Rule Change Needed to Stop Puke Keep-Ball

[lenny]

Players will happily take black cards to close out a game.
They are deliberately trying to prevent the other team moving up the field into a scoring position.
If you punish these specific infringements by bringing the ball up for a set shot in a scoring position, it defeats the purpose of committing the foul in the first place.
Plus, the defending team now have to win their own re-start after the kick is taken.
I think a set-shot, off the ground, from the 45m line is the proportionate response to a cynical foul.

From the 13m or 20m line would be a better deterrent against cynical play. Penalty if it denies a goal scoring chance. Allowing more robust tackles would give defenders a chance to dispossess forwards without requiring the help of 3 or 4 teammates. Defining the tackle and improving it could be a big help in improving the game.

[Rossfan]

Seeing as football is now a total possession game is it time for some firm of tackle on the man who must release the ball then?
I know it " smacks of other codes" as the old Gaels used to say.

[trileacman]

Not a fan of the offensive mark. It's grand if it's a raking 50 hard kickpass but what if its a piddly 20 yard chip to an unmarked player 40m out? Should he derserve a handy free for that?

[cjx]

4 20m free rule to apply for 2nd half on

All 20m free apply from 50th min on inc ET might be best and of course all penalty rules apply as is.


Also ET not new game which is nonsence rewarding bad behaviour.

[cjx]

And a mark is a kick of at least 32m ( 45-13) that is caught cleanly. I believe?

[LeoMc]

Players will happily take black cards to close out a game.
They are deliberately trying to prevent the other team moving up the field into a scoring position.
If you punish these specific infringements by bringing the ball up for a set shot in a scoring position, it defeats the purpose of committing the foul in the first place.
Plus, the defending team now have to win their own re-start after the kick is taken.
I think a set-shot, off the ground, from the 45m line is the proportionate response to a cynical foul.

From the 13m or 20m line would be a better deterrent against cynical play. Penalty if it denies a goal scoring chance. Allowing more robust tackles would give defenders a chance to dispossess forwards without requiring the help of 3 or 4 teammates. Defining the tackle and improving it could be a big help in improving the game.

This. Currently without a defined tackle the cleanest* way is to surround the forward and force him to over carry. As this is difficult to achieve over the size of a pitch we see Managers compressing play into an area where this sort of "tackling" will be achievable.
*By cleanest I mean the least open to a referees interpretation.

[blewuporstuffed]

Kieran Donaghy (on Parkinson's podcast) in favour of:

- Offensive mark

- Replacement of black card with free brought forward 50 yards. This includes not bothering to take name of player who committed the foul (only wastes time and allows defense to reorganise, plus the 50 yards is punishment enough). And if the cynical foul took place anywhere inside the 21, then it's a penalty.

Not sure about the offensive mark myself. I wouldn't be long getting sick of watching O'Gara making great catches, then kicking the ball a mile wide!

50 yard idea is from Aussie Rules. I haven't seen it in practice, but Donaghy was very keen on it. Sounds a bit far. Maybe 30 yards, with proviso that the free has to be taken out of the hands, to keep things moving.

It was definitely a good point he made that for a team defending a lead late on, it actual benefits them to receive cards as it slows the game down further.

Like this idea. Works really well in Aussie Rules albeit a bigger pitch. 50 yard penalties in AFL are typically for either late hits in a marking contest or holding a player who has marked/running across the "Mark"/kicking ball away after a free. Effectively penalises tactics that a team might use to slow down the team with the ball and so it encourages quick ball movement. No issue with the offensive mark either as it encourages quick ball into the forward.

I would be a fan  of extending the advantage rule as well so that the ref can whistle for a foul but the fouled player has the option of playing on. i.e. he can decide to fist pass, take a solo etc. This does not give the offending team time to get back in position etc after a cynical foul.

Of all the hair-brained ideas i have heard floated regarding rule change, this is by far the best one and I would be happy enough to have it trialed.

Get rid of the black card.
For a 'cynical' foul - deliberate bull down, third man tackle etc the referee awards a free 50 yards up the pitch. (i would like to see that tried out to see if 50 yards is too far on a Gaelic pitch)
I would also add things like holding on to the ball /slowing up the oppositions free kick and kicking the ball off the tee and all that nonsense to the offenses punishable like this.

all the shot clock/ limiting hand passes suggestions are counter productive. if we want to encourage attacking play, we shouldn't be putting restrictions of attacking play. we need to either penalise defensive play or incentivise attacking play

[Christmas Lights]

And a mark is a kick of at least 32m ( 45-13) that is caught cleanly. I believe?

Just fcuk off mate.  If you dont like the game, go watch Aussie Rules or NFL or something as thats what you seem to prefer.

[Rossfan]

Very intelligent contribution

[Kickham csc]

Very intelligent contribution

Leave the sport alone.
Has the quality of tackling improved... Yes
Have skill levels improved...Yes (look at the corner backs on the great Kerry teams, kick and catch solo)
Has game scores increased...yes
Has fitness levels improved....yes
Has the ability of forwards to take on backs improved...Yes (if defending has improved, this leads to it being harder to take a man on..whih results in greater skill levels to take a man on
Has the game got faster...Yes (less time on the ball)
Has goalkeeper play improved....Yes
Has the game become more sophisticated...Yes offensive and defensive, Kickout strategies now common

Have pundits become more negative........YESSSSSSSSSSSS

For every action there is a reaction, for every defensive period in time, a positive attacking period will follow

Just let it be

[westbound]

Very intelligent contribution

Leave the sport alone.
Has the quality of tackling improved... Yes
Have skill levels improved...Yes (look at the corner backs on the great Kerry teams, kick and catch solo)
Has game scores increased...yes
Has fitness levels improved....yes
Has the ability of forwards to take on backs improved...Yes (if defending has improved, this leads to it being harder to take a man on..whih results in greater skill levels to take a man on
Has the game got faster...Yes (less time on the ball)
Has goalkeeper play improved....Yes
Has the game become more sophisticated...Yes offensive and defensive, Kickout strategies now common

Have pundits become more negative........YESSSSSSSSSSSS

For every action there is a reaction, for every defensive period in time, a positive attacking period will follow

Just let it be

Yoy forgot to ask one important question

Has the type of football being played led to less entertainment and therefore lower attendances? ............. YESSSSSSS

[Jinxy]

Here's me thinking I was bored stupid watching football nowadays.
Turns out the pundits have just tricked me into thinking most games are like watching paint dry.

[trileacman]

Incentivising attacking play will always incentivise defensive play along side it. The two are relatively inseparable.

If you make goals worth 4 points teams will try harder to stop teams scoring them, so the difficultly in scoring a goal increases proportionately to the reward for scoring one.

If you make a catch from a 40m kick pass worthy of a mark then you incentivise teams to prevent 40m passes being either kicked or caught.

The evidence exists before your eyes. Despite the midfield mark we have not seen a remarkable increase in the proportion of long kick outs. More than ever the top teams look to invent strategies to allow them to kick to unmarked men. The option to go long to a competitive midfield battle is the last one that many keepers take having exhausted any safe short options. The percentage of kick outs that are uncontested is still as high as ever despite the intro of the rule.

[CJ2017]

Not sure how this would go down with everyone and apologies if it was mentioned before.

If a rule was introduced that the ball had to go past the 45m line on the kickout.

As you say Trileacman "The option to go long to a competitive midfield battle is the last one that many keepers take having exhausted any safe short options." Agree with you that the keeper would take the more certain/higher percentage to kick short.

Would a competitive midfield battle be more of a spectacle to watch for audiences I am not sure.

this rule was introduced into the Int Rules in 2014.

[Rossfan]

Thats fine for he elite of the 2 Sports but your Junior B or u 14 on a windy day?
Must go to a few games wherever Kickham lives!!!