USFC Armagh v Derry, St Tiernach's Park, Clones, 19th June 2pm

[tonto1888]

Regarding McDonnells second goal chance......i think if you look again Mark Lynch finished from a very similar position.

I can't understand the criticism of McDonnell by Armagh folk....yes he's past his best but without him on Sunday it would have been cricket scores....jesus i wish we had him for the final!

i think lynch was lot closer to goal.Took it well though

[tbrick18]

The gloating shite coming from some Derry fans here is very reminicient of similar drivel from some Armagh fans after Down. The better team won on Sunday but there is no doubt they had a helping hand from the ineptitude of the Armagh line. Also McDonnells second goal chance which should have been pointed was a major turning point, the Derry goal that came from it killed the game. John Brennan got it spot on on the day and his contribution should not be played down. That said however I wouldn't fear meeting Derry again there is not 9 ponits between the teams.

I dont think there's too much gloating from Derry. We havent won anything and I dont think anyone in Derry is under any illusions about the team we have.
Yes it worked well for us on Sunday, but that's all forgotten the next day out and we'd have to improve again to have any chance in the final regardless of who we play.
I would agree with you that there isnt 9 points between us...on paper, I would put us on a par. Both teams with very good full forward lines and average everywhere else.
It just clicked for us this time.

[tbrick18]

Diver was clean through could have shot for goal as he'd only the keeper to beat but tried to fist it over the bar and fisted it wide!

You're being harsh on Diver there, watch the match again, he had about three Armagh defenders bearing down on him with at least two of them on the goal side.

Not trying to be harsh on him but from where he fisted it he could have kicked it for goal is all I'm saying. A forward would have.
Diver had a great game IMO, I was just trying to highlight to the previous poster that we had more than 3 goal chances.

[lemallon]

On a slightly different note, in many different publications I have seen great praise for the performance of the ref David Coldrick.  While not wanting to dwell on different decisions I thought he ruined the momentum of an excellent first half by taking a ridiculous amount of time to deal with situations.  It took him an age to discuss things with umpires and the Diver Toner kick incident must have taken almost 4 minutes to resolve.   Also after scores he strolled out to midfield and goalies kickouts were terribly slow to occur. 

All this wouldnt be so bad if you had a rugby situation where the clock is stopped when hes doing all this talking.  But I couldnt believe it when at the end of the first half 2 minutes of stoppage time was indicated.  Should have been at least 5 if not 6.  Why oh why has this not been sorted out by GAA authorities.  3/4 minutes could mean at least 3 scores.  Hence to me its a much more important change to be made than hawk eye which may effect one score every 3/4 games.  This lack of proper stoppage time is effecting every half we play.

[Throw ball]

My observations of the game would be as follows:

Armagh were awful, particularly tactically, I can think of very few occasions were failing tactics were changed by POR who instead choose to change players for almost identical players.  Before the game I could have told which subs were going to be used and who they were going to replace and sure enough I got 4 out of 5 of them right. When a defensive system isnt working (i.e. man for man on Lynch and Bradley) there is no point sticking with the system and continually change players without ever thinking of changing tactic.

Derry were good but not great, with the exception of Braddley and Lynch (who were excellent and allowed to be excellent) I thought Derry were ordinary to good and I would expect a big improvement in the final (which I feel will likely be needed)

Bradley is a fantastic footballer but should have been slapped by his manager for the stupid altercation with Mallon which was needlessly instigated by Bradley.  In addition Bradley is one of the cutest footballers at winning himself frees and getting opponents booked that I have ever seen.  Thats not a criticisim as winning a foul is a much a skill in the modern game as beating your man.

Brennan is a fantastic manager both tactically and interms of man management, I bumped into the Derry team when I was getting a feed after the game and they seemed very relaxed and were even having a drink or two as if the game had just been another day at the office.

POR is wasting one of the finest squads Armagh has ever had imo but we will have him for at least one more year. I may only be 26 but this was the first summer I ever booked a holiday without first ensuring it didnt clash with an Armagh game.  The reason for this is I am so disillusioned with the Armagh management.

The refereeing was very poor and highly inconsistent but made no difference to the result, the booking for Donaghy was for me harsh but what irked me more was when Clarke got fouled at the other end the cards werent as quick at coming. Also why was Diver was booked?  From where I was it looked like he kicked Toner in the face?  If he did surely thats either deliberate (and a sending off) or accidental and not even a foul?  This fudge always annoys me. Likewise with Mallon for the retaliation on Bradley

From the minor game Armagh were highly impressive and tbh the scoreline flattered Fermanagh a little as Armagh hit the crossbar three times and the Fermanagh keeper pulled of some wonderful saves.  Third straight Ulster Final for this management team (and I think for McGeown at full forward) and for me they really deserve a chance with the U21's or seniors next year.  Also I would really like to see McGeown in the senior team as he seems well able to take a score and is quite creative, he may well be worth a look in the half forward line.

Must say I think you have summarised things very well from an Armagh point of view. As for McGeown I think he really does show potential but can drift in and out of the game a bit - probably common for a young fella though. It is a great achievement for the minor management to reach 3 Ulster finals in a row and when you look at Armagh's poor minor record over the last forty years it really does show how much difference a good management team can make.

They are a good management team yes but it's not down to them alone. The bigger picture is the overall work done at underage level in Armagh. There has been great work done over the past 8 or 9 years by various unsung heros in restructuring underage football in Armagh and the county has been reaping the benefits the past few years - it's no accident or fluke of having good management in place.

Agree totally. But we need the management teams in place to carry on the work from minor to under 21 and senior. They should all be working under a similar agenda. I would also not be sure about moving the minor management team to senior or under 21 if there was not suitable replacements for them at this level.

[ExiledGael]

All this wouldnt be so bad if you had a rugby situation where the clock is stopped when hes doing all this talking.  But I couldnt believe it when at the end of the first half 2 minutes of stoppage time was indicated.  Should have been at least 5 if not 6.  Why oh why has this not been sorted out by GAA authorities.  3/4 minutes could mean at least 3 scores.  Hence to me its a much more important change to be made than hawk eye which may effect one score every 3/4 games.  This lack of proper stoppage time is effecting every half we play.

Definitely agree with this. Was stunned when they signalled for two minutes at the end of the first half after a series of delays. Unreal amount of time wasted, the average amount of injury time should be nearer five minutes per half instead of the standard two. It's short changing the supporters.

[Armamike]

The logical move would be for the minor management to progress on to U21 at some stage soon and work with those same groups of players again and take them that stage closer to senior. 

[sheamy]

The gloating shite coming from some Derry fans here is very reminicient of similar drivel from some Armagh fans after Down. The better team won on Sunday but there is no doubt they had a helping hand from the ineptitude of the Armagh line. Also McDonnells second goal chance which should have been pointed was a major turning point, the Derry goal that came from it killed the game. John Brennan got it spot on on the day and his contribution should not be played down. That said however I wouldn't fear meeting Derry again there is not 9 ponits between the teams.

Definately no gloating from real Derry supporters lad, or even any that I've talked to. I can say that with some confidence. We have nothing to gloat about for a start. It's nice to win all the same when the whole country and press tell you that you've no chance.

"youse boys (in the meedja) knows nuthin about fudbawl anyway" Wee Eamon.

Good luck to Armagh for the rest of the year. I agree with most of your comments there. Armagh met a tuned-in Derry side (albeit missing a few key individuals) with a good manager. It's all on the day and that's Ulster football. Christ, we should know!

If we beat Tyrone in the final then we can all gloat together 

[Throw ball]

On a slightly different note, in many different publications I have seen great praise for the performance of the ref David Coldrick.  While not wanting to dwell on different decisions I thought he ruined the momentum of an excellent first half by taking a ridiculous amount of time to deal with situations.  It took him an age to discuss things with umpires and the Diver Toner kick incident must have taken almost 4 minutes to resolve.   Also after scores he strolled out to midfield and goalies kickouts were terribly slow to occur. 

All this wouldnt be so bad if you had a rugby situation where the clock is stopped when hes doing all this talking.  But I couldnt believe it when at the end of the first half 2 minutes of stoppage time was indicated.  Should have been at least 5 if not 6.  Why oh why has this not been sorted out by GAA authorities.  3/4 minutes could mean at least 3 scores.  Hence to me its a much more important change to be made than hawk eye which may effect one score every 3/4 games.  This lack of proper stoppage time is effecting every half we play.

You must have been sitting with the season ticket holders were there was bewilderment on how little injury time there was. In the first half, for example, the Diver + Toner incident seemed to take over a minute and a half. When you add on the amount of time spent consulting people on other incidents 2 minutes seemed very little. Although it saved Armagh from further embarrassment the one minute in the second half was laughable. In some match down the line this could effect the result of a game. By the way the best referee timekeeping I remember in a match was the 2004 All Ireland under 21 final when 10 minutes injury time was called and then a further 2 added for injury time in injury time. The referee was a Kerry man but I cannot remember his name.