Tyrone v Kerry NFL Round 2

[tyrone86]

This is some evolution from Tyrone v Kerry in February means shite all to the All Ireland. I wouldn't say that the league means squat, by all accounts it wasn't until after the Derry game last year that Tyrone realised how far back they were and upped the intensity of training accordingly. It's not the end of the world if you don't win it, but it provides a yard stick to see where the other teams and your own players are at that point in time.

[orangeman]

Gone are the days when MH went out to win every match.

I think that's a scandalous accusation. You're suggesting Mickey goes out to lose. Consider yourself reported.

I hear he's even considering playing challenge matches too !!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Zulu]

Lads: the League means squat.

It meant a feckin great deal in 03 and 04 when the AI winners won both. In 05 the winners and semi-finalists contested the NFL semis. In 06 Kerry won both with the AI runners up reaching the semis. In 07 the NFL runners up reached the AIF. In 08 Kerry reached the final.
2002 was the last time NFL had no relevance to the SFC season.

The NFL does not mean squat. It's an indicator as to how teams are progressing. Tyrone in 08 was probably biggest 'squat' example I suppose.

A league game in Febuary does mean 'squat', and all your stats prove ONeill is that the best teams in the country do pretty well in the league as well as the championship, nothing groundbreaking there I'd imagine. Now that the big teams take the league fairly seriously one or two of them are bound to be at the business end just as they generally are in the championship. But reading too much into an early season head to head is nonsense, all Tyrone V Kerry in Feb tells us is that there isn't much between the two teams and we already knew that.

[Tyrone Dreamer]

I posted this on another thread:

Probably the wrong thread but I have suggested one way of changing the season which I will out line below. Its only a rough idea but I think we need to think of better ways to get people interested from earlier in the year:

. Link the league and championship and split the championship into an A championship and B championship.
. Have 2 groups of 8 in the A championship and the same in b). There are a lot of teams who simply arent in a position to compete with the top teams.
. Each team plays each other once with the top four qualifying for the quarter finals with 1st in group 1 playing 4th in group 2 etc.
. Start the B championship earlier. This would mean that the winners of the B championship could have a playoff with one of the 4th placed teams for a quarter final place. Meaning every team in Ireland still has a chance of winning the All Ireland.
. Each team plays 3 home and 3 away games. Have a huge advertising blitz early in the year. Season tickets for home games and for all games will be available through clubs at reasonable prices and with oap/children tickets available. These will have 1st choice on quarter final tickets and on.
. Each team plays 1 neutral match possibly in Croke Park. Say have a few big Croke Park Weekends with double headers on Saturday and Sundays.
. Possibly organise the groups on a geographical basis so that there will be plenty of derbies and bigger crowds.
. There would be relegation/promotion each year between championships.
. Possibly have the provincial championships as a warm up.
. Start the championship in March/April. Matches will be played once every 2 weeks. Every other week will be set aside for club games with county players and there will be no exceptions. Club players need more games than once every 2 weeks so something would have to be considered here. Still think this would be better for clubs than the current situation.

This would be a huge shift from current situation and I'm not saying its the best way forward. But really think it makes no sense currently for most counties to only start playing meaningful games in July even though the season commences in January. Also think it could lead to a better structured season for clubs. Should also mean nearly every county match is important. The traditionalists would probably hate this idea!



If the league means nothing come championship and if no one cares how they do in it then why are we wasting over half of the inter county season by playing meaningless games? It makes no sense.

[under the bar]

I respect your opinion but couldn't disagree more.  I have a healthy respect for Tyrone and a strong dislike of Kerry but I think  a worm turned on Sunday and it wasn't in Tyrone's favour.

Benny Tyrone's line up left out 4 all-stars and best players in Ireland in their positions.  It will take something special from Kerry to beat a full strength Tyrone in August/September otherwise it will be the same old story of bewildered looks from the kingdom.

[Zulu]

If the league means nothing come championship and if no one cares how they do in it then why are we wasting over half of the inter county season by playing meaningless games? It makes no sense.   

I don't agree it means nothing, it's just that it's early in the season so you can't read too much into a result, sure Down beat Tyrone after a replay in the early part of last years championship and we all know how both teams finished up. I think the league is great, there are plenty of great matches and interesting match ups and nattering away about the various results and what it means for promotion or relegation is great IMO.

Benny Tyrone's line up left out 4 all-stars and best players in Ireland in their positions.  It will take something special from Kerry to beat a full strength Tyrone in August/September otherwise it will be the same old story of bewildered looks from the kingdom.

That was hardly a full strength Kerry either, the two O'Se's and Donaghy spring to mind immediately but there'll be other changes before championship.

[ONeill]

A league game in Febuary does mean 'squat', and all your stats prove ONeill is that the best teams in the country do pretty well in the league as well as the championship, nothing groundbreaking there I'd imagine. Now that the big teams take the league fairly seriously one or two of them are bound to be at the business end just as they generally are in the championship. But reading too much into an early season head to head is nonsense, all Tyrone V Kerry in Feb tells us is that there isn't much between the two teams and we already knew that.

Nowhere has anyone said that Tyrone or Kerry's AI chances are now transparent after Sunday. What you can do is analysis what you saw in terms of performances.

But to say that the NFL means nothing is wrong. Last year we were given an indication of Wexford's eventual performance.

[Fear ón Srath Bán]

A league game in Febuary does mean 'squat', and all your stats prove ONeill is that the best teams in the country do pretty well in the league as well as the championship, nothing groundbreaking there I'd imagine. Now that the big teams take the league fairly seriously one or two of them are bound to be at the business end just as they generally are in the championship. But reading too much into an early season head to head is nonsense, all Tyrone V Kerry in Feb tells us is that there isn't much between the two teams and we already knew that.

Nowhere has anyone said that Tyrone or Kerry's AI chances are now transparent after Sunday. What you can do is analysis what you saw in terms of performances.

But to say that the NFL means nothing is wrong. Last year we were given an indication of Wexford's eventual performance.

The NFL is not squat, but only in the context of the Championship; it means nothing in itself, but means a lot as a preliminary for the Championship. Zulu, you can quote me all the stats until you're blue in the face -- I'm still smarting from the rout we had in Tralee in 2005 (and that was the last NFL game), and that meant zilch in Championship terms. Shane, when you're positive about a defeat I'll be worried.

[Zulu]

I'm not sure who is saying what at this stage but to clarify my own position, taking an early season league game and reading anything into it is pointless but a teams overall performance in the league is worth noting though it has to be taken in context. ONeill you cite Wexford's league performance as evidence that a good league can be used as a marker for that years championship but 2 years ago (I think) Donegal won the league and then did SFA after that. So you can pick and chose teams to suit your argument if you want. If anything I think recent years have shown us that getting to the AI QF's is what's important and from there on in performing to your best will decide your season.

[Tyrone Dreamer]

If the league means nothing come championship and if no one cares how they do in it then why are we wasting over half of the inter county season by playing meaningless games? It makes no sense.   

I don't agree it means nothing, it's just that it's early in the season so you can't read too much into a result, sure Down beat Tyrone after a replay in the early part of last years championship and we all know how both teams finished up. I think the league is great, there are plenty of great matches and interesting match ups and nattering away about the various results and what it means for promotion or relegation is great IMO.

Benny Tyrone's line up left out 4 all-stars and best players in Ireland in their positions.  It will take something special from Kerry to beat a full strength Tyrone in August/September otherwise it will be the same old story of bewildered looks from the kingdom.

That was hardly a full strength Kerry either, the two O'Se's and Donaghy spring to mind immediately but there'll be other changes before championship.

Its meaningless from the point of view that most teams dont really care if they do well in the league. Im not sure if it makes sense to have 10 + warm up games (if you include McKenna cup etc) and then maybe only play a couple of important championship games. I know we like to think of ourselves as different to other sports but no other sport I think would come close to having the same proportion of warm up games in their season. Is it any wonder the gaa struggles to attract crowds to the leagues when the games dont really matter.

[Zulu]

Well in fairness I think the league does matter to some teams and every county bar Kerry would take great pleasure in winning it. The problem with runninig a proper competition in the GAA, is we still want to be all things to all men and the fact that we are a dual code association. For example if you start the championship in March/April where does that leave the U21 championship or the Sigerson/Fitz? What about the clubs in dual counties if your playing football every second week? I presume hurling is being played on the altenative weeks, which poses a serious problem for the likes of Cork, Limerick, Wexford, Tipp, Waterford etc., and if you play IC football and hurling on the same weekend then you seriously decrease the attendance at one if not both games for some counties.

IMO we will never get a proper competition until senior IC players only play senior IC football or hurling, they don't play for their clubs, universities or county U21 sides unless the IC senior team is knocked out. I'm not saying that is desireable but when your trying to account for everything nothing gets done properly.

[INDIANA]

I'm not sure who is saying what at this stage but to clarify my own position, taking an early season league game and reading anything into it is pointless but a teams overall performance in the league is worth noting though it has to be taken in context. ONeill you cite Wexford's league performance as evidence that a good league can be used as a marker for that years championship but 2 years ago (I think) Donegal won the league and then did SFA after that. So you can pick and chose teams to suit your argument if you want. If anything I think recent years have shown us that getting to the AI QF's is what's important and from there on in performing to your best will decide your season.

By and large Zulu based on statistics teams that do well in the league do well in the championship. There are exceptions but not many. Teams that do poorly in the league generally make early exits in the championship

[Zulu]

I agree Indiana but as I said in a previous post that is as much to with the fact that the top teams take the league fairly seriously now and therefore they are likely to do well in both league and championship.

[INDIANA]

unless you're dublin. but then again we aren't  a top team anymore.

[Zulu]

That's one thing that has surprised me about Dublin over the past 2 or 3 years, I felt they really should have, and should be now, really going for the league. It would do them the world of good IMO and might give them that well of confidence they need come August.