USFC Armagh v Derry, St Tiernach's Park, Clones, 19th June 2pm

[Doire abú]

at least it's not in Celtic Park....

[armaghniac]

Healy Park comfortably holds 25,000

It certainly does not. I doubt if its official capacity exceeds 17000 or so. Consequently if it were used the probable capacity would exceed 80% and so the game would have to be all ticket, with all of the hassle that entails.

As for the cost of diesel, the reduced cost of this in Monaghan would cover the extra distance.

[PAULD123]

I guess with less money around we will just have lower attendances. The first time I remember any game in Ulster championship being all-ticket was Armagh vs Down in 1992. As I remember in the 80s we used to just turn up and pay, even for Ulster finals to the terrace. I also just paid at the gate for the All-Ireland semi's in 1991 & 1994. Then an economic boom came and stadiums were full. I think we are just returning to how things were about 15-20 years ago.

If capacities are down then we could easily look at smaller grounds like Healy Park. Alternatively we could say that an Ulster semi is no bigger a game than a ulster quarter final (for attendance anyway). Is Armagh vs Derry bigger than Armagh vs Down, or Tyrone vs Monaghan bigger than Tyrone vs Donegal? I'd say roughly equal and of equal standard too. If so then maybe home advantage should be drawn for every game up to the final. It would be harsh on the "away" team but it could be followed up the next year by guaranteeing a home draw the following year. At least you wouldn't have two sets of fans having to travel for every semi-final.

[take_yer_points]

Healy Park comfortably holds 25,000

It certainly does not. I doubt if its official capacity exceeds 17000 or so. Consequently if it were used the probable capacity would exceed 80% and so the game would have to be all ticket, with all of the hassle that entails.

As for the cost of diesel, the reduced cost of this in Monaghan would cover the extra distance.

http://www.ulstercollegesgaa.org/venues/healy-park/

[Will Hunting]

correct me if I'm wrong but did Armagh not play all their home Championship games there while the Athletic Grounds was being redeveloped??

You are wrong.

Well, surely it is true that Clones was Armagh's designated "home" venue over the last 15 years in the Ulster championship? And the only reason why last year's game against Monaghan was in Casement is because Armagh didn't want to play their own home game in Monaghan.

Omagh would have been more than capable of holding this game, even if it only holds 18k. Derry v Fermanagh: 6k, Armagh v Down: 13k, Tyrone v Monaghan: 10k. There'll be no more than 15k at it.

Venue choice probably won't have much bearing on the game itself as Derry have a bad record everywhere. But this decision is certainly a huge disadvantage to Derry fans and that's the issue here.

[tonto1888]

Looking forward to this one. Just hope we (armagh) dont do what we done last year after beating Derry and totally collapse in the next round.

[sheamy]

The reasons for the venue choice are very simple (imo)

How many 'covered seats' at casement v clones? Back of the envelope calculation tells you the Ulster Council make more profit from the expensive £30 (or whatever they will be) covered stand tickets. They weigh that up against potential loss from a few supporters staying away because of the distance. All understandable from a profit point of view IF you are running a business for shareholders where the bottom line is king.

However, these people need to realise they are not running a business. The GAA is owned by the club members and the supporters, not the paid administrators looking to increase a share price for some investor.

Fair enough, their mantra which they choose to put in every programme going, is that they invest 86.483822% back into grassroots. They deserve credit for that.

However, they make a hash of promoting what should be the showpiece of our games to the wider public through cynical practices like this and the cost of tickets. These people need to wake up. I think Colm O'Rourke said as much recently too.

'Profit before the public' should be their new mantra.

[armaghniac]

Might the Ulster council not want to have more covered seats for the comfort of supporters, many of whom will complain vociferously if they don't get them and the weather remains as it is?

But this "simple" theory doesn't hold up as there as as many covered seats in Omagh.

'Profit before the public' should be their new mantra.

Perhaps it is? Perhaps they wish to avoid an all ticket game in Omagh where kids could not be allowed in free?

[sheamy]

Might the Ulster council not want to have more covered seats for the comfort of supporters, many of whom will complain vociferously if they don't get them and the weather remains as it is?

But this "simple" theory doesn't hold up as there as as many covered seats in Omagh.

'Profit before the public' should be their new mantra.

Perhaps it is? Perhaps they wish to avoid an all ticket game in Omagh where kids could not be allowed in free?

I never mentioned Omagh. It wouldn't fill Omagh anyway but that's another story. You think they'd need to issue 25k tickets for Omagh given attendances this year? Seriously? I'd say it's more to do with the VAT rate to be honest i.e. back to my central point.

And the other reason is they don't want people to get wet? I understand what you're saying but don't buy it. Not much comfort in parking in a field, walking 2 mile to the pitch (at which point if it's raining you're pretty damn wet anyway), and then sitting in traffic in Monaghan for an hour on the way home :-)

We'll agree to disagree on that.

[armaghniac]

I never mentioned Omagh.

Well, where did you suggest? Casement is out of consideration, apparently, and no doubt they do not want to spend money fixing the problem when the whole kip will be demolished shortly. So you are left with Omagh. This idea of Healy Park holding 25,000 is Wikipedia nonsense. In 2009, the capacity was stated as 18500.

[sheamy]

I never mentioned Omagh.

Well, where did you suggest? Casement is out of consideration, apparently, and no doubt they do not want to spend money fixing the problem when the whole kip will be demolished shortly. So you are left with Omagh. This idea of Healy Park holding 25,000 is Wikipedia nonsense. In 2009, the capacity was stated as 18500.

what is this "problem"? The antrim county chairman didn't seem to be aware of "the problem" in the Irish News today...I wonder if we'll ever be enlightened.

[Ulick]

Looks like family and stand tickets only for this one, the rest pay at the turnstiles.

[Bogball XV]

I never mentioned Omagh.

Well, where did you suggest? Casement is out of consideration, apparently, and no doubt they do not want to spend money fixing the problem when the whole kip will be demolished shortly. So you are left with Omagh. This idea of Healy Park holding 25,000 is Wikipedia nonsense. In 2009, the capacity was stated as 18500.

That was the capacity then alright and if it's not been increased, Omagh couldn't have been considered for this game.
Why Clones was chosen is probably financial and the VAT concession granted by the Irish Revenue, but not replicated by the HMRC is probably the main reason.  Tbh, you'd wonder why any ground in the six get games.

[screenmachine]

With regards Casement being out of operation - are Antrim not due to play Westmeath in Casement in the coming weeks ahead? I don't see how the argument that Casement wasn't available due to health and safety or for whatever other reason holds up if this is the case?

[screenmachine]

Well they started it.  You couldn't watch them Mexicans or their apple eating neighbours...