McCarthy admits he does not have backing of Cork hurlers

[orangeman]

FROM RTE.IE

Gerald McCarthy has strongly criticised Seán Óg Ó h'Ailpín in a further escalation of the Cork hurling dispute.

Ó h'Ailpín had criticised the manager earlier in the week but McCarthy hit back in a press statement and accused Ó h'Ailpín of flip-flopping on the issue of the manager's coaching ability.

McCarthy said he accepts that Ó h'Ailpín has a very busy life and goes on to state that Ó h'Ailpín's substantial commercial interests arising from his Cork hurling career - dealing with his agent, his membership of the GPA, his job with Ulster Bank and his on-off role with Cork - must make it difficult to find time to reflect.

McCarthy added that if Ó h'Ailpín did find time, then 'perhaps he wouldn't be flip-flopping around the place and changing his mind about my abilities as a coach to suit the agenda of the day'.

McCarthy also made it clear that he would soon be finalising his panel for the season ahead

[Zulu]

I haven't read all the posts in this thread but maybe the supporters of the CB could answer a few questions for me, I've posed some, if not all of them before but I don't think any of you have answered them.

1. Do you think the CCB is doing a good job for Cork GAA and why? Not relevant to this dispute. If clubs in Cork are unhappy with the CB there is a process to change things - long and tedious though it may be. Those bringing up CB shprtcomings are scraping the barrell at this stage in trying to justify the players actions

2. Do you think there was an honest and thorough search for a new Cork hurling manager and why? - A process was put in place Zuu and obviously the people who were involved in selecting a manager felt that Gerald should be given a chance. They may well have been aware of the fact that he did not receive full co-operation from the panel for the past 2 years and may have felt that he would try and make a fresh start with some of the more obvious non-cooperators retired/dropped.

3. Given that there were 2 player representitives on the 7 man panel do you think their opinion of the current manager should weigh heavily with respect to his application and why? I do not believe the two players views should weigh any more or less heavier than any other member. You like the players seem to feel they should have a veto. In fact if the players had any cop they would not be involved at all - as in all other counties

First off Talter thank you for responding to those questions, however I feel you like a number of others around here are arguing around the issue rather than focusing on the real issue. My first question is relevant because the CCB's dealings with the players are reflective of their attitude to many other areas in Cork GAA which is unsatisfactory (to say the least).

You have completely dodged my second question and offered up only conjecture as to the opinions of the CB during the process. Not only that but you have done so only to support your view IMO, lets look at some undisputed facts;

1. Cork didn't win any silverware in Geralds two years in charge
2. Cork lost 5 times in those two years
3. The panel weren't happy with him and didn't want him to be reappointed
4. There wasn't one other candidate proposed by the CB, now unless that one candidate was outstanding I don't think anyone here would be happy if their CB appointed someone under those circumstances.

The players don't want a veto and I or anyone else (I suspect) wouldn't support one but if I was appointing a coach for my club team and I asked the players what they thought of the current coach. And they told me he wasn't great and the chemistry between the squad and him wasn't right I doubt very much i would reappoint him. I would certainly try hard to seek out alternatives, the CCB didn't do this and this raises serious questions about the whole process and their motivations during this process.

[Tatler Jack]

First off Talter thank you for responding to those questions, however I feel you like a number of others around here are arguing around the issue rather than focusing on the real issue.

Zulu - I povided short direct answers  to largely hypothetical questions you posed - I am busy at the moment and have little time for engaging on this debate. However I am not arguing around the issue at all - the porblem for you and others is that we do not know from the players what the issue is!!! First I have said before there are many shortcomings with the GAA in Cork that need to be solved by all - not just by the players. That to me is a seperate debate - the players brought this up as a side issue. The real issue is do the players accept democracy or do the in effect want to have a veto on who manages Cork teams. Yes they do want a veto - their actions and word s show this is the case. Not sure they realise themselves they want a veto but when they say things like " we want to be heard" - that is what they mean.

As reards whether Gerald is the best manager or not - I do not know. He would not have been my choice 2 years ago. However it now seems that over the past 2 years he did not get the full support of the players so laying al lthe balame at his door for defeats is a liittlle convenient. For what its worth I believe Cork have been in decline since the 2006 final defeat and would not have won an AI under any manager over the past 2 years. Unfortuately some of the players and supporters  have trouble accepting the harsh reality that sometimes you are just not good enough!!

I know for fervent supporters of the players Zulu it is difficult to consider that they might ever be wrong - I think if you have any influence with any of them you would be doing a good service to Cork hurling by telling them to get off their high horse, realise that they are not the only ones that care about Cork hurling and that if Cork are to get back to the top again it will take everybody working together and not total victory for one side.

You have completely dodged my second question and offered up only conjecture as to the opinions of the CB during the process

I did not dodge it - I offered a possible answer - conjecture it may be - as would any answer you would provide. And sorry if my answer does not suit you.

[Zulu]

Tatler like everyone else on this board I don't exactly know what is going on and there is undoubtedly enough blame to go all round. However from what I read on this board it seems clear to me that plenty of posters are only too willing to jump on the players for having the temerity to speak up, coloured no doubt by their attitude to the GPA.

Last year the CB back-tracked on the agreement stemming from 2002 that managers can pick their own selectors, what was the motivation for this? It can only have been to antagonize the players, speculation maybe, but nobody I've heard of can come up with a genuine alternative. This year they reappoint a man the players, during the reappointment process, clearly stated they were unhappy with and offered no alternatives. No one can seriously suggest there aren't others out there willing to manage Cork, so again the motivation of the CCB has to be questioned.

I don't for a second accept the players want a veto on their manager, all they want is the best available backroom staff to guide their efforts to succeed and an honest process to achieve that. Few in Cork believe Gerald to be the best available and if the current squad aren't happy with him he shouldn't have been reappointed. To be honest as a coach myself if the team i was coaching came up to me at the end of the season and said they weren't happy for me to the job next year I'd walk away immediately. Because there'd be no point continuing and no enjoyment in doing so.

I believe if the CB had engaged in a honest process and had come up with, lets say 3 names the players thought could do the job the players would have played for whoever the 7 man committee decided on. Instead the committee went for the one man the players definately didn't want and who has a woeful record with Cork over the last 2 years.

Say what you like but I cannot accept that 5 CB men felt that Gerald was the best man for the job when you look at his 2 year record with Cork and his relationship with the players. No, any reasonable person would surely have to question the motivations of the people who reappointed Gerald when they know the facts.

[orangeman]

Tatler like everyone else on this board I don't exactly know what is going on and there is undoubtedly enough blame to go all round. However from what I read on this board it seems clear to me that plenty of posters are only too willing to jump on the players for having the temerity to speak up, coloured no doubt by their attitude to the GPA.

Last year the CB back-tracked on the agreement stemming from 2002 that managers can pick their own selectors, what was the motivation for this? It can only have been to antagonize the players, speculation maybe, but nobody I've heard of can come up with a genuine alternative. This year they reappoint a man the players, during the reappointment process, clearly stated they were unhappy with and offered no alternatives. No one can seriously suggest there aren't others out there willing to manage Cork, so again the motivation of the CCB has to be questioned.

I don't for a second accept the players want a veto on their manager, all they want is the best available backroom staff to guide their efforts to succeed and an honest process to achieve that. Few in Cork believe Gerald to be the best available and if the current squad aren't happy with him he shouldn't have been reappointed. To be honest as a coach myself if the team i was coaching came up to me at the end of the season and said they weren't happy for me to the job next year I'd walk away immediately. Because there'd be no point continuing and no enjoyment in doing so.

I believe if the CB had engaged in a honest process and had come up with, lets say 3 names the players thought could do the job the players would have played for whoever the 7 man committee decided on. Instead the committee went for the one man the players definately didn't want and who has a woeful record with Cork over the last 2 years.

Say what you like but I cannot accept that 5 CB men felt that Gerald was the best man for the job when you look at his 2 year record with Cork and his relationship with the players. No, any reasonable person would surely have to question the motivations of the people who reappointed Gerald when they know the facts.

Are these Cork players now the best men for the job ?

[Reillers]

First of all. I think, I think some of ye are beggining to crasp what is going on a small bit, more so then ye did a few weeks ago.

First of all. There was nothing wrong with what Sean Og said, at all. All truth, all nail on the head truth. He's an honest lad, and even people who've met the lad for a bare of 5 mins know that he's a true gentelman.

He called Gerald's training mickey mouse..maybe he shouldn't have said that..but it's true, everyone knows that, everyone who's seen it knows that.
But Gerald yet again got petty, personal and bitchy as he has with nearly every coment he's made.
The players have been based on fact..that ye don't believe, but fact. Gerald's been petty and made things personal.
What Sean Og does in his own time is his own buisness and to be honest there is no betterembasader for the game then him.

Gerald like, he's on a bit of a personal agenda here. The only ones, like I've said over and over again, with Cork's best intentions at heart are the players.Gerald is running on spite and hate, the board on personal vendetas.The only ones with genuine intentions are the players who are getting slated in the press.

The statement, 99% of what Sean Og said was about the board..but Gerald yet again fails to see that, he makes it about himself..it's not about him. It never really was.

Sean Og said the truth..no else has and I aplaude him for it. He had the balls to say what the boards really is about..something that was pretty much echoed by the two lads.

The board isn't doing a good job..Tatler to say it's not relivant is bull. You're missing the entire point of this bust up. It's about the board, it's always been about the board, about their decision to reappoint Gerald, how it was done.
It's always been about the board, EVERY single problem this team has had 2002, 2006, 2008-the board, the board, the board. If this was a normal work place and workers had gone on strike or refused to come and work, that board would have been thrown out.
The board, like I've said I don't know how many times, has only one intention, to get the revenge that they've been waiting for for 6 years. Blood thirsty and hell bent.
The board only had one intention at the start of this when reappointing Gerald, and no one with any GAA knowledge at all, can justify it. He may be a hurling legend but there's no way, no matter how you look at this that the board honestly thought that they think they'll win an AI with this.
There's no way anyone can justify the board giving the job to him..that is except to get revenge on the players.

We all know it. It was a matter of saying it, and Sean Og said it.

Irrespective of how good a player Gerald was (or how good these lads are now) there's no way he should have been given that job again. No good board with good intentions should have appointed him.

[Zulu]

OM will you please stop answering questions with a question and Reillers will you stop writing so much, although I'm on your side I've stopped reading your posts long ago - there just too long.

[theskull1]

Sean Og speaks the truth ...he's a great lad Reillers isn't he?
Ger McCarthy speaks in response .... he's petty, personal and bitchy?

Jesus

[theskull1]

From a Cork Poster on AFR

Just to prove not all Cork people think like Reillers (who thinks because we're not from Cork we don't really understand)



Gerald is blocking, deflecting and returning the desperate tactics of a loosing group who have underestimated not only Geralds tenacity
but the will of the Grassroots. Martin Bowen the Cork selector who has returned to his Club duties,would not have made the statements he made supporting the managerial efforts of G Mac should he have any doubt as to the intransigence of some of the players. As with most Club officials and members he is the cornerstone of the GAA and an inspiration to the youth. I recall at these conflicting times when Martin spent his two weeks summer holidays preparing his Clubs new pitch and facility, involved in so many volunteer committees he all but gave his life to it. He and his like are the true unsung heroes of the GAA. When I read and hear of what people perceive as heroes, legends etc I think of all the Martins in the GAA and quietly know that the GAA is about a pastime for all the people, belonging to all the members and public and its survival and progression is because of people who have dedicated their lives for the little village, the town and the city. I could not side with some of the present Cork players who have cast some doubt on the character of people who have dedicated their lives for nothing other than to see others take pleasure in a pastime that is sacred to the members , public and to the memory of all gone before. I will not accept or cannot excuse the behaviour and comments emenating from the mouths of some of these players beginning some years ago when demonising a member of the CCB and a selector which became a poplar pastime for some of them. They are repeating this ill advised behaviour again. Where and when did this type of behaviour become acceptable to anyone with decent values. These targeted members of the GAA have wives families and homes to go home to and should be afforded the decency to not have their character decided by people who turn the pursuit of a pastime into publicly humiliating the people who are intrusted by the members to fulfill their wishes. These players who are guilty of this are smart enough to understand you get more of a welcome with honey than vinegar. The Press have not been without some culpability in publishing what I consider questionable decent standards of journalistic ethics that only serve to fuel the conflict and sell more newspapers. This dispute is going to be decided whether some like it or not by the members and the paying public and the brave decision that is to be asked of those players chosen to represent their County. If the game goes ahead between the Cork selection and St Colmans, and the public show by their attendance that they wish to proceed with business as usual the players will have got their answer. From there on I hope some day to see again a Cork hurler with the stickwork that Gerald Mac exhibited in playing centerfield and half forward for Cork which was so lacking in the vital half forward line in the Cork team against KK, a KK player would be ill advised to put up his hand as the maestro of stickwork connected to send the ball into the full forwards, as he went on to win 5 All Ireland hurling championships without ever been arrrogant.

[Tatler Jack]

"

Tatler like everyone else on this board I don't exactly know what is going on and there is undoubtedly enough blame to go all round. However from what I read on this board it seems clear to me that plenty of posters are only too willing to jump on the players for having the temerity to speak up, coloured no doubt by their attitude to the GPA. "

Zulu I am quite well able to have a view on this issue that is formed without my attitude to the GPA. I have been involved in the GAA as a player and in administration for close on 40 years now and one thing I have always respected is the principle of equality from the star player to the person doing the humblest job And I can count among close friends people who played at the highest level and who subscribe to this principle.

"

Last year the CB back-tracked on the agreement stemming from 2002 that managers can pick their own selectors, what was the motivation for this? It can only have been to antagonize the players, speculation maybe, but nobody I've heard of can come up with a genuine alternative. This year they reappoint a man the players, during the reappointment process, clearly stated they were unhappy with and offered no alternatives. No one can seriously suggest there aren't others out there willing to manage Cork, so again the motivation of the CCB has to be questioned."

I do not want to go back over this again but the original motion on this was proposed by Bob Honohan from the floor at a CB meeting and his argument was that the club scene in Cork was being damaged by the fact that the county set ups were completely disconnected from the CB. I would disagree with him but there is no evidence to support the theory that it was just to annoy the players.

"

I don't for a second accept the players want a veto on their manager, all they want is the best available backroom staff to guide their efforts to succeed and an honest process to achieve that. Few in Cork believe Gerald to be the best available and if the current squad aren't happy with him he shouldn't have been reappointed. To be honest as a coach myself if the team i was coaching came up to me at the end of the season and said they weren't happy for me to the job next year I'd walk away immediately. Because there'd be no point continuing and no enjoyment in doing so."

Maybe they do not realise it but that is what they are doing. In no other county have players an input at all in to manager selection. The players  may honestly feel he is not the best but in such a situation you walk away – you do not hold a whole county up to ransom.  I would also not want to remain involved with a group players if I was not wanted. But if I believed that opposition to me was orchestrated by a small group of players I might just dig my heels in!!

"I believe if the CB had engaged in a honest process and had come up with, lets say 3 names the players thought could do the job the players would have played for whoever the 7 man committee decided on. Instead the committee went for the one man the players definately didn't want and who has a woeful record with Cork over the last 2 years. "

Quite possible. However my speculation is that the CB were aware of some of what went on over the past 2 years and decided to back Gerald – i.e. they believed that Gerald did not have a fair chance. No doubt their attitude was coloured by some of the individuals involved. I think Zulu one cannot conveniently overlook the fact that some of the senior players did not want Gerald at the outset and made life difficult for him.

Say what you like but I cannot accept that 5 CB men felt that Gerald was the best man for the job when you look at his 2 year record with Cork and his relationship with the players. No, any reasonable person would surely have to question the motivations of the people who reappointed Gerald when they know the facts.

Ger Mac would not have been my choice for manager 2 years ago much as I respect him as a coach. While you may rightly question the motivation behind his reappointment it also reasonable to question the motives of some of the players over the past 2 years.

Reillers: Don't patronise – we all are well able to grasp what is going on. As regards media statements I believe that Ger Mac's comments on Sean Og's activities outside the field of play were wrong and also the leaking of the Cathal O'Reilly document.  However equally wrong has been the way that players have leaked stuff about training to the media and Sean Og's Newstalk interview was ill guided and completely unfair. I know Sean Og – he is a great ambassador and very straightforward. However he has his faults and tends to see things only from his own view point. Gerald McCarthy is an equally honourable decent person who does not deserve to be treated in the way he has by this group of players.

[orangeman]

First of all. I think, I think some of ye are beggining to crasp what is going on a small bit, more so then ye did a few weeks ago.

First of all. There was nothing wrong with what Sean Og said, at all. All truth, all nail on the head truth. He's an honest lad, and even people who've met the lad for a bare of 5 mins know that he's a true gentelman.

He called Gerald's training mickey mouse..maybe he shouldn't have said that..but it's true, everyone knows that, everyone who's seen it knows that.
But Gerald yet again got petty, personal and bitchy as he has with nearly every coment he's made.
The players have been based on fact..that ye don't believe, but fact. Gerald's been petty and made things personal.
What Sean Og does in his own time is his own buisness and to be honest there is no betterembasader for the game then him.

Gerald like, he's on a bit of a personal agenda here. The only ones, like I've said over and over again, with Cork's best intentions at heart are the players.Gerald is running on spite and hate, the board on personal vendetas.The only ones with genuine intentions are the players who are getting slated in the press.

The statement, 99% of what Sean Og said was about the board..but Gerald yet again fails to see that, he makes it about himself..it's not about him. It never really was.

Sean Og said the truth..no else has and I aplaude him for it. He had the balls to say what the boards really is about..something that was pretty much echoed by the two lads.

The board isn't doing a good job..Tatler to say it's not relivant is bull. You're missing the entire point of this bust up. It's about the board, it's always been about the board, about their decision to reappoint Gerald, how it was done.
It's always been about the board, EVERY single problem this team has had 2002, 2006, 2008-the board, the board, the board. If this was a normal work place and workers had gone on strike or refused to come and work, that board would have been thrown out.
The board, like I've said I don't know how many times, has only one intention, to get the revenge that they've been waiting for for 6 years. Blood thirsty and hell bent.
The board only had one intention at the start of this when reappointing Gerald, and no one with any GAA knowledge at all, can justify it. He may be a hurling legend but there's no way, no matter how you look at this that the board honestly thought that they think they'll win an AI with this.
There's no way anyone can justify the board giving the job to him..that is except to get revenge on the players.

We all know it. It was a matter of saying it, and Sean Og said it.

Irrespective of how good a player Gerald was (or how good these lads are now) there's no way he should have been given that job again. No good board with good intentions should have appointed him.

Is it all as simple as that ?


Sean Og is as honest as the day is long and Mc Cartht is a born liar !     I didn't realise it was all as simple as that ?

[Reillers]

From a Cork Poster on AFR

Just to prove not all Cork people think like Reillers (who thinks because we're not from Cork we don't really understand)



Gerald is blocking, deflecting and returning the desperate tactics of a loosing group who have underestimated not only Geralds tenacity
but the will of the Grassroots. Martin Bowen the Cork selector who has returned to his Club duties,would not have made the statements he made supporting the managerial efforts of G Mac should he have any doubt as to the intransigence of some of the players. As with most Club officials and members he is the cornerstone of the GAA and an inspiration to the youth. I recall at these conflicting times when Martin spent his two weeks summer holidays preparing his Clubs new pitch and facility, involved in so many volunteer committees he all but gave his life to it. He and his like are the true unsung heroes of the GAA. When I read and hear of what people perceive as heroes, legends etc I think of all the Martins in the GAA and quietly know that the GAA is about a pastime for all the people, belonging to all the members and public and its survival and progression is because of people who have dedicated their lives for the little village, the town and the city. I could not side with some of the present Cork players who have cast some doubt on the character of people who have dedicated their lives for nothing other than to see others take pleasure in a pastime that is sacred to the members , public and to the memory of all gone before. I will not accept or cannot excuse the behaviour and comments emenating from the mouths of some of these players beginning some years ago when demonising a member of the CCB and a selector which became a poplar pastime for some of them. They are repeating this ill advised behaviour again. Where and when did this type of behaviour become acceptable to anyone with decent values. These targeted members of the GAA have wives families and homes to go home to and should be afforded the decency to not have their character decided by people who turn the pursuit of a pastime into publicly humiliating the people who are intrusted by the members to fulfill their wishes. These players who are guilty of this are smart enough to understand you get more of a welcome with honey than vinegar. The Press have not been without some culpability in publishing what I consider questionable decent standards of journalistic ethics that only serve to fuel the conflict and sell more newspapers. This dispute is going to be decided whether some like it or not by the members and the paying public and the brave decision that is to be asked of those players chosen to represent their County. If the game goes ahead between the Cork selection and St Colmans, and the public show by their attendance that they wish to proceed with business as usual the players will have got their answer. From there on I hope some day to see again a Cork hurler with the stickwork that Gerald Mac exhibited in playing centerfield and half forward for Cork which was so lacking in the vital half forward line in the Cork team against KK, a KK player would be ill advised to put up his hand as the maestro of stickwork connected to send the ball into the full forwards, as he went on to win 5 All Ireland hurling championships without ever been arrrogant.

That's amazing..I've no time of day for AFR. Everyone entitled to their own oppinion, but I could easily copy and paste 99% of the Rebel Gaa posts. You can manipulate as many as you like.

[Reillers]

First of all. I think, I think some of ye are beggining to crasp what is going on a small bit, more so then ye did a few weeks ago.

First of all. There was nothing wrong with what Sean Og said, at all. All truth, all nail on the head truth. He's an honest lad, and even people who've met the lad for a bare of 5 mins know that he's a true gentelman.

He called Gerald's training mickey mouse..maybe he shouldn't have said that..but it's true, everyone knows that, everyone who's seen it knows that.
But Gerald yet again got petty, personal and bitchy as he has with nearly every coment he's made.
The players have been based on fact..that ye don't believe, but fact. Gerald's been petty and made things personal.
What Sean Og does in his own time is his own buisness and to be honest there is no betterembasader for the game then him.

Gerald like, he's on a bit of a personal agenda here. The only ones, like I've said over and over again, with Cork's best intentions at heart are the players.Gerald is running on spite and hate, the board on personal vendetas.The only ones with genuine intentions are the players who are getting slated in the press.

The statement, 99% of what Sean Og said was about the board..but Gerald yet again fails to see that, he makes it about himself..it's not about him. It never really was.

Sean Og said the truth..no else has and I aplaude him for it. He had the balls to say what the boards really is about..something that was pretty much echoed by the two lads.

The board isn't doing a good job..Tatler to say it's not relivant is bull. You're missing the entire point of this bust up. It's about the board, it's always been about the board, about their decision to reappoint Gerald, how it was done.
It's always been about the board, EVERY single problem this team has had 2002, 2006, 2008-the board, the board, the board. If this was a normal work place and workers had gone on strike or refused to come and work, that board would have been thrown out.
The board, like I've said I don't know how many times, has only one intention, to get the revenge that they've been waiting for for 6 years. Blood thirsty and hell bent.
The board only had one intention at the start of this when reappointing Gerald, and no one with any GAA knowledge at all, can justify it. He may be a hurling legend but there's no way, no matter how you look at this that the board honestly thought that they think they'll win an AI with this.
There's no way anyone can justify the board giving the job to him..that is except to get revenge on the players.

We all know it. It was a matter of saying it, and Sean Og said it.

Irrespective of how good a player Gerald was (or how good these lads are now) there's no way he should have been given that job again. No good board with good intentions should have appointed him.

Is it all as simple as that ?


Sean Og is as honest as the day is long and Mc Cartht is a born liar !     I didn't realise it was all as simple as that ?

It's not as simple as that, no, but Sean Og is not a liar, I'm not saying Gerald is, all I'm saying is that Sean Og, and anyone whos met the guy for 5 mins knows that.

[orangeman]

Tom Kenny gives an interview in the Indo today - says he didn't enjoy training at all - says that Crok in two years have gone from the best team in Ireland to number 3 -and it's ALL the board's fault !!!


Hello !!!!!!!

[Zulu]

He isn't saying it's all the boards fault he is saying that they are a big part of the problem, which they are. Even with the best structures in the world and your CB supporting you 100%, a team amy not win the AI but when your CB are trying to undermine the team then you have little or no chance.