Antrim Hurling

[Minder]

What is the format? If Derry beat Down they are the champions?

[Minder]

Second-half fade out see Antrim fall to defeat - Derry 0-16 Antrim 1-11
23 July 2008
Antrim Under 21 hurlers saw another Ulster title go by the wayside when a second-half capitulation saw them lose to Derry at Celtic Park on Wednesday evening.
During the first half the young Saffrons had played some good hurling and with team captain Eddie McCloskey sending over some very good points and Colm Duffin grabbing a goal they led at the break by 1-9 to 0-7.
However in the second-half they failed to produce the goods and managed to add just two more points, and when a well drilled and determined Derry team upped the pace the Antrim challenge faded.
Antrim still managed to maintain their lead until the dying minutes and had a series of chances to add to it but a series of unbelievable misses saw them fall to defeat to the Oak Leafers for the second year in succession.

[milltown row]

just shows you what Derry hurlers can do if they were to put some effort into hurling. big ball game rules, so Antrim have nothing to fear.

if Derry got their act together they would compete with Antrim every year.

[theskull1]

if Derry got their act together they would compete with Antrim every year.

And we all would benefit from it if they did. Well done to McGilligan for driving them on this year. A wake up call for Antrim, but then we're pretty good at getting back over to sleep again 

[Minder]

Maybe Derry U-21's need to enter Leinster to get more competition...........

[Maximus Marillius]

Jesus. That's bad, again.

why is it bad...thats twice we have dumped you in sucession at u21 level when we were lead to believe that this u21 bunch from Antrim were outstanding. It proves that the work is being done in Derry and that some of the silly stories being promoted about the county board not promoting the game is away from the real truth. Currently our minors have a good environment to develop, otherwise they would not have won the past two years. Lets not forget these derry teams were being beaten at minor level by Antrim, so our internal structures are helping to develop these lads

[imtommygunn]

It proves one of three things Max:

1. The work is being done in Derry.
2. The work's not being done in Antrim.
3. Both of the above.

Sadly I know which one I believe.

You boys can compete at hurling at all levels with Antrim if you put the work in - however as McGilligan says I don't think this is the case.

Don't forget that in these squad of Derry players a number played in Mageean winning Maghera teams - these teams cleaned up so the ability was always there.

[theskull1]

If Brian say's that the Derry county board is not promoting the game then I'd be more inclined to go with his opinion than your's Max...no offense. I think he has used this as a motivational tool (along with may others I'm sure) to drive a committed and talented bunch of hurlers to achieve through adversity. Great credit must be given to the "hurling men" in Derry like of which McGilligan is a prime example.

Tommy...I want to know what you believe?

Is it that the work is not being done in Antrim? If it is you'd need to elaborate as that is too vague. What work specifically

[NAG]

The work has been carried out for years with this specific group of players, by a dedicated bunch of coaches through our development structures.

Need I give anyone here a lesson what happened to these men when these lads reached minor level they were told thanks but no thanks we have two boys lined up to take these guys to the next level.

The two boys then run them all over the country and actually IMO get them beat in Mullingar by a good Galway side by implementing a well known tactical ploy with blew up on them big style.

These lads were then brought directly passed go (i.e. any level of senior club hulring) to play on the county squad with the two boys, gradually running down the quality and competitiveness of our senior county team.

Now that they have played on the big stage they are now too good to get beat by derry at U21 after all they beat laois at the weekend.

This is a total indictment of the way the development structures are handled in Antrim. Instead of nuturing and developing the undoubted talent there is, what do our boys do? Fire them into senior county hurling when they are no more ready for senior club hurling. Inflate some ego's and embarass us in our own province for the past two years.

Total respect to Derry hurlers when I say this, but they should not be able to hold a candle to us at the moment, this is not arrogance but it is reality when you look at the talent pool. IMO had this squad of boys been allowed to progress into senior club hurling and learn their trade there these two defeats would not have happened.

somebody stop me please.....

[imtommygunn]

Rather than bigger picture what is / what isn't being done I think that this county in general pays great disservice to the U21 age group. At hurling and football this year I believe that we have had two sets of players as good as we have had for years. I'm not convinced that there's been much emphasis put into training/preparing these teams in either code.

If these guys are as good as we are led to believe then the perfect platform for them to prove this and the level to aspire to would have been against the stronger southern teams. Two years in a row now they have been denied this - either a because they're not good enough or  b they're not being prepared properly. I've seen these guys at minor level and they have handed out some shocking tankings to teams like Derry - so the question has to be what has happened in those 3 years in between or have Derry improved that much.

Having been involved in the senior hurling set-up may have impacted confidence - not sure.

If these guys are to be the future then the perfect platform for them to be "nurtured" is the u21 platform. Either football or hurling. I think they've been denied this.

[Minder]

Tommy...........I havent heard any comments this year from S & W but they were a bit disengenuous last year when they said we only trained once or twice, i know that wasnt the case and they have trained a fair few times this year too. Many Antrim U-21 teams have had far worse preparation than this one and have achieved more. It is becoming more apparent that the players are not as good as we were told, which is fair enough as most supporters that attend games know the stnadard of player in Antrim. If there wasnt as much b*llshit being fed to us from the Antrim Board/management there wouldnt be such ill will from certain sections. People are not stupid.

[theskull1]

You can't make these vague comments without defining what you mean by not enough work. I could gaurentee you that everybody on that U21 side has been out hurling 3 times a week since March with their clubs so "work" is being done

We need to step back and take a medium term view if that work is not good enough quality and develop people with the capabilites to coach at the right level in every club. No point in blaming S&W for players lacking in "skill"

To me though it's the apathy that exists with Antrim County Teams that brings about results like last night. There's a huge mental/mentality problem with "The saffrons/glensmen" and I'm not sure how it can be delt with. But ones things for sure, if it is not recognised as a problem then it never will be.

[imtommygunn]

Ok sorry for being vague...

Definition of what I mean for work in this case: training and playing friendlies as a team. You can do all the training you want with your own club but this will not help you gel the county u21 team. Maybe I'm wrong on this but I haven't seen any evidence of friendlies...

You look at the minor teams we had who may not have beaten southern opposition but at least competed and they played a lot of friendlies. They spent weekends in places like Kilkenny etc. This was good for team spirit, playing as a team and improving them in general with match sharpness against quality opposition.

Personally I think it's time the county employed different u21 and senior manager's in both codes. Both codes have been a huge disappointment over the last few years. The managers have to run with two separate agendas.

The u21 team were missing Neil McManus who is a massive loss and , I think, Simon McRory and McFall. However that's not to get away from anything else.

[Minder]

Imtommygunn

The last two U 21 teams have had far better preparation than many Antrim U 21 teams, I remember playing U-21 games for Antrim and we had 2 or 3 meetings where 7 or 8 players turned up, on the day of the game you almost had to be introduced to players to familiarise yourself with them. There is no way an U-21 team is going to get the same preparation as a senior team, there are just not enough free nights in the calendar. We have become the county of the excuse, you would have think they would have learnt their lesson last year.

[Guillem2]

Im not convinced that the work is being done in Derry at all. It isn't being done in Antrim and Derry have a crop of really good lads at the minute. This will continue to happen now and again but we can cut alot of it out with proper coaching and preparation.