Tyrone - Is this the end?

[Norf Tyrone]

I believe that Tyrone have lost a few years rebuilding due to too much loyalty to some of the old guard. I hate being harsh on players- especially the ones that delivered 3 x All Irelands- but I thought that more of them should've stepped aside over the last few seasons.

In fairness the 'but' will be who could've replaced them. Which would be a fair retort, but we would've seen more game time for people like Carlin, Cassidy, Colm Cavanagh pre this season, Mulgrew etc.

There are others who I felt could've been afforded an opportunity at some point e.g. Martin Murray.

[Mike Sheehy]

tbh, I dont think this is the time for the Kerry v Tyrone slagging. The time for that is before games, not in the immediate aftermath of defeats.

but..if ye want to go down that road......

Wind it in FFS! And don't be sore that we've deprived you once again of ending your 25 year hoodoo against us! 

decent teams do back 2 back semi-finals

[lenny]

I believe that Tyrone have lost a few years rebuilding due to too much loyalty to some of the old guard. I hate being harsh on players- especially the ones that delivered 3 x All Irelands- but I thought that more of them should've stepped aside over the last few seasons.

In fairness the 'but' will be who could've replaced them. Which would be a fair retort, but we would've seen more game time for people like Carlin, Cassidy, Colm Cavanagh pre this season, Mulgrew etc.

There are others who I felt could've been afforded an opportunity at some point e.g. Martin Murray.

Dublin could and prob should have beaten tyrone by about 15 points but I'm glad they didnt. Great players like Stepehn O'Neill, Jordan, Gormley and Dooher deserved to bow out in a big game at Croker in which they gave a respectable performance. They did ulster proud for the last decade.

[sheamy]

I believe that Tyrone have lost a few years rebuilding due to too much loyalty to some of the old guard. I hate being harsh on players- especially the ones that delivered 3 x All Irelands- but I thought that more of them should've stepped aside over the last few seasons.

In fairness the 'but' will be who could've replaced them. Which would be a fair retort, but we would've seen more game time for people like Carlin, Cassidy, Colm Cavanagh pre this season, Mulgrew etc.

There are others who I felt could've been afforded an opportunity at some point e.g. Martin Murray.

Dublin could and prob should have beaten tyrone by about 15 points but I'm glad they didnt. Great players like Stepehn O'Neill, Jordan, Gormley and Dooher deserved to bow out in a big game at Croker in which they gave a respectable performance. They did ulster proud for the last decade.

+1

[EC Unique]

Is this the end? Not a chance. Tyrone have structures for under age and school's football that are second no no other county. The conveyor will continue to supply quality and Tyrone will continue to be involved in the latter stages of the championship.

[snippets]

We need to have a serious look at what we are doing guys, and the type of footballers we are cultivating through these structures before we keep on spoofing about them. The structures dont allow for late developers and that class of footballer who missed out on the system is out on the cold with Tyrone football often on the call of a minor manager 

[tyronebhoy]

We need to have a serious look at what we are doing guys, and the type of footballers we are cultivating through these structures before we keep on spoofing about them. The structures dont allow for late developers and that class of footballer who missed out on the system is out on the cold with Tyrone football often on the call of a minor manager 

Did Mark Donnelly play much at minor level as I can't really remember him up until this season but you are right.  by and large the players who played minor and U21 get the nod ahead of others who improved as they got older.

[ONeill]

Was fitness an issue this year?

[AQMP]

I would think reports of Tyrone's death are somewhat exaggerated.

[naka]

Is this the end? Not a chance. Tyrone have structures for under age and school's football that are second no no other county. The conveyor will continue to supply quality and Tyrone will continue to be involved in the latter stages of the championship.

its not as easy as this just ask galway in hurling, a good underage set-up doesnt equate to all-irelands

[Rossfan]

I believe that Tyrone have lost a few years rebuilding due to too much loyalty to some of the old guard. I hate being harsh on players- especially the ones that delivered 3 x All Irelands- but I thought that more of them should've stepped aside over the last few seasons.

Looked gone in 2009 closing stages .. e.g Kildare should have beaten them but for terrible shooting in the closing stages, while cork beat them handy enough.
Still they had won an AI only 10 months beforehand so it was hard to expect MH to start rebuilding then.
He now seems to have fallen into the understandable trap that Merc O Dwyer fell into in the mid/late 80s when he kept on his old warriors too long.
You'd wonder if M H is the man to re build or is a whole fresh set up needed in Tyrone.

[Croí na hÉireann]

I think there tends to be overreaction and media spun exaggeration to defeats like this for a team that has won in the past. I think its the end fo Dooher. Thought Gormley and Jordan did fine yesterday though probably not as good as in their heyday. O'Neill looked electric when he came on. Of the others Cavanagh is playing well and the new lads like Peter Harte & Mark Donnelly are lively. Though Brian McGuigan looked good esterday (why was he taken off?). Tyrone can easily contend next year. The major problem I see is the lack of pace in their defence. The two McMahon's just aren't playing as well as in other years and a lot of the rest are decent but similar. Gormley has slowed and can't handle the oppositions main man any more. So new "shutdown" options need to emerge or a new defensive system is needed.

I've maintained since Canavan retired that O'Neill was simply irreplaceable and he still is.

As I posted in the other thread I would agree with all of this apart from the bit about Brian McGuigan. I thought Brennan did an excellent job on him and anytime McGuigan got on the ball there was no one available for the pass. I'd expect to see them all reporting for duty next year apart from Dooher and Jordan.

[rrhf]

To agree with the posts above, I have seen great lads and footballers who by the call of the county minor manager of the time has missed out on minor selection and any hope of an intercounty career is over.   So no matter what size of development squad or indeed how much work we put into lads at an early age -  it still comes down to the call of the Tyrone minor manager.  If he makes a tight call and not on your side, your chances of a future senior intercounty career is almost zero, and you are only 18. On another note do lads playing for under 21s really believe that they are going to play for Tyrone seniors.  The glass ceiling is testament to the success of the senior players, but If I was Tyrone manager this year and thinking to the future Id have been allowing Coney, Mc Kenna, Mc Caul, Mc Nabb and others every chance to establish themselves and would have had had Hughes, Mc Ginley, and Dooher behind them. Unfortunately the cut must run deeper now and like it or not it will be 2014 at the earliest before we can have a team experienced and young enough to win something major.  Lets not leave lads on benches going stale like 2 great prospects Raymie Mulgrew and Peter Donnelly.       

[Orangemac]

In the last 50 years only 5 teams have won 3 AIs with the same nucleus of a team so for that alone Tyrone should be remembered.

That's an interesting one. To save me the bother of looking it up, can you list them?

dublin
meath
kerry
tyrone
down

I can only take a wild guess that Galway's 3 in a row team is one of them. Not 100% on that though.

Galway would be one of them but you couldn't really include Meath as how many from 1988 were there in 1996? 2 or 3?

There was a fair gap between 1961 and 1968 with Down but a fair few of them were still around I think.

On the subject of back to backs did Offaly not win 2 in a row around 1971/1972? Of all teams of the last 50 years they receive no mention at all even the 1982 Offaly team are more heralded nationally , more to the circumstances of their win I suppose.

[Radda bout yeee]

We need to have a serious look at what we are doing guys, and the type of footballers we are cultivating through these structures before we keep on spoofing about them. The structures dont allow for late developers and that class of footballer who missed out on the system is out on the cold with Tyrone football often on the call of a minor manager 

Did Mark Donnelly play much at minor level as I can't really remember him up until this season but you are right.  by and large the players who played minor and U21 get the nod ahead of others who improved as they got older.

Mark Donnelly never played minors but he did play under 21's. Only for sheer determination and attitude he would have been missed like a few others who threw in the county bucket after not making minors.
Correct me if i'm wrong but i think i heard Ricey never played minors or U-21's and bust onto the scene soon after.