Munster 1st round Cork V Tipp

[theskull1]

Tipp struggled with AOS in the NHL and did nothing yesterday to counteract him in the air yesterday. That Tipp forward line bar Eoin kelly has no backbone when it comes to winning dirty ball. EK is a proven top class forward who can take punishment. You don't get rid of that. Lads like Callinan are Christmas decorations that only perform then the team plays well. Noel Mc Grath had an off day as did Corbett but I'd have no faith in the rest. But even still neither of them are ball winners.

Who is AOS (Aisake O Halipin )

Think this showed up Tipps shortcomings on the sideline at this level. Yes when everyones on their game tipps hurling is great to watch and they can mix it with the best but the reality is that their game is too reliant on everybody being "on their game". They have zero game plan...they just hurl (like waterford). Ball after ball after ball in the first half was just drilled aimlessly out of defense into a tightly defended central forward area. Compare that to how cork kept looking to maintain possession and create space up front to exlpoit. No one in a Tipp jersey looked up and that told me they weren't told to. And whilst were talking about keeping possession, puck out after puckout went short and Cusask (as hateful as I find him) is the best in the business at disguising the length of his puckouts and finding players short. Tipp had nothing on their puckouts.....the cork wing half forwards, the midfield and the half back line made sure of that. It really was rabbits in the headlights for tipp yesterday. They had all winter to step up a level in terms of tactical awareness and they haven't. They'll rebound no doubt but I think they haven't got the game to beat the teams that "know" how to win (KK & Ck at this stage).

Think yesterday showed the benefits of keeping faith in a big awkward hurler. How many big men are lost to the game at an early age because their stickwork wasn't up to standard?

And all this praise heaped on Sean Og for his performance yesterday Gardiner and Cusack had top drawer performances but I thought O Halpin was a 6/10 and no more up against a clueless tipp forward line. The Ck defensive unit I'd give 9/10 because they got it so right tactically

[johnneycool]

Dunno where Sheedy goes after that. Problems in every line on the park. I mean one of their forwards goes through on goal gets bottled up, has 2 forwards on the 21 waiting to tap it over. Instead tries a a drop shot from 23 yards which doesn't go 2 yards and the ball is cleared. Nothing Sheedy can do about that.

Struck me yesterday the team is too young. Tipp have too many lads in key positions who are too inexperienced by the looks of it. EK can't be everywhere. He has enough to do be doing marking Cadogan who is a good hurler. But he got no support up there yesterday. Not sure they have the replacements either. Most people were basing their assessment on Tipp's first 15 replicating last years performances. Hammersley looked lively when he came on. Hennessy was a star minor but he didn't catch any puckouts when he came on. Gearoid Ryan is a good hurler but I couldn't honestly pick his best position. I don't envy Sheedy's task where people are expecting an all-ireland as their basis for a good season.

If Cork can keep that level of performance up they'll give anyone a game.
Except Kilkenny.

Will Paul Kelly be making it back any time soon as they'll need him?

[bottlethrower7]

I'd be loathe to start dancing on Tipp's grave just yet. A single game can seriously skew perspective, especially when a team either wins or loses by a lot. The truth is often somewhere far short of people's initial reaction though, in my opinion.

Just as Tipp probably aren't as good as they showed in september, I really believe they aren't as bad as they looked yesterday. But it is a serious blow and I'd doubt their ability to salvage anything from this year's championship. They're a beaten team now, and taking that frailty on into the qualifiers is something that will be hard to overcome. I expect they will feature later in the summer, but that doubt will linger.

They have no strength in depth either. They had a couple of starters that will need to do a lot to convince that  they'll ever be anything other than passengers. Then springing lads that have little or no experience to replace them. But that facet of Tipp isn't new. Time and time again they resorted to springing Benny Dunne from the bench when he was gone past his best. How have they not managed to unearth any new talent, especially considering the relatively decent underage sides they've produced? Cork, in contrast, brought on Cussen and O'Sullivan who, while both inexperienced also, you'd feel would contribute positively when introduced.

Where do they go from here? They have to continue as they've been going. I don't see they've any choice other than to do that. Sheedy needs to go. Not now, but he does need to go. He has brought some cohesion and unity to Tipp as a panel, and that was needed after the disastrous reigns of babs and doyle. But now he needs to hand over to someone who can bring the best out of Tipp as a hurling force. Whether that person is a Tipp person or not, who can say, but these repeated troughs that Tipp have been hitting, are disastrous.

When is the last time Tipp have strung 2 good seasons together? Or let me rephrase, when is the last time Tipp could be said to have put in a good season, then build on that the following year? Even in Nicky's time he seemed to go from a few very low seasons to winning the all-Ireland almost all of a sudden. Last year for Tipp came out of the blue, relative to previous years. Now this?

Someone down there needs to take things by the scruff. There was an article in the sunday times yesterday about Cork not taking measures to ensure their future. I think that article would read better if it were about Tipp. In contrast to Cork, Tipp actually have the players coming through. They're just not coming that extra yard through to senior. For every Lar Corbett there seems to be 2 Willie Ryans or Pa Bourkes. Lads like that should have the work put into them to bring them through because, just as Tipp haven't become a bad team overnight, lads like those 2 don't become bad players overnight either.

[Reillers]

I think we're all getting a little bit too far ahead of ourselves..like a country mile ahead of ourselves.
Cork were excellent and that can only do well for Cork and be a positive thing if we're able to keep the intensity and everything we saw yesterday, up. Tipp had a bad day out, and it was a really bad day out, but that's what it was, a bad day out where their weaknesses were really shown up. Every team has them, and they just didn't get going from the start, while Cork started and finished at 100 miles an hour.
Tipp will unfortunately be back in the qualifers and out the other side, you don't become a bad side over night. I think it was just a bit of a nasty AI hangover, and this should really motivate them now. They're a bit like Cork in that way.

[dowling]

Have to agree to an extent with bottlethrower and reillers. Good win for Cork and bad day for Tipp. But although the margin of the win was unexpected, considering Tipp have only won once in Cork since 1923 I think, even during years when Tipp were winning quite a bit more, I don't think yesterday's result should have been a total surprise. What was surprising was Tipp's lack of penetration and from about twenty minutes in looked like a team heavy on their legs. While I wouldn't rate Sean óg's performance highly, only towards the end he seemed to show, there's no doubting the Cork backs had a day of it.
Still think Cork are lacking in the forwards though. Aisake was a handful yesterday but fluffs more than he makes use of. And even though he scored two points Niall McCarthy is in the same mould. I'd be very surprised if there's not a better forward on the bench. If Ben OConnor was to get injured this Cork team would have a big hole to fill.
Anyway the questions are does this mean Cork are back and can Tipp recover. In spite of Zulu trying to tease us no one ever said they'd gone away, just that they weren't the force they used to be, although yesterday's performance wasn't to be dismissed. Those long and direct balls did pay dividends. What must Ger be thinking.
Can't see Tipp becoming a bad team overnight and whatever was wrong with them yesterday expect them to be thereabouts at the end of the championship.
One question I would ask about this resurgence; Was the 'fair play' money used to good effect for panel development and was that the secret of yesterday's performance? And should other counties now be putting more emphasis on that award?
While I've no admiration for a lot of those players for their vindictivness during their strike it makes for a more interesting championship and the more teams challanging for it the better.

[INDIANA]

I'd be loathe to start dancing on Tipp's grave just yet. A single game can seriously skew perspective, especially when a team either wins or loses by a lot. The truth is often somewhere far short of people's initial reaction though, in my opinion.

Just as Tipp probably aren't as good as they showed in september, I really believe they aren't as bad as they looked yesterday. But it is a serious blow and I'd doubt their ability to salvage anything from this year's championship. They're a beaten team now, and taking that frailty on into the qualifiers is something that will be hard to overcome. I expect they will feature later in the summer, but that doubt will linger.

They have no strength in depth either. They had a couple of starters that will need to do a lot to convince that  they'll ever be anything other than passengers. Then springing lads that have little or no experience to replace them. But that facet of Tipp isn't new. Time and time again they resorted to springing Benny Dunne from the bench when he was gone past his best. How have they not managed to unearth any new talent, especially considering the relatively decent underage sides they've produced? Cork, in contrast, brought on Cussen and O'Sullivan who, while both inexperienced also, you'd feel would contribute positively when introduced.

Where do they go from here? They have to continue as they've been going. I don't see they've any choice other than to do that. Sheedy needs to go. Not now, but he does need to go. He has brought some cohesion and unity to Tipp as a panel, and that was needed after the disastrous reigns of babs and doyle. But now he needs to hand over to someone who can bring the best out of Tipp as a hurling force. Whether that person is a Tipp person or not, who can say, but these repeated troughs that Tipp have been hitting, are disastrous.

When is the last time Tipp have strung 2 good seasons together? Or let me rephrase, when is the last time Tipp could be said to have put in a good season, then build on that the following year? Even in Nicky's time he seemed to go from a few very low seasons to winning the all-Ireland almost all of a sudden. Last year for Tipp came out of the blue, relative to previous years. Now this?

Someone down there needs to take things by the scruff. There was an article in the sunday times yesterday about Cork not taking measures to ensure their future. I think that article would read better if it were about Tipp. In contrast to Cork, Tipp actually have the players coming through. They're just not coming that extra yard through to senior. For every Lar Corbett there seems to be 2 Willie Ryans or Pa Bourkes. Lads like that should have the work put into them to bring them through because, just as Tipp haven't become a bad team overnight, lads like those 2 don't become bad players overnight either.

A lot of Tipps best underage players hit the booze too hard unfortunately. Sheedy can't exactly put minders on them.You also forget that Cork have more GAA clubs then anyone else. Cork have done very well at junior and intermediate all-ireland level. People worry about them in the senior club championship and their dreadful record in it. The strength of Cork hurling is in the country clubs outside the city now and the club scene reflects that.
When Cork had to field a self-inflicted 3rd string last year they stayed with most teams in Div 1. Limericks 3rd string were beaten by 30 points by Dublin . The sheer arrogance which I despise about Cork hurling and their fans is actually well founded in the belief that you will always find hurlers in Cork. You will because of the amount of clubs they have.
Mighn't be any harm anyway. Might put a spanner in the works of Munster rugby whose fans I have a pain in my arse listening to.

[DUBSFORSAM1]

Tipp have the same problems they have had most of the last couple of years in that they don't have a good half forward line who can win 50-50 balls or even 40-60 balls....They need to get a few big guys who can hurl into the team.

[johnneycool]

I'd be loathe to start dancing on Tipp's grave just yet. A single game can seriously skew perspective, especially when a team either wins or loses by a lot. The truth is often somewhere far short of people's initial reaction though, in my opinion.

Just as Tipp probably aren't as good as they showed in september, I really believe they aren't as bad as they looked yesterday. But it is a serious blow and I'd doubt their ability to salvage anything from this year's championship. They're a beaten team now, and taking that frailty on into the qualifiers is something that will be hard to overcome. I expect they will feature later in the summer, but that doubt will linger.

They have no strength in depth either. They had a couple of starters that will need to do a lot to convince that  they'll ever be anything other than passengers. Then springing lads that have little or no experience to replace them. But that facet of Tipp isn't new. Time and time again they resorted to springing Benny Dunne from the bench when he was gone past his best. How have they not managed to unearth any new talent, especially considering the relatively decent underage sides they've produced? Cork, in contrast, brought on Cussen and O'Sullivan who, while both inexperienced also, you'd feel would contribute positively when introduced.

Where do they go from here? They have to continue as they've been going. I don't see they've any choice other than to do that. Sheedy needs to go. Not now, but he does need to go. He has brought some cohesion and unity to Tipp as a panel, and that was needed after the disastrous reigns of babs and doyle. But now he needs to hand over to someone who can bring the best out of Tipp as a hurling force. Whether that person is a Tipp person or not, who can say, but these repeated troughs that Tipp have been hitting, are disastrous.

When is the last time Tipp have strung 2 good seasons together? Or let me rephrase, when is the last time Tipp could be said to have put in a good season, then build on that the following year? Even in Nicky's time he seemed to go from a few very low seasons to winning the all-Ireland almost all of a sudden. Last year for Tipp came out of the blue, relative to previous years. Now this?

Someone down there needs to take things by the scruff. There was an article in the sunday times yesterday about Cork not taking measures to ensure their future. I think that article would read better if it were about Tipp. In contrast to Cork, Tipp actually have the players coming through. They're just not coming that extra yard through to senior. For every Lar Corbett there seems to be 2 Willie Ryans or Pa Bourkes. Lads like that should have the work put into them to bring them through because, just as Tipp haven't become a bad team overnight, lads like those 2 don't become bad players overnight either.

A lot of Tipps best underage players hit the booze too hard unfortunately. Sheedy can't exactly put minders on them.You also forget that Cork have more GAA clubs then anyone else. Cork have done very well at junior and intermediate all-ireland level. People worry about them in the senior club championship and their dreadful record in it. The strength of Cork hurling is in the country clubs outside the city now and the club scene reflects that.
When Cork had to field a self-inflicted 3rd string last year they stayed with most teams in Div 1. Limericks 3rd string were beaten by 30 points by Dublin . The sheer arrogance which I despise about Cork hurling and their fans is actually well founded in the belief that you will always find hurlers in Cork. You will because of the amount of clubs they have.
Mighn't be any harm anyway. Might put a spanner in the works of Munster rugby whose fans I have a pain in my arse listening to.

In as much as I'd agree with you that Cork have a huge number of clubs surely Tipp aren't exactly picking from a small pool of players themselves and must have the second largest number of hurling clubs to pick from.

[Zulu]

Good win for Cork but a poor match and Tipp were woeful. Will all the boys here who were writing off Cork after one or two poor performances after the 'strike' and telling us that this was proof they were wrong to take action now be back on to say otherwise?

Away and catch yourself on.

Why? Lots of muppets came on here and claimed that some of Cork's performances post-strike showed that it was the players who were the problem. Donal Og was written off as were many others, yet I bet that none of you will be on here to accept yer comments were idiotic. As it happens I don't think that this performance today justifies anything but I didn't think that any poor performances since the strike proved anything either so I'm just interested in seeing if the Cork bashers will retracted some of their stupid comments in the months post-strike.

I don't want to take this off-topic but some of the comments by some posters when Cork put in a bad performance in the past two years deserve to be highlighted for teh bullshit they were.

As for Cork, they could well win a poor Munster championship now but they still aren't great.

Was the all-ireland won today? Strange I thought it was a first round game. Will someone please put  me in time machine so I can be transported to the first week of september. Was driving down Jones Road today- didn't see any Cork flags.

Rubbish, a number of lads around here tried to equate a league loss as proof of Cork's demise and that it showed the strike was a failure as the Cork lads previous performances in the championship had nothing to do with McCARTHY AND ALL TO DO WITH THE PLAYERS THEMSELVES. We now know this to be rubbish but anyone who knew their sport always thought this to be the case. I notice none of of those soothsayers have acknowleged their stupidity but instead ignore their previous comments and continue on their merry way.

In saying that I think anyone who thinks this is the re-emergence of Cork needs their head examined. Tipp were awful and Cork were a one trick pony and once AOS is taken care of, which isn't difficult, they'll struggle.

[theskull1]

Rubbish, a number of lads around here tried to equate a league loss as proof of Cork's demise and that it showed the strike was a failure as the Cork lads previous performances in the championship had nothing to do with McCARTHY AND ALL TO DO WITH THE PLAYERS THEMSELVES. We now know this to be rubbish but anyone who knew their sport always thought this to be the case. I notice none of of those soothsayers have acknowleged their stupidity but instead ignore their previous comments and continue on their merry way.

In saying that I think anyone who thinks this is the re-emergence of Cork needs their head examined. Tipp were awful and Cork were a one trick pony and once AOS is taken care of, which isn't difficult, they'll struggle.

Why don't you name names Zulu just so that people don't feel you're pointing the finger at them.

There's a contradictory nature to that post btw

I agree with the latter part of it though. Tipp asked Cork no questions yesterday, so we'll have to see how they react come the time those questions are asked before proper judgement can be made regarding corks revival over the medium term

[Zulu]

I haven't named anyone as those who jumped the gun should know themselves and I don't want to turn this into a 'strike' topic again. However, I did feel it needed to be highlighted as there was a lot of complete BS posted here after the Cork strike by posters who were simply trying to point score when the issue should have been left go. The fact that none of them have come on to accept the stupidity of thier comments just highlights the fact that they were trying to use any Cork failure as a stick to beat the players with rather than a fair analysis of the situation.

Where is the contradiction in my posts, I've asked already but I haven't got an answer?

I agree with the latter part of that post though. Tipp asked Cork no questions yesterday. So we'll have to see how they react before a proper judgement can be made regarding corks revival over the medium term

I thought Cork were poor in many ways yesterday and while they might win Munster, as their is only a decent Waterford standing in their way, I doubt they have enough for Galway and they definitely don't have enough for Kilkenny.

[INDIANA]

Good win for Cork but a poor match and Tipp were woeful. Will all the boys here who were writing off Cork after one or two poor performances after the 'strike' and telling us that this was proof they were wrong to take action now be back on to say otherwise?

Away and catch yourself on.

Why? Lots of muppets came on here and claimed that some of Cork's performances post-strike showed that it was the players who were the problem. Donal Og was written off as were many others, yet I bet that none of you will be on here to accept yer comments were idiotic. As it happens I don't think that this performance today justifies anything but I didn't think that any poor performances since the strike proved anything either so I'm just interested in seeing if the Cork bashers will retracted some of their stupid comments in the months post-strike.

I don't want to take this off-topic but some of the comments by some posters when Cork put in a bad performance in the past two years deserve to be highlighted for teh bullshit they were.

As for Cork, they could well win a poor Munster championship now but they still aren't great.

Was the all-ireland won today? Strange I thought it was a first round game. Will someone please put  me in time machine so I can be transported to the first week of september. Was driving down Jones Road today- didn't see any Cork flags.

Rubbish, a number of lads around here tried to equate a league loss as proof of Cork's demise and that it showed the strike was a failure as the Cork lads previous performances in the championship had nothing to do with McCARTHY AND ALL TO DO WITH THE PLAYERS THEMSELVES. We now know this to be rubbish but anyone who knew their sport always thought this to be the case. I notice none of of those soothsayers have acknowleged their stupidity but instead ignore their previous comments and continue on their merry way.

In saying that I think anyone who thinks this is the re-emergence of Cork needs their head examined. Tipp were awful and Cork were a one trick pony and once AOS is taken care of, which isn't difficult, they'll struggle.

Who exactly Zulu? You want to personalise things -don't sit on the fence. Either put up or shut up.

[theskull1]

Where is the contradiction in my posts, I've asked already but I haven't got an answer?

Well on one hand as a result of corks performance yesterday you want certain posters to acknowledge their stupidity for suggesting that the cork team (particularly the strikers) just weren't up to it anymore. You then state that you weren't that impressed with cork. Is that not contradictory?

[Canalman]

Honestly think Tipp gambed on "peaking" later on in the Championship and got it wrong...... very wrong. They imo looked like a team in the midst of heavy physical training or less likely overtrained.Stll think they will be there or there abouts if they regroup well and " circle the wagons "and sharpen up in training. The younger lads will learn that September 2009 is long gone and 2010 success will have to be earnt and not handed to them.

Have a hunch that Waterford will do well this summer.

[theskull1]

Can someone tell me when Tipp actually look to be playing with a gameplan because I can't see it. When they're on form they'll test any team because they have great hurlers in their panel but KK and CK play with a strategy and you can see it. On an off day a proper strategy can still get you over the line. Tipp had an off day and looked clueless