Mayo v Roscommon - Connacht SFC Semi-Final, June 20, Venue TBC

[Foreverhopeful]

mayo need to pick their best players and play a system to suit that personnel. Basically there no reason why parsons, seamus o shea, harte, mcgarrity, aidan o'shea and barry moran  cant all play in the same team even though they're all midfielders by trade (harte a wingforward more so in my eyes). Surely rosnarun parsons is a better option at no.11 than trevor. You described his attributes which certainly tick all the boxes for a no.11. He is a far superior footballer than trevor so why not play him there and utilise his attacking skills. Especially when our midfield could do with a grafter and we have a ready made one in Seamus O'Shea. Obviously it might not work but better to try.

You dont see Kerry or Tyrone putting Paul Galvin or Brian Dooher in Centre Forward. Nope they do their grafting from the no.10 position, thats where trevor should be. 

I think its fair to say on the big days in Croke Park you need scrappers in the middle. Parsons and Mcgarrity both need a scapper like seamie for example. Otherwise you get run over in midfield. Kerry have the Scanlon, Tyrone had Collie Holmes/ Kevin Hughes. Time we maybe started adopting these models seen as these 2 counties have hogged Sam since 03'.

[moysider]

As one gets older you start to count the championship years harder. The retirement of likes of Jimmy Burke, TJ, Cahill, Ken Mort, Colm Mac, McHale, WJP and others were hard to come to terms with. Talk of rebuilding or different approach  is s**** (just ask Down about trying to recreate the past) When you ve got the likes of Nallen, Heaney and he who cannot be named, you use them. McGrath used Baney and Linden well into their mid-thirties and rightly so, cause he knew the likes would nt be along soon again. We re going into another championship again without the best player in the county on board.

[Maradona]

In fairness lads, time to move on.
I have always been one of his biggest fans, but to be honest I felt more cheated when MCD was not available in his prime (and in fairness to all, that was not always down to management / others).
he will be a classy player when he is 40....but we really need to be moving on and bringing through the new generation. I believe its becomming more and more a young mans game. McDonald fans - do ye really want to see him brought back as some sort of saviour only to get proof that the years have really caught up and the legacy of magic point V Dublin is replaced by a failure to keep the pace in a connaught championship match.

Whats all this about Parsons not up to midfield? Give the lad a chance, he is still U21!

Simple, play Harte at 11 - performed v well there last year, one of our successes (+ Parsons)

In my opinion, AO'S should never be considered for CHF. Could become an all time great at FF, but not CHF or MF

[moysider]

In fairness lads, time to move on.
I have always been one of his biggest fans, but to be honest I felt more cheated when MCD was not available in his prime (and in fairness to all, that was not always down to management / others).
he will be a classy player when he is 40....but we really need to be moving on and bringing through the new generation. I believe its becomming more and more a young mans game. McDonald fans - do ye really want to see him brought back as some sort of saviour only to get proof that the years have really caught up and the legacy of magic point V Dublin is replaced by a failure to keep the pace in a connaught championship match.

Whats all this about Parsons not up to midfield? Give the lad a chance, he is still U21!

Simple, play Harte at 11 - performed v well there last year, one of our successes (+ Parsons)

In my opinion, AO'S should never be considered for CHF. Could become an all time great at FF, but not CHF or MF

Short answer, yes. I d take my chances with him. He s in great shape and if likes of PJ and Dooher can so can he. The new generation is coming through anyway - they always do when they re ready. The thing is whether he d improve the team. I happen to think he would. At least it would have been sensible to find out what he still had to offer rather than dismissing him out of hand as a has-been. The point v Dublin does nt matter anymore. I happen to be convinced we would have won 2 more championship matches last year with him. This year s championship is all that counts now and if he improves us by a single point he should be there imo.

I dont think anybody is saying, even suggesting, that Parsons is nt up to it as a midfielder. Maybe we re too caught up with the cult of the midfielder in this county. Essentially they re ball winners, blockers and workhorses. Like second rows in rugby. No 11 is an important position too. One that more successful counties put more emphasis on than we do. Every successful team has top 11. Ogie, Hanahoe,Thomkins, Blaney, Máirtín Beag, Giles, McGuigan were all deadly playmakers. We dont have one( if we did in the 90s we had the rest to have won 2 or more AI s, but for all Maughan s great attributes he simply had nt a coaching mindset, its that simple)  but some of us seem to think Parsons has the attributes to do the job. Shows how high a regard we hold him in if we can hope he d fit into that company. Trevor cant do the job. Not convinced Harte can either but better bet than Trevor.

[Zulu]

Ciaran Mac is probably my favourite footballer but John O'Mahoney made the right call IMO and I think he should drop Nallen off the panel as well, unless he has an important role on the training ground or the dressing room, beacuse he has no place on an IC football pitch. I've seen plenty of Seamus O'Shea and he simply isn't an IC standard footballer, Mayo supporters need to look at their players in a more analytical fashion IMO.

[moysider]

Ciaran Mac is probably my favourite footballer but John O'Mahoney made the right call IMO and I think he should drop Nallen off the panel as well, unless he has an important role on the training ground or the dressing room, beacuse he has no place on an IC football pitch. I've seen plenty of Seamus O'Shea and he simply isn't an IC standard footballer, Mayo supporters need to look at their players in a more analytical fashion IMO.

In that case there s no point in persisting with likes of Dooher, Joyce and Dara O Sé either right? Can t argue about Seamus O Sé cause I find it hard to remember when he was last fit and well. When he was right he could play.

[Zulu]

In that case there s no point in persisting with likes of Dooher, Joyce and Dara O Sé either right?

No, just because some players can play into their mid thirties doesn't mean all can and IMO Joyce will be shown up this summer if he is played at center forward. Dooher is an exception to the rule and Dara is a ball winner rather than a box to box midfielder, so they aren't compareable IMO. Mac is definitely an IC footballer but I don't think he is a guy who is willing into fit a system and you can only carry that type of player if he is a match winner, Mac while exceptional wasn't a Canavan, O'Rourke, Mullins type player, guys who's will to win was such that they were always worth playing.

[Cosmo Kramer]

I don't like the idea of a McGarrity/Seamus O'Shea partnership at midfield, which is what you would have if you put him in and moved Parsons to 11. I think McGarrity is grand as a second midfielder supporting someone else, but I don't honestly think he's good enough to be our lead man. Parsons is such a good player that you'd want to play him everywhere, but I think its best to put him where we need him most, and thats winning ball in midfield, we don't have anyone else even close to his quality in that position imo.

The thing that struck me in Gaelic Park was the sheer physical size of the team from 8 up this year, it must be at least 10 years if not more since we had as many big lads. Even T Mort and A Moran aren't small and when you put them in with Harte, A O'Shea and B Moran, and the two midfielders, that must be one of the biggest combined midfield/forward lines in the country (apart from Dillon who looked tiny in the parade alongside the rest of them). That's a big advantage for us, and probably another good reason to leave Parsons at midfield, we have a big enough forward line without him.

I haven't seen any video of the NY game anywhere so I stuck a few clips on youtube, the quality off my digital camera is hopeless but you'll get the idea. Harte's goal is in there too, which was quality if you haven't seen it.

http://www.youtube.com/CosmoKramer100

[small white mayoman]

In that case there s no point in persisting with likes of Dooher, Joyce and Dara O Sé either right?

No, just because some players can play into their mid thirties doesn't mean all can and IMO Joyce will be shown up this summer if he is played at center forward. Dooher is an exception to the rule and Dara is a ball winner rather than a box to box midfielder, so they aren't compareable IMO. Mac is definitely an IC footballer but I don't think he is a guy who is willing into fit a system and you can only carry that type of player if he is a match winner, Mac while exceptional wasn't a Canavan, O'Rourke, Mullins type player, guys who's will to win was such that they were always worth playing.

l don't really want to get into the ciaran mc debate but how do we know whether he would be willing to fit into the system when he has not even been tried out with the current management. Also don't think your been really fair on the blond when questioning his will to win i have been watching him for years and have never seen a more competetive player .At the end of the day we won't see him again in the mayo jersey 

[Farrandeelin]

Seen as the McDonald debate has opened once again, I personally would love to see him back. I think he would be a great addition to the team and we probably would win Connacht with him on the team. I honestly don't know what is going on in O'Mahony's head when he is leaving out a great forward that could spray passes, orchestrate openings etc. from the no 11 position. Maybe it's just plain stubbourness on the behalf of the manager. A thing Maughan is probably regretting since 97.

[AbbeySider]

This topic about McDonald will never really be put to bed. Its our own little Saipan story.

I think that the next Mayo manager will have McDonald back if O Mahoney doesnt wait on another year.
Strange when JOM took over he brought back O Neill.

[Farrandeelin]

It was actually Mickey Moran who brought back O'Neill. And he played well in Knockmore's win over Breaffy a few weeks ago as well! Bring him back too I say. Afterall he brought back Nallen and Heaney...

[moysider]

It was actually Mickey Moran who brought back O'Neill. And he played well in Knockmore's win over Breaffy a few weeks ago as well! Bring him back too I say. Afterall he brought back Nallen and Heaney...

MandM were a stroke of good fortune in 06. If, as the CB executive expected and most Mayo supporters wanted, Johnno had taken over from Maughan in Autumn 05 then it s very unlikely that MacDonald would have figured and neither would have O Neill. That wonderful semi v Dublin we would never have known, but we would nt have had to suffer the grief of the final either and that seems to be more important to some. I think it was a great Summer. Ended badly but shit happens in sport. I d take a repeat this year and any year but not expecting too much to be honest. If, and its a big if, we win Connacht and avoid Kerry/Cork in 1/4 we could make a semi. and that would nt be bad at all in the circumstances. Something for the next guy to build on.

[blast05]

two quick points - everyone entitled to opinions, but Rosnarun on Harte - well its ridiculous, and I agree, he must have done something really bad to you. Just wish people were a bit fairer. Harte would be No.1 on my team sheet - exactly the type of player we need more of - good hands, speed and athletic, can take a good score from distance. Big flaw is that he overplays the ball too much.

Re Harte - yes he is excellent but there is no question that he should have got the line against New York and is always liable to hurt us every so often when he is sent off. No question he should be on the team but needs to learn.

[moysider]

two quick points - everyone entitled to opinions, but Rosnarun on Harte - well its ridiculous, and I agree, he must have done something really bad to you. Just wish people were a bit fairer. Harte would be No.1 on my team sheet - exactly the type of player we need more of - good hands, speed and athletic, can take a good score from distance. Big flaw is that he overplays the ball too much.

Re Harte - yes he is excellent but there is no question that he should have got the line against New York and is always liable to hurt us every so often when he is sent off. No question he should be on the team but needs to learn.

There s no arguing with that Blast. Patrick does get done for silly, lazy stuff and - without putting a fine tooth on it - the odd cheap shot. But he s not afraid to get hurt either. I never remember Boylan leave Coyler and others who were fond of cards off his teams, and Mickey Harte wont be dropping Ricey any time soon even though he could be sent off every game he plays. At least Patrick Harte unlikely to resort to bag snatching (gooseing if you prefer).

We ve been too nice for too long. Time we had a few players that could leave a sly one in. We were often on the recieving end. Give the referee a call to make. More often than not they back off. Especially when you get a bit of respect for taking no nonesense. Refs will have no problem sending off a lad from a weaker county but dont dare do so if it involves the big boys. The same craven standards exist at club and schools level as well. Kerry/ Tyrone/Armagh know that. Meath perfected the art of stretching referees and got media onside as well as the no nonesense - tough- but - never- whinge team. It amazes me that when we have a player that can play a bit and can hurt somebody as well we dont want to know. Surely after nearly 60 years of underachievement with nice teams we should embrace a bit of dark stuff. My only issue with Patrick is that he is too obvious.