What do you make of this?

[Dinny Breen]

Have a parish 'guideline' as opposed to a rule, but allow players to transfer if there are exceptional circumstances and both clubs are agreeable.

So much waffle before some made simple sense.

AZ for GAA president, will get Ger Gilroy to run your media campaign...

[AZOffaly]

Ger never responded to my email. He's dead to me.

[deiseach]

Fair point about the transfers, but we all saw the issue with Eamonn Fennell up in Dublin so I'm not sure that's as cut and dried either. I do think that might be the best solution though. Have a parish 'guideline' as opposed to a rule, but allow players to transfer if there are exceptional circumstances and both clubs are agreeable.

If Firies agreed to the transfer, would it not be waved through? If so, I don't see how the current dispensation differs from your proposal

[Lar Naparka]

Looks like this story is going to run for a while longer..

http://www.independent.ie/national-news/gaa-club-to-take-on-familys-cause-after-boys-are-ruled-out-of-bounds-2819898.html

By Majella O'Sullivan
Wednesday July 13 2011
A GAA rule preventing two young brothers playing football with a club outside their parish is to be challenged again.
Padraic O'Sullivan (14) and his nine-year-old brother Colin were told they could not play Gaelic games with Listry GAA club near Killarney, Co Kerry, because of the 'parish rule' -- or Rule 20 -- employed by some county boards.
An application by their parents for an exemption to the rule was defeated by Kerry County Board on Monday night by a majority of 59 to 23.
"Football is my favourite sport," Padraic told the Irish Independent yesterday.
"I've been playing it since I was under 10. It's very upsetting when you can't be picked for the team when you train with them all the time."
The O'Sullivans live in Ballytrasna, Faha, within the parish boundaries of Firies, but they attend school and are involved in parish life in Listry.
However, the family was handed a lifeline yesterday with news that Listry GAA may bring a motion before Kerry County Board calling for some townlands to be made "open areas".
That would mean people living in these areas could choose which club they wanted to play with.
Listry GAA club chairman Noel Kennedy confirmed the motion would be on the agenda at the club's next meeting.
"It hasn't been decided yet because obviously it has to come before the club first for discussion but we probably will pursue that route," Mr Kennedy told the Irish Independent.
It is expected the motion will then be moved at the next meeting of Kerry County Board, where it would be voted on.
Meanwhile, Padraic and Colin are coming to terms with the disappointment of having their application refused.
Like most Kerry families, football is king in the O'Sullivan household and the boys dream about playing championship games with the club with which they feel the most affinity. "It's out of our hands now and all we can do is stand back from it and wait," the boys' father Michael O'Sullivan said.
"We could go back to the GAA's disputes resolution authority (DRA) but there'd be no point. We've been there before."
However, he said the family had no regrets about taking the stand, adding that eight families were involved and all of them had put both energy and money into the challenge.
"We're glad we did it. This is something we need people to talk about and there's never been a proper discussion about the 'parish rule' before," he said.
"We're not against Rule 20. We know why it's there. It just needs to be tweaked a bit."
The boys' mother Christine added: "We've done our best and we're hoping for a bit of common sense. That's all it takes. It's not just our kids. A lot of other children are affected by this rule."
The O'Sullivans have been fighting their cause for five years and admit it has taken its toll on the two boys and their sister Aisling (11). The matter has come before the High Court on two occasions and has also been referred to the DRA twice.
Mrs O'Sullivan said it had been a stressful journey for the family but one they had to take for their children's sake.
- Majella O'Sullivan

[deiseach]

However, the family was handed a lifeline yesterday with news that Listry GAA may bring a motion before Kerry County Board calling for some townlands to be made "open areas".
That would mean people living in these areas could choose which club they wanted to play with

Anyone able to elaborate on how this works?

[AZOffaly]

I believe this works on the basis that areas of land are designated free for all, and people from there can choose who they want to play with. Some cities have this I believe.

[AZOffaly]

Fair point about the transfers, but we all saw the issue with Eamonn Fennell up in Dublin so I'm not sure that's as cut and dried either. I do think that might be the best solution though. Have a parish 'guideline' as opposed to a rule, but allow players to transfer if there are exceptional circumstances and both clubs are agreeable.

If Firies agreed to the transfer, would it not be waved through? If so, I don't see how the current dispensation differs from your proposal

Sorry, I should have said and/or both clubs are agreeable. If the county board deems the circumstances exceptional, then that should override a club objections.

[heffo]

There was a DRA landmark case last year where a child is deemed not to have played 'competitively' until he plays U11 and up - and as such is free to transfer without the approval of his club (subject to rubber stamping by the relevant authority) - we applied it in Dublin during the last transfer window.

[Stevie g 8]

it,s certainly a grey area the GAA need to look at.in some cases like this it seems crazy that it goes to court

[Pickas]

The O'Sullivan boys, as with the underage kids in Ballypickas, have only played GAA with their local club at Under-8 & Under-10 level.
In Ballypickas, kids play hurling with their club from 6 years of age.  Then at Under-12 level they must play with another club, just because they live on the 'wrong' side of an invisible line that splits a club that has been there since 1915.

By the way, for the second day running the GAA website's Daily News page has missed the chance to report on the high-profile "parish rule" case that made ALL the papers yesterday, even though it's tag-line is:
"Catch up on all the latest news, views and GAA-related rumours in www.gaa.ie's latest daily feature, GAA In the Papers."
OOPS!

http://gaa.ie/gaa-news-and-videos/daily-news/2/1307111022-wednesdays-gaa-in-the-papers/

[Pickas]

Pickas, would you be advocating a situation where any player can play for any club they want?

AZOffaly
Yes I'm advocating that situation.  What kind of club would you end up with if players were forced to play with you against their will?  Would they play?

In our club, Ballypickas, an entire family has left the GAA, both hurling and football, because they would not accept the County Board's decision to SPLIT THE FAMILY!   What is being gained by their inconsistent, unreasonable decisions? Where is the leadership from Croke Park?

[AZOffaly]

So in your opinion, it would be fine to allow big clubs, like Portlaoise for example, go around and poach the better players from smaller clubs nearby?

I'm not disagreeing with you, yet , but I'm trying to suss out your idea.

I think in this case it's patently obvious that a more sensible solution should be found, but I'm not sure that the answer is 'everyone can play where they like'.

[Pickas]

I understand the concerns of smaller clubs that players would be 'poached' by bigger, more successful clubs but the example you've used could be the wrong one.  Portlaoise already shares a catchment area or "parish" with three other clubs.  There have been a few cases where players transfered, within the Bye-Laws, from the smaller club to the bigger club, but it doesnt appear to be a huge issue.

There are many other clubs in Laois that share these "parishes" and the only thing stopping players leaving smaller clubs to join neighbouring, bigger clubs is the goodwill between the clubs & the loyalty of club members!  Yet in the case of Ballypickas, club members & their families cannot continue to be loyal because these "parish" boundaries split the club!

So, I repeat, can loyalty be forced? Should it not be earned?

[AZOffaly]

Of course loyalty can't be forced, but that's the sort of emotive language that makes for bad rules.

I don't think we need anything radical here. Why can't the GAA simply say.

'Lads, as a guideline, you must play for the club in your parish. If there's more than one club in the parish you can choose either.

If you, for whatever reason, wish to change clubs submit a transfer request and if both clubs agree, then the GAA will endorse it.

If one of the clubs objects, then the GAA will make a ruling based on personal circumstances and may endorse the transfer despite the objection'.

[Pickas]

But what happens in the situation where the Bye-Laws splits a club in two almost 95 years after the club was established, after the County Board had already officially acknowledged that the club is spread across parts of two "parishes"?