All Ireland Minor Championship - Back Door

[nrico2006]

Because they will be in exams what do you think..

And are A-Level students not in the middle of exams now? 

[rodney trotter]

I said I didn't know about the situation with the A levels

[thewobbler]

One of the biggest issues I have with the GAA at the minute is this shambolic handling of the Minor competition - how has it been allowed to be so unfair for so long now?  Surely this issue has been highlighted before now.

Shambolic is an interesting word, after all what the GAA have actually done is allow provincial boards the autonomy to make it work for themselves. It's a thing in transition at present, but shambles is an unnecessarily strong description.

Unfair is an interesting choice of word too. I presume you are referring to the lack of a back door in Ulster/Connacht.  Personally I'd have the same opinion of minors as I would of seniors i.e. why add another 30+ games to a season, to arrive at the same outcome anyway?  For example, Donegal and Tyrone are a distance ahead of the pack this summer in Ulster. What would a back door do apart from prove this conclusively?


The concept of minor football has arrived at something of a crossroads. It's always had a twofold purpose of acting as a curtain raiser for senior football, and as a taster/first steps/welcome to the occasion for potential future senior players. But due to a combination of exams and the back door, it has become largely detached from senior football championship.

The traditionalist in the GAA world will want to maintain the minor competition. Indeed, I would too. But by detaching it from its curtain-raising role, you do have to question its very existence. There is genuinely no reason to run two high-profile, high-expense, u18 and u21 competitions, when a focused, summer-only u20 competition would provide the best of both worlds - and without the problem of exams for u18s.

Without playing on words, something needs to be done to ensure it is fair and each team in the competition is treated equally.  The provincial championships are ultimately under the control of the GAA and if it is apparent (which in this case it is) that certain teams are gaining unfair advantages then they should have taken action by now.  Tyrone and Donegal seem like the two strongest teams in Ulster this year, but that doesn't stop them from losing to any of the other teams and having their season ended early.  Tyrone lost in dubious circumstances to Armagh in 2009, were put out and Armagh went on the win the All Ireland.  Tyrone, if given the second or third chances that counties in other provinces are, could have potentially won that years competition. 

Also, Tyrone were scheduled to play Monaghan at the weekend just six days after playing their first game.  I believe this was to accommodate Monaghan who won't play in June?  Why are the leaving cert students given special treatment?

I guess my problem with this Nrico, is just how many games do we need to play to unequivocally ensure that the best team wins out in the end? Why stop at a second chance, why not give a third too, in case they freeze once and their best player is injured the second time?

And then what do we tell our clubs? "Yeah we know we've no chance of winning anything this year, but wee Tommy, he's not allowed to play at any grade for St John's until the minors are out, simple as that".

---

I don't know at all what the attendances were like for Leinster MFC games. But I'd still harbour a guess that the crowd in Healy Park last Sunday was greater than the collective crowd for all the games in Leinster. Largely because of the senior game that followed, but in no small part due to the fact that it was do or die time for both teams.

It's be interesting to ask this year's crop of minor footballers do they want 3 low key games, or 1 high profile.

[thewobbler]

* if they actually want the safety net of 3 low-key games, or would prefer to risk it all on 1 big day out.

[AZOffaly]

Dual counties. Easy to say something like that when you're really only thinking about Football.

[Syferus]

The idea that students actually want to study or would use the extra time to study is an incredible fallacy. It's as divorced from reality as the GAA schedule is.

[Jinxy]

Are we still in this?

[rodney trotter]

No.

[Jinxy]

Break it to me gently why don't you.

[nrico2006]

One of the biggest issues I have with the GAA at the minute is this shambolic handling of the Minor competition - how has it been allowed to be so unfair for so long now?  Surely this issue has been highlighted before now.

Shambolic is an interesting word, after all what the GAA have actually done is allow provincial boards the autonomy to make it work for themselves. It's a thing in transition at present, but shambles is an unnecessarily strong description.

Unfair is an interesting choice of word too. I presume you are referring to the lack of a back door in Ulster/Connacht.  Personally I'd have the same opinion of minors as I would of seniors i.e. why add another 30+ games to a season, to arrive at the same outcome anyway?  For example, Donegal and Tyrone are a distance ahead of the pack this summer in Ulster. What would a back door do apart from prove this conclusively?


The concept of minor football has arrived at something of a crossroads. It's always had a twofold purpose of acting as a curtain raiser for senior football, and as a taster/first steps/welcome to the occasion for potential future senior players. But due to a combination of exams and the back door, it has become largely detached from senior football championship.

The traditionalist in the GAA world will want to maintain the minor competition. Indeed, I would too. But by detaching it from its curtain-raising role, you do have to question its very existence. There is genuinely no reason to run two high-profile, high-expense, u18 and u21 competitions, when a focused, summer-only u20 competition would provide the best of both worlds - and without the problem of exams for u18s.

Without playing on words, something needs to be done to ensure it is fair and each team in the competition is treated equally.  The provincial championships are ultimately under the control of the GAA and if it is apparent (which in this case it is) that certain teams are gaining unfair advantages then they should have taken action by now.  Tyrone and Donegal seem like the two strongest teams in Ulster this year, but that doesn't stop them from losing to any of the other teams and having their season ended early.  Tyrone lost in dubious circumstances to Armagh in 2009, were put out and Armagh went on the win the All Ireland.  Tyrone, if given the second or third chances that counties in other provinces are, could have potentially won that years competition. 

Also, Tyrone were scheduled to play Monaghan at the weekend just six days after playing their first game.  I believe this was to accommodate Monaghan who won't play in June?  Why are the leaving cert students given special treatment?

I guess my problem with this Nrico, is just how many games do we need to play to unequivocally ensure that the best team wins out in the end? Why stop at a second chance, why not give a third too, in case they freeze once and their best player is injured the second time?

And then what do we tell our clubs? "Yeah we know we've no chance of winning anything this year, but wee Tommy, he's not allowed to play at any grade for St John's until the minors are out, simple as that".

---

I don't know at all what the attendances were like for Leinster MFC games. But I'd still harbour a guess that the crowd in Healy Park last Sunday was greater than the collective crowd for all the games in Leinster. Largely because of the senior game that followed, but in no small part due to the fact that it was do or die time for both teams.

It's be interesting to ask this year's crop of minor footballers do they want 3 low key games, or 1 high profile.

I have no issue with a backdoor (i.e. one extra life) as it currently is for the seniors.  But if it was simply old school championship format meaning you are out when you lose, thats fine too.  As long as its the same for all teams.  Would I be right in saying that Kerry lost twice last year before they ended up playing Tyrone who were unbeaten? 

[ck]

Bottom line is that Armagh Minors scored 19 points against one of the favourites to win the AI and they are out of the competition. That can't be right.

Cavan were one of the fav to win minor AI? Really?!

[ck]

GAA should scrap u.21 and increase minor to U.19. There would be no exam conflicting and it means the less grades means that young top players wouldn't suffer burnout and over training

[Captain Obvious]

Bottom line is that Armagh Minors scored 19 points against one of the favourites to win the AI and they are out of the competition. That can't be right.

Cavan were one of the fav to win minor AI? Really?!

You quoted a post from two years ago when Armagh scored 19 points against Tyrone.

GAA should scrap u.21 and increase minor to U.19. There would be no exam conflicting and it means the less grades means that young top players wouldn't suffer burnout and over training

It would make more since to scrap pre-season competitions McKenna,O.Byrne cup and play college,club competitions before the end of year instead of February,March.

[ck]

Bottom line is that Armagh Minors scored 19 points against one of the favourites to win the AI and they are out of the competition. That can't be right.

Cavan were one of the fav to win minor AI? Really?!

You quoted a post from two years ago when Armagh scored 19 points against Tyrone.

GAA should scrap u.21 and increase minor to U.19. There would be no exam conflicting and it means the less grades means that young top players wouldn't suffer burnout and over training

It would make more since to scrap pre-season competitions McKenna,O.Byrne cup and play college,club competitions before the end of year instead of February,March.

lol ah god didn't realise the old date.

Yeah fair shout on scraping those competitions, but the issue is players from 18-21 playing for too many teams. So better to scrap grades rather than competitions.

[neilthemac]

Bottom line is that Armagh Minors scored 19 points against one of the favourites to win the AI and they are out of the competition. That can't be right.

Cavan were one of the fav to win minor AI? Really?!

You quoted a post from two years ago when Armagh scored 19 points against Tyrone.

GAA should scrap u.21 and increase minor to U.19. There would be no exam conflicting and it means the less grades means that young top players wouldn't suffer burnout and over training

It would make more since to scrap pre-season competitions McKenna,O.Byrne cup and play college,club competitions before the end of year instead of February,March.

lol ah god didn't realise the old date.

Yeah fair shout on scraping those competitions, but the issue is players from 18-21 playing for too many teams. So better to scrap grades rather than competitions.

SOME players playing too much.
most players this age don't get enough games at club level, or their games are sidelined to accommodate players on county teams.