Cattle cull

[RadioGAAGAA]

Rounding cattle up and putting them on a lorry causes distress to these animals.There was no fencing on the farm and on bad terrain.If you are watching the video the farmer requested the opportunity to round up 4 of the cattle during the cull. Along with the protesters they couldn't manage it.

During the cull.

FFS get a grip.

Sorry was it not a cull?

What state of mind do you think a cow would be in if its calf had been shot? Or a calf would be in if its cow had been shot?

Do you think they'd be nice and settled and cooperative to getting capped onto a lorry?


The fact that the DAERA officials were prepared to even attempt to load them at that point showed the previous "risk assessment" for the bullshit it was. They were willing to undertake a far, far, far more risky proposition than what would have been the case if they'd arrived equipped to do that to start with.

If they're going buck mad in my experience with animals you're as well call it a day, let them settle and come back the next day.

.

Exactly.

So to say that 'cos they couldn't be loaded at that point that it would never have worked is utter bullshit.

[reddgnhand]

Do the authorities have holding facilities for animals in an event like this? What could the authorities actually have done operationally. Not just conceptually. How does that look? Where do they take them?

A mart?

Surely there were better options.

This is kind of my point. That sounds grand and rational and all that and sounds like a better option

A reality is we have created, and live in, a world full of bullshit, red tape, beauacracy etc. That have taken us to a place where common sense solutions are often not available in the reality of all the above nonsense.

I think it's also a bit naive of us to think that it was done on a whim and they didn't exhaust scenarios for the situation.

Cuckoo if you get a chance watch the video on YouTube previously posted.The vets have stated that this has been a process that has lasted 4/5 years. You can clearly see they have been deeply affected by this as they are quite emotional. Decisions to carry out these actions in my opinion should be made by trained vets which they were.

Meant Puckoon typing error sorry.

[reddgnhand]

Do the authorities have holding facilities for animals in an event like this? What could the authorities actually have done operationally. Not just conceptually. How does that look? Where do they take them?

A mart?

Surely there were better options.

And who is going to buy animals that cant go into the food chain? I couldn't see a market even attempt to sell them.

Why was that?

If not suitable for humans there needs to be a proper and humane way for animals to be gotten rid of be it cattle/horses/sheep whatever, surely a demand for dog/cat food. 

Armagh18 the vets in the video and they quote expert studies that this was the most humane way to carry this out. If you get a chance take a look at the video.

[RadioGAAGAA]

And 1 broke out because the facilities were poor.Can you accept at least that vets are best suited to make these calls?

In my experience, no not always.

Some are great.
Some others are just punching their time till they can get to small-animals, and some others are just dreaming of horses.


... and many of them wouldn't be too keen on spending a day rounding up stock over rough ground! (To be fair, I wouldn't be keen on it myself and have walked that road many's a time!)


It also needs to be made clear - DAERA is more than just vets - they have a lot more facilities and equipment available to them than most vets will ever see and use. That I think has been (badly) missed in the decision making.


The right person at the top could have sent 50 fellas down the road with a few hundred gates from greenmount with several big tractors and trailers to load them up.


Yes, not ordinary approach, and crossed divisions within DAERA, but this clearly wasn't ordinary circumstances

[RadioGAAGAA]

Armagh18 the vets in the video and they quote expert studies that this was the most humane way to carry this out. If you get a chance take a look at the video.

You didn't answer before, so I'll ask again.

Are you in any way involved with cattle at all?

[reddgnhand]

And 1 broke out because the facilities were poor.Can you accept at least that vets are best suited to make these calls?

In my experience, no not always.

Some are great.
Some others are just punching their time till they can get to small-animals, and some others are just dreaming of horses.


... and many of them wouldn't be too keen on spending a day rounding up stock over rough ground! (To be fair, I wouldn't be keen on it myself and have walked that road many's a time!)


It also needs to be made clear - DAERA is more than just vets - they have a lot more facilities and equipment available to them than most vets will ever see and use. That I think has been (badly) missed in the decision making.


The right person at the top could have sent 50 fellas down the road with a few hundred gates from greenmount with several big tractors and trailers to load them up.


Yes, not ordinary approach, and crossed divisions within DAERA, but this clearly wasn't ordinary circumstances

But we both don't know the caliber of these vets. Tell me watching the 2 vets questioned by the committee do you think they are sadistic in anyway? These people have been threatened for carrying out their job and have been shown absolutely no respect.

[reddgnhand]

Armagh18 the vets in the video and they quote expert studies that this was the most humane way to carry this out. If you get a chance take a look at the video.

You didn't answer before, so I'll ask again.

Are you in any way involved with cattle at all?

No does that mean I'm not allowed an opinion? Are you a vet at all?

[RadioGAAGAA]

But we both don't know the caliber of these vets. Tell me watching the 2 vets questioned by the committee do you think they are sadistic in anyway? These people have been threatened for carrying out their job and have been shown absolutely no respect.

What 2 vets?

This hearing?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rs4t--M6EXQ&list=PL5lnNfzfEzh5UeUGNYOuL26w6Zmt7dSiz&index=2

[reddgnhand]

But we both don't know the caliber of these vets. Tell me watching the 2 vets questioned by the committee do you think they are sadistic in anyway? These people have been threatened for carrying out their job and have been shown absolutely no respect.

What 2 vets?

This hearing?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rs4t--M6EXQ&list=PL5lnNfzfEzh5UeUGNYOuL26w6Zmt7dSiz&index=2

Yes.

[Stall the Bailer]

Do the authorities have holding facilities for animals in an event like this? What could the authorities actually have done operationally. Not just conceptually. How does that look? Where do they take them?

A mart?

Surely there were better options.

And who is going to buy animals that cant go into the food chain? I couldn't see a market even attempt to sell them.

Why was that?

If not suitable for humans there needs to be a proper and humane way for animals to be gotten rid of be it cattle/horses/sheep whatever, surely a demand for dog/cat food. 

Armagh18 the vets in the video and they quote expert studies that this was the most humane way to carry this out. If you get a chance take a look at the video.

There is a post earlier showing mobile handling facilities. Many farmers and deara would have these. Deara often have grants for farmers purchasing them. The excuse of no other option to round up the cattle is wrong. Deara is not just vets, they have many staff, a lot would be part time farmers as well and would be on farmers daily doing blood tests and the likes. They had the man power to handle this differently.
It is not a black and white issue, the farmer has not done all correctly, likewise Deara. If my memory is correct one of head vets had to resign a few years ago due a failed court case costing the public over one million, or something along those lines. I know of other vets taking a farmer to court and case being thrown out due to the absurdity of it. There is bias here by many, keep that in mind especially as some of this is an opportunity for some political parties and those with a interest will look out for their own.

[RadioGAAGAA]

Armagh18 the vets in the video and they quote expert studies that this was the most humane way to carry this out. If you get a chance take a look at the video.

You didn't answer before, so I'll ask again.

Are you in any way involved with cattle at all?

No does that mean I'm not allowed an opinion? Are you a vet at all?

It does mean your opinion is rather baseless.

You've no idea of the difference good handling systems make, or what even is possible by clamping up a few gates.


I'm not a vet, but involved with farming. Some of it on pretty shit ground so the circumstances here aren't unknown to me for rounding up cattle or sheep.


I do know this - if you gave me access to all the equipment and manpower DAERA has - I'd easily have organised the rounding up of these animals and removal from the 3 sites.

Its Fivemiletown. Its not f**king Tibet or the Amazon.

[reddgnhand]

Armagh18 the vets in the video and they quote expert studies that this was the most humane way to carry this out. If you get a chance take a look at the video.

You didn't answer before, so I'll ask again.

Are you in any way involved with cattle at all?

No does that mean I'm not allowed an opinion? Are you a vet at all?

It does mean your opinion is rather baseless.

You've no idea of the difference good handling systems make, or what even is possible by clamping up a few gates.


I'm not a vet, but involved with farming. Some of it on pretty shit ground so the circumstances here aren't unknown to me for rounding up cattle or sheep.


I do know this - if you gave me access to all the equipment and manpower DAERA has - I'd easily have organised the rounding up of these animals and removal from the 3 sites.

Its Fivemiletown. Its not f**king Tibet or the Amazon.

And your not a vet so makes your opinion baseless.

[reddgnhand]

Armagh18 the vets in the video and they quote expert studies that this was the most humane way to carry this out. If you get a chance take a look at the video.

You didn't answer before, so I'll ask again.

Are you in any way involved with cattle at all?

No does that mean I'm not allowed an opinion? Are you a vet at all?

It does mean your opinion is rather baseless.

You've no idea of the difference good handling systems make, or what even is possible by clamping up a few gates.


I'm not a vet, but involved with farming. Some of it on pretty shit ground so the circumstances here aren't unknown to me for rounding up cattle or sheep.


I do know this - if you gave me access to all the equipment and manpower DAERA has - I'd easily have organised the rounding up of these animals and removal from the 3 sites.

Its Fivemiletown. Its not f**king Tibet or the Amazon.

And in your experience if there is bad terrain is it possible that these cattle could get seriously injured in an attempt to round them up?

[Armagh18]

Armagh18 the vets in the video and they quote expert studies that this was the most humane way to carry this out. If you get a chance take a look at the video.

You didn't answer before, so I'll ask again.

Are you in any way involved with cattle at all?

No does that mean I'm not allowed an opinion? Are you a vet at all?

It does mean your opinion is rather baseless.

You've no idea of the difference good handling systems make, or what even is possible by clamping up a few gates.


I'm not a vet, but involved with farming. Some of it on pretty shit ground so the circumstances here aren't unknown to me for rounding up cattle or sheep.


I do know this - if you gave me access to all the equipment and manpower DAERA has - I'd easily have organised the rounding up of these animals and removal from the 3 sites.

Its Fivemiletown. Its not f**king Tibet or the Amazon.

And your not a vet so makes your opinion baseless.

?? You certainly don't need to be a vet to know about rounding up cattle?

[RadioGAAGAA]

But we both don't know the caliber of these vets. Tell me watching the 2 vets questioned by the committee do you think they are sadistic in anyway? These people have been threatened for carrying out their job and have been shown absolutely no respect.

What 2 vets?

This hearing?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rs4t--M6EXQ&list=PL5lnNfzfEzh5UeUGNYOuL26w6Zmt7dSiz&index=2

Yes.

Its nothing to do with sadistic.

To be honest, its far more masochistic to have to try to round up the stock!

Do you think either of them look like they'd fancy trekking around for half a day?



To be clear - they, or no one else, should be threatened. The one who should be threatened is the farmer who ignored repeated warnings over many years of maltreatment of animals.


Those two just shouldn't be making decisions of this magnitude any longer. I've very little respect for their decision making abilities given what appears to have happened.