Padraic Joyce has retired

[IolarCoisCuain]

In all honesty I've always rated Michael Donnellan above Joyce. It's really about how you judge players - Donnellan's star undoubted burned brighter at its peak, for the All-Ireland chasing years he was quite literally the most devastating player in the country, but his career tailed off with injuries before its natural end.

Joyce's great achievement was his sheer consistency, never really the best player in the country at any one time, but always near the top of everyone's list. I think people forget Joyce was just a rookie in 1998 and was little more than 'another guy' on a very good team, people have associated that first All-Ireland in particular far too much with him simply because he's been the highest profile link to that team for so long.

I just value the short period of utter brilliance even more when it comes as the heartbeat of multiple All-Ireland winning team.

I still feel Galway could have won those All-Irelands without Joyce, but that there was no way on earth they could have without Donnellan - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dQw2a7Ej_NU - and for that reason I'll forever be the odd man out when it comes to Joyce's ultimate place in Galway and Connacht's history.

Donnellan won footballer of the year in 1998 and 2001. You mightn't be as far off the beaten track as you think in your assessment.

[GalwayBayBoy]

I still feel Galway could have won those All-Irelands without Joyce

Listen as a Galway fan who was there for all those games believe me when I say there is absolutely no way Galway would have won those All-Ireland's without PJ. He was the ultimate big game player. The bigger the game the more he delivered. The sign of a truly great player IMO.

In his first year at senior and Galway down 3 points at HT against Kildare in 98 final. He scores 1-1 in the 2nd half the goal coming right after the break and pretty much kicked off the Galway surge.

2000 semi against Kildare. Galway struggling against a super fit Kildare side himself and Donnellan give an exhibition in the second half to win the game.

Drawn final against Kerry in 2000. Galway 7 points down in the first half. He's moved to centre-forward and masterminds a great comeback. In injury time he runs free in acres of space only for Derek Savage not to see him somehow. Otherwise he would have buried Kerry in the last minute. As he's leaving the field he tells his teammates "you can't give Kerry a second chance".

2001 final against Meath.  He has a very poor first half by his own high standards but gives one of the greatest ever Al final displays in the 2nd half. As poor as he was early on he asks his teammates at HT to keep giving him the ball and he wins the game for them almost on his own.

There were plenty of great performances after that in much weaker Galway sides that almost went unnoticed but such is life.

And Donnellan was great. A ridiculously exciting athletic talent in his prime but by 2003 he was already winding down due to constant niggling injuries. PJ was still playing for Galway almost a full 10 years later which is kinda mad when you think about it.

[SLIGONIAN]

Ya PJ, never liked seeing his name in the teamsheet when playing ourselves. The thing i liked most about Joyce was how conducted himself on the field, i never see pull a dirty stroke. Im not sure he was the most talented footballer ever but he has one of the best football brains ive ever see. His reading of space and fooling his marker was second to none and a lethal left foot. He was never greedy either. Enjoy your retirement and thanks for the memories excluding the ones against Sligo but it was truly an honour to watch you play.

[JimStynes]

In all honesty I've always rated Michael Donnellan above Joyce. It's really about how you judge players - Donnellan's star undoubted burned brighter at its peak, for the All-Ireland chasing years he was quite literally the most devastating player in the country, but his career tailed off with injuries before its natural end.

Joyce's great achievement was his sheer consistency, never really the best player in the country at any one time, but always near the top of everyone's list. I think people forget Joyce was just a rookie in 1998 and was little more than 'another guy' on a very good team, people have associated that first All-Ireland in particular far too much with him simply because he's been the highest profile link to that team for so long.

I just value the short period of utter brilliance even more when it comes as the heartbeat of multiple All-Ireland winning team.

I still feel Galway could have won those All-Irelands without Joyce, but that there was no way on earth they could have without Donnellan - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dQw2a7Ej_NU - and for that reason I'll forever be the odd man out when it comes to Joyce's ultimate place in Galway and Connacht's history.

Donnellan won footballer of the year in 1998 and 2001. You mightn't be as far off the beaten track as you think in your assessment.

I also think that out of both players, in their prime, donnellan was the better of the two. Used to love watching donnellan get the ball deep in his own half and just start flying up the field and leaving men dead with his pace. With type of game he played though he was never going to last as long as Joyce unfortunately.

[INDIANA]

In all honesty I've always rated Michael Donnellan above Joyce. It's really about how you judge players - Donnellan's star undoubted burned brighter at its peak, for the All-Ireland chasing years he was quite literally the most devastating player in the country, but his career tailed off with injuries before its natural end.

Joyce's great achievement was his sheer consistency, never really the best player in the country at any one time, but always near the top of everyone's list. I think people forget Joyce was just a rookie in 1998 and was little more than 'another guy' on a very good team, people have associated that first All-Ireland in particular far too much with him simply because he's been the highest profile link to that team for so long.

I just value the short period of utter brilliance even more when it comes as the heartbeat of multiple All-Ireland winning team.

I still feel Galway could have won those All-Irelands without Joyce, but that there was no way on earth they could have without Donnellan - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dQw2a7Ej_NU - and for that reason I'll forever be the odd man out when it comes to Joyce's ultimate place in Galway and Connacht's history.

rarely read a post i disagree with more. you're not the odd man out - you just look like a plonker unfortunately.

[Denn Forever]

He was no Larry Reilly though.

What are Galway going to do without him?  He had strenght and guile,attributes that make a good forward.

Enjoy the inter county retirement and enjoy the club footall for many years to come.

[Syferus]

In all honesty I've always rated Michael Donnellan above Joyce. It's really about how you judge players - Donnellan's star undoubted burned brighter at its peak, for the All-Ireland chasing years he was quite literally the most devastating player in the country, but his career tailed off with injuries before its natural end.

Joyce's great achievement was his sheer consistency, never really the best player in the country at any one time, but always near the top of everyone's list. I think people forget Joyce was just a rookie in 1998 and was little more than 'another guy' on a very good team, people have associated that first All-Ireland in particular far too much with him simply because he's been the highest profile link to that team for so long.

I just value the short period of utter brilliance even more when it comes as the heartbeat of multiple All-Ireland winning team.

I still feel Galway could have won those All-Irelands without Joyce, but that there was no way on earth they could have without Donnellan - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dQw2a7Ej_NU - and for that reason I'll forever be the odd man out when it comes to Joyce's ultimate place in Galway and Connacht's history.

rarely read a post i disagree with more. you're not the odd man out - you just look like a plonker unfortunately.

Well done being classy.

[INDIANA]

nothing classy about claiming one of the all greats as being a passenger on two all-ireland winning teams when he damn well won one on his own!!

[imtommygunn]

Did you see the second half of the 2001 ai final syferus?

Either you're trying to be controversial or you know nothing about football!

I saw him play in maghera one day where he was not so affectionately called slippy tit all day though he was a man who could draw frees. He was a winner as well as a great footballer.

[Syferus]

nothing classy about claiming one of the all greats as being a passenger on two all-ireland winning teams when he damn well won one on his own!!

I think only you could read that into what was said.

[INDIANA]

nothing classy about claiming one of the all greats as being a passenger on two all-ireland winning teams when he damn well won one on his own!!

I think only you could read that into what was said.

what part of galway would have won those two all-irelands without him did I miss?

[GalwayBayBoy]

Nice piece by Keith Duggan in the Times today. Probably writes about Connacht football better than anyone.

Joyce's career an amalgam of style, substance and commitment

KEITH DUGGAN

SIDELINE CUT: They pronounce the name with a scything flatness and to all Galwegians, Pádraic Joyce was always either "Jiyce" or "PJ".

Ever since his star-bursting summer of 1998, Joyce has eclipsed West of Ireland politicians, singers and television stars in terms of instant recognition and importance. The significance you attach to the news this week that he is to retire from Galway football depends on how well you understand Ireland.

The late lamented John McGahern remarked in a radio interview during the height of the silliness that Ireland had changed more in the last 15 years than in the previous 200. He may have been a bit previous in that pronouncement but there is no question that in a bewilderingly fast and false period it was difficult to be certain of what had substance and what was mere illusion. Through it all, Gaelic games remained one of the most trustworthy prisms through which to interpret the country. And within that framework, Joyce possessed a brightness that was impossible to ignore.

It was pure serendipity that Galway happened to have a talented filmmaker in its squad and that John O'Mahony was sufficiently liberal to allow Pat Comer to capture the 1998 season as it unfolded, from the unspeakably black nights which characterise the west of Ireland winters to the hallucinatory days which followed their September All-Ireland victory. That victory, of course, bridged the gap to Galway's eternally Brylcreemed bunch of 1964, '65,'66.

The three-in-a-row side conferred on Galway a permanent place in football's hierarchy. They were, as the Italians say, made men. It didn't matter that they could go through moribund years where they scarcely caused a ripple on the football summer. Deep down, there was a sense that a latent greatness lurked within those flickering maroon teams. And they rushed from nowhere in 1998.

Joyce was the kid on that team, the black-haired full forward with the deceptively quick step and an uncanny knack for making space and kicking these heartbreakingly perfect scores. He scored the goal that tilted the All-Ireland final against Kildare in Galway's favour and celebrated it with the slightly furtive gesture that would become emblematic: head bowed and arm held aloft.

Joyce was from the football heartland of east Galway; the family was a football family and he had schooled at St Jarlath's. He followed the same path as Seán Purcell had done in the 1940s. He won two All-Irelands in three seasons and when the arc of Galway's football team began to decline – and it was a slow curve – he could have taken a quick look around and decided that it was time for him to skip town. One by one, his former team-mates began to fall away and when Michael Donnellan, the undisputed football genius of the era, walked away, Galway's chances of winning another All-Ireland greatly diminished.

It was in the years after that, when Galway slipped back into the pack and Armagh and Tyrone engineered a football revolution, that Joyce's real brilliance became apparent. On good days and bad days for Galway, he never failed to do something that was so brilliantly quick-witted and unexpected that it made everyone in the stadium kind of gasp.

I remember taking my son to a Connacht final when he was four. The whole kick for him was the press box because of the fact that it was an improvised lorry. Of the game, he said only: "The number 11 did everything." Depressingly, he had summed up in five words what I intended taking a 1,000 to explain – there was no more scathing indictment of the futility of this job. Joyce was the No 11 that day.

I interviewed him just once, on the occasion of his captaincy of the Irish International Rules team. He was dead pleasant and just as moderate; like many GAA players, he has made a career out of saying very little in public because if he said what he actually thought about things, he would undoubtedly come across as too caustic and sharp.

On summer days of Galway disappointment, we watched him walk quickly out of dressing rooms in Roscommon or Salthill, bag thrown over his shoulder and head bowed and figured that that would be his exit from Galway football. But for 16 seasons, he showed up for more. He couldn't not.

In recent seasons, he has become a totemic figure in Galway football. The frame thickened a little and the black hair was silver dusted at the temples but the mind and eye were as quick as ever and he manufactured space and scores from nothing. You could see what he meant to younger players from across the country when they shook hands after games.

Much has changed over Pádraic Joyce's playing career.The country became loud, tipsy and grotesque and inevitably it all fell apart. Pat Comer's film caught a moment of Irish life at a very delicate, complex period when everything and everyone was on the verge: things were about to take off.

Watching Joyce play football on a dewy spring day in Tuam or during the height of the championship was for Galway people a vivid connection to that 1998 season but more generally, his presence was a truly eloquent example of grace and commitment and poise and belief in something real – values that were badly in want in this country. He played his heart out for as long as he could.

[Rossfan]

Did you see the second half of the 2001 ai final syferus?

Sure he was only 18 months old then 
I keep tellin ye not to pass any heed on Sufferingus' oul nonsense which is a source of great embarrassment to us Rosfolk.

[mouview]

In all honesty I've always rated Michael Donnellan above Joyce. It's really about how you judge players - Donnellan's star undoubted burned brighter at its peak, for the All-Ireland chasing years he was quite literally the most devastating player in the country, but his career tailed off with injuries before its natural end.

Joyce's great achievement was his sheer consistency, never really the best player in the country at any one time, but always near the top of everyone's list. I think people forget Joyce was just a rookie in 1998 and was little more than 'another guy' on a very good team, people have associated that first All-Ireland in particular far too much with him simply because he's been the highest profile link to that team for so long.

I just value the short period of utter brilliance even more when it comes as the heartbeat of multiple All-Ireland winning team.

I still feel Galway could have won those All-Irelands without Joyce, but that there was no way on earth they could have without Donnellan - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dQw2a7Ej_NU - and for that reason I'll forever be the odd man out when it comes to Joyce's ultimate place in Galway and Connacht's history.

Very hard to agree with 'Galway winning without Joyce', but I take your point about Donnellan being a better player. In a way he was more brilliant and was arguably unequalled in his physical gifts, especially with his searing pace. But Donnellan had a good few quiet days whereas Joyce had much less so. Additionally lingering, chronic injuries conspired against Donellan, while Joyce probably had a better focus and attitude overall.

In a way, it's like comparing short-term brilliance Donnellan / Joe Canning to long-term influence / match craft Shefflin / Joyce.

[Syferus]

You know, I didn't mean Joyce wasn't an important part in the AI seasons - particularly 2001, I was there when he picked us apart in the AIQF in Castlebar - but that if we were to ask who of Donnellan and Joyce could have been injured/not there and Galway still have a live chance at the titles it'd have to be Joyce because Donnellan was such an unreal game-breaker at his peak, all the cutest of Joyce with the pace and raw talent of the all-time greats. I'm not arguing Galway wouldn't have been a poorer team without Joyce.

I just think in Joyce's absence players like Sean Og, Savage, Walsh and Fallon could hope to pick up the slack from his role, simply by how deep the attacking talent from 4-15 was in that Galway team, but that the things Donnellan could do no one else could ever hope to replicate.