Antrim Hurling

[btdtgtt]

Footballers got two good wins at Corrigan and just getting the feel of the place. No way they`re going anywhere. You go where you like btdtgtt!

Thanks bannside.
Either way it's Walsh park for me this weekend.

[north_antrim_hound]

Lads lads lads enough of this constant nonsense with managers and players etc etc. If we had every single player available to us and Brian Cody (inc backroom team) we would still be in the division we are currently in. I am sick to the back teeth with our supporters having this arrogant feeling that we are better than what we are currently. Catch a grip of yourselves, we all need to take a reality check. It's going to take a good number of years of consistent incremental improvements before we finally get back up to 1b never mind 1a.

I do believe I and others said our division is a fair reflection of our standing.
And on that see this article - resonates with what I've been saying about Antrim hurling:
http://m.rte.ie/sport/gaa/2016/0307/773267-landers/

Very intresting and worth some contemplation in relation to club hurling structures
But antrims club scene on the national stage seems to be in rude Heath compared to corks when we consider what LG have achieved recently and hopefully Cushendall shortly
Do you honestly think if Kilkenny switched to a knock out format that there county standards would demote them to division 2 hurling
A point just as relevant in the article is the lack of work at minor and u21
When we can't get our u21 players to train for an all Ireland after breezing through Ulster it would suggest there are other forces at play here other than our club championship formats
But Imm up for more club games for sure
I just don't know for instance if Saul and Clark playing more club games is ever going to prepare them for a Cahal Barrett or noel Connors
It's a completely different arena
But there maybe is  substance to the argument I don't know

[btdtgtt]

I'm not saying it's kingston's thoughts should be lifted and mirrored in Antrim but the general thesis is entirely the same - that is, that the lack of a comprehensive club scene has had a detrimental effect on the county side.
Whilst you might say more club games don't necessarily prepare Saul or Clarke - think of how many hurlers in the county it will benefit?
We raise the general playing standard - and that is what helps improve each and every player.
After all - what's to lose? The past load of years of limited consistency in club season has hardly brought benefits!
If I could bring one thing that would improve Antrim hurling - it wouldn't be Brian Cody - it would be years on end of a comprehensive and meaningful club scene. Ultimately that's what would broader our playing base and increase standards.

Another thought - I'm don't disagree about our club teams "in rude health" in the all Ireland stage - but consider this;
1) if the Antrim champions has to battle through the Leinster or Munster championship would we have seen as many st Patrick's days as we have?
2) although some clubs have made it to the big day - do we have as broad a range of clubs who can win our championship as other top counties?

Just thoughts. I'm not making and statements or judgements.

[cfclg]

I'm not saying it's kingston's thoughts should be lifted and mirrored in Antrim but the general thesis is entirely the same - that is, that the lack of a comprehensive club scene has had a detrimental effect on the county side.
Whilst you might say more club games don't necessarily prepare Saul or Clarke - think of how many hurlers in the county it will benefit?
We raise the general playing standard - and that is what helps improve each and every player.
After all - what's to lose? The past load of years of limited consistency in club season has hardly brought benefits!
If I could bring one thing that would improve Antrim hurling - it wouldn't be Brian Cody - it would be years on end of a comprehensive and meaningful club scene. Ultimately that's what would broader our playing base and increase standards.

Another thought - I'm don't disagree about our club teams "in rude health" in the all Ireland stage - but consider this;
1) if the Antrim champions has to battle through the Leinster or Munster championship would we have seen as many st Patrick's days as we have?
2) although some clubs have made it to the big day - do we have as broad a range of clubs who can win our championship as other top counties?

Just thoughts. I'm not making and statements or judgements.

These few lines above are exactly what we need, well said. That would be the basis for everything else that could follow at county level. Long term plans/goals.

[Milltown Row2]

I'm not saying it's kingston's thoughts should be lifted and mirrored in Antrim but the general thesis is entirely the same - that is, that the lack of a comprehensive club scene has had a detrimental effect on the county side.
Whilst you might say more club games don't necessarily prepare Saul or Clarke - think of how many hurlers in the county it will benefit?
We raise the general playing standard - and that is what helps improve each and every player.
After all - what's to lose? The past load of years of limited consistency in club season has hardly brought benefits!
If I could bring one thing that would improve Antrim hurling - it wouldn't be Brian Cody - it would be years on end of a comprehensive and meaningful club scene. Ultimately that's what would broader our playing base and increase standards.

Another thought - I'm don't disagree about our club teams "in rude health" in the all Ireland stage - but consider this;
1) if the Antrim champions has to battle through the Leinster or Munster championship would we have seen as many st Patrick's days as we have?
2) although some clubs have made it to the big day - do we have as broad a range of clubs who can win our championship as other top counties?

Just thoughts. I'm not making and statements or judgements.

Would the other teams breeze through teams like Ballycastle, Loughgiel and Cushendall should they play in the Antrim championships? The semi finals allow those 'big' teams to beat the minnows from Antrim... The Dunloy team of the 90's and the Ballycastle teams of the 80's should have won the big one... Loughgiel have won it twice  and finally the Dall are 60 minutes from doing the same thing after beating the Galway championships ... I think the range of clubs are small compared to some counties but that's the way it is when you have clubs focusing on one code

[north_antrim_hound]

I'm not saying it's kingston's thoughts should be lifted and mirrored in Antrim but the general thesis is entirely the same - that is, that the lack of a comprehensive club scene has had a detrimental effect on the county side.
Whilst you might say more club games don't necessarily prepare Saul or Clarke - think of how many hurlers in the county it will benefit?
We raise the general playing standard - and that is what helps improve each and every player.
After all - what's to lose? The past load of years of limited consistency in club season has hardly brought benefits!
If I could bring one thing that would improve Antrim hurling - it wouldn't be Brian Cody - it would be years on end of a comprehensive and meaningful club scene. Ultimately that's what would broader our playing base and increase standards.

Another thought - I'm don't disagree about our club teams "in rude health" in the all Ireland stage - but consider this;
1) if the Antrim champions has to battle through the Leinster or Munster championship would we have seen as many st Patrick's days as we have?
2) although some clubs have made it to the big day - do we have as broad a range of clubs who can win our championship as other top counties?

Just thoughts. I'm not making and statements or judgements.

I amnot arguing your mindset at all
A healthier club scene is always going to help the county scene
but it's like arguing about the chicken and the egg
When birr was successful so was Offaly
When sixmimebridge was winning so was Clare
And the most relevant in this discussion
When Newtown shandrum where winning so was cork with same club format as they have now
Now let's take some of them clubs now Imam sure any of our top four clubs would give them there fill if not beat them
Personally I don't know if changing the club format would have as much impact as getting some funding and get every kid in Belfast a hurl and good coaches as well as other areas in Antrim with some resources that could be utilised
And a huge effort in underage development squads
I think the north Antrim underage development and I be leave there is one now around the city is a great step In the right direction

Getting back to the place where it all matters the club scene
I think we need more clubs being competitive hence more underage work there
As bad as things look I have nothing but utter respect for anyone who helps kids at there club but there needs to be more of them
The county situation is what is But one thing I like about PJ is his utter belief that we have good hurlers or we wouldn't be doing what we are doing at club level
We just don't have enough good players and some of them feel it's not worth the hassle
You could even argue that there is nothing wrong at all with Antrim hurling we just punch above our weight sometimes and when we come back down we are all depressed

It's an old chestnut that has been debated for ages and I think there is more than one problem here

[Milltown Row2]

We've done every format there is.. Groups, round robin, and knockout.... Knockout allows the shocks .... Round robins allow the better teams another go... Groups allow the better teams to get more points....9 times out of ten its the same semi finals....

Belfast teams need to improve, and not be just near misses each year..... They gotta be consistent and not just at juvenile level..... The progress the likes of Creggan has made in such a small period is huge... Sustaining that will be an even bigger achievement..... Clooney gales also...St Johns and Rossa (main Belfast clubs) threaten to bring their kids up to winning at senior but fail each time , and so goes that great batch of juveniles.... Something needs changing so that 5/6 teams are capable of winning each year, what that is, is the millions dollar question

[north_antrim_hound]

We've done every format there is.. Groups, round robin, and knockout.... Knockout allows the shocks .... Round robins allow the better teams another go... Groups allow the better teams to get more points....9 times out of ten its the same semi finals....

Belfast teams need to improve, and not be just near misses each year..... They gotta be consistent and not just at juvenile level..... The progress the likes of Creggan has made in such a small period is huge... Sustaining that will be an even bigger achievement..... Clooney gales also...St Johns and Rossa (main Belfast clubs) threaten to bring their kids up to winning at senior but fail each time , and so goes that great batch of juveniles.... Something needs changing so that 5/6 teams are capable of winning each year, what that is, is the millions dollar question

St. John's came within a whisper of beating the dall. There not that far away

[Milltown Row2]

We've done every format there is.. Groups, round robin, and knockout.... Knockout allows the shocks .... Round robins allow the better teams another go... Groups allow the better teams to get more points....9 times out of ten its the same semi finals....

Belfast teams need to improve, and not be just near misses each year..... They gotta be consistent and not just at juvenile level..... The progress the likes of Creggan has made in such a small period is huge... Sustaining that will be an even bigger achievement..... Clooney gales also...St Johns and Rossa (main Belfast clubs) threaten to bring their kids up to winning at senior but fail each time , and so goes that great batch of juveniles.... Something needs changing so that 5/6 teams are capable of winning each year, what that is, is the millions dollar question

St. John's came within a whisper of beating the dall. There not that far away

Every team in Belfast can say they were a whisker away from beating some team..... They were stuffed the year before against Loughgiel.... Consistency is the key.. Not near misses..... Cushendall beat us in injury time a few years ago.... We haven't got to that level again.... When the Johnnies win it then I'll be convinced they have improved

[btdtgtt]

All great valid posts and none necessarily in disagreement.
Agree totally with MR2 on the city clubs - near misses are no good and neither is juvenile succes - it's about consistently performing & wining at senior level.
In terms of the more comprehensive club scene - personally I think it's not just the structure - it's about regular fixtures, full teams available.
Although I did say before I advocate the league being finished prior to championship - so seeding used to determine championship draw in that same year. This makes the league more immediately relevant.
And I agree our top clubs fully deserve their returns - but would maybe our 4th / 5th best club compete with the 4/5th best club in major counties? That's how we'll test the depth of our resources - and when that's the case then ultimately our county team will benefit also!

[NAG1]

All great valid posts and none necessarily in disagreement.
Agree totally with MR2 on the city clubs - near misses are no good and neither is juvenile succes - it's about consistently performing & wining at senior level.
In terms of the more comprehensive club scene - personally I think it's not just the structure - it's about regular fixtures, full teams available.
Although I did say before I advocate the league being finished prior to championship - so seeding used to determine championship draw in that same year. This makes the league more immediately relevant.
And I agree our top clubs fully deserve their returns - but would maybe our 4th / 5th best club compete with the 4/5th best club in major counties? That's how we'll test the depth of our resources - and when that's the case then ultimately our county team will benefit also!

btdtgtt

For once I would be in agreement, the leagues should be used as an incentive for the championship, there is no other way really of making sure there are no dead rubbers.

We dont have the depth of teams currently for a competitive champions league type structure for championship.

What we need is a vibrant club scene with competitive matches during the best hurling months of the year, in the lead up to the championship.

Each game therefore would have meaning, either trying to be seeded in the top four or having home advantage for the opening game, what ever way it is used, it is vital to get all the club teams playing 10 plus hard tough games during the season. Would St Johns be a tougher prospect in the championship if they were playing in Corrigan for example?

Not looking back with rose tinted glasses but if we can get back to a place where a Sunday during the summer months means good quality hurling games all over the county. We could then get to a place where we start to build other things around regular Sunday hurling, juvenile games prior to the main games, go games at half time, fund raising activities for the clubs hosting. Maybe those days are gone but I for one would like to get back to something akin to this.

[btdtgtt]

Not often we say that But Couldn't agree more NAG! 
The picture of regular Sunday afternoons with full blooded senior games - maybe preceded by the same two clubs playing an underage game - put it week in week and year on year - just watch the standard and interest in hurling improve!

[hurlingstick]

This Sunday is the big one.  I'd say it's winner takes all. It's fallen nicely for us being at home. I think we can win this Sunday and make it to the final as I don't think London will trouble us that much. Being the optimist I think we'll beat Westmeath in the 2A final.  Plenty of room for improvement.

[johnneycool]

Not often we say that But Couldn't agree more NAG! 
The picture of regular Sunday afternoons with full blooded senior games - maybe preceded by the same two clubs playing an underage game - put it week in week and year on year - just watch the standard and interest in hurling improve!

The extended intercounty calendar, (granted you aren't in the Leinster round robin and qualifiers this year) has put paid to that and dates for Sunday fixtures are scarce enough for administrators, but this year the Christy Ring games are on saturdays, so in theory the clubs will have their full contingent, albeit the intercounty hurlers will be playing two games in two days.

[Milltown Row2]

Not often we say that But Couldn't agree more NAG! 
The picture of regular Sunday afternoons with full blooded senior games - maybe preceded by the same two clubs playing an underage game - put it week in week and year on year - just watch the standard and interest in hurling improve!

The extended intercounty calendar, (granted you aren't in the Leinster round robin and qualifiers this year) has put paid to that and dates for Sunday fixtures are scarce enough for administrators, but this year the Christy Ring games are on saturdays, so in theory the clubs will have their full contingent, albeit the intercounty hurlers will be playing two games in two days.

Johnney give me the heads up on the Mayo game!! I'd a 7 timer waiting on you fecks lol!!! Mayo?? FFS