The Heineken Cup Thread

[saffron sam2]

Might go too. What's the weather forecast?

[Tankie]

i'm sick just thinking about the game but heading off in about 5hrs and cant wait - safe travels everyone and hopefully the result goes our way!

[The GAA]

Stuart Barnes
Leicester have the solid consistency and the ability to win matches when they have not played well. Having said that, they have played pretty well for the past few months and when they failed to find any sort of form last Saturday they still managed to beat London Irish to become English champions.

Leinster, in contrast, have not put together many cohesive efforts this season but their semi-final win against their great rivals from Munster was at a level of performance which the Tigers have been nowhere near emulating this campaign. If they can repeat the quality of that effort they will become the Heineken Cup champions unless Leicester produce their best 80 minutes of the season.

Having watched Leicester throughout the season and Leinster for most of their campaign I think it is fair to suggest that the Tigers lack the potential to match the Dublin side's best. Against that, Leinster have an awful lot to prove. They need to show that one epic performance was not just a staggering statement of anger aimed at a fellow Irish team who have garnered all the eulogies and trophies while Leinster have been mocked for their failure to deliver on the big day.

Their Heineken Cup campaign has been a muddling mediocre affair, with one dashing effort against London Wasps to go with the muscularity and accuracy of the semi-final. The win against Harlequins in the quarter-final was fortunate. Had Nick Evans been 100 per cent fit, he would probably have steered or booted the London team past Leinster but the luck and some sterling defensive work was with the Irish and it was they who sneaked into a semi.

Heineken Cup winners need lucky breaks and maybe that away quarter-final win was the moment for Leinster. In many ways that 6-5 victory had several similarities with Leicester's narrowest of Premiership final wins. Neither side played with profound belief but both harnessed the organisation of their defences to hang on.

Both sides indeed seemed short on self-belief but made it to the win. The first victory for Leinster in five attempts in England may have fuelled their deficit of confidence while the Tigers, so deadly at the semi-final stage but so poor in recent finals, needed any sort of trophy lift to lift their own belief. Geordan Murphy apart, the Tigers looked frozen in fear as they emerged from the Twickenham tunnel for their team photograph an hour before the final. This was not stony-faced concentration but a twitch of fear from a club used to losing big games.

Forget about the way the Tigers played, as we have all just about forgotten the nervousness of Leinster's quarter-final. The win, for both sides, was all that mattered. Murphy is right to say that the Tigers will stand no chance if they play as they did in the Premiership final (although this is predicated on an assumption that their Irish opponents will rise to the so far one-off levels of the Munster match) but there is little doubt in my mind that the Tigers will leave that form behind. The pressure, with one trophy in the bag, is off and the Tigers can shoot for Europe safe in the knowledge that this has been a successful season.

It places more pressure on Leinster who, should they lose, will be barracked as the team with the ability to touch for club greatness as they did in Toulouse in 2006 but not the appetite, the guts or the nerve to take the title. The Munster victory will mean nothing if they lose.

Who can Leinster rely on to guarantee a certain level of performance? Rocky Elsom would be the first name mentioned in terms of form and consistency but Brian O'Driscoll has been only a little way behind him and has that certain something on so many big occasions. If the Tigers tame both men they are halfway towards wrecking the Leinster game and bringing the match down a notch to a level where their collective excellence at the breakdown and knowledge of Heineken Cup history gives them an edge.

The decision whether to start Alesana Tuilagi after his harsh four-week ban is crucial. Johne Murphy has done well but the Samoan is a central cog in the Tigers attack game; without him they are patient in possession but occasionally short of a punch. Murphy's sinuous game at the back balances well with Tuilagi. In tandem they can threaten any opponent.

Inside them the ricocheting efforts of Dan Hipkiss has the Tigers midfield bouncing. If Gordon D'Arcy slows him down that becomes a big gain for Leinster. They might need it because the Tigers look to have an edge at half back where Julian Dupuy has been superb all season while Sam Vesty has been a revelation at fly half. Nerves got to him last Saturday but he will be all the better for the experience. Johnny Sexton was most impressive coming off the bench at Croke Park but this final represents unchartered waters for him.

He will be pressed throughout by Ben Woods, Leicester's invisible man on the flank who does so much work but is rarely noted. Jordan Crane has a higher profile but is essentially a conservative ball-carrier compared with Jamie Heaslip, who represents a massive threat alongside Elsom as a thunderous back-row runner, an area of the game where the Irish definitely eclipse the English.

The Tigers will want Martin Castrogiovanni back at prop but even if he fails to make the final, the English team will fancy their chances in the scrum although Cian Healy is a player of immense potential and Stan Wright deeply underestimated around the park. Shane Jennings and Leo Cullen, the strong captain of the side, are both former Tiger stalwarts and their knowledge of Leicester ways could play some part in a game which, as I write this preview, seems to get ever closer on the scoreboard.

The Irish will win if they are at their best but Leicester are more likely to play to their full potential. They will be a different team to the one that grasped the English title but with Elsom and that man O'Driscoll in their ranks I think Leinster will rise to the occasion and keep the Heineken Cup in Ireland.

[AZOffaly]

Best of luck to Leinster tomorrow. Keep the cup in Ireland lads.

[Dinny Breen]

The Leinster team to face the Leicester Tigers in Saturday's Heineken Cup final in Murrayfield (KO: 5pm) has been named...
The side shows one change to the starting line up from the semi final victory over Munster with Jonathan Sexton set to partner Chris Whitaker at half-back, while Brian O'Driscoll resumes his centre partnership with Gordon D'Arcy.

In the pack Rocky Elsom starts in the back-row alongside Ireland duo Shane Jennings and Jamie Heaslip, with Leo Cullen leading the side for what is the province's first appearance in the Heineken Cup final.

Rob Kearney is named on a strong replacements bench alongside the likes of Girvan Dempsey, Devin Toner and Sean O'Brien.

LEINSTER:

15: Isa Nacewa
14: Shane Horgan
13: Brian O'Driscoll
12: Gordon D'Arcy
11: Luke Fitzgerald
10: Jonathan Sexton
9: Chris Whitaker

1: Cian Healy
2: Bernard Jackman
3: Stan Wright
4: Leo Cullen CAPTAIN
5: Malcolm O'Kelly
6: Rocky Elsom
7: Shane Jennings
8: Jamie Heaslip

REPLACEMENTS:

16: John Fogarty
17: Ronan McCormack
18: Devin Toner
19: Sean O'Brien
20: Simon Keogh
21: Rob Kearney
22: Girvan Dempsey


Leicester:  G Murphy (capt); Hamilton, Erinle, Hipkiss, Tuilagi; Vesty, Dupuy; Ayerza, Chuter, Castrogiovanni, Croft, Kay, Newby, Woods, Crane.
Replacements: Kayser, White, L Deacon, Moody, Ellis, Smith, J Murphy.

[Dinny Breen]

Having seen the two teams announced, I think if the Leinster Pack can front up and gain parity somewhat then I think the Leinster backline has to much guile for the Leicester backs. The Tigers are very much about power and grunt and are the typical template for English rugby but rugby has moved on since the glory days of 2003 and I think Vesty at 10 can be easliy exploited, he has a great eye for a break but Jennings, Sexton, D'Arcy and O'Driscoll are all excellent defenders and I just can't see Vesty breaking the gainline, his two centres are just bash them up as is Tuiliagi leaving only Hamilton and G Murphy to create. If Leinster can force the Tigers and Vesty down the wrong channels I can see them making hay at the breakdown but Leinster need to use their turn-over ball wisely, big onus on Sexton here, hopefully he won't be too nervous and he can ping Leicester back, hopefully he'll get an easy shot goal early on to settle his nerves.

A lot things need to happen for Leinster to win

- Jackman needs to be on the money with his darts
- Sexton needs to settle and enjoy the game
- Turnover ball needs to go wide early or into the corner via the boot, if they go up the middle Leicester will love this
- Clean and quick scrum ball
- Nacewa into the line as much as possible
- Heaslip and Rocky to get their paws on the pill at least 4/5 times each
- Leinster are patient in attack, Leicester cheat so as long Leinster don't panic the penalties will come
- And finally if the tempo is high and the intensity even higher then Leinster are fitter and fresher and could pull away in the end...

For anyone travelling enjoy the game and hopefully Saturday will be a blue just as Sunday will be a white day.....

[AZOffaly]

Having seen the two teams announced, I think if the Leinster Pack can front up and gain parity somewhat then I think the Leinster backline has to much guile for the Leicester backs. The Tigers are very much about power and grunt and are the typical template for English rugby but rugby has moved on since the glory days of 2003 and I think Vesty at 10 can be easliy exploited, he has a great eye for a break but Jennings, Sexton, D'Arcy and O'Driscoll are all excellent defenders and I just can't see Vesty breaking the gainline, his two centres are just bash them up as is Tuiliagi leaving only Hamilton and G Murphy to create. If Leinster can force the Tigers and Vesty down the wrong channels I can see them making hay at the breakdown but Leinster need to use their turn-over ball wisely, big onus on Sexton here, hopefully he won't be too nervous and he can ping Leicester back, hopefully he'll get an easy shot goal early on to settle his nerves.

A lot things need to happen for Leinster to win

- Jackman needs to be on the money with his darts
- Sexton needs to settle and enjoy the game
- Turnover ball needs to go wide early or into the corner via the boot, if they go up the middle Leicester will love this
- Clean and quick scrum ball
- Nacewa into the line as much as possible
- Heaslip and Rocky to get their paws on the pill at least 4/5 times each
- Leinster are patient in attack, Leicester cheat so as long Leinster don't panic the penalties will come
- And finally if the tempo is high and the intensity even higher then Leinster are fitter and fresher and could pull away in the end...

For anyone travelling enjoy the game and hopefully Saturday will be a blue just as Sunday will be a white day.....

Agree with all of that except the last bit...

[Dinny Breen]

[lynchbhoy]

Having seen the two teams announced, I think if the Leinster Pack can front up and gain parity somewhat then I think the Leinster backline has to much guile for the Leicester backs. The Tigers are very much about power and grunt and are the typical template for English rugby but rugby has moved on since the glory days of 2003 and I think Vesty at 10 can be easliy exploited, he has a great eye for a break but Jennings, Sexton, D'Arcy and O'Driscoll are all excellent defenders and I just can't see Vesty breaking the gainline, his two centres are just bash them up as is Tuiliagi leaving only Hamilton and G Murphy to create. If Leinster can force the Tigers and Vesty down the wrong channels I can see them making hay at the breakdown but Leinster need to use their turn-over ball wisely, big onus on Sexton here, hopefully he won't be too nervous and he can ping Leicester back, hopefully he'll get an easy shot goal early on to settle his nerves.

A lot things need to happen for Leinster to win

- Jackman needs to be on the money with his darts
- Sexton needs to settle and enjoy the game
- Turnover ball needs to go wide early or into the corner via the boot, if they go up the middle Leicester will love this
- Clean and quick scrum ball
- Nacewa into the line as much as possible
- Heaslip and Rocky to get their paws on the pill at least 4/5 times each
- Leinster are patient in attack, Leicester cheat so as long Leinster don't panic the penalties will come
- And finally if the tempo is high and the intensity even higher then Leinster are fitter and fresher and could pull away in the end...

For anyone travelling enjoy the game and hopefully Saturday will be a blue just as Sunday will be a white day.....

neither team are prolific in the kicking dept, I think Leinster will win it if Sexton has a good day with the boot and leinster keep their discipline and not react to leicesters cheating. I agree penalties will come.
I resume Nacewa is backup kicker...

[Dinny Breen]

Kearney is generally the backup kicker but as he is only on the bench I assume D'Arcy is next in line, has kicked for Leinster before. Both teams are without their frontline kickers but I'd say Sexton would be better than Dupuy in that he has always kicked where Dupuy is just a stand-in. Interesting that Dupuy is rumoured to be off to to Stade Francis, not a good week for such speculation..

[Donnellys Hollow]

Leicester have really set their stall out by picking Tuilagi ahead of Johne Murphy. Geordan is the only player in their backline with any sort of guile or creativity. Hipkiss is a crash ball merchant a la most English centres. Erinle is quick but his footballing skills are quite poor. If Leinster can gain parity up front and force Leicester to go wide I'm not sure that backline will have the cutting edge against a Leinster defence that has been excellent. (Is Mauger injured or what? I've seen Leicester play a few times this season and he hasn't been featuring at all.)

The game is going to be won and lost up front. Healy, Jackman and Wright have to front up big time. If they can withstand the onslaught up front then Leinster will win. Quick ball is an absolute must though.

[SLIGONIAN]

Best of luck to Leinster, went to a fair few Heinken cup games in Dublin when I worked there, and there are some team to watch, entertaining attacking rugby. Would love to see BOD get a heinken medal.

[Hound]

I reckon Nacewa is back-up kicker. He hasnt kicked for Leinster before but he did kick plenty of times in NZ.

While Leicester have the superior front row, I think Leinster have the best team on paper. Jamie, Rocky and Shane I'm hoping will all have massive games. And hopefully Sexton can be as good as he has been recently. Leicester have a very strong bench, much stronger than ours and you can count on it that if Plan A doesnt work, they also have a very strong Plan B and then Plan C. Harry Ellis looked like he was chewing a nettle in the after match celebrations last week when he was an unused sub. Its a guarantee that he'll be 100% fired up when he gets his chance.

I'm very hopeful of victory but finals are funny beasts. All kinds of things happen. Remember O'Gara's first HEC final, zero from four for his kicks at goal.

Good luck lads!

[Declan]

Best of luck to Leinster. Funnily enough I was more confident of beating Munster in the semi as I am of them winning this one.

[ziggysego]

Best of luck lads.   What time is it on at?