The Many Faces of US Politics...

[Gabriel_Hurl]

the irony of whitey complaining about someone not talking about the current news story when he's still crying about the Steele Dossier from 7 years ago

[whitey]

the irony of whitey complaining about someone not talking about the current news story when he's still crying about the Steele Dossier from 7 years ago

LOL-you haven't a clue

There's a special counsel investigation currently going on into the Steele Dossier. That's far from old news.

[J70]

Stop changing the subject

Kamala and Joes border policies have been an unmitigated disaster and they're doing nothing to fix it

The Republicans are dead right to bring it to their doorsteps

If they (Democrats) and their supporters (and their donors)  have to deal with it first hand, maybe they'll actually do something about it apart from putting a stupid sign in their front yard

How am I changing the subject?

You said "I guess my point (which either you're missing or I'm not properly articulating) is that it's very easy to support policies that don't impact you."

I pointed out that everyone does this.

I could continue by pointing out how various GOP policies which don't affect them directly could be visited upon THEIR doorsteps. Should we start with environmental or worker protections?

I guess you at least have the balls to admit you support DeSantis and his callous actions.

We're discussing a current immigration crisis and you start bringing up Nancy fvckin Regans views on stem research from 40 years ago.

Stick to the topic at hand!

(Yes-every politician should have to live with the repercussions of their policies. Nothing became more apparent than people voting for a war, they didn't have to fight)

The topic you introduced was people voting and exerting influence on issues that don't directly affect them.

If you didn't want to open that discussion, then why mention it? You mentioned it so you could have a go at the residents of Martha's Vineyard.

You could have left it at you think the Biden admin's policies on immigration are terrible.

And then told us what you would be doing differently.

[J70]

the irony of whitey complaining about someone not talking about the current news story when he's still crying about the Steele Dossier from 7 years ago

LOL-you haven't a clue

There's a special counsel investigation currently going on into the Steele Dossier. That's far from old news.

How long has Durham been investigating now?

The only thing that investigation has going for Trump is that it is still going.

That it's taking place is far more valuable to Trump than any results it has produced or likely will produce.

[whitey]

Stop changing the subject

Kamala and Joes border policies have been an unmitigated disaster and they're doing nothing to fix it

The Republicans are dead right to bring it to their doorsteps

If they (Democrats) and their supporters (and their donors)  have to deal with it first hand, maybe they'll actually do something about it apart from putting a stupid sign in their front yard

How am I changing the subject?

You said "I guess my point (which either you're missing or I'm not properly articulating) is that it's very easy to support policies that don't impact you."

I pointed out that everyone does this.

I could continue by pointing out how various GOP policies which don't affect them directly could be visited upon THEIR doorsteps. Should we start with environmental or worker protections?

I guess you at least have the balls to admit you support DeSantis and his callous actions.

We're discussing a current immigration crisis and you start bringing up Nancy fvckin Regans views on stem research from 40 years ago.

Stick to the topic at hand!

(Yes-every politician should have to live with the repercussions of their policies. Nothing became more apparent than people voting for a war, they didn't have to fight)

The topic you introduced was people voting and exerting influence on issues that don't directly affect them.

If you didn't want to open that discussion, then why mention it? You mentioned it so you could have a go at the residents of Martha's Vineyard.

You could have left it at you think the Biden admin's policies on immigration are terrible.

And then told us what you would be doing differently.

But when it did effect them directly, like it did  last week, they failed the test miserably

I'm not having a go at them-I'm simply stating facts

They overwhelmingly vote Democrat and donate to Democrats who believe in open borders.

They have declared themselves a sanctuary city

They put signs out in their yards welcoming emigrants

Why then would they ship those poor people off the island to a military base within a day or so of them arriving?


And yes, Republican and Democratic voters and donors should absolutely have to live with the consequences of the actions of the people they support-on climate and war and regulation

But right now we're discussing a border crisis that has been created by the current administration

[J70]

How can you say they failed a test when there was never any reason to have ever prepared for it? That makes zero sense. Under the circumstances, moving them to a facility that could handle them in a humane way was the correct thing to do. They're a small island off the coast, not a major city.

Eric Adams said over the weekend that he had attempted to get cooperation from Abbott on a coordinated response to share the burden of the influx from Cuba, Venezuela and Nicaragua, but he was basically told to go f**k himself.

[J70]

Also, what does "open borders" mean?

Is that anything short of stealing kids and building a giant wall?

[whitey]

How can you say they failed a test when there was never any reason to have ever prepared for it? That makes zero sense. Under the circumstances, moving them to a facility that could handle them in a humane way was the correct thing to do. They're a small island off the coast, not a major city.

Eric Adams said over the weekend that he had attempted to get cooperation from Abbott on a coordinated response to share the burden of the influx from Cuba, Venezuela and Nicaragua, but he was basically told to go f**k himself.

Unfortunately Eric Adam's doesn't set National Immigration Policy so what would a Republican Governor have to gain by even speaking to him on the matter

Maybe Eric should have called Kamala instead....she's doing such a great job since being appointed to the role by Joe. I'd say she would have been very helpful

[Eamonnca1]

Also, what does "open borders" mean?

Is that anything short of stealing kids and building a giant wall?

"Open borders" is a trigger phrase used by conservatives to scare people, conjuring up images of terrorists and rapists roaming freely into the country without restriction. They hope that the phrase will trigger the same racist response that it elicits in themselves.

What the conservatives don't realise is that "open borders" describes the relationship that's existed on the island of Ireland for as long as I can remember, and in much of the EU (in the Schengen zone) since about 1992. It also describes the way the entire world used to be, including the United States until relatively recently in its history. The Pilgrim Fathers certainly didn't have all their paperwork filed with the Department of Homeland Security. The modern day confederate fanboys certainly don't have a problem with the way African slaves were hauled across the Atlantic with no paperwork other than their listings as cargo on the ships' manifests. 

Up to the early twentieth century there wasn't a whole lot to stop anyone from getting into the US. A lot of the people scaremongering about "open borders" now are the descendents of people who came in during the open borders era.

In any case the idea that a nation must manage and approve every single person that enters its territory is a relatively recent one, and it's often presented as an axiom. I've yet to hear a convincing argument for why governments should artificially, laboriously, and expensively micromanage exactly who gets into the country. The market does a much better job of that. People tend to go where the opportunities are and away from where the opportunities aren't. They go to where their labour is needed. That's why the open borders of the EU have been such a success, allowing free movement of labour as well as capital. NAFTA allowed free movement of capital without the free movement of labour, but the demand for labour is still there and is filled by undocumented immigration. Such a stupid system.

[whitey]

Also, what does "open borders" mean?

Is that anything short of stealing kids and building a giant wall?

"Open borders" is a trigger phrase used by conservatives to scare people, conjuring up images of terrorists and rapists roaming freely into the country without restriction. They hope that the phrase will trigger the same racist response that it elicits in themselves.

What the conservatives don't realise is that "open borders" describes the relationship that's existed on the island of Ireland for as long as I can remember, and in much of the EU (in the Schengen zone) since about 1992. It also describes the way the entire world used to be, including the United States until relatively recently in its history. The Pilgrim Fathers certainly didn't have all their paperwork filed with the Department of Homeland Security. The modern day confederate fanboys certainly don't have a problem with the way African slaves were hauled across the Atlantic with no paperwork other than their listings as cargo on the ships' manifests. 

Up to the early twentieth century there wasn't a whole lot to stop anyone from getting into the US. A lot of the people scaremongering about "open borders" now are the descendents of people who came in during the open borders era.

In any case the idea that a nation must manage and approve every single person that enters its territory is a relatively recent one, and it's often presented as an axiom. I've yet to hear a convincing argument for why governments should artificially, laboriously, and expensively micromanage exactly who gets into the country. The market does a much better job of that. People tend to go where the opportunities are and away from where the opportunities aren't. They go to where their labour is needed. That's why the open borders of the EU have been such a success, allowing free movement of labour as well as capital. NAFTA allowed free movement of capital without the free movement of labour, but the demand for labour is still there and is filled by undocumented immigration. Such a stupid system.

LOL

I take it you hadn't heard about this case-

https://www.wusa9.com/article/news/local/virginia/fairfax-co-trail-attack-suspect-was-in-the-us-illegally-authorities-say/65-03645a69-ec99-4791-9be5-9b296774e8b2

https://wjla.com/amp/news/local/juan-alfaro-rodriguez-herndon-washington-old-dominion-trai-suspect-man-fairfax-county-police-linked-more-cases-wod-arrested-charged-tracked-down-warrants-woman-assault-indecent-exposure-incident-evidence-investigation

So if I understand correctly New York authorities would have been prevented from handing this guy over to ICE if they caught him.

[J70]

How can you say they failed a test when there was never any reason to have ever prepared for it? That makes zero sense. Under the circumstances, moving them to a facility that could handle them in a humane way was the correct thing to do. They're a small island off the coast, not a major city.

Eric Adams said over the weekend that he had attempted to get cooperation from Abbott on a coordinated response to share the burden of the influx from Cuba, Venezuela and Nicaragua, but he was basically told to go f**k himself.

Unfortunately Eric Adam's doesn't set National Immigration Policy so what would a Republican Governor have to gain by even speaking to him on the matter

Maybe Eric should have called Kamala instead....she's doing such a great job since being appointed to the role by Joe. I'd say she would have been very helpful

So a Republican governor has nothing to gain by speaking to the mayor to whose city he is sending busload after busload of people with no advance notice?

I see.

Like it's said, the cruelty is the point. They're not human beings to these people.

[whitey]

How can you say they failed a test when there was never any reason to have ever prepared for it? That makes zero sense. Under the circumstances, moving them to a facility that could handle them in a humane way was the correct thing to do. They're a small island off the coast, not a major city.

Eric Adams said over the weekend that he had attempted to get cooperation from Abbott on a coordinated response to share the burden of the influx from Cuba, Venezuela and Nicaragua, but he was basically told to go f**k himself.

Unfortunately Eric Adam's doesn't set National Immigration Policy so what would a Republican Governor have to gain by even speaking to him on the matter

Maybe Eric should have called Kamala instead....she's doing such a great job since being appointed to the role by Joe. I'd say she would have been very helpful

So a Republican governor has nothing to gain by speaking to the mayor to whose city he is sending busload after busload of people with no advance notice?

I see.

Like it's said, the cruelty is the point. They're not human beings to these people.

I did use the word "unfortunately" because, yes,  two adults should be able to work together to find a solution

In this scenario however, the 2 individuals involved, have other forces to contend with.

Abbott has to deal with the GOP who love that he's doing this and want him to continue

Adams hands are tied by NYCs sanctuary city status and he can't be seen by his party to do anything to diminish that

[J70]

Disagree on Adams. There is nothing controversial about his working on humane solutions for asylum seekers with Republicans. There is no reason why he can't do so while maintaining the sensible elements of sanctuary city status. And he wasn't elected as a progressive, even if NYC progressives did have an issue with him making such moves (which they'd have no reason to).

I read an editorial earlier by Melissa DeRosa, Cuomo's former right hand woman. She was scathing of Biden's performance on this year's influx, how they're failing to deal adequately with it and reckons they need to put a centralized processing system in place and attack it with resources like they did when the unaccompanied minors influx occurred.

She had nothing but contempt for the GOP's actions on this, mind you.

[whitey]

I actually like Adam's, but Republicans won't work with him or any other Democratic Mayor for that matter

They're like a bunch of fvckin schoolyard bullies (the Republicans), and right now the other bullies are cheering them on

Joe and Kamala are 100% to blame for this mess and from what I can tell have done absolutely nothing to fix the problem. So while I don't agree with using these unfortunates as pawns, the Democrats only have themselves to blame

[Eamonnca1]