Murdering Babies

[FL/MAYO]

It is easy to come on here and give your views on abortion, but if you do not understand each persons reason for getting an abortion you should not be preaching about it. Who are the people that are going to adopt all these children that you suggest should be given up for adoption. It takes a special person to adopt a child and unless you are prepared to do go out and adopt then you better come up with some other solution to the problem before casting stones.  Abortion is a choice that I am sure is the last option for most (not all) of the people that receive them.
I am sure this view will be a minority and unpopular one on this board but I am sick of people (mostly men for some reason) preaching to me on this issue.

What reason, with the exception of the mother's life being at risk, could possibly justify an abortion?











Not that I know of J70

Where the child will be neglected by the parents, where the mother has been raped, where the mother is say 12 and has been raped by her mothers boyfriend, I see this all the time in the job that I work in. I now know why someone can walk up to someone for no reason and shoot them stone dead, its because they were never shown the value of a life in the first place. Some people just should not be allowed to be parents.

Unfortunately I have to go now.

[J70]

The prospective neglect of a child is no reason to snuff out its existence before it is even born. That is an issue for a nation's social services to deal with. If they're incapable of that, then sort that mess out.

[pintsofguinness]

Where the child will be neglected by the parents, where the mother has been raped, where the mother is say 12 and has been raped by her mothers boyfriend, I see this all the time in the job that I work in. I now know why someone can walk up to someone for no reason and shoot them stone dead, its because they were never shown the value of a life in the first place. Some people just should not be allowed to be parents.

People who support abortion are always quick to throw out the rape line when in reality very few of the babies aborted were conceived through rape.
I agree that some people shouldn't be parent's but the answer is not to kill their unborn child. 
The bit I put in bold is quite worrying, lets kill them in the womb before they turn bad, is that the answer?

How anyone could hurt an unborn child is just beyond me.

[ludermor]

when is 'it' a baby?

[J70]

when is 'it' a baby?

Is this going to turn into a debate about the morning-after pill?

I don't know what the defining threshold is, but I certainly see a qualitative difference between a blastula and a foetus.

[Square Ball]

when is 'it' a baby?

When does life begin? is it from the time of conception? or is there a time during the development that it can be called a baby? I ask because I dont know.

[ludermor]

i ask honestly, when do people define a baby.
i dont see a huge problem in abortions, i wouldnt say im happy about the procedure but i think that people should be given the option. Its not a black and white issue so i dont think its fair to say all abortions are wrong/immoral/whatever. Peoples circumstances are different everywhere, just because 1 one couple cant concieve doesnt give a reason to judge people who have abortions for their own unknown reasons.

[theskull1]

I'm pro-choice myself. She has every right to make her own decision if on proper reflection it's the right choice for her.

MAYO, if a woman decides to have an adoption, I will not preach her on the matter.

However, I will express my opinion.

If you express that opinion to that woman, would that not be preaching ziggy?

[pintsofguinness]

i ask honestly, when do people define a baby.
i dont see a huge problem in abortions, i wouldnt say im happy about the procedure but i think that people should be given the option. Its not a black and white issue so i dont think its fair to say all abortions are wrong/immoral/whatever. Peoples circumstances are different everywhere, just because 1 one couple cant concieve doesnt give a reason to judge people who have abortions for their own unknown reasons.

I don't know how I'd define a baby but life begins at conception.

    * Week 3
          o beginning development of the brain, spinal cord, and heart
          o beginning development of the gastrointestinal tract
    * Weeks 4 to 5
          o formation of tissue that develops into the vertebra and some other bones
          o further development of the heart which now beats at a regular rhythm
          o movement of rudimentary blood through the main vessels
          o beginning of the structures of the eye and ears
          o the brain develops into five areas and some cranial nerves are visible
          o arm and leg buds are visible
    * Week 6
          o beginning of formation of the lungs
          o further development of the brain
          o arms and legs have lengthened with foot and hand areas distinguishable
          o hands and feet have digits, but may still be webbed
    * Week 7
          o nipples and hair follicles form
          o elbows and toes visible
          o all essential organs have at least begun to form
    * Week 8
          o rotation of intestines
          o facial features continue to develop
          o the eyelids are more developed
          o the external features of the ear begin to take their final shape

The end of the eighth week marks the end of the "embryonic period" and the beginning of the "fetal period".

    * Weeks 9 to 12
          o the fetus reaches a length of 3.2 inches
          o the head comprises nearly half of the fetus' size
          o the face is well formed
          o eyelids close and will not reopen until about the 28th week
          o tooth buds appear for the baby teeth
          o limbs are long and thin
          o the fetus can make a fist with its fingers
          o genitals appear well differentiated
          o red blood cells are produced in the liver
    * Weeks 13 to 16
          o the fetus reaches a length of about 6 inches
          o a fine hair develops on the head called lanugo
          o fetal skin is almost transparent
          o more muscle tissue and bones have developed, and the bones become harder
          o the fetus makes active movements
          o sucking motions are made with the mouth
          o meconium is made in the intestinal tract
          o the liver and pancreas produce their appropriate fluid secretions
    * Week 20
          o the fetus reaches a length of 8 inches
          o lanugo hair covers entire body
          o eyebrows and lashes appear
          o nails appear on fingers and toes
          o the fetus is more active with increased muscle development
          o "quickening" usually occurs (the mother can feel the fetus moving)
          o fetal heartbeat can be heard with a stethoscope
    * Week 24
          o the fetus reaches a length of 11.2 inches
          o the fetus weighs about 1 lb. 10 oz.
          o eyebrows and eyelashes are well formed
          o all the eye components are developed
          o the fetus has a hand and startle reflex
          o footprints and fingerprints forming
          o alveoli (air sacs) forming in lungs

http://www.nlm.nih.gov/medlineplus/ency/article/002398.htm

I'll ask you the same question I asked mayo, what circumstances justify an abortion?


skull

I'm pro-choice myself. She has every right to make her own decision if on proper reflection it's the right choice for her.

If the baby is born and she decides she can't cope has she a right to kill him/her, if it's the right choice for her?
Does the father have no say?

[stephenite]

Life begins at conception, to end that life at any time is murder. End of story.

Define life? I'm not trying to be smart - but at conception is not just a clump of cells? Can that be described as life? Is this covered somewhere in some UN Charter, not sure but I'll try to look it up at lunchtime...

I'll never be in the position of having to make the decision regarding what happens to something growing inside me, that will result in the birth of another human.

And to that end I don't think I should be able to tell other women what is the morally correct decision for them to take.

Simply my opinion

[theskull1]

It's back to ludermors original question pog isn't it. Everyone has their own opinion.

[SammyG]

There is one post on here that in my opinion sounds like they are preaching and that is the first one. Everyone is entitled to their opinion, I have no issues with that.

Pints asks a fair question. There is no getting around the fact that abortion involves the death of a baby.

I am personally anti-abortion except where the mother's life is at risk (and even then only early in the pregnancy) but that statement is nonsense.

[gaagaa]

I have a friend was a nurse in england way back  & ordered to work for a while in hospital where abortion performed

one night she said the foetus came out alive after being scraped out - they turned music up really loud to try to drown out the baby's moans & left it in a bucket to die - she said it was clearly formed

she ran out in tears & came home after than

thats what were dealing with

[Snowed Under]

I think abortion is disgusting. If a girl has an unwanted pregnancy, she should be made to carry the baby for the full term and then up the baby up for adoption.

The only acceptions are if she was raped or the mother's life is in danger.

Only a man could express these sentiments; I personally think that there is nothing more amazing that a new life but seriously circumstances have to be considered and I am pretty sure that any woman who makes this decision doesn't make it lightly; surely there has to be a right to decide, rape was mentioned, very young has been mentioned, mentally challenged must be taken into account, this is not a black and white area, this is a male dominated board no one here can put themselves in the situation of any woman/girl or that woman/girls family; if both can come through unharmed and each can live a life after the event surely life must be preserved at all costs but seriously it is not a black and white issue - btw I did not read the articles just the comments so maybe I missed something fundemental from pints original post!  BTW BTW the morning after pill, the pill and condoms do not avocate life.  Granted once life is started I feel totally that it should be preserved, babies are amazing but consider the option to be being made to carry it through, the hatred for a mother that doesn't want her child, the anguish for a mother who's mentally challenged's daughter has given her another child to look after in her old age, abortion for abortion sake is sick and distasteful, replusive to say the least but this is a delicate area and one which can't be spouted as black and white.

[stephenite]

I have a friend was a nurse in england way back  & ordered to work for a while in hospital where abortion performed

one night she said the foetus came out alive after being scraped out - they turned music up really loud to try to drown out the baby's moans & left it in a bucket to die - she said it was clearly formed

she ran out in tears & came home after than

thats what were dealing with

Intersting how every anti-abortion person knows the same nurse isn't it? Was this girl from Wexford?