Antrim Hurling

[Buswhacker]

Who do we meet in the Final in September ?

[Seamroga in exile]

Houl on ffs, you've only just bettered Rossa and they have as many in football.

Yes, indeed. A proud moment for the Shamrocks. Rossa have a great tradition in Antrim hurling. I don't quite know what you mean by that. What's football got to do with anything? If we win a couple more championships we'll have won 19, top of the pile.

If...

Well, I wasn't going to say when, was I? We're much too modest for that in Loughgiel. It's inevitable really. Ballycastle and Rossa aren't going to win the championship anytime soon, more's the pity. And the near neighbours got close but the wheels are falling off the wagon over there. The white elephant is more important at the minute. Sure it's handy for us to use it in the winter.  It's good to get your priorities right though. 

All I can see is Cushendall and Loughgiel sharing the championship for the next 5 or 6 years. It's a matter of time and one thing Shamrocks supporters have is patience. We will be top of the pile.

I think the point is that Rossa have managed to build up a big tally of championships despite being committed to dual codes. That is, BC and Sharwocks can concentrate on hurling over their history while Rossa effectively matched them with only half the resources/opportuinites as they committed to hurling also. What is more interesteing however is the current evidence show this is no longer possiible? Dual clubs are either dominant in one code, or mediocre in both! Although as a Belfast man myself note that the vast majority of dual clubs are Belfast based! Not half a clubs!

Well this is a hypothetical argument, of course. Being in so much as there was no real tradition of football in either Loughgiel or Ballycastle during those times. Who knows, maybe we'd be going for top of the pile in football as well if things had been different. And I'd have though being a city club Rossa would have had more players to choose from to play both codes.

[Milltown Row2]

I'd say Loughgiel would have a bigger membership than Rossa and most other city clubs!! 

[Seamroga in exile]

I'd say Loughgiel would have a bigger membership than Rossa and most other city clubs!!

Perhaps now, especially after winning the championship last year. Maybe not back in the day.

On another note, Winker is going for another op on Friday. 

[Milltown Row2]

You have the biggest parish!! Also its not your first championship

[imtommygunn]

Land mass or population though MR?? Bit sparser populated up in the country!!

I would imagine Loughgiel would probably have more membership than all 3 of those shaws road clubs combined and maybe then some. The Johnnies should have a right big membership - not sure of st galls but would guess big enough there too.

[Seamroga in exile]

You have the biggest parish!! Also its not your first championship

It was a while between championships though. And a bigger parish than the falls? I don't think so mate. Perhaps by area, yes, certainly not by population.

[NAG1]

Yeah but dont forget the outlying parishes of Cloughmills and Armoy and any others that have to be factored into that calculation. 

[btdtgtt]

Guys the issue of parishes and population surely is straightwforward? I have no doubt the rural clubs in Antrim (certainly Loughuile) enjoy much greater numbers to chose from.

I mean look at the Falls Rd - there is roughly a dozen clubs all of which play two codes (and other issues) - compared to say Loughuile, one club and one code! Come on Seamroga etc - you cannot dispute the slant here!

The oul line of "the whole city to chose from" is way off the mark also! Players generally come from West Belfast and are divided through a huge number (perhaps too many) clubs.

And thats before we even look at land availaility. Loughuile have two pitches to divide amongst their hurlers - look at St Pauls Sarsfields Rossa StJohns etc with both codes across every age group trying to share one pitch!

Also, if Loughuile are concerned about not having the opportunity to win football championships maybe they should start a team - I think not! The reality is that it is to the detriment of hurling and Belfast clubs have proved this in an attempt to be a complete GAA club. Credit Ballycastle & Dunloy for being dual clubs altho perhaps one major and minor code. Clooney Gaels another example deserving credit.

Now I concede there are many other factors in determining success but surely no right thinking Gael could suggest that rural clubs like Loughuile etc dont have a major advantage ingrained in this regard.

[imtommygunn]

Yeah but the rural places are so much more sparsely populated.

The fulcrum of a lot of communities in rural areas is the GAA club. That is not so much the case for cities.

That will mean much larger percentages of rural communities will play hurling meaning the size of the parish, especially come senior time, really means nothing.

[theskull1]

btdtgtt
Contact Ciara Ferry Antrim Games Manager for the survey carried out around primary schools around the county. The participation levels in some west belfast schools is shocking. Not saying that is solely the clubs fault as there will of course be societal issues at play here. I do think some well supported initiatives need to be developed to get primary schools linked to clubs (10 year plan). The clubs would of course need to have the infastructure (pitches/volunteers/finance/healthy atmosphere) to deliver the positive experience. Not easy

[NAG1]

Dont hold out much hope for the survey making any sesne.

It has been a well recognised fact that the city kids are harder to get involved in a club and what are we doing about it? IMO wasting time trying to chase the 'new Irish' and our unionist brethern in to playing our games and totally neglecting our core constituents.
Im not against reaching out at all, but I am against it when it comes at the detriment of promotion within our heartland which is West Belfast, we have limited resources and if we are putting them into these PR projects we dont have them for the core values.

We have limited resources because Croke park are playing lip service to us in promoting hurling and football in our second largest urban area.

[btdtgtt]

Dont hold out much hope for the survey making any sesne.

It has been a well recognised fact that the city kids are harder to get involved in a club and what are we doing about it? IMO wasting time trying to chase the 'new Irish' and our unionist brethern in to playing our games and totally neglecting our core constituents.
Im not against reaching out at all, but I am against it when it comes at the detriment of promotion within our heartland which is West Belfast, we have limited resources and if we are putting them into these PR projects we dont have them for the core values.

We have limited resources because Croke park are playing lip service to us in promoting hurling and football in our second largest urban area.

Thats 100% NAGG!! We cannot talk about GAA and then rely on schools - these are two different entities! Yes there has been much fantastic work and yes they are an opportunity - but its is clubs that are the basis! Talk to any teacher - their priority is exam results not hurling! There is little funding etc for a teacher to give up voluntary times especially when so many do it already WITH CLUBS!

As for the comparsion here to rural areas - I note Garron Tower and St Louis and C&P are hardly dominating across schools hurling! St Marys have by far a better record across a number of years so the indicator is a false one!

Also your point about chasing the brethren is excellent. Christy Cooney can go to the Shankill and do a nice political photoshoot - but he will be better place jumping over the peace-wall and looking at the dire straits of genuine clubs - in terms of both numbers and finances. Maybe Croke Pk HQ and all their money has become too separated from grassroots!

[imtommygunn]

Rural schools in antrim split clubs though which wouldn't so much be the same for city schools.

You look at say for example St Marys CBS. It's a who's who of Belfast hurling every year for the given age group.

Rural schools could have Cushendall players among 2 or 3 different schools, Dunloy among a few - even Ballycastle ones go to C&P, GT and Loreot Coleraine. Loughgiel would be across a few too.

That's why they're not dominant or even winning much - you're never playing the best from north antrim when you play a north antrim school.

St Pats Maghera is like that in south derry. Their school team is effectively south derry's best, and some north thrown in, for that particular age.

Coaching in each of the rural schools will still improve the players in their catchment areas though...

[theskull1]

I wasn't inferring that we rely on schools...I was simply highlighting a fact that there is a shockingly low level of participation in the primary school population in the west (i.e and that means the whole population over time) and that that needs a bit of joined up thinking between the clubs and high levels within the GAA to improve on the current figures