Messages

Johnny,
          Down were brutal in the 1st half although in fairness to Armagh they harried and chased everything during that period. Big Kieran had another good game and cleared a lot of ball with Armagh moving 4 different men on him although once again he needs to move the ball quicker.

Full back line have to be happy with no goals for the second consecutive match but delivery from the half backs will have to improve as we continue to hit too many hail mary shots.

Midfield dominated when they got into the game although the concern is that Down have now started every slowly in their past two matches,do that against Meath and it could be lights out.

Dule came into it when he moved off McCormack who was bossing him physically in the tight confines of Ballycran but he really opened the shoulders in the second half as did Conor Woods which was pleasing. I really rate Conor and its good to see him get a chance. Ciaran Coulter a vast improvement on Emmett and surely has to start the next day while James did rightly when we came on but hard to judge really as the game was over at that stage.

Big Magic returning will give us a more physical and potent threat in the full forward line which is badly needed. All in all not a bad display but we need to be out of the blocks V Meath the next day in what is shaping up to be a promotion play off- not discounting Derry but expect it to be a straight play off between Down,Carlow and Meath for promotion with Carlow looking good after their win against Meath. How costly will that last minute free in Ballycran prove before the year is out.

This was the inevitable consequence once we opened Croke Park up. As someone who has had his fair share of run ins with the horsey's personal army I have to say that while I'd prefer if she didn't visit Croke Park I knew this day would come as a result of opening it up to other sports.

Is it hard to take yes, can we do anything about it no! Reality is the orgainsation made its choice and we have to live with that, it was the same for my own club when the PSNI got to play before the All Ireland U21 hurling semi final in Newry between the Dubs and Derry, as dictated by Ulster Council and Croke Park. It hurt like hell to see the b*stards out on the field but we have to try and move on at the end of the day, we all have our beliefs and traditions but let's not forget that we are a sporting organisation first and foremost and that has to be the guiding light in any decision that we make.

Personally I hope there are no protests outside the game as it would only reflect poorly on the GAA even though its a rugby game its being held in our ground. As for what Hogan would have thought who knows, you can't second guess the feelings of the dead.

Johnny whoever worte the article in Outlook is stirring,the pitch isn't ruined at all. To be honest it did take a hammering when the Mc Kenna cup was being played and in fact all that running across the pitch DJ does probably did more damage!

I think what the real issue was that the hurlers booked the pitch for a "challenge game" but it then transpired that the "challenge game" was among themselves and as such was a training game. In my opinion the hurlers are as entitled to the pitch as the footballers and I will certainly be raising it at the club if we are going to start this nonesense where the footballers have access to Pairc Esler but the hurlers don't. On that issue I'd have thought that the county board should have played the Armagh V Down hurling match in Pairc Esler this weekend given the local interest probably would have boosted the crowd.

I wouldn't necessarily blame the Ards clubs over the minor debacle as I think the way this was communicated is the real issue and not the actual idea in terms of getting a look at everyone by utilising both the A and B league. Something similar was done for the past two years with the non Ards players playing on the A or B team as required and everyone getting their chance, communication as always in this county the big fall down.

In saying that best of luck to Dutch and his fellow mentors for teh coming year although I feel they will have an uphill battle given the strength of the current antrim minor team who are significantly better than in 2007.

Feet of Flames, explain the Donal Og stir up comment. Is this another GPA gripe, it should be remembered that there are a lot more players in the GPA than Donal Og yet as he is the spokesperson he takes the flak for all the members who vote on their actions. I know some people on the board think I'm pro GPA and constantly standing up for the likes of Donal Og but as I know the guys personally I feel obilgied to answer some of the blatant untrues and mis-representation being posted here.

You clearly have no idea of what the guy does in his own club (coaching juveniles, on the club committee etc) or indeed outside of his club to promote hurling and I have little doubt that his record as a GAA man stands up very favourably with your own.

Just to give you an example, two years ago donal Og organised for the Down minors to travel to Cloyne and have a coaching weekend there hosted by himself, Sean Og, Diarmuid O'Sullivan and John Allen. All the organisation including the challenge match was organised by Donal Og and everyone of the lads involved refused to take anything for their efforts. Not only that but for the past three years Donal Og and Diarmuid O'Sullivan have travelled to Newry to help promote the primary school coaching underway and once again refused to take a penny even though both lads had to take Friday off work to visit the schools.

Get your facts right before accusing people of not being decent human beings and not true gaels, by the way the guy is also fluent in Irish so I think he scores heavily on the "true gael" mark on that one.

Feet of flames, I think people like Sean Moylan, Tom Barry, Terence Mc Swiney, Liam Lynch etc would all disagree with your quote of they only ever had one rebel, take the road from Cork city to Killarney and just count the sheer number of memorials to volunteers from the War of Indepenence!

As for people being unfit to wear the Cork jersey, I think you would be hard pushed to find any group of players who feel as passionately about Cork hurling as the Cork team do. Let's now forget that the basis of this team lifted Cork from the doldrums no Munster title from 1992-1999 to a situation where they have won five Munster titles and 3 All-Irelands in the period since.

There is only one solution to this as I have said in earlier posts and that is for Teddy Holland to stand down, the man lost all credibility with the players due to the underhand manner in which he took the job. In his heart of hearts he knows that he would never have got offered the job if the 1st,2nd, 3rd, 4th, 5th, 6th choices had wanted it or more corerectly decided to stand aside given the players wish that no-one go into role until the selector issue was resolved.

I saw Des Culliane and Bob Ryan on RTE again last night trying the same ould spin as they have over the past 3-4 wks and to make it worse they repeated the lie about the players being willing to play under Teddy Holland. To put the man in place is bad enough but to actually try to mis-represent what was said in confidential discussions just highlights how underhand the CCB has been in their whole dealings with this.

As I said in an earlier post last week from what I've been told the players won't be budging unless Teddy Holland does the decent thing and steps down, if the guy is really a Cork GAA man he will step aside.

Considering Down hit the post and missed two penalties I'd say Carlow were relieved enough with the draw at the end. Agree that we have big problems in the forwards although the quality of the ball going into them is brutal.

Big Kieran struggles from the lack of top class hurling in terms of getting the ball away quicker with a shorter stroke as he can get away with the big wind up at club level but he is learning and improving all the time. The question everyone was asking afterwards was who made the decision to let Simon Wilson hit the last 65, seemed a crazy decision and probably one that Simon took himself rather than instruction from the sideline.

Stephen Murray was a vast improvement on Gazza in full forward although we need Magic back big time if we are to make an impact on the Chirsty Ring. Thought the full back line played well both individually and as a unit once they got to grips with things as Carlow stormed ahead 0-5 to no score and indeed could have had a goal in the same period. Big Kieran won a lot of ball and consdiering he was playing with three stiches in his hand did really well as you could clearly see him avoiding catching the ball in his left hand. Thought Gabriel Clarke did alright particularly in the 2nd hald but Simon Wilson hardly struck a ball all day.

Midfield was pretty even with Brendan and Ruairi getting through a lot of work with some good play and I thought big Ruari tried very hard although was caught in possession a few times although Carlow were fairly handy around the middle of the park with the centre back a good hurler and the centre 3/4 Foley who came out to midefield showing well.

Upfront, the Rat tried hard without getting a lot of service and I though Dule played well given its his first NHL game in a long while. Mc Garry will obviously take time to adjust to the higher level and you could see him getting caught in possession a few times through indecsion but to be honest I thought he did rightly while Ciaran Coulter showed well on his introduction .

Carlow look a handy outfit with some good hurlers, impressed by their upper body stregth Down really struggled to break the tackle with them while their free taker didn't miss a shot all day which was lucky for them given the sheer volume of frees they got from Mr Devlin (surprise surprise!)

Have to admit given everything that happened in the game I was happy enough and expect Down to pick up two points next week against Armagh. Don't agree about the crowd though was hardly 150-200 people there. If you had the Armagh match in Newry next week you could expect 2-3 times that crowd - but doing that might indicate a bit of progressive thinking by the county board!

If you saw my efforts on the hruling field AZ you would be in no doubt on that one! 

The rise of Dublin hurling has been great to see and highlights what can be done with the proper funding and coaching structures being put in place. Paudie Butler told a great story at a coaching course I was at recently in dublin where he said that the Dublin lads at the DJ Carey school of hurling were actually asking constantly when were they getting to play Kilkenny. I said it was a real sign of the new found confidence within Dublin hurling and that the young dubs at the school would have played Kilkeeny twice that weekend if they had got a chance!

I have watched Dublin's rise with interest as in the not so distant past Down would have played them at underage level regularly and they would have been pretty tight games but now Dublin are just on another level. In part Down have stood still and this has contributed to the gap but Dublin have really advanced as well.

Dublin will know they have arrived when the "big counties" start complaining about the level of resoruces being directed there and that day will come, if Dublin win 2-3 All Irelands at underage level in a short period of time which will happen soon I think then watch to see the clamour for a claw back on central resources. Its great to see hurling develop but not at our expense will be the attitude from some. Everyone was delighted when the Dublin colleges started to win a few games in the Leinster competition and indeed when they won the All Ireland but that is already beginning to change and Kierans etc won't be too happy to be relegated down the tiers of provinicial top dogs.

Well done the dubs, hurling needs the game to be strong in Dublin but don't expect the goodwill to last for too much longer, which I suppose is the greatest compliment to your progress.

How often do people have to state that its not a football issue, the fact is that it only happened to affect the footballers first. The fact that Donal Og is "spokesperson" as you say is because the guy has the courage of his convictions and is seeing as a leader within his peer group of players. It would appear you have a fixation with Donal Og and trying to take cheap shots at the guy, as I said in a previous post if you don't know someone dont judge them. I have little doubt his contribution to grassroots GAA is just as significant if not more so as yours.

Stick to the issue and leave your GPA rants to another thread.

Orangeman, that latest post sums up your contribution to this thread. Your real issue with the stance of the Cork players has nothing to do with what the real issues are and all to do with an anti GPA bias. A lot of posters are using this thread to continue the GPA bashing that is prevalent on some other threads stick to the issues at hand and don't pollute every thread with the same tirade that a lot of people are getting sick of listening to.

Grants issue will now be dealt with at congress and has nothing to do with what is at stake in Cork although some of the clowns on the CB share your anti GPA bias and see the current situation as a chance to stick two fingers up to what they perceive to be player power.

Forgot about them Screenexile - two good hurlers they were too.

Fair dues to big Brian for calling it as it is. It is a disgrace the way hurling is treated in Derry and the unfortunate reality is that the prevalance of dual players within the county just makes the situation worse as almost every good young hurler in the county is also a good footballer.

Of the team that won the All Ireland in 93, the Downeys, McGilligan and the Mc Gurks were all great hurlers indeed Seamy Downey was a good a hurler as I'ver seen but once football came calling and they were made to make a choice they chose the big ball.

Every players has a right to play whatever game he wants and make his own choice but what big Brian is cimplaining about is when fixtures etc are deliberately set up in such a way as to make hurling as ackward as possible or where football managers are targeting the best young hurlers to be "panel" members in full knoweldge that come the big time these guys will be bit players but could have been main pillars of the hurling team

As I said maith thu Brian for having the guts to call it the way it is, sad reality is though that the Derry county board won't give a damn anyway.

Talking to one of the players involved late last night and the sticking point is Teddy Hlland, if he doesn't go then it looks unlikely that the players will field even in the championship. I don't think people should under-esitmate the depth of feeling among the players around what they see is a deliberate policy by the CB to undermine the structures that were put in place under previous managements to set Cork up to compete at the highest level. TH has deliberately allowed himself to be used as the stooge of the CB and I have little sympathy for him as he knew what he was doing when he took the job and saw it as an opportunity to manage the senior Cork team a chance he knew he would never have under normal circumstances.

The CB sit there every year congratualting themselves as along as there is a least one smiling Cork captain on the front of the Cork GAA yearbook but they never think about all the All Irelands that could have been won if Cork GAA would move with the times and be as progressive as it should be as a leading GAA county.

If Cork try to field a team in the NFL/NHL it will be a joke as nobody from senior clubs in the county will want to break ranks with their fellow club men on strike, even the top players from intermediate and junior clubs will be unwilling to break ranks on the basis that in some point in the future if they have genuine inter county ambitions they will have to play with the same people who are on "strike" once this sorry mess is sorted out.

Its nonesense to suggest that county board delegates are acting on behalf of clubs, most of these gys are in situ for years and are as detatched from the reality on the ground as the CB is. Do you really think that any club in Cork wants to be seen to vote against or agitate against FM - beleive me wouldn't bode well for your club in the future in relation the fixtures, grants etc. Reality is that FM rules the CB with an iron fist and nobody in officialidom within Cork GAA has the nerve to face him down - it has taken the players to stand up to him just like they did in 2002.

Anyone who says why did Donal Og etc get involved in a football issue, very simple this wasn't just about the footballers but a wider attempt to graps back control of county teams by the CB. In 2002 the issue wasn't with the footballers but the hurlers and yet the footballers backed the hurlers and the same is happening today - the difference is that Bertie Og Murphy despite being blameless compared to TH had the decency and the interests of Cork GAA at heart by stepping aside. Some of the contributions here are more about a GPA bias than anything else, some of the people here slagging off Donal Og and Sean Og should look at those guys records in terms of involvvement in their own clubs along with their commitment to promoting hurling in the country in general and particularly Ulster - as the tattoo says on Big Dan's arm if you don't know me don't judge me.

Orangeman if you knew something about Cork GAA I might take your comments about Donal Og and Sean Og seriously, the reality is that the vast majority of the ordinary GAA supporters in the county back the players. I agree Sean Og didn't do himself any favours with some of his comments but to say the man made an idiot of himself is a bit much.

FM has been a great servant to the GAA but he is a control freak and there have been stories for years about Frank actually giving the team talk in the Cork dressing room before games even if he wasn't a selector. The whole crux of the issue is that the CB want to win back what they beleive to be a loss of their power in the aftermath of the 2002 strike. They started the ball rolling last year by refusing to even interview anyone from John Allen/donal O'grady's backroom team for the hurling job even though this back room staff had helped guide Cork to four all Ireland finals in a row.

Then this year we had the saga of the selctors which was a deliberate ploy to get rid of Billy Morgan and set things up for next year on the hurling side. they didn't expect the reaction from the hurlers as Gerald is in situ for another year and they beleived that the footballers would be isolated and easier dealt with as the GAA public in Cork are generally more focussed on hurling than football.

Holland took the job in full knoweldge that at least four other people had turned down the job given the strings attached and the fact that the players had publicly voiced their concern regarding the selectors issue. Holland was totally opportunistic in his approach to this and that is why the players have a signfificant issue with him, I think the footballers will have a lot bigger issue with him staying than the hurlers as any say in selectors etc in the future will immediately benefit the hurlers in terms of next year when Gerald is up for re-election while the fact that he is in place for 2008 means the current issue with picking selectors won't affect the hurlers.

Arrived late to the game last night and missed the beginning of the Offaly onslaught although the pleasing aspect for me was the fightback in the second half. I know some people will say there was a gale force breeze, that certainly helped but there was also a gal force breeze in Birr last year in the NHL and we just rolled over in the 2nd half.

Some of the old fight seems to be back in the Down set-up which is good to see, very early days yet but let's hope the fighting spirit is the sign of the things to come for the remainder of the year and we get a good NHL under our belts in preparation for the Christy Ring.

My main concern is that we continue to leak goals, Offaly scored three times in the second half only compared to Down who scored 1-4 (five times when we were against the breeze) but its goals that win games or indeed the ability to stop goals and that is an area Jingo needs to work on with the lads.