Gerry McEntee puts Art McRory back in his box

[BennyHarp]

The problem for you lads, Fear, is that it's true on a sporting level that Tyrone, Rumsfeld like, doesn't even know it doesn't know. 

And you pretend not to know what you do know! It's the way things work! 

[Hardy]

I don't know about that!

[Sandy Hill]

If that '96 Meath team was brought to the year 2015 via a time machine, and they ended up playing Tyrone in an All-Ireland semi-final, who would the neutral GAA fan would be up for?

Always had a lot of respect for the Meath team they played the game hard but fair on the majority of occasions and from my memory they never started it but by God they could finish it . . . Cavanagh would be on the back pages first thing Monday morning complaining about big John McDermott tackling him too hard or some nonsense!!

Dinky McBride springs to mind!

[Fuzzman]

Only catching up on this thread now and it really is rich you've got Meath of all teams calling the pot black.
As Fear said Tyrone learnt a lot more about the unspoken methods that day about how you have to earn the right to play football. Kerry for years have been able to mix the nasty stuff to bully teams to earn the right to play the nice stuff.
Tyrone had a few good players back in 96 and Dinky McBride had been a menace in the Ulster championship that year and was the sort of tall ball winning forward that Canavan could benefit from playing alongside.
Of course it was just coincidence that McBride, Dooher and Canavan got targeted by usually Clean players and Tyrone used totally over the top bandages rather than a small sticky plaster. Bad losers like Tipperary lads this year but just without the big bandages and their best player injured for the year ahead.

Anyway enuf of the crap talk.
I think there is a link between players no longer throwing punches and now use other tactics like neck pinching and sledging.
I've said it before I would prefer if Mickey Harte would make a stand and tell his players that anyone saw sledging will be taken off and not play again.
Players might be doing it off their own bat but it has already gone too far and they need to realise it is setting standards and other teams, clubs and underage players will copy it.
Just cos Donegal do it isn't a good enough reason.
I'd like to see the CCCC call a meeting with all county managers and talk about the lack if respect between players at ALL levels. The GAA have this Give Respect Get Respect bullshit campaign but nothing is actually being done about it.
In fairness lots of other teams don't partake in this nonsense but in some parts of Ulster it is rife and something needs to change.

[Hardy]

Only catching up on this thread now and it really is rich you've got Meath of all teams calling the pot black.
As Fear said Tyrone learnt a lot more about the unspoken methods that day about how you have to earn the right to play football. Kerry for years have been able to mix the nasty stuff to bully teams to earn the right to play the nice stuff.
Tyrone had a few good players back in 96 and Dinky McBride had been a menace in the Ulster championship that year and was the sort of tall ball winning forward that Canavan could benefit from playing alongside.
Of course it was just coincidence that McBride, Dooher and Canavan got targeted by usually Clean players and Tyrone used totally over the top bandages rather than a small sticky plaster. Bad losers like Tipperary lads this year but just without the big bandages and their best player injured for the year ahead.

Anyway enuf of the crap talk.
I think there is a link between players no longer throwing punches and now use other tactics like neck pinching and sledging.
I've said it before I would prefer if Mickey Harte would make a stand and tell his players that anyone saw sledging will be taken off and not play again.
Players might be doing it off their own bat but it has already gone too far and they need to realise it is setting standards and other teams, clubs and underage players will copy it.
Just cos Donegal do it isn't a good enough reason.
I'd like to see the CCCC call a meeting with all county managers and talk about the lack if respect between players at ALL levels. The GAA have this Give Respect Get Respect bullshit campaign but nothing is actually being done about it.
In fairness lots of other teams don't partake in this nonsense but in some parts of Ulster it is rife and something needs to change.

Sorry, but I must persist with my theme of myth and legend. Even a level-headed contributor like you, Fuzzman falls into accepting the myth without regard for facts or evidence. You say Tyrone's best players got targeted as if it was a fact. For one thing, you can't know that unless you were in the Meath dressing room.

For a second thing, we had never heard of Dooher or McBride and they were utterly anonymous in this game. Why the hell would we target them?

For a third thing, it was pretty poor targetting, because the target Canavan was missed completely  (we have shown that his injury was a twisted ankle - how do you plan to twist somebody's ankle?) and all three were able to play on, Dooher and McBride with no apparent ill effect other than being near-blinded by their extravagant bandaging.

For a fourth thing, from  what wild leap of imagination comes the suggestion of a need to target anyone in a game in which we were so superior that we could have taken off five players without substitution and saved them for the final?

For a fifth thing, the rape was only discovered after the cheque bounced twenty-four hours later in Dinky's whingeathon on the Marian Finucane show. Suddenly all of Tyrone was in outrage even though, in the meantime, Tyrone team and management interviewees were in awe of Meath's performance immediately after the match and on the highlights programme. (The pundits on the Sunday game did comment at some length on Tyrone's propensity to fall over – little did they ralise the monster whose birth we were witnessing.)

And ... ah no. Five is enough, but I could go on.

After all that, though, fair play to you, Fuzzman for the rest of your post. You're the first Tyrone contributor to acknowledge the fact that your team has brought this  hateful  sledging and trash-talking to the game. It's an honest and brave post for that much. This stuff needs to be stamped out and we'd go a long way to achieving that if the rest of those responsible took charge of that responsibility in the way you suggest.

[BennyHarp]

Only catching up on this thread now and it really is rich you've got Meath of all teams calling the pot black.
As Fear said Tyrone learnt a lot more about the unspoken methods that day about how you have to earn the right to play football. Kerry for years have been able to mix the nasty stuff to bully teams to earn the right to play the nice stuff.
Tyrone had a few good players back in 96 and Dinky McBride had been a menace in the Ulster championship that year and was the sort of tall ball winning forward that Canavan could benefit from playing alongside.
Of course it was just coincidence that McBride, Dooher and Canavan got targeted by usually Clean players and Tyrone used totally over the top bandages rather than a small sticky plaster. Bad losers like Tipperary lads this year but just without the big bandages and their best player injured for the year ahead.

Anyway enuf of the crap talk.
I think there is a link between players no longer throwing punches and now use other tactics like neck pinching and sledging.
I've said it before I would prefer if Mickey Harte would make a stand and tell his players that anyone saw sledging will be taken off and not play again.
Players might be doing it off their own bat but it has already gone too far and they need to realise it is setting standards and other teams, clubs and underage players will copy it.
Just cos Donegal do it isn't a good enough reason.
I'd like to see the CCCC call a meeting with all county managers and talk about the lack if respect between players at ALL levels. The GAA have this Give Respect Get Respect bullshit campaign but nothing is actually being done about it.
In fairness lots of other teams don't partake in this nonsense but in some parts of Ulster it is rife and something needs to change.

Sorry, but I must persist with my theme of myth and legend. Even a level-headed contributor like you, Fuzzman falls into accepting the myth without regard for facts or evidence. You say Tyrone's best players got targeted as if it was a fact. For one thing, you can't know that unless you were in the Meath dressing room.

For a second thing, we had never heard of Dooher or McBride and they were utterly anonymous in this game. Why the hell would we target them?

For a third thing, it was pretty poor targetting, because the target Canavan was missed completely  (we have shown that his injury was a twisted ankle - how do you plan to twist somebody's ankle?) and all three were able to play on, Dooher and McBride with no apparent ill effect other than being near-blinded by their extravagant bandaging.

For a fourth thing, from  what wild leap of imagination comes the suggestion of a need to target anyone in a game in which we were so superior that we could have taken off five players without substitution and saved them for the final?

For a fifth thing, the rape was only discovered after the cheque bounced twenty-four hours later in Dinky's whingeathon on the Marian Finucane show. Suddenly all of Tyrone was in outrage even though, in the meantime, Tyrone team and management interviewees were in awe of Meath's performance immediately after the match and on the highlights programme. (The pundits on the Sunday game did comment at some length on Tyrone's propensity to fall over – little did they ralise the monster whose birth we were witnessing.)

And ... ah no. Five is enough, but I could go on.

After all that, though, fair play to you, Fuzzman for the rest of your post. You're the first Tyrone contributor to acknowledge the fact that your team has brought this  hateful  sledging and trash-talking to the game. It's an honest and brave post for that much. This stuff needs to be stamped out and we'd go a long way to achieving that if the rest of those responsible took charge of that responsibility in the way you suggest.

This post made me laugh.  20 years ago it may have irritated me though.

[From the Bunker]

Only catching up on this thread now and it really is rich you've got Meath of all teams calling the pot black.
As Fear said Tyrone learnt a lot more about the unspoken methods that day about how you have to earn the right to play football. Kerry for years have been able to mix the nasty stuff to bully teams to earn the right to play the nice stuff.
Tyrone had a few good players back in 96 and Dinky McBride had been a menace in the Ulster championship that year and was the sort of tall ball winning forward that Canavan could benefit from playing alongside.
Of course it was just coincidence that McBride, Dooher and Canavan got targeted by usually Clean players and Tyrone used totally over the top bandages rather than a small sticky plaster. Bad losers like Tipperary lads this year but just without the big bandages and their best player injured for the year ahead.

Anyway enuf of the crap talk.
I think there is a link between players no longer throwing punches and now use other tactics like neck pinching and sledging.
I've said it before I would prefer if Mickey Harte would make a stand and tell his players that anyone saw sledging will be taken off and not play again.
Players might be doing it off their own bat but it has already gone too far and they need to realise it is setting standards and other teams, clubs and underage players will copy it.
Just cos Donegal do it isn't a good enough reason.
I'd like to see the CCCC call a meeting with all county managers and talk about the lack if respect between players at ALL levels. The GAA have this Give Respect Get Respect bullshit campaign but nothing is actually being done about it.
In fairness lots of other teams don't partake in this nonsense but in some parts of Ulster it is rife and something needs to change.

Sorry, but I must persist with my theme of myth and legend. Even a level-headed contributor like you, Fuzzman falls into accepting the myth without regard for facts or evidence. You say Tyrone's best players got targeted as if it was a fact. For one thing, you can't know that unless you were in the Meath dressing room.

For a second thing, we had never heard of Dooher or McBride and they were utterly anonymous in this game. Why the hell would we target them?

For a third thing, it was pretty poor targetting, because the target Canavan was missed completely  (we have shown that his injury was a twisted ankle - how do you plan to twist somebody's ankle?) and all three were able to play on, Dooher and McBride with no apparent ill effect other than being near-blinded by their extravagant bandaging.

For a fourth thing, from  what wild leap of imagination comes the suggestion of a need to target anyone in a game in which we were so superior that we could have taken off five players without substitution and saved them for the final?

For a fifth thing, the rape was only discovered after the cheque bounced twenty-four hours later in Dinky's whingeathon on the Marian Finucane show. Suddenly all of Tyrone was in outrage even though, in the meantime, Tyrone team and management interviewees were in awe of Meath's performance immediately after the match and on the highlights programme. (The pundits on the Sunday game did comment at some length on Tyrone's propensity to fall over – little did they ralise the monster whose birth we were witnessing.)

And ... ah no. Five is enough, but I could go on.

After all that, though, fair play to you, Fuzzman for the rest of your post. You're the first Tyrone contributor to acknowledge the fact that your team has brought this  hateful  sledging and trash-talking to the game. It's an honest and brave post for that much. This stuff needs to be stamped out and we'd go a long way to achieving that if the rest of those responsible took charge of that responsibility in the way you suggest.

This post made me laugh.  20 years ago it may have irritated me though.

It is comedy gold. Gas how we all look through rose tilted glasses at our our teams misdemeanors.

[Hardy]

Excellent rebuttal lads. All five points devastatingly refuted.

(Bunker, my glasses are perfectly horizontal.)

[BennyHarp]

Excellent rebuttal lads. All five points devastatingly refuted.

(Bunker, my glasses are perfectly horizontal.)

To be honest Hardy, I did actually start a rebuttal as your points are so utterly ridiculous. But I realised it was 20 years ago and I had things to do. I'll leave you to enjoy your rose tinted garden.

[Hardy]

Excellent rebuttal lads. All five points devastatingly refuted.

(Bunker, my glasses are perfectly horizontal.)

To be honest Hardy, I did actually start a rebuttal as your points are so utterly ridiculous.

OK - you have me there. I never considered that argument. Very convincing.

But I realised it was 20 years ago and I had things to do. I'll leave you to enjoy your rose tinted garden.

You're right - it is nearly twenty years ago, but I didn't bring it up. I only stepped in to correct the errors.

(My garden, unlike my glasses is, in fact, tilted.)

[BennyHarp]

Excellent rebuttal lads. All five points devastatingly refuted.

(Bunker, my glasses are perfectly horizontal.)

To be honest Hardy, I did actually start a rebuttal as your points are so utterly ridiculous.

OK - you have me there. I never considered that argument. Very convincing.

But I realised it was 20 years ago and I had things to do. I'll leave you to enjoy your rose tinted garden.

You're right - it is nearly twenty years ago, but I didn't bring it up. I only stepped in to correct the errors.

(My garden, unlike my glasses is, in fact, tilted.)

Ok, since I have been provoked into a meaningless 20 year old debate;

Point 1: I agree, we won't know as a fact if the Tyrone players were targeted as we weren't in the Meath dressing room. I presume you weren't there either so you can't present your point as fact either. The video evidence of the incidents could point to a systematic attempt to target certain Tyrone players. Again, I don't know this for a fact, but at least I'm basing it on video evidence of incidents that occurred. Have you any evidence to suggest FOR A FACT that those players weren't targeted?

Point 2: if your manager was unaware of the threat posed by Dooher and McBride then he was not the outstanding manager that I have always believed him to be. McBride offered a foil for Canavan that was exceptionally effective in that Ulster championship, an outlet that wasn't there in 95. Close that avenue down and we may be back to all roads leading to Peter. A much easier task to nullify. And well, Dooher was becoming Dooher. In a game were Tyrone were always going to be second best at midfield Doohers role was becoming vital. Again, just because you were unaware, doesn't mean a manager as astute as Boylan was unaware.

Point 3: Canavan was out, on and off, for nearly 2 years with that injury. I hardly think it was just a twisted ankle? Your knowledge on this is obviously very sketchy. He was never the same player after that incident. Ok I could agree, McDermott did not specifically target his ankle, he most definitely was not thinking of a "twisted" ankle as his primary motive but he saw an opportunity to take out Canavan when he was in a very vulnerable position. Fair play to him, it worked and the rest is history.

Point 4: So Tyrone, the previous years All Ireland finalists, coming out of a province that included 3 of the previous 4 All Ireland winners were playing Meath,  team who hadn't won a provincial crown in 5 years. I would say it would take a wild leap of imagination for even the most die hard of Meath fans to consider, at the time of Canavans injury in the first half and the other first half incidents occurred, that Meath were so superior that they could have taken players off to rest them. The rose tinted glasses of 1996 are very powerful.

Point 5: No idea what your are talking about with your rape comment. But I must say that the outrage in Tyrone served to create a mindset that won us the 3 All Ireland titles in future years. Rightly or wrongly, we believed that if we were to win All Ireland titles then we'd have to go and rip them off the traditional strongholds - and so it came to pass. For that I will be eternally grateful.

I write this post in response to your jibes. Let it be known that I bear no animosity to Meath football at all. I have always admired your style of play and was a huge fan of the Team in the late 80s to early 90s and in fact hope to see them rise again to challenge Dublins cake walk in Leinster soon.

[Jinxy]

God, will you Tyrone lads just let it go.
You're actually worse than that Mayo crowd.

[From the Bunker]

God, will you Tyrone lads just let it go.
You're actually worse than that Mayo crowd.

They'll never be worse than us Mayo crowd. That's the one thing we are better than anyone else at! 

[omaghjoe]

Excellent rebuttal lads. All five points devastatingly refuted.

(Bunker, my glasses are perfectly horizontal.)

To be honest Hardy, I did actually start a rebuttal as your points are so utterly ridiculous.

OK - you have me there. I never considered that argument. Very convincing.

But I realised it was 20 years ago and I had things to do. I'll leave you to enjoy your rose tinted garden.

You're right - it is nearly twenty years ago, but I didn't bring it up. I only stepped in to correct the errors.

(My garden, unlike my glasses is, in fact, tilted.)

Ok, since I have been provoked into a meaningless 20 year old debate;

Point 1: I agree, we won't know as a fact if the Tyrone players were targeted as we weren't in the Meath dressing room. I presume you weren't there either so you can't present your point as fact either. The video evidence of the incidents could point to a systematic attempt to target certain Tyrone players. Again, I don't know this for a fact, but at least I'm basing it on video evidence of incidents that occurred. Have you any evidence to suggest FOR A FACT that those players weren't targeted?

Point 2: if your manager was unaware of the threat posed by Dooher and McBride then he was not the outstanding manager that I have always believed him to be. McBride offered a foil for Canavan that was exceptionally effective in that Ulster championship, an outlet that wasn't there in 95. Close that avenue down and we may be back to all roads leading to Peter. A much easier task to nullify. And well, Dooher was becoming Dooher. In a game were Tyrone were always going to be second best at midfield Doohers role was becoming vital. Again, just because you were unaware, doesn't mean a manager as astute as Boylan was unaware.

Point 3: Canavan was out, on and off, for nearly 2 years with that injury. I hardly think it was just a twisted ankle? Your knowledge on this is obviously very sketchy. He was never the same player after that incident. Ok I could agree, McDermott did not specifically target his ankle, he most definitely was not thinking of a "twisted" ankle as his primary motive but he saw an opportunity to take out Canavan when he was in a very vulnerable position. Fair play to him, it worked and the rest is history.

Point 4: So Tyrone, the previous years All Ireland finalists, coming out of a province that included 3 of the previous 4 All Ireland winners were playing Meath,  team who hadn't won a provincial crown in 5 years. I would say it would take a wild leap of imagination for even the most die hard of Meath fans to consider, at the time of Canavans injury in the first half and the other first half incidents occurred, that Meath were so superior that they could have taken players off to rest them. The rose tinted glasses of 1996 are very powerful.

Point 5: No idea what your are talking about with your rape comment. But I must say that the outrage in Tyrone served to create a mindset that won us the 3 All Ireland titles in future years. Rightly or wrongly, we believed that if we were to win All Ireland titles then we'd have to go and rip them off the traditional strongholds - and so it came to pass. For that I will be eternally grateful.

I write this post in response to your jibes. Let it be known that I bear no animosity to Meath football at all. I have always admired your style of play and was a huge fan of the Team in the late 80s to early 90s and in fact hope to see them rise again to challenge Dublins cake walk in Leinster soon.

As far as  Hardy is concerned on Point 3...McDermot wasn't even involved in the "twisting of the ankle" Peter managed that all on his owny own.....  but he sending me a tape of it so that I can examine it

Also Benny I am not grateful and have no respect in the slightest, I hate the Meath hoors, what good was the lesson if we didnt learn to hate them? Their possibly worse than the inbreds which I have been assured by the populace of their neighbouring counties is also an affliction that Meath people suffer from and apparently where the nickname "the Royals" stems from.

[Hardy]

Benny – this is your best effort? Really? You have heard of the Argument From Ignorance fallacy?

You targeted our best players.
- How about some evidence?
No. You provide the evidence that you didn't.

I hate the Meath hoors, what good was the lesson if we didnt learn to hate them? Their possibly worse than the inbreds which I have been assured by the populace of their neighbouring counties is also an affliction that Meath people suffer from and apparently where the nickname "the Royals" stems from.

Ah! More cornerboy trash talk. It seems to be endemic among the bushes. And you expect me to go down to the post office and send you a tape?

You lads need to follow Fuzzman's lead. Face your demons. Work to take your trash-talking, cheating, grief-mocking delinquents under control instead of whinging about something that didn't happen twenty years ago.