Where :New Zealand
When: Sept 9th - Oct 23rd
Ireland's Group
Australia
Ireland
Italy
Russia
USA
Pool Fixtures - Irish Time
Sept 11th Sunday 7am Ireland v USA RTE/BBC
Sept 17th Saturday 9:30am Australia v Ireland RTE/BBC
Sept 25th Sunday 6am Ireland v Russia RTE/BBC
Oct 2nd Sunday 8:30am Ireland v Italy RTE/BBC
________________________________________
First warm-up game this Saturday in Scotland. Ireland team to be announced today at lunch time. Going to be strange watch Ireland play rugby in August as they have games against Connacht, France x 2 and England.
Very low key build up which I like, think we might actually go well this year and a semi-final spot could be on the cards.
Anyone heading out?
I will be watching all the games on tv I think. As long as they are on at a reasonable time.
I hope this shite isn't polluting our TV sets during normal tv viewing hours...
Irelands games are on between 6 am for Russia and 9.30 for Australia. It doesn't bother me but will leave the ole ole pub going brigade a bit out in the cold.
Really excited about this, flying over the Tasman, landing in Auckland on 17th Sept, ticket sorted for the game that night. Might get another game in before heading back to aus, in NZ for 2 weeks, should be deadly craic!
If Ireland can beat Australia to avoid meeting the all blacks in the 2nd round they could get a run going, if they're beat in the first game I would be worried for them.
Personally can't see any of the northern hemisphere teams winning this, the speed at which the tri nations distribute the ball before the break down seems impossible to stop.
Quote from: lfdown2 on August 04, 2011, 12:18:55 PM
If Ireland can beat Australia to avoid meeting the all blacks in the 2nd round they could get a run going, if they're beat in the first game I would be worried for them.
We play SA if we come runners up in the group if we lose to Australia but Australia are beatable and win that and we'd have every chance of making the final. Conditions won't suit Oz as they do tend to struggle in the wet and wind whereas Ireland can mix it a bit more.
Is it on terrestrial TV?
Also, are the warm-up games over the next few weeks on TV?
That seems a tough enough group for Ireland?
Sat 17th – Ireland v Aus in RWC
Sun 18th – Celtic v Rangers in SPL
- Liverpool v Spurs in EPL
- Man U v Chelsea in EPL
- ?? v ?? in All Ireland Final
Make sure the wife and weans aren't about that weekend, could be a good weekends viewing !!
Quote from: Hardy on August 04, 2011, 12:40:30 PM
Is it on terrestrial TV?
Also, are the warm-up games over the next few weeks on TV?
All World Cup games on RTE. Warm-up games on BBC or RTE bar the England one which Sky have exclusive rights.
Quote from: Hoof Hearted on August 04, 2011, 12:42:02 PM
Sat 17th – Ireland v Aus in RWC
Sun 18th – Celtic v Rangers in SPL
- Liverpool v Chelsea in EPL
- Man U v Chelsea in EPL
- ?? v ?? in All Ireland Final
Make sure the wife and weans aren't about that weekend, could be a good weekends viewing !!
Very busy day for Chelsea?
Thanks, Dinny.
Think a quarter final defeat to the Boks looks likely.
Darcy and Ferris are struggling big-time.
SA have 21 players training in a secret game in Sa and have effectively thrown in the towel in the Tri-nations.
For me the Tri-Nations teams look better.
Quote from: AQMP on August 04, 2011, 12:46:15 PM
Quote from: Hoof Hearted on August 04, 2011, 12:42:02 PM
Sat 17th – Ireland v Aus in RWC
Sun 18th – Celtic v Rangers in SPL
- Liverpool v Chelsea in EPL
- Man U v Chelsea in EPL
- ?? v ?? in All Ireland Final
Make sure the wife and weans aren't about that weekend, could be a good weekends viewing !!
Very busy day for Chelsea?
:D :D
I think Spurs are taking their place in the Liverpool game
Quote from: Hoof Hearted on August 04, 2011, 01:23:12 PM
Quote from: AQMP on August 04, 2011, 12:46:15 PM
Quote from: Hoof Hearted on August 04, 2011, 12:42:02 PM
Sat 17th – Ireland v Aus in RWC
Sun 18th – Celtic v Rangers in SPL
- Liverpool v Chelsea in EPL
- Man U v Chelsea in EPL
- ?? v ?? in All Ireland Final
Make sure the wife and weans aren't about that weekend, could be a good weekends viewing !!
Very busy day for Chelsea?
:D :D
I think Spurs are taking their place in the Liverpool game
Easy win so.
Zin Zan Brook is in the same park as me doing a promotion for the Barge pub.
Australua and England will.be very good in four years time but at the moment are just flashing potential. IF we play well a big IF I think we will beat the Aussies and make the semis. I wouldn't mind a crack at Englanf.
Quote from: laoislad on August 04, 2011, 01:24:14 PM
Quote from: Hoof Hearted on August 04, 2011, 01:23:12 PM
Quote from: AQMP on August 04, 2011, 12:46:15 PM
Quote from: Hoof Hearted on August 04, 2011, 12:42:02 PM
Sat 17th – Ireland v Aus in RWC
Sun 18th – Celtic v Rangers in SPL
- Liverpool v Chelsea in EPL
- Man U v Chelsea in EPL
- ?? v ?? in All Ireland Final
Make sure the wife and weans aren't about that weekend, could be a good weekends viewing !!
Very busy day for Chelsea?
:D :D
I think Spurs are taking their place in the Liverpool game
Easy win so.
not that easy , they will get her tight for 70 mins or so, but should see the scousers off 2-1 by the whistle
It'll be the last hurrah for many of this Ireland team. I'd say there'll be a big turnover in players before the next Six Nations.
Possible team:
Kearney - think he'll get the nod if he shows some form, would prefer Murphy or Jones myself
Bowe
O'Driscoll
D'Arcy - presume it'll be Paddy Wallace if he's not fit, would prefer McFadden myself
Earls
Sexton
Reddan - O'Leary is a favourite of the management but Reddan has a better understanding with Sexton
Healy
Best - would prefer Flannery but might come too soon for him
Ross
O'Callaghan
O'Connell
Ferris - D Wallace if not fit
O'Brien
Heaslip
Ireland team to play Scotland at Murrayfield on Saturday 5 August at 2.15pm:
15. Rob Kearney
14. Andrew Trimble
13. Fergus McFadden
12. Paddy Wallace
11. Luke Fitzgerald
10. Jonathan Sexton
9. Tomás O'Leary
1. Tom Court
2. Sean Cronin
3. Tony Buckley
4. Donnacha Ryan
5. Leo Cullen (captain)
6. Mike McCarthy
7. Niall Ronan
8. Denis Leamy
Replacements:
16. Jerry Flannery
17. Marcus Horan
18. John Hayes
19. Mick O'Driscoll
20. Kevin McLaughlin
21. Isaac Boss
22. Felix Jones
That pack will get mullered, one of the weakest Irish packs I have ever seen and definitely the weakest backrow.
Quote from: Donnellys Hollow on August 04, 2011, 01:43:02 PM
It'll be the last hurrah for many of this Ireland team. I'd say there'll be a big turnover in players before the next Six Nations.
Possible team:
Kearney - think he'll get the nod if he shows some form, would prefer Murphy or Jones myself
Bowe
O'Driscoll
D'Arcy - presume it'll be Paddy Wallace if he's not fit, would prefer McFadden myself
Earls
Sexton
Reddan - O'Leary is a favourite of the management but Reddan has a better understanding with Sexton
Healy
Best - would prefer Flannery but might come too soon for him
Ross
O'Callaghan
O'Connell
Ferris - D Wallace if not fit
O'Brien
Heaslip
Would have Murray in for Reddan although the rumour mill has Murry missing out altogether. Also would have McFadden in for D'Arcy. Full back is really up for grabs and not sure about the back row mix, think we will need a groundhog against Oz but our nearest to that is Jennings and he just isn't good enough at International level.
Too soon for Murray I think. He is not included for the scotch game either.
Quote from: Capt Pat on August 04, 2011, 02:04:28 PM
Too soon for Murray I think. He is not included for the scotch game either.
Shouldn't be though, he was the form scrum-half in Ireland in 2011 and deserves to be there ahead of O'Leary, Boss and Stringer.
Is the Scotland game on RTE or Sky Sports?
BBC2 Heffo
Will be over in plenty of time to get yis out of the Pub into CrokePark
Quote from: Dinny Breen on August 04, 2011, 03:07:29 PM
BBC2 Heffo
Will be over in plenty of time to get yis out of the Pub into CrokePark
Cheers Dinny - am gonna live up to every stereotype, watch the match and hang on until I hear the national anthem and arrive tanked up!
Don't forget your 8 ball of Coke as well.
Quote from: Dinny Breen on August 04, 2011, 03:17:47 PM
Don't forget your 8 ball of Coke as well.
I'm in Premium as normal unfortunately so nowhere good to snort coke.
Quote from: heffo on August 04, 2011, 03:23:13 PM
Quote from: Dinny Breen on August 04, 2011, 03:17:47 PM
Don't forget your 8 ball of Coke as well.
I'm in Premium as normal unfortunately so nowhere good to snort coke.
What are you on about? You get it free in there.
Quote from: AZOffaly on August 04, 2011, 04:14:00 PM
Quote from: heffo on August 04, 2011, 03:23:13 PM
Quote from: Dinny Breen on August 04, 2011, 03:17:47 PM
Don't forget your 8 ball of Coke as well.
I'm in Premium as normal unfortunately so nowhere good to snort coke.
What are you on about? You get it free in there.
Maybe you culchie-people do AZ, but us hard working Dubs have to buy it off the street like everyone else.
To be honest we just bring up bags of flour and line the 'coke' up on the bonnet of the car.
@AZ
scurrilous accusation - Kildare fans are happy with Gin & Tonic although Coke would sell well down in the Curragh this week...
Quote from: heffo on August 04, 2011, 04:23:48 PM
Maybe you culchie-people do AZ, but us hard working Dubs have to buy it off the street like everyone else.
I thought there only was culchies or Dubs. Who are these "everyone else" folks?
Has Cardinal Brady approved the timings of the World Cup fixtures?
Quote from: Dinny Breen on August 04, 2011, 01:46:24 PM
Ireland team to play Scotland at Murrayfield on Saturday 5 August at 2.15pm:
15. Rob Kearney
14. Andrew Trimble
13. Fergus McFadden
12. Paddy Wallace
11. Luke Fitzgerald
10. Jonathan Sexton
9. Tomás O'Leary
1. Tom Court
2. Sean Cronin
3. Tony Buckley
4. Donnacha Ryan
5. Leo Cullen (captain)
6. Mike McCarthy
7. Niall Ronan
8. Denis Leamy
Replacements:
16. Jerry Flannery
17. Marcus Horan
18. John Hayes
19. Mick O'Driscoll
20. Kevin McLaughlin
21. Isaac Boss
22. Felix Jones
That team is basically players 16-30 on the plane to New Zealand. The seven players on the bench are the next seven in line for inclusion. Boss and Flans will also be in the squad, throw off McCarthy and Ronan.
QuoteWORLD CUP WARM-UP: ZINZAN BROOKE and Declan Kidney were in the same orbit yesterday and evidently reading from different scripts.
The former All Black number eight, possibly their best, feels Ireland need to beat Scotland this weekend as a matter of World Cup importance. Kidney rolled out a team full of promise and talent, but far from a hard-nosed fleet of front liners.
"Scotland on Sunday. That's very important," says Brooke. "It's crucial for you guys to win that game. Scotland will know that you need to deliver. That's the first marker.
"They key thing is to keep that momentum going. I don't think you need a vintage performance. Don't try too many risky things. Set-piece, run, pass, kick it. A boring game."
Different thinking indeed. The Kiwi, who now runs a bed and breakfast near Legoland in England, has never been one for dovetailing with convention.
Even his penchant for drop kicking was at odds with the All Black pure vision of rugby, as a piece in this week's New Zealand Herald explored. It compared the drop kick to "the unwanted drunken uncle at the family wedding".
The GAA-playing backrow dropped one of the most memorable goals ever seen in the 1995 World Cup two paces inside the England half. Time spent playing with Roskill Rangers in the Auckland GAA League and later St Brendan's in London allowed him kick off either foot throughout his 58 Tests for the All Blacks.
"It doesn't say in the rugby manual that backs are the only ones that kick a ball," says the 6ft 3in backrow. "I think we coach it out of kids now. They are not allowed to do it when they're doing tag and they're not allowed kick it in junior rugby. I just find that crazy."
The GAA connection arrived through his friend, Bernie McCahill, who brought him along to the Maorist club in Auckland and popped the question. "He said to me 'do you want to play Gaelic?' I said 'I never heard of it, what's that?' He said 'it's this Irish game.' I got hooked on it straight away. It was just the freedom. I could kick left and right. I played it the off-season. I never told the All Black selectors. I should never have been playing."
Three World Cups between 1987 and 1995 as well as an enduring status as a number eight with the running and kicking skills of a back-line player, Brooke is encouraging about Jamie Heaslip ("a magnificent athlete") but sees this year's World Cup falling the way of New Zealand. He believes Graham Henry has corrected past errors of analysis and selection policy.
"The two mistakes we did were we didn't analyse the pools and we stuck with the rotation. At the quarter-finals other teams were actually a lot more physical.
"We've got to stick with the nucleus of a team, 10, 11, 12, 13 players to hold the team through the pool rounds. I think they will play their World Cup final team against France. They'll need to."
You'd would wonder where Ireland will play their World Cup final team.
The tragic wash of the earthquake in Christchurch may also give New Zealand a freight of its own as it will when the USA plays Ireland on 9/11 in New Plymouth. Ireland, Brooke believes, can do well but when it comes to the scrum the great man falters in his flattery. "The question for me is the tight five," he says. "The tight five must set a platform. It's the frontrow you need to . . . they are going to be put to the test. Yeah, they'll be put to the test."
Aussies getting beat 17-0 by the all blacks after 25 minutes. Aussies look decent but not in the same class as the all blacks at this stage in their development. We dodged a bullet with the world cup draw. The all blacks would kill us 99 times out of 100. The Aussies are probably a 50 50 game for us.
probably beat us 100 times out of 100
Aus just scored great try there
Blatant knock-on for the Kiwi's 3rd try, every sport has crap officials.
Are NZ peaking too early I wonder.
Ireland v Oz is probably a 70/30 game in favour of Oz.
Quote from: Dinny Breen on August 06, 2011, 09:52:23 AM
Blatant knock-on for the Kiwi's 3rd try, every sport has crap officials.
Are NZ peaking too early I wonder.
Ireland v Oz is probably a 70/30 game in favour of Oz.
Its nearly the same for every World cup they look unbeatable for the previous 3+ years and then come the Finals they get beaten. Can't see it happening this time though.
Quote from: Dinny Breen on August 06, 2011, 09:52:23 AM
Blatant knock-on for the Kiwi's 3rd try, every sport has crap officials.
Are NZ peaking too early I wonder.
Ireland v Oz is probably a 70/30 game in favour of Oz.
agreed, would be 50-50 if it was up here, remember a crap england team beating them in 2007 in France
Quote from: Hoof Hearted on August 06, 2011, 10:05:38 AM
Quote from: Dinny Breen on August 06, 2011, 09:52:23 AM
Blatant knock-on for the Kiwi's 3rd try, every sport has crap officials.
Are NZ peaking too early I wonder.
Ireland v Oz is probably a 70/30 game in favour of Oz.
It won't be in Australia. We have a great chance.
agreed, would be 50-50 if it was up here, remember a crap england team beating them in 2007 in France
The scotch beat us 10-6 with a converted try with 2 minutes to go. I still found it entertaining even though the tries were hard to come by. It shouldn't have been a try but a free kick or penalty to Ireland for Crossing or obstruction on Paddy Wallace. McFadden also foolishly came inside leaving Ansbro alone on the wing to finish well to the delight of the well sauced Murrayfield crowd.
The Scottish pack dominated on the whole leaving the Irish backs little chance to shine. Thse Scottish backs will hardly score a try against England or Argentina but they might bore the opposition to death.
The scrum propped by Court and Buckley started ok but declined as the game went on leaving Leamy possibly Irelands best player to rescue things. There was no chance for the scrum halves to get the ball away at times.
Ronan at openside was mediocre at best. McCarthy at blind side was solid. Not much to say about the backs whose opportunities were limited except defence was good for 78 minutes. It was good to have Kearney back and he was good and solid at full back.
Quote from: Capt Pat on August 06, 2011, 07:18:18 PM
The scotch beat us 10-6 with a converted try with 2 minutes to go. I still found it entertaining even though the tries were hard to come by. It shouldn't have been a try but a free kick or penalty to Ireland for Crossing or obstruction on Paddy Wallace. McFadden also foolishly came inside leaving Ansbro alone on the wing to finish well to the delight of the well sauced Murrayfield crowd.
The Scottish pack dominated on the whole leaving the Irish backs little chance to shine. Thse Scottish backs will hardly score a try against England or Argentina but they might bore the opposition to death.
The scrum propped by Court and Buckley started ok but declined as the game went on leaving Leamy possibly Irelands best player to rescue things. There was no chance for the scrum halves to get the ball away at times.
Ronan at openside was mediocre at best. McCarthy at blind side was solid. Not much to say about the backs whose opportunities were limited except defence was good for 78 minutes. It was good to have Kearney back and he was good and solid at full back.
im a very positive person. and usually see the bright side of things, but that match was f**king BRUTAL !!
Oi brutal but it was O'Byrne Cup stuff as expected we got beaten up front and it was only through Scotland's ineptitude that we managed to stay in touch. Positive in the sense that Kearney and Flannery got some game time.
Next week against France should be similar ilk.
Lads any of ye that have bought tickets for this, have ye gotten them yet?
Got a letter during the week said I should have received my tickets by now, no sign.
only caught bits of that borefest and every tme scotland had the ball they passed the ball forward at some point. Ref only pulled them up on it a couple of times.
Ireland did it a couple of times too but nowhere near as much.
forward passes and offside are not always blown for in rugby and this frequent transgression of the rules drives me nuts.
What is the actual rule about the forward pass? Does the ball have to move in a forward direction from the point of release for it to be a forward pas? Or can it move forward and not be a forward pass if the recipient is behind the passer at the moment of release?
I heard a new interpretation on Saturday from the Scottish commentator or summariser - can't remember which. He said the ball can "drift" forward and not be a forward pass if the hands move backwards when passing. That doesn't make sense to me.
Quote from: Hardy on August 08, 2011, 11:46:05 AM
What is the actual rule about the forward pass? Does the ball have to move in a forward direction from the point of release for it to be a forward pas? Or can it move forward and not be a forward pass if the recipient is behind the passer at the moment of release?
I heard a new interpretation on Saturday from the Scottish commentator or summariser - can't remember which. He said the ball can "drift" forward and not be a forward pass if the hands move backwards when passing. That doesn't make sense to me.
this rugby commentator jargon is whats confusing people.
a forward pass is a forward pass.
The rule (from memory) was that if it was even 'level' it was a foul.
the ball has to move backwards.
if it 'drifts' forward - its still a foul.
Your wrong Lynchbhoy ;D
Still to GAA rules.
The ball can drift forward as long as it's not passed forward.
If you think of the law of physics, quite often a player moving forward passes the ball to a player also moving at pace, and it may appear forward but in actual fact the ball has been passed straight and just because it travels forward doesn't mean it is a forward pass, it is how it was passed.
It's just the momentum of the player that makes it drift forward, no harm in that but it really depends on how the ref interprets it.
Diiny, what about a pass that goes backwards, is missed, and bounces forwards. Is that classed as a forward pass, a knock on, or a live ball?
Also, what do you mean it can 'drift forward if it's not passed forward'? Surely a pass that ends up ahead of the passer is a forward pass? What's a drift (Wind or something?)
Also, you know if a player fumbles the ball forward but manages to catch it before it hits the ground. Then it isn't a knock in.
I think players should try pretending to fumble it forward over lads heads and run all the way up the pitch doing this, shouting "whoaoaoa!" and "ooopps". Refs would have to give the try. Coaches should be teaching kids this in schools
Actually you could be on to something there turk. If Earls was running at a defender say, and just threw the ball over his head and ran around and caught it, is that legal? If the lad tackled him, would he be 'tackling without the balll?'
Only if Earls shouted "whoooops" and made a fumbling gesture when doing it. We are on to something here
Quote from: Dinny Breen on August 08, 2011, 01:02:59 PM
Your wrong Lynchbhoy ;D
Still to GAA rules.
The ball can drift forward as long as it's not passed forward.
If you think of the law of physics, quite often a player moving forward passes the ball to a player also moving at pace, and it may appear forward but in actual fact the ball has been passed straight and just because it travels forward doesn't mean it is a forward pass, it is how it was passed.
when was that rule changed?
along with the 4 points for a try to 5 ?
I can tell you now that this was drummed into us at u10 and a 'level' pass was a 'forward' pass then !
it wasnt yer mickey mouse leinster coaching either - this was in the 'real' rugby heartland !!
now I think I know what you mean by a pass drifting forward, eg a ball thats obv thrwon backwards but caught by the wind, but the laws of physics and gravity dont allow the ball to be up for durations very often that would allow this kind of thing to happen.
only in 'hurricane' type weather !
Quote from: lynchbhoy on August 08, 2011, 02:59:27 PM
Quote from: Dinny Breen on August 08, 2011, 01:02:59 PM
Your wrong Lynchbhoy ;D
Still to GAA rules.
The ball can drift forward as long as it's not passed forward.
If you think of the law of physics, quite often a player moving forward passes the ball to a player also moving at pace, and it may appear forward but in actual fact the ball has been passed straight and just because it travels forward doesn't mean it is a forward pass, it is how it was passed.
when was that rule changed?
along with the 4 points for a try to 5 ?
I can tell you now that this was drummed into us at u10 and a 'level' pass was a 'forward' pass then !
it wasnt yer mickey mouse leinster coaching either - this was in the 'real' rugby heartland !!
now I think I know what you mean by a pass drifting forward, eg a ball thats obv thrwon backwards but caught by the wind, but the laws of physics and gravity dont allow the ball to be up for durations very often that would allow this kind of thing to happen.
only in 'hurricane' type weather !
Wha? They don't teach passing down here at all. Munster training is focussed on various ways of sticking the ball up your jumper, with a few drills in passion and singing Stand Up and Fight.
Quotewhen was that rule changed?
Do they not change the rules every feckin year in that 'sport'? :P
Dinny will be along shortly to tell you they are not rules, they are laws.
Quote from: AZOffaly on August 08, 2011, 03:20:55 PM
Dinny will be along shortly to tell you they are not rules, they are laws.
Well they are 8)
The rule of thumb is the direction of your hands in the pass.
You can fumble and as long as the ref is happy you are in control no knock on will be given. You can't pass the ball forward to yourself, you will see the Quade Coopers of the world passing the ball backwards to themselves, it will fix a defender and a good skill to learn at pace.
This explains the forward pass phenomenon fairly well.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RgMlDy2jP9s (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RgMlDy2jP9s)
Quote from: GalwayBayBoy on August 08, 2011, 04:05:26 PM
This explains the forward pass phenomenon fairly well.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RgMlDy2jP9s (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RgMlDy2jP9s)
Yes - that explains it perfectly. Nearly all passes will go forward when the passer is moving at pace (resultant direction from passer's forward motion and ball's backward motion). Dinny was spot on, as was the Scottish commentator. I beg his pardon. At 4:55 on that video it says almost exactly what he did.
QuoteRugby – team news: While Declan Kidney is not due to name his side until tomorrow lunchtime, France coach Marc Lievremont revealed his hand this afternoon with Biarritz number eight Raphael Lakafia, the only uncapped player in the squad, ready to make his debut in Bordeaux on Saturday.
The 22-year-old was today named in Lievremont's starting line-up for Les Bleus' first World Cup warm-up game. He will feature alongside France captain Thierry Dusautoir and club skipper Imanol Harinordoquy in the backrow.
"We wanted to integrate Raphael Lakafia," Lievremont said. "He will be well surrounded by Thierry Dusautoir, Imanol Harinordoquy and Dimitri Yachvili. We want to have consistency and have two good matches by lining up two homogenous groups. It is a mixture of youth and experience in all areas."
Vincent Clerc has been named on the wing despite nursing a knee injury, with prop Fabien Barcella named 23rd man notwithstanding an elbow problem.
Lievremont's side will face Ireland at home this weekend and then at the Aviva Stadium
on August 20th before kicking off their World Cup campaign against Japan in North Shore City on September 10th.
France: Traille; Clerc, Marty, Mermoz, Palisson; Trinh-Duc, Yachvili; Marconnet, Szarzewski, Ducalcon, Pierre, Millo-Chluski, Dusautoir (capt), Harinordoquy, Lakafia. Replacements: Guirado, Poux, Nallet, Bonnaire, Parra, Skrela, Medard. 23rd man: Barcella.
That's a handy looking French side.
Quote from: Dinny Breen on August 10, 2011, 06:00:48 PM
QuoteRugby – team news: While Declan Kidney is not due to name his side until tomorrow lunchtime, France coach Marc Lievremont revealed his hand this afternoon with Biarritz number eight Raphael Lakafia, the only uncapped player in the squad, ready to make his debut in Bordeaux on Saturday.
The 22-year-old was today named in Lievremont’s starting line-up for Les Bleus’ first World Cup warm-up game. He will feature alongside France captain Thierry Dusautoir and club skipper Imanol Harinordoquy in the backrow.
“We wanted to integrate Raphael Lakafia,” Lievremont said. “He will be well surrounded by Thierry Dusautoir, Imanol Harinordoquy and Dimitri Yachvili. We want to have consistency and have two good matches by lining up two homogenous groups. It is a mixture of youth and experience in all areas.”
Vincent Clerc has been named on the wing despite nursing a knee injury, with prop Fabien Barcella named 23rd man notwithstanding an elbow problem.
Lievremont’s side will face Ireland at home this weekend and then at the Aviva Stadium
on August 20th before kicking off their World Cup campaign against Japan in North Shore City on September 10th.
France: Traille; Clerc, Marty, Mermoz, Palisson; Trinh-Duc, Yachvili; Marconnet, Szarzewski, Ducalcon, Pierre, Millo-Chluski, Dusautoir (capt), Harinordoquy, Lakafia. Replacements: Guirado, Poux, Nallet, Bonnaire, Parra, Skrela, Medard. 23rd man: Barcella.
That's a handy looking French side.
Hopefully it'll be a handy looking Irish team that's announced tomorrow
Quote from: Dinny Breen on August 10, 2011, 06:00:48 PM
QuoteRugby – team news: While Declan Kidney is not due to name his side until tomorrow lunchtime, France coach Marc Lievremont revealed his hand this afternoon with Biarritz number eight Raphael Lakafia, the only uncapped player in the squad, ready to make his debut in Bordeaux on Saturday.
The 22-year-old was today named in Lievremont's starting line-up for Les Bleus' first World Cup warm-up game. He will feature alongside France captain Thierry Dusautoir and club skipper Imanol Harinordoquy in the backrow.
"We wanted to integrate Raphael Lakafia," Lievremont said. "He will be well surrounded by Thierry Dusautoir, Imanol Harinordoquy and Dimitri Yachvili. We want to have consistency and have two good matches by lining up two homogenous groups. It is a mixture of youth and experience in all areas."
Vincent Clerc has been named on the wing despite nursing a knee injury, with prop Fabien Barcella named 23rd man notwithstanding an elbow problem.
Lievremont's side will face Ireland at home this weekend and then at the Aviva Stadium
on August 20th before kicking off their World Cup campaign against Japan in North Shore City on September 10th.
France: Traille; Clerc, Marty, Mermoz, Palisson; Trinh-Duc, Yachvili; Marconnet, Szarzewski, Ducalcon, Pierre, Millo-Chluski, Dusautoir (capt), Harinordoquy, Lakafia. Replacements: Guirado, Poux, Nallet, Bonnaire, Parra, Skrela, Medard. 23rd man: Barcella.
That's a handy looking French side.
so is the bench !
Ireland team to play France:
The Ireland team to play France this Saturday in Bordeaux shows a total of nine changes to the starting team from the side that played Scotland last weekend.
The back three remains unchanged with Rob Kearney, Andrew Trimble and Luke Fitzgerald all named in the side. Paddy Wallace starts in the centre, with Keith Earls getting his first taste of action this season at outside centre. Ronan O'Gara and Eoin Reddan start the game as the halfback combination.
In the forwards, one of the nine changes to the team is a positional switch, with Donnacha Ryan moving from the second row to the blindside and Donncha O'Callaghan coming in to partner Leo Cullen, who will again captain the team.
The other change to the back row is Sean O'Brien, who starts his first game of the August programme. There is an entirely new front row, with Cian Healy, Rory Best and Mike Ross coming into the side.
In the replacements, Paul O'Connell and Jamie Heaslip are named in their first match 22 of the season, with the uncapped former Ireland U20 scrumhalf Conor Murray being named in a match squad for the first time.
Ireland Team & Replacements (v France, Chaban-Delmas, Bordeaux, Saturday, August 13th, kick-off 8.45pm local):
15 - Rob Kearney (UCD/ Leinster)
14 - Andrew Trimble (Ballymena/Ulster)
13 - Keith Earls (Thomond/Munster)
12 - Paddy Wallace (Ballymena/ Ulster)
11 - Luke Fitzgerald (Blackrock College/ Leinster)
10 - Ronan O'Gara (Cork Constitution/Munster)
9 - Eoin Reddan (Lansdowne/Leinster)
1 - Cian Healy (Clontarf/Leinster)
2 - Rory Best (Banbridge/Ulster)
3 - Mike Ross (Clontarf/Leinster)
4 - Donncha O'Callaghan (Cork Constitution/Munster)
5 - Leo Cullen (Blackrock College/Leinster) Captain
6 - Donnacha Ryan (Shannon/Munster)
7 - Sean O'Brien (Clontarf/Leinster)
8 - Denis Leamy (Cork Constitution/Munster)
Replacements:
16 - Jerry Flannery (Shannon/ Munster)
17 - Tony Buckley (Sale Sharks)
18 - Paul O'Connell (Young Munster/Munster)
19 - Jamie Heaslip (Naas/Leinster)
20 - Conor Murray (Garryowen/ Munster)
21 - Fergus McFadden (Old Belvedere/Leinster)
22 - Felix Jones (Shannon/ Munster)
I hope they have a look at Conor Murray in the second half on saturday. He is after all ahead of Stringer and O'Lesry at Munster.
Quote from: Capt Pat on August 11, 2011, 02:07:46 PM
I hope they have a look at Conor Murray in the second half on saturday. He is after all ahead of Stringer and O'Lesry at Munster.
And he's better than Reddan.
Quote from: Hardy on August 08, 2011, 04:09:40 PM
Quote from: GalwayBayBoy on August 08, 2011, 04:05:26 PM
This explains the forward pass phenomenon fairly well.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RgMlDy2jP9s (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RgMlDy2jP9s)
Yes - that explains it perfectly. Nearly all passes will go forward when the passer is moving at pace (resultant direction from passer's forward motion and ball's backward motion). Dinny was spot on, as was the Scottish commentator. I beg his pardon. At 4:55 on that video it says almost exactly what he did.
This doesn't take into account the rotation of the earth and whether the pitch is aligned east/west or north/south.
I now have more sympathy for the rugby refs and their incomprehensible decisions.
QuoteI now have more sympathy for the rugby refs and their incomprehensible decisions.
I don't; the game is like Dungeons & Dragons for the incoherent!
Is the game on TV??
RTE 2
I watched the Aussies and the Boks last night. Boks were all over them but the Aussie defence was very good then hit the home team with a good counterattack try which basically won the game.
We'll have to try and neutralise O'Connor and the fullback if we are to beat them.
Looks like no-one can touch the 'Blacks though.
Ireland Team & Replacements (v France, Aviva Stadium, Dublin, Saturday, August 20th, kick-off 5pm):
15 - Felix Jones (Shannon/ Munster)
14 - Andrew Trimble (Ballymena/Ulster)
13 - Brian O'Driscoll (UCD/Leinster) Captain
12 - Gordon D'Arcy (Lansdowne/Leinster)
11 - Keith Earls (Thomond/Munster)
10 - Jonathan Sexton (St.Mary's College/Leinster)
9 - Tomas O'Leary (Dolphin/Munster)
1 - Cian Healy (Clontarf/Leinster)
2 - Rory Best (Banbridge/Ulster)
3 - Mike Ross (Clontarf/Leinster)
4 - Donncha O'Callaghan (Cork Constitution/Munster)
5 - Paul O'Connell (Young Munster/Munster)
6 - Sean O'Brien (Clontarf/Leinster)
7 - David Wallace (Garryowen/Munster)
8 - Jamie Heaslip (Naas/Leinster)
Replacements:
16 - Jerry Flannery (Shannon/ Munster)
17 - Tom Court (Malone/Ulster)
18 - Mike McCarthy (Buccaneers/Connacht)
19 - Stephen Ferris (Dungannon/Ulster)
20 - Eoin Reddan (Lansdowne/Leinster)
21 - Ronan O'Gara (Cork Constitution/Munster)
22 - Luke Fitzgerald (Blackrock College/ Leinster)
http://examiner.ie/breakingnews/sport/kidney-makes-10-changes-for-return-france-tie-516860.html#ixzz1VIaR06fm (http://examiner.ie/breakingnews/sport/kidney-makes-10-changes-for-return-france-tie-516860.html#ixzz1VIaR06fm)
Ireland Select XV Team & Replacements (v Connacht, Donnybrook Stadium, Dublin, Thursday, August 18th, kick-off 6.30pm):
15 - Geordan Murphy (Leicester)
14 - Johne Murphy (Munster)
13 - Darren Cave (Belfast Harlequins/Ulster)
12 - Ian Keatley (Munster)
11 - Fergus McFadden (Old Belvedere/Leinster)
10 - Paddy Wallace (Ballymena/Ulster)
9 - Isaac Boss (Terenure College/Leinster)
1 - Tony Buckley (Sale)
2 - Sean Cronin (Leinster)
3 - John Hayes (Bruff/Munster)
4 - Mick O'Driscoll (Cork Constitution/Munster)
5 - Leo Cullen (Blackrock College/Leinster)
6 - Kevin McLaughlin (St.Mary's College/Leinster)
7 - Shane Jennings (St.Mary's College/Leinster)
8 - Denis Leamy (Cork Constitution/Leinster)
Replacements:
16 - Damien Varley (Garryowen/Munster)
17 - Marcus Horan (Shannon/Munster)
18 - Donnacha Ryan (Shannon/Munster)
19 - Niall Ronan (Shannon/Munster)
20 - Conor Murray (Garryowen/Munster)
21 - Denis Hurley (Cork Constitution/Munster)
22 - Ian Whitten (Ballymena/Ulster)
McCarthy looks like he might make it.
Sadly Murray won't.
What's up with Bommy Towe?
What is the purpose of the Connacht game?
Quote from: ludermor on August 17, 2011, 04:14:02 PM
What is the purpose of the Connacht game?
It was in Robbie Keane's dream.
Quote from: muppet on August 17, 2011, 04:08:15 PM
McCarthy looks like he might make it.
Sadly Murray won't.
What's up with Bommy Towe?
Murray has a chance still, Stringer is been cut.
McCarthy is interesting, looks like between him and Donnacha Ryan
Bowe is injured, he'll travel though.
Good to see that Ross is fit. If he gets injured Ireland might as well forget about travelling to the World Cup.
Disappointing that Murray doesn't get a start against the French but O'Leary has always been a favourite of Kidney. Maybe they're planning on giving Boss and Murray a half each against Connacht and then calling one of them up for the England match?
Glad Ferris is named on the bench for Saturday I had heard a few rumours he might not make it. O'Brien, Heaslip and Ferris is a serious back row and one to match any Nation. My problems for us would be Hooker, Loosehead, inside centre and FB.
We're strong in all other areas I feel. I'm not getting carried away but if the heads are right we will cause a lot of teams huge hassle and I'm looking forward to the WC.
Would like to see G Murphy gt some decent game time as well as Keith Earls at inside centre but I don't think Kidney will go that way and in fairness who am I to argue with him about it. e hve the makings of a team that can cause problems though that is for sure!
I think the squad is announced on monday. I can't see Jones making the squad I prefer Murphy as the spare full back but he seems to have been forgotten.
Quote from: Dinny Breen on August 17, 2011, 04:26:47 PM
Quote from: muppet on August 17, 2011, 04:08:15 PM
McCarthy looks like he might make it.
Sadly Murray won't.
What's up with Bommy Towe?
Murray has a chance still, Stringer is been cut.
McCarthy is interesting, looks like between him and Donnacha Ryan
Bowe is injured, he'll travel though.
apart from FB , that selection to play France looks very much like the first choice Irish team for the WC
what dya reckon?
wouldnt be mine and I doubt if it would be yours.
Quote from: screenexile on August 18, 2011, 12:49:37 AM
Glad Ferris is named on the bench for Saturday I had heard a few rumours he might not make it. O'Brien, Heaslip and Ferris is a serious back row and one to match any Nation. My problems for us would be Hooker, Loosehead, inside centre and FB.
We're strong in all other areas I feel. I'm not getting carried away but if the heads are right we will cause a lot of teams huge hassle and I'm looking forward to the WC.
Would like to see G Murphy gt some decent game time as well as Keith Earls at inside centre but I don't think Kidney will go that way and in fairness who am I to argue with him about it. e hve the makings of a team that can cause problems though that is for sure!
Gotta tell you fella. If we play that back row we're fucked against the likes of Pocock and McCaw. Wallace is one of the most Important players we have at the moment and MUST play for us to stand a chance of success. O'Brien is not a 7 I'd want going toe to toe with either of those two at the breakdown. To be honest neither is Wallace but he's the best we have in terms of a semi- traditional 7.
Lynvhbhoy- don't forget Bowe as well. When healthy he'll be in there
Quote from: mc_grens on August 18, 2011, 09:33:51 AM
Lynvhbhoy- don't forget Bowe as well. When healthy he'll be in there
'when healthy' !!
I did say the team listed isnt the one i'd pick.
Quote from: lynchbhoy on August 18, 2011, 10:08:35 AM
Quote from: mc_grens on August 18, 2011, 09:33:51 AM
Lynvhbhoy- don't forget Bowe as well. When healthy he'll be in there
'when healthy' !!
I did say the team listed isnt the one i'd pick.
Not quite my team either but it's bloody close. I'm not a big fan of O'Leary's decision making disorder, but I hate that Redden takes 2/3 steps before passing EVERY time. I also understand that Conor Murray is a HUGE gamble. Thank God it's not my decision. I like Jones as backup at 15, I think that opposite Bowe I'd go with Earls as I think he offers more in attack than Trimble.
Quote from: lynchbhoy on August 18, 2011, 09:16:25 AM
Quote from: Dinny Breen on August 17, 2011, 04:26:47 PM
Quote from: muppet on August 17, 2011, 04:08:15 PM
McCarthy looks like he might make it.
Sadly Murray won't.
What's up with Bommy Towe?
Murray has a chance still, Stringer is been cut.
McCarthy is interesting, looks like between him and Donnacha Ryan
Bowe is injured, he'll travel though.
apart from FB , that selection to play France looks very much like the first choice Irish team for the WC
what dya reckon?
wouldnt be mine and I doubt if it would be yours.
Not a chance, I wouldn't have Best, O'Callaghan, O'Leary, D'Arcy, Trimble or Jones starting.
Although Jones is interesting, had the misfortune to play against him and it was like tackling air, my retirement was pretty imminent after that, I am a big fan but like experience at full-back, Kearney is too one dimensional in his attacking so I'd actually plump for G Murphy, I think we'd need his creativity and his defensive frailties are usually exaggerated around provincial bias.
I'd have Murray in for O'Leary, simply the form scrum half and his selection would be positive for squad morale, likewise I'd drop D'Arcy, no form at all and have been advocating O'Driscoll to finish out his career at 12 for the last 2 years.
Ferris has to start if fit, simply our best back-row forward. Where you fit him in is why Kidney gets the big bucks.
Likewise Tommy Bowe has been Ireland's best back over the last 3 seasons, nailed on starter if fit.
But it's good to have options and I think we will go well in this World Cup my only fear is if Flannery doesn't stay fit as Rory Best's line-out throwing seems to be getting worse.
For me in the back row I would go with Ferris O Brien and Heaslip. They are the 3 best players we have on the team not just in the back row. O Brien not a classic 7? No but he has great ball carrying and his tackling can be really strong as well, he can knock people back and that is a big deal. Without a 7 we might need to modify our tactics a bit to compensate. Wallace was never a classic 7 and is past his best. We need to play our best team and play to our strengths.
I like O Leary at scrum half if he is back to his best form of 09. If not then why break up the Leinster partnership of Reddan and Sexton. Murray should be the third scrum half they bring.
What about O Driscoll and Trimble playing the centre positions? I think this is a good option. Bowe and Earls on the wing with Kearney at full back.
I think Best willl sort out his timing with his jumpers in time for the tournament and he helps with the scrumaging. Who would you pick instead of O Callaghan for me he is certain to start. The rest of the pack picks itself with O Connell Healy and Ross.
Quote from: Dinny Breen on August 18, 2011, 10:44:32 AM
Not a chance, I wouldn't have Best, O'Callaghan, O'Leary, D'Arcy, Trimble or Jones starting.
Although Jones is interesting, had the misfortune to play against him and it was like tackling air, my retirement was pretty imminent after that, I am a big fan but like experience at full-back, Kearney is too one dimensional in his attacking so I'd actually plump for G Murphy, I think we'd need his creativity and his defensive frailties are usually exaggerated around provincial bias.
I'd have Murray in for O'Leary, simply the form scrum half and his selection would be positive for squad morale, likewise I'd drop D'Arcy, no form at all and have been advocating O'Driscoll to finish out his career at 12 for the last 2 years.
Ferris has to start if fit, simply our best back-row forward. Where you fit him in is why Kidney gets the big bucks.
Likewise Tommy Bowe has been Ireland's best back over the last 3 seasons, nailed on starter if fit.
But it's good to have options and I think we will go well in this World Cup my only fear is if Flannery doesn't stay fit as Rory Best's line-out throwing seems to be getting worse.
I'd disagree with you a bit about best - though imo we are not great at hooker and its much of a muchness.
Dont know enough about Jones. Like the bit I have seen of him. Dont think he could be parachuted in at FB yet though.
Murphy I had championed years ago when ignored by Ireland and when he was starring for the best club team in Europe at the time, but hasnt been the same since that bad inj (leg break?). Good attacking brain, decent defender, not in form and not as quick as he once was. Good alternative to Kearney who is the new Girvan Dempsey !!
SH between Reddan and Murray for me. Though Reddan has let me down since he has left wasps.
While I think Trimble has somehting to offer, I agree with the rest.
Quote from: Capt Pat on August 18, 2011, 11:19:25 AM
For me in the back row I would go with Ferris O Brien and Heaslip. They are the 3 best players we have on the team not just in the back row. O Brien not a classic 7? No but he has great ball carrying and his tackling can be really strong as well, he can knock people back and that is a big deal. Without a 7 we might need to modify our tactics a bit to compensate. Wallace was never a classic 7 and is past his best. We need to play our best team and play to our strengths.
You're right about Wallace, but he's the closest thing we have to a 7- the most important position on the pitch. O'Brien would carry no ball if
A) we didn't have it
B) he was at the bottom of a ruck digging it out with a 7 on his back.
Wallace must play- the starting back row will be Ferris, Wallace, Heaslip. I agree on Darcy. Can never quite make my mind up on O'Callaghan, mainly because O'Connell seems more comfortable beside him.
Doesn't the same argument apply to both Jones and Murray? I'd love both to be selected, but I just can't see it. I like Best at 1 simply because the Best, Healy, Ross front row seems the most solid unit we've had there in a long time. Which reminds me... Mushy Buckley must NOT travel!
Any word of the other groups?
Thank God Freeview has ITV4 so I can see the likes of Canada or Japan! ;D
I think Ireland need to focus on their own strengths and not what Oz can do, make it a war of attrition up front, Wallace, Ferris, Heaslip and O'Brien are all dynamic ball carriers, the Australian midfield isn't great and if we minimize the number of rucks Pocock who isn't in great form will have less influence. Wallace by the way is no more a natural 7 than O'Brien.
Ireland have the game to beat Australia and we don't fear them.
Need to beat France and England though or forget about it.
Quote from: Dinny Breen on August 18, 2011, 12:34:06 PM
I think Ireland need to focus on their own strengths and not what Oz can do, make it a war of attrition up front, Wallace, Ferris, Heaslip and O'Brien are all dynamic ball carriers, the Australian midfield isn't great and if we minimize the number of rucks Pocock who isn't in great form will have less influence. Wallace by the way is no more a natural 7 than O'Brien.
Ireland have the game to beat Australia and we don't fear them.
Need to beat France and England though or forget about it.
I agree with you 99% Dinny, I just would rather see Wally in at 7, he's not a natural traditional 7, but better a man that's been doing a good job there for province and country for years, than a newly converted 6.
QuoteWallace by the way is no more a natural 7 than O'Brien.
This is a most valid point. Rewind to 4 years ago and people were telling you Ireland have no chance against McCaw without playing a groundhog openside.
Nothing has changed in Wallace's game since then to make him a more valid option for that role now.
Personally I like the thought of three bruising ball carriers targetting weak midfields. If it works just once a game it'll make up for losing a few rucks.
Quote from: mc_grens on August 18, 2011, 12:39:10 PM
Quote from: Dinny Breen on August 18, 2011, 12:34:06 PM
I think Ireland need to focus on their own strengths and not what Oz can do, make it a war of attrition up front, Wallace, Ferris, Heaslip and O'Brien are all dynamic ball carriers, the Australian midfield isn't great and if we minimize the number of rucks Pocock who isn't in great form will have less influence. Wallace by the way is no more a natural 7 than O'Brien.
Ireland have the game to beat Australia and we don't fear them.
Need to beat France and England though or forget about it.
I agree with you 99% Dinny, I just would rather see Wally in at 7, he's not a natural traditional 7, but better a man that's been doing a good job there for province and country for years, than a newly converted 6.
If Wallace was starting in the morning I wouldn't be bothered, been a fan for years but age is not on his side but as you state his experience could be vital.
I don't think Trimble has good enough hands to play in the centre at international level.
I think O'Driscoll with McFadden outside him would represent our best chance of success but looking at the teams for the weekend he's probably behind D'Arcy, Wallace and Earls as a potential centre. If McFadden does travel it will probably be instead of Fitzgerald as a back up winger.
If Ferris, O Brien and Heaslip start Ireland wont have a prayer against Oz imo. Its all well and good being dynamic ball carriers but what is the point of you cant get the ball. Would love to see Ferris being the impact sub coming on with 30 to go.
Someone else mentioned playing Earls at 12. He simply doesnt have the ball skills to play this position and isnt big enough to be a crash ball centre either. I await the backlash but i think the guy is a bit overrated. He has been tried in just about every back position other than half backs and hasnt been brilliant at any. Given Trimbles current form i would think it would be very harsh to drop him for earls and Bowe, if fit has to play.
1 month before the world cup a coach like kidney is not going to start trying Drico at inside centre so people would need to get that out of their head as well. 12 is going to be between Wallace and Darcy and I personally would pick Wallace.
O'Driscoll has played plenty of rugby at inside centre for Ireland and Leinster over the past few years. He always wears the 13 shirt for merchandising purposes.
Are u saying that Darcy or wallace have played at outside centre?
D'Arcy has often played as an outside centre. Himself and O'Driscoll have regularly switch positions during games.
Personally don't think Paddy Wallace is robust enough for international rugby. He gets blown away too regularly in the physical exchanges and he doesn't have enough attacking threat to compensate. If he wasn't able to cover at 10 and at full-back (in an emergency) I doubt he would have got half the chances he has been given down the years.
I have seen to many Leinster games in person but ive been to croker and Aviva quite a bit and fail to recall seeing drico at inside centre for the majority of the game. He may have done it for a certain phase of play or at a certain set piece move but other than that i cant recall it. Or maybe i have missed it completly.
I have to laugh at this myth created by southern media "experts" like George Hook and Neil f**king Francis who criticise Paddy Wallace defending. If you watch him against France last wk or more importantly when Ireland went down under a few years ago he wasnt exposed defensively at all. I happen to think Drico plays better beside him for Ireland than Darc. Only my opinion though and I know im in the minority
A minority of one I say, I actually like Wallace as a player but his defence is too passive and he his line speed is too slow, look how many times he slips a tackle through poor foot placement. He simply played more for Ireland because of his defence, he was messed around too much in his early career.
BOD is 32 years of age, he could play 12 no problem and not just the occasional cameo.
Best v Flannery - Best hasn't played well in a while but on form is worth his place. Flann is plagued by injury problems but when fit can be very influential. Verdict - I think Best will start.
O'Callaghan v the Rest - Disappointed Kidney hasn't a young lock on the way through but the only serious challenger is Leo Cullen who is older, has less international experience, doesn't have the tried and trusted partnership with O'Connell and didn't win a World Cup with Kidney - Verdict - there is no way Kidney will change his mind here.
Backrow - Kidney will start O'Brien, Heaslip & Wallace as 6, 8 & 7. If Ferris is fit and those 3 keep their respective form enough to keep him on the bench, we will have had some WC imho.
SH - Murray should go and might pip Boss depending on the three games. O'Leary will start unless he can't throw the ball out of his way against France. Mind boggling from Kidney really.
Wings - Bowe if fit and Earls. Trimble has done well and will get game time.
Centre - Kidney really should have developed an alternative other than Wallace (another Kidney World Cup winner) but he hasn't. I seriously doubt he will go with McFadden unfortunately. D'Arcy to start with Wallace as back up.
FB - Earls played here against England in our best 6N performance but they never really tested him, Jones is getting a chance but will Kidney really go for something new here? Luke blew it in the 6N and I would love to see Murphy travel. But Kearney will start.
16 forwards will be starters Healy, Best, Ross, POC, DOC, SOB, Jamie, Wally with Court, Flannery, Cullen, Ferris absolute certs if fit. That leaves four probably Buckley(!), Cronin, Leamy and Ryan/McCarthy.
14 backs will be 3 scrum halves, ROG, JS, starting back four of Earls, D'Arcy, BOD & Bowe, leaving 5 which will include Trimble, Wallace, McFadden and 2 from Luke, Jones and Geordan.
We've learned a right bit from that pish today. D'arcy, O'Leary, Earls, Jones and Jennings should not be near our starting team.
A lot of poor performances today and as I suspected the tactic of trying to maul instead of creating a ruck won't work against the stronger teams. Surprisingly our scrum and lineout functioned well but we got creamed physically.
There's a lot to work on for the WC but I'm not completely down hearted Kearney, Bowe, Ferris and Flannery will strengthen the team. I am at a loss about who will play 12 though... Is Fitzgerald an option at all?? That's our biggest weakness!!
These games don't count for anything. Build up confidence my arse. Go out and play at 100% and win today by 30 points and the same against England next week would only make us over confident and set us up for a fall. The only bad thing to come out of today was a bad injury to Felix Jones.
Quote from: screenexile on August 20, 2011, 06:33:38 PMI am at a loss about who will play 12 though... Is Fitzgerald an option at all?? That's our biggest weakness!!
Maybe we saw the answer in the last 15 mins - O'Gara at 10, Sexton at 12.
Quote from: Hardy on August 20, 2011, 07:50:46 PM
Quote from: screenexile on August 20, 2011, 06:33:38 PMI am at a loss about who will play 12 though... Is Fitzgerald an option at all?? That's our biggest weakness!!
Maybe we saw the answer in the last 15 mins - O'Gara at 10, Sexton at 12.
It looked to work well alright, but I think that the both of them play better when they know the other is waiting in the wings to come on. McFadden seems the best option considering D'arcy is so off form, although I don't expect him to travel.
Quote from: Hardy on August 20, 2011, 07:50:46 PM
Quote from: screenexile on August 20, 2011, 06:33:38 PMI am at a loss about who will play 12 though... Is Fitzgerald an option at all?? That's our biggest weakness!!
Maybe we saw the answer in the last 15 mins - O'Gara at 10, Sexton at 12.
Maybe's the right word, but a bit late to start trying it out in the last 15 competitive minutes before selection.
I think the reason Darcy and Ferris played and the reason we have all these warm up matches is so Darcy and Ferris etc can play their way back in to form. That is what warm up games are for.
Quote from: BarryBreensBandage on August 20, 2011, 08:07:24 PM
Quote from: Hardy on August 20, 2011, 07:50:46 PM
Quote from: screenexile on August 20, 2011, 06:33:38 PMI am at a loss about who will play 12 though... Is Fitzgerald an option at all?? That's our biggest weakness!!
Maybe we saw the answer in the last 15 mins - O'Gara at 10, Sexton at 12.
It looked to work well alright, but I think that the both of them play better when they know the other is waiting in the wings to come on. McFadden seems the best option considering D'arcy is so off form, although I don't expect him to travel.
Sorry CP I totally disagree with that. These games are about building momentum and a style of play when we get to NZ.
We have no form and are now relying on a one off performance against Oz to beat them rather than good form!!
first time I've ever agreed with Screen on anything. Its amazing how the Irish rugby fan will never criticise full time professionals for making the basic errors but will quite happily slate amateur gaelic footballers for doing the same. I think its hilarious.
Quote from: INDIANA on August 20, 2011, 08:54:13 PM
first time I've ever agreed with Screen on anything. Its amazing how the Irish rugby fan will never criticise full time professionals for making the basic errors but will quite happily slate amateur gaelic footballers for doing the same. I think its hilarious.
You obviously haven't been on any of the rugby forums. Some of the players are being crucified.
A month of this shite soon. Feck, I'd rather watch the X Factor!!
Quote from: BennyCake on August 21, 2011, 01:21:08 AM
A month of this shite soon. Feck, I'd rather watch the X Factor!!
Is rather watch this than feckin Armagh try to play football! There are 200 other channels I'm sure you can find something else to watch while the Rugbys on!
Quote from: BennyCake on August 21, 2011, 01:21:08 AM
A month of this shite soon. Feck, I'd rather watch the X Factor!!
the D4 press will go mad for it. Cover to cover. we wont be able to escape it.
Thankfully the matches will be on that early that if your not a band wagon jumper or a crowd follower you will miss them. a blessing in my opinion.
How much of the world actually take part in this WORLD CUP
Quote from: snoopdog on August 21, 2011, 11:49:38 AM
Quote from: BennyCake on August 21, 2011, 01:21:08 AM
A month of this shite soon. Feck, I'd rather watch the X Factor!!
the D4 press will go mad for it. Cover to cover. we wont be able to escape it.
Thankfully the matches will be on that early that if your not a band wagon jumper or a crowd follower you will miss them. a blessing in my opinion.
How much of the world actually take part in this WORLD CUP
When does the GAA World Cup start?
Very poor yesterday from a lot of fronts, Earls was brutal, does he ever look outside him, every ball is carried inside and never off loaded,continuously losing the ball in the tackle. johnny should have taken the head off him for the garryowen f**k up
O'leary was brutal again, his passing is terrible, he's making ROG look like a better player than johnny cause ROG gets reddan.
Darcy is living off two years ago, his tackling is non existence.
Ferris looked hungry when he came on, savage in the ruck
Quote from: snoopdog on August 21, 2011, 11:49:38 AM
Quote from: BennyCake on August 21, 2011, 01:21:08 AM
A month of this shite soon. Feck, I'd rather watch the X Factor!!
the D4 press will go mad for it. Cover to cover. we wont be able to escape it.
Thankfully the matches will be on that early that if your not a band wagon jumper or a crowd follower you will miss them. a blessing in my opinion.
How much of the world actually take part in this WORLD CUP
That is interesting with the games on at between 6' and 9 o clock in the morning.
I wonder what will happen to the ole ole bandwagoner pub going brigade. They might be made very quiet and small in number by the early hours.
Quote from: Capt Pat on August 21, 2011, 02:26:27 PM
Quote from: snoopdog on August 21, 2011, 11:49:38 AM
Quote from: BennyCake on August 21, 2011, 01:21:08 AM
A month of this shite soon. Feck, I'd rather watch the X Factor!!
the D4 press will go mad for it. Cover to cover. we wont be able to escape it.
Thankfully the matches will be on that early that if your not a band wagon jumper or a crowd follower you will miss them. a blessing in my opinion.
How much of the world actually take part in this WORLD CUP
That is interesting with the games on at between 6' and 9 o clock in the morning.
I wonder what will happen to the ole ole bandwagoner pub going brigade. They might be made very quiet and small in number by the early hours.
There'll be a special dispensation granted to bars to open in the morning of the games as the meeja believe its only fair that Fiacra and his buddies can get a heino in as they soak up the atmosphere of this unique occasion.
Did Thomond Park not get a dispensation to serve drink on good friday a while back?
A chap on planet rugbys forum says O Leary and Fitzgerald are out. McFadden and Murray are in the squad. Geordan Murphy is going instead of Jones.
Tue Captain Yeah seems that:
Jennings not going.
Fitz not going
TOL not going
Buckley, Hayes and Horan not going.
Murray in. Murphy in. Mc Fadden in.
Has to be devastating for any of the above to be left out. Feel sorry for Felix Jones. Looks like he was going.
Hayes and Buckley both not going??
Gerry Thornly has name this as his squad, he's the IRFU mouth piece so expect this to be it
Forwards: Rory Best, Jerry Flannery, Seán Cronin, Cian Healy, Mike Ross, Tom Court, Tony Buckley, Paul O'Connell, Donncha O'Callaghan, Leo Cullen, Donncha Ryan, Seán O'Brien, Jamie Heaslip, David Wallace, Denis Leamy, Stephen Ferris. Backs: Tomás O'Leary, Eoin Reddan, Isaac Boss, Jonathan Sexton, Ronan O'Gara, Gordon D'Arcy, Brian O'Driscoll, Paddy Wallace, Keith Earls, Tommy Bowe, Andrew Trimble, Luke Fitzgerald, Rob Kearney, Geordan Murphy.
unless divine inspiration Ireland are going to vie for 5th place (ok the draw should make getting tothe semi finals very possible).
but imo we are streets behind the tri nations crew and france, and battling with wales (who punch above their weight) and England (who are in disarray right now) for the fifth place.
not sure how Ireland slipped down , then again not sure how England nosedived so much (yes I do actually- martin johnson).
Disappointed that a couple of has beens are in that squad - if Dinny is right.
Irelands only hope is that some of the teams above cannot take the pressure (eg France and NZ) and usually crack in the latter stages of the WC.
How o'leary could go after saturday would defy belief.
Quote from: lynchbhoy on August 22, 2011, 09:59:13 AM
Irelands only hope is that some of the teams above cannot take the pressure (eg France and NZ) and usually crack in the latter stages of the WC.
That's my take too - I've laid NZ at 1.65. Mad odds to win outright before a ball is kicked or an eye gouged.
Kidney annoucing squad at 1pm
http://www.rte.ie/sport/livestreaming/rugby.html
O'Leary was absolutely appalling on Saturday, wonder if taking Murray instead of him is too much of a gamble though. He has played what? - about 20-30 International Rugby...
Fitzgerald is another boyo not playing great stuff but it would be harsh to leave him at home. Although if it was Gerodan Murphy going in his stead, well then he is bringing plenty of experience to the table if a little short on game time
Murray instead of O'Leary
Buckley travels as does Murphy
Fitzgerald out
Feel bad for Felix Jones. Every time he starts to look good he gets injured.
Quote from: CorkMan on August 22, 2011, 01:19:24 PM
Feel bad for Felix Jones. Every time he starts to look good he gets injured.
Munster to get a good start in the Magners league so?
Nobody can call deccie conservative after that!!
McFadden/Fitz was a very marginal call, delighted that Murray and Boss are in and O'Leary is out.
On the negative side if healy or ross get injured we may just go home, court is an average club player and the less than can be said about buckley the better!!
O'Leary played his way out of the squad on saturday and imo Earls may have played his way out of the team. O'Gara to start ahead of Sexton for me as well.
It will be interesting to see who plays against USA in the first game. That may be the likes of Earls' last chance to claim a starting place. I'd imagine it'll be pretty much the 'test' team for that game, given the fact that Oz are next.
Quote from: CorkMan on August 22, 2011, 01:19:24 PM
Feel bad for Felix Jones. Every time he starts to look good he gets injured.
Jones wasnt good on Saturday anyway. I'd say Murphy would have got the nod. If something happens Kearney, Murphy and not Jones would be the man you'd want v Australia or South Africa.
Delighted that Kidney was brave enough to leave O'Leary behind and bring Murray.
Also happy to see McFadden in. Fitzgerald had his best spell in a long time in the last quarter v France at the weekend. Too late it seems, though I still would have brought him and left Wallace behind.
I also would have brought Jennings instead of Leamy. We lots of cover at 6 and 8, so Leamy is just not going to be required. Jennings would have been a much better option to have.
I'm generally happy with that squad. Dropping O'Leary is long overdue - apart from one match against South Africa last year, he has delivered little more than mistakes in an Ireland shirt.
I'd go along with Hound that I don't see the benefit in Leamy over Jennings, and given the choice between Fizgerald and Earls, I'd always plump for the former; Earls is worth nothing against a proper international side. Paddy Wallace isn't really suitable as out-half cover either. But by and large, well done Deccie.
Quote from: Hound on August 22, 2011, 01:37:08 PM
Quote from: CorkMan on August 22, 2011, 01:19:24 PM
Feel bad for Felix Jones. Every time he starts to look good he gets injured.
Jones wasnt good on Saturday anyway. I'd say Murphy would have got the nod. If something happens Kearney, Murphy and not Jones would be the man you'd want v Australia or South Africa.
Delighted that Kidney was brave enough to leave O'Leary behind and bring Murray.
Also happy to see McFadden in. Fitzgerald had his best spell in a long time in the last quarter v France at the weekend. Too late it seems, though I still would have brought him and left Wallace behind.
I also would have brought Jennings instead of Leamy. We lots of cover at 6 and 8, so Leamy is just not going to be required. Jennings would have been a much better option to have.
Just spun the ould DeLorean up to 88 mph and took a trip into the future. Saw myself on my knees in front of the flatscreen, punching the ground and in tears, shouting at the ceiling...
"Mushy f**king Buckley!"
Quote from: Hound on August 22, 2011, 01:37:08 PM
Quote from: CorkMan on August 22, 2011, 01:19:24 PM
Feel bad for Felix Jones. Every time he starts to look good he gets injured.
Jones wasnt good on Saturday anyway. I'd say Murphy would have got the nod. If something happens Kearney, Murphy and not Jones would be the man you'd want v Australia or South Africa.
Delighted that Kidney was brave enough to leave O'Leary behind and bring Murray.
Also happy to see McFadden in. Fitzgerald had his best spell in a long time in the last quarter v France at the weekend. Too late it seems, though I still would have brought him and left Wallace behind.
I also would have brought Jennings instead of Leamy. We lots of cover at 6 and 8, so Leamy is just not going to be required. Jennings would have been a much better option to have.
I don't think so. Jennings was nowhere to be seen on Saturday and I doubt he would have been going anyway but that made Kidney's mind up.
As for Murphy well apparently he was told last week he wasn't going so I think Deccie's hand was forced on that particular inclusion.
Aside from that I'm very glad to see O'Leary not going. He's pish! Murray will hopefully get a match or 2 but I would imagine he's very much 3rd choice at this stage. It's as strong as we have available going but I am worried as every one of our lines has question marks over it: 2, 4, 7, 9, 12, 14 and 15 could go a few different ways . . .
Good luck Deccie!!
Come on engerland !! ;)
Quote from: lynchbhoy on August 22, 2011, 02:59:45 PM
Come on engerland !! ;)
Typical contrary Dungiven man.
In fairness I think Kidney has made the right decisions, don't rate Jennings period and whilst Leamy isn't my cup of tea either he is a better international player than Leamy, I would have taken Dominic Ryan for the experience if it was up to me.
O'Leary, Trimble and Fitzgerald got their chances and only Trimble showed any form. The inclusion of Buckley highlights the lack of quality props in this country.
We needed to win last Saturday and as it stands we are only going to make up the numbers.
Agree with Hardy and Lynchbhoy on NZ, too short a price, Oz are the value bet and will only meet the quality SH opposition in the final. They won't be far off it.
O Leary was overtaken in Munster by Murray so Kidney had to go the same way in his squad.
By club it is 13 Leinster 9 Munster 5 Ulster 1* Sale OSpreys and Saracens. By state of origin it is 13 Munster 10 Leinster 5 Ulster 1 kiwi and 1 Aussie.
By county 7 Limerick 4 Cork 3 Dublin 2 Tipperary 3 Kildare 1 *Wicklow Carlow Louth Wexford Monaghan Antrim Down Derry Armagh
Quote from: snoopdog on August 21, 2011, 11:49:38 AM
Quote from: BennyCake on August 21, 2011, 01:21:08 AM
A month of this shite soon. Feck, I'd rather watch the X Factor!!
the D4 press will go mad for it. Cover to cover. we wont be able to escape it.
Thankfully the matches will be on that early that if your not a band wagon jumper or a crowd follower you will miss them. a blessing in my opinion.
How much of the world actually take part in this WORLD CUP
Sooner they are knocked out and it's all over the better.
Quote from: Capt Pat on August 22, 2011, 03:19:12 PM
O Leary was overtaken in Munster by Murray so Kidney had to go the same way in his squad.
By club it is 13 Leinster 9 Munster 5 Ulster 1* Sale OSpreys and Saracens. By state of origin it is 13 Munster 10 Leinster 5 Ulster 1 kiwi and 1 Aussie.
By county 7 Limerick 4 Cork 4 Dublin 2 Tipperary 2 Kildare 1 *Wicklow Carlow Louth Wexford Monaghan
3?
Murphy, Heaslip & McFadden
Quote from: Donnellys Hollow on August 22, 2011, 03:37:26 PM
Quote from: Capt Pat on August 22, 2011, 03:19:12 PM
O Leary was overtaken in Munster by Murray so Kidney had to go the same way in his squad.
By club it is 13 Leinster 9 Munster 5 Ulster 1* Sale OSpreys and Saracens. By state of origin it is 13 Munster 10 Leinster 5 Ulster 1 kiwi and 1 Aussie.
By county 7 Limerick 4 Cork 4 Dublin 2 Tipperary 2 Kildare 1 *Wicklow Carlow Louth Wexford Monaghan
3?
Murphy, Heaslip & McFadden
And
1* Derry (Trimble), Armagh (Best), Down (Wallace), Antrim (Ferris).
anyone know if there any spare tickets for Saturdays match with England ?
Quote from: whitegoodman on August 22, 2011, 01:32:54 PM
imo Earls may have played his way out of the team. O'Gara to start ahead of Sexton for me as well.
Don't know how you can say earls played himself on the team, he was brutal on Saturday, one dimensional and constantly taking the ball into conact and losing it, very easy to counter IMO
Sexton has been hampered by having to play with TOL while ROG has been getting ball from Reddan, no comparison
Quote from: Mayo4Sam on August 22, 2011, 07:18:18 PM
Quote from: whitegoodman on August 22, 2011, 01:32:54 PM
imo Earls may have played his way out of the team. O'Gara to start ahead of Sexton for me as well.
Don't know how you can say earls played himself on the team, he was brutal on Saturday, one dimensional and constantly taking the ball into conact and losing it, very easy to counter IMO
Sexton has been hampered by having to play with TOL while ROG has been getting ball from Reddan, no comparison
Have another wee read at what i said!!
My bad
Thank God TOL isn't going. Sexton at 12 with O'Gara at outhalf is something which should be tried out at some stage of the England match imo.
Quote from: screenexile on August 22, 2011, 02:47:27 PM
Quote from: Hound on August 22, 2011, 01:37:08 PM
Quote from: CorkMan on August 22, 2011, 01:19:24 PM
Feel bad for Felix Jones. Every time he starts to look good he gets injured.
Jones wasnt good on Saturday anyway. I'd say Murphy would have got the nod. If something happens Kearney, Murphy and not Jones would be the man you'd want v Australia or South Africa.
Delighted that Kidney was brave enough to leave O'Leary behind and bring Murray.
Also happy to see McFadden in. Fitzgerald had his best spell in a long time in the last quarter v France at the weekend. Too late it seems, though I still would have brought him and left Wallace behind.
I also would have brought Jennings instead of Leamy. We lots of cover at 6 and 8, so Leamy is just not going to be required. Jennings would have been a much better option to have.
I don't think so. Jennings was nowhere to be seen on Saturday and I doubt he would have been going anyway but that made Kidney's mind up.
As for Murphy well apparently he was told last week he wasn't going so I think Deccie's hand was forced on that particular inclusion.
Aside from that I'm very glad to see O'Leary not going. He's pish! Murray will hopefully get a match or 2 but I would imagine he's very much 3rd choice at this stage. It's as strong as we have available going but I am worried as every one of our lines has question marks over it: 2, 4, 7, 9, 12, 14 and 15 could go a few different ways . . .
Good luck Deccie!!
you could No 10 to that list as well but I'd plump for Sexton starting with ROG there as backup for later on
On the plus side O'Connell looks to have shed a few of those unnecessary pounds and was a bit more agile looking.
Quote from: Hound on August 22, 2011, 01:37:08 PM
Quote from: CorkMan on August 22, 2011, 01:19:24 PM
Feel bad for Felix Jones. Every time he starts to look good he gets injured.
Jones wasnt good on Saturday anyway. I'd say Murphy would have got the nod. If something happens Kearney, Murphy and not Jones would be the man you'd want v Australia or South Africa.
Delighted that Kidney was brave enough to leave O'Leary behind and bring Murray.
Also happy to see McFadden in. Fitzgerald had his best spell in a long time in the last quarter v France at the weekend. Too late it seems, though I still would have brought him and left Wallace behind.
I also would have brought Jennings instead of Leamy. We lots of cover at 6 and 8, so Leamy is just not going to be required. Jennings would have been a much better option to have.
Since I got the squad right beforehand ;D. I can announce Jones was on the plane before the injury. Murphy wouldnt have gone.
I'm gutted for Jones but glad for murphy if thats possible.
It is a great pity that O Leary and especially Fitzgerald haven't been able to deliver on their undoubted abilities. I thought Fitzgerald was going to be the next O Driscoll. However over the past year or so due to injuries and lack of form both of these players have fallen so far in their games it is hard to beleive. So Kidney had to take some lesser lights on the trip. McFadden is more talented than Boss and is a jack of all trades and he provides cover for Gordon Darcy at inside center which helps his case.
Also I think if you're going on form D'Arcy shouldn't be near it . . . had to be said!
Quote from: screenexile on August 23, 2011, 12:50:20 AM
Also I think if you're going on form D'Arcy shouldn't be near it . . . had to be said!
Totally agree but who do you play in the Centre, Paddy Wallace?
McFadden I'd like to see in some sort of combination with BOD, Earls maybe but he flatters to deceive. Our midfield despite O'Driscolls greatness will be our downfall...
Sexton played outside ROG for about 20 mins on Saturday, could be worth a shot.
Quote from: Dinny Breen on August 23, 2011, 11:00:58 AM
Quote from: screenexile on August 23, 2011, 12:50:20 AM
Also I think if you're going on form D'Arcy shouldn't be near it . . . had to be said!
Totally agree but who do you play in the Centre, Paddy Wallace?
McFadden I'd like to see in some sort of combination with BOD, Earls maybe but he flatters to deceive. Our midfield despite O'Driscolls greatness will be our downfall...
Sexton played outside ROG for about 20 mins on Saturday, could be worth a shot.
earls is kidneys pet and would never be dropped off the squad. Hasnt played well in a long time.
Darcy has been rubbish for 2 years.
BOD is not the player he was, still a supreme finisher but not as defensively good as prev.
I'd like to see Sexton outside O'Gara.
Wales tried it with Hook outside Jones- didnt always work but at times it had potential.
Sexton a great all rounder and imo could do the job.
What about the state of England Dinny. Loads of talent but in a mess. I'm sorry to say.
What was it left to 15 mins on saturday to test playing johnny at 12?
Surely he needs to start that way on saturday if it's to be a runner for the WC, England have tried it too with JW at 12
Anyone here going to NZ?
Quote from: lynchbhoy on August 23, 2011, 11:13:34 AM
Quote from: Dinny Breen on August 23, 2011, 11:00:58 AM
Quote from: screenexile on August 23, 2011, 12:50:20 AM
Also I think if you're going on form D'Arcy shouldn't be near it . . . had to be said!
Totally agree but who do you play in the Centre, Paddy Wallace?
McFadden I'd like to see in some sort of combination with BOD, Earls maybe but he flatters to deceive. Our midfield despite O'Driscolls greatness will be our downfall...
Sexton played outside ROG for about 20 mins on Saturday, could be worth a shot.
earls is kidneys pet and would never be dropped off the squad. Hasnt played well in a long time.
Darcy has been rubbish for 2 years.
BOD is not the player he was, still a supreme finisher but not as defensively good as prev.
I'd like to see Sexton outside O'Gara.
Wales tried it with Hook outside Jones- didnt always work but at times it had potential.
Sexton a great all rounder and imo could do the job.
What about the state of England Dinny. Loads of talent but in a mess. I'm sorry to say.
England are playing Cup rugby, forget about what you see in the warm-ups, Johnson wants England playing a certain way, it's all about percentages and minimizing turn-overs and mistakes. When the pressure comes on England will be ok, their game plan is limited but effective and risk free, they'll be in the semi-finals and would be hard to bet against.
England and Australia at this stage are promising but are 4 years short of their peak. That could be the final in four years time but this time around they could struggle. They won't be able to match up with New Zealand and that is before taking into account that New Zealand are playing at home. Australia have a punchers chance and England will bring their usual effective world cup game plan and might make progress but won't win, both these teams may even have problems winning their groups. England will face big tough packs in Argentina and Scotland that they won't be able to grind into the ground and run up big scores against, with a bit of luck going against them they could lose one or both of these games. Richie Gray is a phenomenon and could beat England on his own.........well maybe not. Ireland will have a great chance against the Aussies because of the way the game will be played, it should be a great game. It is New Zealands to win. France are to New Zealnd what they are to us a team that we both have difficulties with but I don't see New Zealand capitulating this time. We might have a good tourney and get to the semis or even final but we won't beat New Zealand
That pretty much leaves South Africa to spoil the party for the hosts, they are a bit of an unknown quantity beacause they threw in the towel in the tri nations this year to get ready for the world cup. They are the only real challengers to New Zealand i think. New Zealnad are sure to win this tournament especially with the refs favouring home sides and favourites as they do.
Player to watch: Israle Dagg New Zealand
If Dan Carter gets injured NZ will win diddly squat and even with him I have my doubts, an awful lot of pressure on them.
Darcy is living off form from 5 years ago, i havnt seen him make a line brake in a long time, his passing is average and he is falling off tackles these days. Fair enough Wallace doesnt make line brakes but is an awful lot better passer and kicker than Darcy and imo is as good as tackler as Darcy ( remember France in 6 nations this year ) no matter what the southern media would say.
I have seen some front rowers be better passers than Keith Earls. Not sure if i read it here or somewhere else but he is the Ireland rugby equivalent of Theo Walcott, all speed and no brains. For me he is an outside back or nowhere.
I would therefore go for Wallace or McFadden but think that Kidney is going to pick either Darcy or Wallace as he would have played McFadden at 12 in one of the warmup games if he had any inkling of playing him there at the world cup.
Unfortunately D'Arcy's dancing feet are a thing of the past. A mixture of getting older and injuries have robbed him of that bit of zip. He's pretty much a straightforward banger these days which is pretty easy to defend. That combined with the fact that BOD has also lost a yard of pace means the Irish midfield which was a real strength for so long is now looking rather ordinary going forward although still fairly solid defensively. Maybe the management should have experimented with BOD at 12 and Bowe at 13 in the past year or so but they never did. Can't see them trying it at this late stage.
Quote from: Dinny Breen on August 23, 2011, 11:22:45 AM
England are playing Cup rugby, forget about what you see in the warm-ups, Johnson wants England playing a certain way, it's all about percentages and minimizing turn-overs and mistakes. When the pressure comes on England will be ok, their game plan is limited but effective and risk free, they'll be in the semi-finals and would be hard to bet against.
yep, but yu cant go from zero to 100mph straight away.
The scrum and wilkinson are not a problem, its the continuity, cohesion and back play they are going to be very rusty on. they could make Ireland look good on sat.
I always thought dan carter was over hyped. I could be wrong, but his whole international career he has been a big game bottler. missing pressure kicks like no decent outhalf in Ireland, Wales or England would.
NZ have the squad to win the WC, but they are like england in soccer imo - crumble when put to the test under slight pressure.
the wc will be heavily influenced by the interpretation of the rules by northern and southern hemisphere refs.
Quote from: Capt Pat on August 22, 2011, 03:19:12 PM
O Leary was overtaken in Munster by Murray so Kidney had to go the same way in his squad.
By club it is 13 Leinster 9 Munster 5 Ulster 1* Sale OSpreys and Saracens. By state of origin it is 13 Munster 10 Leinster 5 Ulster 1 kiwi and 1 Aussie.
By county 7 Limerick 4 Cork 3 Dublin 2 Tipperary 3 Kildare 1 *Wicklow Carlow Louth Wexford Monaghan Antrim Down Derry Armagh
Only three Dubs in the entire squad and only one from the southside.
v England Aviva Saturday 27th Aug k/o 2.30pm
15. G Murphy.
14. T. Bowe.
13. K Earls.
12. G D'Arcy.
11. A. Trimble.
10. R. O'Gara.
9. E. Reddan.
1. C. Healy.
2. J. Flannery.
3. M. Ross.
4. D. O'Callaghan.
5. P. O'Connell.
6. S. Ferris.
7. D. Wallace.
8. J. Heaslip.
Subs: Best, Court, Ryan, Leamy, Murray, Sexton, McFadden.
close enough to the probable starting team - then again with kidney these says who knows.
I would never wish inj on any player, but I have to admit I did think reading the team that it wouldnt be the worst thing in the world for one particular individual to have a reoccurrance of he prev woes.
Saw the english side - again closer to their best starting XV - only think that they are being very experimental with their second row.
however johnson says that he is testing out the centre partnership - but the fcuker will only unbalance the side with his crazy selections.
will be interesting to see saturdays game. I had to turn down a ticket for this yesterday.
Quote from: lynchbhoy on August 25, 2011, 03:17:24 PM
close enough to the probable starting team - then again with kidney these says who knows.
I would never wish inj on any player, but I have to admit I did think reading the team that it wouldnt be the worst thing in the world for one particular individual to have a reoccurrance of he prev woes.
Saw the english side - again closer to their best starting XV - only think that they are being very experimental with their second row.
however johnson says that he is testing out the centre partnership - but the fcuker will only unbalance the side with hi
Darcy?
Are O Driscoll and O Brien out of the opening game.
Odriscoll and Obrien are being rested as they picked up minor inj
Any streams for the match today?
Quote from: Hardy on August 27, 2011, 12:41:00 PM
Any streams for the match today?
Here (http://www.watching-paint-dry.com).
:D Laoislad!
If Brian Kennedy ever comes out to sing Ireland's call again... there'll be serious trouble
Earls doesn't look like a center on the basis of that defending... 7 - nil to that other crowd
Poor showing by the Irish today.
Very deflating performance. Need a miracle that Wallace is not badly injured.
I'd be more worried about the tri nations this morning :o
Abysmal... No punch in the middle, couldn't get over the gain line - O'Gara turned down too many shots at goal
Watched the Oz/NZ game today and I'm afraid the conclusion is that we will be going down there to make up the numbers, maybe I'll be proved wrong but doubt it somehow. On the broader picture sure it wouldn't be the world cup without the Kiwis getting a dose of the wobbles, never fails. Smallest seeds of doubt starting to creep in for them which is wonderful from where I sit anyway. Pressure, Pressure, Pressure
The game not being on Rte or BBC I trotted over to Landsdowne road to pick up a free ticket. A cringeworthy game sloppy from Ireland and just hoping nobody gets injured. Unfortunately Dave Wallace looks to be out. Hopefully Healy and Heaslip will be fit for the opening game. Another very disjointed effort from Ireland but nothing to worry about as these are only practice matches. I have been to more competitive games with 50 people at them.
The silver lining to Wallaces injury is that it means Sean O Brien will start at 7 and give Ireland a dynamic ball carrying presence. Ferris also compleyed the game in one piece, hopefully he can make it through the next month as well.
W don't have a proper number 7 but we still have some exceptional back row players to compensate. At 12 Darcy is comin back from a surgery and will play his way into form.
the hopeful thing im clinging to, is that they have been running like horses for the month of august and havent had a ball in their hands, a bit like January in the Gaelic.
If im wrong, well.................... ::)
wallace is out. a disaster
Riduculous the talk of o brien at 7 because he isnt one.
Pocock will have a field day.
Quote from: INDIANA on August 27, 2011, 06:17:54 PM
wallace is out. a disaster
Riduculous the talk of o brien at 7 because he isnt one.
Pocock will have a field day.
Totally agree but he will be played there. Wallace is some loss. For a country with few genuine world class players I think he was one of them..
To quote Pvt Frasier in Dad's Army "We're dooooomed"
Making up the numbers in NZ at this rate.
Quote from: Capt Pat on August 27, 2011, 05:45:27 PM
The game not being on Rte or BBC I trotted over to Landsdowne road to pick up a free ticket. A cringeworthy game sloppy from Ireland and just hoping nobody gets injured. Unfortunately Dave Wallace looks to be out. Hopefully Healy and Heaslip will be fit for the opening game. Another very disjointed effort from Ireland but nothing to worry about as these are only practice matches. I have been to more competitive games with 50 people at them.
The silver lining to Wallaces injury is that it means Sean O Brien will start at 7 and give Ireland a dynamic ball carrying presence. Ferris also compleyed the game in one piece, hopefully he can make it through the next month as well.
W don't have a proper number 7 but we still have some exceptional back row players to compensate. At 12 Darcy is comin back from a surgery and will play his way into form.
We must be waiting 5 years for darcy to get over injury as that was the last time he was on form, he offers nothing at this stage, no kick, no pass, no line break.
As for the boy outside him if that had of been o gara or p Wallace that missed that tackle people would have shouting from the roof tops for them never to play again.
Quote from: Shamrock Shore on August 27, 2011, 06:24:42 PM
To quote Pvt Frasier in Dad's Army "We're dooooomed"
Making up the numbers in NZ at this rate.
Agree totally I'm not all that close to the action but I think we tend to fall into the trap that if certain players get mentioned often enough in the media it nearly becomes an article of faith that they are international or world class players. Well we have a few lads that we seem to be bigging up that, sorry, would not get near a Kiwi panel and, perhaps a Bok or Aussie one either. Few names that spring to mind-Earls, Sexton, Reddan. Few more lads that, thanks for the memories, are slightly gone past their best and that will be found out down under-Darcy, O'Gara, O'Callaghan and, yes folks, O'Driscoll. Great lads one and all but father time waits for no one. We won't get near the Aussies and it will be a last game dogfight to get out of the group with Italy. Another QF exit beckons I think.
I love the way that certain Irish players are "world class"!!! Let's face it, a fully fit Irish team would have no chance against the Aussies and will never get into the semi finals of the world cup! They will be doing well now to beat the italians down there! They have lost 4 games in a row and confidence must be absolutely rock bottom!!!! People should cop themselves on when discussing the Irish teams chances in the world cup cos they never had any chance even with a fully fit team! Maybe these defeats will force fans to take a more reallistic line when discussing their chances!
Quote from: cicfada on August 27, 2011, 06:42:16 PM
I love the way that certain Irish players are "world class"!!! Let's face it, a fully fit Irish team would have no chance against the Aussies and will never get into the semi finals of the world cup! They will be doing well now to beat the italians down there! They have lost 4 games in a row and confidence must be absolutely rock bottom!!!! People should cop themselves on when discussing the Irish teams chances in the world cup cos they never had any chance even with a fully fit team! Maybe these defeats will force fans to take a more reallistic line when discussing their chances!
Wallace is world class.
The only Irish players who are or have been world class have been POC, BOD and Wallace.
At a push Heaslip But thats it.
BOD maybe yes about 2 years ago but who exactly outside of ireland and more specifically Munster would describe wallace or OConnell as world class? Would they have been described as world class south of the equator I wonder?? Self praise is no praise!!What other team in the world would have as many passengers as earls, Darcy, O Callaghan for example? Time to get real folks!
Quote from: cicfada on August 27, 2011, 06:59:13 PM
BOD maybe yes about 2 years ago but who exactly outside of ireland and more specifically Munster would describe wallace or OConnell as world class? Would they have been described as world class south of the equator I wonder?? Self praise is no praise!!What other team in the world would have as many passengers as earls, Darcy, O Callaghan for example? Time to get real folks!
wallace has always been regarded as world class south of the equator. One of the few that is. A natural born power athlete. Something which as rare as hens teeth in this neck of the world. Could have played NFL.
Desperately sad for David Wallacwe. No world cup and possibly his last game in a green shirt. Was probably Ireland's best player in the first 20 minutes as well.
Brian O'Driscoll will get found out and a full strength Irish side wouldnt have a chance against the Australians.....good to have the experts in
New Zealand wont do a 'New Zealand' @ this world cup..its theirs to lose. Resting a lot of their main players and still brushing aside SA and Aus in the tri-nations, all augers well.
After NZ, you have a plethora of nations, France, Puma's, SA, Aus, England, Wales and ourselves who could beat anyone on this list on a given day.
Wallace is a big lose but we've good mobile flankers in reserves,, maybe not strictly 7's though.
Mooted before but Id go with O'Gara @ 10, Sexton @ 12 and BOD @ 13...less missed tackles with 2 good boots to change the whole dynamic of a game if we're under P, which we will undoubtedly be @ times
Mon te fcuk Ireland
Quote from: Hoof Hearted on August 27, 2011, 06:11:31 PM
the hopeful thing im clinging to, is that they have been running like horses for the month of august and havent had a ball in their hands, a bit like January in the Gaelic.
If im wrong, well.................... ::)
I can't beleive the importance a lot of people are attaching to these matches. They are pre season world cup warm up games. They have been very false affairs lacking real competition and intensity. I am not a soothsayer but my guess is we will be fine and qualify from the group. I don't know it but I think we will be very competitive against the Aussies as well.
Irish teams hate being favourites and love being under dogs. In that sense they have played the build up perfectly(apart from losing Wallace). The only way is up.
Quote from: Capt Pat on August 27, 2011, 08:01:44 PM
Quote from: Hoof Hearted on August 27, 2011, 06:11:31 PM
the hopeful thing im clinging to, is that they have been running like horses for the month of august and havent had a ball in their hands, a bit like January in the Gaelic.
If im wrong, well.................... ::)
I can't beleive the importance a lot of people are attaching to these matches. They are pre season world cup warm up games. They have been very false affairs lacking real competition and intensity. I am not a soothsayer but my guess is we will be fine and qualify from the group. I don't know it but I think we will be very competitive against the Aussies as well.
Irish teams hate being favourites and love being under dogs. In that sense they have played the build up perfectly(apart from losing Wallace). The only way is up.
In 2003 England won the WC by winning warm up games against SH opposition.
Dismissing them is typically Irish. Australia are tri-nations champions and regularly beat NZ. When did we last beat NZ?
Thats the scale of the task. Not impossible but you'd want to waken up.
Professional sport isnt a version of the TV show " It'll be alright on the night"
So pre world cup games are not important huh?? Funny but I remember in 2007 clearly , that it was during the warm up games that the bells started ringing in eddie O'sullivan's ears ( according to himself as well).. and we all know what happened then! But they won a few of those matches I recall!! At that time he played the second string in most of those games. What excuse does Kidney have?? It is a matter of building confidence and momentum for the players particularly those young lads, I would have thought...that was the whole point of having these matches!! Maybe it will all come right in New Zealand but yet again we are living in the land of Hope!! In 2007 it was with huge expectations that our lads went to France so now they go to New Zealand with no expectation.....it is just a cunning plan that I obviously have not picked up on yet! Silly me!!
The warm up games are only a part of it. Ireland have only given one really good performance all year and that was at home to England in the last game of the 6 Nations. Apart from that their form has consistently been either patchy or downright poor.
On the other hand Leinster won the European Cup Munster the Magners league. We beat England easily 24-8 in a competitive game 4 months ago. Tommy Bowe is a brilliant attacking back Steven Ferris and Rob Kearney are back from injury. We have a genuine tighthead anchoring the scrum. A very capable half back pairing on Reddan and Sexton. Things can only get better.
[ :)quote author=cicfada link=topic=19967.msg1009319#msg1009319 date=1314473120]
So pre world cup games are not important huh?? Funny but I remember in 2007 clearly , that it was during the warm up games that the bells started ringing in eddie O'sullivan's ears ( according to himself as well).. and we all know what happened then! But they won a few of those matches I recall!! At that time he played the second string in most of those games. What excuse does Kidney have?? It is a matter of building confidence and momentum for the players particularly those young lads, I would have thought...that was the whole point of having these matches!! Maybe it will all come right in New Zealand but yet again we are living in the land of Hope!! In 2007 it was with huge expectations that our lads went to France so now they go to New Zealand with no expectation.....it is just a cunning plan that I obviously have not picked up on yet! Silly me!!
[/quote]
An awful lot of negativity here.
I can't believe people are having a pop at O Driscoll. He is past his prime but he has always delivered when we need him, and he won't let his swansong pass by on a different note.
One thing that does strike me is that Ireland will need horses for courses. When playing a side Like England, we need a physically imposing midfield and back row. The rest of the team can worry about being cute once England's game plan is in tatters.
I honestly don't know if I'd trade Ireland's squad for anyone else's save New Zealand. It has flaws, but there should be enough experience in the squad to know how to cover for them.
Yes too much negativity but.......
Kearney - just coming back from injury
Bowe - just coming back from injury
BOD - almost always delivers
D'Arcy - way out of form
Earls - out of form
Sexton - has delivered in big games in the last 2 years
Redden - indifferent
Healy - Playing well and coming to grips with international scrummaging
Flannery - just coming back from injury (this will be written on his grave)
Ross - If he even sleeps badly we have a crisis
O'Callaghan - usually delivers in big games
O'Connell - almost always delivers
Ferris - just coming back from injury
Heaslip - big player for us and usually delivers
O'Brien - not in the position we would want him to play but it needs to work.
The above is our likely starting 15 if they are fit. We need an awful lot to go right for us to do well in this competition. For we there are too many 'out of form' and 'just coming back from injury' situations there.
Quote from: muppet on August 27, 2011, 09:57:07 PM
Yes too much negativity but.......
Kearney - just coming back from injury
Bowe - just coming back from injury
BOD - almost always delivers
D'Arcy - way out of form
Earls - out of form
Sexton - has delivered in big games in the last 2 years
Redden - indifferent
Healy - Playing well and coming to grips with international scrummaging
Flannery - just coming back from injury (this will be written on his grave)
Ross - If he even sleeps badly we have a crisis
O'Callaghan - usually delivers in big games
O'Connell - almost always delivers
Ferris - just coming back from injury
Heaslip - big player for us and usually delivers
O'Brien - not in the position we would want him to play but it needs to work.
The above is our likely starting 15 if they are fit. We need an awful lot to go right for us to do well in this competition. For we there are too many 'out of form' and 'just coming back from injury' situations there.
Need to pray this fella stays injury free or we're fucked - one could argue we have decent cover in all other positions bar this one.... and if someone mentions Buckley I'll go fecking mad
Quote from: Capt Pat on August 27, 2011, 08:35:14 PM
On the other hand Leinster won the European Cup Munster the Magners league. We beat England easily 24-8 in a competitive game 4 months ago. Tommy Bowe is a brilliant attacking back Steven Ferris and Rob Kearney are back from injury. We have a genuine tighthead anchoring the scrum. A very capable half back pairing on Reddan and Sexton. Things can only get better.
[ :)quote author=cicfada link=topic=19967.msg1009319#msg1009319 date=1314473120]
So pre world cup games are not important huh?? Funny but I remember in 2007 clearly , that it was during the warm up games that the bells started ringing in eddie O'sullivan's ears ( according to himself as well).. and we all know what happened then! But they won a few of those matches I recall!! At that time he played the second string in most of those games. What excuse does Kidney have?? It is a matter of building confidence and momentum for the players particularly those young lads, I would have thought...that was the whole point of having these matches!! Maybe it will all come right in New Zealand but yet again we are living in the land of Hope!! In 2007 it was with huge expectations that our lads went to France so now they go to New Zealand with no expectation.....it is just a cunning plan that I obviously have not picked up on yet! Silly me!!
[/quote]
See Muppets post for a pretty accurate assessment of the state of this team.
In 3 weeks we will play a team who are capable of winning the WC on the back of 4 defeats.
Maybe it will all come together on the day. But thats all we have to cling to- maybe's.
Shades of 2007 all over again. Jesus you'd think we'd have got the preparation right this time. Looks like we've played too many matches
Ireland rugby is right up there with the Isle of Man at the moment.
Quote from: laoislad on August 27, 2011, 09:58:09 PM
Quote from: Shamrock Shore on August 27, 2011, 06:24:42 PM
To quote Pvt Frasier in Dad's Army "We're dooooomed"
Making up the numbers in NZ at this rate.
I hope Hardy watched the paint drying instead of the other rubbish.
I even went to the pub to watch it because I couldn't find a decent stream. I mean - not a stream as in water to drink ...
The pints were nice anyway.
one world cup too late for most of the Irish squad.
Look at the difference between the size of the teams yesterday. Englands backfield looked as big as Irelands pack. Thats where international rugby has gone.
England are not in good form either but Ireland never looked like causing them problems.
on the positive side, Ireland wouldnt spurn the chances to shoot for points in a real match. Obv they wanted to practice lineouts and rolling mauls for the wc.
However earls & darcy v tindell and tuilagi. not even close to being a contest. Throw an aging BOd into that and it wouldnt nmake much difference.
Losing Wallace is a disaster.
Very surprised and impressed with Englands second row. Didnt think they had it in them to be honest- not as a unit at least.
they are poor enough at scrum half too.
If any of their old front row or wilkinson get inj -they are in trouble too.
Quote from: thewobbler on August 27, 2011, 09:20:34 PM
An awful lot of negativity here.
I can't believe people are having a pop at O Driscoll. He is past his prime but he has always delivered when we need him, and he won't let his swansong pass by on a different note.
One thing that does strike me is that Ireland will need horses for courses. When playing a side Like England, we need a physically imposing midfield and back row. The rest of the team can worry about being cute once England's game plan is in tatters.
I honestly don't know if I'd trade Ireland's squad for anyone else's save New Zealand. It has flaws, but there should be enough experience in the squad to know how to cover for them.
Ahh Jesus wobbler am I reading that right, u wouldn't swap the Irish squad for any other save the all blacks?? Ur saying u would prefer our panel to the french, Aussie or the reigning champions for that matter.
Some serious green, white and gold blinkers going on there.
Whitegoodman, there's no doubt I've got tricolour tinted specs on.
Yet while I haven't missed the decline of the Irish team in recent seasons. at the same time, I must have missed the bit when SA, Australia and France showed themselves as reliable, world class performers.
The truth in my mind is that no team apart from NZ has any credentials worth talking about for this tournament.
Yep, only France or SA have the big game mentality to overthrow the All Blacks (and I really hope one of them does). But should that happen, realistically any of Ireland, Wales, England, Australia, SA or even Argentina could actually win it.
Quote from: thewobbler on August 28, 2011, 01:34:04 PM
Whitegoodman, there's no doubt I've got tricolour tinted specs on.
Surely you mean your green with a shamrock and rugby ball logo tinted specs on.
Won't be too many official tricolours flying for that team in the World Cup.
I agree with this once New Zealand get knocked out the tournament would be wide open. To me the big downfall of that plan is Ireland would never be able to
beat the All Blacks.
Quote from: thewobbler link=topic=19967.msg1009507#msg1009507 da :) :)te=1314534844
Whitegoodman, there's no doubt I've got tricolour tinted specs on.
Yet while I haven't missed the decline of the Irish team in recent seasons. at the same time, I must have missed the bit when SA, Australia and France showed themselves as reliable, world class performers.
The truth in my mind is that no team apart from NZ has any credentials worth talking about for this tournament.
Yep, only France or SA have the big game mentality to overthrow the All Blacks (and I really hope one of them does). But should that happen, realistically any of Ireland, Wales, England, Australia, SA or even Argentina could actually win it.
Quote from: thewobbler on August 28, 2011, 01:34:04 PM
Whitegoodman, there's no doubt I've got tricolour tinted specs on.
Yet while I haven't missed the decline of the Irish team in recent seasons. at the same time, I must have missed the bit when SA, Australia and France showed themselves as reliable, world class performers.
The truth in my mind is that no team apart from NZ has any credentials worth talking about for this tournament.
Yep, only France or SA have the big game mentality to overthrow the All Blacks (and I really hope one of them does). But should that happen, realistically any of Ireland, Wales, England, Australia, SA or even Argentina could actually win it.
New Zealand were beaten by Australia yesterday... I don't understand why you think only New Zealand have the credentials to win the World Cup.
Ireland's best 15 playing at the max of their ability will have a shout against Australia or South Africa, no more no less. Even at that we'd need both of those teams not to be firing on all cylinders for us to win. Unfortunantely at the moment with Wallace out we won't have our best 15 and it is difficult to imagine how we will find form to win either of those two games.
To suggest however that our squad is the second best in the tournament is borderline lunacy.
France's second string only beat us comfortably two weeks ago. Matt Giteau can't even make the Australian squad.
Englands backs are probably bigger than the All Blacks forwards too. However they are still pretty shit at center. Tuilagi is talented but he is always cruisin for a bruisin or more likely a suspension. The English don't know how to run a backline against better teams.
[ :)quote author=lynchbhoy link=topic=19967.msg1009467#msg1009467 date=1314526903]
one world cup too late for most of the Irish squad.
Look at the difference between the size of the teams yesterday. Englands backfield looked as big as Irelands pack. Thats where international rugby has gone.
England are not in good form either but Ireland never looked like causing them problems.
on the positive side, Ireland wouldnt spurn the chances to shoot for points in a real match. Obv they wanted to practice lineouts and rolling mauls for the wc.
However earls & darcy v tindell and tuilagi. not even close to being a contest. Throw an aging BOd into that and it wouldnt nmake much difference.
Losing Wallace is a disaster.
Very surprised and impressed with Englands second row. Didnt think they had it in them to be honest- not as a unit at least.
they are poor enough at scrum half too.
If any of their old front row or wilkinson get inj -they are in trouble too.
[/quote]
Quote from: thewobbler on August 28, 2011, 01:34:04 PM
Whitegoodman, there's no doubt I've got tricolour tinted specs on.
Yet while I haven't missed the decline of the Irish team in recent seasons. at the same time, I must have missed the bit when SA, Australia and France showed themselves as reliable, world class performers.
The truth in my mind is that no team apart from NZ has any credentials worth talking about for this tournament.
Yep, only France or SA have the big game mentality to overthrow the All Blacks (and I really hope one of them does). But should that happen, realistically any of Ireland, Wales, England, Australia, SA or even Argentina could actually win it.
Ireland have not in my living memory beaten Austrailia or South Africa in the southern hemisphere and if they couldnt do it in Drico, Darcy, O Connoll etc prime I dont see it happening when they are well past their best.
I would also have serious doubts about our ability to beat France or England down there. If the all blacks somehow are beaten which i dont see happening, only 4 teams can win it imo, S Africa, Australia, England and France.
Special Report tonight Sky Sports News @ 7.30PM - A week in the life of Brian O'driscoll
Quote from: Capt Pat on August 28, 2011, 02:03:32 PM
Englands backs are probably bigger than the All Blacks forwards too. However they are still pretty shit at center. Tuilagi is talented but he is always cruisin for a bruisin or more likely a suspension. The English don't know how to run a backline against better teams.
I wish Ireland were as 'shit' at centre !!
The English backline is still experimental- I'd like to see that back division given a go in the wc - and with a bit of time training and a bit of gametime together, they could be superb.
Tuilagi or Tindell - or Darcy - I know who i'd pick !
We have O Driscoll as well
Quote from: lynchbhoy on August 29, 2011, 12:25:15 PM
Quote from: Capt Pat on August 28, 2011, 02:03:32 PM
Englands backs are probably bigger than the All Blacks forwards too. However they are still pretty shit at center. Tuilagi is talented but he is always cruisin for a bruisin or more likely a suspension. The English don't know how to run a backline against better teams.
I wish Ireland were as 'shit' at centre !!
The English backline is still experimental- I'd like to see that back division given a go in the wc - and with a bit of time training and a bit of gametime together, they could be superb.
Tuilagi or Tindell - or Darcy - I know who i'd pick !
New Zealand took it easy just like England did in the last six nations game. England got hockeyed and were lucky not to be beaten by more. The all blacks almost won.
Quote from: haze on August 28, 2011, 01:55:13 PM
Quote from: thewobbler on August 28, 2011, 01:34:04 PM
Whitegoodman, there's no doubt I've got tricolour tinted specs on.
Yet while I haven't missed the decline of the Irish team in recent seasons. at the same time, I must have missed the bit when SA, Australia and France showed themselves as reliable, world class performers.
The truth in my mind is that no team apart from NZ has any credentials worth talking about for this tournament.
Yep, only France or SA have the big game mentality to overthrow the All Blacks (and I really hope one of them does). But should that happen, realistically any of Ireland, Wales, England, Australia, SA or even Argentina could actually win it.
New Zealand were beaten by Australia yesterday... I don't understand why you think only New Zealand have the credentials to win the World Cup.
Ireland's best 15 playing at the max of their ability will have a shout against Australia or South Africa, no more no less. Even at that we'd need both of those teams not to be firing on all cylinders for us to win. Unfortunantely at the moment with Wallace out we won't have our best 15 and it is difficult to imagine how we will find form to win either of those two games.
To suggest however that our squad is the second best in the tournament is borderline lunacy.
France's second string only beat us comfortably two weeks ago. Matt Giteau can't even make the Australian squad.
Quote from: Capt Pat on August 29, 2011, 02:05:17 PM
We have O Driscoll as well
you miss my point
which would you rather have to select
Tindall
tuilagi
or
darcy.
to be honest, I'd also have tuilagi and tindall over darcy and odriscoll- both are gone.
O'Driscoll still a fantastic finisher at times though.
IMO the centre position needs bigger men than 5' 9" darcy and 5' 10 Odriscoll
Quote from: lynchbhoy on August 29, 2011, 03:01:09 PM
Quote from: Capt Pat on August 29, 2011, 02:05:17 PM
We have O Driscoll as well
you miss my point
which would you rather have to select
Tindall
tuilagi
or
darcy.
to be honest, I'd also have tuilagi and tindall over darcy and odriscoll- both are gone.
O'Driscoll still a fantastic finisher at times though.
IMO the centre position needs bigger men than 5' 9" darcy and 5' 10 Odriscoll
Lynchbhoy, are you Martin Johnston in disguise? :P
That's a knee jerk reaction to one bad result. Our superior midfield play has been one of the reasons we've had the upper hand over England in the last few years! Every so often a banger comes along who can also play ball for sure, but putting Tindall in the same class as O'Driscoll even at this stage of the latter's career is crazy. Tindall and Tuilagi were afforded the chance to look much better than they are on Saturday because their pack was emphatically pushing ours around.
We need to find a way of becoming more dynamic at the breakdown- this is where the Southern Hemisphere sides are miles ahead of us. England are Donegal-esque in that they are set up purely to frustrate.
Quote from: lynchbhoy on August 29, 2011, 03:01:09 PM
Quote from: Capt Pat on August 29, 2011, 02:05:17 PM
We have O Driscoll as well
you miss my point
which would you rather have to select
Tindall
tuilagi
or
darcy.
to be honest, I'd also have tuilagi and tindall over darcy and odriscoll- both are gone.
O'Driscoll still a fantastic finisher at times though.
IMO the centre position needs bigger men than 5' 9" darcy and 5' 10 Odriscoll
The game at the weekend was probably Tindall's best game for England since they won the WC in 2003. England fans have been desperately wanting him out of the team for the past 5 years at least. Tuilagi is a good prospect alright but he was up against a winger playing at outside centre and Earls has never been good defensively playing at 13. Tuilagi was always going to run through him at some point in that game.
This had better be a cunning plan for Kidney and his coaches not to show their hand, and for a different Ireland to show up at the WC.
I cannot for the life of me understand why the IRFU went and handed him a new contract before NZ - after doing exactly the same thing with O'Sullivan in 2007.
Quote from: BarryBreensBandage on August 29, 2011, 07:25:47 PM
This had better be a cunning plan for Kidney and his coaches not to show their hand, and for a different Ireland to show up at the WC.
I cannot for the life of me understand why the IRFU went and handed him a new contract before NZ - after doing exactly the same thing with O'Sullivan in 2007.
The same man Philip Brown is in charge. He has been there for donkeys years.
Does anybody know what the nature of David Wallace's knee injury was ?
Ligaments according to the BBC this morning, 6 months out
Are we allowed a replacement for Wallace? If so, does Jennings get the nod?
Quote from: redhandloo on August 30, 2011, 10:37:51 PM
Are we allowed a replacement for Wallace? If so, does Jennings get the nod?
Jennings has already been called up.
Quote from: GalwayBayBoy on August 30, 2011, 10:48:37 PM
Quote from: redhandloo on August 30, 2011, 10:37:51 PM
Are we allowed a replacement for Wallace? If so, does Jennings get the nod?
Jennings has already been called up.
Cheers GBB
http://www.rte.ie/sport/rugby/worldcup/2011/0903/ireland_smalg.html
Gert Smal says Ireland have something special. FOr what its worth I agree and think we will beat the Aussies. After that who knows.
Looks like the squad are enjoying themselves anyway.
(http://www.irishrugby.ie/images/news/DonnchaOCallaghan_QueenstownSkylineLuge.jpg)
(http://www.irishrugby.ie/images/news/RonanOGara_QueenstownSkylineLuge.jpg)
(http://www.irishrugby.ie/images/news/PaulOConnell_QueenstownSkylineLuge.jpg)
(http://www.irishrugby.ie/images/news/FergusMcFadden_RobKearney_QueenstownSkyline.jpg)
(http://www.irishrugby.ie/images/news/IsaacBoss_StephenFerris_QueenstownSkyline.jpg)
(http://www.irishrugby.ie/images/news/Ireland_QueenstownShotoverJet8.jpg)
(http://www.irishrugby.ie/images/news/Ireland_QueenstownShotoverJet0.jpg)
(http://www.irishrugby.ie/images/news/Playersdowntime_Queenstown.jpg)
Quote from: Capt Pat on September 03, 2011, 01:18:40 PM
http://www.rte.ie/sport/rugby/worldcup/2011/0903/ireland_smalg.html
Gert Smal says Ireland have something special. FOr what its worth I agree and think we will beat the Aussies. After that who knows.
You think so with Tom Court at loose-head. Remember who said it first. I dont think anybody realises how knackered we are with injuries. Its far worse then they are saying.
I see that James O Connor will not start for the Aussies against the Gino Ginellis on saturday. Is he in the coaches bad books? I thought he was their main man, best bacl, goal kicker etc.
Fecking hell. Why not?
Quote from: Capt Pat on September 06, 2011, 07:02:50 PM
I see that James O Connor will not start for the Aussies against the Gino Ginellis on saturday. Is he in the coaches bad books? I thought he was their main man, best bacl, goal kicker etc.
Disciplinary issues going AWOL around the time WC squad was announced. Ashley Cooper ended up taking his place against the sheep shaggers and turned in a big performance so young James has a challenge to get back in, just as Rocky does to hold his place.
Well yes but I hope they aren't taking the Itialians too lughtlyn They have already beaten France this year.
Quote from: Capt Pat on September 06, 2011, 09:05:39 PM
Well yes but I hope they aren't taking the Itialians too lughtlyn They have already beaten France this year.
think it's pretty much the team that beat the Kiwi's so don't think they're taking it lightly
Kidney throws Murray surprise
The 22-year-old Murray, the youngest member of the Irish squad, has made just two appearances for Ireland, both off the bench in World Cup warm-up games.
Despite his inexperience at international and domestic level (he has never played in the Heineken Cup), Murray gets the nod over more senior campaigners, Issac Boss and Eoin Reddan.
Ireland coach Declan Kidney admits it's a bit of a gamble starting with Murray but it's a necessary one.
"Conor's been going well in training and we said we'd judge it off that. If we're to know more about him, now's the time to know," said Kidney.
"He deserves a go and we think he's good enough to start. It's a big call given it's our first game in the World Cup, but what he's been doing merits his inclusion."
Murray will be partnered by Jonathan Sexton at fly-half, with Ronan O'Gara named amongst the substitutes.
Despite being passed fit earlier in the week, flanker Sean O'Brien and full-back Rob Kearney will take no part in the clash, with the duo rested as a precaution.
Shane Jennings and Geordan Murphy are the men to benefit from the decision.
Having recovered from a calf injury, Gordon D'Arcy regains his place at inside centre.
Despite a handful of strong performances during Ireland's warm-up games, Andrew Trimble has to make do with a place on the bench with Tommy Bowe and Keith Earls named on the wings.
Rugby World Cup betting odds
Ireland: 15 Geordan Murphy, 14 Tommy Bowe, 13 Brian O'Driscoll (capt), 12 Gordan D'Arcy, 11 Keith Earls, 10 Jonathan Sexton, 9 Conor Murray, 8 Jamie Heaslip,7 Shane Jennings, 6 Stephen Ferris, 5 Paul O'Connell, 4 Donncha O'Callaghan, 3 Mike Ross, 2 Rory Best, 1 Tom Court
Replacements: 16 Jerry Flannery, 17 Tony Buckley, 18 Donnacha Ryan, 19 Denis Leamy, 20 Eoin Reddan, 21 Ronan O'Gara, 22 Andrew Trimble.
Date: Sunday, September 11
Venue: New Plymouth
Kick-off: 18:00 (06:00 GMT)
Referee: Craig Joubert (South Africa)
Assistant referees: Nigel Owens (Wales), Carlo Damasco (Italy)
Television match official: Graham Hughes (England
Can't abide ITV sports coverage but they've some lineup of pundits - Pienaar, Fitzpatrick, Dallaglio and Lynagh.
I can't understand Keith Earl's inclusion but the rest of it is good.
The Kiwis didn't try and they appear to be resting their best player for an important game. The All Blacks beat Italy by 90 points at the last world cup but the Italians didn't try. When the Italians get their act together their true level is a lot closer to the effort of beating France. This Aussie team will be tops in four years. However right now they are just another contender like Ireland and England with a punchers chance.
Quote from: anglocelt39 on September 06, 2011, 10:01:57 PM
Quote from: Capt Pat on September 06, 2011, 09:05:39 PM
Well yes but I hope they aren't taking the Itialians too lughtlyn They have already beaten France this year.
think it's pretty much the team that beat the Kiwi's so don't think they're taking it lightly
Opening ceremonies >:( why bother. Just gove Toti Te Kanawa a microphone to blast out the more operatic version of World in Unison a couple of times and be done with it in five minutes.
Quote from: Tony Baloney on September 09, 2011, 08:35:26 AM
Can't abide ITV sports coverage but they've some lineup of pundits - Pienaar, Fitzpatrick, Dallaglio and Lynagh.
Fitzpatrick in particular is a cracking pundit I think.
Quote from: thewobbler on September 09, 2011, 08:49:17 AM
I can't understand Keith Earl's inclusion but the rest of it is good.
Keith will do ok against the US. Trimble might come in for the Aussie game. I am getting worried about Rob Kearney is he fit at all?
Quote from: thewobbler on September 09, 2011, 08:49:17 AM
I can't understand Keith Earl's inclusion but the rest of it is good.
Agree with that expect would like McFadden in for D'arcy and would have hoped O'Brien was fit enough for the bench, assuming Trimble is been rested for next week as he played in the 4 warm-up games.
Any streams for this lads? I can't seem to get RTE at work because our proxy is based in fecking Texas.
Veetle
Cheers. Feckit lads, I know it's a bit cliched, but the the Haka is class.
By the way, did anyone hear where the ref, George Clancy, got the news he was going to NZ, and reffing the first game, when he was down in the GAA field watching an Intermediate Hurling League match between Bruff and Cappamore or someone :) Paddy O'Brien rang him there.
Quote from: AZOffaly on September 09, 2011, 09:31:25 AM
Cheers. Feckit lads, I know it's a bit cliched, but the the Haka is class.
Too commercialised for me these days and is an unfair advantage when playing against against other non-South Pacific teams. Plus any half-arsed Kiwi thinks he can do it whereas for example the Tongans would treat the Sipi Tau with a lot more respect and I remember playing with a Tongan International who refused to do it because it wouldn't be respectful.
Quote from: Dinny Breen on September 09, 2011, 09:45:34 AM
Quote from: AZOffaly on September 09, 2011, 09:31:25 AM
Cheers. Feckit lads, I know it's a bit cliched, but the the Haka is class.
Too commercialised for me these days and is an unfair advantage when playing against against other non-South Pacific teams. Plus any half-arsed Kiwi thinks he can do it whereas for example the Tongans would treat the Sipi Tau with a lot more respect and I remember playing with a Tongan International who refused to do it because it wouldn't be respectful.
Nonsense. Still immense on the rugby field between two sides. Many top pro's including O'Driscoll have said it is no advantage to NZ as it should inspire the opposition. I was in Edinburgh for an autumn international a few years back when the scots played NZ and nobody we met from NZ would do it bar a couple of Mouri's who claimed to hold some tribal position, others in their party wouldn't do it.
Quote from: AZOffaly on September 09, 2011, 09:13:39 AM
Any streams for this lads? I can't seem to get RTE at work because our proxy is based in fecking Texas.
http://www.786cast.tv/channel.php?u=HitSports.Net_52F0X
New Zealand are 15-0 up after 22 minutes. This could get ugly.
Quote from: Capt Pat on September 09, 2011, 09:56:50 AM
New Zealand are 15-0 up after 22 minutes. This could get ugly.
22-0 now
Quote from: Bingo on September 09, 2011, 09:54:20 AM
Quote from: Dinny Breen on September 09, 2011, 09:45:34 AM
Quote from: AZOffaly on September 09, 2011, 09:31:25 AM
Cheers. Feckit lads, I know it's a bit cliched, but the the Haka is class.
Too commercialised for me these days and is an unfair advantage when playing against against other non-South Pacific teams. Plus any half-arsed Kiwi thinks he can do it whereas for example the Tongans would treat the Sipi Tau with a lot more respect and I remember playing with a Tongan International who refused to do it because it wouldn't be respectful.
Nonsense. Still immense on the rugby field between two sides. Many top pro's including O'Driscoll have said it is no advantage to NZ as it should inspire the opposition. I was in Edinburgh for an autumn international a few years back when the scots played NZ and nobody we met from NZ would do it bar a couple of Mouri's who claimed to hold some tribal position, others in their party wouldn't do it.
Immense if your maybe 7 and have never seen it before. As for O'Driscoll, he is a professional athlete with a PR machine behind him, don't be so naive, what else would you expect him to say?
The Haki is just commercialised albeit entertaining rubbish. Simon Cowell would be proud.
Look how it evolved for ffs.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KBCpPGNDr1U (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KBCpPGNDr1U)
Quote from: Dinny Breen on September 09, 2011, 10:07:19 AM
Quote from: Bingo on September 09, 2011, 09:54:20 AM
Quote from: Dinny Breen on September 09, 2011, 09:45:34 AM
Quote from: AZOffaly on September 09, 2011, 09:31:25 AM
Cheers. Feckit lads, I know it's a bit cliched, but the the Haka is class.
Too commercialised for me these days and is an unfair advantage when playing against against other non-South Pacific teams. Plus any half-arsed Kiwi thinks he can do it whereas for example the Tongans would treat the Sipi Tau with a lot more respect and I remember playing with a Tongan International who refused to do it because it wouldn't be respectful.
Nonsense. Still immense on the rugby field between two sides. Many top pro's including O'Driscoll have said it is no advantage to NZ as it should inspire the opposition. I was in Edinburgh for an autumn international a few years back when the scots played NZ and nobody we met from NZ would do it bar a couple of Mouri's who claimed to hold some tribal position, others in their party wouldn't do it.
Immense if your maybe 7 and have never seen it before. As for O'Driscoll, he is a professional athlete with a PR machine behind him, don't be so naive, what else would you expect him to say?
The Haki is just commercialised albeit entertaining rubbish. Simon Cowell would be proud.
Look how it evolved for ffs.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KBCpPGNDr1U (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KBCpPGNDr1U)
Whatever you think. ::)
I don't think it is rubbish, but I do think it's part of the All Black Brand.
Still raises the hair on my neck when I see them do it in a big game. If they didn't do it for every test it might be a bit more meaningful as distinct from being part of the package.
Quote from: Dinny Breen on September 09, 2011, 10:07:19 AM
Quote from: Bingo on September 09, 2011, 09:54:20 AM
Quote from: Dinny Breen on September 09, 2011, 09:45:34 AM
Quote from: AZOffaly on September 09, 2011, 09:31:25 AM
Cheers. Feckit lads, I know it's a bit cliched, but the the Haka is class.
Too commercialised for me these days and is an unfair advantage when playing against against other non-South Pacific teams. Plus any half-arsed Kiwi thinks he can do it whereas for example the Tongans would treat the Sipi Tau with a lot more respect and I remember playing with a Tongan International who refused to do it because it wouldn't be respectful.
Nonsense. Still immense on the rugby field between two sides. Many top pro's including O'Driscoll have said it is no advantage to NZ as it should inspire the opposition. I was in Edinburgh for an autumn international a few years back when the scots played NZ and nobody we met from NZ would do it bar a couple of Mouri's who claimed to hold some tribal position, others in their party wouldn't do it.
Immense if your maybe 7 and have never seen it before. As for O'Driscoll, he is a professional athlete with a PR machine behind him, don't be so naive, what else would you expect him to say?
The Haki is just commercialised albeit entertaining rubbish. Simon Cowell would be proud.
Look how it evolved for ffs.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KBCpPGNDr1U (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KBCpPGNDr1U)
That has to be the worst Haka I've ever seen. I think it adds to the occasion myself. Yes it is commercialised but everything is nowadays and hype is the name of the game. . . if you like your Rugby and enjoy the occasion why not buy into it?!
Quote from: AZOffaly on September 09, 2011, 10:41:13 AM
I don't think it is rubbish, but I do think it's part of the All Black Brand.
Still raises the hair on my neck when I see them do it in a big game. If they didn't do it for every test it might be a bit more meaningful as distinct from being part of the package.
If Dublin win the All-Ireland would you be happy to hear Brand Dublin been talked about? I use Dublin in this context as they would be the most obvious county to commercialise...
Call me a traditionalist but I hate when people refer to sports teams as a brand, talk about losing your soul and identity..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=weUHwCjeD7s&feature=related
Willie Anderson goes toe to toe with Buck Shelford at Lansdowne Rd 1989
Try for Tonga, fully deserved.
Good game for NZ though, their 2nd half performance has been poor which will keep expectation in check and will leave plenty to work on for the coaches in particularly at the breakdown on their own ball, where it was slow and that was compounded by a scrum-half Cowan who pass execution was poor. Also their kicking game outside Carter was appalling and France and the Aussies would really punish that.
Quote from: Dinny Breen on September 09, 2011, 10:46:32 AM
Quote from: AZOffaly on September 09, 2011, 10:41:13 AM
I don't think it is rubbish, but I do think it's part of the All Black Brand.
Still raises the hair on my neck when I see them do it in a big game. If they didn't do it for every test it might be a bit more meaningful as distinct from being part of the package.
If Dublin win the All-Ireland would you be happy to hear Brand Dublin been talked about? I use Dublin in this context as they would be the most obvious county to commercialise...
Call me a traditionalist but I hate when people refer to sports teams as a brand, talk about losing your soul and identity..
I'm agreeing with you Dinny. However, you said it was commercialist
rubbish, I don't think it's rubbish, but I do think it's related to the brand. Maybe I should have put 'Brand' in quotes.
What the Haka has become to me is rubbish, teams aren't allowed confront as per Willie Anderson above, there is a strict 10m no go-zone enforced, they are forced to stand and watch as NZ get their mental focus up.
Wales wanted to perform their National Anthem after the Haka a few years ago and NZ responded with 'That's a lack of respect' and did their Haka in the dressing room I kid you not. To me that is rubbish not the actual war dance but the bullsh*t around it.
To me the actual war dance, the hype around it, teams forced to respectfully stand and watch it (loved it years ago when Campese played kick uppies in his own 22) is a distinct competitive advantage and is against the spirit of sport. This is of course just my opinion.
Quote from: Dinny Breen on September 09, 2011, 11:38:26 AM
What the Haka has become to me is rubbish, teams aren't allowed confront as per Willie Anderson above, there is a strict 10m no go-zone enforced, they are forced to stand and watch as NZ get their mental focus up.
Wales wanted to perform their National Anthem after the Haka a few years ago and NZ responded with 'That's a lack of respect' and did their Haka in the dressing room I kid you not. To me that is rubbish not the actual war dance but the bullsh*t around it.
To me the actual war dance, the hype around it, teams forced to respectfully stand and watch it (loved it years ago when Campese played kick uppies in his own 22) is a distinct competitive advantage and is against the spirit of sport. This is of course just my opinion.
Yeah Campo showed it fair respect all right but not as much as Phil Kearns who got up and laughed into Sean Fitzpatricks face as he was doing the jig. Now that was fair crack. Totally fair game as far as I'm concerned, where in the ancient rules of the game does it state that some countries are allowed to do a dance AND the opposition must look on respectfully. Personally I quite enjoy the spectacle but no mistake it's clearly designed to give the AB's a bit of an edge. So let them at it and let the opposition deal with it in whatever way they see fit.
The Haka is a war dance?
Saying we are going to attack and kill you?
Ahh, right so.
Quote from: Dinny Breen on September 09, 2011, 10:46:32 AM
Quote from: AZOffaly on September 09, 2011, 10:41:13 AM
I don't think it is rubbish, but I do think it's part of the All Black Brand.
Still raises the hair on my neck when I see them do it in a big game. If they didn't do it for every test it might be a bit more meaningful as distinct from being part of the package.
If Dublin win the All-Ireland would you be happy to hear Brand Dublin been talked about? I use Dublin in this context as they would be the most obvious county to commercialise...
Call me a traditionalist but I hate when people refer to sports teams as a brand, talk about losing your soul and identity..
Indeed. Couldn't agree more. As an extension of that I hate the whole selling of naming rights for stadiums, etc.
Quote from: Denn Forever on September 09, 2011, 11:48:06 AM
The Haka is a war dance?
Saying we are going to attack and kill you?
Ahh, right so.
It's not actually. The Haka the All Blacks do is something about a lad being found in a hole or something. I think they still do that one. Haka is a name for all of these dances, what the All Blacks do is the 'Ka Mate'
'he Maori haka performed by the All Blacks, has become famous around the world, though few realise it's origin or meaning.
Te Rauparaha, the warrior chief of Ngati Toarangatira, originally from Kawhia, had visited Tuwharetoa to solicit aid against the Waikato and Ngati Maniapoto tribes.
That aid was refused him because of his treachery some years before when he had attacked and killed some of Ngati te Aho at Te Onepu.
It seems that the party had planned to descend to Lake Rotoaira to procure fish when one said, 'Why go fishing - there is food for the taking,' and he pointed to the smoke rising from the Ngati te Aho village.
Te Heuheu Herea, who was himself related to Ngati Maniapoto, softened the refusal by advising Te Rauparaha to follow the forest track over Ponanga Saddle to seek refuge with Te Wharerangi at Motu 0 Puhi.
However, when he arrived there, Te Rauparaha found that Te Wharerangi, although hostile to him, felt obliged to extend some protection to his unwelcome guest against the taua (war party) led by Tauteka and already in hot pursuit.
Accordingly, he told Te Rauparaha to seek refuge in an empty kumara pit nearby empty kumara pit nearby and then asked his wife, Te Rangikoaea, to seat herself over the entrance to the pit.
As the chiefs of the pursuing party approached Rotoaira, they recited incantations to enable them to locate the whereabouts of Te Rauparaha.
Thus led to believe that he was at Motu 0 Puhi, they chanted further incantations to prevent him from escaping southward, and as Te Rauparaha sat crouched in the pit he began to feel the effects of the spells being cast on him.
In addition to assisting in the concealment of the Ngati Toa chief, the main reason why Te Rangi koaea was ordered to sit over the pit was because of the neutralising effect that she, as a woman, had on incantations.
The female genital organs were supposed to have this power and, as influence of the incantations reached Te Rauparaha, he felt their effects bejng neutralised by the chieftainess sitting above him.
He imagined them being whirled round and round and being absorbed, and, to give vent to his feelings, he exclaimed,
Aha ha!
Kikiki kakaka kauana!
Kei waniwania taku tara
Kei tarawahia, kei te rua it te kerokero!
Then he realised that the protecting powers of the chieftainess could be destroyed if amatory advances were made by her husband, and that to save himself he would have to be watchful and see that his protector was not disturbed.
Thus he whispered:
He Pounga rahui te uira ka rarapa;
Ketekete kauana to peru kairiri.
Mau au e koro e
Hi! Ha!
Ka wehi au ka matakana.
Ko wai te tangata kia rere ure? Tirohanga nga rua rerarera
Nga rua kuri kakanui i raro!
When the pursuers arrived, they enquired of Te Wharerangi whether he had seen Te Rauparaha and were informed that he had fled in the direction of the Rangipo desert.
For a moment they did not believe him, but later hurried off in pursuit.
When all was clear, Te Wharerangi asked his wife to let Te Rauparaha out.
During the time Tauteka was talking to Te Wharerangi, Te Rauparaha muttered under his breath...
'Aha ha! Ka mate, ka mate!' - 'I die, 1 die!'
When his pursuers were convinced he was not in Te Wharerangi's pa but had made for Taranaki, he exclaimed, 'Ka ora, ka ora! Tenei te tangata puhuruhuru nana nei i tiki mai whakawhiti te ra!' - 'I live, I live! For this is the hairy man who has fetched the sun and caused it to shine again!
As he took his first two steps out of the pit, he said, 'hupane, kaupane!' and as he stood clear he shouted, 'whiti te ra!' - 'The sun shines!'
Going on to the courtyard of Te Wharerangi and before Te Rangikoaea and the assembled people, Te Rauparaha performed his famous haka...
Aha ha!
Kiki kakaka kauana
Kei waniwaniwa taku tara.
Kei tarawahia, kei te rua i te kerokero!
He pounga rahui te uira ka rarapa;
Ketekete kau ana to peru kairiri
Mau au e koro e
Hi! Ha!
Ka wehi au ka matakana,
Kowai te tangata kia rere ure?
Tirohanga nga rua rerarera
Nga rua kuri kakanui i raro!
aha ha!
A Ka mate! Ka mate! Ka ora! Ka ora!
I die! I die! I live! I live!
Ka mate! Ka mate! Ka ora! Ka ora!
I die! I die! I live! I live!
Tenei te tangata puhuru huru
This is the hairy man
Nana nei i tiki mai
Who fetched the Sun
Whakawhiti te ra
And caused it to shine again
A upa ... ne! ka upa ... ne!
One upward step! Another upward step!
A upane kaupane whiti te ra!
An upward step, another.. the Sun shines!!
Hi !!'
Quote from: AQMP on September 09, 2011, 10:49:00 AM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=weUHwCjeD7s&feature=related
Willie Anderson goes toe to toe with Buck Shelford at Lansdowne Rd 1989
these boys didnt just stand and take it either!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8eGCsEQ15L4 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8eGCsEQ15L4)
Is that what it was like this morning or did they wait for one another to finish?
They waited. That incident almost sparked a diplomatic outcry :)
Quote from: Dinny Breen on September 09, 2011, 11:38:26 AM
What the Haka has become to me is rubbish, teams aren't allowed confront as per Willie Anderson above, there is a strict 10m no go-zone enforced, they are forced to stand and watch as NZ get their mental focus up.
Wales wanted to perform their National Anthem after the Haka a few years ago and NZ responded with 'That's a lack of respect' and did their Haka in the dressing room I kid you not. To me that is rubbish not the actual war dance but the bullsh*t around it.
To me the actual war dance, the hype around it, teams forced to respectfully stand and watch it (loved it years ago when Campese played kick uppies in his own 22) is a distinct competitive advantage and is against the spirit of sport. This is of course just my opinion.
Well said, if they can get away with making throat slashing gestures on the field of play at their opponents then why can they opposition not do what they want. There should be no rule in the sport for the haka FFS, its not part of the game and no team should have to obide by restrictions because of it. The Australian womens team got in bother over it too:
http://www.smh.com.au/rugby-union/union-news/wallabies-face-fine-for-any-haka-high-jinks-before-bledisloe-test-20100909-153c9.html (http://www.smh.com.au/rugby-union/union-news/wallabies-face-fine-for-any-haka-high-jinks-before-bledisloe-test-20100909-153c9.html)
Should Fionn Carr have gone to the world cup? He is playing well for Leinster at the moment. He could look like a superstar when he gets to play with the full Leinster A team. He woukd be similar to Ashton as a player.
Quote from: Dinny Breen on September 09, 2011, 10:46:32 AM
Quote from: AZOffaly on September 09, 2011, 10:41:13 AM
I don't think it is rubbish, but I do think it's part of the All Black Brand.
Still raises the hair on my neck when I see them do it in a big game. If they didn't do it for every test it might be a bit more meaningful as distinct from being part of the package.
If Dublin win the All-Ireland would you be happy to hear Brand Dublin been talked about? I use Dublin in this context as they would be the most obvious county to commercialise...
Call me a traditionalist but I hate when people refer to sports teams as a brand, talk about losing your soul and identity..
+1.
Quote from: Capt Pat on September 09, 2011, 08:45:24 PM
Should Fionn Carr have gone to the world cup? He is playing well for Leinster at the moment. He could look like a superstar when he gets to play with the full Leinster A team. He woukd be similar to Ashton as a player.
He should have stayed playing football for Ardclough!
Why am I watching this shite. Scotland and Romania are poor enough.
The commentators chat shite to.
Ha. Scottish defence is shite, try for Romania.
Quote from: Armaghgeddon on September 10, 2011, 02:34:09 AM
Why am I watching this shite. Scotland and Romania are poor enough.
The commentators chat shite to.
Ha. Scottish defence is shite, try for Romania.
First 20 minutes was competitive enough stuff anyway - had enough and called it a day, up early to watch tail end of Frenchies and then hopefully the wheels coming off the chariot!!
Quote from: Celt_Man on September 10, 2011, 02:58:16 AM
Quote from: Armaghgeddon on September 10, 2011, 02:34:09 AM
Why am I watching this shite. Scotland and Romania are poor enough.
The commentators chat shite to.
Ha. Scottish defence is shite, try for Romania.
First 20 minutes was competitive enough stuff anyway - had enough and called it a day, up early to watch tail end of Frenchies and then hopefully the wheels coming off the chariot!!
Scotland are playing themselves out of this. Commentator blaming the conditions for Patterson missing two easy kicks...ffs it isnt like Scotland has better weather.
Scotland on the ropes.shock could be on
go on romania 12 mins to go for the shock of the tournament
heartbreak for romania.great performance from them though.scotland dont have a decent half back pair.
namibia beating fiji 12 7 after fifteen minutes.three drop goals for namibia.the penalty they got was kicked from their own ten metre line.some kick.
What channel is showing it?
ITV and Setanta Sports have the games. What does Scotlands poor form say about Irelands chances.
The French are struggling to pull away from the Japs as well.
Quote from: Capt Pat on September 10, 2011, 08:02:43 AM
ITV and Setanta Sports have the games. What does Scotlands poor form say about Irelands chances.
Cheers Pat. Ireland should get through the group... After that, who knows on the day what way things could turn out but they have the players to reach the final
The French are really struggling now only 25-18 ahead after 54 minutes. The ref is helping them out as well.
The French are really struggling now. Only leading 25-21 after 60 minutes. Skrla off Parra is now at 10???
Crisis over 35-21, 7 minutes to go . They really did look like they were in trouble at one stage.
Great game between the French and Japan. Best game so far. France looked like contenders for a while. I guess no one wants to empty the tank too early.
Hairy Japanese Bastards
Really like the Argentina jersey. Wheres a good one to pick one up?
Jesus Phil Vickery is another dose... Trying to do his best Brian Moore impression!! c**k!
The Argies shouldnt be kicking all these penos. They should have put that ball in the corner.
England are a dirty team another over the top and late tackle knocks another player out of the world cup.
Another player knocked out by Lawes. A disgrace he should be cited.
Laws will surely be cited after that latest one. The ould all black jersies don't look so good at the moment!
Quote from: thejuice on September 10, 2011, 08:58:56 AM
Really like the Argentina jersey. Wheres a good one to pick one up?
Buenos Aires
Quote from: Hoof Hearted on September 10, 2011, 10:26:28 AM
Quote from: thejuice on September 10, 2011, 08:58:56 AM
Really like the Argentina jersey. Wheres a good one to pick one up?
Buenos Aires
Jeese you are no help. You can get them in Rozario that isca few mioes closer.
Going cheap here - http://www.newrugbyshirts.co.uk/5983/adidas-2011-argentina-rugby-world-cup-home-rugby-shirt/
Or knock £20 off - http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/adidas-Argentina-Rugby-Union-Home-Shirt-2011-2012-/260842716490?pt=UK_Rugby_Shirts&var=&hash=item826579fd9e#ht_1298wt_1141
Quote from: ONeill on September 10, 2011, 10:34:39 AM
Going cheap here - http://www.newrugbyshirts.co.uk/5983/adidas-2011-argentina-rugby-world-cup-home-rugby-shirt/
@ PRICE: £64.99 !
Bargain !!
Argies are wasting some amount of possession and penalties
a decent place kicker for the Argies and england would be dead and buried. Wilkinson missing too which is unlike him. Yachvilli gave a masterclass earlier
This should be torture but it is strangely comical.
I like the commentator whinging about Argentina persistently infringing. Classic comedy.
Quote from: Hoof Hearted on September 10, 2011, 10:43:13 AM
a decent place kicker for the Argies and england would be dead and buried. Wilkinson missing too which is unlike him. Yachvilli gave a masterclass earlier
Most of those kicks were too far out to attempt.
That Argentine prop wasn't off his feet. This is a brital match.
The kicking has been poor so far. Even Carter missed a couple. The Japanese lad missed one right in front of the posts too.
Come on the Argies!!!
FFS I'm a jinx...
Swing Low!
Fookers have it....
I am delighted we managed to avoid these two teams in the draw and the Scots as well. A demonstration from both teams in how not to play the game.
Boooooo.
Thats it, I am going to bed havent missed a game and havent slept either. What a load of collix some of these games have been!
Fifteen men behind the ball on both sides. I dunno.
Vickery has to be the worst co-commentator ever. "Come on England!". FFS. His only comment on the try was "England have a try". There was about fifteen seconds of silence while we and the commentator waited for the analysis. Nothing, so the commentator just resumed telling us what we were watching. When we saw the replay of the Puma winger being tackled yards after he kicked ahead right at the end, Vickery's response was a doubtful "Mmmmmm ..." I'll see Martin Carney in a new light after this. Very much so.
Are England wearing the black kit just to piss off NZ? It looked like they bought it in Penneys, with all the numbers falling off, some even on subs as they came on.
Quote from: Hardy on September 10, 2011, 12:24:40 PM
Fifteen men behind the ball on both sides. I dunno.
Vickery has to be the worst co-commentator ever. "Come on England!". FFS. His only comment on the try was "England have a try". There was about fifteen seconds of silence while we and the commentator waited for the analysis. Nothing, so the commentator just resumed telling us what we were watching. When we saw the replay of the Puma winger being tackled yards after he kicked ahead right at the end, Vickery's response was a doubtful "Mmmmmm ..." I'll see Martin Carney in a new light after this. Very much so.
Are England wearing the black kit just to piss off NZ? It looked like they bought it in Penneys, with all the numbers falling off, some even on subs as they came on.
I thought you'd love that! ;)
Quote from: Hardy on September 10, 2011, 12:24:40 PM
Fifteen men behind the ball on both sides. I dunno.
Vickery has to be the worst co-commentator ever. "Come on England!". FFS. His only comment on the try was "England have a try". There was about fifteen seconds of silence while we and the commentator waited for the analysis. Nothing, so the commentator just resumed telling us what we were watching. When we saw the replay of the Puma winger being tackled yards after he kicked ahead right at the end, Vickery's response was a doubtful "Mmmmmm ..." I'll see Martin Carney in a new light after this. Very much so.
Are England wearing the black kit just to piss off NZ? It looked like they bought it in Penneys, with all the numbers falling off, some even on subs as they came on.
I was just about to post asking if anybody else found the commentary hard to take but a pre emptive strike has been made. Making reference to the game being played "on the banks of the Pacific" kind of stood out for some reason. Not a peculiarly English or ITV thing either, that dude Michael Corcoran can be hard to take when getting worked up about things. Commentary, less is more in my book. Game a bit of a bore, this scrum crack is an awful pile in my opinion
Are England wearing the black kit just to piss off NZ? It looked like they bought it in Penneys, with all the numbers falling off, some even on subs as they came on
It it's a deliberate Pommie ploy to get under the Kiwi skins I'll forgive them for at least 2 of the 800 years. Kiwi's seem incredibly thin skinned about most things Rugby
Is Courtney Lawes going to be cited for takng 2 Argies out of the game at the end of the First half? Will the Argies cite him? Ireland decided not to cite the English player who gouged Healy for some unknown reason.
Jaysus I found the "commentary" from Vickery was just desperate - didn't really listen to the analysis at full time so can't comment on it
Ì can honestly say this is one of the best Haka challenge's ever..
Brilliant Haka Challenge (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nk2Cwl_flZc&feature=player_embedded)
Quote from: Dinny Breen on September 10, 2011, 02:33:35 PM
Ì can honestly say this is one of the best Haka challenge's ever..
Brilliant Haka Challenge (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nk2Cwl_flZc&feature=player_embedded)
What exactly are you wearing there Dinny?
Jesus, Scotland were shite!
I wonder is there hay to be made backing the weaker team on the handicap, is there still the incentive of an extra point for 4 tries or more ?
Another early start....
Game 1: Australia vs Italy [Group C] 4:30am
Game 2: Ireland vs USA [Group C] 7:00am
Game 3: South Africa vs Wales [Group D] 9:30am
Australia to win by between 20-26 points. Australia are simnply too strong for Italy.
Ireland to win by between 11-15 points. Ireland usually hammer USA but they are improving and its the WC.
South Africa to win by between 5-9 points. South Africa still have enough in them to see off Wales.
Maddog this is the scoring system...
Win - 4 points
Draw - 2 points
Loss - 0 points
4 or more tries - 1 point
Loss by 7 points or less - 1 point
Is it possible to get the bonus point for 4 or more tries if you lose the game?
Yes you can still get the bonus point by scoring 4+ tries and lose the game.
The rugby world cup is a like a history lesson in England's world dominance
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zB5eu0EwK34&feature=related
Hilarious
Mon Ireland
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=inoy6eoPvdU&feature=related
Ireland u20's challenge the New Zealand u20's Haka - JWC
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OjKHFvyn4bY
Loves the way the commentors can't stand Ireland doing what they done, ungracious, unworthy - personally didn't see too much long in it. Don't think I could just stand there and watch them psyche you out like that. I'd either do what the lads did there or not watch it at all (probably the latter)
For feck's sake, is this World Cup thing not over yet?
7 on a Sunday morning. Away on with that shite
The Aussies without their bestvplayer a self inflicted wound, now have the weather against them. What about an upset?
Italys defence is playing very well here.
Almost HT and only 3 in it.
6-6 at the break. The Aussies have had enough of the ball but not their best outside back to use it. The Italians even made a few stupid mistakes in that half orcthey would be leading.
Anyone have links to watch the matches for free?
Quote from: DrinkingHarp on September 11, 2011, 05:34:01 AM
Anyone have links to watch the matches for free?
http://www.itv.com/itv1/
The Italians have died on their feet. after only 55 minutes. O'Connor came on and has played a part in all three tries after the Aussies decided to play a bit.
25-6
Quote from: Capt Pat on September 11, 2011, 05:48:31 AM
The Italians have died on their feet. after only 55 minutes. O'Connor came on and has played a part in all three tries after the Aussies decided to play a bit.
25-6
Bergumasco's run there was the slowest I have ever seen :D
Quote from: Armaghgeddon on September 11, 2011, 05:41:36 AM
Quote from: DrinkingHarp on September 11, 2011, 05:34:01 AM
Anyone have links to watch the matches for free?
http://www.itv.com/itv1/
Thanks, but doesnt work stateside.
Any other links? Anyone?
Quote from: DrinkingHarp on September 11, 2011, 06:04:40 AM
Quote from: Armaghgeddon on September 11, 2011, 05:41:36 AM
Quote from: DrinkingHarp on September 11, 2011, 05:34:01 AM
Anyone have links to watch the matches for free?
http://www.itv.com/itv1/
Thanks, but doesnt work stateside.
Any other links? Anyone?
http://www.ilemi.me/27516/1/Watch-Ireland-vs-USA/
Check it when game starts.
Phil Vickery is impersonating a commentator yet again.
Quote from: Armaghgeddon on September 11, 2011, 06:13:14 AM
Quote from: DrinkingHarp on September 11, 2011, 06:04:40 AM
Quote from: Armaghgeddon on September 11, 2011, 05:41:36 AM
Quote from: DrinkingHarp on September 11, 2011, 05:34:01 AM
Anyone have links to watch the matches for free?
http://www.itv.com/itv1/
Thanks, but doesnt work stateside.
Any other links? Anyone?
http://www.ilemi.me/27516/1/Watch-Ireland-vs-USA/
Check it when game starts.
Phil Vickery is impersonating a commentator yet again.
Working so far, showing highlights of the best tries.
A big thank you!!
Oh Feck! Ngwenya is playing, not even Habana could catch him.
The American fans butchered their moments silence for 9-11.
DrinkingHarp:
Here is a link with audio
http://lsh.lshunter.tv/index1.php?option=com_lsh&view=lsh&event_id=61715&tid=206010&channel=0&tmpl=component&layout=popup
Watching on ITV. Don't think the commentators know anything about the USA team. Ireland can win this with forwards. The mauls and scrums will kill them. Open play and tackling on the run is more natural for them.
Quote from: thejuice on September 11, 2011, 07:12:32 AM
Watching on ITV. Don't think the commentators know anything about the USA team. Ireland can win this with forwards. The mauls and scrums will kill them. Open play and tackling on the run is more natural for them.
They wont win it with the penalties anyway.
bring back eddie all is forgiven ;)
Maybe Bowe was just nervous, this is his first world cup match, try should settle him down
Quote from: Declan on September 11, 2011, 07:35:45 AM
bring back eddie all is forgiven ;)
Jaysus Dec nearly choked on my cornflakes here.
I think the performance has been not bad and we showed good patience, the Yanks have put a massive amount of commitment and effort into that 1st half, Ireland should pull away now and win by about 30 points plus..
Midfield is a worry though..
Its the rain I'd say. Still we can win this handy enough. Where can I get odds on the USA not scoring.
We should never have let Eddie go..................so late in the day after all the damage was done.
We should have been putting up high kicks for Bowe to chase in the first half.
Quote from: thejuice on September 11, 2011, 07:54:04 AM
Its the rain I'd say. Still we can win this handy enough. Where can I get odds on the USA not scoring.
Rain me bollix - to quote Hook "This is a shambles". We''ll be ate alive by Australia and the Italians will be no pushover.
Quote from: comethekingdom on September 11, 2011, 07:59:38 AM
Quote from: thejuice on September 11, 2011, 07:54:04 AM
Its the rain I'd say. Still we can win this handy enough. Where can I get odds on the USA not scoring.
Rain me bollix - to quote Hook "This is a shambles". We''ll be ate alive by Australia and the Italians will be no pushover.
George Hook is a rugby Nuala..
Tongie in cheek Dinny
Jaysus what's with the kicking though - Sexton's attempts are poor
Quote from: Dinny Breen on September 11, 2011, 08:01:22 AM
Quote from: comethekingdom on September 11, 2011, 07:59:38 AM
Quote from: thejuice on September 11, 2011, 07:54:04 AM
Its the rain I'd say. Still we can win this handy enough. Where can I get odds on the USA not scoring.
Rain me bollix - to quote Hook "This is a shambles". We''ll be ate alive by Australia and the Italians will be no pushover.
George Hook is a rugby Nuala..
Ireland are playing against a heap of amateurs and are shite. Sexton having a 'mare with the boot.
Quote from: comethekingdom on September 11, 2011, 08:06:14 AM
Quote from: Dinny Breen on September 11, 2011, 08:01:22 AM
Quote from: comethekingdom on September 11, 2011, 07:59:38 AM
Quote from: thejuice on September 11, 2011, 07:54:04 AM
Its the rain I'd say. Still we can win this handy enough. Where can I get odds on the USA not scoring.
Rain me bollix - to quote Hook "This is a shambles". We''ll be ate alive by Australia and the Italians will be no pushover.
George Hook is a rugby Nuala..
Ireland are playing against a heap of amateurs and are shite. Sexton having a 'mare with the boot.
So based on the 1st half what was shite about Ireland's performance, knocking on a ball in those conditions is to be expected but other than that we retained possession, managed the game pretty well and dominated the set-piece and showed patience against a side playing with an emotional frenzy.
Quote from: Declan on September 11, 2011, 08:03:32 AM
Tongie in cheek Dinny
Jaysus what's with the kicking though - Sexton's attempts are poor
Inclined to believe that the new ball is causing the issues, normally reliable kickers missing too many kicks although Sextons last one was a shocker..
Sexton couldnt hit a cows arse with a banjo...O'Gara couidnt hit it with a guitar.
Changing the 1/2 backs has made the difference. Hope they can go on now and buid a good score and finish with some confidence!
Game is won any way.
England 28 USA 10 opening game of the last tournament for them. They fell away in the last 25 minutes against South Africa in that tournament.
Quote from: thejuice on September 11, 2011, 08:28:17 AM
Game is won any way.
Not yet, need another try for bonus point.
America are coming in at all angles in the ruck.
The USA are brutal. We shouldnt be scrapping for a bonus point.
I cant see Sexy starting against aussies after that.
Ferris and POC best of our lot.
nothing surprising really - we'll scrape out in second place in the group and be beaten in the quarters - the amount of basic errors we make is frightening
f**king idiots!
D'arcy shades of stringer 2007 >:(
o'gara kicks away a stupid ball and d'arcy continues his poor form - in a nutshell that last 10 min sums up Irelands problems
Australia sh*tting it..
Well that was fairly brutal!
Dire. Only positive was Ferris.
It's very frustrating as the platform was there at half-time, a bad defeat next week and the Italian game will be a nightmare..
By all accounts I'm glad I didn't set the clock
Is the loss of a bonus point today likely to have any impact?
Will Kearney, Healy & O'Brien be back for next week ?
Maul works a lot better with Best on field. I hate to see Flannery at the back of one.
Quote from: Maguire01 on September 11, 2011, 08:54:52 AM
Is the loss of a bonus point today likely to have any impact?
Who knows, depends on the results against Oz and Italy, highly unlikely in the long run..
I didn't think that was woeful. There are obviously problems but, given the run in, they'll be happy with a win, and a good forward performance. The backs are not clicking, and even though Earls looked a bit livlier today, he's in danger. DArcy has to be dropped as well. Can Trimble play international centre?
Sexton's kicking was woeful, as was Rog's first effort, but all goalkickers seem to be struggling down there.
You wouldn't win the world cup with that performance, but it's hard to win it in the first game anyway!
By the way, if you have no talent, the best way of getting on TV is to be a black springboks fan. The camera WILL find you.
Quote from: Donnellys Hollow on September 11, 2011, 08:46:40 AM
Dire. Only positive was Ferris.
Add in Paul O'Connell- easily Irelands best player since season started.
Depressing performance
Quote from: haze on September 11, 2011, 09:37:16 AM
Quote from: Donnellys Hollow on September 11, 2011, 08:46:40 AM
Dire. Only positive was Ferris.
Add in Paul O'Connell- easily Irelands best player since season started.
Depressing performance
He was dominant in the lineout but you'd expect that of him against the US. (Similar comments would apply to Best because the Australians will actually contest in the air).
O'Connell was average enough in the loose though and he appears to have little or no impact as a ball carrier anymore. The amount of times he picks and drives with his head down and makes barely a yard is unreal. Ferris was the one man in the back row who took the fight to their pack. Jennings was totally outplayed by Clever and Heaslip isn't in good form. Why when the scrum was so dominant did he not pick off the base on a few occasions?
Big calls at 7, 9, 10 and 12 ahead of next week.
Quote from: Dinny Breen on September 11, 2011, 08:59:29 AM
Quote from: Maguire01 on September 11, 2011, 08:54:52 AM
Is the loss of a bonus point today likely to have any impact?
Who knows, depends on the results against Oz and Italy, highly unlikely in the long run..
We most likely won't need the bonus point. A draw with Italy being the only likely scenario where it would count.
Not as bad a performance as might be made out. The pack were well on top and made it a very one sided game.
Healy and Kearney will be back for the next game and it will hopefully put to bed talk of Sean O Brien not playing at 7 the next day. There is no other way.
If Jennings gout out played by Clever Should we Give Pocock a go against him.
Or just pick our best ball carrier and potential game winner at this point in time.
Quote from: Donnellys Hollow link=topic=19967.msg1015745#msg1015745 :) :) :)date=1315730661
Quote from: haze on September 11, 2011, 09:37:16 AM
Quote from: :)Donnellys Hollow on September 11, 2011, 08:46:40 AM
Dire. Only positive was Ferris.
Add in Paul O'Connell- easily Irelands best player since season started.
Depressing performance
He was dominant in the lineout but you'd expect that of him against the US. (Similar comments would apply to Best because the Australians will actually contest in the air).
O'Connell was average enough in the loose though and he appears to have little or no impact as a ball carrier anymore. The amount of times he picks and drives with his head down and makes barely a yard is unreal. Ferris was the one man in the back row who took the fight to their pack. Jennings was totally outplayed by Clever and Heaslip isn't in good form. Why when the scrum was so dominant did he not pick off the base on a few occasions?
Big calls at 7, 9, 10 and 12 ahead of next week.
Wales are up 16 - 10 against the Springboks after being down 7-0 after 2 minutes. Matfield has gone off injured.
South Africa with a try from Hoogard take the lead. 17-16
Quote from: Capt Pat on September 11, 2011, 09:47:59 AM
Healy and Kearney will be back for the next game and it will hopefully put to bed talk of Sean O Brien not playing at 7 the next day. There is no other way.
My sources tell me Healy wont be available. SOB is struggling too.
That was a very poor display today.
Jaysus that was poor stuff there today - taking the point on from the RTÉ boys, Ireland seem to have a problem thinking on their feet - they were all over them in the maul, scrum and to a lesser extend line out. What would have been wrong with "sticking it up the jumper" and scoring some tries in the first half through the front 5 and then try the backs when you're well in front....
Quote from: Celt_Man on September 11, 2011, 11:37:05 AM
Jaysus that was poor stuff there today - taking the point on from the RTÉ boys, Ireland seem to have a problem thinking on their feet - they were all over them in the maul, scrum and to a lesser extend line out. What would have been wrong with "sticking it up the jumper" and scoring some tries in the first half through the front 5 and then try the backs when you're well in front....
If winning the game was the only objective yes, Ireland however need their back-line performing starving them of front-line ball isn't going to help in the long run.
I'll reiterate again, Ireland's problems stem from midfield, D'Arcy's and to a less extend O'Driscoll's form is killing the team, it was obvious in the 6 nations, even more obvious in the warm-up games. If D'Arcy plays next Saturday Ireland will not even get a moral victory in defeat..
Sam Warburton didn't deserve to lose today..
QuoteQuote from: Dinny Breen on Today at 11:55:35 AM
Quote from: Celt_Man on Today at 11:37:05 AM
Jaysus that was poor stuff there today - taking the point on from the RTÉ boys, Ireland seem to have a problem thinking on their feet - they were all over them in the maul, scrum and to a lesser extend line out. What would have been wrong with "sticking it up the jumper" and scoring some tries in the first half through the front 5 and then try the backs when you're well in front....
If winning the game was the only objective yes, Ireland however need their back-line performing starving them of front-line ball isn't going to help in the long run.
I'll reiterate again, Ireland's problems stem from midfield, D'Arcy's and to a less extend O'Driscoll's form is killing the team, it was obvious in the 6 nations, even more obvious in the warm-up games. If D'Arcy plays next Saturday Ireland will not even get a moral victory in defeat..
Sam Warburton didn't deserve to lose today..
The reason D'Arcy will start is that we don't have a proper 7. Our midfield is supposed to make up for that deficiency which . Dropping D'Arcy for a makeshift 12 (BOD or Trimble or whatever) will be disastrous. Kidney should have dealt with this though as it has been coming for a long time.
He could have and probably should have blooded James Downey like he did Murray.
The game has moved on Muppet, the breakdown is completely different D'Arcy and O'Driscoll don't win turnovers anymore as the tackler has to disengage whereas those two were masters at surfing the ball carrier and ripping the ball.
D'Arcy should not be starting, as for James Downey, give us a break, he's a crash ball merchant who failed at Leinster and Connacht and does ok at Northamption because the English game is just bish bosh bash.
McFadden can play at 12 or even Sexton in a 5/8 role, f*ck it shit on a stick would be better than D'Arcy, as soon the ball goes to him we are playing a retreating ruck, which is slow ball. You need quick ball in the modern game.
Quote from: Dinny Breen on September 11, 2011, 12:55:58 PM
QuoteQuote from: Dinny Breen on Today at 11:55:35 AM
Quote from: Celt_Man on Today at 11:37:05 AM
Jaysus that was poor stuff there today - taking the point on from the RTÉ boys, Ireland seem to have a problem thinking on their feet - they were all over them in the maul, scrum and to a lesser extend line out. What would have been wrong with "sticking it up the jumper" and scoring some tries in the first half through the front 5 and then try the backs when you're well in front....
If winning the game was the only objective yes, Ireland however need their back-line performing starving them of front-line ball isn't going to help in the long run.
I'll reiterate again, Ireland's problems stem from midfield, D'Arcy's and to a less extend O'Driscoll's form is killing the team, it was obvious in the 6 nations, even more obvious in the warm-up games. If D'Arcy plays next Saturday Ireland will not even get a moral victory in defeat..
Sam Warburton didn't deserve to lose today..
The reason D'Arcy will start is that we don't have a proper 7. Our midfield is supposed to make up for that deficiency which . Dropping D'Arcy for a makeshift 12 (BOD or Trimble or whatever) will be disastrous. Kidney should have dealt with this though as it has been coming for a long time.
He could have and probably should have blooded James Downey like he did Murray.
The game has moved on Muppet, the breakdown is completely different D'Arcy and O'Driscoll don't win turnovers anymore as the tackler has to disengage whereas those two were masters at surfing the ball carrier and ripping the ball.
D'Arcy should not be starting, as for James Downey, give us a break, he's a crash ball merchant who failed at Leinster and Connacht and does ok at Northamption because the English game is just bish bosh bash.
McFadden can play at 12 or even Sexton in a 5/8 role, f*ck it shit on a stick would be better than D'Arcy, as soon the ball goes to him we are playing a retreating ruck, which is slow ball. You need quick ball in the modern game.
I always thought BOD played his best rugby outside a bish bosh bash merchant such as Maggs, Henderson and Roberts. Anything is better than what we have.
Is international rugby dying a turgid death? hard to believe this is a world cup tournament. This game and the England v Argentina game were pretty dire. The ITV commentator on a Johnny Wilkinson 25 drop out, 'he hits it high in the air so his players can get up there on time' jesus wept! I was waiting for a description of a penalty kick towards goal 'he tries to hit the ball so it lands between the posts'
I heard one of them saying that Wilkinson missed so many because of the air pressure in the stadium. Fack aff
What's this about a new ball? Do they have to have a new ball for every World Cup? Whatever about the ball, it seems to me Sexton has changed his kicking routine. He puts in a little pause after the first step that I never noticed before. I don't know whether he's doing a Padraig Harrington and redesigning his technique or it's just a yip in his routine he's not aware of.
Are you not allowed to wear gloves in rugby? Gaelic players would be wearing gloves in those conditions. Very hard to catch a wet ball without them.
Hardy, there is no standard rugby ball ala O'Neills for football and hurling. Ireland use a Gilbert, Italy a Mitre, Wales a Web Ellis, France use to use an Adidas or a Puma and so forth..
Gilbert won the WC contract
Interesting quote from Johnny Wilkinson
QuoteWorld Cup balls or the unfamiliar fixed roof of the Otago Stadium when England launch their tournament on Saturday. Wilkinson was unhappy with the type of ball used during the 2007 tournament in France but is entering this month's competition in a more positive mood.
"The balls have changed a little bit so we're working every day just to get used to it," said the prolific fly-half, speaking on the eve of a fourth World Cup as England's deadliest kicker. "No one likes change when it comes to high pressure stuff but it's the same for everyone. I'm not averse to a bit of grumpiness when it comes to changing balls but you've got to get on with it. You have to try and dominate the ball rather than let it do the opposite. If I kick a ball at this World Cup I will do it confidently."
As for the gloves, you can wear IRB sanctioned fingerless gloves with grips, some players wear them, Steve Thompson been the best example that I can think of.
That's interesting, DB. Its seems surprising that there's not a tighter spec on the ball as regards dimensions, weight, material and finish. At least i assume it's not a very tight spec if players are able to notice differences between balls. It also surprises me that so few players wear gloves in the wet. Maybe it makes sense for forwards - gloves might adversely affect grip in scrummaging, rucking, or whatever but I'd have thought any such disadvantage for backs would be more that compensated for by the improved ability to hold onto a greasy ball.
was thinking that the new ball must be rubbish as so many good kickers missed way more than usual. However Steyn from SA showed that he wasnt affected by this. Maybe he is the only one and is a bit of a oddity here.
Biggest plus so far at the wc is that the refs are starting to consistently penalise offsides and handling on the deck. England really got caught cold on that.
I stil think there are a few forward passes that are not being blown - hard to see from TV angles - but I thought that in the early SA try v wales that there may have been a forward pass in the build up !
Still wales threw it away. Best game of the opening round for me.
Quote from: lynchbhoy on September 12, 2011, 10:04:57 AM
was thinking that the new ball must be rubbish as so many good kickers missed way more than usual. However Steyn from SA showed that he wasnt affected by this. Maybe he is the only one and is a bit of a oddity here.
Biggest plus so far at the wc is that the refs are starting to consistently penalise offsides and handling on the deck. England really got caught cold on that.
I stil think there are a few forward passes that are not being blown - hard to see from TV angles - but I thought that in the early SA try v wales that there may have been a forward pass in the build up !
Still wales threw it away. Best game of the opening round for me.
Agree with the forward pass in the Saffers' try.
Strongly disagree on refereeing consistency, at least where minnows are concerned... I think it was Setanta who had a package of examples where the big nations were all over the ball on the deck, off their feet and weren't penalised this weekend.
Quote from: mc_grens on September 12, 2011, 10:10:23 AM
Quote from: lynchbhoy on September 12, 2011, 10:04:57 AM
was thinking that the new ball must be rubbish as so many good kickers missed way more than usual. However Steyn from SA showed that he wasnt affected by this. Maybe he is the only one and is a bit of a oddity here.
Biggest plus so far at the wc is that the refs are starting to consistently penalise offsides and handling on the deck. England really got caught cold on that.
I stil think there are a few forward passes that are not being blown - hard to see from TV angles - but I thought that in the early SA try v wales that there may have been a forward pass in the build up !
Still wales threw it away. Best game of the opening round for me.
Agree with the forward pass in the Saffers' try.
Strongly disagree on refereeing consistency, at least where minnows are concerned... I think it was Setanta who had a package of examples where the big nations were all over the ball on the deck, off their feet and weren't penalised this weekend.
penalised a hell of a lot more than usual.
I wrote on this board a while back that if refs were to blow for every transgression, rugby would be way worse than american football and would be a penalty every minute.
thats not what world rugby want in order to promote and showcase their games, but imo what they need to bring back the proper playing of the game and eradicate the cheating that has become part and parcel of each teams approach to modern rugby.
England were never blown as much before.
I didnt see all the games or fell asleep for large parts of the ones I did watch !! - but I thought that the refs were way stricter than usual.
So if you think that a lot was missed- you are right, but usually this is always missed and normally not highlighted by TV stations - so well done setanta.
Looks like our Courtney could be in a spot of bother . . .
http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/rugby_union/14870264.stm
didnt think it was intentional - more of an awkward tackle plus a bit late - like his other hit on an argie - late and maybe deserving of a yelow card.
IMO neither are citing offenses.
Agree with LB, slow motion makes it look worse, think he was just covering and wanted to make sure Ledesma went into touch. A penalty for leading with his knee imho.
In fairness I think the citing is a big harsh. His first tackle made me shudder though you could see the guy's knee crumpling under him and I'd imagine it's a cruciate injury. Was Wallace's injury a cruciate also?!
Lawes did in two players in a little over two minutes of actual playing time. He has to go home.
What part of the rugby players code includes doing in other pro players careers like he did with Tiesi?
This all works out very nicely for the Scots who now won't have to face Tiesi or Lawes in the matches against England or Argentina.
To be honest I thought you were over reacting at the time CP but having looked at it again the first tackle was heavy and very late. Lawes could clearly see your man was going to kick and still went through him. He didn't want Tiesi getting up from that one!
The 2nd one is bad also . . . Jees ye can't do that lads!!
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xl16c6_lawes-desosse-tiesi-et-ledesma_sport
First one is very late and a very very tackle but the second one is a total disgrace....
How in the name of jaysus is it ok to tackle a boy lying on the ground by sliding in with your knees to his shoulder/neck/head area??
The tackle on Tiesi the kicker gets worse the more I look at it. The thing is he is kicking the ball away not taking it into contact. What Lawes did might have been technically legal but I don't think so. It goes against the spirit of the game.
The most notable injury done to a player when I was in school was from a late tackle on a kicker. It is not how the game is played.
Ireland team to play Australia R Kearney; T Bowe, B O'Driscoll, G D'Arcy, K Earls; J Sexton, E Reddan; C Healy, R Best, M Ross, D O'Callaghan, P O'Connell, S Ferris, J Heaslip, S O'Brien.
Replacements J Flannery, T Court, D Ryan, D Leamy; C Murray, R O'Gara, A Trimble.
D'Arcy must have some serious pictures of Kidneyme!!
Imagine Ireland will flood midfield with big ball carriers as the Australian centres are probably the weakest unit in their team, if we minimize turnovers we have a chance, albeit a very small one..
A potentially great looking team especially the back row if they get their act together.
How good are Australia is the big question? They have beaten the All Blacks twice in the last year however in games that were not 100% competitive. On the flip side they lost against Samoa at home without their best players Beale O Connor Cooper Pocock and Genia. They also lost last autumn by a ridiculous score against England.
They are not as good as some would have you beleive I think. They will be very good in four years but I think we can win on saturday with a bit of luck.
The Scotch are leading Georgia 9-3 at half time despite the best efforts of Dan Parks. Trying to kick the ball out at half time he kicked the ball into the back of one of his own players and it bounced back into his own hands ::) he then got caught by the Georgians who would have had a scrum on the Scottish line if there was any time left. A very funny sequence. Best bit of the game so far.
If georgia had some decent running backs they would be a good side.scotland playing the game they want.spend as much time as possible in the georgia half without actually posing a serious threat.
Canada produced a bit of a shock earlier by beating tonga.good game to watch.tonga seemed to take the canadians for granted.
Going with all the smaller teams in the handicap betting would have been very profitable so far.
Quote from: Dinny Breen on September 14, 2011, 03:55:22 AM
Ireland team to play Australia R Kearney; T Bowe, B O'Driscoll, G D'Arcy, K Earls; J Sexton, E Reddan; C Healy, R Best, M Ross, D O'Callaghan, P O'Connell, S Ferris, J Heaslip, S O'Brien.
Replacements J Flannery, T Court, D Ryan, D Leamy; C Murray, R O'Gara, A Trimble.
D'Arcy must have some serious pictures of Kidneyme!!
Imagine Ireland will flood midfield with big ball carriers as the Australian centres are probably the weakest unit in their team, if we minimize turnovers we have a chance, albeit a very small one..
a good move during the game would be to take off darcy, switch Sexton out and bring oGara on at fly half.
Better still leave out darcy altogether.
Will be interesting to see if Australia name Oconnor in the starting line up.
Georgia this morning looked fantastic at times. Loved their power pack rucking rugby.
Then they would just stop it as if they had to even it up and throw the ball out to the backs who fecked it up or kicked it away.
Their ful back looked good attacking though.
Georgia havent got the know how yet to win and control games, def have the pack and physicality. their pack can certainly play power rugby.
Quote from: rossie mad on September 14, 2011, 09:59:28 AM
If georgia had some decent running backs they would be a good side.scotland playing the game they want.spend as much time as possible in the georgia half without actually posing a serious threat.
Canada produced a bit of a shock earlier by beating tonga.good game to watch.tonga seemed to take the canadians for granted.
Going with all the smaller teams in the handicap betting would have been very profitable so far.
Haven't Canada beaten Tonga every time they've played them in WC?
Maybe but i would have thought tonga were a better team than the canadians.would you not put the pacific island teams ahead of the likes of the usa and canada
Quote from: AZOffaly on September 14, 2011, 11:26:58 AM
Quote from: rossie mad on September 14, 2011, 09:59:28 AM
If georgia had some decent running backs they would be a good side.scotland playing the game they want.spend as much time as possible in the georgia half without actually posing a serious threat.
Canada produced a bit of a shock earlier by beating tonga.good game to watch.tonga seemed to take the canadians for granted.
Going with all the smaller teams in the handicap betting would have been very profitable so far.
Haven't Canada beaten Tonga every time they've played them in WC?
I think you could be right- either way it was a good competitive game.
Trimble should be ahead of Earls surely?
If Australia are as physical as they seem, then I think Trimble would be better out there alright. Earls is having a bit of a slump at the moment, and that happens to players. He'll be grand, but if he's not a huge attacking threat with ball in hand, then he shouldn't be there, because defensively he's not strong.
Ahh shite... http://www.rte.ie/sport/rugby/worldcup/2011/0914/flanneryj_varleyd_cronins.html
Flannery out of World Cup
Jerry Flannery's Rugby World Cup is over Jerry Flannery has been ruled out of the remainder of the Rugby World Cup because of a calf injury, with Damien Varley called up to the squad.
Flannery broke down in training ahead of the match with Australia on Saturday in Eden Park and a scan has revealed he will face at least six weeks on the sidelines.
Sean Cronin has been promoted to the Ireland bench in place of Flannery for the crucial clash with Australia.
More to follow.
I think Flannery's frame can't take the muscle he's piled on it. I'd meet him a fair bit around UL and in town, and I'm always taken aback by his physique. But he's a small enough man, and looks like a ball of muscle. I think his frame is too weak for it. Don't know how scientific that is :)
Quote from: AZOffaly on September 14, 2011, 01:25:53 PM
I think Flannery's frame can't take the muscle he's piled on it. I'd meet him a fair bit around UL and in town, and I'm always taken aback by his physique. But he's a small enough man, and looks like a ball of muscle. I think his frame is too weak for it. Don't know how scientific that is :)
I'd say he wasn't fully right and it was a gamble but his size as you point out wouldn't have aided his recovery at all.
Big loss...
Quote from: Dinny Breen on September 14, 2011, 01:57:57 PM
Quote from: AZOffaly on September 14, 2011, 01:25:53 PM
I think Flannery's frame can't take the muscle he's piled on it. I'd meet him a fair bit around UL and in town, and I'm always taken aback by his physique. But he's a small enough man, and looks like a ball of muscle. I think his frame is too weak for it. Don't know how scientific that is :)
I'd say he wasn't fully right and it was a gamble but his size as you point out wouldn't have aided his recovery at all.
Big loss...
He's picking up a lot of injuries as well. And while he is a 'strong' man, I don't think he has a strong frame. Like building a huge house on flimsy foundations.
I don't think he's that big a loss to be fair. Best and him are better at different things but overall I would have them level. Both average at darts, flannery better in the loose, Best better in the Scrum the one thing Best would have over Flannery would be his discipline as Flannery is likely to lose the head at a crucial time in a big game.
Quote from: screenexile on September 14, 2011, 02:01:31 PM
I don't think he's that big a loss to be fair. Best and him are better at different things but overall I would have them level. Both average at darts, flannery better in the loose, Best better in the Scrum the one thing Best would have over Flannery would be his discipline as Flannery is likely to lose the head at a crucial time in a big game.
That hasn't happened in a long time in fairness. And Flannery has played in a lot of big games.
Flannery has much better darts than Best. Helped by the fact he throws to POC and DOC with his province as well.
Quote from: AZOffaly on September 14, 2011, 02:11:11 PM
Quote from: screenexile on September 14, 2011, 02:01:31 PM
I don't think he's that big a loss to be fair. Best and him are better at different things but overall I would have them level. Both average at darts, flannery better in the loose, Best better in the Scrum the one thing Best would have over Flannery would be his discipline as Flannery is likely to lose the head at a crucial time in a big game.
That hasn't happened in a long time in fairness. And Flannery has played in a lot of big games.
He hasn't played a full game for Ireland since that fated kick against France . . . I still think he would have been a liability on the big stage.
Quote from: thejuice on September 14, 2011, 01:12:49 PM
Trimble should be ahead of Earls surely?
Absolutely. Trimble's been the stand out guy for Ireland recently. Shocker of a decision.
When does the four proud provinces of Ireland play again?
Not that I would be happy to see a lad not play but if Pocock can't make it that would give Ireland a huge boost I reckon . . .
http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/rugby_union/14811966.stm
New Zealand seemed to put Japan away fairly handy this morning and look to be going well but I'd wait until their first big knockout match to see what way they are shaping up.
Best part of the World Cup is this - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I8o9KyFxppY (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I8o9KyFxppY)
Quote from: Declan on September 16, 2011, 01:41:07 PM
Best part of the World Cup is this - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I8o9KyFxppY (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I8o9KyFxppY)
:D thats a good assesment of setantas coveage. very poor stuff, ITV is much better this world cup
Quote from: blewuporstuffed on September 16, 2011, 01:48:35 PM
Quote from: Declan on September 16, 2011, 01:41:07 PM
Best part of the World Cup is this - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I8o9KyFxppY (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I8o9KyFxppY)
:D thats a good assesment of setantas coveage. very poor stuff, ITV is much better this world cup
ITV is still a bit annoying . . . their Analysis machine is not as cool as Sky's and the lads aren't as adept at using it either.
do rte have the rights to it or whats the story
Quote from: Stevie g 8 on September 16, 2011, 03:17:12 PM
do rte have the rights to it or whats the story
Yes they do!
From RTE.ie:
Watch Ireland v Australia live on RTÉ 2 and RTÉ.ie/sport from 9am, listen on RTÉ Radio or follow live tracking on RTÉ.ie/sport (kick-off 9.30am)
http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/news/3818292/Mike-Tindalls-kiss-video-leaked.html (http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/news/3818292/Mike-Tindalls-kiss-video-leaked.html)
Great the way the English team's biggest threat is their own media, followed by themselves.
Quote from: muppet on September 16, 2011, 04:56:08 PM
http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/news/3818292/Mike-Tindalls-kiss-video-leaked.html (http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/news/3818292/Mike-Tindalls-kiss-video-leaked.html)
Great the way the English team's biggest threat is their own media, followed by themselves.
a few years ago he could have been tried for high treason and sentenced to death by way of hangin, drawin and quarterin! Or the spear tackle as its more commonly known nowadays!! :)
So Pocock is out of the game. I will make an optimistic prediction of an Irish victory. They don't have anything we don't have now. Question is whether we are in good enough form.
Quote from: Capt Pat on September 17, 2011, 08:01:15 AM
So Pocock is out of the game. I will make an optimistic prediction of an Irish victory. They don't have anything we don't have now. Question is whether we are in good enough form.
I'd beg to differ, we definitely don't have anyone in the backs like Kurtley Beale...
Stephen Moore out as well now
any rte streams for outside of Ireland??
Quote from: CiKe on September 17, 2011, 08:47:59 AM
Stephen Moore out as well now
It is set up for us now. No Ioane either. Time to chit or get off the pot.
No team has anyone like Kurtley Beale but we do have Kearney Bowe O Driscoll Earls and Sexton. We can attack.
Rte pictures a sevcond ahead of the sound
I had t switch to ITV cos of this!
We're in for a shoeing here!
We are not going to get a shoeing. Oz had 10 minutes of possession and a supportive referee - the result was 3 points.
at last, i thought we were going to need the gooch to come on and take our scores
That was as good a passage of play as you'll ever see for Sexton's drop goal. Great handling and getting across the gain line in every phase. Is that really Ireland?
O Connor 10 minutes for every kick. >:(
Heaslip was lucky not to get a yellow for that. They will be well rested with joc kicking all the penos.
Any links lads?
Defence unreal it seems they saved that maul defence that was so impressive in the 6N and the Scotland game. Playing ok but need to concentrate on not conceding penalties and not kicking the ball away needlessly!
I would like us to go for the lineout a bit more with this unpredictable ball!
Two very evenly matched teams. Can't believe so many people have Oz as finalists and Ireland as also rans.
Ireland excellent in the first half. Our scrum is well on top...our back row outstanding !
Much improved after shaky first 10. Scrum
Excellent. Kicking poor from Sexton. It's there for the winning.
liked the pick and go from ferris - picking up Genia that is.
My only worry is that Italy were level with Australia at half time and them got humped :( We need even more effort from the lads second half
Game can be watched here
http://www.rojadirecta.me/goto/fanaticosrugby.blogspot.com
but with Argentinian commentary
Why not kick far out penalties to tye corner? The long range penos with this ball are a waste of time.
Quote from: thewobbler on September 17, 2011, 10:15:25 AM
Two very evenly matched teams. Can't believe so many people have Oz as finalists and Ireland as also rans.
The second half will tell a tale in relation to how good both teams are.
http://www.firstrowsports.tv/watch/84114/2/watch-australia-vs-ireland.html (http://www.firstrowsports.tv/watch/84114/2/watch-australia-vs-ireland.html)
Quote from: Capt Pat on September 17, 2011, 10:26:30 AM
Quote from: thewobbler on September 17, 2011, 10:15:25 AM
Two very evenly matched teams. Can't believe so many people have Oz as finalists and Ireland as also rans.
The second half will tell a tale in relation to how good both teams are.
Also dont forget that Oz are missing arguably the best Hooker and the best 7 in world Rugby today. Need to keep it going here though. C'mon Ireland!
Why does the referee run up with the kicker when he's about to kick??? Would surely put you off
ffs get that ball over the line, nerves going here. Come on
Can we start believing yet?
We need some subs!
fuckfuckfuckfuck has the clock stopped, is it going slower or something?
Kick for the corners on doubtful 3 point attempts.
Never thought I could get worked up over a rugby game but this has me pacing the kitchen with nerves
Too late for the Aussies?
crazy to bring court on now!
go tommy run
Yessssssssssssss
Unreal stuff well done Ireland.
Great win!!
I'd just like to take this opportunity to say...
f**k you, David Campese, f**k. You.
Fantastic !
Absolutely magnificent.
Rory Best MoTM for me , but any of the pack has earned it.
Some performance by the pack.
fecking brilliant
front row was brilliant, healy very prominent, thought they showed very good discipline in the second half in contrast to the first. Great start to the w.e.
Looking forward now to Wales vs Samoa could be great running game, and then AIF tomorrow, what a weekend!
Not knowing much about rugby, was Ireland very good or Aussies crap. Irelands effort and commitment all round was immense.
Australia had a good lad called Cooper, but he wasn't enough.
Quote from: mc_grens on September 17, 2011, 11:15:55 AM
I'd just like to take this opportunity to say...
f**k you, David Campese, f**k. You.
add cicfada and anglocelt39 to that list (and them Irish men!)
absolutely brilliant, esp in the conditions. Cian Healy , O'Brien were immense, as was the rest of the pack. BOD carrying a bad shoulder, young Murray doing well after being introduced...big hits, huge intensity etc
good times! Hopefully keep her lit, top the group and take a good bit of momentum into the knock-outs
One of the best ever wins for Irish sport! looking at the draw now could we make the final?
Quote from: thewobbler on September 17, 2011, 11:16:23 AM
Absolutely magnificent.
Rory Best MoTM for me , but any of the pack has earned it.
The front row were savage, Healy my motm but any of the pack could be picked.
Credit to the coaches, Ireland were well prepared and a performance like that doesn't happen per chance.
Semi-final is a realistic goal even a final as NZ, SA and Aus should now end up on the other side of the draw...
who does it look like they would play if they top the group?
Quote from: Blowitupref on September 17, 2011, 11:21:20 AM
One of the best ever wins for Irish sport! looking at the draw now could we make the final?
:-X
Quote from: Carmen Stateside on September 17, 2011, 11:18:54 AM
Not knowing much about rugby, was Ireland very good or Aussies crap. Irelands effort and commitment all round was immense.
all you need to know is that Australia are reigning Tri-Nations champions and we beat them on the other side of the world in the world cup. brilliant
What a game. Who says you need tries to have a thriller? I was screaming like a little girl when Bowe intercepted that pass and ran up the field at the end. Great stuff.
Brilliant win, I am happy to have been wrong but now they need to concentrate against the smaller teams and carry this on!!
Wales or Samoa. ;D ;D
Quote from: GalwayBayBoy on September 17, 2011, 11:24:21 AM
What a game. Who says you need tries to have a thriller? I was screaming like a little girl when Bowe intercepted that pass and ran up the field at the end. Great stuff.
Bowe steaming through was a Gordon Hamilton 1991 moment.
What did Campese say about Ireland btw?
Quote from: cicfada on September 17, 2011, 11:25:14 AM
Brilliant win, I am happy to have been wrong but now they need to concentrate against the smaller teams and carry this on!!
thats it...keep the momentum going into the remaining games and make a real bucking fist of this world cup!
Wow, forwards were giants of men today. Great day to be Irish. I hope the media dont get carried away now, 2 more games to top the group and then probably Wales (which will be no pushover)
Extraordinary win. And it's not as if they poxed it with a last-minute try, they were the better team from start to finish. Well done to all concerned
You heard it from Capt Pat first.
Quote from: CiKe on September 17, 2011, 08:46:54 AM
Quote from: Capt Pat on September 17, 2011, 08:01:15 AM
So Pocock is out of the game. I will make an optimistic prediction of an Irish victory. They don't have anything we don't have now. Question is whether we are in good enough form.
I'd beg to differ, we definitely don't have anyone in the backs like Kurtley Beale...
If we hold on to win the group, it's likely Wales in the quarter and then England or France in the semi final if the games go to plan! There genuinely would be a chance of a final appearance
Quotef**k you, David Campese, f**k. You.
And Barry Hall and Skippy the Bush Kangaroo too
Quote from: mc_grens on September 17, 2011, 11:15:55 AM
I'd just like to take this opportunity to say...
f**k you, David Campese, f**k. You.
Classic, michael lynagh very good in his comments about Ireland, Cian Healey moth and well deserved. Hope the AIF is as good as that
Quote from: Capt Pat on September 17, 2011, 11:30:13 AM
You heard it from Capt Pat first.
Quote from: CiKe on September 17, 2011, 08:46:54 AM
Quote from: Capt Pat on September 17, 2011, 08:01:15 AM
So Pocock is out of the game. I will make an optimistic prediction of an Irish victory. They don't have anything we don't have now. Question is whether we are in good enough form.
I'd beg to differ, we definitely don't have anyone in the backs like Kurtley Beale...
Good prediction alright, thought we had a chance but didn't believe we'd actually do it. Pocock was huge loss, don't think I heard Mcalman or whatever he's called mentioned once on ITV! Still don't think we've anything like Beale though, the guy looks so threatening - every time he got the ball i was worried!
sweet mother of Jesus. Before the match we were discussing if Ireland were going to get out of the group, and just how big the hammering from aus would be.
Now were are counting down the days to the final. FFS have a bit of cop on.
!!!All aboard the Hype Train!!!!
Just unreal!!!!
We should beat Russia but i'm wary of italy. They're gettin closer every year and due to beat us. They were level with the aussies at half time too.
It's ok for the players to lift it v the aussies but the difficulty may be that we go into the final few games expecting to win. All wins have to be earned and being Irish i expect the worst!
Great win though and hope we kick on and play to our potential in all games (and win the world cup!)
Great stuff,, :) :)
Hope we can deliver against last 2 teams and not take eye off the ball, take each game as it comes and forget about qtr final...
Quote from: trileacman on September 17, 2011, 11:36:46 AM
sweet mother of Jesus. Before the match we were discussing if Ireland were going to get out of the group, and just how big the hammering from aus would be.
Now were are counting down the days to the final. FFS have a bit of cop on.
!!!All aboard the Hype Train!!!!
+1. Enjoy it for what it is - the first time Ireland have EVER beaten a top ranking (NZ, Aus, SA, Eng and Fra) team in the World Cup.
Quote from: trileacman on September 17, 2011, 11:36:46 AM
sweet mother of Jesus. Before the match we were discussing if Ireland were going to get out of the group, and just how big the hammering from aus would be.
Now were are counting down the days to the final. FFS have a bit of cop on.
!!!All aboard the Hype Train!!!!
Who said we wouldn't get out of the group?? Feckin begrudgers in this country... Why can't we be happy and positive about the team?
Eric Elwood should be on that stage.
Quote from: screenexile on September 17, 2011, 11:43:31 AM
Who said we wouldn't get out of the group?? Feckin begrudgers in this country... Why can't we be happy and positive about the team?
Plenty of people, I'd imagine. If Ireland bring their USA game to the Italy game then they might be grateful Australia didn't get a bonus point today!
Moore was the biggest loss for them in the scrum.and lineout I think. It was a tight game not a loose open one where Pocock and Ioane might have thrived.
Quote from: CiKe on September 17, 2011, 11:34:21 AM
Quote from: Capt Pat on September 17, 2011, 11:30:13 AM
You heard it from Capt Pat first.
Quote from: CiKe on September 17, 2011, 08:46:54 AM
Quote from: Capt Pat on September 17, 2011, 08:01:15 AM
So Pocock is out of the game. I will make an optimistic prediction of an Irish victory. They don't have anything we don't have now. Question is whether we are in good enough form.
I'd beg to differ, we definitely don't have anyone in the backs like Kurtley Beale...
Good prediction alright, thought we had a chance but didn't believe we'd actually do it. Pocock was huge loss, don't think I heard Mcalman or whatever he's called mentioned once on ITV! Still don't think we've anything like Beale though, the guy looks so threatening - every time he got the ball i was worried!
Quote from: Capt Pat on September 17, 2011, 11:46:49 AM
Moore was the biggest loss for them in the scrum.and lineout I think. It was a tight game not a loose open one where Pocock and Ioane might have thrived.
So . . . you were wrong then? ;)
Didn't see the game live but watched the analysis there and the highlights. Work rate seemed immense and they were very focused. The focus was actually made very clear by Paul O'Connell after the game in the interview on ITV. The interviewer was gushing with praise about Irelands performance and how it was a momentous day for Irish rugby and O'Connells attitude was "sure we've only won a pool game". Brilliant I thought and the measure of a true leader. Job done, don't bask in the glory, nothing won, move on. Well done Ireland.
Unreal atmosphere, O'Driscoll was almost drowning in adrenaline at the end when giving his speech.
Tough on Murray not getting the try, we all shared his exclamation but ultimately it didn't matter, it wasn't a day for coming up short.
Is there any harm with having both Sexton and O'Gara on at the same time? Sexton just does not inspire confidence at any time from any distance with his penalties, he just does not gather any confidence from converting one or two, that you can say 'yes he'll pop this 25m kick over nice and easy'. The missed easy penalties just demonstrated the unquenchable belief this team had on the day, that they had the beating of Australia in all areas.
Quote from: brokencrossbar1 on September 17, 2011, 11:52:29 AM
Didn't see the game live but watched the analysis there and the highlights. Work rate seemed immense and they were very focused. The focus was actually made very clear by Paul O'Connell after the game in the interview on ITV. The interviewer was gushing with praise about Irelands performance and how it was a momentous day for Irish rugby and O'Connells attitude was "sure we've only won a pool game". Brilliant I thought and the measure of a true leader. Job done, don't bask in the glory, nothing won, move on. Well done Ireland.
Hmm. I thought it was a trite thing for him to say. The interviewer was closer to the truth, this was far more than 'just another pool game'
Quote from: deiseach on September 17, 2011, 11:54:44 AM
Quote from: brokencrossbar1 on September 17, 2011, 11:52:29 AM
Didn't see the game live but watched the analysis there and the highlights. Work rate seemed immense and they were very focused. The focus was actually made very clear by Paul O'Connell after the game in the interview on ITV. The interviewer was gushing with praise about Irelands performance and how it was a momentous day for Irish rugby and O'Connells attitude was "sure we've only won a pool game". Brilliant I thought and the measure of a true leader. Job done, don't bask in the glory, nothing won, move on. Well done Ireland.
Hmm. I thought it was a trite thing for him to say. The interviewer was closer to the truth, this was far more than 'just another pool game'
That's the difference between teams of winners and teams of wannabes. If he had come out saying "yeah this is brilliant, best day ever for Irish rugby" then you could maybe be wary of losing the run of themselves. It was simply a stepping stone with added benefits. For too long we have lived off the mentality of the odd big perfomance. Ireland have the quality to be a top team but for too long have not consistently shown it, the thing now as O'COnnell said is to repeat today's performance again.
Great to see this team put two big performances against big teams back to back.
That is 24-8 against England and 15-6 against the Aussies. Both were competitive games. The other 5 pre world cup and the US were not real competitive games.
We have the potential we just need to stay focused.
Quote from: deiseach on September 17, 2011, 11:54:44 AM
Quote from: brokencrossbar1 on September 17, 2011, 11:52:29 AM
Didn't see the game live but watched the analysis there and the highlights. Work rate seemed immense and they were very focused. The focus was actually made very clear by Paul O'Connell after the game in the interview on ITV. The interviewer was gushing with praise about Irelands performance and how it was a momentous day for Irish rugby and O'Connells attitude was "sure we've only won a pool game". Brilliant I thought and the measure of a true leader. Job done, don't bask in the glory, nothing won, move on. Well done Ireland.
Hmm. I thought it was a trite thing for him to say. The interviewer was closer to the truth, this was far more than 'just another pool game'
Means Fcuk all if they don't win the other games, what's the point of turning up for World Cup games if you think ya can't win them, Very Mick McCarthy type thing, just turn up and enjoy it attitude there ;)
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on September 17, 2011, 12:03:39 PM
Quote from: deiseach on September 17, 2011, 11:54:44 AM
Quote from: brokencrossbar1 on September 17, 2011, 11:52:29 AM
Didn't see the game live but watched the analysis there and the highlights. Work rate seemed immense and they were very focused. The focus was actually made very clear by Paul O'Connell after the game in the interview on ITV. The interviewer was gushing with praise about Irelands performance and how it was a momentous day for Irish rugby and O'Connells attitude was "sure we've only won a pool game". Brilliant I thought and the measure of a true leader. Job done, don't bask in the glory, nothing won, move on. Well done Ireland.
Hmm. I thought it was a trite thing for him to say. The interviewer was closer to the truth, this was far more than 'just another pool game'
Means Fcuk all if they don't win the other games, what's the point of turning up for World Cup games if you think ya can't win them, Very Mick McCarthy type thing, just turn up and enjoy it attitude there ;)
Riiiight. So if Ireland don't win the World Cup, this win was worthless.
Quote from: brokencrossbar1 on September 17, 2011, 12:01:06 PM
Quote from: deiseach on September 17, 2011, 11:54:44 AM
Quote from: brokencrossbar1 on September 17, 2011, 11:52:29 AM
Didn't see the game live but watched the analysis there and the highlights. Work rate seemed immense and they were very focused. The focus was actually made very clear by Paul O'Connell after the game in the interview on ITV. The interviewer was gushing with praise about Irelands performance and how it was a momentous day for Irish rugby and O'Connells attitude was "sure we've only won a pool game". Brilliant I thought and the measure of a true leader. Job done, don't bask in the glory, nothing won, move on. Well done Ireland.
Hmm. I thought it was a trite thing for him to say. The interviewer was closer to the truth, this was far more than 'just another pool game'
That's the difference between teams of winners and teams of wannabes. If he had come out saying "yeah this is brilliant, best day ever for Irish rugby" then you could maybe be wary of losing the run of themselves. It was simply a stepping stone with added benefits. For too long we have lived off the mentality of the odd big perfomance. Ireland have the quality to be a top team but for too long have not consistently shown it, the thing now as O'COnnell said is to repeat today's performance again.
Agree with this O'Connell, O'Gara and Sexton in their interviews all seem to reinforce the point that while the win and performance were great it's a just a win and the goal is still a quarter-final. Their mental focus is that of winners, just need to deliver against Italy in 2 weeks.
The Betting before the tournament was ridiculous. Australia were much shorter odds than Ireland.
Listen ye bundle of begrudgin unbelievin bastards. Maybe now yis will halve a bit of faith in us. Come on Ireland!
You'd think O'Connell would break into a smile seeing as this is the second game of any note, that Ireland have won at a rugby world cup.
Quote from: Main Street on September 17, 2011, 11:53:51 AM
Unreal atmosphere, O'Driscoll was almost drowning in adrenaline at the end when giving his speech.
Tough on Murray not getting the try, we all shared his exclamation but ultimately it didn't matter, it wasn't a day for coming up short.
Is there any harm with having both Sexton and O'Gara on at the same time? Sexton just does not inspire confidence at any time from any distance with his penalties, he just does not gather any confidence from converting one or two, that you can say 'yes he'll pop this 25m kick over nice and easy'. The missed easy penalties just demonstrated the unquenchable belief this team had on the day, that they had the beating of Australia in all areas.
I'd be interested to know if this could work as well. Sexton misses too many important penalties for Ireland.
It was some win! ;D
A proud O'Gara brimming with patriotic tears in his interview.
I'm about 30 mins behind real time.
Great performance and finally revenge for twenty years ago in Lansdowne! Really didn't see that coming at all.
The pack were immense particularly the front row. I'd have expressed reservations about Best in the past but he had his best game for Ireland out there. This result really gives us a great shot at getting to at least a semi-final. The aftermath of the match was good to see. There was no lepping around the place at the final whistle and all of the interviews were quite grounded and measured.
What is very encouraging is that there is still room for improvement. Sexton kicked poorly and left at least six points behind. We also should have had at least one try. Heaslip too was fairly quiet and is yet to find form. Kearney should also come on a bit for the 75 minutes or so he played.
(http://alekwasframed.com/green_tea/emot-bandwagon.gif)
magic, magic.....
I hope these players remember they are professionals representing their country, in the middle of a world cup tournament, when they talk about (wild? uninhibited?) celebrations.
Quote from: GalwayBayBoy on September 17, 2011, 11:24:21 AM
I was screaming like a little girl when Bowe intercepted that pass and ran up the field at the end. Great stuff.
Snap, we scared the shite outta the cub by squealing like school girls as Bowe made the break
Why was Murray's try disallowed?
I too screamed like a little girl when Bowe almost did a Noel Mannion.
I was glad I was so wrong about my thoughts that a shoeing was on the cards.
Great stuff Ireland - now please go find a few dwarfs to throw and a few blondes to grope.
Quote from: Celt_Man on September 17, 2011, 12:45:10 PM
Why was Murray's try disallowed?
Offside, they said!! as i nearly dropped my computer when he ran through
Today was a great day to be Irish, I'd imagine the lads in Oz like Stephenite and Aerlik are walking 20 feet tall.
Some performance by the tight 5, but we need to keep them all fit. Back row were awesome as well with Heaslip looking slightly ordinary but mainly because the flankers were demolishing the Aussies. But it is a worry with Wallace and Flannery gone there isn't much quality to come into that pack. Pray they all stay fit.
We have a problem at 9 where we have guys with different strengths and weaknesses. Both players today made some poor decisions at times and in a big game sometime they won't have such an amount of quick ball. I'd like a look at how Boss is playing so I hope he starts against Russia with Murray coming on.
Sexton was ok, a couple of kicks aside but I would persevere with him. O'Gara is a great man to bring on especially behind a pack that has won its war.
12 is going to be a problem, McFadden to start the next day and hopefully he has a stormer. Kearney started awfully but to his great credit he recovered fully from that and played well especially in the 2nd quarter. Earls (first touch apart) and Bowe both played well will very little ball.
We now face possibly 3 games as favourites which is a different proposition to today. The squad needs to be rotated wisely, e.g. Cullen will start and be Captain the next day but does he rest both O'Cs or just O'Connell? O'Callaghan looks super-fit to me so could conceivably play every week but we might regret that later. Maybe Ryan starting next week?
Credit to Kidney fo today. He has got it spot on, tactically and selection wise.
dont know the ins and outs of this oul game, but like watchin irlande all the same, unreal pride in the country etc;
after ten mins, and after knowing all the pre-wc defeats, i wasnt ready to turn over, but i was gonna start doin bits and pieces round the house while keepin an eye on her...then it all kicked into place!!!
wonderful, wonderful performance, obrien and healy are savage men, takin nothin away from the rest of them; would have been some try by bowe had it went over;
fcuk does the hook man ever be happy??
O'Gara near in tears sums the whole thing up;
take a bow boys (and a dozen pints) ;D
O'Gara damn near in tears being interviewed about the pride he has in his country and team was great to see and fairly touching tbh too...
Nearly wish the Russia game was in the morning (4.30am KO - can't wait for that). Hopefully Deccie avoids the failing of Eddie the Eagle and starts damn near everyone else the next day. Just thinking on my feet here but...
McFadden; Wallace; Cullen and Ryan; Leamy; Court; Cronin, Boss; Varley to get game time; Buckley (God forgive me!); Jennings; Murphy and Trimble should all see significant game time to keep everyone in the zone...
13 names there which would leave 9 boys involved today in the match day 22, with 3 or 4 starting - which is probably a decent balance
Good post muppet. agreed 100%- O'Gara's interview was fantastic
On again on TG4.
Much more relaxed watching it this time!
A long time coming.
Australia were very lucky to beat Ireland in 91 .
What a year for Ireland between beating England in the cricket and now Oz in the rugby.
hard to see how OGara cannot be started now imo. Its ok to bring him on but in future important games in the tournament, it might be too late by then.
I'd play him with sexton at centre number 12. McFadden the only other alrernative imo.
I think its a tad unfair from what I am hearing around the place at the 'puke rugby' label being levelled at the Irish performance (lets see how much stick the press give them after the abuse levelled at the likes of Dublin, Donegal in football or the Irish soccer team in recent months for their ultra defensive displays - cant stand the feckin meeja).
Its about results and I certainly dont care if its not expansive rugby (I prefer the oppoisite actually ! but I'd be in the minority here) - but the win is the only important aspect in tournaments.
Its much the same tactics that beat England in the 6N.
However I was very disappointed at how one dimensional the aussies were. no plan B, and they played lik eIreland played in the pre tournament warm up games. No invention, no decent kicking game and didnt seem to be able to focus on a gameplan. they were all over he shop. Complacent maybe, but they were taight a hard lesson by an experienced side that did exactly what was asked of them all game long. I have been very critical of them recently but this was a grat performance of controlled rugby. Still prob wont win anything, the real game now will be the playoff match v wales after the group phase.
Well done team and Kidney. Tactics the winner here.
Ireland still have a tricky one against Italy to negotiate in the group.
QF could be against Samoa as handy.
Wouldn't fancy Ireland as favourites against Wales in the QF.
This is really exciting for the Irish team. We are a signifigantly better team than we were four years ago. We can scrumage as well as the top scrumaging teams. We have much better resources at the half back position. Murray and Sexton are a big improvement on Stringer and P Wallace. Reddan was an afterthought four years ago and has really brought the scrum half play on. Then we get to the back row. They are light years ahead of Easterby Wallace and Leamy which was a capable international class back row. Darcy is still alive and represents the only big drop off between the team of today and four yesrs ago. O Driscoll has declined a bit as well but he was cursed not to have the games decisive moment today with the ball bouncing over his head after hitting the post. The back tgree four years ago was Dempsey Horgan and Hickey. Kearney is much better than Dempsey as is Bowe over Trimble. Hickey would have the advantage over Earls. Second row O Vonnell and O Callaghan is about the same.
So there is only a dropoff at centre and then the rest of the team has moved forward a tonne. Thst team four years ago was very good but flopped at the world cup and got mugged by the draw. That Argentine team was immense and France were at home and able to best the allblacks. Now after todays win the draw has opened up for us and we have a chance of winning the thing if everything goes right for us. No injuries England beat France in the QF and Australia recover to get to the final on the other side of the draw.
Our last 2 results in competitive games 24-8 against England and 15-6 against Australia and no luck involved we could have won both games by more. That is the big time for us.
Anyone else think that D'arcy was having a good game before going off injured? I know he was due one anyway!!
Darcy played well. He has just come back from injury and people were writing him off too soon. He was quite good for Leinster last year winning the European Cup.
This team can also play better than it did today Players like Kearney and Heaslip can play their way back into form. If they get going we will be hard to stop.
Nice to hear and was good to see him there on the sideline at the end.... http://www.rte.ie/sport/rugby/worldcup/2011/0917/ireland_australia.html
O'Driscoll reveals Flannery inspiration
Ireland captain Brian O'Driscoll has revealed the role injured hooker Jerry Flannery played in inspiring today's stunning 15-6 World Cup victory over Australia at Eden Park.
The Irish placed one foot in the quarter-finals after taking command of Pool C by toppling the Tri Nations champions and tournament second favourites.
It was a smart forward-dominated performance full of controlled ferocity that was completely at odds with their form heading to New Zealand.
O'Driscoll insists the squad never wavered in their belief they could upset 1/5 favourites Australia during an emotional build-up week.
The most stirring moment came when Flannery, the popular Munster player whose career is now in doubt after he was ruled out of the World Cup with a calf injury, presented the team with their jerseys.
"It's nice to back up all our talk from during the week," said O'Driscoll.
"There were some very passionate words said by guys who weren't even in the 22. That's where it came from.
"There were some poignant moments throughout the week.
"I don't think a lot of guys will forget Jerry Flannery handing out the jerseys yesterday at the captain's meeting.
"Mentally we were in a place where we felt as though we owed ourselves a big performance.
"Much as we owed the Irish public one, we owed ourselves one first and foremost.
"There was a tension in training and a sense the performance was coming. It was just a matter of making it happen."
Now Ireland need only account for Russia and Italy to secure the easier quarter-final, probably against Wales or Samoa, offering them a tantalising glimpse of the last four.
But O'Driscoll sounded a note of caution to those supporters plotting their route to the final on 23 October.
"It was nice to deliver this win but that's half the job done. We have a game next week that we must win," he said.
"This is to be enjoyed but we must use it as a stepping stone to a level of consistency.
"That's where we've struggled a bit in the past. A goal of ours in the coming weeks is to make sure that we don't let this standard drop.
"It's a good win but I'm not sitting here with the Webb Ellis trophy beside me.
"It's a win and it's great because it's something we haven't done before, but let's not oversell it.
"It's a means to an end and we must accept it as that. We mustn't get lost in the moment."
Just for interest's sake rte.ie player ratings.... After cooling down a bit, 12 months ago (maybe even six) you would have placed in a looney bin if you said that Jamie Heaslip would have a relatively quiet game and still the Irish pack would dominate the Wallabies despite that....
Player Ratings:
Ireland benefitted from top-drawer displays by six of their eight forwards, high-class scrum and lineout work, a fantastic defensive effort by all 15 players around the field and good attacking play when they needed it.
15 Rob Kearney - Evened things up with Beale after getting outjumped for an early high kick. Strong when he went into contact, released Bowe a couple of times and made some excellent kicks. 7.
14 Tommy Bowe - Lifted the late siege with a brilliant intercept and was always looking for chances out on the right wing. 7.
13 Brian O'Driscoll - Inspiring leadership, his chase after Sexton's kick epitomised what makes him great. Struggled to make one or two tackles as Australian runners cut back hard into him - is that shoulder right? But timed other hits well to stop Australian wide attacks. 7.
12 Gordon D'Arcy - Ireland did not spark in the centres but D'Arcy defended well, and was rarely troubled when carrying into contact, before he was replaced by Ronan O'Gara. Helped limit Quade Cooper's influence with some excellent tackles when the Australian 10 looked to go wide. 7.
11 Keith Earls - The foot in touch at kick-off could have unsettled Ireland, but Earls recovered to play well from there with one hard tackle on McCabe standing out and a few decent runs. Good response to mutterings about his place in the team. 7.
10 Jonny Sexton - A difficult day in some ways, with one bad drop and misses with those key kicks. Kicking out of hand was a mixed bag, but the long passing and ambition to attack surprised Australia and he got Ireland moving well a few times. 6.
9 Eoin Reddan - A very effective cog in the Ireland machine, making sure his dominant pack were supplied with good ball to run on to. One loose kick. Ireland's attacking game had a good tempo when they needed it to. 8.
1 Cian Healy - A magnificent performance, dominating the tight, making crucial steals at the breakdown, and shuddering hits round the field. 9.
2 Rory Best - His best ever match in green, he ran between tacklers to make good yards, threw almost all of his darts perfectly and was part of a brilliant scrum effort. 8.
3 Mike Ross - Ireland's strongman worked incredibly hard around the field as well, showing up for some big carries. But getting on top at the scrum winning vital penalties for Ireland was his main contribution. 8.
4 Donncha O'Callaghan - His team-mates will recognise the effort, though others made more of an impact around the field. 6.
5 Paul O'Connell - Key man for Ireland in the lineout, some handling errors, but also some fantastic plays around the field, with tackles on Genia in particular standing out. 8.
6 Stephen Ferris - Some brilliant tackling - the shunting back of Genia stands out - and also made lots of superb carries. One or two little errors, but was the strongman Ireland needed. 8.
7 Sean O'Brien - Supremely dynamic alongside Ferris, making fantastic yardage and showing his unique brand of ball-carrying to a new audience. Try-saver on Genia (again) has to get a mention too. 8.
8 Jamie Healsip - The quietest of the back-row trio, though he was assured in the lineout. Gave away an early penalty as he struggled to get in the game. 6.
Quote from: Celt_Man on September 17, 2011, 01:34:17 PM
O'Gara damn near in tears being interviewed about the pride he has in his country and team was great to see and fairly touching tbh too...
Nearly wish the Russia game was in the morning (4.30am KO - can't wait for that). Hopefully Deccie avoids the failing of Eddie the Eagle and starts damn near everyone else the next day. Just thinking on my feet here but...
McFadden; Wallace; Cullen and Ryan; Leamy; Court; Cronin, Boss; Varley to get game time; Buckley (God forgive me!); Jennings; Murphy and Trimble should all see significant game time to keep everyone in the zone...
13 names there which would leave 9 boys involved today in the match day 22, with 3 or 4 starting - which is probably a decent balance
Can you post a link of o'gara interview?
http://www.rte.ie/sport/rugby/worldcup/highlights.html
Then click on his interview click just under the screen - hopefully that works...
Team for next week?
Kearney - still looked a bit rusty early on
Murphy
McFadden
Wallace
Trimble
O'Gara
Murray
Court
Cronin
Buckley - surely he'll be ok against Russia?
Cullen
Ryan
Leamy
Jennings
Heaslip - perfect game for him to get a bit of confidence/form back
Varley
Ross
O'Connell
O'Brien
Boss
Sexton
Earls
Would say that would be very close to next wks team and like ur logic with the majority of the team, would say boss must be due a start though.
Supurb display from 1 to 15 with front and back row particularly impressive. Have been a big critic of darcy lately but he did well today. If his injury was a hamstring as it looked he could be out for a few wks meaning whoever impresses more between Wallace and mcfadden could start against Italy as don't see kidney going with o gara and section.
As for oz, no matter how good ur backs r u can't win a game without a half decent hooked never mind possibly the 2nd best 7 in the game. Wouldn't rule them out though and wouldn't want to meet them further down the line if they got them 2 boys back
A great lift for the country. Never was a cliché more apt - men against boys.
Unbelievable performance. Having watched this Ireland team wilt so many times in the face of a physical onslaught, it was great to see them hold out. Was actually comfortable enough in the end although obviously missing Pocock, Ioane and Steven Moore were big losses for the Aussies. Then again, we'd no Wallace or Flannery, even if they were unlikely to start.
The entire Irish pack was simply outstanding.
(http://www.france24.com/en/files/imagecache/aef_ct_wire_image_lightbox/images/afp/photo_1316261124858-1-0.jpg?1316261576)
Interesting to note that although the Wallabies were missing the two boyos, they had the likes of Rocky Elsom on the field and he was simply anonymous.... subbed off during the second half and might have been the second time I heard his name mentioned during the game...
Although perhaps some could enlighten us to his form of late - didn't he get the captaincy taken off him recently??
Opening paragraph of the Sydney Morning Herald:
"It doesn't get any more embarrassing than this for Australian rugby. The Wallabies were yet again shown to be second-rate by one of the also-rans of world rugby."
They can all go and f**k themselves the arrogant kangaroo-shagging twats!
Quote from: gallsman on September 17, 2011, 09:22:50 PM
Opening paragraph of the Sydney Morning Herald:
"It doesn't get any more embarrassing than this for Australian rugby. The Wallabies were yet again shown to be second-rate by one of the also-rans of world rugby."
They can all go and f**k themselves the arrogant kangaroo-shagging t**ts!
We have been no better than an also-ran in every World Cup to date. At times we were worse than that and were never-rans.
Quote from: muppet on September 17, 2011, 09:30:13 PM
Quote from: gallsman on September 17, 2011, 09:22:50 PM
Opening paragraph of the Sydney Morning Herald:
"It doesn't get any more embarrassing than this for Australian rugby. The Wallabies were yet again shown to be second-rate by one of the also-rans of world rugby."
They can all go and f**k themselves the arrogant kangaroo-shagging t**ts!
We have been no better than an also-ran in every World Cup to date. At times we were worse than that and were never-rans.
The article says "world rugby", not "World Cup rugby". Ireland have stuck it up the Wallabies more than enough times in the past to be written off in as condescending a manner as that.
Quote from: gallsman on September 17, 2011, 09:36:07 PM
The article says "world rugby", not "World Cup rugby". Ireland have stuck it up the Wallabies more than enough times in the past to be written off in as condescending a manner as that.
Big difference in fairness...
20 foot tall indeed. 'tis just gone 6:30am, putting the jersey back on and taking the young fella for a stroll down the main street in about an hour.
Condascending doesn't even begin to describe the media commentary, at halfmtime last night the 'analysts' were talking about an honorable Irish performance but that they'd pull away with 15 to go, this morning they're talking about a shocks, famous victories and one for the underdog etc.
They're the Tri-Nations champs to be fair, but we're not that far behind them, it's a world cup so I suppose they need to play to the masses to a certain extent. Makes it all the sweeter for me ;D
Quote from: gallsman on September 17, 2011, 09:22:50 PM
Opening paragraph of the Sydney Morning Herald:
"It doesn't get any more embarrassing than this for Australian rugby. The Wallabies were yet again shown to be second-rate by one of the also-rans of world rugby."
They can all go and f**k themselves the arrogant kangaroo-shagging t**ts!
This is why it's more satisfying to beat the Australians than any other country at every opportunity in any sport.
Quote from: Celt_Man on September 17, 2011, 09:09:11 PM
Interesting to note that although the Wallabies were missing the two boyos, they had the likes of Rocky Elsom on the field and he was simply anonymous.... subbed off during the second half and might have been the second time I heard his name mentioned during the game...
Although perhaps some could enlighten us to his form of late - didn't he get the captaincy taken off him recently??
Apparently Deans took the captaincy off him to remove the burden and pressure of it from him to allow him to concentrate on his own game giving it to the captain of the queensland reds instead.
It was supposedly a success up until now
Fantastic performance and result by Irish team. Like others on my feet cheering Tommy Bowe on, brilliant stuff altogether.
Reading that newspaper article, arrogant p***ks the Aussies when it comes to sport. Enjoy seeing the English beat them even.
Assuming Ireland win the next 2 games it will probably be Wales which will be a 50/50 game if Wales repeat their performance against SA.
i don't know why i think this but have a feeling Wales Samoa could be one of the games of the tournament. Or else it will be rubbish and i'll have gotten up for nothing. I'm worried the Mayweather fight will be on the same time, I can't record one and watch the other...
Quote from: CiKe on September 17, 2011, 11:18:17 PM
i don't know why i think this but have a feeling Wales Samoa could be one of the games of the tournament. Or else it will be rubbish and i'll have gotten up for nothing. I'm worried the Mayweather fight will be on the same time, I can't record one and watch the other...
is it Sky +
Quote from: Capt Pat on September 17, 2011, 04:36:43 PM
This is really exciting for the Irish team. We are a signifigantly better team than we were four years ago. We can scrumage as well as the top scrumaging teams. We have much better resources at the half back position. Murray and Sexton are a big improvement on Stringer and P Wallace. Reddan was an afterthought four years ago and has really brought the scrum half play on. Then we get to the back row. They are light years ahead of Easterby Wallace and Leamy which was a capable international class back row. Darcy is still alive and represents the only big drop off between the team of today and four yesrs ago. O Driscoll has declined a bit as well but he was cursed not to have the games decisive moment today with the ball bouncing over his head after hitting the post. The back tgree four years ago was Dempsey Horgan and Hickey. Kearney is much better than Dempsey as is Bowe over Trimble. Hickey would have the advantage over Earls. Second row O Vonnell and O Callaghan is about the same.
So there is only a dropoff at centre and then the rest of the team has moved forward a tonne. Thst team four years ago was very good but flopped at the world cup and got mugged by the draw. That Argentine team was immense and France were at home and able to best the allblacks. Now after todays win the draw has opened up for us and we have a chance of winning the thing if everything goes right for us. No injuries England beat France in the QF and Australia recover to get to the final on the other side of the draw.
Our last 2 results in competitive games 24-8 against England and 15-6 against Australia and no luck involved we could have won both games by more. That is the big time for us.
No offence CP but we are not a 'top scrummaging nation'. We beat the Aussies who are a relativlely poor scrummaging nation especially without Pocock and Moore
I would say we're behind England, Wales, SA, France and NZ in terms of scrummaging so let's not get carried away with ourselves.
I'm not being negative but more realistic. It is the best we have played this 2 years I just think we have lots of room for improvement in our next big game which will be the Welsh imo... People are presuming because we have beaten them in past 6N games its an easy passage to the semi final.
I think a performance like today would be 50/50 so my message would be 'some work done... a lot more to do!
Mighty stuff. One of the great moments was Ferris picking Will Genia up and carrying him away like a mother carrying a cranky baby out of mass.
Some honest Aussie analysis here
http://www.smh.com.au/rugby-union/union-news/suck-it-up-australia-were-outsmarted-and-outplayed-20110917-1kfip.html
Just watching England Georgia and with time up England ahead 36-10. They have a scrum on the Georgia 5 yard line. I was thinking time to kick the ball out and avoid injury possiblities. No England want a try and Ashton while scoring it nearly breaks his elbow or wrist picking up a knock from a Georgian while going over. :-\
Aaagh I come back in after my walk between matches and Canada lead 10-7 after 10 minutes. Cad a tharla?
Quote from: NetNitrate on September 18, 2011, 02:49:43 AM
Mighty stuff. One of the great moments was Ferris picking Will Genia up and carrying him away like a mother carrying a cranky baby out of mass.
Great stuff. Up there with Con Houlihan's description of Paddy Cullen running back to his goal like a woman who smelt a cake burning.
Just home (in OZ) from Auckland, after one of the great weekends for Irish sport. Similar atmosphere to what Stuttgart 88 felt like. It was electric amongst the irish fans all day Saturday in the build up. You never felt like we were ever gonna get beat. The game was immense with the only annoyance was Sexton's kicking. Time for O'Gara to start. On the hunt for QF tickets
Quote from: Hardy on September 18, 2011, 12:54:38 PM
Quote from: NetNitrate on September 18, 2011, 02:49:43 AM
Mighty stuff. One of the great moments was Ferris picking Will Genia up and carrying him away like a mother carrying a cranky baby out of mass.
Great stuff. Up there with Con Houlihan's description of Paddy Cullen running back to his goal like a woman who smelt a cake burning.
Hard to beat that. :D :D :D :D
Ferris has been cited for alleged Dwarf carrying and throwing in yesterday's game....
:D
Anyone see the size of the replacement Russian scrum-half today?!
Springboks starting to peak at the right time ?
87-0 against Namibia - i suppose they realise now that their 1/4 final is possibly against Australia now rather then Ireland !
TEAM v Russia
15: Kearney
14: Mc Fadden
13: Earls
12: Wallace
11: Trimble
10: O'Gara
9: Boss
1: Healy
2: Cronin
3: Buckley
4: O'Callaghan
5: Cullen (c)
6: Ryan
7: O'Brien
8: Heaslip
16: Varley
17: Court
18: Ferris/Leamy
19: Jennings/Leamy
20: Murray
21: Sexton
22: Murphy
A weakened team on paper, but on paper it looks a great team, if you know what I mean!!
I wouldn't have risked Healy or O'Brien in this one.
Or Heaslip either.
I think the decision to play Heaslip is a good one. He needs to play his way into form and build confidence. Similar comments would apply to Kearney to a lesser extent. I wouldn't have risked Healy and O'Brien though.
Disappointing that McFadden isn't being given a run in the centre. He's obviously not seen as a viable alternative to D'Arcy.
Healy and O Brien had a rest against the US so should still be fresh.
Quote from: Dinny Breen on September 22, 2011, 02:41:11 PM
TEAM v Russia
15: Kearney
14: Mc Fadden
13: Earls
12: Wallace
11: Trimble
10: O'Gara
9: Boss
1: Healy
2: Cronin
3: Buckley
4: O'Callaghan
5: Cullen (c)
6: Ryan
7: O'Brien
8: Heaslip
16: Varley
17: Court
18: Ferris/Leamy
19: Jennings/Leamy
20: Murray
21: Sexton
22: Murphy
has your mate Brian O'D texted you Dinny cause i cant find official team news anywhere !
How beneficial would it be to give Sexton half an hour at centre with ROG?
Quote from: Hoof Hearted on September 22, 2011, 06:33:40 PM
Quote from: Dinny Breen on September 22, 2011, 02:41:11 PM
TEAM v Russia
15: Kearney
14: Mc Fadden
13: Earls
12: Wallace
11: Trimble
10: O'Gara
9: Boss
1: Healy
2: Cronin
3: Buckley
4: O'Callaghan
5: Cullen (c)
6: Ryan
7: O'Brien
8: Heaslip
16: Varley
17: Court
18: Ferris/Leamy
19: Jennings/Leamy
20: Murray
21: Sexton
22: Murphy
has your mate Brian O'D texted you Dinny cause i cant find official team news anywhere !
The starting 15 was correct Reddan Best and Ross instead of Murray Varley and Court on the subs. Leamy and Jennings are subs Ferris takes a break.
Don't you just love how stuffing the Aussies is the gift that keeps on giving. Great sound bites from Kidney, Trevor Brennan and Francis.
(This is how it felt to be a Meathman in 1988, 1996.)
http://www.herald.ie/news/sore-losers-storm-as-australia-brand-ireland-cheats-2884297.html
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/rugbyunion/international/ireland/8783409/Rugby-World-Cup-2011-coach-Declan-Kidney-refutes-Tim-Horan-claims-that-Ireland-faked-injuries-against-Australia.html
http://uk.eurosport.yahoo.com/blog/oval-talk/article/1639/
Ewan Murray wont play for Scotland on a sunday and misses the Argentia game and quater final and semi should they get that far. Was it worth bringing him to the tournament at all???
The US are giving the Aussies a good rattle........... but 17-5 to the Aussies now after a breakaway try under the posts by Beale after 30 minutes
Quote from: Capt Pat on September 23, 2011, 10:06:51 AM
The US are giving the Aussies a good rattle........... but 17-5 to the Aussies now after a breakaway try under the posts by Beale after 30 minutes
glad i bought him into my fantasy team last night - pity i also took elsom out cause he wasnt named in the starting team >:(
Quote from: Hoof Hearted on September 23, 2011, 10:18:15 AM
Quote from: Capt Pat on September 23, 2011, 10:06:51 AM
The US are giving the Aussies a good rattle........... but 17-5 to the Aussies now after a breakaway try under the posts by Beale after 30 minutes
glad i bought him into my fantasy team last night - pity i also took elsom out cause he wasnt named in the starting team >:(
Beale is off injured now after a try and an assist.
Really watching the Aussie games it is clear they don't have the forward power to win this tournament. They rely on Pocock as an equaliser to nullify the opposition. The Italians and Yanks have been able to cause problems. The Irish squeezed them out of the game completely. They certainly have a tonne of attacking ablity.
From Twitter
Paul_OConnell
Jerry Flannery pulls his hat over his eyes and does this...
http://yfrog.com/15m8boz
Quote from: Hardy on September 23, 2011, 09:40:55 AM
Don't you just love how stuffing the Aussies is the gift that keeps on giving. Great sound bites from Kidney, Trevor Brennan and Francis.
(This is how it felt to be a Meathman in 1988, 1996.)
http://www.herald.ie/news/sore-losers-storm-as-australia-brand-ireland-cheats-2884297.html
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/rugbyunion/international/ireland/8783409/Rugby-World-Cup-2011-coach-Declan-Kidney-refutes-Tim-Horan-claims-that-Ireland-faked-injuries-against-Australia.html
So we didn't have a plan to slow down play when the opportunity presented itself? All a bit OTT from what I can make out. slow news day I suspect.
Quote from: ludermor on September 23, 2011, 09:51:42 AM
http://uk.eurosport.yahoo.com/blog/oval-talk/article/1639/
Ewan Murray wont play for Scotland on a sunday and misses the Argentia game and quater final and semi should they get that far. Was it worth bringing him to the tournament at all???
Something is better than nothing, even if he plays just one match and is better than the other guys it was worth it. I dislike the touch Murray gets for sticking to his beliefs. The only one losing out is himself.
The Aussies won the match on the scoreboard but lost the fight. They had three centres a fullback and number 8 go off injured. They had a hooker playing centre by the end. Things are not really going their way and they might be short handed by the time the South Africa game happens.
why in the name of God do teams allow the All Blacks to gain a psychological advantage by "accepting " the challenge of the haka? It is so outdated and yet you will hear all these people talk of its tradition and glory of it etc etc!! If I was a captain of a team then I would instruct them to walk around the kiwis during the haka and stand behind them! talk about daft, let them do it in their dressing room if they want!
Quote from: cicfada on September 24, 2011, 09:32:06 AM
why in the name of God do teams allow the All Blacks to gain a psychological advantage by "accepting " the challenge of the haka? It is so outdated and yet you will hear all these people talk of its tradition and glory of it etc etc!! If I was a captain of a team then I would instruct them to walk around the kiwis during the haka and stand behind them! talk about daft, let them do it in their dressing room if they want!
It's hardly a psychological advantage. It's a bag of shite tourist attraction.
France don't seem to be intimidated yet.
I have no understanding of how Rolland didn't give a penalty to France for tackling Traille in the air........now a try for the All Blacks.
awesome from the ABs so far
Difficult to see how the All Blacks are going to manage to c**k thing up this time. Not that it would have impacted the result, but some of Rolland's decisions were awful. Tackle on Traille in the air, Kaino getting penalised but not binned for an elbow.
Whats the opinions on the Scotland- Argentina game? I have been impressed with the Pumas so far and think they could win this by +7.
Well what a week that was! I expected a few complaints but the weeping and gnashing of teeth over our win against the Aussies (or 'us' to appease one or two on this db). Tim Horan was at it yesterday again about the ref saying he shouldn't get another game. And work was deathly silent, until I asked - tongue in cheek- if anyone watched the game. The pregnant pause was eardrum- busting.
And now to make matters even worser...the NZ Warriors beat Murdoch (aka Melbourne) Storm 20-12 in the NRL semi last night. They play Manly next Sunday, and I hope to Feck they paste them cos there is one Manly "fan" I really want to annoy.
Samoa beating fiji 27 7.Very inconsistent game with a ton of knock ons mainly from fiji.
Very unimpressed with fiji in this world cup thought they would put up a better showing.they have been very indecisive today and against the springboks.Loads of talent but dont have the teamwork or the decision making to trouble better ranked teams.
Samoa can still finish second IF they beat south africa.Cant see that happening.
A ridiculous time lapse problem on the rte commentary over to itv
Bit of of class from Ronan there
Good start for the Suncroft man!
Ireland could put up a cricket score in this if they want to. Russia are pish poor.
Try for O'Brien.
Quote from: boojangles on September 24, 2011, 11:45:03 PM
Whats the opinions on the Scotland- Argentina game? I have been impressed with the Pumas so far and think they could win this by +7.
I expect something similar especiallybif Contepomi is 100% but you never know with the Scotch.
Quote from: Capt Pat on September 25, 2011, 06:17:18 AM
Quote from: boojangles on September 24, 2011, 11:45:03 PM
Whats the opinions on the Scotland- Argentina game? I have been impressed with the Pumas so far and think they could win this by +7.
I expect something similar especiallybif Contepomi is 100% but you never know with the Scotch.
Should be a dour enough contest. Expect either team would be happy to win it 6-3. No tryscorer at 12/1 might be worth a small investment.
Bonus point secured before ht. Very comfortable so far as you'd expect. We started and finished the half quite well.
seems everything going irelands way
Quote from: gerry on September 25, 2011, 06:48:27 AM
seems everything going irelands way
And Hook is still crying! ::)
i like this ref, can we have him for every game
Earls gets his second try.
Cronin's darts have been poor. Handful of lineouts have gone astray. Boss has looked quite good but that's to be expected with the pack so dominant. Ross on for Healy. Very important that Ireland avoid injuries in the last half hour.
Ireland gone very sloppy. Buckley really is a lost cause at this stage.
george will be going mental i guess
Buckley is shite - he should be sent home. Surely there there are better prop fwds available in Ireland than him?
ireland need cluxton to take those handy frees, sexton is poor at them
Have to feel for Johnny, very nervous looking when he is about to kick. Bit of a paradox but that was a good win against a terrible side
Hook giving out again- he is some moron.
Quote from: gerry on September 25, 2011, 07:46:44 AM
ireland need cluxton to take those handy frees, sexton is poor at them
Cost a few people around the country I'd say. I think the handicap was +51.
That was good. No injuries. The ref didn't like Buckley. We are nicely set up for the match against Italy with our strongest team all fit and ready to go.
Quote from: Capt Pat on September 25, 2011, 07:48:57 AM
That was good. No injuries. The ref didn't like Buckley. We are nicely set up for the match against Italy with our strongest team all fit and ready to go.
Nobody bar Kidney likes Buckley he's rubbish. Anyhow job done, 4 games to go now.
Sexton missing that at end was worrying. Its forcing Kidneys hand .
Buckley is the ultimate ruck inspector.
Surely its Varley for backup hooker. Cronin can't throw the ball in.
Quote from: bcarrier on September 25, 2011, 08:06:29 AM
Sexton missing that at end was worrying. Its forcing Kidneys hand .
Buckley is the ultimate ruck inspector.
It's a conundrum - do you pick O'Gara who you know you will kick the kicks but doesn't have the all-round game that Sexton has to get you in the position where the kicks matter or do you go with Sexton who will get you in the position but then misses the kicks that matter ???
Think Kidney will still go with Sexton but will see O'Gara in as the closer of games perhaps as early as the 50 min mark. Pity we can't just bring O'Gara on and off for the penalties.
Mind you from what I hear D'Arcy is out for the Italy game so we might have both on the pitch..
If you play O'Gara next week and beat Italy then do you stick with him for the Welsh? Would Sexton's confidence be shattered if he was dropped now? Really is a headscratcher for Kidney.
O'Gara at 10 with Sexton outside him could be an option but I think he'll go with Wallace if D'Arcy isn't fit. McFadden is quite a good place kicker but isn't likely to be on the field.
Quote from: Donnellys Hollow on September 25, 2011, 08:27:25 AM
If you play O'Gara next week and beat Italy then do you stick with him for the Welsh? Would Sexton's confidence be shattered if he was dropped now? Really is a headscratcher for Kidney.
O'Gara at 10 with Sexton outside him could be an option but I think he'll go with Wallace if D'Arcy isn't fit. McFadden is quite a good place kicker but isn't likely to be on the field.
The Suncroft lad moved into the centre and had a bit of a shocker defensively but hard to switch positions mid-game..
Hard for Kidney as he'll be damned if he does and damned if he doesn't as too many people are still looking at the team with provincial eyes...
Quote from: Dinny Breen on September 25, 2011, 08:36:28 AM
Quote from: Donnellys Hollow on September 25, 2011, 08:27:25 AM
If you play O'Gara next week and beat Italy then do you stick with him for the Welsh? Would Sexton's confidence be shattered if he was dropped now? Really is a headscratcher for Kidney.
O'Gara at 10 with Sexton outside him could be an option but I think he'll go with Wallace if D'Arcy isn't fit. McFadden is quite a good place kicker but isn't likely to be on the field.
The Suncroft lad moved into the centre and had a bit of a shocker defensively but hard to switch positions mid-game..
Hard for Kidney as he'll be damned if he does and damned if he doesn't as too many people are still looking at the team with provincial eyes...
That's very true. I do think Kidney will stick with Sexton but I certainly wouldn't have any complaints if O'Gara got the nod. Hard to see anyone of the other fringe players today forcing their way into Kidney's plans. Boss might have jumped ahead of Murray but that's about it. Buckley is a liability and Cronin's throwing needs a lot of work. I thought Donncha Ryan was quite impressive and Leamy did well when coming on. Heaslip has improved since the US match (big test next weekend against Parisse) and Kearney is looking sharper but will be disappointed to have been beaten for the first Russian try.
On McFadden, we seem to be in the minority of nations who stick to the idea that your 10 is your place kicker and that's that. I know Kearney has occasionally place kicked but only with moderate success. I've also seen Murphy filling in for Leicester down the years The French have had more place kickers at scrum half than they've had at 10 in recent years.
I think you can stick with Sexton if you kick the long range penalties to the corners. That is the approach to take with this ball. The Argie need to work that out quigkly in the game against the Scots.
QuoteAnd Hook is still crying! ::)
poor george getting abuse
ghook George Hook
I will not allow anonymous abuse to drive me off Twitter. But at least I deserve a hearing before the "N" word is hurled at me
Id play the two of them. Sounds like that is what Gafney wants too . Said during week :
Quote"Sexton has all the attributes for a good 12," said Gaffney. "He prefers to play 10 and he's a world-class 10, but they're both world-class players and trying to get them both into the team is a difficult challenge."
I thought the Scotch had it but the Argies score a try as soon as they had to. 13-12 to Argentina.
The Scotch are almost out. They missed out on a bonus point earlier on and it could be costly.
They should have had a penalty on a drop goal attempt at the end but the ref bottled the decision.
Quote from: Capt Pat on September 25, 2011, 10:06:53 AM
I thought the Scotch had it but the Argies score a try as soon as they had to. 13-12 to Argentina.
I take it the Jocks have to beat England to progress?
Beat them well
Quote from: Capt Pat on September 25, 2011, 10:21:08 AM
The Scotch are almost out. They missed out on a bonus point earlier on and it could be costly.
They should have had a penalty on a drop goal attempt at the end but the ref bottled the decision.
In fairness to the ref he had his back to Contepomi and Contepomi realised that so he played the odds and it worked for him. Great game though and given the stakes and the conditions it was even better. The try was top class.
The Scots need a bonus point I think. It is complicated by Argentina playin Georgia the next day? They might not need a bonus point depending how things go.
I'd say Ireland are doomed if they decide to take the field without a good penalty kicker for the first 50 or 60 minutes in the 1/4 finals.
(assuming they reach the 1/4 finals)
Quote from: Main Street on September 25, 2011, 12:43:57 PM
I'd say Ireland are doomed if they decide to take the field without a good penalty kicker for the first 50 or 60 minutes in the 1/4 finals.
(assuming they reach the 1/4 finals)
Wales will be Ireland's opponents, these games tend to be quite open affairs, Wales's defence can be exploited but we'd need Sexton as O'Gara is no threat and makes it a lot easier to defend against plus I wouldn't fancy that Welsh back-row attacking O'Gara's channel. So the more I think about it we'll see Sexton start and the O'Gara to bring the good ship home, expect this for the Italian game as well. That game is indoors so O'Gara's better game management in poor conditions won't be a factor.
Ease off, lads! We're not through yet. All this talk of quarter and semi-finals...let's just take it one game at a time.
Would it not be the greatest failure by any Irish team at competitive level in any sport, if the current rugby team don't make the quarter finals from the top of their pool? Ireland go into the game against Italy, knowing exactly what they have to do. Even the much maligned EOS, had Ireland pumping on all cylinders against Italy on their home turf, when a similar but not the same situation existed.
Fascinating article by Will Greenwood on the choke tackle: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/rugbyunion/international/ireland/8784992/Rugby-World-Cup-2011-Innovative-Ireland-change-the-game-with-implementation-of-the-Choke-tackle.html
The Rules of Rugby (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7rz31VhUEoA)
And yes I know they are laws not rules...
NSFW
I refuse to mention the W word.
Italy= Banana skin.
It will be a tough game but I love the fact that the game is indoors no chance of s scrum and penalty rainy day contest developing. A rainy day leading to scrums which in turn lead to penalties against an under pressure Irish front row and an Italian win. We can plan an expansive game plan to tire out the big Italian frint row and get Cian Healy rolling around the park.
Murphy ribs Castro' ahead of crunch clash
Geordan Murphy and Martin Castrogiovanni have been exchanging insults as the countdown to Ireland's crucial World Cup clash with Italy continues.
The Leicester team-mates own a restaurant together and with Sunday's showdown at Otago Stadium looming large, the two have been in close contact.
"If you look at the shape of both of us, I tend to drink a lot of water and he tends to eat a lot of the food," said Murphy.
Looking like we will have Murray and O'Gara as half-backs in the only changes from the Oz game, Murray will definitely match up on the physical stakes so can understand that but always get the impression Kidney just doesn't fancy Reddan anyhow with ROG in the pocket from a defensive point of view Murray makes sense.
I think the Irish game plan will be straight forward and that's to take Italy on up front for the first 60 mins with O'Gara pinning the Italians pack and as the game loosens we should see the introduction of Reddan and Sexton.
Italy are doing a great job themselves of pumping up the Irish forwards and I'd be very confident of a 12+ point win.
As an interesting aside it's been interesting to note that Kidney and the players have been talking about knock-out rugby and how the Irish sporting psyche is conditioned to it from an early age through schools rugby to the nature of the GAA championships. They sound completely focused and Murphy and Jennings have been rolled out to the media so the main boys can just look forward to their job on Sunday...
Just a query. 2 coaches on the England team have been suspended for 1 match for substituting the ball between phases.
Did something like this happen in the six nations where a ball was kicked to touch, a quick lineout was taken (with a different ball) and a try scored. Did this happen and were there any sanctions?
Quote from: Denn Forever on September 29, 2011, 12:25:48 PM
Just a query. 2 coaches on the England team have been suspended for 1 match for substituting the ball between phases.
Did something like this happen in the six nations where a ball was kicked to touch, a quick lineout was taken (with a different ball) and a try scored. Did this happen and were there any sanctions?
It's not dissimilar but in the Ireland v Wales game Mike Philips took a quick throw in with a new ball, not allowed to be done and the ref and TJ should have spotted it and both were sanctioned. The player was chancing his arm, gamesmanship but not serious.
In a WC game there are 8 balls involved, 4 from each side but a penalty or conversion must be kicked using the ball that was in play at that time, the English coaches switched balls so that their ball was been used, they did this twice and got caught the second time. Beyond gamesmanship seemingly.
Quote from: Dinny Breen on September 29, 2011, 12:34:15 PM
Quote from: Denn Forever on September 29, 2011, 12:25:48 PM
Just a query. 2 coaches on the England team have been suspended for 1 match for substituting the ball between phases.
Did something like this happen in the six nations where a ball was kicked to touch, a quick lineout was taken (with a different ball) and a try scored. Did this happen and were there any sanctions?
It's not dissimilar but in the Ireland v Wales game Mike Philips took a quick throw in with a new ball, not allowed to be done and the ref and TJ should have spotted it and both were sanctioned. The player was chancing his arm, gamesmanship but not serious.
In a WC game there are 8 balls involved, 4 from each side but a penalty or conversion must be kicked using the ball that was in play at that time, the English coaches switched balls so that their ball was been used, they did this twice and got caught the second time. Beyond gamesmanship seemingly.
Like the Cork sliothars. But are the balls not the same anyway? When you say 4 from each side, do you literally mean that each team supplies 4 balls?
Yea each team provides 4 each. Will double check before some Internet warrior pulls me on it..
Quote from: Dinny Breen on September 29, 2011, 12:49:11 PM
Yea each team provides 4 each. Will double check before some Internet warrior pulls me on it..
That'd be mad if you were allowed provide 'different' balls. It seems very amateurish actually. Jaysus, we get new balls for county finals :D
Quote from: AZOffaly on September 29, 2011, 12:50:40 PM
Quote from: Dinny Breen on September 29, 2011, 12:49:11 PM
Yea each team provides 4 each. Will double check before some Internet warrior pulls me on it..
That'd be mad if you were allowed provide 'different' balls. It seems very amateurish actually. Jaysus, we get new balls for county finals :D
I stand corrected somewhat
Teams have had 30 balls to practice with during the tournament and are given four of the eight match balls used for each game the day before they play.
Quote from: Dinny Breen on September 29, 2011, 12:51:26 PM
Quote from: AZOffaly on September 29, 2011, 12:50:40 PM
Quote from: Dinny Breen on September 29, 2011, 12:49:11 PM
Yea each team provides 4 each. Will double check before some Internet warrior pulls me on it..
That'd be mad if you were allowed provide 'different' balls. It seems very amateurish actually. Jaysus, we get new balls for county finals :D
I stand corrected somewhat
Teams have had 30 balls to practice with during the tournament and are given four of the eight match balls used for each game the day before they play.
If you were playing against a team who liked to kick the ball would there be sanctions for letting a bit if air out of the ball so that she wouldn't fly as well. Just curious like.
O'Gara and Murray picked to play on sunday to the far more knowledgeable Ruby heads on this board did ye expect this selection because the 3 wise men in montrose last week were saying Sexton would definitely start .
Quote from: the Deel Rover on September 30, 2011, 09:18:53 AM
O'Gara and Murray picked to play on sunday to the far more knowledgeable Ruby heads on this board did ye expect this selection because the 3 wise men in montrose last week were saying Sexton would definitely start .
Dinny explains it pretty well back up the page.
Quote from: gawa316 on September 30, 2011, 10:07:49 AM
Quote from: the Deel Rover on September 30, 2011, 09:18:53 AM
O'Gara and Murray picked to play on sunday to the far more knowledgeable Ruby heads on this board did ye expect this selection because the 3 wise men in montrose last week were saying Sexton would definitely start .
Dinny explains it pretty well back up the page.
:-[ :-[ he does indeed gawa316
Anyone watching the SA Samoa game? Samoa putting it right up to south africa and should have scored a couple of more tries. Thye just had a man sent off but then South Africa had John Smit sin binned, SA lead 13 5 with 10 mins to go
Quote from: ludermor on September 30, 2011, 10:16:17 AM
Anyone watching the SA Samoa game? Samoa putting it right up to south africa and should have scored a couple of more tries. Thye just had a man sent off but then South Africa had John Smit sin binned, SA lead 13 5 with 10 mins to go
FT SA 13 - Samoa 5
Was 13-0 at HT
Had Samoa been in England's group they probably would have won it!
Samoa were not quite up to it. Good game but they let the South Africans get too far ahead at the break.
Ireland: Rob Kearney, Tommy Bowe, Brian O'Driscoll (capt), Gordon D'Arcy, Keith Earls, Ronan O'Gara, Conor Murray; Cian Healy, Rory Best, Mike Ross, Donncha O'Callaghan, Paul O'Connell, Stephen Ferris, Sean O'Brien, Jamie Heaslip. Replacements: Sean Cronin, Tom Court, Donnacha Ryan, Denis Leamy, Eoin Reddan, Jonathan Sexton, Andrew Trimble.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/rugby_union/15058766.stm
Happy enough with that team Dinny has convinced me that O'Gara and Murray is the right call!
Quote from: AQMP on September 30, 2011, 10:32:11 AM
Quote from: ludermor on September 30, 2011, 10:16:17 AM
Anyone watching the SA Samoa game? Samoa putting it right up to south africa and should have scored a couple of more tries. Thye just had a man sent off but then South Africa had John Smit sin binned, SA lead 13 5 with 10 mins to go
FT SA 13 - Samoa 5
Was 13-0 at HT
Had Samoa been in England's group they probably would have won it!
Awk would ya not talk wets, Samoa couldnt even beat Wales FFS.
England are now 2nd favourites for the world cup imo
We might have been better off picking Sexton and playing an expansive game in that indoor stadium
Quote from: screenexile on September 30, 2011, 12:14:26 PM
Ireland: Rob Kearney, Tommy Bowe, Brian O'Driscoll (capt), Gordon D'Arcy, Keith Earls, Ronan O'Gara, Conor Murray; Cian Healy, Rory Best, Mike Ross, Donncha O'Callaghan, Paul O'Connell, Stephen Ferris, Sean O'Brien, Jamie Heaslip. Replacements: Sean Cronin, Tom Court, Donnacha Ryan, Denis Leamy, Eoin Reddan, Jonathan Sexton, Andrew Trimble.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/rugby_union/15058766.stm
Happy enough with that team Dinny has convinced me that O'Gara and Murray is the right call!
Samoa have been a bit unlucky this tournament. Probably should have beaten Wales really and could maybe have beaten South Africa too. Just a bit of a lack of discipline held them back at times.
Quote from: whitegoodman on September 30, 2011, 01:07:48 PM
England are now 2nd favourites for the world cup imo
The draw is opening up for them all right. They haven't lost to a Five Nations team since Wales in 1987
Quote from: deiseach on September 30, 2011, 03:20:38 PM
Quote from: whitegoodman on September 30, 2011, 01:07:48 PM
England are now 2nd favourites for the world cup imo
The draw is opening up for them all right. They haven't lost to a Five Nations team since Wales in 1987
Yeah but the current England team are not that good!
Quote from: screenexile on September 30, 2011, 03:28:26 PM
Quote from: deiseach on September 30, 2011, 03:20:38 PM
The draw is opening up for them all right. They haven't lost to a Five Nations team since Wales in 1987
Yeah but the current England team are not that good!
True, but history matters. The English team four years ago shouldn't have gotten anywhere near the final, and as for New Zealand . . .
Quote from: screenexile on September 30, 2011, 03:28:26 PM
Quote from: deiseach on September 30, 2011, 03:20:38 PM
Quote from: whitegoodman on September 30, 2011, 01:07:48 PM
England are now 2nd favourites for the world cup imo
The draw is opening up for them all right. They haven't lost to a Five Nations team since Wales in 1987
Yeah but the current England team are not that good!
+1..decent enough scrum but a crowd of brainless wrecking balls along the backline
still New Zealands to lose esp playing at home with refs less likely to penalise their continuous illegal pack play
Shouldnt be complacent...would be one thing going into this match thinking about maybe NZ or SA in a q/f, but the easier path towards the semis and final earned with the great victory over Australia, heads will be well focused for Sunday morning.
Looks well setup for Murray to come of age on Sunday, think he's a mint player
Quote from: J OGorman on September 30, 2011, 03:39:59 PM
Quote from: screenexile on September 30, 2011, 03:28:26 PM
Quote from: deiseach on September 30, 2011, 03:20:38 PM
Quote from: whitegoodman on September 30, 2011, 01:07:48 PM
England are now 2nd favourites for the world cup imo
The draw is opening up for them all right. They haven't lost to a Five Nations team since Wales in 1987
Yeah but the current England team are not that good!
+1..decent enough scrum but a crowd of brainless wrecking balls along the backline
still New Zealands to lose esp playing at home with refs less likely to penalise their continuous illegal pack play
Shouldnt be complacent...would be one thing going into this match thinking about maybe NZ or SA in a q/f, but the easier path towards the semis and final earned with the great victory over Australia, heads will be well focused for Sunday morning.
Looks well setup for Murray to come of age on Sunday, think he's a mint player
Foden , Aston & Tuilagi ar no more wrecking balls than we have ourselves.
Come on England !!
The past is history what matters is now. England will blow up if they get a tough game against France or Ireland. it is waiting to happen. They won't be able to use the crash bang wallop tactics they used against Ireland in the warm ups and Argentina in the opening game with the world watching. They might make a bigger impact on history in four years time.
Quote from: deiseach on September 30, 2011, 03:30:57 PM
Quote from: screenexile on September 30, 2011, 03:28:26 PM
Quote from: deiseach on September 30, 2011, 03:20:38 PM
The draw is opening up for them all right. They haven't lost to a Five Nations team since Wales in 1987
Yeah but the current England team are not that good!
True, but history matters. The English team four years ago shouldn't have gotten anywhere near the final, and as for New Zealand . . .
Quote from: J OGorman on September 30, 2011, 03:39:59 PM
Quote from: screenexile on September 30, 2011, 03:28:26 PM
Quote from: deiseach on September 30, 2011, 03:20:38 PM
Quote from: whitegoodman on September 30, 2011, 01:07:48 PM
England are now 2nd favourites for the world cup imo
[/quote
The draw is opening up for them all right. They haven't lost to a Five Nations team since Wales in 1987
Yeah but the current England team are not that good!
+1..decent enough scrum but a crowd of brainless wrecking balls along the backline
still New Zealands to lose esp playing at home with refs less likely to penalise their continuous illegal pack play
Shouldnt be complacent...would be one thing going into this match thinking about maybe NZ or SA in a q/f, but the easier path towards the semis and final earned with the great victory over Australia, heads will be well focused for Sunday morning.
Looks well setup for Murray to come of age on Sunday, think he's a mint player
Murray looked up for it when he came on against the Aussies. I think he could be ready to make an impact against the Italians.
See you at 8.30am Irish time for England v Scotland.
France lose against Tonga. 19-14. France getting a late try to ensure qualification.
Quote from: Capt Pat on October 01, 2011, 08:08:39 AM
France lose against Tonga. 19-14. France getting a late try to ensure qualification.
Feck they beat the french but lose to canada...unbelievable!
Doesn't make that much difference to our side of the draw (touch wood, fingers crossed etc etc). I'd rather eng played the french in the qf than tonga
Scotland kicking for goal when they need tries???
They have the whole game to get tries they have to take what points they can, england giving away a lot of penalities scotland 6 0 up 16 mins gone
3-0 to the Scotch and now they are trying to kick long range penalties. Go for the corner or run.
We agree to differ I think the Scotch have to go for the four try bonus point. Tries win games while penalties keep the opposition in touch.
If build up a few scores england could fall apart, points on the board then go for tries if they need for the last 20mins. Plus they are not the best try scorers in the world. Wilkinson has missed 3 kicks, phil vickery sounds stunned and
asks when was the last time he missed 3, the commentator says 3 weeks ago!
The Scots just don't have the ability to score 4 tries. If they cam get one before half time they will be in a great position to hold the 8 point gap. They're bossing this 1st half but England will come at some stage.
Scots scrum well on top
Scotland will have the strong wind behind them in the second half, they are demolishing the england and they will be lucky not to get a man binned
If Scotland win by 8 or more does that put them above england in their pool?
8 Point win will do it.
Do Scotland just need to beat England by 8 points to go through?
Dan Carter injured. England and France struggling. Time to dream.
Quote from: Capt Pat on October 01, 2011, 09:18:17 AM
Do Scotland just need to beat England by 8 points to go through?
yes
Scotland are right not to go for tries, IMO. They wouldn't score four in a month. They have every chance of getting the 8-point margin with the boot, playing with the wind and the misfiring Wilkinson having to kick against the wind. Scots were 7.6 on Betfair before kick off. Now 2.7.
1.96 now; England 2.26 (after Wilkinson's drop).
with france and england doing poorly today (the english might not even qualify), a good professional performance from us in tomorrow will give us the best chance EVER of a WC Final appearance. Heres hoping.
That's competely forgetting Wales who could have beaten SA, they'll be thinking the exact same thing, beat Ireland and they can make a final
Aston try last few minutes, game over
Quote from: Mayo4Sam on October 01, 2011, 09:55:53 AM
That's competely forgetting Wales who could have beaten SA, they'll be thinking the exact same thing, beat Ireland and they can make a final
i was thinking that actually, just forgot to type it
I think Scotland will rue that last penalty Patterson kicked. They had England on the rack and should have gone for the try at that stage.
England are piss poor and had Argentina or Scotland any try scoring threat the English would be going home now!
Valiant effort by the Scots but they just don't have the quality!
Christ that France v England quarter-final will have the two worst teams left in it.
England need to start Flood.
Quote from: Dinny Breen on October 01, 2011, 10:18:17 AM
Christ that France v England quarter-final will have the two worst teams left in it.
England need to start Flood.
There's a hostage to fortune if I ever saw one :D
That try came from.Scotland attacking on Englands 22 and using a garyowen to try and score a try. England clear the ball and another garyowen from the Scotch gives England the attacking platform they score the try from. Brutal tactics from the Scots just like the Argies will get you nowhere. England will lose against the first real good team they face. France? or the winners of Ireland v Wales imo.
What in the name of God was Parks doing a garryowen for with about 4minutes left and inside opposition 22. Worst decision all match.
Quote from: CiKe on October 01, 2011, 10:22:13 AM
What in the name of God was Parks doing a garryowen for with about 4minutes left and inside opposition 22. Worst decision all match.
Ah Pat, see you beat me to it.
Quote from: CiKe on October 01, 2011, 10:22:13 AM
What in the name of God was Parks doing a garryowen for with about 4minutes left and inside opposition 22. Worst decision all match.
Parks is a kicker. His immediate reaction when receiving the ball is to drop it to his feet. When you see him pass he is straining against an innate reflex.
Quote from: Hoof Hearted on October 01, 2011, 09:52:32 AM
with france and england doing poorly today (the english might not even qualify), a good professional performance from us in tomorrow will give us the best chance EVER of a WC Final appearance. Heres hoping.
+1. Assuming we win tomorrow all 4 teams will fancy their chances of getting to the final. France and England don't look great shakes at the minute and you would give Ireland or Wales a great chance.
Great game today between England/Scotland bit like an Ulster championship game.
Id say Ireland and Wales will be delighted if England beat France, they are pure muck, no scrum, no invention, a battering ram in tugalagi, tindell is poor, wilkinson has lost his kicking, ashton is a threat but fairly one dimensional
Quote from: trileacman on October 01, 2011, 01:51:25 PM
Quote from: CiKe on October 01, 2011, 10:22:13 AM
What in the name of God was Parks doing a garryowen for with about 4minutes left and inside opposition 22. Worst decision all match.
Parks is a kicker. His immediate reaction when receiving the ball is to drop it to his feet. When you see him pass he is straining against an innate reflex.
Parks is an idiot but the blame can't all be his when you gear a team up to play a certain way you can't blame them when that game plan leads to a teams down fall.
Set out to score a few tries and you might get somewhere. I don't understand the fear factor that inhibits a lot of teams at the world cup.
Quote from: Capt Pat on October 01, 2011, 02:28:37 PM
Quote from: trileacman on October 01, 2011, 01:51:25 PM
Quote from: CiKe on October 01, 2011, 10:22:13 AM
What in the name of God was Parks doing a garryowen for with about 4minutes left and inside opposition 22. Worst decision all match.
Parks is a kicker. His immediate reaction when receiving the ball is to drop it to his feet. When you see him pass he is straining against an innate reflex.
Parks is an idiot but the blame can't all be his when you gear a team up to play a certain way you can't blame them when that game plan leads to a teams down fall.
Set out to score a few tries and you might get somewhere. I don't understand the fear factor that inhibits a lot of teams at the world cup.
agree 100% - you only get a chance every 4 years you may aswell go for it, may as well lose by 20 pts as 1 pt.
Quote from: Mayo4Sam on October 01, 2011, 02:24:30 PM
Id say Ireland and Wales will be delighted if England beat France, they are pure muck, no scrum, no invention, a battering ram in tugalagi, tindell is poor, wilkinson has lost his kicking, ashton is a threat but fairly one dimensional
Some would argue that England backline is every bit as good as Ireland. Foden/kearney, Ashton/bowe, tindall/darcey, cueto/earls Wilkinson/o gara, youngs/Murray, take an aging drico out is there much in it???
Seems to me a lot of ya are overestimating Ireland and underestimating the English and the frogs
Quote from: whitegoodman on October 01, 2011, 02:41:26 PM
Quote from: Mayo4Sam on October 01, 2011, 02:24:30 PM
Id say Ireland and Wales will be delighted if England beat France, they are pure muck, no scrum, no invention, a battering ram in tugalagi, tindell is poor, wilkinson has lost his kicking, ashton is a threat but fairly one dimensional
Some would argue that England backline is every bit as good as Ireland. Foden/kearney, Ashton/bowe, tindall/darcey, cueto/earls Wilkinson/o gara, youngs/Murray, take an aging drico out is there much in it???
Seems to me a lot of ya are overestimating Ireland and underestimating the English and the frogs
no way, would never do that. Been bitten too much in the past. DEFINATELY NOT underestimating Italy tomorrow. If we are beat i wouldnt be shocked. But if we get through tomorrow, i would be dissapointed if we didnt get to the final
Quote from: Orangemac on October 01, 2011, 01:59:16 PM
Quote from: Hoof Hearted on October 01, 2011, 09:52:32 AM
with france and england doing poorly today (the english might not even qualify), a good professional performance from us in tomorrow will give us the best chance EVER of a WC Final appearance. Heres hoping.
+1. Assuming we win tomorrow all 4 teams will fancy their chances of getting to the final. France and England don't look great shakes at the minute and you would give Ireland or Wales a great chance.
Great game today between England/Scotland bit like an Ulster championship game.
Nah, twas too high scoring.
Ashton is clearly a very good player. But that swan diving business he does, I feel is horrible and very unsporting? I am amazed the manager or RFU havent pulled him up on it.
Quote from: pullhard on October 01, 2011, 03:29:44 PM
Ashton is clearly a very good player. But that swan diving business he does, I feel is horrible and very unsporting? I am amazed the manager or RFU havent pulled him up on it.
The manager has, but he does it anyway, which raises questions about Johnson's authority.
Dan Carter misses rest of WC. Big blow to NZ and a real shame for him.
This makes things interesting, not the same team without him. Terrible shame for him. NIck Evans had a great game today but that would go against policy...
Desperate news for the player and the host nation as a whole. Expect a big all black performance against Canada but ultimately their hopes of winning the Webb Ellis have been dealt a severe blow
It can still happen to anyone of Ireland's big players - imagine having to do without the one of the back row the way that they are playing at present. Do you think any of the Kiwis or other nations would give a stuff?
Whilst unfortunate for Carter, We should save our sympathy for any tragedy that may be visited upon Ireland - hopefully none.
O'Gara to kick us to the quarter finals tomorrow, and then Sexton to take over.
In a strange way it could help the all blacks by making them under dogs in their own country and reducing expectations.
it will give everyone a lift that carter is ruled out of the world cup.its hard on him though
A tragedy for Carter, his whole career has been building for this moment. Vice-Captain, top form, top scorer, WC on home turf, he seemed destined to bring this All-black team to the promised land. He must be distraught right now.
You have to look at that All Black team and still say they have a big chance. The back row have Kieran Reid back now. Added to Kaino and McCaw that is the best back row in the tournament. The outside backs SB Williams, Nonu, Conrad Smith, Israel Dagg etc are a lot better than any other group left in the tournament. Thrir front row is strong too. That leaves the second row and maybe now out half as the only spots where they begin to look a bit ordinary. Weepu and Cowan are good scrum halves. They are also playing at home. What is the problem?
Quote from: Capt Pat on October 02, 2011, 07:51:39 AM
You have to look at that All Black team and still say they have a big chance. The back row have Kieran Reid back now. Added to Kaino and McCaw that is the best back row in the tournament. The outside backs SB Williams, Nonu, Conrad Smith, Israel Dagg etc are a lot better than any other group left in the tournament. Thrir front row is strong too. That leaves the second row and maybe now out half as the only spots where they begin to look a bit ordinary. Weepu and Cowan are good scrum halves. They are also playing at home. What is the problem?
Those outside backs are triggered by arguably the game's greatest player, without him pulling the strings they might come back to earth a little bit.
It's a massive shame for the player, the All Blacks, and for anyone who loves rugby.
Tom McGurk nearly gives me heart failure by starting off with a sad announcement which I was sure was going to be Paul O Connell. No worries he was talking about Carter.
Sonny Bill will surely start now and will trigger a lot of offensive plays for the ABs as will Nonu. They have more than one attacking orchestrator.
Carter is an all round class act in all areas and will be missed but he won't signal an end to brilliant all black attacking play.
Quote from: mc_grens on October 02, 2011, 08:03:23 AM
Quote from: Capt Pat on October 02, 2011, 07:51:39 AM
You have to look at that All Black team and still say they have a big chance. The back row have Kieran Reid back now. Added to Kaino and McCaw that is the best back row in the tournament. The outside backs SB Williams, Nonu, Conrad Smith, Israel Dagg etc are a lot better than any other group left in the tournament. Thrir front row is strong too. That leaves the second row and maybe now out half as the only spots where they begin to look a bit ordinary. Weepu and Cowan are good scrum halves. They are also playing at home. What is the problem?
Those outside backs are triggered by arguably the game's greatest player, without him pulling the strings they might come back to earth a little bit.
It's a massive shame for the player, the All Blacks, and for anyone who loves rugby.
where do you propose SB Williams to play if Nonu is also playing? Don't get me wrong I rate him but they aren't going to drop Smith who is probably the best 13 in the tournament (drico still up there, but understandably he isn't what he was due to father time, while Fourie also there or thereabouts_
Quote from: CiKe on October 02, 2011, 08:23:04 AM
where do you propose SB Williams to play if Nonu is also playing? Don't get me wrong I rate him but they aren't going to drop Smith who is probably the best 13 in the tournament (drico still up there, but understandably he isn't what he was due to father time, while Fourie also there or thereabouts_
On the wing full back or wherever but he plays. The tour I mentioned all start.
The Rte commentary is 3 seconds slow today.
Quote from: Capt Pat on October 02, 2011, 08:39:26 AM
The Rte commentary is 3 seconds slow today.
They never get it right, watching it on UTV.
Italy twisted that scrum around not Ireland.
Quote from: Capt Pat on October 02, 2011, 08:36:03 AM
Quote from: CiKe on October 02, 2011, 08:23:04 AM
where do you propose SB Williams to play if Nonu is also playing? Don't get me wrong I rate him but they aren't going to drop Smith who is probably the best 13 in the tournament (drico still up there, but understandably he isn't what he was due to father time, while Fourie also there or thereabouts_
On the wing full back or wherever but he plays. The tour I mentioned all start.
I think he is good enough to play on the wing but when you have specialised wingers as good as NZ do, not sure makes sense. Likewise with fullback, where Dagg has been good and of course they have Muliaina, I don't see him playing there. To my knowledge he has no experience at full back and it would be madness to start him there
Quote from: Capt Pat on October 02, 2011, 08:43:42 AM
Italy twisted that scrum around not Ireland.
Kaplan will warn you then penalise you. He did it to Healy in that scrum and then Italy in the line-out.
good start from ROG
anyone have a link for the match?
i thought italy were going to lie down
Quote from: DrinkingHarp on October 02, 2011, 08:56:03 AM
anyone have a link for the match?
front row sports or first row sports
Quote from: gerry on October 02, 2011, 08:59:02 AM
i thought italy were going to lie down
Why would you think that?
That big hairy Italian has had a rough first half hour!
That was a try. Bowe juggled it, never a knock-on. Why didn't he go to the TMO?
What a dipshit this ref is. That is 7 points gone. The biggest disgrace of the world cupp.
Quote from: muppet on October 02, 2011, 09:05:43 AM
That was a try. Bowe juggled it, never a knock-on. Why didn't he go to the TMO?
exactly
Italians clever. Running offside to stop Murray kicking then running back onside. Murray then distracted and makes a mistake.
here is a link if anyone needs it
http://www.ilemi.me/29933/2/Watch-Ireland-vs-Italy/
Cian Healy really in the wars, gouged and then punched by Bergamasco.
Heaslip doing some great defensive work along with the flankers. Our scrum is a serious operation these days if it can beat up that Italian front row. Only for a dopey ref and a couple of handling errors we would be well ahead.
Lads isthere much difference in playing loose head and tight head in the front row? Hear them mention it there with italy but wouldnt know the impact it has. Is it technique in the scrum that would be the main difference?
Nerve wrecking stuff... An early try in second half please
O Callaghan needs to come off. Italy are going to wind up even more in the 2nd half and we don't need Donnacha the one man penalty count, reacting to them.
Quote from: blewuporstuffed on October 02, 2011, 09:07:07 AM
Quote from: muppet on October 02, 2011, 09:05:43 AM
That was a try. Bowe juggled it, never a knock-on. Why didn't he go to the TMO?
exactly
It was initially a forward pass before the juggling
Rubbish O Se that was a deliberate gouge. He forced his hand into Healys face. We got done by the ref in that half. We could be 16 points up.
A loose head pushes up against one head, a tight head burrows down against two heads. Two different techniques, and tight heads need to be able to accept more pressure on their neck than a loose head.
(this is my interpretation, I'm happy to be put in place!)
We don't need to engage mauls do we? We need to stop mauling.
Quote from: thewobbler on October 02, 2011, 09:22:45 AM
A loose head pushes up against one head, a tight head burrows down against two heads. Two different techniques, and tight heads need to be able to accept more pressure on their neck than a loose head.
(this is my interpretation, I'm happy to be put in place!)
good man. Thought it was something like that.
Quote from: thewobbler on October 02, 2011, 09:19:12 AM
O Callaghan needs to come off. Italy are going to wind up even more in the 2nd half and we don't need Donnacha the one man penalty count, reacting to them.
Em he hasn't conceded any yet.
Should we take off those who have? Like O'Connell & Healy?
We are throwing it left and right a lot without sucking them in as we usually do. Must be a tactical thing.
Go go Tommy Bowe! Come on now lads pull away and finish them off be great for the confidence
Quote from: CiKe on October 02, 2011, 09:36:18 AM
Go go Tommy Bowe! Come on now lads pull away and finish them off be great for the confidence
Bad restart. It isn't over yet. We need to keep up the concentration.
Quinlan mustn't believe in much, starting to do my head in with everything being "unbelievable"
Quote from: muppet on October 02, 2011, 09:38:11 AM
Quote from: CiKe on October 02, 2011, 09:36:18 AM
Go go Tommy Bowe! Come on now lads pull away and finish them off be great for the confidence
Bad restart. It isn't over yet. We need to keep up the concentration.
Likely it's over now, fingers crossed, great break from Darcy
Great try. Shackles coming off.
Some of them really coming into form now, D'Arcy especially. I was wrong about him.
DOC gave away one pen and was lucky to have another reversed. Or maybe I'm making it up!
Fair play that Tommy Bowe. Him and the legend of O Driscoll are the reasons why our back lines pisses all over England.
Bergamasco flanker and Catrogiovani are off as well. Game to Ireland.???.......and Earls agrees.
Looking ahead, here's hoping that Best coming off is only a precaution.
UTV think Best may have done his collar-bone. That would not be good with Flan already out.
Take off Ross O Connell Bowe and Ferris now. The game is over.
Darcy took some hit in the ribs there
I'm with you there Capt Pat. Anyone who is half way irreplaceable should be replaced now.
Better link here: http://www.vipbox.tv/watch/4824/1/ireland-vs-italy.html
O'Brien has been unreal. Injuries are a real worry
yeah i'd take o'brien, bowe and ferris now--i saw Best getting hit over on the right in lead up to try and thought 'we've this game won, no injuries please'
Best had developed brilliantly and rarely, if ever, makes a mistake.
He'll be a serious loss going forward
The Italian number 17 is a bit of a dickweed
Ireland 12/1 to win the cup, but you can get them each way at 4/1.
Should they get there of course
Kaplan will card someone.
Healy might be better off taking a rest from beating up Italians.
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on October 02, 2011, 09:55:49 AM
Ireland 12/1 to win the cup, but you can get them each way at 4/1.
Should they get there of course
What way does each way work - just reach the final?
The amount of times D'Arcy has been taken out off the ball is unbelievable. Italians losing the head now.
The Italians are a disgrace with their foul play.
Ryan is doing what Wobbler thought O'Callaghan might do but I am impressed with him since he came on.
Why did RTE take Hugh Cahill to NZ instead of Ryle Nugent? Think he's a better commentator than Nugent.
Quote from: 4father on October 02, 2011, 09:59:34 AM
Quote from: Milltown Row2 on October 02, 2011, 09:55:49 AM
Ireland 12/1 to win the cup, but you can get them each way at 4/1.
Should they get there of course
What way does each way work - just reach the final?
yes
Did you see yon number 17 with his elbow?
Didn't expect Ireland to be 20+ points ahead going in to the last 10 mins. Building up a head of steam nicely in this tournament.
Wales no pushovers. They could have beaten SA and topped that group.
Great stuff Tommy Bowe
Quote from: ONeill on October 02, 2011, 10:14:18 AM
Didn't expect Ireland to be 20+ points ahead going in to the last 10 mins. Building up a head of steam nicely in this tournament.
Wales no pushovers. They could have beaten SA and topped that group.
What time is the Wales game at next Saturday?
No foul play my arse!
Tommy does like his 78 mins full pitch runs.
Great win for Ireland - Now what about Wales??
Quote from: Orangemac on October 02, 2011, 10:16:25 AM
Quote from: ONeill on October 02, 2011, 10:14:18 AM
Didn't expect Ireland to be 20+ points ahead going in to the last 10 mins. Building up a head of steam nicely in this tournament.
Wales no pushovers. They could have beaten SA and topped that group.
What time is the Wales game at next Saturday?
6am.
very professional performance ( except by officials)
bit like ourselves Wales are really coming into form. There won't be any 30 point wins next week. They have a serious backrown as well and dangerous backs, should be a cracking game.
6am!?!?
Must confess, after Ireland beat Australia, i backed Wales to eliminate Ireland 15/8 with PP.
Hope I'm wrong now!
Didn't get the bonus point.
More seriously Mallet will keep his mouth shut the next time he manages a team against Ireland. The Irish media shout keep a microphone on Gatland all next week.
6am what ?? The game next week?!
Worried about Wales
Can see an England Wales semi and England sneakin into final again--couldnt write those f**kers off ever
Quote from: comethekingdom on October 02, 2011, 10:19:32 AM
Great win for Ireland - Now what about Wales??
50/50. Both have momentum. Wales have racked up big scores in their group - 66 and a 80+. They beat ireland in the 6 Nations too. Wouldn't be gambling the mortgage.
Just realised I'm gonna be in feckin Belgium for the game next week. Feckin better be on in the hotel or I'll lose the plot.
Our back row were world class today!!!!
Quote from: ONeill on October 02, 2011, 10:26:11 AM
Quote from: comethekingdom on October 02, 2011, 10:19:32 AM
Great win for Ireland - Now what about Wales??
50/50. Both have momentum. Wales have racked up big scores in their group - 66 and a 80+. They beat ireland in the 6 Nations too. Wouldn't be gambling the mortgage.
Wales beat us with a dodgy try in Cardiff.
The referee and his officials were a disgrace. They took at least 14 points off Ireland. They didn't sinbin any of the Italians either.
Wales will be going home next week for sure if Rory Best is fit. I will worry if Sean Cronin is at hooker.
Great result, especially in the 2nd half. Held discipline well agin a disgraceful Italian pack. Have leaders in all sectors.
1/4 final is gonna be a humdinger
CMTF
Wales will NOT be a pushover regardless. We rarely have it easy against them, and seldom have they been in such a good place in terms of squad unity as they are now.
who was MOTM?
Quote from: CiKe on October 02, 2011, 10:48:04 AM
who was MOTM?
O'Brien.
Could have been anyone, they were all on top of their games.
Quote from: CiKe on October 02, 2011, 10:48:04 AM
who was MOTM?
Sean O Brien
Was Best really badly hurt? Or is it just a minor shoulder pain from where he has had injury issues in the past?
Michael Lynagh reckons England for the final - feck him!
Quote from: CiKe on October 02, 2011, 10:56:43 AM
Michael Lynagh reckons England for the final - feck him!
Licking Dallaglio's balls
QuoteLicking Dallaglio's balls
Nail on the head!
Great atmosphere in the Mighty Quinn again today. Quare wheena Derry wans there too. Lots of GAA club and county shirts showing that this really is our national team. Now to get to the small issue of the anthem not being played.
Ah well that is the end of "Wabbalies" in this tournament. Might pull a few heads in.
Marked improvement from Darcy and Bowe on previous outings and our back row are outstanding.
If Best is out it is a serious loss, in the scrum, line out and surprisingly in the loose.
Set up for a cracker next week, Wales are also flying, have a very good back row and some very exciting back players.
Looking at the draw and the injury to Carter I fear a repeat of the 07 final :-\
Quote from: whitegoodman on October 02, 2011, 12:50:42 PM
Marked improvement from Darcy and Bowe on previous outings and our back row are outstanding.
If Best is out it is a serious loss, in the scrum, line out and surprisingly in the loose.
Set up for a cracker next week, Wales are also flying, have a very good back row and some very exciting back players.
Looking at the draw and the injury to Carter I fear a repeat of the 07 final :-\
France always always has a game in them. Hopefully it is against England. The other side of the draw can take care of itself. TBH I wouldn't be surprised to see any of the big 3 in the Final. For us one step at a time, we can beat Wales. Just do it!
I would be 10 times more confident of us beating England than Wales. They have a great scrum and pace in their back line. They have improved since the 6N and they have leaders in all the right places. This will be our hardest game in a long long time and if we come out of it there will be 1 score in it!!
I have heard Rory Best is out of the tournment and will be replaced by Mike Sherry.
#seanobrienfacts trending on twitter:
Scientists believe that a big bang created the universe, they also believe a big bang from Sean O'Brien could end it.
Ryanair pays Seán O'Brien €40 each time he looks at their website.
The "S" on Superman's Shirt....stands for Sean O Brien
Wales will be a massive challenge but it does seem to be clicking into place for Ireland. For the first time in donkeys years, Ireland have a very strong scrum. We no longer are just satisfied with parity and we can now really attack other teams at the set piece. Both Ferris and O'Brien are destructive presences in the back row and Heaslip is finding form at the right time. Murray is still a bit raw but he brings something different. O'Gara's confidence is high and there are few better place kickers around. D'Arcy had his best game in a long time and Trimble has the ability to make a significant impact off the bench.
Wales also seem to be coming to the boil at the right time but our record against them is good and we definitely have the edge in terms of experience. As long as we don't let the game get too loose, we should beat them.
Great win today... soaked up the Italian pressure and then hit them in the second half. Very impressed as we killed the game off middling early in the second half when the opportunities presented
What was the carry on with revelations in today's papers about the English players?
Best is out of the tournament according to Tony Leen of the Cork Examiner on Twitter. His collarbone is broke which is what the ITV touchline commentator was implying during the match. Sherry from Munster might come into the squad but I would start Varley and have Cronin on the bench.
It is a set back but not the end of the world.
Quote from: Capt Pat on October 02, 2011, 04:34:01 PM
Best is out of the tournament according to Tony Leen of the Cork Examiner on Twitter. His collarbone is broke which is what the ITV touchline commentator was implying during the match. Sherry from Munster might come into the squad but I would start Varley and have Cronin on the bench.
It is a set back but not the end of the world.
Haven't seen too much of Varley or too much of Cronin for that matter to be honest. How would you rate each of them relative to Best in the scrum, lineout and loose?
Cronin can't throw into the lineout so I don't knoe how he can have a pro rugby career. He is good enough in the loose and I am not sure about the scrum. Varley is a good all rounder as far as I know and I would play him.
Captain Pat, it mightn't be the end of the world but it's a serious blow. Rory might not always pick out the perfect lineout throw but he was an intergral part of a mighty front row which has been the talk of the tournament- his loose play has been excellent also and remember he scored our second try of the campaign. Apart from all of that he is a massive presence in the squad. He is the leader of the formidable four Ulstermen who have been at the top of their games so far-Ferris, Bowe and Trimble.
However, any team with Ross and the Four Ohs (Driscoll,Connell,Gara,Brien) can't be ruled out but I'd be pretty sure Kidney would have preferred a poor victory and a fit Rory than the situation he finds himself in.Still, quiet night in next Friday.
Quote from: Dubh driocht on October 02, 2011, 05:09:38 PM
Captain Pat, it mightn't be the end of the world but it's a serious blow. Rory might not always pick out the perfect lineout throw but he was an intergral part of a mighty front row which has been the talk of the tournament- his loose play has been excellent also and remember he scored our second try of the campaign. Apart from all of that he is a massive presence in the squad. He is the leader of the formidable four Ulstermen who have been at the top of their games so far-Ferris, Bowe and Trimble.
However, any team with Ross and the Four Ohs (Driscoll,Connell,Gara,Brien) can't be ruled out but I'd be pretty sure Kidney would have preferred a poor victory and a fit Rory than the situation he finds himself in.Still, quiet night in next Friday.
Agreed on Best. Good scrummager, and part of one of our star units.
Quote from: Dubh driocht on October 02, 2011, 05:09:38 PM
Captain Pat, it mightn't be the end of the world but it's a serious blow. Rory might not always pick out the perfect lineout throw but he was an intergral part of a mighty front row which has been the talk of the tournament- his loose play has been excellent also and remember he scored our second try of the campaign. Apart from all of that he is a massive presence in the squad. He is the leader of the formidable four Ulstermen who have been at the top of their games so far-Ferris, Bowe and Trimble.
However, any team with Ross and the Four Ohs (Driscoll,Connell,Gara,Brien) can't be ruled out but I'd be pretty sure Kidney would have preferred a poor victory and a fit Rory than the situation he finds himself in.Still, quiet night in next Friday.
Careful now! - Mr Bowe is from Emyvale - Not exactly the 'real Ulster' in the eyes of much of the rugby fraternity in the north!
With Best seemingly following Flannery out and
QuoteMike Ross's reaction to something from Lo Cicero may also be something the citing commissioner wants to look at.
http://www.independent.ie/sport/rugby/world-cup/match-reports/ireland-sail-into-quarter-finals-with-emphatic-win-over-italy-2893770.html
scrum parity and dominance might be history.
Quote from: bcarrier on October 02, 2011, 05:30:47 PM
With Best seemingly following Flannery out and
QuoteMike Ross's reaction to something from Lo Cicero may also be something the citing commissioner wants to look at.
http://www.independent.ie/sport/rugby/world-cup/match-reports/ireland-sail-into-quarter-finals-with-emphatic-win-over-italy-2893770.html
scrum parity and dominance might be history.
I think he means the reverse of what you think he means. Hopefully.
Quote from: muppet on October 02, 2011, 06:15:27 PM
Quote from: bcarrier on October 02, 2011, 05:30:47 PM
With Best seemingly following Flannery out and
QuoteMike Ross's reaction to something from Lo Cicero may also be something the citing commissioner wants to look at.
http://www.independent.ie/sport/rugby/world-cup/match-reports/ireland-sail-into-quarter-finals-with-emphatic-win-over-italy-2893770.html
scrum parity and dominance might be history.
I think he means the reverse of what you think he means. Hopefully.
Me too but bit on boards.ie too.
Quote from: Capt Pat on October 02, 2011, 10:01:57 AM
The Italians are a disgrace with their foul play.
The game was quite tame compared to the Limerick hurling final that I watched on TG4.
Front row
Healy/Cronin/Ross v Jenkins/Bennett/Jones
With Rory Best out Wales probably have a slight edge. They have missed Jenkins and his return is a big plus for them. Jones is one of the best tight heads around. Ireland should hold their own but Cronin's darts need to be on the money.
Adv: Wales
Second row
O'Callaghan/O'Connell v Charteris/Wyn-Jones
Both of the Welsh locks are solid lineout operators but the two Munster lads have more of an impact around the field.
Adv: Ireland
Back row
Ferris/O'Brien/Heaslip v Lydiate/Warburton/Faletau
Ireland's backrow have been outstanding but they are yet to face a ground hog like Warburton who has been superb. Ireland should have an advantage here but they have to ensure that their clearing out is ferocious and Warburton isn't allowed get his paws on the ball.
Adv: Ireland
Half backs
Murray/O'Gara v Phillips/Priestland
Similar enough pairings in many ways. I think Murray will get the nod again to counteract Phillips' physicality around the fringes. Priestland, like O'Gara, is suspect defensively and Ireland will hopefully send the likes of O'Brien and Ferris down his channel early and often.
Adv: Draw
Centres
D'Arcy/O'Driscoll v Roberts/Davies
Ireland have an edge in terms of experience and it was encouraging to see D'Arcy showing something like his old form this morning. Roberts is a very powerful runner but he has been inconsistent in the past. Davies is very talented but he is untested in a contest like this.
Adv: Ireland
Back three
Earls/Kearney/Bowe v Williams/Hook/North
Tommy Bowe is one of the most effective wingers in world rugby and Earls is confidence should be growing with every game. George North looks a hell of a player though and Williams' record speaks for itself. I'd hope that O'Gara will target him and Hook with a few garryowens. Wales maybe have an ever so slight advantage but both teams have excellent backs in reserve - Byrne, Halfpenny, Trimble.
Adv: Wales
Looks a very finely balanced tie and Best's injury is a blow. It's a game Ireland are well capable of winning though and we do have more experience than the Welsh which should stand to us. Unless Ireland try and engage Wales in a 7s type game, we have the pack to beat them.
Quote from: Main Street on October 02, 2011, 07:41:46 PM
Quote from: Capt Pat on October 02, 2011, 10:01:57 AM
The Italians are a disgrace with their foul play.
The game was quite tame compared to the Limerick hurling final that I watched on TG4.
Yeah but thats Limerick, you come to expect it!
Looking back at the game the most encouraging things were probably the performances of Darcy and Murray. It was like the Darcy of five years ago when he would be the best player on the field. If he keeps it up we will be going places. Then there was Murray who already looks the part of an international scrum half. So Best may or may not be injured but this team is still making progress in other areas.
Ferris was immense today the Italians had no answer to him. O Brien drew in the Italian tacklers but I think there is more to come from him. The two tackles the two flankers put in on Castrogiovani are probably what put him out of the game.
Should be a great game this weekend. Think it will be very close so was wondering what happens in the result of a draw at end of 80 mins? is in extra time and still draw the penalties kick out?
O'brien v warburton should be some battle.
Obrien has been one of the players of the tournament so far, but warburton is a top class 7 also.
should be a cracker this weekend
Quote from: Just_Browsing on October 03, 2011, 09:05:40 AM
Should be a great game this weekend. Think it will be very close so was wondering what happens in the result of a draw at end of 80 mins? is in extra time and still draw the penalties kick out?
1. Extra time - following an interval of 5 minutes, extra time of 10 minutes each way (with an interval of 5 minutes) shall be played in full;
2. Sudden death - if the scores are tied at the conclusion of extra time, and following an interval of 5 minutes, then a further extra time of 10 minutes maximum shall be played. During this period the first team to score any points shall be declared the winner (sudden death);
3. Kicking competition - if after this sudden death period no winner can be declared, a kicking competition will be organised between the two teams. The winner of that competition shall be declared the winner of the match.
The kicking competition looks like fun. http://www.rugbyworldcup.com/home/tournamentrules/ (http://www.rugbyworldcup.com/home/tournamentrules/)
Quote from: Hardy on October 03, 2011, 12:20:03 PM
Quote from: Just_Browsing on October 03, 2011, 09:05:40 AM
Should be a great game this weekend. Think it will be very close so was wondering what happens in the result of a draw at end of 80 mins? is in extra time and still draw the penalties kick out?
1. Extra time - following an interval of 5 minutes, extra time of 10 minutes each way (with an interval of 5 minutes) shall be played in full;
2. Sudden death - if the scores are tied at the conclusion of extra time, and following an interval of 5 minutes, then a further extra time of 10 minutes maximum shall be played. During this period the first team to score any points shall be declared the winner (sudden death);
3. Kicking competition - if after this sudden death period no winner can be declared, a kicking competition will be organised between the two teams. The winner of that competition shall be declared the winner of the match.
The kicking competition looks like fun. http://www.rugbyworldcup.com/home/tournamentrules/ (http://www.rugbyworldcup.com/home/tournamentrules/)
cheers hardy - just looked that up. Yeah would actually like to see a game go that far for the spectacle - just not the ireland game!!!!
So the good news is tyat Best is not yet out of the tournament. He has a sprained ac joint in his right shoulder and is a doubt for the Wales match.
Thinking positively hopefully he will be back for the Semi Final.
Apparently the Irish are the most popular other team with the New Zealand public. I think they are beginning to light up to the fact that Ireland could get to the final and we have never beaten New Zealand. The perfect combo for the All Blacks.
Quote from: Hardy on October 03, 2011, 12:20:03 PM
Quote from: Just_Browsing on October 03, 2011, 09:05:40 AM
Should be a great game this weekend. Think it will be very close so was wondering what happens in the result of a draw at end of 80 mins? is in extra time and still draw the penalties kick out?
1. Extra time - following an interval of 5 minutes, extra time of 10 minutes each way (with an interval of 5 minutes) shall be played in full;
2. Sudden death - if the scores are tied at the conclusion of extra time, and following an interval of 5 minutes, then a further extra time of 10 minutes maximum shall be played. During this period the first team to score any points shall be declared the winner (sudden death);
3. Kicking competition - if after this sudden death period no winner can be declared, a kicking competition will be organised between the two teams. The winner of that competition shall be declared the winner of the match.
The kicking competition looks like fun. http://www.rugbyworldcup.com/home/tournamentrules/ (http://www.rugbyworldcup.com/home/tournamentrules/)
Im pretty sure one of the English competitions were decided by a kickoff in the last couple of years.
Quote from: ludermor on October 03, 2011, 01:13:24 PM
Quote from: Hardy on October 03, 2011, 12:20:03 PM
Quote from: Just_Browsing on October 03, 2011, 09:05:40 AM
Should be a great game this weekend. Think it will be very close so was wondering what happens in the result of a draw at end of 80 mins? is in extra time and still draw the penalties kick out?
1. Extra time - following an interval of 5 minutes, extra time of 10 minutes each way (with an interval of 5 minutes) shall be played in full;
2. Sudden death - if the scores are tied at the conclusion of extra time, and following an interval of 5 minutes, then a further extra time of 10 minutes maximum shall be played. During this period the first team to score any points shall be declared the winner (sudden death);
3. Kicking competition - if after this sudden death period no winner can be declared, a kicking competition will be organised between the two teams. The winner of that competition shall be declared the winner of the match.
The kicking competition looks like fun. http://www.rugbyworldcup.com/home/tournamentrules/ (http://www.rugbyworldcup.com/home/tournamentrules/)
Im pretty sure one of the English competitions were decided by a kickoff in the last couple of years.
I didn't know it had been done before - Leicester v. Cardiff, Heineken Cup SF, 2009 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kmIzYvh9Dys&feature=related)
Quote from: Hardy on October 03, 2011, 01:52:30 PM
Quote from: ludermor on October 03, 2011, 01:13:24 PM
Quote from: Hardy on October 03, 2011, 12:20:03 PM
Quote from: Just_Browsing on October 03, 2011, 09:05:40 AM
Should be a great game this weekend. Think it will be very close so was wondering what happens in the result of a draw at end of 80 mins? is in extra time and still draw the penalties kick out?
1. Extra time - following an interval of 5 minutes, extra time of 10 minutes each way (with an interval of 5 minutes) shall be played in full;
2. Sudden death - if the scores are tied at the conclusion of extra time, and following an interval of 5 minutes, then a further extra time of 10 minutes maximum shall be played. During this period the first team to score any points shall be declared the winner (sudden death);
3. Kicking competition - if after this sudden death period no winner can be declared, a kicking competition will be organised between the two teams. The winner of that competition shall be declared the winner of the match.
The kicking competition looks like fun. http://www.rugbyworldcup.com/home/tournamentrules/ (http://www.rugbyworldcup.com/home/tournamentrules/)
Im pretty sure one of the English competitions were decided by a kickoff in the last couple of years.
I didn't know it had been done before - Leicester v. Cardiff, Heineken Cup SF, 2009 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kmIzYvh9Dys&feature=related)
If that happens I expect we will have O'Gara, Sexton and Wallace as the front row.
I think I saw the draw fro the wales game is 20/1 it seemed very generous
Bring on Wales
Building nicely for the weekend - see the guy Sherry getting flew out as cover for Best - he'll have to stay in diff hotel, etc from the Squad unless he is made an official member - be nice enough though - get your flights paid out to NZ for you, there in time for a World Cup Semi Final, Tickets to matches and accomodation paid for - its like an RTE competition prize he's won... :D
Quote from: Just_Browsing on October 04, 2011, 11:36:00 AM
Building nicely for the weekend - see the guy Sherry getting flew out as cover for Best - he'll have to stay in diff hotel, etc from the Squad unless he is made an official member - be nice enough though - get your flights paid out to NZ for you, there in time for a World Cup Semi Final, Tickets to matches and accomodation paid for - its like an RTE competition prize he's won... :D
IMHO of the teams left, apart from SA and NZ, Wales is the most difficulty opponent. I'd much rather be playing Eng, Fra, Arg or the Aussies at this stage. Wales have flown a bit under the radar. This is no foregone conclusion.
Quote from: AQMP on October 04, 2011, 11:49:35 AM
Quote from: Just_Browsing on October 04, 2011, 11:36:00 AM
Building nicely for the weekend - see the guy Sherry getting flew out as cover for Best - he'll have to stay in diff hotel, etc from the Squad unless he is made an official member - be nice enough though - get your flights paid out to NZ for you, there in time for a World Cup Semi Final, Tickets to matches and accomodation paid for - its like an RTE competition prize he's won... :D
IMHO of the teams left, apart from SA and NZ, Wales is the most difficulty opponent. I'd much rather be playing Eng, Fra, Arg or the Aussies at this stage. Wales have flown a bit under the radar. This is no foregone conclusion.
Yes that was a mis-type on my behalf - meant to say in time for a Quarter Final (he is due to land Thur). Also very worried about Wales - scoring very heavily and probably came out of the hardest group in competition and arguably should have won it (hooks penalty was it wasnt it) but hopefully Ireland can come through a tough test.
Quote from: AQMP on October 04, 2011, 11:49:35 AM
Quote from: Just_Browsing on October 04, 2011, 11:36:00 AM
Building nicely for the weekend - see the guy Sherry getting flew out as cover for Best - he'll have to stay in diff hotel, etc from the Squad unless he is made an official member - be nice enough though - get your flights paid out to NZ for you, there in time for a World Cup Semi Final, Tickets to matches and accomodation paid for - its like an RTE competition prize he's won... :D
IMHO of the teams left, apart from SA and NZ, Wales is the most difficulty opponent. I'd much rather be playing Eng, Fra, Arg or the Aussies at this stage. Wales have flown a bit under the radar. This is no foregone conclusion.
Absolutely agree.
Remember USA 94' when we beat Italy?
I wouldn't be surprised to see the Aussies make the semi or further.
Quote from: mc_grens on October 04, 2011, 12:16:04 PM
Quote from: AQMP on October 04, 2011, 11:49:35 AM
Quote from: Just_Browsing on October 04, 2011, 11:36:00 AM
Building nicely for the weekend - see the guy Sherry getting flew out as cover for Best - he'll have to stay in diff hotel, etc from the Squad unless he is made an official member - be nice enough though - get your flights paid out to NZ for you, there in time for a World Cup Semi Final, Tickets to matches and accomodation paid for - its like an RTE competition prize he's won... :D
IMHO of the teams left, apart from SA and NZ, Wales is the most difficulty opponent. I'd much rather be playing Eng, Fra, Arg or the Aussies at this stage. Wales have flown a bit under the radar. This is no foregone conclusion.
Absolutely agree.
agree with that. It's going to take a monumental effort to beat the Welsh on Sat.
Re England, they have no chance of winning the thing or even getting to the final. the only chance they had was by kicking their way to the final, and from what they have showed so far, signs dont look good. Scotland (who are fairly brock @ present) where 5 yards away from taking an unassailable lead fornenst them at the weekend
Mon te fcuk Ireland
What's the craic with Tuilangi and his mouthguard. Can anyone tell if it was a 'sponsored' mouthguard or a 'branded' mouthguard.
One would tell me that he did it on purpose and the other would be an easy enough mistake to make! Although to be fair it shouldn't really happen in the proffessional era!
Same team against the Welsh.Though Bests fitness is still up in the air. I would have played Sexton instead of O Gara as I don't anticipate this game being decide on penalties.
Not too surprising seeing the same team lined out for Saturday. Hopefully Best pulls through and is alright. Can't bloody wait and for once the 6am kick off actually suits me better then a 9.30am one!!
l'd love 2 see the same team start but tbh the AC joint is a tricky little devil.I know some guys that had a similar problem and it took ages to get over it, but fingers crossed
Its prob been said a few times over the page, but I havent time to search, jsut want to check, the winners of Ire v Wal meet Eng/Fra, is that correct?
Yep
Quote from: screenexile on October 04, 2011, 02:46:12 PM
What's the craic with Tuilangi and his mouthguard. Can anyone tell if it was a 'sponsored' mouthguard or a 'branded' mouthguard.
One would tell me that he did it on purpose and the other would be an easy enough mistake to make! Although to be fair it shouldn't really happen in the proffessional era!
Screenexile:
http://www.3news.co.nz/Mouthguard-manufacturer-to-pay-fines-of-Tuilagi-brothers/tabid/1534/articleID/228356/Default.aspx
Quote from: sans pessimism on October 05, 2011, 12:07:38 PM
l'd love 2 see the same team start but tbh the AC joint is a tricky little devil.I know some guys that had a similar problem and it took ages to get over it, but fingers crossed
No way can he play--looks to be bluffing that he's ok in training on the TV
Speaking from experience--you need more than a week before thumping into tackles never mind the pressure in the scrum
Quote from: muppet on October 02, 2011, 03:59:07 PM
#seanobrienfacts trending on twitter:
Scientists believe that a big bang created the universe, they also believe a big bang from Sean O'Brien could end it.
Ryanair pays Seán O'Brien €40 each time he looks at their website.
The "S" on Superman's Shirt....stands for Sean O Brien
Sean O'Brien didn't join Twitter, Twitter joined Sean O'Brien!
"When Sean O'Brien was born he burst out of the womb and took down 2 obstetricians and a gynaecologist."
Rhianna left that field because Sean O'Brien had bales to make..
Bono no longer sings I still haven't found what I'm looking for
Wales have named their team it is a more lightweight and inexperienced version of Wales. Lydiate is at blindside instead of Ryan Jones. No Hook, Steven Jones or Lee Byrne who doesn't even make the panel. We now know their gameplan is to move the ball. I am happy as I don't think it is their best team.
Jenkins
Bennett
Adam Jones
Charteris
wyn Jones
Lydiate
Warburton
Faletau
Philips
Priestland
Shane Williams
Roberts
Jonathan Davies
North
Halfpenny
Deathly silence in Australia, presumably in anticipation of impending defeat against the boks. I was in a S.African foodplace yesterday and had quare craic with a few of the locals. They are so looking forward to kicking Aus arses on Sunday. Going to be some craic again in the Mighty Quinn on Saturday with our game and then, hopefully, the French beating the poms. That's Saturday abandoned ;)
If we can beat Wales then I will be hoping for an English win. No matter what disarray the french are in they seem to beat us whereas ( since 200) we have a deadly record against the chariot boys.
Quote from: Capt Pat on October 06, 2011, 01:44:43 AM
Wales have named their team it is a more lightweight and inexperienced version of Wales. Lydiate is at blindside instead of Ryan Jones. No Hook, Steven Jones or Lee Byrne who doesn't even make the panel. We now know their gameplan is to move the ball. I am happy as I don't think it is their best team.
Jenkins
Bennett
Adam Jones
Charteris
wyn Jones
Lydiate
Warburton
Faletau
Philips
Priestland
Shane Williams
Roberts
Jonathan Davies
North
Halfpenny
These are the players who've done well so far in the world cup. They were a heartbeat from beating South Africa and looked very good in their other games. It's a formidable team that presents us with challenges we haven't faced yet in this tournament.
Quote from: mc_grens on October 06, 2011, 07:22:45 AM
Quote from: Capt Pat on October 06, 2011, 01:44:43 AM
Wales have named their team it is a more lightweight and inexperienced version of Wales. Lydiate is at blindside instead of Ryan Jones. No Hook, Steven Jones or Lee Byrne who doesn't even make the panel. We now know their gameplan is to move the ball. I am happy as I don't think it is their best team.
Jenkins
Bennett
Adam Jones
Charteris
wyn Jones
Lydiate
Warburton
Faletau
Philips
Priestland
Shane Williams
Roberts
Jonathan Davies
North
Halfpenny
These are the players who've done well so far in the world cup. They were a heartbeat from beating South Africa and looked very good in their other games. It's a formidable team that presents us with challenges we haven't faced yet in this tournament.
They are not formidable, they have done well but they lost to a South Africa side that came last by some considerable distance in the Tri-nations. That game sums up Wales for me, they are mentally weak and when it came to closing out that game they couldn't deliver.
Only Philips, Adam Jones, Wyn Jones and Shane Williams were involved in their last Grand Slam in 2008. The Welsh players have failed to deliver at club level consistently, when it comes to knock-out rugby the majority of the Irish squad can look at least 2 Heineken Cup medals, the Welsh players can't. Wales have only won 3 times against Ireland in 10 years including only once away from Cardiff. Ireland are favourites for a reason.
Wales game plan is all about using their centres to generate go-forward ball and the using the off-load to get their back-row and back-three running into space, crucially this off-load is generally done before contact. D'Arcy and O'Driscoll are the key defensively and the much maligned D'Arcy (by me) has found his form and his channel will be the key defensively and if our back-row (Heaslip is doing some amount of work at the break-down) are on their game we can and will slow down enough of their ball to deny that quick ball Wales love. Wales don't have a plan B, they can't go back to their pack because their tight 5 aren't good enough and their back-row are all very loose and not a hope they will match the physicality of the the Irish back-row.
Forget the hype about Wales, they really love building themselves up. Ireland have the edge physically, mentally and experience wise. Ireland will win and I think they will win well.
Apparantly Best has been named in the starting 15
Your a great man for inspiring confidence Dinny...lol! Hopefully everything goes as swimmingly as you have suggested.
They've named Best but I can't see how he can start if he has done his AC joint. It will be rightly tested in a scrum/tackle anyway so if he does start he may not last that long. Hope he pulls through though as he has been immense thus far to be fair.
Quote from: bcarrier on October 06, 2011, 06:59:00 AM
If we can beat Wales then I will be hoping for an English win. No matter what disarray the french are in they seem to beat us whereas ( since 200) we have a deadly record against the chariot boys.
agreed
Quote from: Dinny Breen on October 06, 2011, 09:46:44 AM
Quote from: mc_grens on October 06, 2011, 07:22:45 AM
Quote from: Capt Pat on October 06, 2011, 01:44:43 AM
Wales have named their team it is a more lightweight and inexperienced version of Wales. Lydiate is at blindside instead of Ryan Jones. No Hook, Steven Jones or Lee Byrne who doesn't even make the panel. We now know their gameplan is to move the ball. I am happy as I don't think it is their best team.
Jenkins
Bennett
Adam Jones
Charteris
wyn Jones
Lydiate
Warburton
Faletau
Philips
Priestland
Shane Williams
Roberts
Jonathan Davies
North
Halfpenny
These are the players who've done well so far in the world cup. They were a heartbeat from beating South Africa and looked very good in their other games. It's a formidable team that presents us with challenges we haven't faced yet in this tournament.
They are not formidable, they have done well but they lost to a South Africa side that came last by some considerable distance in the Tri-nations. That game sums up Wales for me, they are mentally weak and when it came to closing out that game they couldn't deliver.
Only Philips, Adam Jones, Wyn Jones and Shane Williams were involved in their last Grand Slam in 2008. The Welsh players have failed to deliver at club level consistently, when it comes to knock-out rugby the majority of the Irish squad can look at least 2 Heineken Cup medals, the Welsh players can't. Wales have only won 3 times against Ireland in 10 years including only once away from Cardiff. Ireland are favourites for a reason.
Wales game plan is all about using their centres to generate go-forward ball and the using the off-load to get their back-row and back-three running into space, crucially this off-load is generally done before contact. D'Arcy and O'Driscoll are the key defensively and the much maligned D'Arcy (by me) has found his form and his channel will be the key defensively and if our back-row (Heaslip is doing some amount of work at the break-down) are on their game we can and will slow down enough of their ball to deny that quick ball Wales love. Wales don't have a plan B, they can't go back to their pack because their tight 5 aren't good enough and their back-row are all very loose and not a hope they will match the physicality of the the Irish back-row.
Forget the hype about Wales, they really love building themselves up. Ireland have the edge physically, mentally and experience wise. Ireland will win and I think they will win well.
Fcuk Dinny, you could have me loose 50 quid right and handy with that peice. C'Mon Ireland :D
I don't see why Best shouldn't be fit. I know from experience of dislocating my AC joint with the right physio work and exercise you can get back reasonsably quickly, I was able to come back within 2 weeks and play in a championship match, I don't see why the likes of Best who is a professional with all the assistance that goes with that can't come back from a sprain.
If he can play in half the time out it took you bc1 then he's some man. Big variety in grades of ac separation. Complete separation, ligaments torn etc could need surgery and rory would prob be at home at this stage. Minor separation and he could be alright. Might be some painkilling substances administered. And he's lucky he only has to scrum down in a rugby world cup quarter final. Could be am armagh senior championship match. ;)
Quote from: North Longford on October 06, 2011, 10:44:11 AM
If he can play in half the time out it took you bc1 then he's some man. Big variety in grades of ac separation. Complete separation, ligaments torn etc could need surgery and rory would prob be at home at this stage. Minor separation and he could be alright. Might be some painkilling substances administered. And he's lucky he only has to scrum down in a rugby world cup quarter final. Could be am armagh senior championship match. ;)
;D
Is it true Francie Bellew once played a match two days after dislocating both shoulders?
Quote from: North Longford on October 06, 2011, 10:44:11 AM
If he can play in half the time out it took you bc1 then he's some man. Big variety in grades of ac separation. Complete separation, ligaments torn etc could need surgery and rory would prob be at home at this stage. Minor separation and he could be alright. Might be some painkilling substances administered. And he's lucky he only has to scrum down in a rugby world cup quarter final. Could be am armagh senior championship match. ;)
Ulster quarter final, Ulster :P, but the point is that he has a sprained shoulder, I had a full seperation and was told by the consultant I had to take 12 weeks off playing. Pure thick wit and a good physio got me fit. I don't see how Best shouldn't be fit given his physical conditioning and the medical staff available to him. Jeez some boys are auld pansies anyway ;D
Sure Ricey has played his whole career with a dislocated face ;)
Quote from: Dinny Breen on October 06, 2011, 09:46:44 AM
Quote from: mc_grens on October 06, 2011, 07:22:45 AM
Quote from: Capt Pat on October 06, 2011, 01:44:43 AM
Wales have named their team it is a more lightweight and inexperienced version of Wales. Lydiate is at blindside instead of Ryan Jones. No Hook, Steven Jones or Lee Byrne who doesn't even make the panel. We now know their gameplan is to move the ball. I am happy as I don't think it is their best team.
Jenkins
Bennett
Adam Jones
Charteris
wyn Jones
Lydiate
Warburton
Faletau
Philips
Priestland
Shane Williams
Roberts
Jonathan Davies
North
Halfpenny
These are the players who've done well so far in the world cup. They were a heartbeat from beating South Africa and looked very good in their other games. It's a formidable team that presents us with challenges we haven't faced yet in this tournament.
They are not formidable, they have done well but they lost to a South Africa side that came last by some considerable distance in the Tri-nations. That game sums up Wales for me, they are mentally weak and when it came to closing out that game they couldn't deliver.
Only Philips, Adam Jones, Wyn Jones and Shane Williams were involved in their last Grand Slam in 2008. The Welsh players have failed to deliver at club level consistently, when it comes to knock-out rugby the majority of the Irish squad can look at least 2 Heineken Cup medals, the Welsh players can't. Wales have only won 3 times against Ireland in 10 years including only once away from Cardiff. Ireland are favourites for a reason.
Wales game plan is all about using their centres to generate go-forward ball and the using the off-load to get their back-row and back-three running into space, crucially this off-load is generally done before contact. D'Arcy and O'Driscoll are the key defensively and the much maligned D'Arcy (by me) has found his form and his channel will be the key defensively and if our back-row (Heaslip is doing some amount of work at the break-down) are on their game we can and will slow down enough of their ball to deny that quick ball Wales love. Wales don't have a plan B, they can't go back to their pack because their tight 5 aren't good enough and their back-row are all very loose and not a hope they will match the physicality of the the Irish back-row.
Forget the hype about Wales, they really love building themselves up. Ireland have the edge physically, mentally and experience wise. Ireland will win and I think they will win well.
I agree with most of that actually. My whole attitude towards it is just that we shouldn't take them lightly. It's the result of being a Derry Football supporter!
One thing I'd add is this: The Welsh are setting huge store on Warburton. I'd love to see Ireland repeatedly sending Ferris and O'Brien rumbling right over the top of him to undermine their confidence.
Quote from: mc_grens on October 06, 2011, 11:41:57 AM
Quote from: Dinny Breen on October 06, 2011, 09:46:44 AM
Quote from: mc_grens on October 06, 2011, 07:22:45 AM
Quote from: Capt Pat on October 06, 2011, 01:44:43 AM
Wales have named their team it is a more lightweight and inexperienced version of Wales. Lydiate is at blindside instead of Ryan Jones. No Hook, Steven Jones or Lee Byrne who doesn't even make the panel. We now know their gameplan is to move the ball. I am happy as I don't think it is their best team.
Jenkins
Bennett
Adam Jones
Charteris
wyn Jones
Lydiate
Warburton
Faletau
Philips
Priestland
Shane Williams
Roberts
Jonathan Davies
North
Halfpenny
These are the players who've done well so far in the world cup. They were a heartbeat from beating South Africa and looked very good in their other games. It's a formidable team that presents us with challenges we haven't faced yet in this tournament.
They are not formidable, they have done well but they lost to a South Africa side that came last by some considerable distance in the Tri-nations. That game sums up Wales for me, they are mentally weak and when it came to closing out that game they couldn't deliver.
Only Philips, Adam Jones, Wyn Jones and Shane Williams were involved in their last Grand Slam in 2008. The Welsh players have failed to deliver at club level consistently, when it comes to knock-out rugby the majority of the Irish squad can look at least 2 Heineken Cup medals, the Welsh players can't. Wales have only won 3 times against Ireland in 10 years including only once away from Cardiff. Ireland are favourites for a reason.
Wales game plan is all about using their centres to generate go-forward ball and the using the off-load to get their back-row and back-three running into space, crucially this off-load is generally done before contact. D'Arcy and O'Driscoll are the key defensively and the much maligned D'Arcy (by me) has found his form and his channel will be the key defensively and if our back-row (Heaslip is doing some amount of work at the break-down) are on their game we can and will slow down enough of their ball to deny that quick ball Wales love. Wales don't have a plan B, they can't go back to their pack because their tight 5 aren't good enough and their back-row are all very loose and not a hope they will match the physicality of the the Irish back-row.
Forget the hype about Wales, they really love building themselves up. Ireland have the edge physically, mentally and experience wise. Ireland will win and I think they will win well.
I agree with most of that actually. My whole attitude towards it is just that we shouldn't take them lightly. It's the result of being a Derry Football supporter!
One thing I'd add is this: The Welsh are setting huge store on Warburton. I'd love to see Ireland repeatedly sending Ferris and O'Brien rumbling right over the top of him to undermine their confidence.
The experience Ireland has brings humilty and Kidney has prepares his sides to respect the opponent. Ireland won't under-estimate them but they won't fear them either and why would they.
Interesting point about Warburton, there is a lot of pressure on his shoulders, he is too young to lead by words so if his game goes belly up Wales will probably follow suit. As long we keep them behind the gain line it will nullify his game and any bit of luck he'll make himself a nice early target at a ruck for O'Brien or Ferris...and then bang!!!!!
My natural fatalism is screaming that Ireland will get caught on the hop on Saturday but rational analysis, such as Dinny provided, only points towards one conclusion. The one thing that is making me more hopeful than my natural caution normally allows is the experience of knock out rugby within the Irish squad. Fellas like Kearney, D'Arcy, O'Driscoll, O'Gara, Heaslip, The O'Cs, Healy and Ross, not to mention the backups like Leamy, Sexton, Reddan, Jennings and co all know what it takes to grind out results against good opposition in knock out matches.
I think the Welsh have a secret fear of the Irish provinces, and the fact that they are facing the pick of them in the sort of game that Welsh teams crumble in gives me hope.
If it's a mad running sort of game, and Ireland don't impose themselves on it, then we could easily be beaten because the Welsh have talent. I just don't think they are ready to beat Ireland in a game like this.
it s a typical Irish thing to be constantly wary of the opposition. Wales are a decent side but lets not over estimate them. How many tries did they run in against the decent teams in there group Samoa and South Africa. Just 2. Ireland are the more experienced side and showed this against a similarly inexperience side to wales in Australia. I expect us to strangled the life out of them upfrom and stop them from get any quick ball. ireland kept australia and italy try-less and I am confident we will restrict Wales to 1 try. Ireland 23
Wales 16
I certainly hope the rugby team can win their 1/4 final, for the first time ever.
For too long (for all time in actuality) Irish rugby has sat at the bottom of the only competing division of 8 or 9 teams. I can imagine the inferiority complex is a big hurdle to overcome, but chin up lads.
Cant believe they have left Hook out. They were complaining they needed two of him last week.
George?
Dinny are you sure ur not an Oz with that confidence?
Whilst I hope your right I have a bad feeling about this one. Wales are a very dangerous side and in Warburton and North they have 2 potential world stars. Warburton and O Brien are 2 completely different 7's but both are very effective in different ways. If he is allowed to play his game he will do a lot of damage to any clean ball Ireland are looking for.
Surprised Hook isnt starting myself but both Jones's are well past their best and Byrne hasnt shown form since their grandslam year so there is no surprise there. The front rows are equally matched, Ireland have a better 2nd row and the back row as well as half backs will be an interesting tustle. Wales outside backs are very dangerous and given quick ball can tear any team apart and I give them a slight edge here. The fact that a lot of this team hasnt been involved in too many of those defeats to Ireland in the past 10 year means that stat is irrelevant imo.
My biggest fear is that Ireland dont do favourites tag very well, at any sport. They even crawled over the line in the grand slam year against Wales.
Heres hoping Dinny is right and Im talking complete shite
The grand slam was a razorback gorilla on their backs, they achieved it though.They were favourites against Italy last week in a do or die game and won comfortably.
I'm not been cocky, I just believe that this team are better than Wales and I firmly believe they will deliver Saturday morning.
Rugby is very much about the mental side and mentally this Irish side have made all the right noises since the victory over Oz and backed it up against Italy. Wales do not have that mental strength in their locker.
hon Ireland
Can't wait for this now and Dinny's post has give the old confidence a boost. The Flynns is in the fridge ready for the pan, the strong coffee has been bought, all I need now is to set the alarm for 5.30 and away we go...c'mon top feck Ireland!!
Sky+ it!! 6am my back side, get up at 9am and just turn on the TV Guide, green button and away you go!
Quote from: sammymaguire on October 06, 2011, 04:57:04 PM
Sky+ it!! 6am my back side, get up at 9am and just turn on the TV Guide, green button and away you go!
lightweight
Anyone have Sammy's number so we could give him a heads up?
Quote from: Boycey on October 06, 2011, 05:00:35 PM
Quote from: sammymaguire on October 06, 2011, 04:57:04 PM
Sky+ it!! 6am my back side, get up at 9am and just turn on the TV Guide, green button and away you go!
lightweight
light, wait?
Quote from: sammymaguire on October 06, 2011, 04:57:04 PM
Sky+ it!! 6am my back side, get up at 9am and just turn on the TV Guide, green button and away you go!
Not a chance, sure the England France game will be on at that time...and anyway the kid will have me up from around 6 am, may as well make the most of it
Quote from: gawa316 on October 06, 2011, 03:01:47 PM
Can't wait for this now and Dinny's post has give the old confidence a boost. The Flynns is in the fridge ready for the pan, the strong coffee has been bought, all I need now is to set the alarm for 5.30 and away we go...c'mon top feck Ireland!!
Have any of the recent decenters over on your other forum jumped back on the bandwagon yet?
The major issue for sat morning is whether or not to drink straight through !
Quote from: Rouge_Diablo on October 06, 2011, 05:26:46 PM
Have any of the recent decenters over on your other forum jumped back on the bandwagon yet?
By 'your other forum' I assume you OWC?
Haven't posted on there or even had a look in I don't know how long so sorry can't answer your question.
Quote from: Rouge_Diablo on October 06, 2011, 05:26:46 PM
The major issue for sat morning is whether or not to drink straight through !
Would love to and once upon a time it wouldn't have been an issue at all but sadly times change :'(. I've a wedding to go after so probably best not to turn up blocked at the church
Quote from: Denn Forever on October 06, 2011, 05:00:53 PM
Anyone have Sammy's number so we could give him a heads up?
text him with the score at 8.55!
i doubt we will get 55 points.
http://aseriesofterribledecisions.blogspot.com/2011/09/if-irish-rugby-profiles-were-more.html?m=0 (http://aseriesofterribledecisions.blogspot.com/2011/09/if-irish-rugby-profiles-were-more.html?m=0)
Paul O'Connell: Paul O'Connell is someone who looks like God designed him as a drunk bet using an experimental 'Minotaur' template. He is a terrifyingly large man and the only player that requires a Heavy Vehicles licence to run from one end of the pitch to the other. At 6ft 7 and 18 stone he isn't the fastest player but this just adds to his, already considerable, intimidation factor. Those extra few moments it takes him to make the tackle give ball-carriers ample time to realize what a spectacularly bad choice it was to take up professional rugby.
He's a proponent of the new 'choke tackle' system of defense, because apparently he didn't feel that normal tackles were violent enough.
Ronan O'Gara: Many people, including myself, have said nasty things about O'Gara but in his defence he's always had the perfect comeback: 1039 points! O'Gara is like a custom video game character who put all his points into kicking power and accuracy but didn't have enough left over to cover running or tackling. The Cork man may not be able to tackle or carry the ball but to be completely fair to him it's hard to do either of those things when you have a f**king sniper rifle instead of a leg.
Cian Healy: Cian Healy is the kind of forward that ball-carriers have nightmares about. His nickname is apparently 'Church'. I'm assuming because many a poor player has hurriedly made their peace with God in the face of his rapidly approaching figure.Healy is known for having to constantly replace his contact lenses during the match, presumably so he can better see the looks of fear on players faces as bears down upon them. When he's not making attacking players immediately regret ever touching the ball he enjoys DJing. I have no idea whether he's any good or not but even if his set was two hours of vuvuzela music I still wouldn't be brave enough to criticize him.
Stephen Ferris: Stephen Ferris is.....actually you know what? f**k it! A picture says a thousand words (all of which in this case are some variation on 'Holy f**king Christ!' and 'Aaaarggh!')
(http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-0v5sYx8ZQkk/Tni6QSxNoYI/AAAAAAAAAA4/4tX3Wlxpg_o/s1600/genia.jpg)
That's Ferris picking up the Australian scrum half Will Genia and running with him for 15 yards. You'd think that carrying a fully grown man would slow him down but it actually took two of Genia's teammates to rescue him before Ferris could kick the poor f**ker over the bar in a drop goal attempt. I think it's a testament to the bravery of the Australian team that they kept playing after seeing one of their players being used as an executive squeeze toy.
Sean O'Brien: Sean O'Brien worked out long ago that running around players is tiring and inefficient so he much prefers to just run through them instead. Getting hit by Sean O'Brien is marginally less painful than being hit by a train but at least the train doesn't wait for you to get up so it can do the exact same thing again 5 minutes later. The only reason he wears a scrum cap is so he doesn't have to pick bits of defender's teeth out of his hair. Wheelchair salesmen send him Christmas cards.
Jonathan Sexton: Sexton is a racehorse cleverly disguised as a human being. It's whispered that he's the successful end result of Irish scientists trying to create an O'Gara/O'Driscoll hybrid. He's stronger and faster than any Fly Half has a right to be and while he can't consistently match O'Gara's terrifying accuracy he makes up for this by occasionally showing up and winning matches single handedly. His 28 points (including two tries) in last year's Heineken cup final was one of the most spectacular comebacks in rugby history. The only reason the Catholic church didn't declare it a miracle is because they were afraid of the competition. Despite his game changing abilities Sexton has often had some confidence issues when it comes to big international matches, which, to be honest, is something I find a little bit endearing in someone who's clearly the son of Zeus.
Brian O'Driscoll: Ireland's captain, star center, leading try scorer and all-round general messiah O'Driscoll is who Batman dresses up as for Halloween. He moves at speeds more usually associated with sports cars than human beings and generally does so with his nose brushing the turf since his centre of gravity is apparently somewhere around his ankles. For the first two years of his career he was just known to defenders as 'a green blur that went past me at knee height and filled me feelings of inadequacy'. He had a nearly career ending injury in 2005 when he dislocated his shoulder but then decided that playing with two shoulders was for pussies anyway and went onto become the player of the tournament in the 2006, 2007 and 2009 6 Nations championships. That's not beating injury, that's kicking injury to death and then f**king injury's girlfriend on it's still warm corpse.
He broke the Irish try scoring record and then decided that that just wasn't impressive enough and went ahead and broke the 6 Nations try scoring record as well. I could list all his other accomplishments but doing so would make me and every single other human being look incredibly inadequate suffice to say that the only reason he let the Irish team play so badly in the Autumn internationals is so he could show Jesus that isn't such a big deal to come back from the dead.
These Rugby fellahs are getting way ahead of themselves.
Win the feckin' quarter final first, then eulogize afterwards.
Lose against Wales and it's all for nothing.
Quote from: sammymaguire on October 06, 2011, 04:57:04 PM
Sky+ it!! 6am my back side, get up at 9am and just turn on the TV Guide, green button and away you go!
Not the same when it's not live.
Quote from: Dinny Breen on October 06, 2011, 11:47:47 AM
Quote from: mc_grens on October 06, 2011, 11:41:57 AM
Quote from: Dinny Breen on October 06, 2011, 09:46:44 AM
Quote from: mc_grens on October 06, 2011, 07:22:45 AM
Quote from: Capt Pat on October 06, 2011, 01:44:43 AM
Wales have named their team it is a more lightweight and inexperienced version of Wales. Lydiate is at blindside instead of Ryan Jones. No Hook, Steven Jones or Lee Byrne who doesn't even make the panel. We now know their gameplan is to move the ball. I am happy as I don't think it is their best team.
Jenkins
Bennett
Adam Jones
Charteris
wyn Jones
Lydiate
Warburton
Faletau
Philips
Priestland
Shane Williams
Roberts
Jonathan Davies
North
Halfpenny
These are the players who've done well so far in the world cup. They were a heartbeat from beating South Africa and looked very good in their other games. It's a formidable team that presents us with challenges we haven't faced yet in this tournament.
They are not formidable, they have done well but they lost to a South Africa side that came last by some considerable distance in the Tri-nations. That game sums up Wales for me, they are mentally weak and when it came to closing out that game they couldn't deliver.
Only Philips, Adam Jones, Wyn Jones and Shane Williams were involved in their last Grand Slam in 2008. The Welsh players have failed to deliver at club level consistently, when it comes to knock-out rugby the majority of the Irish squad can look at least 2 Heineken Cup medals, the Welsh players can't. Wales have only won 3 times against Ireland in 10 years including only once away from Cardiff. Ireland are favourites for a reason.
Wales game plan is all about using their centres to generate go-forward ball and the using the off-load to get their back-row and back-three running into space, crucially this off-load is generally done before contact. D'Arcy and O'Driscoll are the key defensively and the much maligned D'Arcy (by me) has found his form and his channel will be the key defensively and if our back-row (Heaslip is doing some amount of work at the break-down) are on their game we can and will slow down enough of their ball to deny that quick ball Wales love. Wales don't have a plan B, they can't go back to their pack because their tight 5 aren't good enough and their back-row are all very loose and not a hope they will match the physicality of the the Irish back-row.
Forget the hype about Wales, they really love building themselves up. Ireland have the edge physically, mentally and experience wise. Ireland will win and I think they will win well.
I agree with most of that actually. My whole attitude towards it is just that we shouldn't take them lightly. It's the result of being a Derry Football supporter!
One thing I'd add is this: The Welsh are setting huge store on Warburton. I'd love to see Ireland repeatedly sending Ferris and O'Brien rumbling right over the top of him to undermine their confidence.
The experience Ireland has brings humilty and Kidney has prepares his sides to respect the opponent. Ireland won't under-estimate them but they won't fear them either and why would they.
Interesting point about Warburton, there is a lot of pressure on his shoulders, he is too young to lead by words so if his game goes belly up Wales will probably follow suit. As long we keep them behind the gain line it will nullify his game and any bit of luck he'll make himself a nice early target at a ruck for O'Brien or Ferris...and then bang!!!!!
I believe Dinny is a bit too optimistic but then again he has a Rangerover and a horsebox. ;) Don't understand the hype around Adam Jones, I think he and the other tight 5 are no great shakes (with the exception of Wyn-Jones who is good but inconsistent). Warburton is a good groundhog, the like of which Ireland do not have. Ferris is an aggressive tackler and Obrien and Heaslip are ball-carriers. Heaslip has partly been filling this role for a while, hence the few quiet preformances. That back row could trouble us.
Phillips has always threatened Ireland but Murray should counteract him well. Wales back three are lethal in attack but suspect defensively. Halfpenny and Williams are small men and would not appreciate Bowe thundering down on them. I'd like to see them tested in the air also.
On the Irish side, O'Gara, Best, Donncha and Kearney are our liabilities. Donncha is a notorious penalty magnet and needs to continue his good run, however fate would tell you he's due a bad day any weekend. O'Gara is defensively suspect, always has been. Roberts, Priestland or Phillips could make hay down the ten channel. Best carries an injury, if it affects his previously dodgy throwing we could see serious trouble. Our best thrower cried off during the first week and Cronin is poor with the darts. Kearney has done well so far but he is just back from injury, no way he can be at full speed like the other 13.
A bit more of this would do nicely:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/rugby_union/welsh/15181639.stm (http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/rugby_union/welsh/15181639.stm)
Quote from: mc_grens on October 06, 2011, 10:54:30 PM
Quote from: sammymaguire on October 06, 2011, 04:57:04 PM
Sky+ it!! 6am my back side, get up at 9am and just turn on the TV Guide, green button and away you go!
Not the same when it's not live.
ah but still, f**king up the whole weekend (Sat night at least) by being wrecked (with the possibility of Ireland not winning as well) and you can fast forward through the crap bits at half time too...
Ive heard some sickophantic crap in my life but that article takes the biscuit.
That's so good it should be a real word.
I think it's a very nice (new) word.
I beleive Ireland have this one in the bag. Wales like to do what they do and can beat anyone on their day but sometimes you need to be pragmatice and pick your best most experienced game players. I would prefer to see Ryan Jones, Lee Byrne, Stephen Jones and Hook on the team ahead of Lyidate, Halfpenny, Priestland and maybe even North. It is not the way to approach a world cup QF imho with all those inexperienced players. It might click for them and they win easily but I doubt it.
For that reason and the current form of the Irish team and our track record against the Welsh I expect a win that is somewhat comfortable if not on the score board but more comfortable than it should have been.
The Welsh backrow is light weight and that could give us an edge in physicality up front which is what this game will boil down to. If we can win the fight up front O'Gara and the backs will do the rest.
It is also clear that Wales will look to move the ball out wide creating a more open game. While this might work against mammoth South African and English packs against the Irish it just plays into our hands too much. Sean O Brien Heaslip Cian Healy and Ferris could really thrive carrying the ball in a more open game. Equally in the backs just thinking about the damage Bowe, O Driscoll, Kearney and Earls could do against lightweight Welsh defenders is exciting me.
Reading the form line is a tricky business beause we have been playing different teams but I think ours is better and I will predict
Ireland 32
Wales 16.
Irel v Wal - Ireland by 6
Fra v Eng - France have been so woeful you couldn't back them. England by 3
SA v Aus - Saffers by 10
NZ v Arg - All Blacks by 20
Fcuk it. We'll hockey them.
Ireland 30
Wales 5
;D
Real stuff starts now folks, no holding back, no covering up ,no whipping boys against which you can rest a few key players. Ozzies look like they have their strongest available on the park against the Boks on Sunday morning, might be tempted to make an early start for that one
Quote from: AQMP on October 07, 2011, 12:32:04 PM
Irel v Wal - Ireland by 6
Fra v Eng - France have been so woeful you couldn't back them. England by 3
SA v Aus - Saffers by 10
NZ v Arg - All Blacks by 20
The Aussies are pretty much back to full strength. I think that is important to their chances and they will win by 10.
Quote from: Capt Pat on October 07, 2011, 12:49:41 PM
Quote from: AQMP on October 07, 2011, 12:32:04 PM
Irel v Wal - Ireland by 6
Fra v Eng - France have been so woeful you couldn't back them. England by 3
SA v Aus - Saffers by 10
NZ v Arg - All Blacks by 20
The Aussies are pretty much back to full strength. I think that is important to their chances and they will win by 10.
Semis prediction:
Ireland v England
Australia v NZ
Ireland by 10
England in extra time by 3
Australia by 12
NZ by 8
Ireland v Wales should go the same way as Ireland v Italy, except Wales shouldn't fall away to the same extent. I fully expect Drico to do the business for the umpteenth time.
France and England has the potential to turn people off rugby for good. England are all set up for a territory game. France have flair out wide, but won't get many opportunities to use it. They'll get plenty of penalties though, so their kicker will decide this one I think.
I don't rate South Africa. They're the England of the Southern Hemisphere. If Australia run at them from South Africa's half rather than their own, they'll have too much class.
Without Carter, the NZ vs Argentina game could be a surprisingly attritional affair. Argentina really have to prove their worth to the tri-nations, and this is the biggest opportunity they'll get in front of the whole rugby world.
Ireland v France
France have the potential to be brilliant, England are as one dimensional a team as Ive seen since I last watched Scotland
NZ v SA
Going against the grain
Wales 3 ( Just too much hype with us based on one performance. )
England 6 ( Tindalls injury should help them and France are shocking. )
S Africa 6 ( Oz great backs wont get enough ball. )
All Blacks 20 ( Even without Carter far too strong. )
Semi's
England
S Africa
Final
S Africa
Argentina are -28 on the handicap. That's nuts. Those mad Argie bastards never give up.
If all blacks get parity with Argie scrum their back line even without Carter will rip them apart.
Quote from: thewobbler on October 07, 2011, 01:11:29 PM
Argentina are -28 on the handicap. That's nuts. Those mad Argie b**tards never give up.
Where the ¬!£" are those odds available, that's like going into the bookies and buying money
QuoteI think it's a very nice (new) word.
Posted on: Today at 11:05:18 AMPosted by: Hardy
Insert Quote
That's so good it should be a real word.
Posted on: Today at 10:33:55 AMPosted by: NAG1
Insert Quote
Ive heard some sickophantic crap in my life but that article takes the biscuit.
Fantastic stuff - positively onomatopoeiac
Quote from: anglocelt39 on October 07, 2011, 01:45:46 PM
Quote from: thewobbler
Where the ¬!£" are those odds available, that's like going into the bookies and buying money
/quote]
I wouldn't be so sure. I fancy the all blacks to win easily.
England -4 10/11
Ireland -2 10/11
Australia -1 10/11
Argentina +26 10/11
£4 returns £53.13
Quote from: whitegoodman on October 07, 2011, 01:10:52 PM
Going against the grain
Wales 3 ( Just too much hype with us based on one performance. )
England 6 ( Tindalls injury should help them and France are shocking. )
S Africa 6 ( Oz great backs wont get enough ball. )
All Blacks 20 ( Even without Carter far too strong. )
Semi's
England
S Africa
Final
S Africa
you wont be happy until England get to the final ye boy ye!
SA will find it very hard to get to the semi's, and if they did, I very much doubt they would beat NZ
Bet365
Ireland -2.0 @ 1/1
France +5.0 @ 1/1
Australia -1.0 @ 1/1
Argentina +28.0 @ 1/1
15/1. £8 for £128.
Quote from: thewobbler on October 07, 2011, 02:42:06 PM
Bet365
Ireland -2.0 @ 1/1
France +5.0 @ 1/1
Australia -1.0 @ 1/1
Argentina +28.0 @ 1/1
15/1. £8 for £128.
That's my bet I think.
Quote from: thewobbler on October 07, 2011, 02:42:06 PM
Bet365
Ireland -2.0 @ 1/1
France +5.0 @ 1/1
Australia -1.0 @ 1/1
Argentina +28.0 @ 1/1
15/1. £8 for £128.
Makes my odds look terrible!!
Who was that with Link? I don't really look around at odds anymore as when you bet in less than tenners like I do, the time spent researching and funding took away any margins I might have got. I had money in my Bet365 account this morning, apart from that I'd never know their odds.
Quote from: thewobbler on October 07, 2011, 02:50:20 PM
Who was that with Link? I don't really look around at odds anymore as when you bet in less than tenners like I do, the time spent researching and funding took away any margins I might have got. I had money in my Bet365 account this morning, apart from that I'd never know their odds.
Boylesports. Can't get my online accounts in work, my bet worked out at just over 13/1 so i'll could potentially miss out on some profit but i won't complain if it comes through!
Have done 3 legs of wobblers bet but dropped ireland and backed wales to win the race to 10 points. Think they are likely to start a bit better than us but hope we can wear then down.
Ireland-Aus final huuuuuuuuoooon Ireland
One big advantage to Ireland will be the fact that Tommy Bowe knows practically the whole Wales team and their weaknesses and mentalities inside out, whereas they only know Tommy - an extra bowe to our string (or something).
The only worry I have is that if Wales get a sniff of uncertainty in Irish play, they will capitalise - Gatland seems particularly good at coaching them to play like this. Ireland seem to be able to re-group against other teams, but Wales and France seem to breed uncertainty sometimes.
But I think this Ireland team are better and more focused than any other Irish team that I certainly have seen.
Moreover, not only are the old heads playing their best Rugby in ages, so are the relative newcomers.
Cannot Wait.
Come on Ireland !
Went for a risky one tonight
Selection5/4 - Ireland -5
Selection11/4 - France -4
Selectionevens - Argentina +27
Selection5/4 - Australia -5
Your bets (1)
Accumulator (4)
1 line at £21.00 per line
Total stake for this bet: £21.00
Potential Return: £797.34
Time: 07/10/11 22:3
Quote from: Overthebar! on October 07, 2011, 10:40:46 PM
Went for a risky one tonight
Selection5/4 - Ireland -5
Selection11/4 - France -4
Selectionevens - Argentina +27
Selection5/4 - Australia -5
Your bets (1)
Accumulator (4)
1 line at £21.00 per line
Total stake for this bet: £21.00
Potential Return: £797.34
Time: 07/10/11 22:3
thats a quare bet!
I went for a straight Ire/Fra/Aus/NZ accum..€5, might get enough back for a chicken ball special, fingers crossed
A 50/50 game but
Rog and Sexton to carry us home (together standing tall).
Do we stay up or go to bed and hope to get up in time for kick off, or whatever they do in Rugby?
Quote from: Agent Orange on October 08, 2011, 01:10:04 AM
Do we stay up or go to bed and hope to get up in time for kick off, or whatever they do in Rugby?
Stay up, then you can sleep through the England V France game if its boring or if we lose, otherwise excitment and momentum will carry you through.
I'm going for
Ireland 37 Wales 27.
Up and ready to rock-Hooooooaaaaaaaaaaannnnnnn Ireland!!!!!!
im really looking forward to this
Link if anyone needs it.......... http://www.firstrowsports.tv/watch/84761/1/watch-ireland-vs-wales.html
We were all wrong. Stupid to send Earls into contact like that.
Poor defending by Ireland as well.
3 consecutive penalties against Wales.
A few points please.
f**k, we needed at least 3 of that spell or pressure
Another mistake by O'Gara
If you want a 10 who doesn't kick surely it should be Sexton?
At f**k sake 3 points, at last.
Quote from: mayogodhelpus@gmail.com on October 08, 2011, 06:27:04 AM
At f**k sake 3 points, at last.
23 mins with still nil on the board and al that pressure ! Thank f**k we needed something
Some stupid play by Ireland.
Brilliant defending from the Welsh, look like they want this more. 10-3
We just need to go in within 7 points of Wales, any more and I would be very concerned.
O'Gara won't be back after half time.
Should have started Sexton. The Welsh are tackling around the neck.
Quote from: mayogodhelpus@gmail.com on October 08, 2011, 06:33:42 AM
We just need to go in within 7 points of Wales, any more and I would be very concerned.
i think it will be 10-10
Hopefully the Welsh tire in the last 20 minutes. Ireland battering them without making much impact to the scoreboard.
Ireland actually are playing well but the scoreboard doesn't reflect it.
Frantic stuff
poor old Rog is always the scapegoat...theres a lack of composure all over the field. The Welsh are up so quick, we needy start running from deeper
Its gonna happen
Quote from: muppet on October 08, 2011, 06:43:16 AM
Ireland actually are playing well but the scoreboard doesn't reflect it.
Welsh defending like Tyrone.
If Wales maintain this, it would be one of the greatest defensive performances of all time.
They have to break sometime.
I'm still quite confident.
Quote from: J OGorman on October 08, 2011, 06:46:43 AM
Frantic stuff
poor old Rog is always the scapegoat...theres a lack of composure all over the field. The Welsh are up so quick, we needy start running from deeper
Its gonna happen
Poor old ROG didn't kick for goal, took the ball into contact and lost it, kicked over the end line twice, knocked on.........
Ireland are playing well but you get the feeling Wales will do more with 40% possession than Ireland will with 60%.
Can Wales continue to soak up the pressure being put on them? O'Driscoll is the only player who can open up this Wales defence the way things are going. Sexton will come in soon as O'Gara has made a couple of poor decisons at crucial stages.
Sexton needed to better defend against Jamie Roberts and also since it pointless to kicking it to the Welsh.
Quote from: thewobbler on October 08, 2011, 06:47:54 AM
If Wales maintain this, it would be one of the greatest defensive performances of all time.
They have to break sometime.
I'm still quite confident.
me too - definately
Quote from: Bord na Mona man on October 08, 2011, 06:50:56 AM
Sexton needed to better defend against Jamie Roberts and also since it pointless to kicking it to the Welsh.
Hard to see from the TV but there is space somewhere. They have lots of men at the breakdown, lots hanging back for O'Gara's kicks so where is the space. On the wings?
Quote from: Hoof Hearted on October 08, 2011, 06:51:41 AM
Quote from: thewobbler on October 08, 2011, 06:47:54 AM
If Wales maintain this, it would be one of the greatest defensive performances of all time.
They have to break sometime.
I'm still quite confident.
me too - definately
me three - we still well in it, the Welsh cannot hold off forever and they will need to come out and attack.
Quote from: Bord na Mona man on October 08, 2011, 06:50:56 AM
Sexton needed to better defend against Jamie Roberts and also since it pointless to kicking it to the Welsh.
This I not just O'Gara problem- tackling has been poor in general. We need to hit the breakdown harder as we did against the Aussies. Put the welsh on the back foot. Get our back row into the game. Limit warburton's ability to go after 10. The welsh defence won't be as smothering if we're getting quick ball and forcing them backwards.
I've rarely defended ROG in my life, but I feel I have to here. O Gara isn't the problem so much as our ball carriers aren't making breaks and aren't presenting quick ball. When ROG gets his hands on the ball, Wales have him lined up from top to bottom, and they're defending like champions. Sexton wouldn't change that.
Quote from: Hoof Hearted on October 08, 2011, 06:51:41 AM
Quote from: thewobbler on October 08, 2011, 06:47:54 AM
If Wales maintain this, it would be one of the greatest defensive performances of all time.
They have to break sometime.
I'm still quite confident.
me too - definately
Don't share your optimism. Welsh were aways going to come at us early. They've got their lead and are defending well within themselves.
Im confident Ireland can still do this to. Need to start kicking the points and then go for the try line.
Thats more like it
Foot in touch?
It is a try!
Earls deserved that, he's Ireland's best player today.
Never been so happy to be wrong!
Some kick in fairness.
lethal ! Although i have just wakened the 3 weans so im having company for the rest of the match
Thats it lads, now take them.
CAM AN...burnt the bastardin bacon!
Different pressure with the score level.
This is our worse defensive performance of the tournament. Another try early in the half to claw back.
Ireland looking around them >:(
Not at all confident now. Ireland look tired, think Wales win it now :(
Ireland spend 40 minutes making back the early Welsh try and hand them back a 7 point lead instantly. ???
Having weathered the storm, lost the line out and two breaks around the ruck gives up an easy try.
Concentration seems to be very poor for some reason today.
2 awful lineouts. No belief. Defence awful. Forever chokers. Fluked a 6nations when we were cripled with fear and limped over the line instead of driving over and saying were the best. Is it a throw back in our physche from being invaded and dominated by another country throughout history? Shame.
O'Gara turned down kicks like this.
Quote from: Hoof Hearted on October 08, 2011, 07:03:41 AM
lethal ! Although i have just wakened the 3 weans so im having company for the rest of the match
Same here.
Sweet smell of a fry coming from the kitchen.
Quote from: Gold on October 08, 2011, 07:15:38 AM
2 awful lineouts. No belief. Defence awful. Forever chokers. Fluked a 6nations when we were cripled with fear and limped over the line instead of driving over and saying were the best. Is it a throw back in our physche from being invaded and dominated by another country throughout history? Shame.
what in sweet jesus are you on about man
The missed conversation and that free keeps Ireland in the game. Could limp over the line undeservedly.
Wales playing like we should have into the wind.
Someone slap Reddan for me.
Bring on Trimble for Earls now.
Time to bring Trimble on.
we have stopped since Earls scored
Its like we tried to get level then just stopped dead, looking around to see who else was gonna kick on and win it. We're 5 down but it may as well be 50. Where's o'driscoll now? Awful flat performance, sort of one where afterwards the players will be dissapointed that they didn't even throw the shackles off and have a go. Wales are on their game, some defence. They believe they can beat ireland whilst ireland are scared that wales may beat them
Quote from: Gold on October 08, 2011, 07:22:45 AM
Its like we tried to get level then just stopped dead, looking around to see who else was gonna kick on and win it. We're 5 down but it may as well be 50. Where's o'driscoll now? Awful flat performance, sort of one where afterwards the players will be dissapointed that they didn't even throw the shackles off and have a go. Wales are on their game, some defence. They believe they can beat ireland whilst ireland are scared that wales may beat them
Hard for O'Drsicoll when O'Gara. Sexton and Reddan simply kick the ball back to Wales every time.
Are Wales good enough to win the tournament?
game over
Quote from: Gold on October 08, 2011, 07:22:45 AM
Its like we tried to get level then just stopped dead, looking around to see who else was gonna kick on and win it. We're 5 down but it may as well be 50. Where's o'driscoll now? Awful flat performance, sort of one where afterwards the players will be dissapointed that they didn't even throw the shackles off and have a go. Wales are on their game, some defence. They believe they can beat ireland whilst ireland are scared that wales may beat them
no harm to ye, but would you fcuk off from whatever sh1t-pit you came from
Come on Ireland te buck
BOD has cost this game...instead of getting O'Gara to kick in first half he got them to run at the welsh defence....tired them out.
Keith Earls other than his try has been a complete disaster tonight.
Apart from a great finish earls has been absolutely shocking from the very first minute when he lost the ball in contact.
why did o brien not start???!
Lads here losing the head more than the players.
Earls looks like the only player who might score.
Quote from: whitegoodman on October 08, 2011, 07:27:32 AM
Apart from a great finish earls has been absolutely shocking from the very first minute when he lost the ball in contact.
why did o brien not start???!
He did.
Quote from: whitegoodman on October 08, 2011, 07:27:32 AM
Apart from a great finish earls has been absolutely shocking from the very first minute when he lost the ball in contact.
why did o brien not start???!
WHAT ARE YE ON ABOUT, HE DID START
What I mean is its a thing in the irish mindset where we don't believe we are good enough to win. Wheb we're favourites we're at our worst. We have a fear of losing that cripples us into non performance. We'll have a go now that we're well behind but if we got a head I'd guarantee that we'd shit ourselves and sit back and wait to be beaten. A quarter final flop is a failure at this world cup. I was merely suggesting that such a losers mindset may be deeply ingrained in us from centuries of oppression. A blind man could have called this loss to wales
When's the cricket World Cup again?
Quote from: Gold on October 08, 2011, 07:30:22 AM
What I mean is its a thing in the irish mindset where we don't believe we are good enough to win. Wheb we're favourites we're at our worst. We have a fear of losing that cripples us into non performance. We'll have a go now that we're well behind but if we got a head I'd guarantee that we'd shit ourselves and sit back and wait to be beaten. A quarter final flop is a failure at this world cup. I was merely suggesting that such a losers mindset may be deeply ingrained in us from centuries of oppression. A blind man could have called this loss to wales
I would apply all of the above to yourself.
Not over yet.
Quote from: Gold on October 08, 2011, 07:30:22 AM
What I mean is its a thing in the irish mindset where we don't believe we are good enough to win. Wheb we're favourites we're at our worst. We have a fear of losing that cripples us into non performance. We'll have a go now that we're well behind but if we got a head I'd guarantee that we'd shit ourselves and sit back and wait to be beaten. A quarter final flop is a failure at this world cup. I was merely suggesting that such a losers mindset may be deeply ingrained in us from centuries of oppression. A blind man could have called this loss to wales
quite right squire, its all down to oppression.
Gold, people like you shouldn't be allowed te Internet. Keyboard mouthpiece.
The f**king wind would blow earls over, he might create a try but he is just as likely to give one away. Him and darcy are worst defenders on the team and that includes o gara
Quote from: Brick Tamlin on October 08, 2011, 07:30:04 AM
Quote from: whitegoodman on October 08, 2011, 07:27:32 AM
Apart from a great finish earls has been absolutely shocking from the very first minute when he lost the ball in contact.
why did o brien not start???!
WHAT ARE YE ON ABOUT, HE DID START
Didnt look like it, didnt touch leather
A bit late to bring Trimble on. Wales have conceeded 5 tries all tournament, Ireland missed the boat. Brian O'Driscoll's piss poor decision making in first half cost us.
Reddan- Ive never seen worse.. Honestly dont know what he brings to the table.
O'Callaghan knocks on but on another day he would have a penalty for being tackled without the ball. We needs all the calls from here.
clearly ye didnt get up out o the nest and watch the thing from the start
Quote from: king of leon on October 08, 2011, 07:33:26 AM
Reddan- Ive never seen worse.. Honestly dont know what he brings to the table.
Never a fan. There is a reason Stringer was there so long, O'Leary came through and why Murray started.
A lot of the Irish players have appeared dead on their feet from around 55 mins.
Quote from: muppet on October 08, 2011, 07:35:14 AM
Quote from: king of leon on October 08, 2011, 07:33:26 AM
Reddan- Ive never seen worse.. Honestly dont know what he brings to the table.
Never a fan. There is a reason Stringer was there so long, O'Leary came through and why Murray started.
O'Leary cost himself his place with that stupid pass against Scotland.
Ireland didn't want the ball there at the end. Reddan didn't want to get up so we had no scrum-half.
Sad end to some great careers here today.
Quote from: muppet on October 08, 2011, 07:28:30 AM
Lads here losing the head more than the players.
Earls looks like the only player who might score.
Earls has turned the ball over twice,
We have been punished twice for it.
If he cant keep possession of the ball in contact,he shouldnt be starting.
Trimble wouldnt have turned over on either occasion.
Quote from: Armaghgeddon on October 08, 2011, 07:36:47 AM
Quote from: muppet on October 08, 2011, 07:35:14 AM
Quote from: king of leon on October 08, 2011, 07:33:26 AM
Reddan- Ive never seen worse.. Honestly dont know what he brings to the table.
Never a fan. There is a reason Stringer was there so long, O'Leary came through and why Murray started.
O'Leary cost himself his place with that stupid pass against Scotland.
At least there would be a possibility of o leary making somthing happen. Reddan is a bland type of player offensively and suspect defensively.
Wales have been superb today. That's as complete and efficient a performance as you could see.
Ireland looked like the Italy game took too much out of them; the ageing legs and thin squad counted against us big time.
I really hope Wales go on and lift the trophy now though. They're a great team to watch.
Quote from: BallyhaiseMan on October 08, 2011, 07:39:07 AM
Quote from: muppet on October 08, 2011, 07:28:30 AM
Lads here losing the head more than the players.
Earls looks like the only player who might score.
Earls has turned the ball over twice,
We have been punished twice for it.
If he cant keep possession of the ball in contact,he shouldnt be starting.
Trimble wouldnt have turned over on either occasion.
thats because he has our lord at his side.
ifs, buts, maybes
Quote from: BallyhaiseMan on October 08, 2011, 07:39:07 AM
Quote from: muppet on October 08, 2011, 07:28:30 AM
Lads here losing the head more than the players.
Earls looks like the only player who might score.
Earls has turned the ball over twice,
We have been punished twice for it.
If he cant keep possession of the ball in contact,he shouldnt be starting.
Trimble wouldnt have turned over on either occasion.
O'Gara did a hell of a lot worse, didn't score and was on the field for a lot less.
Quote from: Armaghgeddon on October 08, 2011, 07:33:10 AM
A bit late to bring Trimble on. Wales have conceeded 5 tries all tournament, Ireland missed the boat. Brian O'Driscoll's piss poor decision making in first half cost us.
thats dung..we're on the front foot, ball is at the touchline, wind is swirling...course you go for the corner, put the Welsh on the back foot. This defeat is NOT BOD's, its a collective defeat
A win for Shaun Edwards rather than anything else. Ireland had enough ball and territory in the first half but didn't take their opportunities. Curious calls to turn up kickable points but easy to say now.
sick feeling
so oppressing depressing!
Quote from: muppet on October 08, 2011, 07:38:21 AM
Ireland didn't want the ball there at the end. Reddan didn't want to get up so we had no scrum-half.
Sad end to some great careers here today.
jesus aye...a wimper in the end. BUCK!
The Welsh defence and commitment to the cause was incredible
Quote from: J OGorman on October 08, 2011, 07:41:16 AM
Quote from: Armaghgeddon on October 08, 2011, 07:33:10 AM
A bit late to bring Trimble on. Wales have conceeded 5 tries all tournament, Ireland missed the boat. Brian O'Driscoll's piss poor decision making in first half cost us.
thats dung..we're on the front foot, ball is at the touchline, wind is swirling...course you go for the corner, put the Welsh on the back foot. This defeat is NOT BOD's, its a collective defeat
I said weeks ago I would start O'Gara against Italy and South Africa and Sexton in the rest. I would never play Reddan.
Fair play to Wales they completely tied up ROG and we had no ideas. I've never seen O'Connell and O'Callaghan with so many offloads as in the first half. That suggests we weren't playing our normal game. I hope Wales make the final and even win it.
Years ago Gatland gave 5 news caps on the same day for Ireland, O'Gara, Stringer, Horgan, Hayes and someone else (Wallace?) and it heralded a great era for us. He did it again with Wales in this tournament.
Edwards and Gatland's mantra at Wasps was defence wins championships, Wales were brilliant in defence.
Better defence, better control, well done Wales.
Sick!!!!
Ireland emptied the tank in the 1st half and were still 10-3 down. After that the errors just started to mount.
Wales did a great job in messing up the breakdown and slowing down the ball.
Quote from: muppet on October 08, 2011, 07:45:08 AM
Quote from: J OGorman on October 08, 2011, 07:41:16 AM
Quote from: Armaghgeddon on October 08, 2011, 07:33:10 AM
A bit late to bring Trimble on. Wales have conceeded 5 tries all tournament, Ireland missed the boat. Brian O'Driscoll's piss poor decision making in first half cost us.
thats dung..we're on the front foot, ball is at the touchline, wind is swirling...course you go for the corner, put the Welsh on the back foot. This defeat is NOT BOD's, its a collective defeat
I said weeks ago I would start O'Gara against Italy and South Africa and Sexton in the rest. I would never play Reddan.
Fair play to Wales they completely tied up ROG and we had no ideas. I've never seen O'Connell and O'Callaghan with so many offloads as in the first half. That suggests we weren't playing our normal game. I hope Wales make the final and even win it.
Years ago Gatland gave 5 news caps for Ireland, O'Gara, Stringer, Horgan, Hayes and someone else (Wallace?) and it heralded a great era for us. He did it again with Wales in this tournament.
Just heard that the WRFU are to replace Gatland with O'Sullivan for the semi
Quote from: J OGorman on October 08, 2011, 07:46:18 AM
Quote from: muppet on October 08, 2011, 07:45:08 AM
Quote from: J OGorman on October 08, 2011, 07:41:16 AM
Quote from: Armaghgeddon on October 08, 2011, 07:33:10 AM
A bit late to bring Trimble on. Wales have conceeded 5 tries all tournament, Ireland missed the boat. Brian O'Driscoll's piss poor decision making in first half cost us.
thats dung..we're on the front foot, ball is at the touchline, wind is swirling...course you go for the corner, put the Welsh on the back foot. This defeat is NOT BOD's, its a collective defeat
I said weeks ago I would start O'Gara against Italy and South Africa and Sexton in the rest. I would never play Reddan.
Fair play to Wales they completely tied up ROG and we had no ideas. I've never seen O'Connell and O'Callaghan with so many offloads as in the first half. That suggests we weren't playing our normal game. I hope Wales make the final and even win it.
Years ago Gatland gave 5 news caps for Ireland, O'Gara, Stringer, Horgan, Hayes and someone else (Wallace?) and it heralded a great era for us. He did it again with Wales in this tournament.
Just heard that the WRFU are to replace Gatland with O'Sullivan for the semi
I wish they did it yesterday.
How many Irish players did Jamie Roberts put on their arse during that game,
Earls,O Callaghan and O Gara to my counting,
Mike Phillips putting Heaslip on his hole aswell really illustrates a lack of physicality which there in sheer amounts against Italy and Austrailia.
Im not the type to say I told ya so but...................... :-[
Quote from: J OGorman on October 08, 2011, 07:46:18 AM
Quote from: muppet on October 08, 2011, 07:45:08 AM
Quote from: J OGorman on October 08, 2011, 07:41:16 AM
Quote from: Armaghgeddon on October 08, 2011, 07:33:10 AM
A bit late to bring Trimble on. Wales have conceeded 5 tries all tournament, Ireland missed the boat. Brian O'Driscoll's piss poor decision making in first half cost us.
thats dung..we're on the front foot, ball is at the touchline, wind is swirling...course you go for the corner, put the Welsh on the back foot. This defeat is NOT BOD's, its a collective defeat
I said weeks ago I would start O'Gara against Italy and South Africa and Sexton in the rest. I would never play Reddan.
Fair play to Wales they completely tied up ROG and we had no ideas. I've never seen O'Connell and O'Callaghan with so many offloads as in the first half. That suggests we weren't playing our normal game. I hope Wales make the final and even win it.
Years ago Gatland gave 5 news caps for Ireland, O'Gara, Stringer, Horgan, Hayes and someone else (Wallace?) and it heralded a great era for us. He did it again with Wales in this tournament.
Just heard that the WRFU are to replace Gatland with O'Sullivan for the semi
gilbert
Quote from: BallyhaiseMan on October 08, 2011, 07:47:48 AM
How many Irish players did Jamie Roberts put on their arse during that game,
Earls,O Callaghan and O Gara to my counting,
Mike Phillips putting Heaslip on his hole aswell really illustrates a lack of physicality which was evident against Italy and Austrailia.
Heaslip can put most people on their hole
given the right ball.
Its just a shame, our big players never performed, who gives a f**k about the next 4 6nations tournaments this, the world cup is where its at and we didn't perform. All those great players now didnt do it at the very top and its a shame coz I think they had the ability but not the belief to do it at the very top. It may just be a case that wales are better or were better on the day but I think there's more to it than that.
Wales were awesome at tackling and putting us back before we gained any yards whilst we let wales gain easy yards before tacking them. When game was in melting pot and level we froze and fcuked up a line out that led to wales possession, darcy missed a tackle and wales scored and sin e. Will be interesting to see if wales can kick on, I don't think so, they're runnin about like they've won the world cup here and done they're job. I don't thin they'll have the belief to win no matter who they play in the semi and I think they'll lose.
That will do it. Disappointing because we didn't play our best game or players. Should have picked Sexton. A good effort overall in this game and tournament.
We don't like being favourites in games do we. Best of luck to Wales. They deseved the win. Even if we should have been well ahead at half time. We ran out of steam. We lacked strength in depth 1-5. 3 subs should have been on with half an hour to go.
More payback from getting rid of Gatland. We will never live it down. Well deserved for the IRFU for behaving like a bunch of gits.
Quote from: whitegoodman on October 08, 2011, 07:48:42 AM
Im not the type to say I told ya so but...................... :-[
You thought O'Brien didn't start... :P
Feel sick. Priestland was brilliant. Gutted for O'Driscoll.
Quote from: whitegoodman on October 08, 2011, 07:48:42 AM
Im not the type to say I told ya so but...................... :-[
hopefully I will be able to say the same after a French victory!
Quote from: muppet on October 08, 2011, 07:51:13 AM
Quote from: whitegoodman on October 08, 2011, 07:48:42 AM
Im not the type to say I told ya so but...................... :-[
You thought O'Brien didn't start... :P
In case u didnt realise it was a windup lad, jesus.
He was having a very quiet game and it was my humourless way of putting that across. Some of us are a wee bit slow on the uptake on here in the mornings
Quote from: J OGorman on October 08, 2011, 07:54:27 AM
Quote from: whitegoodman on October 08, 2011, 07:48:42 AM
Im not the type to say I told ya so but...................... :-[
hopefully I will be able to say the same after a French victory!
We will see, hope ur right but dont see it. Actuallly think Ireland would have a better chance of beating the English than the welsh.
Quote from: Gold on October 08, 2011, 07:50:11 AM
Will be interesting to see if wales can kick on, I don't think so, they're runnin about like they've won the world cup here and done they're job. I don't thin they'll have the belief to win no matter who they play in the semi and I think they'll lose.
They've been impressive the whole tournament from the game against SA. I think you'll see a NZ/Wales final.
disappointing, but sure how many days have we had like that watching the Irish Rugby team - you get used to it
It's time we stood back, took stock and concentrated on something we're good at - smothering reality whilst convincing us to feel better about ourselves by supporting England's opponents.
What a shame... not to take away from Wales though, they fully deserved it, I thought they were unreal. Hopefully they make the final now.
Quote from: ONeill on October 08, 2011, 08:07:24 AM
It's time we stood back, took stock and concentrated on something we're good at - smothering reality whilst convincing us to feel better about ourselves by supporting England's opponents.
Summed up very well
What a crock of shite
Quote from: muppet on October 08, 2011, 07:51:13 AM
Quote from: whitegoodman on October 08, 2011, 07:48:42 AM
Im not the type to say I told ya so but...................... :-[
You thought O'Brien didn't start... :P
you're no expert on rugby
Quote from: sans pessimism on October 08, 2011, 08:10:29 AM
Quote from: muppet on October 08, 2011, 07:51:13 AM
Quote from: whitegoodman on October 08, 2011, 07:48:42 AM
Im not the type to say I told ya so but...................... :-[
You thought O'Brien didn't start... :P
you're no expert on rugby
Didnt say i was but a lot on here were losing the run of themselves all week like most of the country in fairness. Talk of 20 point victories and the like was utter nonsense.
I wonder who might retire now
Watched I all there in half an hour and I still could realise that from the minute Wales got the ball in the first half, they were much the better team.
Quote from: whitegoodman on October 08, 2011, 08:12:54 AM
Quote from: sans pessimism on October 08, 2011, 08:10:29 AM
Quote from: muppet on October 08, 2011, 07:51:13 AM
Quote from: whitegoodman on October 08, 2011, 07:48:42 AM
Im not the type to say I told ya so but...................... :-[
You thought O'Brien didn't start... :P
you're no expert on rugby
Didnt say i was but a lot on here were losing the run of themselves all week like most of the country in fairness. Talk of 20 point victories and the like was utter nonsense.
At least it stopped people talkin bout shinners and yanks in the aras
Disappointing but what I feared and expected to be honest.
I blame Martin McGuinness/ fine gael blueshirts
Need to get back to the gaelic now. With everyone watching the rugby the dubs snuck in and won the all ireland.
Mass exodus of the bandwagon.
Couldn't build momentum today which was a factor. With the benefit of hindsight probably should have went for the posts in the first half but if we had of missed would have been saying the opposite.
Congratulations to Wales. Fantastic performance-superiorly coached and conditioned team, I am sure a lot of which goes down to Fergus Connolly. Must be a bitter-sweet victory for him.
Quote from: sans pessimism on October 08, 2011, 08:18:01 AM
Quote from: whitegoodman on October 08, 2011, 08:12:54 AM
Quote from: sans pessimism on October 08, 2011, 08:10:29 AM
Quote from: muppet on October 08, 2011, 07:51:13 AM
Quote from: whitegoodman on October 08, 2011, 07:48:42 AM
Im not the type to say I told ya so but...................... :-[
You thought O'Brien didn't start... :P
you're no expert on rugby
Didnt say i was but a lot on here were losing the run of themselves all week like most of the country in fairness. Talk of 20 point victories and the like was utter nonsense.
At least it stopped people talkin bout shinners and yanks in the aras
Fair point.
Colonial sport anyway.
Quote from: ONeill on October 08, 2011, 08:25:36 AM
Colonial sport anyway.
wouldn't say that while standing beside O'Connell or O'Brien-especially today!!
I thought this is rugby country ???
Well done Wales.
Who is the commentator that sounds like Ryan Turbidy? Much better than Ryle, calls things better.
Unlucky ireland. Gave a good account of themselves and gave the country a great performance against australia.
On a side note. When did this french team land in new zealand. All over england
The wheels have come right off the bandwagon. There are tens of thousands of Irish who can put the jersey back in the drawer til the next World Cup.
As O'Neill says, let's get back to what we do best and support whoever England are playing.
11-0 to France. I didn't call this game beforehand because of French unpredictablity. England are just mediocre.
Quote from: Tony Baloney on October 08, 2011, 08:56:53 AM
The wheels have come right off the bandwagon. There are tens of thousands of Irish who can put the jersey back in the drawer til the next World Cup.
As O'Neill says, let's get back to what we do best and support whoever England are playing.
Working rightly so far
Quote from: andoireabu on October 08, 2011, 08:56:00 AM
Unlucky ireland. Gave a good account of themselves and gave the country a great performance against australia.
On a side note. When did this french team land in new zealand. All over england
Ya would want to be careful, that sort of humour isnt accepted very well on here!!
All these games are pointless anyway. NO team will beat the All Blacks
Lievremont grew a tache. 16-0. Game over????
Johnson has to go. He only has half a clue. Pick big men and be agressive.
The French have uncorked the champagne in a big way. They probably won't show up against Wales the next day.
Quote from: passedit on October 08, 2011, 08:58:17 AM
Quote from: Tony Baloney on October 08, 2011, 08:56:53 AM
The wheels have come right off the bandwagon. There are tens of thousands of Irish who can put the jersey back in the drawer til the next World Cup.
As O'Neill says, let's get back to what we do best and support whoever England are playing.
Working rightly so far
;D French are ripping them apart. Pity about those conversions though.
Quote from: Bord na Mona man on October 08, 2011, 09:05:34 AM
The French have uncorked the champagne in a big way. They probably won't show up against Wales the next day.
They might not even show up second half!
Need to capitalise now.
Quote from: sammymaguire on October 08, 2011, 09:02:19 AM
All these games are pointless anyway. NO team will beat the All Blacks
that's been said since they won they first WC in 1987
Phil vickery thinks he is giving a HT teamtalk. Im waiting on the effing and blinding to start
Quote from: sammymaguire on October 08, 2011, 09:02:19 AM
All these games are pointless anyway. NO team will beat the All Blacks
except themselves
Foden just ran with the ball into touch it could be the final nail in the England coffin.
england will get slaughtered tomorrow by their press!
Quote from: Hoof Hearted on October 08, 2011, 09:08:20 AM
Quote from: sammymaguire on October 08, 2011, 09:02:19 AM
All these games are pointless anyway. NO team will beat the All Blacks
that's been said since they won they first WC in 1987
Phil vickery thinks he is giving a HT teamtalk. Im waiting on the effing and blinding to start
On their own home turf this year.
Ah now lads , Johnson has done a fantastic job with the English...
For me anyhow he has:
- Kept them at the top of the tree as one of the worlds most hated teams (in any sport)
- Ensured they are never more than mediocre at best, sparing us a team England tabloid frenzy
- Shown them to be some of the biggest (dumbest) cheats of world rugby
-Blown away the thugs game played by gentlemen nonsense that the tabloids and D4 would promote
- Allowed the public to see them for the overhyped, ignorant, arrogant t!ts they really seem to be
And all this while managing to display not one ounce of charm, wit or humility.
I suppose the fact John Terry thinks he is doing a fantastic job says it all.......
Well done Martin. Hope you are there for another 10 years.
So who do we play next?
It's great all the same that we have a handy run all the way to the Final isn't it.
THIS IS RUGBY COUNTRY! TOGETHER STANDING TALL!
Quote from: Capt Pat on October 05, 2011, 02:09:37 AM
Same team against the Welsh.Though Bests fitness is still up in the air. I would have played Sexton instead of O Gara as I don't anticipate this game being decide on penalties.
There is something I got right. The Welsh gameplan was in part built around O Garas weaknesses. Running at him when in possession and standing off him marking other players when he had the ball forcing him to run which he can't do to any great effect.
Don't look at my match prediction thread. Just about completely wrong.
Quote from: laoislad on October 08, 2011, 09:55:13 AM
So who do we play next?
It's great all the same that we have a handy run all the way to the Final isn't it.
THIS IS RUGBY COUNTRY! TOGETHER STANDING TALL!
Very like Laois hurling/football
"This is rugby country"?.............................WALES
Quote from: laoislad on October 08, 2011, 09:55:13 AM
So who do we play next?
It's great all the same that we have a handy run all the way to the Final isn't it.
THIS IS RUGBY COUNTRY! TOGETHER STANDING TALL!
Made a for a nice break from Irish people sheepishly over obsessing about about English soccer teams.
Presume post is tongue in cheek but annoying all the same.
Wales won? you got to be joking. But it was meant to be Ireland England semi final.
Did anyone else see the man in the Irish jersey beer in hand at the end of the England defeat dancing a jig of joy. We did win today :P
The Irish defense was terrible today. Leaving the blindside unguarded 5 yards out against Mike Phillips is not very clever.
Iris fans are bawling their eyes out in the stadium. All that beer and feeling homesick for rugby country is the cause.
Quote from: Capt Pat on October 08, 2011, 10:54:15 AM
Did anyone else see the man in the Irish jersey beer in hand at the end of the England defeat dancing a jig of joy. We did win today :P
Spotted that too, but it just depressed me. For a short while I'd thought we'd become a serious rugby team, able to compete in semi finals and finals, rather than an average team whose fans have to make do with celebrating England defeats. Back to reality, I suppose.
Disappointed but the better team won. No disgrace.
Quote from: Myles Na G. on October 08, 2011, 11:11:07 AM
Quote from: Capt Pat on October 08, 2011, 10:54:15 AM
Did anyone else see the man in the Irish jersey beer in hand at the end of the England defeat dancing a jig of joy. We did win today :P
Spotted that too, but it just depressed me. For a short while I'd thought we'd become a serious rugby team, able to compete in semi finals and finals, rather than an average team whose fans have to make do with celebrating England defeats. Back to reality, I suppose.
A "serious" rugby team might have won more grand slams. The rugby pool in Ireland is very small as well.
That girlie choir chorus for Ireland's call was ominous, you couldn't imagine the All Blacks having that.
Sad that it has come to this. We had plenty of time scrapping inside their 25 but Wales were superb there and clinical with their opportunities. Wales thoroughly outplayed Ireland in most departments leaving Ireland ragged at the end.
It's the All Black's world cup to lose.
Not that i'd profess huge expertise but it seems we went out there with a very real possibility of being on the plane home after the group stages which would not have been acceptable and would have led to a few of our (extensive) coaching ticket with big questions to answer. So emptied the tank big time against Ozzies and Italy to make 1/4 final. Looks like the effort caught up today and well beaten. Has to be hard to sustain the required level of physical intensity week in week out.
Afraid perennial 1/4 finalists is about where we are at in this comp, this year with a bit of luck we could have made a semi at the outside. Really sorry for O Driscoll who has to be on borrowed time now and is an outstanding Irish sportsman regardless of what your preferred code is. Given the hype and giddiness of the past few days (20 point defeats of the Taffs etc) not sure I could have coped with us making a final in this.
Bate by a better team :(
Every cloud has a silver lining.
At least they beat a tri nations team at the WC. A bit like Mayo beating Cork in the AIQF.
Something to build on.
Thank feck that's all over!
Now I can get a bit of pace.
The bandwagon posters on here are f**king head wreckers. Turns out Ireland lost today because Strongbow landed in Wexford. ::)
Quote from: J OGorman on October 08, 2011, 07:41:16 AM
Quote from: Armaghgeddon on October 08, 2011, 07:33:10 AM
A bit late to bring Trimble on. Wales have conceeded 5 tries all tournament, Ireland missed the boat. Brian O'Driscoll's piss poor decision making in first half cost us.
thats dung..we're on the front foot, ball is at the touchline, wind is swirling...course you go for the corner, put the Welsh on the back foot. This defeat is NOT BOD's, its a collective defeat
Ireland dominated the entire first half and were then knackered in the second because they kept taking the difficult option. This game should have been treated similiar to the Australia game and should have kicked the points, not continually running at the Wales defence....yes it worked eventually but it was also our last score of the game and Wales were handed the perfect opportunity to run away with it which they did. Wales were always going to be fitter than Ireland, and Wales' record of only conceeding a few tries in the pool stages was evident and they were use to playing teams like Ireland.
Quote from: trileacman on October 08, 2011, 01:32:33 PM
The bandwagon posters on here are f**king head wreckers. Turns out Ireland lost today because Strongbow landed in Wexford. ::)
No we lost today because we are not a rugby coubtry like Wales and NZ Gatland etc. We were completely outgeplanned and complacency contributed to the defensive lapses.
Quote from: AQMP on October 08, 2011, 12:39:24 PM
Bate by a better team :(
In a nutshell.
Can't be too critical of Kidney or the team as the Australian game and second half against Italy were excellent. Only bad calls for me were Reddan coming on and leaving Earls on after that clash of heads- Williams wouldn't have got past Trimble so handy for the killer try. Front row met their match and Warburton was outstanding .
Quote from: trileacman on October 08, 2011, 01:32:33 PM
The bandwagon posters on here are f**king head wreckers. Turns out Ireland lost today because Strongbow landed in Wexford. ::)
Not at all, it was clearly down to Brian Boru getting killed at Clontarf in 1014 therefore Ireland not being able to build on the success of the group stages and falling victim to the Anglo-Welsh challenge in 1169.
Hindsight....It's a lovely word
better team won and wales didn't allow us to any space at all, but we didn't help our cause with some curious decisions (think first half penalty decisions) / poor execution.
On the England game laughed a couple of times at Vickery, "Ben Foden, what are you doing soon?" for Vincent Clerc's try and then "he's got some of his make-up in his eye"
Quote from: Capt Pat on October 08, 2011, 02:18:25 PM
Quote from: trileacman on October 08, 2011, 01:32:33 PM
The bandwagon posters on here are f**king head wreckers. Turns out Ireland lost today because Strongbow landed in Wexford. ::)
No we lost today because we are not a rugby coubtry like Wales and NZ Gatland etc. We were completely outgeplanned and complacency contributed to the defensive lapses.
We are as much a rugby country as Wales. 4 HC and a grandslam by far surpasses England's record for the decade and they have the largest player pools. Welsh club sides are cack and the majority of their good players remain with their no-hopers. As for the complacency issue you and Dinny fell foul of it as much as anyone. Ireland are as good an International side as Wales. The meeting today was between two evenly matched sides and there is all this shite now about not being good enough. We had the players today but not the gameplan/ tactics.
Quote from: BennyCake on October 08, 2011, 01:30:45 PM
Thank feck that's all over!
Now I can get a bit of pace.
Had you slowed down for the WC??
That Dinny hoor has a lot to answer for. He was pitching himself as an Irish William Wallace during the week, it was only a matter of turning up. Turns out we weren't really as good as he thought and Wales were much, much better.
Wales were better ON THE DAY.
Quote from: screenmachine on October 08, 2011, 07:14:48 PM
That Dinny hoor has a lot to answer for. He was pitching himself as an Irish William Wallace during the week, it was only a matter of turning up. Turns out we weren't really as good as he thought and Wales were much, much better.
Mea culpa
Wales were just better on the day, Ireland had the possession and the territory just didn't have the control one would have expected their experience to bring.
I'm a positive person but as a Kildare, Arsenal and Ireland rugby fan I can't take anymore :'(
There was f**k all respect shown for the Welsh all week long, all talk about meeting England in the semifinal! Wales were so superior to Ireland . You could see how much they were up for it when the centre smashed O Callaghan over with ease in the first few minutes!!!So much for the golden generation though! still can't get further than the world cup quarter final so what more have they achieved than the other Irish rugby teams in all fairness! 1 grand slam in other words they one more match that other teams that had won the 5 or 6 nations championship! And they beat Australia but could still not advance further than that! If that's the best that the golden generation can do then it's downhill for Irish rugby especially when you consider the decline of Munster and Leinster once the older lads retire! At least it will put an end to those retarded " this is rugby country" ads!! I was very disappointed to watch the match but when I saw how much the Welsh were dominant after Earls scored his try then teh writing was on the wall! Thanks for the memories and now the semifinal will be a classic between the welsh and French!
Quote from: cicfada on October 08, 2011, 08:19:09 PM
You could see how much they were up for it when the centre smashed O Callaghan over with ease in the first few minutes!!!
I thought that smash bordered somewhere between the edge of legally acceptable rugby and a deliberate brutal assault.
I think that same Welsh guy did it again in the 2nd half, used his skull as a battering ram into the face of an Irish player. The All Blacks are the masters of that, but they use their elbows instead of their skull.
Pity that type of stuff is allowed in Rugby and even applauded by some.
Quote from: cicfada on October 08, 2011, 08:19:09 PM
There was f**k all respect shown for the Welsh all week long, all talk about meeting England in the semifinal! Wales were so superior to Ireland . You could see how much they were up for it when the centre smashed O Callaghan over with ease in the first few minutes!!!So much for the golden generation though! still can't get further than the world cup quarter final so what more have they achieved than the other Irish rugby teams in all fairness! 1 grand slam in other words they one more match that other teams that had won the 5 or 6 nations championship! And they beat Australia but could still not advance further than that! If that's the best that the golden generation can do then it's downhill for Irish rugby especially when you consider the decline of Munster and Leinster once the older lads retire! At least it will put an end to those retarded " this is rugby country" ads!! I was very disappointed to watch the match but when I saw how much the Welsh were dominant after Earls scored his try then teh writing was on the wall! Thanks for the memories and now the semifinal will be a classic between the welsh and French!
Some good points in there. the amount of comment/gloating about, among other things, Aussie arrogance, over the past few weeks has been interesting. I suppose when you've appeared in three RWC finals and have won two you can be excused the odd bit of arrogance/cockiness/over confidence/taking the opposition slightly for granted in a pool game. Considering some of the comments on here in advance of the Welsh game makes you wonder what sort of attitude we would display if we won something at this caper, sometime.
Quote from: cicfada on October 08, 2011, 08:19:09 PM
There was f**k all respect shown for the Welsh all week long, all talk about meeting England in the semifinal! Wales were so superior to Ireland . You could see how much they were up for it when the centre smashed O Callaghan over with ease in the first few minutes!!!So much for the golden generation though! still can't get further than the world cup quarter final so what more have they achieved than the other Irish rugby teams in all fairness! 1 grand slam in other words they one more match that other teams that had won the 5 or 6 nations championship! And they beat Australia but could still not advance further than that! If that's the best that the golden generation can do then it's downhill for Irish rugby especially when you consider the decline of Munster and Leinster once the older lads retire! At least it will put an end to those retarded " this is rugby country" ads!! I was very disappointed to watch the match but when I saw how much the Welsh were dominant after Earls scored his try then teh writing was on the wall! Thanks for the memories and now the semifinal will be a classic between the welsh and French!
Right, lets get real here. This the best Irish team there has been. The results v SA, Aus, 6 nations, reg beating England home and away. POC, Darsy, BOD (3 times) player of the 6 nations tournament. O'Connell / BOD coming 2nd in the world player of the year accolade. Rog one of the top test points scorers ever. So yes, in Irish rugby, this is indeed the golden generation. No question.
You are predicting a Leinster team who have been rampant in the HEC these last 2 years, are about to go into decline. How do you know?
One final point..you talk of the welsh centre smashing DOC with ease to try and prove a point, which is nothing but sensationalist poop. A Welsh back smashing an irish lock. Thon welsh centre is 6' 4" and well over 16 stone (just to let you know, but Im sure with your knowledge of the game, that would be akin to telling your granda how to suck eggs)
Quote from: J OGorman on October 08, 2011, 09:41:23 PM
You are predicting a Leinster team who have been rampant in the HEC these last 2 years, are about to go into decline. How do you know?
One final point..you talk of the welsh centre smashing DOC with ease to try and prove a point, which is nothing but sensationalist poop. A Welsh back smashing an irish lock. Thon welsh centre is 6' 4" and well over 16 stone (just to let you know, but Im sure with your knowledge of the game, that would be akin to telling your granda how to suck eggs)
:D :D Thats class. :D :D
Long and short of it. Over the last few weeks rugby has united the country. There's guys calling it a disgraceful performance in both the falls and shankill. Irelands call me hole
Quote from: rrhf on October 08, 2011, 09:53:34 PM
Long and short of it. Over the last few weeks rugby has united the country. There's guys calling it a disgraceful performance in both the falls and shankill. Irelands call me hole
Love this post
Quote from: J OGorman on October 08, 2011, 09:41:23 PM
Quote from: cicfada on October 08, 2011, 08:19:09 PM
There was f**k all respect shown for the Welsh all week long, all talk about meeting England in the semifinal! Wales were so superior to Ireland . You could see how much they were up for it when the centre smashed O Callaghan over with ease in the first few minutes!!!So much for the golden generation though! still can't get further than the world cup quarter final so what more have they achieved than the other Irish rugby teams in all fairness! 1 grand slam in other words they one more match that other teams that had won the 5 or 6 nations championship! And they beat Australia but could still not advance further than that! If that's the best that the golden generation can do then it's downhill for Irish rugby especially when you consider the decline of Munster and Leinster once the older lads retire! At least it will put an end to those retarded " this is rugby country" ads!! I was very disappointed to watch the match but when I saw how much the Welsh were dominant after Earls scored his try then teh writing was on the wall! Thanks for the memories and now the semifinal will be a classic between the welsh and French!
Right, lets get real here. This the best Irish team there has been. The results v SA, Aus, 6 nations, reg beating England home and away. POC, Darsy, BOD (3 times) player of the 6 nations tournament. O'Connell / BOD coming 2nd in the world player of the year accolade. Rog one of the top test points scorers ever. So yes, in Irish rugby, this is indeed the golden generation. No question.
You are predicting a Leinster team who have been rampant in the HEC these last 2 years, are about to go into decline. How do you know?
One final point..you talk of the welsh centre smashing DOC with ease to try and prove a point, which is nothing but sensationalist poop. A Welsh back smashing an irish lock. Thon welsh centre is 6' 4" and well over 16 stone (just to let you know, but Im sure with your knowledge of the game, that would be akin to telling your granda how to suck eggs)
The way that the centre ( doesn't matter how big he is btw) smashed into O Callaghan ( be it illegal or not) was a statement of intent and showed us all who watched the match that they were really up for this one! Anyone that coudn't see that is blind! I am no rugby expert but you don't need to be one to come to my conclusion about that hit!! It is to O callaghan's credit that he carried on well after it!!
As for the Golden Generation, well in world Cup terms and that is the ultimate litmus test of an international teams progress, they have not made it past the quarter final stage! That is not progress for me for a team the likes of which may be not seen again for some time on this island! Maybe winning 6 nations championships and beating southern hemisphere teams iin Winter is enough for you but not for me to be honest! I mean this team has beaten England and wales a lot but still had to watch England go the World Cup Final in 2007 and now will probably watch Wales make it to this years one!!! The fact that they had a world class player like O 'Driscoll playing for them and still ended going home at this stage is so disappointing! I feel so sorry for him and POC and ROG!! If O'Driscoll was our stand out World Class player and his loss will be a massive blow for Ireland then how big would the blow be for leinster?? every time he got an injury for Ireland all the pundits would be saying how weakened the team would be ! well magnify that a few times for Leinster! Yes Leinster have a younger team with less seasoned internationals than Munster but it will be interesting to see how they prepare for the great man's departure! obviously he won't be gone provincially for a few years yet!! All in all disappointing but I suppose we can rewind the Australia match and yearn!!
The best manager and players ireland will ever have, perhaps messed up or perhaps got to their level. Next up can they take 1 more slam
South Africa start strongly but tye Aussies pick off tge scores on the counter and tunovers.
8-0
Everything going Australias way.Broussow is off injured hgiving the Aussies a key advantage at the breakdown. SA have a penalty in front of the posts advantage is played and they make yards only to concede a penalty to Pocock at the break down the story of the game.
8-3
The ref takes a try off SA for a forward pass. Makes up for a had decision he gave against the Aussies a minute earlier.
Daylight robbery if Aussies hang on here. SA should be 20 pts up.
jasus that ref needs glasses. how the aussies won that beats me
6-0 to the ABs. They shouldn't have a problem as they have the edge in the scrums.
Quote from: Capt Pat on October 09, 2011, 09:03:09 AM
6-0 to the ABs. They shouldn't have a problem as they have the edge in the scrums.
try for the argies 7-6 to them now - surely surely not
Argentina try and conversion 7-6
Quote from: gerry on October 09, 2011, 07:45:49 AM
jasus that ref needs glasses. how the aussies won that beats me
.....and we're gone home
I spoke too soon 6-7 to Argentina after a great break by Senatore.
Watch the ABs get a lit of tight decisions from the ref.
Quote from: sans pessimism on October 09, 2011, 09:08:20 AM
Quote from: gerry on October 09, 2011, 07:45:49 AM
jasus that ref needs glasses. how the aussies won that beats me
.....and we're gone home
and the French have lost twice and are in the semi's !!
Quote from: Capt Pat on October 09, 2011, 09:09:04 AM
I spoke too soon 6-7 to Argentina after a great break by Senatore.
Watch the ABs get a lit of tight decisions from the ref.
What's new. The Yankees, Brazil,Man U and Kerry collectively would be embarassed to get the decisions from refs and arselicking from journos the ABs get. In the words of KK I'd just love it if the Argies stole this.
Quote from: Hoof Hearted on October 09, 2011, 09:15:29 AM
Quote from: sans pessimism on October 09, 2011, 09:13:14 AM
Quote from: Hoof Hearted on October 09, 2011, 09:09:50 AM
Quote from: sans pessimism on October 09, 2011, 09:08:20 AM
Quote from: gerry on October 09, 2011, 07:45:49 AM
jasus that ref needs glasses. how the aussies won that beats me
.....and we're gone home
and the French have lost twice and are in the semi's !!
life's a bitch
and then you marry one....but that's your fault no-one elses ;D
not if her father is holding a shot gun!
Quote from: sans pessimism on October 09, 2011, 09:32:34 AM
Quote from: Hoof Hearted on October 09, 2011, 09:15:29 AM
Quote from: sans pessimism on October 09, 2011, 09:13:14 AM
Quote from: Hoof Hearted on October 09, 2011, 09:09:50 AM
Quote from: sans pessimism on October 09, 2011, 09:08:20 AM
Quote from: gerry on October 09, 2011, 07:45:49 AM
jasus that ref needs glasses. how the aussies won that beats me
.....and we're gone home
and the French have lost twice and are in the semi's !!
life's a bitch
and then you marry one....but that's your fault no-one elses ;D
not if her father is holding a shot gun!
thats a different "shotgun" story - still your fault though :D
AB's still getting her tight, should still win though. Will be tough-to-call semi against the Aussies
Will this be the first ever NZ World cup win without a try being scored by them? Credit to Las Malvinas owners. Some effort. Perhaps we will now see them in the annual southern Hem. tournament. Deserve to be, I reckon.
Quote from: Aerlik on October 09, 2011, 09:58:24 AM
Will this be the first ever NZ World cup win without a try being scored by them? Credit to Las Malvinas owners. Some effort. Perhaps we will now see them in the annual southern Hem. tournament. Deserve to be, I reckon.
surely this is proof that they can compete down there
Quote from: Hoof Hearted on October 09, 2011, 10:00:33 AM
Quote from: Aerlik on October 09, 2011, 09:58:24 AM
Will this be the first ever NZ World cup win without a try being scored by them? Credit to Las Malvinas owners. Some effort. Perhaps we will now see them in the annual southern Hem. tournament. Deserve to be, I reckon.
surely this is proof that they can compete down there
deffo
Maybe not 8)
Quote from: Hoof Hearted on October 09, 2011, 10:00:33 AM
Quote from: Aerlik on October 09, 2011, 09:58:24 AM
Will this be the first ever NZ World cup win without a try being scored by them? Credit to Las Malvinas owners. Some effort. Perhaps we will now see them in the annual southern Hem. tournament. Deserve to be, I reckon.
surely this is proof that they can compete down there
Argentina will join the "Tri-nations" next year. That's already been decided quite some time ago.
Your +28 points spread might have been in trouble if Reads first try had counted as it should. The conversion of that would have resulted in a 30 point difference.
Quote from: Capt Pat on October 09, 2011, 10:19:07 AM
Your +28 points spread might have been in trouble if Reads first try had counted as it should. The conversion of that would have resulted in a 30 point difference.
he was out.
Quote from: mc_grens on October 09, 2011, 10:06:46 AM
Quote from: Hoof Hearted on October 09, 2011, 10:00:33 AM
Quote from: Aerlik on October 09, 2011, 09:58:24 AM
Will this be the first ever NZ World cup win without a try being scored by them? Credit to Las Malvinas owners. Some effort. Perhaps we will now see them in the annual southern Hem. tournament. Deserve to be, I reckon.
surely this is proof that they can compete down there
Argentina will join the "Tri-nations" next year. That's already been decided quite some time ago.
Jeez, what'll they call it then??
Quote from: CiKe on October 09, 2011, 10:21:45 AM
Quote from: Capt Pat on October 09, 2011, 10:19:07 AM
Your +28 points spread might have been in trouble if Reads first try had counted as it should. The conversion of that would have resulted in a 30 point difference.
he was out.
He shouodn't have been. He fluffed scoring the try.
Can some of the rugby boys on the board explain to me how the Saffers contrived to lose that game this morning ???
Was away all weekend so came on to read the post mortems and by God the begrudgery and people distancing themselves from Irish Rugby is ridiculous. What was wrong with believing we could beat Wales? That's what everyone should should be thinking coming into a game like this. Shame on you all!!
Anyway I would like to thank the lads for their honesty and commitment to the cause. In reality Wales have the nucleus of 2 Grand Slam teams and only for injury should probably have more. They are a serious outfit and can beat France and give the AB's a game in the final.
The failings which were pointed to before the tournament (and which were probably masked by the Oz game) came to fruition ie. Our scrum, O'Garas defensive frailties, BOD's powers on the wane and the poor form of D'Arcy, Earls and Heaslip.
Having said that we were not a million miles away and had we taken our points it could have been different. Wales were far superior in every way though and fair play to them and best of luck.
Best thing Ireland can do now is clear out whoever won't be available for 2015 and build from now. We may take a few hidings along the way but the Golden age is gone and to get back to the level we have been previously will be a big ask but I reckon we've the right man in charge to do that.
Thanks lads!!!
Quote from: screenexile on October 09, 2011, 06:37:02 PM
Was away all weekend so came on to read the post mortems and by God the begrudgery and people distancing themselves from Irish Rugby is ridiculous. What was wrong with believing we could beat Wales? That's what everyone should should be thinking coming into a game like this. Shame on you all!!
Anyway I would like to thank the lads for their honesty and commitment to the cause. In reality Wales have the nucleus of 2 Grand Slam teams and only for injury should probably have more. They are a serious outfit and can beat France and give the AB's a game in the final.
The failings which were pointed to before the tournament (and which were probably masked by the Oz game) came to fruition ie. Our scrum, O'Garas defensive frailties, BOD's powers on the wane and the poor form of D'Arcy, Earls and Heaslip.
Having said that we were not a million miles away and had we taken our points it could have been different. Wales were far superior in every way though and fair play to them and best of luck.
Best thing Ireland can do now is clear out whoever won't be available for 2015 and build from now. We may take a few hidings along the way but the Golden age is gone and to get back to the level we have been previously will be a big ask but I reckon we've the right man in charge to do that.
Thanks lads!!!
Good post.
Quote from: muppet on October 09, 2011, 06:42:01 PM
Quote from: screenexile on October 09, 2011, 06:37:02 PM
Was away all weekend so came on to read the post mortems and by God the begrudgery and people distancing themselves from Irish Rugby is ridiculous. What was wrong with believing we could beat Wales? That's what everyone should should be thinking coming into a game like this. Shame on you all!!
Anyway I would like to thank the lads for their honesty and commitment to the cause. In reality Wales have the nucleus of 2 Grand Slam teams and only for injury should probably have more. They are a serious outfit and can beat France and give the AB's a game in the final.
The failings which were pointed to before the tournament (and which were probably masked by the Oz game) came to fruition ie. Our scrum, O'Garas defensive frailties, BOD's powers on the wane and the poor form of D'Arcy, Earls and Heaslip.
Having said that we were not a million miles away and had we taken our points it could have been different. Wales were far superior in every way though and fair play to them and best of luck.
Best thing Ireland can do now is clear out whoever won't be available for 2015 and build from now. We may take a few hidings along the way but the Golden age is gone and to get back to the level we have been previously will be a big ask but I reckon we've the right man in charge to do that.
Thanks lads!!!
Good post.
+1
Those English boys just don't know when to stop!!!
England centre Manu Tuilagi has been formally warned by police for disorderly behaviour after jumping from a ferry in Auckland on Sunday night.
A Rugby Football Union (RFU) source confirmed that Tuilagi was detained by police after swimming a short distance to a pier at the ferry terminal.
The RFU would not comment on whether alcohol was involved but did says the player was unharmed.
The England team are due to leave for the UK later on Monday.
Auckland Police spokeswoman Noreen Hegarty said: "A member of the England team jumped off a passenger ferry and swam a short distance to pier three at the terminal at 6.48pm last night.
"As he climbed ashore he was met by police officers before being taken to the Auckland Central police station and held for around an hour and a half.
"He was formally warned about the offence of disorderly behaviour before being released back to the team management. There is no suggestion he was pushed from the vessel."
Quote from: Declan on October 09, 2011, 09:52:50 PM
Those English boys just don't know when to stop!!!
England centre Manu Tuilagi has been formally warned by police for disorderly behaviour after jumping from a ferry in Auckland on Sunday night.
A Rugby Football Union (RFU) source confirmed that Tuilagi was detained by police after swimming a short distance to a pier at the ferry terminal.
The RFU would not comment on whether alcohol was involved but did says the player was unharmed.
The England team are due to leave for the UK later on Monday.
Auckland Police spokeswoman Noreen Hegarty said: "A member of the England team jumped off a passenger ferry and swam a short distance to pier three at the terminal at 6.48pm last night.
"As he climbed ashore he was met by police officers before being taken to the Auckland Central police station and held for around an hour and a half.
"He was formally warned about the offence of disorderly behaviour before being released back to the team management. There is no suggestion he was pushed from the vessel."
If there wasn't,you'd worry for his mental state!!
Quote from: Capt Pat on October 09, 2011, 12:44:17 PM
Quote from: CiKe on October 09, 2011, 10:21:45 AM
Quote from: Capt Pat on October 09, 2011, 10:19:07 AM
Your +28 points spread might have been in trouble if Reads first try had counted as it should. The conversion of that would have resulted in a 30 point difference.
he was out.
He shouodn't have been. He fluffed scoring the try.
f**k sake, that's like saying "if he'd done this and if he'd done that". If Ireland were better defensively yesterday like they should have been then maybe they'd still be in the tournament. Read's foot was in touch, try was correctly disallowed. End of story.
Read should have made it count by not dragging his foot over the line. It would have have been a good score but was over ruled on a technicality.
If I did that in school and the ref said no score I would have been livid. Technology rules at the world cup however.
Quote from: gallsman on October 09, 2011, 10:08:35 PM
Quote from: Capt Pat on October 09, 2011, 12:44:17 PM
Quote from: CiKe on October 09, 2011, 10:21:45 AM
Quote from: Capt Pat on October 09, 2011, 10:19:07 AM
Your +28 points spread might have been in trouble if Reads first try had counted as it should. The conversion of that would have resulted in a 30 point difference.
he was out.
He shouodn't have been. He fluffed scoring the try.
f**k sake, that's like saying "if he'd done this and if he'd done that". If Ireland were better defensively yesterday like they should have been then maybe they'd still be in the tournament. Read's foot was in touch, try was correctly disallowed. End of story.
Quote from: Capt Pat on October 09, 2011, 10:22:49 PM
Read should have made it count by not dragging his foot over the line. It would have have been a good score but was over ruled on a technicality.
If I did that in school and the ref said no score I would have been livid. Technology rules at the world cup however.
Quote from: gallsman on October 09, 2011, 10:08:35 PM
Quote from: Capt Pat on October 09, 2011, 12:44:17 PM
Quote from: CiKe on October 09, 2011, 10:21:45 AM
Quote from: Capt Pat on October 09, 2011, 10:19:07 AM
Your +28 points spread might have been in trouble if Reads first try had counted as it should. The conversion of that would have resulted in a 30 point difference.
he was out.
He shouodn't have been. He fluffed scoring the try.
f**k sake, that's like saying "if he'd done this and if he'd done that". If Ireland were better defensively yesterday like they should have been then maybe they'd still be in the tournament. Read's foot was in touch, try was correctly disallowed. End of story.
Huh? Overruled on a technicality? Yes, he was technically out of play. This argument doesn;t make any sense. I think you're trying to say he could have done better and should have scored.
Quote from: Declan on October 09, 2011, 09:52:50 PM
Those English boys just don't know when to stop!!!
England centre Manu Tuilagi has been formally warned by police for disorderly behaviour after jumping from a ferry in Auckland on Sunday night.
A Rugby Football Union (RFU) source confirmed that Tuilagi was detained by police after swimming a short distance to a pier at the ferry terminal.
The RFU would not comment on whether alcohol was involved but did says the player was unharmed.
The England team are due to leave for the UK later on Monday.
Auckland Police spokeswoman Noreen Hegarty said: "A member of the England team jumped off a passenger ferry and swam a short distance to pier three at the terminal at 6.48pm last night.
"As he climbed ashore he was met by police officers before being taken to the Auckland Central police station and held for around an hour and a half.
"He was formally warned about the offence of disorderly behaviour before being released back to the team management. There is no suggestion he was pushed from the vessel."
And England have been wondering why they have been starting games slowly, must be halftime before the hangovers have cleared.
Quote from: screenexile on October 09, 2011, 06:37:02 PM
The failings which were pointed to before the tournament (and which were probably masked by the Oz game) came to fruition ie. Our scrum, O'Garas defensive frailties, BOD's powers on the wane and the poor form of D'Arcy, Earls and Heaslip.
Best thing Ireland can do now is clear out whoever won't be available for 2015 and build from now. We may take a few hidings along the way but the Golden age is gone and to get back to the level we have been previously will be a big ask but I reckon we've the right man in charge to do that.
Agree with your general sentiment screenexile ...but would have a different take on some of it. I think it was actually the Italy game that masked the failings. D'Arcy in particular had a cracker that day but otherwise has been only a shadow of his 2009 version lately. I think Sexton should have played in the centre but I suppose they should have gone down that road earlier if they were going to use it. I also think the pack and management underestimated the Welsh pack ... I think they expected to maul them over the line of those early lineouts . In hindsight the shot at goal would have been the better option.
Cracking semi final pairings though.
Both will be interesting with Wales hopefully shading theirs and Australia in the other. How do Australia handle the Haka? Distain, feign a lack of interest?
Mils Muliaina and Colin Slade both out of the rest of the tournament. NZ on their 3rd choice 10.
Australia are going to win this fecking thing.
Quote from: AZOffaly on October 10, 2011, 12:52:58 PM
Australia are going to win this fecking thing.
Don't say that ! That would be hard to take.
All Blacks will never win it if they don't win it this time.
Australia can't win the RWC. They've no lineout, very little scrum, no kicking game. They don't even have that much class in their backs.
If rugby can be reduced to simply how good your openside is at stealing ball, then the game will die soon.
Quote from: orangeman on October 10, 2011, 12:58:41 PM
Quote from: AZOffaly on October 10, 2011, 12:52:58 PM
Australia are going to win this fecking thing.
Don't say that ! That would be hard to take.
All Blacks will never win it if they don't win it this time.
David Kirk lifted the Webb Ellis in 87
Quote from: thewobbler on October 10, 2011, 01:00:56 PM
Australia can't win the RWC. They've no lineout, very little scrum, no kicking game. They don't even have that much class in their backs.
If rugby can be reduced to simply how good your openside is at stealing ball, then the game will die soon.
AustrLia have a big chance now. The All Blacks have no fly half. They will beat the winner of France v Wales if they get that far.
I'd like to think Wales have a great chance now.
France could go out the next day and either destroy them and fall assunder in the final or
france could simply fall assunder against wales. They are a strange team.
Still think Wales have the power and the ability to squeeze out wins now, with the all blacks hit with injuries, they are most certainly not at their best.
Quote from: Capt Pat on October 10, 2011, 03:36:12 PM
Quote from: thewobbler on October 10, 2011, 01:00:56 PM
Australia can't win the RWC. They've no lineout, very little scrum, no kicking game. They don't even have that much class in their backs.
If rugby can be reduced to simply how good your openside is at stealing ball, then the game will die soon.
AustrLia have a big chance now. The All Blacks have no fly half. They will beat the winner of France v Wales if they get that far.
Cruden handled himself fine when he came on. Stephen Donald has been called up and is more than capable of playing out-half.
Quote from: gallsman on October 10, 2011, 07:06:59 PM
Quote from: Capt Pat on October 10, 2011, 03:36:12 PM
Quote from: thewobbler on October 10, 2011, 01:00:56 PM
Australia can't win the RWC. They've no lineout, very little scrum, no kicking game. They don't even have that much class in their backs.
If rugby can be reduced to simply how good your openside is at stealing ball, then the game will die soon.
AustrLia have a big chance now. The All Blacks have no fly half. They will beat the winner of France v Wales if they get that far.
Cruden handled himself fine when he came on. Stephen Donald has been called up and is more than capable of playing out-half.
Donald isn't rated by the coaching team and he knows it - he had enough chances as DC's understudy.
Quote from: thewobbler on October 10, 2011, 01:00:56 PM
Australia can't win the RWC. They've no lineout, very little scrum, no kicking game. They don't even have that much class in their backs.
If rugby can be reduced to simply how good your openside is at stealing ball, then the game will die soon.
No class in the Aussie back line?????
James O'Connor, Kurtley Beale and Digby Ioane are world class. Will Genia is doing more than enough to function as a world class scrum half and leading into this tournament Quade Copper was in line to be best player in the world, granted his tournament performances have been shocking but to say there's no class there is way off the mark.
They've been let down badly by their pack, but if they beat the Kiwis they'll be favs for the final.
have you heard - Martin Johnson has resigned - rumour is he is starting a company running stag parties to New Zealand :D
Rhys Priestland doubtful for Wales...but at least they have Hook or Jones to step in.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/sport/2011/oct/11/rugby-world-cup-priestland-wales
Fcuk just thinking about it they have Jones or Hook to come back in. Serious quality!!!
The Welsh have their house well in order and they will be hard stopped even by the All Blacks!
Wales or France? Fancy the French to maybe go all the way but more in hope than logic. Australia have be really really decimated by injuries. Looks like my ould friend Adam-Ashley Cooper will have to play full-back as Beale cries off injured. Real pity too, Beale is the best fullback in world rugby. I doubt if they will beat the Ab's now. At the same time the key to beating the Ab's lies in closing out the inside centre. With Carter gone and SBW or Umaga out of it the AB attack will crumble.
The forwards as a unit are poor but a team would still have to overcome McCaw, Kaino and Read. That's were the ozzies will hit the rocks but the French could possibly outplay them. Dusaitor is a great leader and brilliant 6. Bonnaire is the weakest of the three. Harry is a better 8 in my eyes than Read, a unique athlete and good warrior.
Quote from: trileacman on October 14, 2011, 10:40:47 PM
Wales or France? Fancy the French to maybe go all the way but more in hope than logic. Australia have be really really decimated by injuries. Looks like my ould friend Adam-Ashley Cooper will have to play full-back as Beale cries off injured. Real pity too, Beale is the best fullback in world rugby. I doubt if they will beat the Ab's now. At the same time the key to beating the Ab's lies in closing out the inside centre. With Carter gone and SBW or Umaga out of it the AB attack will crumble.
The forwards as a unit are poor but a team would still have to overcome McCaw, Kaino and Read. That's were the ozzies will hit the rocks but the French could possibly outplay them. Dusaitor is a great leader and brilliant 6. Bonnaire is the weakest of the three. Harry is a better 8 in my eyes than Read, a unique athlete and good warrior.
when did he come back - dont you mean his twin Nonu ?
I think we shit the bet against a good Welsh side. The Welsh have a chance if everything goes their way and the French are off colour. That is the way it went against Ireland. I would like to see the Welsh win but will be a bit sickened as it should be Ireland.
France by 10 I think, still not convinced by Wales.
Hope the wheels stay on the Welsh bandwagon. 25,000 in the Millenium stadium.
On to the punditry. I think ITV and Rte have had a solid world cup. But setanta with Williams and Franno being world class are well ahead.
A good start from Wales but Adam Jones has gone off injured and hook misses a kickable penalty. 3-0 Wales.
Harsh. Yellow would have sufficed
Ref must have a tenner on France.
If they get through will be be back for the final?
Welsh scrum struggling since jones went off
It was illegal, he turned him in the air and dropped him on his head ffs. Wreckless irresponsibility and stupidity. The ref had no choice.
Ref went to Blackrock college. Payback for last week. I thought it was a yellow card perhaps but red. Nothing is going Wales way so far in this game.
Quote from: Dinny Breen on October 15, 2011, 09:27:14 AM
It was illegal, he turned him in the air and dropped him on his head ffs. Wreckless irresponsibility and stupidity. The ref had no choice.
Perhaps reckless, but he seemed to catch him flush in the tackle, don't think it was malicious though.. Typical France always seem to get the rub of the green!!
Quote from: king of leon on October 15, 2011, 09:31:15 AM
Quote from: Dinny Breen on October 15, 2011, 09:27:14 AM
It was illegal, he turned him in the air and dropped him on his head ffs. Wreckless irresponsibility and stupidity. The ref had no choice.
Perhaps reckless, but he seemed to catch him flush in the tackle, don't think it was malicious though.. Typical France always seem to get the rub of the green!!
Looked like clerc jumped into the tackle which didn't help warburton
a yellow would've been enough for me but he was stupid to give the referee a choice to make. this is the kind of tackle the irb are trying to get rid of so it doesn't surprise me that the referee took a hard line approach. there's no point in blaming the ref, players have to take responsibility for their own actions - a cool head will help win a match and warburton didn't show that
There were already citings and bans given for similar tackles. He lifted him, rotated him and then dropped him on his head right in front of the ref. By the letter of the law a red card period, there was no other option for Rolland he would have be crucified if didn't issue the red.
Warburton is an idiot.
Quote from: redhandloo on October 15, 2011, 09:33:20 AM
Quote from: king of leon on October 15, 2011, 09:31:15 AM
Quote from: Dinny Breen on October 15, 2011, 09:27:14 AM
It was illegal, he turned him in the air and dropped him on his head ffs. Wreckless irresponsibility and stupidity. The ref had no choice.
Perhaps reckless, but he seemed to catch him flush in the tackle, don't think it was malicious though.. Typical France always seem to get the rub of the green!!
Looked like clerc jumped into the tackle which didn't help warburton
Yeah it would have been different if he had dumped him, but he seemed to hold back when he realised the position of Clercs body.. Wales are battling gamely but you would expect France to find gaps as the game opens up.
Quote from: Dinny Breen on October 15, 2011, 09:27:14 AM
It was illegal, he turned him in the air and dropped him on his head ffs. Wreckless irresponsibility and stupidity. The ref had no choice.
I didn't think it was that much different to the Umaga?? "spear" tackle on O'Driscoll a few years ago that everyone was, rightly, up in arms about.
Welsh guy in commentary didn't even think it was a yellow card.
If it had been done to Brian O'Driscoll, would a red have been fair?
This has f**ked up the game but if Wales could do it, will Warburton get back?
Quote from: Minder on October 15, 2011, 09:40:02 AM
Quote from: Dinny Breen on October 15, 2011, 09:27:14 AM
It was illegal, he turned him in the air and dropped him on his head ffs. Wreckless irresponsibility and stupidity. The ref had no choice.
I didn't think it was that much different to the Umaga?? "spear" tackle on O'Driscoll a few years ago that everyone was, rightly, up in arms about.
Welsh guy in commentary didn't even think it was a yellow card.
Thats bullshit minder. There were 2 kiwis involved in the bod incident. they lifted him up and drove him into the ground like a golf tee. I would think it was premeditated and deliberate. Warburton didnt use any downward pressure, a bit reckless but I felt he held back at the end
Quote from: Denn Forever on October 15, 2011, 09:42:44 AM
If it had been done to Brian O'Driscoll, would a red have been fair?
This has f**ked up the game but if Wales could do it, will Warburton get back?
No a Tongan got a 5 week ban for a similar tackle expect the same ban.
I thought rugby fans didn't boo the kickers when kicking for goal?
Hooks goal kicking has been desperate.
Welsh commentator on Itv thinks that red was the greatest crime since the holocaust. Everyone on itv says its just a penalty.
I can go as far as to agree with a yellow card as long as a ref is consistent about those sort of things. But it was never a red and the only thing to say in Rollands favour is he only had one chance to see it at high speed.
Quote from: trileacman on October 15, 2011, 09:53:07 AM
Welsh commentator on Itv thinks that red was the greatest crime since the holocaust. Everyone on itv says its just a penalty.
Piienar was fierce annoyed alright.
How the hell is this being defended? It was a clear red - the ones on ITV going on about "letting him go"? He let him go after, as Dinny said, lifting him and turning so that the only place he could land was on his head
From BBC Sport
"Well, how much drama can you take? It was bad enough for Wales when world class prop Adam Jones went off injured so early in the game, but to have captain Warburton red carded was an absolute disaster. was it the right call? Here's what the IRB says: "Law 10 Foul Play: (j) Lifting a player from the ground and dropping or driving that player into the ground whilst that player's feet are still off the ground such that the player's head and/or upper body come into contact with the ground is dangerous play. Sanction: Penalty kick." There was a clarification in 2009. "The IRFU has requested a ruling with regard Law 10-Foul Play. Current Law prohibits the tackling of a player who is in the air, either in the line out or in open play. The Law is designed to protect players, and to prevent them landing on the ground, on their heads or upper body.
It appears a serious anomaly, therefore, that a player(s) can deliberately lift an opponent off his feet and then may drop (or 'spear') the opponent so that he lands head down or on his upper body.
1. 10 4(e) Foul Play -Dangerous tackling. Does the action of deliberately lifting an opponent off his feet in a tackle so that he may then be dropped (or 'speared') so that he lands on his head or upper body constitute tackling 'dangerously' as defined in this Law.
2. Law 10 -Foul Play. Does the action described in 1 by definition contrary to the letter and spirit of the laws and constitutes, per se, an act of foul play should it occur in general play; e.g. a player, on the fringes of ruck or maul, so lifted.
Ruling of the Designated Members of the Rugby Committee
1. The act of lifting an opponent off his feet in a tackle AND dropping or 'spearing' that player so that his head and/or upper body comes into contact with the ground first, is a dangerous tackle.
2. The dangerous play described in 1. above is considered dangerous play no matter where it occurs in the game."
"
"Horse manure" indeed George :D
Anyone watching on RTE or French TV!!! what was the reaction. ITV very partisan (understandably).
Quote from: Capt Pat on October 15, 2011, 09:59:13 AM
I can go as far as to agree with a yellow card as long as a ref is consistent about those sort of things. But it was never a red and the only thing to say in Rollands favour is he only had one chance to see it at high speed.
Can the not take them decisions to the 4th official?
QuoteThe IRB Council has reinforced its zero-tolerance stance towards all dangerous tackles by approving an amendment to the Law relating to the spear tackle.
An amendment to Law 10.4 (j) has been approved to recognise the defensive actions of the tackled player when the arms are outstretched to break a fall and to further ensure the consistency of application of the appropriate sanction for offending players.
The amended Law 10.4 (j) will now read:
Lifting a player from the ground and dropping or driving that player into the ground whilst that player's feet are still off the ground such that the player's head and/or upper body come into contact with the ground is dangerous play.
There is no arguement, it's not about opinion or entertainment. The ref had no choice, he can't think about the fans only the letter of the law, a brave decision but the right one.
Quote from: mayogodhelpus@gmail.com on October 15, 2011, 10:03:09 AM
Anyone watching on RTE or French TV!!! what was the reaction. ITV very partisan (understandably).
Frankie Sheehan thought it was harsh....hence the "horse manure" comment from George!
Quote from: mayogodhelpus@gmail.com on October 15, 2011, 10:03:09 AM
Anyone watching on RTE or French TV!!! what was the reaction. ITV very partisan (understandably).
Watching Setanta - Williams and Francis thought that it was harsh, only a yellow.
To be fair to the ref it is a dangerous tackle and if he hurts his neck in that fall then it could end his career. Look at Tom Evans. It is right that this behaivour is stamped out.
Tis a bad owl game anyway - Wales will need a miracle to win this. I think France will push on from here and make their advantage count.
How important will the loss of the Welsh prop in the first 10 minutes? Come on Wales.
Wales now without Priestland, Jones and Warburton and France cant put them away.
Warburton sending off was correct imo.
Sweeeeet.
Wales fitness levels could be key, great try by Philips...
Wales have been really good in this game. The performance against Ireland was no fluke. They even look like they might win without their best player and down to 14 men.
the way hook and jones have played priestland missing looks crucial.
Wales didn't go for a possible match winning drop goal. A very poor decision imo.
Edge of seat stuff
Gutted for Wales...
O well, I suppose I'll be supporting the Blues in the Final. Well I better get ready for work.
Feel sorry for Wales. 1 men in rugby is a killer.
Stephen Jones looks the spitting image of Gabriel Byrne.
Gutted for Ireland ...
How did Wales lose that game??? They deserved the win.
f**k sake why didn't they have a dig at the drop goal at the end?
Commentators still giving off, the guy was sent off and rightly so, had that been a Welsh, English or Scottish player been on the end of that tackle then they would have been calling red
Regardless of whether the Warburton decision was or wasn't correct, Wales had the opportunities to win that match and couldn't do it. Hook as flaky as ever.
Jones copped out in a big way. Wales nearly won it without an out half for the whole match and with 14 men for most of it.
Milltown, it wasn't a red card. Calling it as a clear red card is just being awkward and controversial for the sake of it.
We shit the nest v Wales.
Wales never had the belief to beat France.
France will never have belief to win the final
ITV or rather the anchor called the sending off for an "exuberant" tackle.
Tough on Wales, in general they played very well but kicking let them down a bit. France never looked like scoring a try and you would think the Aussies and Kiwis will feel they have the beating of them.
On the sending off, it was a tough call to make and sort of in between a red and a yellow, but refs have been told to come down heavily on this type of tackle. Warburton made no attempt to put Clerc back on the ground. Pienaar was giving the impression that because he let him go that that was OK! It was two metres from the ref and he had a really good view so I would lean slightly to the red. I've no doubt the IRB view will be that Rolland got it spot on.
Quote from: Gold on October 15, 2011, 10:53:09 AM
We shit the nest v Wales.
Wales never had the belief to beat France.
France will never have belief to win the final
Eh?? What a load of nonsense!
ITV taking a very measured approach as usual - Wales were "cheated".
The more times I see the tackle the worse it gets.
Quote from: Take Your Points on October 15, 2011, 10:14:47 AM
Your son or team mate?
(http://i52.tinypic.com/2u97gop.jpg)
The worst part of it was the impact shuddering it up through his skill and thorax in slow motion.
Quote from: Hardy on October 15, 2011, 10:58:03 AM
ITV taking a very measured approach as usual - Wales were "cheated".
Soccer-esque moaning going on. Slabbering c***ts.
George Hook on the RTE is a complete and utter knob
Quote from: thewobbler on October 15, 2011, 10:52:33 AM
Milltown, it wasn't a red card. Calling it as a clear red card is just being awkward and controversial for the sake of it.
I'll be in the awkward and controversial camp as well, then. Clear red
Everything looks worse in slow motion.
I never even called it as a foul when watching it unfold. A yellow would have surprised me at that stage.
There was not a drop goal opportunity right at the end. There was an opportunity 5 minutes earlier and it wasn't taken either.
What a gift France will be for whoever makes the final.
Don't think it deserved a red. The guy was not intentionally driving that man into the ground. Yellow deserved at worst.
Wales had enough chances to win the game and more reason why the try should be worth more than 5 points as it is much harder to score a try than kick a ball over the posts.
The kick which dropped inches short was sickening for them.
Quote from: Capt Pat on October 15, 2011, 11:05:19 AM
There was not a drop goal opportunity right at the end. There was an opportunity 5 minutes earlier and it wasn't taken either.
Correct - that's what I meant.
On the tackle - even after two hours of slow motion (a very unfair judge is the slow motion camera) rugby experts can't agree on whether it's a red a yellow or nothing. Yet millions feel free to vilify the ref for getting it wrong (in their opinion) in a split second. Which raises the question - should it be a split-second decision? Is the ref not allowed to consult the TMO for a sending-off decision?
Quote from: thewobbler on October 15, 2011, 11:02:13 AM
Everything looks worse in slow motion.
I never even called it as a foul when watching it unfold. A yellow would have surprised me at that stage.
It obviously looked bad at full speed to Rolland. A slow motion made it look not too bad.
Quote from: Craigyhill Terror on October 15, 2011, 11:01:46 AM
Quote from: thewobbler on October 15, 2011, 10:52:33 AM
Milltown, it wasn't a red card. Calling it as a clear red card is just being awkward and controversial for the sake of it.
I'll be in the awkward and controversial camp as well, then. Clear red
Me too. If that was in a Division 2 AIL game few would dispute the red card. The logic of those defending Warburton seems to be that because it was a major disadvantage to Wales (and it was, they were out on their feet when trying to get across the French 10 metre line at the end) in a World Cup semi-final, the ref should have copped out and given a yellow. It reminded me of when Terje Hauge red-carded Jens Lehmann in the 2006 European Cup final. Nobody thought it was the wrong decision yet he got pilloried for 'ruining the game as a contest', as if it was his fault that Lehmann took Eto'o out. Fair play to Alain Rolland for having the courage to make the big call
Quote from: thewobbler on October 15, 2011, 11:02:13 AM
Everything looks worse in slow motion.
I never even called it as a foul when watching it unfold. A yellow would have surprised me at that stage.
Quote from: trileacman on October 15, 2011, 10:58:50 AM
Quote from: Take Your Points on October 15, 2011, 10:14:47 AM
Your son or team mate?
(http://i52.tinypic.com/2u97gop.jpg)
The worst part of it was the impact shuddering it up through his skill and thorax in slow motion.
So slow motion makes the tackle less of a red and more of a yellow? Again had that been BOD on the end of that.....
You can unintentionally foul someone and still get sent off
Milltown, it takes a lot to get sent off in rugby. Someone's argument above about AIL2 is nonsense - there's about 5 sendings off a season in that division, and the tackling is nowhere near as disciplined as intl level.
Forget the magnitude of the game and the importance of the player. This should never come into it and wouldn't enter my thinking.
If that's a red card offence, then rugby is about to change beyond recognition, as there'll be red cards in every game.
Quote from: Dinny Breen on October 15, 2011, 09:27:14 AM
It was illegal, he turned him in the air and dropped him on his head ffs. Wreckless irresponsibility and stupidity. The ref had no choice.
I'm not going to read all the comments about this because the second one in is the one I agree with, and I have to get ready for a championship match :D
I thought Brent Pope and Frankie Sheehan (especially Brent) were missing the point about Paddy O'Brien's memo where he instructed referees to issue red cards for that. Brent is talking about red cards for cutting someone in the lineout, or taking out a fullback under a dropping ball. Both of those would be at least yellow cards anyway, but the difference about the tackle is that the tackler LIFTS as well as drops. The entire situation is controlled by the tackler. In those other situations at least the jumper knows he is going into the air and is not completely off guard.
Quote from: thewobbler on October 15, 2011, 11:16:44 AM
If that's a red card offence, then rugby is about to change beyond recognition, as there'll be red cards in every game.
Really? You think there are tackles that dangerous in every rugby match?
They have been trying to get rid of this tackle for a few years now, the players talking afterwards have been really straight about it. They have just lost and they have said that's it, the referee give it and are dealing with it a lot better than some here. Great to see the respect for the referee whether they believe it was right or not.
I don't think that's a common tackle in rugby, and if it is it deserves a red. I've been to a lot of rugby matches in the past 10 years and there are a lot of tackles where the players is lifted up by the tackler, but in the vast, vast majority of cases the tackler controls the person he is tackling as they go to ground.
The same way the vast majority of hurlers excercise a duty of care towards opponents in a game (carrying a potentially lethal weapon), most rugby players exercise a duty of care towards a defenceless opponent in those circumstances. Wharburton did not.
Deiseach, I think there is dangerous play in every rugby match, and a large part of it is spur of the moment stuff rather than premeditated. If dangerous play = always a red card, then rugby will lose its soul.
I'd argue that a full back has no choice but to attack a hanging ball, thereby leaving himself open to dangerous play. The minute he declines this opportunity, will be the last time he plays full back. It's not really a 'choice' to leave the ground.
Quote from: thewobbler on October 15, 2011, 11:26:09 AM
Deiseach, I think there is dangerous play in every rugby match, and a large part of it is spur of the moment stuff rather than premeditated. If dangerous play = always a red card, then rugby will lose its soul.
I'd argue that a full back has no choice but to attack a hanging ball, thereby leaving himself open to dangerous play. The minute he declines this opportunity, will be the last time he plays full back. It's not really a 'choice' to leave the ground.
Wobbler read the relevent rule because Rolland was right. You're digging a hole for yourself here. the letter of the law does not allow intent. So Rolland was correct. Stop listening to ITV.
Quote from: thewobbler on October 15, 2011, 11:26:09 AM
Deiseach, I think there is dangerous play in every rugby match, and a large part of it is spur of the moment stuff rather than premeditated. If dangerous play = always a red card, then rugby will lose its soul.
I'd argue that a full back has no choice but to attack a hanging ball, thereby leaving himself open to dangerous play. The minute he declines this opportunity, will be the last time he plays full back. It's not really a 'choice' to leave the ground.
Dangerous play is not always a red card. However, in this particular circumstance, because the tackler is completely in control, they have deemed a red card/.
Well RTE pulled up the laws for us, and the tackle is no doubt dangerous play.
There isn't though a directive that this constitutes a red card, only that it's dangerous play.
For example, If Warburton had have picked him up and dropped him from 6 feet, it'd be a red card, with no complaints. If he executed such a tackle with one foot of a drop, it wouldn't probably even be called as a foul, but would have made a 'best bits' reel.
Which is why a ref has to be the final judge, not the laws. And in my considered opinion, Rolland fucked this one up completely.
Wales missed a conversion which would have won the game
Halfpenny missed a difficult kick which would have won the game
Hook missed 2 kickable ones in the 1st half which would have won the game
Jones bottled out of a drop kick which would have won the game
They can blame the ref all they want.
http://www.irb.com/newsmedia/mediazone/pressrelease/newsid=2040903.html
QuoteCouncil Amends Spear Tackle Law
The IRB Council has reinforced its zero-tolerance stance towards all dangerous tackles by approving an amendment to the Law relating to the spear tackle.
An amendment to Law 10.4(j) has been approved to recognise the defensive actions of the tackled player when the arms are outstretched to break a fall and to further ensure the consistency of application of the appropriate sanction for offending players.
The amended Law 10.4(j) will now read: Lifting a player from the ground and dropping or driving that player into the ground whilst that player's feet are still off the ground such that the player's head and/or upper body come into contact with the ground is dangerous play.
The amended Law will operate globally from December 1, 2010.
Warburton's tackle is exactly what has been highlighted to constitute a 'spear tackle' the spear tackle warrants an automatic red. There is no gray area in this case.
The incident is unfortunate and was the reason Wales got beat. I actually believe they would have won comfortably had Warburton been on the pitch. However the ref cannot be blamed for making the correct call and the blame in this case lies solely at Warburtons door!
Hard luck Wales it was a valiant effort but it wasn't meant to be.
Quote from: thewobbler on October 15, 2011, 11:38:47 AM
Well RTE pulled up the laws for us, and the tackle is no doubt dangerous play.
There isn't though a directive that this constitutes a red card, only that it's dangerous play.
For example, If Warburton had have picked him up and dropped him from 6 feet, it'd be a red card, with no complaints. If he executed such a tackle with one foot of a drop, it wouldn't probably even be called as a foul, but would have made a 'best bits' reel.
Which is why a ref has to be the final judge, not the laws. And in my considered opinion, Rolland fucked this one up completely.
You're totally incorrect wobbler. His head clearly hits the ground. Read the rule. The rule was amended in december. I'm not saying it was right to amend the rule but Rolland applied the rules correctly.
If you dont have laws in physical contact games you have anarchy
Brent and Wobblers point about full backs and lineout jumpers is completely different. In that the player or his team-mates puts him in the air with the obvious intention of returning safely to the ground.
If you lift a player in the air you have responsibility to see him safely to the ground. Its as simple as this. If you lift a player and then turn him its a red card. Just don't turn the f**king player and you won't be red-carded. Its perfectly legal to lift a player and drive him backwards, or lift him with the intention of turning him to your defence.
A FB that attacks a hanging ball is challenged by a player watching a ball, the defender is usually given the benefit of the doubt and if he up ends him its not deemed malicious but warrants a penalty. In a spear tackle, you lift the guy and turn him, you can't do that by mistake or accident.
Just found this also:
http://www.deepsouthrugbyunion.com/images/IRB_Memorandum_re_Dangerous_Tackles.pdf
QuoteThe lifted player is dropped to the ground from a height with no regard to the
player's safety. A red card should be issued for this type of tackle.
It is definitely a red card!
Quote from: thewobbler on October 15, 2011, 11:38:47 AM
Well RTE pulled up the laws for us, and the tackle is no doubt dangerous play.
There isn't though a directive that this constitutes a red card, only that it's dangerous play.
For example, If Warburton had have picked him up and dropped him from 6 feet, it'd be a red card, with no complaints. If he executed such a tackle with one foot of a drop, it wouldn't probably even be called as a foul, but would have made a 'best bits' reel.
Which is why a ref has to be the final judge, not the laws. And in my considered opinion, Rolland fucked this one up completely.
Not exactly wobbler. Tom then read out the directive from early this year where 'such a tackle will be a red card'.
If he wasn't an Irish ref (or if Ireland were there instead of Wales) this discussion wouldn't be happening, he made an absolute bollix of it - or maybe he's achieved what he craved as his decision will be the only thing remembered from the game (Paudie Hughes eat your heart out) . It was very interesting to hear the different attitudes on ITV & RTE, hardly suprising to hear Hook take a contrary position. As soon as it happened my immediate reaction was that he might get a yellow.
Hard luck to Wales, a mamouth effort that deserved more than they received, another performance like that and France will be cannon fodder for the winners of tomorrow's game.
Quote from: bennydorano on October 15, 2011, 01:12:16 PM
If he wasn't an Irish ref (or if Ireland were there instead of Wales) this discussion wouldn't be happening, he made an absolute bollix of it - or maybe he's achieved what he craved as his decision will be the only thing remembered from the game (Paudie Hughes eat your heart out) . It was very interesting to hear the different attitudes on ITV & RTE, hardly suprising to hear Hook take a contrary position. As soon as it happened my immediate reaction was that he might get a yellow.
We're all defensive of an Irish referee? Unlikely that people would feel tribal over a referee. I didn't see the English getting defensive when Howard Webb allowed the Dutch to boot anything in a Spanish shirt for 100+ minutes in the 2010 soccer World Cup final. As for people wouldn't feel the same way had it been Ireland who lost their captain that way, you're right, but that just tells us that you can't rely on sports fans to be objective. Ironically the one group of people you can rely on to be embarrassed when their team benefits from a brutal refereeing decision (not that I think this was but we're talking here) would be the French. The general mood in France after the Thierry Henry incident was one of mortification that that was the manner in which they qualified. The treatment of Marc Lievremont by the French press will be like they'd lost
Quote from: bennydorano on October 15, 2011, 01:12:16 PM
If he wasn't an Irish ref (or if Ireland were there instead of Wales) this discussion wouldn't be happening, he made an absolute bollix of it - or maybe he's achieved what he craved as his decision will be the only thing remembered from the game (Paudie Hughes eat your heart out) . It was very interesting to hear the different attitudes on ITV & RTE, hardly suprising to hear Hook take a contrary position. As soon as it happened my immediate reaction was that he might get a yellow.
Hard luck to Wales, a mamouth effort that deserved more than they received, another performance like that and France will be cannon fodder for the winners of tomorrow's game.
This is from the BBC website:
1102: Ed Morrison, head of elite referee development at the Rugby Football Union, confirmed on Radio 5 live that referee Alain Rolland was "100% right" to send off Warburton, adding that dropping a player from shoulder level is automatic red card.It's been clearly outlined here - with plenty of references to the relevant law - why the referee made the correct decision. He applied the rules, simple as that. This isn't a philosophical debate about what people think should have happened or the bullshit on ITV about "ruining the game" or "fairness" - it's a simple matter of fact.
Pienaar, Dallaglio, Ryder and anyone who thinks it wasn't a red card don't know the rules.
If referees applied the letter if the law in any contact sport, the game would be ruined. Every collision in rugby would result in a penalty one way or the other.
In soccer, every tackle would be a free kick.
In football, every 5th step would be a free kick, and every off the ball nudge would be a booking.
Don't preach the exactness of rules unless you're going to be consistent in that stance on every occasion going forward.
Referees need more sense than Rolland showed today. Nobody was hurt and nobody was in danger of getting hurt.
I've changed my mind. I reckon the turning of the French player in mid air meant it was weeckleesly dangerous by the Welsh captain and the referee made the right decision
It also needs to be noted that the instant reaction of the crowd was a universal 'oooohhh'. They knew in real time that something bad had happened.
Edit: it also needs noting that Hook thought it was the right decision, therefore it must have been the wrong one. D'oh!
Quote from: thewobbler on October 15, 2011, 01:31:10 PM
If referees applied the letter if the law in any contact sport, the game would be ruined. Every collision in rugby would result in a penalty one way or the other.
In soccer, every tackle would be a free kick.
In football, every 5th step would be a free kick, and every off the ball nudge would be a booking.
Don't preach the exactness of rules unless you're going to be consistent in that stance on every occasion going forward.
Referees need more sense than Rolland showed today. Nobody was hurt and nobody was in danger of getting hurt.
Of course the rules should be applied consistently, and maybe every fifth step in football should be a free - we wouldn't be at the point now where players get away with far too many far too regularly.
Nobody was hurt, but that was only through luck. As for nobody being in danger of being hurt - nonsense. When Warburton lifted, turned and then dropped Clerc he was clearly creating a situation in which Clerc was in real danger of being hurt - and being hurt very badly.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cps2a0i1Klw (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cps2a0i1Klw)
Didn't see the game but saw the tackle on the link above.
Whatever about the ref the Welsh should be very disappointed with their Captain. The letter of the law says red and while I would agree that the ref could have shown leniency, Warbarton was an absolute idiot for making him decide.
Quote from: muppet on October 15, 2011, 02:41:15 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cps2a0i1Klw (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cps2a0i1Klw)
Didn't see the game but saw the tackle on the link above.
Whatever about the ref the Welsh should be very disappointed with their Captain. The letter of the law says red and while I would agree that the ref could have shown leniency, Warbarton was an absolute idiot for making him decide.
I've seen Mick Lyons do worse!! ;)
He appeared to just let him go mid way during the tackle. Could have broken the fellas neck, dangerous play, red card. Amazed there is any debate
Quote from: thewobbler on October 15, 2011, 01:31:10 PM
If referees applied the letter if the law in any contact sport, the game would be ruined. Every collision in rugby would result in a penalty one way or the other.
In soccer, every tackle would be a free kick.
In football, every 5th step would be a free kick, and every off the ball nudge would be a booking.
Don't preach the exactness of rules unless you're going to be consistent in that stance on every occasion going forward.
Referees need more sense than Rolland showed today. Nobody was hurt and nobody was in danger of getting hurt.
Nonsense of the highest order. An extra step at GAA is now the equivalent of a potential broken neck from a spear tackle.
I can understand why people wanted to see a yellow card and I don't think much would have been said in the media if it was a yellow but Warburton would have been cited and banned post game . In that case he comes back on after 10 mins and leads Wales to victory yet it would be Wales opponents in the final who would have got the advantage not France who were sinned against. It was the right decision from Rolland.
QuoteIn this context I must have regard to IRB Memorandum, subject Dangerous Tackles which was issued to Referees, Citing Commissioners, Judicial Officers and Non-Legal Judicial Committee Members on 8 June 2009 and circulated to Member Unions on 10 June 2009 (the "June 2009 Memorandum'). It supplements IRB Law Ruling No5 of 2005 and was issued by Paddy O'Brien, IRB Referee Manager and Tim Gresson, IRB Judicial Panel Chairman. It summaries three "possible
scenarios when a tackler horizontally lifts a player off the ground". The three scenarios, in descending order of gravity are:
a. "The player is lifted and then forced or 'speared" into the ground. A red card should be issued for this type of tackle"
b. The lifted player is dropped to the ground from a height with no regard to the player's safety. A red card should be issued for this type of tackle.
c. For all other types of dangerous lifting tackle it may be considered a penalty or yellow card is sufficient."
Jaysus that was some tight finish to the game but Stephen Jones reminded me of Brock James for Clemont against Leinster in the HE Quarter final in the RDS from a couple of years ago... Completely bottled it and didn't want to take the kick on at all...
Would lose no tears for Wales today! They beat use fair and square last weekend. But their Cheating try in the six nations cost us a triple crown!
The tackle was a spear tackle, would it have been fair on France if he had not been sent off, just for the sake of not 'ruining' the game?
just watched sky news and their correspondent thought it 'bizarre 'that Irish world cup rugby referee Alain Rolland had a French father-what??
The reaction of the crowd and the French players tells a tale. As someone said the whole crowd went "oh" in unison and the french team went mad.
All the same Rolland had some set of balls to show the red. He could have taken the easier option and give him 10 in the bin.
Quote from: screenexile on October 15, 2011, 11:42:08 AM
http://www.irb.com/newsmedia/mediazone/pressrelease/newsid=2040903.html
QuoteCouncil Amends Spear Tackle Law
The IRB Council has reinforced its zero-tolerance stance towards all dangerous tackles by approving an amendment to the Law relating to the spear tackle.
An amendment to Law 10.4(j) has been approved to recognise the defensive actions of the tackled player when the arms are outstretched to break a fall and to further ensure the consistency of application of the appropriate sanction for offending players.
The amended Law 10.4(j) will now read: Lifting a player from the ground and dropping or driving that player into the ground whilst that player's feet are still off the ground such that the player's head and/or upper body come into contact with the ground is dangerous play.
The amended Law will operate globally from December 1, 2010.
Warburton's tackle is exactly what has been highlighted to constitute a 'spear tackle' the spear tackle warrants an automatic red. There is no gray area in this case.
The incident is unfortunate and was the reason Wales got beat. I actually believe they would have won comfortably had Warburton been on the pitch. However the ref cannot be blamed for making the correct call and the blame in this case lies solely at Warburtons door!
Hard luck Wales it was a valiant effort but it wasn't meant to be.
+1.
The tail end of the memorandum also states that the ref should take into account the intention of the offending players and must follow the letter of the law. The ref did his job despite claims to the contrary.
Quote from: Dinny Breen on October 15, 2011, 10:04:03 AM
QuoteThe IRB Council has reinforced its zero-tolerance stance towards all dangerous tackles by approving an amendment to the Law relating to the spear tackle.
An amendment to Law 10.4 (j) has been approved to recognise the defensive actions of the tackled player when the arms are outstretched to break a fall and to further ensure the consistency of application of the appropriate sanction for offending players.
The amended Law 10.4 (j) will now read:
Lifting a player from the ground and dropping or driving that player into the ground whilst that player's feet are still off the ground such that the player's head and/or upper body come into contact with the ground is dangerous play.
There is no arguement, it's not about opinion or entertainment. The ref had no choice, he can't think about the fans only the letter of the law, a brave decision but the right one.
how often do you see fellas in international rugby (or even club rugby) sent off for this. This is the first time I have seen it (only times were obviously malicious ones).
Sure there have been several of these in this world cup alone that have resulted on some yellow cards, some just penalties and some ignored completely.
If it is a rule (which is it) then lets have it enforced all the time- I dont know if rolland always enforces it either.
think this was a huge mistake. ITV pundits going mad at half time and rightly so.
Wales threw it away. Losing their places and lack of game time has knocked Hook and Jones confidence and match fitness.
both used to be supremely accurate.
Will the Aussies give the All Blacks a decent game in the morning? Thinking of backing them with the handicap of 7.5...
Quote from: sammymaguire on October 15, 2011, 11:29:22 PM
Will the Aussies give the All Blacks a decent game in the morning? Thinking of backing them with the handicap of 7.5...
SF of a World Cup - it's 50/50. Worth a punt no doubt. Look at today. Down to 14 or not, a few nailed kicks and Wales would have won comfortably
This thread has become beyond uppity. I'll repeat again that if the letter of the law was applied, every contact sport in the world would descend into farce.
I'll keep a wee note of the holier than thous on this thread and see if their opinion matches up when a GAA player from their county gets a red card.
I know from my own stance I'm consistent in sport. I'll forgive exuberance in a tackle but I won't forgive off the ball slaps, and I won't forgive premeditated attacks. Warburton's challenge was dangerous, but it was a man doing his job, and it sits easy with me.
As for the 'oohs in the crowd', do me a favour. Every crunching tackle in every sport is met with oohs.
Even if Warburton had have held him all the way through, it would still have got those oohs. He wiped a man out at full tilt ffs.
Quote from: thewobbler on October 15, 2011, 11:40:51 PM
This thread has become beyond uppity. I'll repeat again that if the letter of the law was applied, every contact sport in the world would descend into farce.
I'll keep a wee note of the holier than thous on this thread and see if their opinion matches up when a GAA player from their county gets a red card.
I know from my own stance I'm consistent in sport. I'll forgive exuberance in a tackle but I won't forgive off the ball slaps, and I won't forgive premeditated attacks. Warburton's challenge was dangerous, but it was a man doing his job, and it sits easy with me.
As for the 'oohs in the crowd', do me a favour. Every crunching tackle in every sport is met with oohs.
Even if Warburton had have held him all the way through, it would still have got those oohs. He wiped a man out at full tilt ffs.
will accept this rule when refs apply it accross the board.
It hasnt been applied during this world cup let alone since Christmas (or before).
I'll give out about refereeing inconsistency in Gaelic games, soccer and rugby where I see it.
Lack of consistency in application of the rule is the problem of other refs and not Rolland who was doing his job
Quote from: Tony Baloney on October 15, 2011, 11:51:01 PM
Lack of consistency in application of the rule is the problem of other refs and not Rolland who was doing his job
possibly,
but that would depend on if he has encountered this kind of tackle/fould since Christmas (at lest) and what his decision was regarding it.
If Beale was fit I would back the Aussies for a win.........on here not with money in the bookies. The Aussies could have signifigant advantage at 9&10. Up front and out wide I think the All Blacks might have the edge in both areas. If Beale was fit The Aussies would be the equal of the All Blacks in the outside backs as well.
Tomorrow I think the Aussies will be looking to catch a few breaks like the French caught today to get the win. All Blacks to win by 6.
Quote from: Hoof Hearted on October 15, 2011, 11:35:36 PM
Quote from: sammymaguire on October 15, 2011, 11:29:22 PM
Will the Aussies give the All Blacks a decent game in the morning? Thinking of backing them with the handicap of 7.5...
SF of a World Cup - it's 50/50. Worth a punt no doubt. Look at today. Down to 14 or not, a few nailed kicks and Wales would have won comfortably
Quote from: lynchbhoy on October 15, 2011, 11:59:59 PM
Quote from: Tony Baloney on October 15, 2011, 11:51:01 PM
Lack of consistency in application of the rule is the problem of other refs and not Rolland who was doing his job
possibly,
but that would depend on if he has encountered this kind of tackle/fould since Christmas (at lest) and what his decision was regarding it.
He gave a red card to Fritz from Toulouse for a tackle not as bad in a HEC cup game against Wasps in Jan this year.
Retrospective bans have been issued for bad tackles in this World Cup that is where the IRB are consistent, Fabrice Estebanez the french center got a 3 week ban.
Rolland was correct, you can have your own opinion but bottom line Warburton was an idiot and cost his team a probable place in the final. Every player from mini to international knows they have a duty of care to their opponent in the tackle what Warburton did in the framework of the law was wrong and I have seen red cards at every level issued out for reckless and dangerous tackles.
Fair enough Dinny on Rolland if he is giving them out consistently ( though do you mean that the hec game you indicate was officiated by Rolland or someone else - I'm unsure here) then that's fine.
You mention earlier that you were watching the game. Via setanta channel. Utv showed a montage of at least four examples from this world cup that had yellow or no cards at all as their resulting decision. Inconsistent - so if there is inconsistency then players like warburton would not be as quick to avoid this. I would like to see it again, but thought momentum from the French player contributed to the elevation as opposed to a straight lift !
It was Rolland who issued the red to Fritz for a bad tackle.
This is professional sport, Gatland and Edwards know that the laws provide a framework and are not as black and white as some posters seem to think they are, they would have had complete dossier on what specific referee's do and don't allow. They would have spoken about the ref a lot to their players and I bet your bottom dollar that they mentioned Rolland is not afraid to send off players for bad tackles unlike some referees who leave it the citing commissioner. If look at the Welsh squad's reaction and Warburton's, they know.
Why do you think the French reaction was so bad, they know what Rolland is like, they would have done their homework and are reffed by Rolland a lot, there was anger but definitely some gamesmanship in there as well.
Bottom line, you have the romantics who blame inconsistency and wanted to see Wales do well and enjoy their game versus the pragmatics who know that it was red card offence even if they knew it was going to ruin the game because a players welfare is far more important than the spectators enjoyment.
Quote from: Take Your Points on October 16, 2011, 12:31:49 AM
Quote from: Dinny Breen on October 16, 2011, 12:20:23 AM
you can have your own opinion but bottom line Warburton was an idiot and cost his team a probable place in the final.
At last, nail, hammer, head.
The emperor has no clothes!
Looking at him on the sideline he knew what he had done and the cost to his team. Only afterwards did Gatland give him the way out to save Hooke and Jones from the spotlight on examining the reasons for losing the game.
The only real excuse for the loss was the injury to Adam Jones at the beginning of the game.
Priestland ?
The aussies are calling this the real final! Arrogant fcukwits. Well, the final will be between my second and third fav. nations (France and NZ).
Hark, is that the gnashing and grinding of teeth amid wails of agony from the neighbours I hear?
Aussies are more hateful than Le Ros Beefs, hope the Kiwis do a real job on them.
Quote from: bennydorano on October 16, 2011, 08:43:29 AM
Aussies are more hateful than Le Ros Beefs, hope the Kiwis do a real job on them.
Would like to see both lose, hope the mad French win it out.
Same here, but I think the Aussies are good value at 5/2.
I see Weepu, Cruden, Nonu, Smith and Jane are the Hurricanes backline. That could help the inexperienced outhalf Cruden.
Good quote from Setanta commentator Conor Morris 'They say when it comes to the semi-final stage of a major competition no one remembers the losers but in New Zealand's case nothing could be further from the truth, if Graham Henry's side lose they will never ever be allowed to forget it'
:D
Quote from: bcarrier on October 16, 2011, 08:31:52 AM
Quote from: Take Your Points on October 16, 2011, 12:31:49 AM
Quote from: Dinny Breen on October 16, 2011, 12:20:23 AM
you can have your own opinion but bottom line Warburton was an idiot and cost his team a probable place in the final.
[/qu
At last, nail, hammer, head.
The emperor has no clothes!
Looking at him on the sideline he knew what he had done and the cost to his team. Only afterwards did Gatland give him the way out to save Hooke and Jones from the spotlight on examining the reasons for losing the game.
The only real excuse for the loss was the injury to Adam Jones at the beginning of the game.
Priestland ?
People in the aftermath have jumped the gun a bit assuming Wales would have won if Warburton had stayed on or Preistland had started or Jones not been injured. It would have been a whole new ball game and if Wales still had a nervous attitude to goal kicking or the French had decided to run the ball who knows what might have happened.
Australia looking ragged as All Blacks turning it on
Australia held on in the opening 15 minutes 8-3. That could be crucial in tge end, not being further behind
Weepu not kicking like last week, missed 3 out of 4 already
The All Blacks have lost the momentum they had in the first 15 minutes and have an advantage of 8 points???
A lift tackle by Jane on cooper just before the end of the 23rd minute. Not as big as war urtons yesterday but still could have caused damage.
They play continued......
Aussies still well in this - and have played very little to none
A fantastic battle shaping up.
That is a bit of a bit of a joke penalty like Dalllaglio said.
Don't be listening to those pooches on ITV. Setanta.
Banner in the crowd: Woodcock v. Pocock - ours is bigger than yours.
Quote from: Capt Pat on October 16, 2011, 09:43:12 AM
That is a bit of a bit of a joke penalty like Dalllaglio said.
aye, there wasnt a whole lot he could do
Quote from: Hardy on October 16, 2011, 09:48:40 AM
Don't be listening to those pooches on ITV. Setanta.
Banner in the crowd: Woodcock v. Pocock - ours is bigger than yours.
remember one in Lansdowne years ago - "Our Willie is bigger than your condom" - Referring to Willie Anderson and the french second row Jean Condom
see the french coach had a right go at some of his players after they went out celebrating when told not to!
Quote from: bridgegael on October 16, 2011, 09:54:51 AM
see the french coach had a right go at some of his players after they went out celebrating when told not to!
They are not going to win again are they? They may as well enjoy it.
How are the All Blacks not home and hosed. Dominating but could do with a score to kill it.
Awesome All Black forward display. Israel Dagg is some player too.
I thought Dagg was man of the match. They gave it to Jane who was lively but did nothing of any note. Daggs kicking was superb in the second half and it shut the Aussies out, his attacking skills showed up well and he made the only try of the game.
Any early odds on the final? What price the upset?
Quote from: AZOffaly on October 16, 2011, 01:14:56 PM
Any early odds on the final? What price the upset?
AZ,I'd say the only upset will be in the French forwards stomachs,thinking about facing the All Blacks pack!
Quote from: sans pessimism on October 16, 2011, 01:20:12 PM
Quote from: AZOffaly on October 16, 2011, 01:14:56 PM
Any early odds on the final? What price the upset?
AZ,I'd say the only upset will be in the French forwards stomachs,thinking about facing the All Blacks pack!
didnt upset them too much 4 years ago in Cardiff
Quote from: AZOffaly on October 16, 2011, 01:14:56 PM
Any early odds on the final? What price the upset?
New Zealand are generally 1/10 or 1/12 to lift the Webb Ellis. Only boylesports and skybet are risking 1/8. I suspect there may be a little value in the French at 6/1.
Quote from: Hoof Hearted on October 16, 2011, 01:22:12 PM
Quote from: sans pessimism on October 16, 2011, 01:20:12 PM
Quote from: AZOffaly on October 16, 2011, 01:14:56 PM
Any early odds on the final? What price the upset?
AZ,I'd say the only upset will be in the French forwards stomachs,thinking about facing the All Blacks pack!
didnt upset them too much 4 years ago in Cardiff
English ref stole it for the French that day if I remember correctly.
Quote from: Capt Pat on October 16, 2011, 01:13:55 PM
I thought Dagg was man of the match. They gave it to Jane who was lively but did nothing of any note. Daggs kicking was superb in the second half and it shut the Aussies out, his attacking skills showed up well and he made the only try of the game.
Dagg prob deserved motm but couldnt argue with Jane getting it.Sum player,and thwarted Aussies tactic of aerial bombardment.Never dropped a ball and always makes ground by beating first man.Some good hits too.Pre-requisites of an All-Black seem to be a great defensive game,hard as nails, and you must give everything.They wouldnt pick O'Gara, or the likes of Quade Cooper for example,hence why Sonny Bill cant keep a place.
France have a great record versus New Zealand, certainly for a northern hemisphere team. If New Zealand reproduce the form of today, then they'll win it handy, but all the pressure will be on the Blacks, and the French won't mind playing them. NZ will be rightfully favourites, but I suspect the odds might be generous, and I've seen and played too much sport in my lifetime to ignore the mental aspect of the situation. If France play with a 'joie de vivre' and NZ are tight, don't be a bit surprised if it;s la Marseillaise that's ringing around the stadium next weekend.
Pity NZ lost I was looking forward to a Horwill v Harry rematch!!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GkP5ZrjRql0 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GkP5ZrjRql0)
It seems the Aussie cult of glorifying gurrierism in sport isn't confined to the Rules game.
Quote from: Hardy on October 16, 2011, 02:35:52 PM
It seems the Aussie cult of glorifying gurrierism in sport isn't confined to the Rules game.
The Aussie sports media are always going on about "the biff".
Sure look at the Cronulla Sharks scandal a few years back and the cyclist banned from the Olympics. Gurrierism and thuggery is a huge part of the Australian sports mentality.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ALt9gDaf-10&feature=player_embedded#! (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ALt9gDaf-10&feature=player_embedded#!)
Ref Rolland shows his French bias in this sending off!
Quote from: From the Bunker on October 16, 2011, 03:02:22 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ALt9gDaf-10&feature=player_embedded#! (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ALt9gDaf-10&feature=player_embedded#!)
Ref Rolland shows his French bias in this sending off!
The rule about the spear tackle is clear and Rolland esp. enforces it
ITV just won't let this go... ::)
Quote from: mayogodhelpus@gmail.com on October 16, 2011, 02:50:16 PM
Quote from: Hardy on October 16, 2011, 02:35:52 PM
It seems the Aussie cult of glorifying gurrierism in sport isn't confined to the Rules game.
The Aussie sports media are always going on about "the biff".
Sure look at the Cronulla Sharks scandal a few years back and the cyclist banned from the Olympics. Gurrierism and thuggery is a huge part of the Australian sports mentality.
And there I was thinking your capacity for idiotic comment was limited to politics. Seem to remember some Smith bird getting into a bit of trouble over some pool antics at the Olympics a few years ago but hey, we're the cuddly loveable Irish. Hardy, ain't you got any sense of Irony at all, at all.
Thought Rolland was spot on with his decision myself. If only all the referees I saw this week were as correct and decisive >: (A certain man from Slane yesterday)
Anyone else think the booing of Coope by the NZ crowd was completely OTT and also the TV director sticking his face up a couple of times near the end of the game? Apparentely Henry was asked during the post match press conference about it and said he brought it on himself and said there was nothingn wrong with it - Hope the French beat them.
Before the tournament when asked what my ideal final would be I said New Zealand vs France. They've aged out some crackers in recent years. Of course I didn't know the French would be as up and down as they have been, or that Carter would be missing. If both play to their potential it'll be an absolute cracker.
Also, I'm surprised nobody has mentioned McCaw's performance at the weekend. Two incidents stood out to me:
1) Pocock turning the ball over on the all black's right wing, with McCaw going straight in on Will Genia and turning the ball straight back over.
2) On the Aussie left wing late on McCaw thundering into a ruck from about five yards out, driving over the ball and turning it over after a sustained period of pressure. I watched him the whole 5 or 6 minutes before it- he was just waiting for his chance. Controlled aggression at its finest.
Thought Kaino and Reid were superb too. One of the best back row displays of the tournament.
Quote from: mc_grens on October 17, 2011, 11:16:40 AM
Before the tournament when asked what my ideal final would be I said New Zealand vs France. They've aged out some crackers in recent years. Of course I didn't know the French would be as up and down as they have been, or that Carter would be missing. If both play to their potential it'll be an absolute cracker.
Also, I'm surprised nobody has mentioned McCaw's performance at the weekend. Two incidents stood out to me:
1) Pocock turning the ball over on the all black's right wing, with McCaw going straight in on Will Genia and turning the ball straight back over.
2) On the Aussie left wing late on McCaw thundering into a ruck from about five yards out, driving over the ball and turning it over after a sustained period of pressure. I watched him the whole 5 or 6 minutes before it- he was just waiting for his chance. Controlled aggression at its finest.
Thought Kaino and Reid were superb too. One of the best back row displays of the tournament.
The biggest problem I have with NZ is that generally a team adopts to how a referee is taking charge of the breakdown, too many refs adopt to how the NZ are playing the breakdown.
Weepu's performance showed you that demons run deep in this NZ side, if France are in with 20 mins to go, a big IF, then I think France will win it.
McCaw apart from 1 or 2 moments against Oz was poor and I really didn't think that much of the NZ back-row performance, it was their back three that were simply brilliant.
Quote from: mc_grens on October 17, 2011, 11:16:40 AM
Before the tournament when asked what my ideal final would be I said New Zealand vs France. They've aged out some crackers in recent years. Of course I didn't know the French would be as up and down as they have been, or that Carter would be missing. If both play to their potential it'll be an absolute cracker.
Also, I'm surprised nobody has mentioned McCaw's performance at the weekend. Two incidents stood out to me:
1) Pocock turning the ball over on the all black's right wing, with McCaw going straight in on Will Genia and turning the ball straight back over.
2) On the Aussie left wing late on McCaw thundering into a ruck from about five yards out, driving over the ball and turning it over after a sustained period of pressure. I watched him the whole 5 or 6 minutes before it- he was just waiting for his chance. Controlled aggression at its finest.
Thought Kaino and Reid were superb too. One of the best back row displays of the tournament.
As far as I can see the French played a bit against England and not at all in any other game.
I would like to see the French win it as the whole New Zealand being the best team in the world then bottling it thing intrigues me. It's just one of those unexplainable phenomena I guess but I really can't see it happening on this occasion.
The AB's look well up for it and their performance on Saturday night was as good as I have ever seen. Having said that you just don't know with the French.
What is disappointing though is that such a weak side can get through to the Final of the biggest tournament in the world. I've been very disappointed with the quality on show from all teams. Only Wales, the AB's and to a lesser degree Ireland have played well in the tournament so far which for a World Cup is just not good enough.
Quote from: Dinny Breen on October 17, 2011, 11:44:29 AM
Quote from: mc_grens on October 17, 2011, 11:16:40 AM
Before the tournament when asked what my ideal final would be I said New Zealand vs France. They've aged out some crackers in recent years. Of course I didn't know the French would be as up and down as they have been, or that Carter would be missing. If both play to their potential it'll be an absolute cracker.
Also, I'm surprised nobody has mentioned McCaw's performance at the weekend. Two incidents stood out to me:
1) Pocock turning the ball over on the all black's right wing, with McCaw going straight in on Will Genia and turning the ball straight back over.
2) On the Aussie left wing late on McCaw thundering into a ruck from about five yards out, driving over the ball and turning it over after a sustained period of pressure. I watched him the whole 5 or 6 minutes before it- he was just waiting for his chance. Controlled aggression at its finest.
Thought Kaino and Reid were superb too. One of the best back row displays of the tournament.
The biggest problem I have with NZ is that generally a team adopts to how a referee is taking charge of the breakdown, too many refs adopt to how the NZ are playing the breakdown.
Weepu's performance showed you that demons run deep in this NZ side, if France are in with 20 mins to go, a big IF, then I think France will win it.
McCaw apart from 1 or 2 moments against Oz was poor and I really didn't think that much of the NZ back-row performance, it was their back three that were simply brilliant.
The New Zealand pack destroyed the Aussies, particularly in the breakdown. The old saying about forwards winning games and backs deciding by how much was very apt.
Yes New Zealand live on the line in the breakdown and often over it, but their physicality, counter rucking, and sheer opportunism in that area is superb.
Quote from: mc_grens on October 17, 2011, 12:33:26 PM
Quote from: Dinny Breen on October 17, 2011, 11:44:29 AM
Quote from: mc_grens on October 17, 2011, 11:16:40 AM
Before the tournament when asked what my ideal final would be I said New Zealand vs France. They've aged out some crackers in recent years. Of course I didn't know the French would be as up and down as they have been, or that Carter would be missing. If both play to their potential it'll be an absolute cracker.
Also, I'm surprised nobody has mentioned McCaw's performance at the weekend. Two incidents stood out to me:
1) Pocock turning the ball over on the all black's right wing, with McCaw going straight in on Will Genia and turning the ball straight back over.
2) On the Aussie left wing late on McCaw thundering into a ruck from about five yards out, driving over the ball and turning it over after a sustained period of pressure. I watched him the whole 5 or 6 minutes before it- he was just waiting for his chance. Controlled aggression at its finest.
Thought Kaino and Reid were superb too. One of the best back row displays of the tournament.
The biggest problem I have with NZ is that generally a team adopts to how a referee is taking charge of the breakdown, too many refs adopt to how the NZ are playing the breakdown.
Weepu's performance showed you that demons run deep in this NZ side, if France are in with 20 mins to go, a big IF, then I think France will win it.
McCaw apart from 1 or 2 moments against Oz was poor and I really didn't think that much of the NZ back-row performance, it was their back three that were simply brilliant.
The New Zealand pack destroyed the Aussies, particularly in the breakdown. The old saying about forwards winning games and backs deciding by how much was very apt.
Yes New Zealand live on the line in the breakdown and often over it, but their physicality, counter rucking, and sheer opportunism in that area is superb.
Yea but that was more to do with the work-rate of their tight 5 in particular Thorn and Mealamu, both made as many or more tackles than Reid. The New Zealand back-row could struggle in the final, they were out-played by Argentina I thought.
I just want New Zealand to earn the World Cup and I to f**k France just give it a lash, they don't have the players, the commitment or the nous to play a negative game.
Quote from: Dinny Breen on October 17, 2011, 01:16:07 PM
Quote from: mc_grens on October 17, 2011, 12:33:26 PM
Quote from: Dinny Breen on October 17, 2011, 11:44:29 AM
Quote from: mc_grens on October 17, 2011, 11:16:40 AM
Before the tournament when asked what my ideal final would be I said New Zealand vs France. They've aged out some crackers in recent years. Of course I didn't know the French would be as up and down as they have been, or that Carter would be missing. If both play to their potential it'll be an absolute cracker.
Also, I'm surprised nobody has mentioned McCaw's performance at the weekend. Two incidents stood out to me:
1) Pocock turning the ball over on the all black's right wing, with McCaw going straight in on Will Genia and turning the ball straight back over.
2) On the Aussie left wing late on McCaw thundering into a ruck from about five yards out, driving over the ball and turning it over after a sustained period of pressure. I watched him the whole 5 or 6 minutes before it- he was just waiting for his chance. Controlled aggression at its finest.
Thought Kaino and Reid were superb too. One of the best back row displays of the tournament.
The biggest problem I have with NZ is that generally a team adopts to how a referee is taking charge of the breakdown, too many refs adopt to how the NZ are playing the breakdown.
Weepu's performance showed you that demons run deep in this NZ side, if France are in with 20 mins to go, a big IF, then I think France will win it.
McCaw apart from 1 or 2 moments against Oz was poor and I really didn't think that much of the NZ back-row performance, it was their back three that were simply brilliant.
The New Zealand pack destroyed the Aussies, particularly in the breakdown. The old saying about forwards winning games and backs deciding by how much was very apt.
Yes New Zealand live on the line in the breakdown and often over it, but their physicality, counter rucking, and sheer opportunism in that area is superb.
Yea but that was more to do with the work-rate of their tight 5 in particular Thorn and Mealamu, both made as many or more tackles than Reid. The New Zealand back-row could struggle in the final, they were out-played by Argentina I thought.
I just want New Zealand to earn the World Cup and I to f**k France just give it a lash, they don't have the players, the commitment or the nous to play a negative game.
Ditto. I just want them both to bring their A game. After that whoever wins, wins.
(http://images.icnetwork.co.uk/collections/wales_virals/Western-Mail-Front-Page-Monday-17-October-2011.png)
I understand they feel down and a bit hard done by but this is a bit OTT isn't it?!
I know we were way OTT about the Henry incident but it was a lot more clear cut than this incident!
Can't stop kicking it wide in a WC semi? Don't worry it's just because your Welsh.
Quote from: screenexile on October 17, 2011, 01:56:03 PM
(http://images.icnetwork.co.uk/collections/wales_virals/Western-Mail-Front-Page-Monday-17-October-2011.png)
I understand they feel down and a bit hard done by but this is a bit OTT isn't it?!
I know we were way OTT about the Henry incident but it was a lot more clear cut than this incident!
Rolland was right on the spot .Very clear cut-He SAW the incident
They missed a few there.
Can't wait to ask Stephen Jones how he feels about bottling the chance to win a World Cup semi final.
Can't imagine why everybody is blaming the referee and nobody is blaming Warburton, like the kind of people who go round to the school and attack the teacher when their kid is given lines for misbehaving.
Can't find "empathy for the players, the occasion and the game" in the index of the rulebook.
Quote from: Hardy on October 17, 2011, 03:48:44 PM
They missed a few there.
Can't wait to ask Stephen Jones how he feels about bottling the chance to win a World Cup semi final.
Can't imagine why everybody is blaming the referee and nobody is blaming Warburton, like the kind of people who go round to the school and attack the teacher when their kid is given lines for misbehaving.
Can't find "empathy for the players, the occasion and the game" in the index of the rulebook.
Oh Hardy, clean out your mouth before Dinny takes you up on that - there are no rules, but laws!
Quote from: sans pessimism on October 17, 2011, 03:34:06 PM
Quote from: screenexile on October 17, 2011, 01:56:03 PM
(http://images.icnetwork.co.uk/collections/wales_virals/Western-Mail-Front-Page-Monday-17-October-2011.png)
Can't stop addicted to the shindig?
France won the toss for the Jersey allowing them to wear their dark blue but are allowing NZ were the All-Black jersey. Nice touch!
Quote from: Dinny Breen on October 17, 2011, 07:03:01 PM
France won the toss for the Jersey allowing them to wear their dark blue but are allowing NZ were the All-Black jersey. Nice touch!
Mind games more than anything I'd say. Try not to aggravate the Kiwi's and let them lure themselves into complacency.
Anybody have any thoughts on this??
http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/rugby_union/welsh/15347253.stm
Gatland thought about cheating and withdrawing a prop to get the Scrums uncontested. Fair play to him for not doing it I say and it's very honest of him to admit it crossed his mind. Surely this needs to be looked into by the IRB!
Quote from: screenexile on October 18, 2011, 01:58:08 PM
Anybody have any thoughts on this??
http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/rugby_union/welsh/15347253.stm
Gatland thought about cheating and withdrawing a prop to get the Scrums uncontested. Fair play to him for not doing it I say and it's very honest of him to admit it crossed his mind. Surely this needs to be looked into by the IRB!
Didn't see him condemn Mike Philips cheating in the quick line-out try in Cardiff. He's trying to take some moral high ground with his whim about the occasion etc etc - It's just a dig at Alan Rolland.
Quote from: Dinny Breen on October 18, 2011, 02:02:05 PM
Quote from: screenexile on October 18, 2011, 01:58:08 PM
Anybody have any thoughts on this??
http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/rugby_union/welsh/15347253.stm
Gatland thought about cheating and withdrawing a prop to get the Scrums uncontested. Fair play to him for not doing it I say and it's very honest of him to admit it crossed his mind. Surely this needs to be looked into by the IRB!
Didn't see him condemn Mike Philips cheating in the quick line-out try in Cardiff. He's trying to take some moral high ground with his whim about the occasion etc etc - It's just a dig at Alan Rolland.
"In the terms of the rules and the regulations, he is perfectly entitled to give a red card - but every game is different."
Well at least that quote from Gatland that is progress. He needs go one the next step and wonder how the ref was put in a position to be 'perfectly entitled to give a red'.
Quote from: muppet on October 18, 2011, 02:09:01 PM
Quote from: Dinny Breen on October 18, 2011, 02:02:05 PM
Quote from: screenexile on October 18, 2011, 01:58:08 PM
Anybody have any thoughts on this??
http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/rugby_union/welsh/15347253.stm
Gatland thought about cheating and withdrawing a prop to get the Scrums uncontested. Fair play to him for not doing it I say and it's very honest of him to admit it crossed his mind. Surely this needs to be looked into by the IRB!
Didn't see him condemn Mike Philips cheating in the quick line-out try in Cardiff. He's trying to take some moral high ground with his whim about the occasion etc etc - It's just a dig at Alan Rolland.
"In the terms of the rules and the regulations, he is perfectly entitled to give a red card - but every game is different."
Well at least that quote from Gatland that is progress. He needs go one the next step and wonder how the ref was put in a position to be 'perfectly entitled to give a red'.
So is he saying that Roland was entitled to give a red card, but he shouldn't have because it was a world cup semi final and it was going to have ahuge impact on the game?
Quote from: AZOffaly on October 18, 2011, 02:10:30 PM
Quote from: muppet on October 18, 2011, 02:09:01 PM
Quote from: Dinny Breen on October 18, 2011, 02:02:05 PM
Quote from: screenexile on October 18, 2011, 01:58:08 PM
Anybody have any thoughts on this??
http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/rugby_union/welsh/15347253.stm
Gatland thought about cheating and withdrawing a prop to get the Scrums uncontested. Fair play to him for not doing it I say and it's very honest of him to admit it crossed his mind. Surely this needs to be looked into by the IRB!
Didn't see him condemn Mike Philips cheating in the quick line-out try in Cardiff. He's trying to take some moral high ground with his whim about the occasion etc etc - It's just a dig at Alan Rolland.
"In the terms of the rules and the regulations, he is perfectly entitled to give a red card - but every game is different."
Well at least that quote from Gatland that is progress. He needs go one the next step and wonder how the ref was put in a position to be 'perfectly entitled to give a red'.
So is he saying that Roland was entitled to give a red card, but he shouldn't have because it was a world cup semi final and it was going to have ahuge impact on the game?
I think that he is saying yes under the letter of the law it COULD be construed as a red but that given there was no injury, the fact it was a semi final, the fact it was so early in the game that he could have showed a yellow card and that would have been the end of it.
I don't agree with that assessment btw I think it was a straight red.
QuoteGatland continued: "I will give you an example with what happened after that. We'd already lost Adam Jones, and we discussed in the (coaches) box whether we would fake an injury to one of our props and go to uncontested scrums.
"But morally, I made the decision it wasn't the right thing to do.
"We could easily have done that in the first 25-30 minutes, but in the spirit of the game, in the spirit of a World Cup semi-final, I didn't think that was the fairest or the right thing.
"That is why I honestly believe Alain Rolland made the wrong decision. Under the rules and regulations he was perfectly entitled to give a red card. But every game is different.
"You have to take the circumstances of the situation and the intent, and in that situation, given his experience and the role he was given, a yellow card was the right decision to make."
One wouldn't have been contemplated without the other. Nonsense talk. The fact is that Wales choked. They had enough chances to win the game without blaming the sending off.
The headline also missed the following.
Can stop from going under the posts for the try (did anyone else think he should have tried to edge to a more central position for the try to give Jones an easier kick?).
Quote from: Hardy on October 17, 2011, 03:48:44 PM
They missed a few there.
Can't wait to ask Stephen Jones how he feels about bottling the chance to win a World Cup semi final.
Can't imagine why everybody is blaming the referee and nobody is blaming Warburton, like the kind of people who go round to the school and attack the teacher when their kid is given lines for misbehaving.
Can't find "empathy for the players, the occasion and the game" in the index of the rulebook.
It's more to do with the mentality of the loser Hardy. They will always look furthest from home for the cause. It's what makes them losers, whether it's the irish blaming Henry and ignoring the sitter cheeky chappy Keane missed against French or the welsh here or the cubs blaming the bartman or the various 'curses' from Biddy Early to the Bambino. Losers look for excuses to fail, winners reasons to succeed.
Quote from: muppet on October 18, 2011, 02:09:01 PM
Quote from: Dinny Breen on October 18, 2011, 02:02:05 PM
Quote from: screenexile on October 18, 2011, 01:58:08 PM
Anybody have any thoughts on this??
http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/rugby_union/welsh/15347253.stm
Gatland thought about cheating and withdrawing a prop to get the Scrums uncontested. Fair play to him for not doing it I say and it's very honest of him to admit it crossed his mind. Surely this needs to be looked into by the IRB!
Didn't see him condemn Mike Philips cheating in the quick line-out try in Cardiff. He's trying to take some moral high ground with his whim about the occasion etc etc - It's just a dig at Alan Rolland.
"In the terms of the rules and the regulations, he is perfectly entitled to give a red card - but every game is different."
Well at least that quote from Gatland that is progress. He needs go one the next step and wonder how the ref was put in a position to be 'perfectly entitled to give a red'.
Well yes, every game
is different but the rules and regulations should be the same for all games. With that sort of logic Warren could find himself on the ITV panel for the next World Cup!
France name an unchanged side for the final.
Parra still at 10 ???
France name unchanged team. Foolhardy or cunning plan?
http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/rugby_union/15363573.stm
Quote from: AQMP on October 18, 2011, 03:29:04 PM
Quote from: muppet on October 18, 2011, 02:09:01 PM
Quote from: Dinny Breen on October 18, 2011, 02:02:05 PM
Quote from: screenexile on October 18, 2011, 01:58:08 PM
Anybody have any thoughts on this??
http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/rugby_union/welsh/15347253.stm
Gatland thought about cheating and withdrawing a prop to get the Scrums uncontested. Fair play to him for not doing it I say and it's very honest of him to admit it crossed his mind. Surely this needs to be looked into by the IRB!
Didn't see him condemn Mike Philips cheating in the quick line-out try in Cardiff. He's trying to take some moral high ground with his whim about the occasion etc etc - It's just a dig at Alan Rolland.
]In the terms of the rules and the regulations, he is perfectly entitled to give a red card - but every game is different
Well at least that quote from Gatland that is progress. He needs go one the next step and wonder how the ref was put in a position to be 'perfectly entitled to give a red'.
Well yes, every game is different but the rules and regulations should be the same for all games. With that sort of logic Warren could find himself on the ITV panel for the next World Cup!
Quick, hide...Here comes Dinny Breen
If Ireland were beaten in similar ircumstances we would be just as bad in fairness. Maybe worse.
As others have said - look at how we dealt with the Henry thing in Paris. People are still going on about it now.
I know they are not strictly the same thing in that one was definite foul play that was missed while the other is less clearly the wrong decision but in terms of our reaction to a perceived injustice we would be every bit as bad have no doubt.
Quote from: galwayman on October 19, 2011, 08:32:12 PM
If Ireland were beaten in similar ircumstances we would be just as bad in fairness. Maybe worse.
As others have said - look at how we dealt with the Henry thing in Paris. People are still going on about it now.
Ah no, we picked sides. Roy Keane or Mick McCarthy.
The Welsh would have blamed Pierluigi Collina.
Quote from: galwayman on October 19, 2011, 08:32:12 PM
If Ireland were beaten in similar ircumstances we would be just as bad in fairness. Maybe worse.
As others have said - look at how we dealt with the Henry thing in Paris. People are still going on about it now.
I know they are not strictly the same thing in that one was definite foul play that was missed while the other is less clearly the wrong decision but in terms of our reaction to a perceived injustice we would be every bit as bad have no doubt.
What Wales game last week and Ireland/France game have in common that refereeing decisions went against Wales and Ireland but they had ony themsleves to blame for not winning the game.
Wales were 1 from 5 with kicks last week vs Frances 3 from 3,lost numerous lineouts and bottled taking on the drop goal that would have won the game. The nature of sport is that decisions will go against you, great teams can find a way to win when they have the chance.
Quote from: Orangemac on October 19, 2011, 11:35:06 PM
Quote from: galwayman on October 19, 2011, 08:32:12 PM
If Ireland were beaten in similar ircumstances we would be just as bad in fairness. Maybe worse.
As others have said - look at how we dealt with the Henry thing in Paris. People are still going on about it now.
I know they are not strictly the same thing in that one was definite foul play that was missed while the other is less clearly the wrong decision but in terms of our reaction to a perceived injustice we would be every bit as bad have no doubt.
What Wales game last week and Ireland/France game have in common that refereeing decisions went against Wales and Ireland but they had ony themsleves to blame for not winning the game.
Wales were 1 from 5 with kicks last week vs Frances 3 from 3,lost numerous lineouts and bottled taking on the drop goal that would have won the game. The nature of sport is that decisions will go against you, great teams can find a way to win when they have the chance.
Unless you're Man United!
France 12.5 on Betfair! Mad odds.
It is kind of 50 50 whether or not France beat those odds. If they do make a game of it anything is possible.
It should be New Zealand they are a better team and at home but.........????!
Weepu makes it more likely to be a 50 50 game with poor kicking like that.
Allez les blancs
Must be 4 or 5 handy frees already to the homeside. The old 'holding onto the ball too long' (milli-sec) is the easy one to give
All blacks have taken the catcher out cleverly for every high ball so far and joubert has ignored it
Very Questionable calls in the front row, crossing in mf, playing the ball on their feet persistently and ref letting them away with it. French have some job on their hands here
ref is having a shocker
Weepu has Mayo blood in him.
3 out of 3 for Weepu all misses ensures a fair game.
Someone knows more about it but New Zealand should have started Donald at fly half for is experience and goal kicking. Weepu is not the man for goal kicking in a world cup final.
Who is back up kicker for the All BLacks?
Just as I say it Cruden goes down injured. Heres Donald.
Another rubbish penalty for the all blacks against Dusautoir
Ah joubert is fecking ruining this game for me. I can't watch in peace for being angry with him. McCaw just lay on the ball again and ref gives nz the put in then french capt penalized for not releasing the tackler - which McCaw has gotten away with 4 times at least this half.
Taxi for Joubert...
In the QF against Argentina Weepu literally played fly half and scrum half. He didn't pass the ball to Slade when he was on. He did the cross field kicks and other fly half roles from the scrum half position. That is great Against a limited Argentine team. However in a world cup final you have to rely on your fly half. They should have let Donald kick the penalty that Dagg kicked dow the middle of the field.
New Zealand need to use their heads and out half or disaster looms. They are playing with 14 men if they don't utilise Donald.
Should have been a penalty for a high tackle from Woodcock. The ref is undrr orders.
Oh Oh
Game is on!!!!
Looks like your pipping me for 3rd place in the fantasy league Pat, try for dusatoir
Weepu is shot. Time for a change.
Kiwis well rattled, panicking in the coaches box
G'wan France
France went from 9/1 before the try to 13/5 now !!!!
Would still like to see New Zealand win but the more the referee gives them the decisions I'll want France to win.
Great game all the same
Has McCaw stayed bound to a single scrum?
Not even close!
French Drop Goal for the winner anybody ?
Traille should have taken the long range kick.
As much as France are ahead I can't see them winning now because they are making too many mistakes! Turnover after turnover!! They can't get into a drop goal position! I hope I am wrong but I can see new Zealand getting a drop goal or penalty here!
Have another look cic - France are behind...
Quote from: cicfada on October 23, 2011, 10:36:25 AM
As much as France are ahead I can't see them winning now because they are making too many mistakes! Turnover after turnover!! They can't get into a drop goal position! I hope I am wrong but I can see new Zealand getting a drop goal or penalty here!
ye need new glasses old boy :D
Not the display that many people thought but an enthralling final and the world's best team definitely won the World Cup.
Well done Kiwis, consistently the best team throughout the tournament. France stumbled into the final and gave it their all mais c'est la vie. Had weepu had his boots on it wouldnt have been so tight.
Weepu must be the happiest man in that stadium.
Great to see the all blacks win a world cup but France deserved the win. The ref let them down.
At least Dusautoirs try got me third in the fantasy rugby I think.
Best team on the day lost. But overall the best team over the finals won out
Quote from: brokencrossbar1 on October 23, 2011, 10:46:30 AM
Quote from: cicfada on October 23, 2011, 10:36:25 AM
As much as France are ahead I can't see them winning now because they are making too many mistakes! Turnover after turnover!! They can't get into a drop goal position! I hope I am wrong but I can see new Zealand getting a drop goal or penalty here!
ye need new glasses old boy :D
Not the display that many people thought but an enthralling final and the world's best team definitely won the World Cup.
Clearly I meant france being ahead on play but unfortunately not on the scoreboard! The best team lost today but overall in the tournament I suppose that the best team won! It was New Zealand's destiny to win! So disappointed for France, I don't like New Zealand at all with that stupid Haka but the bastards are good in fairness! Great final though!!
Can't believe nobody's mentioned McCaw taking out Parra! Dangerous and hugely cynical it would be a disgrace if he gets away with that given the punishment handed out to Warburton!!
Some codswallop on here about NZ deserving it because they were the best overall. Both teams got to the final, France should have won but for the ref. Lost count the amount of times NZ were infringing, offside, tackling high. Phase after phase @ the end, NZ out on their feet and miraculously didn't concede a peno. Commentators saying how disciplined they are, balls, the ref was never ever gonna give France a chance to kick the winning points.
NZ play right on the edge of what's legal, in 80 mins of high intensity rugby they only give away 1 (half) kickable penalty? Like sh1t they did
Missing the rugby already
Quote from: J OGorman on October 23, 2011, 12:35:16 PM
Some codswallop on here about NZ deserving it because they were the best overall. Both teams got to the final, France should have won but for the ref. Lost count the amount of times NZ were infringing, offside, tackling high. Phase after phase @ the end, NZ out on their feet and miraculously didn't concede a peno. Commentators saying how disciplined they are, balls, the ref was never ever gonna give France a chance to kick the winning points.
NZ play right on the edge of what's legal, in 80 mins of high intensity rugby they only give away 1 (half) kickable penalty? Like sh1t they did
Missing the rugby already
Roll on the Heineken cup - best tournament in the world - starts on 11/11/11
It is great to see rugbys premier brand win the tournament on home soil. They did it without Dan Carter and their fourth outhalf and Weepu kicking them out of the game. They are the best team in the world for the last 8 years.
On the other hand France played better but couldn't establish themselves in the game because of the ref. The negative refereeing performance destroyed the quality of the final and maybe changed the result.
It was a brutal game really. As a rugby fan I enjoyed it but won' t be sitting down to watch the thing again.
Quote from: Hoof Hearted on October 23, 2011, 12:43:22 PM
Quote from: J OGorman on October 23, 2011, 12:35:16 PM
Some codswallop on here about NZ deserving it because they were the best overall. Both teams got to the final, France should have won but for the ref. Lost count the amount of times NZ were infringing, offside, tackling high. Phase after phase @ the end, NZ out on their feet and miraculously didn't concede a peno. Commentators saying how disciplined they are, balls, the ref was never ever gonna give France a chance to kick the winning points.
NZ play right on the edge of what's legal, in 80 mins of high intensity rugby they only give away 1 (half) kickable penalty? Like sh1t they did
Missing the rugby already
Roll on the Heineken cup - best tournament in the world - starts on 11/11/11
Sure, we already have the Rabo Direct Pro 12!!
Quote from: Hoof Hearted on October 23, 2011, 12:43:22 PM
Quote from: J OGorman on October 23, 2011, 12:35:16 PM
Some codswallop on here about NZ deserving it because they were the best overall. Both teams got to the final, France should have won but for the ref. Lost count the amount of times NZ were infringing, offside, tackling high. Phase after phase @ the end, NZ out on their feet and miraculously didn't concede a peno. Commentators saying how disciplined they are, balls, the ref was never ever gonna give France a chance to kick the winning points.
NZ play right on the edge of what's legal, in 80 mins of high intensity rugby they only give away 1 (half) kickable penalty? Like sh1t they did
Missing the rugby already
Roll on the Heineken cup - best tournament in the world - starts on 11/11/11
Connacht's inclusion gives it that gravitas that it was lacking.
I can't wait for the next Rugby World Cup.
Quote from: J OGorman on October 23, 2011, 12:35:16 PM
Some codswallop on here about NZ deserving it because they were the best overall. Both teams got to the final, France should have won but for the ref. Lost count the amount of times NZ were infringing, offside, tackling high. Phase after phase @ the end, NZ out on their feet and miraculously didn't concede a peno. Commentators saying how disciplined they are, balls, the ref was never ever gonna give France a chance to kick the winning points.
NZ play right on the edge of what's legal, in 80 mins of high intensity rugby they only give away 1 (half) kickable penalty? Like sh1t they did
Missing the rugby already
Refs were hand picked by a Kiwi for these matches, should we suspected anything else. France deserved a chance to win it at the end and they were denied it, refereeing in the comp just not good enough.
Just watched the highlights on Setanta. Joubert was even worse than I thought on first viewing this morning. How a penalty wasn't given against Kaino towards the end, quickly followed by Conrad Smith running a mile offside beggars belief.
Best team lost today. Best team overall won the tournament.
What a completely woeful tournament from start to finish.
Why not just the play the winners of the tri (quad) nations against the 6 nations champions every couple of years and be done with it, instead of this drawn out waste of time.
Quote from: NAG1 on October 24, 2011, 09:51:39 AM
What a completely woeful tournament from start to finish.
Why not just the play the winners of the tri (quad) nations against the 6 nations champions every couple of years and be done with it, instead of this drawn out waste of time.
Think we should do this with hurling and football All-Ireland's too? 6 or 8 teams in each?
Quote from: NAG1 on October 24, 2011, 09:51:39 AM
What a completely woeful tournament from start to finish.
Why not just the play the winners of the tri (quad) nations against the 6 nations champions every couple of years and be done with it, instead of this drawn out waste of time.
i enjoyed the tournament thsi year, thought it was excellent with some very good games, but there you go, each to their own
Maybe it was the timing of games being on before 9am, but it was largely forgettable to me. Wales brought some life to it but that's all.
Does anyone know does Carter get a Winners Medal?
Quote from: Just_Browsing on October 24, 2011, 10:41:29 AM
Does anyone know does Carter get a Winners Medal?
He collected his medal with the rest of the team yeaterday - well deserved too - best out half in world rugby for some time now.
Did anyone notice the hit Rougerie had on Conrad Smith in the last few phases of the game. Smith was out of it and I'd say he was in a daze even receiving his medal! Tis some brutal game.
Quote from: blewuporstuffed on October 24, 2011, 10:03:50 AM
Quote from: NAG1 on October 24, 2011, 09:51:39 AM
What a completely woeful tournament from start to finish.
Why not just the play the winners of the tri (quad) nations against the 6 nations champions every couple of years and be done with it, instead of this drawn out waste of time.
i enjoyed the tournament thsi year, thought it was excellent with some very good games, but there you go, each to their own
I also enjoyed it. There will always be mismatches but the gap is closing and for 2nd, 3rd level nations, they need the RWC and its qualifying to help with their development and the games popularity.
Not 100% sure, but did it not take France 6 or 7 years to win a match in the 5 nations? Italy are on the up. Hopefully Argentina will show with can compete in next years 'quad' nations. USA are starting to produce very good players etc. However, for the likes of Fiji, Somoa etc, they really need to be allowed to hold onto their best players and not represent the All-Black team, or should that be New Zealand and South Sea Island select
Quote from: GaillimhIarthair on October 24, 2011, 10:47:36 AM
Quote from: Just_Browsing on October 24, 2011, 10:41:29 AM
Does anyone know does Carter get a Winners Medal?
He collected his medal with the rest of the team yeaterday - well deserved too - best out half in world rugby for some time now.
Missed that as went back to bed after the game. :) Def well deserved tho - class act and played in Pool stages so was thinking he should get one. For him personally though probably a bit like Keane with Champions League 1999 - never means as much when your not actually playing.
Quote from: J OGorman on October 24, 2011, 11:18:21 AM
However, for the likes of Fiji, Somoa etc, they really need to be allowed to hold onto their best players and not represent the All-Black team, or should that be New Zealand and South Sea Island select
Are the majority of these player not already born in New Zealand or Australia??
Quote from: ludermor on October 24, 2011, 12:00:04 PM
Quote from: J OGorman on October 24, 2011, 11:18:21 AM
However, for the likes of Fiji, Somoa etc, they really need to be allowed to hold onto their best players and not represent the All-Black team, or should that be New Zealand and South Sea Island select
Are the majority of these player not already born in New Zealand or Australia??
Quade Cooper is a New Zealander who played for the Aussies. There seems to be a lot of players who were born in one place whete they lived for a few years as a child and then moved on. They seem to move around a lot down there.
Saw a clip of Donald's penalty where it looked like it went wide! Also IRB have fined France for advancing on the haka- they can't be serious can they?
I enjoyed the World Cup for the quality of sport on offer, the whole atmosphere of the event and the performances of the Irish team up until the QF.
However, it's disheartening to see rugby, which had long given the impression of refusing to stoop to the squalid practices of most of professional sport, seem to buckle and begin the slide.The dodgy look of the selection of Joubert to referee the final seemed to be confirmed by his performance. There was no way France were going to get a kickable penalty at any stage of that second half. Also, the treatment of the weaker teams as regards scheduling would put the antics of Sepp Blatter in the shade.
I also have to mention the mild annoyance of the showbizifaction of rugby, in common with most of professional sport. How annoying must it be, for instance, to have to listen to Neil F****n' Diamond at full blast at every break in play? What's that about? These are the times when you have an opportunity to compare notes with whoever is beside you, talk about what's going on, etc. If I wanted to listen to Neil F****n' Diamond I'd bring my iPod. Not that I'd EVER want to listen to to Neil F****n' Diamond.
QuoteI can't wait for the next Rugby World Cup.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x1vGRgwo8HA
Quote from: Hardy on October 24, 2011, 03:45:53 PM
I enjoyed the World Cup for the quality of sport on offer, the whole atmosphere of the event and the performances of the Irish team up until the QF.
However, it's disheartening to see rugby, which had long given the impression of refusing to stoop to the squalid practices of most of professional sport, seem to buckle and begin the slide.The dodgy look of the selection of Joubert to referee the final seemed to be confirmed by his performance. There was no way France were going to get a kickable penalty at any stage of that second half. Also, the treatment of the weaker teams as regards scheduling would put the antics of Sepp Blatter in the shade.
I also have to mention the mild annoyance of the showbizifaction of rugby, in common with most of professional sport. How annoying must it be, for instance, to have to listen to Neil F****n' Diamond at full blast at every break in play? What's that about? These are the times when you have an opportunity to compare notes with whoever is beside you, talk about what's going on, etc. If I wanted to listen to Neil F****n' Diamond I'd bring my iPod. Not that I'd EVER want to listen to to Neil F****n' Diamond.
Couldnt agree more it to shows a lack of entertainment on the field when they are continually attempting to blast atmosphere into the stadium
Quote from: Dinny Breen on October 23, 2011, 08:33:13 PM
Quote from: J OGorman on October 23, 2011, 12:35:16 PM
Some codswallop on here about NZ deserving it because they were the best overall. Both teams got to the final, France should have won but for the ref. Lost count the amount of times NZ were infringing, offside, tackling high. Phase after phase @ the end, NZ out on their feet and miraculously didn't concede a peno. Commentators saying how disciplined they are, balls, the ref was never ever gonna give France a chance to kick the winning points.
NZ play right on the edge of what's legal, in 80 mins of high intensity rugby they only give away 1 (half) kickable penalty? Like sh1t they did
Missing the rugby already
Refs were hand picked by a Kiwi for these matches, should we suspected anything else. France deserved a chance to win it at the end and they were denied it, refereeing in the comp just not good enough.
thats what I have been saying for a couple of years now Dinny- I am sure you will remember!
refs are officiation of rugby is poor.
Too much cheating going on at the breakdown, players off their feet interfering with the ball, offsides are not so much common practice but the norm, plus dont get me started about forward passes.
Even though I wanted to see NZ win yesterday, I felt that France were slightly cheated. Numerous bad decisions going against them that were not consistent by this ref in that match.
Funnily enough the first few games were reffed quite well and the officials were seen as being over fussy ! thats the way games shoul dbe refereed.
A second ref is not needed in rugby. One is not enough
Quote from: Capt Pat on October 24, 2011, 01:32:22 PM
Quote from: ludermor on October 24, 2011, 12:00:04 PM
Quote from: J OGorman on October 24, 2011, 11:18:21 AM
However, for the likes of Fiji, Somoa etc, they really need to be allowed to hold onto their best players and not represent the All-Black team, or should that be New Zealand and South Sea Island select
Are the majority of these player not already born in New Zealand or Australia??
Quade Cooper is a New Zealander who played for the Aussies. There seems to be a lot of players who were born in one place whete they lived for a few years as a child and then moved on. They seem to move around a lot down there.
Cooper moved to Australia when he was 13 and came up through their schools and representative system. It's not as if they ripped him away from New Zealand.
Quote from: lynchbhoy on October 24, 2011, 04:25:19 PM
Quote from: Dinny Breen on October 23, 2011, 08:33:13 PM
Quote from: J OGorman on October 23, 2011, 12:35:16 PM
Some codswallop on here about NZ deserving it because they were the best overall. Both teams got to the final, France should have won but for the ref. Lost count the amount of times NZ were infringing, offside, tackling high. Phase after phase @ the end, NZ out on their feet and miraculously didn't concede a peno. Commentators saying how disciplined they are, balls, the ref was never ever gonna give France a chance to kick the winning points.
NZ play right on the edge of what's legal, in 80 mins of high intensity rugby they only give away 1 (half) kickable penalty? Like sh1t they did
Missing the rugby already
Refs were hand picked by a Kiwi for these matches, should we suspected anything else. France deserved a chance to win it at the end and they were denied it, refereeing in the comp just not good enough.
thats what I have been saying for a couple of years now Dinny- I am sure you will remember!
refs are officiation of rugby is poor.
Too much cheating going on at the breakdown, players off their feet interfering with the ball, offsides are not so much common practice but the norm, plus dont get me started about forward passes.
Even though I wanted to see NZ win yesterday, I felt that France were slightly cheated. Numerous bad decisions going against them that were not consistent by this ref in that match.
Funnily enough the first few games were reffed quite well and the officials were seen as being over fussy ! thats the way games shoul dbe refereed.
A second ref is not needed in rugby. One is not enough
Wha? ???
Quote from: ludermor on October 24, 2011, 12:00:04 PM
Quote from: J OGorman on October 24, 2011, 11:18:21 AM
However, for the likes of Fiji, Somoa etc, they really need to be allowed to hold onto their best players and not represent the All-Black team, or should that be New Zealand and South Sea Island select
Are the majority of these player not already born in New Zealand or Australia??
New Zealand had 3 island born players out of a squad of 33 (including Kaino who moved to NZ in early childhood). Australia had 1 out of a squad of 30 (though, they seem to have attracted lads born all over the show - Saudi Arabia, South Africa, Zimbabwe, Papua New Guinea). By contrast, Tonga had about half a dozen New Zealanders with them, and more than half of the Samoan squad was NZ born. With that in mind, I don't think the islands will be doing too much whinging about the player swapping.
The real story:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1XBqetaCfgo (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1XBqetaCfgo)
Quote from: From the Bunker on October 24, 2011, 09:08:42 PM
The real story:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1XBqetaCfgo (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1XBqetaCfgo)
wow...
And more . . .
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hKHCcfPMPHM
just reading that france have been fined for advancing on the haka in the world cup final :o ::) breach of cultural protocal. and i was just starting to think rugby had it sorted
"What an enthralling final it had absolutely everything. " according to the announcer on Setanta Sports. It was a a mess of a final with a brutal last ten minutes. New Zealand held the ball for the last 5. They really need to change the rules so that teams can't burn up the clock like that in tight games
Quote from: Capt Pat on October 28, 2011, 05:48:22 PM
"What an enthralling final it had absolutely everything. " according to the announcer on Setanta Sports. It was a a mess of a final with a brutal last ten minutes. New Zealand held the ball for the last 5. They really need to change the rules so that teams can't burn up the clock like that in tight games
To be fair, munster have done exactly the same thing in the closing stages of their heineken cup finals but I agree totally. Rule needs changed in some capacity
Quote from: Capt Pat on October 28, 2011, 05:48:22 PM
"What an enthralling final it had absolutely everything. " according to the announcer on Setanta Sports. It was a a mess of a final with a brutal last ten minutes. New Zealand held the ball for the last 5. They really need to change the rules so that teams can't burn up the clock like that in tight games
Can't agree Pat, What can they do? Hand the ball over and say "here lads you wana have a go". You can't force them into conceding possession with a kick or playing risky manoeuvres like garyowen's or wide passes.
I didn't like to see it either but there was plenty of infringements if there was impartial ref there to see it. It happens in nearly all field sports, running to the corner flag in soccer/passing along your 45 in GAA.
Quote from: trileacman on October 28, 2011, 09:39:17 PM
Quote from: Capt Pat on October 28, 2011, 05:48:22 PM
"What an enthralling final it had absolutely everything. " according to the announcer on Setanta Sports. It was a a mess of a final with a brutal last ten minutes. New Zealand held the ball for the last 5. They really need to change the rules so that teams can't burn up the clock like that in tight games
Can't agree Pat, What can they do? Hand the ball over and say "here lads you wana have a go". You can't force them into conceding possession with a kick or playing risky manoeuvres like garyowen's or wide passes.
I didn't like to see it either but there was plenty of infringements if there was impartial ref there to see it. It happens in nearly all field sports, running to the corner flag in soccer/passing along your 45 in GAA.
this team has had 4+ years of shit. They were winning that game if it was 3-0 after 1 minute and holding the ball the remaining 79 mins, never mind 5 mins !
as they say in the premier league every week, it's a results business.
Quote from: Hoof Hearted on October 28, 2011, 09:45:00 PM
Quote from: trileacman on October 28, 2011, 09:39:17 PM
Quote from: Capt Pat on October 28, 2011, 05:48:22 PM
"What an enthralling final it had absolutely everything. " according to the announcer on Setanta Sports. It was a a mess of a final with a brutal last ten minutes. New Zealand held the ball for the last 5. They really need to change the rules so that teams can't burn up the clock like that in tight games
Can't agree Pat, What can they do? Hand the ball over and say "here lads you wana have a go". You can't force them into conceding possession with a kick or playing risky manoeuvres like garyowen's or wide passes.
I didn't like to see it either but there was plenty of infringements if there was impartial ref there to see it. It happens in nearly all field sports, running to the corner flag in soccer/passing along your 45 in GAA.
this team has had 4+ years of shit. They were winning that game if it was 3-0 after 1 minute and holding the ball the remaining 79 mins, never mind 5 mins !
as they say in the premier league every week, it's a results business.
The climax of the game is ruined by this rubbish. They have made it too easy to keep the ball at the end. It wasn't always possible to close out games this way. Why not change back to the old rules?
Ding Dong Johnson's Gone!!
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/rugbyunion/article-2062189/Martin-Johnson-quits-England.html?ito=feeds-newsxml
Quote from: screenexile on November 16, 2011, 11:06:12 AM
Ding Dong Johnson's Gone!!
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/rugbyunion/article-2062189/Martin-Johnson-quits-England.html?ito=feeds-newsxml
Shit England will be good now. Johnson didn't have a f**king clue how to be a top level coach. Parachuted in for winning a world cup as a player.
His appointment seemed more in hope than in reason.
How did Sir Clive do in the 1999 world cup? Could they be jettisoning him too soon? He did win the 6 nations this year.
Quote from: Capt Pat on November 16, 2011, 03:11:01 PM
Quote from: screenexile on November 16, 2011, 11:06:12 AM
Ding Dong Johnson's Gone!!
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/rugbyunion/article-2062189/Martin-Johnson-quits-England.html?ito=feeds-newsxml
Shit England will be good now. Johnson didn't have a f**king clue how to be a top level coach. Parachuted in for winning a world cup as a player.
Eddie O'Sullivan quit the USA today too, i wonder.............. ;D
Well, look what Warren did for Wales...
Martin showed good judgement getting out when he did.
http://www.google.com/hostednews/ukpress/article/ALeqM5jINjFapbbjPYSpvi0tbzxNkwe6Og?docId=N0025241322036132570A
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/rugbyunion/international/england/8908818/Englands-Rugby-World-Cup-shambles-laid-bare-as-leaked-report-blames-greedy-players-and-weak-leaders.html
England's Rugby World Cup shambles laid bare as leaked report blames greedy players and weak leaders
Lewis Moody was inadequate, Martin Johnson lacked "b*****", the coaches were laughably inept, and the players were greedy and immature. These are the explosive revelations revealed by a leaked report into England's shambolic Rugby World Cup campaign.
This caught my eye:
Quote
"Ireland had been in there [the Altitude Bar in Queenstown] and were much worse, but I think they might have taken the press with them."
The bit I don't get in all these inquests, furores and soul searching is that, in my opinion, England achieved exactly what they should have this World Cup. Whatever is up with their national development structures, the only player of genuine flair to arrive on the English scene since their RWC victory was Cipriani, who's a bit nuts.
Each of the four semi-finalists were better teams than England, as were each of the other quarter-finalists. So Johnson and co delivered exactly what the team was capable off imho. The RWC wasn't a disaster for England. An eye-opener perhaps, but not a disaster.