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GAA Discussion => GAA Discussion => Topic started by: BennyCake on September 09, 2014, 12:47:26 PM

Title: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: BennyCake on September 09, 2014, 12:47:26 PM
I don't think we have a thread where rules can be discussed and clarified, so here's one now.

I have a couple of rules myself I need clearing up...

- What's the situation regarding extra time? As far as I'm aware, a team down to 13 or 14 players, will have a full team for extra time. Are the players added to the 15 for ET, counted as part of their sub allocation?

Also, teams that have used their allocation of subs in normal time, how many extra subs do they get in ET?

- is a player allowed to fist the ball to himself? I noticed it happened in the Kerry Mayo replay. I didn't think this was allowed.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Hardy on September 09, 2014, 12:52:31 PM
Good idea for a dedicated thread.

We should start with a read of this:

http://www.gaa.ie/content/documents/publications/official_guides/Official_Guide_2012_Part2.pdf (http://www.gaa.ie/content/documents/publications/official_guides/Official_Guide_2012_Part2.pdf)
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: 5 Sams on September 09, 2014, 12:52:58 PM
Dunno about the ET and subs but there's no problem with a player fisting the ball to himself as long as it touches the ground before he regains possession. Thats what happened in the Kerry Mayo game when I think it was Crowley punched the ball ahead of himself and picked it up again after it bounced.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Hardy on September 09, 2014, 02:05:21 PM

- What's the situation regarding extra time? As far as I'm aware, a team down to 13 or 14 players, will have a full team for extra time. Are the players added to the 15 for ET, counted as part of their sub allocation?

Also, teams that have used their allocation of subs in normal time, how many extra subs do they get in ET?

2.6 Players in Extra Time
(a) Any fifteen players may start Extra Time,
except as provided for in (b) and (d) below.

(b) In an Inter-County Game, any fifteen players on
the List submitted to the Referee prior to the
game, except as provided for in (d) below, may
start Extra Time.

(c) The Referee shall be given a List of the 15
players starting Extra Time, or a Note clearly
indicating the changes made from that of
the finishing team in Normal Time. This List/
Note may be in single form but shall otherwise
comply with the provisions of Rule 2.5 - List of
Players.

(d) A player ordered off in any circumstance in
Normal Time, may not play in Extra Time but
may be replaced.

(e) Substitutions/Temporary Substitutions shall
be allowed during the playing of Extra Time as
outlined in Rule 2.4(ii) and (iii).

(f) A Caution (Yellow Card) issued in Normal Time
shall carry over into Extra Time.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: blewuporstuffed on September 09, 2014, 02:22:07 PM
Whats the rule for kickouts now that they are all taken from the 13? where do the outfeild players need to be? outside the 21 or outside the D or what? Every referee seems to inforce something different
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: westbound on September 09, 2014, 02:36:30 PM
Outside the 21 (and 13metres from the ball). But the ball must travel a distance of 13metres before it can be gathered by another player (on the defending team).

Where lots of people get confused is when the ball goes diagonally towards the sideline and travels more than 13metres, a player IS allowed to come inside the 21 to collect the ball provided he was outside the 21 when it was kicked.

I think i remember reading on here before that technically, by the letter of the law the goalkeeper could kick the ball to himself (and in theory dribble the length of the field) as long as he didn't pick it up!

Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Milltown Row2 on September 09, 2014, 03:00:25 PM
Outside the 21 (and 13metres from the ball). But the ball must travel a distance of 13metres before it can be gathered by another player (on the defending team).

Where lots of people get confused is when the ball goes diagonally towards the sideline and travels more than 13metres, a player IS allowed to come inside the 21 to collect the ball provided he was outside the 21 when it was kicked.

I think i remember reading on here before that technically, by the letter of the law the goalkeeper could kick the ball to himself (and in theory dribble the length of the field) as long as he didn't pick it up!

Correct
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: blewuporstuffed on September 09, 2014, 04:07:57 PM
Outside the 21 (and 13metres from the ball). But the ball must travel a distance of 13metres before it can be gathered by another player (on the defending team).

Where lots of people get confused is when the ball goes diagonally towards the sideline and travels more than 13metres, a player IS allowed to come inside the 21 to collect the ball provided he was outside the 21 when it was kicked.

I think i remember reading on here before that technically, by the letter of the law the goalkeeper could kick the ball to himself (and in theory dribble the length of the field) as long as he didn't pick it up!

Correct
Its just that ive seen players standing on the 21 directly in front of the keeper with their arms in the air and referees letting that go (even though they would only be 8m from the ball) whereas some referees insist on all players being outside the 'D' as well.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: screenexile on September 09, 2014, 04:22:00 PM
Outside the 21 (and 13metres from the ball). But the ball must travel a distance of 13metres before it can be gathered by another player (on the defending team).

Where lots of people get confused is when the ball goes diagonally towards the sideline and travels more than 13metres, a player IS allowed to come inside the 21 to collect the ball provided he was outside the 21 when it was kicked.

I think i remember reading on here before that technically, by the letter of the law the goalkeeper could kick the ball to himself (and in theory dribble the length of the field) as long as he didn't pick it up!

Correct
Its just that ive seen players standing on the 21 directly in front of the keeper with their arms in the air and referees letting that go (even though they would only be 8m from the ball) whereas some referees insist on all players being outside the 'D' as well.

Good point! Why is the D there in the first place? Was it brought in as an exclusion zone for when keepers used to kick the ball from the 21?

Anyway if it's there we may as well use it and have lads stand outside it for kickouts!!!
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: AZOffaly on September 09, 2014, 04:22:45 PM
Penalties in Hurling and Football,  and Kickouts I thought.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: westbound on September 09, 2014, 04:32:10 PM
Penalties in Hurling and Football,  and Kickouts I thought.

Correct, exclusion zone was brought in for penalties (and kickouts when they were on the 21).

In response to blewuporstuffed, I guess some referees use some discretion and don't bother holding the game up to move players back a few yards if they aren't going to interfere with the keeper's kickout. If they blocked the ball down I presume the attacker would be penalised.
I'm not saying thats correct as per the rule book, but I'd say that what some refs do.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: johnneycool on September 09, 2014, 04:37:31 PM
Outside the 21 (and 13metres from the ball). But the ball must travel a distance of 13metres before it can be gathered by another player (on the defending team).

Where lots of people get confused is when the ball goes diagonally towards the sideline and travels more than 13metres, a player IS allowed to come inside the 21 to collect the ball provided he was outside the 21 when it was kicked.

I think i remember reading on here before that technically, by the letter of the law the goalkeeper could kick the ball to himself (and in theory dribble the length of the field) as long as he didn't pick it up!

Correct
Its just that ive seen players standing on the 21 directly in front of the keeper with their arms in the air and referees letting that go (even though they would only be 8m from the ball) whereas some referees insist on all players being outside the 'D' as well.

I know its slightly different, but I was once told by an intercouty referee (hurling) when I questioned him on why he gave a free against one of our lads for blocking a sideline cut was that he wasn't the required distance away from the ball. I pointed out he was standing directly beside his marker and he responded that if he'd have blocked it instead it would have been our free...
Not sure if he was using poetic license or not..
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: bailestil on September 09, 2014, 04:44:24 PM
Rule 1.2 Exception II
Any Player who falls or is knocked to the ground while in possession of the ball may fist or palm the ball away on the ground and may score by doing so.

I can safely say I've seen this hundreds of times, and blown up every single time.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: rrhf on September 10, 2014, 06:58:47 AM
The paddy Russell rule.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: westbound on September 10, 2014, 08:49:50 AM
Rule 1.2 Exception II
Any Player who falls or is knocked to the ground while in possession of the ball may fist or palm the ball away on the ground and may score by doing so.

I can safely say I've seen this hundreds of times, and blown up every single time.

In fairness, I've seen a few refs allow this (Correctly) - but the abuse they've gotten from the players/mentors & supporters who obviously didn't know this rule has been ridiculous!
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Harold Disgracey on September 10, 2014, 12:42:03 PM
Has a referee ever ordered a penalty to be retaken for a goalkeeper advancing off his line?
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: blanketattack on September 10, 2014, 02:48:15 PM
If a player attempts a fist pass to his goalie but it goes over his head straight into the net, is it a 45 or a goal?
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: larryin89 on September 10, 2014, 02:57:24 PM
Slightly off topic but still in line with the theme.

Cormac Reiley had an absolute stinker in semi final replay in a lot of peoples opinion. The usually outspoken godfather of  officialdom mr Pat ' i robbed mayo in 96' McNeaney has not commented on the performance . Is there a reason for this , is he obliged to comment on such a controversial performance ?
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Milltown Row2 on September 10, 2014, 04:49:00 PM
Outside the 21 (and 13metres from the ball). But the ball must travel a distance of 13metres before it can be gathered by another player (on the defending team).

Where lots of people get confused is when the ball goes diagonally towards the sideline and travels more than 13metres, a player IS allowed to come inside the 21 to collect the ball provided he was outside the 21 when it was kicked.

I think i remember reading on here before that technically, by the letter of the law the goalkeeper could kick the ball to himself (and in theory dribble the length of the field) as long as he didn't pick it up!

Correct
Its just that ive seen players standing on the 21 directly in front of the keeper with their arms in the air and referees letting that go (even though they would only be 8m from the ball) whereas some referees insist on all players being outside the 'D' as well.

I know its slightly different, but I was once told by an intercouty referee (hurling) when I questioned him on why he gave a free against one of our lads for blocking a sideline cut was that he wasn't the required distance away from the ball. I pointed out he was standing directly beside his marker and he responded that if he'd have blocked it instead it would have been our free...
Not sure if he was using poetic license or not..

Both players need to be back the required distance,  the player who's not back the proper distance and 'fouls' the ball will be penalised against. Has been in a while in fairness, it used to be a hop ball back in the day? Anyways I make sure the feckers are right back and warn them accordingly. The amount of times I've heard he's too close ref!!! Feck off stop annoying me lol
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Rossfan on September 10, 2014, 05:41:09 PM
If a player attempts a fist pass to his goalie but it goes over his head straight into the net, is it a 45 or a goal?

3.4 If a defending player plays the ball through his
own scoring space in any manner, this shall
count as a score.

Hope you're not a Ref blanket  :o
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: From the Bunker on September 10, 2014, 11:11:54 PM
Slightly off topic but still in line with the theme.

Cormac Reiley had an absolute stinker in semi final replay in a lot of peoples opinion. The usually outspoken godfather of  officialdom mr Pat ' i robbed mayo in 96' McNeaney has not commented on the performance . Is there a reason for this , is he obliged to comment on such a controversial performance ?

Silence is golden. It's all about getting past the week after. Dublin losing to Donegal helped defer attention. The pitch intruder also deferred attention. Pat will keep his gob shut. Sure he can't say he had a stinker? Can he? The dogs on the street know we were shafted! Reilly had his agenda (what ever it was) and he seen it through. Kerry seen an opening and they like any grateful receiver said thank you very much. We'd have done the same given half a chance. Churning out the same lines about the Ref being grand, we had more hunger and We played better!
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: blanketattack on September 11, 2014, 01:31:55 AM
If a player attempts a fist pass to his goalie but it goes over his head straight into the net, is it a 45 or a goal?

3.4 If a defending player plays the ball through his
own scoring space in any manner, this shall
count as a score.

Hope you're not a Ref blanket  :o

No, for some reason I thought it was like a throw-in in soccer where if it goes into your own net it's a corner.


Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: blewuporstuffed on September 11, 2014, 08:40:15 AM
Can anyone clarify the advantage rule?
Last week we had a very dubious application of the advantage rule (and it benefited us)
A long ball was played into one of our forwards, who was quite clearly being fouled, but the ball broke to our corner forward who was through one on one with the keeper, the ref quite rightly put his arm in the air for an advantage, our player took a shot at goal and the keeper got down and made a great save.The referee then brought play back for the original foul.
Surely this isnt the way the advantage rule was intended to be applied  ???
I would have thought as soon as the ball fell to our other forward in an advantageous position, that was the end of the advantage, regardless of whether he scored or not?
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: westbound on September 11, 2014, 09:54:05 AM
Advantage Rule:
When a foul is committed the referee may allow the play to continue if he considers it to be to the advantage of the offended team. He shall signal that advantage by raising an arm upright. If he deems no advantage to have occurred, he may subsequently award a free for that foul from where it occurred*. The referee shall allow the advantage to run by maintaining his arm in the upright position for up to five seconds after the initial foul or for less time if it becomes clear that no advantage has accrued. He shall apply any relevant disciplinary action.”

It's at the referee's discretion as to what he considers an advantage to be.

For me, if a foul is committed which is in a scoreable position then if the attacking team doesn't score within the 5 seconds (regardless of whether they have had a shot at goal or not) then the play should be called back for the free.
IMO, a scoreable free is more advantageous than a shot being saved by the goalkeeper. So therefore I would say the referee was correct in the example given by blewuporstuffed.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Hardy on September 11, 2014, 10:24:43 AM
It's interesting that the wording is such that the referee may end the advantage period inside the five seconds if an advantage has not occurred, but may not end it within the five seconds if an advantage has occurred.

So the referee must wait for five seconds to deem that an advantage has accrued but can deem that an advantage has not accrued in, say, 2 seconds.

That seems to mean that he can't consider it an advantage if, for instance, the team of the fouled player gets possession from the foul and end the advantage period. He must wait five seconds. In theory, the attacking team could have two shots back off the post and a great save from the keeper in that time and still get a free. 

It also means that if there's a subsequent foul within the five seconds, he can't start a new advantage, but must stop  for the original foul.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: haranguerer on September 11, 2014, 10:32:49 AM
There would need to be certainty of consistency between refs, but it had occurred to me that in an attackng position where a ref has signalled advantage, you should shoot for goal, no matter the angle, distance, etc, as the point would be secure from the free if you miss anyway. Refs dont like anyone being too smart though, so no doubt you'd lose your free no matter the precedents.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Down Follower on September 11, 2014, 11:01:36 AM
There would need to be certainty of consistency between refs, but it had occurred to me that in an attackng position where a ref has signalled advantage, you should shoot for goal, no matter the angle, distance, etc, as the point would be secure from the free if you miss anyway. Refs dont like anyone being too smart though, so no doubt you'd lose your free no matter the precedents.

I laughed at that one and can imagine a cocky wee corner forward with the coloured boots on trying a ridiculous shot over his shoulder with the weak foot thinking in his head - well I am guaranteed a free anyway!! Ref thinks knows rightly what he is at and plays on coz he was being too smart  ;)
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: westbound on September 11, 2014, 11:06:12 AM
It's interesting that the wording is such that the referee may end the advantage period inside the five seconds if an advantage has not occurred, but may not end it within the five seconds if an advantage has occurred.

So the referee must wait for five seconds to deem that an advantage has accrued but can deem that an advantage has not accrued in, say, 2 seconds.

That seems to mean that he can't consider it an advantage if, for instance, the team of the fouled player gets possession from the foul and end the advantage period. He must wait five seconds. In theory, the attacking team could have two shots back off the post and a great save from the keeper in that time and still get a free. 

It also means that if there's a subsequent foul within the five seconds, he can't start a new advantage, but must stop  for the original foul.

Hardy, I would agree with all you have said except the very last part. If there is a subsequent foul in a better position the ref shouldn't stop play for the original foul.  A free from the position of the latter foul is the advantage accrued.

I would also argue that the ref could give a new advantage and start another 5 seconds but we might need Pat McEnaney to clarify for us!!!  ;)
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: johnneycool on September 11, 2014, 11:13:34 AM
There would need to be certainty of consistency between refs, but it had occurred to me that in an attackng position where a ref has signalled advantage, you should shoot for goal, no matter the angle, distance, etc, as the point would be secure from the free if you miss anyway. Refs dont like anyone being too smart though, so no doubt you'd lose your free no matter the precedents.

In all likelihood the ref is going to be behind you, so seeing an advantage signal could be difficult unless the refs now shout out that they're playing an advantage ala the rugby lads.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: passedit on September 11, 2014, 11:23:28 AM
Not sure the ref I saw on friday night is totally au fait with the advantage rule.

Defender pursuing attacker when a second attacker body checked the defender leaving the first attacker with a clear run on goal which he took full advantage of. Referee awarded the goal then jogged back up the pitch and black carded the body checker. Still trying to get my head round that one.

Also in a recent game same team awarded two fourteen yard frees for a push and a drag back in the large square. The referee's logic for these was that neither foul was 'Aggressive'.  :o
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Hardy on September 11, 2014, 11:33:06 AM
It's interesting that the wording is such that the referee may end the advantage period inside the five seconds if an advantage has not occurred, but may not end it within the five seconds if an advantage has occurred.

So the referee must wait for five seconds to deem that an advantage has accrued but can deem that an advantage has not accrued in, say, 2 seconds.

That seems to mean that he can't consider it an advantage if, for instance, the team of the fouled player gets possession from the foul and end the advantage period. He must wait five seconds. In theory, the attacking team could have two shots back off the post and a great save from the keeper in that time and still get a free. 

It also means that if there's a subsequent foul within the five seconds, he can't start a new advantage, but must stop  for the original foul.

Hardy, I would agree with all you have said except the very last part. If there is a subsequent foul in a better position the ref shouldn't stop play for the original foul.  A free from the position of the latter foul is the advantage accrued.

That makes sense.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: blewuporstuffed on September 11, 2014, 11:56:46 AM
Advantage Rule:
When a foul is committed the referee may allow the play to continue if he considers it to be to the advantage of the offended team. He shall signal that advantage by raising an arm upright. If he deems no advantage to have occurred, he may subsequently award a free for that foul from where it occurred*. The referee shall allow the advantage to run by maintaining his arm in the upright position for up to five seconds after the initial foul or for less time if it becomes clear that no advantage has accrued. He shall apply any relevant disciplinary action.”

It's at the referee's discretion as to what he considers an advantage to be.

For me, if a foul is committed which is in a scoreable position then if the attacking team doesn't score within the 5 seconds (regardless of whether they have had a shot at goal or not) then the play should be called back for the free.
IMO, a scoreable free is more advantageous than a shot being saved by the goalkeeper. So therefore I would say the referee was correct in the example given by blewuporstuffed.
Yes but is an attacker being through one on one with the keeper not more advantageous than a free kick?Therefore the advantage has occurred?if he then chooses to take his point or go for goal (no matter what the out come) then that is up to the attacker.
As I said, we came out the right side of this one, but it just didnt seem right to me.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: westbound on September 11, 2014, 12:20:31 PM
Advantage Rule:
When a foul is committed the referee may allow the play to continue if he considers it to be to the advantage of the offended team. He shall signal that advantage by raising an arm upright. If he deems no advantage to have occurred, he may subsequently award a free for that foul from where it occurred*. The referee shall allow the advantage to run by maintaining his arm in the upright position for up to five seconds after the initial foul or for less time if it becomes clear that no advantage has accrued. He shall apply any relevant disciplinary action.”

It's at the referee's discretion as to what he considers an advantage to be.

For me, if a foul is committed which is in a scoreable position then if the attacking team doesn't score within the 5 seconds (regardless of whether they have had a shot at goal or not) then the play should be called back for the free.
IMO, a scoreable free is more advantageous than a shot being saved by the goalkeeper. So therefore I would say the referee was correct in the example given by blewuporstuffed.
Yes but is an attacker being through one on one with the keeper not more advantageous than a free kick?Therefore the advantage has occurred?if he then chooses to take his point or go for goal (no matter what the out come) then that is up to the attacker.
As I said, we came out the right side of this one, but it just didnt seem right to me.

That's a valid argument blewuporstuffed. And the fact that it comes down to the referee's discretion always leads to inconsistencies.
However, I think that the attacker being through one on one is only an advantage if he's able to score it!!!!  :P
The 5 second part of the rule means that the referee has time to see if a REAL advantage has accrued. I should point out that I like this - it's similar to rugby, but with a more certain time limit!

The problem with the old advantage rule was that the decision had to be made pretty much instantaneously. So in your example above you'd have got the free in and most supporters (obviously not you!) would have blinded the ref for not giving an advantage and said he'd have scored a goal if the ref didn't blow the whistle! (or alternatively blinded him not not giving the free in!)
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Hardy on September 11, 2014, 12:34:16 PM
Just as an aside, it's amusing that it seems the majority of spectators don't have a clue about the advantage rule, as evidenced by the howling and booing every time an advantage fails to accrue and the ref calls play back for the free. People either didn't see the the original foul or have assumed he got away with and haven't noticed the referee's raised hand or, if they have, presume he's waving to his mates. Then when he blows apparently for no reason, they go crazy.   

What's not amusing, but annoying, is when paid commentators and overpaid "pundits" react the same way.

That's not to mention the bemusement when the umpires make the "Hawkeye" signal and the same clowns interpret it as the wide signal and then say Hawkeye overruled the umpire, whereupon the producer orders a close-up of the properly performing umpire in order to shame him before the nation.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: magpie seanie on September 11, 2014, 01:05:24 PM
To be fair there are a few refs I know of here in Sligo that ruin around with an arm up in the air all the time, long bofre any advantage rule was thought of!!!
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: AZOffaly on September 11, 2014, 01:07:19 PM
Fascists!!!
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: PAULD123 on September 11, 2014, 01:57:47 PM
Advantage Rule:
When a foul is committed the referee may allow the play to continue if he considers it to be to the advantage of the offended team. He shall signal that advantage by raising an arm upright. If he deems no advantage to have occurred, he may subsequently award a free for that foul from where it occurred*. The referee shall allow the advantage to run by maintaining his arm in the upright position for up to five seconds after the initial foul or for less time if it becomes clear that no advantage has accrued. He shall apply any relevant disciplinary action.”

It's at the referee's discretion as to what he considers an advantage to be.

For me, if a foul is committed which is in a scoreable position then if the attacking team doesn't score within the 5 seconds (regardless of whether they have had a shot at goal or not) then the play should be called back for the free.
IMO, a scoreable free is more advantageous than a shot being saved by the goalkeeper. So therefore I would say the referee was correct in the example given by blewuporstuffed.
Yes but is an attacker being through one on one with the keeper not more advantageous than a free kick?Therefore the advantage has occurred?if he then chooses to take his point or go for goal (no matter what the out come) then that is up to the attacker.
As I said, we came out the right side of this one, but it just didnt seem right to me.

I disagree. Advantage is if you are in a better position because of continuing to play than you would have been if you had stopped for the original free.

Say a team gets a free inside their own 21, the ball is played quickly forward and the attacker gets a shot away within 5 seconds but misses. The free should not be called back, because even though he missed, the ball is now at the other end of the pitch which is about all you could really have hoped for from a deep defensive free.

But say instead an attacker is fouled on the 13m line dead centre. He slips the ball away as he is going down and his team mate blasts a shot wide. Clearly it is very much less advantageous to have a shot wide than a near certain 13m free scored. In this instance I would argue that anything less than a point scored during advantage play is not advantageous over the benefit of a simple free. The play should be called back for the free.

What is an advantage anyway? I say - Did the offended team gain a better position as a result of the advantage than they would have got from the free? And if you are fouled 13m out then yes, I do think the advantage rule effectively means that you are being allowed two shots at the sticks. Having a one-on-one with the keeper is in itself not an advantage, that's just what happened during advantage. Only after the advantage is at an end can a ref make a decision if the team would have been better off with the free and if it is the difference between one point scored and three points missed then it is definitely one point scored puts you in a better position!

Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: westbound on September 12, 2014, 12:22:31 PM
Advantage Rule:
When a foul is committed the referee may allow the play to continue if he considers it to be to the advantage of the offended team. He shall signal that advantage by raising an arm upright. If he deems no advantage to have occurred, he may subsequently award a free for that foul from where it occurred*. The referee shall allow the advantage to run by maintaining his arm in the upright position for up to five seconds after the initial foul or for less time if it becomes clear that no advantage has accrued. He shall apply any relevant disciplinary action.”

It's at the referee's discretion as to what he considers an advantage to be.

For me, if a foul is committed which is in a scoreable position then if the attacking team doesn't score within the 5 seconds (regardless of whether they have had a shot at goal or not) then the play should be called back for the free.
IMO, a scoreable free is more advantageous than a shot being saved by the goalkeeper. So therefore I would say the referee was correct in the example given by blewuporstuffed.
Yes but is an attacker being through one on one with the keeper not more advantageous than a free kick?Therefore the advantage has occurred?if he then chooses to take his point or go for goal (no matter what the out come) then that is up to the attacker.
As I said, we came out the right side of this one, but it just didnt seem right to me.

I disagree. Advantage is if you are in a better position because of continuing to play than you would have been if you had stopped for the original free.

Say a team gets a free inside their own 21, the ball is played quickly forward and the attacker gets a shot away within 5 seconds but misses. The free should not be called back, because even though he missed, the ball is now at the other end of the pitch which is about all you could really have hoped for from a deep defensive free.

But say instead an attacker is fouled on the 13m line dead centre. He slips the ball away as he is going down and his team mate blasts a shot wide. Clearly it is very much less advantageous to have a shot wide than a near certain 13m free scored. In this instance I would argue that anything less than a point scored during advantage play is not advantageous over the benefit of a simple free. The play should be called back for the free.

What is an advantage anyway? I say - Did the offended team gain a better position as a result of the advantage than they would have got from the free? And if you are fouled 13m out then yes, I do think the advantage rule effectively means that you are being allowed two shots at the sticks. Having a one-on-one with the keeper is in itself not an advantage, that's just what happened during advantage. Only after the advantage is at an end can a ref make a decision if the team would have been better off with the free and if it is the difference between one point scored and three points missed then it is definitely one point scored puts you in a better position!

This is exactly what I was trying to say! - You just explained it better!  :)
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: haranguerer on September 12, 2014, 12:39:32 PM
There would need to be certainty of consistency between refs, but it had occurred to me that in an attackng position where a ref has signalled advantage, you should shoot for goal, no matter the angle, distance, etc, as the point would be secure from the free if you miss anyway. Refs dont like anyone being too smart though, so no doubt you'd lose your free no matter the precedents.

In all likelihood the ref is going to be behind you, so seeing an advantage signal could be difficult unless the refs now shout out that they're playing an advantage ala the rugby lads.

In all likelihood if you see a certain foul and are first onto the ball without hearing a whistle, it would be safe to assume there is advantage being played
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: haranguerer on September 12, 2014, 12:40:54 PM
Has a referee ever ordered a penalty to be retaken for a goalkeeper advancing off his line?

Yes
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: macdanger2 on September 21, 2014, 03:42:47 PM
Are players meant to be outside the semicircle on the 21 when a kickout is being taken?
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: macdanger2 on September 21, 2014, 10:56:32 PM
Are players meant to be outside the semicircle on the 21 when a kickout is being taken?

Anyone??
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Hardy on September 21, 2014, 11:01:43 PM
No, Mac. The semi circle doesn't come into it. They must be outside the 20m line and more than 13m from the ball.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: macdanger2 on September 21, 2014, 11:04:52 PM
Cheers hardy

Always thought that was the purpose of that semicircle. If not, then is there a reason for it?
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: imtommygunn on September 21, 2014, 11:07:20 PM
Defenders have to be outside it for kickouts i think??

Was wondering the same myself with donaghy and the goal.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Hardy on September 21, 2014, 11:14:47 PM
It's just for penalties - all players but goalie and kicker have to be outside it.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: lynchbhoy on September 21, 2014, 11:24:49 PM
Not sure if the 'D' has been modified but it was incorrectly measuring the distance defenders had to be away from the ball at a penalty ( since the penalty spot has been moved forward from the 14 yard line/13 m line) but I don't think the GAA has redrawn the correct distance and new 'D' - they may have , I just haven't heard.

Donaghy was not 13m from the ball for durcans kickout.

The D defines the distance but he didn't have to be outside it. He however wasn't the requisite distance.
But durcan made a schoolboy error and shouldn't have kicked it!
Certainly not with Donaghy lurking so closely!!

Fair play for Donaghy being so alert though
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: macdanger2 on September 21, 2014, 11:27:03 PM
He was at the same against mayo and we almost got caught only that the ref gave us an extremely soft free
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: BennyCake on September 23, 2014, 12:26:39 PM
Keane kicked the ball away when Durcan went to take a kickout. He did similar in Limerick, throwing the spare balls away. Disgusting acts. There has to be a sterner punishment for this sort of behaviour.

Unsurprisingly I didnt hear them mention either on Sunday game either.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Jinxy on September 23, 2014, 12:35:36 PM
Yeah, watching him kick the ball away like that I couldn't help thinking that if I was playing against him and time was almost up, I'd take the red card.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: blewuporstuffed on September 23, 2014, 01:44:31 PM
Keane kicked the ball away when Durcan went to take a kickout. He did similar in Limerick, throwing the spare balls away. Disgusting acts. There has to be a sterner punishment for this sort of behaviour.

Unsurprisingly I didnt hear them mention either on Sunday game either.
That sort of thing is something that should be added to the black card list, however, im not even sure that would be a deterant
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: saffron sam2 on September 23, 2014, 01:53:52 PM
Keane kicked the ball away when Durcan went to take a kickout. He did similar in Limerick, throwing the spare balls away. Disgusting acts. There has to be a sterner punishment for this sort of behaviour.

Unsurprisingly I didnt hear them mention either on Sunday game either.

Niall Morgan says Stevie O'Neill practices that during Tyrone training sessions.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: larryin89 on September 23, 2014, 01:54:21 PM
There are one set of rules for Kerry and then there is the other counties who have to adhere to the ones in the rule book.  Pat  McAneany had a meeting with Eammon Fitz at the dub v Donegal semi final to explain the Kerry rules and had a meeting with Tomas O Se Aug weekend, both were pic with the Don of refs at croker for their meetings. 

Since the ''kerry'' meetings took place the usually outspoken Pat has stayed stum because in no way can he justify Cormac O Reillys display in limerick.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Jinxy on September 23, 2014, 02:30:42 PM
You need to stay on this one Larry.
All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: J OGorman on September 23, 2014, 02:38:37 PM
You need to stay on this one Larry.
All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing.

+1. Larry, yer like a wee dog let out in a big field. Go gettum
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Hardy on September 23, 2014, 03:05:10 PM

Keane kicked the ball away when Durcan went to take a kickout. He did similar in Limerick, throwing the spare balls away. Disgusting acts. There has to be a sterner punishment for this sort of behaviour.


Unsurprisingly I didnt hear them mention either on Sunday game either.
That sort of thing is something that should be added to the black card list, however, im not even sure that would be a deterant

Ah lads. Is there no room for a bit of comedy in the game?
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: larryin89 on September 23, 2014, 03:35:53 PM
Why was pat pic with them ? Why has pat not reviewed the Limerick shambles of a refereeing job after such an outcry not only by the ordinary joe like myself but by tsg s Kevin mcstay on tsg?

What did Liam O Neill by '' if mayo know whats good for them , they'll just get on with it''? Whats good for us a low interest rate on a loan perhaps?

Look at Liam O fat face neills talk at the Kerry hotel on sunday night, are ye blinded, he just said '' my black card rule won the day cause the best footballers in Ireland Kerry won the sam maguire'' he said it with fooking gusto . The little fat bollix.

Of course you're laughing at lil old me with my little bitter bursts but if you examine the whole situation , there is surely an element of truth in what im saying
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: johnneycool on September 23, 2014, 03:38:41 PM
Why was pat pic with them ? Why has pat not reviewed the Limerick shambles of a refereeing job after such an outcry not only by the ordinary joe like myself but by tsg s Kevin mcstay on tsg?

What did Liam O Neill by '' if mayo know whats good for them , they'll just get on with it''? Whats good for us a low interest rate on a loan perhaps?

Look at Liam O fat face neills talk at the Kerry hotel on sunday night, are ye blinded, he just said '' my black card rule won the day cause the best footballers in Ireland Kerry won the sam maguire'' he said it with fooking gusto . The little fat bollix.

Of course you're laughing at lil old me with my little bitter bursts but if you examine the whole situation , there is surely an element of truth in what im saying

Aye that was a bit cringe alright, sour faced auld bollox is always on message no matter the occasion, only one black card dished out from the quarter finals on, not one bit of cynical play thereafter, yeah it worked a treat if you're one of the lesser lights.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: naka on September 23, 2014, 04:43:05 PM
Keane kicked the ball away when Durcan went to take a kickout. He did similar in Limerick, throwing the spare balls away. Disgusting acts. There has to be a sterner punishment for this sort of behaviour.

Unsurprisingly I didnt hear them mention either on Sunday game either.
thought it was a despicable act by keane
was not surprised that no mention was made of it on tv
wasn't surprised at no mention by pat about the reilly shambles in limerick either
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: BennyCake on September 23, 2014, 05:11:59 PM
Keane kicked the ball away when Durcan went to take a kickout. He did similar in Limerick, throwing the spare balls away. Disgusting acts. There has to be a sterner punishment for this sort of behaviour.

Unsurprisingly I didnt hear them mention either on Sunday game either.
thought it was a despicable act by keane
was not surprised that no mention was made of it on tv
wasn't surprised at no mention by pat about the reilly shambles in limerick either

All you'll hear from Spillane is we have the most AIs, we're team of the decade, aren't we a great county, everyone else plays puke football but not us. He's like a child. Why he's still in the media I'll never know.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: BennyCake on September 23, 2014, 06:28:43 PM
What's the rule on a player jumping into a tackle? Both feet were off the ground and he just jumped into a defender. I think it was Young or Keane did it. It resulted in a handy free for Keane. Might have been just before the goal.

It should have been a free out for charging should it not?
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: tyroneman on September 23, 2014, 08:42:20 PM
What's the rule on a player jumping into a tackle? Both feet were off the ground and he just jumped into a defender. I think it was Young or Keane did it. It resulted in a handy free for Keane. Might have been just before the goal.

It should have been a free out for charging should it not?

Yip. In my book that's a free out.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: David McKeown on September 24, 2014, 01:17:20 AM
Going back to the advantage rule if I may.

For me it's a nonsense how some referees are currently interpreting it. Getting a shot at goal from a better position than a free is by definition an advantage. If it goes wide or is saved that's neither here nor there. The advantage was the shot. If an attacker doesn't want that advantage then fine just stop and take the free.

The idea of waiting to see the outcome of a shot is ludicrous. The rule isn't there to give a team two bites at the cherry. It's there for stopping defending teams benefitting when they cheat and break the rules.

If the attacking team wins a free and takes immediately and miss it do they get another chance at the free? 

Also the idea of waiting the full 5 seconds to see if a score has occurred is rubbish what about a high hanging shot from distance taken 5 seconds after the foul. Is the ref supposed to guess where it's going to land? Ie given he's only allowed 5 seconds does he blow for the free in case it falls into the keepers hands or does he wait to see if it makes it over.

As I say it's usualy perfectly obvious which is more advantageous the shot or the free. A free shot at goal from a better angle or shorter distance is more advantageous than a long range. A shot from a tight angle or with multiple defenders around is not. Similarly a shot a goal is more advantageous than a 13m free.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: blewuporstuffed on September 24, 2014, 08:19:00 AM
What's the rule on a player jumping into a tackle? Both feet were off the ground and he just jumped into a defender. I think it was Young or Keane did it. It resulted in a handy free for Keane. Might have been just before the goal.

It should have been a free out for charging should it not?

Yip. In my book that's a free out.
yeah i think it should be a free out, i dont know how the defenders in that situation could have done anything differently to avoid 'fouling' him, bar standing out of the way
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: blewuporstuffed on September 24, 2014, 08:23:32 AM
Going back to the advantage rule if I may.

For me it's a nonsense how some referees are currently interpreting it. Getting a shot at goal from a better position than a free is by definition an advantage. If it goes wide or is saved that's neither here nor there. The advantage was the shot. If an attacker doesn't want that advantage then fine just stop and take the free.

The idea of waiting to see the outcome of a shot is ludicrous. The rule isn't there to give a team two bites at the cherry. It's there for stopping defending teams benefitting when they cheat and break the rules.

If the attacking team wins a free and takes immediately and miss it do they get another chance at the free? 

Also the idea of waiting the full 5 seconds to see if a score has occurred is rubbish what about a high hanging shot from distance taken 5 seconds after the foul. Is the ref supposed to guess where it's going to land? Ie given he's only allowed 5 seconds does he blow for the free in case it falls into the keepers hands or does he wait to see if it makes it over.

As I say it's usualy perfectly obvious which is more advantageous the shot or the free. A free shot at goal from a better angle or shorter distance is more advantageous than a long range. A shot from a tight angle or with multiple defenders around is not. Similarly a shot a goal is more advantageous than a 13m free.
This was exactly my point aswell., and in the example i gave, we were the benefactors of it, but if just didnt seem right to me.
IMO 9/10 when its in a scoring position , the referee should just blow the free, the only time he should allow the advantage is when the player gets away and is through on goal or has a very obviously easier shot at goal.
The advantage rule should only really be used more further out the feild, where the referee can let the play go on a bit more rather than stopping for a free. This is an advantage to teh time on the ball as it doesnt allow the defending team to purposely slow the game down by fouling.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: westbound on September 24, 2014, 09:41:43 AM
Going back to the advantage rule if I may.

For me it's a nonsense how some referees are currently interpreting it. Getting a shot at goal from a better position than a free is by definition an advantage. If it goes wide or is saved that's neither here nor there. The advantage was the shot. If an attacker doesn't want that advantage then fine just stop and take the free.

The idea of waiting to see the outcome of a shot is ludicrous. The rule isn't there to give a team two bites at the cherry. It's there for stopping defending teams benefitting when they cheat and break the rules.

If the attacking team wins a free and takes immediately and miss it do they get another chance at the free? 

Also the idea of waiting the full 5 seconds to see if a score has occurred is rubbish what about a high hanging shot from distance taken 5 seconds after the foul. Is the ref supposed to guess where it's going to land? Ie given he's only allowed 5 seconds does he blow for the free in case it falls into the keepers hands or does he wait to see if it makes it over.

As I say it's usualy perfectly obvious which is more advantageous the shot or the free. A free shot at goal from a better angle or shorter distance is more advantageous than a long range. A shot from a tight angle or with multiple defenders around is not. Similarly a shot a goal is more advantageous than a 13m free.

I would disagree with this. A point (presumably guaranteed from the 13m free) is better for the attacking team than a wide or a save (presuming the shot at goal was not scored).

Also, even under the old advantage rule, if the player got a shot at goal away as he was being fouled; if it went in the ref would allow the goal and if it didn't the ref would give the free in. The difference being that under the old rule the ref had to make the decision instantaneously whereas now he has 5 seconds to decide.

As I mentioned in an earlier post, I like the way the refs are applying the advantage rule. It's very much like the advantage rule in rugby except that there is a definite length of time the advantage can be played. It benefits the attacking team and surely that's the whole purpose, i.e to punish the team who fouls!
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: PAULD123 on September 24, 2014, 10:24:04 AM
Going back to the advantage rule if I may.

For me it's a nonsense how some referees are currently interpreting it. Getting a shot at goal from a better position than a free is by definition an advantage. If it goes wide or is saved that's neither here nor there. The advantage was the shot. If an attacker doesn't want that advantage then fine just stop and take the free.

The idea of waiting to see the outcome of a shot is ludicrous. The rule isn't there to give a team two bites at the cherry. It's there for stopping defending teams benefitting when they cheat and break the rules.

If the attacking team wins a free and takes immediately and miss it do they get another chance at the free? 

Also the idea of waiting the full 5 seconds to see if a score has occurred is rubbish what about a high hanging shot from distance taken 5 seconds after the foul. Is the ref supposed to guess where it's going to land? Ie given he's only allowed 5 seconds does he blow for the free in case it falls into the keepers hands or does he wait to see if it makes it over.

As I say it's usualy perfectly obvious which is more advantageous the shot or the free. A free shot at goal from a better angle or shorter distance is more advantageous than a long range. A shot from a tight angle or with multiple defenders around is not. Similarly a shot a goal is more advantageous than a 13m free.

I disagree with you David. I agree with Westbound. The advantage is there to make sure a team is no worse off by getting a free or playing on. If you have a central 13m free then you are virtually guaranteed a point. The only thing more advantageous is an actual point (or goal). Having a shot at goal saved is less advantageous to the team than having a point. Therefore in final analysis no advantage occurred. So the free should be called back because after the snap shot is saved, as it is then clear it would have been better to have awarded the original free.

But think about it. An attacker is running clean-through on goal. He is fouled. What has happened is the defender is sacrificing a point for a goal chance. Clearly as a minimum the attacker deserves a simple free but he has still been cheated. So the advantage rule allows him to pass to teammate to have that goal chance. But by now it is a much worse goal chance than the clean-through attacker would have had. If you don't call back the free when the goal shot is saved then the cheater still wins. He denied a clear goal chance and the attacking team is told it is to their advantage to have a less good goal chance. That is self-contradictory.

Unless you allow the free to be called back then you are by definition being disadvantageous. If a defender cheats a player out a single shot then I see no problem is saying the advantage is in effect a free less good shot with a guaranteed free kick to come (just like in rugby)
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: David McKeown on September 24, 2014, 04:53:23 PM
Ok so am I right in thinking that you feel it should always be a free unless the ball has been put into the net or over the bar within 5 seconds so that even if a player is fouled takes 2 seconds to escape the foul another 3 seconds to advance towards goal and then shoots the free must come back because when the 5 seconds were up the ball hadn't yet been scored (even had it clearly been going in)?  To me thats a nonsense, the advantage is the shot if the attacking team don't want the advantage then simply don't take the shot.

Also the idea of giving a team two bites at the cherry should only encourage more effectively fouling to prevent that second opportunity.

Why is a team awarded two opportunities to score when advantage is played but not when a free is awarded?

The comparison to rugby I don't get either the relative value of a free in GAA v a penalty in rugby is completely different.  An average rugby match would have far fewer scoring opportunities than a GAA game so a similar advantage rule should not be applied.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: yellowcard on September 24, 2014, 05:40:50 PM
The biggest problem in gaelic football at the minute is the influence that a referee can have over the outcome of a match. I could pick out any given match and probably pull out at least 15 incidences where a referee could justify giving a decision either way yet at the same time he could just as easily justify not giving the same decision. Too many times the rules are applied based on the referees interpretation. Its a worse situation at club level where the referees are under less scrutiny, they are of a poorer standard and worst of all they are biased against one side.   
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: PAULD123 on September 24, 2014, 05:58:51 PM
Ok so am I right in thinking that you feel it should always be a free unless the ball has been put into the net or over the bar within 5 seconds so that even if a player is fouled takes 2 seconds to escape the foul another 3 seconds to advance towards goal and then shoots the free must come back because when the 5 seconds were up the ball hadn't yet been scored (even had it clearly been going in)?  To me thats a nonsense, the advantage is the shot if the attacking team don't want the advantage then simply don't take the shot.

Also the idea of giving a team two bites at the cherry should only encourage more effectively fouling to prevent that second opportunity.

Why is a team awarded two opportunities to score when advantage is played but not when a free is awarded?

The comparison to rugby I don't get either the relative value of a free in GAA v a penalty in rugby is completely different.  An average rugby match would have far fewer scoring opportunities than a GAA game so a similar advantage rule should not be applied.

Ok firstly, I certainly do think 5 seconds is way too long. 2-3 seconds is more than enough to decide on advantage. So I think we agree on that one.

I also think you make a good point about scores in rugby being harder to come by, but that doesn't change the fact that a point is always more advantageous than a miss.

If the defender fouls so absolutely that no advantage could ever occur then he will be getting a booking of black card. So fair enough, let them foul to that level if they want, they won't be doing it for long.

As for two opportunities - It is because they have been cheated out of a really good opportunity. If a defender wants to cheat a fella then he should be punished. Allowing only a less good chance is effectively rewarding the cheater. In the advantage play the attacking team should definitely be allowed a crack at the maximum and if that doesn't come off then be allowed to come back fro a crack at the minimum which is the minimum you desire for being hauled down 13m out.

It would be better and simpler to say that any free within 21m is always called back if no score is made in the following 2 seconds. Any free outside 21m depends solely on the chance to get a good possession/pass/shot away.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: yellowcard on September 24, 2014, 07:36:21 PM
Keane kicked the ball away when Durcan went to take a kickout. He did similar in Limerick, throwing the spare balls away. Disgusting acts. There has to be a sterner punishment for this sort of behaviour.

Unsurprisingly I didnt hear them mention either on Sunday game either.
thought it was a despicable act by keane
was not surprised that no mention was made of it on tv
wasn't surprised at no mention by pat about the reilly shambles in limerick either

It was on a par with Cavanagh pulling down McManus last year and yet it never got mentioned once by any of the pundits in the aftermath. He deserved a good thump but Durcan was still reeling from his own mistake earlier in the match. It's the hypocrisy that is baffling. I don't have much time for Cavanagh but if he had done what Keane done there would have been an outcry. Instead we are constantly fed a diet of garbage that the best footballers playing football in its purest form are Kerry footballers. Rubbish if you ask me.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Hardy on September 25, 2014, 12:22:00 PM
Keane kicked the ball away when Durcan went to take a kickout. He did similar in Limerick, throwing the spare balls away. Disgusting acts. There has to be a sterner punishment for this sort of behaviour.

Unsurprisingly I didnt hear them mention either on Sunday game either.
thought it was a despicable act by keane
was not surprised that no mention was made of it on tv
wasn't surprised at no mention by pat about the reilly shambles in limerick either

It was on a par with Cavanagh pulling down McManus last year

Ah come on now.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Asal Mor on September 25, 2014, 02:26:53 PM
It was worse than Cavanagh, who just did what he had to do. But I'd call it childish rather than disgusting. A fart sniffing fetish is disgusting.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: FermGael on November 09, 2014, 09:03:00 PM
Decided to go up to Owenbeg this afternoon and watch the Ulster Club games.
Two decisions by the referee puzzled me.
1. Slaughtneil defender was soloing out of defence with the ball. He bounced the ball and then lost control of the ball. He regained control by bouncing the ball one handed like a basketball player would and the referee gave a free against him for a double bounce. Was the referee correct?
2. Cavan Gaels player was tackled well and fisted the ball away.  The ball bounced once and the same player regained possession.  The referee played on. Was the referee correct ?
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Zulu on November 09, 2014, 09:08:59 PM
No to first one and yes to second question.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: brokencrossbar1 on November 10, 2014, 09:37:54 AM
No to first one and yes to second question.

I actually think that the ref was right in the first time as well.  The rule about a 'controlling' bounce was implemented a few seasons ago if I recall.  The rule is pretty clear and unambiguous

4.6 To bounce the ball more than once
consecutively after catching it.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: brianboru00 on November 10, 2014, 10:20:52 AM
You have to read the entire rule book

1.5 When the ball has not been caught, it may be
bounced more than once in succession.


and in the "important terms and  definitions" section:
1. BOUNCE For a player who has caught
the ball to play the ball against
the ground with his hand(s)
and to catch it on


Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: brokencrossbar1 on November 10, 2014, 10:42:17 AM
You have to read the entire rule book

1.5 When the ball has not been caught, it may be
bounced more than once in succession.


and in the "important terms and  definitions" section:
1. BOUNCE For a player who has caught
the ball to play the ball against
the ground with his hand(s)
and to catch it on


Fair enough,  I thought I read somewhere that this rule had been abolished
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: brianboru00 on November 10, 2014, 10:55:26 AM
not sure - I thought they had actually included a reference to basketball - but that may have been the clarification :
http://www.gaa.ie/content/documents/publications/rules/Summary_of_Playing_Rule_changes_2010.pdf

The rule has been there for many years but the 2010 changes was clarifying this to give a clearer definition.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Rossfan on November 10, 2014, 11:24:13 AM
You have to read the entire rule book

1.5 When the ball has not been caught, it may be
bounced more than once in succession.


and in the "important terms and  definitions" section:
1. BOUNCE For a player who has caught
the ball to play the ball against
the ground with his hand(s)
and to catch it on


Fair enough,  I thought I read somewhere that this rule had been abolished

Always better to read the oul Treoir Oifigiúil
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Croí na hÉireann on November 10, 2014, 03:01:38 PM
The basketball dribble is a great subvention of the "only one solo" training matches.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: AZOffaly on November 10, 2014, 03:59:35 PM
You have to read the entire rule book

1.5 When the ball has not been caught, it may be
bounced more than once in succession.


and in the "important terms and  definitions" section:
1. BOUNCE For a player who has caught
the ball to play the ball against
the ground with his hand(s)
and to catch it on


Fair enough,  I thought I read somewhere that this rule had been abolished

Always better to read the oul Treoir Oifigiúil

Is that not self contradictory? If the definition of a bounce includes catching it, how can a ball be bounced more than once in succession?
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Jell 0 Biafra on November 10, 2014, 04:30:35 PM
And since a contradiction logically implies everything, nothing is forbidden in football. 
Title: Seo
Post by: drici on November 18, 2014, 09:55:29 AM


24-week suspension for Donegal dual player after social media comment

Social media

BY CHRIS MCNULTY

IN what is believed to be the first case of its kind in Donegal GAA, a club player has been given a proposed 24-week suspension because of comments posted on social media.

Seán Mac Cumhaills’ player David White, who plays football and hurling for the Twin Towns club, has been singled out over a comment following the Donegal SFC quarter-final between Ardara and Naomh Conaill.

In response to a message from the official Donegal GAA account which confirmed that the drawn quarter-final would be replayed that Wednesday night, White is understood to have posted a tweet that was critical of the decision not to play extra-time in the fixture.

The dual star is understood to have posted a similar message on Facebook and County Board chiefs have reacted by handing down the ban. It is likely that the sanction, believed by the relevant parties to be ‘extremely excessive’ will be appealed.

The decision to serve notice of a lengthy ban for social media comments will flash the alarm sirens around the county with club players’ social media activity under scrutiny.

GAA members had been warned by the Donegal County Board in August of this year that they could face disciplinary action over comments made on social media websites.

The secretary of the Donegal Co Board, Aodh Mairtín Ó Fearraigh, also issued an email to club secretaries at that time urging them to make their members aware of the GAA’s social media policies.

That letter outlined that all GAA members are encouraged to take part in social media but the Association expects each individual to follow the guidelines on using social media.

“I would ask all clubs to remind their members and players of the implications of referring to the GAA in social media when they do.

“Each member is to adhere to the GAA’s Official Guide and Club Constitution, as well as other applicable documents. All GAA members are subject to the GAA Code of Behaviour when online, even when they are not acting on behalf of the Association.”
http://donegalnews.com/2014/11/24-week-suspension-for-donegal-dual-player-after-social-media-comment/#sthash.DhRzShsT.mmvPYAuT.dpuf
Title: Re: Seo
Post by: orangeman on November 18, 2014, 11:03:40 AM


24-week suspension for Donegal dual player after social media comment

Social media

BY CHRIS MCNULTY

IN what is believed to be the first case of its kind in Donegal GAA, a club player has been given a proposed 24-week suspension because of comments posted on social media.

Seán Mac Cumhaills’ player David White, who plays football and hurling for the Twin Towns club, has been singled out over a comment following the Donegal SFC quarter-final between Ardara and Naomh Conaill.

In response to a message from the official Donegal GAA account which confirmed that the drawn quarter-final would be replayed that Wednesday night, White is understood to have posted a tweet that was critical of the decision not to play extra-time in the fixture.

The dual star is understood to have posted a similar message on Facebook and County Board chiefs have reacted by handing down the ban. It is likely that the sanction, believed by the relevant parties to be ‘extremely excessive’ will be appealed.

The decision to serve notice of a lengthy ban for social media comments will flash the alarm sirens around the county with club players’ social media activity under scrutiny.

GAA members had been warned by the Donegal County Board in August of this year that they could face disciplinary action over comments made on social media websites.

The secretary of the Donegal Co Board, Aodh Mairtín Ó Fearraigh, also issued an email to club secretaries at that time urging them to make their members aware of the GAA’s social media policies.

That letter outlined that all GAA members are encouraged to take part in social media but the Association expects each individual to follow the guidelines on using social media.

“I would ask all clubs to remind their members and players of the implications of referring to the GAA in social media when they do.

“Each member is to adhere to the GAA’s Official Guide and Club Constitution, as well as other applicable documents. All GAA members are subject to the GAA Code of Behaviour when online, even when they are not acting on behalf of the Association.”
http://donegalnews.com/2014/11/24-week-suspension-for-donegal-dual-player-after-social-media-comment/#sthash.DhRzShsT.mmvPYAuT.dpuf

Slippery slope. Another stick to beat themselves with.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: blanketattack on November 18, 2014, 11:30:54 AM
A couple of rule related questions.
1. A forward is behind the goal line, in the net essentially. A long ball is kicked in (from play) and he moves out in front of the goalie, flicking the ball to the net. Goal or no goal?
2. Same situation but the goalie punches the attacker while he is still behind the goal line. What does the ref give (besides a red card)?
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: DuffleKing on November 18, 2014, 11:37:09 AM

1) Technically, if a player leaves the field of play he cannot reenter without permission from the referee. Free out.
2) Assuming the referee stops play to deal with the incident, play restarts with a free to the team in possession from which they cannot score
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Farrandeelin on November 18, 2014, 08:41:47 PM
If a player remonstrates with a linesman over a lineball decision, does he get a yellow card?
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: muppet on November 18, 2014, 09:11:53 PM
If a player remonstrates with a linesman over a lineball decision, does he get a yellow card?

Yes.

But if he is from Donegal and does it on Twitter he gets a 24 weeks ban.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: fiabhras gael on November 20, 2014, 05:59:47 PM
Anyone know what is the length of term a club chairman can stay in the seat
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Zulu on November 20, 2014, 06:17:55 PM
5 years for all position I think.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: macdanger2 on April 08, 2015, 01:26:20 PM
In the game in Castlebar on Sunday, the Mayo crowd went mad when the Donegal back collected a kickout inside his own 21. Personally, I thought it was ok because he was outside the 21 when the ball was kicked and it's ok to move inside to collect.

On Mad West on the way home though, they said that the rule had been changed from the 21 to the 14 - can anyone confirm this?
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: AZOffaly on April 08, 2015, 01:29:12 PM
We played a game last year, and the ref was specific. You have to be outside 13 metres from the kick out when it is taken, but you could run into collect it. (Not like soccer where you have to touch it outside the box). So a kick out from the 13 metre line, factoring in the exclusion 'D' is basically outside the 20 metre line and the D.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: AZOffaly on April 08, 2015, 01:33:17 PM
Here's the rule

2.7 (a) When the ball is played over the endline by
the Team attacking that end, or after a score
is made, play is restarted by a kick-out off the
ground from the 13m line and within the large
rectangle.
 If the goalkeeper is not taking the kick-out, he
shall stay in the small rectangle, and all other
players, except the player taking the kick-out,
shall be outside the 20m line and 13m from
the ball, until it has been kicked.
 The player taking a kick-out may kick the
ball more than once before any other player
touches it but may not take the ball into his
hands.
 The ball shall travel 13m before being played
by another player of the defending team.


So therefore you could technically kick the ball 13 metres sideways (which is what our goalie did in that game) and as long as the defender was outside the 20 metre line at the time the ball was kicked, he could run in and get it.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: macdanger2 on April 08, 2015, 02:00:47 PM
Cheers AZ
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: BennyCake on April 26, 2015, 01:08:55 PM
Can a player take a sideline kick from the ground if he wishes?
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: JoG2 on May 15, 2015, 11:00:24 AM
was just reading there on gaa.ie that:

'The ball used in Gaelic Football is round, slightly smaller than a soccer ball'.

I've played both sports pretty much all my life but I always thought both balls were the same size, with the A'Neils being heavier. Everyday's a school day
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: brokencrossbar1 on May 15, 2015, 11:08:25 AM
Here's the rule

2.7 (a) When the ball is played over the endline by
the Team attacking that end, or after a score
is made, play is restarted by a kick-out off the
ground from the 13m line and within the large
rectangle.
 If the goalkeeper is not taking the kick-out, he
shall stay in the small rectangle, and all other
players, except the player taking the kick-out,
shall be outside the 20m line and 13m from
the ball, until it has been kicked.
 The player taking a kick-out may kick the
ball more than once before any other player
touches it but may not take the ball into his
hands.
 The ball shall travel 13m before being played
by another player of the defending team.


So therefore you could technically kick the ball 13 metres sideways (which is what our goalie did in that game) and as long as the defender was outside the 20 metre line at the time the ball was kicked, he could run in and get it.

Alternatively your full back could take the kick out backwards towards the goalkeeper,  so long as it traveled 13 m and the goalie started off in the small square and then the FB could take the return pass.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: DuffleKing on May 15, 2015, 11:26:49 AM
5 years for all position I think.

That's a county level regulation only?
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: twohands!!! on May 15, 2015, 01:28:56 PM
5 years for all position I think.

That's a county level regulation only?

Yup
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: macdanger2 on April 15, 2017, 10:33:21 PM
I was chatting to my nephew who plays U12 for a club in Dublin earlier and he's convinced that there's a rule against 1) using two hands to tackle the ball and 2) using anything other than the "near" hand to tackle (he wasn't able to explain what the "near" hand was when you're tackling front on, but anyway)

While I realise that both of these are good practice i.e. you're less likely to foul the playerl; I'm fairly certain that neither are actual rules. Can anyone confirm??
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: hardstation on April 15, 2017, 10:42:37 PM
I was chatting to my nephew who plays U12 for a club in Dublin earlier and he's convinced that there's a rule against 1) using two hands to tackle the ball and 2) using anything other than the "near" hand to tackle (he wasn't able to explain what the "near" hand was when you're tackling front on, but anyway)

While I realise that both of these are good practice i.e. you're less likely to foul the playerl; I'm fairly certain that neither are actual rules. Can anyone confirm??
There are no rules regarding tackling in Gaelic Football. That page of the rule book just says, "Whatever you think yourself".
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: macdanger2 on April 15, 2017, 11:31:41 PM
 ;D ;D

We did discuss that alright
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: ONeill on April 18, 2017, 11:50:10 AM
Can you lift a team mate up to catch the ball, like in a line-out in rugby? Be deadly for the smallish Tyrone lads trying to get a mark.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: John Martin on April 18, 2017, 12:39:46 PM
Does a goalkeeper have any sort of exemption from the foot block rule?
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Main Street on April 20, 2017, 11:01:53 PM
Can you lift a team mate up to catch the ball, like in a line-out in rugby? Be deadly for the smallish Tyrone lads trying to get a mark.

Check out the  'GAA for Dummies' book, if there is one,
until now I didn't think there was a need for one.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Hardy on April 21, 2017, 12:44:37 PM
Can you lift a team mate up to catch the ball, like in a line-out in rugby? Be deadly for the smallish Tyrone lads trying to get a mark.

There's no rule against it. So if you did it and the ref blew it, it'd be interesting to hear his reason and what rule he was invoking.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: rrhf on April 21, 2017, 01:22:26 PM
the ban on foreign sports
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: vallankumous on April 22, 2017, 08:37:49 AM
Can a few carry a player on his shoulders while he holds the ball high in the air?

This would mean the ball carrier could cover the distance of the pitch without taking any steps and there is no determination on how long it might take to take 4 steps.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: BennyCake on April 22, 2017, 09:39:56 AM
Can you lift a team mate up to catch the ball, like in a line-out in rugby? Be deadly for the smallish Tyrone lads trying to get a mark.

There's no rule against it. So if you did it and the ref blew it, it'd be interesting to hear his reason and what rule he was invoking.

If that's the case, could a player be lifted up to sit/stand on the crossbar to prevent a winning point?
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: The Stallion on April 22, 2017, 10:23:52 AM
Are there any transgender players within the GAA? Do the GAA rules address gender fluidity at all?

I know there have been several high profile cases in other sports which caused controversy.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: BennyCake on April 22, 2017, 11:41:57 AM
Are there any transgender players within the GAA? Do the GAA rules address gender fluidity at all?

I know there have been several high profile cases in other sports which caused controversy.

I wonder then, if Northern counties will have to have a percentage of their starting 15 made up of such players, to fall in line with Fair Employment/Equality legislation?
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Ball Hopper on April 22, 2017, 10:25:12 PM
Can a few carry a player on his shoulders while he holds the ball high in the air?

This would mean the ball carrier could cover the distance of the pitch without taking any steps and there is no determination on how long it might take to take 4 steps.

Or how long will a player in possession stand absolutely still before a ref gives a free against him?
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: DuffleKing on April 22, 2017, 10:39:51 PM
Can a few carry a player on his shoulders while he holds the ball high in the air?

This would mean the ball carrier could cover the distance of the pitch without taking any steps and there is no determination on how long it might take to take 4 steps.

Or how long will a player in possession stand absolutely still before a ref gives a free against him?

So we're just pretending not to know the rules now
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Ball Hopper on April 22, 2017, 10:54:44 PM
Can a few carry a player on his shoulders while he holds the ball high in the air?

This would mean the ball carrier could cover the distance of the pitch without taking any steps and there is no determination on how long it might take to take 4 steps.

Or how long will a player in possession stand absolutely still before a ref gives a free against him?

So we're just pretending not to know the rules now

From the "Important Terms and Definitions" part of the rulebook, in case anyone was wondering:

13. OVERCARRY
To take more than four steps while holding the ball in the hand(s).

14. OVERHOLD
To hold the ball longer than is required to take four steps.

Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Farrandeelin on April 22, 2017, 11:11:37 PM
Could this thread be made a sticky?
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: ONeill on April 23, 2017, 10:42:55 AM
Can you lift a team mate up to catch the ball, like in a line-out in rugby? Be deadly for the smallish Tyrone lads trying to get a mark.

There's no rule against it. So if you did it and the ref blew it, it'd be interesting to hear his reason and what rule he was invoking.

If that's the case, could a player be lifted up to sit/stand on the crossbar to prevent a winning point?

Can't believe Jimmy McGuinness didn't try it.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Hardy on April 23, 2017, 12:30:55 PM
14. OVERHOLD
To hold the ball longer than is required to take four steps.

This is the type of shyte that make the Offical Guide a laugh. If you're standing still, the time to take four steps is infinity. If they mean the time required to take four steps if you weren't standing still, what sort of nonsense is that? If your imaginary steps (that you're not taking, remember) were running-flat-out steps, the time to take four of them might be 0.75 of a second. But the referee might be imagining walking steps, as the rules don't tell him otherwise. Four of those might take 3 seconds.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Ball Hopper on April 23, 2017, 09:54:36 PM
14. OVERHOLD
To hold the ball longer than is required to take four steps.

This is the type of shyte that make the Offical Guide a laugh. If you're standing still, the time to take four steps is infinity. If they mean the time required to take four steps if you weren't standing still, what sort of nonsense is that? If your imaginary steps (that you're not taking, remember) were running-flat-out steps, the time to take four of them might be 0.75 of a second. But the referee might be imagining walking steps, as the rules don't tell him otherwise. Four of those might take 3 seconds.

Be a lot easier if they said 4 seconds...
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: DuffleKing on April 23, 2017, 10:58:49 PM

You'd get a lot more than 4 steps in 4 seconds
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: ONeill on April 23, 2017, 11:00:23 PM
Not if you're playing in Omagh on a wet day.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Main Street on April 23, 2017, 11:54:53 PM
Can you lift a team mate up to catch the ball, like in a line-out in rugby? Be deadly for the smallish Tyrone lads trying to get a mark.

There's no rule against it. So if you did it and the ref blew it, it'd be interesting to hear his reason and what rule he was invoking.

If that's the case, could a player be lifted up to sit/stand on the crossbar to prevent a winning point?
:)
Agreed, but why not have 3 players on the crossbar (strength permitting of course) just to be sure of stopping the ball before it crossed the bar, as it is not written in the rules (or the book of genesis) that we can't?
For that matter, there is no rule saying we can't shove the ball up the jersey, take 4 giant leaps and give birth to ball in a more advantageous location on the pitch.
Yes ref, what do you have to say about that?


Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: BennyCake on June 05, 2017, 10:46:00 PM
Just read Louth Meath report. Meath made a late change to their goalkeeper, and apparently that meant they'd used up one of their subs before the match had even started.

What's that all about then? Teams are forever making last minute changes and it doesn't count towards their sub allocation.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: manfromdelmonte on June 05, 2017, 11:16:49 PM
Just read Louth Meath report. Meath made a late change to their goalkeeper, and apparently that meant they'd used up one of their subs before the match had even started.

What's that all about then? Teams are forever making last minute changes and it doesn't count towards their sub allocation.
why was he in the goal getting his hat when the 2nd goal went in???
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: BennyCake on June 05, 2017, 11:56:57 PM
Just read Louth Meath report. Meath made a late change to their goalkeeper, and apparently that meant they'd used up one of their subs before the match had even started.

What's that all about then? Teams are forever making last minute changes and it doesn't count towards their sub allocation.
why was he in the goal getting his hat when the 2nd goal went in???

Mis-read that, it wasn't the goalie, but half forward.

And yeah, that was a strange one. Was like Paddy Cullen blind-folded!
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Norf Tyrone on June 06, 2017, 08:45:23 AM
Just read Louth Meath report. Meath made a late change to their goalkeeper, and apparently that meant they'd used up one of their subs before the match had even started.

What's that all about then? Teams are forever making last minute changes and it doesn't count towards their sub allocation.

I believe if its after you've submitted the teams to the ref 30 mins before throw in you are locked in.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: twohands!!! on June 06, 2017, 09:45:03 AM
Just read Louth Meath report. Meath made a late change to their goalkeeper, and apparently that meant they'd used up one of their subs before the match had even started.

What's that all about then? Teams are forever making last minute changes and it doesn't count towards their sub allocation.

I believe if its after you've submitted the teams to the ref 30 mins before throw in you are locked in.

Yeah - I think it's a newish enough rule and only for intercounty iirc - within the last 3/4 years at Congress.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: tyroneman on June 10, 2017, 07:14:26 PM
One that you rarely see is the sideline ball being moved infield.

Pretty sure if the ref is being given cheek he can move the sideline kick onto the pitch playing area if it is more adventageous, just like he can move a normal free closer to goal.

Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Smokin Joe on June 10, 2017, 07:56:27 PM
One that you rarely see is the sideline ball being moved infield.

Pretty sure if the ref is being given cheek he can move the sideline kick onto the pitch playing area if it is more adventageous, just like he can move a normal free closer to goal.

The ref did this on one occasion last week in the Down v Armagh game.  I remember thinking that it looked odd (as its not normally done)
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Minus15 on June 13, 2017, 05:26:54 PM
It happened in one of the games in at the weekend there too, I always thought 'you couldn't move up a sideline ball'. Was this a myth or did the rule change at some point?
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: BennyCake on June 21, 2017, 05:46:41 PM
Blood subs...

I thought when the rule was introduced, the blood sub coming on had to wear a coloured armband signifying he was a blood sub?

Maybe someone could clarify.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Rossfan on June 21, 2017, 06:53:52 PM
That was done originally alright.
However that was probably too transparent for the GAA and it had to be stopped.
Blood sub rule needs some tidying up.
As it is the Ref tells a lad to go off and a temporary sub comes on. It's up to his manager then how long to leave him on for and there seems to be no time limit which leaves it open to abuse.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: mrdeeds on June 21, 2017, 07:26:07 PM
It happened in one of the games in at the weekend there too, I always thought 'you couldn't move up a sideline ball'. Was this a myth or did the rule change at some point?

Think it used to be that it could be moved in field but not forward but rule amended to allow it to be moved towards oposition goal.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Rossfan on June 22, 2017, 12:29:37 PM
I hear Jarlath's Rules Committee are bringing a tweak to the kick out before the Special Hurley Congress - that the ball has to go outside the 20m line.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: BennyCake on June 22, 2017, 01:40:42 PM
That was done originally alright.
However that was probably too transparent for the GAA and it had to be stopped.
Blood sub rule needs some tidying up.
As it is the Ref tells a lad to go off and a temporary sub comes on. It's up to his manager then how long to leave him on for and there seems to be no time limit which leaves it open to abuse.

Needs tidying indeed.

So, a player could get hurt and bloodied at same time, goes off to get blood sorted. While on sideline, he can't return due to injury, but blood sub stays on.

Can injured/bloody player just slink back to the bench hoping nobody noticed he's all cleaned up, and should be ready to return to play? Does anyone check that he returns immediately? Really then the team get away with using an extra sub?
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: AZOffaly on June 22, 2017, 03:20:01 PM
Because the ref initiates a blood sub, rather than the team, there is a loophole that can be exploited alright. But you'd want to be lucky that the ref orders a lad off that you don't mind losing :)

One of the other complications is that the returning player does NOT have to replace the lad that came on for him, and this would only count as one sub.

Example, Player A gets cut, and re calls for a sub, player B.

Player B has a stormer, but they want Player A to come back on. Player A returns for Player C.

So effectively Player A's return negates the blood sub, and Player B actually replaces Player C. It only counts as 1 sub.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Taylor on June 22, 2017, 03:30:40 PM
Season or two ago a Rugby Union team in England gave a sub a blood capsule to get around a blood sub rule (cant mind the team).

Only a matter of time before someone here is caught at it (assuming it is already taking place left, right and centre)
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: AZOffaly on June 22, 2017, 04:18:05 PM
Season or two ago a Rugby Union team in England gave a sub a blood capsule to get around a blood sub rule (cant mind the team).

Only a matter of time before someone here is caught at it (assuming it is already taking place left, right and centre)

That was Harlequins against Leinster in a Heineken Cup Quarter Final. Nick Evans it was. They went so far as to cut him with a razor in the dressing room after to try and head off suspicion.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: BennyCake on June 22, 2017, 04:33:30 PM
Season or two ago a Rugby Union team in England gave a sub a blood capsule to get around a blood sub rule (cant mind the team).

Only a matter of time before someone here is caught at it (assuming it is already taking place left, right and centre)

Tomato ketchup would do the same trick.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Taylor on June 22, 2017, 07:54:46 PM
Season or two ago a Rugby Union team in England gave a sub a blood capsule to get around a blood sub rule (cant mind the team).

Only a matter of time before someone here is caught at it (assuming it is already taking place left, right and centre)

That was Harlequins against Leinster in a Heineken Cup Quarter Final. Nick Evans it was. They went so far as to cut him with a razor in the dressing room after to try and head off suspicion.

That's the one. I have no doubt it is in our games as well. No reason to believe it isn't when we are already up to our neck in diving, drugs etc etc  :-\
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Croí na hÉireann on June 23, 2017, 09:32:00 AM
One that you rarely see is the sideline ball being moved infield.

Pretty sure if the ref is being given cheek he can move the sideline kick onto the pitch playing area if it is more adventageous, just like he can move a normal free closer to goal.

In the Offaly replay there was something similar. After Heslin scored one of the late goals, Tommy McDaniels ran into the goal, retrieved the ball and kicked it straight into the stand. Referee brought the kickout forward the 13m and the keeper took it out of his hands. Fella operating the scoreboard thought the referee was giving a free out due to where and how the kickout was taken and promptly removed the goal from the scoreboard. This led to confusion in the stand and on the various media platforms until it reappeared without notice on the scoreboard 5 minutes later.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: blewuporstuffed on June 23, 2017, 10:25:41 AM
Season or two ago a Rugby Union team in England gave a sub a blood capsule to get around a blood sub rule (cant mind the team).

Only a matter of time before someone here is caught at it (assuming it is already taking place left, right and centre)

That was Harlequins against Leinster in a Heineken Cup Quarter Final. Nick Evans it was. They went so far as to cut him with a razor in the dressing room after to try and head off suspicion.

I witnessed in a Tyrone senior championship game a few years ago, a player go down injured and the physio coming on to treat him, it was pretty obvious he wouldnt be able to continue and the team had already used their subs,so the physio hit him a box in the mouth to draw blood !!

Happened right in front of us,we couldnt believe it ;D ;D ;D.

That's the one. I have no doubt it is in our games as well. No reason to believe it isn't when we are already up to our neck in diving, drugs etc etc  :-\
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: BennyCake on June 23, 2017, 10:59:07 AM
Ah, that's Tyrone for ye!
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: PMG1 on June 23, 2017, 08:21:58 PM
Season or two ago a Rugby Union team in England gave a sub a blood capsule to get around a blood sub rule (cant mind the team).

Only a matter of time before someone here is caught at it (assuming it is already taking place left, right and centre)

That was Harlequins against Leinster in a Heineken Cup Quarter Final. Nick Evans it was. They went so far as to cut him with a razor in the dressing room after to try and head off suspicion.

I witnessed in a Tyrone senior championship game a few years ago, a player go down injured and the physio coming on to treat him, it was pretty obvious he wouldnt be able to continue and the team had already used their subs,so the physio hit him a box in the mouth to draw blood !!

Happened right in front of us,we couldnt believe it ;D ;D ;D.

That's the one. I have no doubt it is in our games as well. No reason to believe it isn't when we are already up to our neck in diving, drugs etc etc  :-\
I remember that incident well,  think there was actually red sauce used, was laughable but they went on to won the game
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: tonto1888 on July 09, 2017, 10:37:48 PM
Going to use roscommons second goal as an example but there's plenty. How many steps can you take? Do refs just ignore it at times?? Or have I missed a rule change?
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Main Street on July 30, 2017, 02:40:35 PM
I'm confused (common enough) on the difference between a legal 2 /3 man tackle and an illegal one.
Oft times I see almost exactly the same scenario being played out, a player on the ball receiving slaps/blows from 2 or more players simultaneoulsly, sometimes the foul is given, sometimes not.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: hardstation on July 30, 2017, 02:53:20 PM
I'm confused (common enough) on the difference between a legal 2 /3 man tackle and an illegal one.
Oft times I see almost exactly the same scenario being played out, a player on the ball receiving slaps/blows from 2 or more players simultaneoulsly, sometimes the foul is given, sometimes not.
If the player is fouled, it's a free. If he is not, it's not.
A player may be legally tackled by 15 players simultaneously.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Zulu on July 30, 2017, 02:56:18 PM
You're only allowed play the ball so if any of the three defenders hit Donaghy rather than the ball it was a free, though I know that's not really how it's reffed. Thought it was a free myself.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Main Street on July 30, 2017, 03:38:28 PM
You wouldn't mind (within reason) contact from one tackler in an attempt to get the ball, happens all the time,  but 2/3  players flaying away simulaneoulsy with arms and hands  is a clear foul.  I thought the interpretation was back in the day of the swarm, that there could only be one active while others can swarm around, blocking.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Hardy on August 02, 2017, 01:39:56 PM
There's nothing in the rules (never was, I'm fairly sure) about the number of players who can tackle and I don't remember any interpretation of rules that considered the number of payers involved.

I think it's one of those mythical rules that were imagined into existence by force of erroneous reference, like rolling ball, you can't tackle the goalkeeper, etc.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Esmarelda on August 02, 2017, 02:47:47 PM
Going to use roscommons second goal as an example but there's plenty. How many steps can you take? Do refs just ignore it at times?? Or have I missed a rule change?
No, but  you've missed a full thread on the subject.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: DuffleKing on August 02, 2017, 03:42:54 PM
There's nothing in the rules (never was, I'm fairly sure) about the number of players who can tackle and I don't remember any interpretation of rules that considered the number of payers involved.

I think it's one of those mythical rules that were imagined into existence by force of erroneous reference, like rolling ball, you can't tackle the goalkeeper, etc.

Correcto (2 turns ref!)
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Main Street on August 02, 2017, 08:55:08 PM
"The tackle is a skill by which one or more players may dispossess an opponent or frustrate his objective within the rules of fair play. A tackle is aimed at the ball, not the player. A tackler may use his body to confront the opponent, but deliberate bodily contact such as punching, slapping, arm-holding, pushing, tripping, jersey pulling or a full frontal charge is forbidden."

My point is there is leeway for one player to tackle and make body contact at the same time but when you have 2 and 3 doing it at the same time, flaying arms in unison, then imo that's a foul.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: DuffleKing on August 03, 2017, 10:48:07 AM
"The tackle is a skill by which one or more players may dispossess an opponent or frustrate his objective within the rules of fair play. A tackle is aimed at the ball, not the player. A tackler may use his body to confront the opponent, but deliberate bodily contact such as punching, slapping, arm-holding, pushing, tripping, jersey pulling or a full frontal charge is forbidden."

My point is there is leeway for one player to tackle and make body contact at the same time but when you have 2 and 3 doing it at the same time, flaying arms in unison, then imo that's a foul.

That tackle definition isn't fit for purpose.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Rossfan on August 03, 2017, 11:21:10 AM
What are "the rules of fair play"?
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Main Street on August 03, 2017, 03:35:34 PM
"The tackle is a skill by which one or more players may dispossess an opponent or frustrate his objective within the rules of fair play. A tackle is aimed at the ball, not the player. A tackler may use his body to confront the opponent, but deliberate bodily contact such as punching, slapping, arm-holding, pushing, tripping, jersey pulling or a full frontal charge is forbidden."

My point is there is leeway for one player to tackle and make body contact at the same time but when you have 2 and 3 doing it at the same time, flaying arms in unison, then imo that's a foul.

That tackle definition isn't fit for purpose.
who said it was fit for purpose, but it's a standard not a gospel.
Slapping, punching, pushing within limits is allowed when you have one tackler doing it, but 2 or 3  slapping, punching, pushing  at the same time? is that fit for purpose?

Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: macdanger2 on September 30, 2017, 11:16:20 PM
Heard on the news that a rule about kickouts having to go outside the 21 got approved at Congress today. Didn't even realise this was up for discussion. Big enough change and will definitely have an effect next year
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: hardstation on September 30, 2017, 11:22:33 PM
Yes, it will get to the stage where an x will be marked on the field as the optimum catching spot for spectator enjoyment. Any player to catch the ball on this spot will receive a £50 Amazon voucher.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Rossfan on October 01, 2017, 12:38:36 AM
Anything that encourages the ball being kicked forward is to be welcomed.
This was signalled from way back but in typical GAA world fashion no one notices till it's passed.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: mrhardyannual on October 01, 2017, 01:39:56 AM
Heard on the news that a rule about kickouts having to go outside the 21 got approved at Congress today. Didn't even realise this was up for discussion. Big enough change and will definitely have an effect next year
Good move. Along with the mark it should ensure more high fielding.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: macdanger2 on October 02, 2017, 10:41:03 PM
Anything that encourages the ball being kicked forward is to be welcomed.
This was signalled from way back but in typical GAA world fashion no one notices till it's passed.

Fair enough it was presumably signalled but I didn't hear it discussed on any podcasts or papers. Or even on here, was it discussed? Overall, I think it's likely to be positive but it definitely came in under the radar
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: BennyCake on February 02, 2018, 11:16:25 PM
Apologies if discussed previously.

So, up to the third black card, player can be replaced.

Does a team get an additional black card sub, if the game goes to extra time?
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: BennyCake on November 20, 2018, 08:06:56 PM
Who sets the rules for free-kick shootouts after extra time?

Mullahoran and Banagher had to participate at the weekend, and both management said they weren’t  in favour. Just wondered if it was ulster council or gaa hq who set the rules of this?

What would have been the penalty if both teams had have refused to take part in the shootout?
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Rossfan on November 20, 2018, 08:48:15 PM
I'd imagine it's HQ  finish on the day and all that.
Would both  clubs be disqualified?
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Milltown Row2 on November 20, 2018, 09:41:11 PM
Who sets the rules for free-kick shootouts after extra time?

Mullahoran and Banagher had to participate at the weekend, and both management said they weren’t  in favour. Just wondered if it was ulster council or gaa hq who set the rules of this?

What would have been the penalty if both teams had have refused to take part in the shootout?


I’d imagine St Endas would have been crowned champions, it’s not like that’s the first time it’s happened, the players managers and club officials would have known long beforehand, emails or even meetings in some cases are held and club secretary is informed of times regulations on subs water carriers and so.. the place to object is before the match!
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: BennyCake on November 20, 2018, 10:04:38 PM
Fair enough so.

Still, a shitty way to decide a match.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Milltown Row2 on November 20, 2018, 10:28:55 PM
Fair enough so.

Still, a shitty way to decide a match.

Rotten, and I’d only use the method if the other game is 7 days away, if there is a 2 week gap then play the game on the Wednesday night to a finish then.. it needs to be looked at but time constraints can upset the other team having to wait and extra week sitting on their hands
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: theticklemister on November 20, 2018, 10:30:31 PM
A fella goes to catch the ball

He has it, ref blows whistle, and somehow he drops it

what would the referee do?
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Milltown Row2 on November 20, 2018, 10:37:32 PM
A fella goes to catch the ball

He has it, ref blows whistle, and somehow he drops it

what would the referee do?

He has to be in possession when he lands on his feet.

One that gets me and I’ll be honest, if the ball is kicked out and one lad goes for a catch comes off his hands and it’s wrestled away into another players hands before he lands is it a mark?

The ball during the ping pong moment hasn’t touched the ground
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: theticklemister on November 20, 2018, 10:44:21 PM
A fella goes to catch the ball

He has it, ref blows whistle, and somehow he drops it

what would the referee do?

He has to be in possession when he lands on his feet.

One that gets me and I’ll be honest, if the ball is kicked out and one lad goes for a catch comes off his hands and it’s wrestled away into another players hands before he lands is it a mark?

The ball during the ping pong moment hasn’t touched the ground

it caught me twice this year, once at the weekend during a uni game. I said to the lad, he didn't complete the mark, therefore he can't keep possession. The opposition player came in and claimed possession, but because the fella who dropped its team were down a bucketful, i threw the ball up.

It's not in the mark rule guidelines by the GAA
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: theticklemister on November 20, 2018, 10:45:48 PM
A fella goes to catch the ball

He has it, ref blows whistle, and somehow he drops it

what would the referee do?

He has to be in possession when he lands on his feet.

One that gets me and I’ll be honest, if the ball is kicked out and one lad goes for a catch comes off his hands and it’s wrestled away into another players hands before he lands is it a mark?

The ball during the ping pong moment hasn’t touched the ground

No that is not a mark, the catch has to be done without the ball touching any other player. The player who eventually marks the ball can juggle with it as long as he wants as long it doesnt touch another player
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Milltown Row2 on November 20, 2018, 10:54:43 PM
A fella goes to catch the ball

He has it, ref blows whistle, and somehow he drops it

what would the referee do?

He has to be in possession when he lands on his feet.

One that gets me and I’ll be honest, if the ball is kicked out and one lad goes for a catch comes off his hands and it’s wrestled away into another players hands before he lands is it a mark?

The ball during the ping pong moment hasn’t touched the ground

No that is not a mark, the catch has to be done without the ball touching any other player. The player who eventually marks the ball can juggle with it as long as he wants as long it doesnt touch another player

That’s a hard call when three players go for a ball there are hands on that ball by 3 players, even though a player ‘catches’ it!
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: theticklemister on November 20, 2018, 11:00:20 PM
A fella goes to catch the ball

He has it, ref blows whistle, and somehow he drops it

what would the referee do?

He has to be in possession when he lands on his feet.

One that gets me and I’ll be honest, if the ball is kicked out and one lad goes for a catch comes off his hands and it’s wrestled away into another players hands before he lands is it a mark?

The ball during the ping pong moment hasn’t touched the ground

No that is not a mark, the catch has to be done without the ball touching any other player. The player who eventually marks the ball can juggle with it as long as he wants as long it doesnt touch another player

That’s a hard call when three players go for a ball there are hands on that ball by 3 players, even though a player ‘catches’ it!

What would you do with my predicament?
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Milltown Row2 on November 20, 2018, 11:08:46 PM
A fella goes to catch the ball

He has it, ref blows whistle, and somehow he drops it

what would the referee do?

He has to be in possession when he lands on his feet.

One that gets me and I’ll be honest, if the ball is kicked out and one lad goes for a catch comes off his hands and it’s wrestled away into another players hands before he lands is it a mark?

The ball during the ping pong moment hasn’t touched the ground

No that is not a mark, the catch has to be done without the ball touching any other player. The player who eventually marks the ball can juggle with it as long as he wants as long it doesnt touch another player

That’s a hard call when three players go for a ball there are hands on that ball by 3 players, even though a player ‘catches’ it!

What would you do with my predicament?

If you blow your whistle for the mark then stand over it, but delay your next call until you’re sure  :)
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Hound on November 21, 2018, 07:27:01 AM


If you blow your whistle for the mark then stand over it, but delay your next call until you’re sure  :)

Seen it at club level in Dublin 4 or 5 times this year. A player looks like he's claiming a mark, the ref blows the whistle and simultaneously the players drops the ball before completing the catch. In all those cases, the ref gave the mark. I think rightly so. The whistle signals the completion of the mark (rightly or wrongly!). And perhaps in some of those cases the player might have argued that the whistle blowing jolted his concentration resulting in the ball dropping.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: LeoMc on November 21, 2018, 09:04:55 AM


If you blow your whistle for the mark then stand over it, but delay your next call until you’re sure  :)

Seen it at club level in Dublin 4 or 5 times this year. A player looks like he's claiming a mark, the ref blows the whistle and simultaneously the players drops the ball before completing the catch. In all those cases, the ref gave the mark. I think rightly so. The whistle signals the completion of the mark (rightly or wrongly!). And perhaps in some of those cases the player might have argued that the whistle blowing jolted his concentration resulting in the ball dropping.

Agreed. Refs can make wrong calls  :o but once it is made it is made.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: BennyCake on November 21, 2018, 12:04:50 PM
Reading an article about Weeshie Fogarty.

Apparently as a referee, he gave out the first yellow card when the GAA trialled yellow/reds in 1979. Makes you wonder why on earth it wasn’t continued?! It’s a no brainer!

Then again, Tyrone might have beat Dublin in 1995 had Charlie been on the sideline like he should have been. Every cloud, and all that...
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Manning18 on November 21, 2018, 05:36:19 PM
Little off topic but we've no hurling threads to go to really. Changing the ball from white to yellow for visibility, as tennis did back in the day.

https://www.independent.ie/sport/gaelic-games/hurling/gaa-set-to-standardise-yellow-sliotar-after-fenway-classic-37552182.html

Can see a bit of a kick back on this from the odd person, a hurler mentioned just the week past watching the Fenway that different colored balls annoyed him. We'd always have had the odd luminous orange one lying around training and i did find it strange, certainly moreso than the yellow "floodlight football" but probably something you'd get used to.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Nanderson on May 03, 2019, 10:15:59 PM
Does anyone know the official rule for kickouts. Seems to be in club games that referees interrupt the rules different from each other. Our keeper says that the ball can be kicked from the 14 yard line and as long as it travels outside the 21 yard line it is legal even if they are standing inside the D. A ref blew it up as a hopball in our game tonight. who is right?
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Walt Jabsco on May 03, 2019, 10:41:36 PM
Here is the rule regarding kick outs.
Question - Did the ball travel more than 13 m

2.7 (a) When the ball is played over the endline by
the Team attacking that end, or after a score
is made, play is restarted by a kick-out off the
ground from the 13m line and within the large
rectangle.
 If the goalkeeper is not taking the kick-out, he
shall stay in the small rectangle, and all other
players, except the player taking the kick-out,
shall be outside the 20m line and 13m from the
ball, until it has been kicked.
 The player taking a kick-out may kick the
ball more than once before any other player
touches it but may not take the ball into his
hands.
 The ball shall travel 13m before being played
by another player of the defending team
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Nanderson on May 03, 2019, 10:46:57 PM
Here is the rule regarding kick outs.
Question - Did the ball travel more than 13 m
How is the referee meant to know how far 13m is? Should the semi circle be remarked on each pitch as a 13m radius from the 14 yard line then there is a definate region that you cannot be allowed in
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Walt Jabsco on May 03, 2019, 11:18:15 PM
The semi circle was introduced to ensure that all players were 13 metres from the player taking a penalty.It has no relevance regarding a kick out presently but in the past when kick outs were taken at different points whether it be a wide or a score it had relevance. With the kick out from the 13 m line after a wide or a score it done away with this requirement
You asked how does a referee know how they know if a ball has traveled 13m.  The same way he/she makes a judgement if a player is too close to a player taking a sideline or a free - it is a judgement call.

The introduction of the semi circle by a rules revision committee some years back who thought it would be  a good idea but there was a knock on effect on the existing rules in force at that time for both football and hurling and had to be revised. This is something I feel Rules Revision Committees do not take into consideration - the consequences of proposed rule changes and how it affects other rules.     
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Stall the Bailer on May 03, 2019, 11:48:03 PM
You are actually 22m from a penalty taker now when outside the D, as the penalty was moved in 2m from the 13m line where it used to be. Even though the kick out and penalty positions have changed, the exclusion zone hasn't
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Rossfan on May 03, 2019, 11:54:51 PM
So the player taking the kick out can tap  it 5 or 6 metres and then kick it again?
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: westbound on May 04, 2019, 12:39:50 AM
So the player taking the kick out can tap  it 5 or 6 metres and then kick it again?

Technically yes, but there is nothing to stop an attacker tackling him after he taps it the first time!

In theory the player taking the kickout could 'dribble' it all the way to the far end of the pitch (if not opponent bothered to tackle him!)
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: hardstation on May 04, 2019, 01:12:21 PM
So the player taking the kick out can tap  it 5 or 6 metres and then kick it again?

Technically yes, but there is nothing to stop an attacker tackling him after he taps it the first time!

In theory the player taking the kickout could 'dribble' it all the way to the far end of the pitch (if not opponent bothered to tackle him!)
Don’t worry, we’re getting there.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Nanderson on June 10, 2019, 09:23:45 PM
If a team has a sideline ball, and the opposition stop them from taking it quickly and its moved up 10 yards or so, does it still stay as a sideline or does it become a free kick?
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Hound on June 10, 2019, 09:31:30 PM
If a team has a sideline ball, and the opposition stop them from taking it quickly and its moved up 10 yards or so, does it still stay as a sideline or does it become a free kick?
Becomes a free
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Nanderson on June 10, 2019, 09:35:09 PM
If a team has a sideline ball, and the opposition stop them from taking it quickly and its moved up 10 yards or so, does it still stay as a sideline or does it become a free kick?
Becomes a free
Thats what i thought but our referee tonight blew a player up for standing over the line
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: manfromdelmonte on June 10, 2019, 09:47:21 PM
If a team has a sideline ball, and the opposition stop them from taking it quickly and its moved up 10 yards or so, does it still stay as a sideline or does it become a free kick?
Can you bring a sideline closer to the opposition goals? News to me
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Hound on June 10, 2019, 09:49:58 PM
If a team has a sideline ball, and the opposition stop them from taking it quickly and its moved up 10 yards or so, does it still stay as a sideline or does it become a free kick?
Becomes a free
Thats what i thought but our referee tonight blew a player up for standing over the line
But if it’s brought 14m closer to the goal, the kick shouldn’t be anywhere near the sideline.
That’s the way it happens in Dublin club football anyway. Never seen it brought forward by just moving down the line.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Nanderson on June 10, 2019, 09:54:21 PM
If a team has a sideline ball, and the opposition stop them from taking it quickly and its moved up 10 yards or so, does it still stay as a sideline or does it become a free kick?
Becomes a free
Thats what i thought but our referee tonight blew a player up for standing over the line
But if it’s brought 14m closer to the goal, the kick shouldn’t be anywhere near the sideline.
That’s the way it happens in Dublin club football anyway. Never seen it brought forward by just moving down the line.
he just moved it down the line 10 yards and our player kicked it about 2 yards onto the pitch. He's a pretty shit ref so im not surprised he doesnt know the rules
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: DuffleKing on June 11, 2019, 05:55:58 AM

Jesus lads. Pet hate alert...

If we are measuring distance for Gaelic football in terms of moving the ball up, how far a free travels, etc. Its 14 yards or 13 metres.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Tyrdub on June 11, 2019, 09:47:20 AM

Jesus lads. Pet hate alert...

If we are measuring distance for Gaelic football in terms of moving the ball up, how far a free travels, etc. Its 14 yards or 13 metres.

13m
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: theticklemister on June 14, 2019, 07:17:19 AM
Reffed a game last night and got a bit of dogs abuse from both teams. Retired to the bar after and met some of players. Being in Britain we’re closely knit so you know them all and we all frequent same local.

“Je lad you were not good today “ came the call from a few boys from both teams.

“Fair enough”, I said “what did I do wrong?”

One boy said

“Them two high tackles should have been black cards”

I replied “a high tackle is not a black card, I gave two yellows to their men as it didn’t warrant a red”

He continued

“ what about the the hop ball you give when we had the free?”

I responded “ yes you won free, but your man gave a sly dig with elbow. I was standing 5 metres away whilst you were 50 meters away”.

He went on “why did you gave their team a free after everyone starting pushing each other?”

I came back at him “when the player in your team tried and boot the ball off the other mans head, the ball ended up going to the opposition team anyway. A schomzzle broke out. I stopped play to deal with it. The other team were in possession of ball so I gave them possession from the restart.”

Another player, “why did you give the hop ball from the lockout?”

“Because it didn’t go 13 metre”

“ it if cross the line”

“It did, but still needs to travel 13m”.



F
U
C
I
I
N
G

H
E
L
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Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: hardstation on June 14, 2019, 08:28:48 AM
They’re right though. You’re a w4nker.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: theticklemister on June 14, 2019, 08:39:57 AM
They’re right though. You’re a w4nker.

He didn’t say I was a w**ker
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: BennyHarp on June 14, 2019, 09:08:50 AM
Reffed a game last night and got a bit of dogs abuse from both teams. Retired to the bar after and met some of players. Being in Britain we’re closely knit so you know them all and we all frequent same local.

“Je lad you were not good today “ came the call from a few boys from both teams.

“Fair enough”, I said “what did I do wrong?”

One boy said

“Them two high tackles should have been black cards”

I replied “a high tackle is not a black card, I gave two yellows to their men as it didn’t warrant a red”

He continued

“ what about the the hop ball you give when we had the free?”

I responded “ yes you won free, but your man gave a sly dig with elbow. I was standing 5 metres away whilst you were 50 meters away”.

He went on “why did you gave their team a free after everyone starting pushing each other?”

I came back at him “when the player in your team tried and boot the ball off the other mans head, the ball ended up going to the opposition team anyway. A schomzzle broke out. I stopped play to deal with it. The other team were in possession of ball so I gave them possession from the restart.”

Another player, “why did you give the hop ball from the lockout?”

“Because it didn’t go 13 metre”

“ it if cross the line”

“It did, but still needs to travel 13m”.



F
U
C
I
I
N
G

H
E
L
L

The problem is that people have their own blinkered version of the rules. It's a tough enough job in Ireland - its a bloody awful job over here. Keep up the good work fella.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Milltown Row2 on June 15, 2019, 12:50:43 AM
The amount of wankers that don’t know the rules!

I’d a referee from a local club pull me during a kids tournament to say it’s a hop ball if a player touches it before the required distance! A proper balloon who would give the rest of the refs a bad name!
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: marty34 on June 15, 2019, 09:02:12 AM
The amount of w**kers that don’t know the rules!

I’d a referee from a local club pull me during a kids tournament to say it’s a hop ball if a player touches it before the required distance! A proper balloon who would give the rest of the refs a bad name!

That's the issue - people don't have a clue about the rules - not a clue.

At an All Ireland hurling semi-final a couple of yesrs ago. Somebody behind me shouted, 'That's a black card'...omg.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: theticklemister on June 15, 2019, 10:52:17 AM
The amount of w**kers that don’t know the rules!

I’d a referee from a local club pull me during a kids tournament to say it’s a hop ball if a player touches it before the required distance! A proper balloon who would give the rest of the refs a bad name!

That's the issue - people don't have a clue about the rules - not a clue.

At an All Ireland hurling semi-final a couple of yesrs ago. Somebody behind me shouted, 'That's a black card'...omg.


Got this chucked at me in a ladies game too ffs
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Never beat the deeler on June 26, 2019, 05:23:13 AM
Can anyone tell me if Clifford fouls the ball here?

He takes possession and hops the ball. After the hop he flicks it up in the air and catches it before it bounces. I would have thought this would be similar to handpassing the ball over someone's head and catching it.

https://twitter.com/officialgaa/status/1143603014072188929 (https://twitter.com/officialgaa/status/1143603014072188929)
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Ball Hopper on June 26, 2019, 05:44:17 AM
Can anyone tell me if Clifford fouls the ball here?

He takes possession and hops the ball. After the hop he flicks it up in the air and catches it before it bounces. I would have thought this would be similar to handpassing the ball over someone's head and catching it.

https://twitter.com/officialgaa/status/1143603014072188929 (https://twitter.com/officialgaa/status/1143603014072188929)

Never took possession after the first (only) hop?

His mind appears at a different level, foul or not, though.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Never beat the deeler on June 26, 2019, 07:39:28 AM
Can anyone tell me if Clifford fouls the ball here?

He takes possession and hops the ball. After the hop he flicks it up in the air and catches it before it bounces. I would have thought this would be similar to handpassing the ball over someone's head and catching it.

https://twitter.com/officialgaa/status/1143603014072188929 (https://twitter.com/officialgaa/status/1143603014072188929)

Never took possession after the first (only) hop?

His mind appears at a different level, foul or not, though.

I don't deny it was a great piece of quick thinking (or instinct, I suppose). Kindof reminded me of the AFL goal of the season from Jack Higgins last year where he handballed the ball and ran around the post to kick it in.


https://www.afl.com.au/video/2018-07-28/is-this-goal-of-the-year (https://www.afl.com.au/video/2018-07-28/is-this-goal-of-the-year)
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Milltown Row2 on June 26, 2019, 07:42:27 AM
Can anyone tell me if Clifford fouls the ball here?

He takes possession and hops the ball. After the hop he flicks it up in the air and catches it before it bounces. I would have thought this would be similar to handpassing the ball over someone's head and catching it.

https://twitter.com/officialgaa/status/1143603014072188929 (https://twitter.com/officialgaa/status/1143603014072188929)

Never took possession after the first (only) hop?

His mind appears at a different level, foul or not, though.

It could be seen as, he hopped the ball then he slipped so lost control  and flicked it over his head and played on, or a ref would have been just as right to call it as a throw and catch before the ball either touched the ground or a player
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: DuffleKing on June 26, 2019, 08:17:42 AM

There's no way anyone who understands the rules could call a foul on clifford.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Main Street on June 26, 2019, 10:41:44 AM

There's no way anyone who understands the rules could call a foul on clifford.
With a foul being called, can a player in possession of the ball, hop the ball and instead of catching the ball on the rebound, decide to fist it over an opponent's head, run around and repossess the ball?
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: magpie seanie on June 26, 2019, 01:18:16 PM

There's no way anyone who understands the rules could call a foul on clifford.


+1.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: DuffleKing on June 26, 2019, 03:18:46 PM

There's no way anyone who understands the rules could call a foul on clifford.
With a foul being called, can a player in possession of the ball, hop the ball and instead of catching the ball on the rebound, decide to fist it over an opponent's head, run around and repossess the ball?

That is perfectly legal
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: delgany on June 26, 2019, 09:55:33 PM
If he had hand passed the ball over the opponent, it would have to bounce . But it was a open handed flick ! So I presume its ok
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: BennyCake on June 26, 2019, 10:22:58 PM
Can a player stand on the crossbar to stop a free kick going over the bar? Or stand on another players shoulder?
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Milltown Row2 on June 26, 2019, 10:40:22 PM
Can a player stand on the crossbar to stop a free kick going over the bar? Or stand on another players shoulder?

Players (namely goalkeepers) can’t interfere with the goal posts during an opponents free, yellow card.

Not sure on the other one though I’d say that’s it’s dangerous so the ref would stop it
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Never beat the deeler on June 26, 2019, 10:45:57 PM

There's no way anyone who understands the rules could call a foul on clifford.

That's part of the problem, though. Understanding the rules. There is too much room for interpretation.

Clifford here isn't juggling the ball trying to gain control. He is in control the entire time. He flicks the ball up over the defenders head and catches it before it hits the ground.

If this was out the field and a player, running towards another player, did the same it would be blown up (imo)
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Milltown Row2 on June 26, 2019, 11:01:37 PM

There's no way anyone who understands the rules could call a foul on clifford.

That's part of the problem, though. Understanding the rules. There is too much room for interpretation.

Clifford here isn't juggling the ball trying to gain control. He is in control the entire time. He flicks the ball up over the defenders head and catches it before it hits the ground.

If this was out the field and a player, running towards another player, did the same it would be blown up (imo)

Could be looked at this way, he slipped gain control quickly and flicked it over head and gained possession.

Either way it’s down to the refs interpretation of what happened at that split second, 20 refs would be split down the middle on that one, I guarantee that one will be used at a refs meeting next year
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Never beat the deeler on June 27, 2019, 12:36:54 AM

There's no way anyone who understands the rules could call a foul on clifford.

That's part of the problem, though. Understanding the rules. There is too much room for interpretation.

Clifford here isn't juggling the ball trying to gain control. He is in control the entire time. He flicks the ball up over the defenders head and catches it before it hits the ground.

If this was out the field and a player, running towards another player, did the same it would be blown up (imo)

Could be looked at this way, he slipped gain control quickly and flicked it over head and gained possession.

Either way it’s down to the refs interpretation of what happened at that split second, 20 refs would be split down the middle on that one, I guarantee that one will be used at a refs meeting next year

Agree with what you are saying - it could be interpreted that way. I don't think that's what happened though

I think it's not as clear cut as "There's no way anyone who understands the rules could call a foul on clifford."
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Main Street on June 27, 2019, 02:34:42 AM

There's no way anyone who understands the rules could call a foul on clifford.
With a foul being called, can a player in possession of the ball, hop the ball and instead of catching the ball on the rebound, decide to fist it over an opponent's head, run around and repossess the ball?

That is perfectly legal
Thanks, though  i meant to write ‘without a foul being called’, the answer still fits he question.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: David McKeown on June 27, 2019, 08:25:13 AM
I thought the Clifford incident was a foul. You aren’t allowed to transfer the possession of the ball from one hand to another unless both hands are on the ball simultaneously I thought.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: DuffleKing on June 27, 2019, 09:10:53 AM

No, Clifford is not in possession or control of the ball at the instant he flicks it over the defender's head. The ball has been bounced but possession is not regained - it's in the air.

In the same way that he could score a goal with that action whereas he couldn't if he was in control of the ball
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: magpie seanie on June 27, 2019, 09:21:39 AM

No, Clifford is not in possession or control of the ball at the instant he flicks it over the defender's head. The ball has been bounced but possession is not regained - it's in the air.

In the same way that he could score a goal with that action whereas he couldn't if he was in control of the ball


Correct. I didn't think this was so difficult.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: David McKeown on June 27, 2019, 09:46:54 AM

No, Clifford is not in possession or control of the ball at the instant he flicks it over the defender's head. The ball has been bounced but possession is not regained - it's in the air.

In the same way that he could score a goal with that action whereas he couldn't if he was in control of the ball

I’m going to completely disagree here in respect of a goal. Clifford has possession of the ball. Bounces it but doesn’t lose possession therefore he retains possession in the split second before flicking it over the head and catching it with his other hand. If you were correct then all you had to do score a fisted goal is bounce the ball and punch it as it comes back up.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Harold Disgracey on June 27, 2019, 10:30:03 AM
Can a player stand on the crossbar to stop a free kick going over the bar? Or stand on another players shoulder?

Didn’t McGeeney lift Andrew McCann in the air in a vain attempt to block Maurice Fitzgerald’s late free in the drawn 2000 semi?
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: BennyCake on June 27, 2019, 01:53:23 PM
Can a player stand on the crossbar to stop a free kick going over the bar? Or stand on another players shoulder?

Didn’t McGeeney lift Andrew McCann in the air in a vain attempt to block Maurice Fitzgerald’s late free in the drawn 2000 semi?

Yes I had that in mind when asking that question.

Just wondered if he had have stood on his shoulders, and he blocked the ball, would it have been allowed?

Or if two or three players created a set of stairs for another player(s) to run up them, and get high into the air to block the kick. I mean, as long as he/they was far enough away from the kicker, why wouldn’t that be allowed?
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: DuffleKing on June 27, 2019, 03:20:36 PM

No, Clifford is not in possession or control of the ball at the instant he flicks it over the defender's head. The ball has been bounced but possession is not regained - it's in the air.

In the same way that he could score a goal with that action whereas he couldn't if he was in control of the ball

I’m going to completely disagree here in respect of a goal. Clifford has possession of the ball. Bounces it but doesn’t lose possession therefore he retains possession in the split second before flicking it over the head and catching it with his other hand. If you were correct then all you had to do score a fisted goal is bounce the ball and punch it as it comes back up.

Correct - that would be a legitimate goal. Who would risk the timing and variances of a bounce when bearing down on a keeper?
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: David McKeown on June 27, 2019, 04:36:08 PM

No, Clifford is not in possession or control of the ball at the instant he flicks it over the defender's head. The ball has been bounced but possession is not regained - it's in the air.

In the same way that he could score a goal with that action whereas he couldn't if he was in control of the ball

I’m going to completely disagree here in respect of a goal. Clifford has possession of the ball. Bounces it but doesn’t lose possession therefore he retains possession in the split second before flicking it over the head and catching it with his other hand. If you were correct then all you had to do score a fisted goal is bounce the ball and punch it as it comes back up.

Correct - that would be a legitimate goal. Who would risk the timing and variances of a bounce when bearing down on a keeper?

I disagree you remain in possession of the ball when bouncing it. Playing rule 1 states:

When a player is in possession of the ball, it may be:-
(a) carried for a maximum of four consecutive steps or held in the hand(s) for no longer than the time needed to take four steps;
(b) played from the foot to the hand(s) -toe- tapped;
(c) bounced once, and once after each toe-tap;
(d) changed from one hand to the other once,
with the original holding hand maintaining
contact until the change is completed;

Playing rule 3 states as far as is relevant

A player on the team attacking a goal and who is in possession of the ball may not score:
(i) by carrying the ball over his opponents’ goal line;
(ii) a goal with his hands except as provided in Rule 1.2, Exception (ii) but may score a point with the open hand(s) or fist.

Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: David McKeown on June 27, 2019, 04:44:47 PM
So for me Clifford fouled the ball by transferring it between hands in effect throwing the ball
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Keyser soze on June 27, 2019, 04:51:22 PM
If he had  soloed [sp] the ball and it skipped away from him and he then flicked it to another player that would not be deemed a foul by most referees as you would see that regularly happening in matches and I cannot recall it ever being penalised, so why should it be any different because he bounced the ball/
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: David McKeown on June 27, 2019, 06:15:13 PM
If he had  soloed [sp] the ball and it skipped away from him and he then flicked it to another player that would not be deemed a foul by most referees as you would see that regularly happening in matches and I cannot recall it ever being penalised, so why should it be any different because he bounced the ball/

Your example is different for a couple of reasons. 1. If the ball skipped away from him after a solo then he arguably wouldn’t be in possession any more. 2 There is nothing wrong with bouncing the ball then as it’s coming back to your hand flicking it to a team mate but transferring it between hands or scoring are specifically not allowed under the rules.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: twohands!!! on June 27, 2019, 10:07:24 PM
There's no way that Clifford has possession for the entire passage of play.

If the Cork back hadn't bought the dummy and dived in, it would have been relatively easy for him to just jump up and win possession of the ball travelling through the air after Clifford flicks it up.

I don't see how can Clifford be deemed to be in possession of the ball, if the Cork player (or any other player) could have obtained possession by simply plucking it out of the air?


 

Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Main Street on June 27, 2019, 11:55:17 PM
So for me Clifford fouled the ball by transferring it between hands in effect throwing the ball
In that incident I don't see what Clifford did that is covered by the rule on changing hands.
The question is , did Clifford break this rule?
'To play the ball up with the hand(s) and catch it again before it touches the ground, another player, or goal-posts.'

if he didn't foul and is deemed not to have been in possession of the ball when he flicked it over the head of the Cork player, then the change of hands does not come into the equation.
It's either he fouled when when flicking the ball over and catching it, or not? 

Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: westbound on June 28, 2019, 12:05:14 PM
If a player bounces (or solos) the ball with nobody near him and it goes a little bit too high and he taps it with one hand to bring the ball down and then catches it in the other hand.....is that a foul?

That's effectively what clifford did (except there was a defender in the way).

Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Rossfan on June 28, 2019, 12:48:29 PM
Not related to the specific recent discussion but couldn't think of anywhere more suitable

https://m.independent.ie/sport/gaelic-games/gaelic-football/central-council-to-decide-fate-of-football-rule-experiments-38261030.html
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Mad Mentor on June 28, 2019, 01:53:14 PM
As is obvious from this thread, there are many grey areas in the rules. I believe referees are briefed at the start of the year about changes and interpretation of the rules but this is never rolled out to the players and managers of teams. In our club we have a football team at one juvenile grade only, (this is only because one parent is willing to run it and we are a hurling club) so knowledge of the rules is a bit hazy and we concede a lot of frees for fouls the lads don't even know they are committing. However I see teams who have played for years committing similar fouls - and getting called for it- so it's not just our lads lack of knowledge at fault. I believe there is an onus on all county boards to introduce training to all juvenile players about the rules which might help reduce some of the abuse referees get. It seems that the ref is the only person allowed to make a mistake in a match and players can make as many as they like. All young players should have to do some refereeing to see what it's like. It might stop some of the abuse.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: twohands!!! on June 28, 2019, 05:22:23 PM
As is obvious from this thread, there are many grey areas in the rules. I believe referees are briefed at the start of the year about changes and interpretation of the rules but this is never rolled out to the players and managers of teams. In our club we have a football team at one juvenile grade only, (this is only because one parent is willing to run it and we are a hurling club) so knowledge of the rules is a bit hazy and we concede a lot of frees for fouls the lads don't even know they are committing. However I see teams who have played for years committing similar fouls - and getting called for it- so it's not just our lads lack of knowledge at fault. I believe there is an onus on all county boards to introduce training to all juvenile players about the rules which might help reduce some of the abuse referees get. It seems that the ref is the only person allowed to make a mistake in a match and players can make as many as they like. All young players should have to do some refereeing to see what it's like. It might stop some of the abuse.

Excellent suggestions - anyone who has ever reffed a game, tends to be a lot more understanding about how difficult it is and how easy it is to miss something.

It would be interesting to see how many visits the rules section on the GAA website and how many times the rules documents were downloaded.

One thing that really bugs me about the television pundits is that a lot of the time they can be very hazy on the rules. The GAA should be hammering home this point, because people see the action and hear the pundits interpretation and think the pundits interpretation is gospel.

Recently I thought Tomas O'Se was poor in terms of the rules for the Kerry Cork game. Overall I thought Cork's tackling technique was woeful [I'd be shocked if they don't have a very high frees against total the next day out as well - they brought intensity to the game but their tackling attempts had very little proper technique whatsoever - so many times it was just a case of get close to the opposition player and flail arms wildly] Kerry by comparison I thought did poorly even in terms of getting close to the Cork players to make tackles - there was very little evidence of Donie Buckley's impact from what I saw - At one stage in the 2nd half a Cork player was yet again running through the central channel and one of the Kerry players actually made a proper tackle and turned the ball over and I remember thinking to myself - was that the first proper tackle leading to a turnover of the game.

O'Se made no mention of any of this (the constant fouls given away by Cork as a result of poor tackling technique ) that I can recall - he seemed to have no idea that for a tackle to be legit there has to be at least some sort of attempt to play the ball as opposed to the man. There was one occasion where a Cork player was blatantly pulling a Kerry players jersey and had a hold of the one of the Kerry player's arm and even when the action was shown back in slow motion he was on about it being a soft enough free. The problem is that so many people will have watched this and their idea of what's a legit tackle and what's a foul just gets more confused.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: David McKeown on June 28, 2019, 05:38:46 PM
So for me Clifford fouled the ball by transferring it between hands in effect throwing the ball
In that incident I don't see what Clifford did that is covered by the rule on changing hands.
The question is , did Clifford break this rule?
'To play the ball up with the hand(s) and catch it again before it touches the ground, another player, or goal-posts.'

if he didn't foul and is deemed not to have been in possession of the ball when he flicked it over the head of the Cork player, then the change of hands does not come into the equation.
It's either he fouled when when flicking the ball over and catching it, or not?

I wouldn’t disagree with that. For me Clifford didn’t loose possession and therefore fouled the ball in one or other of those two ways.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Dire Ear on June 29, 2019, 06:59:07 PM
Probably a silly question, but the extra ball on the pitch for the Tyrone Cassidy goal?
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: BennyCake on July 01, 2019, 12:15:05 AM
Paddy Durcan’s Point v Armagh. He toe-tapped the ball, but the ball didn’t leave his hands.

Is that not a foul? Surely he overcarried?
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Taylor on July 01, 2019, 07:44:55 AM
Probably a silly question, but the extra ball on the pitch for the Tyrone Cassidy goal?

I didnt notice it at the game but watching back it looked like there was on in the bottom right corner alright
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: BennyHarp on July 03, 2019, 02:01:45 PM
Question about the advantage rule. If a player is fouled in possession and within the 5 seconds (or whatever it is that the ref holds his hand up) the team manages to create a goal scoring opportunity and they miss - lets say, they hit the bar and the ball is cleared. Is that deemed as the advantage over as they where able to fashion a clear opportunity to score? Or is the only satisfactory advantageous outcome in that scenario a score, in which case the play is brought back for a free?
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: hardstation on July 03, 2019, 02:37:25 PM
It’s brought back. If you shoot and miss during the advantage, it is brought back for the free.

I disagree with the ruling btw.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: BennyHarp on July 03, 2019, 02:46:02 PM
It’s brought back. If you shoot and miss during the advantage, it is brought back for the free.

I disagree with the ruling btw.

Cheers, Yeah, i would have thought an opportunity to score a goal would have been more advantageous than a free kick for a point so the player has accrued his advantage from the play.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: johnnycool on July 03, 2019, 04:12:10 PM
It’s brought back. If you shoot and miss during the advantage, it is brought back for the free.

I disagree with the ruling btw.

Cheers, Yeah, i would have thought an opportunity to score a goal would have been more advantageous than a free kick for a point so the player has accrued his advantage from the play.

you've 5 seconds to avail of said opportunity, it's a free go effectively. Miss and you get the free anyway.
If said opportunity is still on when the 5 seconds are up I'm sure most referees will take that into account and let the play develop but if it comes to nothing outside the 5 seconds then that's that.


I see nothing wrong with the rule and think its a good thing.


One for the hurling referees, Cian Lynch deliberately threw the ball onto the ground and caught the hop and played on. Tipp lads in my mind were right to ask why no free was awarded, but referee let him off with it.

What is the ruling there?

It's not as if he dropped it, it was a full throw.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: theticklemister on July 03, 2019, 04:29:58 PM
Question about the advantage rule. If a player is fouled in possession and within the 5 seconds (or whatever it is that the ref holds his hand up) the team manages to create a goal scoring opportunity and they miss - lets say, they hit the bar and the ball is cleared. Is that deemed as the advantage over as they where able to fashion a clear opportunity to score? Or is the only satisfactory advantageous outcome in that scenario a score, in which case the play is brought back for a free?

I play it as, if the tackle has no bearing on the shot being hit and the player is in a more advantageous position and misses, I take it as take your oil.

If the tackle has put the player off their shot, or say the bad tackle/grope has put them into a wider position and goal and Misses, I bring them back for the free.

Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Esmarelda on July 03, 2019, 04:34:46 PM
Question about the advantage rule. If a player is fouled in possession and within the 5 seconds (or whatever it is that the ref holds his hand up) the team manages to create a goal scoring opportunity and they miss - lets say, they hit the bar and the ball is cleared. Is that deemed as the advantage over as they where able to fashion a clear opportunity to score? Or is the only satisfactory advantageous outcome in that scenario a score, in which case the play is brought back for a free?

I play it as, if the tackle has no bearing on the shot being hit and the player is in a more advantageous position and misses, I take it as take your oil.

If the tackle has put the player off their shot, or say the bad tackle/grope has put them into a wider position and goal and Misses, I bring them back for the free.
I'd agree with that but I've been told that that is not what referees are being told to do. If the goal chance is missed, in this scenario, then I think the ref can bring it back.

The way that you and I agree it should be applied is as it is applied in soccer.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Milltown Row2 on July 03, 2019, 05:14:47 PM
It’s brought back. If you shoot and miss during the advantage, it is brought back for the free.

I disagree with the ruling btw.

Cheers, Yeah, i would have thought an opportunity to score a goal would have been more advantageous than a free kick for a point so the player has accrued his advantage from the play.

you've 5 seconds to avail of said opportunity, it's a free go effectively. Miss and you get the free anyway.
If said opportunity is still on when the 5 seconds are up I'm sure most referees will take that into account and let the play develop but if it comes to nothing outside the 5 seconds then that's that.


I see nothing wrong with the rule and think its a good thing.


One for the hurling referees, Cian Lynch deliberately threw the ball onto the ground and caught the hop and played on. Tipp lads in my mind were right to ask why no free was awarded, but referee let him off with it.

What is the ruling there?

It's not as if he dropped it, it was a full throw.

Watched and thought foul, he deliberately threw the ball down, now had he dropped it and took the bounce then fine, but I struggle with a couple of those grey areas. Deliberately dropping the ball to regain it and the throwing the ball on to your stick but missing it and regaining it, but by that action gaining space and ability to take extra hop on stick and steps!

As for the advantage rule it’s 5 seconds (depending on ref) and advantage over, should he shoot within that and miss it’s brought back. Some work out well others don’t, can create a gurning session but thems the rules!
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: macdanger2 on July 03, 2019, 07:54:38 PM
It’s brought back. If you shoot and miss during the advantage, it is brought back for the free.

I disagree with the ruling btw.
gat

What's an even bigger bollix that if the player on the ball fouls during the 5s advantage time, it's a free out rather than just being pulled back for the free in
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Over the Bar on July 03, 2019, 09:58:57 PM
Why do some refs disallow headed goals?
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: theticklemister on July 03, 2019, 11:36:19 PM
Probably things boys are acting the ****
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: theticklemister on July 03, 2019, 11:36:43 PM
Boy they are legitimate
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: BennyCake on July 14, 2019, 12:15:26 PM
Why do some refs disallow headed goals?

Kieran Donaghy headed in a couple a few years back. One v Cork, another v Donegal I think. Unintentional headers, but still headers.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: BennyCake on July 14, 2019, 12:20:49 PM
So, the two bounces rule.

Ball played to Paul Mannion. Before catching it, he bounced with both hands, caught it, then another bounce and into the hands again.

Is that classified as two bounces? As technically he hadnt had the ball in his hands on the first bounce?
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: twohands!!! on July 14, 2019, 09:51:35 PM
So, the two bounces rule.

Ball played to Paul Mannion. Before catching it, he bounced with both hands, caught it, then another bounce and into the hands again.

Is that classified as two bounces? As technically he hadnt had the ball in his hands on the first bounce?

Page 63 of the rule book.

1.5 When the ball has not been caught, it may be bounced more than once in succession.

Legit by Mannion.

This does mean that a player could receive a pass and bounce it the length of the pitch as long as they didn't catch hold of it.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: BennyCake on July 14, 2019, 10:29:43 PM
Fair enough, Ted.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Main Street on July 22, 2019, 08:21:35 PM
Not a rule per se but an alleged practice by refs, yesterday Oisin as co commetator on RTE, after the last free was awarded,  claimed that refs were definitely predisposed to granting the "GAA draw".
Is this really the case?

Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Jayop on July 22, 2019, 08:32:28 PM
How could we give anything other than our own opinion on that unless one of us have been an intercounty referee who would be willing to give a precise answer??

For me, not for a game like the super8 where a draw is the end of it anyway. If it's a very close knock out game then possibly moreso
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: magpie seanie on July 23, 2019, 09:00:46 AM
Another one here that might surprise people. You are only allowed take 4 steps in between bouncing/soloing the ball.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: BennyCake on September 14, 2019, 08:11:01 PM
Another one here that might surprise people. You are only allowed take 4 steps in between bouncing/soloing the ball.

After today’s replay, surely it’s time just to scrap the four steps rule altogether?

I mean, what’s the point? Sure it’s rarely enforced.

While they’re at it, scrap the pick up as well. It’s rarely enforced either.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Nanderson on September 14, 2019, 08:22:09 PM
Should it be changed to 6 steps seeing as that is the average amount taken and be a lot stricter on over-carrying. On the pick up thing, I find its actually slower to pick the ball of the ground than it is to put your toe under it and lift in correctly
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Rossfan on September 14, 2019, 08:36:45 PM
Another one here that might surprise people. You are only allowed take 4 steps in between bouncing/soloing the ball.
Gone beyond a joke these days.
They might as well abolish the rule and allow the man to be tackled like in the 2 Rugbys and Aus Rules.
At least then the rule book could be adhered to.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: under the bar on September 15, 2019, 12:19:01 AM
So, the two bounces rule.

Ball played to Paul Mannion. Before catching it, he bounced with both hands, caught it, then another bounce and into the hands again.

Is that classified as two bounces? As technically he hadnt had the ball in his hands on the first bounce?

Page 63 of the rule book.

1.5 When the ball has not been caught, it may be bounced more than once in succession.

Legit by Mannion.

This does mean that a player could receive a pass and bounce it the length of the pitch as long as they didn't catch hold of it.

On that basis a player could control the ball with one hand and play it basketball style as far as he wants? It would be much easier than soloing so how come we don't see it?   The reason I expect is that 'caught' does not infer with both hands?
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Rudi on September 15, 2019, 12:32:50 AM
Another one here that might surprise people. You are only allowed take 4 steps in between bouncing/soloing the ball.

Without rules there's anacharcy. Has to be a rughy like system that calls back play.  Goal should not have been allowed
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: BennyCake on September 15, 2019, 01:22:26 PM
Kevin McStay alluded to this, after O’Callaghan fouled Morley bearing down on goal. There needs to be appropriate punishment for preventing a goal scoring opportunity, like there is in soccer (red card).

Kerry only got a point from the Morley foul, and if Moran had pulled back Murchan in the same way, a yellow card and a point would be all that happened. As it turned out, the Murchan goal changed the game. A Morley goal for Kerry might have changed the game too.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: magpie seanie on September 17, 2019, 03:20:02 PM
The black card rule is a mess. A body check by a corner forward 100 metres from his own goal deemed more cynical than a jersey pull 20 metres out. A lot of these new innovations and rule changes are botched.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: MC on September 17, 2019, 03:48:54 PM
A lot of the rules are a mess - particularly around the black card.
However, it's the enforcement of the rules that is the biggest mess.
I'm not sure why the linesmen and umpires are not more actively involved in the officiating.
The nonsense that goes on off the ball is just deemed to be 'part of the game' - but the game is football and GAA rules should always be progressing to encourage good football instead of rewarding pulling and pushing and sledging.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: timmyot501 on September 24, 2019, 10:44:45 AM
Is a team allowed to change the goalkeepper to an outfield player if a penalty is awarded??  This is only a temporary change for the penalty kick.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: five points on September 24, 2019, 11:16:55 AM
A lot of the rules are a mess - particularly around the black card.
However, it's the enforcement of the rules that is the biggest mess.
I'm not sure why the linesmen and umpires are not more actively involved in the officiating.
The nonsense that goes on off the ball is just deemed to be 'part of the game' - but the game is football and GAA rules should always be progressing to encourage good football instead of rewarding pulling and pushing and sledging.

Whatever about linesmen, umpires are neither properly trained to make big calls, nor accountable for their mistakes. Even in an All Ireland final, they're the referee's relations and drinking buddies.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: LooseCannon on September 24, 2019, 04:51:31 PM
Is a team allowed to change the goalkeepper to an outfield player if a penalty is awarded??  This is only a temporary change for the penalty kick.
Not sure of its legality, but Nigel Dunne did this a month or so ago for Shamrocks v Rhode in an Offaly senior club game.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Armagh Cúchulainns on September 24, 2019, 05:07:45 PM
Is a team allowed to change the goalkeepper to an outfield player if a penalty is awarded??  This is only a temporary change for the penalty kick.

Yes - an outfield player can stand in goals for a penalty but if he wears the outfield jersey he can not expect the same benefits of a goalkeeper in regards lifting the ball off the ground in the small rectangle.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: BennyCake on September 24, 2019, 05:11:22 PM
Is a team allowed to change the goalkeepper to an outfield player if a penalty is awarded??  This is only a temporary change for the penalty kick.

Yes - an outfield player can stand in goals for a penalty but if he wears the outfield jersey he can not expect the same benefits of a goalkeeper in regards lifting the ball off the ground in the small rectangle.

Can he have the benefits of a goalkeeper if he puts on the goalkeeper’s jersey while facing the penalty?

Is there a rule saying he can’t do that?
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: redzone on September 24, 2019, 10:10:02 PM
If a player receives a one match ban for a straight red can he come on in the next game if it goes to extra time, as its always claimed that (extra time) it's a new game
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: BennyHarp on September 24, 2019, 11:53:31 PM
If a player receives a red card and a one match ban for the next championship game, but in that next game the opposition concede, does the players ban roll on to the next game?
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: delgany on September 25, 2019, 12:14:11 AM
If a player receives a red card and a one match ban for the next championship game, but in that next game the opposition concede, does the players ban roll on to the next game?
Yes. It rolls over to next game ! No escaping the rules. Another example would be a player sent off at end of u21 age group but over age the next year , is banned from senior level match(es)
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: delgany on September 25, 2019, 12:18:19 AM
If a player receives a red card and a one match ban for the next championship game, but in that next game the opposition concede, does the players ban roll on to the next game?
Yes it rolls over! You can’t escape the rules. Another example would be a player sent off in last eligible U 21 game ( over age the next year ) would have ban carried over to next senior game eligible to play in .
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Milltown Row2 on September 25, 2019, 09:03:23 AM
If a player receives a red card and a one match ban for the next championship game, but in that next game the opposition concede, does the players ban roll on to the next game?
Yes it rolls over! You can’t escape the rules. Another example would be a player sent off in last eligible U 21 game ( over age the next year ) would have ban carried over to next senior game eligible to play in .

I’m not sure if you are banned from another grade the following year. So if a player in his last game at under 21 is sent off for a one match ban, I’m sure he can play the following year in first round of senior championship. But this is a CCC decision so it may be different to each county?
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: The Bearded One on September 25, 2019, 10:39:38 AM
In Tyrone a red card match suspension is only applicable at that same level, for example; receive a red card in the senior championship in 2019 and your team loses, they are subsequently relegated via the league to intermediate for 2020 - red card doesn't carry down.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Rossfan on September 25, 2019, 11:02:44 AM
Using a League to decide Championship status seems odd.
What if the Senior Champions finish bottom of the League?
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: The Bearded One on September 25, 2019, 11:12:41 AM
Tyrone operate 3 'Senior' leagues. Teams in Div1 play Senior championship, Div2 player Intermediate, Div3 play Junior.
Teams who win Junior Championship and Junior League are promoted from Div3 to Div2 . Teams who win Intermediate Championship and Intermediate League are promoted from Div2 to Div1. So in theory you can finish bottom of your league but get promoted by winning the Championship.

We also have 3 'Reserve' leagues but strangely your position in these leagues are determined by wherever your 'Senior' team plays.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: blewuporstuffed on September 25, 2019, 11:32:44 AM
Tyrone operate 3 'Senior' leagues. Teams in Div1 play Senior championship, Div2 player Intermediate, Div3 play Junior.
Teams who win Junior Championship and Junior League are promoted from Div3 to Div2 . Teams who win Intermediate Championship and Intermediate League are promoted from Div2 to Div1. So in theory you can finish bottom of your league but get promoted by winning the Championship.

We also have 3 'Reserve' leagues but strangely your position in these leagues are determined by wherever your 'Senior' team plays.

Happened Killyman in 2007
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: BennyCake on September 25, 2019, 11:50:17 AM
If a player receives a red card and a one match ban for the next championship game, but in that next game the opposition concede, does the players ban roll on to the next game?
Yes it rolls over! You can’t escape the rules. Another example would be a player sent off in last eligible U 21 game ( over age the next year ) would have ban carried over to next senior game eligible to play in .

What is a player is sent off in Senior in his last game before retirement? Does he miss his first game for the over 40’s or Masters football?
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Fionntamhnach on September 25, 2019, 12:36:29 PM
Just to add a little more meat to the last two posts...

Teams playing in the SFC play in Division 1 of the All County League, IFC teams play in Division 2 of the ACL, and JFC in Division 3.

A team that wins the SFC cannot be relegated as they have the right to defend their title. Should they finish in an automatic relegation or relegation play-off position in Division 1, the team finishing above them will take their place instead. However if they finish in the top four places in Division 1, they will have made the league semi finals.

A team that wins the IFC or JFC will be promoted to Division 1 or 2 respectively for the following season regardless of their final league position. In Division 2, an IFC winner finishing in a nominal relegation place, automatic or play-off, will not be subject to such (similar to the SFC above) as they have already achieved promotion to Division 1 and play in the SFC for next season.

A team winning the Senior, Intermediate or Junior football championship yet finish in a nominal relegation position in the corresponding league is very rare, but has happened. As blewuporstuffed mentioned, Killyman achieved this in 2007 - they went into the IFC final against Moortown knowing that were they to win, the following year they would play in the SFC and Division 1, but were they to lose they would play in the JFC and Division 3 instead - at that time they were already "technically" relegated in the league as they were bottom of the Division 2 table and could not obtain enough league points to escape, but no team is confirmed relegated until they are eliminated from the corresponding championship.

A team that wins the IFC or JFC and also their corresponding Division 2 or Division 3 league by finishing top of the table in the same season (there is no top four play-off for the title as there is in Division 1) means that the team that finishes in second place in the league gains automatic promotion.

In Divisions 2 & 3, the top four teams in the table excluding the two teams already promoted then compete in a two-round knockout play-off. In Divisions 1 & 2, excluding the SFC & IFC winners the team finishing bottom of the final table is automatically relegated, while the next two teams finishing above shall play-off against each other.

In the Division 2 & 3 promotion play off games, the two winning semi-finalists meet in a final, while in the relegation play-off game in Div 1 & Div 2, the losing team is relegated. The last of the four teams standing in the promotion play-offs and the winning team in the relegation play-off then meet in an interdivisional game (relegation Div 1 winner vs. promotion Div 2 winner, and relegation Div 2 winner vs. promotion Div 3 winner) - should the lower division team win the tie, they are promoted for the following season and the losing side is relegated, should the higher division team win, then both teams shall remain in their respective leagues & championship grade for the following season.

As "bearded one" also mentions, any club that has a second adult team (all bar one in 2019) competes in a corresponding reserve league and championship involving the same clubs that their first teams face - this is termed "reserve football" and operates parallel to the "senior football" league & championships, as such there is no promotion or relegation between divisions in reserve football in Tyrone (this may or may not be the same in neighbouring counties that also have reserve leagues & championships - the term "reserves" seems to be a mainly Ulster thing, and in Tyrone at least all first team sides in a club are referred to as "senior" even if they compete in the IFC or JFC). A team wishing to enter a third adult team can do so by entering them in the "senior" leagues & championships, initially in Division 3 in the league and playing in the JFC. These teams are referred to as "Thirds" - at present, only Errigal Ciaran field a Thirds team in Tyrone, and such is their playing numbers depth they also have a corresponding reserve team that is their fourth-level team, usually referred to as "Thirds reserves".

Hurling, given the much smaller number of adult clubs in the county, operates on a very different system.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: magpie seanie on September 25, 2019, 12:36:55 PM
If a player receives a red card and a one match ban for the next championship game, but in that next game the opposition concede, does the players ban roll on to the next game?
Yes it rolls over! You can’t escape the rules. Another example would be a player sent off in last eligible U 21 game ( over age the next year ) would have ban carried over to next senior game eligible to play in .

I’m not sure if you are banned from another grade the following year. So if a player in his last game at under 21 is sent off for a one match ban, I’m sure he can play the following year in first round of senior championship. But this is a CCC decision so it may be different to each county?


The rules are the same in every county. If you get sent off (match ban) but cannot serve the ban (if, for example you are overage next year and it's your team's last game in a competition) then the CCC should impose a two week ban for each match you should have served and can't serve.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: magpie seanie on September 25, 2019, 12:40:55 PM
Just to add a little more meat to the last two posts...

Teams playing in the SFC play in Division 1 of the All County League, IFC teams play in Division 2 of the ACL, and JFC in Division 3.

A team that wins the SFC cannot be relegated as they have the right to defend their title. Should they finish in an automatic relegation or relegation play-off position in Division 1, the team finishing above them will take their place instead. However if they finish in the top four places in Division 1, they will have made the league semi finals.

A team that wins the IFC or JFC will be promoted to Division 1 or 2 respectively for the following season regardless of their final league position. In Division 2, an IFC winner finishing in a nominal relegation place, automatic or play-off, will not be subject to such (similar to the SFC above) as they have already achieved promotion to Division 1 and play in the SFC for next season.

A team winning the Senior, Intermediate or Junior football championship yet finish in a nominal relegation position in the corresponding league is very rare, but has happened. As blewuporstuffed mentioned, Killyman achieved this in 2007 - they went into the IFC final against Moortown knowing that were they to win, the following year they would play in the SFC and Division 1, but were they to lose they would play in the JFC and Division 3 instead - at that time they were already "technically" relegated in the league as they were bottom of the Division 2 table and could not obtain enough league points to escape, but no team is confirmed relegated until they are eliminated from the corresponding championship.

A team that wins the IFC or JFC and also their corresponding Division 2 or Division 3 league by finishing top of the table in the same season (there is no top four play-off for the title as there is in Division 1) means that the team that finishes in second place in the league gains automatic promotion.

In Divisions 2 & 3, the top four teams in the table excluding the two teams already promoted then compete in a two-round knockout play-off. In Divisions 1 & 2, excluding the SFC & IFC winners the team finishing bottom of the final table is automatically relegated, while the next two teams finishing above shall play-off against each other.

In the Division 2 & 3 promotion play off games, the two winning semi-finalists meet in a final, while in the relegation play-off game in Div 1 & Div 2, the losing team is relegated. The last of the four teams standing in the promotion play-offs and the winning team in the relegation play-off then meet in an interdivisional game (relegation Div 1 winner vs. promotion Div 2 winner, and relegation Div 2 winner vs. promotion Div 3 winner) - should the lower division team win the tie, they are promoted for the following season and the losing side is relegated, should the higher division team win, then both teams shall remain in their respective leagues & championship grade for the following season.

As "bearded one" also mentions, any club that has a second adult team (all bar one in 2019) competes in a corresponding reserve league and championship involving the same clubs that their first teams face - this is termed "reserve football" and operates parallel to the "senior football" league & championships, as such there is no promotion or relegation between divisions in reserve football in Tyrone (this may or may not be the same in neighbouring counties that also have reserve leagues & championships - the term "reserves" seems to be a mainly Ulster thing, and in Tyrone at least all first team sides in a club are referred to as "senior" even if they compete in the IFC or JFC). A team wishing to enter a third adult team can do so by entering them in the "senior" leagues & championships, initially in Division 3 in the league and playing in the JFC. These teams are referred to as "Thirds" - at present, only Errigal Ciaran field a Thirds team in Tyrone, and such is their playing numbers depth they also have a corresponding reserve team that is their fourth-level team, usually referred to as "Thirds reserves".

Hurling, given the much smaller number of adult clubs in the county, operates on a very different system.


Good explainer Fionntamhnach. Can you add how many teams are in each league division and how many league games are played with/without county players? Thanks.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: LeoMc on September 25, 2019, 12:56:43 PM
Just to add a little more meat to the last two posts...

Teams playing in the SFC play in Division 1 of the All County League, IFC teams play in Division 2 of the ACL, and JFC in Division 3.

A team that wins the SFC cannot be relegated as they have the right to defend their title. Should they finish in an automatic relegation or relegation play-off position in Division 1, the team finishing above them will take their place instead. However if they finish in the top four places in Division 1, they will have made the league semi finals.

A team that wins the IFC or JFC will be promoted to Division 1 or 2 respectively for the following season regardless of their final league position. In Division 2, an IFC winner finishing in a nominal relegation place, automatic or play-off, will not be subject to such (similar to the SFC above) as they have already achieved promotion to Division 1 and play in the SFC for next season.

A team winning the Senior, Intermediate or Junior football championship yet finish in a nominal relegation position in the corresponding league is very rare, but has happened. As blewuporstuffed mentioned, Killyman achieved this in 2007 - they went into the IFC final against Moortown knowing that were they to win, the following year they would play in the SFC and Division 1, but were they to lose they would play in the JFC and Division 3 instead - at that time they were already "technically" relegated in the league as they were bottom of the Division 2 table and could not obtain enough league points to escape, but no team is confirmed relegated until they are eliminated from the corresponding championship.

A team that wins the IFC or JFC and also their corresponding Division 2 or Division 3 league by finishing top of the table in the same season (there is no top four play-off for the title as there is in Division 1) means that the team that finishes in second place in the league gains automatic promotion.

In Divisions 2 & 3, the top four teams in the table excluding the two teams already promoted then compete in a two-round knockout play-off. In Divisions 1 & 2, excluding the SFC & IFC winners the team finishing bottom of the final table is automatically relegated, while the next two teams finishing above shall play-off against each other.

In the Division 2 & 3 promotion play off games, the two winning semi-finalists meet in a final, while in the relegation play-off game in Div 1 & Div 2, the losing team is relegated. The last of the four teams standing in the promotion play-offs and the winning team in the relegation play-off then meet in an interdivisional game (relegation Div 1 winner vs. promotion Div 2 winner, and relegation Div 2 winner vs. promotion Div 3 winner) - should the lower division team win the tie, they are promoted for the following season and the losing side is relegated, should the higher division team win, then both teams shall remain in their respective leagues & championship grade for the following season.

As "bearded one" also mentions, any club that has a second adult team (all bar one in 2019) competes in a corresponding reserve league and championship involving the same clubs that their first teams face - this is termed "reserve football" and operates parallel to the "senior football" league & championships, as such there is no promotion or relegation between divisions in reserve football in Tyrone (this may or may not be the same in neighbouring counties that also have reserve leagues & championships - the term "reserves" seems to be a mainly Ulster thing, and in Tyrone at least all first team sides in a club are referred to as "senior" even if they compete in the IFC or JFC). A team wishing to enter a third adult team can do so by entering them in the "senior" leagues & championships, initially in Division 3 in the league and playing in the JFC. These teams are referred to as "Thirds" - at present, only Errigal Ciaran field a Thirds team in Tyrone, and such is their playing numbers depth they also have a corresponding reserve team that is their fourth-level team, usually referred to as "Thirds reserves".

Hurling, given the much smaller number of adult clubs in the county, operates on a very different system.


Good explainer Fionntamhnach. Can you add how many teams are in each league division and how many league games are played with/without county players? Thanks.
Currently it is 16 Senior, 16 Intermediate and 17 Junior. Nice round numbers for the Senior & Intermediate Championship draws. Teams play each other once in the league (15,15 & 16 games respectively). 5 of those will be designated starred games where teams play without their County players meaning County players are available for 10 league games.
For the starred games the fixtures committee tries to pair off teams with similar numbers of County players.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: general_lee on September 25, 2019, 01:05:19 PM
Armagh is slightly similar, except the grades are split in two for league football: Senior A and Senior B; Intermediate A and Intermediate B; and Junior (junior used to be split but a number of teams withdrew so it is now just a 14 team league).

16 teams in Senior football; 16 in intermediate; 14 in junior. Winning intermediate or junior championship ensures promotion as does finishing first or second in your league section; unless you finish second and a team below you wins the championship. So for example there is a team in the intermediate B league, who finished third. They have reached the championship final; should they win they’ll be Senior B league for 2020, skipping a league.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Fionntamhnach on September 25, 2019, 01:13:12 PM
There are 48 GAA clubs in Tyrone that field at least one mens senior football team.

There are 16 teams in both Divisions 1 & 2, and 17 teams in Division 3 with the inclusion of Errigal Ciaran Thirds. As it is a single round robin league, then teams in Divisions 1 & 2 play 15 games, while in Division 3 it is 16.

During the course of the normal league system, there are a number of "starred" rounds whereby should the Tyrone senior football team still be in competitive action, starred club games are fixed where county players are not expected to line out for their club in that round of fixtures. Not 100% sure how many starred rounds there are in Tyrone in 2019, I think it's six, leaving nine rounds where county players are free to play for their clubs. Not an issue in Division 3 this year with no one on the county panel being from a junior ranked club.

As much as possible, the Tyrone CCC will make starred rounds as such so that teams facing each other will both have players on the county panel and that they have an equal penalisation in such players not being available to them. However should a player leave the county panel after all the rounds have been announced, they are not prevented from playing in those starred rounds.

In my vastly overpaid opinion, I think it's an utter hodge podge of a system, but there seems to be little will within the county for any significant change to the present structures for senior & reserve football in Tyrone.

In the past there used to be some subsidiary & preseason competitions - these have not been run now for some years due to poor reception and interest by many clubs.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Milltown Row2 on September 25, 2019, 01:51:42 PM
If a player receives a red card and a one match ban for the next championship game, but in that next game the opposition concede, does the players ban roll on to the next game?
Yes it rolls over! You can’t escape the rules. Another example would be a player sent off in last eligible U 21 game ( over age the next year ) would have ban carried over to next senior game eligible to play in .

I’m not sure if you are banned from another grade the following year. So if a player in his last game at under 21 is sent off for a one match ban, I’m sure he can play the following year in first round of senior championship. But this is a CCC decision so it may be different to each county?


The rules are the same in every county. If you get sent off (match ban) but cannot serve the ban (if, for example you are overage next year and it's your team's last game in a competition) then the CCC should impose a two week ban for each match you should have served and can't serve.

Should or do? I believe you should miss the next round of the competition that you're intitled to play in, so in effect he could play a reserve championship game and that may get him off if the club does not grade him..

There are many loopholes I'm sure and there are as many theories people believe to be true..
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: magpie seanie on September 25, 2019, 02:37:20 PM
If a player receives a red card and a one match ban for the next championship game, but in that next game the opposition concede, does the players ban roll on to the next game?
Yes it rolls over! You can’t escape the rules. Another example would be a player sent off in last eligible U 21 game ( over age the next year ) would have ban carried over to next senior game eligible to play in .

I’m not sure if you are banned from another grade the following year. So if a player in his last game at under 21 is sent off for a one match ban, I’m sure he can play the following year in first round of senior championship. But this is a CCC decision so it may be different to each county?


The rules are the same in every county. If you get sent off (match ban) but cannot serve the ban (if, for example you are overage next year and it's your team's last game in a competition) then the CCC should impose a two week ban for each match you should have served and can't serve.

Should or do? I believe you should miss the next round of the competition that you're intitled to play in, so in effect he could play a reserve championship game and that may get him off if the club does not grade him..

There are many loopholes I'm sure and there are as many theories people believe to be true..


Match bans are in the same competition. Always. If it is not possible to serve a match ban in the same competition (even if it's the following year) then a two week suspension should/must be imposed for each match ban that can't be served, e.g. if it's 2 matches, it's 4 weeks. It's clearly stated in the rulebook.

Like many things with rules there are theories and commonly held views that are not true.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: magpie seanie on September 25, 2019, 02:44:11 PM
There are 48 GAA clubs in Tyrone that field at least one mens senior football team.

There are 16 teams in both Divisions 1 & 2, and 17 teams in Division 3 with the inclusion of Errigal Ciaran Thirds. As it is a single round robin league, then teams in Divisions 1 & 2 play 15 games, while in Division 3 it is 16.

During the course of the normal league system, there are a number of "starred" rounds whereby should the Tyrone senior football team still be in competitive action, starred club games are fixed where county players are not expected to line out for their club in that round of fixtures. Not 100% sure how many starred rounds there are in Tyrone in 2019, I think it's six, leaving nine rounds where county players are free to play for their clubs. Not an issue in Division 3 this year with no one on the county panel being from a junior ranked club.

As much as possible, the Tyrone CCC will make starred rounds as such so that teams facing each other will both have players on the county panel and that they have an equal penalisation in such players not being available to them. However should a player leave the county panel after all the rounds have been announced, they are not prevented from playing in those starred rounds.

In my vastly overpaid opinion, I think it's an utter hodge podge of a system, but there seems to be little will within the county for any significant change to the present structures for senior & reserve football in Tyrone.

In the past there used to be some subsidiary & preseason competitions - these have not been run now for some years due to poor reception and interest by many clubs.


It's a little complicated but I can understand the reluctance to change it. The CCC in Tyrone have a tough job! I think leagues in some counties where they're not linked to championship have really had their value diluted. However I understand breaking that link due to unavailability of county players hampering some clubs. There's a fair balance there in Tyrone. Interesting. Thanks for the explanations from yourself and the others who contributed.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Rossfan on September 25, 2019, 03:30:23 PM
Jases it's no wonder Tyronies have chips on their shoulders with that complicated League/Championship hodge podge ;D
In Ros the Leagues are totally separate and have no bearing on Championship status.
5 Divisions in the AFLs with D4 and D 5 being mainly B teams.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: johnnycool on September 25, 2019, 03:40:19 PM
If a player receives a red card and a one match ban for the next championship game, but in that next game the opposition concede, does the players ban roll on to the next game?
Yes it rolls over! You can’t escape the rules. Another example would be a player sent off in last eligible U 21 game ( over age the next year ) would have ban carried over to next senior game eligible to play in .

I’m not sure if you are banned from another grade the following year. So if a player in his last game at under 21 is sent off for a one match ban, I’m sure he can play the following year in first round of senior championship. But this is a CCC decision so it may be different to each county?


The rules are the same in every county. If you get sent off (match ban) but cannot serve the ban (if, for example you are overage next year and it's your team's last game in a competition) then the CCC should impose a two week ban for each match you should have served and can't serve.

That is my take on it as well.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Fionntamhnach on September 25, 2019, 03:58:05 PM
Jases it's no wonder Tyronies have chips on their shoulders with that complicated League/Championship hodge podge ;D
It's not that complicated. I just enjoy giving explanations that are (mostly) clear and explanatory to those whom are smart or intelligent enough in wanting to really understand something, yet look complicated to buck eejits.  ;D ;D ;D
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Fionntamhnach on September 25, 2019, 04:21:17 PM
It's a little complicated but I can understand the reluctance to change it. The CCC in Tyrone have a tough job! I think leagues in some counties where they're not linked to championship have really had their value diluted. However I understand breaking that link due to unavailability of county players hampering some clubs. There's a fair balance there in Tyrone. Interesting. Thanks for the explanations from yourself and the others who contributed.

NP Seanie. The main criticisms I'd point towards are that as a system, it does not allow a team to at least face every team in their division at the fullest strength available at least once. It's for this reason that promotion & relegation play-offs happen, but it is still a penalty on clubs whom are fortunate enough to have several county players yet have a relatively small playing base.

Secondly, reserve football is struggling with the amount of games being forfeited - since their fixtures are tied to the corresponding senior game (usually league games held on a Sunday have the reserve game at 2.15 and the senior game at 3.45) then the reserve league fixture schedules rely on the progress of the county team, which to someone outside would appear illogical. Since many reserve players often don't know what fixtures are down for what dates, especially after May or early June, and that there's no promotion/relegation or play-offs, many just get frustrated, especially those with families or just a SO whom want to do something together on a Sunday afternoon, yet that Sunday he might not know if there is going to be a game next weekend, what day & time it is and whom it's against. It might involve an 80+ mile round trip.

Finally, the prestige of the league itself has been slowly diminishing over the years itself it Tyrone. These days it is generally a vehicle (at least among the bigger clubs) to ensure that "senior" or "intermediate" status is preserved, with winning the league being a bonus. A few years ago when Errigal Ciaran were Tyrone SFC champions and competing in the Ulster Club championship, they were scheduled to play in a Division 1 league semi-final a week after their first round Ulster win and a week before the subsequent semi-final. Errigal were not happy about this, but the Tyrone CCC wanted to wrap up the league and the other teams involved had already been sitting on their hands for several weeks and didn't budge on the fixtures, so Errigal simply told the board that they wouldn't field for the league semi-final. That doesn't help the standing the league title should have. In turn, this means the vast amount of focus is on the championship, which is Tyrone is still a straight knockout competition. The merits of straight knockout vs. backdoor vs. group stages are best left to another time. The diminishing standing of the league titles only follows on from cup competitions of yesteryear. Back in the 90's each division had a cup competition, split into four groups of four teams, with all group games pencilled down to be played before the league started, so you had two or three games before you began the league. The top team in each section qualified for the semi-finals, where it and the final would be played before the league started or during gaps in the early league rounds - now if you won your cup competition it wasn't a major celebration, but it was still enough for many clubs to at least have a celebration drink up at a local pub after winning the final. Nowadays, I doubt many would care. I reckon the increasing use of outside managers and coaches is a factor - the Ulster club leagues also used to be a factor but these have plummeted in popularity in the last few years.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: omaghjoe on September 25, 2019, 05:30:29 PM
Jases it's no wonder Tyronies have chips on their shoulders with that complicated League/Championship hodge podge ;D
It's not that complicated. I just enjoy giving explanations that are (mostly) clear and explanatory to those whom are smart or intelligent enough in wanting to really understand something, yet look complicated to buck eejits.  ;D ;D ;D
I Suppose it all depends on what your used to, I always switched off when other counties started explained their system thinking it was over complicated and stupid.

Anyway I like Kerry's divisional system as it would give the best players a chance at playing against each other. There are clubs of various sizes and hence abilities in Tyrone and its obviously not fair that a decent player from a wee place like Fintona will never have a chance of playing senior championship unlike his neighbours in over crowded Tattyreagh.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Nanderson on October 12, 2019, 07:35:55 PM
https://twitter.com/officialgaa/status/1183087525679845376?s=20

The steps rule really needs sorting out.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: LeoMc on October 14, 2019, 03:05:28 PM
Jases it's no wonder Tyronies have chips on their shoulders with that complicated League/Championship hodge podge ;D
It's not that complicated. I just enjoy giving explanations that are (mostly) clear and explanatory to those whom are smart or intelligent enough in wanting to really understand something, yet look complicated to buck eejits.  ;D ;D ;D
I Suppose it all depends on what your used to, I always switched off when other counties started explained their system thinking it was over complicated and stupid.

Anyway I like Kerry's divisional system as it would give the best players a chance at playing against each other. There are clubs of various sizes and hence abilities in Tyrone and its obviously not fair that a decent player from a wee place like Fintona will never have a chance of playing senior championship unlike his neighbours in over crowded Tattyreagh.
They could always transfer to Dromore!
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: screenexile on October 14, 2019, 04:06:52 PM
https://twitter.com/officialgaa/status/1183087525679845376?s=20

The steps rule really needs sorting out.

Or just applied by referees . . .
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Milltown Row2 on October 14, 2019, 07:49:39 PM
https://twitter.com/officialgaa/status/1183087525679845376?s=20

The steps rule really needs sorting out.

Or just applied by referees . . .

It should just be four seconds regardless. Tall players four steps will take you further than someone of my height! It’s not fair  ;)
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Rossfan on October 15, 2019, 11:14:25 AM
Not much talk here about the new football Rules proposed for the Special Congress coming up on Saturday!!

Kick outs from the 20. The sideways kick out will come back into vogue again I fear.
"Offensive" mark. Expect some very vague measurements of 20m by Referees.
Sin Bin for black cards. Probably lead to more use of the black.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: BennyCake on October 15, 2019, 12:31:25 PM
Titanic and deckchairs come to mind.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: magpie seanie on October 15, 2019, 01:02:55 PM
Titanic and deckchairs come to mind.


There's more to GAA than the Senior Football Intercounty competitions.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Link on October 15, 2019, 02:26:18 PM
Does anyone know the rules about postponing a game due to injury? Is it up to the referee?

In the last week we've had 2 underage championship games in Derry with 2 lads stretchered off.

U16 semi final, 6 mins left, 1 point in it. Game called off. Post game the word is Jaw injury - not confirmed.
Minor final, 27 mins left, 3 points in it. Game continued after a 15 minute break. Post game the word is back/spine injury.

No updates on the condition of either player but I'd hope they make a full recovery obviously.

The cancellation of one and continuation of the other confuses me given the circumstances.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: rosnarun on October 15, 2019, 02:49:59 PM
Not much talk here about the new football Rules proposed for the Special Congress coming up on Saturday!!

Kick outs from the 20. The sideways kick out will come back into vogue again I fear.
"Offensive" mark. Expect some very vague measurements of 20m by Referees.
Sin Bin for black cards. Probably lead to more use of the black.
gging on last year they will make little difference .
not sure about he offensive mark . I feel some half assed manger will make his nameby concentrating on it and go a long way til its found out  and hes be shown to be a one trick pony .
it should be make clear its a mark and not a free kick Ir much less time to take it  and not the full monty of a routine.
BTW who has the longest build up to a free in the current game? Murphy? dean Rock?
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Milltown Row2 on October 15, 2019, 02:53:46 PM
Does anyone know the rules about postponing a game due to injury? Is it up to the referee?

In the last week we've had 2 underage championship games in Derry with 2 lads stretchered off.

U16 semi final, 6 mins left, 1 point in it. Game called off. Post game the word is Jaw injury - not confirmed.
Minor final, 27 mins left, 3 points in it. Game continued after a 15 minute break. Post game the word is back/spine injury.

No updates on the condition of either player but I'd hope they make a full recovery obviously.

The cancellation of one and continuation of the other confuses me given the circumstances.

At the referees discretion I'd assume. I'd an air ambulance called for a game, one wanted it off, and the other was willing to stay on, that was the winning team looking to stay on the pitch! I said lets give it some time, (no more than 20 mins) and it was all sorted play resummed
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: five points on October 16, 2019, 10:25:56 AM
Totally up to the referee's discretion.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: recyclebin on October 19, 2019, 10:44:30 PM
Can't believe the forward mark was passed. Teams will get even more defensive.

Sun bin will be hard to manage for the refs at club level.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Rossfan on October 19, 2019, 11:31:25 PM
The Club Refs will need to bring a load of alarm clocks ;D
Or as is more likely will use the black card very sparingly.
And there will be some time wasting by teams while they're down to 14 men.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Milltown Row2 on October 20, 2019, 12:02:41 AM
The Club Refs will need to bring a load of alarm clocks ;D
Or as is more likely will use the black card very sparingly.
And there will be some time wasting by teams while they're down to 14 men.

Just stop the sinbin clock if there’s time wasting! ;)
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Solo_run on October 20, 2019, 10:04:27 PM
I like the introduction of the Sin Bin but it still doesn't change the issues referees have implementing rules.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: twohands!!! on October 21, 2019, 07:10:17 PM
I like the introduction of the Sin Bin but it still doesn't change the issues referees have implementing rules.

As far as I'm concerned all this does is reduces the punishment for foul play while increasing the motivation for teams to waste time. Lunacy to think this will improve things.

Taken directly from the GAA.ie website

Quote
The rationale behind this motion is to reduce a rise in cynical play and 'professional' fouling by implementing a penalty 'on the day' that encourages behavioural change.

The horror show that is this sentence is beyond belief - "to reduce a rise in cynical play" by "implementing a penalty 'on the day' that encourages behavioural change"

This complete and utter bullshit bingo says a world about how strong an argument whoever came up with this would be able to make as to why this rule would improve matters.

Previously if a player committed a black card offence that was the end of their involvement in the game.

Now instead for the same offences they face a maximum of ten minutes on the bench - chances are that it will be more like 6/7/8 minutes for most players and it's actually possible that if an injury occurs a player who receives a black card could miss zero actual action in a game. Think about that and what it says about how badly designed a rule this is.

I don't have any stats but I'd imagine that if you looked at when black cards were issued previously a huge majority of them were in the later minutes of games - clearly players were smart/streetwise enough to not commit offences early in games. This sin bin change reduces the disincentive to commit a pull down when a player is through on goals early on in games.

Any manager worth his salt will be telling his players - lads if a player is through on goal, one-on-one with the keeper, don't worry too much about committing a black card offence, it's far easier to cope with going down to 14 men for a few minutes compared to conceding a goal.

The rule also gives an incentive for teams to slow down play/time waste when down to 14. Expect to see players taking the maximum possible time when taking sideline balls, free kicks, kickouts plus maximising the time taken over substitutions and injuries. Super double whammy of stupid.

If you want players to stop committing cynical fouls, you need to increase the punishment for committing cynical fouls, not decrease it.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: highorlow on October 22, 2019, 08:30:57 AM
For the sin bin the small piece I read is the player binned can’t come back on. I don’t think managers or players will be happy to be binned.

Maybe they  should’ve made it for the time it takes the unbinned team to get say 5 points or more. No time wasting then and would lead to open play. Once the team gets the 5 points or 1-2 or 2-0 then the opposition player comes back on.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: johnnycool on October 22, 2019, 10:34:55 AM
For the sin bin the small piece I read is the player binned can’t come back on. I don’t think managers or players will be happy to be binned.

Maybe they  should’ve made it for the time it takes the unbinned team to get say 5 points or more. No time wasting then and would lead to open play. Once the team gets the 5 points or 1-2 or 2-0 then the opposition player comes back on.

unbinned team stick to 4 points (unless they're still getting beat) and don't bother going for the extra score....

As Mr Dodds would say you can drive a coach and horses through that rule if implemented.



Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Milltown Row2 on October 22, 2019, 11:05:05 AM
For the sin bin the small piece I read is the player binned can’t come back on. I don’t think managers or players will be happy to be binned.

Maybe they  should’ve made it for the time it takes the unbinned team to get say 5 points or more. No time wasting then and would lead to open play. Once the team gets the 5 points or 1-2 or 2-0 then the opposition player comes back on.

unbinned team stick to 4 points (unless they're still getting beat) and don't bother going for the extra score....

As Mr Dodds would say you can drive a coach and horses through that rule if implemented.

I’ve noticed games in football that  finished 0-05 0-04!

Everyone looking at the negatives, let the refs (with their ten extra watch’s) allocate the right time based on time of ball in play, the team can time waste all they want providing the ref adds the time
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: magpie seanie on October 22, 2019, 12:22:02 PM
Apparently it has been researched and for every 10 minute period that a team is down to 14 against the opponents 15, the expected score in that time is almost 2 points favourable to the team with the extra player. The current black card is no punishment to the team, especially the team with a strong bench. Think this was a no brainer to introduce and the yellow card will go the same way shortly (black card will be re-absorbed back into yellow card).

Advanced mark is the one I cannot understand. Can't see any reason for it - what it's trying to combat or achieve.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Milltown Row2 on October 22, 2019, 01:18:26 PM
Apparently it has been researched and for every 10 minute period that a team is down to 14 against the opponents 15, the expected score in that time is almost 2 points favourable to the team with the extra player. The current black card is no punishment to the team, especially the team with a strong bench. Think this was a no brainer to introduce and the yellow card will go the same way shortly (black card will be re-absorbed back into yellow card).

Advanced mark is the one I cannot understand. Can't see any reason for it - what it's trying to combat or achieve.

The advance Mark is going to be a nightmare for your club refs!
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: general_lee on October 27, 2019, 12:55:38 PM
A pile of shite. Who are these f**king idiots and when is the last time they played football?
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Rossfan on October 27, 2019, 02:55:04 PM
Usual GAA stuff, no one objects to a proposed rule, then it gets passed and everyone starts moaning about it.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: BennyCake on October 27, 2019, 03:01:05 PM
Usual GAA stuff, no one objects to a proposed rule, then it gets passed and everyone starts moaning about it.

Yes, but the vast majority of GAA folk don’t get to vote at Congress.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: general_lee on October 27, 2019, 04:10:51 PM
Usual GAA stuff, no one objects to a proposed rule, then it gets passed and everyone starts moaning about it.
It’s stupid though. I’m all for our sport evolving positively but at this stage these morons are just making changes for the sake of it. I can’t think of one rule brought in over the last 20 years that actually made any difference in improving the game either as a player or a spectator. Who the f**k decides whether it’s 20m or not!? Referees have enough on their plate. It’s going to be more hassle than what it’s worth.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Rossfan on November 13, 2019, 11:52:32 AM
https://www.irishexaminer.com/breakingnews/sport/gaa/black-card-could-become-a-thing-of-the-past-963539.html
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: theticklemister on November 16, 2019, 05:01:03 PM
Player intentionally for all the world to see goes and and tries to trip a player, misses, player runs run.

Attack comes to nothing. 

What you do?
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Nanderson on November 16, 2019, 05:10:52 PM
Player intentionally for all the world to see goes and and tries to trip a player, misses, player runs run.

Attack comes to nothing. 

What you do?
No foul occurred so play on?
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: hardstation on November 16, 2019, 05:21:48 PM
Attempted kick, with minimal force. Red card.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: magpie seanie on November 18, 2019, 09:17:08 AM
Attempted kick, with minimal force. Red card.


I hope you're not a ref!
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: tyroneman on January 14, 2020, 11:58:40 AM
So I've now seen Refs allowing a defender to call a mark when they win the ball in their own 45.....so is there such a thing?
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Rossfan on January 14, 2020, 12:32:51 PM
Yes, once it's from a kick over 20m from outside the 45.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Milltown Row2 on January 14, 2020, 03:23:17 PM
So I've now seen Refs allowing a defender to call a mark when they win the ball in their own 45.....so is there such a thing?

Is this a forward mark? or a mark from when the keeper kicks the ball ?
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Itchy on January 14, 2020, 03:52:10 PM
Apparently it has been researched and for every 10 minute period that a team is down to 14 against the opponents 15, the expected score in that time is almost 2 points favourable to the team with the extra player. The current black card is no punishment to the team, especially the team with a strong bench. Think this was a no brainer to introduce and the yellow card will go the same way shortly (black card will be re-absorbed back into yellow card).

Advanced mark is the one I cannot understand. Can't see any reason for it - what it's trying to combat or achieve.

Well I wouldve thought it was simple enough, its trying to encourage teams to play early long balls and increasing the reward for doing so with a free kick at goal and I suppose as part of that trying to get teams to push up on the kicker more which in turns unlocks the blankets somewhat. Whether it is successful or not I am not sure.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: theticklemister on January 14, 2020, 07:03:20 PM
Fella gets son binned on 15 th minute. He’s off for ten minutes. During this time there is a 5 minute delay. Do you bring the fella who got win binned back on at 25 minutes?
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Rossfan on January 14, 2020, 07:49:37 PM
Yes , its 10 minutes from when the ref restarted play after the sin binning.
A charter for cynicism and cheating I fear.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: theticklemister on January 14, 2020, 08:05:08 PM
Yes , its 10 minutes from when the ref restarted play after the sin binning.
A charter for cynicism and cheating I fear.

Yip
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Milltown Row2 on January 14, 2020, 08:24:45 PM
It’s simple he’s off the field for ten mins of play! If a team wants to fart about during that period the clock is stopped as normal and the player will come back on after the ref has decided the ten minutes of actual sin binning has occurred.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: theticklemister on January 14, 2020, 08:25:39 PM
It’s simple he’s off the field for ten mins of play! If a team wants to fart about during that period the clock is stopped as normal and the player will come back on after the ref has decided the ten minutes of actual sin binning has occurred.

Are you sure? If been trying to verify this but can’t anywhere
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Milltown Row2 on January 14, 2020, 09:03:13 PM
It’s simple he’s off the field for ten mins of play! If a team wants to fart about during that period the clock is stopped as normal and the player will come back on after the ref has decided the ten minutes of actual sin binning has occurred.

Are you sure? If been trying to verify this but can’t anywhere

I was told, but I’ve in house training for refs on  Monday, it’ll be covered then, let’s just say if I’m refereeing, the player sin binned won’t be coming til ten minutes of play has been done. Teams can fart about as much as they want
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: theticklemister on January 14, 2020, 09:16:20 PM
It’s simple he’s off the field for ten mins of play! If a team wants to fart about during that period the clock is stopped as normal and the player will come back on after the ref has decided the ten minutes of actual sin binning has occurred.

Are you sure? If been trying to verify this but can’t anywhere



I was told, but I’ve in house training for refs on  Monday, it’ll be covered then, let’s just say if I’m refereeing, the player sin binned won’t be coming til ten minutes of play has been done. Teams can fart about as much as they want

When I referee the ladies, I write down the time I sin bin the player and if any minutes needed to be added on in that time, I do so.

Regarding verification, you would think these would be issued on the official gaa.ie to everyone to see. But like some of the GAA rules , there is total ambiguity.     
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: BennyCake on January 14, 2020, 09:42:32 PM
The stop clock is obviously the only way to insure the 10 minutes are served. And to prevent cheating and running Down the clock.

At county level anyway. More difficult at club level.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Milltown Row2 on January 14, 2020, 10:05:13 PM
The stop clock is obviously the only way to insure the 10 minutes are served. And to prevent cheating and running Down the clock.

At county level anyway. More difficult at club level.

Two watches, or use your note book as theticklemister said
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: BennyCake on January 14, 2020, 10:15:56 PM
The stop clock is obviously the only way to insure the 10 minutes are served. And to prevent cheating and running Down the clock.

At county level anyway. More difficult at club level.

Two watches, or use your note book as theticklemister said

That gives more work for referees though. They’ve enough to do. Timekeeping should be taken from the ref.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Milltown Row2 on January 14, 2020, 10:22:10 PM
The stop clock is obviously the only way to insure the 10 minutes are served. And to prevent cheating and running Down the clock.

At county level anyway. More difficult at club level.

Two watches, or use your note book as theticklemister said

That gives more work for referees though. They’ve enough to do. Timekeeping should be taken from the ref.

At club level it won’t be (timekeeping taken away)  it’s daft to apply this at all levels at clubs, inter county they’ve 4th official to keep it sorted. The forward mark alone is crazy at club level especially at juvenile level, just get your big play to play on the 21 and boot the ball in!

Don’t see the benefit on how it will improve the game
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Milltown Row2 on January 20, 2020, 10:38:40 PM
Sin bin is ten minutes regardless of delays like injuries during that period.

Forward mark rule kick must be played before the 45 and travel 20 meters and the player MUST make a hand in air sign.

He’s 15 seconds to play ball, it’s a clean catch Mark called,  should he not and tries to take a mark he’ll be done for over carrying, players can tackle straight away for a forward mark should he want to play on. Oh and if a defender/keeper catches that forward Mark he can have it by making the sign for a mark, a raised hand.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Hound on January 21, 2020, 08:08:46 AM
Sin bin is ten minutes regardless of delays like injuries during that period.


Thanks MR2

Just to be clear, is this one senior man's opinion on how the 10 mins should be implemented, or did he get it from some official source?
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Rossfan on January 21, 2020, 08:43:44 AM
Didn't it say that in explanatory notes issued by the GAA for the special Congress?
I recall reading it somewhere back then.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Dabh on January 21, 2020, 02:27:44 PM
Sin bin is ten minutes regardless of delays like injuries during that period.

Forward mark rule kick must be played before the 45 and travel 20 meters and the player MUST make a hand in air sign.

He’s 15 seconds to play ball, it’s a clean catch Mark called,  should he not and tries to take a mark he’ll be done for over carrying, players can tackle straight away for a forward mark should he want to play on. Oh and if a defender/keeper catches that forward Mark he can have it by making the sign for a mark, a raised hand.

Yeah but my understanding is that, like the existing mark, the player is allowed 4 steps or the length of time to travel 4 steps before they can be tackled ( providing he is outside the large rectangle)
It is not clear what is allowed if he cleanly catches it outside the rectangle but arrives in the rectangle within 4 steps and has not had the opportunity to raise his hand before been met by the wall of defenders stationed just inside the large rectangle
or how a player will make a clean catch inside the rectangle and manage to hold on to the ball while been tackled by multiple players and simultaneously raise his hand to claim the mark. Then somehow clear the 13 yards in front of him within 15 secs so that he can take the kick.
... expect loads of moaning and plenty of refereeing inconsistencies for a while on this one.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Armagh Cúchulainns on January 21, 2020, 04:19:52 PM
Sin bin is ten minutes regardless of delays like injuries during that period.

Forward mark rule kick must be played before the 45 and travel 20 meters and the player MUST make a hand in air sign.

He’s 15 seconds to play ball, it’s a clean catch Mark called,  should he not and tries to take a mark he’ll be done for over carrying, players can tackle straight away for a forward mark should he want to play on. Oh and if a defender/keeper catches that forward Mark he can have it by making the sign for a mark, a raised hand.

Can't wait to get back to the refereeing this year!  :-\
Although as a dual referee I can see myself turning down football games in favour of hurling
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: theticklemister on January 21, 2020, 04:40:23 PM
Are there any posters of images which show clearly these new rules? Anything sent out from HQ?
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: delgany on January 21, 2020, 07:04:14 PM
You cant have an advance mark from a kick out mark.

If the advanced mark is inside the large rectangle , you can tackle immediately.

Reading the changes , I believe there are too many permutations to interpret at club level!
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: macdanger2 on January 21, 2020, 07:38:41 PM
Sin bin is ten minutes regardless of delays like injuries during that period.


Thanks MR2

Just to be clear, is this one senior man's opinion on how the 10 mins should be implemented, or did he get it from some official source?

That's the way it was reffed last year
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Milltown Row2 on January 21, 2020, 09:14:06 PM
Sin bin is ten minutes regardless of delays like injuries during that period.


Thanks MR2

Just to be clear, is this one senior man's opinion on how the 10 mins should be implemented, or did he get it from some official source?

Was discussed at length last night, I’d prefer to stop the watch but not allowed, so any injuries in that period you can use your discretion as to whether they are taking the piss and play on, has to be a head injury or a dangerous one.  Player can only come on after ten minutes then a break in play, can’t come on beforehand or he’ll receive a yellow, a black and yellow is a red!
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Milltown Row2 on January 21, 2020, 09:18:01 PM
Sin bin is ten minutes regardless of delays like injuries during that period.

Forward mark rule kick must be played before the 45 and travel 20 meters and the player MUST make a hand in air sign.

He’s 15 seconds to play ball, it’s a clean catch Mark called,  should he not and tries to take a mark he’ll be done for over carrying, players can tackle straight away for a forward mark should he want to play on. Oh and if a defender/keeper catches that forward Mark he can have it by making the sign for a mark, a raised hand.

Yeah but my understanding is that, like the existing mark, the player is allowed 4 steps or the length of time to travel 4 steps before they can be tackled ( providing he is outside the large rectangle)
It is not clear what is allowed if he cleanly catches it outside the rectangle but arrives in the rectangle within 4 steps and has not had the opportunity to raise his hand before been met by the wall of defenders stationed just inside the large rectangle
or how a player will make a clean catch inside the rectangle and manage to hold on to the ball while been tackled by multiple players and simultaneously raise his hand to claim the mark. Then somehow clear the 13 yards in front of him within 15 secs so that he can take the kick.
... expect loads of moaning and plenty of refereeing inconsistencies for a while on this one.

He must raise his arm, if a defender is refusing him (pulling his arm) it’s a free anyways then any player can take the free and from the ground should he wish. Catch clean n the box the 15 seconds starts from when he raises his hand, I’m sure if he’s being manhandled it could be another free but he should be able to play ball
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Dabh on January 22, 2020, 11:05:12 AM
Sin bin is ten minutes regardless of delays like injuries during that period.

Forward mark rule kick must be played before the 45 and travel 20 meters and the player MUST make a hand in air sign.

He’s 15 seconds to play ball, it’s a clean catch Mark called,  should he not and tries to take a mark he’ll be done for over carrying, players can tackle straight away for a forward mark should he want to play on. Oh and if a defender/keeper catches that forward Mark he can have it by making the sign for a mark, a raised hand.

Yeah but my understanding is that, like the existing mark, the player is allowed 4 steps or the length of time to travel 4 steps before they can be tackled ( providing he is outside the large rectangle)
It is not clear what is allowed if he cleanly catches it outside the rectangle but arrives in the rectangle within 4 steps and has not had the opportunity to raise his hand before been met by the wall of defenders stationed just inside the large rectangle
or how a player will make a clean catch inside the rectangle and manage to hold on to the ball while been tackled by multiple players and simultaneously raise his hand to claim the mark. Then somehow clear the 13 yards in front of him within 15 secs so that he can take the kick.
... expect loads of moaning and plenty of refereeing inconsistencies for a while on this one.

https://www.irishexaminer.com/breakingnews/sport/gaa/referees-briefed-on-clarifications-to-advanced-mark-and-sin-bin-rule-976864.html

'large rectangle exception' is apparently now gone.... 
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Milltown Row2 on January 22, 2020, 11:19:19 AM
Sin bin is ten minutes regardless of delays like injuries during that period.

Forward mark rule kick must be played before the 45 and travel 20 meters and the player MUST make a hand in air sign.

He’s 15 seconds to play ball, it’s a clean catch Mark called,  should he not and tries to take a mark he’ll be done for over carrying, players can tackle straight away for a forward mark should he want to play on. Oh and if a defender/keeper catches that forward Mark he can have it by making the sign for a mark, a raised hand.

Yeah but my understanding is that, like the existing mark, the player is allowed 4 steps or the length of time to travel 4 steps before they can be tackled ( providing he is outside the large rectangle)
It is not clear what is allowed if he cleanly catches it outside the rectangle but arrives in the rectangle within 4 steps and has not had the opportunity to raise his hand before been met by the wall of defenders stationed just inside the large rectangle
or how a player will make a clean catch inside the rectangle and manage to hold on to the ball while been tackled by multiple players and simultaneously raise his hand to claim the mark. Then somehow clear the 13 yards in front of him within 15 secs so that he can take the kick.
... expect loads of moaning and plenty of refereeing inconsistencies for a while on this one.

https://www.irishexaminer.com/breakingnews/sport/gaa/referees-briefed-on-clarifications-to-advanced-mark-and-sin-bin-rule-976864.html

'large rectangle exception' is apparently now gone....

Believe it or not, the trainers who gave us the rules info on Monday got an email on the way up to the hotel to say they had a new update on the rules
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: theticklemister on January 22, 2020, 05:03:44 PM
Who the f**k has seen these rules released today. Oh living Jesus !!
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: theticklemister on January 22, 2020, 05:05:41 PM
10 minute sin binning does not include stoppages what the f**k
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: twohands!!! on January 22, 2020, 05:48:22 PM
10 minute sin binning does not include stoppages what the f**k

This was always the proposal.

Can't help but think it came from some of the same folk who binned the hooter system and gave the cost of having a clock as one of their reasons for doing so.

When you look at the makeup of the Standing Rules Committee, it's no wonder what a dog's dinner they have made of these new rules.

I'm half convinced that some of the hurling folk on the committee are doing all they can to muck up Gaelic football as much as possible.

In a way that's almost a kinder interpretation than the alternative that they did not actually think about how this rules would actually work on a pitch.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: macdanger2 on January 22, 2020, 08:26:07 PM
10 minute sin binning does not include stoppages what the f**k

Where are you getting that from? In the Irish Times link above, it says:

"The time period in the sin bin shall be of 10 minutes duration irrespective of delays"

Isn't that the same as it was last year for the league?
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: theticklemister on January 22, 2020, 08:29:55 PM
10 minute sin binning does not include stoppages what the f**k

Where are you getting that from? In the Irish Times link above, it says:

"The time period in the sin bin shall be of 10 minutes duration irrespective of delays"

Isn't that the same as it was last year for the league?

Yeah irrespective of delays. So if a guy is sinbinned in the 17th minute and there is an injury for 5 minutes on the 22nd minute, he is then free to wonder on in the 27th minute and there has only been 5 minutes of actual play
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: magpie seanie on January 22, 2020, 09:22:55 PM
What's the alternative though? One that will work in every game up and down the country? 4 or 5 watches for each ref?
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: macdanger2 on January 22, 2020, 09:49:20 PM
10 minute sin binning does not include stoppages what the f**k

Where are you getting that from? In the Irish Times link above, it says:

"The time period in the sin bin shall be of 10 minutes duration irrespective of delays"

Isn't that the same as it was last year for the league?

Yeah irrespective of delays. So if a guy is sinbinned in the 17th minute and there is an injury for 5 minutes on the 22nd minute, he is then free to wonder on in the 27th minute and there has only been 5 minutes of actual play

Sorry, I thought you were saying the opposite.

Anything else would be difficult to implement but it definitely lends itself to play acting. How does women's football work it? I guess they have the clock, does that stop for injuries?
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: thewobbler on January 22, 2020, 09:54:35 PM
What's the alternative though? One that will work in every game up and down the country? 4 or 5 watches for each ref?

Remove the sin bin.

Wave the old black card with gay abandon for cynical play, including diving and feigning injury, and for any verbals to the referee.

Watch our sport then grow a set.


The old black car wasn’t perfect. But mainly because it wasn’t applied properly.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: theticklemister on January 22, 2020, 10:11:19 PM
10 minute sin binning does not include stoppages what the f**k

Where are you getting that from? In the Irish Times link above, it says:

"The time period in the sin bin shall be of 10 minutes duration irrespective of delays"

Isn't that the same as it was last year for the league?

Yeah irrespective of delays. So if a guy is sinbinned in the 17th minute and there is an injury for 5 minutes on the 22nd minute, he is then free to wonder on in the 27th minute and there has only been 5 minutes of actual play

Sorry, I thought you were saying the opposite.

Anything else would be difficult to implement but it definitely lends itself to play acting. How does women's football work it? I guess they have the clock, does that stop for injuries?

I referee ladies football here in Britain, both domestically and provincially. We don’t have a clock, but I take into consideration the time I yellow card a player. I write down the time in my notebook of the dismissal and I am then conscience of extra time to be added in the next ten minutes and add it on
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Ball Hopper on January 22, 2020, 10:23:23 PM
What's the alternative though? One that will work in every game up and down the country? 4 or 5 watches for each ref?

Black card = off to the end of the half or rest of game if in second half...too simple?
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Milltown Row2 on January 22, 2020, 10:36:37 PM
What's the alternative though? One that will work in every game up and down the country? 4 or 5 watches for each ref?

Black card = off to the end of the half or rest of game if in second half...too simple?

It’s ten minutes, if black carded on 22 minutes it’ll be 10 minutes later, 2 minutes into second half (after first break of play) or if ref plays a minute it’s the after the first minute of second half
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: BennyCake on January 22, 2020, 11:16:30 PM
How are officials for club games going to keep track of 2 or 3 players in sin bin?

Worse still, at under age level?!
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Milltown Row2 on January 22, 2020, 11:22:41 PM
How are officials for club games going to keep track of 2 or 3 players in sin bin?

Worse still, at under age level?!

The new score cards have a part for the sin bin, time written down of offence, quick glance at watch will alert you. Should be fine, it’s the moaning though that’ll be a pest, I’d only a few black cards all season so I doubt it will be much more than normal, though a big push for verbal abuse to referees will see the card used more often I suspect
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Ball Hopper on January 23, 2020, 12:49:50 AM
What's the alternative though? One that will work in every game up and down the country? 4 or 5 watches for each ref?

Black card = off to the end of the half or rest of game if in second half...too simple?

It’s ten minutes, if black carded on 22 minutes it’ll be 10 minutes later, 2 minutes into second half (after first break of play) or if ref plays a minute it’s the after the first minute of second half

Nope...till the end of the half, whether that be 28 mins or 2 mins.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: lenny on January 23, 2020, 11:35:31 AM
You cant have an advance mark from a kick out mark.

If the advanced mark is inside the large rectangle , you can tackle immediately.

Reading the changes , I believe there are too many permutations to interpret at club level!

If a player injures himself in the act of taking a mark and is unable to kick it, does another player get to take it and can he kick directly for a score. If so I could see that being abused eg in a tight game with a minute or 2 to go a player who isn’t renowned for shooting gets a mark. He lets on to have injured himself and so the ace free taker gets taking the kick resulting in an easy point. Lots of loopholes which will need to be sorted out quickly.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Milltown Row2 on January 23, 2020, 11:38:55 AM
What's the alternative though? One that will work in every game up and down the country? 4 or 5 watches for each ref?

Black card = off to the end of the half or rest of game if in second half...too simple?

It’s ten minutes, if black carded on 22 minutes it’ll be 10 minutes later, 2 minutes into second half (after first break of play) or if ref plays a minute it’s the after the first minute of second half

Nope...till the end of the half, whether that be 28 mins or 2 mins.

I'm sure the trainers told us different, but with all the talking going on during the discussion and the fact that these things have changed so quickly you could be right
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: theticklemister on January 23, 2020, 12:53:31 PM
You cant have an advance mark from a kick out mark.

If the advanced mark is inside the large rectangle , you can tackle immediately.

Reading the changes , I believe there are too many permutations to interpret at club level!

If a player injures himself in the act of taking a mark and is unable to kick it, does another player get to take it and can he kick directly for a score. If so I could see that being abused eg in a tight game with a minute or 2 to go a player who isn’t renowned for shooting gets a mark. He lets on to have injured himself and so the ace free taker gets taking the kick resulting in an easy point. Lots of loopholes which will need to be sorted out quickly.

Closet player as determined by referee if he is properly injured.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Dabh on January 23, 2020, 12:56:06 PM
You cant have an advance mark from a kick out mark.

If the advanced mark is inside the large rectangle , you can tackle immediately.

Reading the changes , I believe there are too many permutations to interpret at club level!

If a player injures himself in the act of taking a mark and is unable to kick it, does another player get to take it and can he kick directly for a score. If so I could see that being abused eg in a tight game with a minute or 2 to go a player who isn’t renowned for shooting gets a mark. He lets on to have injured himself and so the ace free taker gets taking the kick resulting in an easy point. Lots of loopholes which will need to be sorted out quickly.

Yes and Yes.
Thou it is a bit like the GO Games Rule - nearest team mate
If the Referee determines that the player who makes the 'Mark' has been injured in the process and is unable to take the kick, the Referee shall direct the Player's nearest team mate to take the kick but this may only be allowed in exceptional circumstances.
A Score may be made from the free awarded for a mark
.

As a result i have now updated our teams first aid policies.
We now have designated on-field first-responders for any injuries that may occur to those claiming advanced marks in tight games during the final quarter.
And when a player does get injured while claiming such a mark, make sure that they do not bother the refs with it until the designated first responder has arrived to validate the seriousness of the injury.
Meanwhile all other players also have a responsibility to ensure the injured player has a clear area around them and give the designated responder space to operate.
.. i assume most teams will adopt similiar policies
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Milltown Row2 on January 23, 2020, 01:11:01 PM
He’s got 15 seconds or hop ball
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: rosnarun on January 23, 2020, 02:17:37 PM
He’s got 15 seconds or hop ball
so will lots of player go down as if injured to stop the clock?
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Ball Hopper on January 23, 2020, 06:17:19 PM
What's the alternative though? One that will work in every game up and down the country? 4 or 5 watches for each ref?

Black card = off to the end of the half or rest of game if in second half...too simple?

It’s ten minutes, if black carded on 22 minutes it’ll be 10 minutes later, 2 minutes into second half (after first break of play) or if ref plays a minute it’s the after the first minute of second half

Nope...till the end of the half, whether that be 28 mins or 2 mins.

I'm sure the trainers told us different, but with all the talking going on during the discussion and the fact that these things have changed so quickly you could be right

That's my solution MR2, not the current situation. 

All refs prob give a yellow in the first 15 mins of a game anyway and hold off the black, if not ignore the black at club level completely.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Eire90 on January 23, 2020, 07:10:44 PM
Ciaran Donaghy  says get rid of black card an introduce a 50 metre rule for fouls that would have been a black card
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Hound on January 23, 2020, 09:04:19 PM
Ciaran Donaghy  says get rid of black card an introduce a 50 metre rule for fouls that would have been a black card
Conor Lane says do both!
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Ball Hopper on January 25, 2020, 02:48:24 AM
On this defensive mark thing...I presume a shot for a point that falls into the keepers hands is a mark and he has 15 seconds to take his kick after putting his hand up.

There will be outrage if the GAA are seen to be taking soccer rules on board...and soccer says the keeper must use the ball within 6 seconds, not our 15!

Or is there a rule that says keepers cannot claim a mark? 

Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: lenny on January 25, 2020, 09:55:09 AM
On this defensive mark thing...I presume a shot for a point that falls into the keepers hands is a mark and he has 15 seconds to take his kick after putting his hand up.

There will be outrage if the GAA are seen to be taking soccer rules on board...and soccer says the keeper must use the ball within 6 seconds, not our 15!

Or is there a rule that says keepers cannot claim a mark?

for defensive marks the player gets 5 seconds
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Rossfan on January 25, 2020, 10:37:34 AM
On this defensive mark thing...I presume a shot for a point that falls into the keepers hands is a mark and he has 15 seconds to take his kick after putting his hand up.

There will be outrage if the GAA are seen to be taking soccer rules on board...and soccer says the keeper must use the ball within 6 seconds, not our 15!

Or is there a rule that says keepers cannot claim a mark?

for defensive marks the player gets 5 seconds
I don't recall reading that anywhere???
The bit that annoys me is if a player doesn't claim the mark he gets 4 steps where he cant be challenged.
Claiming the mark should be the only privilege, playing on should be fair game for tackles etc
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Milltown Row2 on January 25, 2020, 12:03:25 PM
On this defensive mark thing...I presume a shot for a point that falls into the keepers hands is a mark and he has 15 seconds to take his kick after putting his hand up.

There will be outrage if the GAA are seen to be taking soccer rules on board...and soccer says the keeper must use the ball within 6 seconds, not our 15!

Or is there a rule that says keepers cannot claim a mark?

for defensive marks the player gets 5 seconds
I don't recall reading that anywhere???
The bit that annoys me is if a player doesn't claim the mark he gets 4 steps where he cant be challenged.
Claiming the mark should be the only privilege, playing on should be fair game for tackles etc

Will need to look at that again as I thought if the forward Mark isn’t claimed he can be tackled! Glad I’m not out this weekend! Will study the games tomorrow
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Rossfan on January 25, 2020, 12:52:36 PM
https://www.gaa.ie/news-archive/news/guide-to-new-the-gaelic-football-playing-rules/

See item 4 advanced mark section
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: delgany on January 25, 2020, 02:48:46 PM
Apart from the change to the kick  out , the other two changes have disaster written all over them . They have too many variables that are open to interpretation by the referee and the general public watching games , never mind the impact at club level . Too much, too soon and too many changes .
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: tippabu on January 26, 2020, 09:37:12 AM
So am I right to say that a player who doesnt take a mark and plays on but is tackled gets a free from the point of the tackle? Is there any other penalty such as ball being moved up or a different player to the one who took the mark now being able to take the free? Can a ref give advantage to a player who takes a mark, plays on and is tackled fairly but is trying to break a tackle to get in on goal or will many refs just blow for the free straight away?
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: general_lee on February 02, 2020, 03:38:35 PM
This advance mark rule the shíttest rule ever concocted. Watched a match earlier, ball played in, player catches it and then drops it but the ref already awarded him the mark therefore he gets a free in? Horseshit
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: lenny on February 02, 2020, 03:43:14 PM
This advance mark rule the shíttest rule ever concocted. Watched a match earlier, ball played in, player catches it and then drops it but the ref already awarded him the mark therefore he gets a free in? Horseshit

That’s nothing to do with the rule, the problem there is the ref.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Milltown Row2 on February 02, 2020, 04:56:51 PM
This advance mark rule the shíttest rule ever concocted. Watched a match earlier, ball played in, player catches it and then drops it but the ref already awarded him the mark therefore he gets a free in? Horseshit

That’s nothing to do with the rule, the problem there is the ref.

If he catches the ball clean in air but on way down drops it, it’s a mark. The problem is people not knowing the rules?
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Main Street on February 02, 2020, 05:25:58 PM
This advance mark rule the shíttest rule ever concocted. Watched a match earlier, ball played in, player catches it and then drops it but the ref already awarded him the mark therefore he gets a free in? Horseshit

That’s nothing to do with the rule, the problem there is the ref.

If he catches the ball clean in air but on way down drops it, it’s a mark. The problem is people not knowing the rules?
I would have assumed the player would have to land safely with ball in hand, in order for it to qualify as a clean catch.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Milltown Row2 on February 02, 2020, 05:44:03 PM
This advance mark rule the shíttest rule ever concocted. Watched a match earlier, ball played in, player catches it and then drops it but the ref already awarded him the mark therefore he gets a free in? Horseshit

That’s nothing to do with the rule, the problem there is the ref.

If he catches the ball clean in air but on way down drops it, it’s a mark. The problem is people not knowing the rules?
I would have assumed the player would have to land safely with ball in hand, in order for it to qualify as a clean catch.

We were told that a clean catch, whether he hit the floor or not with the ball wasn’t our concern, but hey no one will know and assume they know better, I’d a balls up today and I knew it made the wrong call with a double mark, it’s going to happen!
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Farrandeelin on February 02, 2020, 09:24:42 PM
Is the original mark still the same? Or do you have to claim it too?
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Rossfan on February 02, 2020, 09:31:58 PM
I know it was bloody Colm Reilly but...
Conor Daly made a defensive mark late on, a schemozzle developed, Fermanagh no.24 got a yellow card and then he hopped the ball.
??????
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Milltown Row2 on February 02, 2020, 09:39:05 PM
Is the original mark still the same? Or do you have to claim it too?

Yes, blow for all marks, if player raises hand he’s 15 seconds to shoot, or has four seconds to play without being tackled
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Rudi on February 02, 2020, 10:24:44 PM
I know it was bloody Colm Reilly but...
Conor Daly made a defensive mark late on, a schemozzle developed, Fermanagh no.24 got a yellow card and then he hopped the ball.
??????

It frustrated me at the time too. However the same thing happened V Tyrone last year. We were awarded a free in after Morgan assaulted one of our players, Harney then was the second man in, free overturned to a hop ball, we end up Div 2.
In conclusion we didn't learn anything from last year, O Reilly made the correct call in accordance with the rule book.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: FermGael on February 02, 2020, 11:05:56 PM
I know it was bloody Colm Reilly but...
Conor Daly made a defensive mark late on, a schemozzle developed, Fermanagh no.24 got a yellow card and then he hopped the ball.
??????

He wasn't awarded the mark. That's where the confusion happened. Reilly did not give it and that's when the Fermanagh player kicked it. That's when the handbags started.
I couldn't tell if it was or wasn't a mark as the ball was so close to the ground when he caught it.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Rossfan on February 04, 2020, 01:03:42 PM
https://www.irishexaminer.com/breakingnews/sport/gaa/plans-afoot-to-curb-backchat-to-referees-979606.html

Should be some fun with the sin bin in Hurley stuff😁
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: johnnycool on February 04, 2020, 02:26:53 PM
https://www.irishexaminer.com/breakingnews/sport/gaa/plans-afoot-to-curb-backchat-to-referees-979606.html

Should be some fun with the sin bin in Hurley stuff😁

john Kiely has already spoken about it, so wait for Eddie Keher to row in that's it would take away the manliness of hurling or some other dirge.

I think there's weight in allowing only two players from each team to speak to the referee and making adult games 35 minutes although I'd allow County Boards to apply bi-laws to allow them to reduce Junior/Junior B or whatever to 30 minutes to prevent auld lads still treading the boards from having a heart attack...

Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: twohands!!! on February 05, 2020, 04:00:14 PM
https://www.irishexaminer.com/breakingnews/sport/gaa/plans-afoot-to-curb-backchat-to-referees-979606.html

Should be some fun with the sin bin in Hurley stuff😁

john Kiely has already spoken about it, so wait for Eddie Keher to row in that's it would take away the manliness of hurling or some other dirge.

I think there's weight in allowing only two players from each team to speak to the referee and making adult games 35 minutes although I'd allow County Boards to apply bi-laws to allow them to reduce Junior/Junior B or whatever to 30 minutes to prevent auld lads still treading the boards from having a heart attack...

Definitely I think the adult games could be increased to 35 minutes especially at the top level of club action.
Agree about allowing county boards to have it in the by-laws to keep Junior B at 30 minutes if so desired.

For the black card in hurling they should put forward a video of all the times in last year's championship where backs fouled to prevent goal-scoring chances.
They should also look at the stats in terms of how many goals were scored where the defender was already on a yellow. From what I remember there seemed to be a fair few cases in the hurling championship last year where goals were scored off backs already on a yellow. Hand to advantage to the attacking player, not the player who can kill a goal chance just by pulling a player down and taking a yellow.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: themac_23 on February 09, 2020, 03:37:12 PM
The mark has to go, completely killing the flow of the game, take it there can’t be a change for at least another year
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: hardstation on February 09, 2020, 03:44:34 PM
Pure shite. Boys catching the ball at their ankles and getting a free for it.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Main Street on February 09, 2020, 09:05:28 PM
Kelly the ref at Tyrone v Kerry gave the free as soon as the hand touched the shoulder of the player in possesion.
Some players (mainly those in muddy white shirts) out of habit were throwing themselves to the ground at the merest touch in order to get the free but they needn't have bothered, the ref did not need to be conned in order to call the free.

Personally I thought this worked well, just have a zero tolerance for the high hand and players in possesion will not have to con the ref, endagering themselves in the process in order to win the free.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Hound on February 12, 2020, 09:58:43 AM
Interesting debate on the Wooly podcast re time added on, with particular reference to the Dublin v Monaghan match.

The 6 minutes wasn't discussed, but the 3.30 added on after the 6 was the key issue.

I checked the recording on Sunday morning, and thought based on my understanding of the rules that the ref got it spot on.

There was a 2 minute stoppage after a Dublin score when the ref went down the other end of the pitch to book 3 players.
There was a 1.30 stoppage after an injury around the middle of the field (the one the ref should have let McManus have an advantage for, but he'd already blown too early)

I can't remember exactly, but there was at least 2, if not 3 substitutions that happened during those two stoppages which played a part in extending them. But overall 3.30 was spot on. 

Conan on the show said he counted more than 4 minutes of stoppage time, so that should have allowed Monaghan have one last attack. He added on the time Beggan took to come up and take frees during injury time.

Pat McEnenany was on to explain the actual rules:

As I thought, you don't add on time for a freetaker taking a free. That's normal playing time. If the ref judges that the player takes too long, then it's a throw ball.
But I thought that if there was a throw ball for timewasting, then the ref would add on the time wasted as extra time. But that's wrong. The only punishment is throw ball, no additional time is added (which isn't logical!)

What surprised me more is McEnenany disagreed with adding time for the bookings. That's normal playing time he said.
(Although it did remind me of a ladies semi final between Dublin and Cork about 6 or 7 years ago. Dublin 1 point behind, 45 seconds left on the clock, a Dublin girl charging forward around midfield and taken out of it. The refs blows for the free. Calls the Cork girl offer to give her a talking to and a card, which takes about 40 seconds. Clock doesn't stop and hooter blows just as Dubs take the free so the Cork booking cost them the (slim) chance they had of equalising).

Anyway, Pat's take on it was that the ref should have just added between 2.00 and 2.30 for the 3 substitutions and the 1 injury stoppage. Personally I think it's a nonsense not to stop the clock for time taken to book a player, as it would otherwise encourage players not carded to get a card in injury time as a way of defending a lead and run down the clock!

Conan had a good idea that the "Stopwatch Clock" should be brought in but only used for added time. And that it stops for every stoppage in injury time so everyone knows where they are and full value is got for the stoppage time.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Milltown Row2 on February 12, 2020, 12:26:56 PM
Interesting debate on the Wooly podcast re time added on, with particular reference to the Dublin v Monaghan match.

The 6 minutes wasn't discussed, but the 3.30 added on after the 6 was the key issue.

I checked the recording on Sunday morning, and thought based on my understanding of the rules that the ref got it spot on.

There was a 2 minute stoppage after a Dublin score when the ref went down the other end of the pitch to book 3 players.
There was a 1.30 stoppage after an injury around the middle of the field (the one the ref should have let McManus have an advantage for, but he'd already blown too early)

I can't remember exactly, but there was at least 2, if not 3 substitutions that happened during those two stoppages which played a part in extending them. But overall 3.30 was spot on. 

Conan on the show said he counted more than 4 minutes of stoppage time, so that should have allowed Monaghan have one last attack. He added on the time Beggan took to come up and take frees during injury time.

Pat McEnenany was on to explain the actual rules:

As I thought, you don't add on time for a freetaker taking a free. That's normal playing time. If the ref judges that the player takes too long, then it's a throw ball.
But I thought that if there was a throw ball for timewasting, then the ref would add on the time wasted as extra time. But that's wrong. The only punishment is throw ball, no additional time is added (which isn't logical!)

What surprised me more is McEnenany disagreed with adding time for the bookings. That's normal playing time he said.
(Although it did remind me of a ladies semi final between Dublin and Cork about 6 or 7 years ago. Dublin 1 point behind, 45 seconds left on the clock, a Dublin girl charging forward around midfield and taken out of it. The refs blows for the free. Calls the Cork girl offer to give her a talking to and a card, which takes about 40 seconds. Clock doesn't stop and hooter blows just as Dubs take the free so the Cork booking cost them the (slim) chance they had of equalising).

Anyway, Pat's take on it was that the ref should have just added between 2.00 and 2.30 for the 3 substitutions and the 1 injury stoppage. Personally I think it's a nonsense not to stop the clock for time taken to book a player, as it would otherwise encourage players not carded to get a card in injury time as a way of defending a lead and run down the clock!

Conan had a good idea that the "Stopwatch Clock" should be brought in but only used for added time. And that it stops for every stoppage in injury time so everyone knows where they are and full value is got for the stoppage time.

I got a bit of abuse (nothing new I suppose) when doing an important championship game, the game was in extra time, 1 minute of extra time in the first ten minute period ad I added over 6/7 minutes for the second period due to 2 injuries and time wasting by the keeper (which reading above I should have hopped the ball), the injuries I stopped the clock and the subs I added the 30 seconds for each.. As you can imagine the winning team will try and play down the clock which is fair enough..

But I was showing my watch the whole time to the players, the supporters on the other hand are watching a clock with the score board wondering WTF! I'd be happy enough for a hotter to do the timing. completely out of my hands then, and would reduce the complaining that goes on during the game, but how do we ensure no one abuses that?
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Main Street on February 12, 2020, 07:55:33 PM
Interesting debate on the Wooly podcast re time added on, with particular reference to the Dublin v Monaghan match.

The 6 minutes wasn't discussed, but the 3.30 added on after the 6 was the key issue.

I checked the recording on Sunday morning, and thought based on my understanding of the rules that the ref got it spot on.

There was a 2 minute stoppage after a Dublin score when the ref went down the other end of the pitch to book 3 players.
There was a 1.30 stoppage after an injury around the middle of the field (the one the ref should have let McManus have an advantage for, but he'd already blown too early)

I can't remember exactly, but there was at least 2, if not 3 substitutions that happened during those two stoppages which played a part in extending them. But overall 3.30 was spot on. 

Conan on the show said he counted more than 4 minutes of stoppage time, so that should have allowed Monaghan have one last attack. He added on the time Beggan took to come up and take frees during injury time.

Pat McEnenany was on to explain the actual rules:

As I thought, you don't add on time for a freetaker taking a free. That's normal playing time. If the ref judges that the player takes too long, then it's a throw ball.
But I thought that if there was a throw ball for timewasting, then the ref would add on the time wasted as extra time. But that's wrong. The only punishment is throw ball, no additional time is added (which isn't logical!)

What surprised me more is McEnenany disagreed with adding time for the bookings. That's normal playing time he said.
(Although it did remind me of a ladies semi final between Dublin and Cork about 6 or 7 years ago. Dublin 1 point behind, 45 seconds left on the clock, a Dublin girl charging forward around midfield and taken out of it. The refs blows for the free. Calls the Cork girl offer to give her a talking to and a card, which takes about 40 seconds. Clock doesn't stop and hooter blows just as Dubs take the free so the Cork booking cost them the (slim) chance they had of equalising).

Anyway, Pat's take on it was that the ref should have just added between 2.00 and 2.30 for the 3 substitutions and the 1 injury stoppage. Personally I think it's a nonsense not to stop the clock for time taken to book a player, as it would otherwise encourage players not carded to get a card in injury time as a way of defending a lead and run down the clock!

Conan had a good idea that the "Stopwatch Clock" should be brought in but only used for added time. And that it stops for every stoppage in injury time so everyone knows where they are and full value is got for the stoppage time.
As the rules stand now McEnaney is spot on, he is the knowledgeable one.
The biggest blooper that the ref made in added time was to blow the whistle immediately when McAnespie was fouled.
 And I'd say everyone and their dog thought the ref would blow up just before the last play.

Agreed on the issue with refs taking up valuable game time with useless lengthy pedantic disciplinary discussions with a crafty culprit,  especially with a game still to be won in added time.



Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Milltown Row2 on February 12, 2020, 10:09:33 PM
To settle the lengthy time of discipline on the ‘fouler’ is by brandish the card, take his number and blow whistle to play on.

This, bringing the player towards you talking and brandishing the card is not needed. The ref has the team sheet with names and numbers already.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Ball Hopper on February 12, 2020, 10:59:19 PM
When the clock hits 70 minutes there will be no more substitutes allowed and no cards will be issued.

Clock or Play will not stop for injuries either...treat them on the field.

Frees must be taken within 30 seconds, otherwise hop the ball.

Game will end when the ball goes out of play after the time expires (like rugby).

For any boxing, grappling or whatever, ref just points them to the line...just like the old days...no need to take names or anything...off you go and play resumes quickly.

Time to put the word "sport" back into our game.

Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: BennyCake on February 12, 2020, 11:16:36 PM
BH, what about when Dublin forwards held the six Mayo defenders last kickout  in the AI final 2 years ago? Does the ref send 12 men off? And how could he even see them all at same time?

People moaned about Tyrone player grappling at Clifford and him unfairly getting the line. You can’t have six players unfairly getting the line too.

I do agree though, come the 70 minutes, no subs allowed.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Ball Hopper on February 12, 2020, 11:53:40 PM
BH, what about when Dublin forwards held the six Mayo defenders last kickout  in the AI final 2 years ago? Does the ref send 12 men off? And how could he even see them all at same time?

People moaned about Tyrone player grappling at Clifford and him unfairly getting the line. You can’t have six players unfairly getting the line too.

I do agree though, come the 70 minutes, no subs allowed.

Send them all off...won't happen again if it causes the losing of the game.  Ref plus 2 linesmen plus 4 umpires should see most of it.

It will be in place well before an All-Ireland final anyway...the first or second league game could see a flood of dismissals after the 70 mins are up. 

Teams will adapt to the rules (or take advantage of them not being applied evenly)...up to the refs to be properly trained, assessed and bad decisions eliminated from their performance as the year goes on. 



Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Taylor on February 13, 2020, 06:17:46 AM
When the clock hits 70 minutes there will be no more substitutes allowed and no cards will be issued.

Clock or Play will not stop for injuries either...treat them on the field.

Frees must be taken within 30 seconds, otherwise hop the ball.

Game will end when the ball goes out of play after the time expires (like rugby).

For any boxing, grappling or whatever, ref just points them to the line...just like the old days...no need to take names or anything...off you go and play resumes quickly.

Time to put the word "sport" back into our game.

And that would help the situation in what way?

If a team is up by a point and I head down the field to start grappling with the opposition star player and we both get the line surely that will only help my team and the other team are missing their star player for the 7mins of injury time?
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Main Street on February 13, 2020, 10:17:22 AM
To settle the lengthy time of discipline on the ‘fouler’ is by brandish the card, take his number and blow whistle to play on.

This, bringing the player towards you talking and brandishing the card is not needed. The ref has the team sheet with names and numbers already.
In Mc'Anespie's case the ref did not even need to blow the whistle but allow the 5 seconds advantage.
Brannigan's refereeing instinct is an example of old school, dogmatically applied.

In a game where two teams were giving their all and flat out for victory, he then decided to allow an extra 30 seconds for himself to book McManus who was complaining about his officiousness.
 

 
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: magpie seanie on February 13, 2020, 11:06:12 AM
Heard David Gough explaining this. The new watches the refs have cater for this and it's all done correctly to the rules. Trouble here is lack of understanding of the rules and possibly the GAA doing a poor job of communicating the actual situation.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: twohands!!! on February 13, 2020, 06:28:27 PM
Heard David Gough explaining this. The new watches the refs have cater for this and it's all done correctly to the rules. Trouble here is lack of understanding of the rules and possibly the GAA doing a poor job of communicating the actual situation.

Quelle Surprise.

Quote
GAA insist time keeping is not a major issue in games
No plans for review despite accusations of inconsistency by Meath boss
Tue, Feb 11, 2020, 01:00
Seán Moran
 
The GAA have no plans to review time keeping procedures after criticism from Meath manager Andy McEntee of the lack of added time played in his team’s narrow defeat by Mayo in Navan.

Feargal McGill, the GAA’s Head of Games Administration, said that he was happy with the standard of time keeping, which was overhauled a few years ago in order to address time wasting. As a result, matches frequently run up to the 76th and 77th minutes.

“I have to say that I think there’s a high standard of consistency at the moment from our officials in how they apply the rules on time. We have minimum allowances for substitutions and regulations that were introduced at the start of 2016 to ensure that adequate additional time was being played.

“I don’t think you have the situation where people are walking away from matches every week complaining about the amount of time being played or not played.

“There have been high-profile incidents recently of referees playing way over the announced time – the Kilcoo game [All-Ireland club football final against Corofin] and the Dublin game [last Saturday] and if you look at both of those games you’d see that the referee got it right.”

McEntee’s unhappiness was made clear to print, digital and broadcast media after the match when he contrasted how his team had been granted no additional time beyond the announced four minutes with Dublin’s experience on Saturday night. Both he and his players seemed to anticipate a further opportunity to equalise after Thomas Reilly had cut the deficit to a point.

“I can’t believe – the amount of breaks that were there in those four minutes of extra-time and we don’t play two seconds of extra-time? Dublin got two minutes last night [Saturday] to get an equalising score. There’s a level of inconsistency all over the place. And they want referees to get respect. They’ve got to show a little bit too.

“It’s one rule for the Dublin’s and the bigger names in this world and it’s a different rule for everybody else.”

He referred to an incident in which Mayo replacement Bryan Walsh had been down injured during additional time.

“He’s supposed to play on . . .” he said of Tyrone referee Seán Hurson. “I mean if that guy is lying down on the ground for 30 seconds holding his head – 30 seconds, you get two scores in 30 seconds”

The Meath manager had grounds for grievance in that instance. Four minutes were announced as injury-time but whereas the injury stopped play for 35 seconds, the clock stopped at four minutes 10 seconds after O’Reilly’s score.

Down referee Ciarán Branagan added three minutes to the announced six at Croke Park on Saturday, enabling Dublin to close a six-point deficit by the 79th minute. Most observers accept that the match had been held up for that amount of time, as the referee administered some cards, injuries were treated and replacements took to the field.

McGill contends however that referees are far more aware of the need to address deliberate time wasting.

“When the board goes up for five minutes’ additional time and teams are trying to run down the clock and as a reaction to that, referees are now way more conscious of the fact that there needs to be at least five minutes of injury-time. People at matches know the phrase, ‘there’ll be at least five minutes additional time’.”

Seven years ago, a motion to congress was successful in introducing the countdown clock familiar from women’s football. But after trialling the idea in third-level college’s fixtures, the GAA decided not to proceed after identifying what were seen as shortcomings in the system.

As a result, the 2013 amendment was deleted at a subsequent Congress.

The misgivings about the time-keeping system that has proved successful in the women’s game were based on reputational damage to the association, according to the report presented to Central Council:

“As part of the two trials of the clock/hooter system conducted, a number of concerns were raised by those who witnessed the trials in action with regard to the impact the introduction of the clock and hooter might have on the playing of our games.

“These included operating officials, referees, players, mentors and spectators. These concerns – along with the suggested protocol for implementation – were also presented to Central Council delegates. In the main, the concerns centred on potential damage to the reputation of association:

These included human error or failure to operate it properly, system failure, prevalence of ‘fouling down’ the clock, the playing of ‘keep ball’ when the clock was in view and deliberate concession of possession in order to make the ball go dead.”


There are no plans to revisit the idea.

Article from the Irish Times a few days back.

Regarding the first bit in bold I don't think I've been at any tight game in the last few years at every level where timekeeping wasn't raised as an issue afterwards.
It's a consistent theme be in club, school or intercounty where the score is tight.

The second bit in bold shows the flimsiness of the case against a hooter system given all the arguements listed here against it already occur.
I argue that more reputational damage is being done by continuing on with the current system.
It's as certain as rain is wet there will be countless more tight games where the ref's timekeeping comes up as an issue until eventually a hooter system is adopted.

The key argument in favour of a hooter system is the blatant evidence of the women's game where the hooter system works so well in literally thousands of games.

I'd love to hear those who have adopted the "yerra things are grand" approach like Feargal here make the case as to why things would not be better with a hooter system like the women's game.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Main Street on February 13, 2020, 07:33:43 PM
Heard David Gough explaining this. The new watches the refs have cater for this and it's all done correctly to the rules. Trouble here is lack of understanding of the rules and possibly the GAA doing a poor job of communicating the actual situation.
Perhaps David needs to communicate better to Brannigan that the time a ref spends running after players, explaining the nature of the offence in great detail, finally booking players and the time players use to take a free kick is not time to be added on,  especially when Dublin are in dire straits.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Dubhaltach on February 13, 2020, 10:44:32 PM
Heard David Gough explaining this. The new watches the refs have cater for this and it's all done correctly to the rules. Trouble here is lack of understanding of the rules and possibly the GAA doing a poor job of communicating the actual situation.

Quelle Surprise.

Quote
GAA insist time keeping is not a major issue in games
No plans for review despite accusations of inconsistency by Meath boss
Tue, Feb 11, 2020, 01:00
Seán Moran
 
The GAA have no plans to review time keeping procedures after criticism from Meath manager Andy McEntee of the lack of added time played in his team’s narrow defeat by Mayo in Navan.

Feargal McGill, the GAA’s Head of Games Administration, said that he was happy with the standard of time keeping, which was overhauled a few years ago in order to address time wasting. As a result, matches frequently run up to the 76th and 77th minutes.

“I have to say that I think there’s a high standard of consistency at the moment from our officials in how they apply the rules on time. We have minimum allowances for substitutions and regulations that were introduced at the start of 2016 to ensure that adequate additional time was being played.

“I don’t think you have the situation where people are walking away from matches every week complaining about the amount of time being played or not played.

“There have been high-profile incidents recently of referees playing way over the announced time – the Kilcoo game [All-Ireland club football final against Corofin] and the Dublin game [last Saturday] and if you look at both of those games you’d see that the referee got it right.”

McEntee’s unhappiness was made clear to print, digital and broadcast media after the match when he contrasted how his team had been granted no additional time beyond the announced four minutes with Dublin’s experience on Saturday night. Both he and his players seemed to anticipate a further opportunity to equalise after Thomas Reilly had cut the deficit to a point.

“I can’t believe – the amount of breaks that were there in those four minutes of extra-time and we don’t play two seconds of extra-time? Dublin got two minutes last night [Saturday] to get an equalising score. There’s a level of inconsistency all over the place. And they want referees to get respect. They’ve got to show a little bit too.

“It’s one rule for the Dublin’s and the bigger names in this world and it’s a different rule for everybody else.”

He referred to an incident in which Mayo replacement Bryan Walsh had been down injured during additional time.

“He’s supposed to play on . . .” he said of Tyrone referee Seán Hurson. “I mean if that guy is lying down on the ground for 30 seconds holding his head – 30 seconds, you get two scores in 30 seconds”

The Meath manager had grounds for grievance in that instance. Four minutes were announced as injury-time but whereas the injury stopped play for 35 seconds, the clock stopped at four minutes 10 seconds after O’Reilly’s score.

Down referee Ciarán Branagan added three minutes to the announced six at Croke Park on Saturday, enabling Dublin to close a six-point deficit by the 79th minute. Most observers accept that the match had been held up for that amount of time, as the referee administered some cards, injuries were treated and replacements took to the field.

McGill contends however that referees are far more aware of the need to address deliberate time wasting.

“When the board goes up for five minutes’ additional time and teams are trying to run down the clock and as a reaction to that, referees are now way more conscious of the fact that there needs to be at least five minutes of injury-time. People at matches know the phrase, ‘there’ll be at least five minutes additional time’.”

Seven years ago, a motion to congress was successful in introducing the countdown clock familiar from women’s football. But after trialling the idea in third-level college’s fixtures, the GAA decided not to proceed after identifying what were seen as shortcomings in the system.

As a result, the 2013 amendment was deleted at a subsequent Congress.

The misgivings about the time-keeping system that has proved successful in the women’s game were based on reputational damage to the association, according to the report presented to Central Council:

“As part of the two trials of the clock/hooter system conducted, a number of concerns were raised by those who witnessed the trials in action with regard to the impact the introduction of the clock and hooter might have on the playing of our games.

“These included operating officials, referees, players, mentors and spectators. These concerns – along with the suggested protocol for implementation – were also presented to Central Council delegates. In the main, the concerns centred on potential damage to the reputation of association:

These included human error or failure to operate it properly, system failure, prevalence of ‘fouling down’ the clock, the playing of ‘keep ball’ when the clock was in view and deliberate concession of possession in order to make the ball go dead.”


There are no plans to revisit the idea.

Article from the Irish Times a few days back.

Regarding the first bit in bold I don't think I've been at any tight game in the last few years at every level where timekeeping wasn't raised as an issue afterwards.
It's a consistent theme be in club, school or intercounty where the score is tight.


The second bit in bold shows the flimsiness of the case against a hooter system given all the arguements listed here against it already occur.
I argue that more reputational damage is being done by continuing on with the current system.
It's as certain as rain is wet there will be countless more tight games where the ref's timekeeping comes up as an issue until eventually a hooter system is adopted.

The key argument in favour of a hooter system is the blatant evidence of the women's game where the hooter system works so well in literally thousands of games.

I'd love to hear those who have adopted the "yerra things are grand" approach like Feargal here make the case as to why things would not be better with a hooter system like the women's game.

Well said.

This just further highlights the absolute disconnect between the top brass of the GAA and the grassroots. I mean is this fella watching games at all? It's an issue that crops up on most weekends!

Here's another quote from Feargal McGill '“The game (Kildare v Mayo) has been fixed for 7pm in Croke Park, and that is not going to change under any circumstances”. A common theme is digging the heels in despite all of the evidence telling you that you're wrong. Like the Newbridge episode, they'll eventually buckle on the stopclock but only after pressure is put on. Always reactive and never proactive.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Milltown Row2 on February 13, 2020, 10:55:32 PM
Heard David Gough explaining this. The new watches the refs have cater for this and it's all done correctly to the rules. Trouble here is lack of understanding of the rules and possibly the GAA doing a poor job of communicating the actual situation.

Quelle Surprise.

Quote
GAA insist time keeping is not a major issue in games
No plans for review despite accusations of inconsistency by Meath boss
Tue, Feb 11, 2020, 01:00
Seán Moran
 
The GAA have no plans to review time keeping procedures after criticism from Meath manager Andy McEntee of the lack of added time played in his team’s narrow defeat by Mayo in Navan.

Feargal McGill, the GAA’s Head of Games Administration, said that he was happy with the standard of time keeping, which was overhauled a few years ago in order to address time wasting. As a result, matches frequently run up to the 76th and 77th minutes.

“I have to say that I think there’s a high standard of consistency at the moment from our officials in how they apply the rules on time. We have minimum allowances for substitutions and regulations that were introduced at the start of 2016 to ensure that adequate additional time was being played.

“I don’t think you have the situation where people are walking away from matches every week complaining about the amount of time being played or not played.

“There have been high-profile incidents recently of referees playing way over the announced time – the Kilcoo game [All-Ireland club football final against Corofin] and the Dublin game [last Saturday] and if you look at both of those games you’d see that the referee got it right.”

McEntee’s unhappiness was made clear to print, digital and broadcast media after the match when he contrasted how his team had been granted no additional time beyond the announced four minutes with Dublin’s experience on Saturday night. Both he and his players seemed to anticipate a further opportunity to equalise after Thomas Reilly had cut the deficit to a point.

“I can’t believe – the amount of breaks that were there in those four minutes of extra-time and we don’t play two seconds of extra-time? Dublin got two minutes last night [Saturday] to get an equalising score. There’s a level of inconsistency all over the place. And they want referees to get respect. They’ve got to show a little bit too.

“It’s one rule for the Dublin’s and the bigger names in this world and it’s a different rule for everybody else.”

He referred to an incident in which Mayo replacement Bryan Walsh had been down injured during additional time.

“He’s supposed to play on . . .” he said of Tyrone referee Seán Hurson. “I mean if that guy is lying down on the ground for 30 seconds holding his head – 30 seconds, you get two scores in 30 seconds”

The Meath manager had grounds for grievance in that instance. Four minutes were announced as injury-time but whereas the injury stopped play for 35 seconds, the clock stopped at four minutes 10 seconds after O’Reilly’s score.

Down referee Ciarán Branagan added three minutes to the announced six at Croke Park on Saturday, enabling Dublin to close a six-point deficit by the 79th minute. Most observers accept that the match had been held up for that amount of time, as the referee administered some cards, injuries were treated and replacements took to the field.

McGill contends however that referees are far more aware of the need to address deliberate time wasting.

“When the board goes up for five minutes’ additional time and teams are trying to run down the clock and as a reaction to that, referees are now way more conscious of the fact that there needs to be at least five minutes of injury-time. People at matches know the phrase, ‘there’ll be at least five minutes additional time’.”

Seven years ago, a motion to congress was successful in introducing the countdown clock familiar from women’s football. But after trialling the idea in third-level college’s fixtures, the GAA decided not to proceed after identifying what were seen as shortcomings in the system.

As a result, the 2013 amendment was deleted at a subsequent Congress.

The misgivings about the time-keeping system that has proved successful in the women’s game were based on reputational damage to the association, according to the report presented to Central Council:

“As part of the two trials of the clock/hooter system conducted, a number of concerns were raised by those who witnessed the trials in action with regard to the impact the introduction of the clock and hooter might have on the playing of our games.

“These included operating officials, referees, players, mentors and spectators. These concerns – along with the suggested protocol for implementation – were also presented to Central Council delegates. In the main, the concerns centred on potential damage to the reputation of association:

These included human error or failure to operate it properly, system failure, prevalence of ‘fouling down’ the clock, the playing of ‘keep ball’ when the clock was in view and deliberate concession of possession in order to make the ball go dead.”


There are no plans to revisit the idea.

Article from the Irish Times a few days back.

Regarding the first bit in bold I don't think I've been at any tight game in the last few years at every level where timekeeping wasn't raised as an issue afterwards.
It's a consistent theme be in club, school or intercounty where the score is tight.


The second bit in bold shows the flimsiness of the case against a hooter system given all the arguements listed here against it already occur.
I argue that more reputational damage is being done by continuing on with the current system.
It's as certain as rain is wet there will be countless more tight games where the ref's timekeeping comes up as an issue until eventually a hooter system is adopted.

The key argument in favour of a hooter system is the blatant evidence of the women's game where the hooter system works so well in literally thousands of games.

I'd love to hear those who have adopted the "yerra things are grand" approach like Feargal here make the case as to why things would not be better with a hooter system like the women's game.

Well said.

This just further highlights the absolute disconnect between the top brass of the GAA and the grassroots. I mean is this fella watching games at all? It's an issue that crops up on most weekends!

I walk away from a match with few thoughts, we could have played better, we were brilliant, can’t remember last time I walked away from a game as a supporter going, flip sake, we should have had 2 more minutes there at the end!
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Dubhaltach on February 13, 2020, 11:01:46 PM
Heard David Gough explaining this. The new watches the refs have cater for this and it's all done correctly to the rules. Trouble here is lack of understanding of the rules and possibly the GAA doing a poor job of communicating the actual situation.

Quelle Surprise.

Quote
GAA insist time keeping is not a major issue in games
No plans for review despite accusations of inconsistency by Meath boss
Tue, Feb 11, 2020, 01:00
Seán Moran
 
The GAA have no plans to review time keeping procedures after criticism from Meath manager Andy McEntee of the lack of added time played in his team’s narrow defeat by Mayo in Navan.

Feargal McGill, the GAA’s Head of Games Administration, said that he was happy with the standard of time keeping, which was overhauled a few years ago in order to address time wasting. As a result, matches frequently run up to the 76th and 77th minutes.

“I have to say that I think there’s a high standard of consistency at the moment from our officials in how they apply the rules on time. We have minimum allowances for substitutions and regulations that were introduced at the start of 2016 to ensure that adequate additional time was being played.

“I don’t think you have the situation where people are walking away from matches every week complaining about the amount of time being played or not played.

“There have been high-profile incidents recently of referees playing way over the announced time – the Kilcoo game [All-Ireland club football final against Corofin] and the Dublin game [last Saturday] and if you look at both of those games you’d see that the referee got it right.”

McEntee’s unhappiness was made clear to print, digital and broadcast media after the match when he contrasted how his team had been granted no additional time beyond the announced four minutes with Dublin’s experience on Saturday night. Both he and his players seemed to anticipate a further opportunity to equalise after Thomas Reilly had cut the deficit to a point.

“I can’t believe – the amount of breaks that were there in those four minutes of extra-time and we don’t play two seconds of extra-time? Dublin got two minutes last night [Saturday] to get an equalising score. There’s a level of inconsistency all over the place. And they want referees to get respect. They’ve got to show a little bit too.

“It’s one rule for the Dublin’s and the bigger names in this world and it’s a different rule for everybody else.”

He referred to an incident in which Mayo replacement Bryan Walsh had been down injured during additional time.

“He’s supposed to play on . . .” he said of Tyrone referee Seán Hurson. “I mean if that guy is lying down on the ground for 30 seconds holding his head – 30 seconds, you get two scores in 30 seconds”

The Meath manager had grounds for grievance in that instance. Four minutes were announced as injury-time but whereas the injury stopped play for 35 seconds, the clock stopped at four minutes 10 seconds after O’Reilly’s score.

Down referee Ciarán Branagan added three minutes to the announced six at Croke Park on Saturday, enabling Dublin to close a six-point deficit by the 79th minute. Most observers accept that the match had been held up for that amount of time, as the referee administered some cards, injuries were treated and replacements took to the field.

McGill contends however that referees are far more aware of the need to address deliberate time wasting.

“When the board goes up for five minutes’ additional time and teams are trying to run down the clock and as a reaction to that, referees are now way more conscious of the fact that there needs to be at least five minutes of injury-time. People at matches know the phrase, ‘there’ll be at least five minutes additional time’.”

Seven years ago, a motion to congress was successful in introducing the countdown clock familiar from women’s football. But after trialling the idea in third-level college’s fixtures, the GAA decided not to proceed after identifying what were seen as shortcomings in the system.

As a result, the 2013 amendment was deleted at a subsequent Congress.

The misgivings about the time-keeping system that has proved successful in the women’s game were based on reputational damage to the association, according to the report presented to Central Council:

“As part of the two trials of the clock/hooter system conducted, a number of concerns were raised by those who witnessed the trials in action with regard to the impact the introduction of the clock and hooter might have on the playing of our games.

“These included operating officials, referees, players, mentors and spectators. These concerns – along with the suggested protocol for implementation – were also presented to Central Council delegates. In the main, the concerns centred on potential damage to the reputation of association:

These included human error or failure to operate it properly, system failure, prevalence of ‘fouling down’ the clock, the playing of ‘keep ball’ when the clock was in view and deliberate concession of possession in order to make the ball go dead.”


There are no plans to revisit the idea.

Article from the Irish Times a few days back.

Regarding the first bit in bold I don't think I've been at any tight game in the last few years at every level where timekeeping wasn't raised as an issue afterwards.
It's a consistent theme be in club, school or intercounty where the score is tight.


The second bit in bold shows the flimsiness of the case against a hooter system given all the arguements listed here against it already occur.
I argue that more reputational damage is being done by continuing on with the current system.
It's as certain as rain is wet there will be countless more tight games where the ref's timekeeping comes up as an issue until eventually a hooter system is adopted.

The key argument in favour of a hooter system is the blatant evidence of the women's game where the hooter system works so well in literally thousands of games.

I'd love to hear those who have adopted the "yerra things are grand" approach like Feargal here make the case as to why things would not be better with a hooter system like the women's game.

Well said.

This just further highlights the absolute disconnect between the top brass of the GAA and the grassroots. I mean is this fella watching games at all? It's an issue that crops up on most weekends!

I walk away from a match with few thoughts, we could have played better, we were brilliant, can’t remember last time I walked away from a game as a supporter going, flip sake, we should have had 2 more minutes there at the end!
The thoughts you refer to are not mutually exclusive.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: PadraicHenryPearse on February 19, 2020, 07:13:32 PM
i made this comment on the dublin monaghan thread but with the added time etc. at the end took over discussion.

i believe there was a sub made after monaghan won a mark in 2nd half (mcmanus i think). is this correct can you make a sub after a mark?
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Main Street on February 19, 2020, 07:47:01 PM
i made this comment on the dublin monaghan thread but with the added time etc. at the end took over discussion.

i believe there was a sub made after monaghan won a mark in 2nd half (mcmanus i think). is this correct can you make a sub after a mark?
Are you asking if a mark constitutes a break in play where a sub can be made?
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: PadraicHenryPearse on February 19, 2020, 08:14:20 PM
yes, thats my question. apologies for being unclear.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Main Street on February 19, 2020, 08:48:24 PM
I can see your point though (ie. if it is your point), if it was the case that McManus made the mark and the Monaghan momentum was halted in order to allow the crafty Dubs to make a substitution, thereby nullifying the honestly won advantage.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: PadraicHenryPearse on February 19, 2020, 09:09:31 PM
I thought the mark lasts 15 seconds so the advantage could have been seen to be with mcmanus also.

if it is only 15 seconds then its not a break in play in my opinion.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Main Street on February 19, 2020, 09:35:36 PM
I thought the mark lasts 15 seconds so the advantage could have been seen to be with mcmanus also.

if it is only 15 seconds then its not a break in play in my opinion.
The mark is only a 5 seconds break if the player chooses to take the free kick.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Nanderson on February 19, 2020, 10:00:45 PM
I thought the mark lasts 15 seconds so the advantage could have been seen to be with mcmanus also.

if it is only 15 seconds then its not a break in play in my opinion.
The mark is only a 5 seconds break if the player chooses to take the free kick.
pretty sure its 15. at least thats what we have been told for the new rules this year. was 5 last year afaik
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: JoG2 on February 19, 2020, 10:11:16 PM
15 secs yes. And ref's have been instructed to give the player taking a mark a couple of steps to decide if he wishes to take the mark ie put his hand up
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: PadraicHenryPearse on February 19, 2020, 10:19:54 PM
is there also guidance about not signalling the mark and playing on. you cannot be tackled for 4 steps or length of time it takes to take 4 steps.

if this happens in the large rectangle would it be a penalty or 14m free?
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: lenny on February 19, 2020, 10:23:02 PM
15 secs yes. And ref's have been instructed to give the player taking a mark a couple of steps to decide if he wishes to take the mark ie put his hand up

Forwards get 15 seconds, defenders get 5 seconds. I suppose the difference being the forward is given more time as he is kicking for a point.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: twohands!!! on February 19, 2020, 10:34:05 PM
I thought the mark lasts 15 seconds so the advantage could have been seen to be with mcmanus also.

if it is only 15 seconds then its not a break in play in my opinion.
The mark is only a 5 seconds break if the player chooses to take the free kick.
pretty sure its 15. at least thats what we have been told for the new rules this year. was 5 last year afaik

Yup it was increased from 5 seconds to 15 seconds when the updated rules came in this year.

The latest version of the rule book on GAA.ie still hasn't been updated with the new rules (there's no mention of the attacking mark anywhere in it)
This is seriously shoddy stuff from the GAA - change the rules, but don't actually bother to update the rule-book on the organisation's web-site.

Based on last year's rules, I think a team is allowed make a substitution when a mark from a kickout is caught and the player opts not to play on because the wording indicates that not playing on is calling "taking a free kick " and free kicks are regarded as a break in play, during which substitutions are allowed.

Quote
A Substitution may only be made during a break in play, after the player has given a substitution note to the Referee, or in the case of a InterCounty Senior game, to the Sideline Official.

This shall also apply to a Temporary Substitution allowed under Rule 1.5 (b), Rules of Control -
Injuries: Blood.

A break in play shall be when the play is stopped after a score or wide or for a free, sideline puck/ kick or when the Referee has stopped play for medical attention to an injured player.

Quote
Mark
When a player catches the ball cleanly from a Kick-Out without it touching the ground, on or past the 45m line nearest the Kick-Out point, he shall be awarded a ‘Mark’ by the Referee.  The player awarded a ‘Mark’ shall have the options of (a) Taking a free kick or (b) Playing on immediately
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Main Street on February 19, 2020, 10:38:58 PM
Okay, the advanced mark is 15 secs and  your everyday plain mark is still 5 seconds.
Both still don't constitute a break in play so that a substitution can be made,  do they?
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: JoG2 on February 19, 2020, 11:08:20 PM
is there also guidance about not signalling the mark and playing on. you cannot be tackled for 4 steps or length of time it takes to take 4 steps.

if this happens in the large rectangle would it be a penalty or 14m free?

You can only shadow the attacker for the 4 steps , if you lay a hand on him in the large rectangle (during the 4 steps) , it's a penalty.

15 secs yes. And ref's have been instructed to give the player taking a mark a couple of steps to decide if he wishes to take the mark ie put his hand up

Forwards get 15 seconds, defenders get 5 seconds. I suppose the difference being the forward is given more time as he is kicking for a point.

Aye, that's it. If the player taking the mark gets injured in the process, the nearest player takes the free. So get your free taker sprinting over if its a level game with a minute or 2 to go!
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: twohands!!! on February 19, 2020, 11:08:26 PM
is there also guidance about not signalling the mark and playing on. you cannot be tackled for 4 steps or length of time it takes to take 4 steps.

if this happens in the large rectangle would it be a penalty or 14m free?

Penalty - see the link here
https://www.gaa.ie/football/news/guide-to-new-the-gaelic-football-playing-rules/

At the moment it's a penalty but the Standing Rules Committee have a motion that will be voted at the Annual Congress on the 29th that would allow defenders to tackle a player who makes an attacking mark in either the large or small rectangle immediately i.e no 4 steps allowance. The Standing Rules Committee continue to cover themselves in glory.
I haven't see the actual wording of this further updating to the advanced mark rule so not sure if it's large or small rectangle.

Also coming up with wording might be a bit tricky in terms of what happens when a player makes a mark just outside the area (be it large or small rectangle) and plays on - where exactly would the defender be allowed tackle him - when the ball comes into the area or would he have to wait for the player to enter the area. Even if the wording is clear it will most likely be an absolute nightmare of a rule for refs to make a call on, and the punishment for a defending team who breaks the rule is a penalty, expect controversy on this one.

Also pondering it a bit you could you see lads deliberatly staying outside the area so they don't get tackled but rather set their bodies to tap over an easy point or even worse the dreaded fisted point - it's possible this advantage mark will increase the logic of taking the fisted points in certain situations  - for instance in the last few minutes of a drawn game -  lad goes up catches ball outside the square, plays on, stays outside the area and uses his four unchallended steps to handpasss the ball at his ease over the bar.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: twohands!!! on February 19, 2020, 11:09:37 PM
Okay, the advanced mark is 15 secs and  your everyday plain mark is still 5 seconds.
Both still don't constitute a break in play so that a substitution can be made,  do they?

Nope 15 seconds for all marks now.

If the player opts to play on, its not a break in play and substitutions aren't allowed.
If the player stops and takes the kick, it is a break in play and substitutions are allowed.

Quote
2: For all marks (the advance mark and the kickout mark) the following provisions apply; the player will now be allowed 15 seconds to take the mark (it was 5 seconds previously). The opposing players must retreat 13m (it was 10m previously).

https://www.gaa.ie/football/news/guide-to-new-the-gaelic-football-playing-rules/
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: twohands!!! on February 19, 2020, 11:23:10 PM
is there also guidance about not signalling the mark and playing on. you cannot be tackled for 4 steps or length of time it takes to take 4 steps.

if this happens in the large rectangle would it be a penalty or 14m free?

You can only shadow the attacker for the 4 steps , if you lay a hand on him in the large rectangle (during the 4 steps) , it's a penalty.

15 secs yes. And ref's have been instructed to give the player taking a mark a couple of steps to decide if he wishes to take the mark ie put his hand up

Forwards get 15 seconds, defenders get 5 seconds. I suppose the difference being the forward is given more time as he is kicking for a point.

Aye, that's it. If the player taking the mark gets injured in the process, the nearest player takes the free. So get your free taker sprinting over if its a level game with a minute or 2 to go!

Can see there being shenanigans with this one.
Last play of a drawn All-Ireland Tommy Walsh goes up among a scrum of players and hauls down a mark.
Gets injured in the process of landing.
Ref has to figure which Kerry player was the nearest to him.
In a scrum of moving jumping players, picking the nearest could be a right game of pin the tail on the donkey.
Is it nearest when he catches the ball in the air or when he lands or what happens if he goes sprawling and ends up on the gound from his leap?
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: bannside on February 20, 2020, 08:31:34 AM
Yesterday I read an article in the Irish News by Brendan Crossan which if someone could paste on here it would be well worth a read. The views expressed are from Antrim manager Lenny Harbinson and I havent seen or heard anything yet that resembles a solution that fixes so many problems at the one time. Probably ten years ahead of it's time, but something needs to happen or our great game will end up being a shoot out between three or four counties and everyone else bankrupt in chasing a prize that is unattainable.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: JoG2 on February 20, 2020, 08:40:06 AM
Both articles


DO away with pre-season competitions.

Rip up the National League and blend it in with the championship.

Give teams more exposure to those above them and try to level the playing field by allowing the rising tide to lift the boats that most need lifted.

That is the general thrust of how Lenny Harbinson views the footballing landscape. It has, over the last 15 years, become very lop-sided.

Go back a decade, back to when Harbinson was guiding St Gall’s to an All-Ireland club title.

ADVERTISING

20 of the 32 counties are in the same division of the Allianz Football League now that they were then. Only Cork and Derry, who were both in Division One then and are both in Division Three now, are more than one league out either way now.

Only Clare from that year’s Division Four have seen the heights of Division Two in that time in between, while Mayo, Dublin, Kerry, Galway and Tyrone have almost exclusively been in Division One, while Monaghan are in their sixth straight year there.

The National League system has produced some extraordinary entertainment, but has it also produced a series of heavier ceilings that the teams beneath just cannot crack?

For Harbinson, the answer is to mash up the league and combine it with the championship in a new format altogether.


“Take all the provincial championships away and say we’re going into four groups of eight. Blend the league into the championship,” says the Antrim manager.

“The top four teams in each group go straight into the top tier knockout. Start it in January, and do away with the Mickey Mouse competitions.

“Come April, the top four go and play for Sam Maguire, the bottom four go into a second tier competition. You could seed it, two from Division One in each group, two from Division Two, and so on.

“You’re giving everybody a go at playing against teams, some who will be at their level, some who will be better. Some days you’ll compete, some days you’ll get a trouncing, but you’d hope that the rising tide would lift all boats and bring your standard up.

“If you don’t get in the top four, the secondary competition is there and run off side-by-side with the primary competition.

“Something like that would have worked a lot better. Instead, because you’re Division Three or Four, you’re shoehorned into a secondary competition and given no chance to affect that.”

His plans can be seen on the opposite page.

The basic rundown is that the pre-season competitions are dropped, the League is brought forward into early January and played off as a double-round competition across the next 17 weeks.

It’s split up into something resembling the old 1A/1B/2A/2B system, with the current standings used as seedings to split the 32 teams into four groups.

The top four at the end of each group go into the All-Ireland SFC and the bottom four go into the All-Ireland IFC. Both are played concurrently and both are straight knockout, with an open draw.

It’s all over by the end of June and each county has played a minimum of 16 games, comfortably more than the current minimum of 10. That’s if you include the pre-season competitions. If not, the minimum is just nine across a season that lasts at least six months, if not eight.

All counties would be subject to a maximum spend of £500,000 per code across all their inter-county squads, from development up to senior, and must invest £100,000 into club coaching and development each year.

Counties that run into an overspend would be deducted points in the following year’s competitions.

University and schools football would be played during the first term between September and December

Harbinson also suggests that the GAA be split into two sections centrally. An administrative end that looks after finances and fixtures, while another central body would be responsible for all strategic investments by any county.

The Antrim boss would do away with Congress and appoint a central GAA board that includes Tom Ryan (Director General), Ger Mulryan (finance director), as well as a handful of other directors including ones to cover coaching and administration.

“They would be responsible to a GAA shareholders’ board made up of six county chairmen, six club chairmen and three independent, professional people.

“That board would have three years to plan and execute, with key measurements in place for GAA shareholders to monitor and measure progress.

“And this group would have the power to hire and fire. If hiring, they can source a chief executive with no GAA past. They only need to get the best person.

“The GAA should also run strategic courses to help counties close the gap. For example, strength and conditioning accreditations. Three people from each county attend and best practice is shared.

“County GAA coaches would have to do a professional badge, and only badge holders can coach or manage at county level, and only within their own county.

“There should also be a team of ‘super coaches’, maybe five groups of four people each that actually go into a failing county and spend time sharing best practice to put a recovery plan in place to help close the gap with other counties.”

Harbinson also says he would do away with the four provincial councils and replace them with four paid directors who sit on the GAA’s central board and each take charge of an area.

“The GAA is run like a business in Croke Park, but once you go outside the front doors, they’re leaving the provinces, and then the counties within each province, to do their own things in many aspects. There’s some governance but not a lot.

“Various parts of the organisation are pulling against each other. It shouldn’t be beyond the realms of possibility for the GAA to have a strategic department, a finance department.

“They can’t be in control of every nook and cranny in every county, but you delegate out and you take central control of it. They don’t do that, and as we can see, costs are going up, there are overspends, and they’re doing nothing about it. It’s been flagged up for years.”

And away on he goes, back to work. The GAA could do worse than bring him in and listen.

***********************

LENNY’S PLAN
(Based on 2020 National Football League, with current standings taken as final positions)

- No pre-season competitions
- No provincial championships
- Championship and league blended together
- Organised in four groups of eight, without New York
- Groups seeded, with two teams from each 2020 NFL division in each group
- Double round league, fourteen games each, home and away
- Top four in each group go through to All-Ireland SFC quarter-finals
- Bottom four in each group move into All-Ireland IFC quarter-finals
- Both competitions open draw
- Two competitions run side-by-sid
- Two options for Championship dates – either May 17 to June 28, or August 9 to September 20
- All-Ireland SFC and IFC finals played on the same weekend, if not together

Groups seeded, randomly generated
Group A: Galway, Meath, Westmeath, Clare, Cork, Derry, Sligo, London
Group B: Mayo, Kerry, Laois, Kildare, Longford, Down, Carlow, Wexford
Group C: Tyrone, Donegal, Armagh, Fermanagh, Offaly, Tipperary, Antrim, Waterford
Group D: Dublin, Monaghan, Cavan, Roscommon, Leitrim, Louth, Limerick, Wicklow

Group stage fixtures
January 4/5
Group A: Meath v Galway, London v Westmeath, Sligo v Clare, Cork v Derry
Group B: Kerry v Mayo, Laois v Wexford, Kildare v Carlow, Longford v Down
Group C: Donegal v Tyrone, Armagh v Waterford, Fermanagh v Antrim, Offaly v Tipperary
Group D: Monaghan v Dublin, Cavan v Wicklow, Roscommon v Limerick, Leitrim v Louth

January 11/12
Group A: Westmeath v Clare, Galway v Sligo, London v Derry, Cork v Meath
Group B: Laois v Kildare, Mayo v Carlow, Wexford v Down, Kerry v Longford
Group C: Armagh v Fermanagh, Tyrone v Antrim, Waterford v Tipperary, Donegal v Offaly
Group D: Cavan v Roscommon, Dublin v Limerick, Wicklow v Louth, Monaghan v Leitrim

January 18/19
Group A: Sligo v Cork, London v Clare, Meath v Westmeath, Derry v Galway
Group B: Carlow v Longford, Wexford v Kildare, Kerry v Laois, Down v Mayo
Group C: Antrim v Offaly, Waterford v Fermanagh, Donegal v Armagh, Tipperary v Tyrone
Group D: Limerick v Leitrim, Wicklow v Roscommon, Monaghan v Cavan, Louth v Dublin

January 25/26
Group A: Galway v Westmeath, Clare v Meath, Cork v London, Derry v Sligo
Group B: Mayo v Laois, Kildare v Kerry, Longford v Wexford, Down v Carlow
Group C: Tyrone v Armagh, Fermanagh v Donegal, Offaly v Waterford, Tipperary v Antrim
Group D: Dublin v Cavan, Roscommon v Monaghan, Leitrim v Wicklow, Limerick v Louth

February 1/2
Break week

February 8/9
Group A: Clare v Cork, London v Galway, Meath v Sligo, Westmeath v Derry
Group B: Kildare v Longford, Wexford v Mayo, Kerry v Carlow, Laois v Down
Group C: Fermanagh v Offaly, Waterford v Tyrone, Donegal v Antrim, Armagh v Tipperary
Group D: Roscommon v Leitrim, Wicklow v Dublin, Monaghan v Limerick, Cavan v Louth

February 15/16
Group A: Derry v Meath, Sligo v London, Clare v Galway, Cork v Westmeath
Group B: Down v Kerry, Carlow v Wexford, Kildare v Mayo, Longford v Laois
Group C: Tipperary v Donegal, Antrim v Waterford, Fermanagh v Tyrone, Offaly v Armagh
Group D: Louth v Monaghan, Limerick v Wicklow, Roscommon v Dublin, Leitrim v Cavan

February 22/23
Group A: Sligo v Westmeath, London v Meath, Galway v Cork, Derry v Clare
Group B: Carlow v Laois, Wexford v Kerry, Mayo v Longford, Down v Kildare
Group C: Antrim v Armagh, Waterford v Donegal, Tyrone v Offaly, Tipperary v Fermanagh
Group D: Limerick v Cavan, Wicklow v Monaghan, Dublin v Leitrim, Louth v Roscommon

February 29 / March 1
Group A: Galway v Meath, Westmeath v London, Clare v Sligo, Derry v Cork
Group B: Mayo v Kerry, Wexford v Laois, Carlow v Kildare, Down v Longford
Group C: Tyrone v Donegal, Waterford v Armagh, Antrim v Fermanagh, Tipperary v Offaly
Group D: Dublin v Monaghan, Wicklow v Cavan, Limerick v Roscommon, Louth v Leitrim

March 7/8
Break week

March 14/15
Group A: Clare v Westmeath, Sligo v Galway, Derry v London, Meath v Cork
Group B: Kildare v Laois, Carlow v Mayo, Down v Wexford, Longford v Kerry
Group C: Fermanagh v Armagh, Antrim v Tyrone, Tipperary v Waterford, Offaly v Donegal
Group D: Roscommon v Cavan, Limerick v Dublin, Louth v Wicklow, Leitrim v Monaghan

March 21/22
Group A: Cork v Sligo, Clare v London, Westmeath v Meath, Galway v Derry
Group B: Longford v Carlow, Kildare v Wexford, Laois v Kerry, Mayo v Down
Group C: Offaly v Antrim, Fermanagh v Waterford, Armagh v Donegal, Tyrone v Tipperary
Group D: Leitrim v Limerick, Roscommon v Wicklow, Cavan v Monaghan, Dublin v Louth

March 28/29
Group A: Westmeath v Galway, Meath v Clare, London v Cork, Sligo v Derry
Group B: Laois v Mayo, Kerry v Kildare, Wexford v Longford, Carlow v Down
Group C: Armagh v Tyrone, Donegal v Fermanagh, Waterford v Offaly, Antrim v Tipperary
Group D: Cavan v Dublin, Monaghan v Roscommon, Wicklow v Leitrim, Louth v Limerick

April 4/5
Break week

April 11/12
Group A: Cork v Clare, Galway v London, Sligo v Meath, Derry v Westmeath
Group B: Longford v Kildare, Mayo v Wexford, Carlow v Kerry, Down v Laois
Group C: Offaly v Fermanagh, Tyrone v Waterford, Antrim v Donegal, Tipperary v Armagh
Group D: Leitrim v Roscommon, Dublin v Wicklow, Limerick v Monaghan, Louth v Cavan

April 18/19
Group A: Meath v Derry, London v Sligo, Galway v Clare, Westmeath v Cork
Group B: Kerry v Down, Wexford v Carlow, Mayo v Kildare, Laois v Longford
Group C: Donegal v Tipperary, Waterford v Antrim, Tyrone v Fermanagh, Armagh v Offaly
Group D: Monaghan v Louth, Wicklow v Limerick, Dublin v Roscommon, Cavan v Leitrim

April 25/26
Group A: Westmeath v Sligo, Meath v London, Cork v Galway, Clare v Derry
Group B: Laois v Carlow, Kerry v Wexford, Longford v Mayo, Kildare v Down
Group C: Armagh v Antrim, Donegal v Waterford, Offaly v Tyrone, Fermanagh v Tipperary
Group D: Cavan v Limerick, Monaghan v Wicklow, Leitrim v Dublin, Roscommon v Louth

Championship schedule
- Either May 17 to June 28, or August 9 to September 20
- If May / June, club fixtures come in straight after inter-county championships end
- If August / September, inter-county teams break on April 26 and club league fixtures are played through May, June and early July, with club championships played from September 27 onwards

May 2/3: Break week

May 9/10: Break week

May 16/17
All-Ireland SFC and IFC round one (lowest ranked team at home where applicable)
All-Ireland SFC: Westmeath v Galway, Donegal v Mayo, Kildare v Dublin, Fermanagh v Roscommon, Tyrone v Galway, Cavan v Armagh, Laois v Monaghan, Clare v Kerry
All-Ireland IFC: Sligo v Derry, Waterford v Offaly, Louth v Down, Carlow v Cork, Limerick v Wicklow, Wexford v Longford, London v Leitrim, Antrim v Tipperary

May 23/24: Break week

May 30/31
All-Ireland SFC and IFC quarter-finals (neutral, games paired)
All-Ireland SFC: Tyrone v Kerry, Armagh v Dublin, Monaghan v Roscommon, Galway v Donegal
All-Ireland IFC: Down v Limerick, Cork v Tipperary, Offaly v Longford, Derry v Leitrim

June 6/7: Break week

June 13/14
All-Ireland SFC and IFC semi-finals
All-Ireland SFC: Kerry v Dublin, Monaghan v Donegal
All-Ireland IFC: Down v Cork, Longford v Derry

June 20/21: Break week

June 27/28
All-Ireland SFC final: Dublin v Donegal
All-Ireland IFC final: Cork v Derry

--------------------------------------------------------

ANTRIM manager Lenny Harbinson believes that the GAA must deal with the growing spending on inter-county teams by not only introducing a spending cap, but also having a minimum spend on coaching and clubs.

The debate around the amount of finance county boards are putting directly into county teams has intensified since GAA director general Tom Ryan revealed last week that the 2019 figure was €30m.

That represented an increase of almost 12 per cent in a single year, and matched up to the vast majority of the €36.1m the GAA brought in from gate receipts. That figure was boosted by the €3m from an All-Ireland football final replay, as well as an increase in ticket prices last year.

Harbinson, whose team have condensed their training down to just two nights a week and are doing double sessions of gym followed by pitch, says that not only must there be a spending cap on county squads, but that county boards must be held responsible for investing in other areas.

“Have a cap at one end and a minimum spend threshold at the other,” said the Saffrons’ boss.

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“There should be a cap. It should be up to a value of £500,000 per code, to cover all their teams from development squads up.

“If Antrim want to spend £200,000 that’s up to them, and if Dublin want to spend right up to the limit, that’s ok.

“What they should be looking at is that every county, depending on their size and number of clubs, should have a minimum spend on coaching and a minimum amount going back into clubs.

“That might be £100,000. They have to show how they’re putting money back into their own county, to get structures in place.


“You need to have a twin-track approach, where you can’t overspend on your county teams and you must take a portion of the budget you have and make sure it’s being invested in grassroots and clubs, to keep the heart of the organisation ticking over.”

In a wide-ranging discussion in today’s Irish News, Harbinson reveals his proposed structure for the championship and states his belief that the existence of provincial councils is one of the biggest barriers to progress in the GAA.

While accepting that some degree of spending on inter-county teams is an inevitability, Harbinson says that the four provincial bodies “have too much say… consequently, the GAA can’t control things.”

“For the greater good of the association, as a Gael, I don’t want to see my own county or any county in financial trouble. That has big consequences.

“Similarly when you read reports about stadiums and whatever else, there are a lot of things wrong. The provincial boards probably have too much say and sway in lots of things. Consequently, the GAA can’t control things.

“If you look at it from finance and fixtures, you have the tail wagging the dog. Central Council should be in control of everything and delegating it out to whatever departments, and regionalise it.

“But you have the Ulster Council and the others making their own fixtures and shoe-horning that into a national fixture list, and it’s not fit for purpose in the 21st century. It’s not working.

“Centralisation, with proper checks and balances, is how to run an organisation. Yes, you delegate out, but it all has to be controlled.

“All the GAA had to do was say ‘thank you very much’ to the provincial organisations.

“Ulster, let’s say they run on a budget of £5m, to run schools, coaching, supporting the community, all of which they’re very good at. I’m not saying do away with it, but what Central Council could do is take all the finances.

“They tell Ulster Council that they’re granted £5m, but it’s controlled centrally. Likewise do the same with the rest. Take all the provincial championships away.

“You can’t do any of that while you have the provincial councils in place, controlling things, controlling fixtures, controlling stadium builds and wanting their slice of the cake.”

* See P68-69 for Lenny Harbinson’s plan to reshape the championship and the GAA’s structures
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: bannside on February 20, 2020, 08:59:22 AM
Excellent thanks. Read that again in detail. It's very hard to pick any single point and find fault with it. Superb vision. Anyone care to share their thoughts. Is this achievable or is it all too futuristic.

The bit I like best is the cap on spending on preparing county teams and more into clubs and grass roots activity. Plus...the view that provincial boards are more of a hindrance than a help. Over €5million paid out last year in salaries across the country and what we have is a fixture congestion mess, county boards going bankrupt and about three or four teams realistically chasing the big prize. Our game is in turmoil in so many levels..something drastically needs to change .
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: magpie seanie on February 20, 2020, 09:08:31 AM
Did he submit that to the Fixtures Review Committee? I know that splitting the year like that (first half county, second half club) and that format (4 groups of 8) were discussed. Think the 4 groups of 8 is one of the options on the table at Congress but the split year was not recommended by the Fixtures Review Committee though not a double round. 14 intercounty games in 17 weeks is just crazy. Leaving clubs without their stars for 6 months is not right in my opinion either, especially when they'll arrive back flaked out (most will doubtless want a break after that punishing schedule at the very least.

Personally I think moving the National football leagues, with an added knockout stage to become the Championship to the summer and provincial championships (on a round robin basis with a final) to spring would be awesome.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: bannside on February 20, 2020, 09:22:46 AM
I take your point MS about county players returning burnt out to their clubs. I know it's not perfect but only 4 counties will be involved at the end of this schedule and in those counties a way should be found to give those players a week or two grace. After that for 8 counties involved in semi finals, the losers will get a month break before they are required for club duty. I understand it's not perfect but it's a massive improvement.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Rossfan on February 20, 2020, 09:53:57 AM
I'm nearly in agreement with Seanie :o :o (2nd time in a week....this will have to stop).
I would play the Leagues Feb to July with gap weeks for the Provincials played in the traditional knockout format.
That would require 11 weekends out of 23/24 leaving time for Club weekends.
The All Ireland SFC to comprise the 4 Provincial Champions, D3 Champions, D4 Champions and either 6 or 10 highest League teams. Straight knock out from there.
If we're to have a Tier 2 call it the All Ireland IFC but limit it to teams 2 to 6 in D3 and teams 2 to 4 in D4.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: PadraicHenryPearse on February 20, 2020, 11:11:23 AM
i've said it before but there is no point in keeping on changing the existing structures unless you know the outcome you want. hacks don't work.

what are the objectives and priorities of the changes? what do we want the gaa intercounty schedule to look like?

time for club and county fixtures at same time or not
more games against similar opposition
provisional championship system
min-max number of games per team
every team with a chance to win all ireland or not
seperate league and championship or not.
most profitable or most appealing to supporters
concurrent championship league or not

when you answer those type of questions and list them by priority then you can deliver a gaa season that meets its agree priorities and objectives.

think we have gone off topic.....
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Rossfan on February 20, 2020, 11:42:37 AM
Off topic is right but Clubs/Counties have the Fixtures Review Committee proposals on front of them.
So over to them.
As for the forward mark... if it's to be kept it should be for an overhead catch inside the 20 and kicked from outside the 45.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: magpie seanie on February 20, 2020, 12:02:08 PM
Off topic is right but Clubs/Counties have the Fixtures Review Committee proposals on front of them.
So over to them.
As for the forward mark... if it's to be kept it should be for an overhead catch inside the 20 and kicked from outside the 45.


To be fair the Fixtures Review Committee did a pretty good job. The review is well worth a read to understand the complexities involved. I think the proposals are pretty good in the main. Think they have outlined where they want to get to and how they propose to get there.

Unfortunately, I'd say the level of review at club and even county level isn't adequate.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Rossfan on February 20, 2020, 12:26:31 PM
Which is a major pity.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: magpie seanie on February 20, 2020, 12:54:39 PM
Yes, it is. The GAA does lots wrong and sometimes when it does things right it gets the communication wrong. It's unfortunate and adds to the feeling of alienation most regular GAA players/officials/supporters have.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Main Street on February 20, 2020, 01:36:48 PM
Okay, the advanced mark is 15 secs and  your everyday plain mark is still 5 seconds.
Both still don't constitute a break in play so that a substitution can be made,  do they?

Nope 15 seconds for all marks now.

If the player opts to play on, its not a break in play and substitutions aren't allowed.
If the player stops and takes the kick, it is a break in play and substitutions are allowed.

Quote
2: For all marks (the advance mark and the kickout mark) the following provisions apply; the player will now be allowed 15 seconds to take the mark (it was 5 seconds previously). The opposing players must retreat 13m (it was 10m previously).

https://www.gaa.ie/football/news/guide-to-new-the-gaelic-football-playing-rules/
Thanks twohands, well explained.
Somehow the reports on the decision to change from 5 seconds to 15 seconds completely passed me by.

When it comes to timekeeping, in that not enough talked about recent Monaghan Dublin encounter, ref Brannigan rightly stopped his clock in added time  for disciplinary issues  and the one injury. Twice  he restarts play and presumably his clock also starts ticking again. On those 2 restart occcasions,  Beggan took a kickout and secondly took a 50m free. From the time the ref indicates the restart, did Beggan still have his  20 or 30 seconds alloted to take each kick?
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: BennyCake on March 09, 2020, 04:25:50 PM
What’s the deal with the forward mark and having to signal with the hand that you intend to take the free?

Seen it last week with Kildare where player lost the free kick from the mark because he didn’t signal with the hand.

Also, can a player signal that he’s taking the free from the mark, then play on or pass to a team mate? Or once signalled, he must take it?
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: rosnarun on March 09, 2020, 05:35:15 PM
What’s the deal with the forward mark and having to signal with the hand that you intend to take the free?

Seen it last week with Kildare where player lost the free kick from the mark because he didn’t signal with the hand.

Also, can a player signal that he’s taking the free from the mark, then play on or pass to a team mate? Or once signalled, he must take it?
qas long as he kicks it is that not the mark taken or does it have to travel a minimum distance?
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Milltown Row2 on March 09, 2020, 07:06:49 PM
What’s the deal with the forward mark and having to signal with the hand that you intend to take the free?

Seen it last week with Kildare where player lost the free kick from the mark because he didn’t signal with the hand.

Also, can a player signal that he’s taking the free from the mark, then play on or pass to a team mate? Or once signalled, he must take it?

The ref will blow for the forward mark, it’s up to the player to signal and stop (within reason) yesterday example in a challenge game I did, the players made the mark sorta thought about a pass but settled and took the score,  had he passed the ball then it’s continued play. Had he taken a few more steps then that’s continued play. If he raises his hand calls mark he should kick for a score
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Milltown Row2 on March 09, 2020, 10:36:29 PM
https://www.irishexaminer.com/breakingnews/sport/gaa/a-lot-of-people-think-referees-are-getting-paid-we-get-absolutely-nothing-for-refereeing-above-in-croke-park-986874.html
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: BennyCake on March 09, 2020, 11:23:38 PM
What’s the deal with the forward mark and having to signal with the hand that you intend to take the free?

Seen it last week with Kildare where player lost the free kick from the mark because he didn’t signal with the hand.

Also, can a player signal that he’s taking the free from the mark, then play on or pass to a team mate? Or once signalled, he must take it?

The ref will blow for the forward mark, it’s up to the player to signal and stop (within reason) yesterday example in a challenge game I did, the players made the mark sorta thought about a pass but settled and took the score,  had he passed the ball then it’s continued play. Had he taken a few more steps then that’s continued play. If he raises his hand calls mark he should kick for a score

Should, or has to?
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Milltown Row2 on March 09, 2020, 11:33:11 PM
What’s the deal with the forward mark and having to signal with the hand that you intend to take the free?

Seen it last week with Kildare where player lost the free kick from the mark because he didn’t signal with the hand.

Also, can a player signal that he’s taking the free from the mark, then play on or pass to a team mate? Or once signalled, he must take it?

The ref will blow for the forward mark, it’s up to the player to signal and stop (within reason) yesterday example in a challenge game I did, the players made the mark sorta thought about a pass but settled and took the score,  had he passed the ball then it’s continued play. Had he taken a few more steps then that’s continued play. If he raises his hand calls mark he should kick for a score

Should, or has to?

Has too
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: The Bearded One on March 10, 2020, 12:20:16 AM
Not the case. You don’t have to shoot for a score, you can pass to another teammate but they can’t call a mark from this.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Milltown Row2 on March 10, 2020, 07:20:02 AM
Not the case. You don’t have to shoot for a score, you can pass to another teammate but they can’t call a mark from this.

Sorry your right, what I meant was he has to play the ball within the time, can’t be a second mark though
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: The Bearded One on March 10, 2020, 11:28:33 AM
Not the case. You don’t have to shoot for a score, you can pass to another teammate but they can’t call a mark from this.

Sorry your right, what I meant was he has to play the ball within the time, can’t be a second mark though

Can't wait for the club leagues to start  8)
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Milltown Row2 on March 10, 2020, 07:51:56 PM
Not the case. You don’t have to shoot for a score, you can pass to another teammate but they can’t call a mark from this.

Sorry your right, what I meant was he has to play the ball within the time, can’t be a second mark though

Can't wait for the club leagues to start  8)

I’d two games on Sunday, a mistake in both, not life threatening at the moment but I’d say come championship it will be bedlam
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Armagh Cúchulainns on March 11, 2020, 07:49:31 PM
Not the case. You don’t have to shoot for a score, you can pass to another teammate but they can’t call a mark from this.

Sorry your right, what I meant was he has to play the ball within the time, can’t be a second mark though

Can't wait for the club leagues to start  8)

I’d two games on Sunday, a mistake in both, not life threatening at the moment but I’d say come championship it will be bedlam

Back at the football whistling myself this year - first time in 4 years. (have been refereeing hurling)

Jaysus what has football become!
3 games in and thankfully haven't make any obvious errors but early days.

From the 3 games (senior, U18) I can see the offensive mark being an issue in big club matches.
The black card and timings will be a disaster to keep an eye on, and multiple black cards will be carnage!

Good luck to us all for 2020  :)
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Milltown Row2 on March 11, 2020, 07:54:40 PM
Not the case. You don’t have to shoot for a score, you can pass to another teammate but they can’t call a mark from this.

Sorry your right, what I meant was he has to play the ball within the time, can’t be a second mark though

Can't wait for the club leagues to start  8)

I’d two games on Sunday, a mistake in both, not life threatening at the moment but I’d say come championship it will be bedlam

Back at the football whistling myself this year - first time in 4 years. (have been refereeing hurling)

Jaysus what has football become!
3 games in and thankfully haven't make any obvious errors but early days.

From the 3 games (senior, U18) I can see the offensive mark being an issue in big club matches.
The black card and timings will be a disaster to keep an eye on, and multiple black cards will be carnage!

Good luck to us all for 2020  :)

New score card available apparently which helps, wouldn’t worry too much on the timing of the black cards, the coaches will be running on with their stop watches ‘informing’ you
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: theticklemister on March 12, 2020, 12:40:55 AM
It’s the advanced mark which scares me!

Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: StephenC on July 06, 2020, 09:36:18 AM
Do the new rules apply to underage? How would the advance mark be figured out when not playing on a full pitch?
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Smokin Joe on July 06, 2020, 10:02:24 AM
Do the new rules apply to underage? How would the advance mark be figured out when not playing on a full pitch?

Yes, they do.

But if a competition isn't going to follow the rulebook in terms of the dimensions of the pitch (which you are doing by playing on a reduced pitch) then I guess they can ignore whatever other rules they wish too, such as the attacking mark.

Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: BennyCake on July 06, 2020, 10:54:50 AM
The new backpass rule.

Can a player pass the ball straight back to the keeper from the kickout, but the keeper just can’t handle it? Can he fist it or hoof it away?
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Smokin Joe on July 06, 2020, 11:34:57 AM
The new backpass rule.

Can a player pass the ball straight back to the keeper from the kickout, but the keeper just can’t handle it? Can he fist it or hoof it away?

Nope.
"Free is conceded when the goalkeeper plays the ball"
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Milltown Row2 on July 06, 2020, 12:57:07 PM
The new backpass rule.

Can a player pass the ball straight back to the keeper from the kickout, but the keeper just can’t handle it? Can he fist it or hoof it away?

If you've a player who wants to hit it back to the keeper after just receiving it for him to fist it or hoof it away then I'd take that defender off very quickly!
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: twohands!!! on July 06, 2020, 08:28:28 PM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sJJhI61m1DI

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jVwePto531c

Quote
WATCH: The new kick-out and mark rules explained
Saturday 4 July 2020
 
By John Harrington

The GAA has produced two videos detailing how the new kick-out, kick-out mark, and advanced mark rules will work in Gaelic Football.

These videos are just one element of an education package that should ensure all referees are up to speed with the rule changes after a long period of inaction due to the Covid-19 pandemic.

“Since Covid-19 kicked in, for most referees it's 20 weeks since we've refereed you know, and even I as a club referee, (I know) it's going to be difficult getting back to it,” says the GAA’s National Match Officials Manager, Donal Smyth.

"For club referees we actually sent out a video that every club referee should have got last week and that contained mental health advice, advice in relation to how to get back up the fitness, and the pathway going forward.

“This week we'll be sending out a video for hurling and football. Two separate videos that will allow them look at their new rules as part of an in-service that they can get up to date on the rules, up to date on some of the stuff for going forward in relation to the new rules.

“It'll be like their in-service they did, but it will be done with a video that they can download themselves and they can watch it back at any stage.

“They should ensure that the Referee's Administrator gets that out to them this week or especially next week before competitive games start because all the new rules are explained and it'll help them get back into thinking about the game.

“We will be getting the information out regarding the new rules on YouTube videos to county boards and to all clubs.

“In the last eight months we've have a real change. We've had the new kick out rule we've had an advance mark and all those things were played in the National League.

“But since Congress 2020 we got two more rules. We got the one in relation to the kick out and the other thing is there's a slight change in the advance mark."

The kick-out and mark rules are explained below.

Kick-out rule

The ball will be kicked from the ground from the centre of the 20M line. The ball must be kicked forward. All players shall be outside the 20 metres line, outside the semi-cirlce arc, and 13 metres from the ball.

If the goalkeeper is not taking the kick-out, he must remain within the small rectangle. The ball shall not travel less than 13 metres and outside the 20 metre line before being played by another member of the defending team.

A further change was made at GAA Congress 2020. A player in direct receipt of a kick-out may not pass the ball to his team's goalkeeper without another player playing the ball.

A breach of this rule would be a technical foul by the goalkeeper. Under the new rule, this would be a free against the goalkeeper.

If a defender kicks out the ball, the rule does not prevent the ball being kicked back to this defender.


Kick-out mark and advanced mark rules

There have been some changes to the kick-out mark which will align the kick-out mark with the advanced mark. The referee awards the mark by blowing his whistle.

The player will now claim the mark by putting his arm in the air. The player now has 15 seconds to take the mark, previous it was 5 seconds.

If in exceptional circumstances the player cannot take the mark awarded from the kick-out, the nearest team-mate will take the free kick and can score from it. The defending player must retreat 13 metres from the taker, previously it was 10 metres.

The kick-out mark is also designated a set-play. With the advanced mark those conditions apply but certain things must happen for a player to be awarded a mark.

The ball must be kicked by an attacking player, not from a set play, which is a kick-out mark, side-line ball, or from a free. The ball must travel 20M or more from outside the 45M line to a player inside the 45M line. The ball must be caught cleanly without touching the ground, and a defender can claim the mark also.

The referee awards the mark by blowing his whistle and the player claims it by putting up his arm. If a player claims the mark inside the 13 Metre line the ball must be taken out to the 13 Metre line directly in line where the mark was awarded.

If the player decides to play on, as with the kick-out mark, he cannot be tackled for four steps or the length of time it takes to travel four steps and/or makes one act of kicking, hand-passing, bouncing, or toe-tapping the ball.

There is one exception to this, when the ball is caught inside the large rectangle including the small rectangle, he can be tackled immediately. This was changed at GAA Congress 2020.

I read the last line of the bit in bold and it made me a bit confused (easily done says you) - to me this looks like if a player other than a goal-keeper takes a kickout, this player can receive the ball back directly back from their team-mate. There is a rule that a keeper has to be in the small square if they are not taking the kickout.

I went to have a look at the rules and regulations on the GAA website and the actual wording of the rule is.

Quote
A player in direct receipt of a kick-out may not pass the ball to his team’s goalkeeper without another player playing the ball.

The rule about the keeper not taking the kick-out is as follows.

Quote
If the goalkeeper is not taking the kick-out, he shall stay in the small rectangle, and all other players, except the player taking the kick-out, shall be outside the 20m line, outside the semicircular arc and 13m from the ball until it has been kicked.

This means that in situations where a team taking a kick-out isn't being pushed up on by the other team, they could have a defender take a short one to an unmarked defender, who could pass it back to his team-mate who could then pop it back to the goal-keeper. Seems strange that this would be allowed. It will be interesting to see if teams actually do this on occasion - there's been numerous times in games the last few years where teams haven't pushed up on the opposition's kickouts even when behind.

The tackling/no tackling/play-on four steps or equivalent is an abomination of a rule in terms of putting the referees in the firing line. I'd say if you sat down with the aim of coming up with a rule designed to shaft referees you'd be hard-pressed to do worse than this. What happens if a player catches a ball in the air inside the large rectangle but lands outside; what happens in the reverse scenario - catches the ball outside and lands inside - lands exactly on the line - lands with one foot in and one foot out. There's no clarity for all this situations and that's before you get into the situations where the ref gets it wrong. It is an inevitably that this rule will end up deciding tight games before long.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Milltown Row2 on July 06, 2020, 09:14:13 PM
Catches the ball, I’ll take my interpretation as if he’s catching not where he lands, If he lands at or out doesn’t matter, it’s the catching  of it for me. And a ref on his own in a club league game will call it and that will be that. Managers supporter and player will just have accept that. I know they won’t and keep up with play will come into that.

Though I’d love to challenge the gobshite to a fitness test  ;D ;D

If clubs or counties are going to over elaborate their kick out to just confuse people then they need to wise up
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: BennyCake on July 06, 2020, 09:40:44 PM
1. Defender takes kickout. Kicks the ball sideways along the 21 yard line, keeper sprints out of the square to pick up the ball and proceed upfield. Is that allowed?

2. What if there’s a gale. Keeper kicks out and the gale blows ball back inside the 21. What then?

3. Keeper kicks ball out, accidentally hits one of his defenders on back of the head and ball comes back to him. Can he gather it?
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Smokin Joe on July 07, 2020, 08:11:10 AM
1. Defender takes kickout. Kicks the ball sideways along the 21 yard line, keeper sprints out of the square to pick up the ball and proceed upfield. Is that allowed?

2. What if there’s a gale. Keeper kicks out and the gale blows ball back inside the 21. What then?

3. Keeper kicks ball out, accidentally hits one of his defenders on back of the head and ball comes back to him. Can he gather it?

1. Don't see any reason why not

2. Hop ball if played by the defending team?

3. The rule states "the player who directly receives the ball from a kick-out cannot pass the ball back to the goalkeeper without another person playing it".  In your case I don't think the defender "passed" the ball back.  So should be OK.

Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: JoG2 on July 07, 2020, 09:03:53 AM
The new backpass rule.

Can a player pass the ball straight back to the keeper from the kickout, but the keeper just can’t handle it? Can he fist it or hoof it away?

This is being rolled out in the county championship this year only, not club , yes?
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Smokin Joe on July 07, 2020, 09:30:28 AM
The new backpass rule.

Can a player pass the ball straight back to the keeper from the kickout, but the keeper just can’t handle it? Can he fist it or hoof it away?

This is being rolled out in the county championship this year only, not club , yes?

No, it's also in for club games
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Armagh Cúchulainns on July 07, 2020, 11:12:24 AM
Don't think the advanced mark will be too problematic other than bad positioning on the part of the referee.
I refereed 5 games before they stopped activity and in each game there was 1 adv mark given, but not taken.

Again the kick-outs wont be a major problem in my opinion. Referees should speak to keepers prior to game or on the first opportunity in the game and quickly run them through the rule - keepers will appreciate this and in most cases coaches wont have told them the correct rule.

The new sinbin will be problematic doing a game on my own. Outside of refs meeting and with coaches/manager I have debated whether we would see more or less blacks shown as easier for a ref to sinbin for 10mins than end his game maybe in the earlier stages of a game. General consensus was less will be shown as could be too much of an imposition on a referee unless he has neutrals with him on line and posts to help keep him right.

Im looking forward to getting back at it again - first match on Thursday evening...
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Taylor on July 07, 2020, 01:55:54 PM
When is contact training allowed in the North for underage?

I cannot see any guidance lately or dates for contact
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: JoG2 on July 07, 2020, 02:06:14 PM
The new backpass rule.

Can a player pass the ball straight back to the keeper from the kickout, but the keeper just can’t handle it? Can he fist it or hoof it away?

This is being rolled out in the county championship this year only, not club , yes?

No, it's also in for club games

Thanks Smokin, could only see this rule in relation to the forthcoming county championship
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Smokin Joe on July 07, 2020, 03:02:57 PM
When is contact training allowed in the North for underage?

I cannot see any guidance lately or dates for contact

It's already allowed for underage in the 6
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Taylor on July 07, 2020, 04:56:20 PM
When is contact training allowed in the North for underage?

I cannot see any guidance lately or dates for contact

It's already allowed for underage in the 6

Was there any official communication for this Joe?
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Smokin Joe on July 07, 2020, 05:29:32 PM
When is contact training allowed in the North for underage?

I cannot see any guidance lately or dates for contact

It's already allowed for underage in the 6

Was there any official communication for this Joe?

It's in one of the FAQs on the gaa website:

QUESTION
When can Clubs return to contact training and challenge games?
ANSWER
•   Contact training can resume from 29 June for all Adult and Juvenile teams in the 32 counties
•   Challenge games can resume from 29 June for the 26 Counties
•   Challenge games can resume from 17 July for the 6 Counties
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: JoG2 on July 07, 2020, 06:04:00 PM
When is contact training allowed in the North for underage?

I cannot see any guidance lately or dates for contact

It's already allowed for underage in the 6

Was there any official communication for this Joe?

It's in one of the FAQs on the gaa website:

QUESTION
When can Clubs return to contact training and challenge games?
ANSWER
•   Contact training can resume from 29 June for all Adult and Juvenile teams in the 32 counties
•   Challenge games can resume from 29 June for the 26 Counties
•   Challenge games can resume from 17 July for the 6 Counties

 :D yeah right!
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Farrandeelin on July 07, 2020, 06:16:38 PM
A lot of clubs near the border are playing challenges against Monaghan and Cavan clubs I believe.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: JoG2 on July 07, 2020, 08:20:10 PM
A lot of clubs near the border are playing challenges against Monaghan and Cavan clubs I believe.

Yes and the teams travelling are covered insurance wise, so no problem there. It's the games within the 6 counties, teams could land themselves in some bother insurance wise.
Title: Re: Gaelic Football - Rules & Regulations discussion/clarification
Post by: Milltown Row2 on July 07, 2020, 11:07:19 PM
You can play as many in house games as you like, organised correctly they can be very competitive