Man Utd Thread:

[ballinaman]

What was Real's goal in the first half disallowed for?

Soft push on RVP by Ramos.

[No Soloing]

Thought this was interesting enough. 50/50 decisions both of them IMO, another day a ref could have reversed the decisions. Good to have a read of the actual laws.


FIFA Law 12: "Reckless" means that the player has acted with complete disregard of the danger to, or consequences for, his opponent. A player who plays in a reckless manner shall be cautioned.

This seems to sum up fairly well the two incidents above. Both Diego López and Nani were trying to win the ball but both of them went in without considering the consequences for their opponent. Nani caught Alvaro Arbeloa with his studs, Diego López punched Nemanja Vidic in the head with both fists.
Nani got sent off and López wasn't even booked

FIFA Law 12: "Using excessive force" means that the player has far exceeded the necessary use of force and is in danger of injuring his opponent. A player who uses excessive force shall be sent off.
Whilst both Nani and López were in danger of injuring an opponent, neither of them used excessive force.

FIFA Law 12: If a player plays in a dangerous manner in a "normal" challenge, the referee should not take any disciplinary action. If the action is made with obvious risk of injury the referee should caution the player. If a player denies an obvious goal-scoring opportunity in a dangerous manner the referee should send off the player.

Again, the Laws of the game would suggest that at worst, Nani should have been booked.

10 pages since the match ended!

I had similar thinking about Lopez & Vidic. If Nani's tackle is reckless or dangerous without regard to another players then its arguable that a goalkeeper coming for a cross or corner leading with 2 fists is in the same category. Or, any player jumping for a header with their arms raised. Jeez, you could even argue that somebody booting a free-kick at a group of players lined up 10 yards away and hitting one of them in the head is 'endangering the safety of an opponent'.

[sans pessimism]

AF not appearing at the PC was not very
mature.If the decision was the other way around
would he have been a no show?.As he said the last night,
(after fulham game)refs calls even out out over the
season-prob didnt think it would happen so soon.

[EC Unique]

Nani lead with the foot but did not see the player. The player coming in could see Nani, Should he have been sent off for putting himself and Nani in danger?

The whole thing is a joke and was never a red in my book. It is a mans sport.

It's over now so should just get the PL wrapped up (again) asap and enjoy the summer.

[imtommygunn]

Nani lead with the foot but did not see the player. The player coming in could see Nani, Should he have been sent off for putting himself and Nani in danger?

That isn't even close to making any sense.

[nrico2006]

Nani lead with the foot but did not see the player. The player coming in could see Nani, Should he have been sent off for putting himself and Nani in danger?

The whole thing is a joke and was never a red in my book. It is a mans sport.

It's over now so should just get the PL wrapped up (again) asap and enjoy the summer.

Good point EC.

As for the Rafael incident, the ball hit his hands which he has used to jump up to attempt to head the ball, have seen them given but that is not a penalty and even at the time I could see from the reaction of the Madrid players that none of them thought it was either.

[EC Unique]

Nani lead with the foot but did not see the player. The player coming in could see Nani, Should he have been sent off for putting himself and Nani in danger?

That isn't even close to making any sense.

Exactly

[imtommygunn]

Nani lead with the foot but did not see the player. The player coming in could see Nani, Should he have been sent off for putting himself and Nani in danger?

That isn't even close to making any sense.

Exactly

I didn't agree with the sending off and was very surprised to see it at the time. However the fact that quite a few think it was a red would suggest that there may have been something in it and the ref probably wasn't the only ref that would have given it.

It's not just ABU people that think it was a red.

[the Deel Rover]

I thought Roy Keane was going to explode on Tv last night. You could see that Dixon and Southgate are scared shit*less of him . I initially didn't think it was a sending off but looking at it on slow motion I think the ref got it right .

[screenexile]

Did someone have the audacity to compare Nani's incident to one of the best goals ever scored by Bergkamp? I've looked at it again and Bergkamp didn't jump and his foot was barely knee high . . . AND HE DIDN'T CRUSH SOME MAN'S RIB CAGE!!

You can argue all you want but bottom line is intent doesn't come into it. Nani raised his leg too high and connected with a players rib cage. Whether certain refs give it or not doesn't matter it was dangerous play.

Had Arbeloa not been there it wouldn't have been dangerous play but he was and Nani didn't actually get the ball so the referee was well within his rights to give the red!

[imtommygunn]

but Arbeloa should also have been sent off for dangerous play as he didn't move out of the road

[angermanagement]

I don't know why old Fergie is getting so upset. He loves nights like those at Old Trafford. He said so himself.

[Bingo]

Some genuine questions:

Is this the end of Rooney at United? When he came on he didn't do much, give ball away a few times and missed a decent chance, very hard for a player of his self belief to accept getting dropped for a game of that magnitude and seeing Nani come in a head of him. Will be look out now or will Fergie look to move him on?

Why did United collapse as bad as they did in the 10/15 spell? Obviously they where a man down but you imagine they should have been able to adapt and cover that off better than they did. They looked very solid before that. Teams have lost players before and can manage, while its not easy, it is manageable. Should a change have been made from bench quicker? Are United mentally fragile and missing the leaders to carry a team in that position. They seemed to get totally lost in the sending off and feel sorry for themselves on the pitch, let Madrid get a foothold. They didn't react to Modric.

Also was the geeing up of the crowd at this stage from Fergie and Giggs needed or did it give the Madrid players a boost seeing them call for help. Did it send out a signal that they needed a lift, we're fighting here and struggling, we need help but I don't think corwd noise would affect the Real players, maybe they felt that the home players needed a lift. Sending out the wrong signals I think.

Just a few thoughts, maybe wide of the mark but worth considering.

[Canalman]

Have to say the standard of punditry last night was woeful. Whatever about the rights and wrongs of the sending off, to say (as the tv guys said) that it was a disgrace, ludicrous etc is for me just nuts. No one bar Keane disagreed.

The red card decision was a tightish  call and imho the referee was entitled to make it. Think UEFA assessors will agree.

Mourinho passed the final interview for the MU job last night.

[highorlow]

Did someone have the audacity to compare Nani's incident to one of the best goals ever scored by Bergkamp? I've looked at it again and Bergkamp didn't jump and his foot was barely knee high . . . AND HE DIDN'T CRUSH SOME MAN'S RIB CAGE!!

They sure did and thought it was objective!