidence and giving consideration of a number of other medical reports before the Court, ruled that Mrs Donaldson was unfit to be tried referring to the Pritchard Criteria in that the defendant would be unable to follow the course of the Court proceedings; instruct solicitors and Counsel; and able to give evidence on her own behalf.
I would imagine the vast majority of the general public would be in a similar predicament if facing such charges.
I don't think she'll get off with it if they are found guilty, I just think she doesn't have to show her face in court and her counsel will speak for her? I'm sure David will confirm
Quote from: JohnDenver on May 20, 2026, 02:41:27 PMQuote from: Milltown Row2 on May 20, 2026, 01:48:29 PMJudge rules that Eleanor Donaldson unfit for trial
Lady Eleanor Donaldson has been deemed medically unfit to stand trial.
Along with her husband Jeffrey Donaldson, the pair face a number of alleged historic sexual offences.
The trial of the Donaldsons is due to commence before Judge Ramsay at Newry Crown Court on Tuesday.
In Court this morning, Thursday, oral medical evidence was provided by a Doctor who had examined Mrs Donaldson on two occasions, in September 2025 and May of this year.
The Court heard that Mrs Donaldson had previously been diagnosed with suffering from chronic anxiety.
As a result of an examination carried out by the Doctor, it was her opinion that Mrs Donaldson would be easily overwhelmed within a Court setting.
The Doctor told the Judge that even with special measures being put in place for Mrs Donaldson she said that Mrs Donaldson couldn't engage with the material during the court proceedings due to her high levels of anxiety and it was hard to see how she could instruct her legal team.
The Doctor explained that if Mrs Donaldson was to give evidence it was highly likely she would break down and receive multiple breaks throughout the hearing which is expected to last a number of weeks.
Judge Paul Ramsay, after hearing oral evidence and giving consideration of a number of other medical reports before the Court, ruled that Mrs Donaldson was unfit to be tried referring to the Pritchard Criteria in that the defendant would be unable to follow the course of the Court proceedings; instruct solicitors and Counsel; and able to give evidence on her own behalf.
I would imagine the vast majority of the general public would be in a similar predicament if facing such charges.
The old "sweating like a rapist" saying now an argument for defense! Twisted auld ****.
Makes a complete mockery of people with genuine mental health concerns.
It wont absolve her if guilty of the accusations. Courts will examine the facts and sentence accordingly.
Hopefully nothing prejudical from online posters interferes with justice.
She will face a "trial of facts" according to Amanda Ferguson reporting from Newry Courthouse.
I don't know what that is but as long as justice is done.
Quote from: johnnycool on May 20, 2026, 03:56:15 PMShe will face a "trial of facts" according to Amanda Ferguson reporting from Newry Courthouse.
I don't know what that is but as long as justice is done.
Looks like it's a trial without a jury, where the court looks at the evidence and determines what happened without a guilty verdict. You can be acquitted but you cannot be convicted.
So is chronic anxiety something that every sufferer is entitled to use in future to avoid trial for crimes?
Quote from: nrico2006 on May 20, 2026, 04:26:55 PMSo is chronic anxiety something that every sufferer is entitled to use in future to avoid trial for crimes?
The issue isn't what do they suffer from it's do they meet the Pritchard criteria.
IE have two highly qualified experts assessed that they can't
1. Understand the course of the proceedings;
2. Understand the evidence;
3. Instruct lawyers properly;
4. Challenge jurors (historically included, though now of limited practical importance);
5. Enter a plea; and
6. Give evidence in their own defence if they choose.
Quote from: nrico2006 on May 20, 2026, 04:26:55 PMSo is chronic anxiety something that every sufferer is entitled to use in future to avoid trial for crimes?
The righteous cry, and the Lord heareth, and delivereth them out of all their troubles.
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on May 20, 2026, 02:45:59 PMI don't think she'll get off with it if they are found guilty, I just think she doesn't have to show her face in court and her counsel will speak for her? I'm sure David will confirm
She can not be found guilty. She will instead face a fact finding hearing. Either alongside Jeffrey's trial or at a later date.
A fact finding hearing doesn't assess guilt or innocence but does assess whether someone did the act.
If there is an adverse finding then the range of options open to the court is different. They range from an absolute discharge to a hospital order.
Quote from: David McKeown on May 20, 2026, 05:18:24 PMQuote from: Milltown Row2 on May 20, 2026, 02:45:59 PMI don't think she'll get off with it if they are found guilty, I just think she doesn't have to show her face in court and her counsel will speak for her? I'm sure David will confirm
She can not be found guilty. She will instead face a fact finding hearing. Either alongside Jeffrey's trial or at a later date.
A fact finding hearing doesn't assess guilt or innocence but does assess whether someone did the act.
If there is an adverse finding then the range of options open to the court is different. They range from an absolute discharge to a hospital order.
How many people try/go down this route ;D ?
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on May 20, 2026, 06:39:51 PMQuote from: David McKeown on May 20, 2026, 05:18:24 PMQuote from: Milltown Row2 on May 20, 2026, 02:45:59 PMI don't think she'll get off with it if they are found guilty, I just think she doesn't have to show her face in court and her counsel will speak for her? I'm sure David will confirm
She can not be found guilty. She will instead face a fact finding hearing. Either alongside Jeffrey's trial or at a later date.
A fact finding hearing doesn't assess guilt or innocence but does assess whether someone did the act.
If there is an adverse finding then the range of options open to the court is different. They range from an absolute discharge to a hospital order.
How many people try/go down this route ;D ?
It's not common but it's not unusual. It's usually not their choice either. If I have a concern about a client and their ability to provide me with instructions I'll direct they see experts. The court will do the same. It's not the case that I client will come and say I'm not fit for this. They occasionally do but they invariably always are fit.
It's also not an easy way out. Finding of facts against and potential hospital orders are not easy things to live with.
Quote from: David McKeown on May 20, 2026, 06:50:04 PMQuote from: Milltown Row2 on May 20, 2026, 06:39:51 PMQuote from: David McKeown on May 20, 2026, 05:18:24 PMQuote from: Milltown Row2 on May 20, 2026, 02:45:59 PMI don't think she'll get off with it if they are found guilty, I just think she doesn't have to show her face in court and her counsel will speak for her? I'm sure David will confirm
She can not be found guilty. She will instead face a fact finding hearing. Either alongside Jeffrey's trial or at a later date.
A fact finding hearing doesn't assess guilt or innocence but does assess whether someone did the act.
If there is an adverse finding then the range of options open to the court is different. They range from an absolute discharge to a hospital order.
How many people try/go down this route ;D ?
It's not common but it's not unusual. It's usually not their choice either. If I have a concern about a client and their ability to provide me with instructions I'll direct they see experts. The court will do the same. It's not the case that I client will come and say I'm not fit for this. They occasionally do but they invariably always are fit.
It's also not an easy way out. Finding of facts against and potential hospital orders are not easy things to live with.
Easier than dying in prison?
Quote from: Baile Brigín 2 on May 20, 2026, 07:06:33 PMQuote from: David McKeown on May 20, 2026, 06:50:04 PMQuote from: Milltown Row2 on May 20, 2026, 06:39:51 PMQuote from: David McKeown on May 20, 2026, 05:18:24 PMQuote from: Milltown Row2 on May 20, 2026, 02:45:59 PMI don't think she'll get off with it if they are found guilty, I just think she doesn't have to show her face in court and her counsel will speak for her? I'm sure David will confirm
She can not be found guilty. She will instead face a fact finding hearing. Either alongside Jeffrey's trial or at a later date.
A fact finding hearing doesn't assess guilt or innocence but does assess whether someone did the act.
If there is an adverse finding then the range of options open to the court is different. They range from an absolute discharge to a hospital order.
How many people try/go down this route ;D ?
It's not common but it's not unusual. It's usually not their choice either. If I have a concern about a client and their ability to provide me with instructions I'll direct they see experts. The court will do the same. It's not the case that I client will come and say I'm not fit for this. They occasionally do but they invariably always are fit.
It's also not an easy way out. Finding of facts against and potential hospital orders are not easy things to live with.
Easier than dying in prison?
Possibly. I don't fancy either option to be fair
Two pencils up the nose and a pair of underpants on the head will be my defence. Wibble.
Quote from: Tony Baloney on May 20, 2026, 07:50:54 PMTwo pencils up the nose and a pair of underpants on the head will be my defence. Wibble.
That may be part of the evidence against Jeffery.
How come she was all fine before this came about, same with Peter Robinson wife, i just cant see Joe Bloggs not been took to trial for this. Hell if u a borderline psycopath u still be seeing a trial.
Yup. There is no "getting off" if the facts clearly implicate you. You may get a nicer cell.
Quote from: Wildweasel74 on May 20, 2026, 10:56:30 PMHow come she was all fine before this came about, same with Peter Robinson wife, i just cant see Joe Bloggs not been took to trial for this. Hell if u a borderline psycopath u still be seeing a trial.
How do we know she was fine? The process she has gone through is the exact same process any defendant would have gone through if there were concerns over their fitness to give instructions.
Quote from: David McKeown on May 21, 2026, 01:00:41 AMQuote from: Wildweasel74 on May 20, 2026, 10:56:30 PMHow come she was all fine before this came about, same with Peter Robinson wife, i just cant see Joe Bloggs not been took to trial for this. Hell if u a borderline psycopath u still be seeing a trial.
How do we know she was fine? The process she has gone through is the exact same process any defendant would have gone through if there were concerns over their fitness to give instructions.
Would there be many examples of working class people going down this path? That's ultimately what people will see this as. Someone of status getting what they would deem as preferential treatment.
Appropriate page number for Jeffrey's little fwyiend ;D
Quote from: NAG1 on May 21, 2026, 01:14:54 PMAppropriate page number for Jeffrey's little fwyiend ;D
Did he not fall out wiff Jweffery about the Irish sea border and the DUP going back into Stormont.
Quote from: SaffronSports on May 21, 2026, 01:03:37 PMQuote from: David McKeown on May 21, 2026, 01:00:41 AMQuote from: Wildweasel74 on May 20, 2026, 10:56:30 PMHow come she was all fine before this came about, same with Peter Robinson wife, i just cant see Joe Bloggs not been took to trial for this. Hell if u a borderline psycopath u still be seeing a trial.
How do we know she was fine? The process she has gone through is the exact same process any defendant would have gone through if there were concerns over their fitness to give instructions.
Would there be many examples of working class people going down this path? That's ultimately what people will see this as. Someone of status getting what they would deem as preferential treatment.
Absolutely there's plenty at an estimate of say between 5 and 10% of cases. They just don't tend to attract press coverage.
I have 6 such cases at the moment
All with the same process as Lady Donaldson went through with many of the same experts and similar concerns.
I understand the optics are bad. I think that's a combination of a number of factors. Poor reporting, social media, human nature, a lack of education on actual procedures etc to name just a few of those.
Quote from: David McKeown on May 21, 2026, 04:11:52 PMQuote from: SaffronSports on May 21, 2026, 01:03:37 PMQuote from: David McKeown on May 21, 2026, 01:00:41 AMQuote from: Wildweasel74 on May 20, 2026, 10:56:30 PMHow come she was all fine before this came about, same with Peter Robinson wife, i just cant see Joe Bloggs not been took to trial for this. Hell if u a borderline psycopath u still be seeing a trial.
How do we know she was fine? The process she has gone through is the exact same process any defendant would have gone through if there were concerns over their fitness to give instructions.
Would there be many examples of working class people going down this path? That's ultimately what people will see this as. Someone of status getting what they would deem as preferential treatment.
Absolutely there's plenty at an estimate of say between 5 and 10% of cases. They just don't tend to attract press coverage.
I have 6 such cases at the moment
All with the same process as Lady Donaldson went through with many of the same experts and similar concerns.
I understand the optics are bad. I think that's a combination of a number of factors. Poor reporting, social media, human nature, a lack of education on actual procedures etc to name just a few of those.
David, you're going to be tortured with questions and queries during this trial. :o
Maybe take a holiday for a week or two...without your phone.
Quote from: marty34 on May 21, 2026, 04:22:28 PMQuote from: David McKeown on May 21, 2026, 04:11:52 PMQuote from: SaffronSports on May 21, 2026, 01:03:37 PMQuote from: David McKeown on May 21, 2026, 01:00:41 AMQuote from: Wildweasel74 on May 20, 2026, 10:56:30 PMHow come she was all fine before this came about, same with Peter Robinson wife, i just cant see Joe Bloggs not been took to trial for this. Hell if u a borderline psycopath u still be seeing a trial.
How do we know she was fine? The process she has gone through is the exact same process any defendant would have gone through if there were concerns over their fitness to give instructions.
Would there be many examples of working class people going down this path? That's ultimately what people will see this as. Someone of status getting what they would deem as preferential treatment.
Absolutely there's plenty at an estimate of say between 5 and 10% of cases. They just don't tend to attract press coverage.
I have 6 such cases at the moment
All with the same process as Lady Donaldson went through with many of the same experts and similar concerns.
I understand the optics are bad. I think that's a combination of a number of factors. Poor reporting, social media, human nature, a lack of education on actual procedures etc to name just a few of those.
David, you're going to be tortured with questions and queries during this trial. :o
Maybe take a holiday for a week or two...without your phone.
I actually am on holiday from next Thursday but always happy to help to the extent I can.
Quote from: David McKeown on May 21, 2026, 04:11:52 PMQuote from: SaffronSports on May 21, 2026, 01:03:37 PMQuote from: David McKeown on May 21, 2026, 01:00:41 AMQuote from: Wildweasel74 on May 20, 2026, 10:56:30 PMHow come she was all fine before this came about, same with Peter Robinson wife, i just cant see Joe Bloggs not been took to trial for this. Hell if u a borderline psycopath u still be seeing a trial.
How do we know she was fine? The process she has gone through is the exact same process any defendant would have gone through if there were concerns over their fitness to give instructions.
Would there be many examples of working class people going down this path? That's ultimately what people will see this as. Someone of status getting what they would deem as preferential treatment.
Absolutely there's plenty at an estimate of say between 5 and 10% of cases. They just don't tend to attract press coverage.
I have 6 such cases at the moment
All with the same process as Lady Donaldson went through with many of the same experts and similar concerns.
I understand the optics are bad. I think that's a combination of a number of factors. Poor reporting, social media, human nature, a lack of education on actual procedures etc to name just a few of those.
Even then 5% or 10% would be very low I would imagine if you put that up against the percentage of people from the working classes going through the courts.
Quote from: SaffronSports on May 21, 2026, 05:29:23 PMQuote from: David McKeown on May 21, 2026, 04:11:52 PMQuote from: SaffronSports on May 21, 2026, 01:03:37 PMQuote from: David McKeown on May 21, 2026, 01:00:41 AMQuote from: Wildweasel74 on May 20, 2026, 10:56:30 PMHow come she was all fine before this came about, same with Peter Robinson wife, i just cant see Joe Bloggs not been took to trial for this. Hell if u a borderline psycopath u still be seeing a trial.
How do we know she was fine? The process she has gone through is the exact same process any defendant would have gone through if there were concerns over their fitness to give instructions.
Would there be many examples of working class people going down this path? That's ultimately what people will see this as. Someone of status getting what they would deem as preferential treatment.
Absolutely there's plenty at an estimate of say between 5 and 10% of cases. They just don't tend to attract press coverage.
I have 6 such cases at the moment
All with the same process as Lady Donaldson went through with many of the same experts and similar concerns.
I understand the optics are bad. I think that's a combination of a number of factors. Poor reporting, social media, human nature, a lack of education on actual procedures etc to name just a few of those.
Even then 5% or 10% would be very low I would imagine if you put that up against the percentage of people from the working classes going through the courts.
The way it works is as experienced lawyers we tend to have a fair idea when someone is borderline fit to give instructions. We also have a knowledge of the legal test.
Talking personally if I had any concerns I'd direct reports immediately and then see what the experts think. I'd say my colleagues would be the same. I've had two cases ever that I can recall where my solicitors who are also highly experienced have disagreed but by and large we are usually in agreement. So we know with a high degree of accuracy when fitness is an issue.
As I say it's an issue in I'd approximate anywhere between 5 and 10 % of cases. That's still a lot of people.
As a result of how few properly qualified experts there are in the area the process can take between 9 months and 2 years. Lady Donaldson's process took exactly how long I would have expected it to take had she been a legally aided working class individual.
The timing of all the stuff in Belfast has certainly taken the attention away from Newry courts where Jeff can go into court without a mob outside berating him
Seems his missus is throwing him under a bus too, be interesting to see how his defense counter the 18 accounts against him
He's a bad **** putting these girls through this
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on June 10, 2026, 01:25:27 PMThe timing of all the stuff in Belfast has certainly taken the attention away from Newry courts where Jeff can go into court without a mob outside berating him
Seems his missus is throwing him under a bus too, be interesting to see how his defense counter the 18 accounts against him
Been following it on that inside the courtroom Facebook page.
It seems to be the case that JD defence has just been "That didn't happen" or your making it up.
As MR said the wife's interviews were quare reading
"Eleanor Donaldson claims 'women were throwing themselves' at Jeffrey Donaldson during marriage".
Who would have thought it? Provides a completely new angle to the DUP's "Where's Jeffrey?" question, which they shouted outside the UUP HQ on the Holywood Road years ago.
Quote from: playwiththewind1st on June 10, 2026, 01:52:33 PM"Eleanor Donaldson claims 'women were throwing themselves' at Jeffrey Donaldson during marriage".
Who would have thought it?
They thought it was Daniel O'Donnell....
Quote from: playwiththewind1st on June 10, 2026, 01:52:33 PM"Eleanor Donaldson claims 'women were throwing themselves' at Jeffrey Donaldson during marriage".
Who would have thought it?
Power brings about attraction for any halfwit, especially those church goers
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on June 10, 2026, 01:55:12 PMQuote from: playwiththewind1st on June 10, 2026, 01:52:33 PM"Eleanor Donaldson claims 'women were throwing themselves' at Jeffrey Donaldson during marriage".
Who would have thought it?
Power brings about attraction for any halfwit, especially those church goers
Whitewell Tabernacle.
Yes I'd say yesterday was nearly the worst day for our Jeffrey as some of the wife's comments were quite damaging I thought. But wasn't headline news he will have been happy with that
There's no coming back for him here regardless.
Quote from: quit yo jibbajabba on June 10, 2026, 02:18:34 PMYes I'd say yesterday was nearly the worst day for our Jeffrey as some of the wife's comments were quite damaging I thought. But wasn't headline news he will have been happy with that
Headline news or not what is happening around the place will have no impact on his case, if it is going bad against him it's going bad. The only news he should be concerned about is what happens when the jury is finished its deliberations. I reckon on the read of it so far it doesn't look good
Quote from: imtommygunn on June 10, 2026, 02:20:30 PMThere's no coming back for him here regardless.
Still wearing the wee fish badge, every single day when he turns up. God's the only judge he needs.
Meanwhile shitebag DUPUDA leader Robinson is calling for the "porous border" to be secured to stop foreigners accessing the 6 from the 26.
Good luck with that ya gobsh1te.
Tomorrow, he will probably call for an emergency border force to be set up, comprising former Black & Tans, Auxiliaries, B Specials, RUC Reserve & UDR.
Quote from: brokencrossbar1 on June 10, 2026, 02:22:41 PMQuote from: quit yo jibbajabba on June 10, 2026, 02:18:34 PMYes I'd say yesterday was nearly the worst day for our Jeffrey as some of the wife's comments were quite damaging I thought. But wasn't headline news he will have been happy with that
Headline news or not what is happening around the place will have no impact on his case, if it is going bad against him it's going bad. The only news he should be concerned about is what happens when the jury is finished its deliberations. I reckon on the read of it so far it doesn't look good
Yeah fair enough just meant for the casual observer some the findings yesterday will have gone unnoticed. Sounds like a weird marriage setup to say the least
Quote from: Rossfan on June 10, 2026, 02:40:22 PMMeanwhile shitebag DUPUDA leader Robinson is calling for the "porous border" to be secured to stop foreigners accessing the 6 from the 26.
Good luck with that ya gobsh1te.
The cynicism is disgusting. A fella fighting for his life and it's somehow Dublin's fault
QuoteMeanwhile shitebag DUPUDA leader Robinson is calling for the "porous border" to be secured to stop foreigners accessing the 6 from the 26.
Good luck with that ya gobsh1te.
What has the border got to do with this Sudanese fella? Sure wasn't it his own British home office that granted him asylum , when he ventured north?
Quote from: AustinPowers on June 10, 2026, 03:55:56 PMQuoteMeanwhile shitebag DUPUDA leader Robinson is calling for the "porous border" to be secured to stop foreigners accessing the 6 from the 26.
Good luck with that ya gobsh1te.
What has the border got to do with this Sudanese fella? Sure wasn't it his own British home office that granted him asylum , when he ventured north?
Shhh. It's the Fenians fault. Just is.
Someone should remind them that Sudan was part of British Empire where they exploited its resources to build their own wealth. They are more responsible that most for migration. They also granted a 5 year Visa.
Quote from: Rossfan on June 10, 2026, 02:40:22 PMMeanwhile shitebag DUPUDA leader Robinson is calling for the "porous border" to be secured to stop foreigners accessing the 6 from the 26.
Good luck with that ya gobsh1te.
Absolutely.
Obviously all the Southern Companies would have to pull out of the North.
Place wouldn't last a month
They are trying to get more hardline. Are there elections coming up?
Quote from: imtommygunn on June 10, 2026, 04:57:05 PMThey are trying to get more hardline. Are there elections coming up?
Votail Emma 4 First Minister.
They seem to be about to mount a campaign against the Common Travel Area, aided and abetted by Benn.
Totally ignoring the fact that yer man had a 5 year visa issued by....guess who?
Quote from: Rossfan on June 10, 2026, 07:00:31 PMThey seem to be about to mount a campaign against the Common Travel Area, aided and abetted by Benn.
Totally ignoring the fact that yer man had a 5 year visa issued by....guess who?
Great news for Sinn Fein and the 2027 Assembly election.
Quote from: playwiththewind1st on June 10, 2026, 02:45:38 PMTomorrow, he will probably call for an emergency border force to be set up, comprising former Black & Tans, Auxiliaries, B Specials, RUC Reserve & UDR.
Correct, and he will be supported by Jim Alistar
Quote from: quit yo jibbajabba on June 10, 2026, 02:18:34 PMYes I'd say yesterday was nearly the worst day for our Jeffrey as some of the wife's comments were quite damaging I thought. But wasn't headline news he will have been happy with that
I've been following it on this podcast.
Some of the stuff alleged is quite sick TBH..
The State of us (https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/series/m002x7vd)
Quote from: Rossfan on June 10, 2026, 07:00:31 PMThey seem to be about to mount a campaign against the Common Travel Area, aided and abetted by Benn.
Totally ignoring the fact that yer man had a 5 year visa issued by....guess who?
I want to start this by saying 100% what happened to that fella in the street in belfast shouldnt happen to anyone ever.
with this being said Rossfan you are correct allowed in by NI then on the other foot we have the victim Mr.Ogilvie with 161 previous convictions and was moved from scotland to hereas he was no longer safe in his own community. it make you wonder what started the incident the other night and further to that why someone with a wrap sheet like Mr.Ogilvie was allowed to just up tools and move anyway.
Quote from: 2ndstringsub on June 11, 2026, 01:05:56 PMQuote from: Rossfan on June 10, 2026, 07:00:31 PMThey seem to be about to mount a campaign against the Common Travel Area, aided and abetted by Benn.
Totally ignoring the fact that yer man had a 5 year visa issued by....guess who?
I want to start this by saying 100% what happened to that fella in the street in belfast shouldnt happen to anyone ever.
with this being said Rossfan you are correct allowed in by NI then on the other foot we have the victim Mr.Ogilvie with 161 previous convictions and was moved from scotland to hereas he was no longer safe in his own community. it make you wonder what started the incident the other night and further to that why someone with a wrap sheet like Mr.Ogilvie was allowed to just up tools and move anyway.
Allowed to stay under a scheme ran by a certain Tory f**ker turned Reform no less....
Buckley on BBC The View making a clean tit of himself.
Big Gav and the rest of the DUP are absolutely creaming their knickers over the thought of getting a hard border (again). They rode their Brexit unicorn in anticipation of a hard Brexit and a physical border between North and South. That backfired spectacularly. Now they are back on the bandwagon this past few days banging on about being unable to control borders. Utter clowns.
Wonder will the West African Orange lodges be welcome this 12th?
Quote from: 93-DY-SAM on June 11, 2026, 11:23:40 PMBig Gav and the rest of the DUP are absolutely creaming their knickers over the thought of getting a hard border (again). They rode their Brexit unicorn in anticipation of a hard Brexit and a physical border between North and South. That backfired spectacularly. Now they are back on the bandwagon this past few days banging on about being unable to control borders. Utter clowns.
Wonder will the West African Orange lodges be welcome this 12th?
To be honest a hard border would be great news as all the hassle it would bring would push the support for UI through the roof you would have a referendum in no time and that would be that. Unionists always after the short term win - they are tools
Quote from: BigGreenField on June 11, 2026, 10:59:45 PMBuckley on BBC The View making a clean tit of himself.
He's a raving lunatic in a fancy suit. Does he actually believe the nonsense he is spouting?
Always the same, Unionists in the big house calling out the rabble. After some poor innocent is burnt out of it or worse they wash their hands of it all.
Weasle words. I dont condone violence but I can understand why the people are upset. How many times have we all heard it over the years.
He's having quite the spat with Tennyson of Alliance on twitter. He is quite frankly a sc**bag.
These boyos would happily have the troubles back and no behaviour since the GFA has told me otherwise.
DUP support Israel and Middle East interventions to the hilt.
Maybe some of our intrepid journalists could corner them on this and its relation to the 38 million displaced people.
QuoteBuckley on BBC The View making a clean tit of himself.
Funny how he and the DUP speak of alien cultures.
Every culture is alien to their "kulture" .
If immigration /asylum seekers is such a big problem for the DUP , they've had a year since the Ballymena riots to bring it to the attention of their loyal British government. What have they actually done or said in the meantime?
Exactly. Opportunistic bollocks they are unashamedly jumping on.
Yesterday during a vote on the minimum criminal age did the DUP, TUV and UUP vote to be different from the 'Mainland'?
Anyone informed on Jeffreys chances? Jury is out for deliberation
So there were no recordings of telephone calls?
Jury sent out to consider its verdict.
Oh is that a quick case, well after the the initial stalling of the wife's issues?
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on June 18, 2026, 01:25:31 PMOh is that a quick case, well after the the initial stalling of the wife's issues?
The defence case didn't last overly long, and seemed to be based on the girls were in cahoots and making it up.
If the jury can't find the compelling evidence to make the charges stick it might be enough.
I suppose they only need some doubt!
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on June 18, 2026, 01:32:37 PMI suppose they only need some doubt!
If you agree to meet at some religious retreat outside Armoy and apologise to one of the girls for something other than abusing her as a child then you'd suspect something was amiss.
Your wife also walks in on you with a child, and walks back out of the room and questions you about it later and you refuse to discuss it, doesn't feel great either.
The biggest shock to me was that he was playing away from home, with a woman no less.
And the wife bugging his car because of his infidelity. Evidently he was untrustworthy, whether that goes as far as pedophilia is another dabate.
No mention of his video fetishes over in London or his one time mentor, Enoch Powell...
May all be a bit circumstantial but he comes across as a wrong un.
Not following this at all but guess reading this a decent chance he may get off?
You would expect politically etc he is finished mind you?
Quote from: johnnycool on June 18, 2026, 03:52:54 PMThe biggest shock to me was that he was playing away from home, with a woman no less.
Begs the question...why??? These lads are all hypocritical bastards.
I suppose without any hard evidence does this just come down to who you believe more?
Do the jury consider the complainants relationship to this man and their motives towards bringing this to trial? I don't believe they have any ulterior motives other than seeing him face justice? Does that factor into their decision making?
Quote from: gallsman on June 18, 2026, 04:04:55 PMQuote from: johnnycool on June 18, 2026, 03:52:54 PMThe biggest shock to me was that he was playing away from home, with a woman no less.
Begs the question...why??? These lads are all hypocritical bastards.
there have been many rumours over the years that it wouldn't be women he was a fan of.
Quote from: Ethan Tremblay on June 18, 2026, 04:07:25 PMI suppose without any hard evidence does this just come down to who you believe more?
Do the jury consider the complainants relationship to this man and their motives towards bringing this to trial? I don't believe they have any ulterior motives other than seeing him face justice? Does that factor into their decision making?
Yes x 4
Quote from: imtommygunn on June 18, 2026, 04:04:13 PMNot following this at all but guess reading this a decent chance he may get off?
You would expect politically etc he is finished mind you?
He has 18 separate charges and I'd imagine one of them will stick and he'll get off with the most serious one. If convicted of even one he will have to have his titles taken away as Stuart Hogg had his MBE removed for harassing the ex-wife.
Quote from: imtommygunn on June 18, 2026, 04:11:46 PMQuote from: gallsman on June 18, 2026, 04:04:55 PMQuote from: johnnycool on June 18, 2026, 03:52:54 PMThe biggest shock to me was that he was playing away from home, with a woman no less.
Begs the question...why??? These lads are all hypocritical bastards.
there have been many rumours over the years that it wouldn't be women he was a fan of.
I was referring to the fact he was shocked to hear of his infidelity, regardless of his proclivities.
Quote from: Ethan Tremblay on June 18, 2026, 04:07:25 PMI suppose without any hard evidence does this just come down to who you believe more?
Do the jury consider the complainants relationship to this man and their motives towards bringing this to trial? I don't believe they have any ulterior motives other than seeing him face justice? Does that factor into their decision making?
An Ex teacher was found guilty recently of sexual offences against women when they were at school , maybe 30/40 years ago. Can't remember how long he got
That was obviously a case of 'who do you believe more'? As there wouldnt be any physical evidence given it was so long ago
Jeffrey has too many accusations thrown at him . You'd imagine at least one of them will stick . If it was a once off , he might have more chance of getting off.
Depends on how many 'good' free P's are in the jury ;)
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on June 18, 2026, 06:00:32 PMDepends on how many 'good' free P's are in the jury ;)
In Newry....
Really all comes down to who the jury believe most and who's stories align best. The meeting in Armoy is key as while it is circumstantial it wasn't denied that there was a meeting, why have the meeting in the first place if there were no issues. I think he could be in trouble
Quote from: brokencrossbar1 on June 18, 2026, 06:11:54 PMQuote from: Milltown Row2 on June 18, 2026, 06:00:32 PMDepends on how many 'good' free P's are in the jury ;)
In Newry....
Really all comes down to who the jury believe most and who's stories align best. The meeting in Armoy is key as while it is circumstantial it wasn't denied that there was a meeting, why have the meeting in the first place if there were no issues. I think he could be in trouble
Would the letter of apology and his wife's disclosure that she was uncomfortable about the incident and raised it with him several times but to no avail, not also be key? Also the affair he had surely tarnishes his holier than thou reputation
BBCs Tara Mills has a bitesize podcast that neatly sums up the trial. It boils down to credibility of the witnesses[x2].
7 men and 5 women on jury. Hopefully , they do right thing.
Quote from: Mourne Red on June 18, 2026, 09:53:48 PMThought the defending barrister comments been horrible whole way through, basically said the victims were lying every time he questioned them
Would be interesting to see how it would go with a defamation case if Donaldson is proven guilty.
It'd certainly clip the wings of fukkers like Kieran Vaughan.
What was Donaldson's side of the story in what he was supposedly apologising for in both the letter of apology or the apology at the Armoy meeting?
Also did the wife not say in her police interview that when she walked in on him with the complainant that it always bothered her what was going on and she questioned him about it for years after
Quote from: maldini on June 18, 2026, 11:02:45 PMWhat was Donaldson's side of the story in what he was supposedly apologising for in both the letter of apology or the apology at the Armoy meeting?
Was thinking that myself when I heard that Maldini.
What was the meeting miles and miles away about then?
Quote from: RadioGAAGAA on June 18, 2026, 10:06:56 PMQuote from: Mourne Red on June 18, 2026, 09:53:48 PMThought the defending barrister comments been horrible whole way through, basically said the victims were lying every time he questioned them
Would be interesting to see how it would go with a defamation case if Donaldson is proven guilty.
It'd certainly clip the wings of fukkers like Kieran Vaughan.
Sue a barrister? Be nice to live in that world but the most would be discplinary matter. Under the adversial system its viewed as "fair play".
The Lucy Letby case was particularly awful in this regard.
Quote from: RadioGAAGAA on June 18, 2026, 10:06:56 PMQuote from: Mourne Red on June 18, 2026, 09:53:48 PMThought the defending barrister comments been horrible whole way through, basically said the victims were lying every time he questioned them
Would be interesting to see how it would go with a defamation case if Donaldson is proven guilty.
It'd certainly clip the wings of fukkers like Kieran Vaughan.
The system would collapse if you had that. And not in a good way
Quote from: gallsman on June 18, 2026, 05:08:39 PMQuote from: imtommygunn on June 18, 2026, 04:11:46 PMQuote from: gallsman on June 18, 2026, 04:04:55 PMQuote from: johnnycool on June 18, 2026, 03:52:54 PMThe biggest shock to me was that he was playing away from home, with a woman no less.
Begs the question...why??? These lads are all hypocritical bastards.
there have been many rumours over the years that it wouldn't be women he was a fan of.
I was referring to the fact he was shocked to hear of his infidelity, regardless of his proclivities.
His infidelity was probably not the biggest shock, the rent boy industry thrives around Westminster.
It was "women" throwing themselves at him and he, a sinner, couldn't control his urges...
Quote from: DaleCooper on June 19, 2026, 12:19:29 AMSue a barrister? Be nice to live in that world but the most would be discplinary matter. Under the adversial system its viewed as "fair play".
The Lucy Letby case was particularly awful in this regard.
Well, if the legal system ever wonder why such a low proportion of rape and sexual abuses cases come to court - the courts need to take a good look in the mirror.
Quote from: RadioGAAGAA on June 19, 2026, 09:18:32 AMQuote from: DaleCooper on June 19, 2026, 12:19:29 AMSue a barrister? Be nice to live in that world but the most would be discplinary matter. Under the adversial system its viewed as "fair play".
The Lucy Letby case was particularly awful in this regard.
Well, if the legal system ever wonder why such a low proportion of rape and sexual abuses cases come to court - the courts need to take a good look in the mirror.
It's a balancing act. Both the accuser and accused should have the same rights to be heard and robustly challenged, within defined rules of engagement, in response. If someone was to accuse you of something you didn't do I'm sure you wouldn't be proposing a softly-softly approach with the accuser.
No outcome today - Back in again on Monday.
Obviously people are not agreeing, it might be that one or two that are digging their heals in or possibly working out which one to give guilty to
Quote from: Mourne Red on June 19, 2026, 05:07:32 PMNo outcome today - Back in again on Monday.
I would assume that their difficulty is around Mrs D and whether or not she knew the full picture
Quote from: Dougal Maguire on June 19, 2026, 06:27:49 PMQuote from: Mourne Red on June 19, 2026, 05:07:32 PMNo outcome today - Back in again on Monday.
I would assume that their difficulty is around Mrs D and whether or not she knew the full picture
Could be or could be on one or two charges or it could be on the other defendant's guilt or innocence
Quote from: RadioGAAGAA on June 18, 2026, 10:06:56 PMQuote from: Mourne Red on June 18, 2026, 09:53:48 PMThought the defending barrister comments been horrible whole way through, basically said the victims were lying every time he questioned them
Would be interesting to see how it would go with a defamation case if Donaldson is proven guilty.
It'd certainly clip the wings of fukkers like Kieran Vaughan.
Well that would need a law change so I wouldn't have thought that's likely at all.
Quote from: RadioGAAGAA on June 19, 2026, 09:18:32 AMQuote from: DaleCooper on June 19, 2026, 12:19:29 AMSue a barrister? Be nice to live in that world but the most would be discplinary matter. Under the adversial system its viewed as "fair play".
The Lucy Letby case was particularly awful in this regard.
Well, if the legal system ever wonder why such a low proportion of rape and sexual abuses cases come to court - the courts need to take a good look in the mirror.
Ahh that old nonsense.
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on June 19, 2026, 05:12:23 PMObviously people are not agreeing, it might be that one or two that are digging their heals in or possibly working out which one to give guilty to
I understand we've had the majority direction so it's more than one or two. Admittedly it must be between 3 and 10 who think either way
Quote from: maldini on June 18, 2026, 11:02:45 PMWhat was Donaldson's side of the story in what he was supposedly apologising for in both the letter of apology or the apology at the Armoy meeting?
That was reported but I think probably unlawfully so it's not possible to answer that anymore.
Quote from: David McKeown on June 19, 2026, 07:49:17 PMQuote from: maldini on June 18, 2026, 11:02:45 PMWhat was Donaldson's side of the story in what he was supposedly apologising for in both the letter of apology or the apology at the Armoy meeting?
That was reported but I think probably unlawfully so it's not possible to answer that anymore.
Is Donaldson's side of that story part of the court recorded evidence
Quote from: Main Street on June 19, 2026, 09:31:06 PMQuote from: David McKeown on June 19, 2026, 07:49:17 PMQuote from: maldini on June 18, 2026, 11:02:45 PMWhat was Donaldson's side of the story in what he was supposedly apologising for in both the letter of apology or the apology at the Armoy meeting?
That was reported but I think probably unlawfully so it's not possible to answer that anymore.
Is Donaldson's side of that story part of the court recorded evidence
I'm not sure I understand what you mean by court recorded evidence. There's been an awful lot of evidence heard by the Jury that can't be reported for legal reasons.
Quote from: David McKeown on June 19, 2026, 10:07:40 PMQuote from: Main Street on June 19, 2026, 09:31:06 PMQuote from: David McKeown on June 19, 2026, 07:49:17 PMQuote from: maldini on June 18, 2026, 11:02:45 PMWhat was Donaldson's side of the story in what he was supposedly apologising for in both the letter of apology or the apology at the Armoy meeting?
That was reported but I think probably unlawfully so it's not possible to answer that anymore.
Is Donaldson's side of that story part of the court recorded evidence
I'm not sure I understand what you mean by court recorded evidence. There's been an awful lot of evidence heard by the Jury that can't be reported for legal reasons.
Can it be reported when the case is over?
Quote from: Dougal Maguire on June 19, 2026, 10:56:38 PMQuote from: David McKeown on June 19, 2026, 10:07:40 PMQuote from: Main Street on June 19, 2026, 09:31:06 PMQuote from: David McKeown on June 19, 2026, 07:49:17 PMQuote from: maldini on June 18, 2026, 11:02:45 PMWhat was Donaldson's side of the story in what he was supposedly apologising for in both the letter of apology or the apology at the Armoy meeting?
That was reported but I think probably unlawfully so it's not possible to answer that anymore.
Is Donaldson's side of that story part of the court recorded evidence
I'm not sure I understand what you mean by court recorded evidence. There's been an awful lot of evidence heard by the Jury that can't be reported for legal reasons.
Can it be reported when the case is over?
I thought what was reported was illegal. Hence why I'm not repeating here and I noticed it was removed a few hours later.
We should change the name of this thread to DUPaedos
Quote from: Mourne Red on June 18, 2026, 09:53:48 PMQuote from: RadioGAAGAA on June 18, 2026, 06:18:34 PMWhy would a direct descendent and another close relation make the accusations if they were not real?
They destroyed familial relationships in bringing the case.
They aren't going to gain monetary.
Indeed, they are more likely to lose out financially (inheritance).
I though the (at least what was reported) defence barrister's arguments yesterday were disgusting and the judge really should have pulled him on it.
Small wonder that so few rape crimes come to court if the defence are allowed to carry themselves like that.
Thought the defending barrister comments been horrible whole way through, basically said the victims were lying every time he questioned them
I would have thought a high ranking barrister would be able to come up with a better line of argument than - eh, you're a liar.
I've always wondered how a defence solicitor/barrister can seperate their own opinion from the trial itself.
Even if they believe the defendant is guilty they still need to do everything they can to get a not guilty verdict, which I couldn't do.
Quote from: RedHand88 on June 20, 2026, 01:29:06 PMI've always wondered how a defence solicitor/barrister can seperate their own opinion from the trial itself.
Even if they believe the defendant is guilty they still need to do everything they can to get a not guilty verdict, which I couldn't do.
Sure, isn't shedloads of money [legal aid] a wonderful thing?
Roy Keane knows
Quote from: Armamike on June 20, 2026, 12:48:45 PMI would have thought a high ranking barrister would be able to come up with a better line of argument than - eh, you're a liar.
The burden of proof lies with the prosecution. It's not up to the defence team to explain why the alleged victims claim what they claim.
Quote from: playwiththewind1st on June 20, 2026, 01:52:46 PMQuote from: RedHand88 on June 20, 2026, 01:29:06 PMI've always wondered how a defence solicitor/barrister can seperate their own opinion from the trial itself.
Even if they believe the defendant is guilty they still need to do everything they can to get a not guilty verdict, which I couldn't do.
Sure, isn't shedloads of money [legal aid] a wonderful thing?
Biggest gravy train about.
If the plug was pulled in this in the morning quite a few of the high profile legal practices in this country would take some hit.
Quote from: David McKeown on June 19, 2026, 06:57:03 PMQuote from: RadioGAAGAA on June 18, 2026, 10:06:56 PMQuote from: Mourne Red on June 18, 2026, 09:53:48 PMThought the defending barrister comments been horrible whole way through, basically said the victims were lying every time he questioned them
Would be interesting to see how it would go with a defamation case if Donaldson is proven guilty.
It'd certainly clip the wings of fukkers like Kieran Vaughan.
Well that would need a law change so I wouldn't have thought that's likely at all.
Didn't realise you could say whatever the f you wanted in court and get away with it.
Thought it was reserved for parliament where you can do anything but (quite ironically given this case) call someone a lair.
Quote from: David McKeown on June 19, 2026, 06:58:23 PMQuote from: RadioGAAGAA on June 19, 2026, 09:18:32 AMQuote from: DaleCooper on June 19, 2026, 12:19:29 AMSue a barrister? Be nice to live in that world but the most would be discplinary matter. Under the adversial system its viewed as "fair play".
The Lucy Letby case was particularly awful in this regard.
Well, if the legal system ever wonder why such a low proportion of rape and sexual abuses cases come to court - the courts need to take a good look in the mirror.
Ahh that old nonsense.
No surprise at not taking criticism of the legal system well.
Its hardly an opinion limited to me as well, see here (https://victimscommissioner.org.uk/news/the-distressing-truth-is-that-if-you-are-raped-in-britain-today-your-chances-of-seeing-justice-are-slim/)
QuoteAttending court can be hugely intimidating for victims of crime. Many will find the experience highly-retraumatising. For rape victims, this is particularly the case.
Special measures are ways to help victims to give their best possible evidence in court. An exceptionally effective one is known as 'Section 28' after the clause in the statute which introduced it.
S28 says that a complainant may have their evidence videoed by the police (instead of making a written statement) which is then served on the defence. The defence then have time to prepare and when they are ready will cross-examine the complainant which is also video recorded. These two videos then become the complainant's evidence for the trial, to be played whenever it takes place.
A huge advantage is that once the recordings are done, the complainant has finished with the proceedings. They can get on with their life and take therapy if they need to. This gets them out of the court queue, saving them perhaps years of anxious waiting. Completing their evidence close to the time of offence also aids memory recall and helps to reduce the distress experienced by some witnesses when giving evidence to a full courtroom at trial.
S28 was piloted long ago and was rolled out nationally for vulnerable complainants from the start of the pandemic. I worked with the Criminal Bar to press for this rollout and the Government response was excellent. However, that limits the use of S28 mainly to child victims. It is good news that the Deputy Prime Minister has resolved to roll it out also for 'intimidated' witnesses which includes adult rape complainants. After its announcement in December, it has since been rolled out to a total of 26 out of approximately 85 Crown Courts in England and Wales. This is excellent and this work must be sped up even further. There are clear views amongst some criminal justice professionals that this should be the default way in which all sexual assault complainants give their evidence. The courts have been using video evidence for almost two decades and S28 is too beneficial for victims not to be used throughout the court system in England and Wales.
Quote from: RadioGAAGAA on June 20, 2026, 06:34:10 PMQuote from: David McKeown on June 19, 2026, 06:58:23 PMQuote from: RadioGAAGAA on June 19, 2026, 09:18:32 AMQuote from: DaleCooper on June 19, 2026, 12:19:29 AMSue a barrister? Be nice to live in that world but the most would be discplinary matter. Under the adversial system its viewed as "fair play".
The Lucy Letby case was particularly awful in this regard.
Well, if the legal system ever wonder why such a low proportion of rape and sexual abuses cases come to court - the courts need to take a good look in the mirror.
Ahh that old nonsense.
No surprise at not taking criticism of the legal system well.
Its hardly an opinion limited to me as well, see here (https://victimscommissioner.org.uk/news/the-distressing-truth-is-that-if-you-are-raped-in-britain-today-your-chances-of-seeing-justice-are-slim/)
QuoteAttending court can be hugely intimidating for victims of crime. Many will find the experience highly-retraumatising. For rape victims, this is particularly the case.
Special measures are ways to help victims to give their best possible evidence in court. An exceptionally effective one is known as 'Section 28' after the clause in the statute which introduced it.
S28 says that a complainant may have their evidence videoed by the police (instead of making a written statement) which is then served on the defence. The defence then have time to prepare and when they are ready will cross-examine the complainant which is also video recorded. These two videos then become the complainant's evidence for the trial, to be played whenever it takes place.
A huge advantage is that once the recordings are done, the complainant has finished with the proceedings. They can get on with their life and take therapy if they need to. This gets them out of the court queue, saving them perhaps years of anxious waiting. Completing their evidence close to the time of offence also aids memory recall and helps to reduce the distress experienced by some witnesses when giving evidence to a full courtroom at trial.
S28 was piloted long ago and was rolled out nationally for vulnerable complainants from the start of the pandemic. I worked with the Criminal Bar to press for this rollout and the Government response was excellent. However, that limits the use of S28 mainly to child victims. It is good news that the Deputy Prime Minister has resolved to roll it out also for 'intimidated' witnesses which includes adult rape complainants. After its announcement in December, it has since been rolled out to a total of 26 out of approximately 85 Crown Courts in England and Wales. This is excellent and this work must be sped up even further. There are clear views amongst some criminal justice professionals that this should be the default way in which all sexual assault complainants give their evidence. The courts have been using video evidence for almost two decades and S28 is too beneficial for victims not to be used throughout the court system in England and Wales.
Most of that's not correct although it's 5 years old at this stage. For example complainants in sexual cases are automatically entitled to special measures including evidence via video link.
Third party disclosure isn't combed through by either the defence or the prosecution but rather by a Judge who concludes if any of it is relevant to matters at issue at the trial. It's limited and only the relevant information is disclosed.
Despite all of that the victims commissioners report doesn't seem to criticise the defence at all.
In 2018 former High Court Judge Sir John Gillen conducted a comprehensive review of prosecutions in Sexual Offence cases.
This was the opening paragraph
t has not been the intention of this Review to reinvent the wheel. Whilst I am satisfied that much needs to be changed in terms of the law and procedures relating to serious sexual offences, it cannot be ignored that in recent years there have been many improvements made in the law relating to such offences.
These improvements have occurred in the treatment of complainants, in the
standards of investigation, in a far more coherent and enlightened approach to prosecutions than before and in improved court processes and procedures.
The report recommended lots of further improvements the vast majority of which has been implemented.
So when someone posts the Courts need to take a look at themselves as if they don't, it's simply ill informed nonsense.
Is the system perfect? Absolutely not but it is a system that is constantly striving to improve.
Quote from: RedHand88 on June 20, 2026, 01:29:06 PMI've always wondered how a defence solicitor/barrister can seperate their own opinion from the trial itself.
Even if they believe the defendant is guilty they still need to do everything they can to get a not guilty verdict, which I couldn't do.
It's not our job to establish guilt or innocence and we will honestly give our clients our advice on what will happen but ultimately we act on instructions and we test the evidence to ensure everyone has a fair trial.
What we don't do is invent defences or present a case other than the one given to us by our clients
So for example if a client tells us they are guilty we don't call them to give evidence to say they are innocent nor do we put any positive case on their behalf.
Similarly we don't plead people guilty unless they tell us they are guilty.
At that point our feelings don't come into it.
Quote from: Armamike on June 20, 2026, 12:48:45 PMQuote from: Mourne Red on June 18, 2026, 09:53:48 PMQuote from: RadioGAAGAA on June 18, 2026, 06:18:34 PMWhy would a direct descendent and another close relation make the accusations if they were not real?
They destroyed familial relationships in bringing the case.
They aren't going to gain monetary.
Indeed, they are more likely to lose out financially (inheritance).
I though the (at least what was reported) defence barrister's arguments yesterday were disgusting and the judge really should have pulled him on it.
Small wonder that so few rape crimes come to court if the defence are allowed to carry themselves like that.
Thought the defending barrister comments been horrible whole way through, basically said the victims were lying every time he questioned them
I would have thought a high ranking barrister would be able to come up with a better line of argument than - eh, you're a liar.
A barrister is only as good as their instructions. We don't come up with lines of argument in criminal trial.
Quote from: playwiththewind1st on June 20, 2026, 01:52:46 PMQuote from: RedHand88 on June 20, 2026, 01:29:06 PMI've always wondered how a defence solicitor/barrister can seperate their own opinion from the trial itself.
Even if they believe the defendant is guilty they still need to do everything they can to get a not guilty verdict, which I couldn't do.
Sure, isn't shedloads of money [legal aid] a wonderful thing?
If only it was.
Quote from: LC on June 20, 2026, 03:31:44 PMQuote from: playwiththewind1st on June 20, 2026, 01:52:46 PMQuote from: RedHand88 on June 20, 2026, 01:29:06 PMI've always wondered how a defence solicitor/barrister can seperate their own opinion from the trial itself.
Even if they believe the defendant is guilty they still need to do everything they can to get a not guilty verdict, which I couldn't do.
Sure, isn't shedloads of money [legal aid] a wonderful thing?
Biggest gravy train about.
If the plug was pulled in this in the morning quite a few of the high profile legal practices in this country would take some hit.
[/Quote from: RadioGAAGAA on June 20, 2026, 06:29:37 PMQuote from: David McKeown on June 19, 2026, 06:57:03 PMQuote from: RadioGAAGAA on June 18, 2026, 10:06:56 PMQuote from: Mourne Red on June 18, 2026, 09:53:48 PMThought the defending barrister comments been horrible whole way through, basically said the victims were lying every time he questioned them
Would be interesting to see how it would go with a defamation case if Donaldson is proven guilty.
It'd certainly clip the wings of fukkers like Kieran Vaughan.
Well that would need a law change so I wouldn't have thought that's likely at all.
Didn't realise you could say whatever the f you wanted in court and get away with it.
Thought it was reserved for parliament where you can do anything but (quite ironically given this case) call someone a lair.
There's good reason for why claims made in court are protected. It would have a serious detrimental impact on justice if it didn't.
Quote from: LC on June 20, 2026, 03:31:44 PMQuote from: playwiththewind1st on June 20, 2026, 01:52:46 PMQuote from: RedHand88 on June 20, 2026, 01:29:06 PMI've always wondered how a defence solicitor/barrister can seperate their own opinion from the trial itself.
Even if they believe the defendant is guilty they still need to do everything they can to get a not guilty verdict, which I couldn't do.
Sure, isn't shedloads of money [legal aid] a wonderful thing?
Biggest gravy train about.
If the plug was pulled in this in the morning quite a few of the high profile legal practices in this country would take some hit.
Yes I imagine if you ended most business main stream of funding overnight they'd suffer.
What would also happen is you'd destroy the justice system. You'd have a two tier justice system and you'd increase public costs.
CPS data. 60% of rape cases brought end up in a conviction.
https://archive.ph/8gNBN
Unfortunately the squeaky wheel gets the grease and the 2% figure bandied around by ideological activists may put people off coming forward [Baroness Stern made this point]
Nadia Whittome MP put this figure out in Parliament and was approvingly quote tweeted by Angela Eagle MP who agreed with her that "rape has essentially been decriminalised".
Quote from: David McKeown on June 20, 2026, 09:54:48 PMQuote from: LC on June 20, 2026, 03:31:44 PMQuote from: playwiththewind1st on June 20, 2026, 01:52:46 PMQuote from: RedHand88 on June 20, 2026, 01:29:06 PMI've always wondered how a defence solicitor/barrister can seperate their own opinion from the trial itself.
Even if they believe the defendant is guilty they still need to do everything they can to get a not guilty verdict, which I couldn't do.
Sure, isn't shedloads of money [legal aid] a wonderful thing?
Biggest gravy train about.
If the plug was pulled in this in the morning quite a few of the high profile legal practices in this country would take some hit.
Yes I imagine if you ended most business main stream of funding overnight they'd suffer.
What would also happen is you'd destroy the justice system. You'd have a two tier justice system and you'd increase public costs.
The barristers themselves have been having a right good go at destroying the justice system from within recently, with people having to appeal to their better nature & practically beg them to put aside their industrial action on a case by case basis, so as to permit a few handpicked extremely serious cases to proceed. Surely the proposed financial settlement will increase public costs, will it not?
Quote from: playwiththewind1st on June 21, 2026, 09:40:34 AMQuote from: David McKeown on June 20, 2026, 09:54:48 PMQuote from: LC on June 20, 2026, 03:31:44 PMQuote from: playwiththewind1st on June 20, 2026, 01:52:46 PMQuote from: RedHand88 on June 20, 2026, 01:29:06 PMI've always wondered how a defence solicitor/barrister can seperate their own opinion from the trial itself.
Even if they believe the defendant is guilty they still need to do everything they can to get a not guilty verdict, which I couldn't do.
Sure, isn't shedloads of money [legal aid] a wonderful thing?
Biggest gravy train about.
If the plug was pulled in this in the morning quite a few of the high profile legal practices in this country would take some hit.
Yes I imagine if you ended most business main stream of funding overnight they'd suffer.
What would also happen is you'd destroy the justice system. You'd have a two tier justice system and you'd increase public costs.
The barristers themselves have been having a right good go at destroying the justice system from within recently, with people having to appeal to their better nature & practically beg them to put aside their industrial action on a case by case basis, so as to permit a few handpicked extremely serious cases to proceed. Surely the proposed financial settlement will increase public costs, will it not?
Strange solicitors and barristers are blamed for that when fees last increased in 2005 and were lowered in 2011 and 2016. Don't think many costs have fallen since then.
The settlement reached after 6 months is apparently well within available budget and is not only significantly below inflation but means in real terms that fees are lower than in 2015 and even 2005.
On the other hand the minister who could have paid the money 6 months ago only made an offer a week ago. It's still significantly below what lawyers who do non criminal work get paid by the state. It won't kick in until at the earliest next February. But yes it's the lawyers to blame.
I am aware that at the top end fees are eye watering but it's for extremely complex and difficult cases and it's paid to a very small number of lawyers. There is however a lot of misinformation out there.
Quote from: David McKeown on June 21, 2026, 11:04:05 AMQuote from: playwiththewind1st on June 21, 2026, 09:40:34 AMQuote from: David McKeown on June 20, 2026, 09:54:48 PMQuote from: LC on June 20, 2026, 03:31:44 PMQuote from: playwiththewind1st on June 20, 2026, 01:52:46 PMQuote from: RedHand88 on June 20, 2026, 01:29:06 PMI've always wondered how a defence solicitor/barrister can seperate their own opinion from the trial itself.
Even if they believe the defendant is guilty they still need to do everything they can to get a not guilty verdict, which I couldn't do.
Sure, isn't shedloads of money [legal aid] a wonderful thing?
Biggest gravy train about.
If the plug was pulled in this in the morning quite a few of the high profile legal practices in this country would take some hit.
Yes I imagine if you ended most business main stream of funding overnight they'd suffer.
What would also happen is you'd destroy the justice system. You'd have a two tier justice system and you'd increase public costs.
The barristers themselves have been having a right good go at destroying the justice system from within recently, with people having to appeal to their better nature & practically beg them to put aside their industrial action on a case by case basis, so as to permit a few handpicked extremely serious cases to proceed. Surely the proposed financial settlement will increase public costs, will it not?
Strange solicitors and barristers are blamed for that when fees last increased in 2005 and were lowered in 2011 and 2016. Don't think many costs have fallen since then.
The settlement reached after 6 months is apparently well within available budget and is not only significantly below inflation but means in real terms that fees are lower than in 2015 and even 2005.
On the other hand the minister who could have paid the money 6 months ago only made an offer a week ago. It's still significantly below what lawyers who do non criminal work get paid by the state. It won't kick in until at the earliest next February. But yes it's the lawyers to blame.
I am aware that at the top end fees are eye watering but it's for extremely complex and difficult cases and it's paid to a very small number of lawyers. There is however a lot of misinformation out there.
Some of the lads would prefer only the richest people get legal representation.
Quote from: David McKeown on June 20, 2026, 09:26:56 PMQuote from: Armamike on June 20, 2026, 12:48:45 PMQuote from: Mourne Red on June 18, 2026, 09:53:48 PMQuote from: RadioGAAGAA on June 18, 2026, 06:18:34 PMWhy would a direct descendent and another close relation make the accusations if they were not real?
They destroyed familial relationships in bringing the case.
They aren't going to gain monetary.
Indeed, they are more likely to lose out financially (inheritance).
I though the (at least what was reported) defence barrister's arguments yesterday were disgusting and the judge really should have pulled him on it.
Small wonder that so few rape crimes come to court if the defence are allowed to carry themselves like that.
Thought the defending barrister comments been horrible whole way through, basically said the victims were lying every time he questioned them
I would have thought a high ranking barrister would be able to come up with a better line of argument than - eh, you're a liar.
A barrister is only as good as their instructions. We don't come up with lines of argument in criminal trial.
in a case where there's a guilty plea, can you not (in a casual conversation) ask your lawyer for their objective opinion on appropriate sounding mitigations, before you splurt out your own grand plan.
Quote from: Main Street on June 21, 2026, 02:37:19 PMQuote from: David McKeown on June 20, 2026, 09:26:56 PMQuote from: Armamike on June 20, 2026, 12:48:45 PMQuote from: Mourne Red on June 18, 2026, 09:53:48 PMQuote from: RadioGAAGAA on June 18, 2026, 06:18:34 PMWhy would a direct descendent and another close relation make the accusations if they were not real?
They destroyed familial relationships in bringing the case.
They aren't going to gain monetary.
Indeed, they are more likely to lose out financially (inheritance).
I though the (at least what was reported) defence barrister's arguments yesterday were disgusting and the judge really should have pulled him on it.
Small wonder that so few rape crimes come to court if the defence are allowed to carry themselves like that.
Thought the defending barrister comments been horrible whole way through, basically said the victims were lying every time he questioned them
I would have thought a high ranking barrister would be able to come up with a better line of argument than - eh, you're a liar.
A barrister is only as good as their instructions. We don't come up with lines of argument in criminal trial.
in a case where there's a guilty plea, can you not (in a casual conversation) ask your lawyer for their objective opinion on appropriate sounding mitigations, before you splurt out your own grand plan.
The lawyer will take your instructions on appropriate mitigations but they come from the client not the lawyer.
Does the wife have any bearing on the deliberations ?. I thought I saw where she can only be found not guilty. Don't really understand that to be honest.
Quote from: Killala on June 21, 2026, 04:44:42 PMDoes the wife have any bearing on the deliberations ?. I thought I saw where she can only be found not guilty. Don't really understand that to be honest.
The circumstances are analyzed without her present due to mental health reasons. 4 psychiatrists reviewed her and judge ruled accordingly.
Quote from: Killala on June 21, 2026, 04:44:42 PMDoes the wife have any bearing on the deliberations ?. I thought I saw where she can only be found not guilty. Don't really understand that to be honest.
The Jury will be deliberating on whether or not she committed the acts alleged. That is different to if she is guilty or not. It's somewhat artificial mind as they won't be able to consider an alternative version of events to the evidence put forward by the prosecution
Quote from: DaleCooper on June 21, 2026, 05:04:58 PMQuote from: Killala on June 21, 2026, 04:44:42 PMDoes the wife have any bearing on the deliberations ?. I thought I saw where she can only be found not guilty. Don't really understand that to be honest.
The circumstances are analyzed without her present due to mental health reasons. 4 psychiatrists reviewed her and judge ruled accordingly.
The video evidence she provided via the police interviews didn't do Jeffrey any favours but wasn't a knock out blow.
Her not being put in the witness stand will have undoubtedly worked in their favour.
This isn't looking good is it? Longer it goes on etc.....
JEFFREY FOUND GUILTY
The wife guilty on 5 counts as well
I hope it's hard time for the hoor.
Quote from: quit yo jibbajabba on June 22, 2026, 01:32:36 PMThis isn't looking good is it? Longer it goes on etc.....
There is nothing "good" about this case whatsoever.
Guilty on all counts.
Guilty
All 18!!!
Quote from: DaleCooper on June 22, 2026, 02:19:02 PMJEFFREY FOUND GUILTY
The wife guilty on 5 counts as well
Where are you seeing this?
Quote from: johnnycool on June 22, 2026, 02:26:17 PMQuote from: DaleCooper on June 22, 2026, 02:19:02 PMJEFFREY FOUND GUILTY
The wife guilty on 5 counts as well
Where are you seeing this?
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/cwy2qp32d1pt
Never thought they'd have the guts to send him down.
Quote from: DaleCooper on June 22, 2026, 02:19:02 PMJEFFREY FOUND GUILTY
The wife guilty on 5 counts as well
No she wasnt she was found to have done the acts thats not the same thing
Quote from: quit yo jibbajabba on June 22, 2026, 01:32:36 PMThis isn't looking good is it? Longer it goes on etc.....
Glad to be wrong
*You know what I mean, for those determined to find offence in any word slightly misplaced
Quote from: johnnycool on June 22, 2026, 12:05:57 PMQuote from: DaleCooper on June 21, 2026, 05:04:58 PMQuote from: Killala on June 21, 2026, 04:44:42 PMDoes the wife have any bearing on the deliberations ?. I thought I saw where she can only be found not guilty. Don't really understand that to be honest.
The circumstances are analyzed without her present due to mental health reasons. 4 psychiatrists reviewed her and judge ruled accordingly.
The video evidence she provided via the police interviews didn't do Jeffrey any favours but wasn't a knock out blow.
Her not being put in the witness stand will have undoubtedly worked in their favour.
The jury will have been told they could not consider her witness statements as evidence against him whether they listened is another matter we probably will never know.
Quote from: DaleCooper on June 22, 2026, 02:19:02 PMJEFFREY FOUND GUILTY
The wife guilty on 5 counts as well
What time are the " protect our children " protests outside the DUP offices scheduled for????
Quote from: quit yo jibbajabba on June 22, 2026, 02:29:22 PMQuote from: quit yo jibbajabba on June 22, 2026, 01:32:36 PMThis isn't looking good is it? Longer it goes on etc.....
Glad to be wrong
*You know what I mean, for those determined to find offence in any word slightly misplaced
There was no word misplaced. Anyone with half a brain knew what you meant. I was worrying the same the longer it went. Might have even been yourself that posted it before, he was a bad hoor for the putting them through a trial. The evidence seemed incredibly damning.
Quote from: David McKeown on June 22, 2026, 02:28:25 PMQuote from: DaleCooper on June 22, 2026, 02:19:02 PMJEFFREY FOUND GUILTY
The wife guilty on 5 counts as well
No she wasnt she was found to have done the acts thats not the same thing
David I get that its two different things legally speaking, but is not the same thing in the eyes of the public? And would that not be the correct way for joe bloggs to look at it?
Quote from: HiMucker on June 22, 2026, 02:33:35 PMQuote from: quit yo jibbajabba on June 22, 2026, 02:29:22 PMQuote from: quit yo jibbajabba on June 22, 2026, 01:32:36 PMThis isn't looking good is it? Longer it goes on etc.....
Glad to be wrong
*You know what I mean, for those determined to find offence in any word slightly misplaced
There was no word misplaced. Anyone with half a brain knew what you meant. I was worrying the same the longer it went. Might have even been yourself that posted it before, he was a bad hoor for the putting them through a trial. The evidence seemed incredibly damning.
Cheers Mucker. Times you wonder why you bother as there's people hanging round to pick holes in anything
He was a sick boyo listening to the evidence we were able to hear. Good day for the victims
Pity the two women were put through that ordeal. Fair play to them for their bravery.
Quote from: HiMucker on June 22, 2026, 02:33:35 PMQuote from: quit yo jibbajabba on June 22, 2026, 02:29:22 PMQuote from: quit yo jibbajabba on June 22, 2026, 01:32:36 PMThis isn't looking good is it? Longer it goes on etc.....
Glad to be wrong
*You know what I mean, for those determined to find offence in any word slightly misplaced
There was no word misplaced. Anyone with half a brain knew what you meant. I was worrying the same the longer it went. Might have even been yourself that posted it before, he was a bad hoor for the putting them through a trial. The evidence seemed incredibly damning.
The problem is we did hear 75% of the evidence and two and a half days is a long time for deliberation on a case that was charged in half a day. So its impossible to really know how damning the evidence was. Certainly enough for a conviction but clearly also something to give food for thought
What prison time you looking at here?
Quote from: David McKeown on June 22, 2026, 02:40:28 PMQuote from: HiMucker on June 22, 2026, 02:33:35 PMQuote from: quit yo jibbajabba on June 22, 2026, 02:29:22 PMQuote from: quit yo jibbajabba on June 22, 2026, 01:32:36 PMThis isn't looking good is it? Longer it goes on etc.....
Glad to be wrong
*You know what I mean, for those determined to find offence in any word slightly misplaced
There was no word misplaced. Anyone with half a brain knew what you meant. I was worrying the same the longer it went. Might have even been yourself that posted it before, he was a bad hoor for the putting them through a trial. The evidence seemed incredibly damning.
The problem is we did hear 75% of the evidence and two and a half days is a long time for deliberation on a case that was charged in half a day. So its impossible to really know how damning the evidence was. Certainly enough for a conviction but clearly also something to give food for thought
Is it possible the length of deliberation was over charges against the wife?
Quote from: Walter Cronc on June 22, 2026, 02:41:54 PMWhat prison time you looking at here?
Potentially life. Usually between 7 and 20.
Quote from: HiMucker on June 22, 2026, 02:36:16 PMQuote from: David McKeown on June 22, 2026, 02:28:25 PMQuote from: DaleCooper on June 22, 2026, 02:19:02 PMJEFFREY FOUND GUILTY
The wife guilty on 5 counts as well
No she wasnt she was found to have done the acts thats not the same thing
David I get that its two different things legally speaking, but is not the same thing in the eyes of the public? And would that not be the correct way for joe bloggs to look at it?
It certainly not the correct way to look at it. A finding on the facts basically means that there is sufficient evidence to find someone guilty if they didn't provide any alternative evidence. So Eleanor Donaldsons lawyers wouldnt have been able to present anything to the jury so the finding is effectively having heard one side we think the person could be guilty.
Quote from: David McKeown on June 22, 2026, 02:40:28 PMQuote from: HiMucker on June 22, 2026, 02:33:35 PMQuote from: quit yo jibbajabba on June 22, 2026, 02:29:22 PMQuote from: quit yo jibbajabba on June 22, 2026, 01:32:36 PMThis isn't looking good is it? Longer it goes on etc.....
Glad to be wrong
*You know what I mean, for those determined to find offence in any word slightly misplaced
There was no word misplaced. Anyone with half a brain knew what you meant. I was worrying the same the longer it went. Might have even been yourself that posted it before, he was a bad hoor for the putting them through a trial. The evidence seemed incredibly damning.
The problem is we did hear 75% of the evidence and two and a half days is a long time for deliberation on a case that was charged in half a day. So its impossible to really know how damning the evidence was. Certainly enough for a conviction but clearly also something to give food for thought
David, you see the jury? Are they just picked randomly - like 12 random people from anywhere in the north?
And they obviously would all know Donaldson from politics and in the media etc.?
And are they 'assessed' in any way?
Quote from: David McKeown on June 22, 2026, 02:44:17 PMQuote from: HiMucker on June 22, 2026, 02:36:16 PMQuote from: David McKeown on June 22, 2026, 02:28:25 PMQuote from: DaleCooper on June 22, 2026, 02:19:02 PMJEFFREY FOUND GUILTY
The wife guilty on 5 counts as well
No she wasnt she was found to have done the acts thats not the same thing
David I get that its two different things legally speaking, but is not the same thing in the eyes of the public? And would that not be the correct way for joe bloggs to look at it?
It certainly not the correct way to look at it. A finding on the facts basically means that there is sufficient evidence to find someone guilty if they didn't provide any alternative evidence. So Eleanor Donaldsons lawyers wouldnt have been able to present anything to the jury so the finding is effectively having heard one side we think the person could be guilty.
Is she looking at a stay in a secure hospital?
David gonna be busy on here for a day or two 😄
I too have questions 😄
Quote from: Baile Brigín 2 on June 22, 2026, 02:43:49 PMQuote from: Walter Cronc on June 22, 2026, 02:41:54 PMWhat prison time you looking at here?
Potentially life. Usually between 7 and 20.
I would not have thought so. Historic sexual offending sentencing is very complex. The court has to look at how modern society views the seriousness of the offence and try and fit that within the sentencing framework that existed at the time of the offence.
I dont know enough about the specifics of the offending to suggest a penalty but the range would be far more narrow
Quote from: HiMucker on June 22, 2026, 02:42:37 PMQuote from: David McKeown on June 22, 2026, 02:40:28 PMQuote from: HiMucker on June 22, 2026, 02:33:35 PMQuote from: quit yo jibbajabba on June 22, 2026, 02:29:22 PMQuote from: quit yo jibbajabba on June 22, 2026, 01:32:36 PMThis isn't looking good is it? Longer it goes on etc.....
Glad to be wrong
*You know what I mean, for those determined to find offence in any word slightly misplaced
There was no word misplaced. Anyone with half a brain knew what you meant. I was worrying the same the longer it went. Might have even been yourself that posted it before, he was a bad hoor for the putting them through a trial. The evidence seemed incredibly damning.
The problem is we did hear 75% of the evidence and two and a half days is a long time for deliberation on a case that was charged in half a day. So its impossible to really know how damning the evidence was. Certainly enough for a conviction but clearly also something to give food for thought
Is it possible the length of deliberation was over charges against the wife?
Might have been but ordinarily a jury would be asked at each stage had they returned verdicts against either of the defendants. So its impossible to know
Quote from: David McKeown on June 22, 2026, 02:28:25 PMQuote from: DaleCooper on June 22, 2026, 02:19:02 PMJEFFREY FOUND GUILTY
The wife guilty on 5 counts as well
No she wasnt she was found to have done the acts thats not the same thing
You are right to be precise. Was being hasty seeing the news.
BBC report
"His wife, Lady Eleanor Donaldson, who faced five charges including four related to aiding and abetting, found to have done the acts"
"Former Democratic Unionist Party (DUP) leader Sir Jeffrey Donaldson found guilty of all 18 sex abuse charges, including rape"
Good for politics here. Had to deal with a cynical relative recently who insisted he would walk due to politics.
Quote from: marty34 on June 22, 2026, 02:45:28 PMQuote from: David McKeown on June 22, 2026, 02:40:28 PMQuote from: HiMucker on June 22, 2026, 02:33:35 PMQuote from: quit yo jibbajabba on June 22, 2026, 02:29:22 PMQuote from: quit yo jibbajabba on June 22, 2026, 01:32:36 PMThis isn't looking good is it? Longer it goes on etc.....
Glad to be wrong
*You know what I mean, for those determined to find offence in any word slightly misplaced
There was no word misplaced. Anyone with half a brain knew what you meant. I was worrying the same the longer it went. Might have even been yourself that posted it before, he was a bad hoor for the putting them through a trial. The evidence seemed incredibly damning.
The problem is we did hear 75% of the evidence and two and a half days is a long time for deliberation on a case that was charged in half a day. So its impossible to really know how damning the evidence was. Certainly enough for a conviction but clearly also something to give food for thought
David, you see the jury? Are they just picked randomly - like 12 random people from anywhere in the north?
And they obviously would all know Donaldson from politics and in the media etc.?
And are they 'assessed' in any way?
Its a jury of your peers and they could only be challenged for cause. So it would have been a pool selected from the electoral register in the area. Then jurors would be picked randomly and would be asked if they knew any of those involved in the case. Once 12 were found that didnt know the parties personally and were available to set for 3/4 weeks the Jury would have been selected
Quote from: johnnycool on June 22, 2026, 02:46:54 PMQuote from: David McKeown on June 22, 2026, 02:44:17 PMQuote from: HiMucker on June 22, 2026, 02:36:16 PMQuote from: David McKeown on June 22, 2026, 02:28:25 PMQuote from: DaleCooper on June 22, 2026, 02:19:02 PMJEFFREY FOUND GUILTY
The wife guilty on 5 counts as well
No she wasnt she was found to have done the acts thats not the same thing
David I get that its two different things legally speaking, but is not the same thing in the eyes of the public? And would that not be the correct way for joe bloggs to look at it?
It certainly not the correct way to look at it. A finding on the facts basically means that there is sufficient evidence to find someone guilty if they didn't provide any alternative evidence. So Eleanor Donaldsons lawyers wouldnt have been able to present anything to the jury so the finding is effectively having heard one side we think the person could be guilty.
Is she looking at a stay in a secure hospital?
If the other conditions are met then yes
I stayed away from it altogether but I did see JD himself corroborated one incident involving a flashlight though provided a more innocent explanation.
To me his responses seemed unconvincing. If he gets over 5 years it would be surprising to me.
What a sinister piece of sh*t Jeff and his mrs are.
Doing what they did was bad enough, but making the victims sit through a trial and be ridiculed and accused of being liars while he sat there just makes the crimes even worse.
Jail time is too good for them.
Thank goodness they've been found guilty and I'd like to think there would be some special treatment reserved for them.
I have a question though, maybe for David. The people who facilitated the meeting between JD and one of the girls so he could apologise, are they not in any way guilty? Surely they had a duty of care at the time to the child and should have been bringing it to the attention of the authorities?
I really hope the 2 victims can move on with their lives and find some peace now that this has been resolved.
Quote from: tbrick18 on June 22, 2026, 03:10:06 PMWhat a sinister piece of sh*t Jeff and his mrs are.
Doing what they did was bad enough, but making the victims sit through a trial and be ridiculed and accused of being liars while he sat there just makes the crimes even worse.
Jail time is too good for them.
Thank goodness they've been found guilty and I'd like to think there would be some special treatment reserved for them.
I have a question though, maybe for David. The people who facilitated the meeting between JD and one of the girls so he could apologise, are they not in any way guilty? Surely they had a duty of care at the time to the child and should have been bringing it to the attention of the authorities?
I really hope the 2 victims can move on with their lives and find some peace now that this has been resolved.
On this question would these parties not have been supeoned if thats the right word to give evidence on the subject of the meetings.
Quote from: Walter Cronc on June 22, 2026, 02:41:54 PMWhat prison time you looking at here?
Judge said lengthy today.
He probably won't ever get out.
Astonishing stuff. Victory for the two victims. Are there more!? Now we know how the Brits got him to sign off the Windsor framework.
"The nature of his abuse shocked those who knew him as an overtly religious politician, who kept a New Testament in his study and used his long career as an MP to fight for traditional moral values"
Telegraph gives indepth overview
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/gift/86bbdf456d5b1a84
"He's a fanatic. And the fanatic is always concealing a secret doubt"
George Smiley
Quote from: Jeepers Creepers on June 22, 2026, 03:24:18 PMAstonishing stuff. Victory for the two victims. Are there more!? Now we know how the Brits got him to sign off the Windsor framework.
You've went a bit Jamie Brysonie there mate 😄
Quote from: Grace Murphy on June 22, 2026, 03:16:28 PMQuote from: tbrick18 on June 22, 2026, 03:10:06 PMWhat a sinister piece of sh*t Jeff and his mrs are.
Doing what they did was bad enough, but making the victims sit through a trial and be ridiculed and accused of being liars while he sat there just makes the crimes even worse.
Jail time is too good for them.
Thank goodness they've been found guilty and I'd like to think there would be some special treatment reserved for them.
I have a question though, maybe for David. The people who facilitated the meeting between JD and one of the girls so he could apologise, are they not in any way guilty? Surely they had a duty of care at the time to the child and should have been bringing it to the attention of the authorities?
I really hope the 2 victims can move on with their lives and find some peace now that this has been resolved.
On this question would these parties not have been supeoned if thats the right word to give evidence on the subject of the meetings.
I understand that they did give evidence of facilitating the meeting but were not party to the actual conversations to a great deal.
The sentencing will be interesting because it is a huge opportunity for a judge to really put a marker down, ands Paul Ramsey would not be afraid to do so, but he needs to be careful too. Given the public profile of the whole thing and the status of Donaldson it will be tough as it has been dragged on for longer than normal due to the wife's health and this will have had an impact on the victims. COupled with fighting it to the very last will mean that there will be no leniency shown I'd say.
Will also be interesting now if the victims forgo their anonymity and make public statements after the sentencing.
Quote from: DaleCooper on June 22, 2026, 03:29:35 PM"The nature of his abuse shocked those who knew him as an overtly religious politician, who kept a New Testament in his study and used his long career as an MP to fight for traditional moral values"
Telegraph gives indepth overview
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/gift/86bbdf456d5b1a84
"He's a fanatic. And the fanatic is always concealing a secret doubt"
George Smiley
It's always the ones you most suspect
Quote from: tbrick18 on June 22, 2026, 03:10:06 PMWhat a sinister piece of sh*t Jeff and his mrs are.
Doing what they did was bad enough, but making the victims sit through a trial and be ridiculed and accused of being liars while he sat there just makes the crimes even worse.
Jail time is too good for them.
Thank goodness they've been found guilty and I'd like to think there would be some special treatment reserved for them.
I have a question though, maybe for David. The people who facilitated the meeting between JD and one of the girls so he could apologise, are they not in any way guilty? Surely they had a duty of care at the time to the child and should have been bringing it to the attention of the authorities?
I really hope the 2 victims can move on with their lives and find some peace now that this has been resolved.
We dont have accessory after the fact laws like they do in some states (I only practice law in 1 so im not an expert on all states) so the short answer is no. There is a longer more complex answer if you really want it but its going to come down to no as well because of the nature of the offence and right to anonymity etc.
Quote from: Grace Murphy on June 22, 2026, 03:16:28 PMQuote from: tbrick18 on June 22, 2026, 03:10:06 PMWhat a sinister piece of sh*t Jeff and his mrs are.
Doing what they did was bad enough, but making the victims sit through a trial and be ridiculed and accused of being liars while he sat there just makes the crimes even worse.
Jail time is too good for them.
Thank goodness they've been found guilty and I'd like to think there would be some special treatment reserved for them.
I have a question though, maybe for David. The people who facilitated the meeting between JD and one of the girls so he could apologise, are they not in any way guilty? Surely they had a duty of care at the time to the child and should have been bringing it to the attention of the authorities?
I really hope the 2 victims can move on with their lives and find some peace now that this has been resolved.
On this question would these parties not have been supeoned if thats the right word to give evidence on the subject of the meetings.
At least one gave evidence I believe. Summons is the word you are looking for (I dont mean that to be condescending so sorry if it comes across like that.) It strikes me the evidence would have been hearsay anyway and would require there to be an exception to the hearsay to allow it to be admissible.
Quote from: RedHand88 on June 22, 2026, 03:21:04 PMQuote from: Walter Cronc on June 22, 2026, 02:41:54 PMWhat prison time you looking at here?
Judge said lengthy today.
He probably won't ever get out.
Lengthy is a relative term. I doubt hes looking at anything close to life
Quote from: brokencrossbar1 on June 22, 2026, 03:36:01 PMQuote from: Grace Murphy on June 22, 2026, 03:16:28 PMQuote from: tbrick18 on June 22, 2026, 03:10:06 PMWhat a sinister piece of sh*t Jeff and his mrs are.
Doing what they did was bad enough, but making the victims sit through a trial and be ridiculed and accused of being liars while he sat there just makes the crimes even worse.
Jail time is too good for them.
Thank goodness they've been found guilty and I'd like to think there would be some special treatment reserved for them.
I have a question though, maybe for David. The people who facilitated the meeting between JD and one of the girls so he could apologise, are they not in any way guilty? Surely they had a duty of care at the time to the child and should have been bringing it to the attention of the authorities?
I really hope the 2 victims can move on with their lives and find some peace now that this has been resolved.
On this question would these parties not have been supeoned if thats the right word to give evidence on the subject of the meetings.
I understand that they did give evidence of facilitating the meeting but were not party to the actual conversations to a great deal.
The sentencing will be interesting because it is a huge opportunity for a judge to really put a marker down, ands Paul Ramsey would not be afraid to do so, but he needs to be careful too. Given the public profile of the whole thing and the status of Donaldson it will be tough as it has been dragged on for longer than normal due to the wife's health and this will have had an impact on the victims. COupled with fighting it to the very last will mean that there will be no leniency shown I'd say.
Will also be interesting now if the victims forgo their anonymity and make public statements after the sentencing.
Not sure I would quite agree, not a Judge known for stiff sentences lets just say
I had been following it a bit and got the impression that he would walk away, but the again keeping an eye on X you will get his own people casting doubt.
So, I was amazed to see that breaking news. And like many institutions and organisations you might think more will come out.
It also nicely is a blow for a lot of the Tommy Two Names crew online and in reality. The bogey man has always been here.
Let him rot!
F**k me. Jim Alistair is some bollox:
https://x.com/cellah26bsky/status/2069064411336044786
Quote from: brokencrossbar1 on June 22, 2026, 03:36:01 PMQuote from: Grace Murphy on June 22, 2026, 03:16:28 PMQuote from: tbrick18 on June 22, 2026, 03:10:06 PMWhat a sinister piece of sh*t Jeff and his mrs are.
Doing what they did was bad enough, but making the victims sit through a trial and be ridiculed and accused of being liars while he sat there just makes the crimes even worse.
Jail time is too good for them.
Thank goodness they've been found guilty and I'd like to think there would be some special treatment reserved for them.
I have a question though, maybe for David. The people who facilitated the meeting between JD and one of the girls so he could apologise, are they not in any way guilty? Surely they had a duty of care at the time to the child and should have been bringing it to the attention of the authorities?
I really hope the 2 victims can move on with their lives and find some peace now that this has been resolved.
On this question would these parties not have been supeoned if thats the right word to give evidence on the subject of the meetings.
I understand that they did give evidence of facilitating the meeting but were not party to the actual conversations to a great deal.
The sentencing will be interesting because it is a huge opportunity for a judge to really put a marker down, ands Paul Ramsey would not be afraid to do so, but he needs to be careful too. Given the public profile of the whole thing and the status of Donaldson it will be tough as it has been dragged on for longer than normal due to the wife's health and this will have had an impact on the victims. COupled with fighting it to the very last will mean that there will be no leniency shown I'd say.
Will also be interesting now if the victims forgo their anonymity and make public statements after the sentencing.
I see some ballbags are already putting it out there who they are on twitter.
Can I ask those in the legal profession, would the jury have known their relationship to the Donaldsons?
Delighted for the 2 Victims and hope this gives them a bit of closure and peace, the pure torture they were put through by both Donaldson's Barristers......accusing them of lying time and time again, pure disgusting. Obviously the PSNI did great work to get this case passed for Prosecution by PPS. Just a pity that "Lady" Donaldson was deemed unfit to take the stand. 2 Disgusting, sick individuals ..... This case perhaps might improve the Public's view of the Judiciary System here in the North, which hasn't at times covered itself in glory, but today shows that "Money" and thinking you are "Untouchable" will not always save you. Irrespective of the time he gets or what happens her, they are finished. Great work by the Jury in this case also.
Quote from: johnnycool on June 22, 2026, 04:04:52 PMQuote from: brokencrossbar1 on June 22, 2026, 03:36:01 PMQuote from: Grace Murphy on June 22, 2026, 03:16:28 PMQuote from: tbrick18 on June 22, 2026, 03:10:06 PMWhat a sinister piece of sh*t Jeff and his mrs are.
Doing what they did was bad enough, but making the victims sit through a trial and be ridiculed and accused of being liars while he sat there just makes the crimes even worse.
Jail time is too good for them.
Thank goodness they've been found guilty and I'd like to think there would be some special treatment reserved for them.
I have a question though, maybe for David. The people who facilitated the meeting between JD and one of the girls so he could apologise, are they not in any way guilty? Surely they had a duty of care at the time to the child and should have been bringing it to the attention of the authorities?
I really hope the 2 victims can move on with their lives and find some peace now that this has been resolved.
On this question would these parties not have been supeoned if thats the right word to give evidence on the subject of the meetings.
I understand that they did give evidence of facilitating the meeting but were not party to the actual conversations to a great deal.
The sentencing will be interesting because it is a huge opportunity for a judge to really put a marker down, ands Paul Ramsey would not be afraid to do so, but he needs to be careful too. Given the public profile of the whole thing and the status of Donaldson it will be tough as it has been dragged on for longer than normal due to the wife's health and this will have had an impact on the victims. COupled with fighting it to the very last will mean that there will be no leniency shown I'd say.
Will also be interesting now if the victims forgo their anonymity and make public statements after the sentencing.
I see some ballbags are already putting it out there who they are on twitter.
Can I ask those in the legal profession, would the jury have known their relationship to the Donaldsons?
Yes they would have the restriction only applies to members of the public
Quote from: Armagh Girl on June 22, 2026, 04:07:25 PMDelighted for the 2 Victims and hope this gives them a bit of closure and peace, the pure torture they were put through by both Donaldson's Barristers......accusing them of lying time and time again, pure disgusting. Obviously the PSNI did great work to get this case passed for Prosecution by PPS. Just a pity that "Lady" Donaldson was deemed unfit to take the stand. 2 Disgusting, sick individuals ..... This case perhaps might improve the Public's view of the Judiciary System here in the North, which hasn't at times covered itself in glory, but today shows that "Money" and thinking you are "Untouchable" will not always save you. Irrespective of the time he gets or what happens her, they are finished. Great work by the Jury in this case also.
I think this post highlights that the issue is perhaps ignorance of the system which individuals then use to blame solicitors/barristers and judges. I've no idea how we come to the conclusion it was great work by the jury. The jury are the trier of fact. Whatever determination they made was the correct one. No idea how this would improve the public view of the judicial system.
On the point of accusing the victims of lying that doesn't come from the barristers particularly the two highly experienced and respected counsel in this case. It comes from a combination of the instructions received from Jeffry in the case of Kieran Vaughan KC and from the evidence in the case in regards to Ian Turkington. It also can only be done if there's an evidential basis for doing so (we may not know what that is) and it would have been stopped by the Judge if it were inappropriate.
Jim Allister shows what is important to him
https://www.facebook.com/jim.allister.1/posts/pfbid0aGsoVym9fGGs1UvADDKkvB9WWckLgje5vajjy8dGWKYd5DqQWY8DxZTWguD1kK4hl
"Donaldson conviction - for how long was he compromised to the detriment of Unionism?
Statement by TUV leader, Jim Allister KC MP:-
The conviction of Jeffrey Donaldson for multiple sexual offences is truly shocking.
Primarily my thoughts are with his victims, but for whose immense courage and honesty, Donaldson would have continued to play out the role of 'statesman'. Now, he stands exposed as a paedophile.
Donaldson must be stripped of his knighthood forthwith.
However, for unionism, a very chilling and troubling issue arises, namely, how far did his 'troubles' give rise to his sell out on the Protocol?
To me it is inconceivable that the government was unaware of his proclivities and the idea of such being used as leverage is far from fanciful.
His about turn from 'unalterable opposition' to the Protocol to Protocol facilitator was telling. From sharing platforms with me and others in robust opposition, he somersaulted to lying salesmanship of the phoney 'Safeguarding the Union' document. Who could forget his brazen lies that the Irish Sea border was gone?
How did this come about? The fact Donaldson insisted in key meetings with HMG on being unaccompanied by colleagues raises red flags in itself. Was he on a mission of attempted self-preservation in the hope, no matter how deluded, he could stave off the fate that has now befallen him?
Yet, his then deputy, Gavin Robinson and others stood nodding in support of the dud deal Donaldson produced.
There is much here for the DUP to address. The DUP needs to own this situation. Government will vehemently deny dirty tricks - of course they will - but people are not stupid and should not be taken for fools.
I have today tabled this motion in the House of Commons:-
"That this House calls on the Prime Minister to recommend to His Majesty The King that the Knighthood of Jeffrey Donaldson, the former MP for Lagan Valley, be removed, following his criminal convictions for sexual offences.""
Quote from: dec on June 22, 2026, 04:37:41 PMJim Allister shows what is important to him
https://www.facebook.com/jim.allister.1/posts/pfbid0aGsoVym9fGGs1UvADDKkvB9WWckLgje5vajjy8dGWKYd5DqQWY8DxZTWguD1kK4hl
"Donaldson conviction - for how long was he compromised to the detriment of Unionism?
Statement by TUV leader, Jim Allister KC MP:-
The conviction of Jeffrey Donaldson for multiple sexual offences is truly shocking.
Primarily my thoughts are with his victims, but for whose immense courage and honesty, Donaldson would have continued to play out the role of 'statesman'. Now, he stands exposed as a paedophile.
Donaldson must be stripped of his knighthood forthwith.
However, for unionism, a very chilling and troubling issue arises, namely, how far did his 'troubles' give rise to his sell out on the Protocol?
To me it is inconceivable that the government was unaware of his proclivities and the idea of such being used as leverage is far from fanciful.
His about turn from 'unalterable opposition' to the Protocol to Protocol facilitator was telling. From sharing platforms with me and others in robust opposition, he somersaulted to lying salesmanship of the phoney 'Safeguarding the Union' document. Who could forget his brazen lies that the Irish Sea border was gone?
How did this come about? The fact Donaldson insisted in key meetings with HMG on being unaccompanied by colleagues raises red flags in itself. Was he on a mission of attempted self-preservation in the hope, no matter how deluded, he could stave off the fate that has now befallen him?
Yet, his then deputy, Gavin Robinson and others stood nodding in support of the dud deal Donaldson produced.
There is much here for the DUP to address. The DUP needs to own this situation. Government will vehemently deny dirty tricks - of course they will - but people are not stupid and should not be taken for fools.
I have today tabled this motion in the House of Commons:-
"That this House calls on the Prime Minister to recommend to His Majesty The King that the Knighthood of Jeffrey Donaldson, the former MP for Lagan Valley, be removed, following his criminal convictions for sexual offences.""
The man lacks any morality or empathy for victims as we well know for his support for Davy Tweed.
Quote from: Jeepers Creepers on June 22, 2026, 03:24:18 PMAstonishing stuff. Victory for the two victims. Are there more!? Now we know how the Brits got him to sign off the Windsor framework.
Victory isn't the word I'd use. There are no winners here. The best they can hope for is maybe a bit of closure and a sense of justice. What was done to them can never be undone.
As for the last bit, not too many times someone on this board shares the thoughts of Jim Allister :o
I hope you're sending a few invoices out after today's questioning on the board David
Quote from: Mourne Red on June 22, 2026, 04:52:06 PMI hope you're sending a few invoices out after today's questioning on the board David
Contrary to popular opinion we are not all greedy ***********
Quote from: David McKeown on June 22, 2026, 03:56:56 PMQuote from: brokencrossbar1 on June 22, 2026, 03:36:01 PMQuote from: Grace Murphy on June 22, 2026, 03:16:28 PMQuote from: tbrick18 on June 22, 2026, 03:10:06 PMWhat a sinister piece of sh*t Jeff and his mrs are.
Doing what they did was bad enough, but making the victims sit through a trial and be ridiculed and accused of being liars while he sat there just makes the crimes even worse.
Jail time is too good for them.
Thank goodness they've been found guilty and I'd like to think there would be some special treatment reserved for them.
I have a question though, maybe for David. The people who facilitated the meeting between JD and one of the girls so he could apologise, are they not in any way guilty? Surely they had a duty of care at the time to the child and should have been bringing it to the attention of the authorities?
I really hope the 2 victims can move on with their lives and find some peace now that this has been resolved.
On this question would these parties not have been supeoned if thats the right word to give evidence on the subject of the meetings.
I understand that they did give evidence of facilitating the meeting but were not party to the actual conversations to a great deal.
The sentencing will be interesting because it is a huge opportunity for a judge to really put a marker down, ands Paul Ramsey would not be afraid to do so, but he needs to be careful too. Given the public profile of the whole thing and the status of Donaldson it will be tough as it has been dragged on for longer than normal due to the wife's health and this will have had an impact on the victims. COupled with fighting it to the very last will mean that there will be no leniency shown I'd say.
Will also be interesting now if the victims forgo their anonymity and make public statements after the sentencing.
Not sure I would quite agree, not a Judge known for stiff sentences lets just say
Probably right, was talking to a friend last week who had said he might give a hefty sentence and he would know mire about that side of things than me but there will be limited leniency shown due to making the trial go the whole way so perhaps he has the freedom to be as hard as he wants.
May be a silly question here - is his position as a (former) MP an aggravating factor when it comes to sentencing? The DUP in their statement mention an abuse of power. Edit: abuse of trust
If Jim is correct about the government cover up Sir JD would have no reason to keep quiet about it now. Having been found guilty any alleged deal has failed. A rather sickening attempt to tear his rivals apart.
Which roads will be closed tonight?
I've checked the concerned parents groups on social media and no new posters going up on gable walls!
I suppose they'll stick him on a few bonfires
The businesses I'm sure will have been told to close or else and the cops will be getting more overtime...
Quote from: general_lee on June 22, 2026, 05:37:46 PMMay be a silly question here - is his position as a (former) MP an aggravating factor when it comes to sentencing? The DUP in their statement mention an abuse of power. Edit: abuse of trust
Not really
Quote from: general_lee on June 22, 2026, 05:37:46 PMMay be a silly question here - is his position as a (former) MP an aggravating factor when it comes to sentencing? The DUP in their statement mention an abuse of power. Edit: abuse of trust
Not just abuse of trust but according to the DUP , Jeffrey also stands guilty of committing the ultimate crime,
betrayal of unionists
Funny enough, they never see it coming, every time the Brits betray them, yet again & throw them under the bus.
Mad story, you never thought he'd reslly be convicted. Fair play to the victims, god knows what they've been through over the years.
Def time to change the name to The DUPaedophile Thread.....
Quote from: Armagh4sam2024 on June 22, 2026, 07:39:57 PMDef time to change the name to The DUPaedophile Thread.....
The problem is a lot of political parties have plenty of dirt on them and it becomes a whataboutery
Davy tweed and him.
Not the time for point scoring. The poor victims in this :(
What an awful human being. As said above never thought the day would come he'd be convicted.
The fact that the PSNI and the prosecution services got this to a trial was the surprise to me.
We've been well used to a feeling that certain people in society are beyond the law and the tickly hand brigade look after their own and seeing this odious sc**bag with his wee fish symbol on his lapel gives hope that there is justice for all.
If the Brits didn't want this to see court if won't have seen the light of day. Nothing happens in this shit hole without the Brits say so
That is true and he mustn't have had too much dirt on the brits as leverage, if Andy can get shafted so can Jeffery
Who's next? Bound to be plenty more where that came from
No riots over this of course!
Apparently he was found of the bottle as well & would ring up Unionist MPs/ colleagues when in London late at night.
It will be interesting to see what comes out in the wash. Deviants are often selected and groomed by TPTB, in a place like London and with his penchant for booze, the odds of him restricting his offending to just the two victims that came forward is low.
Was it him or some other DUP MP who was watching 'late night movies' over in London?
Was there not uproar over it a good few years ago?
Yes. Google summary
The Claims: Donaldson expensed around £600 for over 30 pay-per-view films during hotel stays (such as Jolly Hotel St Ermine and the Hilton) in London.
The Response: Donaldson denied the films were adult in nature. His solicitor stated he used the pay-TV services to watch films like Star Wars and The Chronicles of Narnia to relax after long workdays.
The Resolution: Facing intense public and political backlash, Donaldson repaid £555 to cover the disputed film claims.
I didn't notice much evidence against Lady Dee, said to have opened the door and had a peep at Jeffrey abusing the young girl, another time in 2023 some vague reference to an apology text of sorts but no copy of said text presented. When I first heard of the serious charges being laid upon her I had visions of her being a version of Ghislaine Maxwell supplying a a series of young women to the voracious abuser husband.
Is there other much stronger evidence against her which we don't get to peruse at this stage? So far it just sounds to me that she was a seriously emotionally abused spouse.
Quote from: Main Street on June 23, 2026, 12:58:35 AMI didn't notice much evidence against Lady Dee, said to have opened the door and had a peep at Jeffrey abusing the young girl, another time in 2023 some vague reference to an apology text of sorts but no copy of said text presented. When I first heard of the serious charges being laid upon her I had visions of her being a version of Ghislaine Maxwell supplying a a series of young women to the voracious abuser husband.
Is there other much stronger evidence against her which we don't get to peruse at this stage? So far it just sounds to me that she was a seriously emotionally abused spouse.
There's alot of detail the media can't ever report on.
We only got a snippet of the evidence, dont think we need to know all the details
Quote from: Hereiam on June 23, 2026, 07:29:44 AMWe only got a snippet of the evidence, dont think we need to know all the details
Sam McBrides reporting of this since yesterday would suggest he'd no time for the man and also alluded to the fact that some of the evidence presented was so graphic they couldn't report it:
https://x.com/SJAMcBride/status/2069167719421780291 (https://x.com/SJAMcBride/status/2069167719421780291)
Quote from: DaleCooper on June 22, 2026, 11:49:26 PMYes. Google summary
The Claims: Donaldson expensed around £600 for over 30 pay-per-view films during hotel stays (such as Jolly Hotel St Ermine and the Hilton) in London.
The Response: Donaldson denied the films were adult in nature. His solicitor stated he used the pay-TV services to watch films like Star Wars and The Chronicles of Narnia to relax after long workdays.
The Resolution: Facing intense public and political backlash, Donaldson repaid £555 to cover the disputed film claims.
I had thought he spent the long, lonely nights alone in his hotel room in London reading his free copy of his Gideon bible.
Quote from: johnnycool on June 23, 2026, 08:59:11 AMQuote from: Hereiam on June 23, 2026, 07:29:44 AMWe only got a snippet of the evidence, dont think we need to know all the details
Sam McBrides reporting of this since yesterday would suggest he'd no time for the man and also alluded to the fact that some of the evidence presented was so graphic they couldn't report it:
https://x.com/SJAMcBride/status/2069167719421780291 (https://x.com/SJAMcBride/status/2069167719421780291)
What I found interesting was that all these articles were released as soon as the verdict came in. So they had been prepared in advance. Wonder do they have one prepared incase of a not guilty verdict.
https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/northern-ireland/former-dup-mayor-charged-with-sexual-offences-involving-a-child/a/116919188.html
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cv22rdx450go
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cddr955py8zo
https://www.irishnews.com/news/northernirelandnews/2018/11/23/news/dup-councillor-ian-stevenson-found-guilty-of-sexual-assault-1491375/
For a bunch of so-called god fearing Christians, the DUP seems to have a serious & ongoing problem concerning the proclivities of its elected politicians.
Quote from: RedHand88 on June 23, 2026, 09:07:27 AMQuote from: johnnycool on June 23, 2026, 08:59:11 AMQuote from: Hereiam on June 23, 2026, 07:29:44 AMWe only got a snippet of the evidence, dont think we need to know all the details
Sam McBrides reporting of this since yesterday would suggest he'd no time for the man and also alluded to the fact that some of the evidence presented was so graphic they couldn't report it:
https://x.com/SJAMcBride/status/2069167719421780291 (https://x.com/SJAMcBride/status/2069167719421780291)
What I found interesting was that all these articles were released as soon as the verdict came in. So they had been prepared in advance. Wonder do they have one prepared incase of a not guilty verdict.
Or if not guilty, would he have went back into the DUP again? As if nothing had happened?
Quote from: RedHand88 on June 23, 2026, 09:07:27 AMQuote from: johnnycool on June 23, 2026, 08:59:11 AMQuote from: Hereiam on June 23, 2026, 07:29:44 AMWe only got a snippet of the evidence, dont think we need to know all the details
Sam McBrides reporting of this since yesterday would suggest he'd no time for the man and also alluded to the fact that some of the evidence presented was so graphic they couldn't report it:
https://x.com/SJAMcBride/status/2069167719421780291 (https://x.com/SJAMcBride/status/2069167719421780291)
What I found interesting was that all these articles were released as soon as the verdict came in. So they had been prepared in advance. Wonder do they have one prepared incase of a not guilty verdict.
It seems journalists were allowed to sit in on proceedings so if they were listening to this type of evidence being given they would have been much surer of the outcomings of the jury.
You can never be sure with jurys but they already would have been working on the story and have it ready to go once the jury came back with their verdicts.
The bits I heard on the BBC Sounds podcasts weren't good so lord knows what isn't in the public domain.
It's probably better not to know. I see a lot of talk about prosecuting people for speculating about who the victims are. It is also better not to know who they are (unless they want to be known).
Quote from: RedHand88 on June 23, 2026, 09:07:27 AMQuote from: johnnycool on June 23, 2026, 08:59:11 AMQuote from: Hereiam on June 23, 2026, 07:29:44 AMWe only got a snippet of the evidence, dont think we need to know all the details
Sam McBrides reporting of this since yesterday would suggest he'd no time for the man and also alluded to the fact that some of the evidence presented was so graphic they couldn't report it:
https://x.com/SJAMcBride/status/2069167719421780291
What I found interesting was that all these articles were released as soon as the verdict came in. So they had been prepared in advance. Wonder do they have one prepared incase of a not guilty verdict.
Would have had both prepared I'm sure, just to cover themselves.
Reading through Sam's tweets would just make you even more angry at how the defence was just to call them victims liars. As David mentioned in the thread few pages back, direction of defence comes from the client just goes to show what a piece of shit Donaldson truly is. Will rot in hell
I see that Jeffrey's brother in law had also been convicted of a child related offence.
The PSNI might well be investigating other people around Kilkeel,
Quote from: RedHand88 on June 23, 2026, 09:07:27 AMQuote from: johnnycool on June 23, 2026, 08:59:11 AMQuote from: Hereiam on June 23, 2026, 07:29:44 AMWe only got a snippet of the evidence, dont think we need to know all the details
Sam McBrides reporting of this since yesterday would suggest he'd no time for the man and also alluded to the fact that some of the evidence presented was so graphic they couldn't report it:
https://x.com/SJAMcBride/status/2069167719421780291
What I found interesting was that all these articles were released as soon as the verdict came in. So they had been prepared in advance. Wonder do they have one prepared incase of a not guilty verdict.
Ben Lowry was in charge of that one
Quote from: RedHand88 on June 23, 2026, 09:07:27 AMQuote from: johnnycool on June 23, 2026, 08:59:11 AMQuote from: Hereiam on June 23, 2026, 07:29:44 AMWe only got a snippet of the evidence, dont think we need to know all the details
Sam McBrides reporting of this since yesterday would suggest he'd no time for the man and also alluded to the fact that some of the evidence presented was so graphic they couldn't report it:
https://x.com/SJAMcBride/status/2069167719421780291 (https://x.com/SJAMcBride/status/2069167719421780291)
What I found interesting was that all these articles were released as soon as the verdict came in. So they had been prepared in advance. Wonder do they have one prepared incase of a not guilty verdict.
Of course they do. Basic journalism. Look how quick obituaries are ready.
Minds me on the time big Boris had two speeches prepared depending on what way brexit went
Anyways, carry on
Quote from: marty34 on June 23, 2026, 09:26:49 AMQuote from: RedHand88 on June 23, 2026, 09:07:27 AMQuote from: johnnycool on June 23, 2026, 08:59:11 AMQuote from: Hereiam on June 23, 2026, 07:29:44 AMWe only got a snippet of the evidence, dont think we need to know all the details
Sam McBrides reporting of this since yesterday would suggest he'd no time for the man and also alluded to the fact that some of the evidence presented was so graphic they couldn't report it:
https://x.com/SJAMcBride/status/2069167719421780291 (https://x.com/SJAMcBride/status/2069167719421780291)
What I found interesting was that all these articles were released as soon as the verdict came in. So they had been prepared in advance. Wonder do they have one prepared incase of a not guilty verdict.
Or if not guilty, would he have went back into the DUP again? As if nothing had happened?
Absolutely, he would have been welcomed back with open arms, I daresay.
After all, the DUP has always been well-known for sticking by its core founding principles, including forgiveness, tolerance, inclusivity, love & respect.
If the world was only formed around 4,000 BC, then anything is possible, in the DUP's universe.
I was surprised at the speedy DUP announcement after the guilty verdict. It was as if they were pre-empting any potential questions about: were you aware of any rumours/allegations over the years? Oh no, not a thing
Also, it's a case of distancing themselves from Jeffrey . Hes a wrong un, we're all good living Christian folk. Circle the wagons, thinking ahead to the next election and hanging onto their seats and big paycheque. Ultimately, that's what it's all about
I would find it very hard to believe nobody around the DUP didn't hear any Jeffrey rumours over the years
Quote from: AustinPowers on June 23, 2026, 12:26:30 PMI was surprised at the speedy DUP announcement after the guilty verdict. It was as if they were pre-empting any potential questions about: were you aware of any rumours/allegations over the years? Oh no, not a thing
Also, it's a case of distancing themselves from Jeffrey . Hes a wrong un, we're all good living Christian folk. Circle the wagons, thinking ahead to the next election and hanging onto their seats and big paycheque. Ultimately, that's what it's all about
I would find it very hard to believe nobody around the DUP didn't hear any Jeffrey rumours over the years
Yeah wouldn't really expect anything else there. To be fair there is a big difference in hearing rumours and hearing something credible that could be acted upon.
Did they stick by Davy Tweed?
Quote from: imtommygunn on June 23, 2026, 12:44:04 PMDid they stick by Davy Tweed?
Certainly, a bunch of prominent North Antrim unionist politicians seemed upset at his passing, initially.
https://www.irishnews.com/news/northernirelandnews/2021/11/24/news/ian-paisley-and-mervyn-storey-row-back-from-their-praise-of-david-tweed-2517313/
https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/tuv-leader-jim-allister-apologises-for-hurt-caused-by-statement-made-following-death-of-david-tweed/a/135076441.html
Jim Allister is showing his true colours here and did on Tweed. He's an odious odious man. NI Protocol needs redone he says. Horrendous human being.
Quote from: AustinPowers on June 23, 2026, 12:26:30 PMI was surprised at the speedy DUP announcement after the guilty verdict. It was as if they were pre-empting any potential questions about: were you aware of any rumours/allegations over the years? Oh no, not a thing
Also, it's a case of distancing themselves from Jeffrey . Hes a wrong un, we're all good living Christian folk. Circle the wagons, thinking ahead to the next election and hanging onto their seats and big paycheque. Ultimately, that's what it's all about
I would find it very hard to believe nobody around the DUP didn't hear any Jeffrey rumours over the years
There was a certain level of hypocrisy in the DUP statement from Robinson too, he said something around the lines of nobody being above the law, no matter how long ago things happened.
British forces? Legacy anyone?
I see the Bel Tel were reporting yesterday that it was a majority verdict whilst others have reported it was unanimous. Not that it matters much but I find that interesting
Is there more cases coming forward with Jeffrey? Sam McBride hinted at it on Nolan show this morning
Quote from: imtommygunn on June 23, 2026, 01:18:19 PMJim Allister is showing his true colours here and did on Tweed. He's an odious odious man. NI Protocol needs redone he says. Horrendous human being.
He is, but like it or not there is a conversation to be had about whether or not he was compromised.
Quote from: Baile Brigín 2 on June 23, 2026, 01:52:07 PMQuote from: imtommygunn on June 23, 2026, 01:18:19 PMJim Allister is showing his true colours here and did on Tweed. He's an odious odious man. NI Protocol needs redone he says. Horrendous human being.
He is, but like it or not there is a conversation to be had about whether or not he was compromised.
Is there?
I would imagine if he was compromised he'd have blown that wide open to save himself during the case.
I think it's another case of Jim trying to put the cat among the pigeons without actually having proof of anything.
Quote from: David McKeown on June 23, 2026, 01:43:32 PMI see the Bel Tel were reporting yesterday that it was a majority verdict whilst others have reported it was unanimous. Not that it matters much but I find that interesting
What does the majority need to be for a guilty verdict? Is 7-5 good enough?
Quote from: tbrick18 on June 23, 2026, 02:01:10 PMQuote from: Baile Brigín 2 on June 23, 2026, 01:52:07 PMQuote from: imtommygunn on June 23, 2026, 01:18:19 PMJim Allister is showing his true colours here and did on Tweed. He's an odious odious man. NI Protocol needs redone he says. Horrendous human being.
He is, but like it or not there is a conversation to be had about whether or not he was compromised.
Is there?
I would imagine if he was compromised he'd have blown that wide open to save himself during the case.
I think it's another case of Jim trying to put the cat among the pigeons without actually having proof of anything.
If Allister thinks that - a Unionist trait that that the British establishment is always out to screw them - it doesn't exactly sell the Precious Union that Jeffrey's bosom buddy Arlene Foster always spoke about. And where is Arlene? She usually has a lot to say.
Quote from: dec on June 23, 2026, 02:08:23 PMQuote from: David McKeown on June 23, 2026, 01:43:32 PMI see the Bel Tel were reporting yesterday that it was a majority verdict whilst others have reported it was unanimous. Not that it matters much but I find that interesting
What does the majority need to be for a guilty verdict? Is 7-5 good enough?
Nope, majority verdict is 10-2 where there is a full jury. All the reports I have seen are that it was a unanimous verdict
What can happen to the wife?
https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/courts/former-dup-leader-i-found-donaldson-out-on-lies-too-many-times-over-many-years/a/157396566.html
Mr Acheson also said the NI Prison service faces an "exceptional challenge" to manage Donaldson's safety.
"Even in a sex offender prison or within sex offenders, there are always a hierarchy. And someone who has sexually harmed children tends to sit at the very lowest end of that scale and is highly vulnerable," he said.
"I would suggest in the medium to long term, that the safest option for him - and I'm not sure how this would work - was to request transfer to a prison in GB and to serve his sentence where he is a much smaller fish in a much bigger pond."
Very early on in this someone said to me I wouldn't be surprised if he killed himself and I still wouldn't be surprised at that.
Does the wife have to be locked up in an "institution"? I was surprised to hear she was at home.
Quote from: imtommygunn on June 23, 2026, 03:22:24 PMVery early on in this someone said to me I wouldn't be surprised if he killed himself and I still wouldn't be surprised at that.
Does the wife have to be locked up in an "institution"? I was surprised to hear she was at home.
Seeing his new living situation described on the BBC you can see why especially coming from the privileged position he does
Peter Robinson showing up to Maghaberry Tom Hagen style...
Quote from: tbrick18 on June 23, 2026, 01:37:22 PMQuote from: AustinPowers on June 23, 2026, 12:26:30 PMI was surprised at the speedy DUP announcement after the guilty verdict. It was as if they were pre-empting any potential questions about: were you aware of any rumours/allegations over the years? Oh no, not a thing
Also, it's a case of distancing themselves from Jeffrey . Hes a wrong un, we're all good living Christian folk. Circle the wagons, thinking ahead to the next election and hanging onto their seats and big paycheque. Ultimately, that's what it's all about
I would find it very hard to believe nobody around the DUP didn't hear any Jeffrey rumours over the years
There was a certain level of hypocrisy in the DUP statement from Robinson too, he said something around the lines of nobody being above the law, no matter how long ago things happened.
British forces? Legacy anyone?
True. The same Robinson who put up a paratroopers flag on X, minutes after the Soldier F verdict.
Wonder if he'll get much spam on the oul email a prisoner account, might send him a rake of match reports from the quarter finals on Monday
Quote from: Hereiam on June 23, 2026, 07:29:44 AMWe only got a snippet of the evidence, dont think we need to know all the details
I am not interested in lurid details but considering what was allowed to be reported re Jeffrey, in comparison there was next to zero evidence reported that is convincing about Lady Dee's guilt.
Quote from: tbrick18 on June 23, 2026, 02:01:10 PMQuote from: Baile Brigín 2 on June 23, 2026, 01:52:07 PMQuote from: imtommygunn on June 23, 2026, 01:18:19 PMJim Allister is showing his true colours here and did on Tweed. He's an odious odious man. NI Protocol needs redone he says. Horrendous human being.
He is, but like it or not there is a conversation to be had about whether or not he was compromised.
Is there?
I would imagine if he was compromised he'd have blown that wide open to save himself during the case.
I think it's another case of Jim trying to put the cat among the pigeons without actually having proof of anything.
What would he say? M15/J2 made me vote for the protocol because they knew, but it came out anyway? Still goes to jail but is officially a rat too.
Quote from: nrico2006 on June 23, 2026, 02:40:50 PMWhat can happen to the wife?
She will just have to apply to the governor for conjugal visiting rights, just like anybody else.
Quote from: Main Street on June 23, 2026, 04:58:59 PMQuote from: Hereiam on June 23, 2026, 07:29:44 AMWe only got a snippet of the evidence, dont think we need to know all the details
I am not interested in lurid details but considering what was allowed to be reported re Jeffrey, in comparison there was next to zero evidence reported that is convincing about Lady Dee's guilt.
You don't need to be convinced. It's the jury who needs to be convinced.
Jim was put in his box this morning when interviewed on radio Ulster. He was waffling on about Jeff being scapegoated for the protocol, she asked have you evidence of this, he said no but along the lines of how mi5 work and so on, Oh the irony, then she said are you saying the women raped were used as pawns in this? Backtracked again
I can't see how he could have been given an ultimatum by his 'handlers' to curry favour as this shit was way past being kept under wraps but if he did he was foolish for taking the bait.
His ego probably more to blame on doing a deal with the protocol
I wonder will anybody else come forward now in the light of this case?
Surely the UUP/DUP/OO knew about this years ago? Peoole around him must have knew if they went to the meeting in Armoy etc.
But what a downfall for him. Great bravery by the victims.
Quote from: marty34 on June 23, 2026, 05:59:23 PMI wonder will anybody else come forward now in the light of this case?
Surely the UUP/DUP/OO knew about this years ago? Peoole around him must have knew if they went to the meeting in Armoy etc.
But what a downfall for him. Great bravery by the victims.
The UDR let him in; yet another failure of military vetting, but no big surprise, given that they took anybody in who professed an anti Catholic outlook.
Why is anyone taking the JMcA protocol conspiracy seriously? You could apply the same MI5 made them do it bullshit to every decision made.
The story should be how an MP is distastefully trying to use the case to further his political agenda.
Quote from: marty34 on June 23, 2026, 05:59:23 PMI wonder will anybody else come forward now in the light of this case?
Surely the UUP/DUP/OO knew about this years ago? Peoole around him must have knew if they went to the meeting in Armoy etc.
But what a downfall for him. Great bravery by the victims.
I'd say there's all sorts of shite going on in those mad Christian churches. Make people think they're good living people , when they're all a shower of crooks, pervs and gangsters
Given the overall dogs dinner that is the Presbyterian Church at the minute it's clear that organised religion is under serious pressure. The whole accountability and monitoring in these organisations really needs an overhaul.
Quote from: dec on June 23, 2026, 02:08:23 PMQuote from: David McKeown on June 23, 2026, 01:43:32 PMI see the Bel Tel were reporting yesterday that it was a majority verdict whilst others have reported it was unanimous. Not that it matters much but I find that interesting
What does the majority need to be for a guilty verdict? Is 7-5 good enough?
No 10-2 or 11-1 is the only acceptable majority decision and only then after at least 2 hours is spent trying to secure a unanimous verdict.
Things change if you lose jurors but it must always be a minimum of 9 jurors.
Quote from: nrico2006 on June 23, 2026, 02:40:50 PMWhat can happen to the wife?
4 options now open to the court.
1. Public Protection Order (without restrictions);
2. Public Protection Order with Restrictions;
3. Supervision and Assessment Order;
4. Absolute Discharge.
A discharge is highly unlikely in this case.
A public protection order is basically an order requiring an individual to be detained in hospital for treatment.
The with restrictions part sets out what level of restrictions can be placed on the individual and who ultimately has the power to order a discharge.
A supervision and assessment order doesn't require a person to be detained but does place some restrictions on liberty such as requirements to report to specific services or undergo specific treatments.
David playing a blinder, v informative
Quote from: p3427977 on June 23, 2026, 05:39:22 PMQuote from: Main Street on June 23, 2026, 04:58:59 PMQuote from: Hereiam on June 23, 2026, 07:29:44 AMWe only got a snippet of the evidence, dont think we need to know all the details
I am not interested in lurid details but considering what was allowed to be reported re Jeffrey, in comparison there was next to zero evidence reported that is convincing about Lady Dee's guilt.
You don't need to be convinced. It's the jury who needs to be convinced.
trying to be a smart áss?
Quote from: marty34 on June 23, 2026, 05:59:23 PMI wonder will anybody else come forward now in the light of this case?
Surely the UUP/DUP/OO knew about this years ago? Peoole around him must have knew if they went to the meeting in Armoy etc.
But what a downfall for him. Great bravery by the victims.
Jeffreys bro in law was convicted trying to meet a 13yo. I wonder if that gave them the encouragement or if wheels were already in motion.
Quote from: Main Street on June 23, 2026, 07:20:01 PMQuote from: p3427977 on June 23, 2026, 05:39:22 PMQuote from: Main Street on June 23, 2026, 04:58:59 PMQuote from: Hereiam on June 23, 2026, 07:29:44 AMWe only got a snippet of the evidence, dont think we need to know all the details
I am not interested in lurid details but considering what was allowed to be reported re Jeffrey, in comparison there was next to zero evidence reported that is convincing about Lady Dee's guilt.
You don't need to be convinced. It's the jury who needs to be convinced.
trying to be a smart áss?
No it's the truth.
Quote from: GTP on June 23, 2026, 06:09:26 PMWhy is anyone taking the JMcA protocol conspiracy seriously? You could apply the same MI5 made them do it bullshit to every decision made.
The story should be how an MP is distastefully trying to use the case to further his political agenda.
Everyone agrees it's cynical in the extreme to use this for positioning with unionism for votes. Even by his standards this is odious.
But that doesn't mean it's impossible for Donaldson to have been compromised somewhere along the line.
Quote from: Baile Brigín 2 on June 23, 2026, 10:14:20 PMQuote from: GTP on June 23, 2026, 06:09:26 PMWhy is anyone taking the JMcA protocol conspiracy seriously? You could apply the same MI5 made them do it bullshit to every decision made.
The story should be how an MP is distastefully trying to use the case to further his political agenda.
Everyone agrees it's cynical in the extreme to use this for positioning with unionism for votes. Even by his standards this is odious.
But that doesn't mean it's impossible for Donaldson to have been compromised somewhere along the line.
I know it isn't impossible but giving it any oxygen as a legitimate thought when there is absolutely no evidence lends JMcA plausibility he does not deserve.
The protocol would also be a bizarre thing to get anyone to sign up for if you did want to blackmail a politician.
Lads, lads, it's JA, not JMcA
Stevie Wonder has put that plaster on your man's face from Ghana
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on June 23, 2026, 10:41:55 PMStevie Wonder has put that plaster on your man's face from Ghana
Had a bit too much, again!!! ;D
Quote from: Main Street on June 23, 2026, 11:03:17 PMQuote from: Milltown Row2 on June 23, 2026, 10:41:55 PMStevie Wonder has put that plaster on your man's face from Ghana
Had a bit too much, again!!! ;D
Lol wrong thread! Tea total on school nights too ;D
Quote from: GTP on June 23, 2026, 10:27:04 PMQuote from: Baile Brigín 2 on June 23, 2026, 10:14:20 PMQuote from: GTP on June 23, 2026, 06:09:26 PMWhy is anyone taking the JMcA protocol conspiracy seriously? You could apply the same MI5 made them do it bullshit to every decision made.
The story should be how an MP is distastefully trying to use the case to further his political agenda.
Everyone agrees it's cynical in the extreme to use this for positioning with unionism for votes. Even by his standards this is odious.
But that doesn't mean it's impossible for Donaldson to have been compromised somewhere along the line.
I know it isn't impossible but giving it any oxygen as a legitimate thought when there is absolutely no evidence lends JMcA plausibility he does not deserve.
The protocol would also be a bizarre thing to get anyone to sign up for if you did want to blackmail a politician.
Fair enough to a point. But people on this thread are saying 'people must have known'. Then when JA says what he says we shouldn't give his conspiracy any credence because he is a w**ker.
Why would it be bizarre? Unionist thought needed to be shoved in a direction and it was. If we go all conspiracy it does explain why the DUP were opposed to it, voted for it, then suddenly opposed it again. We never understood that.
Quote from: David McKeown on June 23, 2026, 07:05:44 PMQuote from: nrico2006 on June 23, 2026, 02:40:50 PMWhat can happen to the wife?
4 options now open to the court.
1. Public Protection Order (without restrictions);
2. Public Protection Order with Restrictions;
3. Supervision and Assessment Order;
4. Absolute Discharge.
A discharge is highly unlikely in this case.
A public protection order is basically an order requiring an individual to be detained in hospital for treatment.
The with restrictions part sets out what level of restrictions can be placed on the individual and who ultimately has the power to order a discharge.
A supervision and assessment order doesn't require a person to be detained but does place some restrictions on liberty such as requirements to report to specific services or undergo specific treatments.
Good man David!
We all know that Jeffrey has been found guilty and we have had access to enough of the evidence to have a sense of the seriousness of the charges against him but not for Lady Dee, no evidence of any substance has been revealed to support the verdict against her, not least to support the public ignominy directed against her. Are we living in a big brother knows best world, therefore the prejudices of the public that she must have known that she must have facilitated her husband´s gross sexual abuses are to be supported by such flimsy evidence?
Quote from: Main Street on June 24, 2026, 02:29:56 AMWe all know that Jeffrey has been found guilty and we have had access to enough of the evidence to have a sense of the seriousness of the charges against him but not for Lady Dee, no evidence of any substance has been revealed to support the verdict against her, not least to support the public ignominy directed against her. Are we living in a big brother knows best world, therefore the prejudices of the public that she must have known that she must have facilitated her husband´s gross sexual abuses are to be supported by such flimsy evidence?
MS there is a few different things that arise with the determination into ED. Firstly she wasn't on trial. She faced a finding of fact hearing. The reason I was stressing that earlier is that it is significantly different to a trial. The evidence in it can not be dissected to the same extent that it can in trial so inherently there is less evidence heard and it is less likely to be reported.
Secondly given the nature of this trial and the offences as well as the real possibility of jigsaw identification a large amount of the evidence can not be reported on.
What we do know is that the jury (or at least 10 of them anyway as I've seen conflicting reports on this) were satisfied that the evidence which they heard but we hadn't was enough to leave them convinced that the prosecution evidence was sufficient to allow them to conclude that the act was done.
The defence also don't seem to have made any legal challenge regarding whether or not there was enough evidence for the matter to be left to the jury.
Donaldson was full of entitlement: Knight of the Realm; Privy Council; Orange Order; UDR; MP and the list goes on. He brazened it out with his victims to the bitter end, put them through hell one more time - the worst type.
It now appears quite a few politicians and journalists knew he was at least a liar and led a double life in London - why was he never called out?
Quote from: Sportacus on June 24, 2026, 09:23:42 AMDonaldson was full of entitlement: Knight of the Realm; Privy Council; Orange Order; UDR; MP and the list goes on. He brazened it out with his victims to the bitter end, put them through hell one more time - the worst type.
It now appears quite a few politicians and journalists knew he was at least a liar and led a double life in London - why was he never called out?
Isn't funny how quick they all are in creeping out of the woodwork saying they knew he was dodgy because of x,y and z yet never said anything when he was such a powerful figure.
Quote from: JPGJOHNNYG on June 24, 2026, 09:42:19 AMQuote from: Sportacus on June 24, 2026, 09:23:42 AMDonaldson was full of entitlement: Knight of the Realm; Privy Council; Orange Order; UDR; MP and the list goes on. He brazened it out with his victims to the bitter end, put them through hell one more time - the worst type.
It now appears quite a few politicians and journalists knew he was at least a liar and led a double life in London - why was he never called out?
Isn't funny how quick they all are in creeping out of the woodwork saying they knew he was dodgy because of x,y and z yet never said anything when he was such a powerful figure.
Spotlight on Friday will be an interesting watch....apparently goes in deeply on his double life, heavy drinking, prostitutes etc etc. If it was as bad as it is alleged to have been surely there were questions being being asked behind the scenes and you'd really have to question the DUP having him as leader.
Quote from: RedHand88 on June 23, 2026, 10:39:27 PMLads, lads, it's JA, not JMcA
Apologies, you are correct, JMcA is a bloke I worked with, don't think he endorses the JA conspiracy theory.
QuoteThe Orange Order, a loyalist organisation that counted Donaldson as a prominent member, said it terminated the membership of anyone convicted of a serious criminal offence.
I wonder what their threshold is for a "serious" criminal offence.
Quote from: brokencrossbar1 on June 24, 2026, 10:00:18 AMQuote from: JPGJOHNNYG on June 24, 2026, 09:42:19 AMQuote from: Sportacus on June 24, 2026, 09:23:42 AMDonaldson was full of entitlement: Knight of the Realm; Privy Council; Orange Order; UDR; MP and the list goes on. He brazened it out with his victims to the bitter end, put them through hell one more time - the worst type.
It now appears quite a few politicians and journalists knew he was at least a liar and led a double life in London - why was he never called out?
Isn't funny how quick they all are in creeping out of the woodwork saying they knew he was dodgy because of x,y and z yet never said anything when he was such a powerful figure.
Spotlight on Friday will be an interesting watch....apparently goes in deeply on his double life, heavy drinking, prostitutes etc etc. If it was as bad as it is alleged to have been surely there were questions being being asked behind the scenes and you'd really have to question the DUP having him as leader.
I'd say theres more than him like it within that outfit!
Quote from: gallsman on June 24, 2026, 10:28:25 AMQuoteThe Orange Order, a loyalist organisation that counted Donaldson as a prominent member, said it terminated the membership of anyone convicted of a serious criminal offence.
I wonder what their threshold is for a "serious" criminal offence.
Well.....killing taigs would have been a rather minor misdemeanor.
Quote from: gallsman on June 24, 2026, 10:28:25 AMQuoteThe Orange Order, a loyalist organisation that counted Donaldson as a prominent member, said it terminated the membership of anyone convicted of a serious criminal offence.
I wonder what their threshold is for a "serious" criminal offence.
When they've been convicted in court?
Although, it was clear in court that Soldier F murdered innocent people on Bloody Sunday, yet they still supported him.
Quote from: Grace Murphy on June 24, 2026, 11:06:39 AMQuote from: brokencrossbar1 on June 24, 2026, 10:00:18 AMQuote from: JPGJOHNNYG on June 24, 2026, 09:42:19 AMQuote from: Sportacus on June 24, 2026, 09:23:42 AMDonaldson was full of entitlement: Knight of the Realm; Privy Council; Orange Order; UDR; MP and the list goes on. He brazened it out with his victims to the bitter end, put them through hell one more time - the worst type.
It now appears quite a few politicians and journalists knew he was at least a liar and led a double life in London - why was he never called out?
Isn't funny how quick they all are in creeping out of the woodwork saying they knew he was dodgy because of x,y and z yet never said anything when he was such a powerful figure.
Spotlight on Friday will be an interesting watch....apparently goes in deeply on his double life, heavy drinking, prostitutes etc etc. If it was as bad as it is alleged to have been surely there were questions being being asked behind the scenes and you'd really have to question the DUP having him as leader.
I'd say theres more than him like it within that outfit!
The reason its not talked about with regards the double life in London is simply because they are all at it to some degree..
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on June 24, 2026, 11:49:22 AMQuote from: Grace Murphy on June 24, 2026, 11:06:39 AMQuote from: brokencrossbar1 on June 24, 2026, 10:00:18 AMQuote from: JPGJOHNNYG on June 24, 2026, 09:42:19 AMQuote from: Sportacus on June 24, 2026, 09:23:42 AMDonaldson was full of entitlement: Knight of the Realm; Privy Council; Orange Order; UDR; MP and the list goes on. He brazened it out with his victims to the bitter end, put them through hell one more time - the worst type.
It now appears quite a few politicians and journalists knew he was at least a liar and led a double life in London - why was he never called out?
Isn't funny how quick they all are in creeping out of the woodwork saying they knew he was dodgy because of x,y and z yet never said anything when he was such a powerful figure.
Spotlight on Friday will be an interesting watch....apparently goes in deeply on his double life, heavy drinking, prostitutes etc etc. If it was as bad as it is alleged to have been surely there were questions being being asked behind the scenes and you'd really have to question the DUP having him as leader.
I'd say theres more than him like it within that outfit!
The reason its not talked about with regards the double life in London is simply because they are all at it to some degree..
So that's why Sinn Féin don't take up their seats....to avoid all the temptations & vices that London can offer to the lonely politician.
Quote from: AustinPowers on June 24, 2026, 11:47:48 AMQuote from: gallsman on June 24, 2026, 10:28:25 AMQuoteThe Orange Order, a loyalist organisation that counted Donaldson as a prominent member, said it terminated the membership of anyone convicted of a serious criminal offence.
I wonder what their threshold is for a "serious" criminal offence.
When they've been convicted in court?
Although, it was clear in court that Soldier F murdered innocent people on Bloody Sunday, yet they still supported him.
I mean, for example, is throwing a few petrol bombs at Fenians ok in their book, i.e. what is their definition of "serious", as opposed to whether someone has been found guilty or not.
Quote from: AustinPowers on June 24, 2026, 11:47:48 AMQuote from: gallsman on June 24, 2026, 10:28:25 AMQuoteThe Orange Order, a loyalist organisation that counted Donaldson as a prominent member, said it terminated the membership of anyone convicted of a serious criminal offence.
I wonder what their threshold is for a "serious" criminal offence.
When they've been convicted in court?
Although, it was clear in court that Soldier F murdered innocent people on Bloody Sunday, yet they still supported him.
Would they have members that were convicted of murder but released early under the GFA?
https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/crime/inside-jeffrey-donaldsons-first-full-day-behind-bars-reading-the-bible-as-other-inmates-heckled/a/157643134.html
Donaldson was given a grey prison tracksuit, worn by all new prisoners in committal, and taken to the X-ray chair that is used to check any prisoners coming into the jail in case they have concealed contraband.
Other prisoners heckled him as he was taken through the process.
"They'd all been listening to the news so they knew he was coming on Monday afternoon. He was always going to get abuse and that'll not change anytime soon," said one insider.
Quote from: seafoid on June 24, 2026, 02:53:52 PMhttps://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/crime/inside-jeffrey-donaldsons-first-full-day-behind-bars-reading-the-bible-as-other-inmates-heckled/a/157643134.html
Donaldson was given a grey prison tracksuit, worn by all new prisoners in committal, and taken to the X-ray chair that is used to check any prisoners coming into the jail in case they have concealed contraband.
Other prisoners heckled him as he was taken through the process.
"They'd all been listening to the news so they knew he was coming on Monday afternoon. He was always going to get abuse and that'll not change anytime soon," said one insider.
Insider in prison?, with his mobile phone ;D
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on June 24, 2026, 02:57:28 PMQuote from: seafoid on June 24, 2026, 02:53:52 PMhttps://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/crime/inside-jeffrey-donaldsons-first-full-day-behind-bars-reading-the-bible-as-other-inmates-heckled/a/157643134.html
Donaldson was given a grey prison tracksuit, worn by all new prisoners in committal, and taken to the X-ray chair that is used to check any prisoners coming into the jail in case they have concealed contraband.
Other prisoners heckled him as he was taken through the process.
"They'd all been listening to the news so they knew he was coming on Monday afternoon. He was always going to get abuse and that'll not change anytime soon," said one insider.
Insider in prison?, with his mobile phone ;D
Yeah it takes me about 10 days to get to speak to someone in prison on an emergency basis but they can get this info within hours. It's also not correct in terms of the machine used or of other prisoners in the immediate area
Alison would definitely know prison officers, who would count as "insiders".
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2026/06/24/ex-dup-leader-gives-up-knighthood-over-sex-abuse-conviction/
Donaldson gives up knighthood over sex abuse conviction
Former DUP leader 'renounces and forfeits' title awarded for services to politics
Jeffrey Donaldson was found guilty of abusing two girls over more than 20 years Credit: Charles McQuillan/Getty Images
Tim Sigsworth
News Reporter
Tim Sigsworth
Tim Sigsworth is a general News Reporter for The Telegraph, covering topics in the United Kingdom. See more
Published 24 June 2026 4:48pm BST
Jeffrey Donaldson has given up his knighthood after being convicted of child sexual abuse.
The former leader of the Democratic Unionist Party (DUP) abused two girls over more than 20 years, in crimes covered up by his wife.
The "deceitful" ex-politician is facing jail after being convicted at Newry Crown Court on Monday.
Donaldson, 63, has requested to "renounce and forfeit his knighthood" in a letter to the Cabinet Office, his solicitor said on Wednesday.
He has also tendered his resignation from the Privy Council, which formally advises the King.
Honours can be taken away from recipients who are later convicted of crimes, and they are also able to renounce them voluntarily.
John McBurney, Donaldson's solicitor, said: "I have this afternoon issued a letter signed by Jeffrey Donaldson to the Cabinet Office indicating his request to renounce and forfeit his knighthood.
Good for the cvnt
Fair play Jeffrey maybe not a bad oul spud after all
Quote from: quit yo jibbajabba on June 24, 2026, 05:03:15 PMFair play Jeffrey maybe not a bad oul spud after all
Is Eleanor now called "the artiste formerly known as Lady Donaldson"?
https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/comment/news-analysis/donaldson-may-have-held-it-together-in-witness-box...-but-it-was-a-different-story-in-courthouse-corridors/a/157570431.html
Leaders lose power. They misjudge public opinion; they fail to win elections; they're ousted by rivals. But Donaldson's downfall is far outside the normal currency of politics.
The month after Paisley's funeral, almost 1,000 people attended a public memorial for him in the Ulster Hall. Donaldson will never be remembered like that.
He has already died a political death from which there is no resurrection.
Surely that's an admission of guilt after the verdict went against him? Else he would appeal?
Quote from: Mourne Red on June 24, 2026, 06:29:17 PMSurely that's an admission of guilt after the verdict went against him? Else he would appeal?
Doesn't work like that.
Am I correct in saying he can't appeal anything until he's been sentenced? Although, him surrendering his title would suggest to me he may only appeal the sentencing rather than the conviction.
Quote from: David McKeown on June 24, 2026, 06:32:11 PMQuote from: Mourne Red on June 24, 2026, 06:29:17 PMSurely that's an admission of guilt after the verdict went against him? Else he would appeal?
Doesn't work like that.
Not being cheeky just generally interested how does it work David?
So they did know
https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/dup-figures-supported-sex-pest-donaldson-despite-warnings-over-a-19-year-old-girl/a/157643273.html
Two DUP figures were told that Jeffrey Donaldson was a sex pest, but they continued to support him, a party insider has said.
The source revealed that the Lagan Valley MP had "made a nuisance of himself" with a young woman around 40 years his junior.
The insider said: "Jeffrey was chasing a 19-year-old girl when he was in his 50s. She wasn't interested in him. She didn't want him pursuing her. I've known Jeffrey to be a creep for a long time."
Quote from: Mourne Red on June 24, 2026, 06:29:17 PMSurely that's an admission of guilt after the verdict went against him? Else he would appeal?
Quote from: general_lee on June 24, 2026, 06:42:57 PMAm I correct in saying he can't appeal anything until he's been sentenced? Although, him surrendering his title would suggest to me he may only appeal the sentencing rather than the conviction.
No he has 28 days to appeal from Monday. That's to appeal the guilty verdict. After sentencing, as it's outside the 28 days, he can only appeal the actual sentence.
Quote from: Mourne Red on June 24, 2026, 06:29:17 PMSurely that's an admission of guilt after the verdict went against him? Else he would appeal?
Quote from: general_lee on June 24, 2026, 06:42:57 PMAm I correct in saying he can't appeal anything until he's been sentenced? Although, him surrendering his title would suggest to me he may only appeal the sentencing rather than the conviction.
Not exactly technically no by rule he should be appealing now but the practical reality is that you wait.
Surrendering his title is probably the strategically correct thing to do. Donaldson is convicted rapist. Unless that is over turned on appeal he will always be a convicted rapist.
So if he wasn't to give up his honour he would have to defend why as a convicted rapist he should keep it. He can't really say because I intend to appeal because a that could be said indefinitely and b it doesn't change that he is still a rapist. His presumption of innocence no longer exists.
As a result his title would be stripped anyway. So he's better to give it up now and then if he wants try and get it back after a voluntary surrender where he to successfully appeal (I've no idea if he intends to or has any grounds to) than to try and get it back after being stripped of it.
Quote from: p3427977 on June 24, 2026, 07:54:23 PMQuote from: Mourne Red on June 24, 2026, 06:29:17 PMSurely that's an admission of guilt after the verdict went against him? Else he would appeal?
Quote from: general_lee on June 24, 2026, 06:42:57 PMAm I correct in saying he can't appeal anything until he's been sentenced? Although, him surrendering his title would suggest to me he may only appeal the sentencing rather than the conviction.
No he has 28 days to appeal from Monday. That's to appeal the guilty verdict. After sentencing, as it's outside the 28 days, he can only appeal the actual sentence.
Well there's two schools of thought on this. I'm in this camp but I'm a lifelong holder of minority views. The COA unfortunately to prevent multiple applications will inevitably extend time. The common practice therefore is 28 days from sentence.
Quote from: David McKeown on June 24, 2026, 08:00:18 PMQuote from: p3427977 on June 24, 2026, 07:54:23 PMQuote from: Mourne Red on June 24, 2026, 06:29:17 PMSurely that's an admission of guilt after the verdict went against him? Else he would appeal?
Quote from: general_lee on June 24, 2026, 06:42:57 PMAm I correct in saying he can't appeal anything until he's been sentenced? Although, him surrendering his title would suggest to me he may only appeal the sentencing rather than the conviction.
No he has 28 days to appeal from Monday. That's to appeal the guilty verdict. After sentencing, as it's outside the 28 days, he can only appeal the actual sentence.
Well there's two schools of thought on this. I'm in this camp but I'm a lifelong holder of minority views. The COA unfortunately to prevent multiple applications will inevitably extend time. The common practice therefore is 28 days from sentence.
Ah didnt know it could be changed. Im just going by what a solicitor said on Talkback on Tuesday.
I thought you couldn't just appeal on a whim - you needed to show something incorrect that did, or something new has emerged that would, affect the outcome.
Going back in and shouting louder that its lies won't work. Its not an environment where DUP negotiation tactics will suffice.
Quote from: RadioGAAGAA on June 24, 2026, 08:15:28 PMI thought you couldn't just appeal on a whim - you needed to show something incorrect that did, or something new has emerged that would, affect the outcome.
Going back in and shouting louder that its lies won't work. Its not an environment where DUP negotiation tactics will suffice.
Yeah I think that is true as well.
Quote from: p3427977 on June 24, 2026, 08:11:09 PMQuote from: David McKeown on June 24, 2026, 08:00:18 PMQuote from: p3427977 on June 24, 2026, 07:54:23 PMQuote from: Mourne Red on June 24, 2026, 06:29:17 PMSurely that's an admission of guilt after the verdict went against him? Else he would appeal?
Quote from: general_lee on June 24, 2026, 06:42:57 PMAm I correct in saying he can't appeal anything until he's been sentenced? Although, him surrendering his title would suggest to me he may only appeal the sentencing rather than the conviction.
No he has 28 days to appeal from Monday. That's to appeal the guilty verdict. After sentencing, as it's outside the 28 days, he can only appeal the actual sentence.
Well there's two schools of thought on this. I'm in this camp but I'm a lifelong holder of minority views. The COA unfortunately to prevent multiple applications will inevitably extend time. The common practice therefore is 28 days from sentence.
Ah didnt know it could be changed. Im just going by what a solicitor said on Talkback on Tuesday.
When I started nearly 20 years ago it was a much more strictly observed rule than it is. I'm old school in regards to it.
Quote from: RadioGAAGAA on June 24, 2026, 08:15:28 PMI thought you couldn't just appeal on a whim - you needed to show something incorrect that did, or something new has emerged that would, affect the outcome.
Going back in and shouting louder that its lies won't work. Its not an environment where DUP negotiation tactics will suffice.
Quite correct.
In order to appeal you need leave from a single judge. This is done in writing and on legal argument.
The test to be applied is effectively is the conviction safe. It's not simply were their errors in the trial process or would we have come to a different conclusion.
Any identified errors must have had a substantial impact on the safeness of the conviction.
Common grounds of appeal would include.
Misdirections or non-directions by the trial judge.
Incorrect legal rulings.
Material irregularities in the conduct of the trial
Failures of disclosure.
Improper admission or exclusion of evidence.
Jury irregularities.
Fresh evidence which undermines the verdict.
Abuse of process or serious misconduct by investigators or prosecutors.
If leave is granted a 3 judge panel will consider the issue via oral argument.
If leave is refused you can ask for an oral hearing in any event but you first have to demonstrate there's an arguable case with a reasonable prospect of success that the conviction is unsafe.
I meant to say earlier. The idea that Donaldson is in grey tracksuits or otherwise being treated as a sentenced prisoner are incorrect.
He is still a remand prisoner until he is sentenced. So he will have the right to his own clothes subject to safety issues (so no belts or ties etc) he will have rights to more phone calls and visits. Also some benefits in respect
Of being out of his cell and tuck shop privileges
https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/courts/dup-insiders-on-jeffrey-donaldsons-double-life-some-people-have-skeletons-in-the-cupboard-but-good-grief-this-is-on-a-different-level/a/157415221.html
Another DUP insider says: "Jeffrey was a shrewd, sophisticated liar. We are all horrified at what he did. It was a gross betrayal. The man's a fraud. His entire life was a lie: it was all for show. He was a very sinister person.
"I was never close to Jeffrey. I found him a detached individual. I'm actually surprised he left himself open with a written letter and messages which became evidence at the trial. I thought he was too crafty to leave a paper trail."
"Detached"
Now thats something I have observed just from still photos. Like he isn't there or "all above it". Always smug and arrogant.
Not to take from the victim story. But what kind of amateur hour politics is it that Donaldson sent Bryson down to Dublin behind DUP's back to negotiate with EU ambassadors and reps from Irish government. And Bryson landed Nolan in it by saying he Nolan knew. How many more times can BBC ignore Nolan's lack of journalism ethics.
Quote from: weareros on June 24, 2026, 11:03:19 PMNot to take from the victim story. But what kind of amateur hour politics is it that Donaldson sent Bryson down to Dublin behind DUP's back to negotiate with EU ambassadors and reps from Irish government. And Bryson landed Nolan in it by saying he Nolan knew. How many more times can BBC ignore Nolan's lack of journalism ethics.
Nolan radio programme is a joke and no nationalist should be on that show.
The fact that Dublin reps gave this clown an audience is concerning.
Nolan runs unionism. At the centre of TUV and DUP policy making.
Re: Nolan Show. For all their faults, at least SF don't go on the show. SDLP and Chris Donnelly etc. need to do the same.
https://www.facebook.com/share/1LPkzFHSVx/?mibextid=wwXIfr
Article from the Bel Tel not behind a paywall. Excellent article
Quote from: Mourne Red on June 25, 2026, 10:25:47 AMhttps://www.facebook.com/share/1LPkzFHSVx/?mibextid=wwXIfr
Article from the Bel Tel not behind a paywall. Excellent article
"sex offenders can come from any walk of life". So too can prisonersThe first part is so very true, the second part less so, but it shouldn't be.
Quote from: Mourne Red on June 25, 2026, 10:25:47 AMhttps://www.facebook.com/share/1LPkzFHSVx/?mibextid=wwXIfr
Article from the Bel Tel not behind a paywall. Excellent article
Not sure id agree with all of that but there are some salient points about anonymity of the victims.
https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/politics/ex-dup-minister-i-intend-to-show-that-donaldsons-entire-political-career-was-based-on-dishonesty-and-shocking-immorality/a/157770792.html
Former DUP minister Jim Wells has said Jeffrey Donaldson's entire political career was based on "falsehoods, dishonesty and shocking immorality".
It's not just his political career though it's his entire life.
https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/northern-ireland/wolf-in-sheeps-clothing-hypocrite-jeffrey-donaldson-prayed-over-victims-of-historical-abuse/a/157708251.html
Jeffrey Donaldson listened to the stories of victims of historical abuse and then prayed over them, the Belfast Telegraph can reveal.
Prominent victims' campaigner Marty Adams branded the former DUP leader's show of fake concern for survivors "disgusting and depraved".
He said he was deeply disturbed that trusting victims shared their experiences of abuse with Donaldson at a meeting in his Lagan Valley constituency office in 2019.
"We sat with this man, whom we didn't know was a child abuser, and some of us disclosed what had personally happened to us. I told him things that I haven't even told my partner and family," Mr Adams said.
"Victims of historical abuse don't trust people easily, but we trusted him. He kept shaking his head in apparent dismay at what he heard. He told us to put our faith in God, and he pledged to do everything to help us get justice.
"He knew some of us were Christians. He used that soft voice of his, and we found solace in the words he spoke. He is a dirty, rotten b*****d. He is the lowest of the low. He is a wolf in sheep's clothing."
Quote from: seafoid on June 25, 2026, 03:16:04 PMhttps://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/northern-ireland/wolf-in-sheeps-clothing-hypocrite-jeffrey-donaldson-prayed-over-victims-of-historical-abuse/a/157708251.html
Jeffrey Donaldson listened to the stories of victims of historical abuse and then prayed over them, the Belfast Telegraph can reveal.
Prominent victims' campaigner Marty Adams branded the former DUP leader's show of fake concern for survivors "disgusting and depraved".
He said he was deeply disturbed that trusting victims shared their experiences of abuse with Donaldson at a meeting in his Lagan Valley constituency office in 2019.
"We sat with this man, whom we didn't know was a child abuser, and some of us disclosed what had personally happened to us. I told him things that I haven't even told my partner and family," Mr Adams said.
"Victims of historical abuse don't trust people easily, but we trusted him. He kept shaking his head in apparent dismay at what he heard. He told us to put our faith in God, and he pledged to do everything to help us get justice.
"He knew some of us were Christians. He used that soft voice of his, and we found solace in the words he spoke. He is a dirty, rotten b*****d. He is the lowest of the low. He is a wolf in sheep's clothing."
Mr Adams explained how, at the end of the meeting, Donaldson asked if he could pray with the group of victims.
He said: "I will never forget the Bible verse Jeffrey recited: 'But who shall offend one of these little ones which believe in me, it were better for him that a millstone were hanged round his neck and that he were drowned in the depth of the sea.'
"We found great comfort in that moment of prayer. For survivors, those words carry enormous weight.
"They speak of the innocence of children and the seriousness of abuse, yet that child-raping monster used them."
It was good to see the Lord Maurice Morrow standing right beside Gavin Robinson, as he gave his wee anti Jeffrey speech the other day.
I was just wondering if that's the same guy as the one who pushed this legislation through:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_Trafficking_and_Exploitation_(Criminal_Justice_and_Support_for_Victims)_Act_(Northern_Ireland)_2015
The double standards & the sheer hypocrisy of the DUP are legendary. Unless, of course, they are now planning on asking the authorities to use their own legislation against Jeffrey & put him up on another charge.
'But who shall offend one of these little ones which believe in me, it were better for him that a millstone were hanged round his neck and that he were drowned in the depth of the sea'
Quote from: DaleCooper on June 25, 2026, 04:28:27 PM'But who shall offend one of these little ones which believe in me, it were better for him that a millstone were hanged round his neck and that he were drowned in the depth of the sea'
Or attacked by an anti paedo in the lunch queue in prison.
Quote from: DaleCooper on June 25, 2026, 04:28:27 PM'But who shall offend one of these little ones which believe in me, it were better for him that a millstone were hanged round his neck and that he were drowned in the depth of the sea'
Scripture is very strange indeed.
Two sides to each story.
Turn the other cheek or get drowned.
Jesus did advise us to sell our cloak and buy a sword!
(And of course whip the money lenders and drive them from the Temple. Timely advice)
Story in the Belfast telegraph about Ian paisley knowing about a Donaldson victim in 2021 and using it for political gain. You'd have to imagine they would have to have some proof before publishing that :(
Quote from: imtommygunn on June 25, 2026, 10:13:14 PMStory in the Belfast telegraph about Ian paisley knowing about a Donaldson victim in 2021 and using it for political gain. You'd have to imagine they would have to have some proof before publishing that :(
Sam McBride has stated that it was referred to the police and they have text messages. Also confirmed that the alleged victim was another one, not the 2 involved in the court case
Quote from: imtommygunn on June 25, 2026, 10:13:14 PMStory in the Belfast telegraph about Ian paisley knowing about a Donaldson victim in 2021 and using it for political gain. You'd have to imagine they would have to have some proof before publishing that :(
Jesus. You hope it's not true but it does sound likely
I'd say Ian would need to keep his head a bit low considering his alleged dalliances over the years, never mind his holidays
Quote from: imtommygunn on June 25, 2026, 10:13:14 PMStory in the Belfast telegraph about Ian paisley knowing about a Donaldson victim in 2021 and using it for political gain. You'd have to imagine they would have to have some proof before publishing that :(
Just when you think Paisley couldn't get any lower in people's estimation.
Quote from: Armagh18 on June 25, 2026, 10:30:29 PMQuote from: imtommygunn on June 25, 2026, 10:13:14 PMStory in the Belfast telegraph about Ian paisley knowing about a Donaldson victim in 2021 and using it for political gain. You'd have to imagine they would have to have some proof before publishing that :(
Jesus. You hope it's not true but it does sound likely
Sam mcbride on nolan the other morning alluded to there possibly being more to come, but he wouldn't say so because there is no evidence. Just said something along the lines of "in cases like these, it is very common for more victims to come forward after."
More stuff will probably come out.
There should really be an enquiry into this now - especially from the DUP and who knew what and when about Donaldson.
Paisley - another God fearing Christian. ::)
Quote from: marty34 on June 25, 2026, 11:26:39 PMMore stuff will probably come out.
There should really be an enquiry into this now - especially from the DUP and who knew what and when about Donaldson.
Paisley - another God fearing Christian. ::)
Ian Og, he of brown envelope fame knew years ago and worked it to his advantage
Good living for a living.
It would kind of explain why he seemed untouchable. There's actually another one who seemed untouchable but that was more during Arlene's tenure.
Quote from: JoG2 on June 26, 2026, 12:01:41 AMQuote from: marty34 on June 25, 2026, 11:26:39 PMMore stuff will probably come out.
There should really be an enquiry into this now - especially from the DUP and who knew what and when about Donaldson.
Paisley - another God fearing Christian. ::)
Ian Og, he of brown envelope fame knew years ago and worked it to his advantage
Even the slow on the uptake voters of North Antrim eventually caught on to his antics, although it took them many years to do so. If Paisley told me today was Friday, I would double check it first. He is someone who should never have been let near public life & he has shamelessly traded on his name & background, all his adult life. A man of no real discernible talents, or abilities, but he's not alone within the DUP, in that respect.
Allegedly took the odd visit to gay saunas in London did our Jeffrey. Spotlight tonight 🤝
#bigIanknew
Quote from: playwiththewind1st on June 26, 2026, 08:48:15 AMQuote from: JoG2 on June 26, 2026, 12:01:41 AMQuote from: marty34 on June 25, 2026, 11:26:39 PMMore stuff will probably come out.
There should really be an enquiry into this now - especially from the DUP and who knew what and when about Donaldson.
Paisley - another God fearing Christian. ::)
Ian Og, he of brown envelope fame knew years ago and worked it to his advantage
Even the slow on the uptake voters of North Antrim eventually caught on to his antics, although it took them many years to do so. If Paisley told me today was Friday, I would double check it first. He is someone who should never have been let near public life & he has shamelessly traded on his name & background, all his adult life. A man of no real discernible talents, or abilities, but he's not alone within the DUP, in that respect.
No morals
No integrity
No talent
No humility
No personality
Nothing.
Loyal to one cause. His own pocket.
Quote from: playwiththewind1st on June 26, 2026, 08:48:15 AMQuote from: JoG2 on June 26, 2026, 12:01:41 AMQuote from: marty34 on June 25, 2026, 11:26:39 PMMore stuff will probably come out.
There should really be an enquiry into this now - especially from the DUP and who knew what and when about Donaldson.
Paisley - another God fearing Christian. ::)
Ian Og, he of brown envelope fame knew years ago and worked it to his advantage
Even the slow on the uptake voters of North Antrim eventually caught on to his antics, although it took them many years to do so. If Paisley told me today was Friday, I would double check it first. He is someone who should never have been let near public life & he has shamelessly traded on his name & background, all his adult life. A man of no real discernible talents, or abilities, but he's not alone within the DUP, in that respect.
And where did the people of North Antrim place their newfound enlightenment - Jim Allister!!!
I'd say there is plenty more to come out in the wash about Dundaldson and the DUP. They'll be circling the wagons.
Quote from: DaleCooper on June 25, 2026, 04:28:27 PM'But who shall offend one of these little ones which believe in me, it were better for him that a millstone were hanged round his neck and that he were drowned in the depth of the sea'
Read about this yesterday...
The man had a neck of brass and no shame to "pra
ey for victims of child abuse using this passage all the while with what he was getting up to.
The DUP tried to get out in front of this, to disassociate themselves from it but it's looking like that wasn't entirely the case.
Ian Og, Jim Wells and Poots all have questions to answer if they're now saying they knew about him long before it came out.
Quote from: johnnycool on June 26, 2026, 09:22:43 AMQuote from: DaleCooper on June 25, 2026, 04:28:27 PM'But who shall offend one of these little ones which believe in me, it were better for him that a millstone were hanged round his neck and that he were drowned in the depth of the sea'
Read about this yesterday...
The man had a neck of brass and no shame to "praey for victims of child abuse using this passage all the while with what he was getting up to.
The DUP tried to get out in front of this, to disassociate themselves from it but it's looking like that wasn't entirely the case.
Ian Og, Jim Wells and Poots all have questions to answer if they're now saying they knew about him long before it came out.
Why on earth would they even say that publicly?
Quote from: Armagh18 on June 26, 2026, 09:23:33 AMQuote from: johnnycool on June 26, 2026, 09:22:43 AMQuote from: DaleCooper on June 25, 2026, 04:28:27 PM'But who shall offend one of these little ones which believe in me, it were better for him that a millstone were hanged round his neck and that he were drowned in the depth of the sea'
Read about this yesterday...
The man had a neck of brass and no shame to "praey for victims of child abuse using this passage all the while with what he was getting up to.
The DUP tried to get out in front of this, to disassociate themselves from it but it's looking like that wasn't entirely the case.
Ian Og, Jim Wells and Poots all have questions to answer if they're now saying they knew about him long before it came out.
Why on earth would they even say that publicly?
To get back up on the moral high ground, plus intelligence isn't a thing with them.
Ian Og, I don't think has uttered anything publicly but may well be scuppered by DUP insiders feeding information and texts to the press like Sam McBride.
Sammy Wilson and Arlene and a few others in the London DUP set are very, very quiet on this.
Quote from: johnnycool on June 26, 2026, 09:27:13 AMQuote from: Armagh18 on June 26, 2026, 09:23:33 AMQuote from: johnnycool on June 26, 2026, 09:22:43 AMQuote from: DaleCooper on June 25, 2026, 04:28:27 PM'But who shall offend one of these little ones which believe in me, it were better for him that a millstone were hanged round his neck and that he were drowned in the depth of the sea'
Read about this yesterday...
The man had a neck of brass and no shame to "praey for victims of child abuse using this passage all the while with what he was getting up to.
The DUP tried to get out in front of this, to disassociate themselves from it but it's looking like that wasn't entirely the case.
Ian Og, Jim Wells and Poots all have questions to answer if they're now saying they knew about him long before it came out.
Why on earth would they even say that publicly?
To get back up on the moral high ground, plus intelligence isn't a thing with them.
Ian Og, I don't think has uttered anything publicly but may well be scuppered by DUP insiders feeding information and texts to the press like Sam McBride.
Sammy Wilson and Arlene and a few others in the London DUP set are very, very quiet on this.
I know theres a difference in hearing gossip and rumours and hearing reliable stuff about someone being a wrongun but holy f**k why did they not speak up before all this. Madness
Quote from: Armagh18 on June 26, 2026, 09:23:33 AMQuote from: johnnycool on June 26, 2026, 09:22:43 AMQuote from: DaleCooper on June 25, 2026, 04:28:27 PM'But who shall offend one of these little ones which believe in me, it were better for him that a millstone were hanged round his neck and that he were drowned in the depth of the sea'
Read about this yesterday...
The man had a neck of brass and no shame to "praey for victims of child abuse using this passage all the while with what he was getting up to.
The DUP tried to get out in front of this, to disassociate themselves from it but it's looking like that wasn't entirely the case.
Ian Og, Jim Wells and Poots all have questions to answer if they're now saying they knew about him long before it came out.
Why on earth would they even say that publicly?
Because the DUP's "young earth" brigade of neanderthals are obviously using this as an opportunity to try to re-visit the party's leadership battles, back in 2021. It's clearly unfinished business, for some.
If that Ian Og stuff is true this is really going to unravel here. How many knew? Worse still - any other like minded people in there.
Quote from: imtommygunn on June 26, 2026, 09:54:37 AMIf that Ian Og stuff is true this is really going to unravel here. How many knew? Worse still - any other like minded people in there.
I wouldn't count on it. Both the DUP & Sinn Féin have developed an uncannily similar knack of being able to sit tight & ride out any controversy / media storm, until it eventually blows over. Then, they pick it all up exactly where they left off & resume business as usual, as if nothing ever happened & they assume nobody ever noticed anything was amiss at the time.
Quote from: imtommygunn on June 26, 2026, 09:54:37 AMIf that Ian Og stuff is true this is really going to unravel here. How many knew? Worse still - any other like minded people in there.
Well in a normal society questions would be asked like er what do you mean you knew about it yrs ago and did nothing but as always in NI the usual suspects will just shrug it off.
Am I right in saying the girl that Ian og spoke to was not underage? Seem to get the impression she was in her early 20s and was exploited. Wonder what this means, blackmail?
Read the article on the BBC news site about Jeffrey. Sauna visits etc. if you don't think intelligence services had a list as long as your arm on him and leveraged it, you are deluded.
Quote from: Jeepers Creepers on June 26, 2026, 10:19:12 AMRead the article on the BBC news site about Jeffrey. Sauna visits etc. if you don't think intelligence services had a list as long as your arm on him and leveraged it, you are deluded.
Big Jim could be on to something!
Not that I care. It helped keep the border open.
The only statement from Poots I have seen said he found "Donaldson out on lies too many times over many years" I read this as referring to political matters and nothing to do with the criminal case.
"In 2006, two senior PSNI detectives saw Donaldson entering a sauna which marketed itself as a meeting place for gay men.
Chariots was based in central London, near the Houses of Parliament and the home of the security services."
The above are from a BBC report this morning. Were they spying on him?
States that they were two senior PSNI detectives. Strange?
Quote from: GTP on June 26, 2026, 10:23:54 AMThe only statement from Poots I have seen said he found "Donaldson out on lies too many times over many years" I read this as referring to political matters and nothing to do with the criminal case.
With Poots' track record, he would be as well to button it. It's laughable that he's now throwing the mud around, when he himself has been embroiled in a number of unexplained & mysterious situations of a dubious nature, in which his own integrity has been questioned.
Quote from: marty34 on June 26, 2026, 10:27:27 AM"In 2006, two senior PSNI detectives saw Donaldson entering a sauna which marketed itself as a meeting place for gay men.
Chariots was based in central London, near the Houses of Parliament and the home of the security services."
The above are from a BBC report this morning. Were they spying on him?
States that they were two senior PSNI detectives. Strange?
When I read it I assumed MPs had personal protection, without wondering why it was psni officers in London. Would this be standard?
Quote from: Jeepers Creepers on June 26, 2026, 10:19:12 AMRead the article on the BBC news site about Jeffrey. Sauna visits etc. if you don't think intelligence services had a list as long as your arm on him and leveraged it, you are deluded.
They have it on everyone.
Quote from: RedHand88 on June 26, 2026, 10:30:25 AMQuote from: marty34 on June 26, 2026, 10:27:27 AM"In 2006, two senior PSNI detectives saw Donaldson entering a sauna which marketed itself as a meeting place for gay men.
Chariots was based in central London, near the Houses of Parliament and the home of the security services."
The above are from a BBC report this morning. Were they spying on him?
States that they were two senior PSNI detectives. Strange?
When I read it I assumed MPs had personal protection, without wondering why it was psni officers in London. Would this be standard?
But why would it be senior detectives?
Quote from: DaleCooper on June 26, 2026, 10:31:45 AMQuote from: Jeepers Creepers on June 26, 2026, 10:19:12 AMRead the article on the BBC news site about Jeffrey. Sauna visits etc. if you don't think intelligence services had a list as long as your arm on him and leveraged it, you are deluded.
They have it on everyone.
Absolutely 100%
Have people learned nothing from Epstein? He was one of dozens though a "special" example.
Did MI6 clear him for proximity to the Royals? lol
Old boys networks is how many things get done.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Al-Yamamah_arms_deal
Epstein stuff will come out some day though. It could be a long time though.
Quote from: imtommygunn on June 26, 2026, 10:46:53 AMEpstein stuff will come out some day though. It could be a long time though.
Approximately 100 years after Ghislaine, Andrew, Mandelson, Trump, Bill Gates, Bill Clinton etc etc have all died.
Quote from: marty34 on June 26, 2026, 10:35:33 AMQuote from: RedHand88 on June 26, 2026, 10:30:25 AMQuote from: marty34 on June 26, 2026, 10:27:27 AM"In 2006, two senior PSNI detectives saw Donaldson entering a sauna which marketed itself as a meeting place for gay men.
Chariots was based in central London, near the Houses of Parliament and the home of the security services."
The above are from a BBC report this morning. Were they spying on him?
States that they were two senior PSNI detectives. Strange?
When I read it I assumed MPs had personal protection, without wondering why it was psni officers in London. Would this be standard?
But why would it be senior detectives?
No idea. I might have to give the second half of Norway v France a miss to find out.
Quote from: playwiththewind1st on June 26, 2026, 10:53:51 AMQuote from: imtommygunn on June 26, 2026, 10:46:53 AMEpstein stuff will come out some day though. It could be a long time though.
Approximately 100 years after Ghislaine, Andrew, Mandelson, Trump, Bill Gates, Bill Clinton etc etc have all died.
Well yeah I mot sure about it being our lifetime tbh.
QuoteQuoteThe only statement from Poots I have seen said he found "Donaldson out on lies too many times over many years" I read this as referring to political matters and nothing to do with the criminal case.
With Poots' track record, he would be as well to button it. It's laughable that he's now throwing the mud around, when he himself has been embroiled in a number of unexplained & mysterious situations of a dubious nature, in which his own integrity has been questioned.
Sure they all could have wandered into the Blue Oyster club accidentally
Quote from: AustinPowers on June 26, 2026, 12:20:21 PMQuoteQuoteThe only statement from Poots I have seen said he found "Donaldson out on lies too many times over many years" I read this as referring to political matters and nothing to do with the criminal case.
With Poots' track record, he would be as well to button it. It's laughable that he's now throwing the mud around, when he himself has been embroiled in a number of unexplained & mysterious situations of a dubious nature, in which his own integrity has been questioned.
Sure they all could have wandered into the Blue Oyster club accidentally
As ya do..
Blue oyster club lol. Does anyone else instantly hear the music in their head ;D
QuoteBlue oyster club lol. Does anyone else instantly hear the music in their head ;D
Always :D
Picturing Ian Og and Poots being given the address to find him for urgent party business.
"jeffrey? WTF?!"
"Its not what it looks like, its a joke"
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=F3DRMXuCvx0&pp=ygURc29wcmFub3MgZ2F5IGNsdWI%3D
Victims named on Nolan show by a caller - What happens there David? Would BBC/Nolan be liable or would it be the caller?
https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/politics/dup-orders-independent-review-into-issues-arising-after-conviction-of-jeffrey-donaldson/a/157894060.html
The party leader Gavin Robinson MP, deputy leader Michelle McIlveen MLA and party chairman are deeply concerned by allegations that have surfaced in recent days relating to inappropriate behaviour on behalf of Jeffrey Donaldson, and the indication that some may have had knowledge of inappropriate behaviour but which was never reported to the party officers.
"The party leadership have today commenced the process of commissioning a specialised and detailed independent review into a number of issues arising following the conviction of Jeffrey Donaldson and further details will be announced shortly."
Read moreIan Paisley said in 2021 he knew of a Donaldson 'victim' — and used that information for political ends
A BBC Spotlight investigation being broadcast tonight is reporting that the former DUP leader visited a gay sauna in London at the time when he was describing homosexuality as "sinful".
Meanwhile, as first reported by the Belfast Telegraph, Spotlight also examines how former DUP MP Ian Paisley was contacted by a young woman who said she had been "exploited" by Donaldson.
Three years before Jeffrey Donaldson was arrested, DUP MP Ian Paisley said he had spoken to a "victim" of Donaldson and tried to use that information for political ends, the Belfast Telegraph can reveal.
The information has been known to this newspaper for two years, but can only now be reported for legal reasons.
It involves an individual who was not part of the court case which on Monday saw Donaldson found guilty of multiple serious offences, including rape of a primary school child and sexual assaults against her and another girl.
In June 2024, this newspaper was contacted by someone who said they had a story which they did not want to discuss over the phone.
The individual, who was known to us, met our reporter in a deserted area beside wasteland in Belfast's Titanic Quarter where they said that a third party had an important story about Jeffrey Donaldson, which they outlined.
Jeffrey Donaldson and Ian Paisley Jr in the background © Screen grab
A meeting was then arranged with the third party in her home, where she set out a story which indicated that at least one senior DUP member had serious concerns about Donaldson's behaviour. Precisely what Mr Paisley believed Donaldson to have done is unclear and he has refused to clarify what he knew.
The source, who is a prominent figure, said that after Arlene Foster announced her resignation as DUP leader in 2021, she'd been contacted by Mr Paisley.
The messages show that the person said to Mr Paisley: 'Thanks fir [sic] coffee. Can I ring Sammy and say I have heard rumours about Jeffrey.'
The pair met and she said the North Antrim MP tried to convince her to persuade Sammy Wilson to back Edwin Poots for the DUP leadership, rather than Jeffrey Donaldson.
She said that in this conversation Mr Paisley mentioned something about Donaldson "which would be a huge problem if he got the leadership".
The woman said she did not pick up on what Mr Paisley was hinting at, assuming that it referred to rumours about Donaldson's sexual activities — which were entirely legal, but would have exposed him as a hypocrite.
Earlier today, Stormont Communities Minister Gordon Lyons said Donaldson was "duplicitous" and there was "no inkling" in the party about his propensity for exploitative or abusive conduct.
Mr Lyons' party colleague and Education Minister Paul Givan said there were rumours about Donaldson, but no evidence, and none of a "criminal nature".
Quote from: Mourne Red on June 26, 2026, 09:11:41 PMVictims named on Nolan show by a caller - What happens there David? Would BBC/Nolan be liable or would it be the caller?
I could be wrong but I don't think that could happen.I believe the show has a delay so not actually live and calls can be cut.
Quote from: Mourne Red on June 26, 2026, 09:11:41 PMVictims named on Nolan show by a caller - What happens there David? Would BBC/Nolan be liable or would it be the caller?
This on the radio show today?
Quote from: Killala on June 26, 2026, 10:20:26 PMQuote from: Mourne Red on June 26, 2026, 09:11:41 PMVictims named on Nolan show by a caller - What happens there David? Would BBC/Nolan be liable or would it be the caller?
I could be wrong but I don't think that could happen.I believe the show has a delay so not actually live and calls can be cut.
Looks like couple of Bots on Twitter I just looked up the tweet I read, faceless account on a windup my mistake - Ignore
I just watched the Spotlight programme, wasted an hour of my life. Nobody seemed to have anything about his abuse but a lot of the politicians he shafted knew he was a bad one.
Just following up I see the BBC news says nothing on the BBC Spotlight programme relating to Jeffrey were illegal or connected to the child abuse case. 🙈
I have a question for David as well if he has the time. Spotlight contacted Jeffrey D for comment on the programme. Could he actually communicate given he is currently in prison.
Quote from: Killala on June 26, 2026, 10:41:11 PMI have a question for David as well if he has the time. Spotlight contacted Jeffrey D for comment on the programme. Could he actually communicate given he is currently in prison.
If David was any sort of fella he'd leave his number here so we can WhatsApp him questions.
Was this Spotlight programme made a few months ago and then altered and adjusted in the last few days re: court case outcome.
It certainly laid bare that Donaldson compromised himself to say the least, and that could have been passed up the line to British spooks.
Jim Allister claimed this week he could've been 'turned' on the Windsor Framework deal which put in place the current Irish Sea Border. It was a complete U-turn by Donaldson, who lied through his teeth selling it. Much as I can't have Allister, his conspiracy theory is plausible.
Quote from: Killala on June 26, 2026, 10:29:56 PMI just watched the Spotlight programme, wasted an hour of my life. Nobody seemed to have anything about his abuse but a lot of the politicians he shafted knew he was a bad one.
Thanks for saving us time..most of these documentaries are as such.
I stick mostly to reading, video and audio are huge time sinks
Quote from: Mourne Red on June 26, 2026, 10:29:52 PMQuote from: Killala on June 26, 2026, 10:20:26 PMQuote from: Mourne Red on June 26, 2026, 09:11:41 PMVictims named on Nolan show by a caller - What happens there David? Would BBC/Nolan be liable or would it be the caller?
I could be wrong but I don't think that could happen.I believe the show has a delay so not actually live and calls can be cut.
Looks like couple of Bots on Twitter I just looked up the tweet I read, faceless account on a windup my mistake - Ignore
Some boy did say who it was. Nolan didn't know what to do. Surprised the time delay wasn't used.
Quote from: Tony Baloney on June 26, 2026, 10:42:53 PMQuote from: Killala on June 26, 2026, 10:41:11 PMI have a question for David as well if he has the time. Spotlight contacted Jeffrey D for comment on the programme. Could he actually communicate given he is currently in prison.
If David was any sort of fella he'd leave his number here so we can WhatsApp him questions.
It would appear he doesn't do weekends. Parttimer. He's let himself down his profession down and the gaaboard down
Quote from: DaleCooper on June 26, 2026, 11:35:32 PMQuote from: Killala on June 26, 2026, 10:29:56 PMI just watched the Spotlight programme, wasted an hour of my life. Nobody seemed to have anything about his abuse but a lot of the politicians he shafted knew he was a bad one.
Thanks for saving us time..most of these documentaries are as such.
I stick mostly to reading, video and audio are huge time sinks
I think in fairness the few revelations were leaked in the last day or two eg the gay saunas so possibly unfair on the documentary itself.
Paisley saying he (Jeff) boked over a foreign dignitary as well as a few other drunken escapades were news to me but yeah overall not earth shattering
Quote from: marty34 on June 26, 2026, 10:48:21 PMWas this Spotlight programme made a few months ago and then altered and adjusted in the last few days re: court case outcome.
Yes. Part of the voice-over said at one stage that proceedings were ongoing and then later reverted to a guilty verdict on 18 counts. They'll have been researching and filming over a period of time given the interviews with many different people. The guilty verdict gave everyone the green light to go in on him feet first.
Quote from: Mourne Red on June 26, 2026, 09:11:41 PMVictims named on Nolan show by a caller - What happens there David? Would BBC/Nolan be liable or would it be the caller?
Well the caller has committed a criminal offence. I imagine they will be prosecuted. The Nolan show will be investigated and asked why there wasn't a delay to prevent this. It's unlikely anyone on their end would be prosecuted though.
Quote from: Killala on June 26, 2026, 10:41:11 PMI have a question for David as well if he has the time. Spotlight contacted Jeffrey D for comment on the programme. Could he actually communicate given he is currently in prison.
Not unless he has the producers on his call list. They may have asked him last week.
Quote from: quit yo jibbajabba on June 26, 2026, 11:47:17 PMQuote from: Tony Baloney on June 26, 2026, 10:42:53 PMQuote from: Killala on June 26, 2026, 10:41:11 PMI have a question for David as well if he has the time. Spotlight contacted Jeffrey D for comment on the programme. Could he actually communicate given he is currently in prison.
If David was any sort of fella he'd leave his number here so we can WhatsApp him questions.
It would appear he doesn't do weekends. Parttimer. He's let himself down his profession down and the gaaboard down
Too busy pushing little cubes round little boards on Friday nights.
Quote from: DaleCooper on June 26, 2026, 11:35:32 PMQuote from: Killala on June 26, 2026, 10:29:56 PMI just watched the Spotlight programme, wasted an hour of my life. Nobody seemed to have anything about his abuse but a lot of the politicians he shafted knew he was a bad one.
Thanks for saving us time..most of these documentaries are as such.
I stick mostly to reading, video and audio are huge time sinks
Actually I thought the documentary was quite good, visits to gay saunas, drunk and projectile vomiting over the Mayor of Beijing, revelations from Ian Og about complaints from another lady about his inappropriate behaviour, what more do you want
Quote from: Dougal Maguire on June 27, 2026, 06:22:06 AMQuote from: DaleCooper on June 26, 2026, 11:35:32 PMQuote from: Killala on June 26, 2026, 10:29:56 PMI just watched the Spotlight programme, wasted an hour of my life. Nobody seemed to have anything about his abuse but a lot of the politicians he shafted knew he was a bad one.
Thanks for saving us time..most of these documentaries are as such.
I stick mostly to reading, video and audio are huge time sinks
Actually I thought the documentary was quite good, visits to gay saunas, drunk and projectile vomiting over the Mayor of Beijing, revelations from Ian Og about complaints from another lady about his inappropriate behaviour, what more do you want
When Ian Og talks I just assume it's a lie unless evidence is produced to the contrary.
Jim thinks he was compromised by the very state he wants to be a part of. Some boy.
Wells I don't think has much sense and Ian og well he will do anything for himself.
The armoy ones didn't come out too well but apart from that it wasn't t much new or controversial . Rough hearing those girls talking :(
Quote from: Tony Baloney on June 27, 2026, 07:51:54 AMQuote from: Dougal Maguire on June 27, 2026, 06:22:06 AMQuote from: DaleCooper on June 26, 2026, 11:35:32 PMQuote from: Killala on June 26, 2026, 10:29:56 PMI just watched the Spotlight programme, wasted an hour of my life. Nobody seemed to have anything about his abuse but a lot of the politicians he shafted knew he was a bad one.
Thanks for saving us time..most of these documentaries are as such.
I stick mostly to reading, video and audio are huge time sinks
Actually I thought the documentary was quite good, visits to gay saunas, drunk and projectile vomiting over the Mayor of Beijing, revelations from Ian Og about complaints from another lady about his inappropriate behaviour, what more do you want
When Ian Og talks I just assume it's a lie unless evidence is produced to the contrary.
Ian og some man to be talking. He will have his own Spotlight docu some day
Quote from: Dougal Maguire on June 27, 2026, 06:22:06 AMQuote from: DaleCooper on June 26, 2026, 11:35:32 PMQuote from: Killala on June 26, 2026, 10:29:56 PMI just watched the Spotlight programme, wasted an hour of my life. Nobody seemed to have anything about his abuse but a lot of the politicians he shafted knew he was a bad one.
Thanks for saving us time..most of these documentaries are as such.
I stick mostly to reading, video and audio are huge time sinks
Actually I thought the documentary was quite good, visits to gay saunas, drunk and projectile vomiting over the Mayor of Beijing, revelations from Ian Og about complaints from another lady about his inappropriate behaviour, what more do you want
I just thought it pretty harmless tale telling. Although to be fair Ian Og is the definition of inappropriate behaviour. 😎
There were widespread and quite public allegations some years ago about another DUP member and rent boys. I wonder will these now resurface
Quote from: Killala on June 27, 2026, 08:57:38 AMQuote from: Dougal Maguire on June 27, 2026, 06:22:06 AMQuote from: DaleCooper on June 26, 2026, 11:35:32 PMQuote from: Killala on June 26, 2026, 10:29:56 PMI just watched the Spotlight programme, wasted an hour of my life. Nobody seemed to have anything about his abuse but a lot of the politicians he shafted knew he was a bad one.
Thanks for saving us time..most of these documentaries are as such.
I stick mostly to reading, video and audio are huge time sinks
Actually I thought the documentary was quite good, visits to gay saunas, drunk and projectile vomiting over the Mayor of Beijing, revelations from Ian Og about complaints from another lady about his inappropriate behaviour, what more do you want
I just thought it pretty harmless tale telling. Although to be fair Ian Og is the definition of inappropriate behaviour. 😎
To be fair puking over the mayor of Beijing is pretty epic ;D The DUP did well to keep tidying up after him without any of it getting out. The Sunday life would have had a field day with some of those stories. Still if many in the DUP knew he was a loose cannon then why did they make him leader :o
I still think there's loads of more questions for a lot more people involved in this.
The DUP have realeased a statement saying they are doing 'their' review. This will take the heat off them for a few weeks.
I'd love to see the various DUP whatsapp groups this past few days. Would be enlightening stuff I'm sure.
But it's the religious element to this that gets me. Such hypocrites. And they're all the same.
I can't remember the name of the woman but she was saying the London life and life back home were worlds apart and that had to be known by every journo and party big wigs.
Now I see some on X saying that they always knew he was dodgy, but that's an admission in my book!
The Spotlight show was not as explosive as I thought it might and I do feel it was slightly contrived. What evidence is there that he puked on the Mayor of Beijing? Like he's not going to deny it and no one is actually going to support it. 2 senior members of the PSNI just happened to be walking past a prominent gay sauna place when he just happened to be going in? I don't buy it.
It seems strange that all these stories are breaking now so long after the event. All very convenient. Like everything in this place I am always suspicious of who gains what from each action or event. I think there are more pages to be turned here on this whole thing yet and there will be a few people sweating hard at the minute wondering when they will be in the firing line.
Quote from: brokencrossbar1 on June 27, 2026, 11:47:49 AMThe Spotlight show was not as explosive as I thought it might and I do feel it was slightly contrived. What evidence is there that he puked on the Mayor of Beijing? Like he's not going to deny it and no one is actually going to support it. 2 senior members of the PSNI just happened to be walking past a prominent gay sauna place when he just happened to be going in? I don't buy it.
It seems strange that all these stories are breaking now so long after the event. All very convenient. Like everything in this place I am always suspicious of who gains what from each action or event. I think there are more pages to be turned here on this whole thing yet and there will be a few people sweating hard at the minute wondering when they will be in the firing line.
'What evidence is there that he puked over the Mayor of Beijing?' The statement came from the mouth of Ian Paisley! What sort of doubting Thomas are you?? Ian hasn't a dishonest bone in his body and if he says he witnessed it that should be good enough for everyone
The DUP boking up over a Chinese Communist Party dignitary? Strange goings on @ these gatherings, when the ould Chinese rice wine is served.
Maybe President Xi had a cunning plan, to oust Jeffrey from the DUP leadership & to parachute big Gavin in. Who knows?
Plus, Paisley Junior having a go at anyone [even Donaldson] is just ludicrous, when you look back at his own track record.
David Graham on Sunday Politics mentioned that Sammy and Flegory lived with Jeffrey in London and have been noticeably quiet.
Headline from Sunday "Independent"
Jeffrey Donaldson gave teenagers sex-education classes and told them to place a Bible between them to resist temptation
Child rapist and his wife Eleanor were inspired to become born-again Christians by a convicted paedophile
https://www.msn.com/en-ie/news/uknews/dup-may-be-damaged-beyond-repair-by-donaldson-revelations-says-ex-adviser/
Former DUP special adviser David Graham indicated it will be hard to rebuild trust amid a "drip feed of negativity".
"The DUP have had some significant political crises in the last 20 year, this blows them all out of the water, and by some distance," he told BBC Northern Ireland's Sunday Politics programme.
https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/comment/opinion/the-ruc-widow-who-saw-through-wee-jeffrey-was-her-fury-an-early-warning-sign-we-all-missed/a/157872176.html
He wasn't the first politician to be caught lying.
But the idea that someone as high profile as Donaldson and as much in the public eye can be so depraved unnerves and appals.
What we are seeking is the reassurance that paedophiles cannot move undetected among us, that we can keep children safe from them. There is none.
The guilty verdict may have brought his courageous victims a form of closure, but the trauma he inflicted when he raped a little girl, when he pushed his hands into a little girl's underwear, is a life sentence.
The reality is Donaldson, like so many abusers, was able to control and intimidate for decades. His public persona was his shield, not his undoing.
Quote from: seafoid on June 28, 2026, 01:41:52 PMhttps://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/comment/opinion/the-ruc-widow-who-saw-through-wee-jeffrey-was-her-fury-an-early-warning-sign-we-all-missed/a/157872176.html
He wasn't the first politician to be caught lying.
But the idea that someone as high profile as Donaldson and as much in the public eye can be so depraved unnerves and appals.
What we are seeking is the reassurance that paedophiles cannot move undetected among us, that we can keep children safe from them. There is none.
The guilty verdict may have brought his courageous victims a form of closure, but the trauma he inflicted when he raped a little girl, when he pushed his hands into a little girl's underwear, is a life sentence.
The reality is Donaldson, like so many abusers, was able to control and intimidate for decades. His public persona was his shield, not his undoing.
Cannot move undetected, yeah right....Kincora files sealed, 1 the president of the USA and God knows how many linked to Trumpstein Island, the very famous evergreen UK popstar and indeed a very famous UK actor (the plonker's brother) etc etc . Donaldson going down isn't going to be a busting of the dam, it was just a minor speed wobble in that depraved world unfortunately
Quote from: JoG2 on June 28, 2026, 04:52:55 PMQuote from: seafoid on June 28, 2026, 01:41:52 PMhttps://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/comment/opinion/the-ruc-widow-who-saw-through-wee-jeffrey-was-her-fury-an-early-warning-sign-we-all-missed/a/157872176.html
He wasn't the first politician to be caught lying.
But the idea that someone as high profile as Donaldson and as much in the public eye can be so depraved unnerves and appals.
What we are seeking is the reassurance that paedophiles cannot move undetected among us, that we can keep children safe from them. There is none.
The guilty verdict may have brought his courageous victims a form of closure, but the trauma he inflicted when he raped a little girl, when he pushed his hands into a little girl's underwear, is a life sentence.
The reality is Donaldson, like so many abusers, was able to control and intimidate for decades. His public persona was his shield, not his undoing.
Cannot move undetected, yeah right....Kincora files sealed, 1 the president of the USA and God knows how many linked to Trumpstein Island, the very famous evergreen UK popstar and indeed a very famous UK actor (the plonker's brother) etc etc . Donaldson going down isn't going to be a busting of the dam, it was just a minor speed wobble in that depraved world unfortunately
Ah I really hope that one isn't true...
Quote from: Armagh18 on June 28, 2026, 07:16:31 PMQuote from: JoG2 on June 28, 2026, 04:52:55 PMQuote from: seafoid on June 28, 2026, 01:41:52 PMhttps://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/comment/opinion/the-ruc-widow-who-saw-through-wee-jeffrey-was-her-fury-an-early-warning-sign-we-all-missed/a/157872176.html
He wasn't the first politician to be caught lying.
But the idea that someone as high profile as Donaldson and as much in the public eye can be so depraved unnerves and appals.
What we are seeking is the reassurance that paedophiles cannot move undetected among us, that we can keep children safe from them. There is none.
The guilty verdict may have brought his courageous victims a form of closure, but the trauma he inflicted when he raped a little girl, when he pushed his hands into a little girl's underwear, is a life sentence.
The reality is Donaldson, like so many abusers, was able to control and intimidate for decades. His public persona was his shield, not his undoing.
Cannot move undetected, yeah right....Kincora files sealed, 1 the president of the USA and God knows how many linked to Trumpstein Island, the very famous evergreen UK popstar and indeed a very famous UK actor (the plonker's brother) etc etc . Donaldson going down isn't going to be a busting of the dam, it was just a minor speed wobble in that depraved world unfortunately
Ah I really hope that one isn't true...
A lot of rumbles over the years but he's a 'national treasure' so ye know....
Aye there's a lot of stuff out there about Dave's Brother. Won't be out in the press until he's gone like Saville so the rumbles says
The actual elite do what they want to whoever they want. Imagine Jeffrey Dahmer with billions, lawyers and death squads at his disposal.
Read a lot about who people are talking about here but who knows what's true. You look at Epstein stuff, this Donaldson thing and the likes of saville stuff too. "Elites" behaving in very depraved manners. You watch the likes of that taken film and the depravity in it and you convince yourself it's fake but in reality there is probably a lot of shit like that goes on. Donaldson is small fry compared to a lot of things out there as horrendous as that is.
Question is wrt dup if he is guilty then is he the only one.
I listened to the latest BelTel/indo podcast with court journo Allison Morris giving her account and also revealing some evidence which could not be reported upon previously. She offered some acute observations about Jeffrey, his arrogance, his testimony and his crash landing under expert cross examination, but offered absolutely nothing about the (alleged) evidence that the jury found enough to find Elanor guilty of such a serious crime.
Quote from: imtommygunn on June 28, 2026, 10:01:26 PMRead a lot about who people are talking about here but who knows what's true. You look at Epstein stuff, this Donaldson thing and the likes of saville stuff too. "Elites" behaving in very depraved manners. You watch the likes of that taken film and the depravity in it and you convince yourself it's fake but in reality there is probably a lot of shit like that goes on. Donaldson is small fry compared to a lot of things out there as horrendous as that is.
Question is wrt dup if he is guilty then is he the only one.
This stuff is older than the hills. Associate of mine made a film about the famous Johnny Gosch case and the Franklin scandal.
Saville and Epstein had MI5 clearance to be in close proximity to the House of Saxe Coburg Gotha.
Its a sort of dupers delight I suppose. Most people still dont grasp what Epstein was.
Newton in the Sunday Times today basically saying it's big decision time for the DUP. If they carry on the family values fire and brimstone stuff they are wide open. Let the TUV have that space and become more mainstream. Similar to the Tories in the 90's, wasn't credible with all their shaggers.
He also made the point that Burrows was out with 'let's not use this for political point scoring'. One interpretation is we will go high, Allister will go low. Another is Donaldson spent half his career in the UUP, so the who knew what could be thrown at them.
Apparantly some PSNI detectives saw Dondaldson walk into a gay sauna in London and told the world, which invites a number of questions
Quote from: Main Street on June 28, 2026, 10:21:53 PMI listened to the latest BelTel/indo podcast with court journo Allison Morris giving her account and also revealing some evidence which could not be reported upon previously. She offered some acute observations about Jeffrey, his arrogance, his testimony and his crash landing under expert cross examination, but offered absolutely nothing about the (alleged) evidence that the jury found enough to find Elanor guilty of such a serious crime.
This is the 2nd time I've seen you mention Eleanor and evidence? Are you a friend of hers? You already know we might never hear a lot of the evidence the jury did.
Based on what is emerging we should trust the jury and courts. Heard several women appeal to this narrative of her being "controlled" and a DA victim. BS.
Aiding and abetting is fairly clearcut.
On subject of DA , I Wonder will the alleged domestic abuser in the same milieu ever be named or have his day in court.
Justice is sometimes in the EYE of the beholder....
Quote from: Main Street on June 28, 2026, 10:21:53 PMfind Elanor guilty of such a serious crime
She was not found guilty of a serious crime. The BBC website describes it as "the jury could not find her guilty, in the same way they did her husband, and instead found that she "did the acts" when delivering their verdicts."
I believe the distinction has been discussed previously in this thread.
Allegedly the libel laws here are far for stringent on what can and cannot be published and may have stopped some of the press corp and their legal eagles from going down that rabbit hole.
Strange that the DUP have fought for this divergence from England and Wales law for years!!!
Quote from: GTP on June 29, 2026, 10:28:20 AMQuote from: Main Street on June 28, 2026, 10:21:53 PMfind Elanor guilty of such a serious crime
She was not found guilty of a serious crime. The BBC website describes it as "the jury could not find her guilty, in the same way they did her husband, and instead found that she "did the acts" when delivering their verdicts."
I believe the distinction has been discussed previously in this thread.
Fair enough but in the court of public opinion there is little distinction between a jury finding that she did the acts and being deemed guilty of doing the acts. Nevertheless, there is no serious evidence presented anywhere to support the jury's decision, whereas with Jeffrey there is a trail of information, nor was anything presented in the beltel/indo podcast which could have given more. Instead we are just given some supposedly sensational revelation about her, a very suspicious wife and with good reason to be, bugging Jeffrey's car. As it stands, she has been deemed to have done the deed because the jury thought she must have known based on assumptions. That's a very low bar for a woman who has been certifiably abused for decades and a high bar to get a guilty verdict for the life long wife abuser and a vile pedophile. .
QuoteThat's a very low bar for a woman who has been certifiably abused for decades and a high bar to get a guilty verdict for the life long wife abuser and a vile pedophile.
I've not read anything about this. Where's this come from?
Quote from: Main Street on June 29, 2026, 12:24:34 PMQuote from: GTP on June 29, 2026, 10:28:20 AMQuote from: Main Street on June 28, 2026, 10:21:53 PMfind Elanor guilty of such a serious crime
She was not found guilty of a serious crime. The BBC website describes it as "the jury could not find her guilty, in the same way they did her husband, and instead found that she "did the acts" when delivering their verdicts."
I believe the distinction has been discussed previously in this thread.
Fair enough but in the court of public opinion there is little distinction between a jury finding that she did the acts and being deemed guilty of doing the acts. Nevertheless, there is no serious evidence presented anywhere to support the jury's decision, whereas with Jeffrey there is a trail of information, nor was anything presented in the beltel/indo podcast which could have given more. Instead we are just given some supposedly sensational revelation about her, a very suspicious wife and with good reason to be, bugging Jeffrey's car. As it stands, she has been deemed to have done the deed because the jury thought she must have known based on assumptions. That's a very low bar for a woman who has been certifiably abused for decades and a high bar to get a guilty verdict for the life long wife abuser and a vile pedophile. .
How do you know he is? Obviously not a leap to assume given what he's done but haven't seen it mentioned. Not sure if we'll ever hear exactly what Eleanor did or didn't do for various legal reasons.
Quote from: johnnycool on June 29, 2026, 12:01:54 PMAllegedly the libel laws here are far for stringent on what can and cannot be published and may have stopped some of the press corp and their legal eagles from going down that rabbit hole.
Strange that the DUP have fought for this divergence from England and Wales law for years!!!
It actually means that Belfast is one of the Mecca's world wide for defamation case and explains why local solicitor Paul Tweed is considered the leading expert in the world on defamation law.
Quote from: Main Street on June 29, 2026, 12:24:34 PMQuote from: GTP on June 29, 2026, 10:28:20 AMQuote from: Main Street on June 28, 2026, 10:21:53 PMfind Elanor guilty of such a serious crime
She was not found guilty of a serious crime. The BBC website describes it as "the jury could not find her guilty, in the same way they did her husband, and instead found that she "did the acts" when delivering their verdicts."
I believe the distinction has been discussed previously in this thread.
Fair enough but in the court of public opinion there is little distinction between a jury finding that she did the acts and being deemed guilty of doing the acts. Nevertheless, there is no serious evidence presented anywhere to support the jury's decision, whereas with Jeffrey there is a trail of information, nor was anything presented in the beltel/indo podcast which could have given more. Instead we are just given some supposedly sensational revelation about her, a very suspicious wife and with good reason to be, bugging Jeffrey's car. As it stands, she has been deemed to have done the deed because the jury thought she must have known based on assumptions. That's a very low bar for a woman who has been certifiably abused for decades and a high bar to get a guilty verdict for the life long wife abuser and a vile pedophile. .
We have no idea why the Jury concluded she did the act. Also that's a very artificial finding given that most of the evidence against her couldn't have been fully test because she couldn't give instructions. For example if someone said she was in the room when x or y happened then the height of the defence in a trial of the facts would be to ask if the witness was sure. Whereas in a trial it's conceivable that testing could go much further with information about room layout and/or where the defendant said they were at the time etc.
Based on what I have read about the situation it seems to have been a dysfunctional family.
I think I've just found the winner of the understatement of the year award
https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/politics/the-dups-darkest-hour-exposure-of-jeffrey-donaldsons-double-life-leaves-party-in-deep-crisis/a/157643299.html
The party has been running to stand still. It was on just 18pc in our last poll in April – three points below its 2022 Assembly performance, which itself was dire. Factor in Donaldson's conviction and everything that has emerged since and the outlook is grim.
The TUV will be merciless. Expect Jim Allister to be on rinse and repeat about the 'dud Donaldson deal' for the next 10 months. The claim that spooks possibly blackmailed the former DUP leader into agreeing to restore devolution is a powerful one that will resonate with a chunk of unionist grassroots.
The UUP is on trickier territory with the Donaldson story given that he was an elected representative for the party almost as long as he was for the DUP. However, it is the latter party with which he served most recently and is associated with in the public mind.
UUP leader Jon Burrows hasn't opted for point-scoring against his bigger rival. He is focusing on the need to change the law to stop Donaldson accessing his huge taxpayer-funded pension.
UUP leader Jon Burrows
UUP leader Jon Burrows © PA
He has the advantage of being new to politics, and he's stressing that. The UUP leader told a recent party meeting that his would be a zero tolerance approach and "anyone acting dishonourably is for the door".
The DUP's worst fear will be that the trial and its aftermath has cemented something psychologically with voters – the idea of a party permanently linked to scandal, crisis and decline.
The story no longer concerns just one man. Rather, it's about a political organisation that looks weighed down by questions and controversies.
Quote from: seafoid on June 29, 2026, 07:50:44 PMhttps://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/politics/the-dups-darkest-hour-exposure-of-jeffrey-donaldsons-double-life-leaves-party-in-deep-crisis/a/157643299.html
The party has been running to stand still. It was on just 18pc in our last poll in April – three points below its 2022 Assembly performance, which itself was dire. Factor in Donaldson's conviction and everything that has emerged since and the outlook is grim.
The TUV will be merciless. Expect Jim Allister to be on rinse and repeat about the 'dud Donaldson deal' for the next 10 months. The claim that spooks possibly blackmailed the former DUP leader into agreeing to restore devolution is a powerful one that will resonate with a chunk of unionist grassroots.
The UUP is on trickier territory with the Donaldson story given that he was an elected representative for the party almost as long as he was for the DUP. However, it is the latter party with which he served most recently and is associated with in the public mind.
UUP leader Jon Burrows hasn't opted for point-scoring against his bigger rival. He is focusing on the need to change the law to stop Donaldson accessing his huge taxpayer-funded pension.
UUP leader Jon Burrows
UUP leader Jon Burrows © PA
He has the advantage of being new to politics, and he's stressing that. The UUP leader told a recent party meeting that his would be a zero tolerance approach and "anyone acting dishonourably is for the door".
The DUP's worst fear will be that the trial and its aftermath has cemented something psychologically with voters – the idea of a party permanently linked to scandal, crisis and decline.
The story no longer concerns just one man. Rather, it's about a political organisation that looks weighed down by questions and controversies.
Donaldson looking to appeal which is bad bad news for DUP as it will just keep the whole episode fresh in people's heads for next yrs elections
If he wins an appeal will he be brought back into the DUP family again?
What grounds can he appeal on?
Quote from: imtommygunn on June 29, 2026, 09:05:13 PMWhat grounds can he appeal on?
https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/courts/paedophile-ex-dup-leader-jeffrey-donaldson-expected-to-appeal-child-abuse-and-rape-convictions/a/157939558.html
Facing the prospect of spending at least the next decade behind bars, the former Lagan Valley MP is preparing to challenge the jury's guilty findings.
The shamed politician has 28 days to make an application for leave to appeal.
The grounds for it are likely to centre around the decision not to run his trial on child abuse charges separate from the trial of the facts involving his wife Eleanor Donaldson who was deemed medically unfit to participate.
She was found to have aided and abetted her husband's crimes.
On May 21, five days before the Donaldsons' trial in Newry began, Judge Paul Ramsay ruled they would be heard "simultaneously".
Any appeal from Donaldson is expected to challenge this ruling as it led to their trials running together and Eleanor Donaldson's police interviews being played to the jury.
These included her recalling finding her husband alone in a room with one of his teenage victims and remarking: "I just sort of remember just looking at him and saying, 'What are you doing?'"
Eleanor also told detectives: "In the years that came after that, I never had any cause for concern ever, I never felt that apart from thinking that that was strange and what was that about and I asked Jeffrey about it and he just dismissed it.
"I never had any other feeling that anything was wrong."
Because Eleanor was deemed medically unfit to stand trial, Donaldson's defence team did not have the opportunity to question her about the statements she made to police following their arrest in 2024.
What did the PSNI know, and when did they know it? Was any such information considered a matter of national security, and were these concerns communicated to the Northern Ireland Office?
There was also a direction to the jury that Eleanor's statements could not be used by them to determine her husband's guilt. Donaldson is likely to argue that this prejudiced his case as "what was heard by the jury could not be unheard".
The convicted child rapist is also understood to be examining Judge Paul Ramsay's charge to the jury at the close of the trial and whether that presents potential for grounds for appeal.
Meanwhile, Independent MLA Doug Beattie has called for the Police Ombudsman to investigate what the PSNI knew about Donaldson.
The former Lagan Valley MP was convicted of 18 child sex abuse charges, including one charge of rape against two women when they were children.
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on June 29, 2026, 08:54:59 PMIf he wins an appeal will he be brought back into the DUP family again?
No. Just the LOL
https://www.irishtimes.com/opinion/editorials/2026/06/29/the-irish-times-view-on-donaldson-revelations-a-gathering-storm-for-dup/
The spotlight now falls on the many senior colleagues who were, it appears, aware of his reckless and politically perilous behaviour over the course of his career, and who must account for why they still saw fit to elect him leader. The fact that Donaldson exploited the structures of evangelical Christianity as an alternative justice system to evade the law should also spur serious self-examination among the members of those communities.
Faced with a gathering storm, the DUP has announced an independent review. That seems unlikely to staunch the wounds. With Assembly and local elections less than a year away, a reordering of power within unionism may now be in prospect. And perhaps also a version of the broader reckoning that shook Irish Catholic nationalism in the 1990s, when the chasm between pious public rhetoric and private reality finally proved no longer tenable.
Maybe seafoid; but you'd imagine most DUPers will move toward TUV rather than UUP or Alliance.
Whether lone ranger Jim (and his sidekick Timto) have enough party members who can spell their own name correctly in the application forms is another matter.
Quote from: RadioGAAGAA on June 30, 2026, 01:55:32 PMMaybe seafoid; but you'd imagine most DUPers will move toward TUV rather than UUP or Alliance.
Whether lone ranger Jim (and his sidekick Timto) have enough party members who can spell their own name correctly in the application forms is another matter.
Hopefully it is a significant shift, TUV are even less capable than the DUP and if they gut each other further splits down the Unionist vote.
Also with the way TUV have gone after the DUP on this issue lately the chances of any pacts might be quickly disappearing.
It will probably boil down to whom Allister hates more, come the beginning of May 2027 - the DUP, or "Sinn Féin / IRA".
Hard to call at the minute, but he always hates someone else, at any given time.
Allister is 73 now & he can't go on forever. If he was to go, at some stage, is it conceivable that the TUV will simply fade away?
The level of competence in the TUV is not good. The DUP for all that they are have plenty more than competent in their ranks. (well a bit more...).
Allister doing what he's doing is probably a disaster for unionism.
Once again we sit back and watch the enemy defeat itself 😎🤓
Wallace Thompson, a founding member of the DUP, said he thinks Ian Paisley would be "turning in his grave" at the revelations about the "immoral" life that Donaldson lived.
The former DUP special advisor said the party was founded upon "high moral standards" and that it will now be a "monumental task" for it to deal with the fallout.
You just have to shake your head in sheer disbelief that anyone can sit with a straight face & claim that the DUP ever had "high moral standards".
Cough junior cough ;D
It's a bit like brexit this. The best thing any nationalist party can do is sit back and say nothing.
Quote from: playwiththewind1st on June 30, 2026, 02:29:59 PMIt will probably boil down to whom Allister hates more, come the beginning of May 2027 - the DUP, or "Sinn Féin / IRA".
Hard to call at the minute, but he always hates someone else, at any given time.
Allister is 73 now & he can't go on forever. If he was to go, at some stage, is it conceivable that the TUV will simply fade away?
The same thing was said about Paisley 30 years ago. There always appears to be someone else coming up, and even if the TUV does fade away then Bryson (or someone like him) will set up a new 3 letter acronym party and they'll take up the space that Paisley and then Allister has taken.
The world just keeps spinning.
Quote from: Smokin Joe on June 30, 2026, 04:20:28 PMQuote from: playwiththewind1st on June 30, 2026, 02:29:59 PMIt will probably boil down to whom Allister hates more, come the beginning of May 2027 - the DUP, or "Sinn Féin / IRA".
Hard to call at the minute, but he always hates someone else, at any given time.
Allister is 73 now & he can't go on forever. If he was to go, at some stage, is it conceivable that the TUV will simply fade away?
The same thing was said about Paisley 30 years ago. There always appears to be someone else coming up, and even if the TUV does fade away then Bryson (or someone like him) will set up a new 3 letter acronym party and they'll take up the space that Paisley and then Allister has taken.
The world just keeps spinning.
The Continuity Traditional Unionist Voice
Quote from: square_ball on June 30, 2026, 04:34:22 PMThe Continuity Traditional Unionist Voice
;D
The brains trust would probably go for "The New Traditional Unionist Voice"
Quote from: square_ball on June 30, 2026, 04:34:22 PMQuote from: Smokin Joe on June 30, 2026, 04:20:28 PMQuote from: playwiththewind1st on June 30, 2026, 02:29:59 PMIt will probably boil down to whom Allister hates more, come the beginning of May 2027 - the DUP, or "Sinn Féin / IRA".
Hard to call at the minute, but he always hates someone else, at any given time.
Allister is 73 now & he can't go on forever. If he was to go, at some stage, is it conceivable that the TUV will simply fade away?
The same thing was said about Paisley 30 years ago. There always appears to be someone else coming up, and even if the TUV does fade away then Bryson (or someone like him) will set up a new 3 letter acronym party and they'll take up the space that Paisley and then Allister has taken.
The world just keeps spinning.
The Continuity Traditional Unionist Voice
the continuity Outraged Unionist Voice
They need the DUP to stay in business. The TUV is a parasite. It needs a host. It can never be the main party.
You wonder is Bryson still too scared to go in considering the gorilla beat him last time.
Yeah the TUV can not / will not be the main voice but protest votes seem to be the rage these days so unless they make it through that. This is a big chance for the UUP.
You would think it is a great chance for the UUP if they play their cards right, say nothing and watch everything unfold.
Quote from: seafoid on June 30, 2026, 05:54:57 PMYou would think it is a great chance for the UUP if they play their cards right, say nothing and watch everything unfold.
Sure, weren't the UUP having a complete meltdown, just a couple of weeks ago, until the DUP decided to go full Krakatoa & take over all the headlines?
Poots was just on UTV there, throwing the toys totally out of the pram. He's not a happy bunny!!
Wee Jeff was in the UUP when committing these crimes. They'll be fighting over a pulpit with the DUP to keep their heads down behind.
https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/sunday-life/donaldsons-inspired-to-turn-to-god-by-eleanors-convicted-paedophile-brother-in-law/a/157863550.html
William Walker
Mervyn
Hanna was not the only fellow paedophile who Donaldson was linked to. He was also pals with disgraced DUP councillor William Walker, who was convicted of attempting to sexually communicate with a child in 2022.
The 63-year-old posed as a younger man online and asked his victims to send him images of themselves dressed in school uniforms.
However, the 'children' were in fact vigilantes who confronted Walker and handed over their evidence to police.
The pervert was later sentenced to 100 hours of community service, and left Northern Ireland for a new life in England.
Any suggestions for Acronyms for Bryson's new party?
I'll kick off with TAF - Thick as Fk
Donaldson shafted Pootsy too. He'll be scundered. You would imagine if he'd have known he'd have said something as not like they were friends.
(https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcR29ZP6M_KYDeRXI0gy53WRTwzg9Qg-NvUX8UIORxtPgQ&s)
The BBP.....Blue Bin Party.
Quote from: RadioGAAGAA on June 30, 2026, 04:51:18 PMQuote from: square_ball on June 30, 2026, 04:34:22 PMThe Continuity Traditional Unionist Voice
;D
The brains trust would probably go for "The New Traditional Unionist Voice"
There's bound to be a way of rearranging the usual letters and coming up with a party with CÜNTS as an acronym
The Constitutional Unionist Northern Traditionalist Party
Quote from: DaleCooper on June 30, 2026, 07:28:55 PMThe Constitutional Unionist Northern Traditionalist Party
Cullybackey [Ulster] No Taigs Party.
"Research by the Evangelical Alliance in 2024 found that almost half of practising Protestants in Northern Ireland described themselves as 'evangelical'."
Most of those are either TUV or DUP.
Quote from: seafoid on June 30, 2026, 08:39:37 PM"Research by the Evangelical Alliance in 2024 found that almost half of practising Protestants in Northern Ireland described themselves as 'evangelical'."
Most of those are either TUV or DUP.
And the rest are hypocritical.
Quote from: playwiththewind1st on June 30, 2026, 09:17:50 PMQuote from: seafoid on June 30, 2026, 08:39:37 PM"Research by the Evangelical Alliance in 2024 found that almost half of practising Protestants in Northern Ireland described themselves as 'evangelical'."
Most of those are either TUV or DUP.
And the rest are hypocritical.
If you were ever in any doubt it has been abundantly clear that attending church of whatever hue does not and should not bestow any moral superiority on those people to the rest of us in the great unwashed.
The DUP and their evangelical baptist roots requires them to believe they are better than the rest of us.
Jeffrey lied through his teeth about the Irish Sea Border and Gavin stood behind him time and again like a nodding dog. If Jeffrey was lying, with Gavin at his side, why would anyone believe Gavin now - that's become a big problem for DUP.
Quote from: Sportacus on June 30, 2026, 10:01:42 PMJeffrey lied through his teeth about the Irish Sea Border and Gavin stood behind him time and again like a nodding dog. If Jeffrey was lying, with Gavin at his side, why would anyone believe Gavin now - that's become a big problem for DUP.
Correct. When Jeffrey stood down , Robinson took over and said, well actually we didn't achieve all we said we did.
They took little time throwing Jeffrey under the bus after his guilty verdict. A case of "we knew nothing of Jeffrey's antics". Honestly, we didn't. You can trust us. Vote
Quimby DUP
2010 article from Mr Mallie on the Iris Robinson scandal
https://sluggerotoole.com/2010/01/10/after-the-brutality-the-sword-of-damocles-hangs-over-peter-robinson/
Paedophile Jeffrey Donaldson is being held in the protection wing with those most at risk of being attacked in Gen Pop. That is: bent cops, police informers and paedophiles. With typical dark humour, the prisoners call the unit "peelers, squealers and feelers".
The Gay Sauna Jeffrey frequented was opposite MI5 HQ. The PSNI detectives were on business concerning Dissidents. Never been to a gay sauna meself, is it better than the normal ones?
I thought the bubbles down round the nether regions were as good as it got, there's a while world out there I've missed out on
Quote from: DaleCooper on July 01, 2026, 11:32:29 PMThe Gay Sauna Jeffrey frequented was opposite MI5 HQ. The PSNI detectives were on business concerning Dissidents. Never been to a gay sauna meself, is it better than the normal ones?
Who said they were there about dissidents?
Rwgarding unionism - Unionists always need a party who are right wing and bigoted. It was the DUP, then the TUV came along. This makes the UUP and DUP drift more to the right.
Remember at the all party talks years ago, the DUP taunted the UUP of 'Where's Jeffrey'? How things have changed.
I'm still of the opinion all of this will be forgot come next May and there'll be a unionist pact of sorts.
Quote from: DaleCooper on July 01, 2026, 11:32:29 PMThe Gay Sauna Jeffrey frequented was opposite MI5 HQ. The PSNI detectives were on business concerning Dissidents. Never been to a gay sauna meself, is it better than the normal ones?
Presumably, being gay means that there are nice decorations and coloured lights?
Quote from: DaleCooper on July 01, 2026, 11:32:29 PMThe Gay Sauna Jeffrey frequented was opposite MI5 HQ. The PSNI detectives were on business concerning Dissidents. Never been to a gay sauna meself, is it better than the normal ones?
Was it not a police conference at Westminster?
A friend of mine who's gay told me about the one in Belfast and it would be quite different from any sauna I have been to put it that way...
Quote from: imtommygunn on July 02, 2026, 08:23:17 AMA friend of mine who's gay told me about the one in Belfast and it would be quite different from any sauna I have been to put it that way...
Is the friend in the room with you now Tommy
;D
Maybe Jeffrey's one was different but it wasn't for spectators anyway (or maybe there would be some spectating who knows!). ;D
Quote from: imtommygunn on July 02, 2026, 08:36:53 AM;D
Maybe Jeffrey's one was different but it wasn't for spectators anyway (or maybe there would be some spectating who knows!). ;D
I'd be concerned that 2 cops just happened to be passing a gay sauna while not on duty.. what are the odds lol
Maybe they were spectators also
Quote from: imtommygunn on July 02, 2026, 08:23:17 AMA friend of mine who's gay told me about the one in Belfast and it would be quite different from any sauna I have been to put it that way...
Some of my best friends are gay, don't see much of them in July tends to be something of a cosplay month for them by all accounts
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on July 02, 2026, 09:41:19 AMQuote from: imtommygunn on July 02, 2026, 08:36:53 AM;D
Maybe Jeffrey's one was different but it wasn't for spectators anyway (or maybe there would be some spectating who knows!). ;D
I'd be concerned that 2 cops just happened to be passing a gay sauna while not on duty.. what are the odds lol
Maybe they were spectators also
MI5 headquarters is a stones throw from the sauna, so it is.
Quote from: armaghniac on July 01, 2026, 08:46:49 PMPaedophile Jeffrey Donaldson is being held in the protection wing with those most at risk of being attacked in Gen Pop. That is: bent cops, police informers and paedophiles. With typical dark humour, the prisoners call the unit "peelers, squealers and feelers".
Paedophile Jeffrey Donaldson could be in prison until his late 70s. It's going to be a long stay for him given the respect prisoners have for paedophiles.
Sam McBride is the man who details much of Donaldsons behaviour in embassies so MI6 would be very aware of it.
Poots under P to go.
Meanwhile. Some farmers need to be gone through for a shortcut, look at latest in Ballygawley.
https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/video/concerns-for-lough-neagh-as-sheep-carcasses-left-decomposing-in-rural-river/a/157983996.html
Quote from: seafoid on July 02, 2026, 01:01:28 PMQuote from: armaghniac on July 01, 2026, 08:46:49 PMPaedophile Jeffrey Donaldson is being held in the protection wing with those most at risk of being attacked in Gen Pop. That is: bent cops, police informers and paedophiles. With typical dark humour, the prisoners call the unit "peelers, squealers and feelers".
Paedophile Jeffrey Donaldson could be in prison until his late 70s. It's going to be a long stay for him given the respect prisoners have for paedophiles.
Again this isn't entirely accurate. Paedophiles are ordinarily held in the perhaps inappropriately named bush house. The wing Donaldson is on is the Close Supervision or Hospital wing. Whilst it is occasionally used for risk management it is primarily used to monitor those at risk to themselves or requiring significant medical attention. I've never heard that nickname applied to it.
Also what age is he now?
David no room for your accuracy here ;D
(Seriously though I find your contributions hugely informative.)
I don't see why Poots would cover for Donaldson. He said it himself. Where are Sammy Wilson and Flegory Campbell?
Quote from: imtommygunn on July 02, 2026, 01:36:38 PMDavid no room for your accuracy here ;D
(Seriously though I find your contributions hugely informative.)
I don't see why Poots would cover for Donaldson. He said it himself. Where are Sammy Wilson and Flegory Campbell?
The London brigade are very quiet indeed. Especially Sammy and Campbell. I'm sure they know, from stsying over there regularly, a lot more than most?
I wonder will Sam Mc Bride do a book on it a lâ the RHI scheme?
Yeah your man Shannon the league leader in expense claims too is very quiet...
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c8x2ynd12vlo
Ducks being lined up in a row for a bit of positive Stormont PR before they all f#@k off for the summer.
The public spin will be that a 'budget' has been agreed but in reality the cans will be kicked down the road for another year.
Quote from: LC on July 02, 2026, 02:15:33 PMhttps://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c8x2ynd12vlo
Ducks being lined up in a row for a bit of positive Stormont PR before they all f#@k off for the summer.
The public spin will be that a 'budget' has been agreed but in reality the cans will be kicked down the road for another year.
Nothing will happen before the election...and it's nearly a year away.
Nobody wants to say yes to water charges and raising uni fees etc. but they all want better infrastructure for water and sewerage etc.
Quote from: marty34 on July 02, 2026, 02:21:34 PMQuote from: LC on July 02, 2026, 02:15:33 PMhttps://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c8x2ynd12vlo
Ducks being lined up in a row for a bit of positive Stormont PR before they all f#@k off for the summer.
The public spin will be that a 'budget' has been agreed but in reality the cans will be kicked down the road for another year.
Nothing will happen before the election...and it's nearly a year away.
Nobody wants to say yes to water charges and raising uni fees etc. but they all want better infrastructure for water and sewerage etc.
It would suit them better to deal with blatant waste and make individuals accountable for poor performance. We cant keep tipping money into the bottomless pit and expect a better result. Lets get to the root causes and go from there.
Quote from: Last Man on July 02, 2026, 02:46:39 PMQuote from: marty34 on July 02, 2026, 02:21:34 PMQuote from: LC on July 02, 2026, 02:15:33 PMhttps://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c8x2ynd12vlo
Ducks being lined up in a row for a bit of positive Stormont PR before they all f#@k off for the summer.
The public spin will be that a 'budget' has been agreed but in reality the cans will be kicked down the road for another year.
Nothing will happen before the election...and it's nearly a year away.
Nobody wants to say yes to water charges and raising uni fees etc. but they all want better infrastructure for water and sewerage etc.
It would suit them better to deal with blatant waste and make individuals accountable for poor performance. We cant keep tipping money into the bottomless pit and expect a better result. Lets get to the root causes and go from there.
Institutionally incapable of doing this, civil service hiring like there's no tomorrow. It's a state of mind.
Quote from: imtommygunn on July 02, 2026, 02:02:42 PMYeah your man Shannon the league leader in expense claims too is very quiet...
That's because he's as dumb as fúck.
Quote from: johnnycool on July 02, 2026, 04:19:49 PMQuote from: imtommygunn on July 02, 2026, 02:02:42 PMYeah your man Shannon the league leader in expense claims too is very quiet...
That's because he's as dumb as fúck.
Is that not the usual entry level qualification for any unionist politician? Plus, in Shannon's case, the ability to blub, copiously, every time he opens his fecking mouth.
Quote from: playwiththewind1st on July 02, 2026, 04:50:19 PMQuote from: johnnycool on July 02, 2026, 04:19:49 PMQuote from: imtommygunn on July 02, 2026, 02:02:42 PMYeah your man Shannon the league leader in expense claims too is very quiet...
That's because he's as dumb as fúck.
Is that not the usual entry level qualification for any unionist politician? Plus, in Shannon's case, the ability to blub, copiously, every time he opens his fecking mouth.
Nah, Jim is particularly thick even by DUP councillor standards, let alone MP's.
Quote from: David McKeown on July 02, 2026, 01:34:35 PMQuote from: seafoid on July 02, 2026, 01:01:28 PMQuote from: armaghniac on July 01, 2026, 08:46:49 PMPaedophile Jeffrey Donaldson is being held in the protection wing with those most at risk of being attacked in Gen Pop. That is: bent cops, police informers and paedophiles. With typical dark humour, the prisoners call the unit "peelers, squealers and feelers".
Paedophile Jeffrey Donaldson could be in prison until his late 70s. It's going to be a long stay for him given the respect prisoners have for paedophiles.
Again this isn't entirely accurate. Paedophiles are ordinarily held in the perhaps inappropriately named bush house. The wing Donaldson is on is the Close Supervision or Hospital wing. Whilst it is occasionally used for risk management it is primarily used to monitor those at risk to themselves or requiring significant medical attention. I've never heard that nickname applied to it.
Also what age is he now?
Old enough to know better, or 63, in old money.
Quote from: johnnycool on July 02, 2026, 04:52:05 PMQuote from: playwiththewind1st on July 02, 2026, 04:50:19 PMQuote from: johnnycool on July 02, 2026, 04:19:49 PMQuote from: imtommygunn on July 02, 2026, 02:02:42 PMYeah your man Shannon the league leader in expense claims too is very quiet...
That's because he's as dumb as fúck.
Is that not the usual entry level qualification for any unionist politician? Plus, in Shannon's case, the ability to blub, copiously, every time he opens his fecking mouth.
Nah, Jim is particularly thick even by DUP councillor standards, let alone MP's.
DUP Councillors are far from thick. They always exhibit a high degree of cunning & ingenuity, when it comes to filling in the ould expenses forms.
Exactly. Don't be fooled. They play to the gallows a lot. Look at an example of Givan's trip to Israel. Either he's incredibly naive and didn't read the room or he did it fully intentionally to stir the pot and whip up his own voters. I know which one my own money is on and there are many stunts like it that they pull.
Robinson and the paratroopers fleg
Quote from: playwiththewind1st on July 02, 2026, 04:52:35 PMQuote from: David McKeown on July 02, 2026, 01:34:35 PMQuote from: seafoid on July 02, 2026, 01:01:28 PMQuote from: armaghniac on July 01, 2026, 08:46:49 PMPaedophile Jeffrey Donaldson is being held in the protection wing with those most at risk of being attacked in Gen Pop. That is: bent cops, police informers and paedophiles. With typical dark humour, the prisoners call the unit "peelers, squealers and feelers".
Paedophile Jeffrey Donaldson could be in prison until his late 70s. It's going to be a long stay for him given the respect prisoners have for paedophiles.
Again this isn't entirely accurate. Paedophiles are ordinarily held in the perhaps inappropriately named bush house. The wing Donaldson is on is the Close Supervision or Hospital wing. Whilst it is occasionally used for risk management it is primarily used to monitor those at risk to themselves or requiring significant medical attention. I've never heard that nickname applied to it.
Also what age is he now?
Old enough to know better, or 63, in old money.
Yeah highly unlikely he will be in prison in his 70's let alone his late 70's
What sort of sentence is Donaldson likely to get ?
Someone said to me it could be as little as 2-3 years though I wouldn't know tbh.
Quote from: seafoid on July 03, 2026, 12:12:07 PMWhat sort of sentence is Donaldson likely to get ?
Allison Morris was talking to ones and seemed to think it will be 8 to 10. He has a clean character before now (yes I know). But the fact he fought it will really go against him.
Also he will be sentenced by what the sentence was at the time the crime was committed, not now.
Quote from: imtommygunn on July 03, 2026, 12:13:10 PMSomeone said to me it could be as little as 2-3 years though I wouldn't know tbh.
No chance. Not for 18 charges, 1 of which was rape and a not guilty plea fought tooth and nail to ensure the 2 women had to testify. Would expect/hope it to be closer to 10.
Other cases for abuse seem to be 2-4 years. Sexual abuse is one thing , child rape totally another.
I'd imagine at least 8 years.
I don't know enough about the exact facts and timeline to predict it exactly.
It's also a highly complicated sentencing exercise. You have to apply today's standards to the guidance in place at the time of the offending then consider if that's acceptable by today's standard all while be capped at the maximum sentence available at any stage between the commission of the offence and today.
Also if any of the offences occurred after 1st April 2009 there's different types of sentences will have to be imposed.
If they didn't then he won't have to worry about being assessed as dangerous or having to serve a licence period. He will be entitled to 50% remission.
Also contesting the matter is not an aggravating feature. Credit is afforded if you don't buy you aren't punished for contesting.
With that said if there was a gun to my head I'd say 6-7 years meaning 3 to 3.5 years in custody but without knowing exact details that's speculation on my part and a range of 4-10 is possible (again with only have been served in custody)
Quote from: David McKeown on July 03, 2026, 02:01:57 PMI don't know enough about the exact facts and timeline to predict it exactly.
It's also a highly complicated sentencing exercise. You have to apply today's standards to the guidance in place at the time of the offending then consider if that's acceptable by today's standard all while be capped at the maximum sentence available at any stage between the commission of the offence and today.
Also if any of the offences occurred after 1st April 2009 there's different types of sentences will have to be imposed.
If they didn't then he won't have to worry about being assessed as dangerous or having to serve a licence period. He will be entitled to 60% remission.
Also contesting the matter is not an aggravating feature. Credit is afforded if you don't buy you aren't punished for contesting.
With that said if there was a gun to my head I'd say 6-7 years meaning 3 to 3.5 years in custody but without knowing exact details that's speculation on my part and a range of 4-10 is possible (again with only have been served in custody)
Interesting David.
What's the likelihood of appeal? Have read that he may have a case that the joint trial with the wife led to prejudicial evidence against him from her side of the house.
Jim Wells interviewed in this podcast says that the DUP needs a full investigation and that if it does it will find out something worse. He says it looks bleak for the party.
https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/podcasts/affairs-gay-saunas-and-drinking-excessively-former-mla-on-the-jeffrey-donaldson-he-knew/a/158003982.html
Quote from: seafoid on July 03, 2026, 08:05:36 PMJim Wells interviewed in this podcast says that the DUP needs a full investigation and that if it does it will find out something worse. He says it looks bleak for the party.
https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/podcasts/affairs-gay-saunas-and-drinking-excessively-former-mla-on-the-jeffrey-donaldson-he-knew/a/158003982.html
Is Wells now in with the TUV?
Quote from: marty34 on July 03, 2026, 08:17:29 PMQuote from: seafoid on July 03, 2026, 08:05:36 PMJim Wells interviewed in this podcast says that the DUP needs a full investigation and that if it does it will find out something worse. He says it looks bleak for the party.
https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/podcasts/affairs-gay-saunas-and-drinking-excessively-former-mla-on-the-jeffrey-donaldson-he-knew/a/158003982.html
Is Wells now in with the TUV?
He is. He has a vested interest in the DUP getting roasted.
Quote from: Tony Baloney on July 03, 2026, 07:20:26 PMQuote from: David McKeown on July 03, 2026, 02:01:57 PMI don't know enough about the exact facts and timeline to predict it exactly.
It's also a highly complicated sentencing exercise. You have to apply today's standards to the guidance in place at the time of the offending then consider if that's acceptable by today's standard all while be capped at the maximum sentence available at any stage between the commission of the offence and today.
Also if any of the offences occurred after 1st April 2009 there's different types of sentences will have to be imposed.
If they didn't then he won't have to worry about being assessed as dangerous or having to serve a licence period. He will be entitled to 60% remission.
Also contesting the matter is not an aggravating feature. Credit is afforded if you don't buy you aren't punished for contesting.
With that said if there was a gun to my head I'd say 6-7 years meaning 3 to 3.5 years in custody but without knowing exact details that's speculation on my part and a range of 4-10 is possible (again with only have been served in custody)
Interesting David.
What's the likelihood of appeal? Have read that he may have a case that the joint trial with the wife led to prejudicial evidence against him from her side of the house.
It's been reported that he has appealed.
I think I mentioned it during the trial but the general rule is that evidence of a co-accused is inadmissible unless it's given from the witness box. As a result of the nature of how the case proceeded the jury would have heard a considerable amount of evidence that wouldn't have been admissible had the trials been dealt with separately. Added to that a lot of it wouldn't have been properly challenged. Now the jury would have been warned about that but that may or may not be a point they are trying to raise.
For a conviction following a jury trial, the question is not whether the Court of Appeal would itself have convicted or acquitted. Rather, the Court asks whether, in light of the alleged error and all the circumstances of the case, the conviction can safely stand.
Typical grounds which may render a conviction unsafe include:
Misdirections or non-directions by the trial judge.
Wrong legal rulings.
Material irregularities in the conduct of the trial.
Failures of disclosure.
Improper admission or exclusion of evidence.
Jury irregularities.
Fresh evidence which undermines the verdict.
Abuse of process or serious misconduct by investigators or prosecutors.
It's impossible to know whether there's any grounds for an appeal.
Quote from: Tony Baloney on July 03, 2026, 08:49:12 PMQuote from: marty34 on July 03, 2026, 08:17:29 PMQuote from: seafoid on July 03, 2026, 08:05:36 PMJim Wells interviewed in this podcast says that the DUP needs a full investigation and that if it does it will find out something worse. He says it looks bleak for the party.
https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/podcasts/affairs-gay-saunas-and-drinking-excessively-former-mla-on-the-jeffrey-donaldson-he-knew/a/158003982.html
Is Wells now in with the TUV?
He is. He has a vested interest in the DUP getting roasted.
Listened to 5 mins of that interview...Wells, 'we travelled the world together', 'I knew him well', 'I wouldn't call him a friend '...any fear I had , that loyalists / unionists would circle the wagons and produce an all encompassing loyalist powerhouse to fight the green and kick the statement can down the road for another while went up in smoke...they really are a gather up of absolute idiots
Wells came across as someone without much between the ears in that spotlight show. I didn't realise he had went to the TUV.
Quote from: imtommygunn on July 04, 2026, 03:20:04 PMWells came across as someone without much between the ears in that spotlight show. I didn't realise he had went to the TUV.
Well matched.
Quote from: LC on July 04, 2026, 03:21:07 PMQuote from: imtommygunn on July 04, 2026, 03:20:04 PMWells came across as someone without much between the ears in that spotlight show. I didn't realise he had went to the TUV.
Well matched.
I thought he spoke very well in the BelTel interview. He understands the DUP machine. He said that there is something else to come out and that the future for the DUP is bleak.
Wells was forced to quit as health minister after he, amongst many other things, (in)famously turned up at a lesbian couple's house while out canvassing and started on them for their sinful and wicked ways. He was never the sharpest of politicians and was liable to commit a calamitous gaffe every time he was put in front of a microphone.
Quote from: seafoid on July 04, 2026, 03:56:12 PMQuote from: LC on July 04, 2026, 03:21:07 PMQuote from: imtommygunn on July 04, 2026, 03:20:04 PMWells came across as someone without much between the ears in that spotlight show. I didn't realise he had went to the TUV.
Well matched.
I thought he spoke very well in the BelTel interview. He understands the DUP machine. He said that there is something else to come out and that the future for the DUP is bleak.
Maybe something in Sunday papers tomorrow?
"A young woman described by Ian Paisley as a "victim" of Jeffrey Donaldson said that Emma Little-Pengelly had told her that the disgraced former DUP leader was "a danger" to her, the Belfast Telegraph can reveal" [Suzanne Breen]
That should be the end of Pengelly
Quote from: DaleCooper on July 06, 2026, 03:03:08 PM"A young woman described by Ian Paisley as a "victim" of Jeffrey Donaldson said that Emma Little-Pengelly had told her that the disgraced former DUP leader was "a danger" to her, the Belfast Telegraph can reveal" [Suzanne Breen]
Yet Foster and Loveheart were safe in wee Jeff's company. I wonder why?
Quote from: p3427977 on July 06, 2026, 08:15:09 PMThat should be the end of Pengelly
She has already been thrown out on her ear, as both an MLA & as an MP, by the South Belfast electorate.
That's the beauty of the electoral system in the North of Ireland - the DUP merely switched her to Lagan Valley & made her Deputy First Minister, whilst parachuting Poots into South Belfast.
It's nearly impossible to reject a candidate at the polls, if the party decides that they're still of use.
https://x.com/sjamcbride/status/2074403990280781994?s=46&t=zMI0pHqP8aYtYYerofczvg
Jeff in the news again. Wonder how many more stories will come out.
Quote from: playwiththewind1st on July 07, 2026, 09:58:04 AMQuote from: p3427977 on July 06, 2026, 08:15:09 PMThat should be the end of Pengelly
She has already been thrown out on her ear, as both an MLA & as an MP, by the South Belfast electorate.
That's the beauty of the electoral system in the North of Ireland - the DUP merely switched her to Lagan Valley & made her Deputy First Minister, whilst parachuting Poots into South Belfast.
It's nearly impossible to reject a candidate at the polls, if the party decides that they're still of use.
Or, indeed, if the party recognises that the candidate has incriminating information about other high ranking members that they would never want to come to light.
Quote from: Mourne Red on July 07, 2026, 10:15:02 AMhttps://x.com/sjamcbride/status/2074403990280781994?s=46&t=zMI0pHqP8aYtYYerofczvg
Jeff in the news again. Wonder how many more stories will come out.
Jaysus that snapchat pic has serial killer vibes.
Jeffrey on snapchat like
Quote from: Mourne Red on July 07, 2026, 10:15:02 AMhttps://x.com/sjamcbride/status/2074403990280781994?s=46&t=zMI0pHqP8aYtYYerofczvg
Jeff in the news again. Wonder how many more stories will come out.
f**k
Quote from: playwiththewind1st on July 07, 2026, 09:58:04 AMQuote from: p3427977 on July 06, 2026, 08:15:09 PMThat should be the end of Pengelly
She has already been thrown out on her ear, as both an MLA & as an MP, by the South Belfast electorate.
That's the beauty of the electoral system in the North of Ireland - the DUP merely switched her to Lagan Valley & made her Deputy First Minister, whilst parachuting Poots into South Belfast.
It's nearly impossible to reject a candidate at the polls, if the party decides that they're still of use.
ELP was in the donaldson faction at the time of the contentious leadership battle with Poots which Poots won and then was forced to stand down after he agreed to Irish language legislation which was already part of the New decade, new approach framework.
She'll be thrown under the bus but it won't change a thing if they all knew he was a sex pest, but if they knew about the rape and sexual abuse of a child then that's a whole different ball game.
Not sure where to put this at it's not DUP but didn't think we need a Nigel Farage thread.
Hes giving a statement at 2pm regarding his future in public life.
Quote from: johnnycool on July 07, 2026, 12:37:17 PMQuote from: playwiththewind1st on July 07, 2026, 09:58:04 AMQuote from: p3427977 on July 06, 2026, 08:15:09 PMThat should be the end of Pengelly
She has already been thrown out on her ear, as both an MLA & as an MP, by the South Belfast electorate.
That's the beauty of the electoral system in the North of Ireland - the DUP merely switched her to Lagan Valley & made her Deputy First Minister, whilst parachuting Poots into South Belfast.
It's nearly impossible to reject a candidate at the polls, if the party decides that they're still of use.
ELP was in the donaldson faction at the time of the contentious leadership battle with Poots which Poots won and then was forced to stand down after he agreed to Irish language legislation which was already part of the New decade, new approach framework.
She'll be thrown under the bus but it won't change a thing if they all knew he was a sex pest, but if they knew about the rape and sexual abuse of a child then that's a whole different ball game.
How do you prove ELP, or anyone , knew though? Or did or didn't hear any rumours?
Quote from: RedHand88 on July 07, 2026, 12:58:13 PMNot sure where to put this at it's not DUP but didn't think we need a Nigel Farage thread.
Hes giving a statement at 2pm regarding his future in public life.
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2026/07/07/nigel-farage-statement-on-his-future-reform-leader/
The Reform UK leader is at the centre of an ongoing sleaze inquiry over allegations that he did not correctly report a £5m gift from Christopher Harborne, a cryptocurrency billionaire, before the last general election.
If upheld, he could be suspended from the Commons, which could trigger a by-election in his Clacton constituency.
He is also facing a second investigation over undeclared donations from George Cottrell, one of his closest associates, who has been convicted of wire fraud in the US.
Quote from: AustinPowers on July 07, 2026, 01:00:43 PMQuote from: johnnycool on July 07, 2026, 12:37:17 PMQuote from: playwiththewind1st on July 07, 2026, 09:58:04 AMQuote from: p3427977 on July 06, 2026, 08:15:09 PMThat should be the end of Pengelly
She has already been thrown out on her ear, as both an MLA & as an MP, by the South Belfast electorate.
That's the beauty of the electoral system in the North of Ireland - the DUP merely switched her to Lagan Valley & made her Deputy First Minister, whilst parachuting Poots into South Belfast.
It's nearly impossible to reject a candidate at the polls, if the party decides that they're still of use.
ELP was in the donaldson faction at the time of the contentious leadership battle with Poots which Poots won and then was forced to stand down after he agreed to Irish language legislation which was already part of the New decade, new approach framework.
She'll be thrown under the bus but it won't change a thing if they all knew he was a sex pest, but if they knew about the rape and sexual abuse of a child then that's a whole different ball game.
How do you prove ELP, or anyone , knew though? Or did or didn't hear any rumours?
She didn't seem to know her daddy was in South Africa, quite often.
Quote from: seafoid on July 07, 2026, 01:04:03 PMQuote from: RedHand88 on July 07, 2026, 12:58:13 PMNot sure where to put this at it's not DUP but didn't think we need a Nigel Farage thread.
Hes giving a statement at 2pm regarding his future in public life.
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2026/07/07/nigel-farage-statement-on-his-future-reform-leader/
The Reform UK leader is at the centre of an ongoing sleaze inquiry over allegations that he did not correctly report a £5m gift from Christopher Harborne, a cryptocurrency billionaire, before the last general election.
If upheld, he could be suspended from the Commons, which could trigger a by-election in his Clacton constituency.
He is also facing a second investigation over undeclared donations from George Cottrell, one of his closest associates, who has been convicted of wire fraud in the US.
Resigned as an MP but running in the bye -election....a stunt I'd say but will be interesting where he stands if he losses the election.
Sammy the knight in shining armour out defending Emma.
Quote from: johnnycool on July 07, 2026, 12:37:17 PMQuote from: playwiththewind1st on July 07, 2026, 09:58:04 AMQuote from: p3427977 on July 06, 2026, 08:15:09 PMThat should be the end of Pengelly
She has already been thrown out on her ear, as both an MLA & as an MP, by the South Belfast electorate.
That's the beauty of the electoral system in the North of Ireland - the DUP merely switched her to Lagan Valley & made her Deputy First Minister, whilst parachuting Poots into South Belfast.
It's nearly impossible to reject a candidate at the polls, if the party decides that they're still of use.
ELP was in the donaldson faction at the time of the contentious leadership battle with Poots which Poots won and then was forced to stand down after he agreed to Irish language legislation which was already part of the New decade, new approach framework.
She'll be thrown under the bus but it won't change a thing if they all knew he was a sex pest, but if they knew about the rape and sexual abuse of a child then that's a whole different ball game.
the thing is that ELP will be pilloried for having warned a woman about him, when those who warned nobody get off Scott free.
Recently Jamie Bryson has been creaming himself about how he has turned the tide with Drumcree, dual language signs, illegal bonfires and so on and so forth.
What next is on the horizon for the intrepid keyboard warrior?
- reassembling the UDR?
- return of the RUC?
- return of the B Specials?
- diplock courts?
- internment?
- hard border?
- Irish language criminalised?
- shops closed on a Sunday?
- Gaelic games prohibited?
- etc etc etc
What else?
Hopefully stopping taigs playing garrison sports!
https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/jeffrey-donaldson-remains-in-isolation-in-hospital-unit-of-maghaberry-prison/a/158515997.html
Former DUP leader Jeffrey Donaldson remains in the hospital unit of Maghaberry Prison, isolated from the main inmate population.
Over two weeks after he was found guilty of 18 child sex abuse offences at Newry Crown Court, Donaldson is still in Moyola House, the 19-bed special care wing.
Donaldson is considered to be at high risk of attack within the main prison population due to the nature of his conviction.
As a convicted prisoner he is entitled to two visits a month, separate to legal visits and consolations, but can avail of virtual visits, which were introduced during Covid lockdown.
DUP leader Gavin Robinson © PA Radar
The video calls are monitored by staff, who watch the image but do not listen into the audio.
Donaldson has had an in-person visit from a relative since being locked up and a virtual visit with his wife Eleanor, who was found to have aided and abetted his offending during a trial of the facts.
Sources say he has been mainly keeping to himself, and has had a visit from the prison's Protestant chaplain.
He will be returned to court on September 25 for a submissions hearing, when reports and victim impact statements will be presented to the judge, with his sentence expected to be handed down a week after that.
If he intends to appeal the conviction he has 28 days after the passing of his sentence in which to lodge an appeal.
Read moreDUP reveals who will lead independent review into Jeffrey Donaldson - as party says former leader 'abused various positions of power'
Meanwhile, the DUP has confirmed the party's independent review into Donaldson's time as a member will be led by safeguarding expert Jim Gamble.
The Belfast Telegraph reported a week ago that Gamble had been approached to head up the review.
Calls had been intensifying for Gavin Robinson's party to answer questions about the behaviour of their former leader.
A woman has made a complaint to police that Donaldson sexually assaulted her in the DUP office at Westminster in 2016.
The party said on Thursday: "The DUP has commissioned this focused independent review to establish what, if any, information was known within the party about his conduct, to examine its safeguarding and reporting arrangements, and to make recommendations to ensure good practice for all its members and staff.
The review will be carried out by a specialist multi-disciplinary team from the iNEQE Safeguarding Group, drawing on their safeguarding, child protection and policing expertise.
"The review will be led by Mr Jim Gamble. The review will be conducted entirely independent of the DUP."
Mr Gamble is a former senior police officer who headed up Special Branch in Belfast before moving on to child protection.
The DUP said the terms of reference will be:
Conduct an independent review to establish what (if any) information was known within the DUP concerning allegations of inappropriate conduct relating to safeguarding by Jeffrey Donaldson. This will include who knew, when and from whom they learned it, the form in which it arose (eyewitness, formal complaint, disclosure, concern, rumour or warning), and what action was or was not taken.
Provide an independent and confidential facility for party members to come forward with related information, concerns or experiences relating to Jeffrey Donaldson during his time in the DUP.
Examine and review the DUP's safeguarding processes (including reporting mechanisms) and make recommendations to ensure good practice is followed by all members and staff.
The DUP said it "acted immediately" when Donaldson was first charged.
It added: "We believe in the rule of law and that justice must be obtained through our courts.
"We stand with the victims of his abuse and we salute their bravery and courage for speaking out.
"Regardless of the crime, we will always be on the side of the victim and as a society, we must do everything possible to encourage those who have been abused to come forward to the police and seek justice through our court system.
"As a consequence of his actions, Jeffrey Donaldson must now feel the full force of the law. He stands guilty of abusing and betraying the trust placed in him by many people over the years, including good honest colleagues in both our party and the Ulster Unionist Party as well as the wider community.
"While the DUP never received any report or complaint regarding improper behaviour or criminal behaviour, it is now clear, beyond doubt, that Jeffrey Donaldson abused various positions of power over many years from 1985 onwards and covered up his vile and manipulative behaviour.
"The work of the review has now commenced and the party does not intend to give a running commentary on it whilst it is ongoing respecting the fundamental independent nature of it
Sure to be independent of the DUP with an ex-Branch man running it ;)
My first thought also!
If you think Jim Gamble is going to cover up for a paedophile rapist or a paedophile rapist enabler just because they are in the DUP you are either very bitter or you need your head looked at.
Jeffrey is
Not On Normal Courtyard Exercise
Quote from: DaleCooper on July 10, 2026, 12:14:13 PMJeffrey is
Not On Normal Courtyard Exercise
Wonder is there a gaelic team?
Quote from: RedHand88 on July 10, 2026, 12:22:43 PMQuote from: DaleCooper on July 10, 2026, 12:14:13 PMJeffrey is
Not On Normal Courtyard Exercise
Wonder is there a gaelic team?
Doesn't Scullion do a lot of work with offenders in Maghaberry?
Quote from: RedHand88 on July 10, 2026, 11:53:03 AMIf you think Jim Gamble is going to cover up for a paedophile rapist or a paedophile rapist enabler just because they are in the DUP you are either very bitter or you need your head looked at.
It's a strange one for Gamble to take on, he'll definitely not want to have his reputation (for his current set up, not his special branch stuff) be tarnished by shying away from the hard questions and investigation from within the DUP. But not sure we'll ever hear the full findings
Hopefully he gets it done
Quote from: Armagh18 on July 10, 2026, 01:15:11 PMQuote from: RedHand88 on July 10, 2026, 12:22:43 PMQuote from: DaleCooper on July 10, 2026, 12:14:13 PMJeffrey is
Not On Normal Courtyard Exercise
Wonder is there a gaelic team?
Doesn't Scullion do a lot of work with offenders in Maghaberry?
They could make a goalkeeper out of Jeffrey yet.
https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/deputy-first-minister-insists-she-saw-no-signs-jeffrey-donaldson-was-a-danger-or-sexual-predator/a/158579215.html
Deputy First Minister Emma Little-Pengelly has said she doesn't know why an alleged victim of Jeffrey Donaldson said she warned her about the disgraced former DUP leader being a "danger."
It comes after a woman, who was once described by Ian Paisley Jr as "victim" of Donaldson, showed the Belfast Telegraph Facebook messages between her and a friend in 2020.
In the correspondence, the female, who is not one of the two women Donaldson was found guilty of abusing, claimed Ms Pengelly had cautioned her about the disgraced ex-DUP leader.
The deputy First Minister broke her silence on the claims in an interview with UTV.
Ms Pengelly said that she "absolutely" did not witness any disturbing behaviour by Donaldson.
She said: "I have looked back over that period of time. I cannot be clearer. Look, I can't speak for this woman. I can't explain what she was thinking whenever she said that.
"These are not my words but what I can say absolutely clearly... absolutely clearly is I seen absolutely nothing.
"I witnessed nothing at that time that gave me any cause of concern. I was not told anything about Jeffrey Donaldson that gave me any cause of concern.
"So in 2020, I did not believe that Jeffrey Donaldson was a danger to anyone. And if I had thought that he was a danger to anyone, not only would I have told people, but I would not have been friendly with Jeffrey Donaldson."
Ms Pengelly said she was shocked at what had been revealed.
"I feel really sick even saying his name because of that betrayal," she told UTV news.
"I did not know that this man was a sexual predator. I did not know that this man was a predator towards children.
"It is absolutely against every value that I would have if I'd known that and would not have gone to the police, would not have immediately severed all and any contact with this person."
In December of 2020, the young woman became angry when Ms Little-Pengelly posted "Happy Birthday Sir Jeff. Hope you had a lovely day!" on the then Lagan Valley MP's Facebook timeline.
The post was accompanied by a photograph of Emma Little-Pengelly, Donaldson and Arlene Foster, with Ms Little-Pengelly tagging Mrs Foster, who was DUP leader at the time.
The woman vented her anger at Ms Little-Pengelly's online post.
"I've tried with Emma but that's annoyed me tonight like," the message read.
"She's the one telling me he's a danger to me like and she's on wishing him happy bloody birthday shoes (sic) how highly she thinks of me going and doing that."
In earlier correspondence, the woman expressed her diminishing faith in the DUP.
"[Ms Little-Pengelly] is so protective over me lol like when ***** shouted at me she was like going to tear his hair out lol so I just don't even wanna tell her," a text from April 2020 read.
The following month, the young woman wrote: "I've just lost all complete faith in politics totally disillusioned. Like I'm loyal to the party, but like I mean honestly just so let down with Jeffrey etc."
Ms Little-Pengelly told UTV the revelations in the Donaldson trial were "absolutely shocking" as she said she never had any reason to believe he was an abuser.
"Up until his arrest, I didn't see anything that I would have given me any rise for concern in terms of him being a sexual offender, of him being a paedophile," Ms Little-Pengelly said.
"I was not told anything by anybody that would have given me any sense of that whatsoever. So this has been absolutely shocking."
No reason is given as to why Ms Little-Pengelly — as the young woman claimed — would allegedly believe Donaldson was "a danger" to her in the chain of messages seen by this newspaper
In communication with her friend, the young woman does not state she had shared her experience of Donaldson sending her unwanted messages with the deputy First Minister.
When initially contacted the DUP regarding the woman's claims, the party referred the Belfast Telegraph to Ms Little-Pengelly's legal team.
A statement from WP Tweed solicitors said: "We are instructed to inform you that our client categorically denies that she articulated that Mr Donaldson was a 'danger' to anyone.
"It is our client's emphatic position that she appears to have been entirely misrepresented in correspondence to which she was a complete stranger."
https://www.irishnews.com/news/northern-ireland/dup-mp-tells-young-unionists-they-can-learn-from-nationalism-and-republicanism-B3KSEB325FAQPO7CULOJBJDGHM/?fbclid=IwdGRjcATCx99jbGNrBMLHkGV4dG4DYWVtAjExAHNydGMGYXBwX2lkDDM1MDY4NTUzMTcyOAABHiJ1VMG6-EPSbtOqf0KGfRpLirjxgh4473pcSfB7ilYzyGc5YCRZOLhVtu-7_aem_jHm1pn2HYapa_jE2hzMizg
Great idea, and while they're at it expand it to the English so they can see what their ancestors were really like.
"Thirty years ago they decided that education was their top priority, and they have used their education system to ensure that their young people know their history, know what they're about, and want to advance in whatever walk of life they find themselves in.
Dear Carla,
Tell YOUR people to
1 stop Moygashel type behaviour
2 live in the 21st Century
Quote from: StephenC on July 14, 2026, 09:49:32 AM"Thirty years ago they decided that education was their top priority, and they have used their education system to ensure that their young people know their history, know what they're about, and want to advance in whatever walk of life they find themselves in.
In a constituency where Nationalists are clasing the gap all the time its amazing she doesn't have the foresight to reach out even just a little bit to try and protect her seat/job, instead she sticks to her own declining bigoted base
A bitter bigot is Carla.
Does she think all our parents sat down in a room and agreed to have their kids study hard? There was no opportunity without education for nationalists in our parents era. You look at east Belfast and factories etc things handed on a plate so no incentive to work hard and that has continued there are just no jobs now. Unionism has caused a lot of these problems for themselves- not nationalism.
https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/crime/pressure-mounts-on-dup-to-appoint-different-body-to-carry-out-review-into-paedophile-jeffrey-donaldson/a/158663395.html
Safeguarding expert Marcella Leonard is echoing calls from the Northern Ireland Survivor Council (NISC) for the DUP to appoint a new organisation to carry out a review into Jeffrey Donaldson's time in the party.
https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/picture-of-jeffrey-and-eleanor-donaldson-appears-on-belfast-bonfire/a/158623423.html
Picture of Jeffrey and Eleanor Donaldson appears on Belfast Bonfire
Quote from: imtommygunn on July 14, 2026, 10:21:34 AMA bitter bigot is Carla.
Does she think all our parents sat down in a room and agreed to have their kids study hard? There was no opportunity without education for nationalists in our parents era. You look at east Belfast and factories etc things handed on a plate so no incentive to work hard and that has continued there are just no jobs now. Unionism has caused a lot of these problems for themselves- not nationalism.
While ago I did work for a large factory in one such place. Entire workforce unionised but was very much on flavour.
The subbies on other hand the opposite abd were making serious dough doing non union hours etc and getting things done fast.
Quote from: Brendan on July 14, 2026, 10:08:51 AMQuote from: StephenC on July 14, 2026, 09:49:32 AM"Thirty years ago they decided that education was their top priority, and they have used their education system to ensure that their young people know their history, know what they're about, and want to advance in whatever walk of life they find themselves in.
In a constituency where Nationalists are clasing the gap all the time its amazing she doesn't have the foresight to reach out even just a little bit to try and protect her seat/job, instead she sticks to her own declining bigoted base
She is very safe for at least another 2 general elections. UB along with East Derry should both be chances for nationalism to sneak in but time andagain turnout is poor here on the green side
Quote from: JPGJOHNNYG on July 14, 2026, 11:35:50 AMQuote from: Brendan on July 14, 2026, 10:08:51 AMQuote from: StephenC on July 14, 2026, 09:49:32 AM"Thirty years ago they decided that education was their top priority, and they have used their education system to ensure that their young people know their history, know what they're about, and want to advance in whatever walk of life they find themselves in.
In a constituency where Nationalists are clasing the gap all the time its amazing she doesn't have the foresight to reach out even just a little bit to try and protect her seat/job, instead she sticks to her own declining bigoted base
She is very safe for at least another 2 general elections. UB along with East Derry should both be chances for nationalism to sneak in but time andagain turnout is poor here on the green side
I'd love SDLP and SF to step aside and let AP have a free run in Upper Bann.
Christ Carla never ceases to amaze. She spent last Friday in a courtroom as a solitary Orangeman challenged the PC's Drumcree ruling?! Did she not see the photo of this year's protest of approximately five lads? What a dedicated public servant she is!
Would be very interested to hear exactly what it is she wants in the curriculum.
Quote from: general_lee on July 14, 2026, 11:40:39 AMQuote from: JPGJOHNNYG on July 14, 2026, 11:35:50 AMQuote from: Brendan on July 14, 2026, 10:08:51 AMQuote from: StephenC on July 14, 2026, 09:49:32 AM"Thirty years ago they decided that education was their top priority, and they have used their education system to ensure that their young people know their history, know what they're about, and want to advance in whatever walk of life they find themselves in.
In a constituency where Nationalists are clasing the gap all the time its amazing she doesn't have the foresight to reach out even just a little bit to try and protect her seat/job, instead she sticks to her own declining bigoted base
She is very safe for at least another 2 general elections. UB along with East Derry should both be chances for nationalism to sneak in but time andagain turnout is poor here on the green side
I'd love SDLP and SF to step aside and let AP have a free run in Upper Bann.
Not so sure about Tennyson or the Alliance party for that matter these days, would prefer an agreed nationalist candidate but would never happen and the unionists would just rally round 1 candidate if there was any risk
In the handling areas the DUP have to fight the threat of the TUV and that's involves being ultra-Unionist.
I honestly believe they are sucking the life right out of people.. They and their like should be continually ignored, starving them of any oxygen that they need to live off, they thrive off what themus are doing, then it goes tit for tat..
I seen some seriously bad videos doing the rounds of what can only be described as twats stoking hatred and division
Sad
Quote from: StephenC on July 14, 2026, 09:49:32 AM"Thirty years ago they decided that education was their top priority, and they have used their education system to ensure that their young people know their history, know what they're about, and want to advance in whatever walk of life they find themselves in.
This.
Even when the DUP take a step forward, an acknowledgement that educational attainment needs to improve, it's still couched in Fenian conspiracy and zero sum. Not get your kids to college for their sake, it's themmuns are at it.
Quote from: gallsman on July 14, 2026, 11:54:59 AMChrist Carla never ceases to amaze. She spent last Friday in a courtroom as a solitary Orangeman challenged the PC's Drumcree ruling?! Did she not see the photo of this year's protest of approximately five lads? What a dedicated public servant she is!
Would be very interested to hear exactly what it is she wants in the curriculum.
She has sat in on planning committee meetings for ABC Council in attempts to stop bilingual street signage being erected on the Garvaghy Road. £90k+ of public funds the DUP pissed away on legal fees trying to block it. This is the f**king MP for Upper Bann. Given her penchant for shamelessly posing for photographs with loyalist terrorists and suspected murderers, nothing should surprise you about this odious ****.
Quote from: JPGJOHNNYG on July 14, 2026, 12:15:35 PMQuote from: general_lee on July 14, 2026, 11:40:39 AMQuote from: JPGJOHNNYG on July 14, 2026, 11:35:50 AMQuote from: Brendan on July 14, 2026, 10:08:51 AMQuote from: StephenC on July 14, 2026, 09:49:32 AM"Thirty years ago they decided that education was their top priority, and they have used their education system to ensure that their young people know their history, know what they're about, and want to advance in whatever walk of life they find themselves in.
In a constituency where Nationalists are clasing the gap all the time its amazing she doesn't have the foresight to reach out even just a little bit to try and protect her seat/job, instead she sticks to her own declining bigoted base
She is very safe for at least another 2 general elections. UB along with East Derry should both be chances for nationalism to sneak in but time andagain turnout is poor here on the green side
I'd love SDLP and SF to step aside and let AP have a free run in Upper Bann.
Not so sure about Tennyson or the Alliance party for that matter these days, would prefer an agreed nationalist candidate but would never happen and the unionists would just rally round 1 candidate if there was any risk
I would happily take anyone from Alliance if it meant the DUP never held Upper Bann ever again. See my previous reply to Gallsman
Lockhart now seems to be wee Seamy's buddy.
It's obvious that her latest education statement has been driven by him.
Quote from: gallsman on July 14, 2026, 11:54:59 AMChrist Carla never ceases to amaze. She spent last Friday in a courtroom as a solitary Orangeman challenged the PC's Drumcree ruling?! Did she not see the photo of this year's protest of approximately five lads? What a dedicated public servant she is!
Would be very interested to hear exactly what it is she wants in the curriculum.
What happened last week with the Drumcree thing? She was crowing about some sort of "victory".
Quote from: marty34 on July 14, 2026, 02:49:36 PMLockhart now seems to be wee Seamy's buddy.
It's obvious that her latest education statement has been driven by him.
Million dollar question is who is writing Seamy's cheques.
Quote from: AustinPowers on July 14, 2026, 03:22:17 PMQuote from: gallsman on July 14, 2026, 11:54:59 AMChrist Carla never ceases to amaze. She spent last Friday in a courtroom as a solitary Orangeman challenged the PC's Drumcree ruling?! Did she not see the photo of this year's protest of approximately five lads? What a dedicated public servant she is!
Would be very interested to hear exactly what it is she wants in the curriculum.
What happened last week with the Drumcree thing? She was crowing about some sort of "victory".
High Court judge has essentially said it's worth looking into further and has ordered the PC to disclose its various communications around decision to not let them past.
Some Orangemen with a microphone made a point of thanking Lockhart and a few others, including "Jamie Bryson LLB".
Quote from: general_lee on July 14, 2026, 02:46:55 PMQuote from: gallsman on July 14, 2026, 11:54:59 AMChrist Carla never ceases to amaze. She spent last Friday in a courtroom as a solitary Orangeman challenged the PC's Drumcree ruling?! Did she not see the photo of this year's protest of approximately five lads? What a dedicated public servant she is!
Would be very interested to hear exactly what it is she wants in the curriculum.
She has sat in on planning committee meetings for ABC Council in attempts to stop bilingual street signage being erected on the Garvaghy Road. £90k+ of public funds the DUP pissed away on legal fees trying to block it. This is the f**king MP for Upper Bann. Given her penchant for shamelessly posing for photographs with loyalist terrorists and suspected murderers, nothing should surprise you about this odious ****.
Carla is an absolute star.
I watch her social media ( don't follow and don't respond) but she is so shit scared of the TUV it's comedy.
She posts continuously remembering IRA victims, sometimes in her constituency, sometimes not.
No mention of the McGoldrick or Hamill murders ( strangely) or any murder carried out by loyalists/ RUC/UDR/ Glenanne gang / British forces.
Attacked Michelle O'Neill for a tweet wishing the N.I ladies team good luck in the Euros ( because O'Neill hadn't specifically used Northern Ireland in the tweet)
Not a word of condemnation in relation to the Moygashel bonfire.
Not a word of congratulations to Armagh on winning the 2024 All-Ireland ( she'd over a dozen constituents in the squad)
Her goto is to run to the base on everything.
Keep it up Carla.
She can't see the runaway train that is a border poll hurtling towards Unionism ( or that the British will sell unionists down the river like they always do).
So keep up the good work Carla....every day little by little, tweet by tweet, Facebook post by Facebook post you alienate moderate nationalists.
Keep running to that shrinking Loyalist base.
DEMOGRAPHICS.. you just got to love them!
She's living rent free in your head mate by the sounds of things
*Not a fan
Quote from: quit yo jibbajabba on July 15, 2026, 07:30:44 PMShe's living rent free in your head mate by the sounds of things
*Not a fan
What a stupid post. If anytime you criticise or comment about a politician, "They are living rent free in your head" you are only showing that you have nothing to offer on the discourse.
Quote from: Windmill abu on July 15, 2026, 11:22:08 PMQuote from: quit yo jibbajabba on July 15, 2026, 07:30:44 PMShe's living rent free in your head mate by the sounds of things
*Not a fan
What a stupid post. If anytime you criticise or comment about a politician, "They are living rent free in your head" you are only showing that you have nothing to offer on the discourse.
Thanks Windmill. What's your thoughts on Carla. Be as detailed as possible please
Quote from: quit yo jibbajabba on July 15, 2026, 11:43:38 PMQuote from: Windmill abu on July 15, 2026, 11:22:08 PMQuote from: quit yo jibbajabba on July 15, 2026, 07:30:44 PMShe's living rent free in your head mate by the sounds of things
*Not a fan
What a stupid post. If anytime you criticise or comment about a politician, "They are living rent free in your head" you are only showing that you have nothing to offer on the discourse.
Thanks Windmill. What's your thoughts on Carla. Be as detailed as possible please
I gave some detailed thoughts and the reasoning behind them and you replied with a single ( snide) line.
Why don't you give us your thoughts?
She's a bigot. She posts on fb to gain favour with her crowd and rile up the easy to rile
The fact you go seeking her posts to get annoyed and then come out with your "post by post, tweet by tweet nonsense as if she would somehow be on here reading I found quite amusing. I made a flippant comment (I should have known better than to have engaged on politics on here lol) but do me one thing have a wee look at the length of your post and think is she really deserves that airspace in your head
I wouldn't go seeking her posts myself, they just appear on my feed (algorithms etc), I'm the fool for reading them I suppose.
My dislike of her would be she is a throwback to how it was with that lot. She had little humanity and the staunchist of unionists you could see in modern politics.
She wants division.
Her playbook is to be sectarian.
Then when some anonymous twitter handle comments on her appearance (which i don't condone), ties herself to the proverbial martyrs stake looking for sympathy. Therefore best ignored. But did she call out Vance (the Unionist one) or Katie Hopkins appearance attacks on Naomi Long.
Jeffrey is appealing his sex offending convictions
BBC News - Former DUP leader Jeffrey Donaldson to appeal sex offence convictions
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c2046e37ewyo
Just waiting for him to get off on a technicality now....
Quote from: quit yo jibbajabba on July 17, 2026, 04:25:21 PMJust waiting for him to get off on a technicality now....
.
The courts didn't spell his name in Irish, maybe?
Or left out a fada?
Quote from: quit yo jibbajabba on July 17, 2026, 04:25:21 PMJust waiting for him to get off on a technicality now....
Thankfully that doesn't happen
What selection of jurors at this stage with all the other stuff surfacing would be able to come to any other decision?
If he is allowed to appeal is it a full run of the previous trial, putting those girls through the wringer again?
Quote from: David McKeown on July 17, 2026, 05:23:27 PMQuote from: quit yo jibbajabba on July 17, 2026, 04:25:21 PMJust waiting for him to get off on a technicality now....
Thankfully that doesn't happen
Great. What's likely to happen/worst case scenario
David deffo one my top ten fav solicitors 😜
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on July 17, 2026, 05:45:01 PMWhat selection of jurors at this stage with all the other stuff surfacing would be able to come to any other decision?
Long way away from worrying about that.
Quote from: Dougal Maguire on July 17, 2026, 05:47:05 PMIf he is allowed to appeal is it a full run of the previous trial, putting those girls through the wringer again?
Possibly two if the reasons for the appeal being reported are accurate
https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/courts/jeffrey-donaldson-lodges-appeal-against-rape-and-sexual-assault-convictions-but-faces-battle-to-overturn-verdicts/a/158884886.html
Ulster Unionist leader Jon Burrows responded to the news of Donaldson's intention to appeal by saying: "This man is an utter disgrace, as is his wife Eleanor. His eventual sentencing should reflect his complete lack of remorse."
A successful appeal would have to be founded on points of law which Donaldson claims mean he didn't get a fair trial.
The judge's decision to run the trial of the facts alongside a criminal trial is likely to form the core of Donaldson's appeal. Even if he was to succeed in quashing all the convictions, Donaldson would not simply walk free.
Instead, he would face a retrial before a new jury. There would be no way to have the case heard by a judge alone, and it would not be possible to move the case outside Northern Ireland.
Quote from: quit yo jibbajabba on July 17, 2026, 06:22:56 PMQuote from: David McKeown on July 17, 2026, 05:23:27 PMQuote from: quit yo jibbajabba on July 17, 2026, 04:25:21 PMJust waiting for him to get off on a technicality now....
Thankfully that doesn't happen
Great. What's likely to happen/worst case scenario
David deffo one my top ten fav solicitors 😜
I hope I'm 8th.
What happens now is that the defence have lodged a written argument for leave to appeal. That argument will be considered along with the recording or transcript of any relevant part of the trial by a Single High Court Judge. The Judge will consider whether the argument discloses an arguable case with a reasonable prospect of success that the conviction is unsafe.
If the Judge rules they have then an oral hearing will take place before a three Judge panel chaired by either a Lord Justice of Appeal or the Chief Justice. That panel will decide if the conviction was safe. If it was then the appeal will be dismissed. If it was not safe they will quash the conviction. The Crown will then decide whether to seek a retrial. That will be guided to a considerable degree by the reason for the decision and by the views of the complainants.
If leave is refused by the single judge the defence may either abandon the appeal at that stage or can ask the three Judge panel to consider the issue of leave (which if granted will then proceed as above).
Again the test isn't has their been an error of law. The test to be applied is is the conviction unsafe.
Quote from: seafoid on July 17, 2026, 09:53:30 PMhttps://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/courts/jeffrey-donaldson-lodges-appeal-against-rape-and-sexual-assault-convictions-but-faces-battle-to-overturn-verdicts/a/158884886.html
Ulster Unionist leader Jon Burrows responded to the news of Donaldson's intention to appeal by saying: "This man is an utter disgrace, as is his wife Eleanor. His eventual sentencing should reflect his complete lack of remorse."
A successful appeal would have to be founded on points of law which Donaldson claims mean he didn't get a fair trial.
The judge's decision to run the trial of the facts alongside a criminal trial is likely to form the core of Donaldson's appeal. Even if he was to succeed in quashing all the convictions, Donaldson would not simply walk free.
Instead, he would face a retrial before a new jury. There would be no way to have the case heard by a judge alone, and it would not be possible to move the case outside Northern Ireland.
A lot of this isn't right. Burrows again showing a complete ignorance of the criminal justice system too.
Quote from: David McKeown on July 17, 2026, 11:01:31 PMQuote from: seafoid on July 17, 2026, 09:53:30 PMhttps://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/courts/jeffrey-donaldson-lodges-appeal-against-rape-and-sexual-assault-convictions-but-faces-battle-to-overturn-verdicts/a/158884886.html
Ulster Unionist leader Jon Burrows responded to the news of Donaldson's intention to appeal by saying: "This man is an utter disgrace, as is his wife Eleanor. His eventual sentencing should reflect his complete lack of remorse."
A successful appeal would have to be founded on points of law which Donaldson claims mean he didn't get a fair trial.
The judge's decision to run the trial of the facts alongside a criminal trial is likely to form the core of Donaldson's appeal. Even if he was to succeed in quashing all the convictions, Donaldson would not simply walk free.
Instead, he would face a retrial before a new jury. There would be no way to have the case heard by a judge alone, and it would not be possible to move the case outside Northern Ireland.
A lot of this isn't right. Burrows again showing a complete ignorance of the criminal justice system too.
A lot of the time they know right but just throw out quotes that they believe the public want to hear.
Interesting story here.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cevmyg2jjxxo
I wonder who the Minister is? :o
Quote from: marty34 on July 21, 2026, 01:03:26 PMInteresting story here.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cevmyg2jjxxo
I wonder who the Minister is? :o
If the Shinners had been in charge of Education they would have been pulling the same strokes.
Quote from: LC on July 21, 2026, 02:22:08 PMQuote from: marty34 on July 21, 2026, 01:03:26 PMInteresting story here.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cevmyg2jjxxo
I wonder who the Minister is? :o
If the Shinners had been in charge of Education they would have been pulling the same strokes.
Do you mean no funding for an Ulster Scots school?
Quote from: LC on July 21, 2026, 02:22:08 PMQuote from: marty34 on July 21, 2026, 01:03:26 PMInteresting story here.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cevmyg2jjxxo
I wonder who the Minister is? :o
If the Shinners had been in charge of Education they would have been pulling the same strokes.
Wise up. This £6m was a fraction of the education budget ring-fenced for Irish medium education. The DUP have played the sectarian card shamelessly once again. SF ministers have never taken funds ring-fenced for loyalist or unionist communities and allocated elsewhere. Don't post on an empty head.
Most money moved to Special provision in schools.
Nationalist politicians aren't making much of a fuss about this.
Totally useless.
Quote from: marty34 on July 22, 2026, 08:11:34 AMNationalist politicians aren't making much of a fuss about this.
Totally useless.
It's the summer break, can't be sending press releases from the beach
Quote from: Wildweasel74 on July 22, 2026, 12:30:46 AMMost money moved to Special provision in schools.
If this is where the money is needed then so be it.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c3ryp29l1pqo
Feel for the parents in these situations and they deserve all the support they can get.
Quote from: Wildweasel74 on July 22, 2026, 12:30:46 AMMost money moved to Special provision in schools.
Yet a school in Derry got a 3G pitch they didn't even apply for!
Call it for what it is.
Quote from: LC on July 21, 2026, 02:22:08 PMQuote from: marty34 on July 21, 2026, 01:03:26 PMInteresting story here.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cevmyg2jjxxo
I wonder who the Minister is? :o
If the Shinners had been in charge of Education they would have been pulling the same strokes.
Unfortunately that's not the case. For some reason the Shinners seem to be determined to play fair while the DUP does it's utmost to keep its constituency happy which is why, for instance, they brought out a community hall refurbished Grant which was skewed to favour orange halls and church halls. They also introduced a grant scheme to put 3G pitches at orange halls and one at aughnacloy high school which was not justified but was built as Maurice Morrow was minister. You've got to hand it to them, meanwhile the SF ministers can't order a Chinese if their officials tell them they can only have an Indian and they're eating at home if the DUP decides that Indian is off the menu too
U know nothing about the 3G pitch, i do and the bckground. U just go by whats in the papers.
Quote from: Wildweasel74 on July 23, 2026, 12:18:24 AMU know nothing about the 3G pitch, i do and the bckground. U just go by whats in the papers.
And how do you know that
Quote from: Wildweasel74 on July 23, 2026, 12:18:24 AMU know nothing about the 3G pitch, i do and the bckground. U just go by whats in the papers.
Which one? I remember the Lisneal fuss but I think there was also a CCMS school that got big money for a pitch too also having alleged to have bypassed due process.
3G pitch built beside orange hall between Ballygawley & Augher, they even burn a bonfire every year at it on the 12th.
https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/northern-ireland/senior-orangeman-and-top-dup-figures-eye-irish-government-cash-for-william-of-orange-trail/a/159037553.html
senior Orangeman and leading DUP politicians have discussed accessing Irish Government funding for a new 'William of Orange trail'.
Gavin Robinson and Mervyn Gibson, who is the Grand Secretary of the Grand Orange Lodge of Ireland, met with Communities Minister Gordon Lyons in November 2025.
King William III's victory at the Battle of the Boyne on July 12, 1690, is celebrated each year with Twelfth parades across Northern Ireland.
In July 1998, the Irish Government purchased Oldbridge House in Co Meath — the location of the battle — and developed it as a heritage site. It is currently undergoing a €10m regeneration, paid for through the Shared Island Fund.
Read more
Is there a taller gravestone in Northern Ireland? Historian lays down challenge to public
Details released under the Freedom of Information (FoI) Act show that Mr Gibson, Mr Robinson and Mr Lyons discussed a number of topics at Causeway Exchange last November.
Notes state: "Development of historic William of Orange trail across the island of Ireland — benefits for tourism, and potential for Shared Island funding.
"Need for further scoping and development and the potential engagement with councils to seek assistance with development."
DUP leader Gavin Robinson (centre) during the Twelfth of July celebrations © PA Radar
When asked for further comment, the Department for Communities (DfC) said: "For the details on this trail, you would need to speak to Mervyn Gibson."
The Grand Orange Lodge of Ireland was contacted but has not responded. :-\
TBF, it is one of the more significant historical events on the island.
The question is - would a balanced view be presented in any facilities managed by the OO?
Also - like it or lump it - if we are serious about a UI, then even the OO will have to come along for the ride in some shape or form. Helping out here could go at least some way to dispelling the dublin bogeyman myth the OO would love to portray.
The Republic has all the money.now. it can afford to be generous.
"Dublin bogeyman" with €s.
The "Grand Secretary" and his "Grand Orange Lodge" beginning to see the future?
Quote from: Rossfan on July 23, 2026, 01:01:56 PMbeginning to see the future?
Prob not for this thread - but I read with interest earlier the long term planning going on in Dublin to mitigate overly large reliance on corporation tax as an income stream.
Dublin are starting to put aside money into long term investment (like the Norwegian sovereign wealth fund only on a much smaller scale) for if and when the status quo changes.
The UK? They had the north sea oil. All pissed away. Now financially broke, politically unstable and nowhere to go. Do you see any medium term planning in UK politics now never mind long term?
If you were a betting man and had to pick one of the two economies to be part of in 2050... it'd be the Irish one every time.
Quote from: RadioGAAGAA on July 23, 2026, 12:52:56 PMTBF, it is one of the more significant historical events on the island.
The question is - would a balanced view be presented in any facilities managed by the OO?
Also - like it or lump it - if we are serious about a UI, then even the OO will have to come along for the ride in some shape or form. Helping out here could go at least some way to dispelling the dublin bogeyman myth the OO would love to portray.
I went to see the walls of Derry in the 90s. The Unionist explanations were very ideological. There was nothing Irish about them.
Unionists will have to be more generous in a UI. The ideology is bullshit.
DUP minister wants to pull funding for the Féile an Phobail because it is not inclusive.
The same DUP minister that pours money into Orange Fest.
By the way, the decision by Féile an Phobail to exclude a Woman's rights group is the most stupidest thing ever.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/clyej1ln8ydo
Trans people's rights do not trump non-trans women's right.
Quote from: Orior on July 24, 2026, 10:32:50 AMDUP minister wants to pull funding for the Féile an Phobail because it is not inclusive.
The same DUP minister that pours money into Orange Fest.
By the way, the decision by Féile an Phobail to exclude a Woman's rights group is the most stupidest thing ever.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/clyej1ln8ydo
Trans people's rights do not trump non-trans women's right.
For me Féile got this one wrong. Whilst I don't necessarily agree with the views of this group, you should still allow them a platform and ensure the panel is balanced and voices are allowed to challenge them.
As for the DUP, the hypocrisy is dripping out of them.
It's the wrong decision, not because I'm against either or, it's because these things need to be debated..
It's also important to bring in the OO to explain their culture
Bring in the PNSI and all the other sides of this place to have honest open debates..
You didn't decide to be born where you came from, it just happened, growing up on one side or the other shaped our views, until all views are challenged then we get nowhere and this ban on the women's group is an own goal, as the haters get another chance to hate, the vicious sectarian cycle continues.
Quote from: Orior on July 24, 2026, 10:32:50 AMDUP minister wants to pull funding for the Féile an Phobail because it is not inclusive.
The same DUP minister that pours money into Orange Fest.
By the way, the decision by Féile an Phobail to exclude a Woman's rights group is the most stupidest thing ever.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/clyej1ln8ydo
Trans people's rights do not trump non-trans women's right.
Are they genuinely a womens rights group- which would be totally fine- or are they a we hate trans people group? Hard to know although you're probably better letting them speak either way and having someone debate them properly.
Give them enough rope and they'll hang themselves
Or
If they are against some humans having human rights give them no oxygen.
Quote from: Armagh18 on July 24, 2026, 10:49:52 AMQuote from: Orior on July 24, 2026, 10:32:50 AMDUP minister wants to pull funding for the Féile an Phobail because it is not inclusive.
The same DUP minister that pours money into Orange Fest.
By the way, the decision by Féile an Phobail to exclude a Woman's rights group is the most stupidest thing ever.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/clyej1ln8ydo
Trans people's rights do not trump non-trans women's right.
Are they genuinely a womens rights group- which would be totally fine- or are they a we hate trans people group? Hard to know although you're probably better letting them speak either way and having someone debate them properly.
You have to assume that whoever booked them did a basic check.
The issue here is FnP folded when an online mob got organised. That is a bad precedent to set.
We now have the DUP, of all people, having a reasonable higher moral ground position on equality grounds.
Quote from: Rossfan on July 24, 2026, 11:17:08 AMGive them enough rope and they'll hang themselves
Or
If they are against some humans having human rights give them no oxygen.
The trans people that are against womens rights or the women that are against trans rights?
My post said human rights.
Women and transgender people are humans.
By the way who are the " trans people against women's rights"?
You jumped to this group opposing humans having human rights fairly quickly in fairness. How did you get there?
Feile did the right thing. This is a hate group no doubt with links to Christian right in US. It is difficult enough for trans community, particularly young trans people, without platforming people like this in a festival celebrating culture. Of course the usual bigots in DUP/TUV/UUP will pile on along with the bible bashers and craw-thumpers. If they want a stage to spread hate, let them feck off to an Orange Hall.
Quote from: weareros on July 24, 2026, 01:47:25 PMFeile did the right thing. This is a hate group no doubt with links to Christian right in US. It is difficult enough for trans community, particularly young trans people, without platforming people like this in a festival celebrating culture. Of course the usual bigots in DUP/TUV/UUP will pile on along with the bible bashers and craw-thumpers. If they want a stage to spread hate, let them feck off to an Orange Hall.
would disagree with the decision
give them enough rope to hang themselves.
debate should be encouraged not censored
reality whilst we should support trans rights etc we also need to address fears which have been proferred
Féile an Phobail has done unreal work in west Belfast this past 25 years.
As they started out via debate and discussions, they shouldn't be narrowing it down now.
Quote from: marty34 on July 24, 2026, 02:37:06 PMFéile an Phobail has done unreal work in west Belfast this past 25 years.
As they started out via debate and discussions, they shouldn't be narrowing it down now.
You dont debate nazifascists like jk rowling
Quote from: DaleCooper on July 24, 2026, 03:13:48 PMQuote from: marty34 on July 24, 2026, 02:37:06 PMFéile an Phobail has done unreal work in west Belfast this past 25 years.
As they started out via debate and discussions, they shouldn't be narrowing it down now.
You dont debate nazifascists like jk rowling
Ah come on
Quote from: DaleCooper on July 24, 2026, 03:13:48 PMQuote from: marty34 on July 24, 2026, 02:37:06 PMFéile an Phobail has done unreal work in west Belfast this past 25 years.
As they started out via debate and discussions, they shouldn't be narrowing it down now.
You dont debate nazifascists like jk rowling
True but FanP didn't start out like that. Imagine that attitude starting off - it would never have took off the ground.
Quote from: DaleCooper on July 24, 2026, 03:13:48 PMYou dont debate nazifascists like jk rowling
Just f**king lol.
Quote from: DaleCooper on July 24, 2026, 03:13:48 PMQuote from: marty34 on July 24, 2026, 02:37:06 PMFéile an Phobail has done unreal work in west Belfast this past 25 years.
As they started out via debate and discussions, they shouldn't be narrowing it down now.
You dont debate nazifascists like jk rowling
See you caught a few bites.
Well done. Can't wait to the schools are back.
Was the Stormont Sport/Culture minister at the AI Final?
https://x.com/JonTonge/status/2081635394844577945
·
46m
Latest @LucidTalk
@BelTel
poll compared to 2022 Assembly Election first preference % vote shares SF 22% - 7
UUP 16% +5
DUP 15% - 6
SDLP 13% +4
APNI 10% -3.5
TUV 12% + 4.5
GPNI 5% + 3
AONTU 3% +1.5 PBP
Unionists 43
Nationalists 38
Other 15
Not much hope of a "Border poll" any time soon☹️
Must be 4 don't knows.
Quote from: Rossfan on July 27, 2026, 09:07:12 AMUnionists 43
Nationalists 38
Other 15
Not much hope of a "Border poll" any time soon☹️
Must be 4 don't knows.
I'd say you're delighted
You'd say wrong then.
Obtaining and winning a border poll is akin to playing against 16 men, it'll need to be a surefire 60:40 win before the thing is called at which point it becomes a formality, could be another 25 years yet as Westminster who would love to de-couple aren't remotely competent
Quote from: Rossfan on July 27, 2026, 09:07:12 AMUnionists 43
Nationalists 38
Other 15
Not much hope of a "Border poll" any time soon☹️
Must be 4 don't knows.
Well pbp bring it up to 40 so it and has been for a good 15yrs now all about the alliance and greens
Quote from: JPGJOHNNYG on July 27, 2026, 09:52:44 AMQuote from: Rossfan on July 27, 2026, 09:07:12 AMUnionists 43
Nationalists 38
Other 15
Not much hope of a "Border poll" any time soon☹️
Must be 4 don't knows.
Well pbp bring it up to 40 so it and has been for a good 15yrs now all about the alliance and greens
I'd say the 10% going to Greens, Aontu and PBP is primarily a nationalist vote so that's 45% not going to Unionist/Alliance.
Quote from: weareros on July 27, 2026, 10:12:13 AMQuote from: JPGJOHNNYG on July 27, 2026, 09:52:44 AMQuote from: Rossfan on July 27, 2026, 09:07:12 AMUnionists 43
Nationalists 38
Other 15
Not much hope of a "Border poll" any time soon☹️
Must be 4 don't knows.
Well pbp bring it up to 40 so it and has been for a good 15yrs now all about the alliance and greens
I'd say the 10% going to Greens, Aontu and PBP is primarily a nationalist vote so that's 45% not going to Unionist/Alliance.
Add to that a good chunk of Alliance voters could be Nationalists in places with 0 chance of a green politician getting in. We're not that far away- as ever it's the middle ground that'll need convincing.
Quote from: weareros on July 27, 2026, 10:12:13 AMQuote from: JPGJOHNNYG on July 27, 2026, 09:52:44 AMQuote from: Rossfan on July 27, 2026, 09:07:12 AMUnionists 43
Nationalists 38
Other 15
Not much hope of a "Border poll" any time soon☹️
Must be 4 don't knows.
Well pbp bring it up to 40 so it and has been for a good 15yrs now all about the alliance and greens
I'd say the 10% going to Greens, Aontu and PBP is primarily a nationalist vote so that's 45% not going to Unionist/Alliance.
Probably correct regarding the greens. Alliance are also much more 'Green' than 20 yrs ago which can be seen in how their voters transfer heavily to nationalist parties, unfortunately they also by and large seem happy with status quo and certainly are not going to be actively chasing a UI.
Quote from: weareros on July 27, 2026, 10:12:13 AMQuote from: JPGJOHNNYG on July 27, 2026, 09:52:44 AMQuote from: Rossfan on July 27, 2026, 09:07:12 AMUnionists 43
Nationalists 38
Other 15
Not much hope of a "Border poll" any time soon☹️
Must be 4 don't knows.
Well pbp bring it up to 40 so it and has been for a good 15yrs now all about the alliance and greens
I'd say the 10% going to Greens, Aontu and PBP is primarily a nationalist vote so that's 45% not going to Unionist/Alliance.
No one will really know until an actual poll takes place.
SF drifting badly. Poor performance in Stormont. Just going through the motions. In 26 counties, steady enough but mixed messaging. I think they need a re-boot.
DUP drifting after Donaldson. But conversely TUV gaining on this.
UUP getting the Beattie bounce.
Greens and Alliance where you'd expect them to be. But will need to make a stand, one way or the other, come border poll time. Can't be all things to all men forever.
Aontú/PBP are not gaining much on their 2/3%.
But I can see unionists having a pact in May '27 to tighten things up and win a few more seats and re-gain FM role.
Quote from: marty34 on July 27, 2026, 10:22:50 AMBut I can see unionists having a pact in May '27 to tighten things up and win a few more seats and re-gain FM role.
In the original Stormont model it was the total unionist and nationalist votes that determined the FM. But SF and the DUP subsequently carved it up in the St Andrews agreement, so that the biggest party got FM. So unless the unionists actually merge then it is the biggest of them that get FM. At this point they can all aim to be the biggest unionist party.
Pacts or merging parties is a bad idea for unionism. It will work in a few seats for Westminster like upper Bann and East Derry to stop SF sneaking in but for stv elections like in the assembly it's counterproductive. Unionist complain their votes are shredded among parties during the transfers but any loss is gained by offering more choice and getting people out to vote for a certain party who wouldn't vote for another.
That's right. Getting people out to vote is unionism biggest electoral issue.
Quote from: tiempo on July 27, 2026, 09:19:58 AMObtaining and winning a border poll is akin to playing against 16 men, it'll need to be a surefire 60:40 win before the thing is called at which point it becomes a formality, could be another 25 years yet as Westminster who would love to de-couple aren't remotely competent
100% and a few reasons for it.
If it doesn't happen first time around, you'll have the devil of a time getting it again.
Look at the Scots. If the'd had their referendum in 2017 instead of 2014 the result would almost certainly have been different.
If it does happen on a razor thin majority, it'll be all the harder to drag the "no" vote into making it work for everyone.
Quote from: JPGJOHNNYG on July 27, 2026, 09:52:44 AMQuote from: Rossfan on July 27, 2026, 09:07:12 AMUnionists 43
Nationalists 38
Other 15
Not much hope of a "Border poll" any time soon☹️
Must be 4 don't knows.
Well pbp bring it up to 40 so it and has been for a good 15yrs now all about the alliance and greens
Somebody on Sluggerotoole has done the prospective seats by constituency
Sinn Féin 24,
DUP 15,
SDLP 15,
UUP 13,
TUV 9,
Alliance 9,
Greens 3
Independent Unionists 2.
so Unionists 39, Nationalists 39 and 12 Others, but maybe green enough others.
It's a stalemate no matter who is FM... like it or lump it this place is staying put, a lot of years ago I took the approach/mindset I'm happy where I am, I'm Irish, I live in Ireland, one government telling me what to do and how to live my life won't make me feel any more Irish or less Irish
The thing that worries me more and more is the continued sectarian stuff being put out on social media, I am persuading my kids to leave this shit hole
Minorities are amplified though. You look at for example Elon musk saying the uk is on the brink of civil war. Social media very far removed from reality. There are still very bigoted pockets but they are getting fewer and further between.
I see that last week the lovely lovely Carla Loveheart went to meet some pupils of Boys Model in North Belfast. While there, she told them that Catholics fare much better because they use education and have one religion, one sport and one political party. I would love to hear what the headmaster thought of Carla's performance. Perhaps she would have been better telling the boys to stop building massive bonfires and read a book.
Quote from: imtommygunn on July 27, 2026, 04:38:54 PMMinorities are amplified though. You look at for example Elon musk saying the uk is on the brink of civil war. Social media very far removed from reality. There are still very bigoted pockets but they are getting fewer and further between.
Thought he looked a bit of a tit when the English reporter asked him when was the last time he was in the UK and he had to admit it had been a few years.
100% there are alot of idiots who believe it all and think there is an jihad incoming just over the horizon.
Quote from: Orior on July 27, 2026, 05:35:48 PMI see that last week the lovely lovely Carla Loveheart went to meet some pupils of Boys Model in North Belfast. While there, she told them that Catholics fare much better because they use education and have one religion, one sport and one political party. I would love to hear what the headmaster thought of Carla's performance. Perhaps she would have been better telling the boys to stop building massive bonfires and read a book.
She forgot a few other differences
(https://prod-img.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/public/incoming/onakfv-derry-girls-do-some-brainstorming/alternates/WIDTH_1440/Derry%20Girls%20do%20some%20brainstorming)
Quote from: Orior on July 27, 2026, 05:35:48 PMI see that last week the lovely lovely Carla Loveheart went to meet some pupils of Boys Model in North Belfast. While there, she told them that Catholics fare much better because they use education and have one religion, one sport and one political party. I would love to hear what the headmaster thought of Carla's performance. Perhaps she would have been better telling the boys to stop building massive bonfires and read a book.
It feels like she believes all of "them 'uns" sat down together years ago and said let's get educated and then we'll be better than them. Maybe look after your own house first Carla...
Quote from: imtommygunn on July 27, 2026, 10:23:26 PMQuote from: Orior on July 27, 2026, 05:35:48 PMI see that last week the lovely lovely Carla Loveheart went to meet some pupils of Boys Model in North Belfast. While there, she told them that Catholics fare much better because they use education and have one religion, one sport and one political party. I would love to hear what the headmaster thought of Carla's performance. Perhaps she would have been better telling the boys to stop building massive bonfires and read a book.
It feels like she believes all of "them 'uns" sat down together years ago and said let's get educated and then we'll be better than them. Maybe look after your own house first Carla...
It's embarrassing that she felt the need to state the bleeding obvious, in that, education works, there are still ding bats on both sides but the gurning is awful.. as for one sport, that's bollocks, from soccer to basketball to athletics and whatever else it's sad that using that as a stick to fuel division is a bad look on the Model to allow that..
Most of the stuff she comes out with is most likely disingenuous crap to get votes. Either that or she's stupid. Neither of them are good options. A vile bigot.
Quote from: imtommygunn on July 28, 2026, 08:20:14 AMMost of the stuff she comes out with is most likely disingenuous crap to get votes. Either that or she's stupid. Neither of them are good options. A vile bigot.
It's definitely both. But it works in that part of the world.
DUP are panicking looking at the TUV coming fast up the inside shoulder. Hence this past year, they're attacking everything Irish.
Strange thing is on the recent poll is I thought most of their vote slipage would go to the TUV but I see the UUP, under Burrows, has picked up a bit of that slack. He's drfting into DUP Lite terrority now with some of his statements.
So the DUP are under pressure from both unionist flanks now.
Quote from: marty34 on July 28, 2026, 08:46:17 AMDUP are panicking looking at the TUV coming fast up the inside shoulder. Hence this past year, they're attacking everything Irish.
Strange thing is on the recent poll is I thought most of their vote slipage would go to the TUV but I see the UUP, under Beattie, has picked up a bit of that slack. He's drfting into DUP Lite terrority now with some of his statements.
So the DUP are under pressure from both unionist flanks now.
Burrows I presume you mean.
Stupid question, but are there any material differences in any of the three policy wise?
Quote from: johnnycool on July 28, 2026, 09:02:20 AMQuote from: marty34 on July 28, 2026, 08:46:17 AMDUP are panicking looking at the TUV coming fast up the inside shoulder. Hence this past year, they're attacking everything Irish.
Strange thing is on the recent poll is I thought most of their vote slipage would go to the TUV but I see the UUP, under Beattie, has picked up a bit of that slack. He's drfting into DUP Lite terrority now with some of his statements.
So the DUP are under pressure from both unionist flanks now.
Burrows I presume you mean.
Stupid question, but are there any material differences in any of the three policy wise?
Sorry, correct JC.
Quote from: johnnycool on July 28, 2026, 09:02:20 AMQuote from: marty34 on July 28, 2026, 08:46:17 AMDUP are panicking looking at the TUV coming fast up the inside shoulder. Hence this past year, they're attacking everything Irish.
Strange thing is on the recent poll is I thought most of their vote slipage would go to the TUV but I see the UUP, under Beattie, has picked up a bit of that slack. He's drfting into DUP Lite terrority now with some of his statements.
So the DUP are under pressure from both unionist flanks now.
Burrows I presume you mean.
Stupid question, but are there any material differences in any of the three policy wise?
No real differences policy wise other than who can shout 'No Surrender' the loudest....
In a nutshell!
Meanwhile
https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/comment/news-analysis/in-power-with-no-punch-sinn-feins-failure-to-take-the-gloves-off-with-dup-is-costing-it-dearly/a/159229797.html.
Can't see it all but the headline says it all.
SF are in docile mode as no-one is more expert in shitting on Unionism than Unionists and Westminster
Its a battle of hearts and minds going forward while Unionism continues its long campaign against minds
Am beginning to see Sinn Fein as useless as the DUP. Not 1 thing done of note since they been bck. The new Decade new approach has been a shit show and they can take their fair share of the blame for it.
Sabotaging from within, both sides happily rubbishing each other, really starting to think it's staged ;D
Quote from: Wildweasel74 on July 29, 2026, 11:20:58 PMAm beginning to see Sinn Fein as useless as the DUP. Not 1 thing done of note since they been bck. The new Decade new approach has been a shit show and they can take their fair share of the blame for it.
For me Sinn Fein have become complacent in government just assuming people will vote for them .
And they would be correct as all thats needed is bit of RaRa /themmuns Kayfabe round election time and its usually enough to get them over the line.
Did anyone watch the interview Pengelly did with BBC, it's ok YouTube. She remembers IRA violence, remembers the outrage at 5 when Thatcher signed the Anglo Irish Agreement. Asked about her father and the Ulster Resistance, oh no she was only 5/6, she wouldn't remember that. Her father has always said it's not true. Turned it off after that.
Quote from: p3427977 on July 30, 2026, 04:47:46 PMDid anyone watch the interview Pengelly did with BBC, it's ok YouTube. She remembers IRA violence, remembers the outrage at 5 when Thatcher signed the Anglo Irish Agreement. Asked about her father and the Ulster Resistance, oh no she was only 5/6, she wouldn't remember that. Her father has always said it's not true. Turned it off after that.
Yes I listened to it on redlines podcast she also didn't have any recollection of any Donaldson antics which seems a bit of a stretch as his drinking on nights out seems pretty epic. Very selective memory ;D
Who wrote Pengelly's speech at the Fleadh yesterday?
Quote from: Rossfan on August 03, 2026, 01:59:58 PMWho wrote Pengelly's speech at the Fleadh yesterday?
Some say, despite her background, she has a bit of a grá for Irish culture. Eamon Mallie wrote this about her in Irish Times a while back.
###
He points to a poetry circle that he started during the years of Covid as offering evidence to back up his belief that Little-Pengelly deserves to be given a chance by nationalists and republicans.
He had invited well-known people to read poems online. The DUP's Peter Weir read one, but quite a few others in the party declined.
"I rang [her]. By nine o'clock that night she had sent a video recording of her reading one of Trinity College professor Eiléan Ní Chuilleanáin's poems. And she chose it. I would guarantee that there is not another member of the DUP who would know the work of Eiléan Ní Chuilleanáin. She's much more cross-culturally aware than any DUP people I know," he says.
Sammy Wilson investigated by standards watchdog BBC (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cdx8qxwl8l9o)
Quote from: GTP on August 03, 2026, 03:38:43 PMSammy Wilson investigated by standards watchdog BBC (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cdx8qxwl8l9o)
...again.
Like Paisley Óg, he likes the odd holiday I'm sure.
Jim Shannon in trouble for assaulting a woman
Quote from: Brendan on August 17, 2026, 03:04:39 PMJim Shannon in trouble for assaulting a woman
His sister.
Quote from: oakleafgael on August 17, 2026, 03:16:43 PMQuote from: Brendan on August 17, 2026, 03:04:39 PMJim Shannon in trouble for assaulting a woman
His sister.
News article this morning about how he was in talks with the DUP about the election in 2029.
Tony fearon with a particularly bad pun on FB in relation to this if anyone wants to go see 🤣
Quote from: quit yo jibbajabba on August 17, 2026, 03:45:10 PMTony fearon with a particularly bad pun on FB in relation to this if anyone wants to go see 🤣
MaghaDUPerry?
Some spud was Tone.
Quote from: johnnycool on August 17, 2026, 04:37:23 PMQuote from: quit yo jibbajabba on August 17, 2026, 03:45:10 PMTony fearon with a particularly bad pun on FB in relation to this if anyone wants to go see 🤣
MaghaDUPerry?
Some spud was Tone.
Well spotted Jonny 😄 ah he has/had his moments. This wasn't one of them lol
Quote from: quit yo jibbajabba on August 17, 2026, 04:53:11 PMQuote from: johnnycool on August 17, 2026, 04:37:23 PMQuote from: quit yo jibbajabba on August 17, 2026, 03:45:10 PMTony fearon with a particularly bad pun on FB in relation to this if anyone wants to go see 🤣
MaghaDUPerry?
Some spud was Tone.
Well spotted Jonny 😄 ah he has/had his moments. This wasn't one of them lol
His reply was better- they'll soon have more HMP's than MP's
😅🤣😂
Belfast Telegraph ran a puff piece on him this morning...bad timing?? He said that Donaldson was a Jeckyll and Hyde character...he'd know!
Fake news, nothing on the Newsletter.
Not DUP but that Jon Burrows lad would eat himself if he could.
Nesbitt has just resigned as Health minister after Burrows made a speech in his constituency that he would stop the cancelling of emergency surgery in the Causeway and the merging of it with Antrim Area even if more and more reports on it said that it was unsustainable in its current form.
And people wonder why Bengoa is not being delivered.
Burrows is a dose. Ex-cop, so what would you expect. Loves the word salads.
But key thing here in this case is, for me, politicians won't make big decisions.
Like water rates - no politician will bring them in as, like Coleraine hospital services above, it's career ending.
Isn't funny of all the things that 'our' politicians have been caught doing that the thing that will be career ending will be making a decision that actually makes sense budget wise. ::) ::)
Folk here all want to live in a half acre site, be able to drive to work and have a primary and secondary school 5 mins away and a hospital and gp with a full range of services within 15 mins and aren't prepared to pay for it or get public transport or do anything which might inconvenience them in the slightest. It's no surprise as politicians keep telling them they can have all the able, somebody else just has to do with less.
Nesbit was trying to do the right thing with the limited resources at his disposal, the alternative is to continue to have shite services everywhere rather than good services delivered centrally.
In health people are permanently exclaiming "they don't want to die in an ambulance on the road to (insert name of nearest big city)", we'll you're going to die anyway because the surgeon you campaigned for locally isn't getting enough operations to keep their skills sharp, or worse there is no surgeon because it's a dead end career wise and nobody wants to be there.
Voters are self interested and politicians refuse to tell the truth. And so the world turns.
Nearest Hospital to me, a min 30mins, it is the one in question they taking about, after that its 50mins/1hr to the nxt one. Public transport around here poor on a good day. Northern Ireland never adjusted for population increases. Closed 3 or 4 hospital units 25yrs ago, directed them to Antrim Hospital built 10/15yrs before, and not big enough then, to take its Area A&E, foreby the areas of the hospitals it closed. Havent the ability to increase A&E capacity and wouldnt allow ambulances some sort of procedured drop off to free them up again, and not sorting out care at the other end . They not addressed that basic problem forever but run round trying to sthing required in that area.
Quote from: johnnycool on August 19, 2026, 10:34:30 AMNot DUP but that Jon Burrows lad would eat himself if he could.
Nesbitt has just resigned as Health minister after Burrows made a speech in his constituency that he would stop the cancelling of emergency surgery in the Causeway and the merging of it with Antrim Area even if more and more reports on it said that it was unsustainable in its current form.
In another random thing I found out today. Philip Brett, who seems to be turning into the male Carla Lockhart, had a brother who was killed by the uda because they thought he was a catholic. The DUP get in bed with the LCC etc and this boy is onboard??
And people wonder why Bengoa is not being delivered.
It was without consulting nesbitt too so very possibly a ploy to undermine him and do something like this. Very unlikeable is burrows.
Big Gavin's asking for unity within unionism
Sinking ship!
There's not even unity within each of the biggest unionist parties, never mind d across unionism
This is interesting I'm sure...in some way.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c0e38l74gqro
Quote from: marty34 on August 24, 2026, 04:58:31 PMThis is interesting I'm sure...in some way.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c0e38l74gqro
A criminal prosecution seems a bit saucy here
probably as good a place as any to put this
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c3eqjyeyglpo
Quote from: tonto1888 on August 25, 2026, 01:22:52 PMprobably as good a place as any to put this
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c3eqjyeyglpo
Looking forwards to Jamie's spin on this via the socials
Quote from: tonto1888 on August 25, 2026, 01:22:52 PMprobably as good a place as any to put this
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c3eqjyeyglpo
Incompetent pen pushers in the PC.
If correct process is followed for a new application, they'll still not get down it. Still, good ammo and PR for Lockhart, Bryson, Allister etc.
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on August 25, 2026, 01:26:19 PMQuote from: tonto1888 on August 25, 2026, 01:22:52 PMprobably as good a place as any to put this
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c3eqjyeyglpo
Looking forwards to Jamie's spin on this via the socials
It will be spun as a titanic legal victory, as opposed to a technicality. Fair enough, they got what they were after.
Others will follow along to claim it vindicates and asserts their right to march down the road, which it categorically does not.
So, what does it all mean?
What's the next likely step?
Quote from: AustinPowers on August 25, 2026, 01:31:27 PMSo, what does it all mean?
What's the next likely step?
They will make an application to march.
They should be let nowhere near the place. Like a bunch of toddlers never letting up too.
They'll never get down it but the gloating is sickening on social media. They're all hateful c*nts.
Quote from: gallsman on August 25, 2026, 01:31:59 PMQuote from: AustinPowers on August 25, 2026, 01:31:27 PMSo, what does it all mean?
What's the next likely step?
They will make an application to march.
I'm guessing the parades commission will dot the Is and cross the Ts this time and this high court thing will have been a complete waste of time?
Quote from: RedHand88 on August 25, 2026, 02:28:02 PMQuote from: gallsman on August 25, 2026, 01:31:59 PMQuote from: AustinPowers on August 25, 2026, 01:31:27 PMSo, what does it all mean?
What's the next likely step?
They will make an application to march.
I'm guessing the parades commission will dot the Is and cross the Ts this time and this high court thing will have been a complete waste of time?
That's my guess.
You would hope so but I imagine they'll be complaining that it's all evidence of how the PC isn't fit for purpose/is biased against their culture and they'll campaign against it, call for it to be disbanded etc.
Yeah and they will have the legal side of things behind them to do that, whether that happens or not is completely different..
To counter that, everyone one that fancies a march in anyone's backyard should be applying, using their own logic
Quote from: gallsman on August 25, 2026, 02:35:09 PMYou would hope so but I imagine they'll be complaining that it's all evidence of how the PC isn't fit for purpose/is biased against their culture and they'll campaign against it, call for it to be disbanded etc.
they would need to watch though. It's a small enough percentage of their parades get blocked - they could get a more militant version who let less through.
Quote from: imtommygunn on August 25, 2026, 02:45:21 PMQuote from: gallsman on August 25, 2026, 02:35:09 PMYou would hope so but I imagine they'll be complaining that it's all evidence of how the PC isn't fit for purpose/is biased against their culture and they'll campaign against it, call for it to be disbanded etc.
they would need to watch though. It's a small enough percentage of their parades get blocked - they could get a more militant version who let less through.
Most of them would love that even more so they could make noise and trouble about it.
How many of them genuinely actually give a f**k about walking down the road? Gammon c***ts.
If, and its a mighty big if, they were to allow, on legal terms to let the parade go down the road it will be the straw that breaks the camels back, the place will come crashing down and everyone its seems will get what they want, as none of these work shy MLA's can't be serious that they are making a difference on the practical things that matter, the chaos and turmoil will be what the agitators want.
Electioneering at its finest.
The people around the mic know fine rightly it goes back to the parades commission and gets thrown out, but that's not the main objective.
The objectives are clear, make as big a fuss as possible, drum up the knuckle draggers and cause more hatred from their base line supporters get them out to vote because they hate everything and everyone.
Slimmest chance that it is ever allowed will completely finish this place. SF would have to pull Stormont down.
i think even the people in stormont have now copped on that stormont doesn't work.
Quote from: imtommygunn on August 25, 2026, 03:26:34 PMi think even the people in stormont have now copped on that stormont doesn't work.
Yeah totally think they have too but it is what comes after it that is the thing!
Quote from: marty34 on August 24, 2026, 04:58:31 PMThis is interesting I'm sure...in some way.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c0e38l74gqro
https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cdr7l7v30m3o
Council employee asked to go to her house for a meeting on a Sunday. Wonder did he get double time and TOIL.
The Parades Commission stuff is interesting. Media seem to be suggesting that the position was conceded on the basis the decision wasn't signed by all the Commissioners.
Whereas JB et al are suggesting it was a lot worse than that with Commissioners not making decisions but signing them anyway, secretarial staff committing perjury etc.
Be interesting to see which version is accurate
Journalists should be highlighting the link between Ben Habib, Arlene Forster, David Trimble, Lockhart, Binlid Bryson, Jim Alister and Burrows. Binlid is the media front but Habib is funding this carry on and it needs to be looked into more.
Quote from: David McKeown on August 25, 2026, 04:28:42 PMThe Parades Commission stuff is interesting. Media seem to be suggesting that the position was conceded on the basis the decision wasn't signed by all the Commissioners.
Whereas JB et al are suggesting it was a lot worse than that with Commissioners not making decisions but signing them anyway, secretarial staff committing perjury etc.
Be interesting to see which version is accurate
My reading is the ban itself still stands, but there will be a full review of the Drumcree decision process?
Fairly grim that all the unionist parties want to revisit Drumcree
Using a thinly veiled threat at violence to get down the Garvaghy Road again to, think they all overestimate how many foot soldiers they have these days, any trouble that is stirred up is caused by wee drugged up hoods
Quote from: Baile Brigín 2 on August 26, 2026, 12:08:22 PMQuote from: David McKeown on August 25, 2026, 04:28:42 PMThe Parades Commission stuff is interesting. Media seem to be suggesting that the position was conceded on the basis the decision wasn't signed by all the Commissioners.
Whereas JB et al are suggesting it was a lot worse than that with Commissioners not making decisions but signing them anyway, secretarial staff committing perjury etc.
Be interesting to see which version is accurate
My reading is the ban itself still stands, but there will be a full review of the Drumcree decision process?
Fairly grim that all the unionist parties want to revisit Drumcree
Why the hell would anyone want to go back to those years? The Portadown area (and the North) has seen no trouble over Drumcree in nearly 30 years.
Surely the Parades Commission would make the decision to ban it for that reason alone?
Unionist shit stirrers trying to make/keep themselves relevant, and cosy up to their neanderthal base, and to hell with the absolute mayhem that will inevitably ensue.
Quote from: AustinPowers on August 26, 2026, 12:23:13 PMQuote from: Baile Brigín 2 on August 26, 2026, 12:08:22 PMQuote from: David McKeown on August 25, 2026, 04:28:42 PMThe Parades Commission stuff is interesting. Media seem to be suggesting that the position was conceded on the basis the decision wasn't signed by all the Commissioners.
Whereas JB et al are suggesting it was a lot worse than that with Commissioners not making decisions but signing them anyway, secretarial staff committing perjury etc.
Be interesting to see which version is accurate
My reading is the ban itself still stands, but there will be a full review of the Drumcree decision process?
Fairly grim that all the unionist parties want to revisit Drumcree
Why the hell would anyone want to go back to those years? The Portadown area (and the North) has seen no trouble over Drumcree in nearly 30 years.
Surely the Parades Commission would make the decision to ban it for that reason alone?
Unionist shit stirrers trying to make/keep themselves relevant, and cosy up to their neanderthal base, and to hell with the absolute mayhem that will inevitably ensue.
It's Triumphalism, pure and simple.
They hark back to the days they could do what they want, when they wanted and how they wanted.
Humour me as I play devils advocate, are WE inclusive?
I get the triumphalism, I get the Orange order as a bigoted organisation, I know the knuckledraggers just want the hate to continue for their votes, but it will continue and fester providing there is constant division.. so what are the answers?
BTW I don't want them marching anywhere in the North ;D
Send them all to Rossnowlagh so!
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on August 26, 2026, 12:50:53 PMHumour me as I play devils advocate, are WE inclusive?
I get the triumphalism, I get the Orange order as a bigoted organisation, I know the knuckledraggers just want the hate to continue for their votes, but it will continue and fester providing there is constant division.. so what are the answers?
BTW I don't want them marching anywhere in the North ;D
The reality is you are bang on there are "we" are not inclusive enough. There are orange marches which should be tolerated and this should not be one of them. I lived through this the first time and what it brought out in people was not good.
https://bbc.com/news/articles/c5ye3g2v742o
As predictable as ever from Carla. She's "dumbfounded" over the lack of resignations in the PC.
Presumably somewhat similarly to how I am dumbfounded she ever reached elected office.
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on August 26, 2026, 12:50:53 PMHumour me as I play devils advocate, are WE inclusive?
I get the triumphalism, I get the Orange order as a bigoted organisation, I know the knuckledraggers just want the hate to continue for their votes, but it will continue and fester providing there is constant division.. so what are the answers?
BTW I don't want them marching anywhere in the North ;D
Have you come across many Portadown loyalists?
These are the same people who only
this year last month made formal objections to ABC Council opposing bilingual signage in the exact area of Portadown they want to march through:
https://armaghi.com/news/portadown-news/irish-english-street-signs-in-portadown-streets-backed-by-planning-committee-despite-orange-order-objections/304498
As you can imagine, the threshold for bilingual signage is much higher than in Belfast, with the overwhelming majority of residents in both streets in favour of English/Irish street signs. That wasn't enough for the Portadown District though, they'll be damned if the indigenous language/culture gets any visibility in the Orange citadel. Carla Lockhart herself even took a break from her MP duties to sit in on ABC planning committee meetings while thousands of ratepayers money was wasted in their attempt to block Irish language street signage.
https://sluggerotoole.com/2026/03/23/ar-mhaith-libh-gaeilge-council-refusal-to-erect-irish-language-signage/
These are the same people who at the start of the summer got in their cars, travelled to Scarva and donned masks to be "offended" and shout abhorrent abuse at a peaceful demonstration opposing the Gaza genocide.
If that's not enough, only last month they burnt an Armagh GAA flag on the
kids' bonfire in Edgarstown (it's like an annual ritual in Portadown).
If you cast your mind back to a certain singsong in an orange hall, where were the perpetrators from? Good old Portadown.
You can't even wear a GAA shirt in Portadown: https://www.irishnews.com/news/northern-ireland/catholic-man-attacked-in-portadown-for-wearing-gaa-jersey-KKSVVNUQEBBHXEVIJMBDV7H4YU/
These are the people who got in their cars and vans and drove over to Tesco in Craigavon under the cover of night to erect Loyalist paraphernalia in a mixed housing development:
https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/area/armagh/news/families-flee-homes-after-20-masked-men-descend-on-mixed-craigavon-estate-to-erect-flags/a/157600737.html
These people are not normal. There should be no obligation to be inclusive of bigots. Unionism is a broad church but the OO does not represent all Unionists. Listening to these deranged bigots, they are convinced they have a right to parade where they want. I'm confident they'll not set a foot on the G Road and rightfully so.
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on August 26, 2026, 12:50:53 PMHumour me as I play devils advocate, are WE inclusive?
I get the triumphalism, I get the Orange order as a bigoted organisation, I know the knuckledraggers just want the hate to continue for their votes, but it will continue and fester providing there is constant division.. so what are the answers?
BTW I don't want them marching anywhere in the North ;D
If anything we're too inclusive. In a normal functioning society a far right sectarian organisation like that wouldn't be allowed to exist.
For an example this years main event in county Armagh was in Newtown, for those that don't know it'd be very mixed, with a catholic primary school and GAA club (bulk of the population probably Bulgarian these days actually but that's another matter).
Didn't manage to make it to see the parades this year sadly ;) but by all accounts it passed off with no issue, they got to hang their butchers apron out and dress up like milkmen and play each other flutes and whatever else they like to do.
Quote from: Brendan on August 26, 2026, 12:13:03 PMUsing a thinly veiled threat at violence to get down the Garvaghy Road again to, think they all overestimate how many foot soldiers they have these days, any trouble that is stirred up is caused by wee drugged up hoods
Would imagine they'll be met by a fairly strong protest, could get fecking nasty again which benefits no one but the bigots who can whip up the sectarianism and try to get their knuckle dragging base out
When you see the state of the rabble behind Bryson outside the court yesterday, it was a who's who of bigots. Many of them were not born or were very young when the GFA was signed. Deplorable people who, if they put as much effort and energy into issues like housing, education, health etc. I don't think they have the knowledge or capability of being proper politicians, so they play to the only thing they know - trying to lord it over them'uns.
Again just playing bat for the other side here, as it's impossible to comprehend the thinking other than its been bred into them and fed constantly on drip since birth
They see the GAA (broadly see) as a sectarian sport for the RA (we know it isn't but hear me out)
They see SF as Republicans/ex IRA, hell bent of taking over their NI and making Ireland one again, in fairness that's what SF is about, SDLP is a Nationalist party with the exact same vision (one Ireland) but with the history of the recent troubles they were coming at it from a peaceful attempt
Irish language signs is another attempt at driving a nail in their coffin or Britishness
Shoe on the other foot, we view the prods very much the same, Orange order, unionist political parties, PUL
The question I'm really asking is, are we inclusive? Or are we just fed up with the 100 plus years of being treated like second class citizens and its time to turn the screw..
This isn't a surprise but I can't see a united Ireland in my life time, and if we do and it comes with a reversal conflict to the one that happened before, it'll not be worth one death
Quote from: 93-DY-SAM on August 26, 2026, 02:54:50 PMWhen you see the state of the rabble behind Bryson outside the court yesterday, it was a who's who of bigots. Many of them were not born or were very young when the GFA was signed. Deplorable people who, if they put as much effort and energy into issues like housing, education, health etc. I don't think they have the knowledge or capability of being proper politicians, so they play to the only thing they know - trying to lord it over them'uns.
Sectarianism and bigotry is what will trump housing, health, education etc when it comes down to attracting voters. And they'll go all the harder the next few months to entice out the knuckledraggers into the polling stations.
Whether or not they get down the Garvaghy road or not , the touch paper has been lit. The bigotry has been rekindled and it has the potential to bring everything back 30+ years.
I don't think reasonable unionists see the gaa as the ra though. It is more the extreme ones and the drum beaters.
Sf will always be viewed like that.
This latest stunt on drumcree is why the view of the oo will not change. This is a shocker with what looks like an attempt to drag us into the past.
Do I recall correctly...about 10 years ago some politicians tried to start talks between the OO and Garvaghy residents.
The OO response was we'll take part once the 1st item on the agenda is holding the 1998 parade.
Quote from: AustinPowers on August 26, 2026, 04:20:24 PMQuote from: 93-DY-SAM on August 26, 2026, 02:54:50 PMWhen you see the state of the rabble behind Bryson outside the court yesterday, it was a who's who of bigots. Many of them were not born or were very young when the GFA was signed. Deplorable people who, if they put as much effort and energy into issues like housing, education, health etc. I don't think they have the knowledge or capability of being proper politicians, so they play to the only thing they know - trying to lord it over them'uns.
Sectarianism and bigotry is what will trump housing, health, education etc when it comes down to attracting voters. And they'll go all the harder the next few months to entice out the knuckledraggers into the polling stations.
Whether or not they get down the Garvaghy road or not , the touch paper has been lit. The bigotry has been rekindled and it has the potential to bring everything back 30+ years.
I don't see any politicians on nationalist side that has the ability to make it about economy. Even on economy Unionists will say how much sea border posts costs, and no one is there to outline how much north's exports have increased to GB, 26 counties and EU since the protocol because of access to all markets. Unionists will say GB is their most important market, no one can counter than wealthier 26 counties trades more with GB, and GB is now only 10% of Ireland's trade because it's an open economy and not still stuck to a GB only mindset. Unionists will talk about being part of the 5th largest economy but no one hits back that north has the largest debt per capita in UK and is an absolute failed economy. Orangemen marching won't fix a £16 billion deficit every year, and will further add to it by driving up security costs. Time for nationalists to up the ante with economy.
Quote from: Rossfan on August 26, 2026, 04:53:51 PMDo I recall correctly...about 10 years ago some politicians tried to start talks between the OO and Garvaghy residents.
The OO response was we'll take part once the 1st item on the agenda is holding the 1998 parade.
They are talking about a resolution. The only resolution they see i them marching down the road.
I am sure I am not alone in saying this Drumcree stuff evokes a lot of memories and not good ones. It made the place very tense to live in and just reminds you of those poor wee Quinn children. Sickens me the whole thing but when you have Bryson, Lockhart and Allister then you have significant bigotry floating round and this is the kind of thing that con happen.
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on August 26, 2026, 04:15:24 PMAgain just playing bat for the other side here, as it's impossible to comprehend the thinking other than its been bred into them and fed constantly on drip since birth
They see the GAA (broadly see) as a sectarian sport for the RA (we know it isn't but hear me out)
They see SF as Republicans/ex IRA, hell bent of taking over their NI and making Ireland one again, in fairness that's what SF is about, SDLP is a Nationalist party with the exact same vision (one Ireland) but with the history of the recent troubles they were coming at it from a peaceful attempt
Irish language signs is another attempt at driving a nail in their coffin or Britishness
Shoe on the other foot, we view the prods very much the same, Orange order, unionist political parties, PUL
The question I'm really asking is, are we inclusive? Or are we just fed up with the 100 plus years of being treated like second class citizens and its time to turn the screw..
This isn't a surprise but I can't see a united Ireland in my life time, and if we do and it comes with a reversal conflict to the one that happened before, it'll not be worth one death
What they see as their rights being oppressed is in reality just simple equality. Bloody Catholics getting equal vote and fair elections, bloody Catholics getting Irish street signs and a thousand other things.
Quote from: general_lee on August 26, 2026, 02:06:48 PMQuote from: Milltown Row2 on August 26, 2026, 12:50:53 PMHumour me as I play devils advocate, are WE inclusive?
I get the triumphalism, I get the Orange order as a bigoted organisation, I know the knuckledraggers just want the hate to continue for their votes, but it will continue and fester providing there is constant division.. so what are the answers?
BTW I don't want them marching anywhere in the North ;D
Have you come across many Portadown loyalists?
These are the same people who only this year last month made formal objections to ABC Council opposing bilingual signage in the exact area of Portadown they want to march through:
https://armaghi.com/news/portadown-news/irish-english-street-signs-in-portadown-streets-backed-by-planning-committee-despite-orange-order-objections/304498
As you can imagine, the threshold for bilingual signage is much higher than in Belfast, with the overwhelming majority of residents in both streets in favour of English/Irish street signs. That wasn't enough for the Portadown District though, they'll be damned if the indigenous language/culture gets any visibility in the Orange citadel. Carla Lockhart herself even took a break from her MP duties to sit in on ABC planning committee meetings while thousands of ratepayers money was wasted in their attempt to block Irish language street signage.
https://sluggerotoole.com/2026/03/23/ar-mhaith-libh-gaeilge-council-refusal-to-erect-irish-language-signage/
These are the same people who at the start of the summer got in their cars, travelled to Scarva and donned masks to be "offended" and shout abhorrent abuse at a peaceful demonstration opposing the Gaza genocide.
If that's not enough, only last month they burnt an Armagh GAA flag on the kids' bonfire in Edgarstown (it's like an annual ritual in Portadown).
If you cast your mind back to a certain singsong in an orange hall, where were the perpetrators from? Good old Portadown.
You can't even wear a GAA shirt in Portadown: https://www.irishnews.com/news/northern-ireland/catholic-man-attacked-in-portadown-for-wearing-gaa-jersey-KKSVVNUQEBBHXEVIJMBDV7H4YU/
These are the people who got in their cars and vans and drove over to Tesco in Craigavon under the cover of night to erect Loyalist paraphernalia in a mixed housing development:
https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/area/armagh/news/families-flee-homes-after-20-masked-men-descend-on-mixed-craigavon-estate-to-erect-flags/a/157600737.html
These people are not normal. There should be no obligation to be inclusive of bigots. Unionism is a broad church but the OO does not represent all Unionists. Listening to these deranged bigots, they are convinced they have a right to parade where they want. I'm confident they'll not set a foot on the G Road and rightfully so.
Well said.
Quote from: general_lee on August 26, 2026, 02:06:48 PMQuote from: Milltown Row2 on August 26, 2026, 12:50:53 PMHumour me as I play devils advocate, are WE inclusive?
I get the triumphalism, I get the Orange order as a bigoted organisation, I know the knuckledraggers just want the hate to continue for their votes, but it will continue and fester providing there is constant division.. so what are the answers?
BTW I don't want them marching anywhere in the North ;D
Have you come across many Portadown loyalists?
These are the same people who only this year last month made formal objections to ABC Council opposing bilingual signage in the exact area of Portadown they want to march through:
https://armaghi.com/news/portadown-news/irish-english-street-signs-in-portadown-streets-backed-by-planning-committee-despite-orange-order-objections/304498
As you can imagine, the threshold for bilingual signage is much higher than in Belfast, with the overwhelming majority of residents in both streets in favour of English/Irish street signs. That wasn't enough for the Portadown District though, they'll be damned if the indigenous language/culture gets any visibility in the Orange citadel. Carla Lockhart herself even took a break from her MP duties to sit in on ABC planning committee meetings while thousands of ratepayers money was wasted in their attempt to block Irish language street signage.
https://sluggerotoole.com/2026/03/23/ar-mhaith-libh-gaeilge-council-refusal-to-erect-irish-language-signage/
These are the same people who at the start of the summer got in their cars, travelled to Scarva and donned masks to be "offended" and shout abhorrent abuse at a peaceful demonstration opposing the Gaza genocide.
If that's not enough, only last month they burnt an Armagh GAA flag on the kids' bonfire in Edgarstown (it's like an annual ritual in Portadown).
If you cast your mind back to a certain singsong in an orange hall, where were the perpetrators from? Good old Portadown.
You can't even wear a GAA shirt in Portadown: https://www.irishnews.com/news/northern-ireland/catholic-man-attacked-in-portadown-for-wearing-gaa-jersey-KKSVVNUQEBBHXEVIJMBDV7H4YU/
These are the people who got in their cars and vans and drove over to Tesco in Craigavon under the cover of night to erect Loyalist paraphernalia in a mixed housing development:
https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/area/armagh/news/families-flee-homes-after-20-masked-men-descend-on-mixed-craigavon-estate-to-erect-flags/a/157600737.html
These people are not normal. There should be no obligation to be inclusive of bigots. Unionism is a broad church but the OO does not represent all Unionists. Listening to these deranged bigots, they are convinced they have a right to parade where they want. I'm confident they'll not set a foot on the G Road and rightfully so.
He knows all that. He's being deliberately obtuse :D
No common sense is going to work it seems then
So all I can see is a return to protests and riots
Destabilising the place and allowing loyalist and dissenters to go at it while the innocents lose their lives.
And it will be everyone else's fault but their own. Rinse repeat
The grifters/bigots/hooligans will have their way
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on August 26, 2026, 04:15:24 PMShoe on the other foot, we view the prods very much the same, Orange order, unionist political parties, PUL
Speak for yourself, I don't think like that at all. Unionism is a broad church and most people I've met from a traditionally Protestant/Unionist background are sound.
Not everyone from the other side goes to watch band parades or is a member of the OO, and even the ones that do aren't necessarily that into it. I dare say there are even a good few de facto Unionists in the GAA.
I know it's cliche but a lot of the younger ones aren't as entrenched in the tribalism, especially when they get their eyes opened after spending 3/4 years studying over in Britain (if they come back).
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on August 26, 2026, 04:15:24 PMThe question I'm really asking is, are we inclusive? Or are we just fed up with the 100 plus years of being treated like second class citizens and its time to turn the screw..
Who's we? I think the Fleadh was a good example of inclusivity, but then it wasn't or isn't "ours", it's everyone's. But it was Belfast at its best. When's the last time the city had a buzz like that? Do the Loyalists not get marching in Derry? In Newry? In Armagh? In Lurgan? In Keady? In Pomeroy? In Omagh? In Magherafelt? In Maghera? In Ballycastle?
Is the GAA inclusive? Absolutely, but hardline sections within Unionism f**king despise us and our games and everything about them no matter what the GAA does; it's the IRA at play and whatever else. f**k them, they're a minority anyway and I don't care about including them.
I think there's no getting away from the fact that GAA is massively popular in the north, when I was young you wouldn't dare step outside wearing GAA gear whereas now you can't go anywhere without seeing kids wearing their county or club colours. I think certain elements are struggling with that manifestation in day to day life in the north.
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on August 26, 2026, 04:15:24 PMThis isn't a surprise but I can't see a united Ireland in my life time, and if we do and it comes with a reversal conflict to the one that happened before, it'll not be worth one death
We won't see a repeat. Loyalists won't have the state on their side. Loyalist paramilitaries haven't the capacity or capability to mobilise en masse like Drumcree, Anglo Irish Agreement, UWC strike.
Loyalism is confined to a handful of online propagandists spouting the same shite ad nauseam; I don't need to name them but they're on social media and all they can think about when they wake up every morning is Sinn Féin and the IRA. Their leaders aren't much better, in fact they're just saying out loud what their leaders can't. It's the blind leading the blind, a United Ireland is coming down the line at some stage and if you're lucky you'll still be alive and kicking when it happens.
There is a very amplified minority among them. If people were that staunch the tuv would be making a massive inroad into the voter base. Though saying that Donaldson, now Shannon and even Wilson and Campbell and all of their antics will surely erode some voter confidence so the dup need a "win".
When the backs are against the wall they resort to the tribal drum which is exactly what this is.
I have to say this has sickened me. Drumcree was a disgusting episode which should have been left in the past. Who is behind this cretin Bryson. He is no asset to society and someone is platforming him for their own good. I still think it's possible not all is were dotted and TS crossed and it will make no difference. I would hope that to be correct. These people should not be allowed to win
Quote from: Baile Brigín 2 on August 26, 2026, 12:08:22 PMQuote from: David McKeown on August 25, 2026, 04:28:42 PMThe Parades Commission stuff is interesting. Media seem to be suggesting that the position was conceded on the basis the decision wasn't signed by all the Commissioners.
Whereas JB et al are suggesting it was a lot worse than that with Commissioners not making decisions but signing them anyway, secretarial staff committing perjury etc.
Be interesting to see which version is accurate
My reading is the ban itself still stands, but there will be a full review of the Drumcree decision process?
Fairly grim that all the unionist parties want to revisit Drumcree
Not my reading of the situation. JB is asking that the Order 53 be perused as if it were the finding of the court. That's not how it works. I'm not even sure if there is a judgement in this case other than on costs.
From BelTel:
Northern Ireland Secretary Sir Chris Bryant has expressed "serious concern" about the Parades Commission as he demanded answers from the body in the wake of a High Court ruling linked to the Drumcree dispute.
Earlier this week, Mr Justice McAlinden quashed a decision by the Parades Commission to impose restrictions on an Orange Order march at Drumcree.
The parades body adjudicates on contentious marches, and had blocked the Orange Order from marching along the Garvaghy Road in Portadown in July every year since 1998.
But after a case brought by a Portadown Orangeman, the judge was scathing about the commission's decision-making processes, accusing it of taking shortcuts and stating that "sloppy procedures are manifest".
Sir Chris Bryant met with with Commission's chair, Professor Evelyn Collins, and demanded a number of "written assurances" by the end of the week.
A spokesperson for the Northern Ireland Office said: ""During their discussion, the Secretary of State expressed serious concern over the issues highlighted in the High Court judgment relating to the Orange Order's annual Drumcree parade.
"He reiterated his view that public confidence in the Commission has been damaged and needs to be restored."
Sir Chris asked for written assurances that all of the Commission's decision-making processes are fair and robust; that it acts independently and impartially at all times; and "has a credible plan to enhance public confidence across all communities".
The response was ordered to provide the assurances by close of play on Friday.
However, a DUP MP said that didn't go far enough, and reiterated the party's call for resignations.
Upper Bann MP Carla Lockhart said: "The Secretary of State rightly set the test as being the commission commanding the support of all communities.
"Unionism has been very clear: only resignations will suffice."
She added: "I am also calling for an independent investigation, ideally judge led, into the Parades Commission, its governance and structures and the legislative framework itself."
It came after the First Minister was accused of having a "blind spot" when it comes to the Parades Commission.
First Minister Michelle O'Neill with councillor Catherine Nelson and Finance Minister John O'Dowd
First Minister Michelle O'Neill with councillor Catherine Nelson and Finance Minister John O'Dowd © Stiofán Bruce
DUP leader Gavin Robinson hit back after Michelle O'Neill accused unionist leaders of "triumphalism" and moving towards a "more extreme element" in the wake of a court ruling on Drumcree.
The Orange Order said it intends to apply for another Drumcree parade in the coming days.
Portadown district master Nigel Dawson said a "significant date" in the calendar may be chosen amid speculation it could be September 28, which is known as Ulster Day to loyalists.
Ms O'Neill visited residents of the Garvaghy Road on Wednesday, and said political unionism wanted to "revisit those dark days", referring to widespread disorder because of the tensions around the contentious march.
Speaking outside Drumcree Community Centre, she said locals are "anxious" about what the ruling might mean.
Orangemen during the 25th anniversary Drumcree parade in Portadown in 2023
Orangemen during the 25th anniversary Drumcree parade in Portadown in 2023 © PA Radar
"I think the Garvaghy Road residents have been crystal clear and firm down through the years over the last three decades. They do not want this parade down this road."
She also criticised the Orange Order and unionist leadership's reaction to the ruling.
"Why do the Orange Order want to push a parade down this road? Would it be acceptable to unionism and to the Orange Order for a nationalist or republican parade to walk through the Shankill Road? I would think not.
"What they can't fathom here in this community is why the leaders of political unionism want to revisit those dark days. Why do they want to bring that back into this community?
"That does beg the question: why is unionism limping ever more, or day by day, to the more extreme element of things in society?"
Gavin Robinson
Gavin Robinson © PA Radar
Mr Robinson said it wasn't "triumphalist to expect that applications made to the Parades Commission should be considered properly, in line with legislation and without the inherent disrespect that was revealed during the recent application".
He added: "We often hear that the law should be applied equally, but Michelle O'Neill's blind spot when it comes to a legitimate application by Portadown District Lodge that was treated so dismissively, is revealing.
"She cannot wish away their rights, and nor should she try."
Speaking separately, Communities Minister Gordon Lyons said it was "absolutely outrageous what came out" in court.
"We can't be in a position where we have the essential veto because of a refusal to engage, which was the case with the Residents Association refusing to engage, and that essentially didn't allow any progress at all," he said.
"So I hope there will be tolerance shown and I hope that that parade can return home again.
"But obviously things will need to go through the commission and I hope that they conduct their business very differently this time compared to how they have done it in the past."
Ulster Unionist leader Jon Burrows echoed calls from other unionists for the current Parades Commissioners to resign.
He said: "This was a withering judgment which exposed staggering incompetence in the exercise of an important statutory role. The commission did not even attempt a defence. It conceded."
"Confidence cannot exist in the current commissioners. They should resign immediately. If they refuse, the Secretary of State must remove them."
Quote from: general_lee on August 26, 2026, 07:21:55 PMQuote from: Milltown Row2 on August 26, 2026, 04:15:24 PMShoe on the other foot, we view the prods very much the same, Orange order, unionist political parties, PUL
Speak for yourself, I don't think like that at all. Unionism is a broad church and most people I've met from a traditionally Protestant/Unionist background are sound.
Not everyone from the other side goes to watch band parades or is a member of the OO, and even the ones that do aren't necessarily that into it. I dare say there are even a good few de facto Unionists in the GAA.
I know it's cliche but a lot of the younger ones aren't as entrenched in the tribalism, especially when they get their eyes opened after spending 3/4 years studying over in Britain (if they come back).
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on August 26, 2026, 04:15:24 PMThe question I'm really asking is, are we inclusive? Or are we just fed up with the 100 plus years of being treated like second class citizens and its time to turn the screw..
Who's we? I think the Fleadh was a good example of inclusivity, but then it wasn't or isn't "ours", it's everyone's. But it was Belfast at its best. When's the last time the city had a buzz like that? Do the Loyalists not get marching in Derry? In Newry? In Armagh? In Lurgan? In Keady? In Pomeroy? In Omagh? In Magherafelt? In Maghera? In Ballycastle?
Is the GAA inclusive? Absolutely, but hardline sections within Unionism f**king despise us and our games and everything about them no matter what the GAA does; it's the IRA at play and whatever else. f**k them, they're a minority anyway and I don't care about including them.
I think there's no getting away from the fact that GAA is massively popular in the north, when I was young you wouldn't dare step outside wearing GAA gear whereas now you can't go anywhere without seeing kids wearing their county or club colours. I think certain elements are struggling with that manifestation in day to day life in the north.
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on August 26, 2026, 04:15:24 PMThis isn't a surprise but I can't see a united Ireland in my life time, and if we do and it comes with a reversal conflict to the one that happened before, it'll not be worth one death
We won't see a repeat. Loyalists won't have the state on their side. Loyalist paramilitaries haven't the capacity or capability to mobilise en masse like Drumcree, Anglo Irish Agreement, UWC strike.
Loyalism is confined to a handful of online propagandists spouting the same shite ad nauseam; I don't need to name them but they're on social media and all they can think about when they wake up every morning is Sinn Féin and the IRA. Their leaders aren't much better, in fact they're just saying out loud what their leaders can't. It's the blind leading the blind, a United Ireland is coming down the line at some stage and if you're lucky you'll still be alive and kicking when it happens.
got to agree. I know a few who are studying the Irish language. A couple of them recently got their silver fainnes. One on work and another who actually done it with me. There are plenty of , I dont want to say decent but you know what I mean people from unionist backgrounds. Sadly its the bigots who are very much to the front and centre
Empty vessels make the most noise..
Whether its a small minority on socials drumming up hate and division, as seen every year in the estates that have the bonfires and the during the 12th parades, that core element will not go down without a fight
Having married a 'prod light' ;D her conversion wasn't easy, she may still have that little bit of prodyness way back somewhere I'm not convinced the 'decent prods' as you put Tonto will go into a AI unless there is an overwhelming majority that it would be pointless putting up a fight
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on August 27, 2026, 08:31:39 AMEmpty vessels make the most noise..
Whether its a small minority on socials drumming up hate and division, as seen every year in the estates that have the bonfires and the during the 12th parades, that core element will not go down without a fight
Having married a 'prod light' ;D her conversion wasn't easy, she may still have that little bit of prodyness way back somewhere I'm not convinced the 'decent prods' as you put Tonto will go into a AI unless there is an overwhelming majority that it would be pointless putting up a fight
I like the irony MR.
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on August 27, 2026, 08:31:39 AMEmpty vessels make the most noise..
Whether its a small minority on socials drumming up hate and division, as seen every year in the estates that have the bonfires and the during the 12th parades, that core element will not go down without a fight
Having married a 'prod light' ;D her conversion wasn't easy, she may still have that little bit of prodyness way back somewhere I'm not convinced the 'decent prods' as you put Tonto will go into a AI unless there is an overwhelming majority that it would be pointless putting up a fight
The uber loyalists want their shot at a modern day stand, they'll invoke the Ulster Covenant (V2.0) at some point with a complete lack of irony that a century ago they sold out their own in Cavan Donegal Monaghan, in the end a tifo sized St Patrick will wash the snakes into the sea and back to Scotland where they can become hillbillies
I personally believe when Gerry Adams dies the whole uber loyalists thing will peter out, yes the likes of Bryson and others will stay beating a drum to the end only to line their pockets for the fear of a days work
Quote from: Keyser soze on August 27, 2026, 09:16:16 AMQuote from: Milltown Row2 on August 27, 2026, 08:31:39 AMEmpty vessels make the most noise..
Whether its a small minority on socials drumming up hate and division, as seen every year in the estates that have the bonfires and the during the 12th parades, that core element will not go down without a fight
Having married a 'prod light' ;D her conversion wasn't easy, she may still have that little bit of prodyness way back somewhere I'm not convinced the 'decent prods' as you put Tonto will go into a AI unless there is an overwhelming majority that it would be pointless putting up a fight
I like the irony MR.
Could say that about everyone on here..
Ominous that Brysnt has cut the legs of the commission, effectively repeating the unionist talking points and giving them till Friday to justify their existence.
Leaving aside that cabinet level politcians criticising statutory bodies isn't ideal, this is his first major contribution and it is extremely partisan
Quote from: tonto1888 on August 27, 2026, 08:09:47 AMQuote from: general_lee on August 26, 2026, 07:21:55 PMQuote from: Milltown Row2 on August 26, 2026, 04:15:24 PMShoe on the other foot, we view the prods very much the same, Orange order, unionist political parties, PUL
Speak for yourself, I don't think like that at all. Unionism is a broad church and most people I've met from a traditionally Protestant/Unionist background are sound.
Not everyone from the other side goes to watch band parades or is a member of the OO, and even the ones that do aren't necessarily that into it. I dare say there are even a good few de facto Unionists in the GAA.
I know it's cliche but a lot of the younger ones aren't as entrenched in the tribalism, especially when they get their eyes opened after spending 3/4 years studying over in Britain (if they come back).
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on August 26, 2026, 04:15:24 PMThe question I'm really asking is, are we inclusive? Or are we just fed up with the 100 plus years of being treated like second class citizens and its time to turn the screw..
Who's we? I think the Fleadh was a good example of inclusivity, but then it wasn't or isn't "ours", it's everyone's. But it was Belfast at its best. When's the last time the city had a buzz like that? Do the Loyalists not get marching in Derry? In Newry? In Armagh? In Lurgan? In Keady? In Pomeroy? In Omagh? In Magherafelt? In Maghera? In Ballycastle?
Is the GAA inclusive? Absolutely, but hardline sections within Unionism f**king despise us and our games and everything about them no matter what the GAA does; it's the IRA at play and whatever else. f**k them, they're a minority anyway and I don't care about including them.
I think there's no getting away from the fact that GAA is massively popular in the north, when I was young you wouldn't dare step outside wearing GAA gear whereas now you can't go anywhere without seeing kids wearing their county or club colours. I think certain elements are struggling with that manifestation in day to day life in the north.
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on August 26, 2026, 04:15:24 PMThis isn't a surprise but I can't see a united Ireland in my life time, and if we do and it comes with a reversal conflict to the one that happened before, it'll not be worth one death
We won't see a repeat. Loyalists won't have the state on their side. Loyalist paramilitaries haven't the capacity or capability to mobilise en masse like Drumcree, Anglo Irish Agreement, UWC strike.
Loyalism is confined to a handful of online propagandists spouting the same shite ad nauseam; I don't need to name them but they're on social media and all they can think about when they wake up every morning is Sinn Féin and the IRA. Their leaders aren't much better, in fact they're just saying out loud what their leaders can't. It's the blind leading the blind, a United Ireland is coming down the line at some stage and if you're lucky you'll still be alive and kicking when it happens.
got to agree. I know a few who are studying the Irish language. A couple of them recently got their silver fainnes. One on work and another who actually done it with me. There are plenty of , I dont want to say decent but you know what I mean people from unionist backgrounds. Sadly its the bigots who are very much to the front and centre
Yeah Id agree with that also, you just need to look at the way the flag protest fizzled out.
I don't think he's asked them to justify their existence at all. Rather I imagine he wants to appear to be doing something after loyalism was left a clear open goal by procedural failings within the commission.
He can't simply ignore it, or the gammon will simply shout louder and louder. From a UK Government perspective I imagine they're absolutely raging at getting dragged into things.
I do find it amusing that while demanding anyone with a taigy sounding name resigns from the commission, and thus hamstring it completely, the OO have stated that they still plan to apply to it for permission to march.
It may sound like hyperbole, but any kind of march down the Garvaghy Road being allowed to happen nearly 30 years later could massively derail the entire peace process. Any sort of trust or confidence in Stormont or Westminster from the nationalist community will hugely evaporate. It would be a sickening betrayal and dissidents will capitalise on it.It cannot and will not happen.
I don't think it's hyprebole at all. This is horrendous.
Quote from: imtommygunn on August 27, 2026, 11:58:34 AMI don't think it's hyprebole at all. This is horrendous.
I agree. Although I would think (hope) that nothing comes of it and that the next application will be handled properly before being rejected.
Quote from: imtommygunn on August 27, 2026, 11:58:34 AMI don't think it's hyprebole at all. This is horrendous.
Surely common sense will see through and no parade is allowed.
Good old Seamus Bryson has just tweeted Carla Loveheart's mobile number. Please respect Carla's privacy and do not share her mobile number which is +44 7833 198008
Quote from: RedHand88 on August 27, 2026, 12:04:36 PMQuote from: imtommygunn on August 27, 2026, 11:58:34 AMI don't think it's hyprebole at all. This is horrendous.
I agree. Although I would think (hope) that nothing comes of it and that the next application will be handled properly before being rejected.
I would think that. If that were to happen it would also lead to issues though. It is a can of worms that has now been opened.
One way or another, the f**kers will have their biggest march up to the police barricade in a long time. There will be, shall we say, agitators amongst them. Lockhart, Bryson etc will be platformed with megaphones. Massive potential flashpoint.
Yep. It's a bad bad job. It used to be Bryson then it was Bryson Allister and now it's Bryson Allister Lockhart. Horrible bigots stirring all of this.
Lockhart is something. I've had Bryson blocked on all the socials this years as I don't want to read his scutter but seems to be no avoiding Lockhart no matter what you do - she is a disgusting excuse of a politician and everything that's wrong with this place. You'd love to ignore all the grand standing and huffing and blowing they're doing about this but I have to say this has wound me up a right bit.
There are no decent politicians in the DUP.
Quote from: ClubScene13 on August 27, 2026, 01:17:08 PMLockhart is something. I've had Bryson blocked on all the socials this years as I don't want to read his scutter but seems to be no avoiding Lockhart no matter what you do - she is a disgusting excuse of a politician and everything that's wrong with this place. You'd love to ignore all the grand standing and huffing and blowing they're doing about this but I have to say this has wound me up a right bit.
She's vile. I first noticed her come to attention with bloody sunday and soldier F who she was flying over here the day after that trial for a commemoration. Completely throwing everything in the face of families with innocent people murdered with no regard just to display her bigotry and up her vote.
This has depressed me as much as wound me up. The likes of Byrant and Burnham probably don't realise what basket cases these ones are. They'll know soon enough.
Quote from: gallsman on August 27, 2026, 12:35:37 PMOne way or another, the f**kers will have their biggest march up to the police barricade in a long time. There will be, shall we say, agitators amongst them. Lockhart, Bryson etc will be platformed with megaphones. Massive potential flashpoint.
Absolutely. There has been no trouble for nearly 30 years around the Drumcree issue. Now unionists think they're on the verge of being allowed down the Garvaghy Road. If that application is turned down ,it could certainly lead to a lot of trouble. Indeed, you could see more of the shite we seen in the mid 90's.
Who the f**k wants to go back to that?
Every year we have about eleven months of no bother at all and then marching season starts and everyone tiptoes round the place. Then they add this to it as well. Pathetic.
(Might I add for balance the shit round anti internment bonfires in Derry is growing some legs and isn't great but not this scale).
One of the commissioners has resigned.
Any good data on % of pop that actually attends such parades?
What amazes me about Lockhart is despite how awful she is the general nationalist vote in upper Bann can't get motivated enough to get the vote out. Im not from the constituency but there is still a large number of nationalist that would rather waste their vote on SDLP or alliance in a Westminster election when there is no chance of winning rather than try and get rid of Carla. I don't know enough about the SF candidate but it was the same problem in North Belfast. You had Nigel Dodds of all people there for the taking and for years the nationalists dithered and it took the really strong candidate of finucane for everyone to get behind to finally win
Quote from: JPGJOHNNYG on August 28, 2026, 09:57:36 AMWhat amazes me about Lockhart is despite how awful she is the general nationalist vote in upper Bann can't get motivated enough to get the vote out. Im not from the constituency but there is still a large number of nationalist that would rather waste their vote on SDLP or alliance in a Westminster election when there is no chance of winning rather than try and get rid of Carla. I don't know enough about the SF candidate but it was the same problem in North Belfast. You had Nigel Dodds of all people there for the taking and for years the nationalists dithered and it took the really strong candidate of finucane for everyone to get behind to finally win
There are Nationalists that won't vote SDLP and there are Nationalists that won't vote SF, whether that is to the detriment of having a Unionist MP in there, well they have voted on what drives their sense of politics. The green and orange sectarian voting is what's actually wrong with the place and you seem to be encouraging it.
It's because of said voting that the place really at times looks like it will blow up, someone will light he fuse (Drumcree) and away we go with more hate politics rather than actually sorting out what the ordinary person wants..
Good infrastructure, education, health, cost of living, and a million other things have went to the wall because they refuse to work together, political point scoring while ordinary Joe is picking up the pieces
Have GONE!!!
Quote from: Rossfan on August 28, 2026, 11:19:20 AMHave GONE!!!
Love the Irish correcting my English poor grammar ;D
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on August 28, 2026, 11:06:04 AMQuote from: JPGJOHNNYG on August 28, 2026, 09:57:36 AMWhat amazes me about Lockhart is despite how awful she is the general nationalist vote in upper Bann can't get motivated enough to get the vote out. Im not from the constituency but there is still a large number of nationalist that would rather waste their vote on SDLP or alliance in a Westminster election when there is no chance of winning rather than try and get rid of Carla. I don't know enough about the SF candidate but it was the same problem in North Belfast. You had Nigel Dodds of all people there for the taking and for years the nationalists dithered and it took the really strong candidate of finucane for everyone to get behind to finally win
There are Nationalists that won't vote SDLP and there are Nationalists that won't vote SF, whether that is to the detriment of having a Unionist MP in there, well they have voted on what drives their sense of politics. The green and orange sectarian voting is what's actually wrong with the place and you seem to be encouraging it.
It's because of said voting that the place really at times looks like it will blow up, someone will light he fuse (Drumcree) and away we go with more hate politics rather than actually sorting out what the ordinary person wants..
Good infrastructure, education, health, cost of living, and a million other things have went to the wall because they refuse to work together, political point scoring while ordinary Joe is picking up the pieces
It's not so much green/orange more voting for a better option or even least worst option. Assembly elections and council elections vote for whoever you want and if you have the sense to go right down the list then your vote will eventually count due to stv but with westminster a bit more thinking is needed as it only counts once. My problem with alliance is they are trying to have their cake and eat it and that will only get them so far but they will need to make a decision one way or the other soon enough. Currently their vote is going down and will slide further as long and Muir are performing poorly. SF and SDLP need to work more closely together. Both upper Bann and East Derry are in sight if they can come to some sort of agreement. If both those seats go then NI is over
I'd like someone like Eoin Tennyson given a free run in Upper Bann if it meant Carla Lockhart out of a job. They f**king hate him, he may as well be a Republican in the eyes of the staunch Unionists/Loyalists
https://x.com/vincekearney/status/2093384977203286022
RTE have it but nothing on northern news channels.
DUP Mayor clothing probe.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c62el3yke0xo
That council, under her stewardship must have been some farce. Seems as if she was very big buddy of the DUP.
Armagh woman too. Big money job that in charge of council.
Her PA had a microphone in her pen, know where would someone get thst
Quote from: Hereiam on August 28, 2026, 10:54:50 PMHer PA had a microphone in her pen, know where would someone get thst
www.jamesbond007.com
Doing some crying about Drumcree, is the application issue only to this year, and not previous, so would the same critera still not apply not to allow it down? f**kers starting to get uppity, that they have a good chance of getting parading down the road. Just cant see it.
Quote from: Wildweasel74 on September 01, 2026, 06:37:41 PMDoing some crying about Drumcree, is the application issue only to this year, and not previous, so would the same critera still not apply not to allow it down? f**kers starting to get uppity that they a good chance there get parading down the road. Just cant see it.
I can't see it either, but this court verdict, while potentially meaning very little, has the potential to rile up the loyalist scum into starting trouble.
That Lockhart bigot said lately "it's only a 10 minute walk". Yeah, so is the the way you came , so F**kin walk back that road 10 minutes.
An expensive ten minute walk money wise and tension wise.
Reading a few things that a lot of unionists not impressed by this and it will split unionism further. It is a big exercise in shit stirring and putting it up to "them 'uns".
Strategist Jamie Bryson's 5D Chess plan:
1. Attempt to walk the Garvaghy Road.
2. If accepted, then I'm a super hero.
3. If rejected, then use the same reasoning to reject dual Irish/English signage. Then I'm a hero.
But I have news for Jamie. If he persists with his rejection of Irish signs, then there will be an equality drive to change the names of the following roads/institutions:
- Queens Bridge (Hume Bridge)
- Albert Clock (Adams Clock)
- Royal Avenue (Magennis Avenue)
- Great Victoria Street (Ahern Street)
- Queens University (Mallon University)
- Royal Hospital (Sands Hospital)
- Cromwell Road (Wolf Tone Road)
- Windsor Park (O'Connell Park)
etc etc
What would be so wrong with them walking down with children in Armagh jersies?
Quote from: Genocide Organ on September 05, 2026, 08:51:09 AMWhat would be so wrong with them walking down with children in Armagh jersies?
Look forward to seeing that lol
Not the worst idea ever. You can walk but we can walk too. Make it cross community.
Have traditional groups playing have party, make it proper inclusive ;D
QuoteHave traditional groups playing have party, make it proper inclusive ;D
Are the Wolfe Tones free ?
Could they walk far at their age?
Sure it's only a wee short walk.
Lads, gotta read the long game here, give them a inch now with a minor march and it increase yr on yr.Do think a newer spokesman needed on the residents side.They just associate Brendan with Sinn Fein,dont even know if hes in it.
Quote from: Wildweasel74 on September 05, 2026, 08:38:38 PMLads, gotta read the long game here, give them a inch now with a minor march and it increase yr on yr.Do think a newer spokesman needed on the residents side.They just associate Brendan with Sinn Fein,dont even know if hes in it.
Correct. Not an inch, and no surrender.
Quote from: AustinPowers on September 05, 2026, 07:54:42 PMQuoteHave traditional groups playing have party, make it proper inclusive ;D
Are the Wolfe Tones free ?
Could they walk far at their age?
Them boys are ageless not a bother to them.
Quote from: Armagh18 on September 06, 2026, 08:59:24 AMQuote from: AustinPowers on September 05, 2026, 07:54:42 PMQuoteHave traditional groups playing have party, make it proper inclusive ;D
Are the Wolfe Tones free ?
Could they walk far at their age?
Them boys are ageless not a bother to them.
They might come out of retirement again...for about the fifth time. :o
Quote from: marty34 on September 06, 2026, 01:38:14 PMQuote from: Armagh18 on September 06, 2026, 08:59:24 AMQuote from: AustinPowers on September 05, 2026, 07:54:42 PMQuoteHave traditional groups playing have party, make it proper inclusive ;D
Are the Wolfe Tones free ?
Could they walk far at their age?
Them boys are ageless not a bother to them.
They might come out of retirement again...for about the fifth time. :o
Have they retired again since they played the SSE last weekend?
I thought it was great the way they split up. If there was a musical equivalent of method acting that's it
Gordon Lyons can't help himself, can he? It's just dripping out of the wee bastard.
Why haven't we changed the name of this thread to The DUPaedophiles Thread?
Quote from: Armagh4sam2024 on September 08, 2026, 06:53:01 PMWhy haven't we changed the name of this thread to The DUPaedophiles Thread?
Because most people here are above the age of 15. And no political party or indeed walk of life is immune from paedophilia.
Quote from: red hander on September 08, 2026, 03:22:31 PMGordon Lyons can't help himself, can he? It's just dripping out of the wee bastard.
Montague nit far behind him !
Quote from: red hander on September 08, 2026, 03:22:31 PMGordon Lyons can't help himself, can he? It's just dripping out of the wee bastard.
whats he done now
Some whinging yesterday on the radio about the change to the nursery school entrance criteria, was he piping in on that too or was that just Givan?