AI Football Final 2010: An Corcaigh vs An Dún

[Banana Man]

back of the irish news seems to think that rodgers is definitley out and canty will start, hope they are wrong on rodgers, i hope they are right on canty, can't see him being up to the task of detailing marty clark given his layoff, a fully fit canty yes but one that has a dodgey hammie and not at full pelt training would i think struggle

having said that no doubt canty will still have  a stormer, a legend of a man, would love to see himget a celtic cross (just not this year  )

[western exile]

The big question to me is.  Will Cork take anything from the cynicism of their opponents in last years all ireland final.  Nobody expected Kerry to try to remove the heads of the Cork Lads last year -- thats what they did.   When a game is between 2 football teams its usually the team that changes tactics,  hits the hardest and is prepared to do anything to win that wins.  Are either of these teams prepared to get down and dirty...

Here is James McCartan's answer to your question in today's papers....

"There is no doubt that Cork have a huge panel and are huge physically as well and it is going to take a huge game from us to try and win this.
They are probably the biggest team about. You do spend a wee bit of time trying to figure out – can we win possession, can we break tackles?
"We think we have good footballers, but to get good footballers you have to earn the right to play and we are going to have to at least challenge Cork's physicality. I don't mean go out looking for trouble by any means, but if a man comes to hit you a shoulder, you have to try and be able to stand up to it.
"I wouldn't say we will go looking for trouble because we would be happy if it is an open game. They are a big, strong physical team and well able to mix it and we are just going to have to be able to survive if that happens."

[Jinxy]

back of the irish news seems to think that rodgers is definitley out and canty will start, hope they are wrong on rodgers, i hope they are right on canty, can't see him being up to the task of detailing marty clark given his layoff, a fully fit canty yes but one that has a dodgey hammie and not at full pelt training would i think struggle

having said that no doubt canty will still have  a stormer, a legend of a man, would love to see himget a celtic cross (just not this year  )

Canty will be nowhere near Clarke either way.
Shields will probably pick him up.

[western exile]

back of the irish news seems to think that rodgers is definitley out and canty will start, hope they are wrong on rodgers, i hope they are right on canty, can't see him being up to the task of detailing marty clark given his layoff, a fully fit canty yes but one that has a dodgey hammie and not at full pelt training would i think struggle

having said that no doubt canty will still have  a stormer, a legend of a man, would love to see himget a celtic cross (just not this year  )

Canty will be nowhere near Clarke either way.
Shields will probably pick him up.

Or possibly Eoin Cadogan ?

[Jinxy]

I thought this was an interesting quote from Clarke which highlights the different demands in terms of fitness between gaelic football and aussie rules.

http://www.hoganstand.com/ArticleForm.aspx?ID=135548


"I took home a fair bit, in terms of the weight training and that. I was able to taper my own programme along with Paddy Tally (Down trainer), but the weights in Australia are not that far advanced compared to the GAA," he said.

"Everybody has their own programme and it's a case of following it strictly and approaching it in the right way.

"But, in terms of overall fitness, I'm only starting to get it right recently. It's just been 10 months since I got back and I'm only seeing out games properly now. The main thing I took from Australia is using my voice on the field in training and in games. That's a big focus over there. In previous years, I wasn't doing that as much."

[Jinxy]

back of the irish news seems to think that rodgers is definitley out and canty will start, hope they are wrong on rodgers, i hope they are right on canty, can't see him being up to the task of detailing marty clark given his layoff, a fully fit canty yes but one that has a dodgey hammie and not at full pelt training would i think struggle

having said that no doubt canty will still have  a stormer, a legend of a man, would love to see himget a celtic cross (just not this year  )

Canty will be nowhere near Clarke either way.
Shields will probably pick him up.

Or possibly Eoin Cadogan ?

I think Cadogan will take Coulter.

[Oldhacker]

The posters who are complaining about regular public appearances by Down players obviously did not hear James McCartan's comments during the fund-raising breakfast in Newry earlier this week. James explained that a single media night is held a couple of weeks before the final when a range of interviews are staged and the relared stories are then published and broadcast on a daily basis in the run-up to September 19.

The players also attend a small number of other events, but the shutters come down around ten days before the final. The Canal Court breakfast was the only exception, but it was well-managed and over by 9.30am The Tyrone team which won three All Irelands in the last seven years followed a very similar policy towards the Ulster All Stars and other invitations and it did not do them much harm.

Ronan Murtagh did open a new business in Newry, but this had been planned for some time and again took place ten days before the final.

The objective should surely be to ensure that the players are not placed uinder any undue pressure but also manage to live fairly normal lives and enjoy at least a little of the build-up. Benny Coulter, who is admittedlly one of our most experienced players, has said that he is enjoying every minute of it but still maintaining his focus, which seems reasonable. His younger colleagues are keeping a lower profile, which is also fair.

[Fuzzman]

Only 17 pages on the Thur before the AI final. I am amazed but suppose I'm as guilty as many of the other Tyrone/Armagh fans that normally bombard these board.

I've only been reading backwards from 17 to page 15 and haven't found too much meaty content as yet to dwell on. A lot of people are sitting on the fence me thinks.
I'd have to agree 100% here with Onion Bag that we all know Cork can be formidable opponents and they had me very worried last year v Tyrone but I've saw them v the Dubs this year and they've definitely went backwards and so I'm don't think they have that level of hunger, work ethic and drive that they had for us last year. Then again they've probably not met a team of that level since Tyrone as Kildare were good but seemed to lack belief. Down really crumbled v Tyrone in that 2nd half and whilst I think & hope they've moved on and learnt from that I fear Cork will ask such serious questions from them

I suppose most people are hanging on to this idea that if Cork can get back those qualities that beat Tyrone last year then they should win but Down have progresses and toughened up. Remind me lads have they had to come back from any big deficits this year or have they nearly always being leading most games. I know Kildare got off to a great start but should Cork do the same will Down have the strength of character to do the same or will they crumble.

My heart certainly says Down and most times my head does too. The 5 unbeaten finals does stand a lot to the team and if you compare mental status of both teams then Down should win easy.
You've got a team who have won all AI finals they've ever been in and have a natural Northern cockiness playing a team that have been underperforming for a number of years now and seem to often question themselves in such big games. With the exception of that Tyrone game last year when else have Cork beat a big team that you expected them to?

I'm going for Down but its very much up to this young inexperienced Down team performing on the day and not being a startled earwig. ;-)

I'm all for the traditional Down cockiness, its good, but we must not allow this to blur the facts facing us in Sunday's challenge.  This Cork team are serious opposition and we are rightly underdogs. 

I am in little doubt Down will win but!!!  should Cork find ther 2009 form that has deserted them so far this year we stand to lose our proud record of never been beaten in an AIF.   If that is the case then fair fecks to Cork (always liked them anyway).  From 1 - 15 (or 20) they have the bigger, stronger more experienced squad than us and, were it not a final, my money would be on Cork. 

But it is a final so we have a real chance and we are quite good at finals.  We have a skillful set of forwards, an organised defensive system, a competitive midfield and a useful bench.  Cork have these as well so hopefully, together they will dish us up a great final of open attacking football.   Can't wait. 

To all Down heads I say keep up the craic, enjoy the banter but, especially on this, the only sensible thread on the go at the moment, lets keep it real, fact based and most of all mutually respectful. 
Take the slagging, shitetalk and banter to Hardstation's and Trout's threads instead.  They will believe anything you post.

[Jinxy]

There's pretty much no Cork posters here.
Hard to get much of a thread going.

[cornafean]

You've got a team who have won all AI finals they've ever been in and have a natural Northern cockiness playing a team that have been underperforming for a number of years now and seem to often question themselves in such big games.

There is a bit of a pattern here. Ulster teams have faced non-Ulster opposition 8 times in All Ireland finals in the past 20 years, and have won 7 of the 8. Its hard to imagine that this happened by accident. (In addition, most of those teams were counted as underdogs before their respective finals.)

[Banana Man]

yeah it's pretty poor the little amount of chat there is, as someone said there are very few cork posters on the board, i think everyone in down is quietly confident though

i see that chicken that picks the result like Paul the octopus picked cork, the one consolation is thought they used red and black to represent down and not yellow 

[CompulsoryTillager]

Dromara Gael is quite right about Down wearing an all black strip against Cork in the NFL but it is going back quite a while - probably around 25 years. My recollection is that the game may have been played in Castlewellan and I have a notion that the great Tommy McGovern might have got a rare score for us late on.

1982 it was, and Tommy McGovern scored 1-1, it finished Down 1-6 Cork 2-3

Think I was at that game, do you have the full teams Tillager? I have a vague recollection of a less than svelte Christy Ryan playing full forward for Cork.

Centre-back according to the following day's Indo!

DOWN: P Donnam; P Kennedy, M Curley, M O'Higgins; A Quiery, P O'Rourke, B McGovern; T McGovern, C Burns; J McCartan, A Rodgers, D Bell; M Linden, B Loughran, J Digney. Subs: B Gardiner for Loughran, N King for O'Higgins.
CORK: M Creedon; S Fuohy, T Creedon, J Evans; M Moloney, C Ryan, T O'Callaghan; T O'Reilly, M Burns; D Barry, E O'Mahony, E Murphy; N O'Connor, D McCarthy, J Cleary. Subs: M Connolly for Burns.
Referee: J Toner (Armagh).

[Fuzzman]

I don't get your point. Of course most counties face counties from other provinces most of the time over the past 20 years.
There has only been Cork & Kerry twice and Tyrone v Armagh to break that pattern.

Wonder will Cork target Martin Clarke for some rough & tumble early on. I'd say he'll not be allowed so much time on the ball this time though he's good at making time for himself.

There is a bit of a pattern here. Ulster teams have faced non-Ulster opposition 8 times in All Ireland finals in the past 20 years, and have won 7 of the 8. Its hard to imagine that this happened by accident. (In addition, most of those teams were counted as underdogs before their respective finals.)

[southdown]

Clarke seems to get rid of the ball very quickly which makes it very hard to get close to him. He seems to know exactly what he is going to do with the ball before he gets it.

[jas376]

.....
            Also, to all those people who have been critical of Cork football here and elsewhere, let me just cite one statistic that is sustaining us all in hope down here in Cork  i.e. only one county has defeated Cork in championship football since 2004.

              Now, if only we could maintain that record for just one more game then our mission would be accomplished and everything else would be irrelevant.

valid stat okay. Nor, in same years,  have Cork played a team good enough to have beaten Kerry    until next Sunday

     Fair play, Good point! The answer is no, it hasn't. Sunday will be the first time,as far as I know, which makes it all the more intriguing.
     

      Also, please remember that Cork has played Kerry twice this season and has done reasonably well against them  -  they drew the first game and only lost the replay by a single point to a Kerry team that included Paul Galvin and Tomas O Se.
     Also, I thought Kerry might have been somewhat complacent when playing  Down in this year's quarter final. Kerry went into that game as All-Ireland champions and Munster champions to face a team that had lost in Ulster and hadn't really figured in the latter stages of the championship in recent years and hadn't been overly impressive in the qualifiers. That day Kerry looked far less organised than they usually do when playing their arch rivals Cork and they definitely were affected by the loss of Galvin and O Se.