Antrim Hurling

[btdtgtt]

Couldn't agree more Johnny cool.

Our problem is too many (salaried) officials happy to throw together token gestures at this then gloss up their job. It's about their own empires not genuine hurling development.

I for one have stopped going to woodlands to watch 2 nephews blitz competitions run by certain officials - they don't care, then the event is a half-ass job - and it feeds thru to the kids. It's just a box ticking exercise to justify their jobs - then they go back to their wee empire.

I believe NA make a better job of it but likely still behind our southern counterparts.

[imtommygunn]

Yes understandably we can look to underage setups etc etc and how we can improve that.

However how does that help Kevin Ryan?

Let's not forget that some of these boys were in very competitive underage teams so it's not like they were left behind from an early age. Granted there has been no continuity in that or perhaps it was just fortunate to have such a good group of players at one age but there is the basis of some very good players in antrim if they pull together. Liam Watson and Shane McNaughton are superb forwards and the like of McManus, Graffin, McAuley etc aren't exatcly average either.

[btdtgtt]

A case for Watson - the rest are excellent hurlers by Antrim standards - but distinctly average when compared to the top counties.
Sounds harsh but I think that's true.

[Sleeping giant]

nag it wasnt a book i was writing,   all i was try to get across was that  IMO its the players that needs to sort themselves out.  and not the manager needing to give any sort of special treatment. 

[imtommygunn]

A case for Watson - the rest are excellent hurlers by Antrim standards - but distinctly average when compared to the top counties.
Sounds harsh but I think that's true.

Do you think mcmanus is distinctly average?

[Minder]

A case for Watson - the rest are excellent hurlers by Antrim standards - but distinctly average when compared to the top counties.
Sounds harsh but I think that's true.

Do you think mcmanus is distinctly average?

Compared to the top players he said.

[imtommygunn]

I wouldn't say mcmanus is distinctly average compared to boys from the top counties at all. Maybe tries to a bit much himself at times and boyslike cody etc wouldn't let him away with that but far from average compared to anyone in my view.

[Milltown Row2]

I wouldn't say mcmanus is distinctly average compared to boys from the top counties at all. Maybe tries to a bit much himself at times and boyslike cody etc wouldn't let him away with that but far from average compared to anyone in my view.

Would say the same

[btdtgtt]

Well I stick by that statement.

McManus plays centre back or centre forward.

At centre back: does he compare to Brian hogan, Michael Walsh or tony og regan.
At centre forward: does he compare to shefflin, maher, or a 21yr old Niall Burke.

I don't think so.

Fantastic hurler within Antrim and one of our county's finest - but yes average "compared to the top counties" is what I said.
And if this is the case with Neil it is even more evident with the others you mentioned - if they were all at the top level we simply wouldn't be getting beaten by Westmeath!
Facts lads.

[imtommygunn]

Fact that we were beaten by westmeath yes.  The guy is a chb who have used to plug a gap in forwards a la gary o'kane.

There's nothing better about tony og regan than mcmanus. Hogan yes and probably brick walsh. If you use a basis of 3 players like that then a lot of distinctly average centre backs about in any scheme.

With full commitment i don't think westmeath are within ten and maybe fifteen points of us as per the previous year. Note the full commitment part.

[Na Glinntí Glasa]

fact is folks we have good club players that when playing for the county become distinctly average, and thats all all of them.

for as great a hurler liam watson hes the best club player in antrim but you could barely remember him playing well for antrim. same aplies to alot of others.

Neill mc manus is slightly differnet imo as he has been antrims main scorer for the past few seasons. maybe alot of frees but he still chips in with a hell of a lot of scores. by the way im not saying neils better than laim!

[imtommygunn]

Club and county are leagues apart. Watson has done well enough at times but against the big guns we have taken some awful beatings and no one player could stand out in that in my view. Against Limerick and the likes there'd hardly be ball getting to the like of Watson.

I do think we have a few boys who are in the grand scheme of things above distinctly average. YOu can use the westmeath argument but at the end of the day it's nearly the same boys who beat Dublin the previous year.(or was it the year before).

Watson and McManus are good in the grand scheme of things in my view and Shane McNaughton getting there too. That's compared to most teams. We don't have 15 in that mould and it would seem we don't have commited players either so none of that really matters at present unfortunately.

[theskull1]

Again...players dont live in a vacuum either. The lack of commitment as you call it stems from a general lack of enthusiasm/passion for all things IC related in this County for various reasons I'm sure. No point putting the lack of commitment at the door of those who have dedicated themselves to the game to get to IC standard. We're just not a very well joined up County.

[Jesusjones]

Mc Manus has played consistently well for Antrim for the last 3 or 4 years whether that be against Div 1 or Div 2 teams. Watson on the other hand has had one spectacular game for Antrim against Cork when he scored 6 points. Mc Manus actually scored 7 in that game as well. Mc Manus is consistent, Watson on the other hand could beat the world on his own but for the next 3 matches he might not feature at all. The same year he hit 6 points against Cork he didn't register a single score against Offaly. Down in Parnell Park he came on at half time, played the second half and extra time and never struck leather. No doubting he is the most talented hurler in Ulster but I don't know if he is the best.

[btdtgtt]

Interesting point JJ but I still can't accept we have 5or6 players that match the top counties.
1or2 some people can make a case for but not me there either if I am honest.
Results don't lie - even if the better players were as individuals.