Messages

Every week there's an incident in Tyrone game and every single week the referee's decision goes against Tyrone. Thats the reality and nobody here, even the most partisan aren't denying it.

That's because nobody can be arsed engaging in your nonsense.

It's all nonsense? Well if <checks notes> Bennydorano says so it must be all in my head.

How David Clifford didn't get a card for throwing Kilpatrick to the ground...is a mystery !

St Paddy's day holiday and then the Easter break.

Then they will let the exam pupils out on "study" leave in May and before long you will have June and then they get the paid 8 week vacation.


 

Super Work

Lookit... sure its great to wind them up!

Plenty be happy with their "shitty wage'

England (excluding London) and Wales - £30,000 to £46,525. London - £31,350 to £47,839 (fringes), £34,514 to £51,179 (outer), £36,745 to £56,959 (inner) Scotland - £38,655 to £48,516 (from 1 January 2024) Northern Ireland - £24,137 to £41,094.

At least get some parity with the rest?

Parity is about to hit home.

Tell me the name of any 'business'that didn't experience difficulties around energy prices!

The vast majority of schools are realistically unable to use a business model that also delivers a public service. Education is relatively free to the users other than contributions for trips etc.
The level of funding for some schools is supplemented by capital fee contributions between £500 to £1400 or a few 'private' schools that charge upto £4k.per term. So cheer up and be thankful for what you get for 'free' ffs.

About time the government paid these teachers more so that industrial action stops and inspectors can come in and wipe them out.

Sure they've been hiding in pre school provision and training centres for 4 years....they'll hardly start to September.Nothing to fear !

Eye4education labour Market information gives a great insight into under / over supplied career options

[Funding in NI would need to increase by £500 per pupil for schools to balance their budgets.]

]Funding in NI would need to increase by £500 per pupil for schools to balance their budgets. [/b]

The thing to remember is whether a school has a deficit or not  , it's not going to close anytime soon !
[/quote]

It wouldn't matter if funding increased by £500 or £5,000 per pupil; some schools will stay within budget and others will continue to massively overspend. Because there is no accountability. Some of the overspends in schools are absolutely scandalous. Deficits in controlled schools are roughly twice those in maintained schools. And some very high profile principals are among the worst offenders; two have relatively recently moved on to higher profile, more "prestigious" positions, leaving combined debts in the region of £2 million. There's plenty of scope to increase class sizes, amount of teacher contact time and reduce financial burden of management structures in many schools. I know of one school whose staffing is so bloated that it is used as an example of what not to do and, even then, nothing is done about it.

Until principals and governors are held to account for school budget deficits, we will continue to see massive wastage.
[/quote]
This is what I wondered about when the teaching union fella on the radio said 50% of schools have run up deficits, and therefore presumably 50% haven't.  Various excuses were posted on here, but I can't help wonder are some principals just spending away irresponsibly with no regard whatsoever for the consequences.  Which seems damned unfair on principals who are running a tight financial ship. 

For example principal A lays off a teacher to balance the books, but class size increases and parents aren't
[/quote]

Going by news stories this week, English schools are broke as well with SEN  spending through the roof. Scotland the biggest spenders per pupil.

Funding in NI would need to increase by £500 per pupil for schools to balance their budgets.

The thing to remember is whether a school has a deficit or not  , it's not going to close anytime soon !

It wouldn't matter if funding increased by £500 or £5,000 per pupil; some schools will stay within budget and others will continue to massively overspend. Because there is no accountability. Some of the overspends in schools are absolutely scandalous. Deficits in controlled schools are roughly twice those in maintained schools. And some very high profile principals are among the worst offenders; two have relatively recently moved on to higher profile, more "prestigious" positions, leaving combined debts in the region of £2 million. There's plenty of scope to increase class sizes, amount of teacher contact time and reduce financial burden of management structures in many schools. I know of one school whose staffing is so bloated that it is used as an example of what not to do and, even then, nothing is done about it.

Until principals and governors are held to account for school budget deficits, we will continue to see massive wastage.

This is what I wondered about when the teaching union fella on the radio said 50% of schools have run up deficits, and therefore presumably 50% haven't.  Various excuses were posted on here, but I can't help wonder are some principals just spending away irresponsibly with no regard whatsoever for the consequences.  Which seems damned unfair on principals who are running a tight financial ship. 

For example principal A lays off a teacher to balance the books, but class size increases and parents aren't happy.
Principal B in the same position holds onto the teacher and runs up the deficit - no complaints here from the parents, but up goes the deficit and seemingly no accountability for that.

That's not a good system.

Principals can spend money, but ultimately the board of governors are responsible and a
Going by news stories this week, English schools are broke as well with SEN  spending through the roof. Scotland the biggest spenders per pupil.

Funding in NI would need to increase by £500 per pupil for schools to balance their budgets.

The thing to remember is whether a school has a deficit or not  , it's not going to close anytime soon !

It wouldn't matter if funding increased by £500 or £5,000 per pupil; some schools will stay within budget and others will continue to massively overspend. Because there is no accountability. Some of the overspends in schools are absolutely scandalous. Deficits in controlled schools are roughly twice those in maintained schools. And some very high profile principals are among the worst offenders; two have relatively recently moved on to higher profile, more "prestigious" positions, leaving combined debts in the region of £2 million. There's plenty of scope to increase class sizes, amount of teacher contact time and reduce financial burden of management structures in many schools. I know of one school whose staffing is so bloated that it is used as an example of what not to do and, even then, nothing is done about it.

Until principals and governors are held to account for school budget deficits, we will continue to see massive wastage.
[/quote]
This is what I wondered about when the teaching union fella on the radio said 50% of schools have run up deficits, and therefore presumably 50% haven't.  Various excuses were posted on here, but I can't help wonder are some principals just spending away irresponsibly with no regard whatsoever for the consequences.  Which seems damned unfair on principals who are running a tight financial ship. 

For example principal A lays off a teacher to balance the books, but class size increases and parents aren't happy.
Principal B in the same position holds onto the teacher and runs up the deficit - no complaints here from the parents, but up goes the deficit and seemingly no accountability for that.

That's not a good system.
[/quote]

Principals can spend money, but ultimately the board of governors are responsible and a principal answers to them. Generally a BOG will have a finance officer or committee.
If a school runs up a huge deficit, I'd argue it's not all the fault of the principal, it's more of a governance issue.
From what I've seen in schools, the majority of principals are ex teachers who don't have the skillset to manage a business. BOG members, are usually volunteers who will do a certain amount, but don't want to get too involved. A combination of both scenarios are probably a major factor in schools and defecits, BUT schools are underfunded so that compounds the issues.
[/quote]

What have you seen in schools, then?

When schools are properly funded they will generally be in surplus but it is very difficult at the minute.

Also , teachers & non teaching salaries account for 90 - 95% of budget allocation. The Education Authority undertake all the financial planning. Grammar schools have a bursar to manage finances ! So Principals & BOG have little input !

I have a son who is a teacher, temporary contract from September to June, does not get paid for A/L, going on 3 years now. Therefore does not get paid for three months of the yea. He is seriously considering leaving the profession. Can't get a mortgage as job is not secure. The number of friends he knows on similar situation.

Genuine question.

If there is such a shortage of young teachers, then how is it that there are such a number of young teachers stuck on temporary contracts and unable to secure a permanent post?

What am I missing here, because I can't see any explanation for this glaring discrepancy?

The main factor is that schools are underfunded and funding is only decided on an yearly basis, so no long term planning option
2nd issue is that school year is not aligned to financial year
3rd - school pupil numbers can fluctuate / in secondary - Subject choices at GCSE & A level can vary.
4th - temporary variations in contract by permanent staff

So, schools use temporary contracts to manage a changing financial situation

I have a son who is a teacher, temporary contract from September to June, does not get paid for A/L, going on 3 years now. Therefore does not get paid for three months of the yea. He is seriously considering leaving the profession. Can't get a mortgage as job is not secure. The number of friends he knows on similar situation.

It can be disheartening but he should stick with it.

A few pointers...
If he has worked in the exact same job for 3 years, he should be aware that after 4 years on a temporary contract, he has the right to be made permanent.

With 3 years experience, he should be getting  through to shortlisting stage for jobs.

His temporary pay includes holiday pay allowance.

What untruths are you specifically referring to ?

Moneysavingexpert is worth exploring re - student loans

Most do not repay the full outstanding amount !

[Funding in NI would need to increase by £500 per pupil for schools to balance their budgets.]

Going by news stories this week, English schools are broke as well with SEN  spending through the roof. Scotland the biggest spenders per pupil.

Funding in NI would need to increase by £500 per pupil for schools to balance their budgets.

The thing to remember is whether a school has a deficit or not  , it's not going to close anytime soon !

It wouldn't matter if funding increased by £500 or £5,000 per pupil; some schools will stay within budget and others will continue to massively overspend. Because there is no accountability. Some of the overspends in schools are absolutely scandalous. Deficits in controlled schools are roughly twice those in maintained schools. And some very high profile principals are among the worst offenders; two have relatively recently moved on to higher profile, more "prestigious" positions, leaving combined debts in the region of £2 million. There's plenty of scope to increase class sizes, amount of teacher contact time and reduce financial burden of management structures in many schools. I know of one school whose staffing is so bloated that it is used as an example of what not to do and, even then, nothing is done about it.

Until principals and governors are held to account for school budget deficits, we will continue to see massive wastage.

This is what I wondered about when the teaching union fella on the radio said 50% of schools have run up deficits, and therefore presumably 50% haven't.  Various excuses were posted on here, but I can't help wonder are some principals just spending away irresponsibly with no regard whatsoever for the consequences.  Which seems damned unfair on principals who are running a tight financial ship. 

For example principal A lays off a teacher to balance the books, but class size increases and parents aren't happy.
Principal B in the same position holds onto the teacher and runs up the deficit - no complaints here from the parents, but up goes the deficit and seemingly no accountability for that.

That's not a good system.

Schools are underfunded is the reality of the situation. They are accountable to the Education Authority on a yearly basis but the EA accept that schools have no room to reduce costs.

E.g. schools have to compile with class size policies!

Certainly £5000 a head would be great!

[their]

Going by news stories this week, English schools are broke as well with SEN  spending through the roof. Scotland the biggest spenders per pupil.

Funding in NI would need to increase by £500 per pupil for schools to balance their budgets.

The thing to remember is whether a school has a deficit or not  , it's not going to close anytime soon !

Wage cuts?

They'll be queuing up for that opportunity ...their about to get pay parity with UK ..so I'm sure it'll happen

For Christ's sake, Delgany. I appreciate you are trying to reveal the depths education has fallen to but please try to keep some standards.

You gotta cut your cloth. If a business is struggling there is wage cuts across the board. Teachers need to carry some of the load here. 

Apologies Duine

..so Trailer...if you cut the teaching staff...what do you suggest, the school does with the children, put them in classes of 50 ....Good result for you !

Country coming down with teachers.
Retire older teachers and replace with cheaper youth.
Cut their employers pension contributions
No effect to their take home pay.

Fair solution.

The country is not coming down with teachers, perhaps some backward areas are. In Dublin, there are plenty of schools that cannot get teachers.

Dublin is an outlier because of the cost of living.
We need to be honest with people. There are far far too many teachers produced. It's attractive for it's work life balance and huge pension.
The Department of Education in the North anyway is living far beyond it's means. Teachers should be willing to make sacrifices like the ones I have outlined above to make ends meet. And provide a world class education for its pupils.

St Mary's teacher training college needs scrapped as well. 

Older teachers are not going to take early retirement in the North as DENI impose a 5% actuarial reduction each year after 55 to a teacher's pension.
Reducing the Employers contribution is not going to happen as a result.
The only alternative is to restart the ' Refreshing the workforce ' scheme which did not apply the reduction to pensions.

Significant numbers of young teachers are in the Middle East, enjoying the benefits of a tax free economy, so there are vacancies North & South in specialist subject teaching and getting a sub is difficult.

[their]

Going by news stories this week, English schools are broke as well with SEN  spending through the roof. Scotland the biggest spenders per pupil.

Funding in NI would need to increase by £500 per pupil for schools to balance their budgets.

The thing to remember is whether a school has a deficit or not  , it's not going to close anytime soon !

Wage cuts?

They'll be queuing up for that opportunity ...their about to get pay parity with UK ..so I'm sure it'll happen

For Christ's sake, Delgany. I appreciate you are trying to reveal the depths education has fallen to but please try to keep some standards.

You gotta cut your cloth. If a business is struggling there is wage cuts across the board. Teachers need to carry some of the load here. 

Apologies Duine

..so Trailer...if you cut the teaching staff...what do you suggest, the school does with the children, put them in classes of 50 ....Good result for you !

Country coming down with teachers.
Retire older teachers and replace with cheaper youth.
Cut their employers pension contributions
No effect to their take home pay.

Fair solution.

Older teachers are reluctant to retire due to actuarial reductions of 5% per year from 55 on their pension pot and unacceptable to reduce further and most of the young teachers are in the Middle East, cleaning up in a tax free economy !

[their]

Going by news stories this week, English schools are broke as well with SEN  spending through the roof. Scotland the biggest spenders per pupil.

Funding in NI would need to increase by £500 per pupil for schools to balance their budgets.

The thing to remember is whether a school has a deficit or not  , it's not going to close anytime soon !

Wage cuts?

They'll be queuing up for that opportunity ...their about to get pay parity with UK ..so I'm sure it'll happen

For Christ's sake, Delgany. I appreciate you are trying to reveal the depths education has fallen to but please try to keep some standards.

You gotta cut your cloth. If a business is struggling there is wage cuts across the board. Teachers need to carry some of the load here. 

Apologies Duine

..so Trailer...if you cut the teaching staff...what do you suggest, the school does with the children, put them in classes of 50 ....Good result for you !