The DUP thread

[DaleCooper]

Read a lot about who people are talking about here but who knows what's true. You look at Epstein stuff, this Donaldson thing and the likes of saville stuff too. "Elites" behaving in very depraved manners. You watch the likes of that taken film and the depravity in it and you convince yourself it's fake but in reality there is probably a lot of shit like that goes on. Donaldson is small fry compared to a lot of things out there as horrendous as that is.

Question is wrt dup if he is guilty then is he the only one.

This stuff is older than the hills. Associate of mine made a film about the famous Johnny Gosch case and the Franklin scandal.

Saville and Epstein had MI5 clearance to be in close proximity to the House of Saxe Coburg Gotha.

Its a sort of dupers delight I suppose. Most people still dont grasp what Epstein was.

[Baile Brigín 2]

Newton in the Sunday Times today basically saying it's big decision time for the DUP. If they carry on the family values fire and brimstone stuff they are wide open. Let the TUV have that space and become more mainstream. Similar to the Tories in the 90's, wasn't credible with all their shaggers.

He also made the point that Burrows was out with 'let's not use this for political point scoring'. One interpretation is we will go high, Allister will go low. Another is Donaldson spent half his career in the UUP, so the who knew what could be thrown at them.

Apparantly some PSNI detectives saw Dondaldson walk into a gay sauna in London and told the world, which invites a number of questions

[p3427977]

I listened to the latest BelTel/indo podcast with court journo Allison Morris giving her account and also revealing some evidence which could not be reported upon previously. She offered some acute observations about Jeffrey, his arrogance, his testimony and his crash landing under expert cross examination, but offered absolutely nothing about the (alleged) evidence that the jury found enough to find Elanor guilty of such a serious crime.

This is the 2nd time I've seen you mention Eleanor and evidence? Are you a friend of hers? You already know we might never hear a lot of the evidence the jury did.

[DaleCooper]

Based on what is emerging we should trust the jury and courts. Heard several women appeal to this narrative of her being "controlled" and a DA victim. BS.

Aiding and abetting is fairly clearcut.

On subject of DA , I Wonder will the alleged domestic abuser in the same milieu ever be named or have his day in court.

Justice is sometimes in the EYE of the beholder....

[GTP]

find Elanor guilty of such a serious crime

She was not found guilty of a serious crime. The BBC website describes it as "the jury could not find her guilty, in the same way they did her husband, and instead found that she "did the acts" when delivering their verdicts."
I believe the distinction has been discussed previously in this thread.

[johnnycool]

Allegedly the libel laws here are far for stringent on what can and cannot be published and may have stopped some of the press corp and their legal eagles from going down that rabbit hole.

Strange that the DUP have fought for this divergence from England and Wales law for years!!!

[Main Street]

find Elanor guilty of such a serious crime

She was not found guilty of a serious crime. The BBC website describes it as "the jury could not find her guilty, in the same way they did her husband, and instead found that she "did the acts" when delivering their verdicts."
I believe the distinction has been discussed previously in this thread.

Fair enough but in the court of public opinion there is little distinction between a jury finding that she did the acts and being deemed guilty of doing the acts. Nevertheless, there is no serious evidence presented anywhere to support the jury's decision, whereas with Jeffrey there is a trail of information, nor was anything presented in the beltel/indo podcast which could have given more. Instead we are just given some supposedly sensational revelation about her, a very suspicious wife and with good reason to be, bugging Jeffrey's car. As it stands, she has been deemed to have done the deed because the jury thought she must have known based on assumptions. That's a very low bar for a woman who has been certifiably abused for decades  and a  high bar to get a guilty verdict for the life long wife abuser and a vile pedophile.  .

[p3427977]

That's a very low bar for a woman who has been certifiably abused for decades  and a  high bar to get a guilty verdict for the life long wife abuser and a vile pedophile.

I've not read anything about this. Where's this come from?

[Armagh18]

find Elanor guilty of such a serious crime

She was not found guilty of a serious crime. The BBC website describes it as "the jury could not find her guilty, in the same way they did her husband, and instead found that she "did the acts" when delivering their verdicts."
I believe the distinction has been discussed previously in this thread.

Fair enough but in the court of public opinion there is little distinction between a jury finding that she did the acts and being deemed guilty of doing the acts. Nevertheless, there is no serious evidence presented anywhere to support the jury's decision, whereas with Jeffrey there is a trail of information, nor was anything presented in the beltel/indo podcast which could have given more. Instead we are just given some supposedly sensational revelation about her, a very suspicious wife and with good reason to be, bugging Jeffrey's car. As it stands, she has been deemed to have done the deed because the jury thought she must have known based on assumptions. That's a very low bar for a woman who has been certifiably abused for decades  and a  high bar to get a guilty verdict for the life long wife abuser and a vile pedophile.  .

How do you know he is? Obviously not a leap to assume given what he's done but haven't seen it mentioned. Not sure if we'll ever hear exactly what Eleanor did or didn't do for various legal reasons.

[David McKeown]

Allegedly the libel laws here are far for stringent on what can and cannot be published and may have stopped some of the press corp and their legal eagles from going down that rabbit hole.

Strange that the DUP have fought for this divergence from England and Wales law for years!!!

It actually means that Belfast is one of the Mecca's world wide for defamation case and explains why local solicitor Paul Tweed is considered the leading expert in the world on defamation law.

[David McKeown]

find Elanor guilty of such a serious crime

She was not found guilty of a serious crime. The BBC website describes it as "the jury could not find her guilty, in the same way they did her husband, and instead found that she "did the acts" when delivering their verdicts."
I believe the distinction has been discussed previously in this thread.

Fair enough but in the court of public opinion there is little distinction between a jury finding that she did the acts and being deemed guilty of doing the acts. Nevertheless, there is no serious evidence presented anywhere to support the jury's decision, whereas with Jeffrey there is a trail of information, nor was anything presented in the beltel/indo podcast which could have given more. Instead we are just given some supposedly sensational revelation about her, a very suspicious wife and with good reason to be, bugging Jeffrey's car. As it stands, she has been deemed to have done the deed because the jury thought she must have known based on assumptions. That's a very low bar for a woman who has been certifiably abused for decades  and a  high bar to get a guilty verdict for the life long wife abuser and a vile pedophile.  .

We have no idea why the Jury concluded she did the act. Also that's a very artificial finding given that most of the evidence against her couldn't have been fully test because she couldn't give instructions. For example if someone said she was in the room when x or y happened then the height of the defence in a trial of the facts would be to ask if the witness was sure. Whereas in a trial it's conceivable that testing could go much further with information about room layout and/or where the defendant said they were at the time etc.

[seafoid]

Based on what I have read about the situation it seems to have been a dysfunctional family.

[quit yo jibbajabba]

I think I've just found the winner of the understatement of the year award

[seafoid]

https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/politics/the-dups-darkest-hour-exposure-of-jeffrey-donaldsons-double-life-leaves-party-in-deep-crisis/a/157643299.html

The party has been running to stand still. It was on just 18pc in our last poll in April – three points below its 2022 Assembly performance, which itself was dire. Factor in Donaldson's conviction and everything that has emerged since and the outlook is grim.

The TUV will be merciless. Expect Jim Allister to be on rinse and repeat about the 'dud Donaldson deal' for the next 10 months. The claim that spooks possibly blackmailed the former DUP leader into agreeing to restore devolution is a powerful one that will resonate with a chunk of unionist grassroots.


The UUP is on trickier territory with the Donaldson story given that he was an elected representative for the party almost as long as he was for the DUP. However, it is the latter party with which he served most recently and is associated with in the public mind.

UUP leader Jon Burrows hasn't opted for point-scoring against his bigger rival. He is focusing on the need to change the law to stop Donaldson accessing his huge taxpayer-funded pension.

UUP leader Jon Burrows
UUP leader Jon Burrows © PA
He has the advantage of being new to politics, and he's stressing that. The UUP leader told a recent party meeting that his would be a zero tolerance approach and "anyone acting dishonourably is for the door".

The DUP's worst fear will be that the trial and its aftermath has cemented something psychologically with voters – the idea of a party permanently linked to scandal, crisis and decline.

The story no longer concerns just one man. Rather, it's about a political organisation that looks weighed down by questions and controversies.

[JPGJOHNNYG]

https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/politics/the-dups-darkest-hour-exposure-of-jeffrey-donaldsons-double-life-leaves-party-in-deep-crisis/a/157643299.html

The party has been running to stand still. It was on just 18pc in our last poll in April – three points below its 2022 Assembly performance, which itself was dire. Factor in Donaldson's conviction and everything that has emerged since and the outlook is grim.

The TUV will be merciless. Expect Jim Allister to be on rinse and repeat about the 'dud Donaldson deal' for the next 10 months. The claim that spooks possibly blackmailed the former DUP leader into agreeing to restore devolution is a powerful one that will resonate with a chunk of unionist grassroots.


The UUP is on trickier territory with the Donaldson story given that he was an elected representative for the party almost as long as he was for the DUP. However, it is the latter party with which he served most recently and is associated with in the public mind.

UUP leader Jon Burrows hasn't opted for point-scoring against his bigger rival. He is focusing on the need to change the law to stop Donaldson accessing his huge taxpayer-funded pension.

UUP leader Jon Burrows
UUP leader Jon Burrows © PA
He has the advantage of being new to politics, and he's stressing that. The UUP leader told a recent party meeting that his would be a zero tolerance approach and "anyone acting dishonourably is for the door".

The DUP's worst fear will be that the trial and its aftermath has cemented something psychologically with voters – the idea of a party permanently linked to scandal, crisis and decline.

The story no longer concerns just one man. Rather, it's about a political organisation that looks weighed down by questions and controversies.

Donaldson looking to appeal which is bad bad news for DUP as it will just keep the whole episode fresh in people's heads for next yrs elections