Antrim Football Thread

[Milltown Row2]

MR2 exactly clubs voted for this because it benefits them

Now Solo and Go what your talking about is football quality and benefiting football in the county.

Don't confuse it with preparation for championship etc

16 teams get to call themselves Division 1 senior teams. (Ego benefit)

Your Cargins/Ports/Brides etc don't care because it doesn't impact them that much

Rossa/stjohns/TNN and any team hanging around 8 or lower want 16 teams because if they didn't have it there's a high chance they'd be relegated to Div 2

Likes of Gort retained Div 2 and didn't get relegated (benefit) Lisburn and the likes would be in junior A so it benefits those clubs around that level to have the current structures because they get to play a higher grade albeit weaker comp.

The clubs see the structures as a benefit to them
Your seeing it from a different perspective and not as a club

They voted for the change. It hasn't worked. Would those clubs still vote for it now. Do you think TNN, Rossa, MG, Sars etc want to win a handful of games just to say they are 'Division 1 team'. Not a single player in any of those teams is happy to be beat week in week out but are satisfied because they play 'div 1'. If I was a player who won 1 match all year and was in division 1 id be absolutely scundered to say that.

But I get the status thing. And the simply solution is 1a and 1b. You still play division 1 football. I bet you MG and Sarsfields would bite your hand off to play 1b rather than a 16 team div 1.

And what I'm really saying is, yes in turn it would benefit the county. But I'm talking about individual players and teams. Playing a structure like that improves everyone. Laughable to suggest otherwise.

Not sure what club you are but you really need to take a look at your committee, as they have more than likely voted it, has there been a motion to change it? If not it's laughable that your club is complicit along with others..

Short story, went to agm one year and they were talking ref's, as a player still I was giving off about the standard, club sec pulled me I. Front of the floor and challenged me to make a difference...

Not sure I did but, instead of talking about it, get involved, change from within

[SoloAndGo]

It really doesn't matter who voted for it as it changed a number of years ago. The conversation is about what it should change to now and why. This is a thread that talks about Antrim football. I don't think for a second that I or anybody or anything discussed in this thread will make any decisions.

But it's a thread on Antrim football and this should be a hot topic of conservation here because current structure is so far off the mark.

Instead of 'get involved' or 'not gonna happen discussing it here'. Why not challenge or come up with better alternatives.

[Milltown Row2]

It really doesn't matter who voted for it as it changed a number of years ago. The conversation is about what it should change to now and why. This is a thread that talks about Antrim football. I don't think for a second that I or anybody or anything discussed in this thread will make any decisions.

But it's a thread on Antrim football and this should be a hot topic of conservation here because current structure is so far off the mark.

Instead of 'get involved' or 'not gonna happen discussing it here'. Why not challenge or come up with better alternatives.

There has been multiple attempts on this board with how it should/could look..

You can't challenge it here, but certainly it's been talked about, I'm not shutting it down at all, just that it's been discussed at length on here since the leagues were changed

[JimStynes]

Absolutely right nothing will change based on this thread. But worth the conversation imo to get people talking and bring it to club reps.

The county boys missing is not an issue. They still play half a season and if that's your excuse to get relegated to 1b then it's just an excuse. Cargin won 14/15, Creggan 12/15, St Brides 11/15 all last season whilst missing boys for half the year.

And to be honest, missing county players or tightly contested games that are the difference is a much better alternative than what we currently have. A fiercely contested league that probably any 8 teams could win makes the league certainly more meaningful and attractive to supporters.

In regards to supporters who's interested in Creggan beat St Paul's or Aghohill by 30 points. A 1a, 1b every single game worth a watch imo.

It is a massive issue for a club like Aghagallon. Last couple of seasons have been a shit show but in a normal year we have about 17/18 good quality players. When you're missing 5/6 of those with the county and then a couple injuries then you're down to the bare bones at the start of the season. Some clubs will be going full tilt trying to pick up points off teams early on in the league before county men get back. I just don't really see another way around it, the seasons overlap so you're always missing county players. Teams with the bigger numbers could nearly put out 2 teams that would compete in the early stages of Div 1 so missing a few county men doesn't affect them.  I would be in favour of a 1a and 1b and that is your senior championship. If that is not an option the drop it to 10 teams in Div 1. I definitely think 16 teams in Div 1 is far too many. If that means we drop to Div 2 then that's what it is.

[SoloAndGo]

Absolutely right nothing will change based on this thread. But worth the conversation imo to get people talking and bring it to club reps.

The county boys missing is not an issue. They still play half a season and if that's your excuse to get relegated to 1b then it's just an excuse. Cargin won 14/15, Creggan 12/15, St Brides 11/15 all last season whilst missing boys for half the year.

And to be honest, missing county players or tightly contested games that are the difference is a much better alternative than what we currently have. A fiercely contested league that probably any 8 teams could win makes the league certainly more meaningful and attractive to supporters.

In regards to supporters who's interested in Creggan beat St Paul's or Aghohill by 30 points. A 1a, 1b every single game worth a watch imo.

It is a massive issue for a club like Aghagallon. Last couple of seasons have been a shit show but in a normal year we have about 17/18 good quality players. When you're missing 5/6 of those with the county and then a couple injuries then you're down to the bare bones at the start of the season. Some clubs will be going full tilt trying to pick up points off teams early on in the league before county men get back. I just don't really see another way around it, the seasons overlap so you're always missing county players. Teams with the bigger numbers could nearly put out 2 teams that would compete in the early stages of Div 1 so missing a few county men doesn't affect them.  I would be in favour of a 1a and 1b and that is your senior championship. If that is not an option the drop it to 10 teams in Div 1. I definitely think 16 teams in Div 1 is far too many. If that means we drop to Div 2 then that's what it is.

Listen I get you would rather have county players. But you still have half a league to fulfil with them and if you aren't picking up enough wins to stay up then the issue is not missing your county boys. Every other team is in the same boat remember. 

But for the likes of yourselves then it's even more important there is a 1a, 1b structure. Yous would be 1b and without county players you should still be able to compete with all of the other clubs.

Armagh club structure is perfect for Antrim imo.

[JimStynes]

Absolutely right nothing will change based on this thread. But worth the conversation imo to get people talking and bring it to club reps.

The county boys missing is not an issue. They still play half a season and if that's your excuse to get relegated to 1b then it's just an excuse. Cargin won 14/15, Creggan 12/15, St Brides 11/15 all last season whilst missing boys for half the year.

And to be honest, missing county players or tightly contested games that are the difference is a much better alternative than what we currently have. A fiercely contested league that probably any 8 teams could win makes the league certainly more meaningful and attractive to supporters.

In regards to supporters who's interested in Creggan beat St Paul's or Aghohill by 30 points. A 1a, 1b every single game worth a watch imo.

It is a massive issue for a club like Aghagallon. Last couple of seasons have been a shit show but in a normal year we have about 17/18 good quality players. When you're missing 5/6 of those with the county and then a couple injuries then you're down to the bare bones at the start of the season. Some clubs will be going full tilt trying to pick up points off teams early on in the league before county men get back. I just don't really see another way around it, the seasons overlap so you're always missing county players. Teams with the bigger numbers could nearly put out 2 teams that would compete in the early stages of Div 1 so missing a few county men doesn't affect them.  I would be in favour of a 1a and 1b and that is your senior championship. If that is not an option the drop it to 10 teams in Div 1. I definitely think 16 teams in Div 1 is far too many. If that means we drop to Div 2 then that's what it is.

Listen I get you would rather have county players. But you still have half a league to fulfil with them and if you aren't picking up enough wins to stay up then the issue is not missing your county boys. Every other team is in the same boat remember. 

But for the likes of yourselves then it's even more important there is a 1a, 1b structure. Yous would be 1b and without county players you should still be able to compete with all of the other clubs.

Armagh club structure is perfect for Antrim imo.

But they're not. As I said some teams with no county players are picking up wins early on. Then the bigger teams that have 40 senior players are able to get through a league until their main 2 or 3 players are back (that is if they aren't injured from county). But as I said, the seasons overlap and I don't know how it gets sorted.

I agree with you regarding Armagh's setup and I think it would be better but their Div 1a is as meaningless as Antrim's. They also have a greater amount of teams who are competitive. Armagh also has a number of 2nd teams playing throughout the divisions which helps prop up the quality of the leagues. Clann Eireann 2nd team weren't too far away from winning the intermediate after winning the junior a few years ago. I heard the other day though that a motion has been passed to not allow second teams play in the leagues so it will be interesting how that affects things.

[SoloAndGo]

Absolutely right nothing will change based on this thread. But worth the conversation imo to get people talking and bring it to club reps.

The county boys missing is not an issue. They still play half a season and if that's your excuse to get relegated to 1b then it's just an excuse. Cargin won 14/15, Creggan 12/15, St Brides 11/15 all last season whilst missing boys for half the year.

And to be honest, missing county players or tightly contested games that are the difference is a much better alternative than what we currently have. A fiercely contested league that probably any 8 teams could win makes the league certainly more meaningful and attractive to supporters.

In regards to supporters who's interested in Creggan beat St Paul's or Aghohill by 30 points. A 1a, 1b every single game worth a watch imo.

It is a massive issue for a club like Aghagallon. Last couple of seasons have been a shit show but in a normal year we have about 17/18 good quality players. When you're missing 5/6 of those with the county and then a couple injuries then you're down to the bare bones at the start of the season. Some clubs will be going full tilt trying to pick up points off teams early on in the league before county men get back. I just don't really see another way around it, the seasons overlap so you're always missing county players. Teams with the bigger numbers could nearly put out 2 teams that would compete in the early stages of Div 1 so missing a few county men doesn't affect them.  I would be in favour of a 1a and 1b and that is your senior championship. If that is not an option the drop it to 10 teams in Div 1. I definitely think 16 teams in Div 1 is far too many. If that means we drop to Div 2 then that's what it is.

Listen I get you would rather have county players. But you still have half a league to fulfil with them and if you aren't picking up enough wins to stay up then the issue is not missing your county boys. Every other team is in the same boat remember. 

But for the likes of yourselves then it's even more important there is a 1a, 1b structure. Yous would be 1b and without county players you should still be able to compete with all of the other clubs.

Armagh club structure is perfect for Antrim imo.

But they're not. As I said some teams with no county players are picking up wins early on. Then the bigger teams that have 40 senior players are able to get through a league until their main 2 or 3 players are back (that is if they aren't injured from county). But as I said, the seasons overlap and I don't know how it gets sorted.

I agree with you regarding Armagh's setup and I think it would be better but their Div 1a is as meaningless as Antrim's. They also have a greater amount of teams who are competitive. Armagh also has a number of 2nd teams playing throughout the divisions which helps prop up the quality of the leagues. Clann Eireann 2nd team weren't too far away from winning the intermediate after winning the junior a few years ago. I heard the other day though that a motion has been passed to not allow second teams play in the leagues so it will be interesting how that affects things.

Rossa, St Pauls, St. Johns, TNN, Sarsfields, MG, Glenravel. All very mediocre teams with county players. Thats half the league. I understanding having them improves your team, but there are plenty of games with them and even without that are winnable.

Why do you think Armagh 1a is meaningless? I would disagree. The team that finished 3rd won their championship. They do have a greater amount of teams who are competitive. And another reason why our leagues should be split. The amount of meaningless games in Div 1 and Div 2 in Antrim is mad. Sarsfields won Div 2 and the only difficult games they had were both against MG.

[Deerstalker]

See in today's Irish News Kavan Keenan has pled guilty to his various offences, will he see a custodial sentence ?

[Mick Bustin]

Why do you think Armagh 1a is meaningless? I would disagree. The team that finished 3rd won their championship. They do have a greater amount of teams who are competitive. And another reason why our leagues should be split. The amount of meaningless games in Div 1 and Div 2 in Antrim is mad. Sarsfields won Div 2 and the only difficult games they had were both against MG.

Armagh 1A isn't meaningless at all, it's perfect environment for clubs pushing for a SFC, no meaningless games. Clubs seeded for the championship. Teams still had something to play for in the last few rounds, including the two teams that were relegated.

Although the clubs in their infinite wisdom voted last week to remove all 2nds teams from the all county league/championship competitions so that might impact the league structure as well as dilute the standard with 9 teams given the boot.

[paddyjohn]

See in today's Irish News Kavan Keenan has pled guilty to his various offences, will he see a custodial sentence ?

I hope so. Horrendous what he did and makes even more hard to take that he was poster boy for the county.

[SoloAndGo]

Why do you think Armagh 1a is meaningless? I would disagree. The team that finished 3rd won their championship. They do have a greater amount of teams who are competitive. And another reason why our leagues should be split. The amount of meaningless games in Div 1 and Div 2 in Antrim is mad. Sarsfields won Div 2 and the only difficult games they had were both against MG.

Armagh 1A isn't meaningless at all, it's perfect environment for clubs pushing for a SFC, no meaningless games. Clubs seeded for the championship. Teams still had something to play for in the last few rounds, including the two teams that were relegated.

Although the clubs in their infinite wisdom voted last week to remove all 2nds teams from the all county league/championship competitions so that might impact the league structure as well as dilute the standard with 9 teams given the boot.

A far better model than Antrim and one we could adopt. I actually have no issue with the 2nds teams. If they are good enough then why not? Only issue is if they play within the same league. But this would be rare.

Rumours of Antrim changing the 2nds in Hurling as a few clubs in div 3 are seconds.

[SoloAndGo]

See in today's Irish News Kavan Keenan has pled guilty to his various offences, will he see a custodial sentence ?

I hope so. Horrendous what he did and makes even more hard to take that he was poster boy for the county.

Absolutely spot on.

[JimStynes]

Why do you think Armagh 1a is meaningless? I would disagree. The team that finished 3rd won their championship. They do have a greater amount of teams who are competitive. And another reason why our leagues should be split. The amount of meaningless games in Div 1 and Div 2 in Antrim is mad. Sarsfields won Div 2 and the only difficult games they had were both against MG.

Armagh 1A isn't meaningless at all, it's perfect environment for clubs pushing for a SFC, no meaningless games. Clubs seeded for the championship. Teams still had something to play for in the last few rounds, including the two teams that were relegated.

Although the clubs in their infinite wisdom voted last week to remove all 2nds teams from the all county league/championship competitions so that might impact the league structure as well as dilute the standard with 9 teams given the boot.

I agree towards the end of the league there is more a push but that is the same in Antrim. But ask the majority of the teams in Division 1 Armagh if they're going balls to wall to win a Division 1 title they'd disagree. The CE seniors won the league a couple times with 1/4 of a team. Their goal keeper had to play outfield for most of the league. Tbf they are very fortunate that they had 3 excellent keepers to chose from. But I have watched them many times this year with 2 subs. The Peter's only started playing with 3 or 4 games to go in the league. Cross don't care about the league. Clans downed tools and got relegated. Maghery had half a team until the county men came back. The other divisions are very competitive with not much room for error. One loss early on in the league and it seems to come back to haunt teams at the end of the league so they're all must win games outside of Div 1A. I'd be interested to see what would happen if we had 2nds teams in our league. I remember playing against a very strong Cargin 2nds team for years in Division 2.

Derry league seems to be as crap as ours. Tyrone seems to be very competitive.

[Mick Bustin]

If you think teams in Armagh aren't taking Division 1A seriously then you're mistaken, considering the amount of breakthrough clubs knocking on the door. It's the perfect springboard for the business end. Killeavy are absolutely knocking their pan in to win a championship, won their first ever Division 1A title this year.

Clann Éireann only won their first EVER Division 1A title in 2023. Clans, Mullaghbawn, Harps (2022 Div1A winners), Silverbridge, all played out of their skins to try and avoid the drop. Madden, this years winners have been consistently challenging for the league, it is absolutely the perfect environment for clubs like that to kick on and win a championship.

Clann Éireann rocking up to a league match with 17 players is a bit like Cross back in the day, they have the quality and arrogance to do it.

[statto]

Why do you think Armagh 1a is meaningless? I would disagree. The team that finished 3rd won their championship. They do have a greater amount of teams who are competitive. And another reason why our leagues should be split. The amount of meaningless games in Div 1 and Div 2 in Antrim is mad. Sarsfields won Div 2 and the only difficult games they had were both against MG.

Armagh 1A isn't meaningless at all, it's perfect environment for clubs pushing for a SFC, no meaningless games. Clubs seeded for the championship. Teams still had something to play for in the last few rounds, including the two teams that were relegated.

Although the clubs in their infinite wisdom voted last week to remove all 2nds teams from the all county league/championship competitions so that might impact the league structure as well as dilute the standard with 9 teams given the boot.

I agree towards the end of the league there is more a push but that is the same in Antrim. But ask the majority of the teams in Division 1 Armagh if they're going balls to wall to win a Division 1 title they'd disagree. The CE seniors won the league a couple times with 1/4 of a team. Their goal keeper had to play outfield for most of the league. Tbf they are very fortunate that they had 3 excellent keepers to chose from. But I have watched them many times this year with 2 subs. The Peter's only started playing with 3 or 4 games to go in the league. Cross don't care about the league. Clans downed tools and got relegated. Maghery had half a team until the county men came back. The other divisions are very competitive with not much room for error. One loss early on in the league and it seems to come back to haunt teams at the end of the league so they're all must win games outside of Div 1A. I'd be interested to see what would happen if we had 2nds teams in our league. I remember playing against a very strong Cargin 2nds team for years in Division 2.

Derry league seems to be as crap as ours. Tyrone seems to be very competitive.

Clan Na Gael had two players away with county all year and a number of lads in America for the summer I don't believe that they downed tools and would have been aware that for the long term development of the team playing 1a would be beneficial. By coming in the bottom 4 of the league they also got drawn in the "group of death" and then subsequently didn't get out of the group. 

St Peters won their last three games of league and where competitive throughout and had a good championship run and will be favourites to win intermediate next year. It would have been no big shock that they were relegated from 1b as it was a very competitive division.