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Do people think Ireland is less tolerable towards homosexuals or people of non-white race than other countries or is it the same everywhere?

I despair sometimes at the things i hear from the public and that includes the elderly and politicians towards these normal groups.

For a country the prides itself on being friendly and promotes itself to the world as the best people in the world, we do have a dark underbelly of racism and homophobia. I don't know the reasoning behind. Only thing I can think of, is with regards to racism is that we are only experiencing immigration for the first time as a nation in the last 10 years. As for homophobia, it's appears to me to be an unfortunate hangup of being a religious country (supposedly).

Both very sad indeed.

I find Ireland quite tolerable when the weather is nice.

Just to get this out of the way, because someone is going to say it soon:

O'Neill, this is one of your best creations.

(http://roflcopter.im/plog-content/images/rofl/copter/some-people-are-gay-get-over-it-lol-gays.jpg)

Quote from: ziggysego on February 08, 2010, 10:10:06 AM
For a country the prides itself on being friendly and promotes itself to the world as the best people in the world, we do have a darkie underbelly of racism and homophobia. I don't know the reasoning behind. Only thing I can think of, is with regards to racism is that we are only experiencing immigration for the first time as a nation in the last 10 years. As for homophobia, it's appears to me to be an unfortunate hangup of being a religious country (supposedly).

Both very sad indeed.

bit of a low blow ther ziggy, no need for it...I fixed it for u

Quote from: ziggysego on February 08, 2010, 10:10:06 AM
For a country the prides itself on being friendly and promotes itself to the world as the best people in the world, we do have a dark underbelly of racism and homophobia. I don't know the reasoning behind. Only thing I can think of, is with regards to racism is that we are only experiencing immigration for the first time as a nation in the last 10 years. As for homophobia, it's appears to me to be an unfortunate hangup of being a religious country (supposedly).

Both very sad indeed.

That is exactly what I think.

Quote from: Hardy on February 08, 2010, 10:12:05 AM
I find Ireland quite tolerable when the weather is nice.

Just to get this out of the way, because someone is going to say it soon:

O'Neill, this is one of your best creations.

Unfortunately there are those who will never see the serious side of what this is about.

I think it is ok to disagree on things.  I don't think racism is ok and I don't think homophobia (taken into action) is ok.
You can't tell people not to be homophobic. 

The danger of all this live and let live stuff is Ireland becomes too politically correct.  Look where it got America.

Quote from: The Iceman on February 08, 2010, 02:28:28 PM
I think it is ok to disagree on things.  I don't think racism is ok and I don't think homophobia (taken into action) is ok.
You can't tell people not to be homophobic. 

Im a bit confued here iceman.
You can tell people not to be racist but you cant tell them not to be homophobic ???

How so?

I presume he means you can stop them acting or discriminating on the basis of their prejudice. You can't really make them change their mind.

Quote from: AZOffaly on February 08, 2010, 02:33:27 PM
I presume he means you can stop them acting or discriminating on the basis of their prejudice. You can't really make them change their mind.

Dont think you can separate the 2 AZ

Another problem is a lot of people don't understand what the words mean. On the board here a few weeks ago a poster expressed his dislike of some black person (can't remember who it was). Another idiot said he was being racist, but the views were not expressed because of the man's colour and did not refer to his colour. 
Do people think that it is homophobic to feel squemish-uncomfortable (not sure what word to use) at the sight of two men snogging?

Quote from: full back on February 08, 2010, 02:46:26 PM

Quote from: AZOffaly on February 08, 2010, 02:33:27 PM
I presume he means you can stop them acting or discriminating on the basis of their prejudice. You can't really make them change their mind.

Dont think you can separate the 2 AZ

I think you can. I hate Westmeath feckers, but I wouldn't discriminate against them because of it :D

What is wrong with believing that homophobia is wrong?

Quote from: DuffleKing on February 08, 2010, 03:10:34 PM

What is wrong with believing that homophobia is wrong?

Ask Iris.

Quote from: AZOffaly on February 08, 2010, 02:59:31 PM

Quote from: full back on February 08, 2010, 02:46:26 PM

Quote from: AZOffaly on February 08, 2010, 02:33:27 PM
I presume he means you can stop them acting or discriminating on the basis of their prejudice. You can't really make them change their mind.

Dont think you can separate the 2 AZ

I think you can. I hate Westmeath feckers, but I wouldn't discriminate against them because of it :D

:D

Quote from: muppet on February 08, 2010, 03:17:03 PM

Quote from: DuffleKing on February 08, 2010, 03:10:34 PM

What is wrong with believing that homophobia is wrong?

Ask Iris.

Iris never thought it was wrong. In fact, that was her belief.

Quote from: ziggysego on February 08, 2010, 03:30:16 PM

Quote from: muppet on February 08, 2010, 03:17:03 PM

Quote from: DuffleKing on February 08, 2010, 03:10:34 PM

What is wrong with believing that homophobia is wrong?

Ask Iris.

Iris never thought it was wrong. In fact, that was her belief.

Yes but if you believe it is wrong who better to ask than one of it's main proponents?

Quote from: longrunsthefox on February 08, 2010, 02:57:54 PM
Another problem is a lot of people don't understand what the words mean. On the board here a few weeks ago a poster expressed his dislike of some black person (can't remember who it was). Another idiot said he was being racist, but the views were not expressed because of the man's colour and did not refer to his colour. 
Do people think that it is homophobic to feel squemish-uncomfortable (not sure what word to use) at the sight of two men snogging?

I find it uncomfortable, but I also feel this way when I see heterosexual couples snogging.

Quote from: 118cmal on February 08, 2010, 03:33:33 PM

Quote from: longrunsthefox on February 08, 2010, 02:57:54 PM
Another problem is a lot of people don't understand what the words mean. On the board here a few weeks ago a poster expressed his dislike of some black person (can't remember who it was). Another idiot said he was being racist, but the views were not expressed because of the man's colour and did not refer to his colour. 
Do people think that it is homophobic to feel squemish-uncomfortable (not sure what word to use) at the sight of two men snogging?

I find it uncomfortable, but I also feel this way when I see heterosexual couples snogging.

Two women kissing is nice tho   8)

Quote from: longrunsthefox on February 08, 2010, 03:35:06 PM

Two women kissing is nice tho   8)

Oh Really!!!!

(http://i147.photobucket.com/albums/r310/ludermor/FatLesbians.png)

Nice one centurian, not quite what I had in mind tho  :P

Quote from: muppet on February 08, 2010, 03:17:03 PM

Quote from: DuffleKing on February 08, 2010, 03:10:34 PM

What is wrong with believing that homophobia is wrong?

Ask Iris.

;D

I've read of serious attacks in Dublin on the gays. Remember reading a post by a gay man who was walking up Henry Street ( pedestrian street runs down one side of the GPO ) and two fellas grabbed him by the arms, twisting and yanking them behind his back, kicked his feet from under him causing him to smash his face off the ground as he couldn't put his hands out to break the fall. They then lashed into him with a serious of kicks and punches. The psycholoigacl effect on him was very frightening and I'd say a deep lifelong scar on him.

Watched on TV3 a gay man who was attacked at Christchurch, beat him to a pulp. He managed to break free and ran for it. Ran to a taxi at the lights with the others chasing him, taxi driver wouldn't let him into car. Other taxi came along, pulled up and ordered him to jump in and took him directly to hospital. It's only a matter fo time until one of them are killed. I think their was a man kicked to death up jn the Phoneix Park back in the late 70's. He wasn't gay but a gang of little scumbags thought he was.

Were those attacks because he was gay (how did they know?) or was it because they were simply scumbags on the prowl?

Quote from: AZOffaly on February 08, 2010, 04:43:51 PM
Were those attacks because he was gay (how did they know?) or was it because they were simply scumbags on the prowl?

I think they followed them after leaving a gay bar. The attack on Henry Street - their's a gay bar on Capel St which is at the bottom of Henry St. The attack in Christchurch - probably followed him form the gay bar on Gerorge's St. Maybe this isn't politically correct but to be honest, sometimes the gays are easy to pick out, you know, the effemitive hairdresser type.

I know two blokes who used to go 'gay bashing' as they called it. It was prob back in the late 70s/early 80s. Picked on he wrong gays one time and got themselves a merciless kicking. That was the end of their 'gay bashing' days.

Quote from: SuperMac on February 08, 2010, 04:42:47 PM

Quote from: muppet on February 08, 2010, 03:17:03 PM

Quote from: DuffleKing on February 08, 2010, 03:10:34 PM

What is wrong with believing that homophobia is wrong?

Ask Iris.

;D

I've read of serious attacks in Dublin on the gays. Remember reading a post by a gay man who was walking up Henry Street ( pedestrian street runs down one side of the GPO ) and two fellas grabbed him by the arms, twisting and yanking them behind his back, kicked his feet from under him causing him to smash his face off the ground as he couldn't put his hands out to break the fall. They then lashed into him with a serious of kicks and punches. The psycholoigacl effect on him was very frightening and I'd say a deep lifelong scar on him.

Watched on TV3 a gay man who was attacked at Christchurch, beat him to a pulp. He managed to break free and ran for it. Ran to a taxi at the lights with the others chasing him, taxi driver wouldn't let him into car. Other taxi came along, pulled up and ordered him to jump in and took him directly to hospital. It's only a matter fo time until one of them are killed. I think their was a man kicked to death up jn the Phoneix Park back in the late 70's. He wasn't gay but a gang of little scumbags thought he was.

Fairview I think.

Quote from: SuperMac on February 08, 2010, 04:48:21 PM

Quote from: AZOffaly on February 08, 2010, 04:43:51 PM
Were those attacks because he was gay (how did they know?) or was it because they were simply scumbags on the prowl?

I think they followed them after leaving a gay bar. The attack on Henry Street - their's a gay bar on Capel St which is at the bottom of Henry St. The attack in Christchurch - probably followed him form the gay bar on Gerorge's St. Maybe this isn't politically correct but to be honest, sometimes the gays are easy to pick out, you know, the effemitive hairdresser type.

Jesus, I know you put in a caveat, but like sometimes it's easy to pick out the black guys. ::)

I don't have a problem with gay people.  I have a problem if a gay person is outwardly over the top flamboyantly gay and wants everyone to know.  Your business is your business so keep it that way.
I don't have a problem with other races but if a black man takes my spot in the car park I'll still be pissed off and racist thoughts may automatically spring to mind.

My biggest fear is that we become so politically correct that we are not allowed to think for ourselves anymore. 

I hate the Franco phobia that I see in Ireland (long before Thierry Henry & that is not reason enough for it either). The Irish are watching too much British bigotry towards the French on British TV and also American anti-French feeling (just because the French stand up to them and their illegal wars) in American film.

(http://entertheoctopus.files.wordpress.com/2009/09/french.jpg)

Other than the Henry incident i have seen little or no anti-French activity or commentary.

Some taxidrivers let themselves down wrt to foreigners but mostly Ireland is ok. I think it is popular to run ourselves down in some way or other.

Quote from: The Iceman on February 08, 2010, 06:28:06 PM
I don't have a problem with gay people.  I have a problem if a gay person is outwardly over the top flamboyantly gay and wants everyone to know.  Your business is your business so keep it that way.
I don't have a problem with other races but if a black man takes my spot in the car park I'll still be pissed off and racist thoughts may automatically spring to mind.

My biggest fear is that we become so politically correct that we are not allowed to think for ourselves anymore.

Would you be thinking that he took your spot because he is black, or because inherently - people suck?

Quote from: muppet on February 08, 2010, 07:07:07 PM
Other than the Henry incident i have seen little or no anti-French activity or commentary.

Some taxidrivers let themselves down wrt to foreigners but mostly Ireland is ok. I think it is popular to run ourselves down in some way or other.

I found it common place among the Irish backpacking around Australia, maybe that was them hanging around with the Brits too much or living in a colony of the Empire I don't know. It used to make me sick, last Bastille Day in an Australian nightclub in the middle of a group of Irish & Brits slagging off the French I grabbed a French tri-colour from a group of French and proceeded to hoist it up on the roof to cheers from the French. Drunken Irishman in Australia  ;D

What would be the pc position on not liking a black homosexual?

Quote from: no mo do yakamo on February 08, 2010, 07:20:34 PM
What would be the pc position on not liking a black homosexual?

I think Tracy Chapman was great.

Quote from: no mo do yakamo on February 08, 2010, 07:20:34 PM
What would be the pc position on not liking a black homosexual?

Anglophobe
(http://images.football.co.uk/Dynamic/News/400x400/1192294566_spt_ai_englandvestonia_43.jpg)

Quote from: Puckoon on February 08, 2010, 07:14:46 PM

Quote from: The Iceman on February 08, 2010, 06:28:06 PM
I don't have a problem with gay people.  I have a problem if a gay person is outwardly over the top flamboyantly gay and wants everyone to know.  Your business is your business so keep it that way.
I don't have a problem with other races but if a black man takes my spot in the car park I'll still be pissed off and racist thoughts may automatically spring to mind.

My biggest fear is that we become so politically correct that we are not allowed to think for ourselves anymore.

Would you be thinking that he took your spot because he is black, or because inherently - people suck?

I only used that reference puck to demonstrate that I would have automatic racist thoughts from time to time.  Though I think we all do.
If I am reading properly between the lines I am in agreement with you that people suck.  The human race is on the slide BIG TIME.

That doesn't mean there are not a few diamonds in the rough - they are just harder to find than they used to be.

Quote from: The Iceman on February 08, 2010, 07:45:13 PM
If I am reading properly between the lines I am in agreement with you that people suck.  The human race is on the slide BIG TIME.

That doesn't mean there are not a few diamonds in the rough - they are just harder to find than they used to be.

Ok ok you dont like gays! You like men who dont suck!

Quote from: mayogodhelpus@gmail.com on February 08, 2010, 06:53:37 PM
I hate the Franco phobia that I see in Ireland (long before Thierry Henry & that is not reason enough for it either). The Irish are watching too much British bigotry towards the French on British TV and also American anti-French feeling (just because the French stand up to them and their illegal wars) in American film.

I have a dislike for colonial powers in general.

Quote from: Zapatista on February 08, 2010, 09:02:52 PM

Quote from: mayogodhelpus@gmail.com on February 08, 2010, 06:53:37 PM
I hate the Franco phobia that I see in Ireland (long before Thierry Henry & that is not reason enough for it either). The Irish are watching too much British bigotry towards the French on British TV and also American anti-French feeling (just because the French stand up to them and their illegal wars) in American film.

I have a dislike for colonial powers in general.

Like the Ulstermen who colonised and conquered Scotland, or the Leinstermen who occupied the
South Coast of Wales or attempted colonies in the Isle of Man & Anglesey. Or the Scottish (Colonial Gaels) of Irish decent who had failed to conquer the Northumbrian Kingdom. Or much later the Ulster Gaels who tried to sell the High-Kingship to the Bruces and the men of Connacht had to teach them Ireland's not for sale.

I also forgot the Kingdom of Dublin (our Viking ancestors), the Kingdom of Dublin was a Kingdom long before Denmark, Norway or Sweden, the Kingdom of Dublin (which had many mixed Gael & Gall as well as native allies, was not a benevolent power either)

Of course there is the King of Leinster inviting Strongbow into Ireland and giving his daughter and his Kingdom to a Welsh-Norman lord.

Or the servents of the Kingdom of Ireland and later the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Ireland/Northern Ireland who helped colonise the world, we both the loyal and disloyal happy to oblige.

Or the Independent colonisation of Monserette by Irishmen.

Or the Irish that served France, Spain, Portugal, the Papel States, the United States of America, the Confederate States of America, Australia, Mexico, Austria-Hungarian Empire, the Boars, Rhodesia, South Africa etc. in their World Colonisation.

Quote from: Zapatista on February 08, 2010, 09:02:52 PM

Quote from: mayogodhelpus@gmail.com on February 08, 2010, 06:53:37 PM
I hate the Franco phobia that I see in Ireland (long before Thierry Henry & that is not reason enough for it either). The Irish are watching too much British bigotry towards the French on British TV and also American anti-French feeling (just because the French stand up to them and their illegal wars) in American film.

I have a dislike for colonial powers in general.

I have a problem with mongoloid soccer supporters blathering about French Frog Bastards without having a clue about history or colonial powers, but just cos 1 french man handled the ball.

Irish rascism is odd, I hear people all the time giving out about these polish hoors robbing jobs and scamming the dole (like no irishman would ever do that!), all the foreigners are scum except the one you actually work with - he is a sound fella. Thats they type of rascism I hear all the time.

Can't get over the amount of racism in Ireland, like some of my best friends are......racists :P
or
If there is one thing i hate more than racism, it's English people. :D

Every sunday afternoon I have this strange thought, after the saturday night pints have finally settled and the spuds are tucked away i like to give ole armitage shanks a right pounding, to put it simply, I love a good 'Ian Wright'!, but i always wondered, does this make me gay?

Quote from: RealSpiritof98 on February 08, 2010, 09:45:54 PM
Every sunday afternoon I have this strange thought, after the saturday night pints have finally settled and the spuds are tucked away i like to give ole armitage shanks a right pounding, to put it simply, I love a good 'Ian Wright'!, but i always wondered, does this make me gay?

I read somewhere it does.

The French are proving themselves to be mighty intolerant and racist this last few months

Quote from: mayogodhelpus@gmail.com on February 08, 2010, 09:15:21 PM

Quote from: Zapatista on February 08, 2010, 09:02:52 PM

Quote from: mayogodhelpus@gmail.com on February 08, 2010, 06:53:37 PM
I hate the Franco phobia that I see in Ireland (long before Thierry Henry & that is not reason enough for it either). The Irish are watching too much British bigotry towards the French on British TV and also American anti-French feeling (just because the French stand up to them and their illegal wars) in American film.

I have a dislike for colonial powers in general.

Like the Ulstermen who colonised and conquered Scotland, or the Leinstermen who occupied the
South Coast of Wales or attempted colonies in the Isle of Man & Anglesey. Or the Scottish (Colonial Gaels) of Irish decent who had failed to conquer the Northumbrian Kingdom. Or much later the Ulster Gaels who tried to sell the High-Kingship to the Bruces and the men of Connacht had to teach them Ireland's not for sale.

I also forgot the Kingdom of Dublin (our Viking ancestors), the Kingdom of Dublin was a Kingdom long before Denmark, Norway or Sweden, the Kingdom of Dublin (which had many mixed Gael & Gall as well as native allies, was not a benevolent power either)

Of course there is the King of Leinster inviting Strongbow into Ireland and giving his daughter and his Kingdom to a Welsh-Norman lord.

Or the servents of the Kingdom of Ireland and later the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Ireland/Northern Ireland who helped colonise the world, we both the loyal and disloyal happy to oblige.

Or the Independent colonisation of Monserette by Irishmen.

Or the Irish that served France, Spain, Portugal, the Papel States, the United States of America, the Confederate States of America, Australia, Mexico, Austria-Hungarian Empire, the Boars, Rhodesia, South Africa etc. in their World Colonisation.

DId it take you long to do that? I didn't read it.

The worst racists I've encountered are the Irish and Irish Americans in New York... true right wingers. Horrible shower.

Quote from: longrunsthefox on February 08, 2010, 11:03:45 PM
The worst racists I've encountered are the Irish and Irish Americans in New York... true right wingers. Horrible shower.

WTF...Please explain....  :o

Quote from: stephenite on February 08, 2010, 10:01:25 PM
The French are proving themselves to be mighty intolerant and racist this last few months

What banning burkas, I think they are correct. While the Swiss banning the building of new Mosques is surely far more intolerant.

Quote from: Zapatista on February 08, 2010, 10:04:03 PM

Quote from: mayogodhelpus@gmail.com on February 08, 2010, 09:15:21 PM

Quote from: Zapatista on February 08, 2010, 09:02:52 PM

Quote from: mayogodhelpus@gmail.com on February 08, 2010, 06:53:37 PM
I hate the Franco phobia that I see in Ireland (long before Thierry Henry & that is not reason enough for it either). The Irish are watching too much British bigotry towards the French on British TV and also American anti-French feeling (just because the French stand up to them and their illegal wars) in American film.

I have a dislike for colonial powers in general.

Like the Ulstermen who colonised and conquered Scotland, or the Leinstermen who occupied the
South Coast of Wales or attempted colonies in the Isle of Man & Anglesey. Or the Scottish (Colonial Gaels) of Irish decent who had failed to conquer the Northumbrian Kingdom. Or much later the Ulster Gaels who tried to sell the High-Kingship to the Bruces and the men of Connacht had to teach them Ireland's not for sale.

I also forgot the Kingdom of Dublin (our Viking ancestors), the Kingdom of Dublin was a Kingdom long before Denmark, Norway or Sweden, the Kingdom of Dublin (which had many mixed Gael & Gall as well as native allies, was not a benevolent power either)

Of course there is the King of Leinster inviting Strongbow into Ireland and giving his daughter and his Kingdom to a Welsh-Norman lord.

Or the servents of the Kingdom of Ireland and later the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Ireland/Northern Ireland who helped colonise the world, we both the loyal and disloyal happy to oblige.

Or the Independent colonisation of Monserette by Irishmen.

Or the Irish that served France, Spain, Portugal, the Papel States, the United States of America, the Confederate States of America, Australia, Mexico, Austria-Hungarian Empire, the Boars, Rhodesia, South Africa etc. in their World Colonisation.

DId it take you long to do that? I didn't read it.

No worries, it didn't take long, was off the top of the head and I'm a quick typer often results in poor spelling. Irish colonialism is as bad as anyone else.

Unfortunately the world is getting worse. Just at a time when the general opinion on homosexuality and racial differences in man is beginning to soften and become more accepting, the general behaviour and attitudes of people towards their fellow man is becomming more grotesque.

People suck.

Quote from: longrunsthefox on February 08, 2010, 11:03:45 PM
The worst racists I've encountered are the Irish and Irish Americans in New York... true right wingers. Horrible shower.

What constitutes a 'true right winger' ?

Are all right wingers horrible?

Does this make left wingers, cool, hip and happening dudes?

The last time I was home I was shocked at a mate who informed me that he 'hated n******' I was stunned and told hime never to talk like that in front of me again, he told me straight that this was the way he felt and that all n****** were scum, I effed him off and it was at that point he asked me to fight, I was absolutely amazed, in a bar and wasnt going to start anything in there so I left, he followed me out and had the balls to say that we shouldnt be fighting over n******.

I walked away and to be honest I want right for a few days afterwards, it annoyed me so much, I want nothing to do with this ignoramus ever again.

It's not so long ago that I would have been hard on homosexuals, I would have used the usual slang to describe them and I had absolutely no use for them as people at all, it dawned on me that I was as bad as the lad I described above, maybe even worse and I changed and no longer use racist language to describe anyone other than Down people. :P

I do feel there is an over abundance of racism in Ireland, certainly we are not tolerant as at time we canot even tolerate each other and that is just too bad.

Stew, careful with your word proximities there.

Quote from: Puckoon on February 09, 2010, 12:03:18 AM
Stew, careful with your word proximities there.

I used the full n word once and I think it was appropriate given the story I was telling. Thanks puck, I will change my original post.

Quote from: Puckoon on February 08, 2010, 07:14:46 PM

Quote from: The Iceman on February 08, 2010, 06:28:06 PM
I don't have a problem with gay people.  I have a problem if a gay person is outwardly over the top flamboyantly gay and wants everyone to know.  Your business is your business so keep it that way.
I don't have a problem with other races but if a black man takes my spot in the car park I'll still be pissed off and racist thoughts may automatically spring to mind.

My biggest fear is that we become so politically correct that we are not allowed to think for ourselves anymore.

Would you be thinking that he took your spot because he is black, or because inherently - people suck?

Here what about that Greasy Mexican that stole your I-phone!  ;) Have to agree with the Iceman, whether it is soccer, work etc.. if someone of some kind of different ethnicity pisses me off I do think a few racist thoughts about them, but I don't think I really hold any strongly racist opinions.

I am glad that a lot of people agree with me, and I hope that some day soon gay people will be looked at as just normal people, like as if they have made a choice in life about hairstyle or religion. Perhaps this generation will be the ones who change perceptions and feed that to their children too.

Quote from: stew on February 09, 2010, 12:13:49 AM

Quote from: Puckoon on February 09, 2010, 12:03:18 AM
Stew, careful with your word proximities there.

I used the full n word once and I think it was appropriate given the story I was telling. Thanks puck, I will change my original post.

Stew, you may have missed Puck's point.

Quote from: Olly on February 09, 2010, 09:51:40 AM
I am glad that a lot of people agree with me, and I hope that some day soon gay people will be looked at as just normal people, like as if they have made a choice in life about hairstyle or religion. Perhaps this generation will be the ones who change perceptions and feed that to their children too.

It will never happen.

I think you are wrong but maybe thats my opinion. I work in an office with 4 gays out of 25 men. Its not even talked about and on nights out everyone is happy, no one gets uncomfortable or does anyone try to push their sexuality on others. Things are slowly changing/. I know that in rural parts of Ulster old people would almost treat you like a leper. But these people are dying.

Quote from: Olly on February 09, 2010, 10:01:08 AM
I think you are wrong but maybe thats my opinion. I work in an office with 4 gays out of 25 men. Its not even talked about and on nights out everyone is happy, no one gets uncomfortable or does anyone try to push their sexuality on others. Things are slowly changing/. I know that in rural parts of Ulster old people would almost treat you like a leper. But these people are dying.

Well they reckon that 1 in every 8 is gay so god only knows. Me personally i fall into the category of get on with what you want when your own curtains are pulled but dont involve me. Live and let live but i dont want to see it.

Quote from: Tyrones own on February 08, 2010, 11:14:08 PM

Quote from: longrunsthefox on February 08, 2010, 11:03:45 PM
The worst racists I've encountered are the Irish and Irish Americans in New York... true right wingers. Horrible shower.

WTF...Please explain....  :o

It's a long story but I was in the Bronx for a few years in the early 90s and the attiude of the Irish and Irish American wannabes towards blacks and other minority gropus was appaling. Where do I start? As a black man told me over there, 'The first word the Irish learn getting off the plane is nigger.' A Jewish man told me the Irish are equal opportunists, they discriiminate against everyone. I was friendly with a few Peurto Ricans and went into an Irish cafe one night and next day the Kerry waitress told me not to bring them in again. When I told this to other Irsih people, most agreed with her. They banned Gays from their St Patrick's Day parade.
I could give dozens of examples. I found it quite an eye opener. Striking up a friendship with a black person was certainly frowned on by the Irish about Fordham Road, Decater Avenue and that area. Irony was they were throwing money into buckets for Irish freedom   

If my daughter came home with a coloured man I would be disappointed. If my son came home with another man I would be disappointed.

Does this mean I am racist and homophobic?

Yes, a bit, but everyone is (although they wont admit it even to themselves), so dont beat yourself up about it.

Quote from: EC Unique on February 09, 2010, 11:14:07 AM
If my daughter came home with a coloured man I would be disappointed. If my son came home with another man I would be disappointed.

Does this mean I am racist and homophobic?

It would depend on the reasons for your disappointment. If your daughter came home with a coloured man who was well educated with a very good job and excellent prospects would that temper your disappointment somewhat?

Quote from: EC Unique on February 09, 2010, 11:14:07 AM
If my daughter came home with a coloured man I would be disappointed. If my son came home with another man I would be disappointed.

Really disappointed with this remark and although its not something I feel cocky about, I think you should reassess who you are.

Quote from: Olly on February 09, 2010, 11:21:35 AM

Quote from: EC Unique on February 09, 2010, 11:14:07 AM
If my daughter came home with a coloured man I would be disappointed. If my son came home with another man I would be disappointed.

Really disappointed with this remark and although its not something I feel cocky about, I think you should reassess who you are.

Really? Why? I am happy with who I am and how I have been brought up. I would guess that all of my family and friends would feel the same way. Should we all 'reassess'?

Quote from: Olly on February 09, 2010, 11:21:35 AM

Quote from: EC Unique on February 09, 2010, 11:14:07 AM
If my daughter came home with a coloured man I would be disappointed. If my son came home with another man I would be disappointed.

Really disappointed with this remark and although its not something I feel cocky about, I think you should reassess who you are.

Think Hardy was right - you have to be taking the piss

Quote from: Olly on February 09, 2010, 11:21:35 AM

Quote from: EC Unique on February 09, 2010, 11:14:07 AM
If my daughter came home with a coloured man I would be disappointed. If my son came home with another man I would be disappointed.

Really disappointed with this remark and although its not something I feel cocky about, I think you should reassess who you are.

What a load of balls!  What is wrong with being disappointed if a family member is gay? Am sure most people wouldn't treat that person any differently but if it's how you feel there is nothing you can do about it? That's the problem with political correctness we are not only told how we should behave but how we should feel.

Quote from: haranguerer on February 09, 2010, 11:32:09 AM

Quote from: Olly on February 09, 2010, 11:21:35 AM

Quote from: EC Unique on February 09, 2010, 11:14:07 AM
If my daughter came home with a coloured man I would be disappointed. If my son came home with another man I would be disappointed.

Really disappointed with this remark and although its not something I feel cocky about, I think you should reassess who you are.

Think Hardy was right - you have to be taking the piss

Just spotted this, have to agree - has to be taking the piss. Found this strange from someone challenging people to change their views on gay people...

Quote from: Olly on February 09, 2010, 09:51:40 AM
I am glad that a lot of people agree with me, and I hope that some day soon gay people will be looked at as just normal people, like as if they have made a choice in life about hairstyle or religion. Perhaps this generation will be the ones who change perceptions and feed that to their children too.

Give this opinion on 'choosing' to be gay to the 4 homosexual men in your office and see what they say  ::)

Quote from: EC Unique on February 09, 2010, 11:14:07 AM
If my daughter came home with a coloured man I would be disappointed. If my son came home with another man I would be disappointed.

Does this mean I am racist and homophobic?

What if you son came home with a coloured man and you daughter with coloured lesbian? That would really confuse things for you.

Quote from: thebigfella on February 09, 2010, 11:50:09 AM

Quote from: EC Unique on February 09, 2010, 11:14:07 AM
If my daughter came home with a coloured man I would be disappointed. If my son came home with another man I would be disappointed.

Does this mean I am racist and homophobic?

What if you son came home with a coloured man and you daughter with coloured lesbian? That would really confuse things for you.

Stuff of nightmares :D

Quote from: EC Unique on February 09, 2010, 11:14:07 AM
If my daughter came home with a coloured man I would be disappointed. If my son came home with another man I would be disappointed.

Does this mean I am racist and homophobic?

If you had to choose, would you prefer your son to come home with a white man or a black woman? :D

Quote from: Larry Duff on February 09, 2010, 11:54:43 AM

Quote from: EC Unique on February 09, 2010, 11:14:07 AM
If my daughter came home with a coloured man I would be disappointed. If my son came home with another man I would be disappointed.

Does this mean I am racist and homophobic?

If you had to choose, would you prefer your son to come home with a white man or a black woman? :D

Easy. Black woman. Would still be disappointed but less so.

Quote from: EC Unique on February 09, 2010, 11:57:27 AM

Quote from: Larry Duff on February 09, 2010, 11:54:43 AM

Quote from: EC Unique on February 09, 2010, 11:14:07 AM
If my daughter came home with a coloured man I would be disappointed. If my son came home with another man I would be disappointed.

Does this mean I am racist and homophobic?

If you had to choose, would you prefer your son to come home with a white man or a black woman? :D

Easy. Black woman. Would still be disappointed but less so.

I'd be impressed.

Quote from: EC Unique on February 09, 2010, 11:14:07 AM
If my daughter came home with a coloured man I would be disappointed. If my son came home with another man I would be disappointed.

Does this mean I am racist and homophobic?

Would agree with you, certainly on the gay point (race or colour won't bother me at all). Think things have gone too far, it's okay gays asking for equal rights and being treated with repect but its got to the point where if you don't declare that you are totally comfortable with homosexuality you are seen as a bigot!

Quote from: Larry Duff on February 09, 2010, 11:38:38 AM
That's the problem with political correctness we are not only told how we should behave but how we should feel.

That's what's funny about PC. It doesn't realise it is the replica of what it sees itself as replacing. Incorrect thoughts were a sin under the old system as well and the new regime is just as intolerant as what went before.

Quote from: EC Unique on February 09, 2010, 11:14:07 AM
If my daughter came home with a coloured man I would be disappointed. If my son came home with another man I would be disappointed.

Does this mean I am racist and homophobic?

Absolutely

Quote from: longrunsthefox on February 09, 2010, 10:12:25 AM

Quote from: Tyrones own on February 08, 2010, 11:14:08 PM

Quote from: longrunsthefox on February 08, 2010, 11:03:45 PM
The worst racists I've encountered are the Irish and Irish Americans in New York... true right wingers. Horrible shower.

WTF...Please explain....  :o

It's a long story but I was in the Bronx for a few years in the early 90s and the attiude of the Irish and Irish American wannabes towards blacks and other minority gropus was appaling. Where do I start? As a black man told me over there, 'The first word the Irish learn getting off the plane is nigger.' A Jewish man told me the Irish are equal opportunists, they discriiminate against everyone. I was friendly with a few Peurto Ricans and went into an Irish cafe one night and next day the Kerry waitress told me not to bring them in again. When I told this to other Irsih people, most agreed with her. They banned Gays from their St Patrick's Day parade.
I could give dozens of examples. I found it quite an eye opener. Striking up a friendship with a black person was certainly frowned on by the Irish about Fordham Road, Decater Avenue and that area. Irony was they were throwing money into buckets for Irish freedom

I remember reading about when 19 year old Brenadette Devlin ( McAliskey) was in Chicago and was going to give a speech in a cinema been organised by just about every right wing redneck bigot from Ireland and Irish America. Some young black Americans turned up to hear her and the organisers wouldn't let them in. She wouldn't shake hands with Mayor Daly for his mistreatment of Anti Vietnam protestors by the Chicago police and refused to speak until they let them young blacks in. A major row insued, so as a comprise they let in the young blacks but they had to stand at the back. Some woman Bernadette.

Quote from: mayogodhelpus@gmail.com on February 08, 2010, 07:19:14 PM

I found it common place among the Irish backpacking around Australia, maybe that was them hanging around with the Brits too much or living in a colony of the Empire I don't know. It used to make me sick, last Bastille Day in an Australian nightclub in the middle of a group of Irish & Brits slagging off the French I grabbed a French tri-colour from a group of French and proceeded to hoist it up on the roof to cheers from the French. Drunken Irishman in Australia  ;D

Well, when you have ' Irish ' people who follow English soccer like it's the be all and end all of everything, it's not surprising they act like Brits, though it has to be said they don't drop as low as your average assho1e that follows the English national team  - " their ain't no black in the union jack, let's send them back " at black players playing for England, I'd rather be a Packie than a Frog/Kraut/Itie/Diego etc

But that's the Brits for you, they still have that jingoistic sh!te in them, " their's only two races in the world - the British and the rest " etc, etc

Some people seem to be confusing themselves. If you feel uncomfortable about a gay or black it's because you have been brought up with suspicious morals. It's not your fault as a youngster but as you grow older you should be able to stand back and take stock of your prejudices and work out why.

Of course people choose to be gay or choose to be straight. That choice comes from natural inclinations. You can have homosexual likings but choose to be straight to conform with your community. People choose to be gay because they are gay. I chose to have dinner because I was hungery.

Would be very disappointed if my son grew up to be a queer.
Would be very disappointed if my daughter grew up to be a lesbian.
Would be very disappointed if my daughter married a black guy.
Wouldn't bother me that much if my son married a black girl, as long as she wasn't too black.

Quote from: EC Unique on February 09, 2010, 11:14:07 AM
If my daughter came home with a coloured man I would be disappointed. If my son came home with another man I would be disappointed.

Does this mean I am racist and homophobic?

Depends on your reasons for being "disappointed".
Why exactly would you be disappointed?

Quote from: Hardy on February 09, 2010, 12:41:41 PM

Quote from: Larry Duff on February 09, 2010, 11:38:38 AM
That's the problem with political correctness we are not only told how we should behave but how we should feel.

That's what's funny about PC. It doesn't realise it is the replica of what it sees itself as replacing. Incorrect thoughts were a sin under the old system as well and the new regime is just as intolerant as what went before.

What bothers me about it is that the majority of people who cry loudest about racism and homophobia are the same f**king halfwits who cant form their own opinions. They dont bother to think for themselves, and so go with the prevailing opinion.

I know that I'm a little bit racist, and a little bit homophobic, and I doubt I've ever met anyone from any race or sex, who isnt. (I'm friendly with a gay lad who quote: 'f**king hates queers' - as in the flamboyant type) but endeavour not to discriminate on the basis of either. I also know my reasons for believing its wrong to be homophobic and racist - these will differ with everyone, for no two people are likely to have the exact same opinion for the exact same reason. However, theres a lot of halfwits who have no idea why its wrong to be either, 'it just is'.

To cover the fact that they're halfwits, they then express this opinion as forcibly as possible, and round swiftly on anyone who dares to challenge their idiocy. Its exactly as Hardy says - were general opinion to change tomorrow, these same idiots would be the most racist people about.

Theres plenty of it apparent on this board too - even in that shopping in the north thread for example: arguments being bandied about were that those from the south should be made shop in the south, so that the money earnt in the south should be kept in circulation in the southern economy.

Well then, to follow that argument through - should Polish workers be forced to spend their money here, and not send it home? Or if they are going to send it home, should an Irish man be employed in preference to foreign workers, in the knowledge that the money he earns will benefit the local economy and not be removed from it? And if not, why not?

Quote from: pintsofguinness on February 09, 2010, 01:47:48 PM

Quote from: EC Unique on February 09, 2010, 11:14:07 AM
If my daughter came home with a coloured man I would be disappointed. If my son came home with another man I would be disappointed.

Does this mean I am racist and homophobic?

Depends on your reasons for being "disappointed".
Why exactly would you be disappointed?

And if his son/daughter had any sense she'd tell him he was an ignorant f**ker and have nothing to do with him again - but heh thats just my opinion.

Quote from: Olly on February 09, 2010, 01:20:54 PM
Of course people choose to be gay or choose to be straight. That choice comes from natural inclinations. You can have homosexual likings but choose to be straight to conform with your community. People choose to be gay because they are gay. I chose to have dinner because I was hungery.

You don't choose to be gay, you are gay. Acting upon it is a different matter, but you're still gay.

Quote from: mylestheslasher on February 09, 2010, 01:59:08 PM

Quote from: pintsofguinness on February 09, 2010, 01:47:48 PM

Quote from: EC Unique on February 09, 2010, 11:14:07 AM
If my daughter came home with a coloured man I would be disappointed. If my son came home with another man I would be disappointed.

Does this mean I am racist and homophobic?

Depends on your reasons for being "disappointed".
Why exactly would you be disappointed?

And if his son/daughter had any sense she'd tell him he was an ignorant f**ker and have nothing to do with him again - but heh thats just my opinion.

My sentiments too.

Especially why the f**k would you care what the colour of someone's skin is?  That's just bigotry pure and simple, and I reject the other idiots who are saying that everyone thinks that way to an extent.  I know I don't.  The irony is some of these dicks would complain about unionist bigotry/intransigence on the board from time to time.

Quote from: Master Yoda on February 09, 2010, 01:25:14 PM
Would be very disappointed if my son grew up to be a queer.
Would be very disappointed if my daughter grew up to be a lesbian.
Would be very disappointed if my daughter married a black guy.
Wouldn't bother me that much if my son married a black girl, as long as she wasn't too black.

Being disappointed isn't necessarily being racist or bigoted.

I could be disappointed if a family member married a Rossie. It doesn't make me racist.

What would make me racist however, is if I took any action (say for example never speaking to the family member again) because a person was from France, Nigeria or Roscommon or wherever.

Quote from: ziggysego on February 09, 2010, 02:00:50 PM

Quote from: Olly on February 09, 2010, 01:20:54 PM
Of course people choose to be gay or choose to be straight. That choice comes from natural inclinations. You can have homosexual likings but choose to be straight to conform with your community. People choose to be gay because they are gay. I chose to have dinner because I was hungery.

You don't choose to be gay, you are gay. Acting upon it is a different matter, but you're still gay.

How do you know that? That is one of those points that is the subject of much debate, but because its politically incorrect to say otherwise, its generally stated that it isnt a choice.

Check out the surveys done on lesbianism and you'll see some startling and strong evidence to the contrary.

Quote from: mylestheslasher on February 09, 2010, 01:59:08 PM

Quote from: pintsofguinness on February 09, 2010, 01:47:48 PM

Quote from: EC Unique on February 09, 2010, 11:14:07 AM
If my daughter came home with a coloured man I would be disappointed. If my son came home with another man I would be disappointed.

Does this mean I am racist and homophobic?

Depends on your reasons for being "disappointed".
Why exactly would you be disappointed?

And if his son/daughter had any sense she'd tell him he was an ignorant f**ker and have nothing to do with him again - but heh thats just my opinion.

Wise up. If he told his son to f*** off because he was gay then you have a point. But if he's just disappointed but lives with it then he is more tolerant than most of the PC brigade.

Not liking something but learning to deal with it is tolerance. But these days you have to like everyone or you're intolerant or an "ignorant f**ker"

Quote from: Master Yoda on February 09, 2010, 01:25:14 PM
Would be very disappointed if my son grew up to be a queer.
Would be very disappointed if my daughter grew up to be a lesbian.
Would be very disappointed if my daughter married a black guy.
Wouldn't bother me that much if my son married a black girl, as long as she wasn't too black.

Master bigot more like....

Quote from: SuperMac on February 09, 2010, 12:51:24 PM

Quote from: longrunsthefox on February 09, 2010, 10:12:25 AM

Quote from: Tyrones own on February 08, 2010, 11:14:08 PM

Quote from: longrunsthefox on February 08, 2010, 11:03:45 PM
The worst racists I've encountered are the Irish and Irish Americans in New York... true right wingers. Horrible shower.

WTF...Please explain....  :o

It's a long story but I was in the Bronx for a few years in the early 90s and the attiude of the Irish and Irish American wannabes towards blacks and other minority gropus was appaling. Where do I start? As a black man told me over there, 'The first word the Irish learn getting off the plane is nigger.' A Jewish man told me the Irish are equal opportunists, they discriiminate against everyone. I was friendly with a few Peurto Ricans and went into an Irish cafe one night and next day the Kerry waitress told me not to bring them in again. When I told this to other Irsih people, most agreed with her. They banned Gays from their St Patrick's Day parade.
I could give dozens of examples. I found it quite an eye opener. Striking up a friendship with a black person was certainly frowned on by the Irish about Fordham Road, Decater Avenue and that area. Irony was they were throwing money into buckets for Irish freedom

I remember reading about when 19 year old Brenadette Devlin ( McAliskey) was in Chicago and was going to give a speech in a cinema been organised by just about every right wing redneck bigot from Ireland and Irish America. Some young black Americans turned up to hear her and the organisers wouldn't let them in. She wouldn't shake hands with Mayor Daly for his mistreatment of Anti Vietnam protestors by the Chicago police and refused to speak until they let them young blacks in. A major row insued, so as a comprise they let in the young blacks but they had to stand at the back. Some woman Bernadette.

:) a mighty woman alright

Quote from: longrunsthefox on February 09, 2010, 02:30:06 PM

Quote from: Master Yoda on February 09, 2010, 01:25:14 PM
Would be very disappointed if my son grew up to be a queer.
Would be very disappointed if my daughter grew up to be a lesbian.
Would be very disappointed if my daughter married a black guy.
Wouldn't bother me that much if my son married a black girl, as long as she wasn't too black.

Master bigot more like....

Would be very disappointed if my son grew up to be gay
Would be very disappointed if my son grew up to be a waster
Would be very disappointed if my son grew up to be stupid
Would be very disappointed if my son grew up to be crap at football


All those statements are true, those are just things I would prefer him not to be. Am I a bigot? If I left out the first one am I a bigot? 

This Olly chap appears to be something of a sanctimonious ****. Read into that what you will. It's not personal abuse if you don't know what it says.  :)

Wouldn't care in the slightest if kids came home with boyfriends or girlfriends of a different skin colour. As long as we're not talking about gangbangers or drug dealers or the like.

If a son or daughter was gay would I feel disappointed? Yes. Would it mean I loved the any less? No.

Quote from: Larry Duff on February 09, 2010, 02:40:40 PM
All those statements are true, those are just things I would prefer him not to be. Am I a bigot? If I left out the first one am I a bigot?

I'd only be disappointed if he was a waster. I'd be disappointed if he was stupid, because he was a waster. Other than that, I wouldn't be disappointed.

Quote from: ziggysego on February 09, 2010, 02:42:41 PM

Quote from: Larry Duff on February 09, 2010, 02:40:40 PM
All those statements are true, those are just things I would prefer him not to be. Am I a bigot? If I left out the first one am I a bigot?

I'd only be disappointed if he was a waster. I'd be disappointed if he was stupid, because he was a waster. Other than that, I wouldn't be disappointed.

You wouldn't be disappointed if your child was stupid? Come on Zig! You wouldn't prefer your child to be intelligent?

As I said before, disappointment does not equate with a lack of love.

Quote from: gallsman on February 09, 2010, 02:46:36 PM

Quote from: ziggysego on February 09, 2010, 02:42:41 PM

Quote from: Larry Duff on February 09, 2010, 02:40:40 PM
All those statements are true, those are just things I would prefer him not to be. Am I a bigot? If I left out the first one am I a bigot?

I'd only be disappointed if he was a waster. I'd be disappointed if he was stupid, because he was a waster. Other than that, I wouldn't be disappointed.

You wouldn't be disappointed if your child was stupid? Come on Zig! You wouldn't prefer your child to be intelligent?

As I said before, disappointment does not equate with a lack of love.

People are different. If it can't be help, well so-be-it. If he's stupid because he didn't apply himself at school or try to learn things himself, then I would be disappointed.

And as you say disappointment does not equate lack of love. I wouldn't love my son any less of he was a waster, I'd just be disappointed.

Quote from: ziggysego on February 09, 2010, 02:42:41 PM

Quote from: Larry Duff on February 09, 2010, 02:40:40 PM
All those statements are true, those are just things I would prefer him not to be. Am I a bigot? If I left out the first one am I a bigot?

I'd only be disappointed if he was a waster. I'd be disappointed if he was stupid, because he was a waster. Other than that, I wouldn't be disappointed.

That's fair enough if that's your honest opinion. I'm just being honest in pointing out things that would make me feel disappointed, but ( as gallsman said) it wouldn't make me love him any less. But too many people would prefer if we all just said the right thing and were never really honest just to make sure no one gets the opportunity to be offended.

Of course you can't help it if they're not naturally intelligent, but would you not hope that they would grow up to be intelligent and successful?

There's a difference between being disappointed in the child and disappointed that they didn't manage to fulfil all your hopes and dreams.

Quote from: Larry Duff on February 09, 2010, 02:50:54 PM

Quote from: ziggysego on February 09, 2010, 02:42:41 PM

Quote from: Larry Duff on February 09, 2010, 02:40:40 PM
All those statements are true, those are just things I would prefer him not to be. Am I a bigot? If I left out the first one am I a bigot?

I'd only be disappointed if he was a waster. I'd be disappointed if he was stupid, because he was a waster. Other than that, I wouldn't be disappointed.

That's fair enough if that's your honest opinion. I'm just being honest in pointing out things that would make me feel disappointed, but ( as gallsman said) it wouldn't make me love him any less. But too many people would prefer if we all just said the right thing and were never really honest just to make sure no one gets the opportunity to be offended.

That's fair enough too. People feel what they feel, very little I can do about that. It's only when you try to influence others to feel the same, or act out against the said community about your feelings. That's what I'm against.

Just for the second, I'm not for a second accusing you of that :)

Quote from: gallsman on February 09, 2010, 02:52:04 PM
Of course you can't help it if they're not naturally intelligent, but would you not hope that they would grow up to be intelligent and successful?

There's a difference between being disappointed in the child and disappointed that they didn't manage to fulfil all your hopes and dreams.

That's why I said I've been disappointed if they are stupid because they are a waster.

If my son was gay I'd be raging with the wife. There's no queers in my family.

Quote from: ziggysego on February 09, 2010, 02:54:31 PM

Quote from: gallsman on February 09, 2010, 02:52:04 PM
Of course you can't help it if they're not naturally intelligent, but would you not hope that they would grow up to be intelligent and successful?

There's a difference between being disappointed in the child and disappointed that they didn't manage to fulfil all your hopes and dreams.

That's why I said I've been disappointed if they are stupid because they are a waster.

But what if they worked hard and tried their very best but were unfortunately just naturally limited? Surely you'd prefer it otherwise, no?

Quote from: gallsman on February 09, 2010, 02:57:29 PM

Quote from: ziggysego on February 09, 2010, 02:54:31 PM

Quote from: gallsman on February 09, 2010, 02:52:04 PM
Of course you can't help it if they're not naturally intelligent, but would you not hope that they would grow up to be intelligent and successful?

There's a difference between being disappointed in the child and disappointed that they didn't manage to fulfil all your hopes and dreams.

That's why I said I've been disappointed if they are stupid because they are a waster.

But what if they worked hard and tried their very best but were unfortunately just naturally limited? Surely you'd prefer it otherwise, no?

I'd be disappointed for them, that with all the effort they put in and felt they weren't achieving. I would be proud of the fact that they put in the effort and worked hard. Showed they had determination and will power to try. So they make not have book smarts, but if they applied themselves to something else more suitable to their skills, they would have the potential to do very well.

Quote from: Master Yoda on February 09, 2010, 02:56:33 PM
If my son was gay I'd be raging with the wife. There's no queers in my family.

Would you be wondering if he was yours or not! :D

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HtefgX-ZQYo

I laughed....alot :D

What if you were a siamese twin, your twin brother is gay you are not, you share the same ass, and he has a hot date tonight.

America definitely changed my thinking on a lot of this.  Living in somewhat rural Ireland you do not get exposed to too many other races(at least in 80's and 90's) or gay people.  In fact I think there was only one black man in our town and God Bless the poor lad hung himself.  Over here there are a lot of different people from different places - it really is one big melting pot.  I think I am more leaning towards Puck's views that people suck.  Depending on the area you live they might happen to be white, black, brown or yellow.  There is goodun's and baduns wherever you go.

I don't have anything against gay people.  I don't agree with how they live their lives but its their life and until the cross the boundary line into my world then there is no problem.  That standard though applies to anyone I encounter, gay or straight, black or white - you're ok in my book until you cross the line.

Quote from: ballinaman on February 09, 2010, 03:07:53 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HtefgX-ZQYo

I laughed....alot :D

Class

Quote from: The Iceman on February 09, 2010, 03:23:12 PM

I don't have anything against gay people.  I don't agree with how they live their lives but its their life and until the cross the boundary line into my world then there is no problem.  That standard though applies to anyone I encounter, gay or straight, black or white - you're ok in my book until you cross the line.

And people wonder why gays are afriad to come out! Can you imagine if your brother/sister were gay, they would love to have the love and support from a good sibling like yourself!

Quote from: longrunsthefox on February 09, 2010, 12:50:58 PM

Quote from: EC Unique on February 09, 2010, 11:14:07 AM
If my daughter came home with a coloured man I would be disappointed. If my son came home with another man I would be disappointed.

Does this mean I am racist and homophobic?

Absolutely

Fair enough. I am then. Thats how I fell and am happy enough with that.

my god some of you's are full of your own importance......

the word "disappointment" has been used a lot throughout this thread.... and for those who say it doesn't equate with love....

disappointment in another person especially a relation can have serious consequences, it is also a feeling not easily hid..

Disappointment is a subjective response related to the anticipated rewards. The psychological results of disappointment vary greatly among individuals; while some recover quickly, others mire in frustration or blame or become depressed. A 2003 study of young children with parental background of childhood onset depression found that there may be a genetic predisposition to slow recovery following disappointment. While not every person responds to disappointment by becoming depressed, depression can (in the self psychology school of psychoanalytic theory) almost always be seen as secondary to disappointment/frustration.


so whilst you say you would love your child nonetheless, you are actually causing the child more harm and in the case of the child i am sure they would relate "disappointment" to love....

what right do you have to be disappointed in their choices of partner through race or sexuality....?

Quote from: EC Unique on February 09, 2010, 04:18:07 PM

Quote from: longrunsthefox on February 09, 2010, 12:50:58 PM

Quote from: EC Unique on February 09, 2010, 11:14:07 AM
If my daughter came home with a coloured man I would be disappointed. If my son came home with another man I would be disappointed.

Does this mean I am racist and homophobic?

Absolutely

Fair enough. I am then. Thats how I fell and am happy enough with that.

You can't help being racist or homophobic as that's just the way you are and as nature intended just as much as you can't help it if you're gay.


On that note, HTF.  ;)

People in general are c***ts no matter what sexuality or race they are.

Quote from: leenie on February 09, 2010, 04:32:33 PM
my god some of you's are full of your own importance......

the word "disappointment" has been used a lot throughout this thread.... and for those who say it doesn't equate with love....

disappointment in another person especially a relation can have serious consequences, it is also a feeling not easily hid..

Disappointment is a subjective response related to the anticipated rewards. The psychological results of disappointment vary greatly among individuals; while some recover quickly, others mire in frustration or blame or become depressed. A 2003 study of young children with parental background of childhood onset depression found that there may be a genetic predisposition to slow recovery following disappointment. While not every person responds to disappointment by becoming depressed, depression can (in the self psychology school of psychoanalytic theory) almost always be seen as secondary to disappointment/frustration.


so whilst you say you would love your child nonetheless, you are actually causing the child more harm and in the case of the child i am sure they would relate "disappointment" to love....

what right do you have to be disappointed in their choices of partner through race or sexuality....?

::)

Quote from: BallyhaiseMan on February 09, 2010, 04:36:36 PM
People in general are c***ts no matter what sexuality or race they are.

I'm still resisting this notion but after a few decades it looks like it might hold some value. I honestly thought that everyone is good with a few people in a bad mood.

I'd be disappointed if my son turned out to be black.

Quote from: ludermor on February 09, 2010, 03:57:53 PM

Quote from: The Iceman on February 09, 2010, 03:23:12 PM

I don't have anything against gay people.  I don't agree with how they live their lives but its their life and until the cross the boundary line into my world then there is no problem.  That standard though applies to anyone I encounter, gay or straight, black or white - you're ok in my book until you cross the line.

And people wonder why gays are afriad to come out! Can you imagine if your brother/sister were gay, they would love to have the love and support from a good sibling like yourself!

Ludermor they would have my love and support but I don't have to agree with what they do behind closed doors.

Quote from: gallsman on February 09, 2010, 02:41:23 PM
This Olly chap appears to be something of a sanctimonious ****. Read into that what you will. It's not personal abuse if you don't know what it says.  :)

Wouldn't care in the slightest if kids came home with boyfriends or girlfriends of a different skin colour. As long as we're not talking about gangbangers or drug dealers or the like.

If a son or daughter was gay would I feel disappointed? Yes. Would it mean I loved the any less? No.

Top quality bit of non-racism there!  :D :D :D :D

Quote from: Master Yoda on February 09, 2010, 02:56:33 PM
If my son was gay I'd be raging with the wife. There's no queers in my family.

This quote pretty much sums up the patheticness of some attitudes that prevail in Ireland, in the GAA community, and in the world today.

If these statements are even being made to try and be funny - its maybe even more pathetic.

Racism, sectarianism, homophobism, scumbagism is alive, well and thriving with you lot.

Quote from: Hardy on February 09, 2010, 04:50:04 PM
I'd be disappointed if my son turned out to be black.

Post of the day :D

Quote from: Master Yoda on February 09, 2010, 01:25:14 PM
Would be very disappointed if my son grew up to be a queer.
Would be very disappointed if my daughter grew up to be a lesbian.
Would be very disappointed if my daughter married a black guy.
Wouldn't bother me that much if my son married a black girl, as long as she wasn't too black.

This has to be the most tasteless comment so far on the subject. What if she was  Whitney Heuston? Remember Ali G asking Orange men, who wouldn't marry a Catholic... wat if she was one of the Corrs?!! He'd have fun with you Master Bigot. 

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/northern_ireland/8506672.stm

Is it racist to hate foreign homophobe thugs?

Quote from: leenie on February 09, 2010, 04:32:33 PM

what right do you have to be disappointed in their choices of partner through race or sexuality....?

It is a feeling/emotion. How can rights be attached to it? If it is how a person feels the fact that somebody like you says they have no 'right' to feel like that will not change their feelings.  ::)


You were doing well until you came out with that rubbish :-\

Quote from: Puckoon on February 09, 2010, 05:13:05 PM

Quote from: Master Yoda on February 09, 2010, 02:56:33 PM
If my son was gay I'd be raging with the wife. There's no queers in my family.

This quote pretty much sums up the patheticness of some attitudes that prevail in Ireland, in the GAA community, and in the world today.

If these statements are even being made to try and be funny - its maybe even more pathetic.

Racism, sectarianism, homophobism, scumbagism is alive, well and thriving with you lot.

Puck, there's racism, homopobia and scumbagism in every country in the world. You live in the US. You must see casual racism every day. I know I did when I was there. Why is it news when an 'African American' coach/player/GM or whatever does anything in the NFL/NHL/MLB. It's only in Basketball (the 'street' game) where you never hear about the first African American to coach or whatever.

Quote from: EC Unique on February 09, 2010, 05:19:00 PM

Quote from: leenie on February 09, 2010, 04:32:33 PM

what right do you have to be disappointed in their choices of partner through race or sexuality....?

It is a feeling/emotion. How can rights be attached to it? If it is how a person feels the fact that somebody like you says they have no 'right' to feel like that will not change their feelings.  ::)


You were doing well until you came out with that rubbish :-\

Leenie is rite. Feelings come from thoughts. We have control over our feelings... 'change a thought, change a feeling.'  Is like saying I can't help hating gays and blacks... bollox

The racial divide exists, that is for sure. There is no getting away from it, as it inherently is there that there is a difference in our minds, however slight, between us and people who are different than us.

I dont mind the racial divide being mentioned in a positive light - i.e. when an african american coach wins something for the first time - as I think its a genuine attempt to move in the right direction towards marginalising the differences to a point where maybe they dont exist.


There are no doubt high levels of all those things you mentioned here in the US - however the thread title is about Ireland. I'm an irishman, and I personally would be more dissapointed with the opinions of fellow irishmen, than americans. Therefore, I think my opinion on some of the posts and contributors in this thread is valid and still stands.

Quote from: EC Unique on February 09, 2010, 04:18:07 PM

Quote from: longrunsthefox on February 09, 2010, 12:50:58 PM

Quote from: EC Unique on February 09, 2010, 11:14:07 AM
If my daughter came home with a coloured man I would be disappointed. If my son came home with another man I would be disappointed.

Does this mean I am racist and homophobic?

Absolutely

Fair enough. I am then. Thats how I fell and am happy enough with that.

Tut Tut....Racist homophobic AND a man utd 'fan'.  The shame must be eatin' you from the inside out

Quote from: longrunsthefox on February 09, 2010, 05:27:39 PM

Quote from: EC Unique on February 09, 2010, 05:19:00 PM

Quote from: leenie on February 09, 2010, 04:32:33 PM

what right do you have to be disappointed in their choices of partner through race or sexuality....?

It is a feeling/emotion. How can rights be attached to it? If it is how a person feels the fact that somebody like you says they have no 'right' to feel like that will not change their feelings.  ::)


You were doing well until you came out with that rubbish :-\

Leenie is rite. Feelings come from thoughts. We have control over our feelings... 'change a thought, change a feeling.'  Is like saying I can't help hating gays and blacks... bollox

I dissagree. People feel love towards their children naturally and can not control it.

Quote from: EC Unique on February 09, 2010, 05:34:53 PM

Quote from: longrunsthefox on February 09, 2010, 05:27:39 PM

Quote from: EC Unique on February 09, 2010, 05:19:00 PM

Quote from: leenie on February 09, 2010, 04:32:33 PM

what right do you have to be disappointed in their choices of partner through race or sexuality....?

It is a feeling/emotion. How can rights be attached to it? If it is how a person feels the fact that somebody like you says they have no 'right' to feel like that will not change their feelings.  ::)


You were doing well until you came out with that rubbish :-\

Leenie is rite. Feelings come from thoughts. We have control over our feelings... 'change a thought, change a feeling.'  Is like saying I can't help hating gays and blacks... bollox

I dissagree. People feel love towards their children naturally and can not control it.

Can't argue about that... is innate bond... but attitude to blacks and gays comes from thought process which we can change.

I don't think it is as black and white as that Fox. ;)

Well is no different to English man who would be disapointed if his daughter came home with an Irish man. I'd be disapointed with him  ;)

Quote from: longrunsthefox on February 09, 2010, 10:12:25 AM

Quote from: Tyrones own on February 08, 2010, 11:14:08 PM

Quote from: longrunsthefox on February 08, 2010, 11:03:45 PM
The worst racists I've encountered are the Irish and Irish Americans in New York... true right wingers. Horrible shower.

WTF...Please explain....  :o

It's a long story but I was in the Bronx for a few years in the early 90s and the attiude of the Irish and Irish American wannabes towards blacks and other minority gropus was appaling. Where do I start? As a black man told me over there, 'The first word the Irish learn getting off the plane is nigger.' A Jewish man told me the Irish are equal opportunists, they discriiminate against everyone. I was friendly with a few Peurto Ricans and went into an Irish cafe one night and next day the Kerry waitress told me not to bring them in again. When I told this to other Irsih people, most agreed with her. They banned Gays from their St Patrick's Day parade.
I could give dozens of examples. I found it quite an eye opener. Striking up a friendship with a black person was certainly frowned on by the Irish about Fordham Road, Decater Avenue and that area. Irony was they were throwing money into buckets for Irish freedom

Doubt that....was well and truly embedded long before getting on the plane :-\
Where does the ?"True right wingers" come into that explanation?

My God there'll be no parent of the year awards handed to some of you on this thread and certainly have a very high opinion of yourselves.


EC, you never answered my question, why exactly would you be dissapointed. 

If I found out one of my daughters was a lesbian I would be very upset, I would love her no less obviously but I would have serious issues with it, that said it is her life to live as she chooses and it wouldnt change my opinion on her in any way. Oh aye, she would never spend a night in the same room with her partner under my roof, that would never happen.

If one of my daughters were to marry a black man I couldnt care less, the only thing I would care about is that he loved her and would always treat her right and that he had a job. Colour to me matters not one iota, I dont give a shite what colour somebody is.

Quote from: Tyrones own on February 09, 2010, 05:57:53 PM

Quote from: longrunsthefox on February 09, 2010, 10:12:25 AM

Quote from: Tyrones own on February 08, 2010, 11:14:08 PM

Quote from: longrunsthefox on February 08, 2010, 11:03:45 PM
The worst racists I've encountered are the Irish and Irish Americans in New York... true right wingers. Horrible shower.

WTF...Please explain....  :o

It's a long story but I was in the Bronx for a few years in the early 90s and the attiude of the Irish and Irish American wannabes towards blacks and other minority gropus was appaling. Where do I start? As a black man told me over there, 'The first word the Irish learn getting off the plane is nigger.' A Jewish man told me the Irish are equal opportunists, they discriiminate against everyone. I was friendly with a few Peurto Ricans and went into an Irish cafe one night and next day the Kerry waitress told me not to bring them in again. When I told this to other Irsih people, most agreed with her. They banned Gays from their St Patrick's Day parade.
I could give dozens of examples. I found it quite an eye opener. Striking up a friendship with a black person was certainly frowned on by the Irish about Fordham Road, Decater Avenue and that area. Irony was they were throwing money into buckets for Irish freedom

Doubt that....was well and truly embedded long before getting on the plane :-\
Where does the ?"True right wingers" come into that explanation?

Irish-Americans I encountered were very anti-black, anti-gay, fierce supporters of the death penalty, very fundamental in their religion... I think that is right wing... 

What amazes me about some of the people on here is their almost total ignorance. Paddy went around the world and was treated 2nd class everywhere he went. There isn't one of us on this board that hasn't had a relative live abroad. We heard all the stories and the songs about the world giving Paddy shit and what do we do, we give it back to others cos they are black or Gay or Travellers or whatever. EC Unique - you are a particularily sad little man, happy in your own stupidity. You think it is ok to dislike someone cos of their skin colour? You'll be refusing your kids to use black doctors or surgeons I suppose. Maybe some of ye should take your heads out of your holes cos ye are an embarrassment to the GAA and to Ireland. I'd swap the half of ye for a any other race or creed in the world that had a bit of respect for their fellow man.

Now cue the "PC Brigade bullshit" defence/attack.

Quote from: EC Unique on February 09, 2010, 11:14:07 AM
If my daughter came home with a coloured man I would be disappointed. If my son came home with another man I would be disappointed.

Does this mean I am racist and homophobic?

Yes, and yes. Also, is the term 'coloured' not inherently racist? Are we all not 'coloured'?

Quote from: longrunsthefox on February 09, 2010, 06:52:55 PM

Quote from: Tyrones own on February 09, 2010, 05:57:53 PM

Quote from: longrunsthefox on February 09, 2010, 10:12:25 AM

Quote from: Tyrones own on February 08, 2010, 11:14:08 PM

Quote from: longrunsthefox on February 08, 2010, 11:03:45 PM
The worst racists I've encountered are the Irish and Irish Americans in New York... true right wingers. Horrible shower.

WTF...Please explain....  :o

It's a long story but I was in the Bronx for a few years in the early 90s and the attiude of the Irish and Irish American wannabes towards blacks and other minority gropus was appaling. Where do I start? As a black man told me over there, 'The first word the Irish learn getting off the plane is nigger.' A Jewish man told me the Irish are equal opportunists, they discriiminate against everyone. I was friendly with a few Peurto Ricans and went into an Irish cafe one night and next day the Kerry waitress told me not to bring them in again. When I told this to other Irsih people, most agreed with her. They banned Gays from their St Patrick's Day parade.
I could give dozens of examples. I found it quite an eye opener. Striking up a friendship with a black person was certainly frowned on by the Irish about Fordham Road, Decater Avenue and that area. Irony was they were throwing money into buckets for Irish freedom

Doubt that....was well and truly embedded long before getting on the plane :-\
Where does the ?"True right wingers" come into that explanation?

Irish-Americans I encountered were very anti-black, anti-gay, fierce supporters of the death penalty, very fundamental in their religion... I think that is right wing...

Strange, most of the ones I have met have not given a shite about black or white, were uncomfortable with homosexuality but never said anything negative about gay people, were divided on both the death penalty and politics.

Im loving the undercurrent here that assumes all members here are white and straight. And racism is a whites hating blacks thing.

Quote from: stew on February 09, 2010, 07:11:16 PM

Quote from: longrunsthefox on February 09, 2010, 06:52:55 PM

Quote from: Tyrones own on February 09, 2010, 05:57:53 PM

Quote from: longrunsthefox on February 09, 2010, 10:12:25 AM

Quote from: Tyrones own on February 08, 2010, 11:14:08 PM

Quote from: longrunsthefox on February 08, 2010, 11:03:45 PM
The worst racists I've encountered are the Irish and Irish Americans in New York... true right wingers. Horrible shower.

WTF...Please explain....  :o

It's a long story but I was in the Bronx for a few years in the early 90s and the attiude of the Irish and Irish American wannabes towards blacks and other minority gropus was appaling. Where do I start? As a black man told me over there, 'The first word the Irish learn getting off the plane is nigger.' A Jewish man told me the Irish are equal opportunists, they discriiminate against everyone. I was friendly with a few Peurto Ricans and went into an Irish cafe one night and next day the Kerry waitress told me not to bring them in again. When I told this to other Irsih people, most agreed with her. They banned Gays from their St Patrick's Day parade.
I could give dozens of examples. I found it quite an eye opener. Striking up a friendship with a black person was certainly frowned on by the Irish about Fordham Road, Decater Avenue and that area. Irony was they were throwing money into buckets for Irish freedom

Doubt that....was well and truly embedded long before getting on the plane :-\
Where does the ?"True right wingers" come into that explanation?

Irish-Americans I encountered were very anti-black, anti-gay, fierce supporters of the death penalty, very fundamental in their religion... I think that is right wing...

Strange, most of the ones I have met have not given a shite about black or white, were uncomfortable with homosexuality but never said anything negative about gay people, were divided on both the death penalty and politics.

That was my experience in the Bronx.

I think there's a level of exageration here. I don't believe all Irish people are inherently racist or homophobic. But maybe I'm naive.

Quote from: mylestheslasher on February 09, 2010, 07:03:24 PM
What amazes me about some of the people on here is their almost total ignorance. Paddy went around the world and was treated 2nd class everywhere he went. There isn't one of us on this board that hasn't had a relative live abroad. We heard all the stories and the songs about the world giving Paddy shit and what do we do, we give it back to others cos they are black or Gay or Travellers or whatever. EC Unique - you are a particularily sad little man, happy in your own stupidity. You think it is ok to dislike someone cos of their skin colour? You'll be refusing your kids to use black doctors or surgeons I suppose. Maybe some of ye should take your heads out of your holes cos ye are an embarrassment to the GAA and to Ireland. I'd swap the half of ye for a any other race or creed in the world that had a bit of respect for their fellow man.

Now cue the "PC Brigade bullshit" defence/attack.

Myles while I do agree that there is a lot of ignorance on the board I think a lot of the comments thus far from people have been to provoke comment and based on your reaction it seems to be working.

I think we should respect our fellow man - but it doesn't mean we have to respect or agree with his opinions.  We can respect his right to have opinions but we don't have to respect his opinions.  If we all followed the trend what a boring world we would live in....................

I think that both racism and homophobia are fairly rife amongst Irish people and i've heard many examples of the former, even within my own family, and i've  got nieces and nephews who are half chinese. When i pointed this out the response was  'ah that's different' WTF!!!

I would partly support what Myles said in that it is mind boggling for the Irish to be racist given their treatment abroad in the past. It's particularly disheartening to hear Irish Americans spout some of this nonsense when abroad [my brother and Sis-in-law].

Having said that I'm surprised to see posters saying that Irish/Americans and/or Americans are more racist than anyone else, where's the evidence for this?

I would differentiate between a person's sexual orientation and their race in that a person's race is absolutely predetermined at conception. I don't subscribe to the view that sexual orientation is predetermined at conception in the same fashion but is a mixture of genes, nurture and lifestyle choice. [I have zero evidence for this theory, please do not ask for any as a refusal often offends] No reason to treat them any differently tho. Having said that I wouldn't like my son be a homosexual, though i feel this unlikely as i don't have any children, despite some legendary feats in trying to beget some.  ;)

I agree re. all this crap about being 'disappointed if my son was gay'.

What would you think if your brother, your cousin or, worst still, your best friend turned out to be gay?

Quote from: AZOffaly on February 09, 2010, 07:22:14 PM
I think there's a level of exageration here. I don't believe all Irish people are inherently racist or homophobic. But maybe I'm naive.

You could well be right.

It could just be that this thread has a large proportion of arseholes.

I find it very hard to believe that any man on this board, or in Ireland for that matter, would not be taken aback and disappointed if they found out their son was gay. If you say it wouldn't annoy you in the slightest then I'd call you a liar.

I would have no problems whatsoever with any of my sons taking home woman of any colour.

Quote from: Tony Baloney on February 09, 2010, 07:55:32 PM
I find it very hard to believe that any man on this board, or in Ireland for that matter, would not be taken aback and disappointed if they found out their son was gay. If you say it wouldn't annoy you in the slightest then I'd call you a liar.

I would have no problems whatsoever with any of my sons taking home woman of any colour.

I think taken aback would be a reasonable enough emotion?  Disapointed?  I can say with certainty I wouldn't be disappointed.  I still don't understand what exactly yous are disappointed about. 

Quote from: tyssam5 on February 09, 2010, 05:17:32 PM
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/northern_ireland/8506672.stm

Is it racist to hate foreign homophobe thugs?

Their race has nothing to do with them being homophobic thugs.

Quote from: mylestheslasher on February 09, 2010, 07:03:24 PM
What amazes me about some of the people on here is their almost total ignorance. Paddy went around the world and was treated 2nd class everywhere he went. There isn't one of us on this board that hasn't had a relative live abroad. We heard all the stories and the songs about the world giving Paddy shit and what do we do, we give it back to others cos they are black or Gay or Travellers or whatever. EC Unique - you are a particularily sad little man, happy in your own stupidity. You think it is ok to dislike someone cos of their skin colour? You'll be refusing your kids to use black doctors or surgeons I suppose. Maybe some of ye should take your heads out of your holes cos ye are an embarrassment to the GAA and to Ireland. I'd swap the half of ye for a any other race or creed in the world that had a bit of respect for their fellow man.

Now cue the "PC Brigade bullshit" defence/attack.

:D :D Very good. Fire in a few more insults to make your point even stronger.

You will find there are more Irish people that would share my views than disagree.
Would they all be 'sad little people, happy in their own stupidity'?

Quote from: EC Unique on February 09, 2010, 08:27:44 PM

Quote from: mylestheslasher on February 09, 2010, 07:03:24 PM
What amazes me about some of the people on here is their almost total ignorance. Paddy went around the world and was treated 2nd class everywhere he went. There isn't one of us on this board that hasn't had a relative live abroad. We heard all the stories and the songs about the world giving Paddy shit and what do we do, we give it back to others cos they are black or Gay or Travellers or whatever. EC Unique - you are a particularily sad little man, happy in your own stupidity. You think it is ok to dislike someone cos of their skin colour? You'll be refusing your kids to use black doctors or surgeons I suppose. Maybe some of ye should take your heads out of your holes cos ye are an embarrassment to the GAA and to Ireland. I'd swap the half of ye for a any other race or creed in the world that had a bit of respect for their fellow man.

Now cue the "PC Brigade bullshit" defence/attack.

:D :D Very good. Fire in a few more insults to make your point even stronger.

You will find there are more Irish people that would share my views than disagree.
Would they all be 'sad little people, happy in their own stupidity'?

Sad indictment of the state of the nation.

Quote from: pintsofguinness on February 09, 2010, 06:00:40 PM
My God there'll be no parent of the year awards handed to some of you on this thread and certainly have a very high opinion of yourselves.


EC, you never answered my question, why exactly would you be dissapointed.

Because I would rather my children would grow up and get involved in a heterosexual traditional Irish Catholic relationship/marrage.
Is that so bad to wish for?

Quote from: EC Unique on February 09, 2010, 08:31:56 PM

Quote from: pintsofguinness on February 09, 2010, 06:00:40 PM
My God there'll be no parent of the year awards handed to some of you on this thread and certainly have a very high opinion of yourselves.


EC, you never answered my question, why exactly would you be dissapointed.

Because I would rather my children would grow up and get involved in a heterosexual traditional Irish Catholic relationship/marrage.
Is that so bad to wish for?

No it's not a bad wish, a little old fashioned maybe.

Quote from: Puckoon on February 09, 2010, 08:30:51 PM

Quote from: EC Unique on February 09, 2010, 08:27:44 PM

Quote from: mylestheslasher on February 09, 2010, 07:03:24 PM
What amazes me about some of the people on here is their almost total ignorance. Paddy went around the world and was treated 2nd class everywhere he went. There isn't one of us on this board that hasn't had a relative live abroad. We heard all the stories and the songs about the world giving Paddy shit and what do we do, we give it back to others cos they are black or Gay or Travellers or whatever. EC Unique - you are a particularly sad little man, happy in your own stupidity. You think it is ok to dislike someone cos of their skin colour? You'll be refusing your kids to use black doctors or surgeons I suppose. Maybe some of ye should take your heads out of your holes cos ye are an embarrassment to the GAA and to Ireland. I'd swap the half of ye for a any other race or creed in the world that had a bit of respect for their fellow man.

Now cue the "PC Brigade bullshit" defence/attack.

:D :D Very good. Fire in a few more insults to make your point even stronger.

You will find there are more Irish people that would share my views than disagree.
Would they all be 'sad little people, happy in their own stupidity'?

Sad indictment of the state of the nation.

I want to pitch in here mate and say that the above highlighted comment is your view on this - not necessarily true for everyone.

Let's not get too PC here folks.

Issues like these are very black and white  (pardon the pun) for most people because they don't have personal experiences with other races or with homosexuals.  Those who have friends from other persuasions or races tend to think differently or be more sympathetic.  I don't believe though that the more sympathetic view is the better one.
There is nothing wrong with gay people as I said as long as they keep their business behind closed doors.  I don't agree with what they are doing but that's between them and their maker and not for me to judge.  I would not be happy if my son said he was gay.  He could marry any colour of woman he wanted.

The main issue here is generalization.
All black people, as Chris Rock says in his standup routines, are not niggers.
Just like all Irish people are not alcoholics with ginger beards.
All Jews are not power hungry, world dominating, big nosed money hoarders.
All British people are (not) assholes

I think you can have a black friend or family member but have a generalized distaste for black people - especially in areas like NY or London where a lot of black people have major chips on their shoulders and its tough as a white person to live/socialize there.
I think you can have Eastern European friends but have a generalized distaste for Eastern Europeans living in Dungannon because of recent murders and outbreaks of violence.

Spend a month living in Sydenham or Crystal Palace in London and walk away without a generalized distrust for black people.

And all white people are not racists or homophobes!

Quote from: mylestheslasher on February 09, 2010, 07:03:24 PM
What amazes me about some of the people on here is their almost total ignorance. Paddy went around the world and was treated 2nd class everywhere he went. There isn't one of us on this board that hasn't had a relative live abroad. We heard all the stories and the songs about the world giving Paddy shit and what do we do, we give it back to others cos they are black or Gay or Travellers or whatever. EC Unique - you are a particularily sad little man, happy in your own stupidity. You think it is ok to dislike someone cos of their skin colour? You'll be refusing your kids to use black doctors or surgeons I suppose. Maybe some of ye should take your heads out of your holes cos ye are an embarrassment to the GAA and to Ireland. I'd swap the half of ye for a any other race or creed in the world that had a bit of respect for their fellow man.

Now cue the "PC Brigade bullshit" defence/attack.

Very well said

Quote from: The Iceman on February 09, 2010, 08:55:15 PM

Quote from: Puckoon on February 09, 2010, 08:30:51 PM

Quote from: EC Unique on February 09, 2010, 08:27:44 PM

Quote from: mylestheslasher on February 09, 2010, 07:03:24 PM
What amazes me about some of the people on here is their almost total ignorance. Paddy went around the world and was treated 2nd class everywhere he went. There isn't one of us on this board that hasn't had a relative live abroad. We heard all the stories and the songs about the world giving Paddy shit and what do we do, we give it back to others cos they are black or Gay or Travellers or whatever. EC Unique - you are a particularly sad little man, happy in your own stupidity. You think it is ok to dislike someone cos of their skin colour? You'll be refusing your kids to use black doctors or surgeons I suppose. Maybe some of ye should take your heads out of your holes cos ye are an embarrassment to the GAA and to Ireland. I'd swap the half of ye for a any other race or creed in the world that had a bit of respect for their fellow man.

Now cue the "PC Brigade bullshit" defence/attack.

:D :D Very good. Fire in a few more insults to make your point even stronger.

You will find there are more Irish people that would share my views than disagree.
Would they all be 'sad little people, happy in their own stupidity'?

Sad indictment of the state of the nation.

I want to pitch in here mate and say that the above highlighted comment is your view on this - not necessarily true for everyone.

Let's not get too PC here folks.

Issues like these are very black and white  (pardon the pun) for most people because they don't have personal experiences with other races or with homosexuals.  Those who have friends from other persuasions or races tend to think differently or be more sympathetic.  I don't believe though that the more sympathetic view is the better one.
There is nothing wrong with gay people as I said as long as they keep their business behind closed doors.  I don't agree with what they are doing but that's between them and their maker and not for me to judge.  I would not be happy if my son said he was gay.  He could marry any colour of woman he wanted.

The main issue here is generalization.
All black people, as Chris Rock says in his standup routines, are not niggers.
Just like all Irish people are not alcoholics with ginger beards.
All Jews are not power hungry, world dominating, big nosed money hoarders.
All British people are (not) assholes

I think you can have a black friend or family member but have a generalized distaste for black people - especially in areas like NY or London where a lot of black people have major chips on their shoulders and its tough as a white person to live/socialize there.
I think you can have Eastern European friends but have a generalized distaste for Eastern Europeans living in Dungannon because of recent murders and outbreaks of violence.

Spend a month living in Sydenham or Crystal Palace in London and walk away without a generalized distrust for black people.

Is it too much to ask that a person would have the sense to realise that just because they lived in a crime filled ghetto filled by say blacks that they would realise that the other billions of blacks in the world are not criminals. I mean it is baby infant common sense isn't it? The fact is the more of this intolerance we have in the world the more we hurtle towards disaster. Sadest of all is that I am guessing the majority of people on here are young and could be have kids and are polluting them and so another generation with this prejudicial bullshit.

Quote from: The Iceman on February 09, 2010, 08:55:15 PM

There is nothing wrong with gay people as I said as long as they keep their business behind closed doors. 

Does the same go for hetrosexuals?

Quote from: The Iceman on February 09, 2010, 08:55:15 PM

Let's not get too PC here folks.

a lot of black people have major chips on their shoulders

(http://doctore.blog.is/users/b4/doctore/img/negrosfrowndi2.jpg)

Quote
Spend a month living in Sydenham or Crystal Palace in London and walk away without a generalized distrust for black people.

I have lived near Sydenham in London (about 10 minutes away on the bus) in an area that is predominantly "black" for about 3.5 years.

I do not harbour a generalized distrust for black people as you suggest I should - despite being involved in certain incidents over the years such as having my phone stolen by two black guys.  I have met genuinely nice black people and black people I am fearful off.  However, I have met genuinely nice white people and white people I am fearful off.  I can honestly NOT say that in my area the percentage of "nice" white people outweighs the percentage of "nice" black people.  The issue is not skin colour but it is a lack of opportunity and education.  It has been shown that areas of economic deprivation can go into a downward spiral resulting in those born in those areas being more likely to have less education and "success" in life.  This goes for "whites" in those areas as well - although generally areas tend to become pockets of one ethnicity.  Studies have also been conducted to show that skin colour has no impact on intelligence and that two students born in the same area with the same opportunities will perform no better or worse based on skin colour.  So you are wrong to generalize and say people who live in Sydenham will have a distrust of black people (unless those people fail to see the bigger picture like you have).

Getting back to the discussion at hand - the lady that used to live in the flat above me was from the Ivory Coast.  She told me stories about how the Irish in Dublin regularly shouted abuse at her and her husband and how they ultimately left Dublin as a result.  Living in Belfast I saw every other week reports of the Chinese being attacked.  At work two of the girls of Indian descent were going to Belfast and the Giants Causeway.  I actually gave them a heads up before they went and was fearful that they may have abuse shouted at them.

Same goes for homosexuals. 

The Irish are small minded and easily brainwashed.  Be that by the English, De Velera, the Church or the current Fianna Fail government.  The Irish cling to the "group" mentality and attack those that don't conform to the socially accepted norm.  We are the biggest emmigrators (per capita) in history and yet we lament at the Polish etc coming to Ireland to seek a better life.  A reputation for being warm friendly people but up until recently it was a social taboo for a father to say "I love you" to his Children.  I'd rather my daughter married a "nice" black girl rather than a bigotted, emotionally devoid, small minded Irish man (albeit potentially giving up the grandchildren would be heartbreak)

Quote from: Caid on February 09, 2010, 10:28:20 PM



I do not harbour a generalized distrust for black people .     So you are wrong to generalize and say people who live in Sydenham will have a distrust of black people (unless those people fail to see the bigger picture like you have).
]



The Irish are small minded and easily brainwashed.  Be that by the English, De Velera, the Church or the current Fianna Fail government.  The Irish cling to the "group" mentality and attack those that don't conform to the socially accepted norm. 

::) The irony.

Try again.

If you read over this thread you can see that people are very different still. I think it will make people reassess their thoughts and while I am so pleased to see the liberal and free thinking attitutes of some, there are others who are still living in the 1960s.

Do you not think the 'group' mentality is prevalent in all races, creeds etc and not just the Irish?

It's origins are probably from the start of the human race as a sort of survival instinct, safety in numbers of like minded, similar looking people, all that sort of thing.

With a bit of wit, education and confidence in ones self most people can override this instinct but others can't

The murder trial of Shaun Fitzpatrick in Dungannon shows were homophobia can lead... ironically
was a lot of anger towards Lithuanian community there afterwards but really is two individuals accused of his terrible killing not  a whole race or people...
There was another fellow was stabbed and murdered in Dungannon a few years ago. Eamonn Hughes. The next morning people were asking, 'Was it foreign nationals?'... anyway it turned out local hoods-druggies are on trial for that. Doesn't do to put the same traits on groups of people because their skin colour.       
What country is 'foreign nationa anyway?' Is used in the papers as derogatory term and never  used about people from America or Australia, just East Europeans and black folk.

Some of the most racist people I have met in Oz are Irish backpackers who have done the obligatory Sydney, Melbourne, Brisbane, Darmin, and Perth city route without once ever spending any time in an indigenous community.  Then to hear them spout shite about the aborigines - it makes me sick and on many occasions I have interrupted them during their vitriolic diatribes and asked them to explain the basis for their opinions.   They've never been able to. Never once have I heard one person say they spent time in Waluna, Halls Creek or Fitzroy Crossing, Alice Springs, Hermannsburg, Katherine, Cairns or Weipa.

Folks, if or when you come to this continent, keep your mouths shut about aborigines.  Trusting the words of the other racists in this country is no sound basis for your "opinions".

Quote from: ONeill on February 09, 2010, 09:59:04 PM

Quote from: The Iceman on February 09, 2010, 08:55:15 PM

There is nothing wrong with gay people as I said as long as they keep their business behind closed doors. 

Does the same go for hetrosexuals?

If you look back over my posts ONeill you will say that I said this is true for everyone I encounter.  You are OK until you cross the line

I am not defending racism or homophobia.  I am however understanding of why it exists.

Maybe I spent too much time trying to explain myself instead of being blunt.

People suck.  Everywhere you go there are bad people and good people.  This is not dependent on skin colour, age, body fat percentage, sexual orientation or religion or whatever else we can discriminate against.  People just suck.

As people we tend to generalize.  This leads to discrimination.
Therefore the problem isn't racism or homophobia  - its generalizing.

What's the answer?

I don't think its overly complicated.

Peace.

Quote from: The Iceman on February 10, 2010, 02:08:31 PM
As people we tend to generalize.  This leads to discrimination.
Therefore the problem isn't racism or homophobia  - its generalizing.

That's a rather simplistic and naive notion you have there.

Quote from: ziggysego on February 10, 2010, 02:11:40 PM

Quote from: The Iceman on February 10, 2010, 02:08:31 PM
As people we tend to generalize.  This leads to discrimination.
Therefore the problem isn't racism or homophobia  - its generalizing.

That's a rather simplistic and naive notion you have there.

How so?

Quote from: The Iceman on February 10, 2010, 03:22:28 PM

Quote from: ziggysego on February 10, 2010, 02:11:40 PM

Quote from: The Iceman on February 10, 2010, 02:08:31 PM
As people we tend to generalize.  This leads to discrimination.
Therefore the problem isn't racism or homophobia  - its generalizing.

That's a rather simplistic and naive notion you have there.

How so?

Maybe stereotyping would be a better word?

Quote from: muppet on February 10, 2010, 03:28:37 PM

Quote from: The Iceman on February 10, 2010, 03:22:28 PM

Quote from: ziggysego on February 10, 2010, 02:11:40 PM

Quote from: The Iceman on February 10, 2010, 02:08:31 PM
As people we tend to generalize.  This leads to discrimination.
Therefore the problem isn't racism or homophobia  - its generalizing.

That's a rather simplistic and naive notion you have there.

How so?

Maybe stereotyping would be a better word?

Maybe.

Quote from: tyssam5 on February 09, 2010, 05:06:15 PM

Quote from: gallsman on February 09, 2010, 02:41:23 PM
This Olly chap appears to be something of a sanctimonious ****. Read into that what you will. It's not personal abuse if you don't know what it says.  :)

Wouldn't care in the slightest if kids came home with boyfriends or girlfriends of a different skin colour. As long as we're not talking about gangbangers or drug dealers or the like.

If a son or daughter was gay would I feel disappointed? Yes. Would it mean I loved the any less? No.

Top quality bit of non-racism there!  :D :D :D :D

Nothing racist about being realistic. For example, if I lived in LA and my daughter came home with a black man, I'd much prefer him to be Barack Obama than Boyz in the Hood.

Quote from: pintsofguinness on February 09, 2010, 07:59:48 PM

Quote from: Tony Baloney on February 09, 2010, 07:55:32 PM
I find it very hard to believe that any man on this board, or in Ireland for that matter, would not be taken aback and disappointed if they found out their son was gay. If you say it wouldn't annoy you in the slightest then I'd call you a liar.

I would have no problems whatsoever with any of my sons taking home woman of any colour.

I think taken aback would be a reasonable enough emotion?  Disapointed?  I can say with certainty I wouldn't be disappointed.  I still don't understand what exactly yous are disappointed about.

No grandchildren for one.

They could adopt or buy a kid in africa like Madonna

Major Irony here.

People come on and see its not ok to be anti anything or unsympathetic towards colours, religions, sexual orientation.

But in doing so you are anti conservative yourself.

Why can't conservatives be left alone to their opinions.  Conservatives have just as many rights as gay people or people who choose to get abortions or whatever the case may be.

There is discrimination in many shapes and forms.

By standing up against one you discriminate another...................

Thats life. Thats what the people say......................

Quote from: Aerlik on February 10, 2010, 12:54:59 PM
Some of the most racist people I have met in Oz are Irish backpackers who have done the obligatory Sydney, Melbourne, Brisbane, Darmin, and Perth city route without once ever spending any time in an indigenous community.  Then to hear them spout shite about the aborigines - it makes me sick and on many occasions I have interrupted them during their vitriolic diatribes and asked them to explain the basis for their opinions.   They've never been able to. Never once have I heard one person say they spent time in Waluna, Halls Creek or Fitzroy Crossing, Alice Springs, Hermannsburg, Katherine, Cairns or Weipa.

Folks, if or when you come to this continent, keep your mouths shut about aborigines.  Trusting the words of the other racists in this country is no sound basis for your "opinions".

Dont be so patronising!

Quote from: ludermor on February 10, 2010, 05:38:46 PM
They could adopt or buy a kid in africa like Madonna

That brings up a separate issue. Are you homophobic if you disagree with homosexual couples raising children? I know I don't agree with it, yet I don't consider myself homophobic and happen to have several gay friends.

Quote from: gallsman on February 10, 2010, 05:36:47 PM

Quote from: pintsofguinness on February 09, 2010, 07:59:48 PM

Quote from: Tony Baloney on February 09, 2010, 07:55:32 PM
I find it very hard to believe that any man on this board, or in Ireland for that matter, would not be taken aback and disappointed if they found out their son was gay. If you say it wouldn't annoy you in the slightest then I'd call you a liar.

I would have no problems whatsoever with any of my sons taking home woman of any colour.

I think taken aback would be a reasonable enough emotion?  Disapointed?  I can say with certainty I wouldn't be disappointed.  I still don't understand what exactly yous are disappointed about.

No grandchildren for one.

aye but that's about it.

Quote from: gallsman on February 10, 2010, 06:10:24 PM

Quote from: ludermor on February 10, 2010, 05:38:46 PM
They could adopt or buy a kid in africa like Madonna

That brings up a separate issue. Are you homophobic if you disagree with homosexual couples raising children? I know I don't agree with it, yet I don't consider myself homophobic and happen to have several gay friends.

we've been through this on the board before and I've yet to hear one good reason why they shouldn't. 
In fact every argument used would have been used against single parent families 20 years ago.

Quote from: pintsofguinness on February 10, 2010, 06:13:27 PM

Quote from: gallsman on February 10, 2010, 05:36:47 PM

Quote from: pintsofguinness on February 09, 2010, 07:59:48 PM

Quote from: Tony Baloney on February 09, 2010, 07:55:32 PM
I find it very hard to believe that any man on this board, or in Ireland for that matter, would not be taken aback and disappointed if they found out their son was gay. If you say it wouldn't annoy you in the slightest then I'd call you a liar.

I would have no problems whatsoever with any of my sons taking home woman of any colour.

I think taken aback would be a reasonable enough emotion?  Disapointed?  I can say with certainty I wouldn't be disappointed.  I still don't understand what exactly yous are disappointed about.

No grandchildren for one.

aye but that's about it.

Quote from: gallsman on February 10, 2010, 06:10:24 PM

Quote from: ludermor on February 10, 2010, 05:38:46 PM
They could adopt or buy a kid in africa like Madonna

That brings up a separate issue. Are you homophobic if you disagree with homosexual couples raising children? I know I don't agree with it, yet I don't consider myself homophobic and happen to have several gay friends.

we've been through this on the board before and I've yet to hear one good reason why they shouldn't. 
In fact every argument used would have been used against single parent families 20 years ago.

You asked why someone would be disappointed and I gave you a reason that you apparently find acceptable/understandable. Where's the issue? Ideally I would like my sons to grow up receiving a good education, form a loving relationship with a good woman and raise a fine family I could be proud of.

Not sure what you're asking me gallsman.

Quotewe've been through this on the board before and I've yet to hear one good reason why they shouldn't.
In fact every argument used would have been used against single parent families 20 years ago.

and what a wonderful addition to society that has been.
some day chart a graph for yourself marking the rise in crime and the rise in single parent families and add 2 and 2 together

Quote from: rosnarun on February 10, 2010, 06:45:27 PM

Quotewe've been through this on the board before and I've yet to hear one good reason why they shouldn't.
In fact every argument used would have been used against single parent families 20 years ago.

and what a wonderful addition to society that has been.
some day chart a graph for yourself marking the rise in crime and the rise in single parent families and add 2 and 2 together

Glad to see it's not just black people or gay people we're prejudiced towards.

Quote from: rosnarun on February 10, 2010, 06:45:27 PM

Quotewe've been through this on the board before and I've yet to hear one good reason why they shouldn't.
In fact every argument used would have been used against single parent families 20 years ago.

and what a wonderful addition to society that has been.
some day chart a graph for yourself marking the rise in crime and the rise in single parent families and add 2 and 2 together

The price of diesel has been increasing of late too, is that related to the increase in crime? Just putting 2 & 2 together. leave statistics to someone who understands them if I were you.

Quote from: rosnarun on February 10, 2010, 06:45:27 PM

Quotewe've been through this on the board before and I've yet to hear one good reason why they shouldn't.
In fact every argument used would have been used against single parent families 20 years ago.

and what a wonderful addition to society that has been.
some day chart a graph for yourself marking the rise in crime and the rise in single parent families and add 2 and 2 together

You twat.

Whats the view like up there from that high horse of yours?

Quote from: pintsofguinness on February 10, 2010, 06:35:46 PM
Not sure what you're asking me gallsman.

I'm pointing out that you asked what the problem was and when I gave you one you found acceptable you passed it off as "aye, but that's about the only one." Is there a pre-set benchmark of reasons before I'm allowed form my opinion?

Quote from: gallsman on February 10, 2010, 07:18:16 PM

Quote from: pintsofguinness on February 10, 2010, 06:35:46 PM
Not sure what you're asking me gallsman.

I'm pointing out that you asked what the problem was and when I gave you one you found acceptable you passed it off as "aye, but that's about the only one." Is there a pre-set benchmark of reasons before I'm allowed form my opinion?

I said I didnt understand why people would be disappointed - you said about grandchildren and I accepted that (no doubt you and the other would just be as "disappointed" if you found your son or his wife couldn't have children) - If you come up with another reason why you'd be disappointed and I find it reasonable I'll accept that too.

Quote from: pintsofguinness on February 10, 2010, 07:24:24 PM

Quote from: gallsman on February 10, 2010, 07:18:16 PM

Quote from: pintsofguinness on February 10, 2010, 06:35:46 PM
Not sure what you're asking me gallsman.

I'm pointing out that you asked what the problem was and when I gave you one you found acceptable you passed it off as "aye, but that's about the only one." Is there a pre-set benchmark of reasons before I'm allowed form my opinion?

I said I didnt understand why people would be disappointed - you said about grandchildren and I accepted that (no doubt you and the other would just be as "disappointed" if you found your son or his wife couldn't have children) - If you come up with another reason why you'd be disappointed and I find it reasonable I'll accept that too.

If, heaven forbid, you ever have kids, can you honestly say you wouldn't prefer them to be straight?

Quote from: gallsman on February 10, 2010, 08:19:39 PM

Quote from: pintsofguinness on February 10, 2010, 07:24:24 PM

Quote from: gallsman on February 10, 2010, 07:18:16 PM

Quote from: pintsofguinness on February 10, 2010, 06:35:46 PM
Not sure what you're asking me gallsman.

I'm pointing out that you asked what the problem was and when I gave you one you found acceptable you passed it off as "aye, but that's about the only one." Is there a pre-set benchmark of reasons before I'm allowed form my opinion?

I said I didnt understand why people would be disappointed - you said about grandchildren and I accepted that (no doubt you and the other would just be as "disappointed" if you found your son or his wife couldn't have children) - If you come up with another reason why you'd be disappointed and I find it reasonable I'll accept that too.

If, heaven forbid, you ever have kids, can you honestly say you wouldn't prefer them to be straight?

I would I think but not because of any problem I have, Id be worried about the prejudices he/she may face. 
As long as they were happy, worked hard and were a good person and their partner was the same I'd be happy enough. 

and why heaven forbid if i have kids? what's that mean?

Quote from: pintsofguinness on February 10, 2010, 08:36:33 PM

Quote from: gallsman on February 10, 2010, 08:19:39 PM

Quote from: pintsofguinness on February 10, 2010, 07:24:24 PM

Quote from: gallsman on February 10, 2010, 07:18:16 PM

Quote from: pintsofguinness on February 10, 2010, 06:35:46 PM
Not sure what you're asking me gallsman.

I'm pointing out that you asked what the problem was and when I gave you one you found acceptable you passed it off as "aye, but that's about the only one." Is there a pre-set benchmark of reasons before I'm allowed form my opinion?

I said I didnt understand why people would be disappointed - you said about grandchildren and I accepted that (no doubt you and the other would just be as "disappointed" if you found your son or his wife couldn't have children) - If you come up with another reason why you'd be disappointed and I find it reasonable I'll accept that too.

If, heaven forbid, you ever have kids, can you honestly say you wouldn't prefer them to be straight?

I would I think but not because of any problem I have, Id be worried about the prejudices he/she may face. 
As long as they were happy, worked hard and were a good person and their partner was the same I'd be happy enough. 

and why heaven forbid if i have kids? what's that mean?

Because you frequently mention on here how you have no desire for children. nothing to do with your somewhat sour disposition. ;)

You've just said exactly what I was pointing out the whole time. I'd be disappointed if my child turned out gay, but not through any hatred for or dislike of homosexuality. I'd simply prefer them to be straight.

Quote from: gallsman on February 10, 2010, 08:44:09 PM

Quote from: pintsofguinness on February 10, 2010, 08:36:33 PM

Quote from: gallsman on February 10, 2010, 08:19:39 PM

Quote from: pintsofguinness on February 10, 2010, 07:24:24 PM

Quote from: gallsman on February 10, 2010, 07:18:16 PM

Quote from: pintsofguinness on February 10, 2010, 06:35:46 PM
Not sure what you're asking me gallsman.

I'm pointing out that you asked what the problem was and when I gave you one you found acceptable you passed it off as "aye, but that's about the only one." Is there a pre-set benchmark of reasons before I'm allowed form my opinion?

I said I didnt understand why people would be disappointed - you said about grandchildren and I accepted that (no doubt you and the other would just be as "disappointed" if you found your son or his wife couldn't have children) - If you come up with another reason why you'd be disappointed and I find it reasonable I'll accept that too.

If, heaven forbid, you ever have kids, can you honestly say you wouldn't prefer them to be straight?

I would I think but not because of any problem I have, Id be worried about the prejudices he/she may face. 
As long as they were happy, worked hard and were a good person and their partner was the same I'd be happy enough. 

and why heaven forbid if i have kids? what's that mean?

Because you frequently mention on here how you have no desire for children. nothing to do with your somewhat sour disposition. ;)

You've just said exactly what I was pointing out the whole time. I'd be disappointed if my child turned out gay, but not through any hatred for or dislike of homosexuality. I'd simply prefer them to be straight.

I never said I'd be disappointed, I wouldn't.  I may be worried about what he/she may have to live with and the only reason I may prefer them to be straight is that it may be an easier life when you don't have to face prejudices.  however if I did have kids, by the time they grow up none of this will be an issue, we hope.

Quote from: The Iceman on February 10, 2010, 06:06:50 PM
Major Irony here.

People come on and see its not ok to be anti anything or unsympathetic towards colours, religions, sexual orientation.

But in doing so you are anti conservative yourself.

Why can't conservatives be left alone to their opinions.  Conservatives have just as many rights as gay people or people who choose to get abortions or whatever the case may be.

There is discrimination in many shapes and forms.

By standing up against one you discriminate another...................

Thats life. Thats what the people say......................

That is a strange logic: someone opposing prejudice and bigotry is thereby prejudiced and bigoted themselves! Opposing and endorsing or consenting to prejudice are not morally equivalent positions.

Conservatives or whoever are entitled to their prejudices. They are not entitled to respect for those prejudices. In any decent society they are not entitled to have those prejudices enshrined in law or to expect any protection from the law for disciminating based on them.

The idea that homosexuality should be hidden or that it is acceptable to be disappointed if your child is gay or marries someone from another race is just ridiculous (Pints reasoning that he would fear for his children due to the ridiculous obstacles they might have to face is a fair exception). Why should a gay couple have to hide their affections while straight couples don't? If it makes you uncomfortable (not you specifically Iceman!), that's your problem, not theirs. Its like the ludicrous "don't ask don't tell" rule Obama is trying to have removed from the US military. Under it, you can join the military if you're gay, as long as you don't reveal your homosexuality while you're in there. Which means, while your colleagues are free to talk about their better halves and their kids, you, who may be spilling blood and putting your life on the line with these people, have to keep your mouth shut. All so any of your colleagues who are bigoted and prejudiced don't feel uncomfortable. Not good for morale, just like it wasn't good for morale to have mixed race regiments through WWII. Instead of telling these people to get a grip, you discriminate against the minority because it is easier to do than challenge prejudice.

Thankfully society is slowly growing up and the coming generations will leave these issues behind.

 

Quote from: mylestheslasher on February 10, 2010, 06:57:51 PM

Quote from: rosnarun on February 10, 2010, 06:45:27 PM

Quotewe've been through this on the board before and I've yet to hear one good reason why they shouldn't.
In fact every argument used would have been used against single parent families 20 years ago.

and what a wonderful addition to society that has been.
some day chart a graph for yourself marking the rise in crime and the rise in single parent families and add 2 and 2 together

The price of diesel has been increasing of late too, is that related to the increase in crime? Just putting 2 & 2 together. leave statistics to someone who understands them if I were you.

sure it has some effect , as does all inflation.
there are many shared characteristics in the criminal fraternity but one of the highest is that the individual are from broken and single parent households , you may choose to ignore this and prefer to think of these offender as being evil without reason. but Kids raised in this environment are put a a huge disadvantage for the rest of their lives .
Im was just curious how this was used as a positive in a debate on social structure?

How about nudists, should they be free to do their thing without prejudice? Are you a bigot if you are not happy with your son/daughter parading naked down Grafton st?

Quote from: armaghniac on February 11, 2010, 01:08:50 AM
How about nudists, should they be free to do their thing without prejudice? Are you a bigot if you are not happy with your son/daughter parading naked down Grafton st?

What's next on the list? Paedophiles?!! But that's an interesting question!

I would not think that a local cultural preference that clothing be worn in public is the same as discrimination or prejudice against someone on the basis of their sexuality or their race. Everyone must wear clothes on Grafton Street, just as everyone is required to obey the speed limit and pay their taxes. These are reasonable, modest expectations that Irish society expects everyone to meet. It isn't the case that one group is being singled out and told they must wear clothes while everyone else is free not to.

But then, someone might say, no one is requiring homosexuals to do anything that the rest of normal society won't do! Just like requiring nudists to wear clothes in public is not something we don't require everyone to do!

And, technically, on the surface, that is probably a fair point.

So the argument is whether society's refusal to allow nudists to disrobe on a public street is the equivalent of preventing homosexuals from pursuing relations with the same sex, and similarly, whether disapproval of the former is not bigotry or prejudice if disapproval of the latter is.

I guess societal values are dynamic. At different times, we have different standards for different things. Homosexuality was only decriminalized in Ireland in the past two decades. You could hardly get a condom until the mid-80s. The Aboriginal people were (in legal terms) part of the native fauna of Australia until the late 1960s. At various time, prejudice against homosexuals, aborigines, African Americans, Jews and many other groups have been part of respectable normal society in various places. Sooner or later, the majorities come to see (or are forced to see) that those prejudices are without basis or justification. I would certainly place homosexuality in that category. There is no justification for prejudice against someone based on their sexual preference (if you can present anything that does justify it, please go ahead), just as there isn't based on their race. You can certainly criticize some homosexual behavior such as, in some cases, promiscuity and the risks it carries, but that criticism can be leveled at many heterosexual males too and is a more a gender trait. And I don't see how the religious justification can stand. Make a defense of it if you wish, but the fact that it says so in Leviticus or wherever doesn't seem to be a very sturdy basis to me. So, if you are disappointed that your son or daughter turns out to be gay, beyond Pint's concerns about societal acceptance, I think the problem is you, not them. 

Which leaves the nudists! Are we discriminating against them? Well is there a feeling out there amongst the nudist community that we are? Are they looking to walk down Grafton Street? Do they feel that our decency laws reflect our bigoted intolerance of their lifestyle? Have they ever tested the laws? Personally, I haven't really given their plight much thought, beyond the fact that I would be completely in favour of allowing clothing optional beaches (with prominent warnings for the more modest!) and I couldn't care less what they do in  private. It wouldn't bother me either if sections of public parks were made clothing-optional either like in some places on the continent. Naked bodies don't seem to hurt children in those places, so I am sure as a society we'd adapt fairly quickly once past the initial novelty and thrills. But I honestly don't know if the requirement for clothing on Grafton Street reflects prejudice on our society's part. I don't think so, but I am not a lawyer or a philosopher and perhaps someone so qualified could make a case. Maybe there is a hurting, silent minority out there!

I probably haven't answered your question in this ramble, but I think basically that societies evolve, and its not a simple matter of saying that if objection to X is prejudice, then objection to Y and Z must be too. What is deemed normal and acceptable (or vice versa) today may not be fifty years down the line. But once the case is made against prejudice on a given issue (and none can be made for it), I don't see how any reasonable man, pride apart, could hold on to his views.

Must be quare Peaceful and Serene in some of the households around here
what with some of the Holier than thou attitudes being lauded ::)
Surrounded by Dalai Lama's by Jaysus :o

Quote from: Tyrones own on February 11, 2010, 05:18:20 AM
Must be quare Peaceful and Serene in some of the households around here
what with some of the Holier than thou attitudes being lauded ::)
Surrounded by Dalai Lama's by Jaysus :o

What do you mean?
Its a sad world we live in if people assume there's something wrong with someone who isnt racist or a homophobic.

Quote from: Tyrones own on February 11, 2010, 05:18:20 AM
Must be quare Peaceful and Serene in some of the households around here
what with some of the Holier than thou attitudes being lauded ::)
Surrounded by Dalai Lama's by Jaysus :o

:D :D :D

Quote from: Tyrones own on February 11, 2010, 05:18:20 AM
Must be quare Peaceful and Serene in some of the households around here
what with some of the Holier than thou attitudes being lauded ::)
Surrounded by Dalai Lama's by Jaysus :o

None of us I don't think are 110% clean in our attitudes but racism and homophobia should be challenged every time... sorry to see that disapoints you Tyrone.

http://www.godhatesfags.com/

Some light reading.

Some of the people on here are so horrible inside that im almost homohomophobic - im phobic to homophobics. But I do believe in the power of reflection and many will see the good people and reflect and change.

Quote from: Olly on February 11, 2010, 11:12:44 AM
Some of the people on here are so horrible inside that im almost homohomophobic - im phobic to homophobics. But I do believe in the power of reflection and many will see the good people and reflect and change.

Is there a prize for figuring out what you have said there?

Quote from: Olly on February 11, 2010, 11:12:44 AM
Some of the people on here are so horrible inside that im almost homohomophobic - im phobic to homophobics. But I do believe in the power of reflection and many will see the good people and reflect and change.

I'd say you meant homophobe-phobic.

Homohomophobic doesn't work. Two homos don't make a ... whatever.

Quote from: Hardy on February 11, 2010, 11:26:23 AM

Quote from: Olly on February 11, 2010, 11:12:44 AM
Some of the people on here are so horrible inside that im almost homohomophobic - im phobic to homophobics. But I do believe in the power of reflection and many will see the good people and reflect and change.

I'd say you meant homophobe-phobic.

Homohomophobic doesn't work. Two homos don't make a ... whatever.

I think it means he is a gay homophobic  :o :o   

I would also be disappointed if my son came home with one of those :D :D

Quote from: ludermor on February 11, 2010, 11:08:37 AM
http://www.godhatesfags.com/

Some light reading.

http://www.signmovies.net/videos/music/index.html

Some absolutely cracking videos. Highlights include jews fighting for a coin and a michael jackson in hell diatribe set to 'beat it'

Quote from: EC Unique on February 11, 2010, 11:45:32 AM

Quote from: Hardy on February 11, 2010, 11:26:23 AM

Quote from: Olly on February 11, 2010, 11:12:44 AM
Some of the people on here are so horrible inside that im almost homohomophobic - im phobic to homophobics. But I do believe in the power of reflection and many will see the good people and reflect and change.

I'd say you meant homophobe-phobic.

Homohomophobic doesn't work. Two homos don't make a ... whatever.

I think it means he is a gay homophobic  :o :o   

I would also be disappointed if my son came home with one of those :D :D

The DUP has a few of these  ::)


As long as no one is doing something against there will and not hurting anyone else then no one else has the right to judge (just ask Iris).

It's easy to have prejudices based on some logic that you have a negative view of some people from a designated group and therefore everyone from that group must be the same , from TV or the daily mail/express or whatever, people say I hate Prods/Nordies/Gays/Jews/Americans/Foreigners.. but when you talk to an individual from that group through work or whatever then you realise people are just people with the same sort of issues, insecurities etc. that anyone else have and that stereotypes rarely fit. 

Take everyone as you find them and with the respect you hope they treat you.

Quote from: Fiodoir Ard Mhacha on February 09, 2010, 07:45:41 PM
I agree re. all this crap about being 'disappointed if my son was gay'.

What would you think if your brother, your cousin or, worst still, your best friend turned out to be gay?

maybe just maybe it has something to do with the desire to continue the family tree and name, something which cannot be done obviously with gays and lesbians in the family.

Quote from: The Forfeit Point on February 11, 2010, 01:02:11 PM

Quote from: Fiodoir Ard Mhacha on February 09, 2010, 07:45:41 PM
I agree re. all this crap about being 'disappointed if my son was gay'.

What would you think if your brother, your cousin or, worst still, your best friend turned out to be gay?

maybe just maybe it has something to do with the desire to continue the family tree and name, something which cannot be done obviously with gays and lesbians in the family.

Thats where you're misinformed. Yes you can. Gay men can have children, as can gay women.

Quote from: Maiden1 on February 11, 2010, 12:21:12 PM

Quote from: EC Unique on February 11, 2010, 11:45:32 AM

Quote from: Hardy on February 11, 2010, 11:26:23 AM

Quote from: Olly on February 11, 2010, 11:12:44 AM
Some of the people on here are so horrible inside that im almost homohomophobic - im phobic to homophobics. But I do believe in the power of reflection and many will see the good people and reflect and change.

I'd say you meant homophobe-phobic.

Homohomophobic doesn't work. Two homos don't make a ... whatever.

I think it means he is a gay homophobic  :o :o   

I would also be disappointed if my son came home with one of those :D :D

The DUP has a few of these  ::)

Read a theory once that some of the most ardent homophobes are actually repressed homosexuals themselves. Their extreme stance on homosexuality is thought to be a coping mechanism for dealing with their suppressed emotions. Could be bullshit, but interesting none the less.

No I don't buy into the idea that all homophobes are gay in the same way that I don't believe that all racists are black underneath. I think many people don't like things that are different and maybe thats just a natural instinct that people who are not too even minded cannot deal with. When you have a new heart or lung, your body might not like it and it needs medication to accept it. Maybe homophobes need medication be it in visible form or through thearpy. Thatd turn the tables.

Quote from: Olly on February 11, 2010, 01:23:27 PM
No I don't buy into the idea that all homophobes are gay in the same way that I don't believe that all racists are black underneath. I think many people don't like things that are different and maybe thats just a natural instinct that people who are not too even minded cannot deal with. When you have a new heart or lung, your body might not like it and it needs medication to accept it. Maybe homophobes need medication be it in visible form or through thearpy. Thatd turn the tables.

(http://www.englishrussia.com/forum/files/blank_facepalm_224.gif)

I hate to tell you Olly, you've just opened a can of worms now...

Rugby star says sorry after homophobic outburst on Twitter
'No malicious intent' in post about gay referee, says lock forward

Thursday February 11 2010

A WELSH international rugby player was last night forced to apologise after posting a homophobic comment on the social networking website Twitter, just two months after his Wales team-mate Gareth Thomas became the first professional rugby player in Britain to reveal that he was gay.

Lock forward Jonathan Thomas, 27, who has 51 caps for Wales and is set to play in the second row against Scotland in the Six Nations in Cardiff on Saturday, wrote the offensive remarks during an exchange on Twitter yesterday morning with Ian Evans, one of his team-mates at the Welsh club Ospreys.

Evans wrote: "Legs and ass are in bits, can't move." Thomas posted in reply: "U gotta stop hanging round with Nigel Owens!" [a top Welsh referee who came out in 2007]. Evans then made an apology of sorts on behalf of Thomas: "For those ppl [people] who got the wrong end of the stick... it was from our savage training day yesterday, sorry about my friend fellow ppl."

In his autobiography, Half Time, Mr Owens revealed that he had tried to commit suicide by overdosing on sleeping pills as he struggled to come to terms with his sexuality when he was a young man. He has since said he has experienced no discrimination during his time as a rugby referee.

Yesterday, he told The Independent that he knew both players well and could see "nothing malicious" in what Thomas had written. However, he said he would call him "to find out what he was on about".

"It's probably just tongue-in-cheek, something they said without thinking about it," he said. "If it had been other players that I didn't know so well then maybe I might think, 'Hang on a minute', but with those two there's definitely no issues."

Thomas's comments come at a time when homophobia in British sport is under intense scrutiny. Only this week, the FA provoked anger by delaying the screening of a film designed to highlight and discourage homophobic chanting and insults by football supporters.

In December, the former Welsh captain Gareth Thomas revealed he was gay in a newspaper interview. His agent said he did not wish to comment on the incident because he felt it had merely been "good-natured banter" between the two players.

The posts were deleted from Twitter shortly after The Independent contacted the Welsh Rugby Union last night. In a statement, Jonathan Thomas said: "Nigel is a great friend of mine and there is absolutely no way I would say anything to him or about him publicly - or indeed privately - which I thought he would find personally offensive. There is no malicious intent in this message whatsoever. This was some childish banter between friends and I did not think for a moment that there may be other people out there reading it and/or taking it in the wrong way.

"I made a very silly comment to something else that was written, but nevertheless, I would like to apologise to anyone who is or was offended by it. I have spoken to Nigel this afternoon and, as I knew at the time of writing, he is not offended and he remains a very good friend. I have now removed the offending comment and will be much more conscious of distinguishing between private jokes and what can be said in a public forum in future."

Gay-rights campaigner Peter Tatchell said: "Homophobic tweets are just as unacceptable as similar outbursts on blogs and message boards. This is not what we would expect from players such as Jonathan Thomas. These remarks are particularly disappointing as they come just weeks after Jonathan's former international team-mate Gareth Thomas came out to such public acclaim and admiration.

"Many of us expected and hoped that this was a turning point and that Welsh rugby could kiss goodbye to homophobia. Sadly, Jonathan's proved us wrong."

Source: UK Independent

- Chris Green and James Corrigan

Quote from: Olly on February 11, 2010, 01:23:27 PM
No I don't buy into the idea that all homophobes are gay in the same way that I don't believe that all racists are black underneath. I think many people don't like things that are different and maybe thats just a natural instinct that people who are not too even minded cannot deal with. When you have a new heart or lung, your body might not like it and it needs medication to accept it. Maybe homophobes need medication be it in visible form or through thearpy. Thatd turn the tables.

Now I really think you are a WUM :D :D

So President Obama recently appeared on stage at a Black Awareness Rally singing with a stage full of other Black People.

Obama is half white.

Would it be OK if he appeared a White Rally or even did anything to embrace his White heritage?

I am not a racist but just throwing this question out there to see what peoples thoughts are.




I am a conservative and have no reservations in saying so.  I think the world is becoming far too liberal and is on a morally slippery slope.  The more PC we become the more tolerant we become as a society of things that would normally be frowned upon.  Soon it will be fine for people to do absolutely whatever they want for fear of infringing on their rights to do so.

QuoteI am not a racist but

:o

Don't know of any "white" rallies unless their KKK/Aryan lunatics and I can hardly see him at one of those.

QuoteI think the world is becoming far too liberal and is on a morally slippery slope

Didn't think that there was a direct linkage between those two events depends on what you term moral I suppose

Quote from: The Iceman on February 11, 2010, 02:19:43 PM
I am a conservative and have no reservations in saying so.  I think the world is becoming far too liberal and is on a morally slippery slope.  The more PC we become the more tolerant we become as a society of things that would normally be frowned upon.  Soon it will be fine for people to do absolutely whatever they want for fear of infringing on their rights to do so.

Would you like to see this liberalism conserved?

Quote from: The Iceman on February 11, 2010, 02:19:43 PM
I am a conservative and have no reservations in saying so.  I think the world is becoming far too liberal and is on a morally slippery slope.  The more PC we become the more tolerant we become as a society of things that would normally be frowned upon.  Soon it will be fine for people to do absolutely whatever they want for fear of infringing on their rights to do so.

Am I right in thinking you think homosexuality is immoral?

Quote from: ziggysego on February 11, 2010, 02:44:12 PM

Quote from: The Iceman on February 11, 2010, 02:19:43 PM
I am a conservative and have no reservations in saying so.  I think the world is becoming far too liberal and is on a morally slippery slope.  The more PC we become the more tolerant we become as a society of things that would normally be frowned upon.  Soon it will be fine for people to do absolutely whatever they want for fear of infringing on their rights to do so.

Am I right in thinking you think homosexuality is immoral?

Thats a whole other thread

Quote from: The Iceman on February 11, 2010, 02:19:43 PM
So President Obama recently appeared on stage at a Black Awareness Rally singing with a stage full of other Black People.

Obama is half white.

Would it be OK if he appeared a White Rally or even did anything to embrace his White heritage?

I am not a racist but just throwing this question out there to see what peoples thoughts are.




I am a conservative and have no reservations in saying so.  I think the world is becoming far too liberal and is on a morally slippery slope.  The more PC we become the more tolerant we become as a society of things that would normally be frowned upon.  Soon it will be fine for people to do absolutely whatever they want for fear of infringing on their rights to do so.

Always a give-away,  ...'I'm not a racist but'...  ::)

If you make a joke ( or laugh at a joke) about gays/blacks etc does that make you racist/homophobic? I have laughed at plenty of paddy irishman jokes does that make me racist towards irish people?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MnHYCbCnsf4 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MnHYCbCnsf4)

Quote from: Hardy on February 09, 2010, 04:50:04 PM
I'd be disappointed if my son turned out to be black.

And I'd be disappointed if a black turned out to be my son (because I'd be able to recollect feck all about the conceiving of him!).

This is depressing though:

Quote from: EC Unique on February 09, 2010, 08:27:44 PM
You will find there are more Irish people that would share my views than disagree.
Would they all be 'sad little people, happy in their own stupidity'?

So EC, you have to invoke the lemmings-mentality syndrome to justify your racism and discrimination? Does the Third Reich, the Germans and Hitler ring any alarm bells?

Quote from: Hardy on February 11, 2010, 11:26:23 AM

Quote from: Olly on February 11, 2010, 11:12:44 AM
Some of the people on here are so horrible inside that im almost homohomophobic - im phobic to homophobics. But I do believe in the power of reflection and many will see the good people and reflect and change.

I'd say you meant homophobe-phobic.

Homohomophobic doesn't work. Two homos don't make a ... whatever.

That was damn funny hardy. No doubt about that.

Quote from: Fear ón Srath Bán on February 11, 2010, 05:43:26 PM

Quote from: Hardy on February 09, 2010, 04:50:04 PM
I'd be disappointed if my son turned out to be black.

And I'd be disappointed if a black turned out to be my son (because I'd be able to recollect feck all about the conceiving of him!).

This is depressing though:

Quote from: EC Unique on February 09, 2010, 08:27:44 PM
You will find there are more Irish people that would share my views than disagree.
Would they all be 'sad little people, happy in their own stupidity'?

So EC, you have to invoke the lemmings-mentality syndrome to justify your racism and discrimination? Does the Third Reich, the Germans and Hitler ring any alarm bells?

So if a group of people share an opinion they are 'lemmings' ::)

Try again young man.

Quote from: EC Unique on February 11, 2010, 05:58:00 PM
So if a group of people share an opinion they are 'lemmings' ::).

Nope, they're a lot worse than that. They're racists and bigots  :P

The greatest irony of all is, of course, that we are all descended from black Africans  -- including you milky boy  :D

Adam and Eve were black africans?

My bible shows Eve as being a stunner. And she was white.

I have refrained so far in the debate about racism but here's my tuppence.  I am married to a woman from the Caribbean, she is mixed as most people are in the Caribbean.  Despite the way I probably come across in debates on here, I take people the way I find them.  People can be assholes no matter where they are from or what colour their skin is

Those of you who seem proud of being backward about this really should take a step into the modern world.  There is no such thing as a pure Irishman or Englishman nor any other nationality and the more time goes on the more mixed we all get in truth 

I hate racists and blacks.

Quote from: ardmhachaabu on February 11, 2010, 06:15:52 PM
I have refrained so far in the debate about racism but here's my tuppence.  I am married to a woman from the Caribbean, she is mixed as most people are in the Caribbean.  Despite the way I probably come across in debates on here, I take people the way I find them.  People can be assholes no matter where they are from or what colour their skin is

Those of you who seem proud of being backward about this really should take a step into the modern world.  There is no such thing as a pure Irishman or Englishman nor any other nationality and the more time goes on the more mixed we all get in truth

I stopped reading right there.

f**k away off you and leave it to the rest of us poor bastards. You lucky SOB  ;)

Quote from: ardmhachaabu on February 11, 2010, 06:15:52 PM
  I am married to a woman from the Caribbean, she is mixed as most people are in the Caribbean.

Aye mixed up, marrying an Orchard man.

Quote from: ONeill on February 11, 2010, 08:34:38 PM

Quote from: ardmhachaabu on February 11, 2010, 06:15:52 PM
  I am married to a woman from the Caribbean, she is mixed as most people are in the Caribbean.

Aye mixed up, marrying an Orchard man.

Oh shush you  :D

Quote from: EC Unique on February 11, 2010, 05:58:00 PM

Quote from: Fear ón Srath Bán on February 11, 2010, 05:43:26 PM

Quote from: Hardy on February 09, 2010, 04:50:04 PM
I'd be disappointed if my son turned out to be black.

And I'd be disappointed if a black turned out to be my son (because I'd be able to recollect feck all about the conceiving of him!).

This is depressing though:

Quote from: EC Unique on February 09, 2010, 08:27:44 PM
You will find there are more Irish people that would share my views than disagree.
Would they all be 'sad little people, happy in their own stupidity'?

So EC, you have to invoke the lemmings-mentality syndrome to justify your racism and discrimination? Does the Third Reich, the Germans and Hitler ring any alarm bells?

So if a group of people share an opinion they are 'lemmings' ::)

Try again young man.

Forming an opinion of people without any scientific evidence to support the view is not worthy of respect. I don't respect the opinion of rascists or the opinions of people who think the world is flat. They are idiots.

Quote from: EC Unique on February 11, 2010, 05:58:00 PM

Quote from: Fear ón Srath Bán on February 11, 2010, 05:43:26 PM

Quote from: Hardy on February 09, 2010, 04:50:04 PM
I'd be disappointed if my son turned out to be black.

And I'd be disappointed if a black turned out to be my son (because I'd be able to recollect feck all about the conceiving of him!).

This is depressing though:

Quote from: EC Unique on February 09, 2010, 08:27:44 PM
You will find there are more Irish people that would share my views than disagree.
Would they all be 'sad little people, happy in their own stupidity'?

So EC, you have to invoke the lemmings-mentality syndrome to justify your racism and discrimination? Does the Third Reich, the Germans and Hitler ring any alarm bells?

So if a group of people share an opinion they are 'lemmings' ::)

Try again young man.

Young man, as you so arrogantly call him EC, has you and your bigotry well sussed. Trying to hide behind 'clever' remarks doesn't disguise what you are about.

What exactly am I about Fox?

About trying to hide your right wing, fundamental religious, racist, homophobic views behind the excuse you know loads who feel the same way. Have you children or is that a figment of your imagination? I would hope my children would never come home with a character like you...   

Quote from: EC Unique on February 11, 2010, 11:16:43 PM
What exactly am I about Fox?

Tell you what EC, call up to the Messiah up the hill in Glencull, and confess your racist and bigoted sins. Then be prepared for a zillion decades of the rosary  :D

Thanks fox, what are you after anyway  ;)

Quote from: Fear ón Srath Bán on February 11, 2010, 11:27:45 PM

Quote from: EC Unique on February 11, 2010, 11:16:43 PM
What exactly am I about Fox?

Tell you what EC, call up to the Messiah up the hill in Glencull, and confess your racist and bigoted sins. Then be prepared for a zillion decades of the rosary  :D

Thanks fox, what are you after anyway  ;)

Well, I agree with you on this one. First time for everything I suppose  8)

Quote from: longrunsthefox on February 11, 2010, 11:26:45 PM
About trying to hide your right wing, fundamental religious, racist, homophobic views behind the excuse you know loads who feel the same way. Have you children or is that a figment of your imagination? I would hope my children would never come home with a character like you...   

Are you a looney left wingnut, anti religious, love everybody and feck all conservatives type of fella?

It takes all sorts, and believe me, left wingers are every bit as dangerous as right wingers. ;)

Quote from: stew on February 11, 2010, 11:37:34 PM
It takes all sorts, and believe me, left footers are every bit as dangerous as right footers. ;)

fixed

Quote from: stew on February 11, 2010, 11:37:34 PM
It takes all sorts, and believe me, left wingers are every bit as dangerous as right wingers. ;)

Wrong stew: extremism of any kind is just as dangerous as extremism of any other kind. It matters not the political orientation.

You dig man, peace and love and all that  ;)

Quote from: EC Unique on February 11, 2010, 05:58:00 PM

Quote from: Fear ón Srath Bán on February 11, 2010, 05:43:26 PM

Quote from: Hardy on February 09, 2010, 04:50:04 PM
I'd be disappointed if my son turned out to be black.

And I'd be disappointed if a black turned out to be my son (because I'd be able to recollect feck all about the conceiving of him!).

This is depressing though:

Quote from: EC Unique on February 09, 2010, 08:27:44 PM
You will find there are more Irish people that would share my views than disagree.
Would they all be 'sad little people, happy in their own stupidity'?

So EC, you have to invoke the lemmings-mentality syndrome to justify your racism and discrimination? Does the Third Reich, the Germans and Hitler ring any alarm bells?

So if a group of people share an opinion they are 'lemmings' ::)

Try again young man.

Don't be ridiculous EC. FoBS may be a lot of things, but he isn't a young man!

Quote from: ziggysego on February 11, 2010, 11:49:05 PM
Don't be ridiculous EC. FoSB may be a lot of things, but he isn't a young man!

You want me to turn rabidly right-wing Zig? Keep going buddy  :D

Quote from: longrunsthefox on February 11, 2010, 11:26:45 PM
About trying to hide your right wing, fundamental religious, racist, homophobic views behind the excuse you know loads who feel the same way. Have you children or is that a figment of your imagination? I would hope my children would never come home with a character like you...   

Is mass generalizing through ignorance as bad as being racist or a homophobe ?

Quote from: Tyrones own on February 12, 2010, 12:03:38 AM

Quote from: longrunsthefox on February 11, 2010, 11:26:45 PM
About trying to hide your right wing, fundamental religious, racist, homophobic views behind the excuse you know loads who feel the same way. Have you children or is that a figment of your imagination? I would hope my children would never come home with a character like you...   

Is mass generalizing through ignorance as bad as being racist or a homophobe ?

At least you're admitting now that being racist and homophobic is bad ;)

Quote from: Tyrones own on February 12, 2010, 12:03:38 AM

Quote from: longrunsthefox on February 11, 2010, 11:26:45 PM
About trying to hide your right wing, fundamental religious, racist, homophobic views behind the excuse you know loads who feel the same way. Have you children or is that a figment of your imagination? I would hope my children would never come home with a character like you...   

Is mass generalizing through ignorance as bad as being racist or a homophobe ?

Not if it's through ignorance.

If my son was gay I would feel no disappointment but a sense of loss that my name would not be extended upon. But that's irrelevant atter 150 years . Sure half the country are O'Neill and they don't know it.

Quote from: stew on February 11, 2010, 11:37:34 PM

Quote from: longrunsthefox on February 11, 2010, 11:26:45 PM
About trying to hide your right wing, fundamental religious, racist, homophobic views behind the excuse you know loads who feel the same way. Have you children or is that a figment of your imagination? I would hope my children would never come home with a character like you...   

Are you a looney left wingnut, anti religious, love everybody and feck all conservatives type of fella?

It takes all sorts, and believe me, left wingers are every bit as dangerous as right wingers. ;)

But only TO is to your right, to you the rest of the planet are those dangerous left wingers.

Quote from: The Forfeit Point on February 11, 2010, 01:02:11 PM

Quote from: Fiodoir Ard Mhacha on February 09, 2010, 07:45:41 PM
I agree re. all this crap about being 'disappointed if my son was gay'.

What would you think if your brother, your cousin or, worst still, your best friend turned out to be gay?

maybe just maybe it has something to do with the desire to continue the family tree and name, something which cannot be done obviously with gays and lesbians in the family.

family tree and name? Who actually gives a shit about that?  I'm not buying it.

Quote from: pintsofguinness on February 12, 2010, 12:17:32 AM

Quote from: The Forfeit Point on February 11, 2010, 01:02:11 PM

Quote from: Fiodoir Ard Mhacha on February 09, 2010, 07:45:41 PM
I agree re. all this crap about being 'disappointed if my son was gay'.

What would you think if your brother, your cousin or, worst still, your best friend turned out to be gay?

maybe just maybe it has something to do with the desire to continue the family tree and name, something which cannot be done obviously with gays and lesbians in the family.

family tree and name? Who actually gives a shit about that?  I'm not buying it.

Why would you want to buy the name ONeill?

Not limited to Ireland
http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/football/news-and-comment/football-accused-in-homophobia-row-1897128.html (http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/football/news-and-comment/football-accused-in-homophobia-row-1897128.html)

Quote from: pintsofguinness on February 12, 2010, 12:17:32 AM

Quote from: The Forfeit Point on February 11, 2010, 01:02:11 PM

Quote from: Fiodoir Ard Mhacha on February 09, 2010, 07:45:41 PM
I agree re. all this crap about being 'disappointed if my son was gay'.

What would you think if your brother, your cousin or, worst still, your best friend turned out to be gay?

maybe just maybe it has something to do with the desire to continue the family tree and name, something which cannot be done obviously with gays and lesbians in the family.

family tree and name? Who actually gives a shit about that?  I'm not buying it.

My Family tree and Family name mean a lot to me. One of the most important things to me. I'm sure most people would value these things no matter what their views on this thread subject.

Quote from: stew on February 11, 2010, 11:37:34 PM

Quote from: longrunsthefox on February 11, 2010, 11:26:45 PM
About trying to hide your right wing, fundamental religious, racist, homophobic views behind the excuse you know loads who feel the same way. Have you children or is that a figment of your imagination? I would hope my children would never come home with a character like you...   

Are you a looney left wingnut, anti religious, love everybody and feck all conservatives type of fella?

It takes all sorts, and believe me, left wingers are every bit as dangerous as right wingers. ;)

So,...to oppose fundamenalist religion, homophobia and racism makes a person a 'looney left wingnut.' You can do better than that Stew. 

Since when did being fundamentalist become a bad thing.

Quote from: ONeill on February 12, 2010, 12:09:24 AM
If my son was gay I would feel no disappointment but a sense of loss that my name would not be extended upon. But that's irrelevant atter 150 years . Sure half the country are O'Neill and they don't know it.

If you only ever had daughters, it'd be the same thing.

What about fathers who want the name carried on - would you be dissapointed if your cub went to the cloth?

Quote from: Puckoon on February 12, 2010, 04:23:29 PMwould you be dissapointed if your cub went to the cloth?

I'd be distraught. Happily, they were better brought up than that.

QuoteIf you only ever had daughters, it'd be the same thing.

It appears logic has long left this discussion, if it ever showed its head at all.

Quote from: hardstation on February 12, 2010, 12:13:13 AM

Quote from: muppet on February 12, 2010, 12:10:37 AM

Quote from: stew on February 11, 2010, 11:37:34 PM

Quote from: longrunsthefox on February 11, 2010, 11:26:45 PM
About trying to hide your right wing, fundamental religious, racist, homophobic views behind the excuse you know loads who feel the same way. Have you children or is that a figment of your imagination? I would hope my children would never come home with a character like you...   

Are you a looney left wingnut, anti religious, love everybody and feck all conservatives type of fella?

It takes all sorts, and believe me, left wingers are every bit as dangerous as right wingers. ;)

But only TO is to your right, to you the rest of the planet are those dangerous left wingers.

"Clowns to the left of me, jokers to the right. Here I am, stuck in the middle with stew".

Thats shite.

Over here I am a libertarian. I am disgusted equally by the likes of Rush Limbaugh and Nancy Pelosi, they are dangerous people who, to me are all that is wrong with America and why America is held in such low esteem these days.

I would never have voted for Obama, unlike that sc**bag Limbaugh however I do not want him to fail, I want him to succeed and I want him to follow through on the promises he made when elected in relation to the economy and in terms of the middle east.

Quote from: The Forfeit Point on February 11, 2010, 01:02:11 PM

Quote from: Fiodoir Ard Mhacha on February 09, 2010, 07:45:41 PM
I agree re. all this crap about being 'disappointed if my son was gay'.

What would you think if your brother, your cousin or, worst still, your best friend turned out to be gay?

maybe just maybe it has something to do with the desire to continue the family tree and name, something which cannot be done obviously with gays and lesbians in the family.

One son, happens to be gay, end of family tree. Shucks. ::)

Quote from: longrunsthefox on February 11, 2010, 11:26:45 PM
About trying to hide your right wing, fundamental religious, racist, homophobic views behind the excuse you know loads who feel the same way. Have you children or is that a figment of your imagination? I would hope my children would never come home with a character like you...   

Fox. You seem to be taking me as some sort of white hood wearing, gay bashing mad man that is against all things different. I am not. I simply stated that I would be disappointed if my children turned out to be gay or married into another ethnic group. Neither of which would change my love for them. I would also be disappointed if they did not gain a 3rd level education, as I did but I would love them no less.

Maybe it is a bit old fashioned but it is how I feel.

I know a few gay people and have worked with several different nationality of people and I respect them all the same. They are all the same to me as anyone else.

The only thing that gets me going is homosexual men that insist in skipping about like a big fairy. No need!!
As far as I can make out they are in the minority amongst the gay community.

Quote from: EC Unique on February 12, 2010, 08:41:43 PM

Quote from: longrunsthefox on February 11, 2010, 11:26:45 PM
About trying to hide your right wing, fundamental religious, racist, homophobic views behind the excuse you know loads who feel the same way. Have you children or is that a figment of your imagination? I would hope my children would never come home with a character like you...   

Fox. You seem to be taking me as some sort of white hood wearing, gay bashing mad man that is against all things different. I am not. I simply stated that I would be disappointed if my children turned out to be gay or married into another ethnic group. Neither of which would change my love for them. I would also be disappointed if they did not gain a 3rd level education, as I did but I would love them no less.

Maybe it is a bit old fashioned but it is how I feel.

I know a few gay people and have worked with several different nationality of people and I respect them all the same. They are all the same to me as anyone else.

The only thing that gets me going is homosexual men that insist in skipping about like a big fairy. No need!!
As far as I can make out they are in the minority amongst the gay community.

Why?

Quote from: EC Unique on February 12, 2010, 08:41:43 PM

Quote from: longrunsthefox on February 11, 2010, 11:26:45 PM
About trying to hide your right wing, fundamental religious, racist, homophobic views behind the excuse you know loads who feel the same way. Have you children or is that a figment of your imagination? I would hope my children would never come home with a character like you...   

Fox. You seem to be taking me as some sort of white hood wearing, gay bashing mad man that is against all things different. I am not. I simply stated that I would be disappointed if my children turned out to be gay or married into another ethnic group. Neither of which would change my love for them. I would also be disappointed if they did not gain a 3rd level education, as I did but I would love them no less.

Maybe it is a bit old fashioned but it is how I feel.

I know a few gay people and have worked with several different nationality of people and I respect them all the same. They are all the same to me as anyone else.

The only thing that gets me going is homosexual men that insist in skipping about like a big fairy. No need!!
As far as I can make out they are in the minority amongst the gay community.

If you dont mind me asking - how can you reconcile these two points of view?

Surely if they are the same as everyone else, why would it dissapoint you if your children married someone from another ethnic group.

And does that include carrickmore?

Quote from: pintsofguinness on February 12, 2010, 08:45:55 PM

Quote from: EC Unique on February 12, 2010, 08:41:43 PM

Quote from: longrunsthefox on February 11, 2010, 11:26:45 PM
About trying to hide your right wing, fundamental religious, racist, homophobic views behind the excuse you know loads who feel the same way. Have you children or is that a figment of your imagination? I would hope my children would never come home with a character like you...   

Fox. You seem to be taking me as some sort of white hood wearing, gay bashing mad man that is against all things different. I am not. I simply stated that I would be disappointed if my children turned out to be gay or married into another ethnic group. Neither of which would change my love for them. I would also be disappointed if they did not gain a 3rd level education, as I did but I would love them no less.

Maybe it is a bit old fashioned but it is how I feel.

I know a few gay people and have worked with several different nationality of people and I respect them all the same. They are all the same to me as anyone else.

The only thing that gets me going is homosexual men that insist in skipping about like a big fairy. No need!!
As far as I can make out they are in the minority amongst the gay community.

Why?

Because they have already demonstrated a high academic ability and I would be disappointed if they did not use it to its full potential.

Quote from: Puckoon on February 12, 2010, 08:48:42 PM

Quote from: EC Unique on February 12, 2010, 08:41:43 PM

Quote from: longrunsthefox on February 11, 2010, 11:26:45 PM
About trying to hide your right wing, fundamental religious, racist, homophobic views behind the excuse you know loads who feel the same way. Have you children or is that a figment of your imagination? I would hope my children would never come home with a character like you...   

Fox. You seem to be taking me as some sort of white hood wearing, gay bashing mad man that is against all things different. I am not. I simply stated that I would be disappointed if my children turned out to be gay or married into another ethnic group. Neither of which would change my love for them. I would also be disappointed if they did not gain a 3rd level education, as I did but I would love them no less.

Maybe it is a bit old fashioned but it is how I feel.

I know a few gay people and have worked with several different nationality of people and I respect them all the same. They are all the same to me as anyone else.

The only thing that gets me going is homosexual men that insist in skipping about like a big fairy. No need!!
As far as I can make out they are in the minority amongst the gay community.

If you dont mind me asking - how can you reconcile these two points of view?

Surely if they are the same as everyone else, why would it dissapoint you if your children married someone from another ethnic group.

And does that include carrickmore?

I would just like them to be married to a nice Irish Catholic. Is that wish so wrong?

As for Carrickmore? I would f**king disown them :D

Quote from: EC Unique on February 12, 2010, 09:09:00 PM

Quote from: Puckoon on February 12, 2010, 08:48:42 PM

Quote from: EC Unique on February 12, 2010, 08:41:43 PM

Quote from: longrunsthefox on February 11, 2010, 11:26:45 PM
About trying to hide your right wing, fundamental religious, racist, homophobic views behind the excuse you know loads who feel the same way. Have you children or is that a figment of your imagination? I would hope my children would never come home with a character like you...   

Fox. You seem to be taking me as some sort of white hood wearing, gay bashing mad man that is against all things different. I am not. I simply stated that I would be disappointed if my children turned out to be gay or married into another ethnic group. Neither of which would change my love for them. I would also be disappointed if they did not gain a 3rd level education, as I did but I would love them no less.

Maybe it is a bit old fashioned but it is how I feel.

I know a few gay people and have worked with several different nationality of people and I respect them all the same. They are all the same to me as anyone else.

The only thing that gets me going is homosexual men that insist in skipping about like a big fairy. No need!!
As far as I can make out they are in the minority amongst the gay community.

If you dont mind me asking - how can you reconcile these two points of view?

Surely if they are the same as everyone else, why would it dissapoint you if your children married someone from another ethnic group.

And does that include carrickmore?

I would just like them to be married to a nice Irish Catholic. Is that wish so wrong?

As for Carrickmore? I would f**king disown them :D

Its a bit like wishing them to be an F1 driver - you are kinda putting constraints, no matter how subtle, on their lives.

First they got to find an Irish girl
Then shes got to be catholic
Then shes got to end up being nice.

Thats a tough set of criteria right there.

Personally if my old man told me he wanted me to be married to a nice irish catholic Id tell him to take a run and jump.

...and get a third level education puck!

I wouldn't like to be growing up in your house EC!

Quote from: EC Unique on February 12, 2010, 08:41:43 PM

Quote from: longrunsthefox on February 11, 2010, 11:26:45 PM
About trying to hide your right wing, fundamental religious, racist, homophobic views behind the excuse you know loads who feel the same way. Have you children or is that a figment of your imagination? I would hope my children would never come home with a character like you...   

Fox. You seem to be taking me as some sort of white hood wearing, gay bashing mad man that is against all things different. I am not. I simply stated that I would be disappointed if my children turned out to be gay or married into another ethnic group. Neither of which would change my love for them. I would also be disappointed if they did not gain a 3rd level education, as I did but I would love them no less.

Maybe it is a bit old fashioned but it is how I feel.

I know a few gay people and have worked with several different nationality of people and I respect them all the same. They are all the same to me as anyone else.

The only thing that gets me going is homosexual men that insist in skipping about like a big fairy. No need!!
As far as I can make out they are in the minority amongst the gay community.

It's a fairly simple tenet: if you judge anyone differently because of what they were born, or the colour of his/her skin, or his/her sexual orientation, etc.,  you're a racist or a bigot.

Are you that fascist pig EC?

Ok EC... you want a nice, Irish white hetrosexual intelligent Catholic to marry your child. What if they were disabled? or a dwarf? or maybe had a stammer?....   

Quote from: longrunsthefox on February 12, 2010, 10:44:14 PM
Ok EC... you want a nice, Irish white hetrosexual intelligent Catholic to marry your child. What if they were disabled? or a dwarf? or maybe had a stammer?....   

...With a nice surname too ::)

Quote from: Fear ón Srath Bán on February 12, 2010, 10:05:16 PM

Quote from: EC Unique on February 12, 2010, 08:41:43 PM

Quote from: longrunsthefox on February 11, 2010, 11:26:45 PM
About trying to hide your right wing, fundamental religious, racist, homophobic views behind the excuse you know loads who feel the same way. Have you children or is that a figment of your imagination? I would hope my children would never come home with a character like you...   

Fox. You seem to be taking me as some sort of white hood wearing, gay bashing mad man that is against all things different. I am not. I simply stated that I would be disappointed if my children turned out to be gay or married into another ethnic group. Neither of which would change my love for them. I would also be disappointed if they did not gain a 3rd level education, as I did but I would love them no less.

Maybe it is a bit old fashioned but it is how I feel.

I know a few gay people and have worked with several different nationality of people and I respect them all the same. They are all the same to me as anyone else.

The only thing that gets me going is homosexual men that insist in skipping about like a big fairy. No need!!
As far as I can make out they are in the minority amongst the gay community.

It's a fairly simple tenet: if you judge anyone differently because of what they were born, or the colour of his/her skin, or his/her sexual orientation, etc.,  you're a racist or a bigot.

Are you that fascist pig EC?

I pretty much accept that I am mildly racist fear. I have demonstrated that already in my view that I would like my family to continue in the form that has served it so well. I am happy enough with that 'label'. It does not bother me. Why use the word 'pig'?

Quote from: pintsofguinness on February 12, 2010, 09:33:52 PM
...and get a third level education puck!

I wouldn't like to be growing up in your house EC!

Finding an Irish, Catholic girl in Ireland is not that difficult Pints! ::)

Quote from: EC Unique on February 13, 2010, 12:12:16 AM

Quote from: pintsofguinness on February 12, 2010, 09:33:52 PM
...and get a third level education puck!

I wouldn't like to be growing up in your house EC!

Finding an Irish, Catholic girl in Ireland is not that difficult Pints! ::)

Doesnt mean the person I'd want to marry is an Irish Catholic. 

Quote from: pintsofguinness on February 13, 2010, 12:21:13 AM

Quote from: EC Unique on February 13, 2010, 12:12:16 AM

Quote from: pintsofguinness on February 12, 2010, 09:33:52 PM
...and get a third level education puck!

I wouldn't like to be growing up in your house EC!

Finding an Irish, Catholic girl in Ireland is not that difficult Pints! ::)

Doesnt mean the person I'd want to marry is an Irish Catholic.

Certainly not Pints. I am only expressing my own views on this thread. You are intitled to what ever you want, as am I.

Quote from: EC Unique on February 13, 2010, 12:09:40 AM
I pretty much accept that I am mildly racist fear. I have demonstrated that already in my view that I would like my family to continue in the form that has served it so well. I am happy enough with that 'label'. It does not bother me. Why use the word 'pig'?

There's no such thing as "mildly" racist EC, it's like saying someone is a little bit xenophobic, or a little bit paedophilic, or a tad anti-semitic, or partly a psychopath. Racism is an extreme, and I have an unapologetic antipathy towards anyone of that particular disposition.

You'd do well to remember how we (the Paddy Irish) were treated by people of a mindset such as your own not so long ago. And it isn't a pretty memory.

Quote from: EC Unique on February 13, 2010, 12:09:40 AM
I pretty much accept that I am mildly racist fear. I have demonstrated that already in my view that I would like my family to continue in the form that has served it so well. I am happy enough with that 'label'. It does not bother me. Why use the word 'pig'?

Why would anybody of such inferior stock as you have any delusions of superiority ?

Quote from: longrunsthefox on February 12, 2010, 10:44:14 PM
Ok EC... you want a nice, Irish white hetrosexual intelligent Catholic to marry your child. What if they were disabled? or a dwarf? or maybe had a stammer?....   

Just for the record, I don't have a stammer.

It's funny how there wasn't the same outrage when the
"butter wouldn't melt in their mouths brigade" were weighing in
on the travelers thread a while back....  ::)

Why do you continue to try and belittle those who arent homophobic or racist?
Because your belief that everyone has the same attitudes as you help justify your own prejudices?

Quote from: Fear ón Srath Bán on February 13, 2010, 12:43:28 AM

Quote from: EC Unique on February 13, 2010, 12:09:40 AM
I pretty much accept that I am mildly racist fear. I have demonstrated that already in my view that I would like my family to continue in the form that has served it so well. I am happy enough with that 'label'. It does not bother me. Why use the word 'pig'?

There's no such thing as "mildly" racist EC, it's like saying someone is a little bit xenophobic, or a little bit paedophilic, or a tad anti-semitic, or partly a psychopath. Racism is an extreme, and I have an unapologetic antipathy towards anyone of that particular disposition.

You'd do well to remember how we (the Paddy Irish) were treated by people of a mindset such as your own not so long ago. And it isn't a pretty memory.

Are you saying there are no different degrees of racism? Do you consider me the same as a member of the KKK who would happily murder a black person?

Quote from: EC Unique on February 13, 2010, 11:08:12 AM

Quote from: Fear ón Srath Bán on February 13, 2010, 12:43:28 AM

Quote from: EC Unique on February 13, 2010, 12:09:40 AM
I pretty much accept that I am mildly racist fear. I have demonstrated that already in my view that I would like my family to continue in the form that has served it so well. I am happy enough with that 'label'. It does not bother me. Why use the word 'pig'?

There's no such thing as "mildly" racist EC, it's like saying someone is a little bit xenophobic, or a little bit paedophilic, or a tad anti-semitic, or partly a psychopath. Racism is an extreme, and I have an unapologetic antipathy towards anyone of that particular disposition.

You'd do well to remember how we (the Paddy Irish) were treated by people of a mindset such as your own not so long ago. And it isn't a pretty memory.

Are you saying there are no different degrees of racism? Do you consider me the same as a member of the KKK who would happily murder a black person?

You have described yourself as mildly rascist. Which means I suppose you have a dislike of people of a different colour than you. Care to explain how you came to this conclusion? I don't think you have done that and I must say I am intrigued to hear your reasoning.

There are people from Derry, Armagh and Tyrone who genuinely hate each other because of where they come from. What do ye call that?

Quote from: mylestheslasher on February 13, 2010, 02:32:23 PM

Quote from: EC Unique on February 13, 2010, 11:08:12 AM

Quote from: Fear ón Srath Bán on February 13, 2010, 12:43:28 AM

Quote from: EC Unique on February 13, 2010, 12:09:40 AM
I pretty much accept that I am mildly racist fear. I have demonstrated that already in my view that I would like my family to continue in the form that has served it so well. I am happy enough with that 'label'. It does not bother me. Why use the word 'pig'?

There's no such thing as "mildly" racist EC, it's like saying someone is a little bit xenophobic, or a little bit paedophilic, or a tad anti-semitic, or partly a psychopath. Racism is an extreme, and I have an unapologetic antipathy towards anyone of that particular disposition.

You'd do well to remember how we (the Paddy Irish) were treated by people of a mindset such as your own not so long ago. And it isn't a pretty memory.

Are you saying there are no different degrees of racism? Do you consider me the same as a member of the KKK who would happily murder a black person?

You have described yourself as mildly rascist. Which means I suppose you have a dislike of people of a different colour than you. Care to explain how you came to this conclusion? I don't think you have done that and I must say I am intrigued to hear your reasoning.

The only reason I describe myself as that is as I have stated I would rather my family married another Irish Catholic.  If that is racist then so be it. Otherwise I don't have a problem with any ethnic group.

Quote from: ONeill on February 13, 2010, 02:34:43 PM
There are people from Derry, Armagh and Tyrone who genuinely hate each other because of where they come from. What do ye call that?

Tribalism is what you call that - are you not supposed to be a teacher?

Quote from: EC Unique on February 13, 2010, 11:08:12 AM

Quote from: Fear ón Srath Bán on February 13, 2010, 12:43:28 AM

Quote from: EC Unique on February 13, 2010, 12:09:40 AM
I pretty much accept that I am mildly racist fear. I have demonstrated that already in my view that I would like my family to continue in the form that has served it so well. I am happy enough with that 'label'. It does not bother me. Why use the word 'pig'?

There's no such thing as "mildly" racist EC, it's like saying someone is a little bit xenophobic, or a little bit paedophilic, or a tad anti-semitic, or partly a psychopath. Racism is an extreme, and I have an unapologetic antipathy towards anyone of that particular disposition.

You'd do well to remember how we (the Paddy Irish) were treated by people of a mindset such as your own not so long ago. And it isn't a pretty memory.

Are you saying there are no different degrees of racism? Do you consider me the same as a member of the KKK who would happily murder a black person?

The gap isn't anything like as wide as you seem to think it is. Once you're judging people solely on the colour of their skin rather than the content of their character you're on a very slippery slope; implicitly you're making the value judgment that one person is better than another purely on the lottery of the circumstances of their birth.

Quote from: ONeill on February 13, 2010, 02:34:43 PM
There are people from Derry, Armagh and Tyrone who genuinely hate each other because of where they come from. What do ye call that?

Being idiots.

Quote from: ONeill on February 13, 2010, 02:34:43 PM
There are people from Derry, Armagh and Tyrone who genuinely hate each other because of where they come from. What do ye call that?

I doubt that Shane, saying it is one thing, actually living it is insanity.

Quote from: Fear ón Srath Bán on February 13, 2010, 03:38:10 PM
The gap isn't anything like as wide as you seem to think it is. Once you're judging people solely on the colour of their skin rather than the content of their character you're on a very slippery slope; implicitly you're making the value judgment that one person is better than another purely on the lottery of the circumstances of their birth. You may not murder that black person, but neither would you prevent it since that life doesn't have the same intrinsic value as yours, so you believe.

I honestly do not think there is anything wrong with wanting my family to remain 100% Irish.

I do not value anyone else on a higher or lower level to myself and as for

''You may not murder that black person, but neither would you prevent it since that life doesn't have the same intrinsic value as yours, so you believe.''

That is very presumptions of you and also very wrong. I would put as much effort into preventing a murder as you or any other decent person would.

Please retract that statement >:(

Quote from: EC Unique on February 13, 2010, 05:02:20 PM

Quote from: Fear ón Srath Bán on February 13, 2010, 03:38:10 PM
The gap isn't anything like as wide as you seem to think it is. Once you're judging people solely on the colour of their skin rather than the content of their character you're on a very slippery slope; implicitly you're making the value judgment that one person is better than another purely on the lottery of the circumstances of their birth. You may not murder that black person, but neither would you prevent it since that life doesn't have the same intrinsic value as yours, so you believe.

I honestly do not think there is anything wrong with wanting my family to remain 100% Irish.

I do not value anyone else on a higher or lower level to myself and as for

''You may not murder that black person, but neither would you prevent it since that life doesn't have the same intrinsic value as yours, so you believe.''

That is very presumptions of you and also very wrong. I would put as much effort into preventing a murder as you or any other decent person would.

Please retract that statement >:(

100% Irish! Jesus Christ would you listen to yourself. Would prospective boyfriends to your daughter have to present their family tree at the door before being allowed to 2nd base?

Quote from: EC Unique on February 13, 2010, 05:02:20 PM
Please retract that statement >:(

OK EC, statement expunged, so maybe you're not quite the fascist pig that "mildly racist" would suggest  ;)

Lose the hangup with 100% Irish FFS (check out where we actually came from in the first instance). I wish that I had met and married a native Gaelic speaking mild tempered redhead of unspeakable beauty from the Wesht. It didn't happen, big deal.

It's a good thing that Padráig Pearse's maternal grandfather wasn't as "mildly racist" as you, since his father's Englishness might have robbed our Pantheon of one of the greatest of Irishmen ever. Do you know of greater exponents of all that is Gaelic and great than the O'Halpíns? As Micheál O Muircheartaigh might say "with a father from Fermanagh and a mother from Fiji, and neither a hurling stronghold".

Live a little, and appreciate the disparate reality of what we actually are, diversity enriches, it always has.

Quote from: Fear ón Srath Bán on February 13, 2010, 10:01:00 PM

Quote from: EC Unique on February 13, 2010, 05:02:20 PM
Please retract that statement >:(

OK EC, statement expunged, so maybe you're not quite the fascist pig that "mildly racist" would suggest  ;)

Thanks :)

Maybe I am wrong to think this way but I do. Maybe in years to come I may have to face up to a challange and only then I will know how I really feel.

Anyway I am done on this thread as it is a bit too serious.

Back to the premiership threads for a bit of simple banter. :D

Don't be cheering for any of those black players  ;)

Was Padraig Pearse not supposed to like the menfolk? Oh aye, but he was maybe gay so let's not talk about the father of the Free State in such negative tones. ::)

Quote from: Fiodoir Ard Mhacha on February 14, 2010, 10:25:30 AM
Was Padraig Pearse not supposed to like the menfolk? Oh aye, but he was maybe gay so let's not talk about the father of the Free State in such negative tones. ::)

Sssshh! Don't dare whisper anything like that.

Some of his poetry would certainly suggest so.

Quote from: Fiodoir Ard Mhacha on February 14, 2010, 10:25:30 AM
Was Padraig Pearse not supposed to like the menfolk? Oh aye, but he was maybe gay so let's not talk about the father of the Free State in such negative tones. ::)

Maybe he was and I couldn't care less, but I recall it was Ruth Dudley Edwards who put that "story" out there and only an imbecile would take anything she says seriously.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-11011034 (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-11011034)

Serious disgrace.


HMRC staff sacked over race abuseSeven Revenue and Customs staff have been sacked for deliberately under-paying benefits to ethnic minorities.

It follows an internal investigation into nine men based at the HM Revenue and Customs call centre in Belfast.

Two resigned after it was launched and seven were dismissed on Tuesday.

They are believed to have tampered with computer records to ensure ethnic minorities living across the UK did not receive the benefits they were entitled to. All have now been fully reimbursed.

The allegations of racially-motivated gross misconduct were investigated last January when a complaint was lodged by somebody who said that their records had been changed.

'Decisive action'

A detailed audit was carried out and the inquiry then widened it to take in another 16 child benefit cases.

It is understood the nine men were suspended once the investigation started, but two quit immediately.

Dave Hartnett, permanent secretary for tax at HMRC, said the department operates a zero-tolerance policy on racial discrimination.

"The vast majority of our people are entirely professional and one of the ways we support that professionalism is by taking decisive action against the tiny minority who let us all down by falling far short of those standards," he said.

The HMRC contact centre is based at Dorchester House, close to the city centre in Belfast's Great Victoria Street.

Quote from: Fiodoir Ard Mhacha on February 14, 2010, 10:25:30 AM
Was Padraig Pearse not supposed to like the menfolk? Oh aye, but he was maybe gay so let's not talk about the father of the Free State in such negative tones. ::)

Irish Free State you racist  >:(  ;)  >:(

Quote from: Puckoon on August 18, 2010, 03:39:17 PM
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-11011034 (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-11011034)

Serious disgrace.


HMRC staff sacked over race abuseSeven Revenue and Customs staff have been sacked for deliberately under-paying benefits to ethnic minorities.

It follows an internal investigation into nine men based at the HM Revenue and Customs call centre in Belfast.

Two resigned after it was launched and seven were dismissed on Tuesday.

They are believed to have tampered with computer records to ensure ethnic minorities living across the UK did not receive the benefits they were entitled to. All have now been fully reimbursed.

The allegations of racially-motivated gross misconduct were investigated last January when a complaint was lodged by somebody who said that their records had been changed.

'Decisive action'

A detailed audit was carried out and the inquiry then widened it to take in another 16 child benefit cases.

It is understood the nine men were suspended once the investigation started, but two quit immediately.

Dave Hartnett, permanent secretary for tax at HMRC, said the department operates a zero-tolerance policy on racial discrimination.

"The vast majority of our people are entirely professional and one of the ways we support that professionalism is by taking decisive action against the tiny minority who let us all down by falling far short of those standards," he said.

The HMRC contact centre is based at Dorchester House, close to the city centre in Belfast's Great Victoria Street.

Saw that on the news and was dumbfounded.  I would love to know the background of these people (petty and all as it seems).  9 people suggests an organised campaign and undoubtedly it is happening elsewhere in the public sector  and elsewhere in the Uk and probably ROI. I'm suprised it hasn't received more publicity as it could be a huge can of worms.

I had heard about this a few months ago from someone that works there and was given a different story, that it was merely dodgy racist emails and given the public sector cuts that are on the way they will be looking for any excuse to sack staff. Looks like that was the story they put out and turns out it was a lot more serous. If not I'm sure the people sacked would have some sort of redress if the media reports are inaccurate?

I see from the BBC, that the former TUV member Ann Cooper, supports the actions of the 9 men sacked by the HMRC.

On her Twitter account, which has now being deleted, she said the follow: "Well done lads. Sorry you got caught. You deserve a medal. We need more like you."

I see Ann Cooper is standing for the BNP in the Assembly elections. I suppose there isn't a big leap between the two parties.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-12992184 (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-12992184)

A complaint has been made to gardaí over comments by Fine Gael Mayor of Naas Darren Scully, who said he would refuse to represent constituents of African origin.

Speaking to Clem Ryan on KFM's 'Kildare Today', Cllr Scully said he made his decision based on what he described as the ''aggressive attitude'' he has experienced when representations were made to him by ''black Africans''.

He said he would in future pass any representations from Africans on to other public representatives.

However, he stressed that this was his own view and not that of Naas Town Council.

A special meeting of Naas Town Council has been called this evening to discuss the matter.

Mayor Scully is expected to attend the meeting.

Mr Scully said that over his seven years as a councillor his experiences of dealing with "black Africans" were not good.

He said most of the issues had to do with housing and he had been met "with aggressiveness and bad manners".

Mr Scully said he has always made it clear that he would speak his mind and that following his comments last night he received "extremely nasty and abusive emails and text messages".

However, he insisted that he made his decision based on the experiences that he has had "with every single case over seven years".

This afternoon, Labour's Aodhán Ó Riordáin made a complaint under the Prohibition of Incitement to Hatred Act in relation to the comments.

A statement from Fine Gael said the views expressed by Cllr Scully do not reflect the views of Fine Gael and they are not party policy.


The statement added that the party will be looking into the matter of Cllr Scully's comments.

Fine Gael Minister of State Dinny McGinley has said that the comments were in no way reflective of Fine Gael's policy on immigrants.

Mr McGinley refused to be drawn on whether Mr Scully should resign or leave the party.

Currently on TodayFM. 

Quote from: ONeill on February 13, 2010, 02:34:43 PM
There are people from Derry, Armagh and Tyrone who genuinely hate each other because of where they come from. What do ye call that?

Buck eejits.

If they hate each other over football they are eejits ffs.

Some of my best friends are from Tyrone!!

I have no time for gypsy's, I have had nothing but  bad experiences with them, I guess i am a racist.,

Homosexuals were also a tough one for me but I got over that, hopefully I can begin to to think gypsies are lazy, robbing feckers who contribute nothing to society.

Quote from: stew on November 22, 2011, 05:31:58 PM
I have no time for gypsy's, I have had nothing but  bad experiences with them, I guess i am a racist.,

Homosexuals were also a tough one for me but I got over that, hopefully I can begin to to think gypsies are lazy, robbing feckers who contribute nothing to society.

Why?

Quote from: orangeman on November 22, 2011, 05:05:49 PM
A complaint has been made to gardaí over comments by Fine Gael Mayor of Naas Darren Scully, who said he would refuse to represent constituents of African origin.

Speaking to Clem Ryan on KFM's 'Kildare Today', Cllr Scully said he made his decision based on what he described as the ''aggressive attitude'' he has experienced when representations were made to him by ''black Africans''.

He said he would in future pass any representations from Africans on to other public representatives.

However, he stressed that this was his own view and not that of Naas Town Council.

A special meeting of Naas Town Council has been called this evening to discuss the matter.

Mayor Scully is expected to attend the meeting.

Mr Scully said that over his seven years as a councillor his experiences of dealing with "black Africans" were not good.

He said most of the issues had to do with housing and he had been met "with aggressiveness and bad manners".

Mr Scully said he has always made it clear that he would speak his mind and that following his comments last night he received "extremely nasty and abusive emails and text messages".

However, he insisted that he made his decision based on the experiences that he has had "with every single case over seven years".

This afternoon, Labour's Aodhán Ó Riordáin made a complaint under the Prohibition of Incitement to Hatred Act in relation to the comments.

A statement from Fine Gael said the views expressed by Cllr Scully do not reflect the views of Fine Gael and they are not party policy.


The statement added that the party will be looking into the matter of Cllr Scully's comments.

Fine Gael Minister of State Dinny McGinley has said that the comments were in no way reflective of Fine Gael's policy on immigrants.

Mr McGinley refused to be drawn on whether Mr Scully should resign or leave the party.

What a sc**bag. Its a poor reflection on his town that such a halfwit wins elections.

Quote from: stew on November 22, 2011, 05:31:58 PM
I have no time for gypsy's, I have had nothing but  bad experiences with them, I guess i am a racist.,

Homosexuals were also a tough one for me but I got over that, hopefully I can begin to to think gypsies are lazy, robbing feckers who contribute nothing to society.

Oh, the PC brigade will be after you now!  ;)

Its PC to question the demonization of an entire ethnic group based on a few personal interactions?

Quote from: BennyCake on November 22, 2011, 06:39:25 PM

Quote from: stew on November 22, 2011, 05:31:58 PM
I have no time for gypsy's, I have had nothing but  bad experiences with them, I guess i am a racist.,

Homosexuals were also a tough one for me but I got over that, hopefully I can begin to to think gypsies are lazy, robbing feckers who contribute nothing to society.

Oh, the PC brigade will be after you now!  ;)

Not before the punctuation police  :P

The most shocking thing about this story, for me, was the age of the Councillor. I read the story before I saw a picture and was expecting some old fella.

Quote from: Maguire01 on November 22, 2011, 06:54:20 PM

Quote from: BennyCake on November 22, 2011, 06:39:25 PM

Quote from: stew on November 22, 2011, 05:31:58 PM
I have no time for gypsy's, I have had nothing but  bad experiences with them, I guess i am a racist.,

Homosexuals were also a tough one for me but I got over that, hopefully I can begin to to think gypsies are lazy, robbing feckers who contribute nothing to society.

Oh, the PC brigade will be after you now!  ;)

Not before the punctuation police  :P

That's not punctuation, that's spelling!  :P

Quote from: Fear ón Srath Bán on November 22, 2011, 07:03:52 PM

Quote from: Maguire01 on November 22, 2011, 06:54:20 PM

Quote from: BennyCake on November 22, 2011, 06:39:25 PM

Quote from: stew on November 22, 2011, 05:31:58 PM
I have no time for gypsy's, I have had nothing but  bad experiences with them, I guess i am a racist.,

Homosexuals were also a tough one for me but I got over that, hopefully I can begin to to think gypsies are lazy, robbing feckers who contribute nothing to society.

Oh, the PC brigade will be after you now!  ;)

Not before the punctuation police  :P

That's not punctuation, that's spelling!  :P

Misuse of an apostrophe; well within the remit of the punctuation police. There may also be cause to call in the spelling police for this offending instance.

Spelling trumps punctuation every time.

Quote from: trileacman on November 22, 2011, 05:45:30 PM

Quote from: stew on November 22, 2011, 05:31:58 PM
I have no time for gypsy's, I have had nothing but  bad experiences with them, I guess i am a racist.,

Homosexuals were also a tough one for me but I got over that, hopefully I can begin to to think gypsies are lazy, robbing feckers who contribute nothing to society.

Why?

Because he's a bigoted, narrow-minded f**k?

Quote from: gallsman on November 22, 2011, 07:46:58 PM

Quote from: trileacman on November 22, 2011, 05:45:30 PM

Quote from: stew on November 22, 2011, 05:31:58 PM
I have no time for gypsy's, I have had nothing but  bad experiences with them, I guess i am a racist.,

Homosexuals were also a tough one for me but I got over that, hopefully I can begin to to think gypsies are lazy, robbing feckers who contribute nothing to society.

Why?

Because he's a bigoted, narrow-minded f**k?

Let me ask you something Gallsman.......

(http://t1.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcT3ud8S27nq8Mz4LCdYUBt7SaCgcigejyqtz-VpJ8K93nLhoC-xLcoJJAO6)

That just made me leave sausages outta the freezer for brekkie

Quote from: gallsman on November 22, 2011, 07:46:58 PM

Quote from: trileacman on November 22, 2011, 05:45:30 PM

Quote from: stew on November 22, 2011, 05:31:58 PM
I have no time for gypsy's, I have had nothing but  bad experiences with them, I guess i am a racist.,

Homosexuals were also a tough one for me but I got over that, hopefully I can begin to to think gypsies are lazy, robbing feckers who contribute nothing to society.

Why?

Because he's a bigoted, narrow-minded f**k?

I would appear he is and he revels in it too obviously. Maybe he should run for mayor of Naas.

 :D...classic shoot from the hip stew right there.

What would Jesus think?

Quote from: theskull1 on November 22, 2011, 10:58:22 PM
:D...classic shoot from the hip stew right there.

What would Jesus think?

Jesus would think "what a Dick" , I was just on the phone to him there.

Quote from: mylestheslasher on November 22, 2011, 11:02:35 PM

Quote from: theskull1 on November 22, 2011, 10:58:22 PM
:D...classic shoot from the hip stew right there.

What would Jesus think?

Jesus would think "what a Dick" , I was just on the phone to him there.

What would you care what he thinks, your pure fcuked anyhow!

Quote from: stew on November 22, 2011, 11:05:50 PM

Quote from: mylestheslasher on November 22, 2011, 11:02:35 PM

Quote from: theskull1 on November 22, 2011, 10:58:22 PM
:D...classic shoot from the hip stew right there.

What would Jesus think?

Jesus would think "what a Dick" , I was just on the phone to him there.

What would you care what he thinks, your pure fcuked anyhow!

Actually he said I'm sound, he left the keys to the gate under a rock. He did say the likes of you totally missed the point and would burn in hell fire for eternity. I thought that was an over reaction on his part but he is an angry god you know.

What does he think about Croke Park and who should be entitled to use it this week?

This thread was started by Olly......with a sensible post  :o  :o  :o

I think people's homophobia has eased off a little in the last year. Men like Louis Walsh, Graham Norton, Brian Dowling and Oscar Wilde can now roam the country free from abuse and being hurled at. The biggest pity was that shows like Glenroe and Winning Streak never had fictional gay characters to pathe the way for tolerance, especially in the elderly and decrepit. On my grandmother's deathbed I tested the water as a social experiment and told her I was gay. I was living in Cornwall at the time. She looked at me in disdain and says 'that's England for you. You'll be wearing a wig soon'. I didn't get the latter sentiment but by spitting on the ground after it I knew it wasn't a pleasantry.

Quote from: Olly on November 23, 2011, 09:51:59 AM
I think people's homophobia has eased off a little in the last year. Men like Louis Walsh, Graham Norton, Brian Dowling and Oscar Wilde can now roam the country free from abuse and being hurled at. The biggest pity was that shows like Glenroe and Winning Streak never had fictional gay characters to pathe the way for tolerance, especially in the elderly and decrepit. On my grandmother's deathbed I tested the water as a social experiment and told her I was gay. I was living in Cornwall at the time. She looked at me in disdain and says 'that's England for you. You'll be wearing a wig soon'. I didn't get the latter sentiment but by spitting on the ground after it I knew it wasn't a pleasantry.

That is the peasantry

Quote from: stew on November 22, 2011, 11:05:50 PM

Quote from: mylestheslasher on November 22, 2011, 11:02:35 PM

Quote from: theskull1 on November 22, 2011, 10:58:22 PM
:D...classic shoot from the hip stew right there.

What would Jesus think?

Jesus would think "what a Dick" , I was just on the phone to him there.

What would you care what he thinks, your pure fcuked anyhow!

Stew - I sent a tenner to a senior Mufti in Mecca to pray for you.  The Muslim prayers are worth double points this month
at Tesco.   

That buck in Naas might have a point
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=493pL_Vbtnc

Quote from: Hardy on November 23, 2011, 12:29:49 AM
What does he think about Croke Park and who should be entitled to use it this week?

He thinks its lovely and that soccer and rugby should never have been allowed in. Of course he has reserved a place in hell for Sean Kelly as punishment for his role in this. He has no problem with American football being let in.