Seanie Johnston Switch and outside managers

[Croí na hÉireann]

IF SJ wants his transfer and has his paperwork in order then let him go and play club football in Kildare. He can put in the effort with his new club to make their championship team for next year instead of parachuting in at the last minute and depriving some lad from Straffen the chance to play this weekend.

He's not wanting to transfer to Straffan, St Kevins are a 20 min drive away from Straffan! He wanted initially to remain a Cavan Gaels player and declare for Kildare at the same time. When that was shot down this convenient move to St Kevins (same club as Niall Carew) emerged.

If the transfer goes ahead after the Kevins/Leixlip match in Clane on Saturday he can play away for the remainder of the county league and championship but he cannot play for Kildare this summer because he won't have played in the Kildare club championship. The second round of the county championship in Kildare won't be played until after the county team's campaign is over.

Seeing as McGeeney obviously wants to get Seanie on board would he not be able to exert his influence and have a second round of championship games scheduled as soon as Seanie's club transfer goes through? I don't think we've heard the last of Seanie for this summer anyway.

[AZOffaly]

It'd be great, and I'd vastly prefer it, if the whole affair had never happened, and if Johnson was playing with Cavan this weekend. But it has happened, and its just a joke that an organisation the size of the GAA has to resort to tactics like this because they've realised they dont actually know what to f**k they're doing.

And all that talk about ethos is bollocks, so please either desist or explain how it tallies with countless other players who are allowed to transfer, and players from stronger hurling counties being actually encouraged to transfer!! It would actually be a good ethos, but the fact of the matter is, it isnt one! The whole things a balls, but this latest episode starts to comfirm suspicions that the whole organisation is a balls.

OK. I'll try and make it simple for you.

The ethos of the GAA is that you play for the club and county where you were born and raised. You are supposed to feel a sense of identity for those with whom you play, and those whom you represent.

In certain circumstances people may change their club, based on their residency, and in doing so may decide to also represent that county or may retain allegience to their initial county.

In all these cases there *must* be an attachment to the club and county they want to represent. Allowing 'Free Movement' is the antithesis of this ethos.

Now, your big bugbear. Hurling. You are absolutely right in that the programme to allow certain hurlers represent other counties *does* fly in the face of this ethos. It absolutely does. However, it was initiated as a programme to help the counties involved, which were certainly in the lower tiers and weaker counties. It was and is a special circumstance designed to spread the gospel of hurling. It is almost the opposite of the Seanie Johnston Saga because in this case a player from a 'weaker' county is joining a 'stronger' one, at least in perception.

So while the hurling is definitely an approved exception, the ethos is still very much as I described.

[Dinny Breen]

It'd be great, and I'd vastly prefer it, if the whole affair had never happened, and if Johnson was playing with Cavan this weekend. But it has happened, and its just a joke that an organisation the size of the GAA has to resort to tactics like this because they've realised they dont actually know what to f**k they're doing.

And all that talk about ethos is bollocks, so please either desist or explain how it tallies with countless other players who are allowed to transfer, and players from stronger hurling counties being actually encouraged to transfer!! It would actually be a good ethos, but the fact of the matter is, it isnt one! The whole things a balls, but this latest episode starts to comfirm suspicions that the whole organisation is a balls.

OK. I'll try and make it simple for you.

The ethos of the GAA is that you play for the club and county where you were born and raised. You are supposed to feel a sense of identity for those with whom you play, and those whom you represent.

In certain circumstances people may change their club, based on their residency, and in doing so may decide to also represent that county or may retain allegience to their initial county.

In all these cases there *must* be an attachment to the club and county they want to represent. Allowing 'Free Movement' is the antithesis of this ethos.

Now, your big bugbear. Hurling. You are absolutely right in that the programme to allow certain hurlers represent other counties *does* fly in the face of this ethos. It absolutely does. However, it was initiated as a programme to help the counties involved, which were certainly in the lower tiers and weaker counties. It was and is a special circumstance designed to spread the gospel of hurling. It is almost the opposite of the Seanie Johnston Saga because in this case a player from a 'weaker' county is joining a 'stronger' one, at least in perception.

So while the hurling is definitely an approved exception, the ethos is still very much as I described.

AZ, firstly I am against SJ.

Now where was this ethos with Thomas Walsh, Niall Browne and more recently Enda Williams or Declan Brennan. Where was this ethos when Karl O'Dwyer played for Kildare or Larry Tompkins for Cork or Declan D'Arcy for Leitrim. Where was this ethos when half the Laois Senior Squad was playing in Dublin? It doesn't exist and is just a romantic notion that is pedaled out in cases like this.

[rrhf]

Very well articulated.  He has also the freedom to choose what he wants do to outside the GAA, ie play soccor for whoever he wants.  Kildare Town FC might be the handy choice within his locality and there would be the added carrot of a few pound.  Rugby as well let you pick your club and if hes prepared to really travel further than Straffan Australian rules might also be an opportunity. Theres so many great opportunities albeit outside GAA for a cub these days and particularly if you are prepared to travel.  But sadly the GAA structure rightly or wrongly tries to stop opportunistic transfers so its the wrong organisation for some.     

[J OGorman]

Bottom line, is McGeeney's approach to county football, or should I say, his uber professional approach not detrimental to both the GAA and Kildare? Kildare are fast becoming the most disliked team in the land. The county board is into the eyeballs giving McGeeney and his backroom team everything their hearts desire. They get a €300k handout from Croke Pk and a few days later jet off to Portugal (and no-one is buying the players paid for it cr&p). Seriously, what planet are these people living on?? The country's on its knees, unemployment is through the roof, most folk dont have the money to scratch their holes, yet a  county team up to its oxters heads off for 10 days warm weather training, crazy. Added to that, this dubious transfer and approaches to other players, imo whats going in Kildare is completely against what the GAA should be about

Even if Kildare did win the All-Ireland, would it really be all worth it? County board bankrupt, reputation in tatters
What price a Sam Maguire?

[Donnellys Hollow]

IF SJ wants his transfer and has his paperwork in order then let him go and play club football in Kildare. He can put in the effort with his new club to make their championship team for next year instead of parachuting in at the last minute and depriving some lad from Straffen the chance to play this weekend.

He's not wanting to transfer to Straffan, St Kevins are a 20 min drive away from Straffan! He wanted initially to remain a Cavan Gaels player and declare for Kildare at the same time. When that was shot down this convenient move to St Kevins (same club as Niall Carew) emerged.

If the transfer goes ahead after the Kevins/Leixlip match in Clane on Saturday he can play away for the remainder of the county league and championship but he cannot play for Kildare this summer because he won't have played in the Kildare club championship. The second round of the county championship in Kildare won't be played until after the county team's campaign is over.

Seeing as McGeeney obviously wants to get Seanie on board would he not be able to exert his influence and have a second round of championship games scheduled as soon as Seanie's club transfer goes through? I don't think we've heard the last of Seanie for this summer anyway.

The clubs will never agree to it now. The structure of the Kildare championship has changed this year and under the new system if you lose in the first and second round then you are gone. No club will want to risk being out of the county championship by mid-June. Lads would lose interest and the county league would turn into a farce.

Not a hope Leixlip will agree to delaying the match on Saturday and rightly so. They're warm favourites to beat Kevins as it stands so they'll hardly want to face them with Johnston in tow. The only hope he has is if there's a draw on Saturday night (replay would take place next Wednesday) but the CCCC would probably just postpone the meeting scheduled on Monday night again.

It's kind of ironic that the scheduling of the Kildare championship is preventing this from going through because it's largely down to McGeeney that it isn't run off while the county team are still involved in the All-Ireland.

[Croí na hÉireann]

It'd be great, and I'd vastly prefer it, if the whole affair had never happened, and if Johnson was playing with Cavan this weekend. But it has happened, and its just a joke that an organisation the size of the GAA has to resort to tactics like this because they've realised they dont actually know what to f**k they're doing.

And all that talk about ethos is bollocks, so please either desist or explain how it tallies with countless other players who are allowed to transfer, and players from stronger hurling counties being actually encouraged to transfer!! It would actually be a good ethos, but the fact of the matter is, it isnt one! The whole things a balls, but this latest episode starts to comfirm suspicions that the whole organisation is a balls.

OK. I'll try and make it simple for you.

The ethos of the GAA is that you play for the club and county where you were born and raised. You are supposed to feel a sense of identity for those with whom you play, and those whom you represent.

In certain circumstances people may change their club, based on their residency, and in doing so may decide to also represent that county or may retain allegience to their initial county.

In all these cases there *must* be an attachment to the club and county they want to represent. Allowing 'Free Movement' is the antithesis of this ethos.

Now, your big bugbear. Hurling. You are absolutely right in that the programme to allow certain hurlers represent other counties *does* fly in the face of this ethos. It absolutely does. However, it was initiated as a programme to help the counties involved, which were certainly in the lower tiers and weaker counties. It was and is a special circumstance designed to spread the gospel of hurling. It is almost the opposite of the Seanie Johnston Saga because in this case a player from a 'weaker' county is joining a 'stronger' one, at least in perception.

So while the hurling is definitely an approved exception, the ethos is still very much as I described.

Ahem.                   

[AZOffaly]

It'd be great, and I'd vastly prefer it, if the whole affair had never happened, and if Johnson was playing with Cavan this weekend. But it has happened, and its just a joke that an organisation the size of the GAA has to resort to tactics like this because they've realised they dont actually know what to f**k they're doing.

And all that talk about ethos is bollocks, so please either desist or explain how it tallies with countless other players who are allowed to transfer, and players from stronger hurling counties being actually encouraged to transfer!! It would actually be a good ethos, but the fact of the matter is, it isnt one! The whole things a balls, but this latest episode starts to comfirm suspicions that the whole organisation is a balls.

OK. I'll try and make it simple for you.

The ethos of the GAA is that you play for the club and county where you were born and raised. You are supposed to feel a sense of identity for those with whom you play, and those whom you represent.

In certain circumstances people may change their club, based on their residency, and in doing so may decide to also represent that county or may retain allegience to their initial county.

In all these cases there *must* be an attachment to the club and county they want to represent. Allowing 'Free Movement' is the antithesis of this ethos.

Now, your big bugbear. Hurling. You are absolutely right in that the programme to allow certain hurlers represent other counties *does* fly in the face of this ethos. It absolutely does. However, it was initiated as a programme to help the counties involved, which were certainly in the lower tiers and weaker counties. It was and is a special circumstance designed to spread the gospel of hurling. It is almost the opposite of the Seanie Johnston Saga because in this case a player from a 'weaker' county is joining a 'stronger' one, at least in perception.

So while the hurling is definitely an approved exception, the ethos is still very much as I described.

AZ, firstly I am against SJ.

Now where was this ethos with Thomas Walsh, Niall Browne and more recently Enda Williams or Declan Brennan. Where was this ethos when Karl O'Dwyer played for Kildare or Larry Tompkins for Cork or Declan D'Arcy for Leitrim. Where was this ethos when half the Laois Senior Squad was playing in Dublin? It doesn't exist and is just a romantic notion that is pedaled out in cases like this.

Most of those are wrong Dinny. But is it not better to enforce the rule and ethos rather than turn a blind eye to it? We all give out about this, and yet when it suits lads they are delighted.

If a fella moves to an area and transfers, I have no problem with that. That is by definition an attachment.

Karl O'Dwyer was living and working in Kildare I thought?

Juat because some lads try to flaunt the rules doesn't mean the rule or ethos is unworthy. Stand up for the rules I say.

But if a lad meets the rules, then let him off.

[AZOffaly]

It'd be great, and I'd vastly prefer it, if the whole affair had never happened, and if Johnson was playing with Cavan this weekend. But it has happened, and its just a joke that an organisation the size of the GAA has to resort to tactics like this because they've realised they dont actually know what to f**k they're doing.

And all that talk about ethos is bollocks, so please either desist or explain how it tallies with countless other players who are allowed to transfer, and players from stronger hurling counties being actually encouraged to transfer!! It would actually be a good ethos, but the fact of the matter is, it isnt one! The whole things a balls, but this latest episode starts to comfirm suspicions that the whole organisation is a balls.

OK. I'll try and make it simple for you.

The ethos of the GAA is that you play for the club and county where you were born and raised. You are supposed to feel a sense of identity for those with whom you play, and those whom you represent.

In certain circumstances people may change their club, based on their residency, and in doing so may decide to also represent that county or may retain allegience to their initial county.

In all these cases there *must* be an attachment to the club and county they want to represent. Allowing 'Free Movement' is the antithesis of this ethos.

Now, your big bugbear. Hurling. You are absolutely right in that the programme to allow certain hurlers represent other counties *does* fly in the face of this ethos. It absolutely does. However, it was initiated as a programme to help the counties involved, which were certainly in the lower tiers and weaker counties. It was and is a special circumstance designed to spread the gospel of hurling. It is almost the opposite of the Seanie Johnston Saga because in this case a player from a 'weaker' county is joining a 'stronger' one, at least in perception.

So while the hurling is definitely an approved exception, the ethos is still very much as I described.

Ahem.                   

Born in Dublin, raised in Offaly

[Donnellys Hollow]

Bottom line, is McGeeney's approach to county football, or should I say, his uber professional approach not detrimental to both the GAA and Kildare? Kildare are fast becoming the most disliked team in the land. The county board is into the eyeballs giving McGeeney and his backroom team everything their hearts desire. They get a €300k handout from Croke Pk and a few days later jet off to Portugal (and no-one is buying the players paid for it cr&p). Seriously, what planet are these people living on?? The country's on its knees, unemployment is through the roof, most folk dont have the money to scratch their holes, yet a  county team up to its oxters heads off for 10 days warm weather training, crazy. Added to that, this dubious transfer and approaches to other players, imo whats going in Kildare is completely against what the GAA should be about

Even if Kildare did win the All-Ireland, would it really be all worth it? County board bankrupt, reputation in tatters
What price a Sam Maguire?

Nonsense. The €300k was simply an advance on money that was going to be paid to KCB anyway. The players funded their trip to Portugal through their grant money and various other fundraising efforts. They also didn't go on a holiday last winter (unlike plenty of other county teams) so they could take that training trip to Portugal.

Although the money being spent on county teams these days is far too high, it is not the reason for KCB's financial issues. The repayments on the €3.5m centre of excellence at Hawkfield are the root cause of the current debt.

[Dinny Breen]

It'd be great, and I'd vastly prefer it, if the whole affair had never happened, and if Johnson was playing with Cavan this weekend. But it has happened, and its just a joke that an organisation the size of the GAA has to resort to tactics like this because they've realised they dont actually know what to f**k they're doing.

And all that talk about ethos is bollocks, so please either desist or explain how it tallies with countless other players who are allowed to transfer, and players from stronger hurling counties being actually encouraged to transfer!! It would actually be a good ethos, but the fact of the matter is, it isnt one! The whole things a balls, but this latest episode starts to comfirm suspicions that the whole organisation is a balls.

OK. I'll try and make it simple for you.

The ethos of the GAA is that you play for the club and county where you were born and raised. You are supposed to feel a sense of identity for those with whom you play, and those whom you represent.

In certain circumstances people may change their club, based on their residency, and in doing so may decide to also represent that county or may retain allegience to their initial county.

In all these cases there *must* be an attachment to the club and county they want to represent. Allowing 'Free Movement' is the antithesis of this ethos.

Now, your big bugbear. Hurling. You are absolutely right in that the programme to allow certain hurlers represent other counties *does* fly in the face of this ethos. It absolutely does. However, it was initiated as a programme to help the counties involved, which were certainly in the lower tiers and weaker counties. It was and is a special circumstance designed to spread the gospel of hurling. It is almost the opposite of the Seanie Johnston Saga because in this case a player from a 'weaker' county is joining a 'stronger' one, at least in perception.

So while the hurling is definitely an approved exception, the ethos is still very much as I described.

AZ, firstly I am against SJ.

Now where was this ethos with Thomas Walsh, Niall Browne and more recently Enda Williams or Declan Brennan. Where was this ethos when Karl O'Dwyer played for Kildare or Larry Tompkins for Cork or Declan D'Arcy for Leitrim. Where was this ethos when half the Laois Senior Squad was playing in Dublin? It doesn't exist and is just a romantic notion that is pedaled out in cases like this.

Most of those are wrong Dinny. But is it not better to enforce the rule and ethos rather than turn a blind eye to it? We all give out about this, and yet when it suits lads they are delighted.

Of course it is but how can you talk about ethics in this case when it has been blatantly ignored for years, it is not ethos it's hypocrisy.

Karl O'Dwyer was living and working in Kildare I thought?

Oh you romantic, he moved to Kildare then got a job teaching, played intermediate and then moved to senior club, difference though he was discarded by Kerry and not rated as highly as SJ, Karl though has settled in Kildare can't see Seanie settling down somehow. Social media, the modern media and the internet has changed this kind of game and the GAA are playing catch up when for years it was easier to ignore.

[Dinny Breen]

Bottom line, is McGeeney's approach to county football, or should I say, his uber professional approach not detrimental to both the GAA and Kildare? Kildare are fast becoming the most disliked team in the land. The county board is into the eyeballs giving McGeeney and his backroom team everything their hearts desire. They get a €300k handout from Croke Pk and a few days later jet off to Portugal (and no-one is buying the players paid for it cr&p). Seriously, what planet are these people living on?? The country's on its knees, unemployment is through the roof, most folk dont have the money to scratch their holes, yet a  county team up to its oxters heads off for 10 days warm weather training, crazy. Added to that, this dubious transfer and approaches to other players, imo whats going in Kildare is completely against what the GAA should be about

Even if Kildare did win the All-Ireland, would it really be all worth it? County board bankrupt, reputation in tatters
What price a Sam Maguire?

Nonsense. The €300k was simply an advance on money that was going to be paid to KCB anyway. The players funded their trip to Portugal through their grant money and various other fundraising efforts. They also didn't go on a holiday last winter (unlike plenty of other county teams) so they could take that training trip to Portugal.

Although the money being spent on county teams these days is far too high, it is not the reason for KCB's financial issues. The repayments on the €3.5m centre of excellence at Hawkfield are the root cause of the current debt.

Stopping introducing facts DH, ignorance is a much better form of argument.

[Donnellys Hollow]

Karl O'Dwyer was living and working in Kildare I thought?

Oh you romantic, he moved to Kildare then got a job teaching, played intermediate and then moved to senior club, difference though he was discarded by Kerry and not rated as highly as SJ, Karl though has settled in Kildare can't see Seanie settling down somehow. Social media, the modern media and the internet has changed this kind of game and the GAA are playing catch up when for years it was easier to ignore.

How long was Karl with Rathangan for? I think Micko owned the garage on the Allen side of the village. He probably still does!!

[haranguerer]

The ethos of the GAA is that you play for the club and county where you were born and raised. You are supposed to feel a sense of identity for those with whom you play, and those whom you represent.

You are absolutely right in that the programme to allow certain hurlers represent other counties *does* fly in the face of this ethos.

And I'll also try to keep it simple. The bit in bold is a worthwhile ethos, and one certainly worth standing by. But it no longer exists, so theres nothing to stand by.

An ethos is a fundamental value. There can be very few reasons for changing a fundamental value, and no reasons whatsoever for the organisation which supposedly has at their core this fundamental value, to actually contradict it. By doing so, no matter about the reasoning behind it, they have demonstrated, that it actually isnt their ethos, and lost any credibility they may have had when they try to reclaim this ethos later, as in the SJ saga.

Any reasons for the contradiction of what may previously have been an ethos are irrelevant, the fact remains that it was to be a fundamental value, and as such, something the organisation stood by in the face of all else.

Btw, hurling isnt any big 'bugbear' of mine - it should appear obvious that I've quoted it often purely because its just the most simple example for me to use, and doesnt involve getting into the ins and outs of individual cases (see what happened above with those cases dinny mentioned). You also appear to be saying, or at least implying in that paragraph that the ethos isnt as important as long as the traffic is from stronger to weaker counties. If this is the case, when you read it back I hope the ridiculousness of that isnt lost on you. 

[AZOffaly]

It'd be great, and I'd vastly prefer it, if the whole affair had never happened, and if Johnson was playing with Cavan this weekend. But it has happened, and its just a joke that an organisation the size of the GAA has to resort to tactics like this because they've realised they dont actually know what to f**k they're doing.

And all that talk about ethos is bollocks, so please either desist or explain how it tallies with countless other players who are allowed to transfer, and players from stronger hurling counties being actually encouraged to transfer!! It would actually be a good ethos, but the fact of the matter is, it isnt one! The whole things a balls, but this latest episode starts to comfirm suspicions that the whole organisation is a balls.

OK. I'll try and make it simple for you.

The ethos of the GAA is that you play for the club and county where you were born and raised. You are supposed to feel a sense of identity for those with whom you play, and those whom you represent.

In certain circumstances people may change their club, based on their residency, and in doing so may decide to also represent that county or may retain allegience to their initial county.

In all these cases there *must* be an attachment to the club and county they want to represent. Allowing 'Free Movement' is the antithesis of this ethos.

Now, your big bugbear. Hurling. You are absolutely right in that the programme to allow certain hurlers represent other counties *does* fly in the face of this ethos. It absolutely does. However, it was initiated as a programme to help the counties involved, which were certainly in the lower tiers and weaker counties. It was and is a special circumstance designed to spread the gospel of hurling. It is almost the opposite of the Seanie Johnston Saga because in this case a player from a 'weaker' county is joining a 'stronger' one, at least in perception.

So while the hurling is definitely an approved exception, the ethos is still very much as I described.

AZ, firstly I am against SJ.

Now where was this ethos with Thomas Walsh, Niall Browne and more recently Enda Williams or Declan Brennan. Where was this ethos when Karl O'Dwyer played for Kildare or Larry Tompkins for Cork or Declan D'Arcy for Leitrim. Where was this ethos when half the Laois Senior Squad was playing in Dublin? It doesn't exist and is just a romantic notion that is pedaled out in cases like this.

Most of those are wrong Dinny. But is it not better to enforce the rule and ethos rather than turn a blind eye to it? We all give out about this, and yet when it suits lads they are delighted.

Of course it is but how can you talk about ethics in this case when it has been blatantly ignored for years, it is not ethos it's hypocrisy.

Karl O'Dwyer was living and working in Kildare I thought?

Oh you romantic, he moved to Kildare then got a job teaching, played intermediate and then moved to senior club, difference though he was discarded by Kerry and not rated as highly as SJ, Karl though has settled in Kildare can't see Seanie settling down somehow. Social media, the modern media and the internet has changed this kind of game and the GAA are playing catch up when for years it was easier to ignore.

Ethos is Ethos. There are thousands and thousands of players throughout the country. Most of them abide by this ethos, and in fact a lot of them go to huge lengths to stay with their home club. We are talking about a tiny, high profile, minority. They cannot set the ethos, the majority set the ethos.