Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification

[on the sideline]

What happened with Rafferty  saving the  shot late on?

Defender then  passed it back to him in the square,  but play was stopped.  Armagh got a  Free.

What was that about?

Didn't see the incident myself but keepers can receive a pass in their own square, if the player passing the ball is also in the square

Rafferty seemed to be doing serious giving off about it at the time not sure what was going on.

Ref initially pointed for a free in and then changed his decision. Looked like someone told him he got the rule wrong.

If that is what happened though should it have not been a hop ball even though that would have been unfair on Armagh.

Mind you winning the free was a big disadvantage anyway.

Ref made three mistakes, there was no foul, clearly collected pass inside square, blew whistle for foul, realised he made mistake, good, but having blown for the foul and discussed reason he can't just change it,  different if he puts arm up for free going different direction and changes straight away, the actual rules don't allow that. And thirdly after making a balls up gives Armagh a free out when there was no free in first place, hop ball on 14 was the best case scenario but he even got that wrong.

Now bring yourself to the club games when no one is 'helping' the ref, going to be carnage

Is that right?  In the Armagh v Down Ulster Semi last year the referee awarded Armagh a free then got talked out of it and changed his mind and decided to award an earlier free.

Once the referee has given a decision and has sounded his whistle to restart play, he shall not alter that decision. This looked like that?

Last year there looked like a foul on a Down player but the referee didn't give the play continued for several seconds and an Armagh player (Murnin I think) was fouled.  The referee awarded the free kick before Armagh could take it Sean Hurson who was the linesman called the referee over and the referee awarded a free kick to Down.  It was widely assumed at the time it was for the original foul the referee had decided was not a foul. I can't remember anyone at the time suggesting it was against the rules although it might have been said I just don't remember.

Last night looked similar in that the referee clearly blew his whistle and awarded a free in only to stop a few seconds later then change his mind and award a free out (although I couldn't see any reason why a free out should have been awarded)

Haven't seen the incident, but did the player who passed it to Rafferty win possession inside the penalty box and if so did he pass directly to Rafferty? If so all is fine.

He can't carry it in and then pass to the keeper or win it inside the box, give it to someone else who then gives it to gk, he must do it himself directly.

Won it directly from a high ball

Both players inside the small square which is allowed

Just watching it again there.  Rafferty makes a save and knocks it down to the defender who catches it and passes it back to Rafferty.  Both players in the small square.

The ref awards a free in.  The Armagh players protest and the ref runs in seems to explain he got it wrong and changes the free.  Aidan O'Shea then intercepts the pass back to the keeper for the free and throws the ball on the ground near Rafferty i.e. he doesn't hand it to Rafferty nor the defender beside him but the free isn't moved.

Seems like a series of errors

From what we were told on Monday that can't get passed back to Rafferty. We were told it can only be passed to the goalkeeper if the defender wins/intercepts the ball inside the penalty box, directly from the opposition. So if it came off Rafferty to the defender then the defender didn't win it directly from the opposition, and therefore he can't pass to the goalkeeper. We put the referee's over this several times.

These rules just make things unnecessarily complicated.

For the amount of times that's going to happen in a game will be once or twice at most.. told that the only time the keeper can take a pass is inside the small square, there was no add ons to that when initially explained

The problems you're having is listening to one ref or a couple

I've been to couple workshops and online stuff, from those that were involved in setting up the rules.

When some of these questions are asked it's never totally definitive

And that's the massive problem. It should be definitive.

I thought from the initial explanation it was only in the small square this could happen, so when it was explained that it was in the penalty area I asked two of the inter county referees present and they said it was definitely inside the penalty area.

Mad, inside the small square was or how I've approached it.

Also can the keeper collect a 'loose' ball, when can it be deemed a 'pass'  inside his own half? The keeper thing for me is or will cause hassle

Not from his own man. Just from the opposition.

[David McKeown]

What happened with Rafferty  saving the  shot late on?

Defender then  passed it back to him in the square,  but play was stopped.  Armagh got a  Free.

What was that about?

Didn't see the incident myself but keepers can receive a pass in their own square, if the player passing the ball is also in the square

Rafferty seemed to be doing serious giving off about it at the time not sure what was going on.

Ref initially pointed for a free in and then changed his decision. Looked like someone told him he got the rule wrong.

If that is what happened though should it have not been a hop ball even though that would have been unfair on Armagh.

Mind you winning the free was a big disadvantage anyway.

Ref made three mistakes, there was no foul, clearly collected pass inside square, blew whistle for foul, realised he made mistake, good, but having blown for the foul and discussed reason he can't just change it,  different if he puts arm up for free going different direction and changes straight away, the actual rules don't allow that. And thirdly after making a balls up gives Armagh a free out when there was no free in first place, hop ball on 14 was the best case scenario but he even got that wrong.

Now bring yourself to the club games when no one is 'helping' the ref, going to be carnage

Is that right?  In the Armagh v Down Ulster Semi last year the referee awarded Armagh a free then got talked out of it and changed his mind and decided to award an earlier free.

Once the referee has given a decision and has sounded his whistle to restart play, he shall not alter that decision. This looked like that?

Last year there looked like a foul on a Down player but the referee didn't give the play continued for several seconds and an Armagh player (Murnin I think) was fouled.  The referee awarded the free kick before Armagh could take it Sean Hurson who was the linesman called the referee over and the referee awarded a free kick to Down.  It was widely assumed at the time it was for the original foul the referee had decided was not a foul. I can't remember anyone at the time suggesting it was against the rules although it might have been said I just don't remember.

Last night looked similar in that the referee clearly blew his whistle and awarded a free in only to stop a few seconds later then change his mind and award a free out (although I couldn't see any reason why a free out should have been awarded)

Haven't seen the incident, but did the player who passed it to Rafferty win possession inside the penalty box and if so did he pass directly to Rafferty? If so all is fine.

He can't carry it in and then pass to the keeper or win it inside the box, give it to someone else who then gives it to gk, he must do it himself directly.

Won it directly from a high ball

Both players inside the small square which is allowed

Just watching it again there.  Rafferty makes a save and knocks it down to the defender who catches it and passes it back to Rafferty.  Both players in the small square.

The ref awards a free in.  The Armagh players protest and the ref runs in seems to explain he got it wrong and changes the free.  Aidan O'Shea then intercepts the pass back to the keeper for the free and throws the ball on the ground near Rafferty i.e. he doesn't hand it to Rafferty nor the defender beside him but the free isn't moved.

Seems like a series of errors

From what we were told on Monday that can't get passed back to Rafferty. We were told it can only be passed to the goalkeeper if the defender wins/intercepts the ball inside the penalty box, directly from the opposition. So if it came off Rafferty to the defender then the defender didn't win it directly from the opposition, and therefore he can't pass to the goalkeeper. We put the referee's over this several times.

These rules just make things unnecessarily complicated.

For the amount of times that's going to happen in a game will be once or twice at most.. told that the only time the keeper can take a pass is inside the small square, there was no add ons to that when initially explained

The problems you're having is listening to one ref or a couple

I've been to couple workshops and online stuff, from those that were involved in setting up the rules.

When some of these questions are asked it's never totally definitive

And that's the massive problem. It should be definitive.

I thought from the initial explanation it was only in the small square this could happen, so when it was explained that it was in the penalty area I asked two of the inter county referees present and they said it was definitely inside the penalty area.

Mad, inside the small square was or how I've approached it.

Also can the keeper collect a 'loose' ball, when can it be deemed a 'pass'  inside his own half? The keeper thing for me is or will cause hassle

Not from his own man. Just from the opposition.

Collecting a ball from the opposition wouldn't need a rule clarification surely. I thought it was a loose ball if it was lost be that by a wayward pass or a tackle or whatever.

I keep going back to. Are these rules published anywhere or do we just get given a general gist and we make it up as we go along?

[Milltown Row2]

Yes I highlighted loose for a reason

A ball could be played back into 'traffic' keeper comes out with the ball and was the ball played to the defender?

The cries from players/managers/supporters would be deadly

There's a rule book and amendments but I've only done a few games and I'm thinking or doubting things all the time

[David McKeown]

I'm really quite amazed at the number of people on Twitter who would seem to prefer watching 70 mins of own-half possession football as a windy day spectacle, over the stack them up, chase them down approach seen under the new rules.

Now I've got to thinking that most people are unable  to remember much of anything past a few months ago. This is by far the most logical explanation for this bizarre behaviour.

I prefer it because there is little to no excitement to it. Games are potentially exciting for about three minutes. They don't ebb and flow like they used to.

Honestly David I just don't understand this take. Games didn't ebb and flow for almost a decade there. It was 60 minutes of possession nonsense and if we were lucky we got a good last 10.

The first half of last year's AI final is the prime example of why the rules had to change. Boredom personified. No ebb, no flow. Just boredom. 

Similarly I don't understand your take either. I will always be biased about the All Ireland final (and the entirety of last years championship in general) but I thought criticism of it was well overblown. It may not have had goal mouth chances galore but it had plenty of ebb and flow and drama. A tight game that was always on a knife edge.

So far this year I'm struggling to remember a game that was tight. Games are more like offence v defence training sessions back to back. The weather may have a lot to do with that but I find long periods of matches now very boring as one team enjoys their period to attack.

I find the rules infuriating where minor infractions are unjustifiably punished (3 v 3) and 50m advancement for shooting as a whistle is blown for example. Yet major infractions like black and red cards are negated. The new rules now even reward foul play when teams can pressure opposition frees in the opposition half. Add to that two different advantage rules the one played when there has been a foul much less advantageous that the one played when a catch is made.

Even if the rules did need changed after last year it was tweaks that were needed not the wholesale changes that have come and don't seem to have been thought through properly.

I feel like clever innovative play is no longer rewarded and there is a drive towards the homogenisation of tactics.

I think we are going backwards. I'm old enough to remember goal kicks being from the edge of the small square. We changed that rule because we thought it punished teams further after conceding now we are returning to punishing the conceding team again by forcing kick outs to congested middle areas where the opposition can have an extra player.

I think the new rules denigrate skills as well with 50's worth half of what an easier free much closer to goal is worth. One on one defending now considered less important than a simple catch etc. Even goals are less rewarding under the new rules. 2 goals being worth the same as 3 points from 40 odd out.

So yes for me the game is not better than last year.

All that said. We are 4 matches into the league I'm prepared to give the new rules more time. I fear we will see them exploited more as managers etc have more real world data to analyse but I will wait and see.

I should also add that I've always enjoyed a great tactical battle, two of my favourite games I've ever watched as a neutral were Dublin v Donegal in 2014 when I remember Dublin players looking over to their sideline for help because they couldn't cope with the tactics Donegal were employing and the 2011 all Ireland final when I had the pleasure of sitting beside a coach who had won all Irelands at multiple levels and who was able to analyse the match at unbelievable level. So that may flavour my view on the whole issue.

[David McKeown]

Yes I highlighted loose for a reason

A ball could be played back into 'traffic' keeper comes out with the ball and was the ball played to the defender?

The cries from players/managers/supporters would be deadly

There's a rule book and amendments but I've only done a few games and I'm thinking or doubting things all the time

Are the rules published anywhere as I haven't seen them as yet.

[Ball Hopper]

Yes I highlighted loose for a reason

A ball could be played back into 'traffic' keeper comes out with the ball and was the ball played to the defender?

The cries from players/managers/supporters would be deadly

There's a rule book and amendments but I've only done a few games and I'm thinking or doubting things all the time

Are the rules published anywhere as I haven't seen them as yet.

Have you looked on gaa.ie at the very bottom of the home page is a set of headings, and under "The GAA" is a link called "Rules and Regulations".  Click on that link and you will see a bunch of stuff...I believe you might be most interested in a link near the bottom of the page "GAA Official Guide Part 2 (31.01.25)" and clicking on that will bring you to the pdf file.  I'll leave you figure out how to read the table of contents and get to the playing rules of football...but you will notice the recent changes/additions are in red print.

Now I'll ask you a question...how hard did you look for the rules?

[Saffron_sam20]

I'm really quite amazed at the number of people on Twitter who would seem to prefer watching 70 mins of own-half possession football as a windy day spectacle, over the stack them up, chase them down approach seen under the new rules.

Now I've got to thinking that most people are unable  to remember much of anything past a few months ago. This is by far the most logical explanation for this bizarre behaviour.

I prefer it because there is little to no excitement to it. Games are potentially exciting for about three minutes. They don't ebb and flow like they used to.

Honestly David I just don't understand this take. Games didn't ebb and flow for almost a decade there. It was 60 minutes of possession nonsense and if we were lucky we got a good last 10.

The first half of last year's AI final is the prime example of why the rules had to change. Boredom personified. No ebb, no flow. Just boredom. 

Similarly I don't understand your take either. I will always be biased about the All Ireland final (and the entirety of last years championship in general) but I thought criticism of it was well overblown. It may not have had goal mouth chances galore but it had plenty of ebb and flow and drama. A tight game that was always on a knife edge.

So far this year I'm struggling to remember a game that was tight. Games are more like offence v defence training sessions back to back. The weather may have a lot to do with that but I find long periods of matches now very boring as one team enjoys their period to attack.

I find the rules infuriating where minor infractions are unjustifiably punished (3 v 3) and 50m advancement for shooting as a whistle is blown for example. Yet major infractions like black and red cards are negated. The new rules now even reward foul play when teams can pressure opposition frees in the opposition half. Add to that two different advantage rules the one played when there has been a foul much less advantageous that the one played when a catch is made.

Even if the rules did need changed after last year it was tweaks that were needed not the wholesale changes that have come and don't seem to have been thought through properly.

I feel like clever innovative play is no longer rewarded and there is a drive towards the homogenisation of tactics.

I think we are going backwards. I'm old enough to remember goal kicks being from the edge of the small square. We changed that rule because we thought it punished teams further after conceding now we are returning to punishing the conceding team again by forcing kick outs to congested middle areas where the opposition can have an extra player.

I think the new rules denigrate skills as well with 50's worth half of what an easier free much closer to goal is worth. One on one defending now considered less important than a simple catch etc. Even goals are less rewarding under the new rules. 2 goals being worth the same as 3 points from 40 odd out.

So yes for me the game is not better than last year.

All that said. We are 4 matches into the league I'm prepared to give the new rules more time. I fear we will see them exploited more as managers etc have more real world data to analyse but I will wait and see.

I should also add that I've always enjoyed a great tactical battle, two of my favourite games I've ever watched as a neutral were Dublin v Donegal in 2014 when I remember Dublin players looking over to their sideline for help because they couldn't cope with the tactics Donegal were employing and the 2011 all Ireland final when I had the pleasure of sitting beside a coach who had won all Irelands at multiple levels and who was able to analyse the match at unbelievable level. So that may flavour my view on the whole issue.

+1

[David McKeown]

Yes I highlighted loose for a reason

A ball could be played back into 'traffic' keeper comes out with the ball and was the ball played to the defender?

The cries from players/managers/supporters would be deadly

There's a rule book and amendments but I've only done a few games and I'm thinking or doubting things all the time

Are the rules published anywhere as I haven't seen them as yet.

Have you looked on gaa.ie at the very bottom of the home page is a set of headings, and under "The GAA" is a link called "Rules and Regulations".  Click on that link and you will see a bunch of stuff...I believe you might be most interested in a link near the bottom of the page "GAA Official Guide Part 2 (31.01.25)" and clicking on that will bring you to the pdf file.  I'll leave you figure out how to read the table of contents and get to the playing rules of football...but you will notice the recent changes/additions are in red print.

Now I'll ask you a question...how hard did you look for the rules?

Cheers. I had looked at the start of the league when they weren't available and had only looked for amendments since. My bad. Good to finally see them written down.

[David McKeown]

Having now read I'm a little clearer on the rules.

I didn't realise for example that if you breach the 3v3 rule in an attempt to win the ball the punishment is a free on half way but if you accidentally do it it's a free on the 20m line.

I'm glad to see the advantage rule has been changed to remove the absurdity that if you fouled the ball during your advantage it cancelled the advantage and resulted in a free the other way.

I didn't know that causing injury to a player is now a straight red even if there is no force.

Indicating a free but then solo and going is a free the other way so although the referee the other day was criticised he may have been correct.

[Milltown Row2]

Having now read I'm a little clearer on the rules.

I didn't realise for example that if you breach the 3v3 rule in an attempt to win the ball the punishment is a free on half way but if you accidentally do it it's a free on the 20m line.

I'm glad to see the advantage rule has been changed to remove the absurdity that if you fouled the ball during your advantage it cancelled the advantage and resulted in a free the other way.

I didn't know that causing injury to a player is now a straight red even if there is no force.

Indicating a free but then solo and going is a free the other way so although the referee the other day was criticised he may have been correct.

The 3v3 rule if a player has accidently through momentum broke the halfway line, its a free from that spot rather than the 50m free shot, if two players happen to cross the line together to contest the ball its a hop ball? or has it changed? It's hard to keep up with the amendments lol

[on the sideline]

I'm really quite amazed at the number of people on Twitter who would seem to prefer watching 70 mins of own-half possession football as a windy day spectacle, over the stack them up, chase them down approach seen under the new rules.

Now I've got to thinking that most people are unable  to remember much of anything past a few months ago. This is by far the most logical explanation for this bizarre behaviour.

I prefer it because there is little to no excitement to it. Games are potentially exciting for about three minutes. They don't ebb and flow like they used to.

Honestly David I just don't understand this take. Games didn't ebb and flow for almost a decade there. It was 60 minutes of possession nonsense and if we were lucky we got a good last 10.

The first half of last year's AI final is the prime example of why the rules had to change. Boredom personified. No ebb, no flow. Just boredom. 

Similarly I don't understand your take either. I will always be biased about the All Ireland final (and the entirety of last years championship in general) but I thought criticism of it was well overblown. It may not have had goal mouth chances galore but it had plenty of ebb and flow and drama. A tight game that was always on a knife edge.

So far this year I'm struggling to remember a game that was tight. Games are more like offence v defence training sessions back to back. The weather may have a lot to do with that but I find long periods of matches now very boring as one team enjoys their period to attack.

I find the rules infuriating where minor infractions are unjustifiably punished (3 v 3) and 50m advancement for shooting as a whistle is blown for example. Yet major infractions like black and red cards are negated. The new rules now even reward foul play when teams can pressure opposition frees in the opposition half. Add to that two different advantage rules the one played when there has been a foul much less advantageous that the one played when a catch is made.

Even if the rules did need changed after last year it was tweaks that were needed not the wholesale changes that have come and don't seem to have been thought through properly.

I feel like clever innovative play is no longer rewarded and there is a drive towards the homogenisation of tactics.

I think we are going backwards. I'm old enough to remember goal kicks being from the edge of the small square. We changed that rule because we thought it punished teams further after conceding now we are returning to punishing the conceding team again by forcing kick outs to congested middle areas where the opposition can have an extra player.

I think the new rules denigrate skills as well with 50's worth half of what an easier free much closer to goal is worth. One on one defending now considered less important than a simple catch etc. Even goals are less rewarding under the new rules. 2 goals being worth the same as 3 points from 40 odd out.

So yes for me the game is not better than last year.

All that said. We are 4 matches into the league I'm prepared to give the new rules more time. I fear we will see them exploited more as managers etc have more real world data to analyse but I will wait and see.

I should also add that I've always enjoyed a great tactical battle, two of my favourite games I've ever watched as a neutral were Dublin v Donegal in 2014 when I remember Dublin players looking over to their sideline for help because they couldn't cope with the tactics Donegal were employing and the 2011 all Ireland final when I had the pleasure of sitting beside a coach who had won all Irelands at multiple levels and who was able to analyse the match at unbelievable level. So that may flavour my view on the whole issue.

Thank God I'm not the only one who thinks along these lines.

[David McKeown]

Having now read I'm a little clearer on the rules.

I didn't realise for example that if you breach the 3v3 rule in an attempt to win the ball the punishment is a free on half way but if you accidentally do it it's a free on the 20m line.

I'm glad to see the advantage rule has been changed to remove the absurdity that if you fouled the ball during your advantage it cancelled the advantage and resulted in a free the other way.

I didn't know that causing injury to a player is now a straight red even if there is no force.

Indicating a free but then solo and going is a free the other way so although the referee the other day was criticised he may have been correct.

The 3v3 rule if a player has accidently through momentum broke the halfway line, its a free from that spot rather than the 50m free shot, if two players happen to cross the line together to contest the ball its a hop ball? or has it changed? It's hard to keep up with the amendments lol

To commit a breach of rule 2.14 (the 3 v 3 rule) in the act of carrying, receiving or intercepting the ball or attempting to do so leaving less than three players on either side of the half way line.

No mention of it being accidentally or as a result of momentum etc.

[Milltown Row2]

Having now read I'm a little clearer on the rules.

I didn't realise for example that if you breach the 3v3 rule in an attempt to win the ball the punishment is a free on half way but if you accidentally do it it's a free on the 20m line.

I'm glad to see the advantage rule has been changed to remove the absurdity that if you fouled the ball during your advantage it cancelled the advantage and resulted in a free the other way.

I didn't know that causing injury to a player is now a straight red even if there is no force.

Indicating a free but then solo and going is a free the other way so although the referee the other day was criticised he may have been correct.

The 3v3 rule if a player has accidently through momentum broke the halfway line, its a free from that spot rather than the 50m free shot, if two players happen to cross the line together to contest the ball its a hop ball? or has it changed? It's hard to keep up with the amendments lol

To commit a breach of rule 2.14 (the 3 v 3 rule) in the act of carrying, receiving or intercepting the ball or attempting to do so leaving less than three players on either side of the half way line.

No mention of it being accidentally or as a result of momentum etc.

It's not as black and white as that in practical terms. I did bring this up at the last meeting, I've about 7 different questions that I've thought about over the weekend to get confirmation on, momentum and accidentally over the halfway line was definitely used. I shouldn't though with two weeks before the start of the club leagues here in Antrim be still unsure on new rules, and seeing so many different applications at county level with 9 officials at hand to help

[donelli]

Is there any change to deciding a game in the event of a draw at extra time (ie has penalties been replaced)
cant find it anywhere. appreciate if someone can point to that change (if it was made)

[DuffleKing]

Having now read I'm a little clearer on the rules.

I didn't realise for example that if you breach the 3v3 rule in an attempt to win the ball the punishment is a free on half way but if you accidentally do it it's a free on the 20m line.

I'm glad to see the advantage rule has been changed to remove the absurdity that if you fouled the ball during your advantage it cancelled the advantage and resulted in a free the other way.

I didn't know that causing injury to a player is now a straight red even if there is no force.

Indicating a free but then solo and going is a free the other way so although the referee the other day was criticised he may have been correct.

The 3v3 rule if a player has accidently through momentum broke the halfway line, its a free from that spot rather than the 50m free shot, if two players happen to cross the line together to contest the ball its a hop ball? or has it changed? It's hard to keep up with the amendments lol

Not the punishment