The Heineken Cup Thread

[AZOffaly]

If it's Munster v Leinster, it will be in Thomond Park, or at least it should be assuming Munster have home advantage. (Big assumption with Montauban upcoming). Thomond Park holds 26k, so it should be ok for it, given that Munster played the Q/F in Kingsholm last year.

[Tankie]

If it's Munster v Leinster, it will be in Thomond Park, or at least it should be assuming Munster have home advantage. (Big assumption with Montauban upcoming). Thomond Park holds 26k, so it should be ok for it, given that Munster played the Q/F in Kingsholm last year.

Well it would be the IRFU's decision, i'm sure if they could get Croker thats where it would be, i cant see them taking it outside the country tho if it was to happen. Where with a Semi-final they would have no choice if Croker was not available!

[Kerry Mike]

Croker only available for Internationals , so no HC games will be played there. Savage performance by Munster on Friday night, setup nicely for a home 1/4 if they can do the business in France will be tough but its in their hands now.

The 40:1 from Ladbrokes on O'Connells first try was warmly welcomed too in these cold & hard economic times 

[Tankie]

Croker only available for Internationals , so no HC games will be played there. Savage performance by Munster on Friday night, setup nicely for a home 1/4 if they can do the business in France will be tough but its in their hands now.

The 40:1 from Ladbrokes on O'Connells first try was warmly welcomed too in these cold & hard economic times 

Doesnt really make sense when you look at it now that Croker cannot host this game (if it was to happen) but there you go!


I dont think Munster have much to worry about this weekend, where as I could see Leinster losing!!!!

[AZOffaly]

Croker only available for Internationals , so no HC games will be played there. Savage performance by Munster on Friday night, setup nicely for a home 1/4 if they can do the business in France will be tough but its in their hands now.

The 40:1 from Ladbrokes on O'Connells first try was warmly welcomed too in these cold & hard economic times 

Doesnt really make sense when you look at it now that Croker cannot host this game (if it was to happen) but there you go!


I dont think Munster have much to worry about this weekend, where as I could see Leinster losing!!!!

It makes sense to Munster. In this hypothetical situation, why would you take the game away from Thomond Park, where Munster would have home advantage?  What would be the point in building this new stadium that comfortably meets the HEC Q/F attendance requirements, only to give any advantage away when you play your biggest rivals? That would stick in my craw.

[Dinny Breen]

The game would be in Turnip Park, why would Munster give up home advantage, the IRFU would not dictate otherwise. Anyway lot of rugby before that happens, I can see Munster losing in France and although I can Leinster winning I think they won't get the bonus but a win should get them at least a best loser place which wouldn't be too bad, an away quarter to Cardiff is a better option that Turnip Park.

[AZOffaly]

Turnip Park  ? I wouldn't be overly confident in Montauban either Dinny, certainly not overly confident about getting 4 tries. As for Leinster, I'm sure they'll handle Edinburgh handily enough. It could end up with Leinster at home (Where would that be played?)

Anyway, I heard a much better description of Leinster a couple of weeks ago. I was always uncomfortable calling them the Ladyboys, it was a bit OTT. But from now on I will happily refer to them as the Latte Boys.

[Uladh]

Edinburgh is a tough ask. surely contepomi will have to play at stand off?

As a long time admirer of munster and the munstr way i'm thinking of jumping ship. as muh as i admire the ability and charachter of men like o'connell and wallace the media love in is sickening me. maybe i just like to be in the underdog's camp. feck it, part of me wants armagh to take micko's advice and to dissapear back to the wilderness at a faster rate than they currently are...

[AZOffaly]

I can see where you are coming from Uladh. There was a good article in the paper (may have been the Tribune) last week headlined. 'Leinster's greatest crime is that they are not Munster'. In other words they are being completely given a hard time in the media, compared to the soft soap that Munster get when they have a bad performance. Munster get criticised, but it's much more analytical in terms of what's going on. Leinster are criticised for lack of leadership, heart, spirit etc etc. And it gets personal too. I think too many people in the Irish media try to hide it, but they don't really like the likes of Contempomi etc.

There's no doubt that Munster are a great team at competing and now winning trophies, and have been for a few years. There's also no doubt that a good atmosphere at Thomond Park is something to be experienced, but make no mistake, as this recession hits, and when Munster hit the inevitable wall in terms of performance and achievement, the Munster phenomonen will drift away. I just hope that when it does we have a core of 10-15k that will still go to the games and cheer on Munster, with the fervour that they have now. I think that's what you will see, and the media will get off the bandwagon completely then.

Munster are a great story. The teams trials, tribulations and finally, triumphs. The heartbraeaking stories, interspersed with glorious victories agains the odds, and seismic moments like Gloucester, Sale, Saracens, Toulouse etc. The carnival that follows them in terms of fans. The aura of Thomond Park. All of that stuff makes a great story, but a lot of what is written is just like a spin off series from that story. The bare truth is that Munster fans, and bandwagonners, have been very lucky to have a team that inspires all of us, but that team will not be there forever. What happens after that will be the real test of the 'Munster' that the media has portrayed.

[Uladh]

Is there any truth in the english/scottish/welsh accusations that munster and leinster enjoy an unfair advantage in terms of their geographical areas of pull and therefore the financial muscle?

i don't know what ulster's excuse is

[AZOffaly]

Well the Welsh and Scottish RFUs have also set up regional teams. Glasgow and Edinburgh are not the Glasgows and Edinburghs of 20 years ago, and Welsh rugby has done the same. I suppose those countries wouldn't have the same regional identity that is such a part of Ireland (promoted by the GAA!!).

In terms of finance, I'm not sure of the numbers, but English clubs were paying big money, and French clubs crazy money, and I don't think Irish contracts apart from the likes of O'Discoll, O'Connell, etc are in the hundreds of thousands or anything like that. In terms of demographics, I suppose Munster would have a million or so people in it's catchment area, whereas Leinster slightly more than that. The English Clubs like Sale and 'Quins and Wasps and Leicester would have more than that. The West Country region in England (Bristol, Gloucester, Bath) would probably be weakest in terms of catchment area because they are relatively small cities, and the population centres around them would be split as all clubs are close enough together.

The real unfairness would be Garryowen taking on huge clubs like Sale, without any sort of comparable finances, which is what the English clubs would like. I think it's fair enough at the moment, the problem is the English clubs are playing poorly.

[Uladh]

Fair enough. i'm not well up on irfu structures and its a charge that these scots throw up at me regularly. i'll have a half assed defence now.

i'd imagine the leading irish players could command relative fortune n england or france then and stay for the betterment of irish rugby?

[Dinny Breen]

i'd imagine the leading irish players could command relative fortune n england or france then and stay for the betterment of irish rugby?

Yes but once an Irish professional finishes playing rugby in Ireland he's entitled to get all his tax back that he paid over his professional career, a massive incentive plus player burn-out and management is handled far better in Ireland, professionals in Ireland are capped at 33 games, in France or England they could end up playing closer to 40, the more games the more chance of injury.

The Irish are very parochial and reallly bought into the Provinces, no surprise really when considers the success of the Railway cup in the 30s, 40s, 50s etc. This was all helped by the failed success of Munster which build a legacy and the 99 success of Ulster which provided a benchmark to the other provinces and demonstrated we could compete afer decades of failure at International level. The Welsh need Cardiff or the Ospreys to get to a final this year, if that happens the Regions will take off, still very divisive at the moment. Scotland is a strange fish, traditional the Borders was the rugby stronghold but the clubs refused to support the franchise and SRFU threw their all into Edinburgh and Glasgow and with 12K at their recent xmas derby the outlook is at least positive.

The problem in England is that there is very little rugby shown on Terrestrial TV and the growth of the game has stagnated particulary with the 24/7 Premiership Soccer saturation, England should have pushed on from the World Cup win in 2003 but they haven't, still the population base alone means they will always be competitive..

[Tankie]

The game would be in Turnip Park, why would Munster give up home advantage, the IRFU would not dictate otherwise. Anyway lot of rugby before that happens, I can see Munster losing in France and although I can Leinster winning I think they won't get the bonus but a win should get them at least a best loser place which wouldn't be too bad, an away quarter to Cardiff is a better option that Turnip Park.

If the IRFU could get 83k into Croker the game would be played in Croker. In 2006 Munster played their Q/F in LR!

[Hound]

Edinburgh is a tough ask. surely contepomi will have to play at stand off?

Yeah, well Cheika ignored the Magners League form in the run up to the Wasps game, but maybe he'll finally cop on now. Nacewa is a quality player, but doesnt have the kicking game to be an out half IMO. I'd have Felipe at 10 and Nacewa at 12.