Antrim Hurling

[oisinog]

Yes there was always going to be an appeal.  It is wrong to punish the entire club in my opinion.  Playing all of their matches away and being banned from under 21 championship as well as the individual bans are sufficient and still send a very strong message out which is the purpose of the thing. 

Clubs have a right to appeal.  Referee's who are also members know this.  You have to accept the rules of our democratic association.  Rasharkin are protecting their club using the rules that govern clubs from Burt to Ballygunner.  If referee's are talking about a strike or any other action against the democratic decisions taken, then they too are bringing the GAA into disrepute if you ask me.

Playing matches away from home is not a big enought punishment. This happend at a nutural venue no connection to the club. What would stop the players doing it again.

I think Ulster have been mad overturning this decision what will prevent other clubs from attacking refs. This does not do enough to discourage people

[4father]

I think the outcry and the shock about it all so far will go a long way to discourage attacks on referee's. 

But it doesnt matter what either of us think about it, we are paid members of the GAA and we accept the democracy that exists in it.  If they have made an appeal and it has been accepted by the higher authority then we must accept it and go on doing what we all do to make our GAA clubs good. 

However, if a counter appeal goes in and the original ban or part of the original ban is upheld then Rasharkin must accept that too.  At the end of the day, they are talking about saving their club effectively.  If it were mine, i'd fight tooth and nail to save it.

[oisinog]

I think the outcry and the shock about it all so far will go a long way to discourage attacks on referee's. 

But it doesnt matter what either of us think about it, we are paid members of the GAA and we accept the democracy that exists in it.  If they have made an appeal and it has been accepted by the higher authority then we must accept it and go on doing what we all do to make our GAA clubs good. 

However, if a counter appeal goes in and the original ban or part of the original ban is upheld then Rasharkin must accept that too.  At the end of the day, they are talking about saving their club effectively.  If it were mine, i'd fight tooth and nail to save it.

You make a good point

[playwiththewind1st]

I think the outcry and the shock about it all so far will go a long way to discourage attacks on referee's. 

Do you know what the problem is? It won't.

[ManInBlackandGreen]

You are all talking about rasharkin, players, club, individuals etc etc, its the treatment of Ray I am talking about and other Referee that have the mis-fortune to experience the same thing. The process he has now engaged has effectively ended his refereeing career, as he was given no other option or choice but to take this process by the behaviour and direction both by Antrim who actually sent him to Coventry to protect themselves, and UC then followed. Forget about the club etc etc his own county for self preservation effectively stiffed him! Thats what I'm talking about and any other Referee in the future will be treated the same way, this is what has to stop! So as previously said WHAT WILL YOUR COUNTY DO FOR YOU? FCK ALL!

[Milltown Row2]

Your right mibag. Ray has been the victim here and people seemed to forget that. While all of Rasharkin may not have been involved and the individuals have been punished will that be enough for the collective (being the clubs) to reel in those dickheads they have within/outside  (they always know who these wankers are by the way) their club and get back to what we are all about

[playwiththewind1st]

If referee's are talking about a strike or any other action against the democratic decisions taken, then they too are bringing the GAA into disrepute if you ask me.  

How come? Would you willingly go out to do a job, on a voluntary basis, if you knew you were going to get the crap beat out of you?
Referees do a good job & purely because they want to. By definition, they can walk away, any time they want, particularly if they are not being protected.

[Buswhacker]

Why can't the GAA adopt a no nonsense policy like the rugby codes.Referees are not subjected to abuse from players in any shape or form.Decisions are generally accepted in a sporting manner. The governing bodies in both codes of rugby do not dilly dally with regard to punishment,and both players and spectators know that.The GAA need to get their house in order with regard to discipline and treatment of referees..............too many local vendettas,and petty inter club issues. If clubs, players or spectators misbehave they should pay the price and know that they're paying it.

[Glensman]

Why can't the GAA adopt a no nonsense policy like the rugby codes.Referees are not subjected to abuse from players in any shape or form.Decisions are generally accepted in a sporting manner. The governing bodies in both codes of rugby do not dilly dally with regard to punishment,and both players and spectators know that.The GAA need to get their house in order with regard to discipline and treatment of referees..............too many local vendettas,and petty inter club issues. If clubs, players or spectators misbehave they should pay the price and know that they're paying it.

+1

[4father]

If referee's are talking about a strike or any other action against the democratic decisions taken, then they too are bringing the GAA into disrepute if you ask me.  

How come? Would you willingly go out to do a job, on a voluntary basis, if you knew you were going to get the crap beat out of you?
Referees do a good job & purely because they want to. By definition, they can walk away, any time they want, particularly if they are not being protected.

The rumours aren't suggesting that they are going to walk away though.  I respect any mans right to walk away and especially RM who I know and respect very much.  But if they are talking about striking, then they are not accepting the democratic decisions of the GAA and are disrupting the games schedule which, in my humble opinion brings the GAA into disrepute.

[playwiththewind1st]

I don't understand this "democratic decisions" point.

If the county set up a set of fixtures for the weekend, then the Referees' Committee will allocate those matches to particular referees.

A referee has the ultimate right to expect that if he goes out to do a match, then he will come home in the same shape as he went out.

That is what it's all about - it's a basic health & safety issue, For far too long, people who abused referees [either verbally or physically] got away with it. Now, it's got to a level that's completely unacceptable. What I'd like to know is why would anyone basically want to go out to officiate, if there's any chance that they'll get the crap kicked out of them?

The disincentives now far outweigh the incentives for going out & refereeing, in my view, & it will be v difficult to get new recruits, let alone hang on to the dwindling numbers who want to do it.

[4father]

I don't understand this "democratic decisions" point.

If the county set up a set of fixtures for the weekend, then the Referees' Committee will allocate those matches to particular referees.

A referee has the ultimate right to expect that if he goes out to do a match, then he will come home in the same shape as he went out.

That is what it's all about - it's a basic health & safety issue, For far too long, people who abused referees [either verbally or physically] got away with it. Now, it's got to a level that's completely unacceptable. What I'd like to know is why would anyone basically want to go out to officiate, if there's any chance that they'll get the crap kicked out of them?

The disincentives now far outweigh the incentives for going out & refereeing, in my view, & it will be v difficult to get new recruits, let alone hang on to the dwindling numbers who want to do it.

While I agree with most of your points in terms of how unacceptable it is to be under threat and that it may well prove difficult to get new referee's.  No physical or verbal abuse should ever be tolerated.  If anything, it is an opportunity for clubs in Antrim to send motions to GAA convention around how to tackle the issue on a national level. 

You say you don't understand the 'democratic decisions' point i'm making.  It really is simple.  The GAA has decision making bodies and within that process, individuals, clubs and county boards have right to appeal decisions.  The referee's committee is as much part of the GAA as is any club, county board or individual member which means we all must accept the decisions taken by the GAA once they reach their conclusion.  That is not to say that there could be a counter appeal and if that goes against Rasharkin then the club must accept that after exhausting any other avenues.  No if the referee's committee are talking about a wholesale strike (which the rumours are suggesting), then that means that no clubs will get games regardless of fee's paid, exemplary past behaviour or anything else which in my opinion would be bringing our association into disrepute.  For example, if McDermott's GAC felt they were hard done by in suspensions and appeals and if that club decided disrespect the democratic decisions taken (democratic by means of elections, votes, national democratically accepted rules etc) and go on strike, the in my opinion McDermott's GAC would be bringing the association into disrepute.  Other teams suffer because of their actions.  In the referee's case, if they decide to go on strike, then nobody will get games and that is wrong.

I agree something needs to happen on a national scale around respect for refs and the rugby idea is a great example of how it can work but that is up to clubs, referee's committees or individuals to put forward those idea's to be decided upon.

[ManInBlackandGreen]

I don't understand this "democratic decisions" point.

If the county set up a set of fixtures for the weekend, then the Referees' Committee will allocate those matches to particular referees.

A referee has the ultimate right to expect that if he goes out to do a match, then he will come home in the same shape as he went out.

That is what it's all about - it's a basic health & safety issue, For far too long, people who abused referees [either verbally or physically] got away with it. Now, it's got to a level that's completely unacceptable. What I'd like to know is why would anyone basically want to go out to officiate, if there's any chance that they'll get the crap kicked out of them?

The disincentives now far outweigh the incentives for going out & refereeing, in my view, & it will be v difficult to get new recruits, let alone hang on to the dwindling numbers who want to do it.

While I agree with most of your points in terms of how unacceptable it is to be under threat and that it may well prove difficult to get new referee's.  No physical or verbal abuse should ever be tolerated.  If anything, it is an opportunity for clubs in Antrim to send motions to GAA convention around how to tackle the issue on a national level. 

You say you don't understand the 'democratic decisions' point i'm making.  It really is simple.  The GAA has decision making bodies and within that process, individuals, clubs and county boards have right to appeal decisions.  The referee's committee is as much part of the GAA as is any club, county board or individual member which means we all must accept the decisions taken by the GAA once they reach their conclusion.  That is not to say that there could be a counter appeal and if that goes against Rasharkin then the club must accept that after exhausting any other avenues.  No if the referee's committee are talking about a wholesale strike (which the rumours are suggesting), then that means that no clubs will get games regardless of fee's paid, exemplary past behaviour or anything else which in my opinion would be bringing our association into disrepute.  For example, if McDermott's GAC felt they were hard done by in suspensions and appeals and if that club decided disrespect the democratic decisions taken (democratic by means of elections, votes, national democratically accepted rules etc) and go on strike, the in my opinion McDermott's GAC would be bringing the association into disrepute.  Other teams suffer because of their actions.  In the referee's case, if they decide to go on strike, then nobody will get games and that is wrong.

I agree something needs to happen on a national scale around respect for refs and the rugby idea is a great example of how it can work but that is up to clubs, referee's committees or individuals to put forward those idea's to be decided upon.

4Father what was democratic about the UC decision? get real or I would suggest do your research in relation to what actually happened at UC then come back on and talk about "Bringing the game into disrepute", your posts actually show how little you really know about what went on! 

[4father]

Well I can only assume that an appeal was lodged by Rasharkin and the appeal was partly upheld.  Ulster Council is a democratic layer of the GAA so I can only presume that this body gave Rasharkin their hearing and decided that the Antrim Boards punishment was either harsh or illegal or something like that.

Let me begin my research by asking you what went on instead of being all secretive about it.  What WASN'T right about the UCs decision?

[ManInBlackandGreen]

To assume (ass u me) and then to presume is where you go wrong so anything after that is pure BS, and as thought you expound and take the live and let live approach in your posts, either harsh or illegal, jesus you really are full of it aren't you, so you can assume seeing as you like the word that an appeal by Antrim suggests that not everything is right in the process. It doesn't take a genius to work that one out, the truth will out, and I am not here to educate, however previous posts on both codes here by other individuals should carry you some way to realising that unless you actually know what your talking about and are in full possession of the facts then stay off these sites  and refrain from spouting BS. Again my previous posts deal with RM, and you like many others should take the time to actually read the detail instead of jumping on the bandwagon.