Tuam Babies

[seafoid]

While the unmarried pregnant women were sent to these institutions, then abused by those running the institutions and babies and mothers were dying in atrocious conditions, what was the equivalent in the North.  The attitudes in the North towards unmarried pregnant women were no different so what happened?

Same thing but perhaps just not as prevalent. Nazareth house in Derry was a mother and baby home I believe but I'm open to correction on that. Also it would have to be said that in the period 1930-1960 Northern Ireland would not have been just as impoverished as the West of Ireland with probably a better health and social protection systems. 1950's Tuam, I would say, would have been a particularly backward and impoverished place, no offence intended. The conditions and attitudes in the Eastern mother and baby homes would have been better than in the poorer West, perhaps the statement during the week that the Donnybrook home gave Christian burials to the dead babies might be a reflection of this. I'm not saying that the conditions were good or proper but certain homes were probably worse than others, I'd say it's unlikely that all the homes were as bad as Tuam.

Catholic housing in NI in the 30s was very poor. I wouldn't make any assumptions about Tyrone in 1936

[manfromdelmonte]

It has to be repeated again and again that infant mortality in ireland was high among the poorest. High infant mortality figures were the effects of poverty ridden unsanitary conditions.
The unmarried mothers sent to these homes, by and large were from the poorest homes.

In the North, the state agencies did not like to interfere directly with such foster, mother/child institutions, they were regarded as a private arrangement between a family and their religion,
and they saved the state a fortune.

under law at the time, these homes did not have to have a qualified doctor or nurse on the staff
just think about that for a minute

to call a doctor would have cost money, which would have eaten into their bottom line (these places were basically a vehicle for smuggling new born babies to the states)
if something went wrong, the nuns had to deal with it.

[seafoid]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nWKuGqtWDow

[Oraisteach]

Seafoid, thanks for posting that video.  Very sad.

[Asal Mor]

So cruel and  so sad. The Catholic Church were evil beyond belief. It's crazy that they still hold a prominent place in Irish society.

[AhNowRef]

Davy Carton of the Sawdoctors had a crucial role in this debacle.He even sang about leaving the girls in Tuam before setting off on the N17.

You are complete slime .. total & absolute scum.

[seafoid]

Seafoid, thanks for posting that video.  Very sad.

Even after  they leftt the gulag they were prisoners.

[Declan]

So cruel and  so sad. The Catholic Church were evil beyond belief. It's crazy that they still hold a prominent place in Irish society.

We lived under the equivalent of the Taliban.

[Shamrock Shore]

So cruel and  so sad. The Catholic Church were evil beyond belief. It's crazy that they still hold a prominent place in Irish society.

We lived under the equivalent of the Taliban.

At least one poster here would like for us to return to such times - at least when he's not making insensitive comments and jokes about the suffering and death of thousands of innocents.

[Dire Ear]

Davy Carton of the Sawdoctors had a crucial role in this debacle.He even sang about leaving the girls in Tuam before setting off on the N17.

You are complete slime .. total & absolute scum.

Yip,  once again

[Take Your Points]

I still cannot believe that Tuam is the only place that such inhumanity occurred as the attitudes in society, the all Ireland Church and government of the time.

[Take Your Points]

This week FF proposed taking all hospitals away from the religious orders, e.g. St Vincent's and the Mater.  What should they be doing with the private hospital business related to the Bon Secours nuns:

http://www.limerickleader.ie/news/home/234812/bon-secours-group-acquires-limerick-private-hospital.html

[seafoid]

I still cannot believe that Tuam is the only place that such inhumanity occurred as the attitudes in society, the all Ireland Church and government of the time.

Of course it wasn't.
The political culture was built around land and small farmers. Women were chattel.

[Itchy]

Given the abuse, the torture, the rape, the cover ups etc etc. Why do people go to mass to hear the same organisation lecture them on right and wrong, to be indoctrinated in guilt and to allow your children be told that "they" are sinners. Why would any honest man become a priest to be part of these organisations when there are other options available to help people and to worship God.

I consider these questions to be truly one of life's great mysteries.

[Take Your Points]

I still cannot believe that Tuam is the only place that such inhumanity occurred as the attitudes in society, the all Ireland Church and government of the time.

Of course it wasn't.
The political culture was built around land and small farmers. Women were chattel.

I don't mean inhumanity in general but in terms of there being more institutions like that of the Bon Secours nuns in a number of other parts of the country which need more investigation.