The OFFICIAL Liverpool FC thread - #DankeJürgen

[deiseach]

Key point is Irish Catholic
Liverpool had bundles and bundles of catholics playing with them long before Whelan arrived, lots of them 2nd/3rd generation Irish. They just didnt have many Irish playing with them. Heighway mustn't have been Catholic if the stat is true.

If the excellent LFCHistory.net is to be believed, only seventeen Free-State/Republic of Ireland internationals have ever played for Liverpool, and that includes the likes of Ken De Mange. Reading through the names on there, it's possible that there were no Catholics until Whelan. The only one I'd wonder about would be Bill Lacey, who seems to have guested for Linfield but declared for the Free State and played for Everton as well. Obviously very confused.

[heganboy]

it's possible that there were no Catholics until Whelan.  Obviously very confused.

I thought we were trying to keep this kind of nonsense on Poor wee Rory's thread (because apparently he deserves it...)

[J OGorman]

it's possible that there were no Catholics until Whelan.  Obviously very confused.

I thought we were trying to keep this kind of nonsense on Poor wee Rory's thread (because apparently he deserves it...)

exactly. in 4 years living in England, I never met one english man / woman who gave two hoots about religion.

[Hound]

Key point is Irish Catholic
Liverpool had bundles and bundles of catholics playing with them long before Whelan arrived, lots of them 2nd/3rd generation Irish. They just didnt have many Irish playing with them. Heighway mustn't have been Catholic if the stat is true.

If the excellent LFCHistory.net is to be believed, only seventeen Free-State/Republic of Ireland internationals have ever played for Liverpool, and that includes the likes of Ken De Mange. Reading through the names on there, it's possible that there were no Catholics until Whelan. The only one I'd wonder about would be Bill Lacey, who seems to have guested for Linfield but declared for the Free State and played for Everton as well. Obviously very confused.

Yeah, but "No Catholics until Whelan" is complete nonsense when you consider that there were plenty of English catholics playing for them before that.

Saying LFC had no Irish Catholics playing with them for a long number of years is as just as meaningless as saying they had no French protestants playing with them for 100 years.

[deiseach]

Yeah, but "No Catholics until Whelan" is complete nonsense when you consider that there were plenty of English catholics playing for them before that.

Saying LFC had no Irish Catholics playing with them for a long number of years is as just as meaningless as saying they had no French protestants playing with them for 100 years.

I know, I know. I still find it interesting. There was a market for players to make a career out of playing in Ireland once. Our obsession with English soccer teams is a very recent phenomenon.

[screenexile]

Borini out for 3 months . . . Come back Andy Carroll all is forgiven!!!

[spuds]

Torres re-emerging into the light


SID LOWE says a recent frank interview the Spaniard gave hints at the emotional journey he has undertaken

FERNANDO TORRES has admitted he became exactly the kind of player he had always despised when he reached a point where he did not care if Chelsea won or lost. The Spain striker says he has refound himself since the dark days of last season and has learned to become a different player in order to serve the team above himself. He has also insisted that he has no regrets about joining Liverpool but admits that the way he left Anfield was "not the best".

"Halfway through last season, I distanced myself from the values I had grown up with," Torres told El Pais. Catharsis and confession come together in a remarkable interview with the paper's reporter Lu Martin, which reveals the Spaniard's self-awareness and hints at the emotional journey that Torres has undertaken.

"I had team-mates who didn't care if the team won or lost because they were not playing," Torres said. "I never wanted to be like that. [But] one day I discovered that I was like them, that it didn't matter if we won or lost if I was not playing. I wasn't part of the group. I discovered I was not happy because I had stopped being what I had always wanted to be. In the dressing room, you can never lose that group concept.

"But I learned to look at myself and to realise that the only person that can change is you. The only person who can say: 'You're making mistakes, you've got to do something' is you."

Torres added that he found that his game changed under Andre Villas-Boas and that contributed to his frustration but that with time he found satisfaction in a more selfless role.

"I became a different player because I was serving the team," he said. "It was to my personal detriment but it was the only way to play. At times I thought: 'I'm going to run in behind the defender, I'm going to offer myself and go into the space.'

"And I could go 70 minutes without touching the ball. If I played in my [natural] position, I wasn't involved in the game. What do I do? It was so different to what I was used to with [Rafa] Benitez that I was not happy and you could tell.

"When we changed coach [and Roberto Di Matteo took over] it was a bit more similar [to Benitez's style]. That had a good side to it, which was that I learned: I became a better player.

"I can now do things that I was not able to before. You can be the player that your coach wants but you're not the player that people expect you to be. I spoke to Steve Holland, the [Chelsea] assistant, a lot and we worked hard on it."

"I became more mature, I came to know myself better and became conscious of the fact that it depends on me. I learnt to be more self-critical, to understand everyone better and to accept the situation.

"I learnt that if we won it didn't matter that I hadn't played. I had to keep working. You can settle into a comfort zone or you can accept your role and Paulo Ferreira taught me to say to myself: 'This is the situation now.' He always trains as hard as anyone, he always has a smile, he is always close to the young players. He has taught me a lot.

"When I retire the only thing that concerns me is that no one can say that I was a bad team-mate or disrespectful or self-important."

Asked if he would go to England again if he could turn back the clock, Torres replied: "Definitely. Not just because of the professional experience but the personal one too. You start to see things in a different way, your perspective gets opened up."

"I owe Liverpool a huge amount," he said. "To the people, to the men in charge, to Benitez and his staff, to the city. Liverpool is a fundamental part of my life. They don't remember me that way, but time will change that.

"I could not have chosen a better place to go when I left Atletico. The other day when the news broke about Hillsborough, I felt emotional. I have experienced that, I know what the people have been through, I have seen them cry. I've lived that, I made it mine. This has arrived too late but it's another step. And it is things like that that playing for Liverpool gives you: it's a feeling.

"I decided to leave because I had to take a step forwards. It wasn't the best way to have gone but nor were things exactly as they were sold [to people]. One day the truth will come out. In a sporting sense, nothing was happening; a new project was needed. We talked about that - about growth. My son is a Liverpool fan and he was already kicking a ball before he was one. He was born in the football city; he had no choice."

© 2012 Guardian Service





http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/sport/2012/1018/1224325412342.html

[stew]

Torres re-emerging into the light


SID LOWE says a recent frank interview the Spaniard gave hints at the emotional journey he has undertaken

FERNANDO TORRES has admitted he became exactly the kind of player he had always despised when he reached a point where he did not care if Chelsea won or lost. The Spain striker says he has refound himself since the dark days of last season and has learned to become a different player in order to serve the team above himself. He has also insisted that he has no regrets about joining Liverpool but admits that the way he left Anfield was "not the best".

"Halfway through last season, I distanced myself from the values I had grown up with," Torres told El Pais. Catharsis and confession come together in a remarkable interview with the paper's reporter Lu Martin, which reveals the Spaniard's self-awareness and hints at the emotional journey that Torres has undertaken.

"I had team-mates who didn't care if the team won or lost because they were not playing," Torres said. "I never wanted to be like that. [But] one day I discovered that I was like them, that it didn't matter if we won or lost if I was not playing. I wasn't part of the group. I discovered I was not happy because I had stopped being what I had always wanted to be. In the dressing room, you can never lose that group concept.

"But I learned to look at myself and to realise that the only person that can change is you. The only person who can say: 'You're making mistakes, you've got to do something' is you."

Torres added that he found that his game changed under Andre Villas-Boas and that contributed to his frustration but that with time he found satisfaction in a more selfless role.

"I became a different player because I was serving the team," he said. "It was to my personal detriment but it was the only way to play. At times I thought: 'I'm going to run in behind the defender, I'm going to offer myself and go into the space.'

"And I could go 70 minutes without touching the ball. If I played in my [natural] position, I wasn't involved in the game. What do I do? It was so different to what I was used to with [Rafa] Benitez that I was not happy and you could tell.

"When we changed coach [and Roberto Di Matteo took over] it was a bit more similar [to Benitez's style]. That had a good side to it, which was that I learned: I became a better player.

"I can now do things that I was not able to before. You can be the player that your coach wants but you're not the player that people expect you to be. I spoke to Steve Holland, the [Chelsea] assistant, a lot and we worked hard on it."

"I became more mature, I came to know myself better and became conscious of the fact that it depends on me. I learnt to be more self-critical, to understand everyone better and to accept the situation.

"I learnt that if we won it didn't matter that I hadn't played. I had to keep working. You can settle into a comfort zone or you can accept your role and Paulo Ferreira taught me to say to myself: 'This is the situation now.' He always trains as hard as anyone, he always has a smile, he is always close to the young players. He has taught me a lot.

"When I retire the only thing that concerns me is that no one can say that I was a bad team-mate or disrespectful or self-important."

Asked if he would go to England again if he could turn back the clock, Torres replied: "Definitely. Not just because of the professional experience but the personal one too. You start to see things in a different way, your perspective gets opened up."

"I owe Liverpool a huge amount," he said. "To the people, to the men in charge, to Benitez and his staff, to the city. Liverpool is a fundamental part of my life. They don't remember me that way, but time will change that.

"I could not have chosen a better place to go when I left Atletico. The other day when the news broke about Hillsborough, I felt emotional. I have experienced that, I know what the people have been through, I have seen them cry. I've lived that, I made it mine. This has arrived too late but it's another step. And it is things like that that playing for Liverpool gives you: it's a feeling.

"I decided to leave because I had to take a step forwards. It wasn't the best way to have gone but nor were things exactly as they were sold [to people]. One day the truth will come out. In a sporting sense, nothing was happening; a new project was needed. We talked about that - about growth. My son is a Liverpool fan and he was already kicking a ball before he was one. He was born in the football city; he had no choice."

© 2012 Guardian Service





http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/sport/2012/1018/1224325412342.html

Good interview that, hopefully Liverpool fans can move on and wish him well.

[spuds]

It sounds like he went through a more serious crises in his sporting life that I guessed, seems to be getting out the far side of it now but I suspect will never be the player he was. Will be interesting to hear the truth of his departure from Anfield that he mentions.
Thought came to me from reading that article that he was softening his way towards a return but most unlikely, he'll always be a red in my book ahead of Mickey Own.

[ludermor]

Key point is Irish Catholic
Liverpool had bundles and bundles of catholics playing with them long before Whelan arrived, lots of them 2nd/3rd generation Irish. They just didnt have many Irish playing with them. Heighway mustn't have been Catholic if the stat is true.

If the excellent LFCHistory.net is to be believed, only seventeen Free-State/Republic of Ireland internationals have ever played for Liverpool, and that includes the likes of Ken De Mange. Reading through the names on there, it's possible that there were no Catholics until Whelan. The only one I'd wonder about would be Bill Lacey, who seems to have guested for Linfield but declared for the Free State and played for Everton as well. Obviously very confused.

this subject was on Politics.ie http://www.politics.ie/forum/culture-community/155305-liverpool-irish-football-6.html
"I was delighted to play for Ireland as although my parents were actually English, I was born in Dublin and grew up there until I was ten, so I had that association with the country that I didn't have with England. I had played at underage level for Ireland on the international scene already but had also represented England in School's football but Ireland was the team that I had decided to play for, and I never had to give it anymore thought after that."
Considering the strong irish links to the liverpool team of the 80's and 90's it hard to imagine no irish players before 1970.

This site has list of irish players who have played for some of the bigger clubs. That great Irish club Celtic only had 5 irish players in the 41 years from 1937 to 1978 , when Pakie Bonner signed. http://www.soccer-ireland.com/glasgow-celtic/irish-players/index.htm

[Minus15]

http://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/news/el-hadji-diouf-says-liverpool-players-1387022

Diouf is some boy

[supersub]

That has to be a wind up.

On the verge of leaving the club only to do a U turn at the last minute - yes Diouf Steven doesn't give a f**k!

[superblues]

That has to be a wind up.

On the verge of leaving the club only to do a U turn at the last minute - yes Diouf Steven doesn't give a f**k!

so thats means he does give a f**k

[laoislad]

http://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/news/el-hadji-diouf-says-liverpool-players-1387022

Diouf is some boy

The sewer rat is at the right club now that suits him in Leeds United.

[superblues]

suited liverpool for a good while