Kildare V Tyrone QR3 20/07/13

[Ohtoohtobe]

Yeah I assume it's Brolly. Could be Whelan, O'Hara or Parkinson either.

People who say McGeeney has done a bad job in Kildare simply don't know what they're talking about.
Percentage of championship games won from 2004-2007: 33%
Percentage of championship games won under McGeeney: almost 70%.

This includes an unlucky AI semi-final defeat in 2010 and one-point losses to Dublin and Donegal in 2011.
He's taken Kildare from a level where our sole dream was to restore an ounce of pride in the jersey by maybe beating a team like Laois or Offaly - which we were incapable of before he arrived - to hammering those counties by at least 10 points almost every time we play them. We've also beaten Meath, a county of comparable resources, three times running in championship and haven't once been knocked out of the championship by anyone outside the top tier.

The players he achieved that with are either retired, considering retirement, or past their best. This year we started four 19-year-olds in all our big games and the teams that beat us were the two league finalists.

I don't know why people seem to think he should be winning All-Irelands; he basically works with the proceeds of three Leinster U21 winning sides (04, 08, 13). The counties ye seem to think he should be beating win a lot more at underage than three provincial titles per decade. He's played a part in starting to change that, managing the U21s this year, while the minors have won a Leinster title in great style and there's another very promising bunch at U16 this year, although McGeeney is not involved in the latter two.

I just don't understand what the man has done to earn the amount of abuse he gets, particularly from Dublin sources. He is more honest and honourable than most of his detractors.

Anyway, a bit of realism is needed. Kildare should hope to contend strongly around 2016-2019.

[Mayo4Sam]

Like I said
I suppose its down to Kildare Co board and supporters, are they happy being the 8th-12th best team in Ireland (if even this year) year after year

You only have to look at ourselves and Donegal for a blueprint for being at the top table, remember we lost to Sligo and Longford, Donegal got hammered by Armagh in 2010. Along come two managers with a solid game plan and transformed both teams to where they are now.
Likewise Cavan and Monaghan look like similar candidates from this year, I'm not sure why you have to wait until 2016.
I'm all for things taking time but he has had more than enough chances.

[heffo]

I just don't understand what the man has done to earn the amount of abuse he gets, particularly from Dublin sources. He is more honest and honourable than most of his detractors.

What abuse is he getting?

[Donnellys Hollow]

He has brought a great level of professionalism to Kildare and he succeeded in getting people behind the county team again, both players and supporters. He was very unfortunate in many ways during 2010 and 2011 when Kildare were not that far away at all.

Things have gone downhill since then for a number of reasons:
- Other counties like Dublin and Donegal who we were competitive against in 2011 have kicked on.
- Dermot Earley and Daryl Flynn were never fit meaning we have had to make do with a makeshift midfield.
- Key players from 2010 and 2011 have lost form due to injuries and simply too much mileage. Kavanagh has been a bigger loss than anticipated.
- It has been necessary to blood many young players all at once and they do not have big match experience yet.
- The Seanie Johnston episode was very divisive and possibly acted as a distraction for the players.

McGeeney has been quite positive for Kildare but I think the time has now come for change. I just can't see there ever being consistency of selection under McGeeney and the same tactical errors are being made year after year.

[Zulu]

Six years is long enough IMO to get a team where they are going,

I don't think that's a given. Kildare have a very strong Dublin to get over each year and a number of decent teams like Meath, Wexford, Louth and Longford that are good enough to beat a lot of teams outside the very highest level.

Blaming bad luck is a cop out, luck evens out.

Nobody's blaming bad luck but to ignore the bad decisions they've suffered in big games is to ignore the reality of the situation.

You only have to look at ourselves and Donegal for a blueprint for being at the top table, remember we lost to Sligo and Longford, Donegal got hammered by Armagh in 2010. Along come two managers with a solid game plan and transformed both teams to where they are now.
Likewise Cavan and Monaghan look like similar candidates from this year, I'm not sure why you have to wait until 2016.
I'm all for things taking time but he has had more than enough chances.

That's fair enough but you can't simply compare counties like that. Kildare have done very well but have lacked the quality forwards that might have pushed them past one or two of the teams that beat them. Both Horan and McGuinness have done well but  I'm not sure Mayo would be celebrating a three in a row if they were in any other province and McGuinness might have got ahead of the pack for a year or two but I think they might struggle from here on in.

The bottom line is you have to ask how far off are Kildare from where Kildare should be and I think they are close enough to where they should be. Who else could come in and get them up a level?

[Dinny Breen]

Like I said
I suppose its down to Kildare Co board and supporters, are they happy being the 8th-12th best team in Ireland (if even this year) year after year

You only have to look at ourselves and Donegal for a blueprint for being at the top table, remember we lost to Sligo and Longford, Donegal got hammered by Armagh in 2010. Along come two managers with a solid game plan and transformed both teams to where they are now.
Likewise Cavan and Monaghan look like similar candidates from this year, I'm not sure why you have to wait until 2016.
I'm all for things taking time but he has had more than enough chances.

sorry mate you're deluding yourself in you think Mayo are ahead of Kildare. Dublin Kerry Cork they are not. Win an All-Ireland first.

[Mayo4Sam]

DH, two points there.
On Dermot Earley, if your gameplan or any plans are based around a man in his mid-30s then youre in trouble, likewise for Johnny Doyle now.
The Seanie Johnson affair was brought on by McGeeney himself, IMO he should have said no, he didnt and any fallout from that is well deserved.

I also think injuries cant be blamed, the modern squad has 9 possible starters in backs and the same in forwards, maybe you rely on one or two more than others but this is the way Dublin, Donegal and Mayo all are and its not because they;'ve all of a sudden found extra players who are of a standard, its because all players are trained to a system and style so they are interchangeable.

[Mayo4Sam]

Like I said
I suppose its down to Kildare Co board and supporters, are they happy being the 8th-12th best team in Ireland (if even this year) year after year

You only have to look at ourselves and Donegal for a blueprint for being at the top table, remember we lost to Sligo and Longford, Donegal got hammered by Armagh in 2010. Along come two managers with a solid game plan and transformed both teams to where they are now.
Likewise Cavan and Monaghan look like similar candidates from this year, I'm not sure why you have to wait until 2016.
I'm all for things taking time but he has had more than enough chances.

sorry mate you're deluding yourself in you think Mayo are ahead of Kildare. Dublin Kerry Cork they are not. Win an All-Ireland first.

I would have thought it was a given that Mayo, Dublin and Donegal were the best three teams in the country.
I do know we need to win the all ireland to get full respect but for the last three years we've been there or there abouts and beaten plenty of other contenders

[Rossfan]

So if McGeeney takes over Leitrim he'd be a failure if he didn't win at least one All Ireland?
Maybe he just hadn't the players in Kildare to win things.
He improved their overall standing and they became a top 8 or 10 side in the unofficial rankings consistently reaching the Qtr Finals.
However he hadn't enough special players to kick on to really challenge for Sam.
Last year his 2008 -11 team hit the "wall" against Cork leading him to start bringing in young lads this year.

They have won 3 of the 4 Leinster titles this year so they must be doing something right in 4x4 land.

[Dinny Breen]

He has brought a great level of professionalism to Kildare and he succeeded in getting people behind the county team again, both players and supporters. He was very unfortunate in many ways during 2010 and 2011 when Kildare were not that far away at all.

Things have gone downhill since then for a number of reasons:
- Other counties like Dublin and Donegal who we were competitive against in 2011 have kicked on.
- Dermot Earley and Daryl Flynn were never fit meaning we have had to make do with a makeshift midfield.
- Key players from 2010 and 2011 have lost form due to injuries and simply too much mileage. Kavanagh has been a bigger loss than anticipated.
- It has been necessary to blood many young players all at once and they do not have big match experience yet.
- The Seanie Johnston episode was very divisive and possibly acted as a distraction for the players.

McGeeney has been quite positive for Kildare but I think the time has now come for change. I just can't see there ever being consistency of selection under McGeeney and the same tactical errors are being made year after year.

Who Kk? This is twice you have said time for change but who are these candidates that can fill the void. Brian Murphy threw away a minor in 2010 and it was only the involvement of Lacey this year that actually turned our minors into winners. Glenn could have stayed with the 21s 5 years ago but opted for the
Longford job - his League record is no better than McGeeney and his championship is one win in Leinster. His involvement with Towers last year led to demotion to Intermediate. I would love to see him back involved but not as manager. 

[Donnellys Hollow]

DH, two points there.
On Dermot Earley, if your gameplan or any plans are based around a man in his mid-30s then youre in trouble, likewise for Johnny Doyle now.
The Seanie Johnson affair was brought on by McGeeney himself, IMO he should have said no, he didnt and any fallout from that is well deserved.

I also think injuries cant be blamed, the modern squad has 9 possible starters in backs and the same in forwards, maybe you rely on one or two more than others but this is the way Dublin, Donegal and Mayo all are and its not because they;'ve all of a sudden found extra players who are of a standard, its because all players are trained to a system and style so they are interchangeable.

I'm in agreement with you. I was just pointing out why Kildare have fallen back on where they were in 2010/2011 when they were genuine All Ireland contenders IMO.

McGeeney has had over two years now to settle on a midfield pairing and a centre back and he has never done it. I get that he has to experiment but there was never any consistency with his selections and that stifled any bit of momentum that was there. This idea he has of playing half forwards in the half backs has never worked yet it was persisted with. Dan Flynn was one of Kildare's best players in the League and against Offaly as a midfielder. For the Dublin game he was moved to full forward and he couldn't get a kick. Then on Saturday he starts at left half back. It's been a similar story with Cribbin who has the potential to be a top forward. It's no wonder Kildare struggle to keep their shape when players are being moved from pillar to post all the time. I'm afraid I can't see this ever changing under McGeeney.

[Dinny Breen]

Like I said
I suppose its down to Kildare Co board and supporters, are they happy being the 8th-12th best team in Ireland (if even this year) year after year

You only have to look at ourselves and Donegal for a blueprint for being at the top table, remember we lost to Sligo and Longford, Donegal got hammered by Armagh in 2010. Along come two managers with a solid game plan and transformed both teams to where they are now.
Likewise Cavan and Monaghan look like similar candidates from this year, I'm not sure why you have to wait until 2016.
I'm all for things taking time but he has had more than enough chances.

sorry mate you're deluding yourself in you think Mayo are ahead of Kildare. Dublin Kerry Cork they are not. Win an All-Ireland first.

I would have thought it was a given that Mayo, Dublin and Donegal were the best three teams in the country.
I do know we need to win the all ireland to get full respect but for the last three years we've been there or there abouts and beaten plenty of other contenders

Given by who the same people who rate Kildare so highly!!! Cork Dublin Kerry Tyrone and Donegal know what it takes to win one everyone else is outside that club. Ratings are only for insecure supporters looking for some sort of validation.

[Donnellys Hollow]

He has brought a great level of professionalism to Kildare and he succeeded in getting people behind the county team again, both players and supporters. He was very unfortunate in many ways during 2010 and 2011 when Kildare were not that far away at all.

Things have gone downhill since then for a number of reasons:
- Other counties like Dublin and Donegal who we were competitive against in 2011 have kicked on.
- Dermot Earley and Daryl Flynn were never fit meaning we have had to make do with a makeshift midfield.
- Key players from 2010 and 2011 have lost form due to injuries and simply too much mileage. Kavanagh has been a bigger loss than anticipated.
- It has been necessary to blood many young players all at once and they do not have big match experience yet.
- The Seanie Johnston episode was very divisive and possibly acted as a distraction for the players.

McGeeney has been quite positive for Kildare but I think the time has now come for change. I just can't see there ever being consistency of selection under McGeeney and the same tactical errors are being made year after year.

Who Kk? This is twice you have said time for change but who are these candidates that can fill the void. Brian Murphy threw away a minor in 2010 and it was only the involvement of Lacey this year that actually turned our minors into winners. Glenn could have stayed with the 21s 5 years ago but opted for the
Longford job - his League record is no better than McGeeney and his championship is one win in Leinster. His involvement with Towers last year led to demotion to Intermediate. I would love to see him back involved but not as manager.

You're right that there is no obvious alternative and Kildare will have to gamble if McGeeney's time is up. Would Cian O'Neill ever consider management? He has worked with Murphy before.

[Dinny Breen]

He has brought a great level of professionalism to Kildare and he succeeded in getting people behind the county team again, both players and supporters. He was very unfortunate in many ways during 2010 and 2011 when Kildare were not that far away at all.

Things have gone downhill since then for a number of reasons:
- Other counties like Dublin and Donegal who we were competitive against in 2011 have kicked on.
- Dermot Earley and Daryl Flynn were never fit meaning we have had to make do with a makeshift midfield.
- Key players from 2010 and 2011 have lost form due to injuries and simply too much mileage. Kavanagh has been a bigger loss than anticipated.
- It has been necessary to blood many young players all at once and they do not have big match experience yet.
- The Seanie Johnston episode was very divisive and possibly acted as a distraction for the players.

McGeeney has been quite positive for Kildare but I think the time has now come for change. I just can't see there ever being consistency of selection under McGeeney and the same tactical errors are being made year after year.

Who Kk? This is twice you have said time for change but who are these candidates that can fill the void. Brian Murphy threw away a minor in 2010 and it was only the involvement of Lacey this year that actually turned our minors into winners. Glenn could have stayed with the 21s 5 years ago but opted for the
Longford job - his League record is no better than McGeeney and his championship is one win in Leinster. His involvement with Towers last year led to demotion to Intermediate. I would love to see him back involved but not as manager.

You're right that there is no obvious alternative and Kildare will have to gamble if McGeeney's time is up. Would Cian O'Neill ever consider management? He has worked with Murphy before.

He would be a gamble  but you know from his experience with Tipp, Mayo and Kerry his knowledge of the Kildare club and underage scene he could be a viable candidate. Would he be interested though?

[Donnellys Hollow]

He has brought a great level of professionalism to Kildare and he succeeded in getting people behind the county team again, both players and supporters. He was very unfortunate in many ways during 2010 and 2011 when Kildare were not that far away at all.

Things have gone downhill since then for a number of reasons:
- Other counties like Dublin and Donegal who we were competitive against in 2011 have kicked on.
- Dermot Earley and Daryl Flynn were never fit meaning we have had to make do with a makeshift midfield.
- Key players from 2010 and 2011 have lost form due to injuries and simply too much mileage. Kavanagh has been a bigger loss than anticipated.
- It has been necessary to blood many young players all at once and they do not have big match experience yet.
- The Seanie Johnston episode was very divisive and possibly acted as a distraction for the players.

McGeeney has been quite positive for Kildare but I think the time has now come for change. I just can't see there ever being consistency of selection under McGeeney and the same tactical errors are being made year after year.

Who Kk? This is twice you have said time for change but who are these candidates that can fill the void. Brian Murphy threw away a minor in 2010 and it was only the involvement of Lacey this year that actually turned our minors into winners. Glenn could have stayed with the 21s 5 years ago but opted for the
Longford job - his League record is no better than McGeeney and his championship is one win in Leinster. His involvement with Towers last year led to demotion to Intermediate. I would love to see him back involved but not as manager.

You're right that there is no obvious alternative and Kildare will have to gamble if McGeeney's time is up. Would Cian O'Neill ever consider management? He has worked with Murphy before.

He would be a gamble  but you know from his experience with Tipp, Mayo and Kerry his knowledge of the Kildare club and underage scene he could be a viable candidate. Would he be interested though?

If he ever has designs on something more than a coaching role then who better than with his own county. I suppose it depends on how Kerry do for the remainder of this year and what arrangements are in place there.

It's probably a pointless discussion anyway because the County Board will reappoint McGeeney if he wants to stay on.