The Offical Glasgow Celtic thread

[Lamh Dhearg Alba]

What bloody changes has craig brown made?
Motherwell were going well anyway before he came in.Thats a ridiculous statement seeing that the team was doing fine only for the previous manager and board to fall out.

Going so well that they hadnt won in 7 games? Granted Gannon made some astute signings in the summer and had Motherwell playing some nice stuff early on (couple of terrible European scores apart) but his man management skills seem to have left a lot to be desired. He fell out with a number of the squad as well as the board and his crusade against the media and referees did him no favours. Motherwell was a really unhappy camp by the end of the December and they would probably be at the bottom of the league by now had Gannon still been in charge. Brown was lucky in that he assembled a decent enough squad but in fairness to him he has them doing better than Gannon had managed. Calderwood is a bit different and Im not sure anybody can credibly claim he has turned Killie around given they hadnt won a game under him until last night.

Must say Im surprised by the mess Mowbray has made of the Celtic job so far. The signings and results have not been good enough and his naivety with the media is bizarre. He says he needs time to turn Celtic around but given the budget he has and the competent squad inherited it should have been possible for him to put his own stamp on and keep winning the vast majority of SPL games at the same time. Being 10 points a very limited and totally skint Rangers team is poor indeed.
The transfer window flurry of activity doesnt inspire confidence either, the man spends weeks stressing about how its a long term project then signs a load of players on short term loan deals .

For whats its worth I thought he was right to move on Caldwell, Killen and Flood. Robson might have been worth keeping until the end of the season to help tide Celtic over. McDonald was a good player for Celtic but at £3.5m that was a good deal. McManus probably was worth keeping. By no means a great player but a steady left sided centre half (not so many of those around) and also a good leader on the park. Alongside the right partner he would have done a job.
Strachan is not a great manager (and he is making a total mess of Middlesbrough) but he did what was asked of him at Celtic and knew how to deliver success in Scotland and at least compete in Europe. Mowbray might still manage that but at this stage it looks a long shot.

[lynchbhoy]

Sambasaffron, no Celtic fan, least of all me, wants to see any Celtic manager fail, and if Strachan had presided over a run like this he'd have been run out of Glasgow. If anything Mowbray has got an easy ride.

The fact that so may players went off the boil simultaneously is more than coincidental, and the manager has to take responsibility, as the principal function of any manager in any walk of life is to get the best out of his human resources and create an environment where each one can realise his full potential.

There are no more excuses. As I said before it only took a couple of weeks for Brown and Calderwood to turn Motherwell and Killie around and get them playing with self belief, and they hadn't the luxury of bringing in players costing millions etc. Mowbray has shown not one inkling that he is up to the task of managing a big club like Celtic.

he did and then left himself...

[lynchbhoy]

It is at least gratifying to see that Mowbray's erstwhile supporters have deserted him. I said after Strachan's resignation last May that his reign would be revised in a new light in the seasons to come. I never particularly liked him as a person but I thought under the circumstances, although far from perfect, he did a good enough job.

Bringing in a gang of new players mid season, who lets face it, apart from Keane, have no proven pedigree, and jettisoning the likes of Caldwell (Scotland's Player of the Year a while ago), Robson, Mc Donald, and Mc Manus (none of whom are world beaters admittedly, but all of whom had experience of coming from behind Rangers, and winning games and the league under extreme pressure, and most of them Scots as well), doesn't seem like a sensible thing to do. Also Mc Geady is way out of form (just like Mc Donald, Mc Manus and Caldwell before him). This is too much of a coincidence and responsibility must rest with the manager and his failure to get players to play to their full potential.

Mowbray looked utterly clueless last night on the sidelines. Its obvious that managing Celtic and the attendant pressures are all far too much for him and he's way out of his depth. The Board need to act now, as much for Mowbray's own good as that of the club.

mcdonald has been shocking since christmas last year. Strachan presided over a bigger debacle of being at the club a couple of years and still losing a massive lead and the league.

POTY awards are great, but still dont make caldwell a good player. Have you not seen him play. While mcmanus is likable hes not a centre half or a lb. Left sided in a back three maybe. Mcdonald sold for massive profit when he has lost his touch from over a year ago - thats good business. Robson I would have kept.

McGeady has not played well under strachan lest we forget the rows and benchings of the young starlet -  gs who almost sold him can take no credit there either.

strachan left a mess and I like what I see of his cleaning out the deadwoon.

However I feel mogga made serious mistakes the other night. Too patient with Fortune, should have played rasmussen. I presume ODea was inj - and he was a loss given his recent form. Too many changes parachuted into the team - forced and unforced and that didnt help.
I expect this will improve. Will it be enough to overhaul rangers -unlikely but you never know.

Celtic need continuity and consistency as they should have beaten rangers in all games this season instead of a win, draw and loss.

I cant see mogga being sacked. who or what would replace him ? Owen coyle is still too inexperienced so wheredoes that leave lambert. Rem the last two inexperienced managers Celtic had - Brady and barnes...
yes - I do !!

[take_yer_points]

It is at least gratifying to see that Mowbray's erstwhile supporters have deserted him. I said after Strachan's resignation last May that his reign would be revised in a new light in the seasons to come. I never particularly liked him as a person but I thought under the circumstances, although far from perfect, he did a good enough job.

Bringing in a gang of new players mid season, who lets face it, apart from Keane, have no proven pedigree, and jettisoning the likes of Caldwell (Scotland's Player of the Year a while ago), Robson, Mc Donald, and Mc Manus (none of whom are world beaters admittedly, but all of whom had experience of coming from behind Rangers, and winning games and the league under extreme pressure, and most of them Scots as well), doesn't seem like a sensible thing to do. Also Mc Geady is way out of form (just like Mc Donald, Mc Manus and Caldwell before him). This is too much of a coincidence and responsibility must rest with the manager and his failure to get players to play to their full potential.

Mowbray looked utterly clueless last night on the sidelines. Its obvious that managing Celtic and the attendant pressures are all far too much for him and he's way out of his depth. The Board need to act now, as much for Mowbray's own good as that of the club.

mcdonald has been shocking since christmas last year. Strachan presided over a bigger debacle of being at the club a couple of years and still losing a massive lead and the league.

POTY awards are great, but still dont make caldwell a good player. Have you not seen him play. While mcmanus is likable hes not a centre half or a lb. Left sided in a back three maybe. Mcdonald sold for massive profit when he has lost his touch from over a year ago - thats good business. Robson I would have kept.

McGeady has not played well under strachan lest we forget the rows and benchings of the young starlet -  gs who almost sold him can take no credit there either.

strachan left a mess and I like what I see of his cleaning out the deadwoon.

However I feel mogga made serious mistakes the other night. Too patient with Fortune, should have played rasmussen. I presume ODea was inj - and he was a loss given his recent form. Too many changes parachuted into the team - forced and unforced and that didnt help.
I expect this will improve. Will it be enough to overhaul rangers -unlikely but you never know.

Celtic need continuity and consistency as they should have beaten rangers in all games this season instead of a win, draw and loss.

I cant see mogga being sacked. who or what would replace him ? Owen coyle is still too inexperienced so wheredoes that leave lambert. Rem the last two inexperienced managers Celtic had - Brady and barnes...
yes - I do !!

I don't think Owen Coyle is the right man either but if you think he's still too inexperienced then Mowbray isn't too far behind him. Both started management within a year of each other (both with Scottish clubs before moving to English clubs and getting both promoted to the Premier League). Their managerial experience is similar.

[lynchbhoy]

I don't think Owen Coyle is the right man either but if you think he's still too inexperienced then Mowbray isn't too far behind him. Both started management within a year of each other (both with Scottish clubs before moving to English clubs and getting both promoted to the Premier League). Their managerial experience is similar.

Think mowbray has that extra year on coyle ?
other than that yes I would agree very similar credentials with both mangers gaining promotion to epl etc Mowbray would have had better (arguably) exp in spl.

But thats my point anyhow, this is the level that Celtic are able toget - the lower ranked epl manager level. The guus hiddinks etc are out of reach.
Who else can celtic get. its a step up from Strachan who I dont think won promotion etc or anything as a manager - though I could be wrong.

I also dont know if Tony is correct in saying that Desmond will be picking up Keanes wages.
Must try to find out. It would be a break from the norm for DD. If anything I'd expect Keane to be part funded by spurs !

[T Fearon]

Well he certainly picked up the tab for Roy Keane's wages, but I suppose with merchandise sales and extra bums on seats etc,its a question of speculating to accumulate.

Its a sorry state of affairs but you wouldn't bet on Celtic beating anyone at the moment and I don't see the logic of those berating Strachan after a few weeks at Middlesbro while still supporting Mowbray after six months at Celtic Park.

The rest of the season will tell the tale, that is if Mowbray lasts beyond the weekend (surely defeat to Dunfermline would bring the curtain down?). If Strachan gets Boro into a play off place with largely Celtic's team from last year, and Mowbray doesn't at least get within striking distance of Rangers, or vice versa, then that will prove who the better manager is. I genuinely hope they both do well, and if Mowbray proves me wrong I'll gladly hold my hands up.

Still think Lambert has done enough to merit a chance, perhaps with Neil Lennon as his back up, and John Hughes seems to have the knack as well.

[lynchbhoy]

Well he certainly picked up the tab for Roy Keane's wages, but I suppose with merchandise sales and extra bums on seats etc,its a question of speculating to accumulate.

Its a sorry state of affairs but you wouldn't bet on Celtic beating anyone at the moment and I don't see the logic of those berating Strachan after a few weeks at Middlesbro while still supporting Mowbray after six months at Celtic Park.

The rest of the season will tell the tale, that is if Mowbray lasts beyond the weekend (surely defeat to Dunfermline would bring the curtain down?). If Strachan gets Boro into a play off place with largely Celtic's team from last year, and Mowbray doesn't at least get within striking distance of Rangers, or vice versa, then that will prove who the better manager is. I genuinely hope they both do well, and if Mowbray proves me wrong I'll gladly hold my hands up.

Still think Lambert has done enough to merit a chance, perhaps with Neil Lennon as his back up, and John Hughes seems to have the knack as well.

...the boro team that were in the top few of their div before strachan took over?

it matters not as he was just not good enough in the end and seemed to have lost the dressing room, mcgeady ,boruc, brown and others.
The comparison is back at you as you keep bringing up the strachan taking over from MON scenario etc.
John Hughes is the exact same as Mogga - great at hibs and a couple of smaller jobs before - but still imo too soon to take Celtic.
Prob too soon for mowbray too but he's there now.

Sacking mowbray would be crazy - who else can be brought in...unless they break the bank for Hiddink etc

as for Lambo- rem bares and brady ?

[Lamh Dhearg Alba]

Well he certainly picked up the tab for Roy Keane's wages, but I suppose with merchandise sales and extra bums on seats etc,its a question of speculating to accumulate.

Its a sorry state of affairs but you wouldn't bet on Celtic beating anyone at the moment and I don't see the logic of those berating Strachan after a few weeks at Middlesbro while still supporting Mowbray after six months at Celtic Park.

The rest of the season will tell the tale, that is if Mowbray lasts beyond the weekend (surely defeat to Dunfermline would bring the curtain down?). If Strachan gets Boro into a play off place with largely Celtic's team from last year, and Mowbray doesn't at least get within striking distance of Rangers, or vice versa, then that will prove who the better manager is. I genuinely hope they both do well, and if Mowbray proves me wrong I'll gladly hold my hands up.

Still think Lambert has done enough to merit a chance, perhaps with Neil Lennon as his back up, and John Hughes seems to have the knack as well.

Tony I would be astonished if Strachan does a job for Middlesbrough. The Championship is arguably a higher standard than the SPL, certainly it has far greater strength in depth, so how does Strachan figure that signing players he didnt use when at Cetic will benefit Middlesbrough? Killen is awful. Lee Miller is a player wjo had potential and pissed it away. He has scored 4 goals for Aberdeen this season and was out of contract this summer, the Dons couldnt believe their luck when Strachan paid £500,000 for him this week. Strachan did a credible job at Celtic but he is not a great manager and it was time for him to move on. He will fail at Middlesbrough and leave a pile of expensive duds behind him.

On another couple of points the Coyle/Mowbray comparison isnt a great one. With the squad he inherited and budget he had you would have expected Mowbray to promote WBA whereas Coyle took up a pretty limited Burnley squad against all expectation. In his 6 months in the Premiership at Burnley he made a better fist of competing than Mowbray did with WBA. At this stage Coyle's record as manager is better than Mowbrays.

Wouldnt be getting too excited about Hughes either. Did ok with Falkirk for a while but came within 20 minutes of relegating them last season when he had a better budget and squad than a number of rival clubs. Landed on his feet with Hibs but again Hibs are paying more cash this season than in a long time. With the likes of Riordan, Stokes and Miller on board he should be doing well and given how poor the OF are this season its a real chance for Hibs to break into the top two but that looks unlikely. Hughes would be a poor poor choice for Celtic and is a bit like Mowbray in that he goes on about his football philosophy all the time rather than going out and winning games.

[tyroneStatto]

http://www.celticfc.net/news/stories/news_040210103021.aspx

I see the stiffs beat drogheda 3-1 last night with brown scoring. the irony is that celtic team would probably have beaten kilmarnock.

[slow corner back]

Falkirk are currently enjoying their longest run inthe SPL ever. Currently 5 years thanks to Yogi hughes. Their longest previous run was three years. Hibs are currently one point behind Celtic in the table with a fraction of the resources. John Hughes is a serious contender for the celtic job next time it comes up ( next monday maybe? )

[T Fearon]

What you need to succeed in the SPL is essentially a team with a good complement of scrappers, then when you've won the war you can concentrate on playing football. Walter Smith, Craig Brown, John Hughes, Jimmy Calderwood etc all understand this, Mopwbray unfortunately doesn't as Celtic haven't one scrapper in their team, apart from Brown who isn't even fit yet.

[lynchbhoy]

What you need to succeed in the SPL is essentially a team with a good complement of scrappers, then when you've won the war you can concentrate on playing football. Walter Smith, Craig Brown, John Hughes, Jimmy Calderwood etc all understand this, Mopwbray unfortunately doesn't as Celtic haven't one scrapper in their team, apart from Brown who isn't even fit yet.

Mowbray prob the biggest scrapper of all those mentioned when they all played soccer tony (guessing about calderwood/smith/brown as I'm not that old to remember them playing)
so I am pretty sure he understands - plus he played in the spl not that long ago.
He's better qualified than us as well as most others !

[T Fearon]

Well if he understands he's not putting it into practice!

Alas I'm old enough to remember Walter in his Dundee Utd playing days (he featured in the 1974 Scottish Cup Final defeat to Celtic) and I remember a long haired, much slimmer Jimmy Calderwood, in the Birmingham City team of the mid 70s as well, alongside Trevor Franics and Kenny Burns

[lynchbhoy]

Well if he understands he's not putting it into practice!

Alas I'm old enough to remember Walter in his Dundee Utd playing days (he featured in the 1974 Scottish Cup Final defeat to Celtic) and I remember a long haired, much slimmer Jimmy Calderwood, in the Birmingham City team of the mid 70s as well, alongside Trevor Franics and Kenny Burns

would say that he prob does know, also that imo he does need a bit more physicality
but
as me Dad used to say, when yer fightin, yer not playing football....

so Mowbray requires a mixture of a lot of things that he is obv trying to rectify
I dont agree with his tactics of team selections the other night but he's the man in charge and imo getting it right - though looking like it may be too late for this season

I also think that Robbie keanes arrival took mogga by surprise. I'd say DD had a hand in that
Keane might have skewed the balance and Mowbrays decision making a bit- as I cannot understand why Rasmussen was not on or even starting the other night!

[T Fearon]

if and when they start winning on a consistent basis I'll believe he's getting it right, Id be amazed if DD isn't picking up the tab for Keane, but he will be expecting a return and that can only come from a successful team