Messages

SammyG states his points..... a LOT. I certainly don't agree with most of them, but I like to think that I can at least try to see his point of view. Never once did I think it was bigoted...... just ill-informed

Okay, ill and informed.
If you need us to prepare your obituary Sammy, let us know, otherwise take it easy and get back to health in good time.

hh - id agree that the ideals of the uvf may be very different from what they claim - they are simply drug dealing gangsters in my mind - but the problem is they claim to have an ideal, defending their communities against their enemies.

Obviously if this was their only concern they wouldnt be peddling drugs and extorting their own communities.

What has changed now?
Were they given an ultimatum to change just one thing, they decided to give up on the redundant defending idea but continue to peddle drugs?

[No work was carried out during that twelve month period]

From the The high court Judicial Review
"Construction works ceased on the site in November 2001 and there has been no work done since. The building contractor is still in possession of the site. In July 2003 Shamrock Rovers applied for and was granted an extension of the planning permission for a period of one year to 31st October 2004, to enable them to complete the stadium. No work was carried out during that twelve month period. In October 2004 Shamrock Rovers applied for a further extension for a period of one and a half years to complete the stadium. On 14th December 2002, the respondents as planning authority refused that application."

What a lazy shower of club members. They wouldn't even know how to lay a brick.

Well, I'm scratching my head right now to come up with any interpretation other than that Ulaidh considers that the Provos were in some way mitigated or absolved in their actions since they were acting for a cause.

The scratching isn't exactly taxing the limits of rational thought to come with an alternative to that stereotypical emission. 'Mitigated or absolved' are words from your dictionary.
It's the absolute certainty of your 'flight of fancy' interpretation, it betrays the one dimensional viewpoint that make up your ability to utter such crap.   

Gandhi was opposed to Imperialism and was successful in defeating it, despite* his eschewing the use of violence. I admire Gandhi.

Ah yes the movie, don't confuse Gandhi's ideas with the ending of the Raj. At the time, Atlee acknowledged that the main reason for the fall of the Raj were the ideals of the militant Subhash Chandra Bose and the very violent Indian National Army.
Imo the closest equivalent of a Gandhi in the Irish national movement would have been John Redmond.

Whatever about the rights and wrongs of the IRA's campaign, they were struggling for an ideal.

So the ends justify the means, then, eh,   

You must have stretched every one of your brain cells to make that inference from Ulaidh's post.
Do you have an itch that never ceases to need scratching?

What about the TDs and councillors all over the country who are members of GAA clubs? Should they all resign membership just in case a "conflict of interest" arises regarding funding or planning???
No - didn't think so. You need them, don't you?

They need the GAA more than the GAA need them
Haven't you read between the lines in the Constitution of the State re the special position of the GAA?
We are like the Army in Turkey only more subtle.
Dail Eireann and local politicians had better behave themselves.

Report from BBC website.

What report from what BBC website?
gobshite.com more like it

I don't know much about hurling but it was a great game to watch and Waterford deserved to edge it. Some rock hard feckers play that game. The ref I thought played it just right, he let the game flow especially in the last 20 minutes, in the face of no prisoner tough tackling and shall we say 'competitive' challenges. 

Good to see that they banned the gouger involved in abusing Webb, wonder is that enough for some of the high horses on here.

Never content, prepare yourself for the "Hoops fans grass on supporter" shocker headlines.

Yep because a newspaper reported what Charlton said, that automatically makes it true.  The team bus had a police escort (as did the NI team bus and as would happen in any town, even Dublin) to get it through the traffic. Charlton made claims about having to have armed guards 'on the bus' and various other nonsense, all of which was made up by him (or more likely his ghost writer).

The article ticks the boxes as being an account of the situation. It is a fair reference. Even BB get's in his mercenary dig .
Whether the armed gaurds were on the bus or travelled in escorts and were outside the bus while the players were getting on and off is irrelevant. Machine gun at the ready, armed police, were a common feature in NI then, it's not exactly a sensational revelation.
As I recall, my reaction at that time was that the FAI were acting like a bunch of wimps in trying to get the game played elsewhere. The FAI have whined like puppies in other situations as well.
Intimidation from NI supporters was never going to materialize into a Montevideo situation.
As for Charlton's desire to travel on the day from Carrick, that's fair enough, keep the team away from the security scenario.
Managers moan, it was always going to be a tough game without the added extraordinary hype and tension.
AFAIR Brasil were allowed to fly into La Paz a couple of hours before an important WCQ game, altitude issues.

Disingenuous, Main Street.

Nothing disingenious about it at all.
If you were following the thread, hard work I know, it was Sammy who brought this up. Said the armed guards didn't exist, and Jack was talking shite.
I am merely a messenger not an agenda merchant.

Charlton is also on record talking about armed guards on the bus and going being terrified driving through the 'mountains' to get to the match. Inspite of the fact that the bus had no guards (armed or otherwise) and the bus didn't go near any mountains (or even small hills) on the way to WP. I suppose if you talk enough shite some of it sticks. Charlton was pissed off because we didn't just roll-over and allow the RoI to qualify, as he expected us to.

Was he talking shite Sammy?
from the herald tribune
http://www.iht.com/articles/1993/11/17/irish_3.php
"The Ireland manager, Charlton, had requested that his team remain until Wednesday afternoon in a heavily secured hotel at Carrickmacross, a short bus ride south of Belfast. But the international soccer federation, FIFA, insisted per regulations that the visiting team arrive 24 hours before kickoff, requiring Ireland to fly north Tuesday and be escorted by armored police vehicles to a hotel chosen after four changes of mind."
Charlton was a pro he knew it was going to be a hard game like everybody else, it was shite like that that no manager wants.

So based on my own experience of that night, a surprisingly clear mw rte radio commentary some 1500 miles away, the commentators were regularily drowned out by the bigots. And with the Kop End, loud and sustained, 10 times worse than ibrox. Then where GSpain was located in the stands, vile sectarian abuse were the words he used. You could conceivably see our intrepid fictitious civil servant getting the shock of his life which triggered a fundamental self examination.
Where fantasy is stretched beyond any credible limit is that a football fan would switch allegience, that just shows that Marie Jones knew feck all about soccer.
My own feelings about that night are dominated by the equaliser and getting to the world cup. Probably angry that there was the media hype before, that Irish fans couldn't or wouldn't go, that the team were left on their own, that sport was infected in this way.
Charlton has gone on record as being shocked at the level of hostility and bigotry. But immediatly after the game he was invited to give an award to some young lads and he received a standing ovation from a packed room of NI fans and many well wishes, probably confused him totally.
I can seperate the then basic hostile Ni fan who wanted to beat us from the fans who were out and out bigots. I'm glad they are gone.
But I don't get the idea put out that the play will have the opposite effect than its intention. I would have to see proof of that.

Perhaps, but GSpain who was there with the travelling support has stated on this very website that he had experienced worse at other matches and that in his opinion, the abuse at Windsor was hugely exagerated.

I dont know how it was reported.
In a GAA board it's sinisterly ironic that the witness you drag up is GS pain, does the GS stand for  - glass spreader
GSpain did acknowledge that there was sustained loud vile sectarian abuse throughout the game. Other supporters reported worse, though there could have been a hint of exageration of the peril they faced
However I think mild mannered Packie Bonner's statement of 10 time worse than Ibrox is quite damning.

Neil Lennon is one of my favorite players, not at all one of the best, just in regards to football intelligence, team leader and holding player par excellance. I am not a Celtic fan.
Games that I remember with him in particular were the away games against Ajax and Liverpool.
His time had to come some day to leave his favored club and he couldn't have chosen a better time to leave.