Sham Colleges

[foxcommander]

Is it that all the nazi nutjobs are illiterate or all the illiterates are nazi nutjobs?

In fairness, the immigration of educated foreigners often diminishes the prospects of illiterate locals.

Yes and this can provide a fruitful bounty for ultra-nationalist movements.

Which is why a balanced approach to immigration is required to ensure that the local population have a fair shot at gaining employment for jobs they are capable for and to earn a decent wage. Mass immigration drives down wages due to cheap labour. I know many people who lost their jobs because of this.
You would see less resentment from local populations if they had a fair chance.

What country would that be in?

Have a good guess..

Well there aren't many serious commentators blaming immigration for the astonishing rise in unemployment in the 26.

So i'm guessing the 6?

26. maybe because no-one wants to admit it - the government seem to keep it quiet.
or maybe you've missed the fact that 250,000 have left the country due to lack of work?

Ah right.

So the high unemployment in the south is down to immigrants and the Government want to 'keep it quiet'.

You catch on quick.
It has certainly had a knock-on effect on employment prospects for the indigenous population

[muppet]

Ah right.

So the high unemployment in the south is down to immigrants and the Government want to 'keep it quiet'.

You catch on quick.
It has certainly had a knock-on effect on employment prospects for the indigenous population

I met this sort of abuse when I moved to Dublin.

I guess I should see it as progress that I am no longer targeted for taking someone else's job.

[foxcommander]

Ah right.

So the high unemployment in the south is down to immigrants and the Government want to 'keep it quiet'.

You catch on quick.
It has certainly had a knock-on effect on employment prospects for the indigenous population

I met this sort of abuse when I moved to Dublin.

I guess I should see it as progress that I am no longer targeted for taking someone else's job.

You shouldn't have been targeted. That is shameful.
You seem to miss the point of my argument though if this is your comeback.

[muppet]

Ah right.

So the high unemployment in the south is down to immigrants and the Government want to 'keep it quiet'.

You catch on quick.
It has certainly had a knock-on effect on employment prospects for the indigenous population

I met this sort of abuse when I moved to Dublin.

I guess I should see it as progress that I am no longer targeted for taking someone else's job.

You shouldn't have been targeted. That is shameful.
You seem to miss the point of my argument though if this is your comeback.

If your point is that the immigrants are to blame for high unemployment, then yes it is a point that I missed.

We have seen this ideology before where the majority blames an easy target minority for its woes.

[lynchbhoy]

To be fair muppet there is/was some merit in what he is saying in relation to the building game

Bad enough we had unskilled irish chancers taking jobs of skilled tradesmen because they were 'cheaper' but this was made worse by foreign lads adding to it.
Then he housing bust really kicked in and everyone lost out

These jobs the gov are supposedly creating
- it will be interesting to see ( in light of priory hall as just one of many examples) if the builders/sub contractors hire experienced tradesmen to do a quality job, or will they hire cheaper inexperienced but willing workers.
I'd not be confident to be honest!

[muppet]

To be fair muppet there is/was some merit in what he is saying in relation to the building game

Bad enough we had unskilled irish chancers taking jobs of skilled tradesmen because they were 'cheaper' but this was made worse by foreign lads adding to it.
Then he housing bust really kicked in and everyone lost out

These jobs the gov are supposedly creating
- it will be interesting to see ( in light of priory hall as just one of many examples) if the builders/sub contractors hire experienced tradesmen to do a quality job, or will they hire cheaper inexperienced but willing workers.
I'd not be confident to be honest!

Indeed, but the job losses were hardly the fault of immigrants.

The jobs were lost, that is not the same as saying locals were displaced by foreigners.

[lynchbhoy]

To be fair muppet there is/was some merit in what he is saying in relation to the building game

Bad enough we had unskilled irish chancers taking jobs of skilled tradesmen because they were 'cheaper' but this was made worse by foreign lads adding to it.
Then he housing bust really kicked in and everyone lost out

These jobs the gov are supposedly creating
- it will be interesting to see ( in light of priory hall as just one of many examples) if the builders/sub contractors hire experienced tradesmen to do a quality job, or will they hire cheaper inexperienced but willing workers.
I'd not be confident to be honest!

Indeed, but the job losses were hardly the fault of immigrants.

The jobs were lost, that is not the same as saying locals were displaced by foreigners.

I'm against unskilled people in skilled jobs.
So IMO immigrants, local chancers and sc**bag sub contractors/builders are all equally to blame

IMO there needs to be a system where tradesmen must pass a practical test in their trade.
Only then can this be eradicated!

There should be a green card system also- plus a revamp of the welfare and taxation systems!
IMO

[muppet]

To be fair muppet there is/was some merit in what he is saying in relation to the building game

Bad enough we had unskilled irish chancers taking jobs of skilled tradesmen because they were 'cheaper' but this was made worse by foreign lads adding to it.
Then he housing bust really kicked in and everyone lost out

These jobs the gov are supposedly creating
- it will be interesting to see ( in light of priory hall as just one of many examples) if the builders/sub contractors hire experienced tradesmen to do a quality job, or will they hire cheaper inexperienced but willing workers.
I'd not be confident to be honest!

Indeed, but the job losses were hardly the fault of immigrants.

The jobs were lost, that is not the same as saying locals were displaced by foreigners.

I'm against unskilled people in skilled jobs.
So IMO immigrants, local chancers and sc**bag sub contractors/builders are all equally to blame

IMO there needs to be a system where tradesmen must pass a practical test in their trade.
Only then can this be eradicated!

There should be a green card system also- plus a revamp of the welfare and taxation systems!
IMO

I would agree with you completely.

[foxcommander]

Ah right.

So the high unemployment in the south is down to immigrants and the Government want to 'keep it quiet'.

You catch on quick.
It has certainly had a knock-on effect on employment prospects for the indigenous population

I met this sort of abuse when I moved to Dublin.

I guess I should see it as progress that I am no longer targeted for taking someone else's job.

You shouldn't have been targeted. That is shameful.
You seem to miss the point of my argument though if this is your comeback.

If your point is that the immigrants are to blame for high unemployment, then yes it is a point that I missed.

We have seen this ideology before where the majority blames an easy target minority for its woes.

Immigration is to be welcomed if there is a need for the numbers. If there aren't enough jobs to go around there is little point in inviting more people in.
I don't blame immigrants for high unemployment although their presence and price point are driving factors in having a growing section of irish people out of work. That said, the irish themselves got a bit above their station during the "boom" and won't get out of bed for some menial jobs, which in turn supports demand from other countries.

What I am trying to say is that we should be mindful of getting our own citizens as close to full employment as possible. The knock on effect if we don't is more numbers on the dole and people who are working have to carry the can to support them. Wouldn't it be better if the welfare system would supplement a low income family who are trying to make ends meet by doing an honest days work rather than just give handouts to all and sundry.

I've no time for those who want to sit home and watch Jeremy Kyle every day. Community service after a year if you don't find a job or benefits cut.

It's about everyone pulling their weight. 

[muppet]

Immigration is to be welcomed if there is a need for the numbers. If there aren't enough jobs to go around there is little point in inviting more people in.
I don't blame immigrants for high unemployment although their presence and price point are driving factors in having a growing section of irish people out of work. That said, the irish themselves got a bit above their station during the "boom" and won't get out of bed for some menial jobs, which in turn supports demand from other countries.

What I am trying to say is that we should be mindful of getting our own citizens as close to full employment as possible. The knock on effect if we don't is more numbers on the dole and people who are working have to carry the can to support them. Wouldn't it be better if the welfare system would supplement a low income family who are trying to make ends meet by doing an honest days work rather than just give handouts to all and sundry.

I've no time for those who want to sit home and watch Jeremy Kyle every day. Community service after a year if you don't find a job or benefits cut.

It's about everyone pulling their weight.

You see this is a different issue entirely. Are immigrants taking locals jobs, or is the problem that are they just sitting idle on the welfare system?

The reality is that we had 'full employment'. Because of that, and the idiotic ideology of Bertie, McCreevy and Harney, we held recruitment fairs around the world looking for more workers to fuel our boom. This short term thinking was quite successful. The vast majority of these people came to work, not to join 'all and sundry' on welfare. Since the crash the number of immigrants has fallen 4 out of the last 5 years.

[lynchbhoy]

we still get immigrant workers in- there is a shortage in certain IT sectors so the companies have to apply for and usually get the visa's to bring in non EU people.
I know a good few, and some of these have ended up staying and are eligible after 6 or 7 years to become IRish citizens.
that's not something we can do in USA since they changes their eligibility laws unfortunately.
don't know about Australia or Canada.

anyhow we will prob need more workers to come in to fill the void in IT for example until the surge in stufents doing computer based courses graduate and gain experience and maturity in the workforce!

muppet- you'll love this
half watching tv3 this morning and they were showcasing (the morning breakfast show is really one long advert show with the news every 30 mins) some Irish tanning stuff.
the CEO or whatever she was , at great emphasis said that it was an Irish owned, Irish run and fully Irish staffed company.
I thought the emphasis on Irish staffed was actually quite wrong.
it might be but the way she said it , just didn't sit right.
imo

[muppet]

we still get immigrant workers in- there is a shortage in certain IT sectors so the companies have to apply for and usually get the visa's to bring in non EU people.
I know a good few, and some of these have ended up staying and are eligible after 6 or 7 years to become IRish citizens.
that's not something we can do in USA since they changes their eligibility laws unfortunately.
don't know about Australia or Canada.

anyhow we will prob need more workers to come in to fill the void in IT for example until the surge in stufents doing computer based courses graduate and gain experience and maturity in the workforce!

muppet- you'll love this
half watching tv3 this morning and they were showcasing (the morning breakfast show is really one long advert show with the news every 30 mins) some Irish tanning stuff.
the CEO or whatever she was , at great emphasis said that it was an Irish owned, Irish run and fully Irish staffed company.
I thought the emphasis on Irish staffed was actually quite wrong.
it might be but the way she said it , just didn't sit right.
imo

I have no problem with that at all. In this PC world she would need to be careful how she phrased it, but I have no problem with it personally.

My issue is with some far left/right groups who target immigrants and blame them for everything. This happens in many countries but thankfully we seem to be above that in Ireland.

[lynchbhoy]

I thought it was completely inappropriate!

maybe it was I was just over tired!

[J70]

I can remember about ten years ago Harney and the government saying we would need about 100,000 immigrants to fill the vacant jobs. So are these people supposed to just f**k off back where they came from after uprooting themselves to move to Ireland and build new lives because suddenly Irish people want those jobs back for themselves?

[muppet]

I can remember about ten years ago Harney and the government saying we would need about 100,000 immigrants to fill the vacant jobs. So are these people supposed to just f**k off back where they came from after uprooting themselves to move to Ireland and build new lives because suddenly Irish people want those jobs back for themselves?

http://irishecho.com/2011/02/business-briefs-ireland-needs-200000-workers-in-next-5-years-2/

Last weekend, while attending a jobs fair in South Africa, Tanaiste Mary Harney said she was considering allowing FAS, a government recruitment and training agency, as well as reputable private companies, to issue work permits directly.

Harney also said the State needs new labor to remain competitive, avoid a wage spiral and implement the National Development Plan. This would require an additional 200,000 workers by 2006, she said. FAS director general Roddy Molloy said there are now 40,000 vacancies in Ireland.