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However, for the likes of Fiji, Somoa etc, they really need to be allowed to hold onto their best players and not represent the All-Black team, or should that be New Zealand and South Sea Island select

Are the majority of these player not already born in New Zealand or Australia??

New Zealand had 3 island born players out of a squad of 33 (including Kaino who moved to NZ in early childhood). Australia had 1 out of a squad of 30 (though, they seem to have attracted lads born all over the show - Saudi Arabia, South Africa, Zimbabwe, Papua New Guinea). By contrast, Tonga had about half a dozen New Zealanders with them, and more than half of the Samoan squad was NZ born. With that in mind, I don't think the islands will be doing too much whinging about the player swapping.

[Clans?]

Next Question - where are those boys from?

Ryan Magennis - Clans?
David Lavery - Maghery?
Declan McKenna - Harps
Adrian Conlon Tullysaran?
Mark Shields - Whitecross
Aidan Forker - Maghery?
Michael Stevenson - Sarsfields?
James Donnelly - Killeavy
James Lavery - Maghery
Pauric Gribben - Ballymacnab
Brian Mallon - Tir na Og
Sean Moore - Ogs
Eugene McVerry - Mullaghbawn?
Stefan Forker - Maghery
Stefan Campbell - Clans

Subs: Sean Hughes - Ballymacnab?, Ryan Rafferty - Granemore, Paul Carvill - Tir na Og?, Conor White - Harps

Tipp Football semis at the arse end of October? What's to stop them (Westmeath, Waterford too - in fact all bar AI semi-finalists should) playing them in Aug/Sept, can hardly be that many dual players involved.  A lot of counties are doing a disservice to the games themselves, playing in gutters at this time of year when there's bugger all stopping Aug/Sept finals.

Tipp's minor team probably held the show up.

Foo Fighters at the Point in 2002. Great night, looks a bit shit here though.

That doesn't look like The Point in that video

Because it's not. It's the Ambassador. Didn't realise that they played in Dublin twice that year, as well as doing Witnness.

Foo Fighters at the Point in 2002. Great night, looks a bit shit here though.

its a lot more than 25% down to Fergies skills as a manager i think

having said that though, its not broadcasted as much as other clubs how much United have spent down through the years

This info is easily obtained

http://www.transferleague.co.uk/league-tables/1992-to-2011.html

Probably a bit lopsided due to Chelsea/Citys recent spending but shows Uniteds success down to way more than money..

Without info on wages, you're really only getting half the picture here.

Very sorry display from Ballymacnab. Outside of their outstanding keeper, they hadn't a single player that showed up on the day. A real pity for a club that evidently put in a lot of work around the place in preparation for the day.

Not that it would have made a blind bit of difference to the result, but if the Nab had've been set up a bit cuter they could've kept the score down a bit. They should've crowded the middle and their defence playing into that breeze in the first half. Instead they naively went man to man in defence and left their best players scratching their holes while the game was played up the other end of the pitch. Cross were out of sight before the Nab players had time to catch a breath.

Cross won their four championship games this year by an average of 16 points. I hope they win the AI to mollify that pretty depressing statistic at least a bit.

[but why should we reward 13 man defenses?]

Darran O'Sullivan scored 0-1 against Mayo the semi-final. Other than two early goal chances (both missed) he was well marked by Keith Higgins and had little influence.

Brogan did more in his semi-final than either O'Sullivan or Lacy. Debatable who did more in the final, I'd suggest probably O'Sullivan.

I'd give it to Brogan  with O'Sullivan a worthy winner if he gets the nod. Giving it to Lacey would be rewarding everything that is wrong with football, not Lacey's fault I might add, but why should we reward 13 man defenses?

Take the point about O'Sullivan in the semi-final but still think in the grand scheme of things he was the best individual this year.

Anybody that thinks that is all Lacey was about this year is extremely naive. I saw him play against Cavan, Tyrone, Kildare and Dublin and he is alot more than just a defender relying on those around him. His engine is unreal and as soon as the ball was turned over he was more often than not the man that carried the ball and got it going forward. He was involved and set up a lot of scores.

I remember against Cavan in particular, Seanie Johnston spent more time running after Karl Lacey than the other way around.

Lacey deserves more respect that somebody saying 'sure he had 12 lads around him'.

I'd rather give the award to someone that played against 13 men than one of the 13 men. The 13 man defense wasn't Lacey's fault so I am not attacking him personally, but why would we reward such negativity?

Right so don't give it to an outstanding defender or it's a reward for negativity.

Donegal may have played negatively but there were outstanding individual defensive contributions from McGee, Cassidy and Lacey. The allstars should reflect this though whether or not player of the year does remains to be seen.

Don't pretend my argument was something it wasn't. I played as a defender myself and have no problem with a defender winning the award. Most defenders don't have the luxury of 7 spare defenders to help out, that is simply my point.

Lacey's best work came when Donegal were in possession and going forward. I don't get how he was helped in this regard by the number of defenders left behind him.

It was a joke ye dry shites.

I think its the seeds pre qualifying tournament which has us 5th

It's not. It's the 'national team coefficients established at the conclusion of the group stage'.

http://www.uefa.com/uefaeuro2012/news/newsid=1689808.html

[both]

So Portugal, France, Croatia and Czech Rep would be top seeds? Would take Czech Republic.

No. Portugal, France, Croatia and Ireland are seeded as things stand. We'll be seeded as long as both Bosnia and Serbia don't win.

[Whoever we get we're surely gonna be massive underdogs]

Whoever we get we're surely gonna be massive underdogs that said it's great to be the play offs and be so close to a major tournament...

Even Estonia? The Czechs or Montenegro shouldn't have anyone quaking in their boots either. Some people need to realise that there are feck all decent international sides out there. Playing tight, percentages football like we do gives us a decent shot against the vast majority of opponents. One defeat in twenty qualifying games is an impressive record.

From Main Street's link a few pages back and the scores at present it looks like we'll still be seeded.

Looks like Croatia and Portugal will definitely be seeded. France will also be seeded if their score remains the same. We'll come in next, with Serbia not counting as they're currently losing in Slovenia. Montenegro, Turkey, Estonia and Czech Republic would go unseeded.

Not looking like being seeded. France Portugal turkey Belgium most likely above.

Belgium aren't even in the playoffs.

Funny game, nice result.

Thought Cox was decent and Walters looked very useful when he came on. Duff put in a good shift. Delighted Dunne got his goal.

Doyle looked to be in one of his moods and deserved to be lined. McGeady was largely shite, but has had a good campaign and is still better than Hunt.

With Doyle and Keane out for the first playoff game, wouldn't mind seeing a front two of Walters and Long. Nice mix of strength and pace there. Cox could be a great addition if he could do two good things in a row a bit more often.