Hurling 2024

[Sheedy]

So in the end hurling ends up as inevitable as football, you'll get short odds on Limerick and Dublin all Irelands again.

[burdizzo]

I know, but it's still a hundred times more entertaining.

[Milltown Row2]

So in the end hurling ends up as inevitable as football, you'll get short odds on Limerick and Dublin all Irelands again.

What do you prefer? That the best teams don't win?

Shocks are great and ignites passion and unparalleled celebrations but sometimes teams come along that you just have to take your hat off and appreciate how good they are, we have it more often at club level.

It comes to an end either by other teams raising their standards, a shock or the cycle finishes.

How anyone can look at Limerick and be bored at how they win games I'll never know.

Just accept that every now and then (history has shown it) a team comes along, be it football soccer hurling basketball or whatever and dominate because they are so good.

[johnnycool]

So in the end hurling ends up as inevitable as football, you'll get short odds on Limerick and Dublin all Irelands again.

Ultimately in these prolonged championships with round robins, back doors etc etc its the teams with the bigger and stronger panels that comes through.
The days of catching a big team cold and them gone for the year are no longer with us, well until this stage in the hurling and for a while yet in the football.

Limerick are some outfit, and whilst Clare to their credit kept it interesting right to the last 5 minutes or so there was only going to be one winner.
Clare didn't get the goals they needed, one poor shot and one hitting the post, those go in and its a much tighter game.
Thought the Clare keeper should have done better with Hegartys goal, if you come off the line, you need to come out and take everything with you, he stuttered and was indecisive, caught in no-mans-land and paid the price for a well struck ground shot.
Limericks shooting was far more accurate as well, their gameplan more decisive, starving Shane O'Donnell of ball, forced Clare to bring him out the field and their biggest goal threat negated in one move. Kelly evidently isn't up to speed as yet and realistically their forwards only managed the odd fits and starts of good play apart from Peter Duggan who was the pick of their players.
Big Cleary got pinged twice for pulling jerseys off the ball, probably on reputation alone and I'd encourage referees to work with their umpires more on that but for everyone who's at it.

Dublin, Dublin, Dublin, what the feck were you thinking?

A Leinster final, a crack at Kilkenny with nothing else on the line. You'd have thought they'd go at them hammer and tongs, but it was everything but.
Allowing Richie Reid to sit in the pocket and ping balls into space for his Ballyhale teammates up the field to run onto and torment their markers was criminal at this level. He negated their sweeper totally, barring two balls that he intercepted way late on and in junk time when the result was a foregone conclusion.
On numerous occasions a ball was lumped up to a Dublin forward and whilst it initially looked like a one-on-one, the next men into that area to win the break were wearing black and amber all the time.

They now will in all probability face Cork in a quarter final and surely we'll see some fire from them in that game if there's any fire in them at all.

Clare will probably have a Wexford quarter final and they'll need the three weeks to get over that defeat, but that game will be far from a gimme and Wexford have some good forwards who could trouble that Clare defence, so Lohan has a bit of work to do there also.

[Captain Obvious]

Jarlath  Burns clarified a remark made by Limerick captain Declan Hannon after his team won the Munster SHC final on Sunday. In his acceptance speech following their defeat of Clare, Hannon said: "We've a backroom team of 53 people. I'm not gonna thank them all, but I want to thank in particular John Kiely and Paul Kinnerk for everything they do for us."

"I did clarify that with Paul Foley the Ard Comhairle rep from Limerick because I knew he didn't mean that," he said.

"I can tell you if you're a captain up there... I'm often standing beside them and I know how nervous they can be. There aren't 53. I can reassure people around the country if you are trying to get up to that level it's not... I think it's 37 on the panel and 16 on the backroom, so he looked at the whole family all as one, 53 people."

Dublin footballers have apparently a management team of 30. 

[NAG1]

Disappointed with the Munster game yesterday, Limerick always seemed to be able to keep them at arms length.

Clare gave away some serious ball over the 70mins pucking aimless long balls down on top of extra cover defenders. Can't do that as well as missing frees etc against this Limerick team.

The Limerick half back lined for the first time this season completely dominated the game, they look back to their best for sure.

[johnnycool]

Jarlath  Burns clarified a remark made by Limerick captain Declan Hannon after his team won the Munster SHC final on Sunday. In his acceptance speech following their defeat of Clare, Hannon said: "We've a backroom team of 53 people. I'm not gonna thank them all, but I want to thank in particular John Kiely and Paul Kinnerk for everything they do for us."

"I did clarify that with Paul Foley the Ard Comhairle rep from Limerick because I knew he didn't mean that," he said.

"I can tell you if you're a captain up there... I'm often standing beside them and I know how nervous they can be. There aren't 53. I can reassure people around the country if you are trying to get up to that level it's not... I think it's 37 on the panel and 16 on the backroom, so he looked at the whole family all as one, 53 people."

Dublin footballers have apparently a management team of 30. 

16 looks like a small backroom team for a panel of 37, FFS Down hurlers would have a dozen or so between coaches, S&C, analysts, stick and kitmen, not to mention physios, doctor etc, so I smell cover up on that one...

That doesn't mean all are on JP's payroll.

[marty34]

Kilkenny blew Dublin out of it. Really hungry and agressive - typical Kilkenny.  Dublin downed tools after5 mins, which was disappointing.  They are good in the tight confines or Parnell Park but, for whatever reason, they struggle in Croke Park. In fairness to KK,they were ruthless. They have mixed it up a bit this year and it's working well. Another run out in Croke Park beckons. John Donnelly and Mullan in great form from play.

In Munster, Clare needed the goal chances to go in...and they didn't.  Always seemed to be playing catchup. Cleary is not mobile enough for Gillane. Limerick leave an acre of space in front for Gillane to run in to and all Cleary can do is pull and drag. Always guaranteed to get a yellow card. Why don't they switch and put the keeper 10 yards in front of Gillane?

Clare didn't seem to have that buzz about them yesterday - a bit flat.  Summed up well by the performance of TK. He was disappointing by his own his standards. Limerick were excellent. They work so hard and always stick to the process.

A special mention to young O'Brien at full-forward. Nearly MOTM for me.  He was excellent. Any ball that went in tended to stick.  Imagine no Sean Finn, Peter Casey, Seamie Flannagan or Darragh O'Donovan. Crazy team.       

[johnnycool]

Kilkenny blew Dublin out of it. Really hungry and agressive - typical Kilkenny.  Dublin downed tools after5 mins, which was disappointing.  They are good in the tight confines or Parnell Park but, for whatever reason, they struggle in Croke Park. In fairness to KK,they were ruthless. They have mixed it up a bit this year and it's working well. Another run out in Croke Park beckons. John Donnelly and Mullan in great form from play.

In Munster, Clare needed the goal chances to go in...and they didn't.  Always seemed to be playing catchup. Cleary is not mobile enough for Gillane. Limerick leave an acre of space in front for Gillane to run in to and all Cleary can do is pull and drag. Always guaranteed to get a yellow card. Why don't they switch and put the keeper 10 yards in front of Gillane?

Clare didn't seem to have that buzz about them yesterday - a bit flat.  Summed up well by the performance of TK. He was disappointing by his own his standards. Limerick were excellent. They work so hard and always stick to the process.

A special mention to young O'Brien at full-forward. Nearly MOTM for me.  He was excellent. Any ball that went in tended to stick.  Imagine no Sean Finn, Peter Casey, Seamie Flannagan or Darragh O'Donovan. Crazy team.     

[marty34]

Kilkenny blew Dublin out of it. Really hungry and agressive - typical Kilkenny.  Dublin downed tools after5 mins, which was disappointing.  They are good in the tight confines or Parnell Park but, for whatever reason, they struggle in Croke Park. In fairness to KK,they were ruthless. They have mixed it up a bit this year and it's working well. Another run out in Croke Park beckons. John Donnelly and Mullan in great form from play.

In Munster, Clare needed the goal chances to go in...and they didn't.  Always seemed to be playing catchup. Cleary is not mobile enough for Gillane. Limerick leave an acre of space in front for Gillane to run in to and all Cleary can do is pull and drag. Always guaranteed to get a yellow card. Why don't they switch and put the keeper 10 yards in front of Gillane?

Clare didn't seem to have that buzz about them yesterday - a bit flat.  Summed up well by the performance of TK. He was disappointing by his own his standards. Limerick were excellent. They work so hard and always stick to the process.

A special mention to young O'Brien at full-forward. Nearly MOTM for me.  He was excellent. Any ball that went in tended to stick.  Imagine no Sean Finn, Peter Casey, Seamie Flannagan or Darragh O'Donovan. Crazy team.     

I was there.

Gillane stays in on the goaline beside the keeper and there's 30 yards of space, from sideline to sideline, in front of him.

He knows he has the pace and mobility for Cleary and he's done it year after year and Clare are not learning from it.  I'm sure Gillane is delighted when he knows Cleary will be marking him.

It'll not work all the time but Gillane loves to be in on the goalline and sprints ou.  His movement is very good in fsirness. Top player.  I see his brother was sub keeper yesterday.

This is what happens and it happened on Sunday once again:

Cleary pulls and drags Gillane constantly.  He gave 2 frees away on Sunday when Gillane was making his runs and 2 handy frees at that. 

Next thing, Cleary gets the yellow card.

Next thing. He's taken off with 15mins/20mins to go.

If you have any better ideas, we'll listen.

[Milltown Row2]

Sweeper keeper isn't exactly working out in football nowadays, teams are catching on and working traps to catch out the role of the keeper. The same will happen in hurling if that was done, I get the idea of it but Gillane can win his own ball high or low or out to the wings, if there is an empty net, I'd say its easier to strike it with the hurl to an empty net at their level than football.

The center half has to help out the area in front of him and the midfield has to drop back a bit to cover that space, there was always (in my days) a defensive midfielder and an attacking one, Not sure those roles are done anymore but anyone marking Gillane needs help outfield to reduce those balls going in, and that starts at corner forward!

Limerick didn't really give Clare any easy balls out other that the short puck outs, and when they did they closed them down quick enough to cause the odd mistake and turnover

Will know more about Corks consistency over the next game or two to see if they are a contender or whether Kilkenny were great and can improve or Dublin just threw the towel in

[johnnycool]

Kilkenny blew Dublin out of it. Really hungry and agressive - typical Kilkenny.  Dublin downed tools after5 mins, which was disappointing.  They are good in the tight confines or Parnell Park but, for whatever reason, they struggle in Croke Park. In fairness to KK,they were ruthless. They have mixed it up a bit this year and it's working well. Another run out in Croke Park beckons. John Donnelly and Mullan in great form from play.

In Munster, Clare needed the goal chances to go in...and they didn't.  Always seemed to be playing catchup. Cleary is not mobile enough for Gillane. Limerick leave an acre of space in front for Gillane to run in to and all Cleary can do is pull and drag. Always guaranteed to get a yellow card. Why don't they switch and put the keeper 10 yards in front of Gillane?

Clare didn't seem to have that buzz about them yesterday - a bit flat.  Summed up well by the performance of TK. He was disappointing by his own his standards. Limerick were excellent. They work so hard and always stick to the process.

A special mention to young O'Brien at full-forward. Nearly MOTM for me.  He was excellent. Any ball that went in tended to stick.  Imagine no Sean Finn, Peter Casey, Seamie Flannagan or Darragh O'Donovan. Crazy team.     

I was there.

Gillane stays in on the goaline beside the keeper and there's 30 yards of space, from sideline to sideline, in front of him.

He knows he has the pace and mobility for Cleary and he's done it year after year and Clare are not learning from it.  I'm sure Gillane is delighted when he knows Cleary will be marking him.

It'll not work all the time but Gillane loves to be in on the goalline and sprints ou.  His movement is very good in fsirness. Top player.  I see his brother was sub keeper yesterday.

This is what happens and it happened on Sunday once again:

Cleary pulls and drags Gillane constantly.  He gave 2 frees away on Sunday when Gillane was making his runs and 2 handy frees at that. 

Next thing, Cleary gets the yellow card.

Next thing. He's taken off with 15mins/20mins to go.

If you have any better ideas, we'll listen.

I understand the conundrum that Limerick create for opposing teams in that regard and they do target those spaces out on the wings, drop your halfbacks a bit to cover that and they'll kill you with points from out the field, push up and Gillane and the bull have acres of space to work in.
Play a sweeper and they'll work the space and time to negate that too.
The only thing to cause Limerick problems this year is Corks directness and lads running off the breaking ball at pace. They'll have a plan for that the next time they meet.

Quilligan doesn't seem to be the paciest, nor bravest when it comes to the outfield stuff as we saw from the Hegarty goal. but if he does vacate the goal-line they'll target that right away and with even bigger consequences.

Easier said that done, but whoever does get the better of them will need to stop the runners coming through the middle and picking out the spaces for the bull and Guillane and make that ball dirtier to give the defenders a chance to negate them.
Clares problem at the minute is that Conlon and Cleary aren't mobile enough to cover those spaces, and anyone they have who has the pace hasn't the physical presence to handle Guillane if the Limerick lads go direct.

Guillane is the perfect target man in modern hurling, closely followed by the likes of Eoin Cody...

[marty34]

What you say is all well and good but all I'm saying is Clare have to try something.

This Cleary issue has happened year after year, twice in fact every year - in group and Munster Final.  Not Cleary's fault by the way as he's a spoiler and suits lads like T.J. and Horgan etc. If you can't stop the quality ball coming in then you must try and block Gillane coming out.

If you watch Gillane closely (obviously not seen on tv) but he stands in the square a lot of the time. Quilligan is in there but stands behind him. All he has to do is stand 5 yards in front and read the ball. Not sure how fast he is.

It might work or might not. Even if he blocks Gillane's run off a bit, giving time for Cleary to get out it might help.

But to do nothing is foolish and to let the same thing happen time after time is poor.

[Milltown Row2]

What you say is all well and good but all I'm saying is Clare have to try something.

This Cleary issue has happened year after year, twice in fact every year - in group and Munster Final.  Not Cleary's fault by the way as he's a spoiler and suits lads like T.J. and Horgan etc. If you can't stop the quality ball coming in then you must try and block Gillane coming out.

If you watch Gillane closely (obviously not seen on tv) but he stands in the square a lot of the time. Quilligan is in there but stands behind him. All he has to do is stand 5 yards in front and read the ball. Not sure how fast he is.

It might work or might not. Even if he blocks Gillane's run off a bit, giving time for Cleary to get out it might help.

But to do nothing is foolish and to let the same thing happen time after time is poor.

He was pretty poor getting off his line for Hegartys goal.

Keepers, natural keepers are traditional enough still, taking the return from pass to fullback from puck outs is the limit.

Still thinking teams need to avoid midfield and halfback lines of limerick..

Or as Cork did was run at them, make Limerick foul or break their lines, certain referees will not allow some of the physicality they bring to the game..

What will stop or reduce their play is being on top of their hand passes..

Would love to have a slow mo on a lot of their hand passes

[Saffrongael]

You don't need the slo mo, they are throwing them