Shamrock Rovers Ultras

[deiseach]

and every single councellor in the SDCC who voted for a soccer only stadium when last asked.

I like that - "when last asked". Remind us what the result of the previous vote was?

[dublinfella]

and every single councellor in the SDCC who voted for a soccer only stadium when last asked.

I like that - "when last asked". Remind us what the result of the previous vote was?

and ill remind you what the one before that was.... you either support the democratic process or you dont.

the real reason for the hostility from sections of the GAA on this is simple. For probably the first time ever the state said 'no' to the association. And this has caused profound confusion and anguish from the old guard.

Not only have we got FF and SF TD's openly supporting Rovers over the GAA, a Kerry minister for sport who used to be the chairman of his club has decided to go against the association line and do another sport an overdue favour. Queue him being threatned, abused and called an enemy of the GAA for the simple reason he wont allow a GAA club dictate funding towords soccer.

This is simply slow learners in the GAA not realising they dont have the political clout of old. Despite a clear media campaign against JO'D and Rovers.

[deiseach]

and ill remind you what the one before that was.... you either support the democratic process or you dont.

If that's the case, I don't. Democratically elected politicians cannot subvert the law, and Thomas Davis' stance has been demonstrated  through the courts to have merit, that

the council decision of February 13th, 2006, individually and exclusively affected the GAA club. The stadium was in the club's area and the GAA club was the most likely to derive the most immediate and frequent benefit from access to the stadium, the judge said. It had established a "substantial interest" in the case and had raised the necessary "substantial" grounds required for leave to be given for judicial review of planning decisions.

Without wanting to resort to hyperbole, it's a good thing that elected politicians are held to be accountable to the law. I dread a world where decisions are made on the basis of what 50% + 1 want.

the real reason for the hostility from sections of the GAA on this is simple. For probably the first time ever the state said 'no' to the association. And this has caused profound confusion and anguish from the old guard.

Not only have we got FF and SF TD's openly supporting Rovers over the GAA, a Kerry minister for sport who used to be the chairman of his club has decided to go against the association line and do another sport an overdue favour. Queue him being threatned, abused and called an enemy of the GAA for the simple reason he wont allow a GAA club dictate funding towords soccer.

This is simply slow learners in the GAA not realising they dont have the political clout of old. Despite a clear media campaign against JO'D and Rovers.

The rest of this . . . well, we've been down this road many times. The idea that anyone owes Rovers anything is one I don't agree with. If they put up even 50% of the money towards this project, I'd probably change my tune. But at the current rates of funding, I'll support anyone who is willing to yell "stop!"

[dublinfella]

If that's the case, I don't. Democratically elected politicians cannot subvert the law, and Thomas Davis' stance has been demonstrated  through the courts to have merit, that

What 'law' did the 'politicians' break? The case is about the timing of amendments to the county managers plan. Purely a technical issue.

Why are TD allowed bring pressure to bear on the local councellors but not the department who are inolved in the process?

[snatter]

you either support the democratic process or you dont.

Soccerfella,

you're a complete hypocrite.
If you were a true democrat (as opposed to an anti gaa, pro sham rovers fantasist), you would deplore the minister's subversion of local democracy, when he
1.forced SDCC to overturn their original decision to allow gaelic games to be played.
2. ignored the public consultation which overwhelmingly backed access for gaelic games.

http://www.unison.ie/irish_independent/stories.php3?ca=9&si=1795877&issue_id=15386

However, after a public consultation process and following a recommendation by the Tallaght Area Committee in November 2005, the County Manager's proposal was altered to one in favour of a multi-sport stadium, involving the development of a larger-sized pitch suitable for Gaelic games.
The council, on December 12, 2005, unanimously adopted a resolution in favour of the second proposal.

However, after it was told that the Minister for Arts, Sports and Tourism, John O'Donoghue would only provide funding for a soccer-only stadium, on February 13, 2006, the council passed a resolution which reverted to the original proposals.

[deiseach]

If that's the case, I don't. Democratically elected politicians cannot subvert the law, and Thomas Davis' stance has been demonstrated  through the courts to have merit, that

What 'law' did the 'politicians' break? The case is about the timing of amendments to the county managers plan. Purely a technical issue.

Why are TD allowed bring pressure to bear on the local councellors but not the department who are inolved in the process?

Technicalities ARE the law. Calling something a technicality might make it sound trivial, but it's still law and not even elected representatives can break it.

[deiseach]

Soccerfella

This is where I came in and where I'm leaving it for the night. Can we all leave the soccerfella / roversfella / whateveryourehavingyourselffella jibes out?

[dublinfella]

you either support the democratic process or you dont.

Soccerfella,

you're a complete hypocrite.
If you were a true democrat (as opposed to an anti gaa, pro sham rovers fantasist), you would deplore the minister's subversion of local democracy, when he
1.forced SDCC to overturn their original decision to allow gaelic games to be played.
2. ignored the public consultation which overwhelmingly backed access for gaelic games.

http://www.unison.ie/irish_independent/stories.php3?ca=9&si=1795877&issue_id=15386

However, after a public consultation process and following a recommendation by the Tallaght Area Committee in November 2005, the County Manager's proposal was altered to one in favour of a multi-sport stadium, involving the development of a larger-sized pitch suitable for Gaelic games.
The council, on December 12, 2005, unanimously adopted a resolution in favour of the second proposal.

However, after it was told that the Minister for Arts, Sports and Tourism, John O'Donoghue would only provide funding for a soccer-only stadium, on February 13, 2006, the council passed a resolution which reverted to the original proposals.

During the public consultation process TD lobbied the individual councellors. They were the only dissenting voices. THIS CHANGE WAS CONDITIONAL ON THE FUNDING REMAINING IN PLACE.

Again, how is TD lobbying councellors acceptible, whereas the minister who is funding the stadium involving himself in the process is a gross perversion of democracy?

Twice the council have voted in favour of the original plan.when the minister pointed out consequences of having to rip up the stadium, foundations, drainage and reduce the capacity to one fifth of its original size they reverted.

[dublinfella]

Soccerfella

This is where I came in and where I'm leaving it for the night. Can we all leave the soccerfella / roversfella / whateveryourehavingyourselffella jibes out?

either argue your corner or dont.

when challenged to use their grey matter 90% of posters on this site revert to childish insult.

would you prefer if this was all a happy clappy agreeable brothers site? sad.

[Good Relations]

At the end of the day I think it boils down to jus a few things....

1: Thomas Davis and the GAA in general (around Tallaght) dont like to see soccer doing well.

2: Rovers were quite happy to let under GAA age matches take place on the pitch,but oh no TD wanted senior matches to be held on it despite the fact that there is fantastic facilities in Tallaght and surrounding areas to hold such matches.

3: I think TD are afraid that soccer will dominate the area as far as under participation in sports is concerned and this is totally ridiculous as there are are just as many GAA clubs around Tallaght providing under age facilities as there are soccer.

Lastly, just as an overall suggestion to get the GAA lads thinking...Supposed a soccer club asked to use a publicly funded GAA ground as there home pitch for a season..What would the reaction be. Suppose Cork city for example wanted to play in Pairc Ui Chaoimh in Cork..I know what the reaction would be down there.

[tayto]

1] I don't know anyone who cares how soccer is doing. You say it like liverpool or man united are coming to tallaght.

2] There is a need for a southside venue for matches involving southside dublin clubs. Possibly the odd Dublin match. There is a new south Dublin team coming into the hurling league and they need a home ground. Seriously it's a losing battle to try and undermine the GAAs need for a southside venue. The GAA don;t need a stadia for juvenille matches, they can play in the facilities already owned by the clubs in the area.

3] Arent rovers underage sections already in the area? I cant imagine a bigger turn off for kids then watching Eircom league football. Any eircom league matches i've been to the kids are playing with their mates.

[Hardy]

I cant imagine a bigger turn off for kids then watching Eircom league football. Any eircom league matches i've been to the kids are playing with their mates.

[tayto]

I cant imagine a bigger turn off for kids then watching Eircom league football. Any eircom league matches i've been to the kids are playing with their mates.

It's funny but it's true. kids running amuck. A lot of them in man united or liverpool gear.

Those figures make for stark reading don't they. Appaling attendances. Imagine going full time on the back of those figures, little wonder the league is a mess.

[magpie seanie]

Good Relations:

1: Thomas Davis and the GAA in general (around Tallaght) dont like to see soccer doing well.

1. I suppose Shamrock Rovers and the soccer community in general (around Tallaght) love seeing the GAA doing well?


All Thomas Davis and the GAA want is a fair deal and the law has upheld the view that they have a case. THAT is the democratic process (that Dublinfella cribs on about) in action.

This notion that the Chairman of TD is on a solo run is complete nonsense too. People like him that put in many hours of work for no financial reward scare the average Joe. Most folk cannot understand that type of dedication and are all too willing to believe any lie indicating its not as it seems. Anything to make them feel better for sitting on their own holes doing nothing. That's just society unfortunately. If he was on a solo run and as big an ogre as Dublinfella paints him he'd have been got rid of long ago.

John O'Donoghue is simply wrong here but as proven throughout his career he is incapable of compromise and unswerving in his belief in himself. After the election he will not be Minsiter for Sport - whether FF get in or not. A solution, suitable for all sides will then be worked out.

[Hardy]

People like him that put in many hours of work for no financial reward scare the average Joe. Most folk cannot understand that type of dedication and are all too willing to believe any lie indicating its not as it seems. Anything to make them feel better for sitting on their own holes doing nothing. That's just society unfortunately.

That's a good point and well observed. Sadly, it is quite common for people involved in community activities to have their motives impugned.

And I speak as one of those sitting on his hole doing nothing.