The Ulster Championship proper hasn't even begun and Throne are gone. Summer will arrive in 4 weeks and hopefully Donegal will join them in the qualifiers.
Here's hoping Armagh can cause an upset, they certainly won't fear Donegal after today's performance.
Sure we nearly beat them last year.Must have at least a 50-50 chance
Donegal will win with a bit to spare. Playing at a higher level all year so far and a game under their belt already to get the rustiness out of the system. They will dominate MF and we won't keep it kicked out to them.
Yeah, MF would have to be our main area of concern, has to be Findon & Ethan Rafferty, but i'm sure there'll be a fair bit of congestion in the area anyway. We also need a CHB that doesn't play for the Wolfe Tones.
I think midfield will not be a problem with Ethan and findon as it will be heavily populated.
I do think that Donegal will just be cuter than us.
Don't see midfield being a huge issue as the Athletic Grounds is a tight field and it wasn't as if Donegal dominated Tyrone at midfield today. Armagh have a punchers chance in this game, the main concern I'd have over Armagh is defensively. They learned very little playing poor teams in the League and it's hard to know whether they have improved anything from last year and McGeeney has a huge selection headache after using so many players during the League. I'd expect the game to take the same pattern as today with Donegals better game management eventually getting the home in a tight contest.
Quote from: yellowcard on May 17, 2015, 08:00:29 PM
Don't see midfield being a huge issue as the Athletic Grounds is a tight field and it wasn't as if Donegal dominated Tyrone at midfield today. Armagh have a punchers chance in this game, the main concern I'd have over Armagh is defensively. They learned very little playing poor teams in the League and it's hard to know whether they have improved anything from last year and McGeeney has a huge selection headache after using so many players during the League. I'd expect the game to take the same pattern as today with Donegals better game management eventually getting the home in a tight contest.
To dispel this fallacy
Athletic Grounds dimensions 143 x 88 m
Croke Park dimensions 144.5m x 88m
MF will be congested but the reality is that Donegal will be doing that as much as we will, they are the masters of it but in McElhinny and Gallagher have 2 very good players who compliment each other well. The fact that they have been playing at a higher pace so far this season and have a championship match played already will be a key factor.
Disagree.50/50 game,we should have beaten Donegal last year,they're not as good now and don't have Mc Guinness.Hopefully we'll be written off as was the case against Cavan last year.
Whose job is it to oil the hinges on the back door? As I see it, and. I'm not being a Nostradamus predicting this, our forwards will struggle in the quicksand of the Donegal defense, while, at the other end, Finn, foul, Murphy point. With that glum outlook, I can only be optimistic. Anything better than that, and we're in with a shout.
Game 70.30 at best in Donegals favour, where the big progress from Armagh since last year, they looked to have went back in some league games.
Quote from: brokencrossbar1 on May 17, 2015, 08:19:42 PM
Quote from: yellowcard on May 17, 2015, 08:00:29 PM
Don't see midfield being a huge issue as the Athletic Grounds is a tight field and it wasn't as if Donegal dominated Tyrone at midfield today. Armagh have a punchers chance in this game, the main concern I'd have over Armagh is defensively. They learned very little playing poor teams in the League and it's hard to know whether they have improved anything from last year and McGeeney has a huge selection headache after using so many players during the League. I'd expect the game to take the same pattern as today with Donegals better game management eventually getting the home in a tight contest.
To dispel this fallacy
Athletic Grounds dimensions 143 x 88 m
Croke Park dimensions 144.5m x 88m
MF will be congested but the reality is that Donegal will be doing that as much as we will, they are the masters of it but in McElhinny and Gallagher have 2 very good players who compliment each other well. The fact that they have been playing at a higher pace so far this season and have a championship match played already will be a key factor.
Shows how appearances can be deceptive, it's probably due to the sidelines being close to the perimeter of the field. However my point remains the same, McElhinney is not a classical midfielder but likes to ghost into space with forward runs. Gallagher is more conventional and is still one of the top players in the country from kick outs. If Armagh break even here it will be seen as a success. My biggest concern is Armaghs defence. Tyrone done brilliantly today in terms of not conceding score able free kicks and Armagh will have to do the same. We have a few serial foulers in defence who will have to alter their natural instincts, otherwise these will be crucial in what is sure to be another tight affair.
Quote from: bennydorano on May 17, 2015, 07:39:59 PM
Yeah, MF would have to be our main area of concern, has to be Findon & Ethan Rafferty, but i'm sure there'll be a fair bit of congestion in the area anyway. We also need a CHB that doesn't play for the Wolfe Tones.
Who is your preferred half back line?
Midfield shouldn't be an area of concern as we should have enough to compete well here. Findon to go up against Gallagher (should take a lot from last years QF) with rafferty / Campbell there as well.
Moriarty is suspended and he would probably have picked up McFadden. My concern would be defence as Mallon and Murray are considerably smaller / lighter than mcbrearty and McFadden. Murphy spent most of today's match around the half forward line and I would assume Vermont will follow him
We need a back row of Mallon, Donaghy and Morgan to deal with Donegal. In Donaghy fit?
If we get over this, I think we should be fit to go all the way in Ulster. Big if though. Armagh were the better team in the first half of the quarter final last year, and despite us dominating the second, they still found the goal when they needed it to get back into it. I agree with Tony - 50/50.
Division three league football is poor preparation for championship game like this. Last year in the quarter final Armagh had serious momentum from a number of qualifier wins.
Quote from: Orior on May 17, 2015, 11:16:00 PM
We need a back row of Mallon, Donaghy and Morgan to deal with Donegal. In Donaghy fit?
I think donaghy will start this one, with mallon, Vernon,morgan, mc keever and shields
findon and ethan
up front will be interesting,dyas, kernan, forker,Clarke, murnin and the last one could be anyone
That game yesterday will be a big help to Donegal as all the training & league games in the world don't prepare you for championship.
Donegal will target Jamie Clarke big time & will feel that if they can do a job on him that they should have enough to see them through.
Playing at home will be a big advantage for Armagh & I see another tight game with Donegal to get through by a couple.
Armagh & McGeeney will have known for some time that Armagh would be playing Donegal and they will be as ready for them as practicably possible, yes the lack of game time/championship intensity will be missing but they should be able to give them a right rattle. Unfortunately playing at home is not really beneficial to the home team the way it would be in say soccer so I wouldn't imagine Donegal having any fear of coming to Armagh.
There is a big game in Armagh and they've had some time to prepare for this game so there should be no excuses and we'll certainly know in 4 weeks time where Armagh is at regarding progression from last year. Looking forward to the game and a full house in Athletic Grounds for what should be a right good battle...
Quote from: Orior on May 17, 2015, 09:43:56 PM
Quote from: bennydorano on May 17, 2015, 07:39:59 PM
Yeah, MF would have to be our main area of concern, has to be Findon & Ethan Rafferty, but i'm sure there'll be a fair bit of congestion in the area anyway. We also need a CHB that doesn't play for the Wolfe Tones.
Who is your preferred half back line?
Gk?
Mallon, Vernon, Murray
Shields, McKeever, Morgan
Findon, E Rafferrty
Dyas, McKenna, C Raff
Campbell, Jamie, Mcparland.
When i started typing there i just realised how many options we actually have. it's more a team i'd like to see rather the team i'd expect to see. I'd like to see McParland on there, he's a poacher.
That wouldn't be too far off my team Benny. I'd swap A Forker for McKenna (who would be unlucky to miss out). There's a few fitness concerns on your team in Mickey Murray and Stefan Campbell. Murnin wouldn't be too far off but again he has fitness problems and I'd worry he'd be too green to be in a FF line with those McGee boys horsing about.
I agree wholeheartedly with your suggestion of keeping Finn Mo as far away from the pitch as possible but I think Geezer will play him.
Quote from: bennydorano on May 18, 2015, 01:33:58 PM
Quote from: Orior on May 17, 2015, 09:43:56 PM
Quote from: bennydorano on May 17, 2015, 07:39:59 PM
Yeah, MF would have to be our main area of concern, has to be Findon & Ethan Rafferty, but i'm sure there'll be a fair bit of congestion in the area anyway. We also need a CHB that doesn't play for the Wolfe Tones.
Who is your preferred half back line?
Gk?
Mallon, Vernon, Murray
Shields, McKeever, Morgan
Findon, E Rafferrty
Dyas, McKenna, C Raff
Campbell, Jamie, Mcparland.
When i started typing there i just realised how many options we actually have. it's more a team i'd like to see rather the team i'd expect to see. I'd like to see McParland on there, he's a poacher.
I'd go the same up until the forwards where I'd move Dyas CHF, Aidan Forker in wing half forward and Tony Kernan on in place of McParland at corner forward. The starting XV could include any 15 out of about 22 players and nobody would be surprised.
Quote from: mackers on May 18, 2015, 02:03:55 PM
That wouldn't be too far off my team Benny. I'd swap A Forker for McKenna (who would be unlucky to miss out). There's a few fitness concerns on your team in Mickey Murray and Stefan Campbell. Murnin wouldn't be too far off but again he has fitness problems and I'd worry he'd be too green to be in a FF line with those McGee boys horsing about.
I agree wholeheartedly with your suggestion of keeping Finn Mo as far away from the pitch as possible but I think Geezer will play him.
I was under the impression Finn Mo was suspended for this game? Having said all that he has done a good job on McFadden before but his inability to tackle makes him a liability...
A Forker will play...no doubt about that...
Keeper
Mallon
Vernon
Murray
McKeever
Morgan
shields
Findon
Rafferty
T Kernan
Dyas
A Forker
Clarke
Murnin
Campbell
Campbell, T Kernan, A Forker, Dyas all around the middle sector doing the donkey work. The defence will prob be what ive picked but not in that particular position, they will all have a certain person to pick up and a role to play...I really fear for us around the middle though as we were cleaned out there in Croke Pk last year, we need to kick the ball in the opposite direction of Gallagher
Well we now know Finn Mo is suspended so a lot of you will be relieved. Paddy Power in hearing this news has shortened Armagh's odds...lol. I now want to say that I don't believe Campbell will line out against Donegal so we may well see a place for either McKenna, C Rafferty, or McParland. If he's fit C Rafferty will prob get the nod for his work rate...
Quote from: illdecide on May 20, 2015, 08:44:27 AM
Well we now know Finn Mo is suspended so a lot of you will be relieved. Paddy Power in hearing this news has shortened Armagh's odds...lol. I now want to say that I don't believe Campbell will line out against Donegal so we may well see a place for either McKenna, C Rafferty, or McParland. If he's fit C Rafferty will prob get the nod for his work rate...
You've made my day! Must be due to an accumulation of cards earlier in the year on top of the sending off in the league final?? Not surprising. Caolan Rafferty, if fit, has to be an automatic starter, he's just the type of strong fast player needed against the Donegal defence.
Armagh are a no nonsense team with a serious(ly grumpy) manager.
Brolly can say what he wants about Donegal seemingly always being in control despite adversity (or often all evidence to the contrary) and that everything is part of the bigger plan etc etc but tbf hardly any of this garb is actually true at all . Eg the tyrone "3 point trashing". The truth is we could have easily lost to tryrone if the ball had of bounced differently on a few occasions and we really should have lost to Armagh last year .
He's still. kinda perpuating that myth and I can't help feel it's actually gonna catch him out badly one of these days .
Anyway there's no doubt we're a stubborn dogged team but we will do well to get out of there with a win.
No doubt in my head Armagh & their home crowd are looking forward to this match more than us and it depends on whether we can catch them slightly cold & get out of the traps faster.
Really, really looking forward to this.
It'll be my first trip to what seems like an excellent new ground, to see the lads play a county that I would have spent half my teens cursing!
Plenty of decent footballers in that Armagh team, and they've an excellent support when they get the wagon rolling. It'd be great to see them burst through, but hopefully through the qualifiers :P
Quote from: Conallach on May 21, 2015, 10:34:37 PM
Really, really looking forward to this.
It'll be my first trip to what seems like an excellent new ground, to see the lads play a county that I would have spent half my teens cursing!
Hopefully you'll curse some more and not enjoy your trip too much, not unlike Donegal's last championship visit to an Armagh venue.
Terrace tickets on sale online for this,
http://gaa.tickets.ie/Listing/EventInformation/23346/ulster-gaa-football-championship-qf-armagh-v-donegal-athletic-grounds-14-June-2015
get them now before they are all gone.
Sold out
What? Already? Now what?
It seems the Armagh county board have already appointed the 2 turnstiles operators for the day ,,,damm it
clubs are getting tickets
Quote from: naka on May 22, 2015, 04:35:50 PM
clubs are getting tickets
Clubs have most of the tickets.
We'll see how many Donegal people will travel, there weren't many in Cross in 2010. :P
Quote from: armaghniac on May 22, 2015, 05:10:42 PM
Quote from: naka on May 22, 2015, 04:35:50 PM
clubs are getting tickets
Clubs have most of the tickets.
We'll see how many Donegal people will travel, there weren't many in Cross in 2010. :P
Yeah but they're not shite now. I'd say many of them were cross after that 2010 display though.
Quote from: armaghniac on May 22, 2015, 05:10:42 PM
Quote from: naka on May 22, 2015, 04:35:50 PM
clubs are getting tickets
Clubs have most of the tickets.
We'll see how many Donegal people will travel, there weren't many in Cross in 2010. :P
I'd arrived home from the states that morning and had considered driving down from Dublin via Crossmaglen, but the family member I had with me refused point blank. Thank christ!!
Quote from: BennyCake on May 22, 2015, 05:38:45 PM
Quote from: armaghniac on May 22, 2015, 05:10:42 PM
Quote from: naka on May 22, 2015, 04:35:50 PM
clubs are getting tickets
Clubs have most of the tickets.
We'll see how many Donegal people will travel, there weren't many in Cross in 2010. :P
Yeah but they're not shite now. I'd say many of them were cross after that 2010 display though.
It was symptomatic of the team at the time. Lots of good players, most of whom would go on to win AI and multiple Ulster medals, but no fight or pride and poorly coached. The two (shite!) early goals ended the game against what was an average Armagh team. Stevie McDonnell commented on Neil McGee chatting about not being arsed and wanting the game to end. Can you imagine that from the Donegal team now?
Quote from: J70 on May 22, 2015, 06:07:32 PM
Quote from: armaghniac on May 22, 2015, 05:10:42 PM
Quote from: naka on May 22, 2015, 04:35:50 PM
clubs are getting tickets
Clubs have most of the tickets.
We'll see how many Donegal people will travel, there weren't many in Cross in 2010. :P
I'd arrived home from the states that morning and had considered driving down from Dublin via Crossmaglen, but the family member I had with me refused point blank. Thank christ!!
The game was shite, but you would have got to visit Cross, so it wouldn't have been a complete waste.
But you are right, Donegal did not want to know that day.
Remember that game well.An acquaintance arrived just before throw in,dressed to the nines and explained that he was a guest at a wedding and would be back in time for the soup providing there was no extra time!
Quote from: armaghniac on May 22, 2015, 05:10:42 PM
Quote from: naka on May 22, 2015, 04:35:50 PM
clubs are getting tickets
Clubs have most of the tickets.
We'll see how many Donegal people will travel, there weren't many in Cross in 2010. :P
Reckon we will have no bother selling our full allocation for the game (probably be between 7-8 thousand tickets) hopefully it's a better day than that 1 in 2010. I was 1 of the unfortunate dobegal supporters to be at that game, never seen us with such a poor support at a championship game
Quote from: J70 on May 22, 2015, 06:12:37 PM
It was symptomatic of the team at the time.
If I remember rightly, the camera picked up McFadden having a laugh in the dug-out after being subbed late on with the team about 15 points down. I was in Donegal for a few days break, a couple of years later, and Donegal lads I talked to still referred to that moment.
Quote from: Rufus T Firefly on May 23, 2015, 12:51:53 AM
Quote from: J70 on May 22, 2015, 06:12:37 PM
It was symptomatic of the team at the time.
If I remember rightly, the camera picked up McFadden having a laugh in the dug-out after being subbed late on with the team about 15 points down. I was in Donegal for a few days break, a couple of years later, and Donegal lads I talked to still referred to that moment.
According to McFadden, he was having a rueful joke about himself, as he had just been asked to stay out after the game to get an award for his 100th county game. Apparently he got a bit of grief from the Armagh lads as they warmed down while he was being photographed during the presentation.
http://www.donegaldemocrat.ie/sport/soccer/forward-thinking-mcfadden-1-4247035 (http://www.donegaldemocrat.ie/sport/soccer/forward-thinking-mcfadden-1-4247035)
A year later Donegal were the first team evicted from the championship, battered and bruised by nine points by Armagh in a first round qualifier in Crossmaglen. The RTE cameras breezed by the Donegal bench and McFadden, who had been replaced by Adrian Hanlon, was seen to have a sarcastic grin on his face.
As the obituary continued at home, McFadden's behaviour was condemned. However, it was later learned he had been asked by county board officials to stay around after the final whistle to receive a presentation to mark his 100th appearance for the county.
McFadden felt it was neither the time nor the place for such gestures and was making a joke at his own expense. As he left the field after being forced to stand in front of the cameras, barely able to muster a smile, the Armagh players snorted laughter during their warm-down and one even muttered: "It must be the man of the match award."
It was an embarrassing and avoidable episode for McFadden and one not of his own making. He admits now that he considered his own future, whether it was all worthwhile.
Guess who won the prize of a new jersey on Seó Spóirt on TG4 this week.
A man who proves constantly that if you are not in - you cannot win.
He's some man for one man.
Always a help to win an Armagh Jersey before the first match in the Championship! ;D
(http://i849.photobucket.com/albums/ab56/declanrice/157_zpsvzhpouwm.png)
Top man drici!
This game is going to be hard to get tickets for...it seems that all online tickets are gone (17 minutes, some sort of Ulster Council record) and only clubs will have them now.
Quote from: illdecide on May 26, 2015, 10:40:19 AM
This game is going to be hard to get tickets for...it seems that all online tickets are gone (17 minutes, some sort of Ulster Council record) and only clubs will have them now.
There was over 18000 + kids at the Cavan - Monaghan game. While that was between neighbours, these are bigger counties, Armagh has a tradition of going to games and Donegal are on a roll. There are thousands of people who might go to this game who will not get in.
I see the mind games are starting for this...McGeeney reckons Donegal are soft(ish) and Gallagher has said it will be his hardest game as Donegal have had the luck with home matches...I think Armagh can take them but certainly wouldn't rule out a draw. Should be the game of the Championship up to that date and I reckon there will be fireworks at it (could well be another CAVAN game where there is fisty cuffs before the throw in)...I've been looking forward to this for some time (just hope i'm not disappointed)
Quote from: illdecide on June 03, 2015, 11:24:47 AM
I see the mind games are starting for this...McGeeney reckons Donegal are soft(ish) and Gallagher has said it will be his hardest game as Donegal have had the luck with home matches...I think Armagh can take them but certainly wouldn't rule out a draw. Should be the game of the Championship up to that date and I reckon there will be fireworks at it (could well be another CAVAN game where there is fisty cuffs before the throw in)...I've been looking forward to this for some time (just hope i'm not disappointed)
If Gallagher is any good then McGeeney's mind games are a waste of time
If McGeeney has anything about him then Armagh will be well fit for Donegal's mind games.
Hopefully there will be a football game somewhere in the middle of this
Armagh operating in div 3 will not help them but this could be game of the year. I think Donegal have slipped and Armagh are improving. Looking forward to this game a lot
Quote from: drici on May 24, 2015, 03:58:16 PM
(http://i849.photobucket.com/albums/ab56/declanrice/157_zpsvzhpouwm.png)
T, you're a lucky shite, so you are ;)
Don't think Armagh playing in division 3 will make too much difference on the day. League status doesn't matter in Ulster. Looking forward to a bruising encounter, hopefully a bit of bite in the game after the tame enough fare we've had so far. Anyone care to take a stab at likely line out for Armagh? Any injury concerns?
It's hard to know unless you're in the camp to know if there are any injuries etc. I'll take a stab at the following.
Geoghan
Mallon
Vernon
Murray
J Morgan
C McKeever
M shields
Findon
Rafferty
T Kernan
Dyas
A Forker
Clarke
Murnin
Campbell (will be brought in or around the middle) (if he gets fit enough in time)
We will have great options from the bench either way...O'Hanlon, Donaghy, C Rafferty, McVerry, Harold, McKenna...there are more guys on the edge of the team too.
The good thing about us now is a bit of strength and depth and no-one will walk onto this team when they're fit...knowing K McGeeney they'll have to earn their spot as there are guys chomping at the bit looking their place too...Things are def looking up.
Quote from: J70 on May 18, 2015, 01:16:37 AM
If we get over this, I think we should be fit to go all the way in Ulster. Big if though.
You Donegal boys are so modest. The AI is a gimme if you get over this one.
Quote from: babarino on June 04, 2015, 01:16:00 PM
Quote from: J70 on May 18, 2015, 01:16:37 AM
If we get over this, I think we should be fit to go all the way in Ulster. Big if though.
You Donegal boys are so modest. The AI is a gimme if you get over this one.
As if you Monaghan boys are not confident about winning Ulster this year!
Seriously, where are Armagh going to get the scores to beat Donegal? Just cant see it!
Quote from: Wildweasel74 on June 04, 2015, 07:19:53 PM
Seriously, where are Armagh going to get the scores to beat Donegal? Just cant see it!
Nor me.
Looking forward to the game with a cloud of impending doom hovering over me. Hoping that Kyrie has undergone a miraculous recovery and is his old self. Hmmm. . . Go Cavs
Oops So excited about tonight's basketball game that I posted in the wrong thread. Well, for some, Armagh vs Donegal may well look like a basketball game.
Quote from: Wildweasel74 on June 04, 2015, 07:19:53 PM
Seriously, where are Armagh going to get the scores to beat Donegal? Just cant see it!
They kick the ball between the two white posts! ;D
Many may not believe it but Armagh have some very good forwards. When fit Clarke, Campbell, Rafferty, Kernan, Dyas and Forker can all score well. The one thing they do not have, however, is a player who will consistently score heavily.
To be honest as an Armagh man the bigger worry is winning enough ball around the middle third to give the forwards a chance to score. The one hope though is that Tyrone played with only 2 forwards - Cavanagh played around the middle - and they got close to Donegal.
Armagh were constantly in bother with various refs in the league with their tackling, really wouldn't be surprised to see them lose this on the number of frees they give away and McGeeney to complain about it after.
Make no mistake this game will have everything and I reckon from before the first whistle Armagh will be putting a marker down to Donegal that they're not coming to Armagh to walk all over us. There will be bookings, sending offs, black cards and God only knows what else. When the football finally breaks out there shouldn't be a kick of ball between the two sides (as long as Armagh don't lose a few players to the above cards).
For the first time in a while we have a strong bench and there are scores in our team and I believe Armagh will win this by 1pt but wouldn't rule out a draw. I haven't looked forward to a match as much in a long time and can't wait for next Sunday...
My preference would be along the lines of:
Geoghan
Mallon Vernon Donaghy Murray
J Morgan C McKeever M Shields
Findon Rafferty
Campbell Dyas A Forker
Clarke Murnin
If Campbell not fit then McKenna. Only use O'Hanlon and McVerry if others injured or carded. Bring on Harold when Findon runs himself into the ground. Besides Finn Mo I'm not sure of the defence replacements. Bring it on.
Quote from: illdecide on June 05, 2015, 11:07:28 AM
Make no mistake this game will have everything and I reckon from before the first whistle Armagh will be putting a marker down to Donegal that they're not coming to Armagh to walk all over us. There will be bookings, sending offs, black cards and God only knows what else. When the football finally breaks out there shouldn't be a kick of ball between the two sides (as long as Armagh don't lose a few players to the above cards).
For the first time in a while we have a strong bench and there are scores in our team and I believe Armagh will win this by 1pt but wouldn't rule out a draw. I haven't looked forward to a match as much in a long time and can't wait for next Sunday...
Is this prediction based on McGeeney's statement that Donegal are not that physical?
Quote from: J70 on June 05, 2015, 03:49:39 PM
Quote from: illdecide on June 05, 2015, 11:07:28 AM
Make no mistake this game will have everything and I reckon from before the first whistle Armagh will be putting a marker down to Donegal that they're not coming to Armagh to walk all over us. There will be bookings, sending offs, black cards and God only knows what else. When the football finally breaks out there shouldn't be a kick of ball between the two sides (as long as Armagh don't lose a few players to the above cards).
For the first time in a while we have a strong bench and there are scores in our team and I believe Armagh will win this by 1pt but wouldn't rule out a draw. I haven't looked forward to a match as much in a long time and can't wait for next Sunday...
Is this prediction based on McGeeney's statement that Donegal are not that physical?
I think McGeeney was looking at the low number of scoreable frees Donegal generally concede and confusing this defensive discipline with not being physical.
At the moment I think that by far the likeliest outcome is that Armagh's lack of discipline will be a key factor in costing them the game.
Quote from: twohands!!! on June 05, 2015, 03:55:35 PM
Quote from: J70 on June 05, 2015, 03:49:39 PM
Quote from: illdecide on June 05, 2015, 11:07:28 AM
Make no mistake this game will have everything and I reckon from before the first whistle Armagh will be putting a marker down to Donegal that they're not coming to Armagh to walk all over us. There will be bookings, sending offs, black cards and God only knows what else. When the football finally breaks out there shouldn't be a kick of ball between the two sides (as long as Armagh don't lose a few players to the above cards).
For the first time in a while we have a strong bench and there are scores in our team and I believe Armagh will win this by 1pt but wouldn't rule out a draw. I haven't looked forward to a match as much in a long time and can't wait for next Sunday...
Is this prediction based on McGeeney's statement that Donegal are not that physical?
I think McGeeney was looking at the low number of scoreable frees Donegal generally concede and confusing this defensive discipline with not being physical.
At the moment I think that by far the likeliest outcome is that Armagh's lack of discipline will be a key factor in costing them the game.
Maybe it's reverse psychology and Donegal will come down prepared for a fight and will bully us and the ref will send off a few of their players ;)
I think some are reading too much into what McGeeney said. He said Dublin and Kerry are more physical than Donegal. Are Donegal people saying that is not true? Besides in most matches I have seen over the last few years the opposition has nearly always been bigger physically than Armagh. Mallon, Murray, Shields, Dyas and Clarke etc. are hardly muscle men. The game may be tough and physical but I would be surprised if it was particularly dirty.
Good interview in the Democrat with Rory Kavanagh about the appointment of McGuinness and then a bit about the struggles against Armagh over the years, including how they'd regrouped by last season.
We were capable of these big performances. We never feared Tyrone and always had a decent record against them. But we had a psychological block that was always there with Armagh. It was something then that they could play on: 'We've got Donegal's measure here.'
http://www.donegaldemocrat.ie/sport/gaelic-games/rory-kavanagh-after-crossmaglen-we-didn-t-know-if-we-would-play-football-for-donegal-again-1-6781296 (http://www.donegaldemocrat.ie/sport/gaelic-games/rory-kavanagh-after-crossmaglen-we-didn-t-know-if-we-would-play-football-for-donegal-again-1-6781296)
Quote from: Throw ball on June 05, 2015, 06:40:13 PM
I think some are reading too much into what McGeeney said. He said Dublin and Kerry are more physical than Donegal. Are Donegal people saying that is not true? Besides in most matches I have seen over the last few years the opposition has nearly always been bigger physically than Armagh. Mallon, Murray, Shields, Dyas and Clarke etc. are hardly muscle men. The game may be tough and physical but I would be surprised if it was particularly dirty.
I'd never really perceived Kerry or Dublin as having a physical edge on us. We've played both twice over the past four years, and I don't think that was an issue any time, either way.
I presumed McGeeney was saying this to motivate his own players. Perhaps there is a perception, which you voice, that Armagh are a bit inferior in that respect, and he is trying to stop that affecting the players.
As for dirt, it depends what you mean! There'll be plenty of mouthing and bits of pushing and shoving here and there, but that is usually the case anyway.
I think that what Geezer meant was that the southern media perceive Ulster teams, especially Donegal, as being the big bad wolves of Gaelic Football, while Dublin and Kerry get away with far worse. I reckon he was thinking long term rather than this particular game.
Illdecide has pretty much summed up my feelings on the game in his earlier post. Haven't looked forward to a game this much in years, a packed to the rafters Athletic grounds, ulster championship game, sure ye couldn't beat it.
Really looking forward to this game, a packed ground, a great atmosphere & 2 fully committed teams, what more could you ask for?
As for the game itself, Donegal have the better players, especially up front. Armagh will be looking to Jamie Clarke for a big performance & if Donegal do a mam to man marking job on him, a la Justin McMahon, then it's hard to see where the Armagh scores are going to come from.
As against that home advantage is with the Orchard men & that is always worth a few points. I expect Donegal to play a tight controlled game & to come out 2 or 3 points the better of a low scoring game.
Really looking forward to this
Actually think Armagh can beat Donegal
A lot of the posters seem to think our forward line is weak
Actually think at last Armagh have forwards capable of scoring
Hopefully Clarke murnin and Campbell are on the top of their game
Can see those three with forker, dyas and Kernan in the half forward line
Quote from: BluestackBoy on June 07, 2015, 08:08:31 PM
Really looking forward to this game, a packed ground, a great atmosphere & 2 fully committed teams, what more could you ask for?
As for the game itself, Donegal have the better players, especially up front. Armagh will be looking to Jamie Clarke for a big performance & if Donegal do a mam to man marking job on him, a la Justin McMahon, then it's hard to see where the Armagh scores are going to come from.
As against that home advantage is with the Orchard men & that is always worth a few points. I expect Donegal to play a tight controlled game & to come out 2 or 3 points the better of a low scoring game.
Clarke doesn't tend to score too much for us and wasn't prolific during the league. For all our failings, one of them isn't that we're over reliant on Jamie for scores. Would be very surprised if he weighs in with anything more than a couple of points on Sunday.
K Lacey will prob pick up J Clarke and i'm happy with that as it will curb his own influence on the game which will be a big factor in the game. Armagh no longer rely on J Clarke for scoring and as Armamike said he'll prob get 2-3pts in the game but he'll pull defenders away and he'll create space for the other forwards. Hope we get a good game and i'll have no problems with whoever wins just as long as the man in black does not ruin it and lets the two teams play football.
Getting properly nervous for this now
Quote from: tonto1888 on June 08, 2015, 10:51:59 AM
Getting properly nervous for this now
Why? Armagh have literally nothing nothing to lose. Full team to pick from, sell-out home tie against the team to beat in Ulster, no one giving them a hope. All the Derry ones gearing up for a semi v Donegal. Armagh are a bit better than people give them credit, this crop of players have developed and are still developing nicely. Massive ask no doubt but I've a quiet optimism going into this, Donegal can be got in the long grass.
Think Armagh might win this one, Donegal weren't that impressive against Tyrone.
Who will do the Justy McMahon on Murphy?
Quote from: general_lee on June 08, 2015, 11:51:39 AM
Quote from: tonto1888 on June 08, 2015, 10:51:59 AM
Getting properly nervous for this now
Why? Armagh have literally nothing nothing to lose. Full team to pick from, sell-out home tie against the team to beat in Ulster, no one giving them a hope. All the Derry ones gearing up for a semi v Donegal. Armagh are a bit better than people give them credit, this crop of players have developed and are still developing nicely. Massive ask no doubt but I've a quiet optimism going into this, Donegal can be got in the long grass.
I agree with what youre saying mate, I just get nervous in the build up to games, the bigger the game the more nervous I get
Quote from: tonto1888 on June 08, 2015, 11:58:23 AM
Quote from: general_lee on June 08, 2015, 11:51:39 AM
Quote from: tonto1888 on June 08, 2015, 10:51:59 AM
Getting properly nervous for this now
Why? Armagh have literally nothing nothing to lose. Full team to pick from, sell-out home tie against the team to beat in Ulster, no one giving them a hope. All the Derry ones gearing up for a semi v Donegal. Armagh are a bit better than people give them credit, this crop of players have developed and are still developing nicely. Massive ask no doubt but I've a quiet optimism going into this, Donegal can be got in the long grass.
I agree with what youre saying mate, I just get nervous in the build up to games, the bigger the game the more nervous I get
i get ya. I'll be some sight come match day myself especially if it is close.
I find it hard to watch at times when its really close
David Colderick the man in the middle
There will be some great individual battles...
J Morgan v P McBrearty
Vernon v Murphy
A Mallon v MacNiallais
McKeever v McFadden
M Shields v O'Reilly
Murray v McHugh (if he starts) C Toye could start in his place and he'd be too big for Murray!!!
Would Vernon likely follow Murphy out the field?
Quote from: DuffleKing on June 08, 2015, 12:21:23 PM
David Colderick the man in the middle
Not good news for Armagh imo - his style of reffing definitely won't suit them.
Quote from: twohands!!! on June 08, 2015, 12:56:41 PM
Quote from: DuffleKing on June 08, 2015, 12:21:23 PM
David Colderick the man in the middle
Not good news for Armagh imo - his style of reffing definitely won't suit them.
What is that even supposed to mean?
Quote from: yellowcard on June 08, 2015, 03:01:50 PM
Quote from: twohands!!! on June 08, 2015, 12:56:41 PM
Quote from: DuffleKing on June 08, 2015, 12:21:23 PM
David Colderick the man in the middle
Not good news for Armagh imo - his style of reffing definitely won't suit them.
What is that even supposed to mean?
This poster has had several swipes at Armagh's tackling/discipline in this thread. Probably a WUM that's best ignored.
Quote from: illdecide on June 08, 2015, 09:25:44 AM
K Lacey will prob pick up J Clarke and i'm happy with that as it will curb his own influence on the game which will be a big factor in the game. Armagh no longer rely on J Clarke for scoring and as Armamike said he'll prob get 2-3pts in the game but he'll pull defenders away and he'll create space for the other forwards. Hope we get a good game and i'll have no problems with whoever wins just as long as the man in black does not ruin it and lets the two teams play football.
Where will Clarke play?
Lacey will be centre back.
Quote from: yellowcard on June 08, 2015, 03:01:50 PM
Quote from: twohands!!! on June 08, 2015, 12:56:41 PM
Quote from: DuffleKing on June 08, 2015, 12:21:23 PM
David Colderick the man in the middle
Not good news for Armagh imo - his style of reffing definitely won't suit them.
What is that even supposed to mean?
He's a rather "fussy" ref - and his style of reffing definitely isn't suited to Armagh's physical/rough style of game.
People will say that Donegal are physical too, but to my mind their defenders are far better in terms of conceding scoreable frees/making their tackles look legitimate.
In the 7 championship games in 2012 they conceded a total of 25 points in frees and no penalties and that was in games against Cavan, Derry, Tyrone, Down, Kerry, Cork and Mayo.
In the 6 championship games in 2014 they conceded a total of 25 points in frees and no penalties and that was in games against Derry, Antrim, Monaghan, Armagh, Dublin and Kerry. A key factor in the win over Dublin was Dublin got 2 points from frees.
The ability to not concede scoreable frees is a key component of the blanket defence that a lot of teams overlook.
Armagh have had an issue with their discipline last year and I believe it is extremely likely that poor/ill-discipline is likely to cost him this year as well
In the game against Donegal last year - Donegal got 6 points from frees while Armagh got 2 which was vital. I'd imagine if you looked back at other Armagh championship losses in recent years that the concession of scoreable frees was a key factor.
Don't be surprised if the game on Sunday ends up with lots of Armagh folk giving out about the ref.
Quote from: twohands!!! on June 08, 2015, 04:02:44 PM
Quote from: yellowcard on June 08, 2015, 03:01:50 PM
Quote from: twohands!!! on June 08, 2015, 12:56:41 PM
Quote from: DuffleKing on June 08, 2015, 12:21:23 PM
David Colderick the man in the middle
Not good news for Armagh imo - his style of reffing definitely won't suit them.
What is that even supposed to mean?
He's a rather "fussy" ref - and his style of reffing definitely isn't suited to Armagh's physical/rough style of game.
People will say that Donegal are physical too, but to my mind their defenders are far better in terms of conceding scoreable frees/making their tackles look legitimate.
In the 7 championship games in 2012 they conceded a total of 25 points in frees and no penalties and that was in games against Cavan, Derry, Tyrone, Down, Kerry, Cork and Mayo.
In the 6 championship games in 2014 they conceded a total of 25 points in frees and no penalties and that was in games against Derry, Antrim, Monaghan, Armagh, Dublin and Kerry. A key factor in the win over Dublin was Dublin got 2 points from frees.
The ability to not concede scoreable frees is a key component of the blanket defence that a lot of teams overlook.
Armagh have had an issue with their discipline last year and I believe it is extremely likely that poor/ill-discipline is likely to cost him this year as well
In the game against Donegal last year - Donegal got 6 points from frees while Armagh got 2 which was vital. I'd imagine if you looked back at other Armagh championship losses in recent years that the concession of scoreable frees was a key factor.
Don't be surprised if the game on Sunday ends up with lots of Armagh folk giving out about the ref.
Two things. I don't believe that Donegal are overly physical. They have the 2 Magees who like to engage in physical and verbal combat but have very few other physical players.
Secondly how many times have you watched Armagh play since McGeeney took over? Armagh are far from a physical side, that is a lazy perception that comes from a couple of schmozzles in last years championship. Armagh fans will know that Moriarty, Morgan and Findon in particular need to be careful of conceding scoreable free kicks but I'm confident that with McGeeney in charge we will have addressed this.
A bright start for Donegal:
Armagh 0-1 Donegal 0-4
Two goals for Armagh, so after 15 mins:
Armagh 2-1 Donegal 0-5
Then Donegal will come on strong, and nab a soft goal before the break.
Armagh 2-2 Donegal 1-8
Armagh man will be sent off just after the break.
Donegal man sent off with 5 minutes to go, but it hardly matters.
Donegal cruise to an easy win:
Armagh 2-7 Donegal 1-15
Quote from: Orior on June 08, 2015, 08:39:47 PM
A bright start for Donegal:
Armagh 0-1 Donegal 0-4
Two goals for Armagh, so after 15 mins:
Armagh 2-1 Donegal 0-5
Then Donegal will come on strong, and nab a soft goal before the break.
Armagh 2-2 Donegal 1-8
Armagh man will be sent off just after the break.
Donegal man sent off with 5 minutes to go, but it hardly matters.
Donegal cruise to an easy win:
Armagh 2-7 Donegal 1-15
Bollocks Orior!
McKeever sent off after 90 seconds
We score three goals in fifteen minutes op top of the 4 points, play a fourteen man rearguard and beat Donegal at their own game by a point!
This has all the hallmarks of the game of the championship so far. Both teams are loaded with potential tactics, both teams have high levels they can play to, done gal should have more, but I like the work that mc geeney puts into his teams. I fancy the donegal machine this year to go further but only if they go through ulster.. I really don't think.they have the age profile and appetite to win an all Ireland through the back door. Armagh will be at a serious level on Sunday but will also want to go direct to an ulster. If donegal win an ulster there will be few who have ever had a tougher campaign across all provinces. I'm going for Armagh because of their freshness.
Armagh TV preview tonight 8pm http://www.armaghgaa.net/70-minutes-show-returns/
At end of the show,Enda Mc Ginley compared the Ulster Championship with the feeling Benny Tierney's mother had the day she gave birth to him. "It mightn't be beautiful but you still can't wait to see it!" :D :D ;D
Quote from: rrhf on June 08, 2015, 09:38:05 PM
This has all the hallmarks of the game of the championship so far. Both teams are loaded with potential tactics, both teams have high levels they can play to, done gal should have more, but I like the work that mc geeney puts into his teams. I fancy the donegal machine this year to go further but only if they go through ulster.. I really don't think.they have the age profile and appetite to win an all Ireland through the back door. Armagh will be at a serious level on Sunday but will also want to go direct to an ulster. If donegal win an ulster there will be few who have ever had a tougher campaign across all provinces. I'm going for Armagh because of their freshness.
I bet you are!
Paddy Power have Armagh @ 2/1 to win the game and Donegal at 4/7, i'm a we bit surprised at those odds as I thought it would be a bit closer in the betting but maybe i'm looking at it with Orange tinted glasses on.
Quote from: illdecide on June 11, 2015, 11:15:37 AM
Paddy Power have Armagh @ 2/1 to win the game and Donegal at 4/7, i'm a we bit surprised at those odds as I thought it would be a bit closer in the betting but maybe i'm looking at it with Orange tinted glasses on.
I'd have 2/1 as about right - Donegal have more pedigree over the last few years, they've a hard match v Tyrone already under their belts and they finished 4th in D1 this year.
Armagh did (unexpectedly) well last year, had a very good league albeit in D3 and they're at home.
It'll be interesting to see how McGeeney gets on in his first Ulster championship match, I wonder if he'll have a plan for Donegal.
I'd say the bookies spread of 2 points to Donegal will be on the money
Quote from: topcuppla on June 10, 2015, 12:51:40 PM
Quote from: rrhf on June 08, 2015, 09:38:05 PM
This has all the hallmarks of the game of the championship so far. Both teams are loaded with potential tactics, both teams have high levels they can play to, done gal should have more, but I like the work that mc geeney puts into his teams. I fancy the donegal machine this year to go further but only if they go through ulster.. I really don't think.they have the age profile and appetite to win an all Ireland through the back door. Armagh will be at a serious level on Sunday but will also want to go direct to an ulster. If donegal win an ulster there will be few who have ever had a tougher campaign across all provinces. I'm going for Armagh because of their freshness.
I bet you are!
Bollocks, you are a hater rrhf, nothing wrong with that but you are full of mad dogs shite!!!
But himself and ONeill are bitter individuals and haters in such a nice way, we should maybe cut them some slack, hopefully Armagh will come up against them again this year. ;)
I think if we can keep 15 for 65 minutes Armagh may well just pip Donegal. Big test for Geezer the Messiah.
tickets are hard to get in Armagh
club could have gotten rid of another 50/60
Quote from: rrhf on June 08, 2015, 09:38:05 PM
Both teams are loaded with potential tactics"
:)
Brilliant line that!!!! PMSL.
Quote from: illdecide on June 11, 2015, 11:15:37 AM
Paddy Power have Armagh @ 2/1 to win the game and Donegal at 4/7, i'm a we bit surprised at those odds as I thought it would be a bit closer in the betting but maybe i'm looking at it with Orange tinted glasses on.
Thought Armagh would have been around 3/1 myself. Donegal are aiming for their 4th Ulster title in 5 years and Armagh have played against cannon fodder all year in division 3. Cork beat them by 8 points in a challenge 2 weeks ago and I think Armagh will get a rude awakening with the intensity levels in this game.
Quote from: yellowcard on June 11, 2015, 02:58:39 PM
Quote from: illdecide on June 11, 2015, 11:15:37 AM
Paddy Power have Armagh @ 2/1 to win the game and Donegal at 4/7, i'm a we bit surprised at those odds as I thought it would be a bit closer in the betting but maybe i'm looking at it with Orange tinted glasses on.
Thought Armagh would have been around 3/1 myself. Donegal are aiming for their 4th Ulster title in 5 years and Armagh have played against cannon fodder all year in division 3. Cork beat them by 8 points in a challenge 2 weeks ago and I think Armagh will get a rude awakening with the intensity levels in this game.
games against cork was tight enough for majority of the game,
it was played at championship [pace and cork only moved ahead when both sides emptied bench in last 5/10 minutes
Hard one to call...Armagh are at the beginning of their journey under McGeeney with some players to either make a name for themselves on this stage....or fade away to what could have been. Would be great to see young McKenna, Murnin and O'Hanlon set down markers for their future, Ethan and Findon to establish themselves as a force backed up by the battle-hardened guys who have given such great service. There is still a kick in Donegal though and this game will go a long way to proving if Armagh are all that or if Donegal are on the wane. Armagh by 2 - listening a little more to my heart than my head on this though.
1.
Geoghan
2. 3. 4.
Mallon Vernon Murray
5. 6. 7.
Shields Donaghy McKeever
8. 9.
Findon Rafferty
10. 11. 12.
A Forker Dyas T.Kernan
13. 14. 15.
Clarke Murnin Campbell
.......but then again who knows????
Surely the (supposed) teams will be named tonight??
Getting nervous over this one. Most non Armagh supporters would feel I am sure that Donegal have better players all over the field. Loyal Armagh supporters would feel our players are better than many think. Sunday should tell us if we are going the right way or not. I would be fairly happy with most areas for Armagh but would worry if we can win enough ball around the middle - still an area we need improvement. We will also have a debut keeper. Also hope for calm heads!
On the Cork game I was told Armagh were winning by 2pts until they put 5 subs on and them Cork scored to goals in a few mins so from what I can gather Armagh gave Cork their fill of it. I hear R Gallagher is running the sh*te out of the Donegal boys and they're not happy with it, them guys are at full fitness and only need sharp stuff. Everyone keeps going on about the tight pitch at Athletic Grounds...FFS it on a couple meters shy of Croke Park so the pitch dims will not be a factor.
For me Donegal are 2-3 years ahead of Armagh but we're developing fast and our hunger may well see us over the line, who knows a draw could be a big possibility...Can't wait until Sunday.
Armagh team is to be named Sat nite.
I can only see Donegal winning this.
Two teams are at two different ends of the spectrum. Can't believe Donegal are as long as 4/7.
Donegal and Mayo double this weekend.
Hunger alone will not win this game for Armagh, they need to nullify Murphy's influence and Vernon needs the game of his life or resort to the Tyrone tactics.
Armagh half forward line might be the most crucial in staving McHugh and McGlynn's deep probing runs.
Jamie Clarke needs to get on the ball much more than he has in previous Championship games, he'll take men with him and space should open up in front of the McGees. Kernan must convert every free opportunity that is given to him. Everything must go Armagh's way to win this I think.
Why do a lot of you ignore James Morgan in team selections? Charlie Vernon is a serious footballer and if tasked with Murphy I'd say he will be up to it. I just have an inkling for Armagh. That said Donegal are a serious team, although I think they are on the down slope. It just depends how far up the other side Armagh have got to.
Quote from: Applesisapples on June 12, 2015, 11:10:25 AM
Why do a lot of you ignore James Morgan in team selections? Charlie Vernon is a serious footballer and if tasked with Murphy I'd say he will be up to it. I just have an inkling for Armagh. That said Donegal are a serious team, although I think they are on the down slope. It just depends how far up the other side Armagh have got to.
I agree Apples...I think Donegal are weaker this year than previous years and it's just a wait and see if Armagh has progressed from last year. I also agree about J Morgan and he'd be in my team. I think he's perfect for McBrearty and can nullify him out of the game, if Big Charles can keep Murphy relatively quiet Armagh will win this
Quote from: illdecide on June 12, 2015, 11:43:03 AM
Quote from: Applesisapples on June 12, 2015, 11:10:25 AM
Why do a lot of you ignore James Morgan in team selections? Charlie Vernon is a serious footballer and if tasked with Murphy I'd say he will be up to it. I just have an inkling for Armagh. That said Donegal are a serious team, although I think they are on the down slope. It just depends how far up the other side Armagh have got to.
I agree Apples...I think Donegal are weaker this year than previous years and it's just a wait and see if Armagh has progressed from last year. I also agree about J Morgan and he'd be in my team. I think he's perfect for McBrearty and can nullify him out of the game, if Big Charles can keep Murphy relatively quiet Armagh will win this
Tyrone kept Murphy absolutely anonymous from play and they still got beat. There are more strings to Donegal than just Murphy.
Nullifying McGlynn might be more important than stopping Murphy. Who do Armagh deploy on him? Forker or maybe utilise the pace and power of Caolan Rafferty (if fit)?
Quote from: illdecide on June 12, 2015, 11:43:03 AM
Quote from: Applesisapples on June 12, 2015, 11:10:25 AM
Why do a lot of you ignore James Morgan in team selections? Charlie Vernon is a serious footballer and if tasked with Murphy I'd say he will be up to it. I just have an inkling for Armagh. That said Donegal are a serious team, although I think they are on the down slope. It just depends how far up the other side Armagh have got to.
I agree Apples...I think Donegal are weaker this year than previous years and it's just a wait and see if Armagh has progressed from last year. I also agree about J Morgan and he'd be in my team. I think he's perfect for McBrearty and can nullify him out of the game, if Big Charles can keep Murphy relatively quiet Armagh will win this
he'll need backup obviously, he goes 1 on 1 with McBrearty he'll get roasted. You'll have to double team McFadden and Murphy as well. Keep an eye on the runners from the half back line and stop MacNiallais getting on the ball. Clarke will do well to get a point from open play. Armagh are really up against it, but on the day in championship football, anything can happen
Quote from: JoG2 on June 12, 2015, 01:02:34 PM
Quote from: illdecide on June 12, 2015, 11:43:03 AM
Quote from: Applesisapples on June 12, 2015, 11:10:25 AM
Why do a lot of you ignore James Morgan in team selections? Charlie Vernon is a serious footballer and if tasked with Murphy I'd say he will be up to it. I just have an inkling for Armagh. That said Donegal are a serious team, although I think they are on the down slope. It just depends how far up the other side Armagh have got to.
I agree Apples...I think Donegal are weaker this year than previous years and it's just a wait and see if Armagh has progressed from last year. I also agree about J Morgan and he'd be in my team. I think he's perfect for McBrearty and can nullify him out of the game, if Big Charles can keep Murphy relatively quiet Armagh will win this
he'll need backup obviously, he goes 1 on 1 with McBrearty he'll get roasted. You'll have to double team McFadden and Murphy as well. Keep an eye on the runners from the half back line and stop MacNiallais getting on the ball. Clarke will do well to get a point from open play. Armagh are really up against it, but on the day in championship football, anything can happen
He marked the Gooch (1 on 1) for Cross as a cub and never got roasted Jo!
Donegal have threats all over the field, never mind McBreaty and McFadden who on their day can both be stinking. Hopefully Murphy continues playing out the field and McElhinney isn't given the same freedom he was v Tyrone.
I'm hoping Murnin starts for Armagh as he is a good target man and physical to boot, a bit of an unknown quantity from a Donegal perspective who may focus their attentions on other players. Agree a lot will need to go Armagh's way though for them to win.
Quote from: Walter Cronc on June 12, 2015, 01:07:35 PM
Quote from: JoG2 on June 12, 2015, 01:02:34 PM
Quote from: illdecide on June 12, 2015, 11:43:03 AM
Quote from: Applesisapples on June 12, 2015, 11:10:25 AM
Why do a lot of you ignore James Morgan in team selections? Charlie Vernon is a serious footballer and if tasked with Murphy I'd say he will be up to it. I just have an inkling for Armagh. That said Donegal are a serious team, although I think they are on the down slope. It just depends how far up the other side Armagh have got to.
I agree Apples...I think Donegal are weaker this year than previous years and it's just a wait and see if Armagh has progressed from last year. I also agree about J Morgan and he'd be in my team. I think he's perfect for McBrearty and can nullify him out of the game, if Big Charles can keep Murphy relatively quiet Armagh will win this
he'll need backup obviously, he goes 1 on 1 with McBrearty he'll get roasted. You'll have to double team McFadden and Murphy as well. Keep an eye on the runners from the half back line and stop MacNiallais getting on the ball. Clarke will do well to get a point from open play. Armagh are really up against it, but on the day in championship football, anything can happen
He marked the Gooch (1 on 1) for Cross as a cub and never got roasted Jo!
we'll see. Would be madness to go 1 on 1 the kind of form he's in imo. The frequency and speed of balls into him will be different than in a winter club match Walt.
Quote from: JoG2 on June 12, 2015, 02:04:29 PM
Quote from: Walter Cronc on June 12, 2015, 01:07:35 PM
Quote from: JoG2 on June 12, 2015, 01:02:34 PM
Quote from: illdecide on June 12, 2015, 11:43:03 AM
Quote from: Applesisapples on June 12, 2015, 11:10:25 AM
Why do a lot of you ignore James Morgan in team selections? Charlie Vernon is a serious footballer and if tasked with Murphy I'd say he will be up to it. I just have an inkling for Armagh. That said Donegal are a serious team, although I think they are on the down slope. It just depends how far up the other side Armagh have got to.
I agree Apples...I think Donegal are weaker this year than previous years and it's just a wait and see if Armagh has progressed from last year. I also agree about J Morgan and he'd be in my team. I think he's perfect for McBrearty and can nullify him out of the game, if Big Charles can keep Murphy relatively quiet Armagh will win this
he'll need backup obviously, he goes 1 on 1 with McBrearty he'll get roasted. You'll have to double team McFadden and Murphy as well. Keep an eye on the runners from the half back line and stop MacNiallais getting on the ball. Clarke will do well to get a point from open play. Armagh are really up against it, but on the day in championship football, anything can happen
He marked the Gooch (1 on 1) for Cross as a cub and never got roasted Jo!
we'll see. Would be madness to go 1 on 1 the kind of form he's in imo. The frequency and speed of balls into him will be different than in a winter club match Walt.
True. Bit of a difference in arguably the greatest forward to ever grace the game and McBrearty all the same!
Quote from: Walter Cronc on June 12, 2015, 02:06:57 PM
Quote from: JoG2 on June 12, 2015, 02:04:29 PM
Quote from: Walter Cronc on June 12, 2015, 01:07:35 PM
Quote from: JoG2 on June 12, 2015, 01:02:34 PM
Quote from: illdecide on June 12, 2015, 11:43:03 AM
Quote from: Applesisapples on June 12, 2015, 11:10:25 AM
Why do a lot of you ignore James Morgan in team selections? Charlie Vernon is a serious footballer and if tasked with Murphy I'd say he will be up to it. I just have an inkling for Armagh. That said Donegal are a serious team, although I think they are on the down slope. It just depends how far up the other side Armagh have got to.
I agree Apples...I think Donegal are weaker this year than previous years and it's just a wait and see if Armagh has progressed from last year. I also agree about J Morgan and he'd be in my team. I think he's perfect for McBrearty and can nullify him out of the game, if Big Charles can keep Murphy relatively quiet Armagh will win this
he'll need backup obviously, he goes 1 on 1 with McBrearty he'll get roasted. You'll have to double team McFadden and Murphy as well. Keep an eye on the runners from the half back line and stop MacNiallais getting on the ball. Clarke will do well to get a point from open play. Armagh are really up against it, but on the day in championship football, anything can happen
He marked the Gooch (1 on 1) for Cross as a cub and never got roasted Jo!
we'll see. Would be madness to go 1 on 1 the kind of form he's in imo. The frequency and speed of balls into him will be different than in a winter club match Walt.
True. Bit of a difference in arguably the greatest forward to ever grace the game and McBrearty all the same!
True, though McBrearty will be playing a lot closer to goals
Anyways, we'll see on Sunday. Looking forward to it (as are all the Dubliners on here, secretly)
Quote from: JoG2 on June 12, 2015, 03:01:33 PM
Quote from: Walter Cronc on June 12, 2015, 02:06:57 PM
Quote from: JoG2 on June 12, 2015, 02:04:29 PM
Quote from: Walter Cronc on June 12, 2015, 01:07:35 PM
Quote from: JoG2 on June 12, 2015, 01:02:34 PM
Quote from: illdecide on June 12, 2015, 11:43:03 AM
Quote from: Applesisapples on June 12, 2015, 11:10:25 AM
Why do a lot of you ignore James Morgan in team selections? Charlie Vernon is a serious footballer and if tasked with Murphy I'd say he will be up to it. I just have an inkling for Armagh. That said Donegal are a serious team, although I think they are on the down slope. It just depends how far up the other side Armagh have got to.
I agree Apples...I think Donegal are weaker this year than previous years and it's just a wait and see if Armagh has progressed from last year. I also agree about J Morgan and he'd be in my team. I think he's perfect for McBrearty and can nullify him out of the game, if Big Charles can keep Murphy relatively quiet Armagh will win this
he'll need backup obviously, he goes 1 on 1 with McBrearty he'll get roasted. You'll have to double team McFadden and Murphy as well. Keep an eye on the runners from the half back line and stop MacNiallais getting on the ball. Clarke will do well to get a point from open play. Armagh are really up against it, but on the day in championship football, anything can happen
He marked the Gooch (1 on 1) for Cross as a cub and never got roasted Jo!
we'll see. Would be madness to go 1 on 1 the kind of form he's in imo. The frequency and speed of balls into him will be different than in a winter club match Walt.
True. Bit of a difference in arguably the greatest forward to ever grace the game and McBrearty all the same!
True, though McBrearty will be playing a lot closer to goals
Anyways, we'll see on Sunday. Looking forward to it (as are all the Dubliners on here, secretly)
Morgan was very poor against Omagh last year and got taking off very early if I remember correctly.
Can't see past Donegal, people talking on here of their demise are badly mistaken. they started off slow last year to. For the few weaknesses they showed against tyrone we still couldn't break them down in second half.
I think they will win by 3 or 4, Vernon wont be fit for murphy
Is anyone else getting a feeling of deja vu? !999.................................
Quote from: ardchieftain on June 12, 2015, 03:58:52 PM
Is anyone else getting a feeling of deja vu? !999.................................
In what way?
Quote from: ardchieftain on June 12, 2015, 03:58:52 PM
Is anyone else getting a feeling of deja vu? !999.................................
Russian president Boris Yeltsin survives impeachment hearings (May), reshuffles his cabinet twice (May, Aug.), and takes military action against Islamic separatists in Dagestan and Chechnya. Background: 1999 in Review.
Nelson Mandela, first black president of South Africa, steps down (June 16), and Thabo Mbeki takes over.
War erupts in Kosovo after Yugoslavia's president Slobodan Milosevic clamps down on the province, massacring and deporting ethnic Albanians. NATO begins Operation Allied Force on March 24, 1999, launching air strikes against Belgrade for 78 consecutive days until Milosevic relents. Background: Timeline: The Splintering of Kosovo and Timeline: NATO in Kosovo.
Magnitude 7.4 earthquake kills more than 15,600 and leaves 600,000 homeless in Turkey (Aug. 17).
East Timor population votes for independence from Indonesia (Aug. 30, 1999), which causes pro-Indonesian forces to massacre and uproot thousands of East Timorese.
Pakistani government is overthrown in the midst of economic strife and intensified fighting with India over Kashmir (Oct. 12). Background: 1999 in Review.
The world awaits the consequences of the Y2K bug, with more drastic millennial theorists warning of Armageddon.
Lads, any recommendations for a good, supporter-friendly pub in Armagh city to watch the Galway-Mayo match in afterwards?
you'd be welcome anywhere - Red Neds is as good as you'll find - short walk from the field.
Quote from: ardchieftain on June 12, 2015, 03:58:52 PM
Is anyone else getting a feeling of deja vu? !999.................................
Yeah, I wouldn't be shocked if this ended in a draw either. ;)
Quote from: The Iceman on June 12, 2015, 05:50:25 PM
you'd be welcome anywhere - Red Neds is as good as you'll find - short walk from the field.
Sounds perfect a chara, I'll head in there afterwards!
Always liked Armagh ones, we got a great many of you in Rann na Feirste over the years, including a couple of lads that I hope have an awful day Sunday, and a fine remainder of the summer. :D
Quote from: redhandefender on June 12, 2015, 03:36:17 PM
Morgan was very poor against Omagh last year and got taking off very early if I remember correctly.
Can't see past Donegal, people talking on here of their demise are badly mistaken. they started off slow last year to. For the few weaknesses they showed against tyrone we still couldn't break them down in second half.
I think they will win by 3 or 4, Vernon wont be fit for murphy
Ah Shane dry them, Charlie will give him all he wants.
I suppose I will support Armagh due to the lough shore connection, lough shore barbarians have to stick together. greetings from Derry
Quote from: The Iceman on June 12, 2015, 05:50:25 PM
you'd be welcome anywhere - Red Neds is as good as you'll find - short walk from the field.
Not quite anywhere! The Ogs club beside the pitch will be buzzing. Walking back to the town you could try the Toby Jug and then Red Neds (oneils). If you cannot get in there walk to the far end of the town and try Devlin's or McKennas. Do not venture into pubs in Scotch Street or Barrack Street.
Donegal Team
(http://donegalgaa.ie/wp-content/uploads/2015/06/donegal-team-v-Armagh-e1434143658306.jpg)
Ó Duarcáin instead of Ó Durkan.
No real shocks with the line up.
Armagh finally get around to naming their team
http://www.armaghgaa.net/wp-content/uploads/2015/06/Official-Match-Day-Senior-Team-Sheet-D%C3%BAn-na-nGall.png
Who was the last Annaghmore man to start a championship game for Armagh? Sammy Mc Neice
Can't see Armagh getting within 5 points in this one. Man for man there's a clear gap in ability, so Armagh's chances would come down to being a better collective... except they're playing the collective.
Quote from: thewobbler on June 13, 2015, 09:40:45 PM
Can't see Armagh getting within 5 points in this one. Man for man there's a clear gap in ability, so Armagh's chances would come down to being a better collective... except they're playing the collective.
Clear gap in ability? I really don't know where that is coming from. We'll see tomorrow.
I seriously doubt the team named earlier will start either.
One spare terrace ticket for tomoro. I'm Belfast based. Pm if interested
The winners today will fancy their chances of winning Ulster big time. It's hard to call, especially with Armagh's home advantage.
Donegal's discipline will be severely tested today. If it gets heated, I'd expect Armagh to win; dull it'll be Donegal.
Not sure why but seems to be a lot of people underestimating Donegal or don't think they're as good as last year. They really are machine like and are very comfortable playing their system with everyone knowing their role to a tee. The goal Tyrone scored against them was a very rare lapse in concentration which they will be hell bent in not repeating.
McBrearty has really bulked up and now has a lot of strength to add to his already fine range of skills and pace.
Murphy will probably play further out the pitch and won't be as quiet as he was the last day.
I expect Armagh to play very defensive today but they're not as experienced at this system as Donegal are.
I think Donegal by 5 or 6 but I wouldn't like to meet either team in the qualifiers.
Discipline crucial for Armagh today cos if they go a man down its game over.
(http://www.irishtimes.com/polopoly_fs/1.2247903.1434136361!/image/image.jpg_gen/derivatives/box_620_330/image.jpg)
Quote from: Fuzzman on June 14, 2015, 10:14:30 AM
Not sure why but seems to be a lot of people underestimating Donegal or don't think they're as good as last year. They really are machine like and are very comfortable playing their system with everyone knowing their role to a tee. The goal Tyrone scored against them was a very rare lapse in concentration which they will be hell bent in not repeating.
McBrearty has really bulked up and now has a lot of strength to add to his already fine range of skills and pace.
Murphy will probably play further out the pitch and won't be as quiet as he was the last day.
I expect Armagh to play very defensive today but they're not as experienced at this system as Donegal are.
I think Donegal by 5 or 6 but I wouldn't like to meet either team in the qualifiers.
I too get the feeling that people are over-estimating Armagh, based on historical reasons.
Today sees three of the big names Donegal, Kerry and Mayo going up against three "improving" teams Armagh, Tipperary and Galway.
Tipperary and Galway both have a more impressive recent history with U21 and underage. In terms of last year's championship all 3 of the sides did decently in the qualifiers.
A lot of people seem to be thinking back to last year's Armagh v Donegal game but Donegal won that despite it being Armagh's best performance of the year and possibly Donegal's worst of the year (the other being the final) If it wasn't Donegal's worst performance, it was definitely a long long way off their usual standard.
Fairly obvious Armagh are letting Mallon have the ball. Terrible kicker.
Donegal rampant, Armagh are shocking
Update....Armagh County Board have planned a minutes silence at half time for the team!
This one is pretty much over already..
The Division 1 Division 3 divide seems very apparent at this stage!
Looking ominous for us in the next round as well!!
That's some place kicking exhibition. Armagh are lost against this, don't know how to attack on the rare trip inside the donegal 45 and don't know how to defend against the patience of the over laden midfield.
Armagh very poor
This is like the sanitised version of Galway Hurlers v Dublin last week.
Hardly seen a hard hit in this game yet, thought Armagh were going to come with a physical approach, they do have the edge in midfield though are surrounded pretty quicker when they come to ground
Plus you not going to swap the man on McBearty!!
Quote from: screenexile on June 14, 2015, 02:28:28 PM
The Division 1 Division 3 divide seems very apparent at this stage!
Looking ominous for us in the next round as well!!
That doesn't really explain what's hapeening. Last August these teams were pretty much equal.
Donegal looking very impressive and look like serious AI contenders, Armagh made to look very poor.
It'll be a major shock if they don't win Ulster based on this.
Some free by Murphy there :o
Those frees are the only reason to keep watching this game. Each one better than the last.
Quote from: Syferus on June 14, 2015, 02:38:37 PM
Quote from: screenexile on June 14, 2015, 02:28:28 PM
The Division 1 Division 3 divide seems very apparent at this stage!
Looking ominous for us in the next round as well!!
That doesn't really explain what's hapeening. Last August these teams were pretty much equal.
What a difference a year makes!!
Murphy with the frees off the ground is deadly regardless of distance, outside Shine for Roscommon Murphy must be a close second
Key Stat
Donegal Frees Conceded 7
Armagh Frees Conceded 11
However I also was keeping track of scoreable versus non-scoreable.
Scoreable is a bit of a tricky one but basically if I felt there was a chance of a score I put it in that category. Obviously Donegal have Murphy as a threat from distance so that pushes out the scoreable distance.
However the key point is that Donegal conceded no scoreable free in that half, despite the fact that Armagh consistently attempted to run at their defence.
Donegal Scoreable Frees Conceded 0
Armagh Scoreable Frees Conceded 5
Of the 5 Armagh Scoreable Frees Donegal have conceded 4.
When are Armagh going to start fighting? If they don't hurry up it will be too late
Wonder where this fits in to Kieran McGeeney's five-year plan?
Quote from: twohands!!! on June 14, 2015, 02:49:36 PM
Wonder where this fits in to Kieran McGeeney's five-year plan?
Clearly they need more muscle
Quote from: Itchy on June 14, 2015, 02:44:55 PM
When are Armagh going to start fighting? If they don't hurry up it will be too late
Maybe get it abandoned!!
What does McGeeney tell them at half time?
Quote from: Fuzzman on June 14, 2015, 02:53:09 PM
What does McGeeney tell them at half time?
Maybe apologise for being clueless ??
Armagh are a bad outfit. I felt that donegal might do this to them.. mc geeney must be sick. Give it a rattle ffs. Bad day for the orange men. ...
I can't recall as spineless an Armagh performance since Tyrone hammered them by 24 points! Already an embarrassment for McGeeney and it's only half time!
I thought the Ulster Championship didn't have turkey shoots?
More mythology
Some amount of steps from Clarke before the shot off the post.
Seen enough, time to cut the grass! we going to get some trimming in the semi final
1st scoreable free conceded by Donegal in the 47th minute.
This is as bad as Armagh of the 80s and 90s. This is really heartbreaking..
Two hands, I am a fan of stats in their place, but if you think the difference in this game has anything to do with frees conceded or that it's even relevant as a key stat I'm afraid you have the wrong end of the stick completely.
I thought mcgeeney would have instilled discipline. Armagh's tackling very poor on that front.
Good to see Mark McHugh back.
I have never witnessed as poor execution of tackling as this. Constantly diving in and then when the player is past they just slap wildly at Donegal players no wonder they've conceded so many frees!!
Quote from: INDIANA on June 14, 2015, 02:56:30 PM
I thought the Ulster Championship didn't have turkey shoots?
More mythology
Zzzzzzzzzz
Murphy's free taking a real joy.
That side to side hand passing is a load of shite. Donegal f**king about nearly results in Armagh goal
Quote from: heganboy on June 14, 2015, 03:13:08 PM
Two hands, I am a fan of stats in their place, but if you think the difference in this game has anything to do with frees conceded or that it's even relevant as a key stat I'm afraid you have the wrong end of the stick completely.
A key fact of the game is how good the Donegal defence has been in the tackle, especially when you consider how much Armagh have run at their defence.
It's obviously not the only factor ; Donegal had to do the business at the other end but it really shows how well the Donegal team have defended - Armagh have only scored 0-7 after 60 minutes
At the moment the free count is Armagh conceded 22 Donegal 10
Donegal have reaped 5 points from frees while Armagh have only reaped 2, so it's obviously not had a massive impact on the scoreboard but if Donegal had only scored 2 points from frees while Armagh had scored 5 it would currently be a 2 point game....
Only 2 scores for Donegal so far in 2nd half
Quote from: Pub Bore on June 14, 2015, 03:27:51 PM
Only 2 scores for Donegal so far in 2nd half
Yeah but they have won the Piggy in the middle contest!
Quote from: From the Bunker on June 14, 2015, 03:28:59 PM
Quote from: Pub Bore on June 14, 2015, 03:27:51 PM
Only 2 scores for Donegal so far in 2nd half
Yeah but they have won the Piggy in the middle contest!
Donegal didn't have to score. For a while there it was a bit like the Cross / Dromintee C'ship match from last year.
There should be no objection to the elimination of the Ulster Championship and the provincial series in general after the last two weeks rubbish
Another cut and paste post Indi?
Are you excited about meeting Donegal this year again?
As a Kildare man who is still hearing half our county talk of Geezer in reverential tones that Armagh performance was very familiar.
There is no in-game tactical changes. I mean sitting back and playing a mass defense when you need the ball. Donegal were well entitled to keep the ball.
On a positive note Murphy is a joy to watch.
Shocking, shocking stuff from Armagh there. I thought we barely got out of second gear at times, but then we didn't have to. We really could have won that by 20 points if we'd wanted just by committing a few more players forward, especially in the first half when McBrearty was winning everything, but ending up very isolated and in need of a someone running through in space to lay it off too. Monstrous game from Michael Murphy, repeatedly powering through several Armagh men in the middle of the field, dictating the play and hitting some quality frees. McBrearty looked very impressive too, as did MacNiallais and Ryan McHugh. The McGees were barely mentioned all game, which was telling about how things were going!
Nice to get a good win in Armagh, but we were barely tested.
Ourselves and Armagh to play in the 'worst performance of Championship 2015' final
Quote from: Fuzzman on June 14, 2015, 03:44:03 PM
Another cut and paste post Indi?
Are you excited about meeting Donegal this year again?
Are you excited about your annual run through the qualifiers?
Just in from the game, that was atrocious. No discernible game plan from Armagh, no passion from the majority of the team as well. Thought Coldrick was terrible.
Genuine question to Armagh people?
Apart from hype, over training and a massive expenses bill, What exactly does Kieran McGeeney bring to a county?
Don't know is the answer.Dire performance altogether,no plan,no leadership,playing one forward against at least three Donegal defenders,passing sloppy etc.Big gamble playing Campbell who has been absent all year,and Donegal were never going to repeat the mistake of conceding territory like they did in AI Quarter Final last year.
Magnificent day in Armagh--a beautiful blue sky, the cathedral serene in the background, a full house at the Athletic Grounds. But then the whistle blew and the game started . . .
The McBrearty goal was devastating, and after that a catastrophe, the essence of which was Geezer being thoroughly out coached. He seemed to have no idea how he was going to thwart the familiar Donegal defense, a visionless plan that had our lads running into tackles and then resorting to wild no-hope hay-making kicks. And then to see our team parked in our half of the field watching the Donegal lads going through a glorified hand-passing practice session was immensely frustrating.
I don't think our guys gave up; instead, they just didn't seem to have a clue what to do, and blame must be placed squarely on management.
As others have mentioned, Murphy's free-taking was sublime.
Quote from: Harold Disgracey on June 14, 2015, 04:23:31 PM
Just in from the game, that was atrocious. No discernible game plan from Armagh, no passion from the majority of the team as well. Thought Coldrick was terrible.
I thought Coldrick was all right. One or two questionable frees and an inexplicable lack of a card for an Armagh midfielder, but nothing that made any difference and overall a decent performance, at least from tv viewing. Armagh people should have the ref well down their list of things to be upset about after that game.
Quote from: INDIANA on June 14, 2015, 04:22:36 PM
Are you excited about your annual run through the qualifiers?
Yes.
Quote from: twohands!!! on June 14, 2015, 03:26:28 PM
Quote from: heganboy on June 14, 2015, 03:13:08 PM
Two hands, I am a fan of stats in their place, but if you think the difference in this game has anything to do with frees conceded or that it's even relevant as a key stat I'm afraid you have the wrong end of the stick completely.
A key fact of the game is how good the Donegal defence has been in the tackle, especially when you consider how much Armagh have run at their defence.
Again I'm going to have to disagree with you. The tackles (both legal and illegal) were symptom rather than cause.
The channels through which Armagh tried to attack and the lack of support to the man leading the channel resulted in Armagh running into tackles with no release path. That left them hanging on to the ball and passing, very often aimlessly, to Donegal directly or into no man's land where Donegal were more often not first to the ball.
The reverse was also true, Donegal had a very patient build up and you could often see 7 men lined across the 65, the forwards runs ahead were made to count (both to create space for the attack from the massed ranks or often directly to create the score) and the channels were co-ordinated, that left the Armagh defenders in a position where they had to foul to prevent the ball release to a 3 on 1, or the momentum of the attacker would have carried the attacker past the static defender and again the foul was often conceded.
He was poor and had the game been any way close there would be a hell of a lot of comment on his performance. Armagh were totally clueless, at times it looked as if they were afraid to put in a tackle for fear of giving away a free.
As others have pointed out Murphy's free kicks were superb, although he took forever to take them.
This may have been asked before, but what is McGeeney's main managerial achievement in provincial championship football ? While he has had a few decent results in the qualifiers with Kildare and Armagh over the years, significant wins at provincial level
have been rare for his teams. His Kildare side beat a fairly limited Meath in the 2010 AI quarter final, so does that go down as the best day of his coaching career ?
Relax,we play Wicklow in qualifiers and then maybe Leitrim in Rd2,we could go all the way to Rd 3 like we did in 2013!
Quote from: ck on June 14, 2015, 04:52:24 PM
Genuine question to Armagh people?
Apart from hype, over training and a massive expenses bill, What exactly does Kieran McGeeney bring to a county?
Virtual bankruptcy in the case of Kildare
Quote from: heganboy on June 14, 2015, 05:09:56 PM
Quote from: twohands!!! on June 14, 2015, 03:26:28 PM
Quote from: heganboy on June 14, 2015, 03:13:08 PM
Two hands, I am a fan of stats in their place, but if you think the difference in this game has anything to do with frees conceded or that it's even relevant as a key stat I'm afraid you have the wrong end of the stick completely.
A key fact of the game is how good the Donegal defence has been in the tackle, especially when you consider how much Armagh have run at their defence.
Again I'm going to have to disagree with you. The tackles (both legal and illegal) were symptom rather than cause.
The channels through which Armagh tried to attack and the lack of support to the man leading the channel resulted in Armagh running into tackles with no release path. That left them hanging on to the ball and passing, very often aimlessly, to Donegal directly or into no man's land where Donegal were more often not first to the ball.
The reverse was also true, Donegal had a very patient build up and you could often see 7 men lined across the 65, the forwards runs ahead were made to count (both to create space for the attack from the massed ranks or often directly to create the score) and the channels were co-ordinated, that left the Armagh defenders in a position where they had to foul to prevent the ball release to a 3 on 1, or the momentum of the attacker would have carried the attacker past the static defender and again the foul was often conceded.
Donegal didn't have to do anything attacking wise today.
All they did was draw the Armagh blanket out and Armagh bought it. Long ball into isolated one on one situations.
That's it summed up in one sentence.
Quote from: Mourne Rover on June 14, 2015, 05:14:16 PM
This may have been asked before, but what is McGeeney's main managerial achievement in provincial championship football ? While he has had a few decent results in the qualifiers with Kildare and Armagh over the years, significant wins at provincial level
have been rare for his teams. His Kildare side beat a fairly limited Meath in the 2010 AI quarter final, so does that go down as the best day of his coaching career ?
Won the O Byrne Cup.
Far better at Brazilian ju jitsu then management.
Quote from: INDIANA on June 14, 2015, 05:19:17 PM
Quote from: heganboy on June 14, 2015, 05:09:56 PM
Quote from: twohands!!! on June 14, 2015, 03:26:28 PM
Quote from: heganboy on June 14, 2015, 03:13:08 PM
Two hands, I am a fan of stats in their place, but if you think the difference in this game has anything to do with frees conceded or that it's even relevant as a key stat I'm afraid you have the wrong end of the stick completely.
A key fact of the game is how good the Donegal defence has been in the tackle, especially when you consider how much Armagh have run at their defence.
Again I'm going to have to disagree with you. The tackles (both legal and illegal) were symptom rather than cause.
The channels through which Armagh tried to attack and the lack of support to the man leading the channel resulted in Armagh running into tackles with no release path. That left them hanging on to the ball and passing, very often aimlessly, to Donegal directly or into no man's land where Donegal were more often not first to the ball.
The reverse was also true, Donegal had a very patient build up and you could often see 7 men lined across the 65, the forwards runs ahead were made to count (both to create space for the attack from the massed ranks or often directly to create the score) and the channels were co-ordinated, that left the Armagh defenders in a position where they had to foul to prevent the ball release to a 3 on 1, or the momentum of the attacker would have carried the attacker past the static defender and again the foul was often conceded.
Donegal didn't have to do anything attacking wise today.
All they did was draw the Armagh blanket out and Armagh bought it. Long ball into isolated one on one situations.
That's it summed up in one sentence.
That's three sentences.
Quote from: INDIANA on June 14, 2015, 05:20:58 PM
Quote from: Mourne Rover on June 14, 2015, 05:14:16 PM
This may have been asked before, but what is McGeeney's main managerial achievement in provincial championship football ? While he has had a few decent results in the qualifiers with Kildare and Armagh over the years, significant wins at provincial level
have been rare for his teams. His Kildare side beat a fairly limited Meath in the 2010 AI quarter final, so does that go down as the best day of his coaching career ?
Won the O Byrne Cup.
Far better at Brazilian ju jitsu then management.
Won a Division 2 League Title. His inability to make changes cost us the 2009 Leinster final. Needs a Mickey Whelan type figure with him, he's tactically sterile.
Quote from: Dinny Breen on June 14, 2015, 05:21:33 PM
Quote from: INDIANA on June 14, 2015, 05:19:17 PM
Quote from: heganboy on June 14, 2015, 05:09:56 PM
Quote from: twohands!!! on June 14, 2015, 03:26:28 PM
Quote from: heganboy on June 14, 2015, 03:13:08 PM
Two hands, I am a fan of stats in their place, but if you think the difference in this game has anything to do with frees conceded or that it's even relevant as a key stat I'm afraid you have the wrong end of the stick completely.
A key fact of the game is how good the Donegal defence has been in the tackle, especially when you consider how much Armagh have run at their defence.
Again I'm going to have to disagree with you. The tackles (both legal and illegal) were symptom rather than cause.
The channels through which Armagh tried to attack and the lack of support to the man leading the channel resulted in Armagh running into tackles with no release path. That left them hanging on to the ball and passing, very often aimlessly, to Donegal directly or into no man's land where Donegal were more often not first to the ball.
The reverse was also true, Donegal had a very patient build up and you could often see 7 men lined across the 65, the forwards runs ahead were made to count (both to create space for the attack from the massed ranks or often directly to create the score) and the channels were co-ordinated, that left the Armagh defenders in a position where they had to foul to prevent the ball release to a 3 on 1, or the momentum of the attacker would have carried the attacker past the static defender and again the foul was often conceded.
Donegal didn't have to do anything attacking wise today.
All they did was draw the Armagh blanket out and Armagh bought it. Long ball into isolated one on one situations.
That's it summed up in one sentence.
That's three sentences.
Jaysus one championship win and Kildare lads are getting brave
McGeeney knows that you need money to compete at the top level. He got a limited team like Kildare quite far with it and he's only starting with Armagh so he has to be given a chance. It'll be a costly experience though.
Abysmal performance from Armagh and the scoreline probably flattered us as Donegal simply played out the game in a very frustrating series of keep ball exercises in the second half. They could even afford to rest McBrearty and Murphy towards the end. Mc Brearty in the first 15 minutes basically won Donegal the game, caused Morgan all sorts of trouble and Armagh looked clueless in trying to chase down the game after a poor start. Turned the ball over far too often. Donegals free concession rate is no fluke and they are a well drilled outfit who are greater than the sum of their parts. No progression from Armagh, too much emphasis on over thinking about the game and over analysing the opposition rather than trying to produce good decision makers on the field.
It's hard to imagine Armagh being worse than in the 80's but Ciaran McKeever seems to have captained them down to that level. There will be songs in his honour sung in Tyrone and Down! 😆
Quote from: StGallsGAA on June 14, 2015, 05:40:22 PM
It's hard to imagine Armagh being worse than in the 80's but Ciaran McKeever seems to have captained them down to that level. There will be songs in his honour sung in Tyrone and Down! 😆
Wtf? McKeever was one of the few that performed well today. Sounds like you have a wee bit too much hate.
McKeever usually does play well but he's undoubtedly a poor captain. More likely to start a schmozzle than step in to prevent one.
We caught them cold
2 points scored in the 1st half
Armagh like Tyrone need a kind draw in Ulster to get some traction first. They dont need to be meeting us or Monaghan in their first game.
Am convinced we will met one or both teams again in the comming months & both will be different types of games than that.
Armagh never got going at all
Lacey is so important to the way we play & there is that slow metamorphosis happening & hopefully ending in us defending higher up the pitch.
We are becomming a much easier team to watch under Rory. For me he's stepping out of Jim's shadow slowky but surley.
Although I don't think that Armagh performed anywhere near their best today - I believe that this is probably a fair representation of where we are at at the moment; a young and inexperienced team who have a lot of learning to do before they can really compete with the top 5 teams. We will hopefully take a lot from this and get a few more games in the back door. C.Raff, McKeever and A.Mallon the only three who performed today imo. Very disappointing.
Quote from: Whitnail on June 14, 2015, 06:10:24 PM
We caught them cold
2 points scored in the 1st half
Armagh like Tyrone need a kind draw in Ulster to get some traction first. They dont need to be meeting us or Monaghan in their first game.
Am convinced we will met one or both teams again in the comming months & both will be different types of games than that.
Armagh never got going at all
Lacey is so important to the way we play & there is that slow metamorphosis happening & hopefully ending in us defending higher up the pitch.
We are becomming a much easier team to watch under Rory. For me he's stepping out of Jim's shadow slowky but surley.
Youse definitely kick the long ball in much more often than under McGunness and it was that tactic that won Donegal the game in the first 10 minutes with McBrearty wreaking havoc. Then once youse got the lead Donegal reverted to type by playing keep ball which was very hard to watch.
I commented on other forums of the absolute fallacy that Armagh are a hard physical team. Last year Cavan played the media well after they had charged into Armagh at the parade. The other incidents against Tyrone and Donegal were nothing. There were far more worse incidents in the Galway v Mayo game today. I have been told that Spillane said Armagh spent too much time in the gym. If he had been sitting were I was he could see how physically superior Donegal were man for man. Armagh were too nice today. The higher free count is as much to do with Donegal knowing how to commit the half foul - doing enough to slow the player without doing enough for the referee to give a free - and Armagh's lazy or over eager tackling. Donegal also know how to win frees for Murphy to convert.
For Armagh to win today they needed everything to go their way. The opposite happened.
You can talk all you like about tactics too but the match was over after 10 minutes. If Armagh had tried to play more open after that they could have been beat by 20. It will take more than 1 match to judge the management.
Quote from: yellowcard on June 14, 2015, 06:18:36 PM
Quote from: Whitnail on June 14, 2015, 06:10:24 PM
We caught them cold
2 points scored in the 1st half
Armagh like Tyrone need a kind draw in Ulster to get some traction first. They dont need to be meeting us or Monaghan in their first game.
Am convinced we will met one or both teams again in the comming months & both will be different types of games than that.
Armagh never got going at all
Lacey is so important to the way we play & there is that slow metamorphosis happening & hopefully ending in us defending higher up the pitch.
We are becomming a much easier team to watch under Rory. For me he's stepping out of Jim's shadow slowky but surley.
Youse definitely kick the long ball in much more often than under McGunness and it was that tactic that won Donegal the game in the first 10 minutes with McBrearty wreaking havoc. Then once youse got the lead Donegal reverted to type by playing keep ball which was very hard to watch.
Can't dissagree with that and we will be caught out eventually if we jeep that up but in fairness Armagh should have abandoned the blanket for the last ten minutes and harrased our back line &stopped us doing it.
Kerry did that to us in last year's all Ireland final so I know how demoralizing it is
Long may Armagh remain in the wilderness where they belong. ^_^
Quote from: J70 on June 14, 2015, 05:00:02 PM
Quote from: Harold Disgracey on June 14, 2015, 04:23:31 PM
Just in from the game, that was atrocious. No discernible game plan from Armagh, no passion from the majority of the team as well. Thought Coldrick was terrible.
I thought Coldrick was all right. One or two questionable frees and an inexplicable lack of a card for an Armagh midfielder, but nothing that made any difference and overall a decent performance, at least from tv viewing. Armagh people should have the ref well down their list of things to be upset about after that game.
Best team won but coldrick was awful
Donegal played him well got some easy frees yet we seemed to work so hard for our frees
Bad day but Armagh are young we are building so not too despondent
Quote from: naka on June 14, 2015, 07:02:49 PM
Quote from: J70 on June 14, 2015, 05:00:02 PM
Quote from: Harold Disgracey on June 14, 2015, 04:23:31 PM
Just in from the game, that was atrocious. No discernible game plan from Armagh, no passion from the majority of the team as well. Thought Coldrick was terrible.
I thought Coldrick was all right. One or two questionable frees and an inexplicable lack of a card for an Armagh midfielder, but nothing that made any difference and overall a decent performance, at least from tv viewing. Armagh people should have the ref well down their list of things to be upset about after that game.
Best team won but coldrick was awful
Donegal played him well got some easy frees yet we seemed to work so hard for our frees
Bad day but Armagh are young we are building so not too despondent
Would have to agree - if Geezer can manage to get this group to stick together they will come good. Still building..
Quote from: SouthDublinBro on June 14, 2015, 06:58:36 PM
Long may Armagh remain in the wilderness where they belong. ^_^
Those 3 defeats in 2002/03 must still be hurting.
Quote from: SouthDublinBro on June 14, 2015, 06:58:36 PM
Long may Armagh remain in the wilderness where they belong. ^_^
Never knew the Dubs seen us as rivals but there you go. I'd take that as a compliment.
Quote from: naka on June 14, 2015, 07:02:49 PM
Quote from: J70 on June 14, 2015, 05:00:02 PM
Quote from: Harold Disgracey on June 14, 2015, 04:23:31 PM
Just in from the game, that was atrocious. No discernible game plan from Armagh, no passion from the majority of the team as well. Thought Coldrick was terrible.
I thought Coldrick was all right. One or two questionable frees and an inexplicable lack of a card for an Armagh midfielder, but nothing that made any difference and overall a decent performance, at least from tv viewing. Armagh people should have the ref well down their list of things to be upset about after that game.
Sounds like a Fianna Fail election manifesto. You're going nowhere under Geezer.
Best team won but coldrick was awful
Donegal played him well got some easy frees yet we seemed to work so hard for our frees
Bad day but Armagh are young we are building so not too despondent
Did Kerry not show the way to beat Donegal in last years AIF. Similarly, could Armagh not have copied Tyrone tactics in the previous round. Very surprised at Armagh. Very poor
Quote from: INDIANA on June 14, 2015, 08:13:40 PM
Quote from: naka on June 14, 2015, 07:02:49 PM
Quote from: J70 on June 14, 2015, 05:00:02 PM
Quote from: Harold Disgracey on June 14, 2015, 04:23:31 PM
Just in from the game, that was atrocious. No discernible game plan from Armagh, no passion from the majority of the team as well. Thought Coldrick was terrible.
I thought Coldrick was all right. One or two questionable frees and an inexplicable lack of a card for an Armagh midfielder, but nothing that made any difference and overall a decent performance, at least from tv viewing. Armagh people should have the ref well down their list of things to be upset about after that game.
Sounds like a Fianna Fail election manifesto. You're going nowhere under Geezer.
Best team won but coldrick was awful
Donegal played him well got some easy frees yet we seemed to work so hard for our frees
Bad day but Armagh are young we are building so not too despondent
Indiana
We will keep mc geeney
He will be ok for us
I think the Armagh posters need to ask a few more questions here. Forget about the nine point margin- I don't think I've ever seen a more one sided Ulster Championship game.Look at the slating Paddy O'Rourke and Paul Grimley got in recent years. Mc Geeney was a great footballer who led by example but I'm not sure if he's a great manager. If it's true that he has raised a six figure sum for the team, and I had contributed, then I would be asking for my money back. I think Armagh have got a better squad than Down at present but there is no way a Jim McCorry team would have been embarrassed the way Armagh were today. However, they could not have got a handier draw than Wicklow ( who finished joint bottom of Division 4 with London- yet Martin Carney said today that Armagh would not get it easy against them!! Either he hasn't a clue or Armagh really are bad). Maybe Geezer should ask Grimley or POR for some tactical advice.
I am devastated, completely and utterly gutted after that performance, for those Armagh fans crying about the referee please stop, he was not that bad, I did think Donegal got the odd call but nothing was going to change that result today, that game was men against boys from the get go and I am shocked at how far we have fallen since the AIQF of last year, I know Division 3 ball is not the best and they already had a tough game against Tyrone but for the love of all that is holy you cannot go out against a team of this calibre and shit yourself, and sadly, that is exactly what we did, the second they went longball into the lone full forward for the first time we should have known they had changed things up.
Screaming at the TV does you no good but my week is fucked and I hope to God Geezer shows up in the qualifier because if this is the best he can do tactically he needs to go!
Dunn Droicht,you've never seen a more one sided Ulster Champiinship game? You weren't at the 1999 Ulster Final then? The early goal knocked the stuffing out if Armagh and dampened the crowd.It was reminiscent of Celtic V Juventus,with all the hype but it just evaporated on the pitch and then stands with an early goal from Juventus.
Such are the vagaries of sport,had they not conceded the goal they may have settled into the game and put up a much better performance.
Quote from: An Watcher on June 14, 2015, 08:37:34 PM
Did Kerry not show the way to beat Donegal in last years AIF. Similarly, could Armagh not have copied Tyrone tactics in the previous round. Very surprised at Armagh. Very poor
How? By latching on to the goalkeepers mistake? That was the only diff between Kerry and Donegal last sept.
There have been beatings like this handed out since the dawn of the Ulster Championship. But I guess what a few people are getting at is that a team that has been so lavishly funded has never been beaten like this before.
To be honest, us Ulster folk might as well get used to it. Donegal have the best individual players in Ulster by a distance, they're almost perfectly balanced between defence, midfield and attack, and most importantly they all know their roles down to a tee and are 100% committed to playing as a structured team. And even without bringing in new blood, they'll be a force for the next 2-3 seasons.
You have to remember that Dublin have been swatting off teams on a par with Armagh, Down and Derry by 15-20 points for the past 3 years, yet Donegal are a match for them. They're that good.
For the other 8 counties in uUlster, our best hope of an SFC going anywhere else is that Michael Murphy picks up a knock (nothing major, but enough to keep him out of a game or two), and torrential weather conditions.
Keep it in perspective.Armagh hammered Donegal in 2010 yet Donegal were AI Champions two years later.Similarly Mayo hammered Dinegal in 2013. If The early goal had been avoided or indeed if Campbell had not missed an open goal at the start of the second half the result would have been much closer.Do not judge a team on one game.
Tony has been at the Buckie a bit too hard if he's putting that thrashing down to an early goal. Armagh simply don't have the players and half of those on the pitch didn't haven't the bottle.
Quote from: INDIANA on June 14, 2015, 02:56:30 PM
I thought the Ulster Championship didn't have turkey shoots?
More mythology
Why do you do it to yourself? I don't like Big Brother. I wouldn't continuously watch it and then come on here lamenting about it. Do your wellbeing a favour and stay clear of watching the Ulster Championship
You underestimate what the loss of an early goal can do in an overhyped fixture,particularly from the underdogs perspective.It was exactly the same when Celtic met Juventus,coming off the back of defeating Barcelona a few years ago.Hyped up to the nineties but a soft early goal deflated the whole team and fans,a blow from which they never recovered in the tie.
Sorry snoopdog I'll rephrase that, did Kerry last year and Tyrone this year not show how to be competitive against Donegal
We not playing soccer Tony, why use the comparison
Heard Murphy interviewed after Tyrone and Armagh and he starts with "hi come here", is this a Donegal thing?
No matter about blanket defences 25 scoring chances each and one team wins by 9 points. Donegal forward systems are nearly as good as their defensive.
Quote from: Minder on June 14, 2015, 10:49:58 PM
Heard Murphy interviewed after Tyrone and Armagh and he starts with "hi come here", is this a Donegal thing?
Nah say it in Tyrone as well in a similar context, usually to signify that the speaker is deadly serious and going to be very honest.
However the way he said it was very Donegal
A more common expression might be "c'mere till i tell ye" although that may indicate a rebuttal is coming, although not necessarily
Quote from: Minder on June 14, 2015, 10:49:58 PM
Heard Murphy interviewed after Tyrone and Armagh and he starts with "hi come here", is this a Donegal thing?
It comes out in us whenever there is a camera close.
"Like" & "ya know" are more examples.
Women go mad for it Minder, you should try it out!!!
Tony keeps lamenting the early goal, and claims the game could have worked out differently if it had been avoided. However, Donegal could have had two other early goals as Armagh's defensive system fell apart. Donegal scored largely at will in the first half and did not even concede a single free in their own half until well after the break. The second half was a training match and consisted of Armagh keeping 13 men behind the ball in a contest which they were usually around ten points behind. Armagh were probably unlucky not to get a consolation goal but that would simply have resulted in Donegal stepping up a gear. Armagh are probably at about the same level as or ahead of six or seven other Ulster counties but they never seriously competed with Donegal today.
Quote from: BluestackBoy on June 14, 2015, 11:31:07 PM
Quote from: Minder on June 14, 2015, 10:49:58 PM
Heard Murphy interviewed after Tyrone and Armagh and he starts with "hi come here", is this a Donegal thing?
It comes out in us whenever there is a camera close.
"Like" & "ya know" are more examples.
Women go mad for it Minder, you should try it out!!!
North Donegal for ewes (yeows)
An early goal in any game is a huge psychological boost to one team and a huge psychological blow to the other.Doesnt matter what code.This is particularly true in a game like yesterday,overhyped since the draw was made.
Of course Donegal are further advanced and experienced than Armagh,but they are not as far advanced as the score line and respective performances seemed to suggest yesterday.
Quote from: T Fearon on June 15, 2015, 05:11:44 AM
An early goal in any game is a huge psychological boost to one team and a huge psychological blow to the other.Doesnt matter what code.This is particularly true in a game like yesterday,overhyped since the draw was made.
Of course Donegal are further advanced and experienced than Armagh,but they are not as far advanced as the score line and respective performances seemed to suggest yesterday.
Cloud. Cuckoo. Land.
Quote from: T Fearon on June 15, 2015, 05:11:44 AM
An early goal in any game is a huge psychological boost to one team and a huge psychological blow to the other.Doesnt matter what code.This is particularly true in a game like yesterday,overhyped since the draw was made.
Of course Donegal are further advanced and experienced than Armagh,but they are not as far advanced as the score line and respective performances seemed to suggest yesterday.
Like the early goal Joe Kavanagh scored in the '93 All Ireland final
Like the early goal Noel Donnelly scored in the '97 Ulster semi final
Quote from: tyroneman on June 15, 2015, 06:56:30 AM
Quote from: T Fearon on June 15, 2015, 05:11:44 AM
An early goal in any game is a huge psychological boost to one team and a huge psychological blow to the other.Doesnt matter what code.This is particularly true in a game like yesterday,overhyped since the draw was made.
Of course Donegal are further advanced and experienced than Armagh,but they are not as far advanced as the score line and respective performances seemed to suggest yesterday.
Cloud. Cuckoo. Land.
I actually think he has a point
Look at last years ai where donegal never recovered from the shock of conceding an early goal
Or 2011 when they won it where mayo never recovered from the early 2 goals
Quote from: T Fearon on June 15, 2015, 05:11:44 AM
An early goal in any game is a huge psychological boost to one team and a huge psychological blow to the other.Doesnt matter what code.This is particularly true in a game like yesterday,overhyped since the draw was made.
Of course Donegal are further advanced and experienced than Armagh,but they are not as far advanced as the score line and respective performances seemed to suggest yesterday.
(https://mwcma.files.wordpress.com/2014/05/blindfold-critique-joshua-david-lynch.jpg)
Don't know where to even start...Donegal were good and Armagh were bad (how's that for analysis ;)). The early goal was crucial and the few pts scored after that to put Donegal 1-02 to 0-00 up was basically game over and you could see it in the body language of the players after that. McGeeney is getting it in the neck from everyone this morning but if i'm being totally honest I don't think there was much he could have done yesterday to salvage anything after the start Donegal got off to. Yes you can make a sub or two and change positions here and there but ultimately when the players are out on the pitch it's up to them really. You can all blabber today about this and that but there wasn't a person in the country would have predicted that result yesterday as everyone thought it was going to be a tight game (even the Donegal players were shocked at how easy they got it).
Nothing went right for Armagh yesterday and everything clicked for Donegal and sometimes that's the way it goes but I know one thing if we're luck enough to get thru the qualifers and meet Donegal again it will be a lot tighter than it was yesterday but you have to call a spade a spade and that Donegal are a top 3 team in the country who will still be playing football at the end of August (i'll be surprised if they're not).
Quote from: BluestackBoy on June 14, 2015, 11:31:07 PM
Quote from: Minder on June 14, 2015, 10:49:58 PM
Heard Murphy interviewed after Tyrone and Armagh and he starts with "hi come here", is this a Donegal thing?
It comes out in us whenever there is a camera close.
"Like" & "ya know" are more examples.
Women go mad for it Minder, you should try it out!!!
(http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/life/article30898795.ece/ALTERNATES/h342/2015-01-12_lif_6022790_I2.JPG)
Donegal play a kind of tsunami football when they attack. Very hard to defend with multiple players attacking in a line.
The two McHughs key operators in that team imo.
Very enjoyable game to watch tbh. Sunshine helped. Armagh imo had one of those days
watched the game again last night
Donegal are physically very strong on the ball and in the tackle as well as being extremely disciplined
had to laugh at spillane saying Armagh spent the winter in the gym cos they were physically over run
the Donegal system is actually very fluid with constant rotation in the forward line which given that it is ostentively 4 years old allows it to be honed to near perfection,
for me Armagh are at least 3 years away from this and I can see only experienced teams like the dubs Mayo, Kerry and monaghan giving these guys a testing time.
Donegal will be there or thereabouts
Quote from: naka on June 15, 2015, 09:35:39 AM
watched the game again last night
Donegal are physically very strong on the ball and in the tackle as well as being extremely disciplined
had to laugh at spillane saying Armagh spent the winter in the gym cos they were physically over run
the Donegal system is actually very fluid with constant rotation in the forward line which given that it is ostentively 4 years old allows it to be honed to near perfection,
for me Armagh are at least 3 years away from this and I can see only experienced teams like the dubs Mayo, Kerry and monaghan giving these guys a testing time.
Donegal will be there or thereabouts
I'd actually agree with him here for once, insofar as Armagh looked like a team who spent the winter in the gym doing bicep curls, bench-presses and nothing else.
Working on their 'Geezer Muscles' basically.
What exactly was Armagh's game plan?
At least Jamie Clarke showed some heart and tried to tackle and put pressure on Donegal's defence.
Donegal were a joy to watch yesterday...... actually so were Armagh.
Jinxy it shows how bad you lot are if a bunch of bicep curling bench pressing Geezer muscling guys beat you idots of the park, so how bad are you lot? the amount of muppets on here more content on Armagh loosing that their own team is unreal.
And there were some thinking Armagh would too big odds at 2/1!
Quote from: illdecide on June 15, 2015, 10:40:50 AM
Jinxy it shows how bad you lot are if a bunch of bicep curling bench pressing Geezer muscling guys beat you idots of the park, so how bad are you lot? the amount of muppets on here more content on Armagh loosing that their own team is unreal.
;D
Quote from: seanaglis on June 15, 2015, 07:23:05 AM
Quote from: tyroneman on June 15, 2015, 06:56:30 AM
Quote from: T Fearon on June 15, 2015, 05:11:44 AM
An early goal in any game is a huge psychological boost to one team and a huge psychological blow to the other.Doesnt matter what code.This is particularly true in a game like yesterday,overhyped since the draw was made.
Of course Donegal are further advanced and experienced than Armagh,but they are not as far advanced as the score line and respective performances seemed to suggest yesterday.
Cloud. Cuckoo. Land.
I actually think he has a point
Look at last years ai where donegal never recovered from the shock of conceding an early goal
Or 2011 when they won it where mayo never recovered from the early 2 goals
Donegal came back from 5 points down to lead in last year's final. The game was then a stalemate till Durcan ' s mistake, and even then Donegal closed a four point gap to a point again before Kerry tagged on a couple to kill it.
Geezer looked stronger than half that Armagh Team judging by the pressure on the tee shirt sleeves. I don't think Armagh are as bad as they showed yesterday, and Donegal whilst good were shown in a better light by an insipid performance from Armagh. Playing Division 3 is no preparation for a seasoned Donegal team. I felt too may of our lads were caught up in the occasion and the hype from within the county. It was a day when you'd have killed for Aaron Kernan to come on and lead the revival. Was Dyas injured? Why is Aaron Cunningham not in the squad he would have shown better than some of yesterdays performers? Armagh continued the stupidity displayed by Tyrone of taking the ball into the tackle and they persisted with it even though it wasn't working. I have to agree with Joe Brolly who commented that Geezer has a system into which he fits players a bit like Jimmy but Rory Gallagher tweaks his system to suit the players. Jamie Clarke was shackled, Donegal found a way to free up Murphy a wee lesson there maybe?
iv never heard booing from a crowd before at a match for actual style of play....a donegal man beside me said,,,"its hard oul stuff to watch, but sure if we keep winning im happy" and he is right in everything he said,,,,its crap to watch but if Armagh could do it as well as donegal id be happy too.
Much like our situation in rebuilding Tyrone, there is very little point saying Armagh are 3 years behind Donegal if there is little prospect of either the players or the tactics / system bridging that gap.
While Harte may have the experience to figure out a way to compete against them he simply doesn't have the players (most importantly the forwards) and while Armagh fans might feel they have the players I don't think they have the tactical nous on the sideline.
If you take Jamie Clarke and Sean Cavanagh out of the equation there are simply no marquee players on either the Armagh or Tyrone teams. There are plenty of decent players, plenty of hardworking players and some who may become very very good but not enough to match the reservoir of class that the top teams are drawing from.
Look at the players who didn't even start for Dublin or Kerry. Tyrone or Armagh would have them in a heartbeat.
Quote from: Applesisapples on June 15, 2015, 11:43:32 AM
Geezer looked stronger than half that Armagh Team judging by the pressure on the tee shirt sleeves. I don't think Armagh are as bad as they showed yesterday, and Donegal whilst good were shown in a better light by an insipid performance from Armagh. Playing Division 3 is no preparation for a seasoned Donegal team. I felt too may of our lads were caught up in the occasion and the hype from within the county. It was a day when you'd have killed for Aaron Kernan to come on and lead the revival. Was Dyas injured? Why is Aaron Cunningham not in the squad he would have shown better than some of yesterdays performers? Armagh continued the stupidity displayed by Tyrone of taking the ball into the tackle and they persisted with it even though it wasn't working. I have to agree with Joe Brolly who commented that Geezer has a system into which he fits players a bit like Jimmy but Rory Gallagher tweaks his system to suit the players. Jamie Clarke was shackled, Donegal found a way to free up Murphy a wee lesson there maybe?
Has he even played for Cross much in the last 12 months, strange statement.
I agree with your second bit about Geezer fitting the players into a system. Armagh footballers aren't traditionally suited to playing a running game, Donegals players are brought up on it. He hasn't figured out a way to get the best out of Jamie Clarke and was tactically outwitted by Gallagher yesterday. The players aren't as bad as they looked yesterday but they looked scared and you it looked like they had focussed far too much on the opposition instead of building a game plan to suit the players that we have.
Quote from: tyroneman on June 15, 2015, 11:55:51 AM
Much like our situation in rebuilding Tyrone, there is very little point saying Armagh are 3 years behind Donegal if there is little prospect of either the players or the tactics / system bridging that gap.
While Harte may have the experience to figure out a way to compete against them he simply doesn't have the players (most importantly the forwards) and while Armagh fans might feel they have the players I don't think they have the tactical nous on the sideline.
If you take Jamie Clarke and Sean Cavanagh out of the equation there are simply no marquee players on either the Armagh or Tyrone teams. There are plenty of decent players, plenty of hardworking players and some who may become very very good but not enough to match the reservoir of class that the top teams are drawing from.
Look at the players who didn't even start for Dublin or Kerry. Tyrone or Armagh would have them in a heartbeat.
There is a lot of truth in this, apart from Clarke the other Armagh players wouldn't be getting a call from the manager if they moved to Kerry or Dublin, or even Donegal. But Armagh have never really put Clarke to full use, players don't seem to support him when the hordes surround him and he is playing too far out the field. There was no Armagh player yesterday who enhanced their reputation by showing a marked improvement on previous year, and several who played less well than previously. Among Armagh's better players are McKeever and Mallon, who won't be there in 3 years time.
Quote from: yellowcard on June 15, 2015, 12:06:40 PM
Quote from: Applesisapples on June 15, 2015, 11:43:32 AM
Geezer looked stronger than half that Armagh Team judging by the pressure on the tee shirt sleeves. I don't think Armagh are as bad as they showed yesterday, and Donegal whilst good were shown in a better light by an insipid performance from Armagh. Playing Division 3 is no preparation for a seasoned Donegal team. I felt too may of our lads were caught up in the occasion and the hype from within the county. It was a day when you'd have killed for Aaron Kernan to come on and lead the revival. Was Dyas injured? Why is Aaron Cunningham not in the squad he would have shown better than some of yesterdays performers? Armagh continued the stupidity displayed by Tyrone of taking the ball into the tackle and they persisted with it even though it wasn't working. I have to agree with Joe Brolly who commented that Geezer has a system into which he fits players a bit like Jimmy but Rory Gallagher tweaks his system to suit the players. Jamie Clarke was shackled, Donegal found a way to free up Murphy a wee lesson there maybe?
Has he even played for Cross much in the last 12 months, strange statement.
I agree with your second bit about Geezer fitting the players into a system. Armagh footballers aren't traditionally suited to playing a running game, Donegals players are brought up on it. He hasn't figured out a way to get the best out of Jamie Clarke and was tactically outwitted by Gallagher yesterday. The players aren't as bad as they looked yesterday but they looked scared and you it looked like they had focussed far too much on the opposition instead of building a game plan to suit the players that we have.
I was asking the question. I like Cunningham as a player when playing for Cross.
You can have all the tactical nous in the world but if players can't fist pass 5 yards or kick a point from 30 then there is no hope of winning a match be it Donegal or Antrim.
Armagh lacked experience and leadership especially in the forwards. It was literally men against boys yesterday. Quite worrying how hesitant players were to have a shot for a point on the edge of the D and instead passing on responsibility. Support play was virtually non-existent. I don't put this down to poor standard of player but perhaps preparation. The first 10-15 mins Armagh froze. Riddled with mistakes and by the time they got the act together it was too late.
Hats off to Donegal. Ruthlessly strangled what little fight Armagh offered. Even ten points up they were falling with cramp/injuries. Murphy a joy to watch. If I was from the hills I'd have loved every minute of that.
The seeds for this Armagh loss were sown over a year ago. You can not compete with the Donegals of this world coming out of Div 3. We gave them a great match last year but we had serious momentum built up for that game. Our last serious game before yesterday was that AIQF. The basic mistakes that were made yesterday were not punished by the Wexfords and Limericks but Donegal punished us in fine style.
I would not be overly critical of any of the players or the management team at this point. We need to get back on the horse and try and build the same momentum through the qualifiers as we did last year. I still think we have the makings of a good team, remember Donegal steamrolled a much better team than us last year but we have to learn our lesson.
One poster referred to booing at Donegal's style of play which I didn't hear but they can be very frustrating to watch. If it's frustrating to watch it must be much worse to play against. That said in McBearty, Murphy, Lacey, McGlynn they have some superb footballers.
Why would Armagh supporters jeer Donegal when their own team was sat back with a packed defense when 10 points down? Especially to the extent that Donegal wasted 8 minutes flinging the ball about, with no pressure exerted, amongst themselves around their half - back line and midfield! :o ;D
Not saying either that it's not frustrating (Kerry did it to us for a couple of minutes late in last year's final), but you can't fault a team for playing keep ball when that far ahead.
I assume you're exaggerating j70? I was in Thurles so I didn't see this, but surely they didn't keep possession for 8 minutes?
Quote from: AZOffaly on June 15, 2015, 03:10:57 PM
I assume you're exaggerating j70? I was in Thurles so I didn't see this, but surely they didn't keep possession for 8 minutes?
That's what Brolly had timed it at - four different sessions of keep-ball.
Probably a little exaggerated, but it was lengthy.
An average of two minutes a pop just going over and back? Jaysus. And were Armagh 'chasing' the game at this point, or were they just resigned to defeat?
Quote from: J70 on June 15, 2015, 03:09:45 PM
Why would Armagh supporters jeer Donegal when their own team was sat back with a packed defense when 10 points down? Especially to the extent that Donegal wasted 8 minutes flinging the ball about, with no pressure exerted, amongst themselves around their half - back line and midfield! :o ;D
Not saying either that it's not frustrating (Kerry did it to us for a couple of minutes late in last year's final), but you can't fault a team for playing keep ball when that far ahead.
Agreed. I have no problem whatsoever with Donegal or any team playing keep ball when they're in the lead. They earned the right to do that. My problem was with Armagh sitting back watching them do it.
I'd hate to get Armagh in the qualifiers, Wounded pride and all that.
I suppose if we beat London, we'll get them :o
Quote from: AZOffaly on June 15, 2015, 03:14:58 PM
An average of two minutes a pop just going over and back? Jaysus. And were Armagh 'chasing' the game at this point, or were they just resigned to defeat?
I'm not sure even Armagh knew they were in such a mess.
To me it seemed like they were so concerned with getting back into their defensive position they lost sight of the overall picture i.e getting more scores than the opposition in order to win the game.
Any decent manager would have known that once Donegal had opened a sizeable lead their approach to the game changes and they were going to play keep-ball in the middle of the field and made a plan to deal with this.
Armagh seemed to have made no plan whatsoever to deal with such a scenario.
Donegal had tactics, Armagh didn't even look as they had tic-tacs they were that mixed up.
Paralysis by analysis.
Quote from: J70 on June 15, 2015, 03:09:45 PM
Why would Armagh supporters jeer Donegal when their own team was sat back with a packed defense when 10 points down? Especially to the extent that Donegal wasted 8 minutes flinging the ball about, with no pressure exerted, amongst themselves around their half - back line and midfield! :o ;D
Not saying either that it's not frustrating (Kerry did it to us for a couple of minutes late in last year's final), but you can't fault a team for playing keep ball when that far ahead.
It was actually Donegal supporters onto their own team to attack and put Armagh to the sword
Quote from: DuffleKing on June 15, 2015, 03:47:02 PM
Quote from: J70 on June 15, 2015, 03:09:45 PM
Why would Armagh supporters jeer Donegal when their own team was sat back with a packed defense when 10 points down? Especially to the extent that Donegal wasted 8 minutes flinging the ball about, with no pressure exerted, amongst themselves around their half - back line and midfield! :o ;D
Not saying either that it's not frustrating (Kerry did it to us for a couple of minutes late in last year's final), but you can't fault a team for playing keep ball when that far ahead.
It was actually Donegal supporters onto their own team to attack and put Armagh to the sword
Really?
Well that's idiotic too.
Game was won. Well won. And Armagh were camped in their own half. Team did the right thing.
Meant to say earlier, Donegal had some support at the game.
Armagh are not as bad as they showed here today. I think the start Donegal had put them in disarray. I wouldn't be so quick to blame Geezer, leadership comes from the pitch and experience which Donegal have in spades but Armagh need to develop. Remember this is largely the same Donegal team that Armagh put to the sword a few years back...all part of learning and growing. I'd start worrying if they were facing relegation next year though.
Quote from: Harold Disgracey on June 15, 2015, 04:26:16 PM
Meant to say earlier, Donegal had some support at the game.
They always do when they are winning...a bit like Down and Tyrone... :-)
Quote from: Harold Disgracey on June 15, 2015, 04:26:16 PM
Meant to say earlier, Donegal had some support at the game.
That's cos they buy up all the SuperValu tickets.
Quote from: J70 on June 15, 2015, 04:12:35 PM
Quote from: DuffleKing on June 15, 2015, 03:47:02 PM
Quote from: J70 on June 15, 2015, 03:09:45 PM
Why would Armagh supporters jeer Donegal when their own team was sat back with a packed defense when 10 points down? Especially to the extent that Donegal wasted 8 minutes flinging the ball about, with no pressure exerted, amongst themselves around their half - back line and midfield! :o ;D
Not saying either that it's not frustrating (Kerry did it to us for a couple of minutes late in last year's final), but you can't fault a team for playing keep ball when that far ahead.
It was actually Donegal supporters onto their own team to attack and put Armagh to the sword
Really?
Well that's idiotic too.
Game was won. Well won. And Armagh were camped in their own half. Team did the right thing.
I disagree. I'd want my team to keep pushing but there you go. They played keep ball until some of the Armagh players lost the head and barge in and foul them. Murphy would dander up to the free, take 90 seconds to hit it.......but here's the important bit.....he put it over! As I said, frustrating to watch.
Quote from: Harold Disgracey on June 15, 2015, 04:26:16 PM
Meant to say earlier, Donegal had some support at the game.
Could be the colours, but it looked at least 50/50, if not majority Donegal from the tv views.
Quote from: Applesisapples on June 15, 2015, 04:31:39 PM
Quote from: Harold Disgracey on June 15, 2015, 04:26:16 PM
Meant to say earlier, Donegal had some support at the game.
They always do when they are winning...a bit like Down and Tyrone... :-)
Just wait to see what happens if we manage to get to the AI semi!
Wonder how yesterday compared to Crossmaglen five years ago?!
Quote from: mackers on June 15, 2015, 04:42:32 PM
Quote from: J70 on June 15, 2015, 04:12:35 PM
Quote from: DuffleKing on June 15, 2015, 03:47:02 PM
Quote from: J70 on June 15, 2015, 03:09:45 PM
Why would Armagh supporters jeer Donegal when their own team was sat back with a packed defense when 10 points down? Especially to the extent that Donegal wasted 8 minutes flinging the ball about, with no pressure exerted, amongst themselves around their half - back line and midfield! :o ;D
Not saying either that it's not frustrating (Kerry did it to us for a couple of minutes late in last year's final), but you can't fault a team for playing keep ball when that far ahead.
It was actually Donegal supporters onto their own team to attack and put Armagh to the sword
Really?
Well that's idiotic too.
Game was won. Well won. And Armagh were camped in their own half. Team did the right thing.
I disagree. I'd want my team to keep pushing but there you go. They played keep ball until some of the Armagh players lost the head and barge in and foul them. Murphy would dander up to the free, take 90 seconds to hit it.......but here's the important bit.....he put it over! As I said, frustrating to watch.
are you seriously lamenting about Donegal's tactics when 8/9/10 points up playing on your home pitch?
Quote from: JoG2 on June 15, 2015, 04:58:58 PM
Quote from: mackers on June 15, 2015, 04:42:32 PM
Quote from: J70 on June 15, 2015, 04:12:35 PM
Quote from: DuffleKing on June 15, 2015, 03:47:02 PM
Quote from: J70 on June 15, 2015, 03:09:45 PM
Why would Armagh supporters jeer Donegal when their own team was sat back with a packed defense when 10 points down? Especially to the extent that Donegal wasted 8 minutes flinging the ball about, with no pressure exerted, amongst themselves around their half - back line and midfield! :o ;D
Not saying either that it's not frustrating (Kerry did it to us for a couple of minutes late in last year's final), but you can't fault a team for playing keep ball when that far ahead.
It was actually Donegal supporters onto their own team to attack and put Armagh to the sword
Really?
Well that's idiotic too.
Game was won. Well won. And Armagh were camped in their own half. Team did the right thing.
I disagree. I'd want my team to keep pushing but there you go. They played keep ball until some of the Armagh players lost the head and barge in and foul them. Murphy would dander up to the free, take 90 seconds to hit it.......but here's the important bit.....he put it over! As I said, frustrating to watch.
are you seriously lamenting about Donegal's tactics when 8/9/10 points up playing on your home pitch?
I'm saying it was frustrating to watch. Do you enjoy watching a team pass a ball about on the half way line?
Quote from: DuffleKing on June 15, 2015, 03:47:02 PM
Quote from: J70 on June 15, 2015, 03:09:45 PM
Why would Armagh supporters jeer Donegal when their own team was sat back with a packed defense when 10 points down? Especially to the extent that Donegal wasted 8 minutes flinging the ball about, with no pressure exerted, amongst themselves around their half - back line and midfield! :o ;D
Not saying either that it's not frustrating (Kerry did it to us for a couple of minutes late in last year's final), but you can't fault a team for playing keep ball when that far ahead.
It was actually Donegal supporters onto their own team to attack and put Armagh to the sword
I didn't hear any boo's from where I was standing. There were a few shouts from Armagh folks for their team to get after Donegal, but no booing and certainly not from Donegal people.
Armagh needed to come out and get the ball, instead they left a couple of forwards to chase around after the Donegal lads. I think we were smart to take advantage of that.
What did people expect Donegal to do?
There they are 8-10 points ahead on a sweltering warm day & the opposition have not one but two sweepers!!!
They took the clever option & said to Armagh "If you want the ball come & get it" but Armagh didn't seem to want it as Donegal were allowed to pass laterally at their ease.
Quote from: BennyCake on June 14, 2015, 07:46:25 PM
Those 3 defeats in 2002/03 must still be hurting.
Just the one where Ray Cosgrove missed the free. Although I still find it amusing how the greatest Armagh side of all time barely pipped one of the weakest Dublin teams in history.
On the subject of the game, I wasn't surprised to see Donegal look a lot stronger without that overrated waster Colm McFadden playing. I still wouldn't be too worried about Donegal's performance from a Dublin perspective, their game last year vs the Dubs was their world cup final. They won't be able to replicate it again so soon.
Quote from: mackers on June 15, 2015, 05:05:11 PM
Quote from: JoG2 on June 15, 2015, 04:58:58 PM
Quote from: mackers on June 15, 2015, 04:42:32 PM
Quote from: J70 on June 15, 2015, 04:12:35 PM
Quote from: DuffleKing on June 15, 2015, 03:47:02 PM
Quote from: J70 on June 15, 2015, 03:09:45 PM
Why would Armagh supporters jeer Donegal when their own team was sat back with a packed defense when 10 points down? Especially to the extent that Donegal wasted 8 minutes flinging the ball about, with no pressure exerted, amongst themselves around their half - back line and midfield! :o ;D
Not saying either that it's not frustrating (Kerry did it to us for a couple of minutes late in last year's final), but you can't fault a team for playing keep ball when that far ahead.
It was actually Donegal supporters onto their own team to attack and put Armagh to the sword
Really?
Well that's idiotic too.
Game was won. Well won. And Armagh were camped in their own half. Team did the right thing.
I disagree. I'd want my team to keep pushing but there you go. They played keep ball until some of the Armagh players lost the head and barge in and foul them. Murphy would dander up to the free, take 90 seconds to hit it.......but here's the important bit.....he put it over! As I said, frustrating to watch.
are you seriously lamenting about Donegal's tactics when 8/9/10 points up playing on your home pitch?
I'm saying it was frustrating to watch. Do you enjoy watching a team pass a ball about on the half way line?
I enjoy a team rolling over at home without a whimper even less. your angst should lie squarely at the feet of your own county Mackers
Quote from: SouthDublinBro on June 15, 2015, 06:38:51 PM
Quote from: BennyCake on June 14, 2015, 07:46:25 PM
Those 3 defeats in 2002/03 must still be hurting.
Just the one where Ray Cosgrove missed the free. Although I still find it amusing how the greatest Armagh side of all time barely pipped one of the weakest Dublin teams in history.
On the subject of the game, I wasn't surprised to see Donegal look a lot stronger without that overrated waster Colm McFadden playing. I still wouldn't be too worried about Donegal's performance from a Dublin perspective, their game last year vs the Dubs was their world cup final. They won't be able to replicate it again so soon.
McFadden had a poor 18 months by his own high standards but I thought he was excellent against Tyrone
Quote from: SouthDublinBro on June 15, 2015, 06:38:51 PM
Quote from: BennyCake on June 14, 2015, 07:46:25 PM
Those 3 defeats in 2002/03 must still be hurting.
Just the one where Ray Cosgrove missed the free. Although I still find it amusing how the greatest Armagh side of all time barely pipped one of the weakest Dublin teams in history.
On the subject of the game, I wasn't surprised to see Donegal look a lot stronger without that overrated waster Colm McFadden playing. I still wouldn't be too worried about Donegal's performance from a Dublin perspective, their game last year vs the Dubs was their world cup final. They won't be able to replicate it again so soon.
Absolutely hilarious.
Quote from: SouthDublinBro on June 15, 2015, 06:38:51 PM
Quote from: BennyCake on June 14, 2015, 07:46:25 PM
Those 3 defeats in 2002/03 must still be hurting.
Just the one where Ray Cosgrove missed the free. Although I still find it amusing how the greatest Armagh side of all time barely pipped one of the weakest Dublin teams in history.
On the subject of the game, I wasn't surprised to see Donegal look a lot stronger without that overrated waster Colm McFadden playing. I still wouldn't be too worried about Donegal's performance from a Dublin perspective, their game last year vs the Dubs was their world cup final. They won't be able to replicate it again so soon.
1. McFadden was superb against Tyrone.
2. Were you worried about this Donegal side before last year's meeting?
Quote from: SouthDublinBro on June 15, 2015, 06:38:51 PM
Quote from: BennyCake on June 14, 2015, 07:46:25 PM
Those 3 defeats in 2002/03 must still be hurting.
Just the one where Ray Cosgrove missed the free. Although I still find it amusing how the greatest Armagh side of all time barely pipped one of the weakest Dublin teams in history.
On the subject of the game, I wasn't surprised to see Donegal look a lot stronger without that overrated waster Colm McFadden playing. I still wouldn't be too worried about Donegal's performance from a Dublin perspective, their game last year vs the Dubs was their world cup final. They won't be able to replicate it again so soon.
Winning the world cup last year did indeed soften the blow of losing the AI final.
Donegal played around with Armagh in that second half like a cat with a mouse, I have never seen anything like it in senior championship football before, it must have been hard for Armagh supporters to watch, what happens next for Armagh I just dont know, they will be hard to motivate for the qualifiers.
Quote from: giveballaghback on June 15, 2015, 07:45:15 PM
Donegal played around with Armagh in that second half like a cat with a mouse, I have never seen anything like it in senior championship football before, it must have been hard for Armagh supporters to watch, what happens next for Armagh I just dont know, they will be hard to motivate for the qualifiers.
Its not too often that Armagh get beatings like the did yesterday. The last time I can remember feeling anything similar was against Kerry in 06. Hard to take but we will bounce back.
Quote from: giveballaghback on June 15, 2015, 07:45:15 PM
Donegal played around with Armagh in that second half like a cat with a mouse, I have never seen anything like it in senior championship football before, it must have been hard for Armagh supporters to watch, what happens next for Armagh I just dont know, they will be hard to motivate for the qualifiers.
I would say the opposite. Armagh are proud and will want to prove a point.
As for the Donegal playing the ball about. At that stage I feel Armagh were resigned to defeat and did not want to push up on Donegal in case they got caught out and suffered a bigger defeat.
The Dubs may joke but Donegal are a serious team and when they hit a purple patch they can match anyone. Cute as hell too. Always the sign of a top team.
I agree Donegal are a serious outfit, best tacklers by a mile, they just do enough in the tackle to avoid a free, I have no douth Armagh will be back, the best thing that could happen for Armagh would be for Donegal to go on and destroy another top team and I think they will, this is going to be a very interesting season all round, Donegal v Kerry all-ire semi would be some feast!
I posted about Donegal's subs and squad depth after the Tyrone game. Had a look at the sub made in this match.
Quote from: twohands!!! on May 17, 2015, 10:50:54 PM
Mentioned my doubts about Donegal's squad depth before the game
The substitutions today didn't exactly do much to disprove this.
M McHugh for O'Reilly (39)
A Thompson for Toye (66)
D Walsh for McElhinney (70)
D McLaughlin for McFadden (70)
- Donegal's 2nd sub is working in another country while the 18th and 19th players came on in injury time.
A Thompson for E McGee ht
H McFadden for McBrearty 50
D Walsh for C Toye 56
G McFadden for McElhinney 65
You would have said that yesterday was the perfect day to use all 6 subs but the fact that Donegal only used 4, 2 of which were used to cover injuries suggests that management do not have much faith in the squad depth. It's one thing to be stuck on the bench when it's a tight game and the management keeps an experienced battle-hardened All-Ireland winner on the pitch ahead of you but in a game that's done, dusted and put to bed like the 2nd half of yesterday's game was is pretty much the perfect scenario in which to give the squad players a run-out, lads down the pecking order can surely feel a mire aggrieved not to be given a run. If you are one of those squad players you have to be thinking that the managers basically not going to give you a run unless things get really desperate and that your chances of starting a game are utterly tiny.
Colm McFadden was out with a virus so while he was named in the match-day squad he wasn't an option. I would imagine if he was fit he would likely have seen some game-time but in a sense once the squad guys saw him absent they must surely have figured their chances of getting a run increased a fair bit so that only makes it worse, thinking "Colm was out, we'd hammered Armagh off the pitch and were cruising and I couldn't even get 5 minutes"
A related interesting point to ponder is that McBrearty wasn't actually named in the starting 15 given the damage he did. I really don't think this was a dummy team move but a "legitimate" late replacement given McFadden's illness.Wonder did any journo ask Gallagher about this?
It's not an issue now, but I believe before September comes there's decent odds its very likely to be one - even going the direct route Donegal have a minimum of 5 more games to play if they get to the final.
I haven't checked but from memory I'm pretty sure that Dublin, Mayo and Kerry used all 6 subs in their championship games and are I would be surprised if all of those 3 didn't do so in all their games in the championship.
What made me think of it was reading a report of the Clare Cork game and seeing Clare had only used 3 subs while in the middle of an injury crisis.
In terms of teams with injuries at the weekend Clare had something like 6/7 likely starters out and Meath had something similiar. Kerry had 4 on their injured list and I think Cork had 4 too. Basically Donegal have had 1 player out through injury/illness (Colm McFadden) in the 2 games so far and it's very hard to see them maintaining that level of squad fitness for the remainder of the championship.
Quote from: giveballaghback on June 15, 2015, 07:45:15 PM
Donegal played around with Armagh in that second half like a cat with a mouse, I have never seen anything like it in senior championship football before, it must have been hard for Armagh supporters to watch, what happens next for Armagh I just dont know, they will be hard to motivate for the qualifiers.
I disagree, I think they will use it as motivation. Go and show everyone we are not as bad as we were against Donegal. Go and show everyione we can play. Thats what Id be doing if I were McGeeney anyway
Quote from: tyroneman on June 15, 2015, 11:55:51 AM
Much like our situation in rebuilding Tyrone, there is very little point saying Armagh are 3 years behind Donegal if there is little prospect of either the players or the tactics / system bridging that gap.
While Harte may have the experience to figure out a way to compete against them he simply doesn't have the players (most importantly the forwards) and while Armagh fans might feel they have the players I don't think they have the tactical nous on the sideline.
If you take Jamie Clarke and Sean Cavanagh out of the equation there are simply no marquee players on either the Armagh or Tyrone teams. There are plenty of decent players, plenty of hardworking players and some who may become very very good but not enough to match the reservoir of class that the top teams are drawing from.
Look at the players who didn't even start for Dublin or Kerry. Tyrone or Armagh would have them in a heartbeat.
I don't think Harte has the 'nous' to figure out the top teams though, he has shown nothing different in the past 5 years to suggest otherwise. You just have to look at Donegal yesterday and how they have shown that a team can play differently so soon after a new manager has been appointed, the amount of high ball pumped was something that you will rarely see Tyrone try.
Quote from: Throw ball on June 15, 2015, 08:18:55 PM
Quote from: giveballaghback on June 15, 2015, 07:45:15 PM
Donegal played around with Armagh in that second half like a cat with a mouse, I have never seen anything like it in senior championship football before, it must have been hard for Armagh supporters to watch, what happens next for Armagh I just dont know, they will be hard to motivate for the qualifiers.
I would say the opposite. Armagh are proud and will want to prove a point.
As for the Donegal playing the ball about. At that stage I feel Armagh were resigned to defeat and did not want to push up on Donegal in case they got caught out and suffered a bigger defeat.
The Dubs may joke but Donegal are a serious team and when they hit a purple patch they can match anyone. Cute as hell too. Always the sign of a top team.
I think you could well be right there. The team played with an obvious fear from the beginning and were far too concerned with the opposition. Too much analysis of the game instead of building a game plan to suit our own players. I hope that lessons are learned and we have a good game to begin with in the qualifiers to begin with to restroe some wounded pride.
Quote from: JoG2 on June 15, 2015, 06:44:10 PM
Quote from: mackers on June 15, 2015, 05:05:11 PM
Quote from: JoG2 on June 15, 2015, 04:58:58 PM
Quote from: mackers on June 15, 2015, 04:42:32 PM
Quote from: J70 on June 15, 2015, 04:12:35 PM
Quote from: DuffleKing on June 15, 2015, 03:47:02 PM
Quote from: J70 on June 15, 2015, 03:09:45 PM
Why would Armagh supporters jeer Donegal when their own team was sat back with a packed defense when 10 points down? Especially to the extent that Donegal wasted 8 minutes flinging the ball about, with no pressure exerted, amongst themselves around their half - back line and midfield! :o ;D
Not saying either that it's not frustrating (Kerry did it to us for a couple of minutes late in last year's final), but you can't fault a team for playing keep ball when that far ahead.
It was actually Donegal supporters onto their own team to attack and put Armagh to the sword
Really?
Well that's idiotic too.
Game was won. Well won. And Armagh were camped in their own half. Team did the right thing.
I disagree. I'd want my team to keep pushing but there you go. They played keep ball until some of the Armagh players lost the head and barge in and foul them. Murphy would dander up to the free, take 90 seconds to hit it.......but here's the important bit.....he put it over! As I said, frustrating to watch.
are you seriously lamenting about Donegal's tactics when 8/9/10 points up playing on your home pitch?
I'm saying it was frustrating to watch. Do you enjoy watching a team pass a ball about on the half way line?
I enjoy a team rolling over at home without a whimper even less. your angst should lie squarely at the feet of your own county Mackers
No, it doesn't. I was not one of the posters who fancied Armagh before the game. As I said in my original post I think Armagh were always going to be up against it after coming out of Division 3. We employed the same tactics as we did successfully against Donegal last year. Last year, however, we were on the back of a roll of matches and had some serious momentum. Donegal blitzed us in the first half playing some great football with some analysts saying it was the best they had played since their recent upturn in 2011. We were turned over repeatedly in that first half because we were not used to the intensity levels that Donegal were playing at. In the second half they had earned the right to sit back and hit us on the counter. If we pushed up they would have repeated what they had done on a much better team than us in the AISF when they tried to play attacking football against Donegal. Armagh's goose was cooked ten minutes in, they needed the start that Donegal got.
When Donegal started playing the "possession" football it was effective for the reasons that I explained earlier but it wasn't pretty.
You need to be more worried about how Derry are going to deal with Donegal if they play to the same level as they played on Sunday.
Quote from: nrico2006 on June 16, 2015, 08:35:33 AM
Quote from: tyroneman on June 15, 2015, 11:55:51 AM
Much like our situation in rebuilding Tyrone, there is very little point saying Armagh are 3 years behind Donegal if there is little prospect of either the players or the tactics / system bridging that gap.
While Harte may have the experience to figure out a way to compete against them he simply doesn't have the players (most importantly the forwards) and while Armagh fans might feel they have the players I don't think they have the tactical nous on the sideline.
If you take Jamie Clarke and Sean Cavanagh out of the equation there are simply no marquee players on either the Armagh or Tyrone teams. There are plenty of decent players, plenty of hardworking players and some who may become very very good but not enough to match the reservoir of class that the top teams are drawing from.
Look at the players who didn't even start for Dublin or Kerry. Tyrone or Armagh would have them in a heartbeat.
I don't think Harte has the 'nous' to figure out the top teams though, he has shown nothing different in the past 5 years to suggest otherwise. You just have to look at Donegal yesterday and how they have shown that a team can play differently so soon after a new manager has been appointed, the amount of high ball pumped was something that you will rarely see Tyrone try.
It's a difficult one to assess to be fair.
On one hand you could argue that with the first of the Donegal sequence wins Tyrone were cruising until they got the yips and Joe mcMahon got hit a box in the jaw that had just healed. With him off Donegals attack got more into the game and punished Tyrones wayward shooting. Durkins wonder save, the post and last time out the bar all gave Donegal that bit of luck needed.
On the other hand you can say that's all well and good but bottom line is Donegal won those games. End of. The lack of big scalps and the d1/2 yo yo routine all with virtually the same tactics each time would point to a stale approach.
Personally I think Harte is convinced his system is right but he hasn't acknowledged that the current players are just not good enough, yet.
Quote from: tyroneman on June 16, 2015, 09:22:04 PM
Quote from: nrico2006 on June 16, 2015, 08:35:33 AM
Quote from: tyroneman on June 15, 2015, 11:55:51 AM
Much like our situation in rebuilding Tyrone, there is very little point saying Armagh are 3 years behind Donegal if there is little prospect of either the players or the tactics / system bridging that gap.
While Harte may have the experience to figure out a way to compete against them he simply doesn't have the players (most importantly the forwards) and while Armagh fans might feel they have the players I don't think they have the tactical nous on the sideline.
If you take Jamie Clarke and Sean Cavanagh out of the equation there are simply no marquee players on either the Armagh or Tyrone teams. There are plenty of decent players, plenty of hardworking players and some who may become very very good but not enough to match the reservoir of class that the top teams are drawing from.
Look at the players who didn't even start for Dublin or Kerry. Tyrone or Armagh would have them in a heartbeat.
I don't think Harte has the 'nous' to figure out the top teams though, he has shown nothing different in the past 5 years to suggest otherwise. You just have to look at Donegal yesterday and how they have shown that a team can play differently so soon after a new manager has been appointed, the amount of high ball pumped was something that you will rarely see Tyrone try.
It's a difficult one to assess to be fair.
On one hand you could argue that with the first of the Donegal sequence wins Tyrone were cruising until they got the yips and Joe mcMahon got hit a box in the jaw that had just healed. With him off Donegals attack got more into the game and punished Tyrones wayward shooting. Durkins wonder save, the post and last time out the bar all gave Donegal that bit of luck needed.
On the other hand you can say that's all well and good but bottom line is Donegal won those games. End of. The lack of big scalps and the d1/2 yo yo routine all with virtually the same tactics each time would point to a stale approach.
Personally I think Harte is convinced his system is right but he hasn't acknowledged that the current players are just not good enough, yet.
If Mickey H said that, then I am surprised.
Tyrone played a good game against Donegal and were not that far off. My feeling at the time was that they were good enough to win, but just didn't believe it. Maybe that a croc of s... but ...... it's good to share :)
Is this what McGeeney was planning for, for half a year?
Holy fook.
There's not enough cross men on the panel
Quote from: rrhf on June 16, 2015, 11:06:55 PM
There's not enough cross men on the panel
I'd say they weren't too happy.
Quote from: rrhf on June 16, 2015, 11:06:55 PM
There's not enough cross men on the panel
A point I've made myself, the question is why?
Who's missing?
Quote from: Applesisapples on June 17, 2015, 11:42:42 AM
Quote from: rrhf on June 16, 2015, 11:06:55 PM
There's not enough cross men on the panel
A point I've made myself, the question is why?
I think there's plenty of Cross men on the panel, anymore and it would affect our chances of winning trophies.
Question: What would Paul Hearty have done when the ball for the first goal came in?
a) Flattened McBrearty and punched the ball 50 yards clear
b) Flattened both Morgan and McBrearty and punched the ball 50 yards clear
c) Flattened both Morgan and McBrearty, tried to punch the ball and miss it
d) Try to punch the ball away but run into Morgan
e) Try to punch the ball away but get flattened by McBrearty
f) All the above
g) None of the above
h) Something else?
My guess is (b)
Quote from: brokencrossbar1 on June 17, 2015, 12:42:58 PM
Quote from: Applesisapples on June 17, 2015, 11:42:42 AM
Quote from: rrhf on June 16, 2015, 11:06:55 PM
There's not enough cross men on the panel
A point I've made myself, the question is why?
I think there's plenty of Cross men on the panel, anymore and it would affect our chances of winning trophies.
Down with that sort of thing. County first, club second, girlfriend third, family fourth, golf fifth, wife sixth!
Quote from: Orior on June 17, 2015, 01:30:44 PM
Question: What would Paul Hearty have done when the ball for the first goal came in?
a) Flattened McBrearty and punched the ball 50 yards clear
b) Flattened both Morgan and McBrearty and punched the ball 50 yards clear
c) Flattened both Morgan and McBrearty, tried to punch the ball and miss it
d) Try to punch the ball away but run into Morgan
e) Try to punch the ball away but get flattened by McBrearty
f) All the above
g) None of the above
h) Something else?
My guess is (b)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JZVtfmlBbKw
Quote from: brokencrossbar1 on June 17, 2015, 12:42:58 PM
Quote from: Applesisapples on June 17, 2015, 11:42:42 AM
Quote from: rrhf on June 16, 2015, 11:06:55 PM
There's not enough cross men on the panel
A point I've made myself, the question is why?
I think there's plenty of Cross men on the panel, anymore and it would affect our chances of winning trophies.
Aye Crosses chances...not Armagh's
Quote from: Orchard Officer on June 17, 2015, 02:32:51 PM
Quote from: Orior on June 17, 2015, 01:30:44 PM
Question: What would Paul Hearty have done when the ball for the first goal came in?
a) Flattened McBrearty and punched the ball 50 yards clear
b) Flattened both Morgan and McBrearty and punched the ball 50 yards clear
c) Flattened both Morgan and McBrearty, tried to punch the ball and miss it
d) Try to punch the ball away but run into Morgan
e) Try to punch the ball away but get flattened by McBrearty
f) All the above
g) None of the above
h) Something else?
My guess is (b)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JZVtfmlBbKw
First post and throws this up ;D Even used an Armagh name.
Quote from: Applesisapples on June 17, 2015, 02:50:34 PM
Quote from: brokencrossbar1 on June 17, 2015, 12:42:58 PM
Quote from: Applesisapples on June 17, 2015, 11:42:42 AM
Quote from: rrhf on June 16, 2015, 11:06:55 PM
There's not enough cross men on the panel
A point I've made myself, the question is why?
I think there's plenty of Cross men on the panel, anymore and it would affect our chances of winning trophies.
Aye Crosses chances...not Armagh's
Which is the more likely to win Ulster?
Quote from: Orior on June 17, 2015, 01:30:44 PM
Question: What would Paul Hearty have done when the ball for the first goal came in?
a) Flattened McBrearty and punched the ball 50 yards clear
b) Flattened both Morgan and McBrearty and punched the ball 50 yards clear
c) Flattened both Morgan and McBrearty, tried to punch the ball and miss it
d) Try to punch the ball away but run into Morgan
e) Try to punch the ball away but get flattened by McBrearty
f) All the above
g) None of the above
h) Something else?
My guess is (b)
hmmm
Quote from: Orior on June 17, 2015, 01:30:44 PM
Question: What would Paul Hearty have done when the ball for the first goal came in?
a) Flattened McBrearty and punched the ball 50 yards clear
b) Flattened both Morgan and McBrearty and punched the ball 50 yards clear
c) Flattened both Morgan and McBrearty, tried to punch the ball and miss it
d) Try to punch the ball away but run into Morgan
e) Try to punch the ball away but get flattened by McBrearty
f) All the above
g) None of the above
h) Something else?
My guess is (b)
Where is i) drop the ball into the back of the net?