The Many Faces of US Politics...

[Tyrones own]

I think it's astonishing that they are to be shipped to Ireland to rebuild their lives without
some kind of public scrutiny or evaluation from the Irish Government....maybe even get put to a vote of the people before hand.
But then to be seen in the eyes of the world to be going against anything remotely tied to
W has to be a good thing regardless of the outcome!
Granted I don't know they're guilty but tell me how you boy's are so sure they're not
and won't return to terrorism after released!

but it is still funny reading the last page or two.

Any funnier than the 10 pages that went before it or most all of the 65 pages on Hurls thread
when ye had the wellies on

[Tyrones own]

Or are you just twisting for another angle to beat Obama with?

Lets be honest here...he's doing a good enough job of it on his own

Sorry, but I don't see any partisan angle here. If these guys need to be released and can't go home, how is he wrong to get Ireland to accept them? You didn't bring up this subject to undermine your thesis that he and the Democrats are the embodiment of evil, so what exactly is this topic supposed to be proving?

Point being...his numbers in the poll's show he's doing enough harm himself to his administration every time he opens his mouth
without help from any "right wing Racist's"

[J70]

Or are you just twisting for another angle to beat Obama with?

Lets be honest here...he's doing a good enough job of it on his own

Sorry, but I don't see any partisan angle here. If these guys need to be released and can't go home, how is he wrong to get Ireland to accept them? You didn't bring up this subject to undermine your thesis that he and the Democrats are the embodiment of evil, so what exactly is this topic supposed to be proving?

Point being...his numbers in the poll's show he's doing enough harm himself to his administration every time he opens his mouth
without help from any "right wing Racist's"

That being your opinion (polls show his approval has stabilized over the past month), what has that got to do with the two detainees. If you think he is wrong to release them and that doing so is depressing his numbers, then say so. I doubt if most Americans even know that the two boys are heading for Ireland.

His current approval, according to Gallup, is 52%. Only Clinton was lower at this point in past 60 years, while Reagan had the exact same approval rating. Both were re-elected with ease. Bush senior had 70% at this time and lost. Dubya had 76% post 9-11 and came close to losing to Kerry. Jimmy Carter had 57% and is now generally regarded as the worst post-war president!

[J70]

I think it's astonishing that they are to be shipped to Ireland to rebuild their lives without
some kind of public scrutiny or evaluation from the Irish Government....maybe even get put to a vote of the people before hand.
But then to be seen in the eyes of the world to be going against anything remotely tied to
W has to be a good thing regardless of the outcome!
Granted I don't know they're guilty but tell me how you boy's are so sure they're not
and won't return to terrorism after released!

"Return to terrorism"? Am I missing something? I thought they were being released because there was no evidence they were ever involved? And one would assume (and expect) that the Irish and US authorities have done the necessary analysis here.

[Tyrones own]

Or are you just twisting for another angle to beat Obama with?

Lets be honest here...he's doing a good enough job of it on his own

Sorry, but I don't see any partisan angle here. If these guys need to be released and can't go home, how is he wrong to get Ireland to accept them? You didn't bring up this subject to undermine your thesis that he and the Democrats are the embodiment of evil, so what exactly is this topic supposed to be proving?

Point being...his numbers in the poll's show he's doing enough harm himself to his administration every time he opens his mouth
without help from any "right wing Racist's"

That being your opinion (polls show his approval has stabilized over the past month), what has that got to do with the two detainees. If you think he is wrong to release them and that doing so is depressing his numbers, then say so. I doubt if most Americans even know that the two boys are heading for Ireland.

His current approval, according to Gallup, is 52%. Only Clinton was lower at this point in past 60 years, while Reagan had the exact same approval rating. Both were re-elected with ease. Bush senior had 70% at this time and lost. Dubya had 76% post 9-11 and came close to losing to Kerry. Jimmy Carter had 57% and is now generally regarded as the worst post-war president!

Those aren't quite the figures I have but OK.... you and I both know that the media blitz he ran last Sunday
to explain himself and to get his push for health care back on track fell flat and if stabilization is what you deem
successful then OK..he's doing great! Have you checked his numbers by state by the way... your own state of NY makes
interesting reading

[Tyrones own]

"Return to terrorism"? Am I missing something?

Evidently yes;
http://www.usnews.com/articles/news/2009/01/13/some-freed-terrorism-detainees-return-to-the-fight.html
So I'll ask this again.... ( I know shocking isn't it) how do either of you "know"  that they
are or aren't connected to terrorism???

[mountainboii]

"Return to terrorism"? Am I missing something?

Evidently yes;
http://www.usnews.com/articles/news/2009/01/13/some-freed-terrorism-detainees-return-to-the-fight.html
So I'll ask this again.... ( I know shocking isn't it) how do either of you "know"  that they
are or aren't connected to terrorism???

11%, and only about 3% actually confirmed, according to 'Pentagon intelligence', the merits of which is debatable given the recent track record.

Do you really support locking up nine innocent men for the sake of catching one that may be guilty?

I thought this quote in that link was particularly hilarious:

"Just that we have, you know, intelligence, in some cases evidence, to prove that they have indeed gone on to return to violence, and that's a real concern."

Suppose we'll have to, you know, take your word for it then.

[Tyrones own]

Yes and even with that excellent piece of investigative journalism.... How do you "know"
that these two in particular are innocent men

[mountainboii]

Yes and even with that excellent piece of investigative journalism.... How do you "know"
that these two in particular are innocent men

Well if America's finest couldn't get anything to stick after eight years of waterboarding and God knows what else, then I happy enough.

[muppet]

Yes and even with that excellent piece of investigative journalism.... How do you "know"
that these two in particular are innocent men

Because in civilized countries they are innocent until proven guilty. Therefore they are legally innocent. On top of that they haven't even been charged with anything.

This should all be investigated by a war crimes tribunal but the USA only uses them on their enemies. 

[Tyrones own]

Because in civilized countries they are innocent until proven guilty. Therefore they are legally innocent. On top of that they haven't even been charged with anything.

Yes and neither had the ones that returned to fight....the fact that they hadn't been charged meant they were innocent too I suppose

By the way...still no word out of the Top Dems today about the despicable
riotous scenes in Pittsburgh on Fri I see...Shocker I know,

[mountainboii]

Because in civilized countries they are innocent until proven guilty. Therefore they are legally innocent. On top of that they haven't even been charged with anything.

Yes and neither had the ones that returned to fight....the fact that they hadn't been charged meant they were innocent too I suppose

By the way...still no word out of the Top Dems today about the despicable
riotous scenes in Pittsburgh on Fri I see...Shocker I know,

How do you know they were returning to the fight? Evidently, there was no indication that they were involved in terrorism in the first place, or they would've been put on trial. So how do you know they weren't innocent men, radicalised by half a dozen years of torture and sadism?

Its fallacious to assume that those who become involved in terrorism after their release from Guantanamo, were involved before their detention.

[Tyrones own]

How do you know they were returning to the fight?

Where exactly did I say they were returning to fight?

So how do you know they weren't innocent men

I don't!.....How do you know they are? for the 4th time

So how do you know they weren't innocent men, radicalised by half a dozen years of torture and sadism?

Let me see if I have this right...it's ok if they go back to Yemen as terrorists as long as it's only because they were radicalized
by torture and sadism.... I have it now

[mountainboii]

Where exactly did I say they were returning to fight?

This was obviously what you implied in the following post.

Yes and neither had the ones that returned to fight....the fact that they hadn't been charged meant they were innocent too I suppose

So how do you know they weren't innocent men

I don't!.....How do you know they are? for the 4th time

In the real world, when someone is not charged with any crime they are considered innocent. Does US intelligence monitor your every movement? If not, they can't possibly be 100% that you are not a terrorist. Maybe you should be kept in prison, and tortured, indefinitely. You know, just in case.

So how do you know they weren't innocent men, radicalised by half a dozen years of torture and sadism?

Let me see if I have this right...it's ok if they go back to Yemen as terrorists as long as it's only because they were radicalized by torture and sadism.... I have it now

Reverting to type I see. Creating straw men and putting words in people's mouths. Pathetic.

[J70]

Sorry TO, but the onus is on the US to make the charges stick. You can't just pick people up, throw them in prison and forget about them. I would have thought that someone from your northern background would be averse to the state locking people up without charges or trial?

And spare us the crocodile tears about the Pittsburgh riots (although it was interesting to compare the tone of Fox News' coverage of it with their reverent coverage of the townhalls and tea bag protests). Your own side is every bit as hypocritical, but no one else is really arsed enough to whinge about and dig up every little example.