Man Utd Thread:

[Maroon Manc]

Mourinho has hardly been a massive failure, United finished 2nd last season achieving 12 more points then they did the year before. The football was poor and the CL exit was extremely tame so clearly he's not exempt from criticism but why give him a new contract 8 months ago if he wasn't going to be backed in the summer?

United have a large squad full of players on far too much money which United will struggle to move on and they've all either been bought by Woodward or he's given them new contracts, he's a very poor negotiator.

Mourinho has been backed but not to the extent that was required or to the extent Pep was and Pep inherited a team with a lot more quality; Klopp as it stands has out performed all of his rivals in the transfer market to be fair. United needed a complete overhaul inside the first 2 years and it never came, apparently Mourinho only buys players in their prime but Bailly, Lindelof, Fred, Pogba & Lukaku were all in their mid 20's and mostly younger when they were bought. Mourinho is far from blameless and off course he deserves criticism but United's problems run far deeper than him.

Woodward is way out of his depth.

[thewobbler]

I think you're overestimating the pull / gravitas of Man Utd here Maroon.

It'll take diehard United fans a few years to come to terms with this, but the pull of Manchester United during the Fergie era was guaranteed silverware. So if Spurs, West Ham, Everton, Newcastle, Leeds, Blackburn had a player who was clearly top-drawer and was ambitious for trophies, all United had to do was leak a story to the press and the wheels would be set in motion. They'd get their man. Of course United always paid better than average, but money wasn't the main motivator behind playing for Fergie.

Nowadays, United have been pulled back onto the same pedestal as Liverpool. It's an attractive club, make no mistake, but if they've eyes on a premiership player, chances are that Chelsea, City and Liverpool will have eyes too. It was a simple choice for everyone apart from Alan Shearer a decade ago. Not so now.

So United have to rely more on scouting of foreign players, and place more trust in potential than proven end product in the EPL these days. Perhaps Woodward's biggest failing in recent seasons has been in fulfilling manger's shopping lists without analysing if the money being spent properly. But then again, if you're going to hire Van Gaal and Mourinho and then tell them what to do, that's madness in itself. I'm not sure he can really win here.

[seafoid]

Mourinho has hardly been a massive failure, United finished 2nd last season achieving 12 more points then they did the year before. The football was poor and the CL exit was extremely tame so clearly he's not exempt from criticism but why give him a new contract 8 months ago if he wasn't going to be backed in the summer?

United have a large squad full of players on far too much money which United will struggle to move on and they've all either been bought by Woodward or he's given them new contracts, he's a very poor negotiator.

Mourinho has been backed but not to the extent that was required or to the extent Pep was and Pep inherited a team with a lot more quality; Klopp as it stands has out performed all of his rivals in the transfer market to be fair. United needed a complete overhaul inside the first 2 years and it never came, apparently Mourinho only buys players in their prime but Bailly, Lindelof, Fred, Pogba & Lukaku were all in their mid 20's and mostly younger when they were bought. Mourinho is far from blameless and off course he deserves criticism but United's problems run far deeper than him.

Woodward is way out of his depth.

Woodward is a banker so he doesn't know much about football.
Coming second might be ok but not to Man City.
There are no quick fixes to the Man Utd crisis. I think the club went through a similar period of mediocrity in the 70s after Busby retired. Several managers won nothing.

[Boycey]

Crisis ffs 

[magpie seanie]

Mourinho has hardly been a massive failure, United finished 2nd last season achieving 12 more points then they did the year before. The football was poor and the CL exit was extremely tame so clearly he's not exempt from criticism but why give him a new contract 8 months ago if he wasn't going to be backed in the summer?

United have a large squad full of players on far too much money which United will struggle to move on and they've all either been bought by Woodward or he's given them new contracts, he's a very poor negotiator.

Mourinho has been backed but not to the extent that was required or to the extent Pep was and Pep inherited a team with a lot more quality; Klopp as it stands has out performed all of his rivals in the transfer market to be fair. United needed a complete overhaul inside the first 2 years and it never came, apparently Mourinho only buys players in their prime but Bailly, Lindelof, Fred, Pogba & Lukaku were all in their mid 20's and mostly younger when they were bought. Mourinho is far from blameless and off course he deserves criticism but United's problems run far deeper than him.

Woodward is way out of his depth.

There's no way he should have got a new contract. That was insanity. Insanity the club will pay for when they sack him (hopefully soon). Hirisng him in the first place was insanity though.

United are one of the richest clubs in the world. It's no reason for wasting money on the wrong players and giving exhorbitant contracts granted. However, to scapegoat Woodward totally for this is wrong. Mourinho's relationships with several super agents made these deals possible and they are players he identified. He's be crying to the media if Woodward didn't stump up to keep his buddies happy.

Woodward not being good at his job might mean the club wastes money. Which means less money for the Glazers to rob. I can live with that. I can't live with United not attempting to play in an attacking manner most of the time and a manager who criticises players and embarrasses the club at every turn when he opens his mouth. He's a cuckoo in a nest that was made by a different breed of bird. He needs to be got out before any real progress can be made. Klopp as you mentioned underlines how poor a job Mourinho is doing. Deschamps during the World Cup showed how poor a coach Mourihno now is.

[magpie seanie]

Crisis ffs 

It is a crisis. This is one of the biggest clubs in the world and some people are trying to portray a distant 2nd without ever being in contention as something to be encouraged by. Would that wash with Barcelona, Real Madrid, Bayern Munich? That's the level United should be at. Not going out of the CL to the likes of Sevilla.

[Ethan Tremblay]

The whole mind frame and the player culture at united has changed and Mourinho isn't the guy to turn that around to what it was.  United did finish 2nd last season but they don't seem to have the same steel they once did to grind out results. 

Getting beat last year by Newcastle, Brighton, WBA, Huddersfield, drawing with Burnley and Southampton.  They have top players but they are more interested in their hairstyles or launching fashion ranges, which is all well and good, but when they are doing a substandard day job something needs looked at. 

Anyone who thinks 2nd place is a good result needs to go away and look at themselves. 

[seafoid]

When a team is lost the players don't learn as a team, there is a lot of chopping and changing and the team loses against more organised outfits. This applies as much to GAA as to the EPL. Man Utd are lost.

Man City will probably win the Champions League in the next few years. Because they are organised and know what they are doing.
It is impossible to imagine Man Utd winning the Champions league. 10 year olds on the Continent if asked to name a team from Manchester would probably say City.

[Geoff Tipps]

United fans are sending another plane up!

[Maroon Manc]

Mourinho has hardly been a massive failure, United finished 2nd last season achieving 12 more points then they did the year before. The football was poor and the CL exit was extremely tame so clearly he's not exempt from criticism but why give him a new contract 8 months ago if he wasn't going to be backed in the summer?

United have a large squad full of players on far too much money which United will struggle to move on and they've all either been bought by Woodward or he's given them new contracts, he's a very poor negotiator.

Mourinho has been backed but not to the extent that was required or to the extent Pep was and Pep inherited a team with a lot more quality; Klopp as it stands has out performed all of his rivals in the transfer market to be fair. United needed a complete overhaul inside the first 2 years and it never came, apparently Mourinho only buys players in their prime but Bailly, Lindelof, Fred, Pogba & Lukaku were all in their mid 20's and mostly younger when they were bought. Mourinho is far from blameless and off course he deserves criticism but United's problems run far deeper than him.

Woodward is way out of his depth.

There's no way he should have got a new contract. That was insanity. Insanity the club will pay for when they sack him (hopefully soon). Hirisng him in the first place was insanity though.

United are one of the richest clubs in the world. It's no reason for wasting money on the wrong players and giving exhorbitant contracts granted. However, to scapegoat Woodward totally for this is wrong. Mourinho's relationships with several super agents made these deals possible and they are players he identified. He's be crying to the media if Woodward didn't stump up to keep his buddies happy.

Woodward not being good at his job might mean the club wastes money. Which means less money for the Glazers to rob. I can live with that. I can't live with United not attempting to play in an attacking manner most of the time and a manager who criticises players and embarrasses the club at every turn when he opens his mouth. He's a cuckoo in a nest that was made by a different breed of bird. He needs to be got out before any real progress can be made. Klopp as you mentioned underlines how poor a job Mourinho is doing. Deschamps during the World Cup showed how poor a coach Mourihno now is.

The Glazers are ultimately to blame for the mess that the club is in but Fergie, Moyes, LVG, Mounrinho and Woodward have played their part in where United are today; The owners refused to invest in the squad and all the best players either left but mainly got old and weren't replaced by players of similar quality. Fergie was the brains behind Moyes who was clearly out of his depth and between him and LVG they wasted over £300m on players not good enough, some have moved on but its not easy to get rid of 13 players who are all on top money. I expected more from United last year in terms of points, thought they were capable of getting around 86 points they ended up with 81, expected more in Europe and thought we'd be slightly be better to watch but Mourinho has hardly been a disaster. Given the lack of spending this summer and what we already know about the squad the best we can hope for is 3rd and to win a cup and get to the last 8 in Europe. Mourinho has bought some very good players, most of them United would have no problem getting their money back on.

I've got no issues with the way he treats Shaw, he's a poor excuse for a professional and the same goes for Martial. I know for a fact what Martial is like so got no issues with the way he's dealt with him. As for Pogba his performances haven't been good enough but he knew what his agent was like when he signed him.

Mourinho is clearly to blame for some of whats going on but its not totally his fault.

[johnnycool]

You lads are looking at this all wrong.

The Glazers and Woodward are doing a great job in business terms.

Income and margins are great and not really impacted by coming second to Man City in the PL.

Granted a longer run in the CL would have been nice, but the money is still flowing into those US coffers.

ker ching.

[brokencrossbar1]

Hold on a second ... how the hell are the Glazers not backing managers?  Lukaku? Pogba? Sánchez package? Luke Shaw may not have worked out but they made him the most expensive teenager at the team in the world then broke it the following season with Martial!  Repeatedly they have backed managers and they have just fucked it up....well in some people's eyes. In my opinion, the players that are there could really challenge if they had the right man managing them. There is a rotten core in the club maybe but that's not the reason they are not doing what they can on the field.

[seafoid]

You lads are looking at this all wrong.

The Glazers and Woodward are doing a great job in business terms.

Income and margins are great and not really impacted by coming second to Man City in the PL.

Granted a longer run in the CL would have been nice, but the money is still flowing into those US coffers.

ker ching.

Too many people think of Man Utd as a football team

[magpie seanie]

Hold on a second ... how the hell are the Glazers not backing managers?  Lukaku? Pogba? Sánchez package? Luke Shaw may not have worked out but they made him the most expensive teenager at the team in the world then broke it the following season with Martial!  Repeatedly they have backed managers and they have just fucked it up....well in some people's eyes. In my opinion, the players that are there could really challenge if they had the right man managing them. There is a rotten core in the club maybe but that's not the reason they are not doing what they can on the field.

Absolutely 100% agree.

[Captain Obvious]

Hold on a second ... how the hell are the Glazers not backing managers?  Lukaku? Pogba? Sánchez package? Luke Shaw may not have worked out but they made him the most expensive teenager at the team in the world then broke it the following season with Martial!  Repeatedly they have backed managers and they have just fucked it up....well in some people’s eyes. In my opinion, the players that are there could really challenge if they had the right man managing them. There is a rotten core in the club maybe but that’s not the reason they are not doing what they can on the field.

Absolutely 100% agree.

In fairness lads 81 points is normally enough to challenge or in leicester city case two seasons ago win the league. Didn't challenge last year because Manchester City accumulated 100 points and if they repeat that points total this season they are unlikely to be challenged again.

Looking over last seasons results, two things i noticed, one Manchester United beat all 19 teams in the league and two never once did they concede 3 goals in a match. At the weekend 3 goals was conceded in the first half against Brighton so something doesn't just add up there.