Antrim Hurling

[btdtgtt]

i was thinking the same myself.

if it fails sell casement off and let them build houses/commercial properties etc. find a greenfield site and build it there. the residents get no compensation package at all.

It won't fail - Sinn Fein have a vested interest in securing the new ground for West belfast. There is other sites nearby earmarked for housing. That's why their Minister is now saying the money is ring-fenced - they want the stadium too.
As for building it on a Greenfield site - I dare say some in Ulster Council and maybe even Antrim would support this.
It would be a disgrace! I think suggesting such a thing is a disgrace!
Ireland's 2nd biggest City without a central GAA presence and no county ground? Do you really want Belfast to become a worse GAA story than Derry City?
Also - but of lesser significance - The infrastructure is in Belfast.
Casement is a traditional / spiritual home - even since being re-re-possessed from the Britsh Army.Why should the incompetent procedures of others rob Belfast gaels of a stadium they have cherished, it's not their fault.

i dont understand how they are entitled to any money in the first place. ravenhill went up without a mute and it situated in an area where property is at a mental high and Windsor has went up without a mute either.

The residents have never claimed they just want money. A new stadium but of smaller size is their agenda. The reason the other stadia didnt face such objections is because the planning process was followed correctly in these situations. Blame the proceess not the residents.

Talk seems to be that SF will pull moves to secure the money into the new year.
The government money handcuffs Ulster Council to the project.
A new Casement is built (with DUP trying to change the name) on a smaller scale - residents happy.
The only remaining issue is the waste of money getting to this point - and Antrim being without a stadium for all this time.
Hopefully the eventual new stadium will make us forget the shambles that lead to it - and hopefully those at fault will be accountable. Not likely. The issue of ownership (ie) Ulster Council or Antrim is still one which our own County Reps need to be held accountable for.

[Na Glinntí Glasa]

if the residents haven't claimed they wanted money then why did they reject a recent compensation amount? money should not be an issue. address the stadium size like they want and that's it. end of according to them. the majority want the stadium, they want what it will bring to their area, they want a smaller capacity - that's grand and well - but there's some who do want to get what they can from this set up.

i want the stadium built as soon as and i understand the history of the place. ive been going to games there since the 80's when i was kid with my dad and i love the place but if its a case of pushing our county forward i would rather see a brand new set up to take us into the future.

we lost 3 clubs this year in belfast and at convention they said another 2 will possibly go next year in the city. thats depressing reading. in a city like belfast losing so many clubs will kill the game in the long term.

[hurlingstick]

There are too many clubs in Belfast, Dunloy, so I'm glad clubs are folding. I mean this in the kindest way. Shaws road alone has 3 clubs, side by side. It's too many to create good sides. Naomh Gall, Naomh Eoin, McD's all within a stone's throw of each other as well. It spreads good players very thinly. I would love to see less clubs of better quality in the city. I would also love to see a quality hurling only club.

[Na Glinntí Glasa]

i know what your saying. its not what i would like to see but it means smaller clubs will disappear at the expense of the larger clubs to keep the GAA alive in the city.

Breadgh have done a great job there and have a great youth set up. they seem to have no problems attracting players and it may be due to them being the only club about that area.

[btdtgtt]

if the residents haven't claimed they wanted money then why did they reject a recent compensation amount? money should not be an issue.

Precisely They rejected a buy off becasue money wasn't their concen.
It was offered because the powers-that-be erroniously though that was it. Again thats not the residents fault.
address the stadium size like they want and that's it. end of according to them. the majority want the stadium, they want what it will bring to their area, they want a smaller capacity - that's grand and well - but there's some who do want to get what they can from this set up.

i want the stadium built as soon as and i understand the history of the place. ive been going to games there since the 80's when i was kid with my dad and i love the place but if its a case of pushing our county forward i would rather see a brand new set up to take us into the future.

we lost 3 clubs this year in belfast and at convention they said another 2 will possibly go next year in the city. thats depressing reading. in a city like belfast losing so many clubs will kill the game in the long term.

On another couple of points raised:
- glad DR you acknowldge that the greenfield notion to leave Belfast without the GAA presence is unthinkable. Dunsilly (don't laugh!) is fine - but in addition to Casement. Belfast cannot be left wanting by the GAA in the way Derry is now a reosurce with little or no yield due to it's neglect.

- I agree there are too many clubs in WEST Belfast. Bredagh & St Endas are benefitting now from large populations which west belfast have didvided (also benefitting from their hard work in utilising in now).

- Hurlingstick I would never be happy to see clubs folding! But it's reluctantly agree in inevitable.
My personal prefernce would be for amalgamations - whereby a club which traditionally preferred hurling and a club which traditionally preferred football could operate under the same banner as effectively a dual club. These will develop over time to form new entities in their own right. The current set-up means young lads are not getting games or they get demoralised playing for weaker clubs - the loss of players suits nobody!

[Na Glinntí Glasa]

i think thats part of the problem here, the GAA want this to be a stadium capable of holding the ulster final. 18,000 wouldnt cut it for them.

i dont think they realise that we wouldnt get 18k at the combined national league games between hurling and football in 2 years.

have you heard anything HS about the potential of a settlement and its outcome?

[Na Glinntí Glasa]

if the residents haven't claimed they wanted money then why did they reject a recent compensation amount? money should not be an issue.

Precisely They rejected a buy off becasue money wasn't their concen.
It was offered because the powers-that-be erroniously though that was it. Again thats not the residents fault.
address the stadium size like they want and that's it. end of according to them. the majority want the stadium, they want what it will bring to their area, they want a smaller capacity - that's grand and well - but there's some who do want to get what they can from this set up.

i want the stadium built as soon as and i understand the history of the place. ive been going to games there since the 80's when i was kid with my dad and i love the place but if its a case of pushing our county forward i would rather see a brand new set up to take us into the future.

we lost 3 clubs this year in belfast and at convention they said another 2 will possibly go next year in the city. thats depressing reading. in a city like belfast losing so many clubs will kill the game in the long term.

On another couple of points raised:
- glad DR you acknowldge that the greenfield notion to leave Belfast without the GAA presence is unthinkable. Dunsilly (don't laugh!) is fine - but in addition to Casement. Belfast cannot be left wanting by the GAA in the way Derry is now a reosurce with little or no yield due to it's neglect.

- I agree there are too many clubs in WEST Belfast. Bredagh & St Endas are benefitting now from large populations which west belfast have didvided (also benefitting from their hard work in utilising in now).

- Hurlingstick I would never be happy to see clubs folding! But it's reluctantly agree in inevitable.
My personal prefernce would be for amalgamations - whereby a club which traditionally preferred hurling and a club which traditionally preferred football could operate under the same banner as effectively a dual club. These will develop over time to form new entities in their own right. The current set-up means young lads are not getting games or they get demoralised playing for weaker clubs - the loss of players suits nobody!

what do you think of the new hurling club belfast shamrocks? do you think thats the way forward for some clubs in the west (the smaller ones i mean) with regards to hurling? its sort of like the Sean stensions scenario in the south west where portgleone and ahoghill combine at under age and then split up at minor level to their respective senior teams?

[btdtgtt]

Belfast Shamrock is a noble effort made by noble GAA people - but I think it's handicapped by the lack of stability. Guys aren't sure to commit as they believe its a notional or temporary thing - Sean Stinson has tradition. Thats why I think formal amalgamations with permanent security would be more succesful. Young lads knew they would be playing for Stinsons - they didnt sign up to Shamrocks.

On Casement I agree with HS and believe:

Current plan scrapped.
Politics steps in to secure the money.
New plan gets go ahead - smaller stadium built.
Then more politics over the name and what it's used for (at club, county, intercounty & social levels!)
Still, that's better than no stadium!

[Gizzy15]

i was thinking the same myself.

if it fails sell casement off and let them build houses/commercial properties etc. find a greenfield site and build it there. the residents get no compensation package at all.

i dont understand how they are entitled to any money in the first place. ravenhill went up without a mute and it situated in an area where property is at a mental high and Windsor has went up without a mute either.

I know with Ravenhill for one had made some concessions during its process but these were done early and with respect to locals, ulster Rugby kept their powder dry and local groups happy.

[north_antrim_hound]

I spoke to one of the residents who told me that they have not been approached by the GAA about a settlement. Therefore, there is no settlement. IMO, the judge will quash the planning permission today and the GAA will reapply.

If there wasn't agrrement reached with the residents at the very start then things should not have gone this far
Our county board chairman and his cronies must be thinking," what do you have to do to get sacked round here" them and whatever Ulster coucil personel involved are a bunch of idiots
It's our fault ( the clubs) that these people are still running things

The plan for the stadium was always for  a 35000 seater and if the residents didn't want it then it should have been moved to dunsilly before now
The residents can delegate the projects capacity so move it somewhere more suitable  where local people don't mind and they can benefit from the various financial rewards

No one coming out of this looking good including the residents

[johnneycool]

I spoke to one of the residents who told me that they have not been approached by the GAA about a settlement. Therefore, there is no settlement. IMO, the judge will quash the planning permission today and the GAA will reapply.

If there wasn't agrrement reached with the residents at the very start then things should not have gone this far
Our county board chairman and his cronies must be thinking," what do you have to do to get sacked round here" them and whatever Ulster coucil personel involved are a bunch of idiots
It's our fault ( the clubs) that these people are still running things

The plan for the stadium was always for  a 35000 seater and if the residents didn't want it then it should have been moved to dunsilly before now
The residents can delegate the projects capacity so move it somewhere more suitable  where local people don't mind and they can benefit from the various financial rewards

No one coming out of this looking good including the residents

Ahem,
    this is an Ulster stadium, not an Antrim stadium..

[north_antrim_hound]

I spoke to one of the residents who told me that they have not been approached by the GAA about a settlement. Therefore, there is no settlement. IMO, the judge will quash the planning permission today and the GAA will reapply.

If there wasn't agrrement reached with the residents at the very start then things should not have gone this far
Our county board chairman and his cronies must be thinking," what do you have to do to get sacked round here" them and whatever Ulster coucil personel involved are a bunch of idiots
It's our fault ( the clubs) that these people are still running things

The plan for the stadium was always for  a 35000 seater and if the residents didn't want it then it should have been moved to dunsilly before now
The residents can delegate the projects capacity so move it somewhere more suitable  where local people don't mind and they can benefit from the various financial rewards

No one coming out of this looking good including the residents

Ahem,
    this is an Ulster stadium, not an Antrim stadium..

Casement was antrim county grounds to someone signed it over for nothing to Ulster council
Clones is Monaghan county grounds
What's your point here

[johnneycool]

I spoke to one of the residents who told me that they have not been approached by the GAA about a settlement. Therefore, there is no settlement. IMO, the judge will quash the planning permission today and the GAA will reapply.

If there wasn't agrrement reached with the residents at the very start then things should not have gone this far
Our county board chairman and his cronies must be thinking," what do you have to do to get sacked round here" them and whatever Ulster coucil personel involved are a bunch of idiots
It's our fault ( the clubs) that these people are still running things

The plan for the stadium was always for  a 35000 seater and if the residents didn't want it then it should have been moved to dunsilly before now
The residents can delegate the projects capacity so move it somewhere more suitable  where local people don't mind and they can benefit from the various financial rewards

No one coming out of this looking good including the residents

Ahem,
    this is an Ulster stadium, not an Antrim stadium..

Casement was antrim county grounds to someone signed it over for nothing to Ulster council
Clones is Monaghan county grounds
What's your point here

That if a decision is made to move the new development away from the Casement site, the needs of the entire province will need to be put into consideration as well as the viability of the stadium to host extra curricular activities.
Whilst Dunsilly is reasonably well serviced by the M2/M22 (not sure about how well to the current Antrim centre of excellence though!) I can't see it going there and is probably more likely to go to either Armagh or Dungannon which I think would be a mistake as well.

Antrim have thrown all their eggs into the redevelopment of Casement in some form and IMO thats the only viable option open to Antrim gaels.

[north_antrim_hound]

I spoke to one of the residents who told me that they have not been approached by the GAA about a settlement. Therefore, there is no settlement. IMO, the judge will quash the planning permission today and the GAA will reapply.

If there wasn't agrrement reached with the residents at the very start then things should not have gone this far
Our county board chairman and his cronies must be thinking," what do you have to do to get sacked round here" them and whatever Ulster coucil personel involved are a bunch of idiots
It's our fault ( the clubs) that these people are still running things

The plan for the stadium was always for  a 35000 seater and if the residents didn't want it then it should have been moved to dunsilly before now
The residents can delegate the projects capacity so move it somewhere more suitable  where local people don't mind and they can benefit from the various financial rewards

No one coming out of this looking good including the residents

Ahem,
    this is an Ulster stadium, not an Antrim stadium..

Casement was antrim county grounds to someone signed it over for nothing to Ulster council
Clones is Monaghan county grounds
What's your point here

That if a decision is made to move the new development away from the Casement site, the needs of the entire province will need to be put into consideration as well as the viability of the stadium to host extra curricular activities.
Whilst Dunsilly is reasonably well serviced by the M2/M22 (not sure about how well to the current Antrim centre of excellence though!) I can't see it going there and is probably more likely to go to either Armagh or Dungannon which I think would be a mistake as well.

Antrim have thrown all their eggs into the redevelopment of Casement in some form and IMO thats the only viable option open to Antrim gaels.

Our county board signed over our county grounds to Ulster council for nothing
For a project to accomadate Ulster finals and the like as well as generate some extra revenue via non GAA activities
As it turns out the site is not viable for  various reasons so what was the point
Surely some research and consultation before signing over anything woukd have been logical
In my view dunsilly was another alternative to casement for an Ulster stadium for some of the reasons you just mentioned
Imm looking at this mess purely from an Antrim perspective.
If it's knocked on the head now because they can't get capacity requirements will the Ulster council look for a better location and give casement back to  Antrim
By its current state what do antrim do with it, don't thinks there's any money to fix it back
Where Ulster football finals are played are last thing on the agenda at the minute in antrim

[getevennotcross]

Lads, lads, lads, nothing but innuendo, hearsay, rumour and speculation here.  Lets just leave to those who are better placed and in a position to comment, on how things are progressing and moving things on.  Makes you wonder though why JC stood down for the MORA committee and also that BM has quietly disappeared?  Either way a stitch up by Antrim CD and UC and you will never know the full ins and outs of events.

Sure makes you wonder if extreme ideology has clouded common sense among all parties involved?

And yes, we do have too many clubs, but who is going to be brave enough to lets say, kick off potential merges among O' Donavan Rossa, Noamh Gall, Noamh Eion, Noamh Pol, Padraig Sairseil, Noamh Una, Noamh Teresa, Lamh Dhearg etc. ??  No certainties but distinct possibilities, but ultimately inevitable in all eventualities.  Just not enough young cubs to go around, as the association goes forward and too many alternative options for young people, with soccer, rugby being much, much  more lucrative and appealing. Changing and interesting times ahead I would say!