The Many Faces of US Politics...

[deiseach]

you prefer the russian style? or maybe the chinese? youd be speaking german if it wasn't for freedom american style

It was the Russians who made by far the greatest contribution to defeating Germany in the Second World / Great Patriotic War. So I suppose, by your own logic, what we have is freedom Russian style

[magickingdom]

you prefer the russian style? or maybe the chinese? youd be speaking german if it wasn't for freedom american style

It was the Russians who made by far the greatest contribution to defeating Germany in the Second World / Great Patriotic War. So I suppose, by your own logic, what we have is freedom Russian style

tell me your joking? the russians were defending themselves, the 200,000 dead americans were defending europe

[ardmhachaabu]

you prefer the russian style? or maybe the chinese? youd be speaking german if it wasn't for freedom american style

It was the Russians who made by far the greatest contribution to defeating Germany in the Second World / Great Patriotic War. So I suppose, by your own logic, what we have is freedom Russian style

tell me your joking? the russians were defending themselves, the 200,000 dead americans were defending europe

Uh huh, Pearl Harbour had nothing to do with it, eh?

[deiseach]

tell me your joking? the russians were defending themselves, the 200,000 dead americans were defending europe

I am not joking. 200,000 American dead versus 9,000,000 for the Soviet Union - and that's just soldiers. If you think the western Allies could have defeated Germany without that sacrifice, you have a strange sense of proportion

[dec]

you prefer the russian style? or maybe the chinese? youd be speaking german if it wasn't for freedom american style

It was the Russians who made by far the greatest contribution to defeating Germany in the Second World / Great Patriotic War. So I suppose, by your own logic, what we have is freedom Russian style

Eastern Europe experienced "freedom Russian style" for about 45 years.

[deiseach]

It was the Russians who made by far the greatest contribution to defeating Germany in the Second World / Great Patriotic War. So I suppose, by your own logic, what we have is freedom Russian style

Eastern Europe experienced "freedom Russian style" for about 45 years.

Indeed. But hey, at least they weren't speaking German!

[redandblack4ever]

I've just read this entire thread and I'm LMAO. You've got Tyrone's Own and that fool from Amargh, who don't have a clue about politics in the US. All the two of them spout is right wing bullshit straight from Faux News and their stables of clowns. Anyone in the US who has a inkling of what's going on, sure as hell wouldn't be getting their talking points from either the Republican Party or Faux News.

To the both of you, go out join the Teabaggers or the Repukes, I don't care which one you decide to join, but I willl say this to you both, have you ever thought in your lives, "there but for the grace of God, go I?"

My personal opinion of the Pukes and Teabaggers is this: "I got mine, so fcuk you." Selfishness and greed have overtaken some people in the USA. Most of the Teabaggers are old, white people who survive on Medicare (which by the way is a single-payer health system) and Social Security payments and their private pensions.(If they stilll have a retirement accout to fall back on; many people lost a awful lot of money when the market crashed in 2008). The rest of them are uneducated and ignorant cretins, who for the most part, are racists. Take a look at the spelling of some of the posters at their protests. They might speak a form of English but some of them sure can't spell for shite.

I don't understand why anyone who works for liiving, i.e. the building trades, laborers, etc. would even think about voting for a Repuke. As my late father always said "it's like the chickens voting for Colonel Sanders."

I have an opinion of these two fools on this board and believe me it's neither nice or politically correct. Listen guys, if you want to have any credibility with me, don't populate a thread with talking points that come straight from Faux News or from the latest e-mail from the RNC.

Mrs. redandblack4ever

[Tyrones own]

I've just read this entire thread and I'm LMAO. You've got Tyrone's Own and that fool from Amargh, who don't have a clue about politics in the US. All the two of them spout is right wing bullshit straight from Faux News and their stables of clowns. Anyone in the US who has a inkling of what's going on, sure as hell wouldn't be getting their talking points from either the Republican Party or Faux News.

To the both of you, go out join the Teabaggers or the Repukes, I don't care which one you decide to join, but I willl say this to you both, have you ever thought in your lives, "there but for the grace of God, go I?"

My personal opinion of the Pukes and Teabaggers is this: "I got mine, so fcuk you." Selfishness and greed have overtaken some people in the USA. Most of the Teabaggers are old, white people who survive on Medicare (which by the way is a single-payer health system) and Social Security payments and their private pensions.(If they stilll have a retirement accout to fall back on; many people lost a awful lot of money when the market crashed in 2008). The rest of them are uneducated and ignorant cretins, who for the most part, are racists. Take a look at the spelling of some of the posters at their protests. They might speak a form of English but some of them sure can't spell for shite.

I don't understand why anyone who works for liiving, i.e. the building trades, laborers, etc. would even think about voting for a Repuke. As my late father always said "it's like the chickens voting for Colonel Sanders."

I have an opinion of these two fools on this board and believe me it's neither nice or politically correct. Listen guys, if you want to have any credibility with me, don't populate a thread with talking points that come straight from Faux News or from the latest e-mail from the RNC.

Mrs. redandblack4ever

Fcuk lads we have nancy herself on here
But seriously, who in the fcuk do you think you are......I'd tell ye what to do with your elitist point of view but it wouldn't be nice
nor politically correct

[heganboy]

I've just read this entire thread and I'm LMAO. You've got Tyrone's Own and that fool from Amargh, who don't have a clue about politics in the US. All the two of them spout is right wing bullshit straight from Faux News and their stables of clowns. Anyone in the US who has a inkling of what's going on, sure as hell wouldn't be getting their talking points from either the Republican Party or Faux News.

To the both of you, go out join the Teabaggers or the Repukes, I don't care which one you decide to join, but I willl say this to you both, have you ever thought in your lives, "there but for the grace of God, go I?"

My personal opinion of the Pukes and Teabaggers is this: "I got mine, so fcuk you." Selfishness and greed have overtaken some people in the USA. Most of the Teabaggers are old, white people who survive on Medicare (which by the way is a single-payer health system) and Social Security payments and their private pensions.(If they stilll have a retirement accout to fall back on; many people lost a awful lot of money when the market crashed in 2008). The rest of them are uneducated and ignorant cretins, who for the most part, are racists. Take a look at the spelling of some of the posters at their protests. They might speak a form of English but some of them sure can't spell for shite.

I don't understand why anyone who works for liiving, i.e. the building trades, laborers, etc. would even think about voting for a Repuke. As my late father always said "it's like the chickens voting for Colonel Sanders."

I have an opinion of these two fools on this board and believe me it's neither nice or politically correct. Listen guys, if you want to have any credibility with me, don't populate a thread with talking points that come straight from Faux News or from the latest e-mail from the RNC.

Mrs. redandblack4ever

Great discussion piece- thanks...

But Im not sure that your credibility is what anyone is seeking and that post probably not going to entice anyone into 'fair and balanced"discussion

[Tyrones own]

Got this email this morning and thought I'd share it;
                                                                      Divorce agreement

            Dear American liberals, leftists, social progressives, socialists, Marxists and Obama supporters, et al:

            We have stuck together since the late 1950's or the sake of the kids, but the whole of this latest election process has made me realize that I want a divorce.... I know we tolerated each other for many years for the sake of future generations, but sadly, this relationship has clearly run its course.

            Our two ideological sides of America cannot and will not ever agree on what is right for us all, so let's just end it on friendly terms. We can smile and chalk it up to irreconcilable differences and go our own way.

            Here is a model separation agreement:

            Our two groups can equitably divide up the country by landmass each taking a similar portion. That will be the difficult part, but I am sure our two sides can come to a friendly agreement. After that, it should be relatively easy! Our respective representatives can effortlessly divide other assets since both sides have such distinct and disparate tastes.

            We don't like redistributive taxes so you can keep them. You are welcome to the liberal judges and the ACLU. Since you hate guns and war, we'll take our firearms, the cops, the NRA and the military.  We'll take the nasty, smelly oil industry and you can go with wind, solar and biodiesel.  You can keep Oprah, Michael Moore and Rosie O'Donnell (You are, however, responsible for finding a bio-diesel vehicle big enough to move all three of them).

            We'll keep capitalism, greedy corporations, pharmaceutical companies, Wal-Mart and Wall Street. You can have your beloved lifelong welfare dwellers, food stamps, homeless, homeboys, hippies, druggies and illegal aliens. We'll keep the hot Alaskan hockey moms, greedy CEO's and rednecks. We'll keep the Bibles and give you NBC and Hollywood .

            You can make nice with Iran and Palestine and we'll retain the right to invade and hammer places that threaten us. You can have the peaceniks and war protesters. When our allies or our way of life are under assault, we'll help provide them security.

            We'll keep our Judeo-Christian values.. You are welcome to Islam, Scientology, Humanism, political correctness and Shirley McClain. You can also have the U.N.. but we will no longer be paying the bill.

            We'll keep the SUV's, pickup trucks and oversized luxury cars. You can take every Subaru station wagon you can find.

            You can give everyone healthcare if you can find any practicing doctors.  We'll keep The Battle Hymn of the Republic and the National Anthem. I'm sure you'll be happy to substitute Imagine, I'd Like to Teach the World to Sing, Kum Ba Ya or We Are the World.

            We'll practice trickle down economics and you can continue to give trickle up poverty your best shot.

     

        Since it often so offends you, we'll keep our history, our name and our flag. 

        Would you agree to this?  If so, please pass it along to other like minded liberal and conservative patriots and if you do not agree, just hit delete. In the spirit of friendly parting, I'll bet you Answer which one of us will need whose help in 15 years.

        Sincerely,
        John J. Wall
        Law Student and an American

        P. S. Also, please take Ted Turner, Sean Penn, Martin Sheen, Barbara Streisand, & Jane Fonda with you.

        P. S. S.  And you won't have to press 1 for English when you call our country.

[Hedley Lamarr]

The Israeli Army's plan to deport tens of thousands of Palestinians from the West Bank is both inhuman and illegal.

It is also highly provocative and could reignite the intifada. This, of course, would suit the Netanyahu government very well, since once more, even the indirect peace talks with the Palestinians would be back on hold and Israel could protest yet again that its security was threatened by "terrorist violence."

How much longer is the international community going to sit by and allow the illegal occupation of Palestinian lands, the economic blockade of Gaza and the subjugation of the already wretched Palestinian population? This latest enormity by the Israeli authorities involves a deft adjustment to an existing military order drawn up in 1969 which empowers the army to expel what it is pleased to call "infiltrators."

A new definition of "infiltrator" will embrace anyone living in the West Bank who has not been issued with a permit by the Israeli authorities.

Potentially tens of thousands of Palestinians could fall victim to this sly maneuver, splitting families and further disrupting what passes for economic life in the occupied West Bank.

Introducing a layer of judicial oversight to the deportation process is merely a smoke screen to cover the blatant illegality of the whole procedure. The military is already empowered to throw a Palestinian out of Palestine within 72 hours, hardly time enough to mount a proper legal appeal.

Saeb Erekat, the chief Palestinian negotiator, is entirely right when he drew the comparison with the apartheid regime in white-run South Africa. There if a person did not have the necessary passbook, he/she was expelled even from their ancestral lands. Even though Israel had extensive clandestine relations, particularly military, with the white South African regime, it publicly condemned the enormity of apartheid. Now it is embracing it with open arms.

This latest contemptible move is unlikely to play well in the Obama White House. It may indeed be a signal that relations between the president and Netanyahu are even more strained than was at first appreciated. Washington simply has to take a stand on this. Whatever Israel's security concerns, there can be no grounds for what is little short of ethnic cleansing. Obama needs to understand that Israel simply does not want peace, because ever since its creation in 1948, this state has survived on a war footing.

Zionists around the world pour money into Israel so it can maintain what it calls its defensive posture. American aid and technology underpin a relatively small and fragile economy. Lasting peace based on a just settlement for the Palestinians, therefore, holds unknown risks for the Israelis. They understand aggression. They do not understand peace.

So once again, an Israeli government is poking the Palestinian beehive, hoping for an angry swarm to react, which it can then swat with its vastly greater firepower.

But maybe this time they have gone too far. How can it ever be said that Palestinians have entered their own land illegally? The real illegal infiltrators in the West Bank are actually the Israelis.

[give her dixie]

Hedley, this new law is just something else. One more piece of evidence to show just how Israhell have turned into an Apartheid state.
Where are they going to deport the Palestinians to? Or maybe they will just shoot them, like they have been doing for years anyway? Deport native Palestinians, and at the same time allow over 500,000 illegal settlers, mainly young Jewish US citizens, to live in the West Bank?

But hey, as long as there are stupid US senators and congressmen, (and eejits like to), Israhell will have an endless supply of weapons, cash, aircraft, bombs and bullets to slaughter and ethnicially cleanse Palestinians and steal more of their land.

Plus, this week, Wikileaks are to release another video showing US troops slaughter 87 innocent Afghans. Wonder what sort of deluded immature response the US and to will come out with to justify it?

Oh, the land of the free and the home of the brave........ US troops, very brave individuals indeed.....
The world sure is a safer place when they are in control. Lets see how brave they are if they attemp another illegal war in Iran?

[give her dixie]

A Sign of Empire Pathology

More US military personnel have taken their OWN lives than have died in action

Here is a shocking statistic that you won't hear in most western news media: over the past nine years, more US military personnel have taken their own lives than have died in action in either the wars in Iraq or Afghanistan. These are official figures from the US Department of Defence, yet somehow they have not been deemed newsworthy to report. Last year alone, more than 330 serving members of the US armed forces committed suicide - more than the 320 killed in Afghanistan and the 150 who fell in Iraq (see wsws.org).



Since 2001, when Washington launched its so-called war on terror, there has been a dramatic year-on-year increase in US military suicides, particularly in the army, which has borne the brunt of fighting abroad. Last year saw the highest total number since such records began in 1980. Prior to 2001, the suicide rate in the US military was lower than that for the general US population; now, it is nearly double the national average.



A growing number of these victims have been deployed in Iraq or Afghanistan. What these figures should tell us is that there is something fundamentally deranged about Washington's "war on terror" - which is probably why western news media prefer to ignore the issue. How damning is it about such military campaigns that the number of US soldiers who take their own lives outnumber those killed by enemy combatants.



What is even more disturbing is that the official figures only count victims of suicide among serving personnel. Not included are the many more veterans - officially classed a civilians - who take their own lives.



Most likely, these deaths are reported in some small-town newspaper in "a brief" news item with no context or background as to what drove these individuals to take their own lives. It is estimated that the suicide rate among veterans demobbed from fighting in Afghanistan and Iraq is as high as four times the national average. The US Department of Veteran Affairs calculates that over 6,000 former service personnel commit suicide every year.



Many of these men have come home to a country they have fought for only to find no jobs, their homes repossessed by banks that have enjoyed trillion-dollar bailouts and broken relationships.



Meanwhile, President Obama - the erstwhile peace candidate - has taken on the role of Commander in Chief with gusto, telling his countrymen and women that they are fighting a "just war" to "defend American lives". Only a year ago, he was campaigning for the presidency on a ticket to end such wars. Now, more than his predecessor, George W Bush, Obama is committing to wars without end. How soul-destroying is that for a grunt holed up in a bunker, with his young family back home probably telling him that they have just signed up for food stamps? In their guts, these US soldiers must know - as many other ordinary people around the world do - that these wars are nothing but a desperate, pathological bid by a dying power to salvage its crumbling empire - an empire that enriches a tiny elite and impoverishes the majority. Is it any wonder that many of them simply lose the will to live?

[Declan]

Bush, Cheney, and Rumsfeld Knew They Were Innocent
by Andrew Sullivan
The inmates at Gitmo were routinely referred to as "the worst of the worst." Rumsfeld, Bush and Cheney all knowingly pushed this lie. And it was a lie - because they all knew that the chaotic way in which these terror suspects had been captured had left such esoteric questions as innocence or guilt by the wayside.

In a March 24 legal declaration in the Hamdi case, a first-hand eye-witness to the Bush-Cheney administration's contempt for due process and embrace of torture, stated under oath what he saw on the inside. The statement - widely covered across the world - was largely ignored by the US Mainstream Media.

But it's devastating to have a former high Bush-Cheney official state under oath that the last administration knew it had countless innocent prisoners, lied about it, and tortured many. Lawrence Wilkerson, former secretary of state Colin Powell's chief of staff, is the man putting the record straight. Money quote:

In fact, by late August 2002, I found that of the initial 742 detainees that had arrived at Guantánamo, the majority of them had never seen a U.S. soldier in the process of their initial detention and their captivity had not been subjected to any meaningful review. A separate but related problem was that often absolutely no evidence relating to the detainee was turned over, so there was no real method of knowing why the prisoner had been detained in the first place.   Secretary Powell was also trying to bring pressure to bear regarding a number of specific detentions because children as young as 12 and 13 and elderly as old as 92 or 93 had been shipped to Guantánamo...

During the morning briefings, Ambassador at-Large for War Crimes, Pierre Prosper, who was a primary person working on negotiating transfers, would discuss the difficulty he encountered in dealing with the Department of Defense, and specifically Secretary of Defense Rumsfeld, who just refused to let detainees go.

I came to understand that there were several different reasons for the refusal to release detainees in Guantánamo, even those who were likely innocent. These reasons continued to the time of my departure from the Department of State in 2005. At least part of the problem was that it was politically impossible to release them. The concern expressed was that if they were released to another country, even an ally such as the United Kingdom, the leadership of the Defense Department would be left without any plausible explanation to the American people, whether the released detainee was subsequently found to be innocent by the receiving country, or whether the detainee was truly a terrorist and, upon release were it to then occur, would return to the war against the U.S.

Another concern was that the detention efforts at Guantánamo would be revealed as the incredibly confused operation that they were.   Such results were not acceptable to the Administration and would have been severely detrimental to the leadership at DOD.

Another part of the political dilemma originated in the Office of Vice President Richard B. Cheney, whose position could be summed up as "the end justifies the means", and who had absolutely no concern that the vast majority of Guantánamo detainees were innocent, or that there was a lack of any useable evidence for the great majority of them. If hundreds of innocent individuals had to suffer in order to detain a handful of hardcore terrorists, so be it.   That seemed to be the philosophy that ruled in the Vice President's Office.

I discussed the issue of the Guantánamo detainees with Secretary Powell. From these discussions, I learned that it was his view that it was not just Vice President Cheney and Secretary Rumsfeld, but also President Bush who was involved in all of the Guantánamo decision making. My own view is that it was easy for Vice President Cheney to run circles around President Bush bureaucratically because Cheney had the network within the government to do so. Moreover, by exploiting what Secretary Powell called the President's "cowboy instincts," Vice President Cheney could more often than not gain the President's acquiescence.

Lie after lie after lie. And the illegal imprisonment and torture of individuals often completely unrelated to terrorism at all. And no accountability. This was America for almost eight years. And Obama has perpetuated the avoidance of responsibility with staggering diligence.

[give her dixie]

A couple of must see video's exposing what Israhell/US troops get up to in Palestine.
This is what US taxpayers fund and support.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tW1-_JmXQt0&feature=player_embedded#

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fm_btvBgZLE

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RT1AuJf4ZJ0