The Cost Of Dublin's Domination Is Becoming Clearer

[AZOffaly]

I think the Dubs devleopment squads should be forced to pack up any Caviar they don't eat after training and send it down the country to poor put upon lads in other academies.

[J70]

There's no mention of proportionality in these figures. What percentage of the Irish population lives in County Dublin? Shouldn't the money dished out be somewhat on a per capita basis? If there are 20,000 kids playing U-14 in Dublin clubs and 300 in Leitrim, then surely the funding should be based on that? If there is a huge disparity in per capita funding, that is a different story.

[AZOffaly]

There's no mention of proportionality in these figures. What percentage of the Irish population lives in County Dublin? Shouldn't the money dished out be somewhat on a per capita basis? If there are 20,000 kids playing U-14 in Dublin clubs and 300 in Leitrim, then surely the funding should be based on that? If there is a huge disparity in per capita funding, that is a different story.

You can't just do it that way though. The structures can be flexed to support more or less participants, but the capital costs should be relatively equal. As I said, I don't really want to see Dublin losing what they are doing, I would just like to see other counties having the opportunity to provide the same quality to their players.

We have 4 GDAs in Tipp, and they cover both sports, with 1 GDA assigned per division. They organise coaching courses, visit schools, help with development squads, liaise with clubs in their divisions etc etc.

Development squads have a very constrained budget. They don't get any gear other than their jersey at the end of the year, and we don't give them food after training. We are allowed travel to one away challenge per YEAR, as well as our 3 blitzes. I don't believe Dublin mentors worry about any of that stuff, and that helps.

[Canalman]

Mischievous reporting of figures as always to get the masses riled up.

Would personally like to see the total figures received by the counties totted up when Provincial council subsidies, Central council subsidies, Sports Grants, NI Govt grants .............. not to mention "sugar daddy" contributions etc  are all totted up.

Dublin probably would come tops but not imo anyway way out ahead.

Plenty of counties going on foreign training trips, having masses of backroom staff  etc and they ain' t all Dublin.

Still heaps of people in this country that just cannot and will not accept that the current crop of Dublin players are possibly the best around at the moment. Has to be the money/ "athleticism"  as it simply cannot be that they are better footballers .

[AZOffaly]

There's no doubt about that Canalman, and I hope I'm not coming across as bitter about this. I genuinely think Dublin have done a fabulous job investing the money they do receive.

But if the money is not a factor, and the Dubs are just inherently better, then lets remove the money and see what happens. I think it's a huge factor. I know myself that financial constraints *do* affect your ability to develop players, expose them to playing with/against better players etc etc, as well as just the sheer logistics of providing quality coaching in the clubs. If you have more money, and don't have to worry as much about 'do we have enough money to run a bus to Tullamore', then it *has* to be a factor in the development of those great players.

[larryin89]

I don't think anyone in their right mind wouldn't acknowledge Dublin have a fantastic team at present with some great footballers. I also don't think anyone outside of Dublin would would be of the opinion Dublin are  not in receipt of unfair funding . The figures speak for themselves.

Of course it's coming to light now because of dublins success on the field , it's hardly surprising other counties are looking to take away any advantage Dublin have , for goodness sake why wouldn't they look for fairness.

The home advantage issue is one thing but this is completely different and anyway the home advantage issue is down to gobshites like Sean boylan leading the way on the "everyone wants to play in Croker v the dubs " horse manure.  Dublin will not be beaten in Croker for the foreseeable but there was always a chance if you brought them to navan , portlaois etc against Meath,Laois , as for the token gesture of Nolan park , wow I can't believe the stupidity of some in that Leinster council.

[seafoid]

The GAA should fix Leinster football. Dubs have 10  out of the last 11 I think

You're correct in what you said earlier. Offaly, Kildare, Meath and all the others should bear the brunt of the blame for their own issues, not cast arrows towards Dublin. However, if Offaly make the absolute most of their resources (and they are trying) the artificially inflated gap between themselves and Dublin will still not close, simply because Dublin is able to provide a huge amount of quality coaching and games development, thanks to money from Croke Park.

If that money is not a primary factor, and there is just something inherently better in the Dublin lads, then removing it should make no difference to the current state of play, and the money can be used elsewhere.

If it is a primary factor, then it has to be addressed, either by increasing money to the other counties, or reducing the money to Dublin. My preference would be to increase the money (assuming coherent plans on how to spend it are produced) rather than punishing Dublin for being excellent.

Unfortunately that requires even more money, so what do the GAA do? As I said, they will be swayed by whatever generates a healthier bottom line. For years, that was made healthier by a strong Dublin team and a full Croke Park several days a year. Now that the pendulum has swung so far, that relative strength is actually having a detrimental effect on attendance, and if attendance and interest are affected, so too are the coffers in all counties.

It's a hard medium to find. The GAA needs a competitive Dublin, but it doesn't need, or can't have, a Dublin which through it's own strength reduces the interest in the games themselves.

When have they ever not been competitive?

95 to 05?;I remember long stretches. Only 4 all Irelands in 30 years I think.

[GalwayBayBoy]

Of course money is a big factor. More money = more widely available and better quality coaching for kids and teens which produces better adult footballers down the line. It's not rocket science.

Great teams may have come about almost by accident in the past but the availability of funding is becoming a much larger part in producing great sides.

Even leaving aside Dublin for the time being and looking inside my own province. I don't have the figures but I would be very surprised if Mayo haven't outspent every other county in Connacht over the past decade by a considerable distance. Whether it be on coaches, trainers, backroom staff, trips abroad, etc, etc. This being on football only obviously.

[AZOffaly]

I don't think training camps abroad, or extended backrooms, are necessarily a game changer on a sustainable basis. They are short term measures targetted at the senior team. The coaching and games development spend is much more important for long term progress. Weather versus Climate

[GalwayBayBoy]

Here's what the Irish Times has to say.

Ten years ago, then GAA director general Liam Mulvihill said in a section subtitled 'Dublin' that the "excellent work being done in Dublin is evident in the success of the underage teams from the capital in Féile na nGael and Féile Peile".
He also said: "As a result of the money pumped in by the Irish Sports Council, the Leinster Council, Dublin County Committee and ourselves a total of 46 new people are now involved in games development activities in the city.
"I have said in the past that we cannot expect immediate recompense from this investment, as it is a long-term project and we must persevere with the hard, unfashionable work which draws no plaudits, but which is vital in terms of planting seeds for future success."
The years have rolled by and not only has the unfashionable work drawn no plaudits but its future success has proved a source of anxiety rather than celebration.
There were further questions at this week's launch of the GAA annual accounts about the huge disproportion between Dublin's games development grant of €1.46 million and that drawn down by other counties. Put in context it means that Dublin get 47 per cent of the total grants in this category disbursed to all the counties in Ireland.
To recap, the original funding announced by Dublin in 2005 involved the Irish Sports Council investing €1 million a year to develop participation in Gaelic games in the county. This was used to appoint Games Promotion Officers (GPOs) to clubs in order that they could assist with training and organisation as well as devising and implementing out-reach programmes to local schools.

It wasn't free to everyone and the funding basis is 50:50 between the participating clubs and the county board, which accesses the money through Croke Park, as that was how it was decided to distribute the ISC funding. Over the years the level of that funding has fallen back to around the €600,000 mark but Croke Park have topped up the difference to enable the programme to proceed,
The problem now is that, in contrast to 10 years ago when Dublin were in the midst of a 16-year senior All-Ireland drought, the county has won three of the last five. It also has access to greater sponsorship opportunities than other counties and the current deal with insurance multinational AIG is believed at nearly €1 million per annum to be comfortably more than twice what any other county can command.
The population advantages of having 1.3 million living in the county makes its attractions to advertisers and media obvious.
An interesting point made in the middle of Croke Park stadium director Peter McKenna's presentation was his reference to 'Dublin's domination in Leinster' being a factor in the stadium's €600,000 drop in match-day rental income.
Ironically one of the reasons counties in Leinster won't vote to send Dublin out of Croke Park for championship fixtures – unless drawn against them – is that there's more gate receipts for distribution if they're kept in the stadium.

Now there is an acknowledgement that the champions' domination of the province is affecting gate receipts.
It has equally been pointed out that addressing Dublin's imperium in Leinster is not really a matter for Dublin. That is true but as the county powers on with its development programme and growing success in bringing through young players to senior fulfilment the one thing most conspicuously lacking in Leinster is the sort of opposition that Meath and Kildare used to provide in the province.
Those counties can respond mournfully that their slice of the national games development cake – allowing that further grants are sourced through the Leinster Council in a manner that doesn't favour Dublin so disproportionately – is respectively €45,600 and €42,600.
Per capita that means that Dublin get more than a euro whereas Meath and Kildare are on 24 cent and 20 cent.
GAA director of finance Tom Ryan said at Tuesday's launch of accounts that there was a sub-committee appointed under the auspices of the National Finance Committee to look specifically at that question.
"It's not a question of trying to take resources away from particular counties, the job really should be to provide extra for all of the other counties. It's going to be a job of work that will probably take up to three years in terms of rebalancing competition dividends and things like that, but you will see some changes emerging from that group over the course of the next 18 months to three years."
Despite Ryan's assurances it's hard to see how any rebalancing can take place without reducing the money wealthier counties currently receive.

There is also a reason why this hasn't been done to date and that's partly because Croke Park don't want to be laying off GPOs and more critically because Dublin have been doing such a good job in promoting Gaelic games in the capital.
Much of the commercial appeal of the games is tied up with their profile in the country's biggest population centre. Neither do Dublin avail of the sort of fund-raising capacities that some of their national rivals can through strong immigrant identification in the US or active supporters' clubs.
GPOs must prove their worth. They have periodic review meetings every few months in which they lay out targets relating to both their clubs and local schools for the next period and account for progress in the previous one.
For the first time ever in Dublin the GAA is a visible, recreational presence throughout the county. The question for the GAA and it's a very hard one to address is: has it all been too much of a success?

[seafoid]

Of course money is a big factor. More money = more widely available and better quality coaching for kids and teens which produces better adult footballers down the line. It's not rocket science.

Great teams may have come about almost by accident in the past but the availability of funding is becoming a much larger part in producing great sides.

Even leaving aside Dublin for the time being and looking inside my own province. I don't have the figures but I would be very surprised if Mayo haven't outspent every other county in Connacht over the past decade by a considerable distance. Whether it be on coaches, trainers, backroom staff, trips abroad, etc, etc. This being on football only obviously.

Still won nothing

[Main Street]

There's no mention of proportionality in these figures. What percentage of the Irish population lives in County Dublin? Shouldn't the money dished out be somewhat on a per capita basis? If there are 20,000 kids playing U-14 in Dublin clubs and 300 in Leitrim, then surely the funding should be based on that? If there is a huge disparity in per capita funding, that is a different story.

I'm for rational distribution of facilities.
That the 300 kids in Leitrim have ready access to a similar standard of facilities (infrastructure and coaching) that the 20,000 in Dublin have.
That's my criteria for achieving more equality.
But in that scenario, Leitrim would need more funding  in proportion than Dublin would need.

[armaghniac]

There's no mention of proportionality in these figures. What percentage of the Irish population lives in County Dublin? Shouldn't the money dished out be somewhat on a per capita basis? If there are 20,000 kids playing U-14 in Dublin clubs and 300 in Leitrim, then surely the funding should be based on that? If there is a huge disparity in per capita funding, that is a different story.

There a lot of young people in Dublin playing and it is very much in the GAA's interest to get these people playing. The success of Dublin is doing this is to be commended, other Eastern counties like Wicklow, Louth and Kildare have not shown much interest in GAA. The issue is whether this should be allowed imbalance all inter county competitions also in a scenario where 30% of the population live in Dublin.

[larryin89]

30% is that correct. Top of my head 6 million population of 32 counties , .6 = 10% X 2 = 1.2 . Surely it's nearer 20% ?

[seafoid]

If the Glazers continue to rape Man Utd there could be hundreds of thousands of Dubs turning up at GAA clubs to follow the Gah.