Change underage back to u14,16,18

[thewobbler]

You know, I've found an odd thing over the past couple of seasons Johnnycool; that mentors are almost entirely more civilised and balanced at u14 football (competitive) than they are at u10.5 and u12 Go Games levels.

I'd harbour a few guesses as to why. Real referees would help. That the kids are older and don't need so much of a "protective arm" would help. That the teams are streamed more evenly would help.

But I would think the main reason is that as mentors go through the ranks and gain experience, most of them come to realise that treating a juvenile league match like a senior championship final helps nobody, but does stress everyone.

——

All under 12 footballers keep score whether the referee does or not. There's pretty much always one team cheering at the final whistle.

[johnnycool]

You know, I've found an odd thing over the past couple of seasons Johnnycool; that mentors are almost entirely more civilised and balanced at u14 football (competitive) than they are at u10.5 and u12 Go Games levels.

I'd harbour a few guesses as to why. Real referees would help. That the kids are older and don't need so much of a "protective arm" would help. That the teams are streamed more evenly would help.

But I would think the main reason is that as mentors go through the ranks and gain experience, most of them come to realise that treating a juvenile league match like a senior championship final helps nobody, but does stress everyone.

——

All under 12 footballers keep score whether the referee does or not. There's pretty much always one team cheering at the final whistle.

I'd agree with that sentiment from my experiences as well but that's due to the coaches (and parents) being conditioned with the go-games mentality from P4 (U8.5) and P6(U10.5) that they need to involve every kid in those short sided blitzes.

Not sure how the football works @U12 in Down, but in the hurling they still involve mini-blitzes with 3 or 4 teams playing slightly longer games amongst themselves so every kid gets an opportunity to play and winning is very much for the kids and not something the coaches get excited about.

I'd not be rushing to change that in Down.

As for the intercounty model change to U17, for me it was well intentioned to take the heat out of minor in what is an exam year for a lot of kids, reduce the load on the 1% of elite players, but wasn't thought through enough in terms of the impact at club level.

The reduction to U17 meant you didn't have a transition year for 17yo's who weren't getting exposed to adult hurling and then the only hurling available the following year was adult and that can take time for some lads and some drift away.

At least with club being U18, they have their core agegroup of minor and in our case we let the 18yo's also train and play adult hurling, but those who struggle will also have their minor games to keep them involved.

That's my experiences of it, other clubs and counties will vary.

[tbrick18]

Seen a thing on facebook/instagram outlining the underage structures across the country with the majority of counties (20) using even ages, 5 using odd ages & 7 using a mix.  Just wondering if its accurate.

Derry's structures are
U7.5 (p2&3), U9.5 (p4&5) & U11.5 (p6&7) for go-games
Then u14, u16 & u18

You have 3 years at u14 if you've a "good" birthday.

In Derry there was an u12.5 league last year, mostly clubs with bigger numbers, to give players just out of u11.5 competitive football - not sure if it will be scheduled for the 2026 year group.

I know of clubs exploring the option of going to the Inishowen u12 league but apparently the county board are starting to listen to the clubs re the u12 situation

Tyrone has u10.5, u12.5 then u14s, u16s, minor.
For those with a bad birthday coming out of u14s, they only get 1 year at u14s then straight into u16s.
Not great for development of your mid/lower tier players and contributes to a drop off in numbers imo.

I personally think the even numbers the whole way up are a better fit.

Tyrone also just played 5 rounds of an U13 League as well. Good to see it back in the calendar.

I thought u13 league was totally uncalled for. U14s start very early with u12s coming in behind. Then U13s, made up of younger u14s and u12.5s, starting end of october and only finishing on sat past. Players at that age (and then coached) going from Jan to end of Nov is too much imo.
Plus the games are all fixed for 11 on a sat morning - with no time changes allowed. Meaning quite a few games conceded (Fianna conceded all games). Sat mornings this time of year usually have soccer/basketball/swimming.....it just feels to me like it's not needed and doesn't suit too many lads.

[marty34]

Seen a thing on facebook/instagram outlining the underage structures across the country with the majority of counties (20) using even ages, 5 using odd ages & 7 using a mix.  Just wondering if its accurate.

Derry's structures are
U7.5 (p2&3), U9.5 (p4&5) & U11.5 (p6&7) for go-games
Then u14, u16 & u18

You have 3 years at u14 if you've a "good" birthday.

In Derry there was an u12.5 league last year, mostly clubs with bigger numbers, to give players just out of u11.5 competitive football - not sure if it will be scheduled for the 2026 year group.

The U12.5 league in Derry was organised by the clubs, there was no county board involvement. It was a series of challenge games, mostly 13 a side on shortened pitches with the option of playing 15 if numbers allowed. No scores kept (though all the lads playing always know the score, same as gogames). It did tend to be the bigger clubs, think there were around 10 clubs involved, who had enough to field a team of mostly first years. Worked pretty well to give those lads who weren't ready for U14s some football and as a bridge from 9 a side Gogames to full pitch 15 a side games - it's a big jump. Apparently the Derry youth officers are looking at the U11.5-U14 situation at the moment.

That's an issue alright.

15-a-side and big goals. Compare that to Go Games.

Now granted, only a few may make that jump in the first year but they seem to adjust ok.

For the other lads, they play on a 'B' team or the younger age team and it isn't as fast and furious. So maybe tht's a good introduction for them.

But the goalie gets its tight in the big goals and kicking it out. Although the keeper in the younger team can kick from his hands. 

[blanketattack]

I think having one or two 0.5 age groups up along is a great idea. It gives the children who were unlucky with their birthday a boost.

[Armagh18]

I'd be in favour of the .5 age groups, keeps you in the school year

[tbrick18]

I'd be in favour of the .5 age groups, keeps you in the school year

No issue in principle. It becomes a problem for some players when the .5, changes to u14s.
Example, any players with a July birthday who are at best average, when they come out of u12.5s they go straight into competitive u14 football, where its going to be difficult to get them competitive football. They don't progress as much as they might have if getting plenty of games, and then at the end of 1 year, they have to go up to u16 grade due to their birthday.
By this stage they will really struggle to get football and in all likelihood drop away.

An alternative approach is to keep everything .5 age groups, OR the 2 year age groups ensuring all players are guaranteed 2 years at every level - giving them a chance to progress which should help with player retention.

That half/half approach doesn't work when the switch over happens imo.
There's no perfect answer, but I think that current approach in Tyrone is the least best approach.

[Armagh18]

I'd be in favour of the .5 age groups, keeps you in the school year

No issue in principle. It becomes a problem for some players when the .5, changes to u14s.
Example, any players with a July birthday who are at best average, when they come out of u12.5s they go straight into competitive u14 football, where its going to be difficult to get them competitive football. They don't progress as much as they might have if getting plenty of games, and then at the end of 1 year, they have to go up to u16 grade due to their birthday.
By this stage they will really struggle to get football and in all likelihood drop away.

An alternative approach is to keep everything .5 age groups, OR the 2 year age groups ensuring all players are guaranteed 2 years at every level - giving them a chance to progress which should help with player retention.

That half/half approach doesn't work when the switch over happens imo.
There's no perfect answer, but I think that current approach in Tyrone is the least best approach.

Sorry, meant keep it the same right up, Armagh did 14.5, 16.5 and 18.5 a few years ago and it was grand, not sure why they went back. Keep players in their school year right through.

[thewobbler]

I don't think it's a better way Armagh18.

Somewhere along the line lads have to work out if lads a couple of school years above them are better, or vice versa.

What you're suggesting here is in effect putting that on hold until they're adults.

Furthermore the unintended consequence of keeping everyone in school years is that their development then takes place in silos, and integration at adult level can only become more difficult.

And last but not least, all you actually end up doing is taking the best month to be born in away from January, and placing it firmly in July. For the July birthdays then get it better at club level as well as at schools level where they've always had it.

[johnnycool]

for us the .5 school year works to keep the friendship groups forged in the school together at training and blitzes and they're more likely to stick at it.

When it comes to secondary education they are split up anyway so its not so important and hopefully by then we've been able to nurture the grá for the game before that.

Larger clubs pulling from more than one primary school don't probably see it as an issue either way.

[tbrick18]

for us the .5 school year works to keep the friendship groups forged in the school together at training and blitzes and they're more likely to stick at it.

When it comes to secondary education they are split up anyway so its not so important and hopefully by then we've been able to nurture the grá for the game before that.

Larger clubs pulling from more than one primary school don't probably see it as an issue either way.

I agree with that. The only gripe I have is the changing it from .5 to evens part way through. That is the point in time when lads start to consider stopping playing anyway as it get maybe too competitive, but makes it really difficult for lads who maybe haven't fully developed yet and have bad birthdays to only get 1 year at u14.

So my point is, .5's or evens are both valid options, but don't change it half way through the age groups.

[cornerback]

I don't mind the Derry model, .5 age groups at primary school to keep class groups together but it then jumps from u11.5 to u14.  This means a bad gaa birthday gets 2 years at u14 and a good gaa birthday gets 3 years.  However, I still think they need to keep an intermediate u12.5 age group to help some bridge the gap from u11.5 to u14.

The LFGA model in Derry stops the .5 age groups at u10.5 and then u12.  u12 isn't a competitive league but it's a step up from go-games - usually a proper ref (albeit probably from the home club) and can be 11-a-side or 13-a-side depending on the league entered.  This does mean some girls will only get 1 year at u12.

Local soccer is just year of birth so bridges 2 primary school classes and there really is no issues, boys and girls might gravitate to their peers but overall it's just one team.